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Ep 4. Sandy Mallik, PTC
145 Plays2 years ago
In this episode, we venture into the world of AR/VR with Sandy Mallik, who heads Marketing for PTC in the UK and Nordic region. Here, he busts typical myths about AR/VR technology, how it can be implemented in the post-covid world and why one must opt for technology marketing as a career.
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Transcript
Introduction to the Podcast
00:00:00
Speaker
Hi, this is the Marketing Connect Podcast. Hi, this is the Marketing Connect Podcast. Hi, this is the Marketing Connect Podcast, a show where we get up close and personal with some of the most celebrated marketeers in the country. We talk to them and discover nuances of marketing that we often miss. After all, we are a show for marketeers by marketeers. Listen in.
00:00:34
Speaker
Good evening, ladies and
Meeting Sandy and His Role Transition
00:00:35
Speaker
gentlemen. This is Saurabh, and we are back with yet another episode of Marketing Connect. Today, I have a very exciting guest with me. I call him Sandy, but I will let him introduce himself to you. Sandy, over to you. OK, thanks. Thanks, Saurabh. It's really exciting to be a part of this, and I hope
00:00:56
Speaker
You know, I'm not sure whether I'm interested in marketeer, but I'm sure I had my own share of my unique journey. So I'm currently heading marketing with PTC. At the moment, I'm in a transition. I am currently looking at Indian geo, but I'm soon moving to UK and Northern Europe to do field marketing for that region.
00:01:21
Speaker
I started my career, you know, I have been a marketer through and through, so mostly tech marketing has been my forte ever since I've left college and I love it. I think it's exciting to be a marketer and to be a tech marketer. Amazing. Sandy, assume Karoki, we don't know anything about you or PTC.
Exploring PTC's Innovations
00:01:42
Speaker
So tell me, what does PTC do? What does the company do and what do you do there? So PDC is a Boston-based company.
00:01:51
Speaker
a leader in industrial IoT platform and augmented reality. So our technology helps industrial companies to create value for themselves, their customers and the world. So from hospital equipment with increased uptime and a space suite that is just as durable as half the way to more sustainable buildings and efficient manufacturing.
00:02:12
Speaker
Each improvement in our technology helps to create and makes a better world. So, you know, it's through a combination of augmented reality, industrial IoT, PLM, CAD solutions, PTC technology helps customers to achieve some results, you know, something tangible. Say, for example, in our CEO, Jim Hepelman's word, the goal of digital transformation is not to just become a digital company. Instead, for industrial companies to capitalize on the digital technologies and to defend and advance their competitive advantages more,
00:02:41
Speaker
holistic and we provide that platform and the technology to actually, you know, enable digital transformation for most of our customers. My role in PTC is really as a marketeer to promote that technology, to improve adoption, to enable adoption. And as a marketeer, I don't just think of just selling, but also to inspire companies to make them feel confident to go and
00:03:09
Speaker
start this process of change because technology adoption is change for any organization especially in the scale and breadth that we talk about you know for example augmented reality is a new thing especially in India for a lot of people and there is a you know like a huge range of opportunities that are possible with augmented reality so implementing an augmented reality strategy is not about
00:03:35
Speaker
just buying an IT system. It's a whole switch and change process. And my role as a marketeer is to be the starting point of that process for any company, for any CXO.
00:03:49
Speaker
Got this. So, you mentioned some really interesting buzzwords that, you know, all marketeers today look for, right? EOT, IoT, digital transformation, augmented reality, virtual reality.
Demystifying Augmented Reality
00:04:02
Speaker
So, Sandy, how about you assume that I am a six year old, and you explain all these three things to me, like, you know, really, really simple terms, so that my listeners could actually understand that, you know, where is the world headed in the next few years?
00:04:18
Speaker
So let's start with augmented reality. And I'll also give some examples of the applications of augmented reality. And since it's a marketing conversation, I will keep to some of the applications for marketing as much as can also take you through a shop floor examples. So let's say an example of TVS Motors, an Indian company that launched an app called TVS Arise.
00:04:45
Speaker
So what does that app do? It's like, you know, you can actually augment your bike in your living room and you can show it and share it with your friends. You can actually change the features and functionality. Similarly, you know, Porsche has done a whole, you know, app for the European market where you enter into a showroom. So you see a car and you say, and you ask the sales guy that, you know what, I want a black color.
00:05:11
Speaker
And so you can actually, with using the app, you can change the color, you can change the design. You can experience the car in an augmented setting, but in a real showroom. You know what I mean? So these are the kind of applications I can explain. So for kids, if you're talking about kids, Lego toys, for example, used our solution. And they wanted children to connect digitally experienced. So basically, they created an app that they can scan on physical toys or on prints.
00:05:41
Speaker
and they can interact, and more of the scans they did, more loyalty points they got, and they could upgrade their games. And interestingly, in 60 days, 2.7 million downloads happened. And actually, that helped Lego to actually win the Editor's Choice Award at the London's Toys Fair last year. So it's interesting how companies, the possibility with augmented reality is incredible.
IoT and Customer Experience
00:06:11
Speaker
IoT has more applications, internet of things or industrial IoT as many buzzwords call it has more applications in the manufacturing center where you want to connect your factory or machines and you want to have a real-time information about the performance of those machines. This is something that IoT does but of course there is another part of IoT which is smart connected products where your products become
00:06:35
Speaker
you know, sensor enabled. So for example, you can switch on your air condition even before arriving home, or you can switch on your geezer even before you reach home. Those kind of things are IoT. So I think a lot of automobile companies are getting into IoT, and they have these whole experience that is enhanced. And the performance of the, you know, I think the customer experience is going to go up with internet, especially smart connected products.
00:07:02
Speaker
So that is the IoT kind of examples that I can share. And this is what PTC does. Got this. So one of my friends recently got a new car, and he was super excited to tell me that before I go to the car, I can switch on the AC, and it will be at 22 degrees when I enter the car. And I think that is what IoT does for him, right? Amazing.
00:07:23
Speaker
So, Sandy, tell me these technologies that you work on are very different from, you know, FMCG market here, wherein they are supposed to create, you know, brand salience more than anything else.
A Day in Sandy's Life
00:07:35
Speaker
In your case, a lot of your work would probably be evangelism of these technologies to other industries, right? So, tell me what does a typical day look like for you in an office?
00:07:51
Speaker
The good thing about a marketing job is that there is no typical day. Every day is different. But having said that, at any point, there is always a few elements that are constantly working together. There is a lot of focus on the top line. Even for FMCG companies, I'm sure they do a lot of focus on top line.
00:08:21
Speaker
I'm constantly working with the business functions and the business leaders to ensure that we are going up to the right market to understand what are the challenges, the potential challenges, and therefore, how do we actually go and inspire those people, our target audience, to start trying us out, you know? So, typical day arranges between a lot of calls with sales, with product management, with
00:08:48
Speaker
outside vendors with agencies. So on one side, we are making all the plans and strategy and initiatives. On the other side, we have on ground execution and then measuring of results. So typically it's a range of activities, whether it's meeting internally with the sales or the product teams or externally with agencies, media, all kinds of people.
00:09:11
Speaker
Got this. So I'm going to ask you a tough question. How Sandy tell me, did you always want, did you always want it to be in the technology marketing space or it just happened to you? Like, you know, most marketeers don't know where to go and wherever their first job exam, they just follow that. What happened? What about you? Yeah, actually it was an interesting start. So I, when I was in college, that was many, many years ago, 20 more plus years ago, you know, there was no internet. I mean, forget about internet. I studied in, I studied in San Stevens.
00:09:41
Speaker
And the top of the town, you know, the college was all about civil services, you know, career. The MBA was getting there. I mean, marketing and kind of finance profession. People were trying for IAMs and trying for each cat, but it was still very old school, very different. And we didn't have internet. We didn't have, we would go to a cyber cafe and we didn't even know what technology would be or would become. There was no imagination at the time.
00:10:10
Speaker
which was back in the 1999 and 2000. So, you know, I didn't know I would become a technology marketer, but I knew I would become, I want to become a marketer. And, and, and the reason was because there was, you know, a marketing role is always exciting, new, different things. There's a challenge all the time. And I landed into technology by chance.
00:10:34
Speaker
But also, I had a choice. So without naming companies, there was a situation once at the start of my career where I was working for consumer brands through an agency. I was working in market research. But I realized that there is a lot of saturation. I mean, there is a lot of people doing it, and I probably wouldn't find my niche. And therefore, I jumped into tech marketing. So it was kind of a choice, but it was a choice for sure. It wasn't something that came into it. It wasn't something I didn't have an option.
00:11:04
Speaker
Cool, Sandy. Amazing that you actually had a choice and there is some bit of luck and some bit of personal choice that you made to come into tech marketing.
AR in Consumer Experience
00:11:15
Speaker
So tell me, I'm going to put you on the spot here and assume Karoki, I am a FFCG marketeer and I'm supposed to launch a new brand of chocolates. And somebody told me that, you know, speak to Sandy from PPC and he could help you with doing an AR-VR based solution for your brand.
00:11:32
Speaker
So walk me through a step by step kind of a journey and how I could become a more tech slash exciting brand for my consumers. So for example, you know, I'll give you an example from what has been done already, and then I will put it in the context of a chocolate company. So we work, PDC worked with a wine company called Vivino. And, you know, a wine company, you know, choosing a wine in a wine store could be a daunting task.
00:12:01
Speaker
to understand which wine you should choose, what are the other options, what kind of recipe a wine can go with. All that kind of questions gets answered through AR. So there is an image that gets augmented. There is a person who actually tells you about it.
00:12:18
Speaker
You can ask questions. So there is a very interactive process where actually the wine bottles kind of speaks with you or speaks to you and tells you about it, tells you about what are the things that it goes well with, what is the flavor, taste, acidity, blah, blah, blah. So let's take the chocolate brand. Same thing, you know, choosing a chocolate to be, you know, either to gift someone or
00:12:40
Speaker
for a dinner party, it could be a daunting task. So you can actually create a more augmented experience, because of course you cannot replace the sense of taste or smell, because those are things that, you know, it can only replace the visual experience, but also giving information about the chocolate, about how it is made, what is the percentage of cocoa versus the other ingredients, where it was sourced,
00:13:07
Speaker
whether it was done in a more, what you say, humanitarian way or not, all those kinds of questions. So you might get a background study about chocolate through augmented reality, just like Vivino is promoting its wine using augmented reality. Got it.
00:13:23
Speaker
So Sandy, before you pitch PTC to me, you touched upon a very interesting word that I hear a lot from people and marketeers these days. You use the word humanitarian. Tell me something as a marketeer, what is your stand on ethics versus humanity versus the world hoping to become more kinder with everything that's happening around us? What's your take on that, Sandy?
00:13:48
Speaker
So I think this is something that as a professional, I also stand for is I think I am striving to make a difference, make an impact in whatever possible way to make this world a more kinder, inclusive place.
Storytelling and Ethics in Marketing
00:14:07
Speaker
people are tolerant to one another irrespective of their religious, religion, caste, sexual preferences, gender, et cetera. And I think in that regard, I like, you know, you know, I'm inspired by people such as, you know, Dan Lady who created sheet screen.
00:14:25
Speaker
which kind of broke the boundary of talking about bringing a simple family story on the air and telling a very simple story of how love and family and inclusivity is so important. And it's such a simple story, but it's such a powerful story. It has moved millions of people around the world. And I think those are the kind of stories we need to say, even as marketeers, when we go out and try to do campaigns, we should always think of
00:14:54
Speaker
ways and means to tell those stories by touching some kind of a social issue. So it's not just about selling a product, but also about telling a story that inspires a set of people that
00:15:10
Speaker
that helps to raise our conscience towards each other, towards society, towards the environment. I think that's what we are lacking right now. I think the pandemic has helped a lot of people to actually realize that, especially from the materialistic or the capitalist world.
00:15:25
Speaker
But I think it's important as marketeers. You're talking about people like me. You're talking to talking about people like me, capitalists and, you know, materialists. I am, I am, I am, I am totally into capitalism. I'm not against it. But I think the ethics of the human side is important as much as we are, we try to do our jobs by, you know, which is selling or, you know,
00:15:49
Speaker
selling products that we sell every day. So yeah. So tell me, I'm going to probably shift gears and I'm going to ask you a little more personally because you're intriguing conversation. So tell me some companies, assuming that you weren't working for PTC, what kind of companies would you want to work for and give me a why? I mean, I mean, I just want to understand from you what excites you with those companies and what makes you look up to them. So I think, you know, I am
00:16:19
Speaker
I'm very much a storyteller, and at the core of my heart, I like companies or businesses that tell stories. Like how Mira and I are, her popular one-liner is, if you do not tell your stories, nobody will. We are supposed to tell our stories in whatever way, format. If we are in a place of privilege where we can tell our stories,
00:16:44
Speaker
tell it so that the world gets inspired. And who knows, there are a lot of people who would want to hear that story. So I really get inspired by companies such as Netflix, also YouTube to some extent for democratizing content, letting people express themselves, letting people tell their stories. I think even Netflix, for letting a lot of young talent get an opportunity to tell their unique stories and find their unique voices.
Inspiration from Netflix and Social Impact
00:17:12
Speaker
and not be afraid of any kind of societal norms or boundaries. So I wouldn't say I would like to work for those companies because I am very much happy here and I like my work. It is a trick question to have your colleagues listen and then pull your legs. I know. But definitely those companies who tell the stories
00:17:35
Speaker
inspire me. But I also like a lot of companies, a lot of FMCG companies, I won't name them who actually promote the cause. For example, black is beautiful, something that one of the brand I don't want to name, but they actually hired a colored model to be the face instead of choosing. So those kinds of brands, even as consumer companies, FMCG companies, they can also do their bit by telling such stories and inspiring girls to not
00:18:05
Speaker
be in the pressure to fit into a certain skin color or beauty. You know, I think that's that's a responsible marketing and a responsible business, I would say, which I would be inspired by. So so I'm going to I'm going to push it further. I know that you were refusing to name any names per se. But if I had to tell you that, you know, Sandy Mirko, a company can give me the name that you think is doing a phenomenal job in marketing, what would that be? It could be Indian, it could be international, it could be a regional, whatever kind of a company.
00:18:35
Speaker
I don't know whether I can remember off the hat or I can be 100% sure. But I don't know whether I can point my finger into one brand, but there are a lot of companies. I can't really think of companies.
00:18:55
Speaker
They are doing a lot for underprivileged girls, girl child, especially in India, we have this issue. I don't exactly say her name, but yeah, there are a lot of companies who are working on those lines. There are a lot of companies working on, against fairness, fairness creams, which is a great thing. I think we should, it's high time we get out of that fairness thing for women.
00:19:23
Speaker
And a lot of companies, for example, I remember one of those award functions which I was watching where, what is her name, Annie Schumer got the beauty, some glamour award. So I think it's very important for companies to bring a more inclusive sense of beauty, a more inclusive sense of what,
00:19:48
Speaker
beauty should be or what a person should be you know instead of putting them into the boxes and and the pressure of being thin and pretty and especially for women and and especially a lot of companies who are doing a lot of work on promoting uh you know the girl child ensuring the girl child education i think those are really inspiring i don't know names at the moment i mean i cannot name names but yeah
00:20:14
Speaker
It's an it's an inspiring answer, Sandy, but, you know, I mean, I'm known to pull legs of my of my guests. So I have to tell you that you are a you could make a great politician as well. I mean, you know, you've been on the right side of conversation all this while. OK, let me let me get back to a serious conversation about the world that you operate in. Right. I mean, digital transformation and digital impact. So tell me if any students are listening to the conversation and they want to make a career into this
00:20:42
Speaker
Sunrise industry, as I want to call it, what would you advise
Advice for Young Marketers
00:20:47
Speaker
them? How can they do that? And what are the first few things that they should look at? I think, you know, for youngsters, I always when I'm trying to hire or when I'm trying to, you know, coach them, I look for their ability to draw inspiration from multiple areas instead of being very myopic or very
00:21:12
Speaker
squared to just one thing, you know, and this is something typically I feel a lot of very typical geeky techy people, they are only focused on the technology so much so they do not really draw inspiration from the world of fashion or films or art or literature. And that is where I feel as a marketeer, even if I'm a tech marketeer, even if I'm, I am talking and telling stories to people, you know, even if I'm selling
00:21:40
Speaker
high tech industry and we shouldn't forget that as marketeer one I would say try and be curious to ideas and inspirations from across the spectrum and world you know with the with the internet anything is possible you know one can keep watching videos you know they can go deep dive into a person comedian or there's a lot of material out there I think one needs to understand just be curious to learn about different things rather than
00:22:11
Speaker
just my opaque or one single linear way of looking at career. So that would be my advice. But you also said something really interesting here that you said you could do multiple things, including watching, say, stand-up comedy. Now, tell me, when you're not working, what kind of media do you consume? How do you keep yourself aware about what's happening in the world? What kind of newspapers do you read? Who are the favorite columnists, bloggers, and other people like that?
00:22:42
Speaker
I have no favorites, but I read times. I mean, not times, times of India, times UK. I read financial times. I read a lot of whatever I could grab my hands. I'd also like watching interesting things on Netflix, not necessarily English making series, series which are probably not necessarily related to a certain kind of entertainment.
00:23:12
Speaker
I also follow a lot of artists on Instagram. So I tend to follow their lives. And also, if you really ask me what favorite, I would say a couple of writers who inspire me. One of them is this Nigerian lady called Chimamanda Adeichi.
00:23:38
Speaker
She talks about the African-American experience versus the African experience in America in a white world. And I think her short story collection was incredible. She's extremely talented and tells her stories very succinctly, both promoting the feminist point of view and the color point of view.
00:23:57
Speaker
And I like this author which most people wouldn't know and I follow him dearly on Instagram is Neil Patel. He's one of the Indian American writers, you know, gay writers who has actually written an election of short stories, you know, across different kind of situations, you know, it's not necessarily an LGBTQ short story collection, but rather
00:24:22
Speaker
It is a short story collection talking about different kind of encounters, relationships, which are not in the conventional frame of reference. So I really follow such people. I don't know them personally. Like I said, I like Dan Levy. But yeah, in terms of consumption of material, it's a wide range. And today we have that wide range of content available out there.
00:24:49
Speaker
So Sandy, tell me, it's a tough one. I was reading a lot about AR and VR and people have been saying that these technologies have been coming soon for the last 10 years now and just haven't seen to come around.
AR's Role During COVID
00:25:05
Speaker
I mean, what is your take as an expert in the industry and as a stakeholder in the industry? Wasn't AR supposed to be the saving grace in this world that got stuck into their homes because of COVID? Yes.
00:25:19
Speaker
Yes, companies who have adopted AR. So I'll give you some examples of what it means. Some examples that may or may not have been implemented. So for example, there is something called expert capture. So for example, you are in a shop floor and you cannot have all the people on the shop floor in a manufacturing setup because of social distancing, because of COVID.
00:25:47
Speaker
you are making people take turns and coming onto the shop floor. And there are issues that one is facing with the specific machine. One can actually remotely help somebody, train somebody, or even get the expert knowledge without that person's physical presence. That is what augmented reality can do in a shop floor setup. And I'm talking about a hardcore manufacturing setup
00:26:15
Speaker
physical presence is important. It's not about working from home, but even there AR can enable work from home, even in a manner with augmented reality that is possible. Furthermore, real estate. So real estate is one of the industry that is really showing a lot of interest in augmented reality. And this is how AR can help real estate companies. So let's say a real estate company is selling premium homes. And every time, and they have a diverse set of buyers who have diverse set of taste,
00:26:45
Speaker
So when you make a sample flat, the whole dilemma is who am I catering to? So you don't have to create a sample flat. Give them augmented reality. Make them augmented.
00:26:58
Speaker
you know, a device or maybe an app or ideally a device they wear in, they walk into an empty flat and they can exactly see the apartment, the interiors as they want to see. If they want to select a particular sofa, they can do select a particular color of the room. They can try out. So imagine trying out an empty apartment.
00:27:17
Speaker
looking and virtually you are seeing a completely the setup that you want to see you are more likely to buy firstly secondly the real estate company doesn't need to invest in different kind of multiple you know sample flat interiors and thirdly you can also tie up with companies such as Urban Ladder and you know
00:27:40
Speaker
to actually sell those products. So for example, if I'm buying, if I'm a real estate home buyer and I walk into an empty apartment with a device, AR device, and I can, and I am now decided to buy the apartment. I also can, you know what, I'm going to have this color. I will have this sofa. I will have this. I've decided my interiors and I would know how much it will cost, which vendors will supply to me. And it's all set. So imagine you are actually not only selling home, you're selling an entire
00:28:07
Speaker
home, like not just a building, you know, with the furniture, with the everything as per your customer. The entire experience, right? The entire experience. Yeah. So in a, in a COVID situation where you cannot social distancing and all that. So you just open up all your sample apartments, have one, one handheld device. You don't have to crowd overcrowd your one sample flat and let people see and buy. So it's so much easier, you know, with COVID is actually
00:28:36
Speaker
helped our business. Our share prices have gone up like anything. It has helped our business for people to realize the importance of these technologies to actually get better and do things in a more efficient format without having too much of physical overcrowding. Of course, COVID has taken away many lives and it's not a good thing.
00:28:57
Speaker
but it's been a boon for our industry.
Strategic AR/VR Partnerships
00:29:00
Speaker
So tell me, isn't AR and VR solutions kind of expensive to get off the ground for a brand? Not really. I will not like to sell with the pricing and all that, but it is not at all a problem. The interesting thing about, one thing I would like to say, which is also an interesting bit about my job, which is different from a lot of other
00:29:25
Speaker
FMCG or consumer market deals is that we work as an ecosystem. We don't just provide a solution. So we work with a lot of strategic partners such as Rockwell Automation, Microsoft, a host of SI partners such as Infosys, Wipro, Tech Mahindra, Capgemini, Accenture. We work with a lot of consulting firms such as Deloitte and KPMG to bring about a whole experience at this technology adoption.
00:29:55
Speaker
Like I said, it is not just about buying a point solution. It's about a whole strategy. It's about, you know, engaging with consultants and it's not expensive because you are looking at the ROI, you look at the medium to long term impact of your investment.
00:30:12
Speaker
Okay, Sandy, so while I was doing research for this podcast episode, I spoke to a couple of marketing friends, and they said AR, VR, Karnana bought expensive with that. So what are other such myths that marketers have before they want to adopt AR or VR as a mode of, as a communication tool for themselves? Yeah, I think, sort of, this is more from a
00:30:38
Speaker
this is a mind block rather than really being expensive. Because especially for sales and marketing applications, the examples that I gave you on the wine bottle or Porsche in-store experience, it is just about some programming, creating the app, getting the codes or getting those part models and integrate it so that one can actually augment it. It is not a big expensive affair,
00:31:08
Speaker
But it definitely requires a shift in the way we think. It's a number of people involved, a number of teams involved within the organization. It's not just a marketer implementing a campaign, but it may involve the product design team. It may involve the product engineering teams also in case of car manufacturers. Actually, it's rather a lot of people to be involved in the implementation of the AR
00:31:34
Speaker
uh strategies rather than the cost. So I would say uh and and we are here like I said we come as an ecosystem so we are here to help not just it's not a point solution you know so those are the roadblocks we get it's more to do with the change management it's more to do with the whole mystery of the implementation rather than the price.
00:31:55
Speaker
That's amazing. So, Sanit, tell me if I were to ask you that, you know, why should I not join the AR slash VR industry? What would you tell me? I think one should take it up. There is no reason why you shouldn't take it up. This is the future because it's very exciting. And as a marketeer, you know, there is a lot of potential and I would say white space to explore. There is no precedence. There is
00:32:23
Speaker
There is no formula as such, you know, even when we work with agencies, we are both the parties are evolving and we are debating and learning. It's not like going to an Ogilvy and asking to give us the most creative, you know, ad for, you know, for our FMCG product. It's very different. There is no reason. And it's interesting, like, for example, coming to the FMCG point,
00:32:52
Speaker
There was recently, we worked with Burger King in one of our regions to do this campaign called Burn the Ad. So even for FMCG companies, how they are adopting AR. So there was an app where Burger King or anybody who loves to eat burgers can point that app to any competitor ads of Burger King, say McDonald's or KFC or any of the ads on Billboard or
00:33:22
Speaker
newspaper and the ads get burned and the more ads they can burn the more loyalty bonus they get to buy free burgers you know from Burger King so every time they look at an ad they're actually thinking how do I burn it to go and eat in Burger King rather than I don't know so it's such an interesting innovative way of looking at it so I think if you work for an AR company there is so much more exciting things that you can do and
00:33:48
Speaker
with the technology and your customers who go and use your technology. And I would say there is no reason why one shouldn't really join for an AR or IoT company.
00:33:58
Speaker
Got this. So I am one of those people that follows Charlie Munger's model of invert, always invert, thinking that, you know, if I know that I'm going to die in a certain place, I will never go there. So I try to ask contrarian questions to sort of clarify my learning. That is where it comes from. Okay, got it.
00:34:20
Speaker
And if you were to go back to college today, it could be your, you know, or it could be the MBA or it could be any other course. What kind of things would you want to learn to be relevant in today's time and age? Okay. First of all, I don't know. You know, there are a few things that I would like to learn. I like to, first of all, I feel for youngsters or people who want to learn world is the best place. You have lessons from anyone and everyone around.
00:34:50
Speaker
Very cliche, as it sounds. But course-wise, I would like to learn more storytelling. I also could read a lot on storytelling, creative writing, because as a marketeer, we are essentially storytellers. And if we cannot inspire enough without stories, we haven't done a great job. So storytelling. And I would also see a little bit of acting.
00:35:12
Speaker
Because what we do when we step into our office or not our virtual offices is we leave our, I mean, in any business, whether we are in corporate or any business, when we are talking with people in a professional setup, we have to let go our personal self and walk into a self where we are ourself, as much authentic as we are, but also be ready to be
00:35:42
Speaker
Ourselves without being impacted. You know what I mean? So for example, if you are if you have a very You know healthy yet intense debate with somebody in your organization You shouldn't go home and feel so bad about it or stressed about it because it's nothing personal So I think the workshops acting workshops allows one to actually get into a method or get into a situation and come out of it you know and
00:36:09
Speaker
untouched or unaffected. So I think acting lessons, workshops, I wouldn't say full of full-time acting classes to become an actor, but to be able to get through these situations in a work life is going to be very exciting. So have I ever seen you buy a mistake in a TVC or something? Me? No, no, no. I like the whole business of storytelling and theater.
00:36:39
Speaker
and theatrical aspect of life. But I haven't really, you know, I don't think you need to see me in a TV series. You just can meet me and just see the theatrical side. Is that what your colleagues tell you when they meet you? Well, yes, I think there has to be an element of entertainment, you know, otherwise life is so dull and boring, unless we are breaking our boundaries and becoming a little excited and, you know,
00:37:05
Speaker
Dramatic, I would say, or more animating. That's the right word. So you told me right in the beginning that you are transitioning to a different role in a different territory.
Navigating New Markets
00:37:20
Speaker
So tell me as a marketer who doesn't have, pardon my ignorance, I'm assuming that you don't have experience in that market as yet. So as somebody who doesn't have experience in a different market, what are you doing to prepare yourself for that challenging role ahead?
00:37:34
Speaker
I think there are few things that remain the same. For example, I have had some international experiences through education and also work, but if one doesn't have any experience in the market, I think the basic rules of marketing is pretty much the same. What really works in one's favor if they're transitioning within the same company or the same industry is the network they have, network of people within the organization they work with as much as with their
00:38:03
Speaker
partners and strategic partners. And the only preparation, the prep work would be to understand the customers or the prospects of that region, how they operate, how different they are from one region to another. So my movement into a more mature market would mean that those customers are way more mature. So some of the techniques that I would do in India, for example, more digital, more volume oriented marketing,
00:38:28
Speaker
would change if I am in Northern Europe, we know in the Nordic countries where it's more account based, you know, going deep into our understanding the account and understanding, say, for example, what an IKEA needs and then and then evangelizing the technology through the chain of stakeholders within IKEA rather than trying to go after the entire furniture market. You know what I mean? So that is the difference. It's going from market to market.
00:38:54
Speaker
And tell me, it's more of a personal question than anything else, to be honest. But tell me, what are your biggest fears when you go to a role like that? Is it fear of performance? I mean, I just wanted to understand myself more than for the podcast, per se. Actually, I don't have any fear. I think the only fear is, of course, the cultural difference, the people. I have lived in the UK, so I'm kind of used to the British culture.
00:39:24
Speaker
but I'm more excited and nervous for the Nordic region because culturally they're very different. And that would be my only fear, whether I would be able to fit and whether I will be able to gel with them because at the end of the day, any job we do, marketing, finance, sales, it's all about people, the stakeholders that we work with and how we get the work done and how we collaborate.
00:39:55
Speaker
The bottom line is that, you know, all this. So like Jeff Emmelt, CEO, one of the CX CEOs of GE. You know, I remember one of the videos that he said, in which he said that he was educated, like he was, he did his MBA from Harvard. I think Harvard or, so he said that during my, I mean, I'm quoting him, which I still remember, it was interesting.
00:40:24
Speaker
All due to my MBA, I used to ignore the organization behavior courses. I would think of it as a fluffy, artsy kind of thing. And I would take up finance and corporate finance and hardcore number crunching courses. But little did I realize back then that organization behavior and all the behavioral courses is all that I would need
00:40:45
Speaker
for the rest of my career. Even my message to the aspiring marketeers or anyone, behavioral courses, telling stories, the human side of things is the most important thing, I feel, in my opinion, to any job success.
00:41:04
Speaker
I think, and that's what we think, you know, we think it's very artsy, it's very soft and fluffy. You know, I'm spending so much of money in my MBA and why should I go and waste my time doing a course like an example in Warwick. We had this course called the Leadership and the Art of Judgment, a very interesting course. And the course was mainly about judgment. And when you say judgment, people tend to think of judges, you know, but we as a leader or as a manager, as any professional, we are making a, we are making judgment
00:41:34
Speaker
every minute we are making a decision we are meeting people so the art of judgment you know to remove the biases that we have to understand is it very important you know we tend to take it for granted who cares about judgment we have so much of prejudice but to be conscious about judgment to be conscious about our prejudice is an art as much as a science you know so i think courses such as those
00:41:57
Speaker
are important and those are the biggest challenge that I would see moving into any role or any region. I think my biggest fear moving to a Europe or a Nordic country would be to you know catch a cold because they're like cold to a different level.
Social Impact in Marketing Campaigns
00:42:11
Speaker
Coming from India I think I don't think I can handle it. Yeah you live in Goa also.
00:42:16
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, every time I've traveled there, I have been, I've been like, but yeah, the last question that I asked every marketeer on my podcast is that, you know, if I told you to throw open a marketing challenge to the listeners of the podcast, what would that be? So I would say this is a challenge for a marketeer, no matter which industry you are in, no matter what you're trying to sell, whether you're selling
00:42:44
Speaker
sanitary napkins, which can be very socially contextual to selling, you know, notepads, notepads in the sense, not iPad, but old school notebooks. How can you think of a marketing campaign that will help the, you know, some kind of social cause, solve a social cause or promote a social message? So that could be my marketing challenge to the listener. So no matter which product you sell,
00:43:14
Speaker
Think about a campaign that can impact anything in the society. Something that does good for a certain section of the society with your campaign, as much as it helps to sell some product. Interesting and tough to think on, man. I don't think I can come with an answer right away, but we'll do so. You just heard the latest episode of the marketing director.
00:43:40
Speaker
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