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Truth-Telling, Humor, and Hope with Mark S. King #46
30 Plays10 days ago
Author and HIV Activist Mark S. King shares with co-hosts Mattie Bynum and Shane Lukas a clear framework for movement work: credibility comes from truth-telling, and leadership means learning to hand the microphone to someone else. He breaks down what mentorship can look like in practice—spotting talent, offering encouragement, making introductions, and helping amplify voices without strings attached. The co-hosts also discuss how queer communities can respond when funding and infrastructure are stripped away, especially around HIV prevention and care access. Mark points to voting as a key lever to “stop the bleeding,” alongside showing up in community and staying engaged beyond the moments that feel urgent for the most privileged. The episode ends with a call to participation: keep building, keep advocating, and don’t confuse visibility with safety.
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Transcript
Historical Context and Introduction
00:00:00
Speaker
I've always said that activism is driven by those with the most to lose. That's why regular cis white men like me were so involved in AIDS in the 80s.
00:00:12
Speaker
We were dying. What happened after we got what we came for, we left and were never seen or heard from again. And we left behind all of these folks who did not have the resources we had.
00:00:25
Speaker
And to me, that is the outrage and the tragedy of what happened post-AIDS.
00:00:35
Speaker
Hello and welcome to Power Beyond Pride, a weekly queer change-making podcast bringing you voices and ideas from across our fierce and fabulous spectrum to transform our world.
00:00:45
Speaker
I am Maddie Bynum, the hostess with the Moses, and I am she, her, my pronouns, I will say, and I'm an actress, comedian, singer, dancer, funny, hoops, plus size model, just all around great joy to be around. And if not, I don't care because I love me more than anything else. That's Yes, and I am here today with my beautiful, amazing co-host, Mr. Shane himself. Go ahead and introduce yourself, baby. Thank you, Maddie.
00:01:14
Speaker
I am Shane Lucas, he, him, his. I am a lifelong harm reduction activist. I am the owner of A Great Idea, and I am actually the victor in the war with a tick that decided to make its home on my net.
00:01:26
Speaker
So, yes. Woo-hoo! Woo-hoo! Woohoo! I caught it before it could do damage. So I'm a winner of nature. I feel like a victor. And we are your... Nature always trying to kill you. i don't care what anybody says, always trying to kill you. All right, you know, who not we are trying to celebrate and elevate queer
Meet Mark S. King
00:01:44
Speaker
activists today. And today on our QueerCast journey, both both Maddie and I are gonna be your co-hosts. And in this episode, we are talking to Mark S. King, blogger, activer, actor, activer, activer.
00:01:57
Speaker
yeah That is a new term, you heard it here. And I am gonna make it a thing. HIV AIDS activist and the author of My Fabulous Disease, Chronicles of a Gay Survivor. Mark, it's so great to go. So great to meet you in person. You and I have been connecting in different digital forms forever. So thank you for joining today. You are so welcome. I love y'all's energy. I'm Mark. He, him, his. I love to live in a world where we still share our pronouns to make the world safer for all of us.
00:02:29
Speaker
Okay. Yes. Yes. Love that. I love it. Well, first off, can I just highlight again, activer? What is an activer? Mark, can you you just give us the definition? I don't know. Maybe you've seen you're acting like an activist, but that doesn't sound too good because I think I've been the real deal for a while. So I don't know. Maybe ah people say actors sometimes, and I guess that's true. I guess back in the day when I was just a little gay bee in Hollywood, I was an actor. That's true.
00:02:57
Speaker
But gosh, that seems like many lifetimes ago. We get a lot if we're lucky. That's true. We do. And a lot of performers do have an activist bent to them. they I mean, need we go to Pedro Daddy, our zaddy of the moment. Pedro Pascal has been quite quite an activor. So i'm that's kind of I'm kind of okay with that term.
00:03:18
Speaker
Yes. Yes. Well, let's face it, the best activism has a sense
Humor and Courage in Activism
00:03:23
Speaker
of the theatrical, doesn't it? That is true. yeah i think that's why actors and actresses make the best activists, because we are overly dramatic for no reason.
00:03:34
Speaker
And every reason. Yeah. And no matter what it is we're fighting or talking about or really elevating, we have a sense of humor. have little sense of humor, even in the darkest days. I'm sure we're going to talk about this. But certainly my background coming of age in the 70s seventy s and getting through a getting out of the 80s alive as an activist and AIDS, there was a lot of humor. There was, gosh, there was a lot of humor. And I'm sure we'll talk about that. But anyway, yes, there's humor.
00:04:01
Speaker
Well, and I'd add courage to that, too, because I think it takes to be a performer, to get on that stage, to get in front of those lights, to, don't know, do anything that you've got a room full of people who are sitting there judging you, whether or not you've got the right makeup on or the costumes or whatever. That is a level of courage that I think, I don't know. On the other hand, it's something that you produce.
00:04:22
Speaker
or we've been craving it since we were three. I don't know about you, Maddie, but I have never been a stranger to the spotlight. I have headphones about it. I have no shame about being up
Television and Personal Backgrounds
00:04:35
Speaker
front.
00:04:35
Speaker
I would think since I became an actor, I tell people now I'm more of a S&M person than I was prior to being an actor because it is a state of masochism to get on stage and sit in there and put your whole life, lifestyle especially as a comedian, like not just being an actress, but being a comedian and telling all my own faux pas. Oh, yes, that's a whole different form of state of masochism, but it's worth That's a whole dimension. You are walking us down to very different panamays around.
00:05:04
Speaker
Around one's desire for the limelight and critique. But to your point, Mark, I mean, there's a level of performance and a level of taking that critique as an activist because you have to be willing to confront people who don't agree with you and who don't who may not like you, right? That's right. Now, as we talk about being actors and activists and everything, Mark, was telling you before we started the show that we had something in common. So now it is time for me to just talk about what we have in common. Other than both being beautiful actors, we both have something in common and we're both fabulous.
00:05:37
Speaker
You have a blog and a book called My Fabulous. Let me make sure ill say this correctly. My Fabulous Disease Chronicles of a Gay Survivor. And for a lovely period of my time, I was on a show called My Big Fat Fabulous Life on TLC. Oh, wow. So we both are very fabulous individuals, and I love that. You my mind was reeling when you told me we had something in common, because I don't know if you're familiar with my kind of checkered past.
00:06:08
Speaker
but there's many things I have been at one point or another, and I thought there might've been other intersections, but okay. fred walls I want to explore these intersections. I want to explore where we're going. I feel like you've just, first of all, so much fabulousness already and this role. Yeah, but also I'm kind of dying to know where what possible intersections you might've entertained. Well,
00:06:31
Speaker
I don't know. I don't want to project anything on you, okay? But I'm saying, i yes, I was an actor. i owned a phone sex company for a number of years back in Wolf Anvilist. And I'm thinking, well, Maddie has a lovely voice. So maybe there was that. Maybe it was that. I don't know. And no shade and no judgment because I owned the damn thing. I made a living, a good one for a few years.
00:06:55
Speaker
And so I thought, well, maybe it's that. And then there's other darker dimensions of my past. And I don't know. So what did you Google me before the show? Because it's funny you say that because in high school, I was voted most likely to be a sex phone operator when I graduated because of my voice. that I'm really wrong. I'm going to say the duration of this. now Now
Reflections on Aging in the Queer Community
00:07:17
Speaker
the duration of this interview all has to be done as phone sex voice.
00:07:21
Speaker
I want to go to the high school that actually has that category of award because that's where I want to go to high school. Yeah, well, good for you. so well yeah i i knew there was something there.
00:07:34
Speaker
yes so Yeah, I think we do have a lot of similarities in cross-interceptions. But we'll discuss that later. We can't give everybody a tea. Everybody can't. Okay. All right. No, we have to run this call for a period of time. Every minute is $1.99 of this podcast. Oh, my goodness. Oh, wait a minute. And if you would like to know more for $2.99 a minute, you can call back in. And you'll need the awesome book that you need on Power be Beyond Pride.
00:08:04
Speaker
yeah
00:08:08
Speaker
I love it. Absolutely. This is, this is this as I'm learning things about you, Mark, that I have not known. so I look forward to getting to know more about you. And I know this is such an exciting opportunity to be able to spend some time on where you are because you have had such an incredible career. and You continue to have such an influence and a role in so many great, important conversations that having you here to talk about where queer activism is today is to me a really meaningful opportunity.
00:08:35
Speaker
So thank you. You're welcome. You're welcome. And honestly, for people who may not, i mean, how could y'all not know who Mark is and his amazing book and blog? But Mark, could you give us just a quick summary of your journey that brought you here to where you are today?
00:08:51
Speaker
Oh, goodness. I'll give you the elevator pitch, okay? Or the pitch, or at least the thing. I am going to be 65 years old this year. i oh Thank you. I came of age so in the 70s and spent the 1980s in Los Angeles.
00:09:07
Speaker
So I was in West Hollywood during the dawn of the AIDS epidemic and tested positive the week the test became publicly available in March of 1985. And like everybody else, just figured I would never make it out of the 1980s, right? and And somehow did and devoted myself to lifting up that issue and helping others and marching in the streets and doing what we had to do to be seen and heard and for someone to care about us. Because there were definitely years in which...
00:09:38
Speaker
It felt as if no one did, at least no one was in a position of authority to help us in our government, in our institutions, our churches, our civic organizations. And so we had to do for ourselves. And I learned a lot from that era and fortunately lived to tell about it. And For many years, I've just been an essayist.
00:09:59
Speaker
I write first person about what's going on in my life, our aging, HIV, being a long-term survivor, being a recovering from meth addiction. That's been a big part of my story for a lot of years.
00:10:10
Speaker
and And telling the truth, and we were talking earlier about how it's scary sometimes to put yourself out there whatever, that's That's been my bread and butter is being scared, is being in front of my keyboard and saying, how do i say the truth about this thing? What does that courage come from?
00:10:28
Speaker
i have a certain shamelessness. it's And I'm not sure where that comes from. I really do. And by that, I mean, i will not be shamed. actually there And that took a lot of work. It's weird. It's like I grew up in Louisiana.
00:10:43
Speaker
i i knew I was gay when I was a young teenager. And I figured if there was nothing wrong with it and I decided there wasn't, then there wasn't anything wrong with anybody knowing about her.
00:10:55
Speaker
Now, that might have been a strange calculation when you're 16 and you live in Bossier City, Louisiana, but that is indeed what I did. Fortunately, i had older brothers that looked out for me, and i i don't know. i don't know where that comes from. I think I have a curiosity about other people and about the strange decisions I've made along the way, and I i don't mind telling the truth about it.
00:11:21
Speaker
I think that's what it is. i think the I think that, I don't think that i've my life has been any more interesting than anybody else's. It's just that I live out loud. I live on the page and I say the truth about what's going on about the men that I'm having sex with and how much sex I'm having and HIV and how that all, and crystal meth and how that all kind of got tangled up together and telling the truth about it along the way, I guess. There's so much more truth to tell. I'm facing 60, I'm facing 65. It's like I'm facing the callos, but I felt that way at 35, right?
00:11:55
Speaker
And here I am. And there's a lot of things they don't tell you about getting older. And so I get to tell people. I get to tell the truth about us as peers facing our late 60s.
00:12:07
Speaker
And so far, so good. I'm enjoying it. That was more than you needed to know, Maddie, but you asked. It's okay. You know what? But was going to say, think that also goes back to being a Southerner.
00:12:18
Speaker
Southerners, we like to tell the truth. We like to embellish and we love storytelling. So we'll take a 10 story and turn it into a 45 minute miniseries because that's what we do. That's true.
00:12:29
Speaker
and i will it know I'd love to ask you something around aging because it's something i just turned 50. So this is a whole conversation and things like that, that I've gone around what, what it means. And when people talk about aging, I'm often like a lot of us who came out in that era, whether we were living with HIV or not, really didn't see a trajectory of aging. Like we didn't see that as a possibility.
00:12:52
Speaker
Are you experiencing also this sort of, there's no model for what it looks like for one. do you feel like there is a, like part of the things you're wrestling with as you coming into this age, hey, i don't know what this is supposed to look like for someone who has expressed to that authentic self early on And now I'm in this space where I'm looking looking at my peers and they're like, and I'm like, i don't think you understand the level that what this journey meant.
Mentorship and Generational Impact
00:13:19
Speaker
And then I have another sort of more complicated, sort of add-on question to that. But first, can you express that going into 65, some of these challenges, is part of it just your own set of expectations about not just the experience of living with HIV, but also just queer people did not really have what aging looked like? Well, no, first of all, we didn't in the modern era of being queer. Let's say from the 80s on, where we started being on the cover of magazines and people talked openly about what it meant to be LGBT or back in the day, gay.
00:13:56
Speaker
best I remember what it was gay and lesbian, right? That's it. Those were only two term or not. Well, the only two we'll discuss on the radio. How about that on podcasting? But those were the two synonymous, either gay or lesbian. Right, right. that was Those were our choices. and And that was our only vocabulary, right? And thank God our vocabulary has grown, which I think is a great thing. However,
00:14:22
Speaker
In the modern day of what it meant to be gay and outward, we're not talking about the closeted and the self-hating and the the old sad queer that ages and dies alone from pre-1980 or so, right?
00:14:35
Speaker
The unfortunate thing is we lost a generation. We lost a generation of people who could have been our elders now. who could have been the mentors who were showing us what it looked like to age gracefully. We lost an entire battlefield filled with those men of me. I lost my mentors in that way. And i had fortunately a couple.
00:15:00
Speaker
I have had a couple. who have demonstrated for me what it looks like to be older and comfortable in your own skin, not feeling the need to be on the merry-go-round of circuit parties and beer busts and whatnot.
00:15:16
Speaker
and And has a sense of contentment about who we are and knows how to give back. and how to mentor younger gay men.
00:15:26
Speaker
It's a strange thing because there are some strange elements to it. How do we mentor younger gay men without it there being a sense of sexual tension?
00:15:37
Speaker
How do we, daddy, boy, that whole thing. In other words, how do you, how can you be a project person A sense of, no, i am authentically wanting to help you.
00:15:50
Speaker
So, so, so this is not, don't get it twisted, right? It's hard because all we know of our relationships with each other as other queers by and large are transactional.
00:16:04
Speaker
Are I going to give you this, what are you going to what's in it for me sort of thing? And it's hard to know when somebody is there to help you. And so fortunately, I've had a couple of, ah in my case, older gay men who were exactly that for me.
00:16:19
Speaker
They wanted nothing back, but they saw in me when I was younger, talent or ability or, and they wanted to help me. nurture that. and And they did, and they introduced me to people, and they supported my work or my writing or whatever it was.
00:16:36
Speaker
And ah it made a really profound effect on me. So I guess as I'm getting older myself, have I had opportunities to do that? Yes, I have. I've had great opportunities where I've recognized in a younger person real ability and usually it's a matter of just telling him wow what you wrote what you said what you that at that speaking engagement at that round table or at that protest or whatever it was you were terrific let me know if there's anything i could do to help you on that road to doing that are you're a really good writer have you considered submitting to so and so um that's what do we do to amplify your voice
00:17:19
Speaker
That's, I'm going to enjoy myself doing that because first of all, who doesn't want to be the arbiter i mean come of potential, but also it'll be fun to do it because who doesn't want to discover talent yeah and be able to nurture it. And especially somebody who maybe not, doesn't even see it in themselves. Yeah.
00:17:42
Speaker
but it's there, but maybe they don't even recognize it. They don't even realize, oh no you keep stepping up, honey. Step up. Go higher. Reach further. I think and as I look at aging as well as just this conversation, I think the best way to look at it is for me, i look at getting older as becoming my Jennifer Lewis mixed with Andre Batali.
00:18:07
Speaker
i mean, Andre Leon Talley mixed with just a little bit of Eartha Kitt. So that's what my golden years were like. As a beautiful, trans, gorgeous, intersex, all these beautiful things, because don't conform to just one title. Yeah.
00:18:27
Speaker
Like, so and I think that's what we have to look at it as we get older, because we make the aging. Like, Mark, I'm to be honest with you. I'm looking at you now. You're saying you're 65. I'm still seeing 36. I don't know where this is coming from. But i think we as the individuals make the aging. And as we go to break...
00:18:46
Speaker
And we come back to finish this beautiful conversation. i do want to take two seconds because Mark, you brought up a good a good point as we go to break. Let's take a few moments of silence for those that we didn't lose. Those mentors, those unsung heroes, those people that shaped a whole generation of young men and women and that will probably not get the recognition they deserve. Okay.
00:19:10
Speaker
So as we go to break, let's just honor and memorialize those people. And we'll be right back to Power Beyond Projects.
00:19:24
Speaker
Welcome back. This is Power Beyond Pride, a queer changemaking podcast. And I'm Shane here with my fabulous co-host, Maddie. And we are here having an insightful conversation with author and speaker Marcus King, who makes this show, by the way, two thirds ginger. So we'll come back to that, which is really exciting. It's actually probably more.
00:19:45
Speaker
How much ginger, Mark? I said now with more ginger. Now with more ginger, maybe beyond the like FDA, well, when the FDA used to actually watch these things, probably would say this is too much ginger for any of your diets. But you know what? I don't know if it's two-thirds ginger, though, because the other day I was noticing as my hair grows out, it turns red and blonde. So it might be all gingified. Three-quarter ginger. I'm just cracking.
00:20:07
Speaker
All ginger? like it. like I like it. like the most pies in my life, so I'm in good company, so we good. Well, and before break, Maddie was noting that, Mark, as we age, I'm just going to say us gingers defy, we just defy many laws of the world. And as we age, so we certainly are trying to buck our buck buck the many years that we are grateful to have in in in our back pocket.
00:20:31
Speaker
one of the things that you talked about, which is really powerful, is the role of mentorship, the role of what it means to look for our elders. Obviously, we took a few moments to acknowledge the loss of many community members.
00:20:42
Speaker
Why I think this is so important right now, and I think about this as I start moving into this sort of elder phase, certainly those young people who I'm hoping to coach and kind of continue to support, is that as I've looked forward to, one of the things that gives me pause about those who have been older, now there are exceptions to that, so I do want to throw some love out to people like Hardy Haberman,
00:21:01
Speaker
ah People like Ray Spannon, Suzanne Farr, many leaders in the community who've been just amazing, who've been around for a long time. But for gay men, one thing that I think i i come back to sometimes is that many of the people who are port pretending to be in positions of power are people who...
00:21:18
Speaker
escaped a lot of the HIV epidemic era by being married, they have kids, they lived a life that wasn't the artists, that wasn't the queer courageous, it was this other life.
00:21:33
Speaker
And I think I'm really careful about the wisdom they throw. and I'm curious your thoughts on this, because sometimes that wisdom feels a little loaded with some of the normalizing that we've seen things move toward. And I'm like, but our elders, the real elders, the ones, you know, again, i'm grateful there are people like you and other people who been very vocal and very adamant about their role, have been really trying to draw attention to what it means and the beauty of the queer experience. but I'm really cautious around some of the elders who are showing up who didn't really embody that.
00:22:07
Speaker
And I think for younger people, i get nervous about what they're asking them to be. Okay. I am going to reserve judgment on whatever choices anybody made back in the day when they were hiding out or had religious pressure or familial pressure that drove them to decisions that were not in their own best interest and had to live a lie for some period of time.
00:22:35
Speaker
I'm going to reserve judgment on them because I don't know what they went through and what drove them to do that. Now they show up now and have opinions. Great.
00:22:45
Speaker
There are such a, because they represent a segment of our community that was driven underground for whatever reasons, and they didn't feel the strength or they had too much fear, or maybe they faced real physical consequences for coming out then.
00:23:03
Speaker
And so they decided not to. So I'm going to set that one aside. In other words, I'm not going to go there and I'm not going to judge them and I'm not going to second guess why they did what they did, nor am I going to devalue their contribution in the here and now.
00:23:20
Speaker
Here they are now. And now they're bringing us the perspective of someone who did have to live that way. That doesn't make them any less authentic. It doesn't make them any less valuable to ah us, to the rest of us.
00:23:32
Speaker
And so I am all about activism is about inclusion. It's about addition, not subtraction. And we need all of us and includes people whose experience that in our eyes may not be as authentic or maybe they weren't fully queer their whole I don't care.
00:23:53
Speaker
I don't care. Welcome. Welcome in. Well, and to that i end, I don't, yeah, I don't think my question is so much about their experience. I certainly value and I share that. It is that they have found security in a normalization.
00:24:07
Speaker
And that in the queer movement is sort of reflective of some divides going on between generational divides, as you mentioned before, the broader spectrum of identities and the landscape of identities and what has blossomed as different being in the world, but also class divides. where you have people with enormous amounts of wealth that they accumulated through these different channels, through by playing by the rules.
00:24:31
Speaker
And now they are, in some cases, working against the success of, for example, people with trans experience. There yeah is a hostility to more inclusive spaces. And so I'm all on board with the idea of inclusion, but as you're aging, are you getting any sense of, hey, like there are people here who are leading and speaking in these movements, but they benefited in some ways by fitting
Critique and Current Challenges in Activism
00:24:56
Speaker
in.
00:24:56
Speaker
And I think we we aren't talking about what it means to to be courageous. No, you're right. I think there's two two there's two different conversations to be had from what you're talking about.
00:25:07
Speaker
One of them is, what does it mean to be, in other words, in other words those people who have have adventurous as sexual identities, her who are in a triad, or they have open relationships, or they're polyamorous, or they're all of these all of these different permutations of their sexual identities and how they live. Me?
00:25:30
Speaker
me I'm a monogamous guy who's married and literally lives in the suburbs. I'm that guy you're talking about. I'm that guy. But do I lift up and support and have enthusiasm for my friends who live differently? Yes, I do. I don't try to say this is the way we all should live. And look at me. I'm the heteronormative one. Aren't I great? You know, absolutely not.
00:25:59
Speaker
I've always said that and this kind of fits into that, activism is driven by those with the most to lose. Activism is driven by those with the most to lose.
00:26:10
Speaker
That's why regular cis white men like me were so involved in AIDS in the 80s. We were dying. We were dying.
00:26:21
Speaker
And so we were very much involved in the fight. What happened after we got what we came for, after we got the medicine and we got the activism and we got the FDA to pay attention and we got the support groups and the food programs and the housing program, after we got all of that, we left.
00:26:42
Speaker
And we went and got gay married and lived in the suburbs and were never seen or heard from again. Can we just stop right there for a second? Because a whole conversation in itself. And I think that we are using it to discuss the topic of the 80s and the AIDS epidemic.
00:26:56
Speaker
But just in general, once cis white gender affirming gay men, I'm not going to say they're cis, but they can assimilate. i think once they got the right.
00:27:10
Speaker
the bigger portion of the fight for gay rights stopped all in itself by itself in general. Oh, yes. Whether it is about AIDS prevention, HIV prevention, awareness, whether it's about housing, whether it's about gay or lesbian, trans.
00:27:25
Speaker
Marriage equality. Right. Once... That section of our community got the assimilation, the got the, hey, you're welcome, come in. It was like, fuck the rest i hate hey and they were and never right And I make this point all the time in the HIV community, because that's where I have the activism groups and I live.
00:27:46
Speaker
And I say, we left and we left behind but all of these folks who could not, find who did not have the resources we had. who didn't have the privilege and the money and the, oh, I know how to put on a fancy fundraiser and get all this attention. They didn't have all that.
00:28:04
Speaker
And we left them. And to me, that is the outrage and the tragedy of what happened post-AIDS. And that is that we left because we all stopped dying.
00:28:16
Speaker
And meanwhile, how many trans women are murdered every week? I mean, they our trans family are facing this a comparable level of death and dying and and violence.
00:28:31
Speaker
that we once did, and we are not there to help them. We are not, we have- How are those communities responding when you say this? Like, i as somebody who's been a voice in it for a long period of time, pushing back this conversation and trying to say, hey, pay attention here.
00:28:48
Speaker
How are people responding to that? Unfortunately, I'm usually saying it to an audience of black women. Who are like, uh-huh, I mean, they're i'm saying I'm not telling them anything they don't already know because they are the ones who are leading the HIV community-based fight right now.
00:29:05
Speaker
HIV community-based response activism is led by black women. Period. And whether it's black trans women are black cis women, it doesn't matter. they are That is the population who is loving each other and building communities and building responses and getting out people out to the polls. all of it.
00:29:27
Speaker
is by and large led by black men. And i but when I make that point about how white guys like me kind of got off and left, ah ah it's funny. It's my way of saying, where are you?
00:29:41
Speaker
It's too bad they went. And it's also my way of saying, oh, but I'm still here. but I mean, I get to have my cake and eat it too. I'm making that point. But obviously, I'm a guy that never left.
00:29:52
Speaker
so Or at least I didn't i didn't go. i didn't disappear. I stuck around. I stuck around. So let me ask this question with you always being in here and being very well represented. Thank you, Mr. King. We love that. Thank you. Thank you. But you recently attended the 2025 HIV Prevention Summit.
00:30:09
Speaker
So with the administration where we are now and with the environment of the AIDS crisis and just communities in general, what do you see?
00:30:20
Speaker
What's your outlook on it? We are exhausted. we are traumatized. we are The administration has succeeded it its whole shock and awe approach of we are going to throw flamethrowers in every direction so that we just don't even know which way is up anymore. It's been incredibly difficult.
00:30:45
Speaker
effective and successful. And we have lost researchers. We have lost research into an AIDS vaccine, into AIDS treatments that cannot be resumed.
00:31:00
Speaker
The research has ended. Those patients those that they're following are gone. there You can't just, with another administration, say, oh okay, well, now we're going to pick up that research where we left off. No, it's yeah it's gone. You got to start that over again.
00:31:17
Speaker
yeah And i have people who are literally in tears in these conferences who have lost their research, that they have personally been so invested in for whoever. And we're talking about an HIV vaccine.
00:31:33
Speaker
We're talking about injectable medications on once-a-year basis. Everything that we thought we would have that was on the horizon has been wiped out. and And in the meantime, just funding for, you just funding to finding to get an HIV test.
00:31:52
Speaker
What clinic do I go to get an HIV test now? Chances are they are struggling and their hours are smaller. They're not sending out vans anywhere to go to come to where you are to test you.
00:32:06
Speaker
And what will the effect be? there The instances of HIV will rise. It will rise among those who depended on those kinds of programs.
00:32:16
Speaker
Not people like me who could go to my doctor because I have one because I have insurance and I can, if were i negative, get my regular HIV test in my nice doctor's office and everything's cool. No, we're talking about people who don't have that.
00:32:32
Speaker
Right. So it'll be the most vulnerable. So all those places that we see, HIV has always been a problem in the South. In Dade County, Florida, people who don't speak English don't have access to ah those sorts of programs.
00:32:48
Speaker
Those people will be, will die. Will die because they will not get diagnosed. And then then when they get diagnosed, it will be because they end up in an emergency room with three T cells and pneumocystis pneumonia, and they're going to die like it's 1985.
00:33:04
Speaker
I'm about to say, yeah, we're going back to um the 80s all over again. And I was there and it wasn't pretty. And that's where we're at. And so when you ask, what is the feeling? I just interviewed Paul Kawada. He is the exiting executive director, longest serving executive director of any national HIV place there for 36 years.
00:33:24
Speaker
And he was literally in tears during my interview with him. He was so exhausted and traumatized. by what has been done by this administration and everything being stripped away that he had been working for 30 years.
00:33:37
Speaker
I don't even, he says, I have to find my smile again. I'm so exhausted and i need to go away and just try to get over this. And i asked him, what do you want?
00:33:49
Speaker
What should people do? yeah And he said, vote. The only thing that will change this is vote and vote like we've never voted before vote. We'll see what happens.
Mark's Media Journey
00:34:00
Speaker
So my activism, other than going to all of the funds, and I say fun, you though they are kind of fun, the protests that we've had in recent months against Trump and Musk and all of that, all of my activism, all of my efforts, all of my donation dollars will go towards the election.
00:34:19
Speaker
We'll go towards the midterm and turning around the midterm so we can least stop the bleeding. Because right now it's a gusher. Thank you. I mean, all of that is is incredibly powerful. We're going to go to break here, but I wanted to just say how potent that message is. And knowing these conversations are going on my hope is that we not only acknowledge the conversations going on, but we really start talking about solutions. Like we really start talking about the way our communities can embolden each other, encourage that participation.
00:34:57
Speaker
Because to your point, and There's been so much distance as people stepped away from the immediacy and the urgency of a movement to them. And yet we've never really addressed so many communities who have had an ongoing challenge in access healthcare, to prevention, to support, to behavioral health support, all of that. And I think my hope is and we start thinking about what solutions look like as well, because we're going to have to. And it's sad that we are put in a position where we're going to see so much cruelty enacted.
00:35:27
Speaker
And hopefully our better selves show up in in conversations and marches. It's great that you're doing that. And when we come back, I'd love to hear a little bit about the response to your vlog work, your other media work. And we're going to take a few minutes to get to know you a little bit better. So stick with us here at Power Beyond Pride. We are with the amazing author and activist, Mark S. King.
00:35:50
Speaker
And we'll be right back after this break.
00:35:59
Speaker
Well, welcome back. This is Power Beyond Product. We're a change-making podcast, and I am the one and only Maddie Bynum sitting here with the awesome, crazy Shane Lucas. feel seen.
00:36:14
Speaker
And yeah I am having the most amazing conversation with someone that I have envied. And it's funny, Mark, I've never truly envied anybody, but you have one thing that I want to do. And I wish I could actually hear it in the original voice. But I have to ask you, how did it feel when you heard the words Mark King from Shreveport, Louisiana? Come on down. Why, how did it feel? And you got to meet Bob Parker.
00:36:45
Speaker
All right. Okay. So I guess I will be talking about this in my entire life, I guess. i will And why not? Okay. So, yes, it was 1980. I was 19 years old.
00:36:57
Speaker
And my boyfriend and I went to Los Angeles to for vacation. We took a tour of CPS Studios. Well, excuse me. And so while we're on the tour, we see a line forming to watch The Price is Right. We're like, oh, why not watch The Price is Right? Sure.
00:37:13
Speaker
And they interview everybody standing in line. Some producer comes by and chats you up. And I could tell. I could tell. So when he gets to me, I just turn it on. turn it on. Hi, my name is Mark, and I drove here all the way from New Orleans, Louisiana, just to be on this show.
00:37:32
Speaker
Was it the Southern charm or the ginger power? Which was combination. Well, I had like bright red hair. i had bright red hair and freckles. And so I looked very Opie Taylor, all American, whatever.
00:37:44
Speaker
Very misleading, but that's what I looked like. And so, yeah, I got on the show and I ended up winning a car. And you can watch it on YouTube, Winning a Car on the Prizes Right 1980, I think it's on there. And it was hilarious because...
00:38:03
Speaker
Bob Barker is talking to me about being a student in New Orleans and all of that. And he says at one point, so tell me, you've got a girlfriend back there at the University of New Orleans. And for split second, all the possible answers went through my head of how to answer that.
00:38:19
Speaker
And meanwhile, my lover, Charlie, who has been screaming from the audience, wearing a matching outfit, by the way. We were both wearing outfits that were from the gay disco in Houston and name tags they have on with which is a big price tag. We put the name tags over the logo.
00:38:40
Speaker
outs We didn't want to out ourselves. But they're showing Charlie more than they're showing me because I'm up so on stage and I'm kind of freaked out. And he's screaming and whistling and all that. So he's in the video a lot.
00:38:53
Speaker
Anyway, so I realized, okay, let's see, it's 1980. This will never get on TV if I tell him, oh no, I'm gay, Bob. And that's my boyfriend.
00:39:05
Speaker
That was never gonna get on TV. So when he asked if you have any girlfriends back there, I said several. yeah Well, you didn't yeah why I did not lie. So, yeah, it was. The girls, they're friends.
00:39:22
Speaker
Yeah, they're girls. They're girlfriends. Oh, yeah. know, any kid that was born, i would say before 1985, at some point in time, i had a sick day fantasy, being at home, stuck with your grandparents, watching Young and Restless, bold and um beautiful But at 11 o'clock, I think every kid had that snow day, sick day fantasy of being on Price is Right. Because at 11 o'clock, that was all you could do. Because you remember, I know for me growing up, my grandparents, they watched the morning news, the Price is Right 11, midday news at 12, young and the rest came on at 1230. So you had to be still.
00:40:03
Speaker
During Morgana Rae, I'm throwing Price is Right. And still to this day, at beautiful 40 years old, Plinko is my favorite game ever. It's so funny when I meet younger people and they're like, what is Plinko? And I'm like, you'll never understand the beauty.
00:40:19
Speaker
We got to bring, we got to bring a, yeah, we got to do a queer version of Price is Right. That's what we need. I think something that's somewhere between whatever that one is behind doors have to dress up in costumes and the Price is Right. I think it has to be kind of a mix. Either that or let's make a deal.
00:40:33
Speaker
Yeah, let's make a deal about with prices like that combo. yeah so So Mark, obviously, in addition to this 1980 appearance, your media empire dick kicked off at some point. So do you want to share a little bit about your essentially what it's been like to build up these different media channels? Because you run a blog, you've been writing for a long time. You certainly are. You certainly built up a career as a spokesperson in many ways around different movement needs and your own lived experience.
00:41:02
Speaker
Like what, what is that response felt like in this current moment? but It's been a lot of fun. First of all, I just picked up a camera early in terms of trying to figure out how to videotape things. I was videotaping with big Betamax camcorders and early on.
00:41:21
Speaker
And so i incorporated that into my YouTube channel, My Fabulous Disease. I'm all about branding. ah Yes, you have to. And so the YouTube channel is my fabulous disease. And really, it was a matter of when I wrote my first book, it was a memoir of coming of age in Los Angeles, running a phone sex company while AIDS appear.
00:41:45
Speaker
And it was called A Place Like This. And so my web person just said, well, you need to have a web page to promote your book. And and while you're since you've got that webpage, why don't you start a blog?
00:41:58
Speaker
I said, what's a blog? and And she said, oh you just write your stuff and to use it. You kind of well, now that my fabulous disease is the blog. it's It's for all of my writing and whatnot.
00:42:11
Speaker
And so... It's funny, I'm not as accomplished a videographer, or at least I was for a long time. But it is a lot of work. It was for me. We didn't have the modern tools we have now where you could just do it all on your phone, and edit on your phone, and put in people who are, and I haven't learned that. i As I say to my husband, I'm full.
00:42:34
Speaker
I'm full. i've got I've learned all I'm going to learn about tech gadgets and whatnot. I don't want to there i don't want to know anymore. so So my YouTube channel is not as active as it used to be. And it turns out that in terms of the traffic on my fabulous disease and all that, I learned that even though I worked hard at the you at the video stuff, I got just as much traffic when I was writing.
00:42:59
Speaker
If I had a piece that was honest and had something to say about our current situation or something, that ah wrote some storytelling I was revealing about what once happened to me,
00:43:13
Speaker
that was, that did just as well. And I said, okay, good. I'm just going to write. And so I've really just focused. I do a lot of writing for other publications and, and but the writing is really where it's at for me.
00:43:26
Speaker
but That's now
Personal Insights and Anecdotes
00:43:27
Speaker
my media. Oh, the YouTube channel still exists. People can go through all sorts of, look at all sorts of things on myfabulousdisease.com. I really focus on the writing and the storytelling and telling people what happened to us.
00:43:40
Speaker
And I think it's important. I think that there's always going to be people who are discovering it for the first time. I don't want to stuff it down their throats. I'm not one of those, back in my day, you need to know that we used to walk five miles for our easy teeth.
00:43:54
Speaker
I'll pill both ways. I'll pill both ways. In the snow. Yes. Although you're in Louisiana, so I guess in the swamp? Yeah. That's not what it was in Louisiana. Don't worry. I can say we embellished in the South to make the story. So it could have snowed on a good April day in Louisiana. The devil came up and it just happened. We have more to get to know about you now.
00:44:16
Speaker
I'm about to say, Mark, this is the favorite time of the show, especially for me and Shane. You got two wheels as your host today, and we love being petty. So this is the part of the show that we get to learn more about you. We get to be petty, get to ask you some intriguing, intrusive questions, too. Oh, goodness, please.
00:44:32
Speaker
At this time, are you ready for Speed Round? Yes or no? Oh, please. All right, Shane. Well, let's kick it off. You got the first question. All right, I got to know. This has been on my mind. Favorite Superman, Reeves, Ruth, Cavill, or Cornswept?
00:44:47
Speaker
Cavill, because I think he could do some real damage. Interesting. ah yeah Okay. Okay. Okay. Very cool. Good answer. Interesting answer. Okay. So name this island. Name an island that starts with the R in the United States.
00:45:03
Speaker
Rhode Island. That's a good one. well yeah That's not the answer. but It's not even an island. That is the irony of Rhode Island. Exactly.
00:45:14
Speaker
It's the island that's not an island. It does say Rhode Island. mean, I say States. don't think that's the point, because I'm going to be honest with you. I didn't know Rabbit Island existed. Well, there was a Rhode Island in New York, too.
00:45:26
Speaker
I feel like the Miss Teen USA, as who said, described her perfect date, and she says 28th. Uh-oh.
00:45:35
Speaker
Sorry about that. It's not too hot, not too cold. We're just learning about you. We're learning about you, Mark. And Rhode Island it is. All right. Favorite junk food? Oh, ah potato chips. Potato chips, ruffles, of sour cream, and onion.
00:45:49
Speaker
Yes. Okay. For sure. What's one fundamental truth or lesson you've learned through activism? It's driven by those with the most to lose. Tell the truth.
00:46:01
Speaker
or you don't have credibility and then no and there people will stop listening to you and learn how to hand the microphone to somebody else. That's three lessons. I feel like I got a three for one here. that's that That feels like a very good deal there. That's a mentor moment. We need a little theme for that. We're like, to teach to to mentor moment. men I'm kind of into that.
00:46:25
Speaker
Do you prefer when you're writing, do you prefer it to be silent or you prefer having music in the background? Oh, absolutely. It's quiet. Quiet. It's the only meditative time I have. And that is writing. It's usually early in the morning. The house is quiet.
00:46:38
Speaker
Nothing's going on. The TV's not on. It's the only way I can write. And it is truly the only meditative time I really have. When I'm really kind of with my thoughts, it's the only kind of like spiritual moment I can have where I'm just quiet.
00:46:53
Speaker
And I really look forward to it. So the next question feeds back into the last question. So i want switch it up a little bit. What is the most spiciest moment you've had in your life? And I'll let you use spicy to your own interpretation. i My star-fucking moments, I would say, probably.
00:47:10
Speaker
Because I'm a big media whore and star-fucker. And so it would be some star-fuck story, probably. So is it more important... the celebrity level or like their general opinion? Is it about how they look or really just about? Oh, no.
00:47:27
Speaker
It's not about how they look, darling. It's about how big a star they are.
00:47:34
Speaker
I liked it. Now I feel like i want to ask questions like, now I want to get now i want to get down to a Kevin Spacey or like somebody else question and be like, which one are you going to sleep with more? Kevin Spacey or I'm trying to think of somebody in the kind of same realm of Okay, we're just joking, right? Because I think it's pretty well documented what my history is.
00:47:57
Speaker
Okay. I'm just asking ah if you had to prefer. i was guessing your level, like your star quality preference between two, i would say not and I would say unattractive or socially unacceptable. No, I don't think there was anything unattractive about it. Spacey or Diddy.
00:48:11
Speaker
Oh, my God. don't even know if you want to compare us to, oh, good God. You have to pick one. No, is that inappropriate? We can move on. and is that um yeah i i I've written about this. I had an affair with Rock Hudson but early on in the early eighty s prior to obviously prior to his announcement.
00:48:33
Speaker
And this was like Macmillan and Wife era Rock Hudson. Yeah. Okay, well, never mind. This was... Google. we'll use the day Someone used the Google machine for, what is it, Macmillan and... What was it? Macmillan and Wife. It was series he did. It was around the time, it was before he was on Dynasty kissing Linda Evans.
00:48:54
Speaker
He was a... Which did not make him gay. we wouldn't we what You would call now a grayish gray-haired daddy.
Power, Pride, and Activism Call to Action
00:49:03
Speaker
he was a very handsome man all the way through yeah Moments that the opportunity presented itself, I knew what would be happening. and That seems like a euphemism. I'm going to use opportunity prevented presented itself as a new euphemism. for And at the time, I was a strawberry blonde...
00:49:19
Speaker
wink in West Hollywood. And as I would later learn, it's more remarkable if I had not had sex with Rock Hudson because that was needed't very much his type.
00:49:30
Speaker
Well, as a strawberry blonde, I say thank you for taking that for the tea. You're welcome. I'll tell your details offline. Oh, well, I look forward to that tea over tea. but Some tea over tea, if you ask me. All right.
00:49:48
Speaker
Well, let me ask this question. What does power beyond pride mean to you? Gosh, what does power beyond pride mean to you? That's funny. I would have to really dissect that because I'm a word person.
00:50:01
Speaker
And so I think about pride and what's more important. What is more important? To have pride or to have power? What is the more important trait?
00:50:12
Speaker
And i would have to lean toward having pride because when you have pride in yourself, that leads to power, right? Unfortunately, we're living in a world right now that power, what what's we're but what's being demonstrated from our White House is that power trumps everything.
00:50:33
Speaker
And no play on words, but yes. ah Right. And so how do we how do we put as much emphasis on personal pride, meaning personal integrity?
00:50:44
Speaker
Honesty, all sorts of ah those those sorts of traits that we value being just as powerful as unbridled ambition and all of those ugly things that we are associating with power right now.
00:51:01
Speaker
I have forgotten your question. I've gone down a rabbit hole of language. and where are not None of us are opposed to rabbit holes. You are fine. You are fine. I actually answered the question. And I just, well we'll stop there and just sum it up there and just say, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Mark.
00:51:18
Speaker
You're welcome. You have truly been a mentor in this episode. You have truly been a ray of sunshine in this episode. You have truly lightened all of us up. I know me and Shane are happier today this episode with the illustrious Mark. Like, it's been a great having you here today.
00:51:35
Speaker
Very lovely. People can follow you through My Fabulous Disease, your YouTube channel. Are there other, do you want to share a little bit of your social channels and any channels people can find you? They can, I mean, they can find me on Facebook as Mark S. King. My Fabulous Disease has a Facebook page.
00:51:50
Speaker
There is a that really is the best way to find me as well. Both of my books are available on Amazon and i love Amazon reviews.
00:52:01
Speaker
There's nothing like an Amazon review. It's almost as good as going need to sign your book in person some somewhere. It's life's greatest joy. And that includes sex. Signing your book. Getting to sign your book is somebody bought it and wants you to sign it. Oh, my God.
00:52:16
Speaker
Oh, that's the best. A good review is kind of better than sex. than Yeah, a good review. or I say but best review is a review of sex. It's a good review of sex. hey and I'm going to go with getting a combo.
00:52:28
Speaker
Okay, great. Where does one read reviews of your segment? There used to be, for those of us who are former sex workers, there used to be a site where those things could happen. Oh, that's what i want to say now said what they thought of you. I do know there is a website that where you can review fuckboys and guys.
00:52:49
Speaker
Because one of my friends, actually, so one of my friends, his friend ended up on the web website. but time We were sitting around talking one night and we saw his friend and we were reading some of the things that was said. And I was just like, yeah.
00:53:06
Speaker
wow Wow. So that's what you do in your spare time, sir. you i to be clear, Amazon reviews for Mark S. King should not be reviews of Mark and any of his intimate experiences. i they Those should be reserved for private emails, I guess. So we'll go for those. And and ah positive reviews, oh you new a little like a hand, like one of those little face symbol charts. And that's always, I find those to be useful. The...
00:53:34
Speaker
Mark, you've been an absolute delight. Thank you again so much for sharing your wisdom, your experience, your joy, your insights. It is really important in this current moment and it's and something we're really proud of to not only hear from individuals who have been activists across the movement for many years, But those who are also leading new parts in their life and have grown into spaces where they're starting to shape the conversations in their local communities. And so it helps them understand also that there's these legacies, there are these learned pieces, there are these coalitions that can all be built in this moment. And so thank you for doing that for so many years, as well as continuing to be a voice that encourages people, that that encourages them to step into the space. So thank you. Thank you for that.
00:54:14
Speaker
It has been my privilege privilege and my pleasure. you your Thank you. Thank you again. i am your co-host, Shane Lucas. i He, him, his. And I am the owner of A Great Idea. i am a lifelong harm reduction advocate, activist, and a person who took my non-lethal mousetrap and distributed my field mouse to a local rest area. So that that is what I did.
00:54:40
Speaker
Only you, Shane. But I love it. I love it. Only you, Shane. And I am your other fabulous co-host. I am Maddie Bynum. She, her. And instead of listing my credentials, I'm going to take this time to say and re-echo Mark and Shane.
00:54:55
Speaker
We're coming up on a mid-year election year, y'all. It is our power. It is our duty to go vote. I don't care how you vote because at this point, your vote is your decision. However, I just need people to vote. I need people to get out there.
00:55:10
Speaker
Instead of us having conversations, let's be active and let's make changes because we have the power. We are the people of the people, by the people, for the people. So there you go. And with that being said, remember to subscribe.
00:55:24
Speaker
To get your every episode of Power Beyond Pride at powerbeyondpride.com or you can find us on any platform, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts from. And make sure to always check out our next episode that airs every Tuesday of every week.
00:55:39
Speaker
And Power Beyond Pride is a project from A Great Idea, queer-owned design and content agency. Learn more about them at agreatidea.com. This episode is produced by Shane Lucas and I, Maddie Biner, is your new project developer. And our editor Jared Redding. And with the support of the amazing Ian Wilson.
00:55:58
Speaker
And Maddie and I are both part of this podcast. Awesome host team, fabulous host team, if you will. And we invite you to send in your questions and comments at Power Beyond Pride.com. And once again, check out our new episodes each week on Tuesdays. And we look forward to Queer Changemaking with you next time. Thank you again from all of us here at Power Beyond Pride.