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#85 Christopher Bartel - USAF, BAASS & Skinwalker Ranch
403 Plays2 years ago
Not long after graduating from high school, Christopher Bartel joined the United States Air Force (USAF) in 1997.
There, he served on active duty for nine years with the USAF Security Forces. During that time, Bartel was stationed at Nellis Air Force Base in Las Vegas, NV, with two deployments to Saudi Arabia in 1999 and 2002. Later, he went on to become a cadre instructor for the Ground Combat Training Squadron at Creech Air Force Base in Indian Springs, NV. After being honorably discharged from military service, Bartel was hired as a Security Police Officer by the Nevada National Security Site (also known as the Nevada Test Site). The skills and experiences he acquired in the military made him a valuable asset to the BAASS security team given the nature and scope of their DIA contract.
When he first deployed to Skinwalker Ranch in October 2010, he did not know much about the property, its past history, or the true nature of US government involvement in the site. For Bartel, it was merely an assignment, like many others in the past, and he adhered strictly to the guidelines and protocols set forth by his employer. Interestingly, an unconventional aspect of his job did require him to try and tap into his surroundings and establish contact with “the unknown.”
Chris Twitter: https://twitter.com/ChrisBartelSWR
Chris Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/christopher...
University of Maryland Art Gallery's The Skinwalker Ranch Series, 2010–2016 digital photo archive: https://www.skinwalkerranchportfolio....
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There, he served on active duty for nine years with the USAF Security Forces. During that time, Bartel was stationed at Nellis Air Force Base in Las Vegas, NV, with two deployments to Saudi Arabia in 1999 and 2002. Later, he went on to become a cadre instructor for the Ground Combat Training Squadron at Creech Air Force Base in Indian Springs, NV. After being honorably discharged from military service, Bartel was hired as a Security Police Officer by the Nevada National Security Site (also known as the Nevada Test Site). The skills and experiences he acquired in the military made him a valuable asset to the BAASS security team given the nature and scope of their DIA contract.
When he first deployed to Skinwalker Ranch in October 2010, he did not know much about the property, its past history, or the true nature of US government involvement in the site. For Bartel, it was merely an assignment, like many others in the past, and he adhered strictly to the guidelines and protocols set forth by his employer. Interestingly, an unconventional aspect of his job did require him to try and tap into his surroundings and establish contact with “the unknown.”
Chris Twitter: https://twitter.com/ChrisBartelSWR
Chris Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/christopher...
University of Maryland Art Gallery's The Skinwalker Ranch Series, 2010–2016 digital photo archive: https://www.skinwalkerranchportfolio....
!! SUPPORT DISCLOSURE TEAM !!
Disclosure Team Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/disclosureteam
Disclosure Team PayPal: https://paypal.me/disclosureteam?coun...
Disclosure Team Instagram: https://www.instag
Transcript
Introduction and Guest Welcome
00:00:01
Speaker
you
00:00:39
Speaker
Hey everybody, how's it going? Welcome back to the channel. I'm your host Vinnie Adams. I'm really looking forward to this one. It was brought forward a couple of days because Chris has been on the road and he's got loads to do and I completely appreciate that but I didn't want to miss out so we're doing it now and I'm not going to waste any more time.
Marathon Journey and Military Background
00:00:58
Speaker
Let me introduce my guest for today's show, Mr Chris Bartel. Chris, how you doing man?
00:01:03
Speaker
Good, I'm doing well. Thanks for taking the time and moving the schedule around. I appreciate it. Hey, my pleasure, my absolute pleasure. So yeah, I appreciate you stopping on your marathon journey that you're doing. So yeah, really. So listen, Chris, before we jump into sort of the more recent stuff, I'd love to just get you to sort of talk a bit about your military background, if you could. Sure. I joined the United States Air Force back in 1997.
00:01:32
Speaker
My first duty station was Nellis Air Force Base in 1998. Served there for almost 10 years. Active duty on the main base side. During that time, I was also stationed at Creech Air Force Base up in Nevada. I was a cadre instructor for GCTS Ground Combat Training Squadron. And then around 2006, I got out of active duty status.
00:01:59
Speaker
and went into the reserves until 2009. In 2006, I was hired for the Department of Energy for the Nevada Test Site as a security police officer. And I worked there for several years. And then my wife, I met at Nellis, she got orders to Malstrom Air Force Base. And we moved up there briefly and then came back to Las Vegas. And on that way back to Las Vegas, it was during the federal hiring freeze.
00:02:27
Speaker
So I started making phone calls back to Las Vegas and got hired with a company who had the contract for Area 51 and worked there part time. And then at the same time, hired with Bass. But the Bass didn't know that I was working at 51 because we can't tell people that you work at 51. And then I actually quit Bass and then went back to 51 and then went back to Bass full time.
Area 51, Secrecy, and Skinwalker Ranch Experiences
00:02:51
Speaker
Wow. Then went to Skinwalker Ranch from 2010 to 2016 and then left the company in 2018 and moved to Kansas and became a federal police officer there. Wow. That's quite the resume. About 25 years of law enforcement, security and cool things in the desert. Absolutely. So during your time at like Nellis and Malmstrom and that, were there ever any chatter about UFOs and things around those days?
00:03:18
Speaker
I heard about the missile stuff out there. I didn't pay much. I mean, it was interesting. But with my background and where I used to work at, I'm kind of a little bit jaded when it comes to the UAP topic. I mean, I'm interested in it. I think there is something to it, you know? But I think a lot of the tech that we see could be our technology. That'll probably, yeah.
00:03:42
Speaker
So, I mean, I'm interested in the topic, but I'm mostly boots on the ground looking for hard evidence on the ground, because I can't control it in the skies. I have a good idea, but I can't control it up there. I can't control it on the ground. Now that's fair enough. And so when you first started working for BASC, did you initially go straight into the ranch when Bigelow employed you? Yeah, I came in at the very end of BASC pretty much. There was only a small handful of us at the time.
00:04:10
Speaker
And I was specifically assigned to the ranch. That was my detail. So I was there. I got hired in September and October I was there every month for two weeks off and on rotation. And yeah. And so it was part of that actually study that you were doing with the ranch was part of the OSAP program.
00:04:33
Speaker
Apparently so. I wasn't aware of AUSAP at the time, but yeah, I guess that was part of it. Yep. I didn't know about AUSAP until August of 19. Right. That's fair enough. Yeah, that's when I heard about it. Cool. Were you on the ranch permanently, staying over on the ranch, living there, or was it just like you were living nearby? Yeah, I know. You lived in Vegas, but you got a rental car and you drove up from Vegas to
00:05:01
Speaker
the ranch, which is about a nine hour drive. And then you stay at the ranch for two weeks. And then you rotate back to Las Vegas. At the time there was, when I first got hired, there was two officers up there, myself and another person. And then I think it was late 2011. It might've been early 2011, went to one person up there. So one person to secure at the time, almost a thousand acres of land, it was pretty intense.
00:05:28
Speaker
Wow, that's incredible. And so how long were you on the ranch before the first strange thing happened to
Strange Encounters at Skinwalker Ranch
00:05:36
Speaker
you? Well, the first week I was up there, honestly, I'll be honest with you, I kind of just wrote it off as just another ranch, you know, because I'm from a small town in Kansas, grew up on a ranch. We had horses and I'm very familiar with that dynamic. So my first week up there, I was kind of like,
00:05:53
Speaker
Not very impressed, you know, but I also went with a very open mind, you know, and a genuine heart. And I think that's key out there. And then the second week is when I experienced something that was pretty, that kind of caught me by surprise, which was the big canine wolf, whatever you want to call it incident. And after that happened, I kind of changed my perspective a little bit. Like there is something else going on out here. Uh, and then that led me down the rabbit hole of trying to figure it out, basically.
00:06:22
Speaker
Yeah. So could you just go into a little bit more detail on that, that canine, the footprint thing? Cause it, you know, I know I saw it recently on the episode of Skinwalker Ranch and found it fascinating, but for anyone that might not have seen it, are you able to just talk us through it? Yeah, I'll talk, I'll give you a brief. I mean, it's a, it's very more detailed. It was a pretty, it corresponded in like two day event basically, but
00:06:45
Speaker
At the time, there was another officer up there and he reported seeing some large tracks that looked very unusual. And then we followed the tracks and it looked like it looked like this animal was walking on two feet for like maybe 100 feet for like a three foot stride. And it was just bizarre. I just didn't look normal. And then we'll go to four feet. But they're very large tracks. And so we went out with the mindset, like we're going to capture this thing, capture this thing, which is looking back now is completely ridiculous. But
00:07:13
Speaker
when you're out there, when you're out there, you just got to have to kind of, uh, adjust fire basically. And you can't be scared, you know? And so me and my friend were like, well, we're going to go out there and try to capture this thing. And then that night we went out and we had the dogs with us. We had three dogs at the time, two labs and a little, uh, uh, blue healer. And, um, the dogs right there, very suspicious the whole night, like very clingy. And, uh, we started,
00:07:43
Speaker
Backtracking our tracks back about 3 a.m Because we couldn't find nothing and then it looked like this animal had been following us the whole night We found tracks behind our tracks Wow, and then when we got to the corner up by homestead one, which is now called the triangle, which is crazy I Heard this we both heard this growl how ungodly growl I
00:08:08
Speaker
And we saw this large animal, black, jump out of the ditch and run west. And we ran after it and it disappeared. It was, it was so, the dog stopped right in the tracks and looked at us and we looked at the dogs like, what was that? And it was a son, you know, just like the took the wind out of yourselves. And I remember on the initial report, I didn't even write, I didn't even write that I saw it because it really freaked me out. And at the time I had an active shoe clearance with the DOE still.
00:08:34
Speaker
And if you have an active tube clearance, you cannot report stuff like that or they'll, they'll yank your clearance. So I was kind of in a rock in a hard place. I didn't know what to say. Uh, but luckily I took photograph prints of it and everything. And I kind of just kept that in my brain pan, you know, like tell, to tell a story to my kids one day. And then, you know, back then there was no talk of a TV show or, or anything, but I was very interested in, in, in finding out the big mystery out there. So that led me down a whole different path.
00:09:04
Speaker
No, it's great. I've actually got the pictures here. Let me just show them. So yeah, we can see here the size of these prints. Now they're very large. And there's the crazy thing is back. So that happened in October of 2010. And, you know, I was there for almost six years or five years after that, or 2016 is my left, but
00:09:31
Speaker
I never encountered the wolf like that again, except for one time in 2015, I believe I was sitting down at the East gate in a lawn chair with the dogs. And by now, by 2015, the ranch became like the second home. You know, I wasn't scared. I was out there by myself. Sometimes I would sleep on the mace at night because I really felt like the more I immerse myself in the environment, the more layers are being pulled back. I mean, that's how I felt like the more I really pushed myself, the more things I would experience, you know,
00:10:01
Speaker
So anyways, I'm sitting in a lawn chair and behind me, my back is facing the Eastern Valley where I spent most of my time at too. I heard that same howl growl, like I heard in 2010 and I came off my chair with a gun out with no flashlight, like in a spin move and the dogs went after it and then came right back. It was like letting me know that it was like still there, you know, and it's like,
00:10:28
Speaker
It's kind of weird because I didn't find any tracks, but there was something there that I was trying to get my attention.
00:10:34
Speaker
And that's how I worked on the ranch. When you least expect it, things happen. But you think after being out there for so long, I'll have thousands of stories. And it's not true. I only have a small handful of stories that I would consider credible, you know? Yeah. Yeah, of course. You can let your imagination go pretty wild out there if you let it. I bet. Yeah. Now we heard stories of like strange wolves right back to the, is it the Sherman family that were there before?
00:10:59
Speaker
Bigelow purchased the ranch. And they even said that they tried to follow some large creature and the tracks just ended in the middle of a field. And so I guess it sort of relates to that in some way as well. Yeah. I, you know, I didn't even read the book at first until, because I didn't want to have any pre-note, you know, anything in my mind to kind of like perpetrate something that wasn't there. So it was months later, I read that book, the first, the hunt for a skinwalker and I was, you know, the first chapters about the wolf and I was like, what?
00:11:29
Speaker
What is that? It kind of freaked me out a little bit, but yeah, they probably experienced something. And there is a lot of big animals out there too. So there is big, there's mountain lions out there, there's big beavers out there, porcupines, very large coyotes. But I'm used to those animals growing up in a farm. This felt like it was something different.
00:11:56
Speaker
because it was a combination of stuff going on. It wasn't just a big canine. It was like this thing had the jump on us the whole night and was just observing us and the dogs were acting very suspicious. So it was a combination of things. It wasn't just like a one-time event. It was things leading up to a big event. And then when the event happened, it felt like I was in slow motion, like it felt like time compressed. It was so bizarre, you know, and,
00:12:26
Speaker
It was a strange. Yeah.
Phenomena and Psychological Impact at the Ranch
00:12:28
Speaker
Yeah. And a lot of the stories, even again, dating back to the Sherman family where, you know, there was a multitude of phenomena that were they experienced. So did you come across anything else, you know, of a different type? So, you know, we've had people talking about portals, poltergeists, UFOs. Did you experience any of those things for yourself? I never saw any portal stuff. Um,
00:12:51
Speaker
UFO stuff. Honestly, I didn't see... Honestly, I didn't spend much time looking at the sky because of my background. I felt like I had a pretty good grasp of the sky. I guess that's kind of dumb on my part. I should have spent more time looking at the sky. I focused more on the ground because I treated the ranch more like a crime scene and I wanted to find real evidence to back up the data or to back up people's stories.
00:13:18
Speaker
There were several nights I would sleep on this one part of the Mesa and sky watch all night long until the morning. And I did that quite frequently with the dogs and it was a very cool experience. But I kind of treated it more like with the cop mentality of like, this place is a giant crime scene. There has to be some type of residual evidence that maybe links up with people's experiences. And I was able to find some stuff, you know, but the pull through guys stuff. Yeah, there was a couple of things that were kind of
00:13:48
Speaker
keep the hair on the back of your neck, stand up. But once again, trying to document it was so hard. There was one time on the Western side of the property, it was me and another officer again, we were sitting there on a tree stump, just kind of processing the day, whatever. It's probably about three o'clock in the morning. And it was in the fall, it was cold. And we're about to head back to Homestead 1.
00:14:16
Speaker
and we heard a faint drum beat like just long enough for me to take out my voice recorder and hit record and it was gone maybe five seconds and it felt like it was coming deep within a tree line so naturally we're thinking well maybe there's people out here
00:14:33
Speaker
having a powwow or you know we're on a reservation it's not uncommon but when we went out to look where we heard the sounds we heard we couldn't find anybody and this is back in the early days where there wasn't a lot of people around the ranch you know it wasn't a mainstream topic there was not many people going out there messing around so i don't know that's how it kind of works out there and we least expect that something happens
00:14:55
Speaker
Yeah. And then obviously you were security was your job on the ranch, but I read in one of your bio somewhere that even as security, you were, you're part of your job was kind of to investigate these things and not just sort of guard the place. Let's say so. Yeah, we weren't. Yeah. There's this pretty notion of like, we were just some Walmart guards out there. That is not true at all. All of us out there were combat veterans. And on top of that, most of us came with.
00:15:24
Speaker
clearance backgrounds. And we treated the ranch like another job assignment, like I would work at the DOE. But part of the job was to collect data. It was to secure the property, but also collect data and report anything out of the ordinary, and sometimes also partake in experiments to help figure stuff out. And we did. And that's how
00:15:49
Speaker
That's how it was during my time, you know. Yeah. Yeah. And did you have like regular sort of visiting scientists or anything like that coming onto the ranch ever? We had nobody. So there was no, so you were kind of the lead investigators. We were the scientists, the security, the ranch manager, we helped the ranch manager and we were everything, but that's just how it was. And that's, and maybe that's why they wanted in prior military to work more with less. That's kind of like the military motto.
00:16:17
Speaker
Um, I know and before my time there was a couple scientists out there helping out and stuff. So, um, during my time, I think we had one guy, but he wasn't there for very long, just little spurts. And there was other guys that would come out and little spurts and do little things, but not for longterm. Nobody was out there living in, cause this is, and this is important for people to remember to understand what it was like being out there by yourself. Okay. So you're out there all night long.
00:16:44
Speaker
working, patrolling, looking for data, looking for evidence, you know, experiencing things, maybe not experiencing things, but your mind, the psychological effect of what you're being exposed to, you're aggressively looking for the phenomenon. And then it's not like you go back to a hotel room and call it a day. No, you go back to homestead one and you go and you go to sleep. And that's where it gets kind of sketchy because now you're like, okay, I have to get some sleep sometime. And hopefully someone has to get on the property and kill me.
00:17:13
Speaker
or hurt somebody or break something or steal something. So your mind is constantly operating in the red zone the whole time. You have no relief. And that's just how it was. Now
Investigations and Cultural Significance
00:17:29
Speaker
that's cool. And obviously we're on the third season of the Secret of Skidmore Caranche show now under the
00:17:37
Speaker
Uh, the Brandon Fuegel ownership. So do you think that it looks from that series that things have ramped up more than when you were there? Oh, absolutely. Yeah. They, they got a, you know, Brandon Fuegel has provided his team a lot of support to get the job done. And that's not a knock on my previous employer. That's just how, that's the truth. Um, I have no ill will towards my previous employer. That's just the card that was dealt. You know, you play your position and my position was to do what I had to do.
00:18:07
Speaker
But the team that's out there now, I've been out there several times to help, you know, pass over data and information to help with the ongoing research out there. And they have incredible amount of stuff out there and equipment and half the stuff that makes it to the TV. They have so much data that only a small fraction of it makes it to the TV show. Yeah. I mean, they have so much stuff. Yeah, I was going to say that obviously there's a lot of naysayers that say this is all just purely for entertainment purposes and things like that.
00:18:37
Speaker
And the ones who say that are the ones who never spend any time out there. I mean, let's be real here. If you want to find out what's going on and then you went to basin keywords, you went to base and not just skinwalker ranch. I suggest you lace up your boots and you go spend a couple of weeks out there in the desert. Like I just did. Yeah. And then you tell me and tell the people that it's not real because it's this, the whole, you went to base and that's got strange phenomenon and it dates back centuries. And there's petroglyphs everywhere that proves it.
00:19:06
Speaker
And that's what my biggest focus was, was relating the Native American history to the phenomena. We call it the phenomena, but in indigenous history, it's called their culture. We're behind the power crib. They're way ahead of us. We're kind of going back full circle now and trying to understand what our ancient people were doing and experiencing and also trying to explain with science. You know, I always say, you know, it's not the scientific method that matters, it's the Native method that matters. Understand that history, that is key.
00:19:35
Speaker
to really, you have to, that's, you're not going to learn about skinwalker ranch, spend a couple of days out there or anywhere out there. You have to really immerse your body and soul and spirit into that land. And that may sound like some weird shamanistic viewpoint, but it's true. And I just spent a whole eight days with Carl the crusher and James Kenan. And we went all over the place collecting data.
00:20:02
Speaker
and explore new locations that nobody's been to before, and photographing stuff. I mean, it was so much fun, but it was exhausting. It was a lot of fun, but I am pretty tired. No, I bet. Carl's actually, he was here a minute ago in the chat saying, Chris is the real deal, one of the few. I appreciate that, Carl. We had a good time. Carl's the real deal. Carl's the real deal. When he's documenting down in Southern Utah, I hope you have him on the show.
00:20:31
Speaker
here's onto something that could probably change the history books yeah i'm serious i've i've uh had quite a lot of private video chats with carl recently let's say that much
00:20:42
Speaker
I feel like he's being guided to something different. And I kind of felt like I was being guided out there on the ranch to find stuff too. It's kind of weird to, and the team that's out there now, I, you know, those guys are being guided for those who walk in truthly footsteps of honesty. And that's the, you have to have a genuine soul and a mindset when it comes to this subject. If you're out there looking to do something malicious or make profit or what I mean, there's nothing wrong with making money, but
00:21:09
Speaker
there's other people involved in this circle that have had the wrong reasons or the wrong insight, and they've missed the mark. I feel bad for them because they don't get it and they never will get it. No, absolutely. And you were talking there about it being such an old and ancient kind of phenomena. When you were at the ranch, did you have a good rapport with the local utes in the local surrounding areas? When I first got there, there was intel that people wanted to kill us,
00:21:39
Speaker
Um, it was, it wasn't very, uh, a very easy work environment to say the least, but over time, years and years and years, I was able to befriend a few locals and talk to them and really get some good intel and some good insight about the property that goes back way before people had been sold the land. Um, but before then it was kind of sketchy for sure. Um, you know, it's just.
00:22:08
Speaker
You're on tribal land. It's just a different type of atmosphere. You know, you have to be respectful out there. You can't be going out there with an ego and this arrogant attitude. You really have to just be humble. And that's the key, you know, and that's kind of, and it helped, it helped that my mom, um, you know, she was born and raised on reservations throughout the Southwest. My grandfather used to be the project manager for a lot of reservations. So she raised me very, um,
00:22:33
Speaker
more like a Buddhist mindset with everything. And, uh, was very big on traditional history and the ancient history. And then my grandfather on my, on my dad's side, he's the one that taught me how to look for artifacts and respect the land and, you know, giving tobacco out. And, and he was very, uh, insightful about that type of stuff, but not did it all quick until I got to the, you went to basin.
00:23:00
Speaker
And then I found myself immersed in real native culture and history everywhere. I mean, throughout the whole basin, you have the Walker Wars and the Black Hawk Wars, all that energy frequency vibration is displaced in the natural environment. And, you know, my theory is maybe some of the negative blowback that people get around the basin is simply the fact that we are trespassing on ancient grounds or sacred grounds.
00:23:23
Speaker
and just to be respectful. If you're going to go out there and explore and collect data, just have that in your mindset, hey, I need to be respectful out here. There's something much bigger out here. And I'm glad you showed that on the TV show because the ranch in the Uinta Basin is bigger than my photography. It's bigger than a government contract, the science experiment TV show documentary. There is real history out there. And we were just scratching the surface of what we know is our reality.
00:23:52
Speaker
Absolutely yeah well said I appreciate that a lot definitely. So let's talk about you mentioned that your photography I'd love to like you know if you could just talk about it when you first started out with that and some of the places you've been and the things that you found.
Photography, Orbs, and Personal Experiences
00:24:07
Speaker
Yeah that's yeah I've always done photography since high school as a hobby through my whole military career
00:24:17
Speaker
And in Las Vegas, you know, I've lived in Las Vegas for 20 years. I have a huge portfolio of Las Vegas pictures that are probably like, probably 30 to 40,000 images of Vegas from 1998 to 2018. I mean, I have so many cool Vegas pictures. I need to post more of those because we're kind of neat. And then when I got to the ranch, I had a, you know, I did photography as a hobby, but I had a pretty good mind of the do's and do nots of photography. And one of the big things that caught me by surprise was,
00:24:45
Speaker
When I first came out there, I was kind of able to help debunk some of the dust particles that were mistaken for orbs through flash photography. And let me tell you, I didn't make too many friends doing that. There were some guys that were pretty upset that I not exposed that. I was just like, hey guys, this is not what you think it is. If you're taking a picture with a flash inside Homestead 2 where there's three inches of dirt and it's at night and you're going to get tons of orbs,
00:25:15
Speaker
But if you have three dogs laying at your feet, not doing anything, the biosensors, it tells you that there's nothing there. If I'm taking a picture and there's a hundred orbs in it and the dogs are sleeping, I'm sorry, there's no energy there. It's dust particles. Yeah. Animals will, animals will pick up on stuff way before we will. So anyways, but that's what kind of brought my camera into it because I had a better camera, a more high definition camera, and it was able to kind of clean out some of the dust particles. I would still get a couple in my camera.
00:25:45
Speaker
And then from then on, I just carried my camera as a second piece of equipment to help photograph the ranch for evidence, but also because I fell in love with the place and there were so many beautiful landscapes and these things I was finding. I'm like, man, I got to photograph this and just document it because I fell in love with the property. And I'm glad I did because it was just really a story to tell my kids one day.
00:26:09
Speaker
Sure yeah no and for anybody that wants to have a look at Chris's work obviously he posts a lot on social media but if you go to the description below there's a link to uh what's it called I've forgotten it's a there's a website you've got which oh yeah it showcases it yeah chrispartel.com and that's uh you'll also find Taras Matla's uh from the University of Maryland um he reached out to me two years ago he did
00:26:36
Speaker
and asked if I can donate the images to the museum. And I was like, absolutely. So I donated my whole archive to the University of Maryland. One, to archive it, but for two, so other people can look at it and maybe find something that I missed. More academic eyes on it. I thought it'd be beneficial for other people to see it. Maybe they saw something that I missed or maybe something that I saw and missed contributed, they can correct me.
00:27:03
Speaker
So that was good. I'm glad I did that because it led to other things. Yeah, no, it's fabulous. I recommend anybody go and check that out. The link is in the description. And before we before we move on and talk about what you've been up to for the last sort of eight days and that got a couple questions in the chat there. So witnesses and Sean asks, has your world view changed with your experiences? And if so, how? Absolutely.
00:27:32
Speaker
You know, I had a pretty good open mindset going into Skinwalker Ranch, coming from my background with my mother and my upbringing, but also the areas I used to work at professionally before, you know, before coming to Skinwalker Ranch, I had already worked in special access programs for major part of my career. But when you're finally out there by yourself and you're immersed in that environment,
00:27:56
Speaker
It's kind of hard. I focus more on like a spiritual evolution mindset. I felt like I evolved spiritually being out there. And I really believe my photography creativity expanded being out there. And it might be just a simple fact of being alone out there for so long, that that was my only hobby to get through the weeks out there. But it really helped me practice my craft.
00:28:20
Speaker
And then meeting some of the local people and talking about oral traditions and then going around and seeing the petroglyphs everywhere. And just the amazing, you know, that you went to basin, got so much history, you can almost feel the energy out there. You really can in some of these locations. So yeah, it made me realize like, you know, people operate on different frequencies, you know, lower frequency or higher frequency. And I really feel like at the ranch, I tapped into a different frequency out there that opened my mind up a lot, a lot more, you know,
00:28:50
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, I'd love to spend time out there and especially meet up with you, Carl Vibe and, you know, before we get into that, I've got one more question here. Yoni says, did you have or still have experiences with the hitchhiker effect? So that one. So I've only told the story like once or twice, because it involves some family members of mine.
00:29:17
Speaker
But yeah, we did have a hitchhiker event that happened in 2011 that affected not just me, but family members as well. And this is the honest truth. I talked to my mom because I didn't know what to do really. And she suggested that the next time I go to the ranch, grab Sage and smudge my house. So I did that. And then shortly after that, I felt like my perception of the ranch changed because that's when I started finding artifacts and stuff.
00:29:45
Speaker
But I really believe the hitchhiker effect looking back at it now was at the time, I wasn't sure what I was doing out there. I had no direction. I was just kind of following what I was told to do. But I feel like the hitchhiker effect might be, you know, you go to these areas that are sacred with lots of energy there and something attaches to you and follows you home and then presents itself as a warning, basically saying, you know, you trespass on my land. Now I'm trespassing on yours tread lightly.
00:30:14
Speaker
And once I kind of flipped my mind to that perception, everything changed. I didn't have any more hitchhiker problems. The ranch kind of felt more of a positive vibe than a negative vibe. And that's when everything changed for me was that event, smudging the house, and then realizing, hey, maybe I am trampling around out here on something that I can't find or see yet.
00:30:39
Speaker
And that's not, that's just the foundation of the property out there. There's other things out there too, the Gilsonite and the natural occurrences out there, the magnetic anomalies. There's so many overlapping layers to the ranch and the new team that's out there now really pulling back the layers. I mean, they're just, it's amazing some of the stuff that I watched the show and I learned things, you know, when I was out there for a long time. But what I focused on was mostly the Native American lore and traditions and tying that into everything else.
00:31:06
Speaker
But, um, yeah, so after that, I never had a problem again. So I feel like, I really feel like the ranch has this, um, consciousness about it that knows if you're genuine or not. If you go out there with ill intentions, you're going to get exposed. If you go out there with a genuine heart, you're going to be okay. You've got, and I used to tell people, you know, if you, if you're looking for darkness on the ranch, you can find it, trust me. But if you're looking for light on the ranch, you can find that as well. And that's what I focused on was the light through my photography.
00:31:37
Speaker
And, um, but I had people that I knew that ranch tear them apart, you know? Um, yeah. Wow. I really appreciate you sharing that. I really do. Cause I know, like you said, you've not told that before. And, uh, yeah, I feel honored for you to open up like that. I'm a lot more open now about some things than before, because I wasn't sure what I could and couldn't say about.
00:32:01
Speaker
you know, having a clearance and stuff. But now it's like, I don't feel like I need to hide anything anymore because it's the truth. And I can back it up with, with evidence and documentation. You know, I just, I mean, this is the problem with, with some of these places. You have people that have this perception, you know, it's skinwalker ranch or it's another location and they can write whatever story they want. And everybody's going to blindly believe that because well, there's already a reputation there, but,
00:32:30
Speaker
Has anybody fact-checked those stories? And I really try to be truthful as much as I can. And there was a time on Skinwalker Ranch where I just stopped reporting stuff altogether. Because nobody cared. Nobody cared that I reported things. And the company went into a different mindset of focusing more on the aerospace side of the house. But that doesn't mean the phenomena stopped out there at all. But most of us who were left out there, we just stopped reporting things because
00:32:58
Speaker
It seemed like nobody really cared. And so why am I going to waste time reporting a bunch of crazy stuff when nobody's listening? So at that point, you're just like, well, I'm here just on a spiritual evolution or a spiritual journey, basically. That's how, you know, looked at it. So that's kind of what's my focus. Amazing. Yeah, I can understand. Yeah. So let's talk about this trip that you you're literally on your way back from right now. Yeah. How did that come about?
Recent Explorations and Future Plans
00:33:26
Speaker
So me and James Keenan for last, we've been doing this thing every year. We try to make it a point to go out to the winter basin and spend a good five days. This time it was over a week and really explore new things out there and kind of tie it all together. James Keenan, that guy has a wealth of information and he does his research and he has scientific equipment to back up the data. And he doesn't go just here. He goes all over the country, all over the place.
00:33:55
Speaker
And he goes to these places sometimes by himself and spends the time and energy. And so I kind of followed James' lead on these events as the second guy with my photography and with my experiences. And Carl was with us on this trip, and he's on the level two. He's tapped into that frequency as well. And his ability to see petroglyphs, and he's got a great eye for that. I mean, he really does. He's being guided too, I think.
00:34:24
Speaker
I think he's just started his research in the Magic Mesa down in southern Utah and I cannot wait to see what he finds. Hopefully I get to go out there this year and spend a couple of days out there because I can't wait to photograph that area and see what I find as well. So yeah, we go out there and just explore all over the Uinta basins and go to new locations and we talk to locals around the area and find out
00:34:49
Speaker
uh, stories about this place. So we'd go out there and spend a night and see what we could find anything. And some nights it's a bus. Some nights it's like, whoa, something is out here, you know? And, uh, it was pretty fun. This time we went from, we went from going to an inactive volcano to going underground in the cave systems and a matter of two days. And then, uh, just hiking everywhere, going and seeing new petroglyphs and McKee Springs and
00:35:17
Speaker
And, uh, just kind of going where the wind blows us, I guess we would just go, Hey, let's go here and check it out. And sure enough, we'd find something like, wow. You know, and I thought I have like 4,000 images. I have to go back and really dissect and see what we missed or what we saw. Cause some of the, some of the places we went to the weather was kind of super windy or it was raining a couple of days. And so you're kind of rushing through to get to find stuff. And, uh, it was a lot of fun.
00:35:46
Speaker
Wow, it sounds it. I've said to Carl, I've said to a lot of people when I come out to the States, I'll definitely be paying them a visit, but I really hope I get to visit Utah, both the North and the South, maybe Brandon or less. A few of us come to Skinwalker Ranch. Yeah, that'd be awesome. I think getting out there and absorbing some of that energy out there, I think it surprises a lot of people because the TV show,
00:36:12
Speaker
You only see a little bit of what the whole basin offers. And there are so many beautiful areas out there. No wonder people were naturally drawn to that location. It's gorgeous. Yeah. And have you been up to them? Is it McConkie Ranch there? They've got the petroglyphs in there. Yeah. We've been to McConkie Ranch a couple of times and they got some amazing petroglyphs out there. Go back to the Fremont era. And then we went to McKee Springs. It's another place that's got amazing glyphs as well.
00:36:40
Speaker
And that was really fun, too, going up in those hills and finding those. And it's everywhere you look out there, you just wonder, is there one out there I missed or, you know, because there's still so much out there that's being discovered every day, you know, that's what's exciting about it. So before we before we wrap up, I wanted to know if you've got anything planned for the rest of the year. Obviously, you're going back to work and your normal life, but anything you've got coming up as well. Yeah, actually, I got a project coming out. I think it's coming out at the end of this month with Taras Mala.
00:37:11
Speaker
I'm from the University of Maryland. It's a little mini documentary that we shot last year when I was in DC. I was in Washington DC twice last year. And we shot this little mini documentary kind of going over the photography of Skinwalker Ranch and explaining some of my experiences and more in detail. And I've only seen like a rough cut of it, but it's very well done. And it's kind of cool because it's me telling my story on my own without being chopped up in production or whatever.
00:37:39
Speaker
And it really focuses more of what my intentions were and how my photography has evolved since then. And so I really can't wait to see it and for other people to see it. And it'll be free online. It'll be, it's an academic project. So it'll be free on YouTube and on the Maryland University website, and I'll have it on my website. So it's just more history about the beautiful area of Skinwalker and the surrounding areas. So I hope people enjoy it.
00:38:05
Speaker
I'm sure they will. I can't wait to see it. I mean, I'm so fascinated by everything in those areas, so I'm sure it'll be amazing. Before we go, Yorne's got another great question. She says, is the energy around or close to the petroglyphs different than the rest of the area? Yes, it is. As a matter of fact, Coral has done a good job documenting it with
00:38:29
Speaker
magnetic detectors and EMF reads and equipment that shows that some of these glyphs are producing different types of magnetic anomalies. There is something there, absolutely. Wow, that's incredible. I mean, I really hope Karl continues on this journey because like I said, I've spoken to him a lot about it and he's definitely working in the right direction to finding some incredible things. Oh, he's on the right path, that's for sure. Yeah.
00:38:59
Speaker
Well, listen, Chris, thank you so much for taking your time out of your drive. I know you said you've got about another 13 hours ahead of you. Um, I don't, I don't envy you there. Break. And that's why I want to do this interview while things are still fresh in my mind. And I didn't go back to going back to dad and, and back to my job. So I'm glad we were able to work it out. And I really appreciate your time and allow me to tell some of my stuff. You're welcome. Absolutely. Anytime man. I really, I really mean that genuinely.
00:39:27
Speaker
I cannot thank you enough, man. So please stay in touch. I look forward to seeing your little documentary that's coming out. Yeah. So yeah. All right. Take care. Thank you, man. Speak soon. Safe journey. Thank you. Bye for now. Bye-bye. Well, guys, that was amazing. I really, really appreciated Chris literally stopping mid-journey to come and talk to me and answer questions. And he did say he's got another 13 hours of driving.
00:39:55
Speaker
Yeah, I know how hard that is. So guys, thank you so much for being here in the live chat. I'm hoping to maybe do a video this weekend. I'm going to be at the Awakening Expo in Blackpool. It's this big conference that's happening. I'm going to be there with a lot of my colleagues from UAP Media UK. So I'm thinking about making some kind of video, possibly even doing some kind of live stream. I've not decided yet. I'm going to check to see what the
00:40:21
Speaker
the signals like when I'm up there. So, you know, look out for something. I will be posting a lot across my social media as well. I'm there. Yeah. And then next week I have got who am I joined by? Steve Bassett is coming on on the 29th, but I have today just arranged for the full cast of the upcoming phenomenology documentary that I was a part of in Colombia. We're going to do a big panel discussion on the 28th. So I'm looking forward to that.
00:40:49
Speaker
So again, go over to my Instagram, my Twitter. You can keep up with all the announcements there. So yeah, thank you so much, guys. I really appreciate you being here. Enjoy the rest of your day. I'll see you soon. Take care. Bye-bye.