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Episode 131: Legends... a 3rd part?
133 Plays4 years ago
Hello, Podwalkers, and welcome back to another episode of the Goblin Lore Podcast! And we are back with part two of a look at our friend Jay Annelli's book on the Legends of the Multiverse. This fantastic book is a visual history with plenty of amazing artwork. Perfect for an audio podcast to talk about right?? Also we want to say congrats to Jay on the birth of his child and his amazing roast of Hobbes. Hilariously this week's episode might have made that roast hit a little close to home. Also we talked about this story behind Admiral Beckett Brass
Again we would like to state that Black Lives Matter (with a link to where you can offer support both monetary and not).
We also are proud to have partnered with Grinding Coffee Co a black, LGBT+ affiliated and owned, coffee business that is aimed at providing coffee to gamers. You can read more about their mission here. You can use our partner code for discounted coffee!
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As promised, we plan to keep these Mental Health Links available moving forward too. For general Mental Health the National Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI) has great resources for people struggling with mental health concerns as well as their families. We also want to draw attention to this article on stigma from NAMI's site.
If you’re thinking about suicide or just need someone to talk to right now, you can get support from any of the resources below.
- National Suicide Prevention Lifeline: 1-800-273-TALK (8255)
- Veteran's can Press 1 at anytime to be taken to the Veteran's Line
- Crisis Text Line: Text HOME to 741-741
- International suicide hotlines: A comprehensive resource list for people outside the US.
- IMAlive: Click Chat Now to access a live online network of volunteers through instant messaging.
- TrevorLifeline, TrevorChat, and TrevorText (LGBTQ+ crisis support): 1-866-488-7386, or text “Trevor” to 1-202-304-1200
- Trans Lifeline (US): (877) 565-8860
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You can find the hosts on Twitter: Hobbes Q. at @HobbesQ, and Alex Newman at @Mel_Chronicler. Send questions, comments, thoughts, hopes, and dreams to @GoblinLorePod on Twitter or GoblinLorePodcast@gmail.com.
Opening and closing music by Wintergatan (@wintergatan). Logo art by Steven Raffael (@SteveRaffle).
Goblin Lore is proud to be presented by Hipsters of the Coast, and a part of their growing Vorthos content – as well as Magic content of all kinds. Check them out at hipstersofthecoast.com<
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Transcript
Opening Mishap and Introductions
00:00:30
Speaker
Hello podcasters and welcome to the third episode on the legends of Magic the Gathering. Okay, so I'm sorry, I need to cut in right now and yeah, because it's it's our brand and we're only 20 seconds into this recording. You started by saying podcast by podcasters, not podwalkers. Wow.
00:00:54
Speaker
That's not good. That's that's an important institution in this show. It is an institution I'm going to even just start over most likely going to still lead in leave in like all of this completely nonsensical piece but
00:01:09
Speaker
as is our brand, but we've got a like, you do it is part of, you know, that is something that we cannot ignore. So hello, Podwalkers, and welcome to another episode of the Goblin Lore podcast. Alex and I are coming back at you with the third part of our review of J and Ellie's epic book, Legends of Visual History, as told through a audio only format.
00:01:37
Speaker
So, I am Hobbs Q, pronouns he him. And I thought, Alex, you know, we recorded earlier this week, and you and I were just talking a little bit off air, but I just thought we'd say like, what did you do this past weekend? You know, like, let's show that we do some self care. Sure. So, I'm Alex Newman, phone on Twitter at Mel underscore chronicler, Hobbs is at Hobbs Q.
00:02:00
Speaker
And my pronouns are he him. And and one of the things I finished up this weekend, I was playing it last week, because it just came out.
Indie Game Insights and Personal Anecdotes
00:02:08
Speaker
But this this indie game called unpacking, that just came out this week, it was one of my most anticipated titles of video game releases of this year. And I will let people know that before we had signed on and Alex and I were just kind of talking offline, I thought he was a because he had moved
00:02:25
Speaker
at some point and I know how that can be like where boxes just don't get unpacked and he said he was playing the game unpacking and I assumed that he had found a way to try to like gamify his brain into wanting to unpack and then he was like no no no it's a real game and then you went into like it's one of my most anticipated titles
00:02:45
Speaker
I really enjoyed it. I got to play a demo of it, I want to say last year, early this year, during a PAX or during one of those conventions and things. There were some demos that were available for just people, anyone online, just because of the nature of online cons. That's one of the positives. There's a lot of things we lose by not
00:03:07
Speaker
Being able to have in-person things with the COVID, but that was a good positive. Anyway, that's a whole other thing. But this game is what it sounds like. You kind of follow the life of this person through.
00:03:21
Speaker
the different moves in their life. So you start with the first one, they're a kid getting their first room as a child, and then the next one is like a dorm room. And then as you start to go through all these different moves in their life, and there's years in between, and they tell you the years.
00:03:38
Speaker
this year than 19 whatever and 2000 whatever. So you know how many years but that's all you get the only story you get of what happened in those intervening years is the new items that are coming out of these boxes or the old items that aren't coming out of the boxes anymore. Yeah, this is awesome. Like it would you started describing it? I was like, wow. It's so cool. And, and I was telling like environmental storytelling is a thing that I've, I've come to really appreciate in particularly
00:04:07
Speaker
visual media. You can do it in other places too, but like in movies and shows and things and video games and finding ways to tell a story of the place by what's around. Like a quintessential place that they tend to do this really well as you use typical zombie movie. If you go through your characters are walking through a street, you get to see the barricades and the signs and the
00:04:32
Speaker
Actually, one of my favorite zombie movies, Zombieland, does this very well. They're very good at environmental storytelling in the different scenes and the different locations. But this game has also a lot of environmental character building because you never see the character. You never see the person whose stuff you're moving. There are some photographs and things, but just the graphics of the game, they're not
00:04:56
Speaker
super clear. And also, of course, some of them are going to be family and friends and things. And so you can kind of interpret, you know, the photos that you're sticking on the fridge, which ones might be include the person whose stuff you're moving, but it's, it's really cool to kind of see the story of this person's life through the objects that are being moved, the objects that aren't being moved, the spaces that they're moving into.
00:05:19
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, what'd you just start describing? I was like, Oh my god, so like, it's so cool. I now want to go play a game and packing is literally one of my least favorite things in the world. It's funny, because I don't really like packing. I've moved a bunch. I've moved a lot. But I actually really like unpacking.
00:05:35
Speaker
personally, because see packing, I have to put all my stuff in boxes and it's a lot of work and it's it's and then all my stuff is gone. But unpacking is when I get to go through all of my stuff again. And then I like this game is doing exactly that. Yeah, I find the things that I may have forgotten about I go through and go I forgot I had this movie or this, these pictures from this trip or whatever.
00:05:57
Speaker
And so that was part of why I was like, oh, this game is right up my alley. And yeah, it was really good. It's a pretty quick play, just a few hours, depending on how quick you want to push through it. But I really enjoyed it. That's awesome. So I said, yes, I am Hobbs Q. And Alex was nice enough to give my handle since I forgot it this weekend, because as people know, or may know, if you've heard, listened to the show recently, or listened to the show kind of at all,
00:06:27
Speaker
I am actually having a child in three weeks, child number two, to join Gwen. So we will be finding out more about that, given that we don't have a name or know anything about gender or sex of the baby or anything. And we didn't last time either.
00:06:46
Speaker
So we, Jen and I went to downtown Minneapolis and went and just stayed at a hotel. We had Jen's parents come over and they stayed with Gwen, which Gwen was absolutely excited about. It's her second time doing like a sleepover with grandparents and we're trying to set up because we'll be going into the hospital for an induction and it may be a couple of days, so it's good practice. And we literally just
00:07:10
Speaker
went downtown. We didn't even go out to eat because we're still very cautious with COVID and everything. We literally ordered from a steakhouse downtown and we did an order for pickup and we were embarrassed when we saw the amount of food that apparently sides are because they're for the table.
00:07:29
Speaker
And that meant we ended up with a four-person thing of mashed potatoes, and yet we finished them pretty easily too. Pretty handily, I would say. So yeah, we just went and did that, hung out, and had a view of
00:07:44
Speaker
downtown Minneapolis at night, we were overlooking the target field where the twins would normally play, which is still lit up. And we could see that from our room. And it was just kind of nice to just have a weekend kind of just we don't do this a ton very often. I mean, Gwen's just now getting to the point where that's even a possibility. And then we're going to add in, you know, another kid that makes it even less popular, or possible. I mean,
00:08:12
Speaker
maybe less popular too, but definitely less possible. So yeah. So Alex, we left off having made it through roughly half of the book, a little over half, a little
Magic Lore Recap: A Journey Through Worlds
00:08:27
Speaker
over half. So yeah, going through, um,
00:08:30
Speaker
previous episodes, if for some reason you're picking this one up, we've talked about Ravnica and Dominaria in our first one, and then New Phyrexia, Alara, and Zendikar in the last episode. We're hoping to get to this. I thought that we got through New Phyrexia in the first. Oh, you're right. New Phyrexia was in the first episode. I think we literally only made it through Alara and Zendikar last time. I wasn't actually playing the first time we went to either of those sets, so I don't know how I had so much to say.
00:08:59
Speaker
Well, you know, I tend to talk. It's something I'm good at. Well, we also had the tagline for last week's episode, which was brains that weren't brainy. And I think we are both probably a little bit more relaxed. Not at the end of a workday, both of us coming off of time off or just
00:09:20
Speaker
like weird work Mondays last week. So yeah, our hope is that hopefully we can get through and like the rest is, I think, I think we'll do it, but the more we talk about it and not actually do it, the less likely we're to go.
Innistrad: Gothic Horror Unveiled
00:09:37
Speaker
So let's start talking about Innistrad. Um,
00:09:40
Speaker
What do you want to talk about at Innistrad? Okay, so Innistrad, you don't really like Innistrad, if I remember correctly. This gothic horror is not really your thing. It's not really my thing. I have no problem with it existing, and I know lots of people love Innistrad, and that is great. I think that is a wonderful thing.
00:10:05
Speaker
It's not my thing. It's it's hard for me. I literally and this, this is one of the larger worlds. I think it is outside of maybe Dominaria and Ravnica like this is the one with the most and I have literally one I guess technically two people I want to
00:10:20
Speaker
I guess there's a third I can I can add in there like that's it I don't so I'm gonna start us off by saying cuz we're getting you know, we're basically getting ready for a wedding on On Innistrad Crimson vow is set to come out Very very shortly and actually the first two characters listed here interestingly the big given that this book came out as we know over a year ago are the betrothed of Edgar Mark have who is kind of the the
00:10:48
Speaker
the leader of one of the families of vampires, who basically just goes to sleep for long periods of time. Now, he is kinsman to Sarkin.
00:11:00
Speaker
Or Soren. Definitely not Soren. I was trying to work that one out in my head. And then he is getting married to Olivia Voldaren. Basically they're pulling together two bloodlines and it is interesting because they are the first two listed here. So if people don't know for some reason, Innistrad is a world of werewolves, vampires, angels, humans,
00:11:29
Speaker
Ghosts ghosts spirits. Yeah, let's you know if we want to go kind of broadly well
00:11:37
Speaker
There's this moon there that we should probably talk about at some point, but you don't need to worry about the moon. The moon just affects the tides. What's it going to do? We'll say this again, too. Like at some point, Jay has written a second book that came up right as we started recording about this one. So we're kind of behind, which was specifically about the planes and that one we want to spend. We'll talk about the planes here, too.
00:12:01
Speaker
But we want to try not to leave room for the actual like stories of some of these big and so a lot of like there's a whole conversation about how Innistrad has vampires that are different because we talked about that a little bit with Zendikar where the vampires and zombies that's right zombies we also have zombies here it's a horror is our gothic horror kind of tropes or stories I mean yes and like these are more traditional gothic horror vampires and that's the thing that
00:12:26
Speaker
we could get into more compared contrast. That's the thing that to peek behind the curtain has actually been on our docket. Since we started this show three years ago as a potential show topic that I've never Wow, we should go back to that docket. There might be ideas. There are ideas and some of them are just like, these are great and nebulous and cool. But I have no idea how to turn that into a conversation we can have. But that's,
00:12:51
Speaker
that's one that we might figure out how to hammer out at some point is talking about the parallel evolution sort of actually that's the actual term for two species that like evolve together in the same environment but you know for humans on two different worlds that evolved you know
00:13:08
Speaker
Tarkir and Alara like they start very close you know compared to goblins who are different on lots of worlds vampires who you have a couple different kinds of vampires but they're you know different the Ixalan vampires are different from the Innistrad vampires are different from the Zendikar vampires so there's definitely something to talk about there.
00:13:27
Speaker
But so the main thing to kind of talk about this, there are these angels. I mean, the reason is that we want to mention Avacyn. So there's these sisters of angels, one of whom.
00:13:40
Speaker
Basically, we did not know anything about until recently, which is kind of a cool thing. It was like this lost sister of these angels. Avacyn had basically kind of taken the place of this lost sister. Yes, because Avacyn, these angels existed before on Aenistrad. Then Sorin, who was a planeswalker and also a vampire, decided he needed to protect the humans enough that the vampires didn't
00:14:09
Speaker
you know, kill themselves by extinguishing their food supply and not having any humans to predate upon. So he creates Avison to protect the humans and to be a balancing force. Right to be a balancing force. And there was like a church that basically kind of arose as Avison being kind of the protector of hope.
00:14:30
Speaker
Yes. And these angels, well, three of them at least, ended up sort of folding in with and working with her because she was very powerful built by a pre-mending walker. I think he was pre-mending at the time. I believe so. Yeah. So that was kind of their like, well, this is probably our best way to do the thing we want to do, which is protect people. We'll work with this new angel, this powerful being. But one of them did not fit.
00:14:58
Speaker
No, yeah, the the black and white aligned sister did not fit in well. So that's what we're kind of seeing these the sisters the angels are all kind of aligned it with different color. Yeah, they're all white plus one other white X. Yeah. So basically, we had had kind of the the the white, red and just sell the white blue and bruna and white, green and cigar. And we did not have the white black up until very recently, did we actually get to learn more
00:15:28
Speaker
Mm-hmm commander legends that we actually got to learn about her So the rest are kind of they you know Like they all have that white X piece in it and that the the color combinations where they kind of are Taking on like how they're protecting or how they're kind of working as the angelic protectors Where they become interesting actually the one I want to talk about is brussella because as we mentioned before Emrakul finds her way to Well, basically, yeah Emrakul finds her way to Innistrad
00:15:59
Speaker
That's kind of through the pulling in through the...
Chaos on Innistrad: Emrakul's Impact
00:16:02
Speaker
Well, who called her there? The previous time. Well, that was the previous Innistrad set. We have two sort of disconnected, sort of together sets we're going through right now at the time of recording. As Hobbs mentioned, it was the previous visit back to Innistrad, shadows over Innistrad and Eldritch Moon.
00:16:22
Speaker
was when Emrakul showed up because Nahiri was being mad for lots of good reasons. Yeah. Nahiri wanted vengeance. A lot of vengeance. And so she decides that the best way to get vengeance is to call for an Eldrazi. Yeah. There's
00:16:42
Speaker
Yeah, there's conversations you could be had around making that choice. But that was a choice that was made in the theory being a place of art in this book. So we may talk about that. Yeah, but this doesn't let us because it does mean that because of this.
00:16:58
Speaker
The two angels of Bruna and Gisela fused together into an Aldrich horror of an archangel. And I just think that's pretty awesome. This was when they tried to do a combining of cards. They basically became a supercard if you met certain conditions.
00:17:18
Speaker
which is an interesting, we talked a couple of times about the silver border sets that when they are printed, the silver border cards, whatever they're doing with the cards cannot be something that could exist in black border because otherwise they're eating up.
00:17:34
Speaker
development space that could be used in Black Border, but Silver Border can be a good place to test out weird mechanics because they don't have to make them fit in the rules. They just have to explain it well enough that people can play it. And that was the very first unglued set was Big Furry Monster. It was a card so big, it was a $99.99 for 15
00:17:56
Speaker
black mana it was so big it actually was two cards so you couldn't play it unless you had both halves in your hand and yeah and so and they did some cool stuff with um this set where with double faced cards where they actually combined not only double faced but they combined
00:18:14
Speaker
to make a giant card. Well, and that's how they did it. That's how they sort of ported that into black border is these were individual, you know, double face cards, but they had a normal front face that can be played on their own. But if you had both in play, and you hit certain conditions, you could then flip them or I don't think you technically flip them, but then you merge them or whatever mechanic name was, and they become then the giant two part card.
00:18:40
Speaker
that's on the back and actually we have we have two of those in the book two of those in this and my other favorite is the fact that the other one is Hanware which is a location and it's a garrison that basically gets corrupted by the Eldrazi and it's an entire township yes it becomes like a murderous village I was going to mention that it was it's our only location that shows up in our legends book
00:19:03
Speaker
um because it's it's a there's a creature a non-legendary creature and a legendary land i believe that again if they're both in play and you meet certain criteria they merge together and become henworth riding township which is just great word play there too like
00:19:24
Speaker
for naming that the writhing township is very very eldritch horror which is what we kind of get you that was when there was a transition you had the classic gothic horror world kind of became cosmic horror for a set
00:19:37
Speaker
Yeah, it was kind of – there's a lot of discussion and this gets back into planes and I think also story. But that happened. I think we're going to save that because I think there is something to be said just for Innistrad in general. So where I – there's things that I love about Innistrad and part of it may just be it's one of my favorite original draft sets. Like original Innistrad is one of my favorite draft sets.
Zombies of Innistrad: Necromantic Styles
00:20:02
Speaker
This gets us more into the planes, though. So we'll just talk about—there's Giroff and—I literally don't know how to pronounce her name. I think it's Gisa, but I thought it was Gisa. I don't know. I've known what I'm basing that on. No. So it might be Gif—I mean Gisa.
00:20:20
Speaker
I'm not sure. It could be Giza. No, I think it is Giza, but they are twins, the twins of Giza and Giroff. They're basically mad scientists. They're pretty awesome. Giroff is more the mad scientist. Giza is more the traditional necromancer. But that's an interesting thing, and maybe we'll talk
00:20:44
Speaker
here it's characters we can talk about it a little bit with these two but it's also a lens into an aspect of the world where you talk about different vampires different goblins and different worlds well this world being this classic horror there's two different kinds of zombies yes there are in this same world so you have black which the black zombies tend to be the more classic necromancy magic reanimating corpses as opposed to the blue is sort of the the frankensteinian
00:21:10
Speaker
you know about you know stitched together yeah i say a lot of those black cards with with stitching in them um they are like these prized amalgams i mean i think it's a cool card name one of the like the yes it's an actual card name yep so like giraffe like it's basically been stitching these back using alchemy to make zombie
00:21:31
Speaker
He still is a necromancer, but he's like using more servants. He's grassy. Yeah, the bluer sciency side of it as opposed to the black sort of dark magic more side of it.
00:21:45
Speaker
And I love that for Gisa that we're basically saying that she focuses on quantity of zombie servants over quality. And that kind of fits, you know, you look at, you kind of go back into sort of the old fantasy and, and old stories you go find out like of how those two different types of zombies work, that's kind of
00:22:08
Speaker
what you do the, you know, when you make Frankenstein's monster, that's a bigger, it's an investment thing is right. You wanted lots of small ones towards Yeah, they're, you know, you use the word hoard that quantity over quality definitely fits. And I think it's kind of cool to have these be twins that are, you know, and there's we even get them on a card together. And it's interesting. They're,
00:22:33
Speaker
Two of, at least the ones I've heard talked about the most, there's a lot of characters who were flavor text for a long time, and then Future Sight and Other Times Hard Block did a lot of this, where they turned a lot of flavor text-only characters into actual card characters. But these were two big ones, Jiralf and Gisa. They were flavor text characters through the original Innistrad block, didn't have their own cards until a Commander set. That was, I want to say 2015, where they did monocolored decks.
00:23:02
Speaker
And then now we've, like you said, we've seen a card with both of them in one of the actual Innistrad sets. Yeah. This is where those set symbols, Eldritch Moon. It's interesting to see how they combine their abilities kind of together. Because there's a lot to do with the style that is
00:23:25
Speaker
do with the alchemy and the the giraffe side is like filling your graveyard it's a lot more there's like mill for advantages um and you know that what's interesting is they kind of come up as almost the that i guess this
00:23:41
Speaker
We had a previous big zombie warrior that was the big blue-black that was Grimgrin. Grimgrin was actually killed. I know that just because we're coming back to it, there's a lot of jokes about that because people want more Grimgrin. I mean, can't you have a zombified zombie? Do zombies really ever fully die? I don't know.
00:24:03
Speaker
Um, but we do get the two sisters, we get the brother and sister basically together and to combine their two abilities is kind of a cool, to me is a cool thing with looking at, like you said, the two different styles of zombies here. Yeah. And it's, it's cool to see that. And actually we're seeing that in.
00:24:22
Speaker
I can't remember which of these Innistrads. One of the more recent Innistrads, we get to see that with, if I was going to talk about this, I should have prepared their names. The green and red, they were partners from Commander Legends. They are partners in business and life. And life, but they have a card. Helena and Elena are getting a card now. Thank you for rescuing me there. No problem. They have a combined card as well. I hadn't thought about that. They're not in the book. We're not supposed to be talking about it, Alex. That's an interesting thing that
00:24:53
Speaker
How do you find the abilities? Well, and I'm just always fascinated by different ways that Wizards decides to sort of do story informing mechanics and forming story, informing cards back and forth. And like, doing the Giza and Jarelf card is, to the best of my knowledge, one of the first times where they took, it might be the first time, but I may be wrong here, where they took two individual characters who had their own cards and then put them together into a single card.
00:25:19
Speaker
Which is an interesting thing to see like two characters represented on a single card. Yeah. And right now they're doing it again on the same world. So it's back in a straw again, is where this is happening for the second time.
00:25:33
Speaker
It is more coincidental. But it's it's it's an interesting thing to know. It works. I mean, that's kind of a cool thing to be thinking about. Like, how do you represent more than one character on a single card? And it's a way to it from a from a purely mechanical sort of meta textual level two, it's a way to build more design space.
00:25:54
Speaker
as well. Now, it's a thing that I would guess they want to be a little more limited in because having that individual character is sort of iconic for what a legend is.
00:26:04
Speaker
That's the whole point of sort of how the commander format works. You have this singular legend who is the leader of these 99 other cards, but it is cool to pull that out of their back pocket on occasion when they decide it's appropriate to say, well, let's combine. What would happen if these two work together and then create a single card for two characters like that?
00:26:26
Speaker
So the last one that we have here is Ulrich. Ulrich is a werewolf. And this, like I said, this was the set that we really got to get werewolves with this idea of a mechanic between day and night. And they've kind of done it a couple of different ways. The most recent set is even changing it a bit so that we have werewolves that are day bound versus night bound.
00:26:48
Speaker
It's all mechanically kind of works similarly. It's based on spells being cast, basically transform, except now with day and night, it kind of stays day and night. But it is this way that we get like human werewolves. So there's still werewolves, but human on one side and then a werewolf only on the other side. And Ulrich is kind of the one of the mainies, Ulrich of the Kralenhord. And Ulrich is
00:27:15
Speaker
there is kind of this interesting thing that people have been wanting a legendary werewolf to be able to play as kind of a commander, right? Because that is a tribe that did not really have this. No, they didn't get one on the original Innistrad. No, that was Yeah, the original Innistrad, we had a planeswalker with Arlen, but we did not get a legendary creature and Ulrich was that
00:27:40
Speaker
So Ulrich Does not return to civilization when he returns to human form he stays in the woods or in the wild so most of our werewolves when they are in human form actually are like part of civilization kind of as we kind of think of versus Ulrich who stays in out in the wilds, so Okay, Alex we could leave in a Strad. Yeah, you want to So
00:28:07
Speaker
And again, I apologize for anyone who loves the set and things. It's funny because I say there wasn't as much for me. I talked a lot about mechanics because there's a lot of mechanically, to me, mechanically interesting things going on there. But story-wise and character-wise, there's less for me to engage with.
00:28:29
Speaker
Yeah. So versus this hat. Yeah. So let's let's move because you have more to
Theros: Greek Mythology in Magic
00:28:34
Speaker
say on theory. I definitely have more to say on theros. I we're gonna I'm gonna laugh because Alex, we literally just talked about how we didn't know when they put multiple people on the same card.
00:28:46
Speaker
Well, yes, but you'd notice how they didn't have previous cards before. So they specified that. So rather than talking around this thing, Theros, if Innistrad was something that didn't appeal to me too much, like Greek Mythologies, the other side, that's something that I've been interested in since I was young. It's something that I really thought was cool. And actually, Theros came out shortly after I came back to Magic. I started playing in Gatecrash.
00:29:14
Speaker
So I'll play a little bit with the Return to Ravnica Innistrad block, and then Theros came out. That's the one standard rotation that I actually played a lot. But then the very first characters in this section are Kynell and Tiro, which honestly is possibly the only entry in this book that has two characters in a single entry. But they were...
00:29:38
Speaker
A commander, when they did the four-color commander decks, Kainos and Tiro were the not black, so it was blue, red, green, white commander. These two, they were in the story. There was a couple of cards that referenced them. You notice Guardians of Miletus is one of the cards that give the art in this section of the book and their section. But these two were
00:30:06
Speaker
Well, the original art the guardians art is like them is like statues, you think of kind of like more of the range heading. Because they were they were warriors who lit an uprising against a tyrant. They, you know, what says here, you know, spurred by their love for each other and for their people, they lit an uprising against a tyrant. They say it got us appeared before them and they built this city.
00:30:31
Speaker
And so that's why there were statues of them, because they were the founders of Miletus, one of the major cities in Theros. And they... So, A, there's a few things. It's really cool to have them. They're characters that were referenced that got a card later. They're two...
00:30:52
Speaker
openly gay men in Magic, which is cool to see that being represented. The four-color thing, we talked about that in our last recording because we talked about like three of the five, I think, were in that section, at least two of them. And so we talked a lot about that there, so I don't know we need to rehash too much of that now, but that was a really cool thing that
00:31:16
Speaker
We now have four color commanders that can build, people can build those color combinations. And honestly, I really like the car too, because there's land-centric mechanics, and that's one of my go-tos when I build commander decks. I love things that sort of build around lands.
00:31:35
Speaker
I mean, they're like become like the preeminent in some ways group hug commanders. So yeah, that's kind of a cool piece about their mechanics. And yep, and there's that too, because it's not only like land stuff for yourself, but they also give, you know, cards or drop land drops to to the rest of the table. So they're they're big for that too.
00:31:52
Speaker
So the next that we have is Daxos. And Daxos is an Oracle of the God, which is kind of cool because he actually is somebody that finds a spirit, a kindred spirit in Elspeth, which is kind of because she is so unsure of her place in this world. And like, it's kind of like they were actually in love because that Xenogos cast a spell on Elspeth, making her believe that she was lashing out at fire, actually a monster, only to find she had slain her lover basically in Daxos.
00:32:20
Speaker
uh and she makes a pact to bring Daxos back but when he comes back from the underworld he is devoid of his identity which is just like really really depressing and sad like i don't know he's like he is the tragic kind of this is where we get the tragedy of of
00:32:41
Speaker
And actually, is Daxos one that we now get? We have three versions of Daxos? Yeah, I was going to note that too. We've only had two trips to Theros, but because Daxos returned was a commander product.
00:32:55
Speaker
Legend, he actually has three representations and all different color combos because he was white-blue in his original, white-black as Daxos the Returned, and then Daxos Blessed by the Sun, which is where Heliod restores him to life and so he's no longer one of the Returned, which are different sort of zombies in Theros.
00:33:17
Speaker
He wants to care about the enchantment theme, which is a cool piece to all of. Yeah, that's a big part of the sort of world building in Theros. They used like, enchantment creatures or just enchantments in general to sort of be part of the effect of the gods being part of the world. Like, and that's a very Greek mythology thing too, where the gods were very present in the events of the world.
00:33:43
Speaker
Well, and this is where we first got God, right? That's right. Actually, God creature type. Yes, as opposed to, you know, we had creatures and beings that were referenced as gods, you know, Yagmoth being worshiped you, you had we talked last time about progenitus.
00:33:59
Speaker
And he had progenitus as well as a being of myth, but like the actual creature type. So, Mistform Ultimis became a god when Theros launched. That's an old school reference there if you want. Mistform Ultimis being... Every creature type. Legends, like the first creature ever printed, like way before... No, no, no, no, definitely not. It's not Legends.
00:34:23
Speaker
No, no, not legends, legions. I thought you said legends. I thought it was legions, but it was that lock. It is legions. Yeah, and there were mist-formed creatures that could gain all creature types, but Mist from Ultimis was a legendary creature that straight up just had passive ability types.
00:34:41
Speaker
And now we have the changelings of Lorwin are like that as well. But so for a long time, Wizards would maintain a Mistform Ultimis watch on the website and whenever new creature types. That was basically just their way of saying, hey, we have new creature types added to the comprehensive rules. But it was a fun, flavorful way of saying, well, Mistform Ultimis is now
00:35:02
Speaker
Yeah, so so Daxos kind of gets goes through these different Iterations and I laugh because there's a lot of people like the Daxos then is given nicknames so you can remember Which Daxos it is, you know, like hot Daxos versus a cold echo Daxos
00:35:20
Speaker
Uh, and I said, since we're talking about the gods, Heliod is, so in this set, we, we got white, we got a god of each color. Um, so each, basically it was to represent kind of those different domains of the Egyptian pantheon. The Greek. Greek.
00:35:38
Speaker
We'll get to Egyptian when we get to Amonkhet. That is true, which is that even in here? Yes. Okay, cool. Oh, that's right, because they forget about Nicol Bolas again. That's right. But Theros has – so Heliad is kind of the interesting in some ways of where –
00:35:57
Speaker
Yeah, because they get to through the story not to go through too many details of his story, but he's model white and also a big jerk. Yeah, like kind of that that like where white can go wrong. Yeah, they get to they get to make sort of a model white villain though he wasn't really well he was the main villain I suppose of theros beyond death but
00:36:19
Speaker
of the original Theros block, he wasn't really the main antagonist, that was Xenogos, but Heliod was kind of the big jerk, even more so than I think Xenogos. Even Xenogos didn't quite do the same dirty things where you're like, really?
00:36:34
Speaker
Yeah, no, no. Well, Heliod's mad because this isn't interesting because we had our first kind of gods versus planes walkers scenario or situation and, and basically, you know, she shows up with his old his weapon, which had been lost the history kind of thing else Beth had she showed up with it. And he basically tried to send her on like an impossible task because he was jealous and pissed that she had his reference. Yeah, yeah.
00:37:00
Speaker
So yeah, so we get kind of the, we had Erebos as the other guide in here. There's a number of others, but not in the book. I do want to very quickly mention Hythonia, because honestly, it's almost because I don't have anything to say about Hythonia. Hythonia in particular, maybe, maybe seated for something. This is,
00:37:29
Speaker
sort of this is like speculation about speculation but again one of the things about these books is a there's going to be some very major pivotal people in these represented they want to show us these different planes they want to show us all these people but there are so many characters in so many places and magic they can't put everything so you have to you have to pick and choose to some degree
00:37:50
Speaker
And so the fact that they decided to put hyphenia in this book, who is a Gorgon, was a legendary creature in Theros, to the best of my knowledge, had like two or three cards associated with her. And that's it through four sets. So I'm really curious why Theros, which was a set of legends, like there was a lot of legends in this set, because that's, that's, there's a lot of heroes that it goes back to Greek mythology, it fits sort of the flavor they were trying to capture. It's really curious to me that hyphenia was put in here.
00:38:20
Speaker
I don't know that we're going to get anything. Nothing may happen to that. Maybe that's one that Jay just wanted to stick in. But Thonia, this queen of the Gorgons, is an interesting inclusion in this book, is all I'm saying. Is what you're hypothesizing. Yeah, that's maybe in three years we get back to Theros and something's happened with Thonia. Maybe we don't ever see her again.
00:38:40
Speaker
So we talked about some of these planes we can go through pretty quickly. The next one, Fiora, is more interesting for us to come back to discussing as a plane. Yeah. The main legend, we've already talked about Grenzo. We talked about Grenzo a lot. Yeah. And we even brought in both King Brago and Queen Martetra, so you can go back and listen to our episode on Grenzo. They're in here, we think they're in here as main sceneings, because this is the plane of conspiracy and there's a lot of intrigue and this sets us up.
00:39:11
Speaker
And those two sets are very popular for what they did. They're a very weird thing. I love those two sets. If you never got a chance to play conspiracy or conspiracy, whatever number two was called, you should check them out. Take the throne or something like that. Take the throne, yeah.
00:39:27
Speaker
because they're group drafts so you don't just draft like normal drafts can be fun I love drafting but you draft and then you play in three and four person games and so what you're doing is very different and they also put in some weird draft matters stuff but that's a whole
00:39:44
Speaker
Yeah, given Alex's we've managed to say every single time. This is I think this speaks to the fact that why we chose to do this book, we literally thought that it would take us two episodes. I was thinking one episode. Oh, that's right. Yeah, that's very fair. You thought one episode and
00:40:01
Speaker
I think it speaks to kind of, you know, we joked at the end of last episode that we have to have Jay on. Like we just ended on a cliff about like needing to have Jay on. And part of this is Jay is somebody whose work we've just respected for a very long time. I mean, he's like the gatekeeper of lore in some ways. I mean, keeping a lot of this stuff straight. And even then, you know, I think it shows that we've managed to get through three more planes.
00:40:27
Speaker
one of which was Fiora that we just kind of dismissed, and we're closing in on 40 minutes. I mean, we're at some point, like, it's there's so much in this book. I mean, I think that this is what it shows is we keep thinking we're going to get further along. And part of it is, and I think
00:40:43
Speaker
It's hard. Well, it's hard, but I mentioned this in one of our past recordings too, and I love when we get things like this to talk about because there's lots, as I mentioned in this episode when I was talking about our document, there's lots of things that it's like, these are really cool 10-minute conversation.
Acknowledging Magic's Lorekeepers
00:41:00
Speaker
This would be a really cool 10-minute conversation.
00:41:01
Speaker
Well, that's not an episode. Right. We want we want 40 to 60 ish minutes of an episode. But so this book is a whole book of those sort of small little pieces. And it gives us a framework to like string together 10 of these conversations that are like several minutes each.
00:41:22
Speaker
Yeah, I mean that's that's that's what it's turning into because each time we get going we start finding these these elements that are interesting and just yeah, we talked about a little bit about this about the the actual book itself and you know what what Wizards is trying to do with this and then when we get to the planes one and how we think that they could be well we know for a fact that there's stuff that has been in here that was like
00:41:45
Speaker
you maybe didn't know why, and then what we found is within last year, it was actually something that was relevant to new projects. This is something where if you watch the product releases, the sets that come out, that happens a lot, particularly in the commander sets, the modern masters, the modern horizons, or maybe not modern masters, but the modern horizons, things where they're making new cards that aren't part of standard, those sets
00:42:14
Speaker
They are always pulling things from places all over the multiverse. Sometimes just because, like, oh, this is just a good fit. But sometimes it is seeding something new. Or it's keeping it in the memory.
Tarkir: Dragons and Timelines Explored
00:42:30
Speaker
You go back a number of Commander sets. We've had Legends from Kamig...
00:42:36
Speaker
Kamigawa through – I don't know how many of them, most of them I would say. And now, just in the last several months, we've learned that there's a new Kamigawa set coming out in 2022.
00:42:57
Speaker
Kamigawa versus... There's a lot of whole things within that whole thing. But just that I mean, there's these things, or look, Tarkir happens a lot. You'll see at least the last few commander-related sets. They will have people not only from Tarkir, but from both timelines in Tarkir, because that was a big feature of that set.
00:43:23
Speaker
And we've mentioned that in past episodes that this like multiple timeline thing and I mean it's fine when we start with Tarkir it flat out starts with the course of Tarkir's history begins on Dominaria with the Elder Dragons Ugin and Bolas because they're twins and you know like they like Bolas killed his brother in a rage Ugin was reborn and restored as a spirit who found his home on the plane of Tarkir away from his brother but like
00:43:52
Speaker
There's this whole cool thing then where when Nicol Bolas discovered where his brother was and was plotting, he appeared on Tarkir to kill him again and then when Ugin dies,
00:44:03
Speaker
Basically, this whole civilization that had been planned around dragons falls. Yeah, the dragons just all die out. Right. Over time, they're haunted out. So we have like this book goes through and gives us and talks about kind of these dragons. This is where we got more elder dragons again. So I think that thing is a big thing to be thinking about the I think
00:44:25
Speaker
Only three of them are listed here, but it's the same sort of thing that we had color pairs of. There were actually two color pairs of dragons. There were five of them. This is where we got clans. So this is where we started getting some different names for two color pairs. Well, and this is the concept arc here is where we got the shard or the wedges were named for the first time. We talk about the shards and Alara.
00:44:47
Speaker
And so yeah, let's just get Tarkir on because there's a lot of world things to talk about in Tarkir. My god, there's a lot of world things. And we're gonna try not to get into that. Let's not because Tarkir is one that you and I could go forever. But for character wise, Elesha. We got to talk about Elesha first. Yeah, first first character in the section. So that is helpful. It is helpful. And yes, and we for a reason.
00:45:10
Speaker
Yes, well, and Alesha is the first open trans character in Magic. A big deal is made about her claiming her name. I mean, it is this idea of taking the name when she became Alesha. She chose that name on the battlefield through her skill as a warrior. And that was part of the culture of the clan as well, but it's also a very important moment.
00:45:38
Speaker
for, you know, this trans character to come out and say claim, this is who I am. This is my name. This is my identity. And she took her name from her grandmother, her grandmother. So there's there's like actual like familial history to the name as well. Yeah.
00:45:55
Speaker
We have Zurgo is real cool because it's Orcs. This is the return of Orcs to magic. Both Orcs and goblins on target. Yes. Early sets had Orcs but a really weird thing and this I guess is more world thing but they were all pretty bad and then they stopped making Orcs so it was really cool to see Orcs back. We can talk about them more.
00:46:16
Speaker
Zurgo was also interesting to a case study of how he changed during the timeline, because Zurgo, the clan leader of the Mardu, was big and burly and powerful. And then Zurgo Bellstriker, the messenger of the
00:46:39
Speaker
I can't think of the name. The Colegon. Colegon, thank you. So basically when we moved from kind of these clans to the... Well, we moved to these... Yeah, sorry. Headed by the dragons. Yeah, the ones that are headed by the dragons. There's a pivot set in the middle where Sark and Vol goes back in time and Marty McFly's timeline and then comes back to the future and now the clans, rather than being three-color wedges... Are two. There are two-color pairs following the dragons as opposed to a world with no dragons.
00:47:08
Speaker
And so then you get to see a number of characters. Tigam is another one. He was in the story, he's in the book here, but he was in the story only. But then they actually created two Tigam cards, a white-blue in the current timeline and a blue-black in the past, the rewritten timeline, who were in two different Commander decks in the same year, if I remember correctly. So you got to see them compared to each other right there.
00:47:35
Speaker
Right. Um, the other cool ones, you know, uh, oh, she's not even mentioned here. So I guess we can't talk about her. Nevermind. Yeah. Yeah. We're not going to talk about an our set. We're not going to talk about the fact that she went from a creature to a planeswalker, which yes, that was a very cool. Maybe we just say anything about it. We just heard on the Kaladesh. Yeah. We just went on to Kaladesh. Um, Kaladesh being the important,
00:48:02
Speaker
You know, we get Pia in LR, which is Chandra's mom. So this is Chandra's home world, basically.
Kaladesh: Characters and Representation
00:48:13
Speaker
Pia is one of the few characters to get four pages. There's a couple in this book, but that is how significant she is in here. You get the same two little paragraphs that most people, most of these characters get about two paragraphs, but then you get several pages of art with her and her husband, her and Chandra. It's very nice.
00:48:32
Speaker
It is really nice and because she she is interesting in that she was like locked away after her daughter like basically her husband gets killed and then Chandra sparks and disappears and basically she gets locked up and then basically where we come back into this is where she is. You know.
00:48:54
Speaker
She has been locked in a secret consulate prison. And when she's released, she kind of joins these renegades, which is when Chandra comes back.
00:49:03
Speaker
Yep, and then the Gatewatch sort of get involved, and there's the whole thing. That's the Kaladesh Aether Rupal storyline. Because they knew Tezzeret was there, and Bolas was poking around, so they went to sort of investigate that. I think they also… Yeah, too much story there. And Chandra just went there. Chandra just wanted to go home. I think they sort of stumble upon the whole Tezzeret thing. They do.
00:49:25
Speaker
So we do get to see the other ones in here. Padeem, who's a Vadalkan. We have Vadalkans because they are the Artificers. And this is a plane that is really about invention. There's actually a fare going on. Sram is here. So this is where we got vehicles. And Sram is kind of an edificer. I like that it's an edificer, not an artificer. And that's basically because he's working on infrastructure and all of the equipment and stuff. Yeah.
00:49:59
Speaker
Yeah, we talked about the aetherborn previously. And so it's cool to see an aetherborn, you know, present here, gonti in particular, sort of this under kingpin underbelly, you know, criminal enterprise, it's kind of neat to see that. And if you haven't listened, I do highly recommend the the two partner we did on the aetherborn is another one to do with kind of, you know,
00:50:21
Speaker
with the gender identity. And that's so we talked a lot more about Ganti there. And I would highly recommend going back. Yeah, and the aetherborn in general, their whole history, like I think the aetherborn are really cool from a fantasy. I love that magic is for multiple things. Like, hey, it's really nice to see the aetherborn are generalists. We're talking about it. We're not really talking about it. We're, I think we're talking like everyone knows it. And not necessarily, but he does the aetherborn are generalists. There's some that choose a gender.
00:50:51
Speaker
because everyone else on the plane by and large is gendered so I think that's a thing that some of them that fits for them but by and large the aetherborn are they them they're genderless they're fantasy species they they live for like three to four years it's there's a whole thing I I love them from a
00:51:11
Speaker
to creating more fantastical things in the world going beyond orcs and elves and humans, which is cool. I love dwarves. I love orcs and elves and humans, but I also really like to see magic branching out and creating very unique things that fit their worlds that are very different and kind of developing the fantasy story of the world. As we're talking about this for this, I think it's interesting to note that
00:51:40
Speaker
What we talked about in our episode with F. Neitzda is that that is about an aetherborn who is able to extend this life because they know exactly how long they have to live. Gandhi is somebody who specifically sought out ways to extend their life. And so from this, it's kind of this interesting thing of like a way to kind of like, Gandhi wants to expand their own life.
00:52:09
Speaker
Okay, where are we at? What are we doing? We got a few left. There's a few left, but all these have just a couple, so let's just see if we can do this. Amaket is Egypt. It's an Egyptian plane, and we got gods again. It's made better.
00:52:32
Speaker
in his, literally in his image, is he is ever present are always like in the hit the background. It's all it's a whole thing. Yeah. Didn't get a page on this chapter. I think somehow Nicole Bullis wasn't a creature when he was
Amonkhet and Ixalan: Gods and Pirates
00:52:46
Speaker
there. And so maybe that's why. Yeah. Okay.
00:52:49
Speaker
So Hazorette, who I really want to talk about here. It's a cat god. Cat god. She's not only a cat god, but Hazorette is the mono red god on this plane. And I want to talk about how cool it is, because we mentioned, and I can't remember what it was, but I love how the sort of color pie, the color identities are starting to be stretched. So we talk about, you know,
00:53:15
Speaker
Why am I blanking on the Sun God from Theros? A Heliod. Heliod being a big old jerk and kind of the bad guy for a lot of the time he's on the screen as a mono-white planeswalker. But then we get to the Egypt world with Hazoret, who is a red god.
00:53:30
Speaker
red typically being the color of goblins and chaos and things but also passion and you know protectiveness and so and creativity and all these other things and so Hazoret is actually during this during the events of this whole thing Hazoret is the last god that
00:53:49
Speaker
was survived the benevolent God. Yes, is a benevolent God to begin with. But also of all of them is the last to survive. And we see Hazoret becoming the protector, the soul protector of the people of Abenkhet. And it's like, I think weird because they didn't need anything. They didn't need to be protected from anything. She wanted to be there in case. Yeah, just in case.
00:54:13
Speaker
Ball is tears everything apart and they need someone to protect them in the desert ever gonna be used Yeah, exactly that's there. Yeah, it's so great. It doesn't yeah, so it's just like it can't the joke here being that Hobbs is a fan of bullets bullets is kind of a bad guy, but I just who might not have a lot of background with our podcast so I love that you have
00:54:42
Speaker
has right in that position. And honestly, I really enjoyed Amonkhet. I have other worlds that are like probably my favorite to spend time in general, but this is one of my, one I'm looking forward to most from the story standpoint, because I really, I want to see what happens to this society. I want to see how they develop and how they rebuild.
00:55:00
Speaker
with the influence of this model Red God trying to be their protector, which she is, and is very good at that. But white is generally not a good color, is in opposition of order. Red is in opposition of white.
00:55:16
Speaker
White being the color of order, usually the color of laws, that's where you get like, Miletus was blue-white. They're structured and lawful and this is their things. And it's not that red can't exist in a society, it's just that often red isn't as good at building those structures.
00:55:33
Speaker
that some people need, or that some things, you know, your infrastructure, you got to have organization to make sure your aqueducts are getting things from your water from point A to point B. And that's something that White's very good at. Red isn't as good at that. So I'm just really curious to see how this this group of survivors sort of rebuild and what happens with Hazoret as their
00:55:58
Speaker
I also think it's pretty awesome that the cat is red, that just gets very appropriate. Yeah, that's fair. So we have Ixalan, the pirate world, kind of the pirate dinosaur world. Pirate dinosaur, which kind of overshadows the vampires and the merfolk, but that's weird because we have them everywhere. But it's a very interesting plane. It's a plane that planeswalkers through machinations of somebody, once again, not important.
00:56:26
Speaker
not important which bolus it was i mean but but basically planeswalkers were getting like trapped here so like once they were here they couldn't leave yeah and in fairness that ends up here with no memory that wasn't kind of bolus's fault no that's a whole other thing he might want that ability but it's not his fault one thing i think is interesting there and again this is maybe for the next episode but lynda is
00:56:52
Speaker
Black, white, she's the leader of these vampires on Ixalan. It's interesting to see vampires in white because that's not a place where they are very often. Doesn't make them good necessarily, but it is a different representation of how they can
00:57:08
Speaker
work. We also get Beckett brass, Admiral Beckett brass, who is a female who this is one that people talk about, like the differences in art styles, because she has been depicted in different ways, which is interesting because of her, she is not a, like, a typical magic body type. Yes. And one thing I love about this, well, and the artist said,
00:57:35
Speaker
Can he say Jason Rainbow? He says he would model it after his... His mom? I believe it was, yeah. It is. Which A is just so cool and incredible, but it also reminded me of something, and I want to tangent just a second because I thought this was amazing. There's an author named Scott Lynch whose books I really enjoyed, but his second book has a middle-aged woman pirate.
00:57:59
Speaker
captain. And so some writer, some reader, you know, typical, but sort of internet person was talking about how, you know, this is an unrealistic stereotype of political correctness. Real pirates can't be controlled by women. There's this whole thing. And so his response was just like,
00:58:22
Speaker
You know what? Yeah, this middle-aged mother of two is wish fulfillment fantasy. And you know what? So what? Why should middle-aged mothers get wish fulfillment characters? Yeah. Everyone else does. And so he went on this whole thing, this whole reaction about that. I love that. And this is a very similar thing. It's like, yep. So she's very, as you say, Hobbs, different body type, different, you know, than we normally see represented, especially as like a pirate, as someone who's in the action and stuff. And it's like, cool. I think it's amazing. That's fantastic.
00:58:51
Speaker
And Jason has a very awesome thread about her. So he had kind of said this back when he did the original art in 2017. He said that, you know, Admiral the Pirate Fleet and my mom finally got to put her in a painting. And then she actually has, since I believe, passed away.
00:59:13
Speaker
And he has a very, very awesome thread. And I'm actually just going to link this thread because it is a very beautiful one, um, when, when he did lose his mom. Um, so it is just, from that as a stat standpoint, like it was one of these, it was like, it actually is an amazing to see the art match up with kind of this character. Um, and, and what her role was as the pirate and why he chose his, his mom for that representation.
00:59:42
Speaker
Yeah, no, just fantastic. We got L-Drain.
00:59:50
Speaker
And Eldraine, the last two here, I think were both like the most recent sets that came out. I think they're just trying to give us some recent things that people who are just buying booster packs had recognized. I do want to mention King Eld... King Kenrith. His first name, I'm going to stumble on. Kenrith the Returned King is his card.
01:00:15
Speaker
A, it was kind of a cool card, but it was a weird thing, because I think it was a Biobox bonus. But Mono white card, but he has activations of all five colors. So this is, I think, Wizards. They did a little bit of it early on, but in the last two years, like really kicked up playing around with color identity like that to give Commander more options without like, while still using the color pie to sort of separate certain things. So it's like, if you can play this in the two color standard deck,
01:00:43
Speaker
you don't get the other color activations unless you find ways to do it. But one of the things, gosh, it feels weird that it's this late, but I guess magic doesn't represent a lot of marriage and couples, you tend to get like orphans and things. That's typical fantasy. Because one of the things about the Kenrith family is it's a mixed race family. Yes. With Kenrith and Queen Linden on the next page.
01:01:12
Speaker
That's cool to see that representation there. And she's also an amazing like within her own right. She is incredible. Her story, her card is really cool. And she has a lot of stuff to kind of do herself. I have not finished reading this book. But from what I understand, well, I mean, even the card Kenrith, the return to King suggests that he was missing for a while. And there's a lot of work that Queen Linden did to kind of hold this kingdom together.
01:01:37
Speaker
Yep. So our last plane is a Korea, which is kind of our kaiju plane. And that is kind of what we have mainly represented here. We have the humans. Yeah. And there's like these bonds between humans and week. Yeah, there were there was some story like it represented you kind of had the three factions, you had the major monsters, the kaiju, you had the humans kind of led by General Kudrow, who kind of wasn't a nice person.
01:02:02
Speaker
the human race in this inhospitable world. But at the same time, he was kind of a jerk about what he was doing. And then well, I think we talked about this with a choreo before that like, he's not really heroes. No, I mean, think that Luca is a hero was a terrible person to grow with some cool people on the plane. But yeah, in the story, because this book I have read there were some some pretty good characters in in there.
01:02:30
Speaker
none of whom are in this book because I think this was this may have been before all that story was written. I don't know but I do know that that is
01:02:40
Speaker
I don't know the release dates of these things. Not just the release dates, but keep in mind all of this stuff has different run-up times. Most sets take at least two years from the very, very earliest conceptions of them to when they actually release. Lots of things are being in development at the same time. Maybe we're wrong about the timing of that.
01:03:03
Speaker
Yeah, and like Vivian was in that story, Vivian Reed, who's kind of our, got to be our mono green planeswalker while the other ones were all gone. Our like core set planeswalkers, we had Nissa for a while, and then she's off doing gate watch stuff, and then not doing gate watch stuff. You had Garak for a while, then he's off being corrupted and doing that.
01:03:25
Speaker
stomping around being angry stuff. So then you get Vivian Reed for a while. And I really, really enjoyed getting to see Vivian Reed's kind of be care from Yeah, there were some short stories before that I hadn't read like from Ixalan and stuff that I know she was and honestly, I got to get back to those because I really enjoyed her character. In the she's not in this book, Alex, she's a planeswalker. He isn't bringing her up. This would be like somebody bringing up bolus over and over again. You're right. It would be it would be exactly like just mentioning bolus and then ending the show.
01:03:56
Speaker
And that's our show for today. You can find the host on Twitter. HotzQ can be found at HotzQ, and Alex Newman can be found at Mel Underscore. Send any questions, comments, thoughts, hopes, and dreams to at goblinmoorpod on Twitter, or email us at goblinmoorpodcast at email.com. If you want to support your friendly neighborhood gobsmores, the cast can be found at patreon.com slash goblinmoorpod.
01:04:22
Speaker
Opening and closing music by Vindergarten, who can be found on Twitter at Vindergarten, or online at vindergarten.bandcamp.com. Logo art by Steven Raffaele, who can be found on Twitter at Steve Raffel. Boblin Lore is proud to be presented by Hipsters of the Coast as part of their growing Vorthos content, as well as magic content of all kinds. Check them out on Twitter at hipstersmtg, or online at hipstersofthecoast.com.
01:04:52
Speaker
Thank you all for listening, and remember, goblins, like snowflakes, are only dangerous in numbers.