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Video Game Films
270 Plays3 years ago
In this episode, Fraser (Satsunami) and Adam discuss the genre of video game films. Is there hope for this type of film? Or are they always destined to fail? Let's find out!
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Transcript
Introduction to Video Game Films
00:00:05
Speaker
Welcome to Chatsunami.
00:00:17
Speaker
Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of Chat Tsunami. I'm Sat Tsunami and joining me for, well, is it right to say Strolling Down Memory Line with these films? Yes, my very good friend Adam. Strolling is not the word I would use. Tumbling.
00:00:37
Speaker
yes um collapsing like fall like you know like an action film where like the the floor gives way and like you know the main characters fall through several floors oh yeah i feel like that's what the metaphor for this falling through the building anyway good to be here
00:00:53
Speaker
What a start. Actually reminds me of, have you ever seen the film Golden Eye? Oh yeah. Do you remember the bit where one of the villains, throughout the film he keeps saying he's invincible and he's like shot at, he gets blown up. Or he doesn't get blown up but he nearly gets blown up.
00:01:09
Speaker
And everyone's just like, oh, I can't believe this. And he's like, I am invincible. And then at the end, he just gets frozen. And it's like, that's what I feel when you're watching these films and you're like, or some of them. You're like, this isn't so bad. And then you get to a certain point. And yeah.
00:01:28
Speaker
It's not the best sometimes Oh goodness me Honestly, see like between researching this and a few other things like there have been a lot of surprises today I mean, I told you what happened to me today So just to kind of give context before we jump into the topic today You know how you get those adverts on YouTube for different advertisers, you know like
00:01:56
Speaker
like NordVPN, Raid Shadowlight, you know, all of those kind of things. Well, I got a real life version of that today when somebody knocked on my door and...
00:02:07
Speaker
It was a guy from Hello Fresh, which I did not realise that they actually made house calls. Did you know that? No, I did not know that either, but every day's a school day. Yeah, he started... So, let me give you context. This guy came to the door, he had his Hello Fresh mask on, he has a big apron on, and he started asking about my cooking habits and things, and I was like...
00:02:33
Speaker
I was like, if I didn't know what Hello Fresh was, I would have been gravely concerned. I was like, are you here to offer a sponsorship for Chatsanami or even Chatsanami though? I was like, yeah, no. So when they told me I wasn't interested, they just kind of was like, oh, right, OK, and walked away. And I was like, this is weird. Yeah. So yeah, that's my fun fact of the day.
00:02:57
Speaker
or rather fun encounter of the day, which seems to be few and far between.
The Controversy and Reception of Video Game Films
00:03:02
Speaker
As you can see, today we are indeed going to be tackling a very controversial topic. Would you say this is controversial? Like in terms of gaming, sorry. Let me do you two.
00:03:14
Speaker
I think it probably still is. I think it maybe has died down a bit because I think we've just maybe become numb to the idea that this is a phenomenon now and it's going to happen. So I don't think maybe it's as heated as it once was, but I still think it's a controversial thing for many gamers and probably for many film fans as well.
00:03:32
Speaker
Well, that's true. If you think about it though, video game films are that weird in-between, aren't they? Some of them are either so bad they're good or they just don't appease anybody. They don't appease film buffs, they don't appease video game fans. In fact, there's a perfect comic which I always bring up in the stream. I always bring it up and I just think it encapsulates this perfectly.
00:04:00
Speaker
It's like a stick figure who plays a game that's called Blue, so it's just literally the colour blue and he's playing this game and he says, oh this is fantastic, this is great, I love this, oh boy, they're adapting this into a film and then he goes to the cinema and he looks, you know, he sits down, he's got his popcorn and everything and then two seconds later the screen flashes up and
00:04:22
Speaker
instead of the colour blue on the screen it's the colour red but it's got the words blue just like painted across the screen and the guy's like look of horror and he says it's just fantastic and that's kind of how they feel well at least for some of them because definitely in the i mean we talked about this last week um where yeah we talked about the super mario brothers film uh which is probably like the most infamous example
00:04:49
Speaker
I mean, well, maybe not the most infamous, but one of them. I mean, would you agree with that? Oh, it's definitely one of them. Again, I'm not sure if it's the most infamous. It's up there though. Oh yeah, because it's one of those ones that they took a chance at something different and yeah, it didn't really work.
00:05:05
Speaker
But I mean, we kind of spoke about this like, or rather we touched on it a little last week about the kind of landscape at the time around like the kind of 80s and 90s like all films or video game films rather.
Historical Failures: 80s and 90s Adaptations
00:05:18
Speaker
Would you say it's right to assume that there were a lot of terrible film like video game films coming out of that time? You know, would you say that was probably its lowest point? Probably was like
00:05:29
Speaker
Yeah like I did feel there was a lot getting churned out but like yeah with not much soul and everything so you probably yeah I would say. Because I mean as we said we've got the Super Mario Brothers film you had the Mortal Kombat film which I think you and I watched in one of the bad film nights which had some really interesting moments in it like that was one of the ones that was so bad it was good but if you went in you know wanting to be uh or not wanting but if you went in as a Street Fighter fan I don't know how much
00:05:59
Speaker
stupid like it, or rather Mortal Kombat Street Fighter. Either way, whatever fan you wear of these films, even Mario, not Mario, sorry. In fact, no Mario. I was like, Mario didn't have a film. I can't believe I suppressed that just like that. Speedrun of separation, guys.
00:06:19
Speaker
I mean, I think the one thing you can say in their favor was at least this was like the start of it. So, you know, you're like, OK, maybe maybe this will. OK, this is obviously we know how this ends, but like, oh, yeah, going back to that time and like, well, maybe this is just teething problems, you know, like this is the first time they're trying to adapt video games into films, perhaps, you know,
00:06:36
Speaker
you know something can be awkward when they first start and perhaps they'll grow out of it like because i'm actually just i was just scrolling through some films to remind myself again and there's a lot in the mid 2000s the mid 2000s actually i think might right i know i said the 90s there but i think the mid 2000s might actually rival for the worst because there was a lot of stinkers there
00:06:52
Speaker
Do you know what it actually reminds me of? And this might sound like a weird example, but you know superhero films. It reminds me of the trend for that because in the 90s you had, technically you had Batman and things like that, but there were a lot of stinkers between the 90s and the early 2000s. It was not a good time.
00:07:13
Speaker
for those kind of films, but it's exactly the same for video game films. Of course we could have mentioned like one of the most infamous directors of course, Uwe Ball, which I take it you've heard of him? Unfortunately I have.
00:07:28
Speaker
Yeah, the German director, the man, the myth, and the... I don't want to say legend. The reprobate. The reprobate, thank you. Thank you. I don't have my thesaurus stand, so thank you. I'm being kind before the myth, I think. Yeah, for those of you who don't know about Uwebo, he is
Impact of Uwe Boll on the Genre
00:07:47
Speaker
quite... He's an interesting character, but he's directed some of the worst video game films, I think of all time. That, of course, being Alone in the Dark, Far Cry,
00:07:58
Speaker
Which I didn't actually realise had a film. Yeah. I'm going to be honest, a genie who didn't know that. Blood rain as well, you know, I think. House of the Dead. Yep, House of the Dead. I could be wrong, but... Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post-book list. Post
00:08:13
Speaker
And apparently the reason they did it was it was like a tax scheme or something like that. Like genuinely, it was something to do with Hollywood. It was either Hollywood producers or people who wanted to make films in Germany. There was like a tax loophole. So they ended up hiring Uwebo to make these films. And it didn't matter whether the films gained money or not. It didn't matter. It could absolutely tank. But because of the tax laws or something, they would still be getting their money back. So it was like,
00:08:42
Speaker
doesn't matter you know but heal as if like that is probably detrimental in the long run like especially in regards to you know how video game films were perceived as a whole just shows what a talent he is as well well that well don't say that too loud because he will challenge you to a boxing match oh fair enough
00:09:00
Speaker
In fact, he can probably beat me up, I'll give him that. I'm not even joking with that, by the way. Did you know that? Yeah, there was a point in his career where he got so peeved at negative responses, he actually called out critics. And he started saying things like, yeah, I'm going to beat you up in a boxing match. He can take a good cup of tea. I'll join him with it. Yeah, some people actually took him up on that offer, and you think, is that the best idea? Did they actually happen, did they? Yeah, no, some of them actually happened.
00:09:29
Speaker
Yeah, well there's pictures of him in the ring, so whether or not it did go ahead... Did you know what? He may not have much talent, but I'll give him credit for that at least. At least he's a man of his word in that record. Yeah, I mean at least he didn't say, oh I'm gonna beat you up and then he didn't.
00:09:49
Speaker
It's kind of like the schoolyard bully, isn't it? Yeah. Where it's like, oh, I'm going to beat you up and then he doesn't, but... No, no, he is a very horrible man, but apparently he runs a... At least, from what I read about, he ran a... I think it was a restaurant or a diner in... I think it was Vancouver. Could be wrong with that, but yeah, he got into the restaurant business and ironically enough, his reviews for that are booming. They're actually really good.
00:10:15
Speaker
Oh, good for him. Well, there you go. He's found his area. Each, that's the one. Yeah, even though it took him like, you know, a thousand bad films and a couple of YouTube videos where he told everyone to F off. You know, other than that, but I feel as if we've got the elephant out the room, kind of.
00:10:34
Speaker
But would you say that that was like one of the worst things to happen to video game films? I think so because that like set a trend. I think that's you know what I think that's why many people probably have like an opinion of video game movies like okay fair enough the ones in the 90s were bombs but like at least they were like
00:10:52
Speaker
big studio bombs in a way you know at least it was big studios back in them when you've got like some like just when you've just got some like guy just making them for like for peanuts and they're absolutely terrible and there's like no redeeming features in them at all you
Success Stories: Detective Pikachu and Sonic
00:11:07
Speaker
know then like i think if you think of a video game movie that's probably what you think of you're like god you know it's just some it's just some obnoxious german guy you know trying to get trying to get like tax breaks you know so i think it was very damaging could we get on the t-shirt
00:11:23
Speaker
Make it happen. Yeah. Let's crowdfund it and see if it gets more than Uwe Bull's actual crowdfund. Let's make a film about Uwe Bull. How better. I think people have already made films about him. I wouldn't be surprised if there was a film out there in all seriousness.
00:11:45
Speaker
What about what he told me was making the room and stuff? He seems like a character from a movie in fairness, rather than an actual human being. I mean, you're not wrong. It's kind of weird to look at these films nowadays when they're so popular. But then again,
00:12:05
Speaker
Now I'll take that back a step because although we've got films like, I mean the most successful ones I can think of off the top of my head are of course Detective Pikachu and the Sonic film which despite their kind of like wary response, more so for Sonic because of the you know the redesign for the model, that was an absolute nightmare and you know Detective Pikachu people thinking
00:12:30
Speaker
I don't know because as far as I know anyway unless there's some obscure like film out there like the only real Pokemon films are of course based off the anime so they're the animated ones which although the first couple came out here they didn't really reach like that kind of height if you know what I mean it wasn't like a yearly release like over here in the cinemas that kind of got more and more obscure so when Detective Pikachu came out it was like
00:12:56
Speaker
Is it going to be as popular? Is it not? But there is that kind of sense of scepticism. Yeah. Like, when you hear, oh, they're going to adapt to film from like a video game, you kind of think, is it going to be good? Like, in all seriousness, when you hear, for example, like Bioshock, is that not meant to be getting turned into a film? Well, it was Room Right. I thought it was cancelled, but maybe it's come back again now. Yeah. Now it's probably stuck at the bottom of the ocean.
00:13:23
Speaker
yeah which is a shame but it's like when you hear that though because I know Bioshock is one of your favorite series like how did you feel about that? Repidation is the is the word like it's one thing when a franchise like like sonic or something a franchise that like I'm not I'm not like a fan of I don't know that much about it's turned into a video game but like oh fair enough but there is I feel utter trepidation of like
00:13:47
Speaker
you know, it's a series I really love, like Bioshock or something like that, I would, I just don't, there's not enough proof, positive proof out there for me to believe that it can be done well. Maybe, maybe in the future we'll get more, there'll be better, you know, adaptations and it'll start to tip the scales, but at the minute honestly I'd rather they stayed away from, especially franchises that I love. I think, do you think
00:14:11
Speaker
they probably tried to take it a bit safer with video game films like in terms of their plot and like what happens in them. I think some some of them certainly some of them certainly do try and play a more safe road yeah like it's weird because again kind of depends on what the game you're you're choosing to adapt is because some of them do have more easily adaptable stories than others so you can be a little bit more like
00:14:36
Speaker
You know, some video games do have quite like by the numbers plots and you can quite easily translate those over, you know, and make a relatively safe plot while with others you're kind of forced to maybe be, maybe the game's more wacky or like, it's like with the Super Mario Brothers film, like how would you, okay, now you could probably adapt a plot from one of the latter Super Mario games, like Odyssey or something. But in 1993, what plot line was there to adopt from a Super Mario game? There was nothing that became close to a recognizable film script.
00:15:05
Speaker
So you had to, that's why they had to do this weird, like, weird dystopian dino hat and thing because, like, you can't do, like, can you have 19 minutes of somebody of a portly plumber running right and jumping?
00:15:20
Speaker
You know, so again, it really depends on on what you're working with, you know, something like Prince of Persia or something. At least there's a story there that, you know, perhaps you don't do it that well, but you could at least like take it and be like, right, we can make this like a by the numbers action film. And I know there's like Silent Hill.
00:15:36
Speaker
I heard divided opinions on the Silent Hill film, I've never seen it. But again, that's a plot that you could probably just like make it into a kind of bog-sounded horror film. So I think like, I think maybe as well that there's a big studio behind it, there's probably more of a temptation to try and like, you know, appeal to the masses and make a safe product. Yeah, like kind of lipping off of that idea that they are like
00:15:54
Speaker
pushing the safe product. Like, in terms of the Silent Hill films, I know there was a severe lack of understanding of the source material. Like, don't get me wrong, I'm not a big, like, Silent Hill fan because I'm terrified when it comes to these kind of games. Read as, I am a wimp. But, from what I know, there's a particular character for those of you who don't know, or haven't played it called, Pyramid Head, who is supposed to be like, and correct me if I'm wrong, Adam, but is he not like a
00:16:21
Speaker
psychological manifestation or sorry a physical manifestation of psychological guilt or something like that basically that's what he is yeah like he's supposed to be the embodiment of that who he was sorry that's what he started off as oh yeah yeah yeah before they became like part of a keychain
00:16:38
Speaker
Yeah, before they'd go and put them in all the recent Silent Hill games. Oh god. It's that way. Because it reminds me of those meme videos where it's like, no, don't turn me into X. So it's like, no, don't turn me into a keychain. And then the next frame, it's just him as a keychain going, ah.
00:16:56
Speaker
But it's true, it's because he's so marketable, you know? He's so like, oh, I recognise that guy. He's the Pyramid Head from Silent Hill. But anyway, so looking back into the films, that's apparently what they did. They just turned him into a scary monster rather than, you know, having anything more clever.
00:17:14
Speaker
If you know what I mean? Not being like, oh, this character embodies X, or this character embodies what you know, it's just like, nah, nah, nah, he's just a pyramid head with a large, like, Final Fantasy sword, and you're like, oh, oh, okay.
Challenges in Adapting Complex Game Plots
00:17:27
Speaker
Yeah, fair do's, you know what? Let's not get started on the Resident Evil films, like, how did they go? Because I know you're a bigger Resident Evil fan than I am.
00:17:36
Speaker
I have to be honest, I've never seen any of the Resident Evil films. From what I understand, the first film is kind of akin to the plot of the first game. I think it's some different characters, but it's roughly the same idea of a special forces team going to a spooky mansion.
00:17:52
Speaker
filled with zombies, but they seem to, they went down a, actually a very, very different route to the, to the games, which is, you could argue is a positive or a negative. Like I think there's valid arguments, both sides. Um, but it seems to be very much became like an end of the world apocalyptic thing. So it seems that the quality varies. Like I was, if you look at this, like it seems to jump kind of all over the place. Like I don't think any of them are like what you'd call good, but like some of them seem to be kind of passable while there's others that are just apparently absolutely turgid.
00:18:22
Speaker
But yeah, it seems to have gone down a very different route, which I think is maybe something that you should do with a video game. I don't know how you'll feel about this, but I kind of think you maybe should put your own spin on it because, again, it's kind of a thing of like, I don't quite get why you would just copy and paste something when there's something else already there.
00:18:44
Speaker
What is the point in copy and pasting the Bioshock one into a film when there's a game there already that you can play? Is it not surely better to maybe take that universe and try and tell a different story? I don't know how you feel about that, but I'm more in favor of that if they're going to do a video game adaptation.
00:19:00
Speaker
feel as if it's a double-edged sword because I completely agree there's already the story there you know yeah it's like all you have to do is take like the building blocks from the game and then create your own thing and honestly I'm one of those weirdos who thinks that you know the kind of weirder thorns you know like if they take a property and then they just make it you know their own thing yeah you know like
00:19:25
Speaker
for example, just trying to think. Like even the Super Mario Brothers, I'll just kind of backtrack to that. Like, even though it definitely wasn't done well, but at the same time it was done, you know? It was like, they still went out on a limb, they still tried their own thing, and whether you think it's good or bad, you know, at least it's memorable. I feel as if that's, like, at least a good thing that people are still kind of talking about it. Other films, like, going back to one you mentioned earlier about The Prince of Persia, I feel as if that is definitely, for me personally,
00:19:55
Speaker
it's one of the worst adaptations purely for the fact that A, I can't remember any of it because I actually went to see this in the cinema and I just remember it being quiet. It was both fast-paced and boring. It's a weird combination, you know? It was one of these films that I just sat there thinking, all right, they're going to the next thing, all right, they're going to the next thing. Oh, that's the lights up. Okay, I've got to go home. Oh, where's my wallet?
00:20:22
Speaker
Like going from thing to thing and you're like, and I know that was kind of half trying to be its own thing, half trying to, because I mean a lot of films do try to distance themselves I think. I mean look at for example the recent ones like I haven't played to detect to Pikachu games but I think they are definitely a little bit different.
00:20:44
Speaker
compared to the game itself because at least they do like a lot of world building and things and considering the only Pokémon films before this was the animated ones you know they did a damn fine job even though some bits were a bit safe same with the Sonic film the Sonic films just like a like a buddy road trip film essentially at its core but because it's still kind of straight away from that
00:21:06
Speaker
You know, so here's the thing, there's actually two examples, like if you take the sonic films, which apologies, I'm bringing it back to sonic, I'm sorry. But there's actually two examples you can look at here for this particular topic.
00:21:22
Speaker
So Sonic actually has an animated film that was made in the 90s that was supposed to be a lot more closely related to the games. Yeah, it did not do well at all because it was just a bit too weird. I think I mentioned this before but they had like cat giros and Sonic giving the finger at one point and owls dressing up as like 90s kids whereas although this one
00:21:47
Speaker
The new one's definite with the better film, but it's a lot more safer. It's like it's still trying to do its own thing. Because I'm actually wondering what you think about this. Do you think that it's that struggle of trying to fit? Because I've noticed a lot of these films try to kind of put the video game model into our world.
00:22:08
Speaker
You know, like if you look at Hitman or maybe not Prince of Paris. I mean, technically, yes and no. It's just more like fantasy in that regard. You know, about like the Sonic with even Mortal Kombat, I suppose technically. But again, maybe more fantasy. But you know, do you think that's kind of a struggle that a lot of these creators have? Or to try and adapt them?
00:22:29
Speaker
Yeah, I think, I think it really depends as well as like, if you're making one of these films, right? Okay, you're making video game into a film. So you have to, you're trying to obviously attract people who are fans of the game to come and spend their money to see the film. But the chances are, you know, and maybe with the save some, maybe from some massive franchise that maybe like Pokemon or something like that, where there's like million, like maybe billions of fans. I don't know. Like there's a lot though. There's like hundreds of millions at least.
00:22:57
Speaker
Unless you're dealing with that, you need to get people in who perhaps aren't fans of the game and might not even be gamers. You need to attract them. So that's a kind of difficult. That's a very difficult balancing act because, you know, for people who aren't fans of these games or haven't or like are fans of games in general, haven't played this particular game.
00:23:13
Speaker
You have to get something to come into it. I think putting it into our world is a way of making it a bit more recognisable to people who aren't fans of the game,
Appealing to Gamers and Non-Gamers
00:23:24
Speaker
if that makes sense. I think it's one of those studio ways of trying to cast as big a net as you can. That kind of safe, we don't want to lose all our money here.
00:23:34
Speaker
How can we make this as safe as possible rather than just sticking with the video game and then hoping that they can attract people on it via that way? I think it's just one of those studio, it's just one of these byproducts of being made by a giant industry that's desperate to focus on the bottom line.
00:23:55
Speaker
I can't actually think of a film off the top of my head that's actually achieved. You know, it's had like a film that's actually made for the game, if you know what I mean. It's like, I mean, maybe Pokemon or Detective Pikachu is probably the closest for that, because there's like a lot of easter eggs and things. But again, that has the luxury of being a well-known brand. You know, you can't imagine something like, I mean,
00:24:18
Speaker
Like, I'm trying to think, like, what are their film? I mean, Warcraft, technically, did it? Yeah. Well, there does seem to be, appear to be some that have been made by people who are fans, you know, of the games. Like, apparently, the Silent Hill one, the director was actually apparently a huge fan, and he had, like, he had the game, like, playing while he was directing and stuff, and while, like, you know, the production was ongoing, to try and, you know, to try and keep it as close as possible to that idea. Like, I think, as well, the guy made Warcraft.
00:24:46
Speaker
If I understand rightly, I think he was a fan as well. And then I think he says that, I got meddled with by the studio, I think is his sort of excuse for why it didn't turn out like the way he wanted it. So like there have been people who have been fans who've made this, but again, you are working with it. Unless you're like, you know, like doing this, financing it yourself, like you need to like this. There's people above you who have like a stake in this or going to put input into it.
00:25:10
Speaker
and you know going to change and they're probably not fans of it they're probably looking very much on like an investor I want a good return from this you know so like they come in but things they things they might do and suggest might not be good might not be good ideas I mean one example apparently with the street fire film from 94
00:25:27
Speaker
You might be able to tell this guy, I've not actually seen it, but I know you have. So apparently the guy who wrote that wanted to be like said right to Capcom, right? We need to make, we need to cut, we need to, we can only have a few characters because he said that he wanted to have seven because he was like, that's as many characters as an audience can realistically like, you know,
00:25:44
Speaker
remember and get invested in it. So that's like, I don't know what the Street Fighter roster was at the time, but I think seven was it was a quite big cut. It was at least half of the roster, but apparently Capcom kept pressuring and pressuring some more like most of the roster ended up in the film. Oh, there's hundreds. Yeah. Yeah. So I again, like I don't does it feel a bit like it's like, oh, here's you know, here's, um, so I'm absolutely blank. Here's Ryu and here's them.
00:26:07
Speaker
is, oh my god I'm terrible, Zangief and you know just appearing for like a few minutes at a time and you're like who is that again you know especially if you're not a fan of the game because I mean you've got like a whole subplot in that film of like Chung Lee and M. Bison and it has actually one of the best lines in the film where she says something to him like you killed you know or you burned my village or something like that and he like replies for you the day M. Bison you know came to your village was the worst day of your life
00:26:37
Speaker
For me it was a Tuesday. She just like looks at him and the camera just like hard cuts to the next scene It's like this is this is incredible this one But like yeah, there are a lot of characters, but I mean also as well They had the star power behind that film like you had Kylie Minogue, you had Jean-Claude Van Damme
00:26:59
Speaker
You know, you had so many people in that film and it was just insane. And that's another thing they obviously depend on. Like, for example, was it Michael Fassbender that was in the Assassin's Creed film? Yeah. They had quite a few Marion Cuttyards in it as well. I think Jeremy Irons was in it. They tend to get a lot of big bugs. You're right, Jake Gyllenhaal for Prince of Persia. Oh, got him blanking for... Well, Bob Hoskins at the time was a big thing for Super Mario Brothers.
00:27:26
Speaker
Dennis Hopper. The ones that are made by big studios tend to... Oh, Jim Carrey's in the Sonic the Hedgehog. They do tend to attract, get big names in as a way to draw people in who aren't necessarily fans of the game. I'm laughing because I'm thinking of the Detective Pikachu one that's like, who was in that? And I'm like, oh god, it was a screaming kid from the new Jurassic Park film. It was Will Smith's son. Was it? Yeah, it's one of Will Smith's sons, Justice Smith or something like that. Is it?
00:27:53
Speaker
Yeah, one of the more talented of the spiff kids. Oh, okay, right. And Ryan Reynolds. Forget Ryan Reynolds. Oh, Ryan Reynolds, yes, because he was fantastic. I mean, honestly, see after Green Lantern, he's just been on the up and up. I mean, once you put that behind him, I'm not saying that was the fella that propelled him.
00:28:11
Speaker
into the spotlight. That would just be cruel. So what would you say that a video game film has to do to be a good adaptation? What do you think is the core thing that it needs to do? I think the number one thing, looking back to the point I made earlier, is you need to choose which game to adapt because some of them are better for adaptation than some that I don't think you could ever adapt.
00:28:37
Speaker
because of the way they are like I've heard they're making a Minecraft film how are you gonna adapt unless it's like some kind of like unless it's something akin to the Lego movie which it might be something akin to that and then in which case that might work but it's the same with like as I said like Super Mario Brothers was in many ways a logical choice to pick but in so many other ways such an illogical choice because it just has no plot so I think that one the I think the key thing really is concentrate on making a good film first
00:29:03
Speaker
being a good adaptation is one thing but that should be a secondary concern make a good film because at the end of the day like people are gonna more like oh that was a great film rather than that was a below average film but my god that was a good adaptation of the source material nobody's gonna say that you know outside of some random defenders of it but make a constant making a good film first and like
00:29:25
Speaker
That's what I think people have tried to do in the past, but other reasons have kind of got in the way. Also as well, you need to get people in who are fans of the film. I think that's why some of these video game movies are bombed so much, because you can just tell people aren't that. Do you think anybody who made the Prince of Persia film was like a fan, was like a diehard fan of the series? Do you think anybody on that kind of writing or production or directing staff was a genuine fan? No, I don't see it.
00:29:50
Speaker
It doesn't come across, does it? It comes across as people who were late for their lunch, so they just wrote down anything and then they ran off for lunch after the first draft. And then they read the Wikipedia page for the Sands of Time plot.
Potential and Pitfalls of New Adaptations
00:30:02
Speaker
Let's put that into that. So you can tell, you need to get people who actually care about it. And that might have been difficult maybe at a time, but I think now you could definitely find...
00:30:13
Speaker
We have generations now who have been reared on video games, you know, at least have played them. Maybe they're not, maybe they might not still be active gamers, but like they will have at least played some of these things in the past and maybe have some fondness for them. So you got to look for those people as well. I think you've got to be ready to put money into it as well, because some of these things are going to be so difficult. I can only imagine how much the Warcraft film costs.
00:30:33
Speaker
But something like that must have been into the hundreds of millions for the effects and the CGI and the cast and everything like that. So I think it's one of the things you need to be prepared to put a lot of money in to do it. Can you imagine trying to adapt Halo? How expensive that would be? Well, technically.
00:30:50
Speaker
They have many films. This is the actual annoying thing about Halo. It's the fact they do have the resources. A lot of people say, oh I don't know if Halo would be a good adaptation. They've literally done it before but in shorter form.
00:31:08
Speaker
Yeah. Like, I mean, if you look at the live action, and this is going back to episode two of Chat Tsunami, this is a flashback discussing Halo, but it's like, you know that way where it's like, you've seen like the Halo Reach and Halo 5, God forbid, kinda shorts and things, they do have the resources and things, but it's, see, this is the thing, it's like, a film could have all the resources in the world, but if they don't have the direction, like, the direction is absolutely key.
00:31:37
Speaker
I mean, do you think that, like, what's more important? Like, do you think, and probably I know what you're gonna say, but like, do you think a film with all the resources but no direction would come out better than a film with the right direction but not as much put into it?
00:31:53
Speaker
Oh god no, you need the right direction because there's so many examples of how many big budget films we've seen that are flops or aren't good at all because they don't have a competent person.
00:32:09
Speaker
the helm you know while people have been able to make really really excellent films on like shoestring budgets and everything like one of my favorite films of all time like the original terminator is made on a relatively like tiny budget but you know he had somebody in charge of James Cameron who was a very composite director and you know he believed in the project and wanted to do the best he could and that's why you know that's why I think it's such a great film but yeah it was you know like
00:32:31
Speaker
you can look at like pick any pick any number of like you know big budget summer blockbusters that have come out like look at the Godzilla one from when was that the 90s late 90s you know yeah you had what's his name Roland Emmerich what Matthew Broderick yeah the Matthew Broderick one you know that's like that had all the resources behind it but yeah it had to be absolutely absolute like dud because it was because clearly he's just not a guy who's who has like I don't I don't want to slam Roland Emmerich here but you know
00:32:58
Speaker
Nobody's got, I don't think if you're like making the list of the greatest directors of all time, his name's gonna show up on it. He's anywhere near the top. So, you know, like definitely like competent direction is clearly the key thing.
00:33:10
Speaker
It's actually a very good point that you made earlier when you said about just trying to actually get a good film out of it because like I'm trying to word it because I'm thinking of films like Doom and how technically at the very end they have like a moment where it's like a first person shooting thing and you know I don't know I'm not a Doom fan personally but like I can imagine maybe like a Doom fan going well that's the thing from Doom first person shooting
00:33:39
Speaker
But there's only good bit in that film actually. Yeah, the rest of it is just absolutely horrific. Is that you clapping to the agreement now? No, that was me knocking my microphone off. Have you happened to remind me of the doom?
00:33:56
Speaker
Oh, of course. Yeah. Was it you as well that wasn't a fan of Doom? I mean, it's been a long time since I've seen Doom. And again, I think it's I think it's maybe akin to like Super Mario. And again, a long time I've seen it. So if I watch it again, I might have a completely different reaction. But I think it's akin to the Super Mario Bros film in that it's a terrible adaptation of the source material.
00:34:17
Speaker
it's absolutely it's probably actually i think it's a worse but you know maybe maybe it's about on the level of the adaptation of super mario bros but i think it's a you can have fun with it yeah if you want some people i think you can maybe have fun with it again i'm willing to be to be proven wrong because it's multiple times as i've seen it but i think it's on that like it's a terrible film but it's kind of funny you know and plus it's one film where you see the rock player bad guy that's a rarity so
00:34:43
Speaker
Oh, sorry, sorry. Ignore what I just said. Whatever I just said there before makes it kind of notable in film history. That's the only notable thing. I mean, Carl Orpin's in it, of all people. I know, I know. Although technically I think that was before we started becoming a chameleon and just like acting and everything.
00:35:06
Speaker
Rosamund Pike's in it as well, and that wasn't long after everything, James Bond, everything or nothing. No, not everything or nothing, sorry, that's the game. Die another day. Die another day, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so like, again, there are big Dexter Fletcher's and there's some big names attached to that again. Like, again, they always seem to attract big names for the most part, but, you know, they just waste them. Do you know, it's really weird because, as you said, they do. I mean, look at the Tomb Raider films with like Catherine Zeta Jones and things, which you wouldn't expect
00:35:34
Speaker
Well, I suppose at the time she was doing a lot of action films, but she did Mr. and Mrs. Smith after that as well. You mean Angelina Jolie, by the way? Angelina Jolie, who did I say? Catherine Zeta J. That's the one. Angelina Jolie, rather. Why did I say her? I know she was in another one. Is she in one of them, maybe? No, no, I don't think she's in Tomb Raider, but I'm sure she's in some, unless I'm talking at Mars for that one. Angelina Jolie. Yeah, she was the one in Mr. and Mrs. Smith as well.
00:35:59
Speaker
they get really big names for this, you know, for these films and half of the time they're just wasted. Like I mean look at Michael Fassbender, like he is, or rather he was at the time especially with like the X-Men films and things like that coming out.
00:36:14
Speaker
and those were obviously really popular and he's a good actor as well but when they bring him into a film like that and then he gets a really lukewarm response it kind of feels wasted potential, doesn't it? It's what they're forced to work with. Exactly. It's not the talent that's missing. Well, there is talent missing.
00:36:37
Speaker
But not on the acting side, not on the acting side. But I feel as if it is just a really difficult job. As you said, it's a really difficult job to kind of balance the, kind of the fine line between like, attracting, you know, the right audience, trying to make something decent out of it. At the same time, I think, here's a question for you, and this is kind of outside of it, but do you think the kind of shift
00:37:01
Speaker
for the perception of video games as a whole has also helped the shift with the films or do you think they're both separate? You know how when we were growing up and video games were just all of that silly thing to pass the time and don't get me wrong it still kind of is but you know with like the rise of like eSports and things like that and it's getting taken a lot more seriously in some regard. I mean look at Twitch!
00:37:24
Speaker
Hey Jeffrey Bezos, I'm on Twitch. Would you say that video game films have also shifted with that perception, or do you think they are still in the same rock as they were in the past? I think definitely the credibility of video games has risen. The video game industry is now more profitable than Hollywood.
00:37:43
Speaker
It makes more money. It's a bigger industry. And so I think you can't really ignore it now because it is such a big industry. And so I think in that term, it's not maybe the poor relation as it once was. I don't know. Again, it depends. I think maybe from a general public view, it's perhaps more accepted now. But I still think there's probably a lot of people who, a lot of cinephiles who still would look down on a video game adaptation. And I honestly can't blame them because, again, I don't think there's that much body of proof
00:38:12
Speaker
to dispel any kind of negative. I mean, that's why I think a lot of gamers also looking at that way is a lot of negativity. Because again, where's the where's the proof like it can be done well consistently, you know, rather than like, like, has there ever been a genuinely great video game adaptation?
Detective Pikachu's Broad Appeal
00:38:29
Speaker
Like, maybe the only ones I can think of are like Detective Pikachu. And I heard the Sonic movie is supposed to be pretty good. Are they the only real two examples?
00:38:38
Speaker
The Sonic film is good, don't get me wrong. I surprisingly enjoyed it because I thought, I'll give you a laugh. The Sonic film came out obviously last year during the corona coming out. Clashing dates as it were. So obviously I didn't get to see it in the cinema but I did see Detective Pikachu in the film, in the cinemas rather. It was actually one of my friends who came over and he was like, oh I got this for my birthday. And I was like, oh right, what is it? And he brought out a...
00:39:06
Speaker
He brought out a DVD of the Sonic film and I was like, what the hell are you doing? Because he's not a Sonic fan at all. He was just like, oh yeah, I was giving this for my birthday. And I was like, alright. And we watched it and surprisingly it was a good film.
00:39:21
Speaker
As an adaptation, see this is the thing, at the very beginning of the film it starts off with like a baby Sonic as you know like running around Green Hill Zone or what's supposed to be and you know it's like it's got Sonic's world but then two seconds later he throws like a ring up and that's like a plot device throughout the entire film that he throws like these rings that it's not technically like the games but he throws a ring and it creates a portal and then he gets transported to our world where he has to hide out and that's when the kind of adaptation stops
00:39:51
Speaker
You know, it's like, it's still Sonic, he still, you know, runs fast and everything. And technically there was a series called Sonic X which did a similar thing where they took Sonic from his world and then they put him into, like, the real world, quote-unquote. Well, real anime world, let's say. But then they tried to, like, do the stories from the video games which it really clashed. So you've got, like, the real world and then you've got, like, all these, like, gargantuan monsters and things like roaming about and you're like,
00:40:21
Speaker
But again, anime, more kid-friendly than ever. You can understand that, but for the Sonic film itself, it was a good film. And I feel as if it was a good play for them to put it in the real world. For Pokémon, they actually didn't put it in the real world. I think they did put it in their own fake world, obviously.
00:40:41
Speaker
At the same time, they did it quite well. Technically there was a loophole in the film where one of the key tenets of Pokémon is catching Pokémon and causing them to battle and fight. In that film there's underground rings where people fight, but there wasn't much of it on the surface of the city.
00:41:05
Speaker
As I said, the plot itself isn't... it is no Shakespeare. But then again, you're going into Detective Pikachu. I feel as if you'd be a real arse if you're like, ooh, it doesn't compare to Citizen Kane. Stop comparing everything to Citizen Kane. It's like...
00:41:22
Speaker
Absolutely. I adored Detective Pikachu. There were so many like Easter eggs and that. That's one of the better examples I would say of being able to appeal to the fans because I had a lot of Easter eggs in the background but at the same time it still had enough.
00:41:39
Speaker
for just casual audiences. I think that's where it really struck gold. I mean, they're both examples of films that really have taken off. With films like Warcraft, I think the reason that's still quite popular is I think it did well in China. So yeah, surprisingly. I don't know why, but you're one of these oddities, but at least I think it was. Yeah, I'm just looking through the list as well of other films and I don't think
00:42:06
Speaker
There were many.
Failures and Memorable Missteps
00:42:08
Speaker
Did you ever see the Max Payne film? I did watch that one actually. How was it? It's not good. Max Payne is one of these funny ones that I've played the third game and I really really enjoy the third game. I've played a bit of the
00:42:22
Speaker
Like I played a bit of the first game and I kind of I quite like the Max Payne character But I need like I don't think I was quite able to get into it, but I really want to try and yeah It's on the list to go back and try and replay so like I am I'm not like a particularly well-versed in the Max Payne universe I have to admit I'm not like a huge fan, but like I do really like it, but I'm so adaptation was just
00:42:41
Speaker
It was boring and bad. So it was boring like the Prince of Persia one, but it was also bad like, God like Doom or something like that, you know. So it was a bad combination. But that's one again that has a set story. But it's like, it's weird because they tried to follow the story, but they also changed bits of it. So it kind of failed on both levels.
00:43:02
Speaker
you know it's like a bad adaptation but also like it's maybe it perhaps stuck too closely to the story but also changed stuff that then just was like why did you why is that in it why did you change that it just makes it worse so just like the worst worst of everything basically so yeah not a good one saying that note should we move on to like a lot these films shouldn't do
00:43:21
Speaker
I mean like I'm gonna pick up on something you said earlier but it's like a film if a film's gonna be like you know its own thing like as you were talking about with Super Mario at the very least it was kind of memorable for some bits just because of how wacky it was like if you're gonna like bomb out and completely crash and burn at least make an impact
00:43:44
Speaker
Which I know is a very nihilistic thing to say, to be like, if you're gonna fail, do it with style. The other example I'm thinking of is Street Fighter, which is a bad adaptation, but is a lot of fun to watch. Same with the Mortal Kombat film, that is a terrible film, but at the same time, again, it's a lot of fun because you've got the cheesy overacting, you've got things like that, you know. I feel as if the worst thing that you can do in the film
00:44:11
Speaker
Like, a film in general, but I feel as if the worst thing you can ever do, especially for video game films, is just make it boring, you know? Like, by the numbers, unmemorable, like, Prince Iperra. I know I'm a lot more critical on it than New York's apologies. No, I need to... I'm not like a defender of it or anything. Go ahead.
00:44:32
Speaker
As you button up your hoodie and just like hijack and slap you in the face and challenge you too. I was going to say you're hiding like you're Prince of Paris from merchandise. Just rewind time.
00:44:47
Speaker
And that's why I think it's very good. You know, it has to make an impact, at least. I think the latest... I haven't seen it, but I think the latest Mortal Kombat was received quite well. This would be pretty good, actually. Yeah, maybe breakups too, but it's supposed to be decent.
00:45:02
Speaker
Yeah, which is a relief that they're kind of getting off their feet now rather than... Yeah. Because, I mean, Ooey Bull, I think, is definitely one of the worst things to happen to this genre of films. Yeah, definitely. Like, those kind of, like, creators who are like, oh, I don't care about the film, let's just pump something out and that's it. Yeah. You know, there's your film, where's my money?
00:45:23
Speaker
kind of thing and that is damn it. Like if I made bad films in general like that's you know like people do that you know there's hundreds of like bad directors out there who make bad films but to make a bad film and then attach it to like video games as a whole it's quite damaging too and I know I keep saying this like a broken record but it is it's like it's really damaging to the reputation of like video game film because no it
00:45:50
Speaker
No, don't get me wrong, as I said, no one's going to be like, oh this is high art or anything, but at the same time nobody's going to really take it seriously or think, I want to go see that, you know? And they could be missing out in the gym, but, you know, because like, we've got hundreds, well, alone in the dark, so. Which apparently is one of the worst films ever made. Would you believe it? It scores very low. I think it's got like 1% on Rotten Tomatoes. Oh yes. Oh yeah. I do believe. It's one of those films.
00:46:16
Speaker
I'll have to watch that one. I'll have to watch that and review it. Oh Jesus. You're not dead.
00:46:22
Speaker
What did I say about last week? You're not back in the game. You're not doing it again. But yeah, I'm going to flip that question on to you. Is there anything else you can think of that video game film adaptations shouldn't do? I don't want to repeat myself again because I feel like I'm going to repeat a lot of what I said earlier. But again, if you look at some of the video games that have been adapted into films, some of them are head scratchers. There's a need for speed film.
00:46:49
Speaker
Why? Why is the need for speed a film? I know some of the games have plots, but they're not like, they should, I mean, I'm not, I don't know, I've ever played a need for speed game. So please somebody tell me if these are actually like story masterpieces. And I just don't know about it. But like, the stories are way for Finnan though. She isn't like Street Racer wants to get to the top of Street Racing League, you know, like, so again, it's like, they just seem to pick some of them such random, like, just like I was like throwing a dart or like, here's, we put like a ton of video games up on the wall for a dart and we'll make a film of that one.
00:47:19
Speaker
But I'll give you one better. Angry Birds. Yeah, there's two Angry Birds films. How? How are the two Angry Birds films? Because it makes more sense. Again, that's supposed to be quite like a decent rating on Rotten Tomatoes, the second one. So there you go. Maybe it's maybe it's amazing. And there's Minecraft is getting like, I don't know. It just seems weird for the ones that get picked as well. It's like how you choose. I think some of the worst things you can do is like when you're adapting them, Mr. And we've kind of talked about this, but it's a try and like jam
00:47:46
Speaker
the adaptation into like an already like almost like a form, like a formula script. So like I've watched one of the Hitman films, I've not watched the second one, but both of them like just trying to like jam Agent 47 and the Hitman kind of world into like a generic action film.
00:48:01
Speaker
Which, to an extent, if you play the Hitman games, you can play them, like, kind of action games, but you're sort of playing them wrong in a way. Not to say that you shouldn't play them like that, because you can if you want to, but the Hitman games are meant to be about, like, social stealth, you know, like, careful preparation, and sort of planning and everything. Well, the one I saw, so I saw the first one, and from what I saw in the trailer, the second one, they're just generic action films. There's none of that kind. They might have one scene where, like, he does, like, some assassinating, but, like, it's all, like, car chases and, like,
00:48:29
Speaker
slow motion like Matrix style gun fights and everything so again like and that's not what Hitman is about you know and as well like I feel like Agent 47 is one of these characters that like he's fun to play as but I don't know if I want to sit and watch a film because it's not exactly like a
00:48:45
Speaker
a likeable character for the most part or like a hero you know so it's that kind of different and that's sort of the thing like it's different to like when you're playing a video game like you are experiencing it yeah well if you're watching a film like it's a more passive and that's not to say you can't get swept up and emotionally involved in a film
00:49:04
Speaker
because you can do and there's like so many films that really do like, you know, draw you into the world and everything, but it's a more passive activity than actually playing a video game. That's why I think we thought before, like sometimes a video game story isn't like the most important thing because you can kind of get swept up into the world or like the gameplay and stuff, you know, and delve into it and you can kind of overlook. I mean, think about Bioshock Infinite, right? Yeah. If Bioshock Infinite was a film, I think it would be a terrible film for the most part.
00:49:30
Speaker
Because the plot is nonsensical, and you'd just be passively watching this thing and be like, what is happening? But if you're playing it, you'd get me and you both got swept up in it. So again, just seeing a lot of things made by people who just don't really have an interest in the source material and just want to
00:49:46
Speaker
pump it for some money as opposed to like you know have any kind of love for it and want to do well like again and then you get caught in that thing of like how close do you how close an adaptation do you want like the recent Tomb Raider film like it's okay like it's not it's not it's not a terrible film it's not a terrible adaptation but it's again it kind of I think for me it kind of falls near that Prince of Persia way but like if you play the reboot of the Tomb Raider franchise which was like 2013 I think the first one came out
00:50:14
Speaker
That was a very kind of dark film. And like, there was a lot of like almost kind of horror elements and like kind of grueling, like, you know, Lara was like, I think it was almost like a joke now, how like much Lara was just like injured and like, you know, like impaled
Contrasts in Adaptation Tones
00:50:27
Speaker
on things and everything, you know, and the quite horrific death scenes you could have and stuff. And well, the Tomb Raider film kind of toned it down. And it was like, I think it was like a 12. So they didn't really have, it was more like the kind of romp being more akin to the older kind of Tomb Raider games. So again, you argue that's kind of failing in the adaptation side of it.
00:50:44
Speaker
But again, like, as we say, sometimes you can be too close in adaptation and then you're like, you know, what's the point? Like, I just go play the game. Or if you don't want to play the game, just go watch something on YouTube. You know, watch a playthrough on YouTube. Plenty of those. So they're like, the thing is, there's so many pitfalls on this road to making a video game adaptation that like, that's why I think I'm so skeptical about it, because there's just so many ways for it to go wrong.
00:51:04
Speaker
I mean, I think there is like two... Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but there's definitely two, I suppose, outline factors as well beyond trying to adapt a film and make it both a good adaptation and a good film. It's like, do you ever remember the film Pixels with Adam Sandler? And the way... And again, it's obviously a mixed thing about the way people see people who
00:51:30
Speaker
you know have video games as a hobby but it's like there's a lot of films like that where if it's not pixels it's like that gamer film. Do you ever remember that? I was not the one with Gerard Butler. Yeah that's the one. Yeah it was like an FPS guy getting controlled by like a teenager or something. That was a weird weird film but I suppose it's like that kind of like
00:51:51
Speaker
and again I don't know if I'm reading too much into it but you know it's like that kind of the way they're interpreting like what gamers want if you know what I mean they're like saying oh they want this like cool dark gritty or they want this kind of they just want pixels literally they just want Pac-Man they want because if you remember the poster for that is literally a giant thing of Pac-Man because it's recognizable and I don't think they really thought to I mean this Adam Sandler but
00:52:17
Speaker
you know it's like they didn't like make it probably with the intention of being like oh this is gonna be like a really good you know adaptation of like video game culture is just gonna be yeah it's just gonna be things on the screen I mean it's the same with that gamer film it's like oh FPS is everything let's put that oh second life's a thing let's put that you know it was like
00:52:37
Speaker
Yeah. Just stuff, really. And I think that's the same for a lot of, or not a lot of them, but some of the worst end of these films, it's like, it's not an adaptation. It's not a good film. It's just stuff with the name slapped on it. I think you've completely hit the nail on the head here. Like, so much of it is surface level. It's surface level adaptation.
00:52:57
Speaker
you know, pixels, it was like, oh, people just want to see Pac-Man and Donkey Kong. You know, like with Doom, it was like, oh, it's an FPS game, so let's just throw this FPS scene in. You know, you're not actually, in the same way that it's like, oh, let's just, we're putting it in this universe, you know, that's just what people want to see. You're not actually getting to the heart of like why people enjoy these games and why people enjoy gaming. And honestly, I would argue the best video game adaptation that's ever been made is Wreck-It Ralph.
Successful Video Game-Themed Films
00:53:22
Speaker
I don't know if you've ever seen Wreck-It Ralph. Oh, yeah. No, no, I'd totally do it. That is the best one.
00:53:25
Speaker
Because, like, first of all, it's a great film, number one, you know, and like, but number two, there's enough, while it's like a completely original, it's an original game, I know he's kind of based off different game characters, but it's an original kind of game and an original character and everything. There's enough stuff in there, there's enough kind of nods and winks for gamers to be like, oh, that's fun, you know, there's like, there's a cameo from somebody in there, but then there's like a reference to Final Fantasy or something, you know.
00:53:47
Speaker
enough of that, but there's also like enough of people to be like a kind of genuine like fondness for gaming. And like, it's not like, it's not like the butt of the joke, like, how are you nerds like playing your games? And it's not like, you know, it's not like pandering, you know, like, Oh, this, how cool is this? Like, it's not like, it's not just like, Oh, they just like the kind of like that game. It was like, Oh, they just like action. You know, there's like surface level action. There's nothing, nothing beneath it, you know, or record. I've had a heart and everything. And that's why it's the best kind of adaptation, but just so many of these seem to be surface level.
00:54:16
Speaker
borrowing, you know, without actually getting to the core of why people like these things. And I mean, if you look at the video games themselves, which I know is like a whole other topic in itself, but they are really turning into films more than games these days. It was not all of them, obviously, but like a good chunk of it.
00:54:33
Speaker
like you and I joke because you and I of course doing the let's play of heavy rain just now but you know I think that was like one of the it is probably one of the key um like video game franchise like the games made by Quantic Dream slash um David Cage where they literally are just like quick time events they're not really games in their own right but they play out as films like I kind of choose your own story essentially yeah
00:55:00
Speaker
And I feel as if nowadays, like, obviously back when we were growing up, you know, I think the main point of the games were just to be fun, you know? Whereas, don't get me wrong, like, that's still the thing nowadays, but now there's, like, a lot more emphasis, like, was it Battlefield 3 or 4 that had, like, an award-winning... Or it might have been Call of Duty, I can't remember. It might have been Ghost, actually, that had, like, an award-winning writer or something on it. Oh, really? Oh, I think Ghost did actually have a bit of a... Was it Ghost, yeah.
00:55:28
Speaker
You have something out from the Batman films, like the Nolan Batman ones I want to say. I can't remember.
Games Adopting Cinematic Storytelling
00:55:34
Speaker
Maybe it was Advanced Warfare actually, I think he might have been attached to it. Yeah, there was definitely one of them that was really... I can't even remember. But anyway, he was like... It's just the point that
00:55:45
Speaker
you know they're trying to craft better like stories to give them work because I mean how many times have you heard that you know with a video game when they're like oh we want to create a more cinematic experience and things they are trying to mirror like the films more than the films were trying to mirror the games if you know what I mean which I know it's kind of like a very basic thing to say but it just it seems as if
00:56:07
Speaker
they're doing a better job adapting into an interactive film. I mean look at Until Dawn. That's another perfect example of another choose your own story kind of thing but it's another one of those games where you're like what they're doing here is they're just adapting a film or they're trying to make an interactive film maybe rather than a video game whereas the films that are based on the video games are just like yeah
00:56:35
Speaker
Let's just slap our little sonic Pikachu, like the Prince of Persia on the lunchbox, the Doomguy. That's another thing, just slightly off-topic, but the Doomguy wasn't even in that film, neither was the Power Armor. I mean, that in itself is a tragedy, because they had the BFG, technically. That's the aim.
00:56:55
Speaker
Yeah, that was about that, and they had it on Mars, I think. Is it on Mars? Oh, maybe it is. Do you know what I guess so? I think they replaced Hell with Mars, and they called it Hell or something, like there was some weird plot loophole there, but yeah, never again.
00:57:12
Speaker
It's funny. Oh, sorry. Oh, no, no, no. No, it was funny for hunting. No, fair. It was just funny you saying that like video games being better adaptations of films rather than films being better adaptations of video games because I was just thinking about like Naughty Dog, you know, people who make Uncharted and The Last of
Upcoming Adaptations and Expectations
00:57:29
Speaker
Us. Their games are basically films. Yeah. No, I'm not trying to like slam them or anything like that. It's not a criticism because they are like very like cinematic experiences.
00:57:38
Speaker
Like they are films, but they are really good out of date, or like films you could argue. Like Uncharted is basically Indiana Jones, you know, and stuff. So like, I totally agree with you. Like video games are doing a better job of aping films, you know, than the other way around. And I mean, yeah, the last of us definitely is like the perfect example. I would just...
00:57:57
Speaker
Sorry, I would have said that the reason I'm laughing is because I would have said something like Heavy Rain or like Detroit Become Human would have been one of the examples there but I feel as if maybe what The Last of Us is a better like example of it. I mean technically it could be considered just like another attempt of like
00:58:18
Speaker
this isn't even a word, but thaumafying games? Rather than, like, would you say it's like that or, like, they're trying to gamify the experience? Like, make it more cinematic, really. Well, I think, like, that is a trend in the triple, that has been a trend, a growing trend in the triple-A gaming industry, which has, like, I think now become just a standard thing, is that they do make these very cinematic experiences.
00:58:40
Speaker
and a lot of the ones that come out seem to basically be you're almost like this almost doesn't feel like a kind of big budget film. That's why I think it's so funny that Uncharted and The Last of Us are getting film adaptations because like to me they're kind of films already. They're the kind of games that you like people will probably people who aren't probably gamers could play like you know in a way like they are very accessible.
00:59:01
Speaker
and you know they are recognizable enough to big screen like summer blockbusters. So in a way it is the kind of filmifying is that even a word like the film of gaming you know like if I just created a term there horrible like horrible horrible term to say but yeah I
Future of Video Game Films: Hope or Skepticism?
00:59:18
Speaker
totally agree. We did it together don't you buddy.
00:59:21
Speaker
So it kind of is like a wrap in that point but what do you think, and this is going to be the generic what do you think about the future of video game films but like with the release of like better video game films you feel as if it's gonna get better? Because I mean I know technically we've got like a lot or not a lot but there have been examples of a couple of series rather moving to like a Netflix format
00:59:46
Speaker
Of course, the main example being the Witcher, which, fantastic show if you haven't seen it, but would you say there is hope? That's what I'm asking this intro. I guess there's hope. I'm still not. I'm still skeptical, I'm going to be honest, because I've yet to see enough evidence.
01:00:02
Speaker
we'll see like there's a lot of there are quite a few coming up so i said uncharted and um blast of us are both in development there's a fallout tv series apparently as well oh god um minecraft there's supposed to be a tomb raider reboot and not reboot sorry sequel there's a lot of ones in development so there's supposed to be a juke nukem where john cino played juke nukem which sounds kind of funny um five nights at freddy's that's due to be i think
01:00:25
Speaker
That's supposed to... Fruit Ninja apparently. There you go. Gears of War is supposed to be getting one. Dave Bautista wants to make a Gears of War. I would watch that. I would watch it as well, to be honest. There's maybe some interesting ones there. I'm still... I'm skeptical. I don't... I haven't seen enough proof and I just think, because it's going to be made in these big studios, I just think it will be generic at best.
01:00:49
Speaker
to be honest I think it will be like above average but no more I can't see I really can't see them being but unless it's like you know unless there's people who really really love love have a genuine love for like a particular game or particular series and really get the freedom to pour into that into it you know I just I can't honestly like maybe I'm being too negative but I just can't see it so
01:01:11
Speaker
I'm going to remain skeptical. I mean, that's a completely valid stance to take on it. Because as you said, there's just been so many bad video game films that you think, is it going to get better? And it's quite interesting because what we were talking about last week about the Super Mario Brothers, that that was so bad that Nintendo never really attempted another live action film until Detective Pikachu. And that absolutely, obviously that soared with popularity.
01:01:39
Speaker
Because it is a well-made film. There are bits you can obviously pick out, but... I mean, that's the same with any film, really. That there are going to be plot holes, or why didn't X do Y, you know? That kind of thing, but it's... Again, I don't feel as if... I have to agree with you. I feel as if it's kind of... It's not a lot against the rise and tide of bad films that already exist. And I mean, it's one thing for a film like Street Fighter, for example,
01:02:08
Speaker
or Mortal Kombat the old one to be bad but it's good like so bad that it's good I mean even look at the Dungeons and Dragons film kind of going off on the tangent like that's so bad but it's got its moments where you're kind of like oh you know with a couple of friends you could watch it and it would be like an enjoyable experience like The Room or Burdemic or those kind of films which actually I still need to get you to watch Burdemic but oh yeah you'll love it trust me I'm sure I will
01:02:36
Speaker
But when it comes to the ones that are just bottom of the barrel, just, ugh. I mean, you know, as we said, with Doom, Prince of Persia, Hitman, Assassin's Creed, those kind of felt anything by you, they both.
01:02:51
Speaker
It is one thing to make a bad film. To make an unforgettable or just downright boring experience is just another thing. And the fact it seems to always be video game film, like I'm not saying other films are exempt from being bad films, like there's tons of bad films that aren't based on video games, but it seems as if the reputation heavily falls on video game films.
01:03:12
Speaker
rather than vice versa of it happening to any other genre. Because, I mean, if you look at, like, although it's over-saturated now, I mean, superhero films, thanks to, like, Batman. Not Batman. I can't imagine. Well, technically Batman, but also, like, the Marvel films. Oh, the Nolan ones, yeah. And, yeah, the whole Marvel universe. Like, although there's a lot of them now, like, there's still kind of a rise in popularity of those superhero films. And again, that's a whole other topic, but
01:03:38
Speaker
Yeah, with video game films, it seems that even with non-gamers, it seems to be the laughingstock, kind of. Maybe laughingstock's like a too harsh a term, you know? It's like, you know, it's being paraded in the street with a bell being rung, you know, in shame. But it's not that bad. But at the same time, you kind of think, is it good?
01:04:00
Speaker
Is it going to be good as the next one? Because every time they announce something, like if you notice this, every time they announce something and then they're like, oh, it like takes ages for them to actually make the damn film is what I'm trying to get at, like they'll announce so and so of films coming out this, you know, this year and then, you know, just it disappears. I mean like the Sonic film or the Mario film that's supposed to be cut, although I think they have got a trailer for the new Mario film.
01:04:28
Speaker
Which is actually quite interesting, just before we finish up, but that is quite interesting, like the fact that for Mario, they've done the opposite and instead of going for live action, they've gone for 3D a bit more, which is quite interesting. Yeah, they've just dove into the entire animated scene, which makes sense though, right enough. But again, there's a lot of, or not a lot of films, but there's a lot of games that you definitely couldn't adapt. Like, I mean, look at Skyrim. Can you imagine trying to adapt something like Skyrim?
01:04:58
Speaker
There's a way to do that. Like I actually argue, I would argue that that's actually a good candidate for an adaptation. As long as you don't try and do one of the established storylines, I totally agree. If you try and do like a complete adaptation, like, you know, you're going to have an absolute mess of a film. But if you were to take the world of Skyrim and tell a unique story, I think you do have a potential there. But you're probably right in the fact that they'd be like, oh no, we better have like the Dragonborn storyline. And that would likely be a mess.
01:05:26
Speaker
I suppose it's a bit similar to what Star Wars is going through where it's like on the one hand you get like stories that because the Star Wars universe is so huge you know you could have like two stormtroopers hosting a podcast like you know like an abandoned planet or something like that or you could have like Jim the Janitor like halfway across the galaxy in his story you know when are we gonna get Jim a Star Wars story when are we gonna get a Disney
01:05:52
Speaker
But that's the thing, though. It's like, well, a lot of the major properties that they've got going, especially with the films, they try to interlink the main characters from other things. It's like, oh, it's not good enough that, for example, the solo film, which I know I'm going in a tangent this way to have a point.
01:06:13
Speaker
It's like slight spoilers but I don't think anybody cares because it was not a good problem. But you see one of the characters from that who has completely nothing to do with the main plot end up talking to one of the main antagonists from the previous films and it's that like trying to interlink everything you know it's
01:06:33
Speaker
It's just a danger, really. Just trying to interlink, you know, everyone and everything together. And it's like going back to Skyrim. It's trying to, you know, if you try to interlink, as you said, the Dragonborn story with, I don't know, Jim the Barkeep, let's just say, again. You know, he's been promoted from wiping meat off the table. He now serves the meat. But it's like, if he made him the Dragonborn or had him like tagging alongside the dragon... I mean, maybe it would be a fun romp. Maybe it's...
01:07:02
Speaker
I think they would just need to take a risk in all honesty. I think they would just need to take a risk and see where it goes really. And then hopefully we can actually get a good adaptation. Or not a good adaptation. I think the main aim is to get better films out of this genre. I mean what would you hope for? Better films to be honest. Films made by people who actually have a passion for these properties. Or just you know what maybe just stop.
01:07:31
Speaker
One or the other. Stop doing it or else do it with some passion and some love. Do it properly. Yeah. Do it properly or don't do it at all. Got you. Got you. So yeah, should we wrap things up, do you think? Yeah. Let's put a bow on this. Yep. So yeah, Adam, as always, thank you so much for joining me. You know, the wonderful world of our ramblings.
01:07:59
Speaker
No, this was good fun. This was a lot to talk about in this one. And, you know, I think we've covered a lot of good stuff. So, my pleasure. My pleasure to close, to bring the curtains down on this discussion. So, of course, next week we're going to have our 10-hour discussion all in ET. No, the film! Nah, I'm only kidding. Nah. I wouldn't put you guys through it. I wouldn't put myself through it. After the conversation we just had, maybe I would put Adam through it. I don't know. I'm only kidding. Sorry.
01:08:30
Speaker
Yeah, you and I are going to be having words after this. I love you too, man. Oh, man. Yeah, so is this your last episode in Chatsunami? Well, I mean, after I played E.T., I presume I'll just implode. Yeah. So, probably. It was fun. It was fun, y'all. I was going to say, are you going to that big Atari in the sky? Yeah, oh, God. I don't know. I'm going to hell.
01:08:54
Speaker
Aww, it's not that bad, surely. It is. You know the history of Atari. You've seen what they mean. They're terrible. That is true. I feel as if the sound effects alone just, yeah, they're just a nightmare. So, yeah, moving on from that very depressing note.
01:09:13
Speaker
If you would like to see more of, well, both my content and our content in Chatsunami, you can find me personally on Instagram, Twitter, TikTok, YouTube, Facebook as well, and of course Twitch under the name Satsunami42. You can catch us on Anchor, Spotify, YouTube as well. So if you don't have any of the podcast apps, although you can find us in all the podcast apps, just search Chatsunami and yeah, we will pop up.
01:09:39
Speaker
But yeah, we're also on YouTube. We've got our own dedicated channel just under the name Chatsanami. So yeah, feel free to check that out. And yeah, of course, on YouTube, we've also got our own Let's Play series called Tea Posing, which Tea Posing has been a lot of fun, hasn't it?
01:09:55
Speaker
It truly has been. I had a blast at it. Because you and I have been playing Heavy Rain and my other friend Green Shield and I have been playing through, well, both Warzone and Breath of the Wild, but also you've dropped in for a couple of the Warzone videos. And that has been a lot of fun. You both swiftly booted me out. We didn't boot you out. You are dishonorably discharged. There's a big difference here.
01:10:27
Speaker
Don't you bring that sass into the industry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
01:10:33
Speaker
Oh yeah. So yeah, if you fancy that, then I'll just put the link in. If you fancy checking that out, please feel free to. It's a lot of fun to record them, like both the podcasts, the lights plays and just the general streams and hanging out with you guys as well. So yeah, thank you all so much for dropping by. It's honestly, it's always a pleasure, isn't it? Indeed, it always is. It is. And as always guys, stay safe, stay awesome and most importantly, yeah, don't watch any UV Bowl films.
01:11:02
Speaker
And stay hydrated of course. Bye guys. Bye bye.