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Best of Season 4: Reena and the Red Panda: A Conversation with Reena Friedman Watts!
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Hello everyone and welcome to the best of Season 4. This week we are going back to my conversation with the one and only Reena Friedman Watts, host of the Better Call Daddy podcast. Without any further ado, hope you enjoy!
In this episode, Satsunami is joined by the incredible host of the Better Call Daddy podcast Reena Friedman Watts! From the secrets to a successful podcast to Reena's journey as a content creator, this is one that you will not want to miss!
This podcast is a member of the PodPack Collective, an indie podcasting group dedicated to spreading positivity within the podcast community. For further information, please follow the link: https://linktr.ee/podpackcollective
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Transcript
Introduction to Season 4 Best with Rina Friedman Watts
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello everyone and welcome to the best of Season 4. This week we're going back to my conversation with the one and only Rina Friedman Watts, host of The Better Call Daddy Podcast. Without any further ado, hope you enjoy.
Rina's Enthusiasm for Indie Podcasting
00:00:13
Speaker
people
00:00:17
Speaker
Welcome to Chad Tsunami.
00:00:29
Speaker
Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of Chatsunami. My name's Chatsunami and joining me today is a fantastic content creator that you might have seen around. She is the host of the Better Cold Addy podcast. It is none other than the one and only Rina Friedman-Mort. Rina, welcome to Chatsunami.
Collaborating in the Podcasting Community
00:00:50
Speaker
Thank you so much for having me. I love collaborating with other indie podcasters. Oh, honestly, same. It's the highlight of my week when I see that I've got another Monday podcaster lined up and I'm just like, yeah, let's go. Let's do it. But how are you doing tonight? I am doing awesome. And this is the highlight of my day as well. I look forward to it because we're going through the grind and I am sure that you've learned something that I haven't learned and I've learned things that you haven't learned. And the best way to grow is collaborating with other people who are doing what you love doing. oh Absolutely.
Misconceptions in Broadcasting
00:01:23
Speaker
Because I feel as if that is a misconception for people getting into broadcasting. And I've said this in the past, that people think, oh, it's just such an easy job. You turn on a microphone and then suddenly after talking into the mic for several hours, you're going to be famous. You know, you're going to be like a lone island and everything. And it's just as you're really not the case, is it? It's not going to be Rena Tsunami after today. Well, we'll we'll talk about it after the episode. Yeah, we'll we'll be in talks here.
00:01:51
Speaker
but You'll hear from my producer. Yes, I've got a red panda lawyer in the corner. I often joke about that, but but yeah, he'll be in touch. He'll be in touch.
Podcasting Tools and Tech Challenges
00:02:00
Speaker
ah One thing that we were talking about is the tools that we use and just little things that we've discovered, like even the app we're recording this on now, Zencaster, if you talk on top of each other that the audio might dip down. I didn't know that. Yeah, it's a bit of a problem, I'm going to be honest. especially because it's not a universal problem and as someone who works with software in my day job it's a bit of a pain when you've got a problem that's not as I said universal to every single instance so whenever I'm talking to like for example for you and I tonight it seems alright and I keep saying tonight apologies because I know time differences are a wonderful time it's your afternoon but yeah when I talk to some other people sometimes my audio load up
00:02:46
Speaker
or it would just be like a battle of audio waves. So it is interesting to
Rise of Indie Podcasting
00:02:51
Speaker
see that. I mean, Zencast is great, but I think it's a case that not every app or software is going to be perfect, is it? I've even noticed with Riverside that the audio quality might be good, but the video quality might be pixelated or delayed. And I also, I haven't found one tool that does everything I need, so I have found some tools that do one thing that I need and I'm constantly on the search for how do I integrate those tools. Oh no, absolutely. It's like collecting Pokémon,
Discovering New Podcasting Tools
00:03:24
Speaker
isn't it? It's like trying to find the right audio editor, the right recorder. It is. It's just trying to get that perfect mix because there are a lot of companies out there, aren't there? I kind of noticed this in recent years and I think it's because indie podcasting especially and in the celebrity sphere, podcasting has had an awful boom in popularity and interest. So a lot of companies are trying to capitalise on it. They're trying to say, come over here, we'll host your podcast, we'll record everything, we'll do this and that. But it is quite tricky. You're completely right. It is tricky that they can do everything correctly. Not only can they do everything correctly, but where are the best content creators doing their thing? And how can we learn from what has been a game changer for them? I want to hear what has been a game changer.
Cost of Podcasting Tools
00:04:18
Speaker
So today, a podcaster that I just connected to this past week, he's a standup comedian. I've actually connected to a couple comedy guys recently, but anyway, he is the modern day overthinker, Colin Strayjack. He was telling me that he uses video dot.ai. And I had had another creator who interviewed me recently mention the same app. So it's like if two creators that I've collaborated with say that this is a game changer, then you're like, hmm, let me see what that does. And then I'm like, hey, have you used the Headliner app? That one creates audiograms. The thing is, is when you use these apps, it looks like you've used an app sometimes. I feel as if that is quite a sticking point for a lot of creators, especially when they find the perfect app to use, like, for example, with Zencaster or Headliner. And then they have a limit on their service because obviously they're a business at the end. of the day. As much as I would love them to release everything for free and to have amazing top quality audio for everyone or video, at the end of the day they are a business and they need subscriptions in order to keep themselves going, and keep the lights on as it
The Hustle and Expenses of Indie Podcasting
00:05:29
Speaker
were. But those subscriptions really stack up. because I mean I pay a subscription for my website which is powered through Podpage. On the one hand I am kind of lazy in that regard because I know I could easily get a free WordPress one but at the same time there's also that sticking point of Podpage being integrated with your feed, being able to pick up your episodes and everything. It's just so much handier but I think if I had to pay for Podpage and then I had to pay for Headliner and then I had to pay for everything else. You know, it's just that stacking one on top of the other and that this kind of level of indie podcasts creating like I wouldn't say as much as it pains me to say. I wouldn't say I'm at that level of professional podcaster, as much as I would like to think you know and
Rina's Podcasting Motivations
00:06:21
Speaker
dream about it. But yeah, it's quite an expensive process if you're going for all the top things. Do you think that puts off a lot of new creators that want to get into podcasting, that they think they have to subscribe to all these services?
00:06:36
Speaker
That's a great question. I would say that I think a lot of new podcasters don't think about all of the expenses going into it. And if they did, it might hold them back from actually wanting to pull the trigger. I think that for me, there were so many reasons why I wanted to podcast. One, I had a lot of connections from my TV days that I still wanted to keep in touch with. And like you said, have casual chats with, have casual conversations with that I thought people might want to be a fly on the wall for. So that was one reason too. My dad has always wanted his own show. He's a total
Starting with Minimal Equipment
00:07:12
Speaker
character. I felt like we had a special relationship and I wanted to share his wisdom with the world with What's funny about that is that not only have I been sharing my dad's wisdom with the world on our Better Call Daddy podcast, but every time we have on a guest, they're sharing their wisdom with us. And it is, I feel like given my dad something to look forward to, it's given me special time with my dad and it's upped our wisdom rating by doing it together. So I think don't think too much about all of these add-ons. There's ways to do it inexpensively. I had a Yeti mic for definitely the first year. That thing is like a hundred bucks. Now I've upgraded my computer. I've upgraded my mic. I'm working at a radio station one day a week to expand my reach. I've joined a podcaster network. I'm doing some affiliate sales. These things add on over time. Don't get too caught up in, oh my God, I got to be on YouTube shorts. I got to have video. I got to have the best graphics. I got to have the best templates. I got to have a professional editor. Those things you can add on one thing at a time gradually.
Balancing Hard Work and Luck in Creation
00:08:14
Speaker
because I have to say I think being on all these apps has taught me in particular a very valuable lesson that although part of what you're putting out there, especially at the beginning as an indie broadcaster, part of it is hard work. Your networking, your editing, everything that you put in your research, half of it is hard work. But the other half sometimes, and I think this is a sticking point for a lot of people and it was for me for a while, it can be just dumb luck sometimes. And I wouldn't say it's like the majority of it is dumb luck, but I feel as if some of it is, depending on how viral you want the show to get. Because I remember, and I've said this story in my lead time, so apologies if I'm repeating myself, but there was a video I posted on TikTok and it was just a meme video. That was it. Nothing to do with the podcast. Just a completely off-the-topic meme about, I think it was Kung Fu Panda or something very silly about that. And that got over a million views. Why? I've got no idea. I didn't look at the analytics. I didn't have a memento board up on the wall or anything with the red strings. We were like, okay, if I put this up at this time, then just purely by chance I got that and it's got nothing to do with the podcast. Whereas when I put up clips of the podcast I'm lucky if I break maybe a couple of hundred views. I thought that's the thing as well and again I'm not saying it for people to give up their dreams and be like oh well if it's down to luck then what's the point? It's just it's one of those things that sometimes you get lucky and you can get on people's radars but what are your thoughts on that? I think hard
Finding Your Audience Creatively
00:09:56
Speaker
work, dumb luck, and it's an artistic expression. So that's why even regarding the apps that can create audiograms for you, if you select what was most important to you from the episode and you create a meme out of it, I feel like that's fun for you, that's an artistic expression for you, and that might hit. You might find your people better that way because you're being yourself. What do you think about that? I feel as if, and this isn't limited to podcasts and I have to say it because before I got into podcasting, I did Twitch streaming during the pandemic in 2020. One of the things that I do find is that a lot of people who go into these content creation endeavors, they don't go in it for the right reasons. If that makes sense,
Importance of Authenticity
00:10:47
Speaker
they don't go in because they want to put their voice out there. For example, with your podcast, you have such a unique
00:10:54
Speaker
take on things. You do it absolutely fantastically. I'll get to it later to see how fantastic you do your marketing and everything because it's like when I see you on Twitter and things, I'm like, when my podcast grows up, I want it to be just like that. ah But when I see a lot of content creators, they look up to megastars or popular YouTubers, popular Twitch streamers, and they want to be the next them. They don't want to be behave themselves. They don't want to brand the podcast as, oh, this is my show. They want to say, oh, I want to be the next, I don't know, let's play channel or, oh, I want to be the next, whatever. And then when their podcast or show or whatever they're doing doesn't take off, then there's that chance. And I've seen it before, but there is that chance of having the wrong reaction towards it, feeling quite angry, jealous.
Evolution of Podcast Themes
00:11:47
Speaker
That's definitely not the way forward, I would say. Yeah, that's a slippery slope. The whole comparisonitis or trying to be something that you're not. It's honestly taken me a long time to love myself and to lean into my unique gifts. And I think the relationship with my dad has gotten me there. It's actually been since
00:12:08
Speaker
I was a little girl, and I felt like I had something special there. But the show has pivoted. Like I said in the beginning, I thought focusing on some of my connections with reality stars or me being able to book crazy stories would be the hook. But what actually my show has turned more into is stories of inspirational fathers, dads that are teaching their sons interesting skills or things, daddies, girls, lack of fathers. So it's been more of the daddy angle, which I wouldn't have expected versus the shock and awe. I do sprinkle in comedians because I love comedy, other content creators, other podcasters, because that's part of who
Pandemic's Impact on Podcasting Plans
00:12:53
Speaker
I am as well. But yeah, I think finding your unique angle, your unique niche is part of the evolution of putting together your own thing. And going back to as you were talking about there with your own podcast, the Better Call Daddy podcast, absolutely fantastic podcast. Am I right in saying though that you started this around July 2020? Yes. So was this a product of being a the lockdown?
Rina's Podcasting Journey
00:13:23
Speaker
It started a little bit before that, but yes, I think I was needing more human interaction. And this was a project where I could demonstrate my love of production and casting and connecting with people and networking. So I was
00:13:41
Speaker
thinking about it going into the pandemic because I was working for a podcaster right beforehand. I was booking her hard to reach guests. I was helping her with sponsorships around events. I was part of Kathy Heller's big coaching program. I was one of her coaches. I had seen that she was making multiple streams of income from being a podcaster. So I was like, Hey, if I'm booking her all of these hard to reach people and she's figured out ways of creating business around that, why can't I do that too? Out of curiosity, did you have to think for a while about what you were going to do the podcast about? Or did you just immediately think that, yeah, this is the one that I immediately want to go in running as soon as I hit the ground? That's a great question. And I had thought about it for months before I actually pulled the trigger. It's funny because when I was working for Kathy Heller, my dad was doing business in California around an event that I was helping produce for her. I was pregnant at the time and he ended up extending his trip to help me set up tables and move all of the boxes around and the furniture around and he was like my production assistant. My dad has always been like my number one fan, my biggest cheerleader and so I knew he wouldn't back out on me. I had co-hosted another podcast a couple years prior where I was booking guests and I occasionally filled in as a host and that kind of sparked something in me where again I had thought about doing it myself but I didn't know all of the pieces. I didn't know which mic to use. I didn't know which hosting platform to use. During that show, we were recording it on Skype. The technology has definitely improved, where there are so many different ways in which you can podcast. You can record into a platform. You can host many different places. There are so many different microphones. You can do it in person. You can do it
Father's Reflections Segment
00:15:32
Speaker
remotely. So it was kind of just figuring out what was going to be the easiest way to do it. But the dad piece, I knew I just didn't know exactly what to call it, what the graphics were going to look like. I actually hired a friend of mine. She was a mompreneur. She had been laid off from her job. She was part of the coaching program that I was a coach for. And I loved her work. I had seen some of her cartoons and I was like, hey, could you draw one of me and my dad? And it was her idea, Shari Perry, to have my dad coming out of a telephone like a genie and a
00:16:03
Speaker
So she came up with that idea. I thought it was really cute. And I've kept that same graphic for all four seasons. I loved it. It's personalized. and I feel like it captures the theme of my show. People know the idea from just looking at the art. But every season, I've changed different aspects of the intro. I've included my kids in some of the transitions. My daughter says, let's switch it over to Grandpa. And then Grandpa comes on at the end of every episode. And we reflect on the episode. Sometimes the guests have a question. question for my dad and I feel like the biggest gift to my guests is my dad's reflection on their story and his intergenerational wisdom. How does he relate to their story? What did he learn from it? What would he add? What does it bring up for him? And he definitely has a different perspective than
Journey of Finding Your Voice
00:16:49
Speaker
I do and and years of experience and his own experiences that he relates to their story. And my guests love it. And it's my favorite part to give the guest. In the final edit, I tag my dad onto the episode. So they don't get to hear that until I send them the final episode. Honestly, I think it is just such a great way to tackle these topics and these interviews. When I first heard it, I was listening to hear about how you would actually do it and obviously when I heard your dad giving his point of view as well, it's
00:17:21
Speaker
just such a unique way to do those episodes and again it's done just absolutely fantastically because there's a lot of podcasters that for better or for worse I don't know if you've seen them about you know podcasters that they just want to hear their own voice at times, they want to be the central authority about whatever they're talking about and when they've got a guest on or whatever, they'll try to say, oh, I believe this, I believe that, what do you believe? And then they kind of just like cut into that. But I do think it is fantastic that you are not only listening to your guests, but also bringing your dad in to have, as you said, that extra generational input. Yeah, I've, to be honest, never so much wanted the spotlight. Actually putting myself in front of the camera has been a big challenge for me. I prefer being behind the scenes and worked behind the scenes for years, but I felt like now for content generators, you need to be in front of the camera so people know, like, and trust you factor. And so this show has given me a platform where I can inch my way into that. And with the
Collaborating with the Right People
00:18:28
Speaker
support of my dad, I can be myself best. So I think that if you're starting a podcast, one, guest on other people's shows. So you get comfortable in sharing your story and you kind of figure out what other people want to know about you and the questions that people might ask about your life and your story. And two, collaborate with people that see you in the best light, are going to make space for you, and are going to make the conversation easy where it doesn't feel scripted, it doesn't feel tense, and you can share in a vulnerable way. No, I would completely agree with that because I feel as if one of the maybe pitfalls is the wrong word, but one of the issues some new podcasters or content creators might have with collaboration is not getting the right fit for who they're collaborating with.
00:19:16
Speaker
I remember when I just started out and I was gaining a relative traction enough for one or two people to take notice and they said, hey, we love your show. I can't remember what podcast it was, but without naming any names anyway, this podcast was like, hey, we love your show. We'd love to have you on. And I was like, Yeah, ah sure. Let me just double check and see who you guys are. So I looked and long story short, it was a very quote unquote keeping it real podcast ah where they didn't care about what they said. It was very politically charged, let's just say. And I was like, no. 100% no because I don't know how new podcasters would feel about feeling pressured. Honestly, don't feel pressured if you're listening to this and you think, oh, should I go? Should I not?
Learning from Failed Collaborations
00:20:03
Speaker
Definitely go for someone that you feel as if you are going to be comfortable with because, yeah, there can be that pressure to think if you're going to collaborate with absolutely everyone but But it is okay you know to step back and be like, oh, I don't know if that person would fit in. Or have you ever seen that before? Or have you ever had someone where they've approached you and said, oh, do you want to come on my show? But they're probably not the right fit. That's a great question. A couple of things came up for me there. One, yes, I have gone on someone's podcast and it went a different direction where I needed to reroute.
00:20:39
Speaker
the conversation because I didn't really like where it was going. I feel like I was kind of able to save it and not go too much further in the direction I didn't like going, but I probably should have done better research to know that some of his beliefs didn't really match mine. And then I just want to say something else alongside that. I have gone on someone's podcast and then never heard back. And I was thinking to myself, was I not the right fit? Did I not deliver enough value? Did that person just never put it out? I actually recently re-looked up the guy and he just like all of a sudden stopped airing episodes. So that could be the thing too. Like maybe that podcaster doesn't really know the direction that they're going. And then I've had guests on to where it started off and it was just going to be like an informational get to know you. And then the conversation went well. So I was like, Hey, let's turn this into an episode. And then I hit record and it didn't really make the best episode because that wasn't the initial reason why we connected. We initially connected to just have a conversation and then recording kind of mid conversation didn't make
Handling Pitches and Expectations
00:21:51
Speaker
sense. So then I invited that person back on to try to do it more strategically. And then the second take wasn't good either. And so the person reached back out to me. I never told her I wasn't going to error. I kind of just thought that she might not notice because a lot of times people don't even care. Like once you have the conversation, they never talked to you again. So I thought maybe just I could sweep it under the rug. I probably should just told her it didn't work out. And she reached back out to me. She was like, Hey, is that ever going to air? And I was like, it didn't work. I'm sorry. You know? But you have to give people the benefit of the doubt, right? Especially if there are hundreds of episodes in. Don't take it personal. Think about how you can add value to the show. I had somebody reach out to me this week and they were like, hey, I love the flow of your podcast. If you ever need somebody from a media agency, I'd love to share your podcast with my audience. I was like, oh really? Which episode did you listen to of mine that you loved the flow? You get pitched so many times, you're like, should I call their bluff?
00:22:48
Speaker
you know, funny enough, I had a comment from another indie
Cold Pitches and Ethical Considerations
00:22:52
Speaker
podcast. I think it was Ice McCinema, another Scottish film podcast, and they were like, oh, we loved your finale. We loved how great a conversationalist you are with your co-hosts. So I went to my friend Andrew, who I did the episode with, and I told him I gave him this feedback, and he went, really? Us?
00:23:11
Speaker
but say so I'm like, I know, I know, I too was shocked. But yeah, in that case, it definitely sounds as if they just yeah said, yeah, all the episodes. It is quite interesting when you do get those, because I have to admit, on the opposite end of that, I got an email recently, some and I don't know if you've ever got these emails where it was basically our website now has a domain name, so now it's literally just instead of putting podpage.com forward slash chat tsunami, we're now chat tsunami.com. And I got a message through my website from some company saying, oh, I noticed that your website doesn't pop up when you put in the name. Don't worry with our package and all the usual stuff that we will be able to bought you and Google and everything. So I literally two seconds later typed in chat tsunami and it was the first result. And I was like, Hmm, have you ever had that before? Oh, gosh, the amount of cold pitches I get and some of them are smart to where they figure out how to WhatsApp you. I'm like, what in the world block?
00:24:18
Speaker
Really? Yes. I had one of these podcast promoters. What's at me? I'm like, I don't know how you figured out my number. That that was smart. You know, they they want to tell you that they'll spend money on Google ads and they'll monetize your channel and one week. All of these outrageous claims and then they show you all of their clients and then they circle the number of views you're getting and how they can up your engagement and I'm like I don't want to cheat though whereas it's nice to have things go viral for me it's not just about the views.
00:24:52
Speaker
Like you said, what is your why? What is your intention? Are you looking to grow as a human? Are you
Showing Real Struggles vs. Success Highlights
00:24:58
Speaker
looking to network with people? are you Why are you doing it? I think that that is something that's really important to continually check yourself on. Yeah, it's definitely true. Having a goal for podcasting can definitely take you a long way. And it definitely takes you a while. I would say, at least in my experience, I would say that it does take a while to try and find where you're going with it. It's like, as you said, with that other one who just stopped uploading, it's like if they officer speculating that if they thought, oh, I'm just going to end because I've got no real clear goal, no motivation for it, you know that's perfectly fine. But there are a lot of people that unfortunately
00:25:43
Speaker
prey on that because that feels as if it's almost like a standard that a lot of people put out there. And I mean, I don't get me wrong, I've done this as well when everybody does this, that they'll put up the best of their channel. Like, I had a guest who said this a good couple of years ago. I think her name was Glitterkitty1, her username. And when we were talking about content creation and the struggles of that, she brought up a very excellent point that a lot of people want to see your highlight reels in content creation.
Supporters in the Podcasting Community
00:26:19
Speaker
They want to see your triumphs and everything. They don't want to see the negative side of it, which on the one hand you know you can see why people would gravitate towards people who are seemingly more successful but on the other hand that creates almost a false image that people might think oh I now have to live up to that standard of podcasting or content creation as a whole. I'm sitting here shaking my head up and down. Yes, people only want to see the highlight reel. They want to see people who keep it positive. But like you said, that there's a lot of hard work. A lot of hard work goes into it. And if you talk to any podcaster who's been doing it for a long time, many of us feel like they want to quit every day.
00:27:06
Speaker
I mean especially when you see your analytics not doing as well or you put out a bit of content and you think this is going to be the one and it doesn't and it's a really hard hobby, isn't it?
00:27:18
Speaker
Yes, but luckily I have my dad to remind me of all of the reasons why we're doing it. Seriously, I think that you need an encourager or you need to collaborate with other podcasters who are like, I'm in this for the freaking long game. I am in this because I love this as a creative outlet. And if you don't have a platform, you're not going to reach all of these cool people that you can reach if you do have a platform.
00:27:44
Speaker
No, it's absolutely right though because something that surprised me when I got into podcasting was just how positive the podcasting community was in comparison to other content creation groups. Would you say there's a difference between the positivity of indie podcasting versus maybe other areas? Yes, definitely. Although once some of these podcasters get on a network and they are getting tens of thousands of listens per episode, I think that the ego comes into play where even though other people have made their dreams come true, a lot of podcasters start weighing, are these new indie podcasters worth their
Marketing Challenges in Podcasting
00:28:26
Speaker
time?
00:28:26
Speaker
out of the 327 or so that I have aired episodes that I've aired, I've only had a couple of people be like, so how many downloads are you getting? And truthfully, that varies per guest and per how much the guest shares or whether that guest has an email list or whether that guest is going to promote too. That definitely comes into play. Yeah, marketing's a pain in the backside, isn't it?
00:28:51
Speaker
That is one of the biggest pieces of podcasting that I think that indie podcasters don't really want to do. I think it's the biggest pain point. Because especially though with the issues I suppose is the right term with other social media sites like for example Twitter slash X. I feel as if after everything that went on with that happened they are At least for me, I would say, and a couple of other people I've talked to, it seems as if there has been an impact on the interactions and especially for views. Don't get me wrong, I don't really look at views and think, oh, so many people have looked at my tweet. But I feel as if ever since the takeover and everything, it has dropped significantly. And because of that turmoil, you have loads of companies that are coming out of the woodwork to promote their
00:29:42
Speaker
quote unquote alternatives. For example you have Blue Sky, Mastodon, Threads as well, Instagram, TikTok, it's just it can be quite difficult to juggle all of them. Oh yeah and that's why I think It's important to know where your audience is and where you're getting the most interaction. And if you're not getting the most interaction, then go more all in on the other places. I think it's important to have a profile on each, but if you're not getting engagement, maybe that's not where you should spend the most of your efforts.
00:30:19
Speaker
I'm actually curious to hear what you think about this because I've got an Instagram page of course for the podcast but I also cross post to a Facebook group like I literally just post it to Instagram but automatically post it onto to Facebook. But I barely get any interactions on Facebook. and I might get one or two, but it's not really where I'm putting my eggs in the basket as it were. But I feel as if there is that kind of, and I think it was something more talking about earlier, it's that almost pressure that you need to be visible everywhere. because something that you brought up earlier that I just want to touch on when you talked about how you're doing a lot more video episodes as opposed to just being behind the mic, I completely relate to that because for the longest time you know I've been very self-conscious about myself and thinking should I put myself out there should I just
00:31:15
Speaker
keep myself hidden behind the red panda avatar because at least for me being behind the mic and being behind the camera means that the red panda and chat tsunami is almost the symbol of the
Importance of Branding
00:31:27
Speaker
podcast. Like when people look at the podcast they're gonna think oh it's chat tsunami it's about this it's about that but they're not gonna necessarily associate it with me if that makes sense. Like I don't want to be the glory hawk It sounds contradictory, doesn't it, that I'm saying that as the host of a podcast, I don't want to be the focus of my own podcast. But I feel as if with everybody coming on, I want them to almost have that shared exposure. But apologies, that was a very long ramble there.
00:31:56
Speaker
Well, I want to know who the red panda is. Well, do you know the story behind the red panda? Why I chose it? I don't. The reason I chose it was is because, well, first of all, red pandas are cute as hell. That's just a fact of life. But years and years ago, my girlfriend and I went to Edinburgh Zoo for Valentine's Day and we went on a date and we saw these lovely red pandas. After that, we ended up getting each other these plushies. So she got me a red panda because I was like oh the red pandas are cute and in return I got her a wee koala. So I've still got that plushie and you might have seen it in videos and things that I do on TikTok and whenever I do a video with a red panda plushie chances are it's the same one. The reason I chose that is because it is to me personally it's a symbol of a really happy time in my life and I want to spread that, as cheesy as this sounds, apologies for it, I want to spread that happiness to other people with the podcast. Whether I'm talking about something silly like about gaming or films or whether my friends and I talk about something a wee bit more serious I just want people to look at the Red Panda and feel happy, just like I do whenever I see that Red Panda. But on the downside, it does mean that whenever there's like a news story about Red Pandas or there's like a really funny picture of a Red Panda, I will always, without fail, get tagged by someone in the indie podcast and community and they'll be like, hey Satsu, is this you? Yeah, why not? It's me.
00:33:28
Speaker
but I feel like maybe you can play that up more. If people are associating you with it, yeah. Don't get me wrong, I'm absolutely delighted that people do that because it's almost like a Pavlov reaction that now whenever they see red pandas, they're starting to think of chat tsunami, which don't get me wrong, red pandas, as far as I know, aren't as common walking around. But when they do pop up, it is quite impactful. And that is actually something that I'm quite curious to hear your thoughts on on just about branding as a whole, because do you feel as if that's another issue that new podcasters have when they come into podcasting? They want to try and be popular, but their branding isn't as stellar.
Selecting a Unique Podcast Name
00:34:08
Speaker
GKM Oh yeah, branding is an evolution too. One really just easy tip that I started doing in the beginning is if you have a headshot that people know you buy, you need to have that same headshot on every platform. Just like you have the red panda and people know you buy that, what do people remember about you? And I experimented with from season to season, changing my colors, changing my graphics, but people get attached to the original. People get attached to the red panda, right? So I actually think switching up my graphics too much made it a little bit less recognizable. So I think just stick to the basics. Let's start with if you have one headshot, make sure it's on LinkedIn, make sure it's on Instagram. Are all of your names matching on every platform? My Twitter name was Rina Rina. So then I was like, I should make it Rina Friedman Watts. The same as LinkedIn, the same as Instagram, the same on Twitter.
00:35:11
Speaker
Unfortunately, I wasn't able to grab better call daddy on Twitter. Somebody had it. So I did like better called dad one. But if you can get those names on every platform, that's something to think about with branding and with creating a show is is that name available? How many people have it? Same thing with your website. Do you want dot .com? Do you want dot .ai?
Social Media Etiquette for Promotions
00:35:33
Speaker
There's so many different extensions now. Do you want to own multiple extensions? Because if somebody else wants the name, are you protecting it? Do you want to have different variations of that? Do you want to own all of the domains, right? So in creating a name and a brand, you need to see what's available and who else are you associating yourself with by taking that name.
00:35:54
Speaker
I actually remember my friends and I were working on another project and we were trying to come up with a name for it. Basically, it's it's a podcast thing, but it's not really associated with Chatsunami, but we were trying to come up with a name and one of my friends immediately just slammed his fist on the table and he was like, whatever you do, I am vetoing the name or rather not another ex-podcast.
00:36:20
Speaker
Which, don't get me wrong, if that's what your podcast is called, that's fair enough. But there's a lot of people that call it a kind of ironic name. Oh look, it's a podcast about gaming podcasts. How many people are going to take that? How many people are going to just say, I'm going to choose this name? I love that your red panda story is tied to a good moment with your girlfriend at the zoo. And when you shared that story with me and then connected that to spreading happiness, that's something that's memorable.
00:36:51
Speaker
Honestly I feel as if a lot of, and again it's not everyone because as I said to the indie podcast community yeah as far as I've seen so far, the majority of people have been absolutely fantastic and they have been so supportive but you do get people that you do look at their promotion style. And again, it's obviously not naming any names, not targeting anyone, but you see some of them and you kind of think this isn't the way to do it. Like, have you ever had anybody of just tag you out of the blue? Yeah, just for a new episode. Not even anything to do with yourself or for your content. Just, yeah, I've got a new episode. Let me tag Reena.
Integrating Guests into Branding
00:37:33
Speaker
There's tagging protocols and not everybody knows them.
00:37:37
Speaker
It's a struggle. Tagging manners. Yes, tagging etiquette, as you said. Yeah, tagging etiquette. It's funny because I feel like there's been different versions of that on LinkedIn. Like years ago, everybody tagged each other. Now it's almost like you have to ask if you like to be tagged. I can honestly just imagine that message being like, Dear Sarah Madam, may I tag you in this post? Kind regards.
00:38:02
Speaker
but Hey, try it, that could mix things up. I'm just still thinking about Reena and the red panda. Maybe you could make graphics with your guests with a red panda. I know that's like extra work, but maybe you could create a template like that where you just have like a split screen of if you don't want to show up on the graphic. The guest with the red panda I think is fun. How can you play that up even more? How can you get more of your audience to associate you with spreading happiness and red panda? well Funny enough, when I started the podcast, we did the first 50 episodes live on Twitch, and what I used to have was it was like a picture of the red panda. I'll need to show you something. Fantastic image. But it was a picture of the red panda sitting behind a desk, and there would be a big screen right beside him, and there would be a big thing that said, today's topic, and then underneath it would just be like a blank screen screen that I could put people's
00:39:01
Speaker
images in or things like that. For the longest time I did start using that but then the more and more the podcasts went on. I think by the time the 50th episode aired and that was like the last episode we really did live before we transitioned into a recording them. off air, as it were. There was that. And for my podcast star, I've got two absolutely fantastic artists that do them. One of them is a guy called Arose Carlo from the Philippines, a fantastic guy, but he does like a lot of the chibi artwork for it. honestly, he must be sick of me like every time I have a themed month. I don't know if you've seen the artwork for the theme months, but every time there's a theme month, I always try and shake up the artwork. I always say right it has to be the red panda and whoever I'm on with to make it more theme appropriate and everything and I just keep thinking he must just be looking at his DMs and seeing me pop up and think oh Jesus not this guy again.
Personalized Podcast Intros
00:39:59
Speaker
The only other thing that I did think and I haven't had a chance to use it yet was I thought how do I get one avatar to kind of fit all
00:40:08
Speaker
And I had this idea of an avatar where it was just like this kind of robot with a kind of TV head. And then I thought in that way I could have the name of the person in the box. So for example, like for tonight we're recording this both in Scotland and America. You know, it's as if you're beaming in or like a guest is beaming in to talk, but I do agree. It's definitely something I do need to capitalise on a lot more. It is hard, especially when you're collabing with people, isn't it? You have to not only get the artwork right for yourself and for the show, but you also have to make sure that you're not doing a disservice to the person that have come on your show. Yeah, I feel like my branding is so personalized. Like I've had all of my kids turned into cartoon characters as well. So one of my graphics is like my mom, my dad, and then me, my husband, and all four kids. And all of those cartoons go around the guest's headshot. So that's very personalized to me and my family. And I feel like by putting the guest with my family around them, it's almost like inviting them into my family in some kind of way. I do absolutely love how personal that is and I do think that's fantastic but I'm just laughing because in comparison, I'm looking at my own podcast art and my friend Adam and I, we pretty much did the first 50 odd episodes. or yeah there was a couple that he was out for but I was asking him oh what avatar would you like because if he was going to be part of the show I thought you know I want more of a face on there and I knew he wouldn't want his face so he ended up saying he wanted to be a sandwich. I don't know if you've seen the artwork for his avatar. I love the idea, that's creative. I think I heard you talk about it before, the sandwich. Long story short, it was out of a game called Deadly Premonition where some of the characters go into this diner and they have this horrible looking sandwich and one ah of them says the sandwich is so bad, he calls it the center sandwich. because it's punishing yourself by eating the sandwich and because we got really close over playing that game it was like I want to be a sinner sandwich so I was like right okay you're a sinner sandwich my other friend wanted to be a chippy version of himself like a kind of cutesy cartoony version so I was like right okay you're that I got another friend on for more of the gaming side, but he was very indecisive, so I made him into a panini. Well, I didn't make him into a panini, but that was kind of related to the sandwich. So it's honestly this cartoony over the top. Lightheartedness, I think, is what I would try to get at, because I know for your podcast especially, and I mean after, is it over 300
Milestones in Podcasting Journey
00:42:54
Speaker
episodes that you've done? yeah
00:42:55
Speaker
That is absolutely fantastic by the way. I meant to bring that up earlier but I was looking at the list and I was like wonder how many you've done and I saw it was like over 300. I was like my god I've got about half of that.
00:43:07
Speaker
You should give yourself credit because that's not easy either. It's an uphill struggle wasn't it? I was thinking about what kind of sandwich would I want to be and it's funny because my husband loves to play this game with our kids where when they're little he turns them into hot dogs and so he takes the kid and he puts them between two pillows which are the buns and then he puts relish and salt and pepper and he puts ketchup and mustard and then he mixes it all up all over the kid and then he picks them up in the two pillows and eats them like a hot dog. So I guess if I were to be a sandwich, I would want to be like Reena hot dog. You're what I can't argue with that. That's a good choice.
00:43:45
Speaker
I never actually thought about that question for myself nor has it ever come up when you know they see Adam's avatar and they go, alright, he's a sandwich with a face and they just never ask any questions but I don't know, I mean I'm British so it'd probably be like a boring sandwich, like a sandwich from the local bakery or something like that.
00:44:05
Speaker
Probably not a baguette, I'm not that fancy yet. Going back to something you were saying there earlier, maybe when I get 10,000 please in an episode or something, then I'll just slowly transition into a baguette. But as a closing point though, as I said before, you have done the Better Call Daddy podcast, you have been absolutely fantastic at branding yourself on Twitter and everywhere
Helping Others Start Podcasts
00:44:27
Speaker
else. And am I right in saying this well, you also wrote a thing called Megawatts Productions? Yes, megawatts productions. I help other podcasts come to life. So if you want to start a podcast, I can help you do that. And I really enjoy the entire process from picking out the music to helping with branding to coming up with the guests to being on the recording to packaging the audio ready for broadcast. When I was doing my research for this episode, I was like flicking through the website and they just thought, it is just absolutely fantastic what you do both as a content creator and as someone who supports other podcasters because you do a lot of supporting, I have to say. And I don't mean that in a bad way, by the way, sorry. You really do support a lot of podcasters out there. Thank you. Yeah, it's amazing when you connect with so many other content creators, what can come of that? Just referrals and affiliates and speaking gigs and in-person interviews and events and just all kinds of new ideas. That is why I feel like everyone should have a podcast because you will learn a lot about yourself. It's great for business and you will evolve as a human.
Scripted vs. Unscripted Content
00:45:42
Speaker
I would honestly say that before I started a podcast, I was very self-conscious about my own voice. I was very self-conscious about how I spoke, the way I conducted myself through content creation, especially because honestly, you should see some of the earlier content creation stuff I tried to do. it I was really, I mean, I still am into language learning. And before I got into Twitch streaming, I thought, Maybe I've tried to do content related to language learning and I did a lot of script reading and I don't know how you feel about this. You feel as if it's harder to read from a script as opposed to something like this where it's very much off the cuff and it's quite natural. Oh, yes. And it sounds much different. Can you tell the difference in someone reading a script versus shooting from the hip?
Gaining Comfort in Podcasting
00:46:37
Speaker
Oh 100%. That is like night and day. Some people, don't get me wrong, some people are just that talented. like They were born with the voice of an angel being like, I have the power to hide the fact I'm reading from a script, but there's some people, myself included, because if you listen to my solo episodes especially, you'll hear that maybe I'm a bit more stilted in the way I say things. I am getting better but there's definite with that difference between when I do a solo episode where I actually have to effort into concentrating in what I have to say as opposed to bouncing off somebody else. It's definite. What like can you tell when you hear people? Yes, because one of my clients is a completely scripted show. And so even though I help script it, I usually say to the guest, I know you know the questions. I know you know the answers. Please try not to look at the script because I want it to sound conversational.
00:47:35
Speaker
Because I mean, especially for people starting out, it can be nerve wracking when you want to put out something that's polished and clean and everything. And I do think that is something that people underestimate. You know, it's people don't really realise that it takes a while to get to that level of feeling comfortable. Yeah, that's why I suggest guesting on other people's podcasts before starting your own. I think that's the best order. Get comfortable having conversations, knowing your own story, and just the medium of communicating
Outsourcing for Enjoyment
00:48:08
Speaker
in this way. But before we wrap up, what advice would you give new podcasters out there? Because as I said, you are, and again, I'm not just saying this because you're on, and I always say this to other people, like I'm not just saying nice things because you're on as a guest, but as an accomplished content creator like yourself, the fact that you've done a great job in marketing and supporting other people and especially with your own podcast,
00:48:35
Speaker
What is the one key advice that you would give new podcasters coming into the medium? I would say invest in yourself because if you just want to have the conversations, that piece is hard enough to get good at. So I would say hire somebody to do the things that you don't like doing. If you don't like marketing, if you don't like doing the social media, if you don't like editing, those pieces will hold you up. So find a VA, find an editor, find somebody that can help you with the pieces you don't like doing, and then you can focus on what you do like doing. I had to do that in my own business, but by investing in myself, I got the return. You know what?
Finding Rina's Content Online
00:49:15
Speaker
I couldn't have said it better myself.
00:49:17
Speaker
On that note, Reena, thank you so much for coming on the show tonight and yeah sharing your wisdom on podcasting. Thank you so much. I have loved hanging out with the red panda. Oh no, I've honestly enjoyed having you here. Before we wrap up, where can these lovely listeners at home find your content? BetterCallDaddy.com is my newly made over website and you can find me on Instagram, LinkedIn and Twitter at Reena Friedman Watts.
00:49:44
Speaker
And if you want to listen to more content from ourselves over at Chat Tsunami, you can check us out on the website, chattsunami.com, as well as all good podcast
Finding Chatsunami Content Online
00:49:55
Speaker
apps. Just look for the Raypanda under the name Chat Tsunami and we'll see you there. I also want to give a huge shout out to our Pandalorian patrons, Robotic Battle Toaster and Sonya. Thank you so much for supporting the show. But until then, stay safe, stay awesome, and most importantly, stay hydrated.
00:50:12
Speaker
Welcome to Chatsunami, a variety podcast that discusses topics from gaming and films to anime and journal interests.
Zencastr Sponsorship Mention
00:50:20
Speaker
Previously on Chatsunami, we've analysed what makes a good horror game, conducted a retrospective on Pierce Brosnan's runs James Bond, and listened to us take deep dives into both the Sonic and Halo franchises. Also, if you're an anime fan, then don't forget to check us out on our sub-series, Chatsunani, where we dive into the world of anime. So far, we've reviewed things like Death Note, Princess Mononoke, and the hit Bayblade series. If that sounds like your cup of tea, then you can check us out on Spotify, iTunes, and all good podcast apps. As always, stay safe, stay awesome, and most importantly, stay hydrated.
00:50:54
Speaker
This episode is sponsored by Zencaster. If you're a podcaster that records remotely like me, then you'll know how challenging it can be to create the podcast you've always wanted. That's where Zencaster comes in. Before I met Zencaster, I was put a naive podcaster, recording on low quality, one-track audio waves.
00:51:11
Speaker
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