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The Chevy Chase Show Episode 1 - Chevy Chasers #102
2 Playsin 9 hours
In the early 90s after a series of bad film choices, Chevy's career was stalling out. With Carson retiring, Fox saw this as a golden opportunity to poach Chevy - who had long been envisioned as a late night host - and rocket to the top of the late night ratings. Chevy was less interested in creating the show Fox wanted and wanted to make a surreal variety show. The final product was a massive bomb that only served to worsen his career.
This Chevy Chasers is for the first week of April.
Chevy Chasers is a production by Benjamin Vigeant and Jess Morrissette
Show art by Jess Morrissette
Editing by Benjamin Vigeant
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Chevy Chasers Podcast
00:00:14
Speaker
Today is 4 slash 1 and it is time for another Chevy Chasers. I'm Ben Vigent and you're not.
00:00:26
Speaker
I'm Jess Morissette and you're not. And this is Chevy Chasers. What is Chevy Chasers, Jess? It is your one-stop podcast shop for all the career retrospective you could ever ask for, for one Mr. Cornelius Crane Chevy Chase. We talk it all from the days of Saturday Night Live all the way through whatever it was he did most recently. That documentary. Yeah.
00:00:59
Speaker
yeah which you've heard our episode on that, our live reactions to it. I mean, do you know? Well, that was for our patrons. Yes. Like, yeah, if if you sign up to the Chevy Chasers Patreon, you can get our special documentary ah live stream where you can sync it up with the documentary. Like, it's a commentary track.
00:01:23
Speaker
Yeah. And weirdly, you can also sync it up if you put on Dark Side of the Moon. Yeah. All of that also syncs up with our commentary.
Debate and Canon Status of 'Wicked'
00:01:31
Speaker
It was a real labor of love to put together, but I think it paid off.
00:01:35
Speaker
Yeah. Like, listen, you sync it up. With the documentary. And then you turn on Dark Side of the Moon. And then you turn on Wizard of Oz. And then you turn on Return of Oz. And then you turn on The Wiz.
00:01:50
Speaker
Then you turn on... Wicked Part 2 for good. Yeah. Do not go with just Wicked. Wicked is not what you want. No, no, no, no, no. i i Listen, Jess, I hate to be controversial here, but I don't consider Wicked canon. But I do consider Wicked Part 2 for good.
00:02:09
Speaker
canon well i think yeah i mean that's increasingly the accepted position of they're all oz heads out there yeah all the oz heads out there the yellow brick rotors yeah they're they're all saying we loved wicked part two for good now is is goodbye yellow brick road canon yeah hmm yeah hmm thanks bernie toe what's the uh What is the the Sam Raimi?
00:02:41
Speaker
ah What was that? that Evil Dead? Yeah. Evil Dead, that's canon.
00:02:49
Speaker
yeah Bruce Campbell, I think, my favorite Dorothy. There was a... He did a ah Wizard of Oz movie. Oh, did he? He did.
00:03:00
Speaker
Was that Return to Oz? Is that him? Return to Oz? That was... That's TV movie. Yeah. don't know. This was a movie movie. It was a movie movie. it was a real It was a real movie with real movie effects. It was shot on real movie film.
00:03:15
Speaker
With un real movie magic. It was shot on reels. It was shot on reels. It's a real movie with real reels. That sounds like real magic. Yeah. All right. No, Sam Raimi, Sam Raimi. Oh, Spiderman.
00:03:31
Speaker
It was called oz the great and powerful. Oh. And ah based on the fact that you don't know anything about it, that should say enough.
00:03:44
Speaker
About that 2013 movie. 2013? So that is relatively recent. Was Tim Burton not available?
00:03:55
Speaker
know Yeah. Like in terms of like directories that people loved in the eighties and nineties, kind of debasing themselves working at Disney making crap.
00:04:07
Speaker
i Yeah. And like, and, and I think that was it for, for old Sam for like until he, you know, he, he came back and he made that.
Chevy Chase and Late-Night TV Parallels
00:04:23
Speaker
ah Marvel movie. Everyone loved. Multiverse of madness. Which I don't think, I think, I don't think that was his fault that that was bad. but It was very Sam Raimi. was nine-year break.
00:04:34
Speaker
Have you seen it? You haven't seen Multiverse of Madness. of course haven't seen that. I know that you haven't seen it. I don't why ask, but I will say it very Sam Raimi. Like, there bits of it that are straight evil dead. There are bits that are Sam Raimi.
00:04:44
Speaker
It's like very evil dead. Like, he didn't get completely chewed up by the Marvel machine, but also I wouldn't argue it's a particularly good movie. But it is a Sam Raimi movie. Okay. Huh.
00:04:56
Speaker
I mean, it's fine. How how do you feel about Doctor Strange? ah What do you think? I don't have strong opinions. Yeah. Like I'm to say, I mean, I would think you kind of like a bandit Cumberbatch. You seem like a i really like credited Cumberbatch. Uh, here.
00:05:14
Speaker
Did you know he had a movie out this year? And not only did he have a movie out this year, but apparently it did pretty well. What was it? He had a movie called send help. with Rachel McAdams. Oh, it made over double its budget.
00:05:29
Speaker
Isn't she his co-star in Dr. Strange Multiverse of Madness? What, Sam Raimi's co-star? No, Benedict Cumberbatch's. Isn't she... All I know about Rachel McAdams, in addition to, of course, her being in Mean Girls, is that she's also in the the first season of Strings and
Impact of SNL's 'Lazy Sunday'
00:05:47
Speaker
Arrows. I mostly remember her from that one verse in Lazy Sunday.
00:05:57
Speaker
man have you have you re-watched uh lazy sunday recently yes because it was what the like the 20th anniversary yeah something like that yeah something like that was uh it was a december yeah it was the 20th anniversary last year december 17th 2005 yeah and if we're mean we're speaking to a bunch of snl heads out there in the audience all right you know heavy chasers That's right. You know, this is SNL digital short with the Lonely Island. It is featuring Andy Samberg and Chris Parnell rapping about preparing to go see the Chronicles of Narnia movie.
00:06:33
Speaker
You know, it's it's so funny thinking about Lazy Sunday and watching it because it's like, it's very bracing. And I mean, I guess that was the point. It's very bracing and it's like low techness.
00:06:46
Speaker
And now like the your digital shorts, And I mean, the like the Lonely Island stuff that they ended up doing, like that all ended up being very polished and stuff. And so it's very notable for not being polished.
00:07:00
Speaker
Right. And if I'm not mistaken, the season that, the season of SNL that Lazy Sunday, debuted in and that a lot of those early digital shorts were in was the first season that SNL switched to HD for their broadcast. So you're getting a show that looks slicker than ever, which I think adds to those digital shorts because they look relatively raw in comparison to this show that has just gotten much better looking across the board. I think it makes them feel a little bit more real and authentic. I mean, it did feel like Latin and in the bottle at the time. I do remember thinking it's like,
00:07:37
Speaker
This is the funniest thing I've ever seen in that moment. Yeah. Like, and I mean, I just remember, is that the last time? is that like the last time that like something that SNL did something like really groundbreaking? Yeah.
00:07:58
Speaker
Like that really like, like that actually changed things. Because I, I could, I would argue, lazy Sunday changed things. Yes. Like in comedy, like, yeah, in a digital distribution. I mean, it changes things across like how internet video works at some level. I mean, it it was the video that sort of shot YouTube to, uh, being a cornerstone of our media landscape for better or worse. I mean, yeah. And for SNL, like, yeah, i can't think of anything else that would be a game change. I mean, like they've done a lot of stuff that people have talked about that has been popular. yeah Fantastic cast. Yeah. like funny thing they've done but like is that the last thing they did that like you know shook up the formula i think certainly yeah you know i'll i'll think about like say you know i remember uh uh watching like the first but when uh tim and eric started tim and eric awesome started
00:09:03
Speaker
And watching those episodes and like, think it was so funny. And like, that's a show that changed things because you can see a marked difference in comedy that comes after Tim and Eric, because and like, even if you don't like it, ah everybody was trying to do it afterwards. Yeah, absolutely. Usually to diminishing returns.
00:09:28
Speaker
yeah and um so uh like the like you know i like you know i'm i'm thinking like it's like you know monty python like seeing monty python or like you know like ah a comedy thing that just changes that like like mad tv changes just the the game is never the same after that first episode mad tv Yeah.
Cultural Impact of Mad TV
00:10:00
Speaker
Everybody sees Stuart for the first time. like Oh, this goose little man child is hilarious. Yeah. every ever Everyone sees Miss Swan. and nice guys yeah Everyone sees an offensive Rachel stereotype and it just pisses their pants. And it's like, I must do that. Yeah. I didn't think you could do these anymore. This is amazing. Yeah. No. Boy, Mad TV. You know, we don't care for Mad TV here at Chevy Chasers.
00:10:28
Speaker
No. yeah All right.
Chevy Chase in Musical Roles
00:10:29
Speaker
Anyway, Jess, I have a question for you. and my question for you is give me your weekend update.
00:10:46
Speaker
Oh man, Ben, by the time this episode releases uh, on the first of April, I will have spent a lovely weekend traveling to the city of Cincinnati to see the musical Chicago, which is much better than traveling to the city of Chicago to see the musical Cincinnati.
00:11:09
Speaker
about ah But yes, I'm going to see the traveling Broadway production of Chicago, which I've seen fun a few years back. It's one of my favorite musicals. My daughter loves Chicago. it'll be her first time seeing live. She's a good movie.
00:11:23
Speaker
Yeah, listens to the cast recording, listens to the movie soundtrack quite frequently. I'm very excited for this. Love Chicago. And Cincinnati's got lovely theater to go see this sort of thing in. So it'll be a fun trip.
00:11:36
Speaker
um But what I was thinking as i was like prepping this trip and thinking, hey, we have this record for Chevy Chasers coming up. Is there a year in his career And which Chevy Chase could have played Billy Flynn, the slick lawyer character from Chicago. Could he have ever occupied this role, even in like a brief performance? Like, could he have done a short run on Broadway as Billy Flynn? Or is there no point in his career at which this would have been a viable role for him to fill?
00:12:17
Speaker
You know, i have a feeling that if Chevy would have done a musical, he would have done one.
00:12:28
Speaker
That's good. I mean, this is a man who loves music. He loves all that jazz. That's exactly that's exactly it Like, it's like, because, you know, Chevy is like a physical performer, but I don't think he's a dancer.
00:12:44
Speaker
Well, I mean, our episode we're going talk about today might suggest otherwise. Sure. ah He does dance. Um, uh, but I don't he physically moves his body in a dance like fashion. fashion So yeah, I mean, that's i like, but even like younger, um, which is what, what we'd be talking about. Like, um, because he's, he's 50, uh, in, in, uh, 93, 93. Yeah. yeah
00:13:16
Speaker
Um, and also does he really sing? I mean, I bet he sings in that way that every comedian can bust out some comedy singing.
00:13:27
Speaker
But most musicals are going to require a bit more chops than that. I mean, so it's like, all right. So he's not a stand-up actor. i mean He's a stand-up comedian. That's not his forte. Like he toured with National Lampoon.
00:13:41
Speaker
So it's not like... You know, because because part of me is just like, he doesn't, I think during his run, like the run where he could conceivably do it. um with Like, i don't think he would have at all been interested in performing every night for even a couple months.
00:14:10
Speaker
Much less matinees. And um I don't like... Yeah, I, you know.
Exploring 'On Cinema' and Fan Culture
00:14:21
Speaker
imagine this, and I thought to myself, he might fit this role, but I can't imagine there being a point in his career where he would have been interested in it or anyone would have been particularly interested in him in it. I suspect the amount of work and close proximity to your fellow actors in production like that would, Chevy Chase might not last long in that intimate environment.
00:14:45
Speaker
Like, it's a very, i mean, You know, like a lot of a lot of showbiz is a lot of high pressure, high, like, but I think like a Broadway type thing would just not...
00:15:02
Speaker
you know, I think the, the most, you know, as, as our Patreon listeners, now I, I like, I think the most people are going to get out out of him on a stage is, ah him, uh, watching Christmas vacation with an adoring audience, uh, as seen in the documentary.
00:15:20
Speaker
Yeah. I think that's about right. Well, i guess that brings me to ask you, Ben, would you mind sharing with me your weekend update?
00:15:36
Speaker
So I mentioned a ah Tim and Eric last weekend. ah i I didn't see Tim and Eric, but I saw Tim.
00:15:46
Speaker
Oh. um I saw. So I am big fan of the cult series. a comedy show on cinema. Have you ever heard of this, Jess? No. You've probably seen me post about it. Okay. And then then like, this is just some nonsense I don't understand.
00:16:09
Speaker
And then like moved on. Like you, you probably like saw a couple of my posts and was its like, I'm not even going to interface with this. Yeah, no, I, I have muted a lot of your posts for that. source yeah Yeah, for sure. For sure.
00:16:20
Speaker
And, um, so on cinema, um, is one of those comedy things that has like a small cult audience that is like slavishly into it.
00:16:36
Speaker
and And I'm part of this and it's, uh, uh, Tim Heidecker, and greg turkington and uh greg turkington are have you ever heard of uh the stand-up comedian neil hamburger you know who that is yes yes not tim that's him that's him that's okay okay okay and uh and if for the listener if you're not familiar with neil hamburger neil hamburger is a comedian that goes up and intentionally bombs, coughs into the microphone. He's ah like holding a cocktail that he's constantly like spilling on himself.
00:17:10
Speaker
He tells terrible jokes. It's incredible. um On cinema... is this show, it started out as like this little podcast that Tim and Greg did together while they were working on a movie together. And like the joke of the podcast was that they would just very like dryly do this, like short episodes of this movie podcast where they didn't say anything substantial. and That was just weird. but Weird format. ah but it went But they weren't like bidding or anything. Like it was just like...
00:17:45
Speaker
very like idiotic discussion right very and then ah it was uh picked up as a web series by adult swim and so the the web series was like the two of them like just sitting there in like a fake movie theater set and reviewing reviewing movies and saying like absolutely nothing about them and giving everything five bags of popcorn.
00:18:19
Speaker
i like an arbitrary review system like this. This is already around my alley. So every movie, it's just like, well, ah Five bags of popcorn. and And that was it. And then like, but the thing is, is that over the course of the first season, and this is like, I don't know, like, you know, six, you know, like 10, six, I don't know. It's like not that many episodes.
00:18:41
Speaker
They're all pretty short. Like they slowly build up like a light tension between the two of them. Like they start to kind of snipe at each other. Yes.
00:18:53
Speaker
And so now... now i On Cinema has had, let's see here. Let me log into the special website for it that I pay a subscription to.
00:19:08
Speaker
um It's had 16 seasons. And it what started as like this like tiny little germ...
00:19:21
Speaker
of like these two guys very lightly sniping at each other has become this elaborate mythology with a bunch of other characters and actors.
00:19:32
Speaker
And there's like spinoff series that are all canonical. Okay. i like all this. also take the side of Tim or Greg.
00:19:43
Speaker
so I'm a Tim head. i hate Greg. I hate Greg heads. Um, And sounds like a lot of emotional investment. Oh, it's well, but the thing is, is it's, it's like wrestling. Like it's like, really like you. So real.
00:20:00
Speaker
Yeah. It's, it's real. Um, in, and I can't even like, in the In the middle of it, there is ah a trial.
00:20:13
Speaker
One of them goes on trial, and they shot it as a trial, and each episode of the trial is one hour.
00:20:24
Speaker
And the trial, they start paying off. like running gags that they set up like years ago. Like it was, it's one of the most elaborate and insane comedy things, but it, it is like for a very specific cult because you have to like, just watch it.
00:20:48
Speaker
And there's just like it, you know, it's dense, right? It sounds dense. Um, but I mean, it's incredible. And so, i one of the other things they do is every year they have a Oscar special, um, which they, ah counter program the Oscars and do a live show that runs the entire length of the Oscars.
00:21:15
Speaker
Like, they'll they'll take breaks to, like, kind of set up their scenes and stuff. But, yeah, they do, like, a three-and-a-half-hour live videocast, ah which, like, and, but anyway, so they they just went on tour, and a friend of mine was like, you know, this this theater where they're going to,
00:21:40
Speaker
Like there's, you know, box, like balcony box seats, like little, ah and that's seat six. And if we all go in, like it only costs a little bit more than a normal ticket.
00:21:53
Speaker
you just have to pay for the whole thing so if we all feel it and we and six of us were like yeah you know what never done that did it you want to know what what incredible oh yeah we were like directly level with the stage right next to it oh man they were incredible seats yes and like the john wilkes booth seat Yeah, they they were John wil john Wilkes booth seats for sure. And um like we
00:22:27
Speaker
ah like. ah This might shock you, but, you know, i I react loudly to things and also like it's a show where, like say, if you agree with Tim or something like, you know, I'll say yes. Yes.
00:22:44
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah. because Because, again, we're all in character. And people are there. There are people that brought signs. They're waving signs. There are people wearing, like, ah like outfits.
00:22:58
Speaker
Like, this is, it's a whole thing. Yes. This is like, this is starting to sound like Rocky Horror Picture Show. kind is. For people who are a little nerdier than those people.
00:23:12
Speaker
it's It's Rocky Horror Picture Show, but no one's getting laid. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. they yeah There you go. There you go. Yeah, that checks out. Just a room full of Brad's.
00:23:24
Speaker
Yeah, it's a room full of Brad's. My sister Margo... Uh, she was a Rocky horror picture show, uh, person in the eighties. Um, and she's, I believe you're about the the same age. Yes, I think so.
00:23:41
Speaker
Um, so, uh, like when she was in high school, she would drive up to, ah new Haven and, and uh do rocky horror there which was also interesting because that's like yale and so there's a lot of like students there and all like a very committed rocky horror scene there at least at the time i don't know about now but what's interesting they and i don't believe that this is as much the case anymore but what's interesting is that um
00:24:12
Speaker
uh when she went to other rocky horrors they had slightly different like mostly the same call and response but they had slightly different yes this this is yeah like local flavor yeah before the internet had like one html 1.0 website that you went to to find out all the queues yeah yeah so then yeah have you ever gone to a live of rocky horror picture i haven't either i would love to what character if you had to cosplay who are you gonna be i think i know you haven't seen rocky horror picture show no Ben. I'm not going to see it if I'm i and i' i'm going. i'm good I'm doing it.
00:24:45
Speaker
Ben. right, Jess, next time you're in Chicago, they're doing Rocky Horror, we'll go. I would love this. Ben. We'll go to the music box. And if and if they're not, then we'll go see the if they're they're probably doing The Room. Have you seen The Room?
00:24:58
Speaker
no You know about The Room, though, right? I don't think I know about The Room. The Room is the new canon midnight movie. like Okay, okay, okay, okay. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Like, it it is um ah the The Room is like, a a really incredibly entertaining, so bad it's good. like um it it is... it's It's a movie that, like...
00:25:29
Speaker
it it's it's made by a a strange man with A lot of issues. why Speaking of which, why do you think nothing but Troubled ever became a Midnight movie classic? Because it sucks, man. Like, ah the room is way more entertaining.
00:25:48
Speaker
I mean, it would have to be. the The room is, like, pure entertainment. it Like, because it's just, like, they they it's, you know, it's a it's a written, directing directed, starring movie. Yeah.
00:26:00
Speaker
And, um, like, and everybody, everybody in the movie is like, wow, you're just so great. Like, it's very, like, everybody's just like, oh wow, you're so great. And all the women are so terrible to him. And, and it's, it's just like, oh, why aren't, why don't the, why don't women understand what a lovely man he is? Like,
00:26:23
Speaker
mean, you sold me on it. It's it's it's a really, i haven't I haven't seen The Room in like 15 years. And it's it's a real, that's a a midnight classic. But you know what?
00:26:36
Speaker
I, you know, we've we've we've talked enough. How about an 11 p.m. classic? Yeah. You know, what we have an 11 p.m. classic over Chevy's objections. Did you know that?
00:26:53
Speaker
Oh, I didn't know that he objected to the time slot as well. He objected to the time slot. And to everything else. This is a podcast reveal. So the listeners, Jess's reaction to this is going to be live. He doesn't know what I'm about to do. I'm going to hold up a book that I received
Chevy Chase Show's Infamous Failure
00:27:08
Speaker
recently. It is the authorized biography of Chevy Chase called I'm Chevy Chase, so you're not.
00:27:14
Speaker
Beautiful cover. Beautiful cover. It's a, it's a photo. Chevy is just smiling. ah It's handsome man. ah Yeah. And, um and here there's, there's a right here on in hardcover.
00:27:28
Speaker
um ah And, and here's, here's a quote ah right on, right on the front. going to read this quote here. I'm Chevy Chase and you're not shows us a talented actor, committed activist, and genuinely good-hearted funny man.
00:27:48
Speaker
Who do you think said that? Goldie Hawn. No. Chevy Chase. No.
00:27:56
Speaker
President Bill Clinton. President Slick Willie Clinton. Let me read this again. i home chevy i'm sorry. Go ahead, please.
00:28:13
Speaker
I'm sorry. i don't have I don't have a Clinton in me. I think you do. I think you need to keep going. I think it's what i think it's going to coalesce by the end of this. It's all coming together. You just had to give it a second.
00:28:27
Speaker
Ben, if you give up on every impression, it's never going to get better. I'm Chevy Chase. I'm Chevy Chase.
00:28:36
Speaker
yeah that's it chose us and hell today i i try dan quail i don't even know i don't know what dan quail sounds like come on man yeah but but i don't know what dan quail i could do arm Chevy chase and you're not shows us a talented actor committed activist and genuinely good-hearted and funny man is that Al Gore Al Gore I'm doing Albert Gore yes lock box yeah good um could I hear maybe Jimmy Carter
00:29:12
Speaker
It's Jimmy Carter. well but Hold on. Hold on. No, no, no. Here we go. I'm Chevy Chase and you're not chose as a talented actor, committed activist, and genuine good. Oh man. Good Clint Eastwood. You nailed it. Yeah, that's right on target. yeah Clint Eastwood. That's who I was doing. ah But has anyone ever said he is a philanthropist or does it? activist that's committed yeah yeah committed Committed activist. Committed activist. I know. so All right. Sure. Sure. sure sure
00:29:42
Speaker
Because I did, i did read this. um It like, it does say that he wanted it to be at the same time as the other late night shows. And he was kind of pissed off.
00:29:57
Speaker
surprising um that uh it was at uh like at uh at 11 like that was a um and here on the US TV schedule that's gonna put him up against the local news rather than against the other late night programs yeah like it's he he felt that that was like kind of putting um You know, all right, so... do do da dada where's the Where's the quote here? Contrary to what Chevy thought of the time slot, New York Times saw it as an advantage to start at 11 p.m., 35 minutes earlier than Letterman, Jay Leno, or Ted Karpel.
00:30:36
Speaker
Karpel? Ted Karpel. Ted Karpel Tunnel. Yeah, Ted Karpel Tunnel. um But, like, you know, this goes into that, um you know, he...
00:30:51
Speaker
i Like this this came at a period where, you know, his, his movie output had kind of. Yeah. And I mean, we should give some context. I mean, I think the listeners have figured this out by now. We are talking today. Oh yeah. We haven't talked about this at all. Yeah. The first episode of the Chevy Chase show. This is his 1993 debut as a late night talk show host in the vein of the tonight show or the late show.
00:31:19
Speaker
And what this show is probably more famous for than anything else is being an absolute flop. Yeah. An enormous bomb as we'll see. We're talking about the first episode, an enormous bomb within seconds of it beginning.
00:31:35
Speaker
It would be canceled a few weeks later. It becomes the butt of like of the entertainment industry joke for a few for a few months after that. This is a monumental failure from Chevy Chase at what was already a low point in his career.
00:31:54
Speaker
So that's the context what we're talking about today. Yeah. And like, so
00:32:04
Speaker
like And the the thing is also, like to to kind of also like set the table here, is that this felt like an obvious layup.
00:32:21
Speaker
um this like The the idea of having kevy chase as a late night talk show host had been floated since he had exploded on weekend update okay and i he had filled in for johnny carson on the tonight show prior to this it made a lot of sense and also his persona feels kind of tailor-made for late night like this kind of like handsome arrogant kind of above it all like it feels like he could occupy kind of a similar but different lane ah to David Letterman right yes like absolutely and and you look at it's like well he did weekend update and he was pretty good at that so it's like well you know then we just extend that like we just make that like an hour like late night show
00:33:18
Speaker
And, um, and, uh, uh, yeah. And the thing is, is that like, it seems like he avoided that. Uh, uh, probably, ah for the reasons that this bombed.
00:33:34
Speaker
Yes. He wanted a very different show than what we ended up with. oh yeah. And, and I could, I could read exactly what he wanted. um but, uh, one other One other thing is important piece of context is that this was on Fox.
00:33:51
Speaker
And this was Fox trying to buy into getting a late night show because NBC has the Tonight Show. i And ah like ah CBS has the Late Show. with david And then they each had their their extra lates. ABC has Nightline, right? With Ted Koppel, which is a more serious news show. But it's competing in that same time slot. There are studios kicking around out there at this time. Who what was Arsenio on?
00:34:28
Speaker
but he I believe he was on Fox, but wasn't he an earlier time slot? He didn't hit late night, if I recall. ah So maybe, hold on. When was, let's see. i don't want to. Because Arsenio was hot for like a moment.
00:34:41
Speaker
Yes. Um, like he, he actually like his, it was a 89 to 94. Okay. Um, and it was, but but but but yeah, it was, it was on, uh, it was on Fox, but what time?
00:35:00
Speaker
So maybe this was so he, but he was until 94. So then, uh, so then ah Oh, maybe he moved over.
00:35:11
Speaker
ah whatever. Anyway. yeah Yeah. I don't know. yeah Save that for and i mean Arsenio Chasers. And and yeah that's right. And Conan O'Brien is debuting on Late Night at this same time, too. So, I mean, this is that huge era of shakeup with Johnny Carson's retirement. There's reshuffles the entire Late Night scene. That's the other big thing is that.
00:35:36
Speaker
Um. Like, you know, he was the Johnny Carson was the king of it. And i if you ah pissed Johnny Carson off, he would like, he would take it personally and never have you back on, which is what he did to Joan Rivers yes famously.
00:35:58
Speaker
ah Like, And so that would also prevent like, you know, like some people, uh, you were like, all right, well, I don't want to, I don't want to cross like this very powerful, like, you know, television host.
00:36:15
Speaker
Um, But anyway, so yeah, i Carson retiring. That's a big change. You have Letterman. Like you have the Jay Leno shit going on with and Letterman like that feud's going on. yes You have like all the late night wars. Then you have a total unknown in Conan O'Brien. yeah Who is also like coming out to terrible reviews. Yes.
00:36:42
Speaker
And I want to talk about Conan a little bit, but a little later, like we'll put a pin in Conan for now. Yeah. And whatever harry zakti this is a crazy time. I mean, like whoopie Goldberg had a short lived talk show in this same era. I believe Joan Rivers, they tried to give a show. I think Fox approached Dolly Parton about a late night show before they went to Chevy chase. It is just all up in the air. Everyone wants to grab this like 11 to 1135.com.
00:37:12
Speaker
time slot area and plant their flag on it and Chevy Chase feels like he solid best he makes mistake it's something like ah and so it's like all right well here he is like he's available like you know he's he's ready and um like so I'm gonna I'm gonna what what uh uh chevy's vision uh was was for this should do this is bill clinton no uh chevy never wanted it a talk so once again this is from i'm chevy chase and you're not uh the book
00:37:53
Speaker
uh chevy never wanted a talk show to compete with the others he wanted more of a comedy variety show with parodies chevy's original idea was to open the first show in a quote expressionistic surreal way end quote on a gray floor two gentlemen wearing gray full body uniforms carrying a burlap sack they would release a rattlesnake with chevy lip-syncing an operatic aria sung by caruso i The real rattlesnake would be replaced by a fake animatronic snake, which would bite Chevy.
00:38:25
Speaker
Blood would come come out of my leg. Emergency medical services. Dissolved two. Credits. Me on a stretcher. An ambulance. An empty stage. Chevy wanted comedy, danger, and music.
00:38:37
Speaker
That's entertainment. Now... I'm going to just Fox wanted a huge glittery set set and a traditional talk show. I knew going in, I didn't have a chance. I want something far out. I wanted the kind of television that you couldn't get. Nevertheless, against his better judgment, he proceeded.
00:38:55
Speaker
Here's the thing. Very often when like, you know, you hear about like the studio suits or something like, it's like, Oh, they came in they made this. real They ruined everything. They were in this creative vision that would have been a success. Had they not meddled.
00:39:11
Speaker
There's no way that that would have worked either. No, this, they were absolutely correct. You need to bring on attractive celebrities to talk about their next project after you've delivered monologue with a few chuckles to it, throw to your band to play a little number to walk you over to your desk.
00:39:28
Speaker
And then like maybe read some wacky headlines or something. ah Yeah. I mean, and and so even ahead of like my, my, basis of like Conan comparison but like the thing is is that Conan wanted to do something different too but like he didn't fuck with the format like that like he because he famously loved that format he just wanted to do weird stuff within it kind like Letterman before him I mean, this was ah people who revered this late night format, map but wanted to play with what it could be.
00:40:00
Speaker
And Chevy wants to do like this. And like he he says in a lot of interviews, if you look him up, he it says that he wanted to do something like the Ernie Kovacs show, which is a, um,
00:40:15
Speaker
The Ernie Kovac show was, I believe that was in the fifties and I've watched a lot of it. It's actually very good. I watched a bit to prepare for this and it is very good. it holds up as absurdist comedy yeah and just about as well today as it did then, which is the beauty of truly absurdist comedy. It's, it is timeless.
00:40:33
Speaker
And like to the point where it's like, if I described it, you if it would just be tedious. I would just be like on YouTube. Yeah. You'll love it. Ernie Kovacs on YouTube. KOVACS.
00:40:45
Speaker
He like what I would say about Ernie Kovacs when I watched it for the first time, my comedy nerd dad like came and he had like these VHS type tapes.
00:40:59
Speaker
And he was like, you have to watch this. And I, uh, and you know, it's because of my dad. I know about Ernie Kovacs and Bob and Ray and a soupy sales of among many others. Yeah. I mean, Huntington, West Virginia's own soupy sales.
00:41:15
Speaker
I will say of all of them, Soupy Sales is absolutely like of all my dad's like comedy comedy nerd, like boomer dad. i i mean My dad actually, I think is older than a boomer.
00:41:27
Speaker
But all my old, old man, dad, comedy things they got me into. Soupy Sales is the one where I'm like, yeah, that one's not that funny. That's okay. Yeah, more like brothy sales.
00:41:40
Speaker
I'm sorry, Soupy. ah Anyway, um bernie Ernie Kovacs, when I watch, like, it it is pretty much someone doing, like, weird like tim and eric type like television parody uh in like you know 1950 something yeah playing with the format of television interesting ways doing things with comedy with a camera that you couldn't normally do in a like a live action setting he is really like playing with this format in some interesting ways and yeah the idea that chevy aspired to that i mean this is
00:42:15
Speaker
this is always fascinating. And I think it was our friend Grayson who pointed this out to us. um And I think may really astute point. Chevy is a weird comedy nerd who seems to exclusively make some of the most middle of the road stuff imaginable when it comes to his own career. And a lot ways it's like he's playing straight down the middle as a person who clearly loves weird comedy. Yeah.
00:42:42
Speaker
Yeah. Like, yeah. You know, he he was honest he was on a weird comedy sitcom. And he like torched to that. Like, yes. Yes. And even then it's weird in the context of like network TV airing at 8 PM version of weird.
00:43:02
Speaker
um So yeah, i mean, this is, this is fascinating, but this is the show he wanted to make. I mean, this sort of premise and you see, at least I would argue one little hint of this in the first episode, the, the disembodied heads moment. the Disembodied heads thing, which will that. Yeah. Anyway,
00:43:18
Speaker
So thirty foot for all of the hoopla of it, like Fox is all in and they're spending... big And they're promising huge ratings. Like they are selling, they're promising larger ratings than Letterman Leno. They're just like, if those shows are getting three or 4 million, we can promise advertisers five or six. I mean, they are getting like big names ah signing up to advertise. And when they don't deliver those ratings, they have to then do make goods for a lot of those advertisers and show their ads for free to try to help recoup some of that advertising.
00:43:53
Speaker
unrealized value out of the ads. I mean, it is upside down almost from the moment that it launches. And Chevy Chase has already essentially quit by the moment the show begins. He's checked out from the moment walks on stage. Like, they're they're so um like, like they were, yeah, they were jacking up. This is in the book too. They were jacking up the price on the advertising.
00:44:24
Speaker
So like it was, they were so sure that this, was like, quote, the expectations for, this is ah from, ah they're it's quoting the New York Times, the expectation for Mr. Chase's premiere show tomorrow night ah as a late night comedy talk show host on the Fox network are rather high.
00:44:46
Speaker
And then here it is. Again, this is from the book. Even the advertising rates were different for the two time slots. Nesvig explained that Fox was selling the show as a Chevy Chase 1 and Chevy Chase 2 with a higher price for the first half hour. $30,000 for each 30-second commercial and $20,000 for time slots in the second half hour.
00:45:17
Speaker
Fox also set high ratings guarantees for the first half hour of the show. Advertisers for Chevy show included Nike, Levi's and film companies.
00:45:30
Speaker
like top tier advertisers for, yeah. I mean, yeah, these, these are the sorts of advertisers that late night shows dream of attracting and to sell to these advertisers sat on scene.
00:45:42
Speaker
This debuting program. I mean, they go so far as to renovate to the tune of like a million dollars and entire theater in Los Angeles, rename it Chevy Chase which is hubris.
00:45:58
Speaker
Yeah, I know that is painted over in a matter of weeks. It's no longer, but it's like, it's like the Chevy chase Memorial theater briefly. And then it just goes to be in, you know, whatever. yeah after I think that theater is, is, is still up, but it is not in like, I think it's being renovated. It's it's been at like a service for a couple of years.
00:46:19
Speaker
It is a theater that, uh, eventually like for a long time after, ah was occupied by Nickelodeon. It was Nickelodeon, was, uh, Los Angeles.
00:46:32
Speaker
Like if they were doing a live show. So I think that's where they did all that. and Oh yeah. And probably now, I mean, part of that renovation is just getting the green slime out of everything. And yeah, I mean, it's, uh, mean, I'm sure that takes a toll over the course of a few decades, but but you know what, let's, you know, let's, let's start, let's start talking about it. So, man,
00:46:56
Speaker
the The episode begins and I'll string us along, but yeah we we start and there's a cold open and it's Chevy talking to a little, like him doing a little hand you know puppet like what do you call it like he's drawn a face on his hand and he's moving his thumb to move its mouth you know that yeah yeah that people do yeah so he's the thing and he's yeah yeah he's talking to it a little bit about like coming onto the show and then it just starts to vomit thick viscous yellow vomit
00:47:36
Speaker
Yeah. So there's just projectile vomit shooting out of his hand. Like after he's talked about, Oh, you've got first night jitters me too. Oh, I don't think I can anything. And then just, yeah. Horribly gross, viscous vomit comes shooting out directly at the camera.
00:47:50
Speaker
so you're just getting like a face full of vomit shot out of the palm of Chevy Chase's hand. Now I'm at Nike and I'm like, Oh, hello, Mr. Nike. Are you, are you watching the show right now? Yeah. Uh,
00:48:05
Speaker
You know that ah ah check. Oh, your commercial is coming up in just a moment. Don't worry. yeah The first ad break. Just do it. I called it the bank. It's voided.
00:48:18
Speaker
No, I mean, this is that they had months presumably to work on this to figure out how they were going start the show. This is their opening statement to the audience. Then it segs into the only good part of the Chevy Chase show.
00:48:30
Speaker
And I want to say this. I have a lot of thoughts on the Chevy Chase show. I say wearing a an authentic Chevy Chase show hat. Yes, ben looks like with his headset and the Chevy Chase show hat looks like a production assistant ah for the Chevy Chase show. Only he doesn't look like he's been verbally abused recently. Yeah, that's the only difference. I've watched every episode of the Chevy Chase show that's available online, which is almost all of them. I think a couple of them are missing.
00:48:59
Speaker
Yeah, those are the Library of Congress, though. Yeah. um This is the only good part of the Chevy Chase show. The opening credits. Opening credits, which are excellent. Yes.
00:49:11
Speaker
It is top notch. It's yeah claymation Chevy chase. And he's running around Hollywood, stealing the letters from various landmark signage, like going and getting a letter him from the Fredericks of Hollywood, the Chinese theater and, uh, capital records. So he's stealing familiar letters from around the city to assemble the logo for his show, the Chevy chase show. And it's all done in really high quality animation. it looks like they spent some money or claymation clay animation, as I like to call it. um it looks like they spent some real money on this. It looks good. it
00:49:43
Speaker
It looks really good. It's the best part of the show. It has a jazzy theme. You know, it's, it's a good stuff theme too. Yeah. Yeah. And so then, and, and, and so, and so now we get to, so he he comes out, we see the, the, the big stage for the first time.
00:50:02
Speaker
i and, um, the, there's a basketball hoop. Yes. On the stage. There's a, there's a guy like there's some, some guy playing basketball there before him.
00:50:20
Speaker
Don't know who that is. Like maybe he's someone I should know. I don't know who that is. i tosses him. Yeah. He feeds him the rock. Um, Right. Yeah. And he takes a shot right there on stage in front of the audience. Misses. Misses. Not a good omen. Not a good omen.
00:50:40
Speaker
Feeds him the rock again. yeah He tosses again. and then the And then you have a quick edit to a close up insert shot of the ball going in. And then we go return to the wide and see the ball bouncing away.
00:50:57
Speaker
That second shot did not make it in. And how do we, how can we be so sure? Because Chevy makes a third shot, which he also misses. Yes. And this one, the second one he misses is a layup.
00:51:08
Speaker
He is like now right under the basket. And again, they cut to a shot of it going through the hoop. That is not real. He looks uncomfortable handling the ball, uncomfortable dribbling it. This has to be nerves, right? There's no way oh if he was bad at basketball that he would insist on having, making a basketball shot part of his signature walk-on, right? Like, i mean, he had to think, I can nail this thing. Like, this is this is nothing. And nerves have got him. So...
00:51:39
Speaker
we're I'm going to play the first clip in a little bit. So standing O, big applause hoops hollers. As someone... that has seen every episode that you can see.
00:51:55
Speaker
ah i will say now, this is a running this is running in this episode, this is running the entire run of the show, which is that this is the first demonstration of his inability to control the audience. Even if it's positive, he has no control of the audience. And so here's just the Thank you very much.
00:52:20
Speaker
Hello. All right, please. ah Please, please, please. Sit down.
00:52:36
Speaker
Hey. If I knew were going to be this enthusiastic, I would have rehearsed. You know, I... you know
00:52:46
Speaker
you can You can tell listening to that clip, ah there's some real frustration in there.
00:52:57
Speaker
Yeah. He just wants them to fucking shut up. Yeah. I have words I have to say, and you're going to have to be quiet before I can say them. Feels like the vibe here very much. yeah know, I think about this is such a basic skill that every late night host needs. Like I think of like Conan O'Brien at the peak of his cultural influence and his crowds were incredibly hot. Like you have people who are fired up and Conan's ability to like milk that applause and cheering from them and then stop them when it's time for him to begin performing.
00:53:28
Speaker
was something that he and most other people who do this sort of live audience-driven television get pretty good at. Chevy never gets better at this. No, no. He's always mad at them.
00:53:39
Speaker
Yes. we'll talk about more. So I actually, and then he launches into his monologue, and this is the second clip, because i had he immediately has a joke that just flops.
00:53:53
Speaker
But I think the moment I knew I wanted to get back on TV was the day my daughter's ah Tied me up and made me watch All Heavenly Dog twice.
00:54:05
Speaker
Now, now you say, Ben, that didn't bomb. People laughed. ah That's the first joke. in a monologue on your first episode, you do not want a smattering of laughter that comes before the rim shot and then silence after. No, that is not the reaction you want here. And even the awkwardness of his delivery there. He's, I think, nervous. He's struggling to read the teleprompter. He's pausing mid-sentence. He is soaked in what I would call pre-flop sweat.
00:54:42
Speaker
the moment he's out there, like he is, he looks like someone who's never been on camera before in his life. And he has spent a lot of time on camera by this point in his career. Yeah. And it includ in lot television. Yeah.
00:54:53
Speaker
And this isn't live. And the, um, you know, the, the thing is, is that like, um, when I, the very first time I saw this, like you said, like, you know, he felt like, you know, he was done.
00:55:12
Speaker
you know, at that moment, like, you know, during the cold open or whatever, when we watched it, when we like saw him step out onto the stage and then like, you know, ah falter, like, you know, controlling the audience, like my friends and I, it was just like, that's it. He he's decided it's not happening. Like it felt like, you know, maybe up to that point, he's like, you know, maybe like he can negotiate this.
00:55:39
Speaker
And that moment he's just stepping out and just being like, Nope. Like I'm fucked. Like you, you, you see it, you see it. Oh yeah. It's just happening there in real time. And it is, it is so tough to watch. Like I can't think of many more awkward moments I've ever seen make it to live television well aired television this isn't live this is live to tape so i mean here's something else and maybe this is a bigger question that we need to revisit throughout this yeah there was time to do second takes of all this sort of stuff there was time for a producer to come out and talk to the audience and tell them what sort of reaction they needed you and i have both been at events that were being filmed for television and know how producers sort of juice a crowd to get what they need out of them and all that sort of stuff
00:56:31
Speaker
what Did his production hang him out to dry with this or did just nobody care? i'm Or was he refusing to do second takes? I don't know. I'm also wondering, did they do like, you know, i a lot of, a lot of these shows they'll do like a week or so of like dress rehearsal shows.
00:56:58
Speaker
um Like, I, as it turned out, was fortunate enough to be in the audience for, I forgot if I've talked about this on here, uh, the audience for the very first episode of the Colbert rapport.
00:57:14
Speaker
Oh, wow. I don't think you have talked about that. That's amazing. Oh, that's a hot episode. My loud laugh when he's talking about truthiness and he's. That's truthiness. That's the truthiness episode. Yeah. Um,
00:57:27
Speaker
And I mean, what a thrill that was to be there. It was such a well-designed set. And there were a lot of little jokes in the books on the bookcase that you could only see if you were there. It was really cool. that's fantastic. What happened to that guy? Like when...
00:57:45
Speaker
um when I like, you know, sent my email ah to, you know, them like to say like, I'd like tickets. um It was like, you may show up during our week of shows that we're just shooting with Steven that are not going to air.
00:58:03
Speaker
And we're just, you know, we're just doing like straight dress rehearsals. We're shooting them like episodes or having guests doing everything. It's just that these are not, Or you might come to an actual show.
00:58:16
Speaker
Yeah. It's just like, okay. um And so it's like, did they not do that? I think I've read in part of my research for this, that Chevy was actively opposed to rehearsing. And I don't know if this is some sort of, I know some performers probably erroneously believe that rehearsing and over rehearsing will sort steal that spark of a performance once they get out there.
00:58:43
Speaker
Or maybe he was just lazy. Or maybe, again, he'd already just given up on this project before it had a chance to even start. But as I understand it, Chevy was very much opposed to the idea of rehearsal. And it shows. He is someone who I think hasn't thought about the basic mechanics of what it's going to take to host this show until he is in the middle of hosting this show.
00:59:07
Speaker
And so... Delivers a couple more flop jokes. Terrible. Terrible. Like... He's nervously swallowing the whole time, like big gulps. Like, ugh.
00:59:25
Speaker
He is so unhappy. Like, it is... There... You know, like, you might see something and then, like, later read ah this actor go, like, oh, yeah, I hated it. And, like, you don't see it in the performance or anything or, like, you know.
00:59:40
Speaker
But this... It's all there. It's all right there. There's no, you don't need to be an empath. You don't need to be or Troy yes see how I, I sense distress.
00:59:55
Speaker
Yes. No, I mean, and a lot of it, like you get the feeling at various moments. It's like, he hates his writers. He probably hates his producer. He definitely hates his audience.
01:00:07
Speaker
Oh, he hates the audience. I think it gets so bad that this isn't something you see very often at Chevy Chase performance. I think there are moments when he hates himself.
01:00:19
Speaker
Well, I mean, he certainly isn't happy to be like, it's like, well, what decisions? So, all right, let's, so then we got another remote, which this is another thing where it's just like, all right, well,
01:00:35
Speaker
You know, and all right, so this is a ah pre-tape. So this should be funny. Yeah. um And so, ah wait, ah but before we even get to that, i is this when he shows the plaque? Hold on, let me look at my notes here.
01:00:49
Speaker
i'm I'm just, i so yeah, we we ah we get a remote, sorry, ah of the dedication of the Chevy Chase Theater.
01:01:02
Speaker
Once again, what um what remarkable hubris. um Yes. oh And then i he's introduced by the honorary mayor of L.A., a thing I've never heard or of Hollywood, a thing I've never heard of. Have you ever heard of this?
01:01:24
Speaker
I mean, I think that's who's always doing like the Walk of Fame crap and all that sort of stuff. I mean, it's just like an honorary who knows what organization he represents. But i think I have heard of this, I think. But yeah I mean, it I don't think this person wields much power. No.
01:01:40
Speaker
And so like this all this guy, like is kind of the master of ceremonies ah at this dedication. And oh, how fun. Chevy's going to fire a water balloon full of champagne at the theater.
01:01:54
Speaker
with a slingshot. Yeah, to christen it. That's hilarious. Like, that's the joke. Um, and then we go back in the, yeah, it works. I mean, theres and there's a marching band there and majorettes and it still feels like air everybody's kind of going through the motions, but yeah, fine. He's dedicated his theater and he comes back from the clip. Yeah. And his timing is so off.
01:02:16
Speaker
And so, yeah, Yeah. He can't figure out how to come back from the clip. Nope. He keeps repeating the phrase. One thing you didn't see on that tape. One thing you didn't see on that tape because the audience members keep interrupting them with woos and he still can't control the audience.
01:02:31
Speaker
And again, like, you know, this is something that you can have, like the production help you with. Like, yes, they could cut out three seconds there that would make this look immensely smoother. And they did not.
01:02:44
Speaker
like And um this is why i wonder if they're hanging him out to dry. Is this a production team that's grown to hate Chevy already? And they just want him to look bad on television. They've spent so much money. i like, there's gotta to be they, they've spent so much money. Like, you know, I, I know that Fox in the nineties was constantly making very stupid decisions. So, but like, Jesus, man. Yeah. Um,
01:03:13
Speaker
So then he shows, this is what I was getting to before, he shows that he got a plaque with the key of the city from the honorary mayor. And he says that means a lot to him. It's a heartfelt moment at first glance.
01:03:27
Speaker
Yeah. And it's kind of like, supposed to be yeah it's, it's unclear if he's being sincere or not. And I think he was being sincere. Yeah. Because at one point he has this nice line. He's like, you know, I'm just some TV guy who got lucky.
01:03:41
Speaker
And I mean, it is that's absolutely true. It's talent. But yeah, I mean, this, it's certainly framed as like, yeah, this is a real honor to get the key to the city of Hollywood. You know, this is for someone like me who kind of came, he frames himself as an outsider, which I think is again, fascinating for someone who is again, most middle America family comedy kind of guy that you could imagine at this point in his career. I mean, he's, he's right in that phase of his career.
01:04:10
Speaker
for him to frame this, you know, as like a real honor, like for saying, it like, okay, I'm kind of going with this. And then he goes outside the theater for another pre-tape. He leaves and we're supposed to be, this is live. Obviously it's a pre-tape from earlier in the day. And the mayor of Hollywood is back and he's going to do the, put the hands in the cement Hollywood walk of fame bit. And actually this is on the scale of a disastrous episode.
01:04:36
Speaker
One of the funnier bits, but again, it's so awkwardly thrown to and come out of and everything else that ruins it. The gag is here. He leans over to put his hands into the concrete to leave his prints there.
01:04:48
Speaker
And he falls forward into the concrete, which is like several feet deep. He goes in basically up to his ankles face first into this concrete yeah and then has to kind of swim and climb his way out.
01:05:00
Speaker
That's a good visual gag. I mean, that's, you know, what you assume is going to be a shallow pool of concrete is much deeper and he falls into it. Not bad. But then again, when he comes back from the clip, he doesn't know how to like segue to the next bit.
01:05:15
Speaker
It's a mess. Yeah. And so, and the next bit is, is the thing that we were talking about, which is, so this is, this is them indulging Chevy. This is them letting, like, it's like, all right, fine, Chevy. We'll let you do your weird little surreal shit.
01:05:31
Speaker
And so this is like, even if I didn't know going into it that he was like, you know, wanted to do Ernie Kovacs thing, I would have been like, oh, he's doing Ernie Kovacs.
01:05:44
Speaker
Because the thing is, is that it's this, this sequence where you see Chevy's face three times. He's ah like,
01:05:55
Speaker
There's a black background. His face is covered with like white makeup. Like a Venetian clown. Yeah. Like it's very clown.
01:06:06
Speaker
It's a very clownish thing. It's playing. It's like playing this like kind of jazzy song. I forget what the song is. And like these three, these three faces that all have like kind of distinct kind of different looks. They're bopping their heads and singing in different ways, kind of sniping at each other.
01:06:25
Speaker
And I mean, it's kind of technically impressive. oh Yeah. But here's the thing is that on Ernie Kovacs one, like this sort of thing really worked.
01:06:41
Speaker
Um, because like the show kind of set you up for it. It was also kind of novel. This isn't like novel. Like it's him like kind of taking this other guy's idea and kind of doing his version of it, which is fine. I don't, I'm not saying like, Oh, he stole this.
01:06:57
Speaker
I'm saying like, he doesn't understand why that bit was enjoyable. Yeah. Right. It's just a bit he loves. Yeah. And he seems to be doing his version of it and adding very little in the, pride I mean, it feels very self-indulgent. It's experimental and weird. Like he wants it to be, but it doesn't work. It speaks to his own comedy sensibilities, but doesn't amount to comedy itself. Honestly, why I kept thinking watching this and this probably would have been a very timely reference at the time. Ben, are you familiar with Mac tonight from the old McDonald's ads? Like the, I'm only familiar with it
01:07:33
Speaker
because I think it's like now like a psychotic right wing meme. Yeah, probably so. I mean, all three of these faces kind of have Mac tonight vibes to them already is like big disembodied white faces floating in a black void.
01:07:49
Speaker
yeah, yeah i mean this lasts a minute and a half i timed it out it feels like oh it's an eternity it is on screen for what feels like five minutes it's not the most awkward thing that drags on forever on screen this episode by a long shot uh but what i what this this is what i wrote in my notes is it's like
01:08:15
Speaker
You know, this isn't the show for that kind of bit. And it doesn't matter if that's what Chevy wanted to do. That's just not what the show is. And that's not what the audience... Like, you can be unexpected and you can so surprise people and you can surprise people people like with something that they didn't know that they wanted.
01:08:37
Speaker
But that's not what this is. This is just like... you know, again, if you're going to do something like this, you have to kind of like people have to kind of be teed up for it.
01:08:48
Speaker
You had to build up to this. Yeah. You've got to get people ready for this comedy before you drop it on them. in And scare quotes there. Yeah. And so, all right. So now, we go from that we're now at the desk uh which you know kind of a decent late night you know desk set either there's fish behind him which is not a great choice no that that doesn't read great on camera it creates a busy look it kind of gives me bit reference yes yeah yeah and they were all dead by the end of the show though um he bait and feed them that was another big mistake they made um
01:09:27
Speaker
It reminds me, have you ever watched Watch What Happens Live with Andy Cohen, the Bravo late night talk show? They have a very cluttered like clubhouse style set. And there's a lot of visual clutter on this set. But at least it looks a little different than all the other late night shows. I don't know. There's some different choices I would make. But yeah, it's kind of charming. But now we're into very much...
01:09:49
Speaker
traditional late night talk show
Guest Appearances: Goldie Hawn and Whoopi Goldberg
01:09:51
Speaker
territory. We've yeah gotten the experimental bit out of the way. We've gotten the, you know, the pre tapes out of the way. Now we are sitting down with a guest. And, and I want to know 11 minutes in 11 minutes in and we have in, and we get Goldie And that's kind of nuts to me because it's like, again, that's like the back half of the show usually. And now we're like talking with a guest, whatever.
01:10:16
Speaker
Anyway, So Goldie, so, you know, ah again, as as somebody that's watched all these, ah he's a terrible interviewer.
01:10:29
Speaker
oh Yes. And it doesn't care about other people, which is a bad trait in an interviewer. And yeah. and the worst thing i could say about this is that this is probably the night that he gives the most shit. What I will say There are a couple good, like, you know, there are a couple good ones.
01:10:54
Speaker
Probably the only one I remember from when I watched all these, and that's that's a little while ago now, that he, like, kind of, like, actually, like, kind of, like, woke up for was when he had Dan Aykroyd.
01:11:09
Speaker
Yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense. And that makes sense, right? Yeah. ah But everybody else. So anyway, so Goldie Hawn. is She's bubbly light energy. She seems genuinely thrilled to be there. And she is trying...
01:11:27
Speaker
So hard. Yes. And I have to say, God bless Goldie Hawn and Beverly D'Angelo, two of Chevy's co-stars, maybe the only two co-stars that have consistently throughout his career had nothing but kind things to say about Chevy Chase. It's possible, I suppose, that maybe Chevy Chase treats beautiful blonde women differently than he does some other people. ah But...
01:11:52
Speaker
She looks thrilled to be there. She is giving 110% and doing all she can to carry this interview. She knows that her, she like, like anyone with eyes, she could tell that her friend is in distress and she's trying to help. And so, but, but here's, here's just, I, I, I have some clips from this interview. Here's, here's a, here's the first one.
01:12:16
Speaker
I remember the first thing you said to me was, uh, Hello. and you have you had ah You had a bag. ah bag cro shade bag It was crocheted bag. yeah i had a lot of stuff in now
01:12:34
Speaker
Yeah. So here's a problem is that even with a guest, it's really game and really wants to, because they're all performers. They all want to light up the room. They all want the audience to laugh and and be entertained. The problem, like the, the, the job of is,
01:12:55
Speaker
is to kind of corral those anecdotes is to corral. Like, so like if the the guest gets a little boring with their story, like kind of nudge them in the right direction to, to take them in it a good place.
01:13:10
Speaker
Like poor Goldie is just filling up all of the air and chevy is just stammering yes and like ah it's like i i remember when i saw you and uh like i said hello ah you had a bag like you know they're like like she's manic energy he's depressive energy yes yeah and i mean it almost feels like you're like
01:13:41
Speaker
eavesdropping on a brunch conversation between a couple of friends who haven't seen each other in two or three years, more so than it does a television interview at times. I mean, they clearly have fondness for each other. So they're half telling anecdotes because both of them are already know how the story ends. So they don't have to complete the story they're telling, but there's an audience, uh, that's, that's also needs to be clued in on this. There's also just, again, you think about like basic production problems. You have an almost immediate,
01:14:10
Speaker
um I don't know, guess I would call it a blocking issue at some level of Chevy Chase is a very tall man. Yeah. And already he's seen in a chair behind a desk, as you expect in a lot these talk shows. Goldie Hawn is a tiny woman, probably at least a foot shorter than him.
01:14:28
Speaker
And she is seen on a couch, which already sits several inches lower than his chair. He looks like he is looming over her like a monster through most of this interview. And at one point he lowers his chair and now he's seen behind the desk like that one Spider-Man meme where like the desk comes up to his shoulders because he's tried to lower it to be on a more natural type. This is the sort of thing. If you did rehearsals, you would see it's like Chevy. This doesn't look great on television. We either need to swap out the couch. We need to figure out how to reorient this set in some way.
01:15:00
Speaker
This is basic television production 101 and the kind of thing that you see if you put human beings behind a camera for the first time before it's time to film your episode. Now, ah how about another clip?
01:15:14
Speaker
You know, there's one moment I remember from foul play that I'll never forget. I was very, very nervous doing the picture, unlike tonight. Yeah. So this is another thing from this episode is that he just constantly mentions how nervous yeah he is.
01:15:31
Speaker
And unfortunately, that's not endearing. Like it, it unfortunately, because you can tell. And so it's not like, oh, that's charming. It's like, yeah, you're, you're blowing it.
01:15:44
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, it's a good thing that's as awkward as this gets, but it doesn't somehow become more awkward. Oh no, Jess. Okay. I stopped watching this. Sing a song from the couch.
01:16:00
Speaker
Yeah. And here's a clip. As for your smile, it's lyrical, friendly, warm as a summer's day.
01:16:13
Speaker
Now at least she's sitting like a respectful distance from him while she's singing this, right? Like a few feet away. no. no She's singing it directly right into his face.
01:16:24
Speaker
Like, like inches. Yeah. And also here's, here's, here's the thing. Goli Han is, is a very charming, lovely, uh, actor. She's like little pitchy dog, but, um,
01:16:44
Speaker
she's not quite. I, I, I don't think much of her is a singer, at least here. I don't know. Does she have an album? Why am I going to discover now that she she has 17 albums? She's Australia's best selling. Oh my God. score Oh my god She's like the Kylie Minogue of Australia.
01:17:02
Speaker
Um, yeah, she, yeah. Very good. Very good. Yes. She does actually have a discography. oh wow. Of course she she has one album. Um, Okay, there you go.
01:17:13
Speaker
What's it called? Songs in the Key of Goldie? Called Goldie, 1972. Wow. wow though Well, that would that checks out. Yeah. um Boop, boop. She has a couple... say She has two singles from that ah i and then a single from 1997. I'm that and she was Dead. Yeah.
01:17:35
Speaker
yeah she was the artist behind the day the music died yeah I didn't know that. i didn't know that was her song. Wait, I know there's the Don McLean cover of it, but she apparently wrote that and did the original. is that correct?
01:17:47
Speaker
No, it's not. I'd be amazed if it was. like That's her one big contribution. No, I'm sorry. It is. That was that was one of my classic, Jess goof-em-ups. So... We have a commercial break.
01:17:59
Speaker
and then And then Chevy does ah and another thing that's kind of uncomfortable that he does again later in this episode, which is he just starts pressing Goldie on how much she's a mom.
01:18:10
Speaker
Yes. He's obsessed with the idea that women can be moms and successful career people. like yeah He really presses her on this. and then like And at first it's uncomfortable, but then it's clear that they're setting up for a bit.
01:18:26
Speaker
Oh, it's such a bit. ah And so it's her her son her son's birthday. And there he is, sitting in the front row. wearing a suit that makes it look like he's in an all white R&B group ah of of the early 1990s. Like he's, he's like one of the guys from Color Me Bad. Yeah.
01:18:48
Speaker
He, he, he looks very nineties. He looks like a very nineties little ah teenage boy. Yeah, that's right. um Chevy walks out with this huge chocolate cake and,
01:19:01
Speaker
And like, oh but it's even weirder as he's walking over, he's talking to the, he's like looking frantically around left and right, looking for a producer and saying, are we okay with this? Are we okay on time? Are we okay with this?
01:19:14
Speaker
Cut that all out. Cut that shit out. Cut that shit out that you don't want to see that. He doesn't know if this planned stage segment fits in the show. If it fits in the show, just let it fit in the show.
01:19:25
Speaker
Don't put that part in. I think it's over there. so i know this i know that we'll cover this eventually on Chevy Chasers because this is, you know, the the total Chevy Chase experience. But I will tell you, Jess, there is an episode of the Chevy Chase show ah where he scold he snaps and he scolds the audience.
01:19:48
Speaker
Oh, perfect. He gets so angry there there is a moment. I'll never forget this. I don't remember which episode I'll never forget watching it because like my friends paused it. And then we had to watch it again because we were just like, Oh my God, did that really happen?
01:20:04
Speaker
Where like, he's trying to tell a joke and the audience is like, so out of control and he just loses his composure. And he goes, if you don't stop, then I won't be able to get to the part.
01:20:19
Speaker
And then we won't be able to do the bit for the show. you
01:20:25
Speaker
It's something like that. It's something like that. Like and yeah I'm going to turn this car around. Yeah. I can't be home by three 30 this afternoon. If you don't shut up and let me finish delivering this joke. It's like, if you, if you keep making noise, I'm not going to be able to get to the sketch that we're, I'm doing like, it's like that. Like he like snaps and just starts yelling at the audience. It's amazing. It's so amazing. Um,
01:20:54
Speaker
you know, he goes earth his jack chi ba production crew that like perhaps cared about their boss might've like, you know, use that you have multiple cameras ah and like kind of used a way to massage that out of the show.
01:21:11
Speaker
Like, but no, Jimmy chase aired on television. Yeah. Jimmy chase. This is something that'll really come up during his like weekend update top segment. Um, He's apparently unfamiliar with how multiple cameras work on a television set. Like this seems to be a real problem for him in general, figuring out which camera to look at. So again, you'd think seasoned professionally sat behind a fake news desk before, but what does he do with this sheet cake? He gets this chocolate sheet cake and he starts to walk down.
01:21:40
Speaker
And this is, I think maybe one of the problems of the crowd is that you can see the crowd the entire time. And they're very close kind of yeah to the stage. Yeah. And I think, they need to be dark. Like the lights need to be darker. They need to be a little further. and They need to be like, think about any late night show you ever watch. You do not see the audience. They are like flush with the stage. Yeah. I mean, like they could run up onto the stage if they wanted to. And he's probably thinking that the entire show.
01:22:09
Speaker
Anyway, so he steps out with a chocolate cake and he immediately and unceremoniously like drops it in like a funny, like doing a Gerald Ford thing. And that's supposed to be funny.
01:22:22
Speaker
He's stepping down some stairs when he does it and just kind of dumps it on the ground. And, but there's not like a pratfall to it. So it just looks like he steps on ah a step and then just drops it intentionally. There's no comedy supposed to be.
01:22:35
Speaker
I think that was probably scripted as a pratfall. Oh yeah. that He chose not to do in the moment. He chose instead. I'll just drop it on the floor instead. I think this is stupid and I'm not going to do it.
01:22:47
Speaker
That's right. I think he was probably supposed to fall and either drop it on the floor or maybe even drop it on himself. Yeah. Yeah, because that would be either covering himself in chocolate cake or dumping it onto a son who's like they're singing happy birthday to him. It's supposed to be a special moment for him. Either one of those feels like the joke for him to take one step down toward the audience and then just like literally just drop it directly onto the floor, not getting cake on anybody has some real like When are we going to to the fireworks factory, Chekhov's cake kind of stuff going need to see somebody's face covered with cake. Like, yes, it would be funny also if he dropped it on her son.
01:23:26
Speaker
Yes. Either one of those is the payoff to that. But just because honestly, it kind of just makes him look like an asshole. It's like, hey, kid, I've got birthday cake for you. But I threw it on the ground. I'm not a part of your system.
01:23:38
Speaker
And then and then what happens Is that then, oh don't worry. He had another cake and he just gets another enormous chocolate cheek cake and then just gives it to the kid and walks away. And then this like, you know, 14 year old boy has to sit with what looks like a five pound chocolate cheek. That would serve a large party. Like what? That's not like a gift. And that's a responsibility you've just given somebody. And then, and then.
01:24:07
Speaker
ah And then the the the band starts to play, ah ah what, La Bamba? Twist and Shout. Twist and set Shout. Yeah, the music, they can't play La Bamba. And and so they start playing Twist and Shout.
01:24:21
Speaker
And Chevy and Goldie start like awkwardly dancing on the stage. And then he like announces to the audience, Hey, everybody get up and start dancing too. And so all like, it's the, it's the little boy's birthday. And so then we see the whole audience, like kind of uncomfortably standing up and dancing and, you know, slowly like moving their arms back and forth.
01:24:47
Speaker
And we just see this, this boy sitting With this enormous cake on face. Yes. Which I don't think is supposed to be the joke. Like, I don't think the joke is, ha ha. We give this guy an enormous cake. No, no, no. can't dance. I think this is just a byproduct of poor. And also even giving him the real cake at that point undercuts the gag of the first. I mean, it's not good comedy.
01:25:06
Speaker
It's not good. stay i And again, Ben, I timed this out. This lasts a full minute of just Goldie Hawn and Chevy Chase dancing and kissing on the lips multiple times.
01:25:17
Speaker
there I get that they're very close and dear friends to one another. The energy, the vibes are just way off. The vibes are so off. that um And then, like...
01:25:32
Speaker
I think the audience dancing thing is trying to do like a like a Jay Leno. like It's like he comes out and he like you know interacts with the audience, you know? Yeah. And, you know, i think Arsenio Hall, like the, you know, like engaging your rowdy audience. I do think this audience is very much a post Arsenio audience in the sense of it's a, yeah it's a Fox audience. And, you Arsenio had his dog pound, which are, as you know, people out there are going to all the, like, you know, the entrance and the big jokes, and the big segments and everything. cause it's like This is married. maand Like the audience is like carrying on and making noise. Like,
01:26:09
Speaker
There's an expectation of a Fox show that the audience is going to be a little easier. Yeah, it's rowdy. And it just gets away from him at every stage. it just Again, he never figures out how to time himself around them. It's a good thing, though, that...
01:26:28
Speaker
Chevy Chase has experience sitting behind a fake news desk and reading out funny headlines. I mean, this is literally the bit that made him a household name across America. So if you want to play the hits, you can't call it weekend update, but you can call it news update. Terrible news update. ah So we go basically to a complete, I have to ask you your a question, man. need you to comedy workshop this for me. Yeah.
01:26:57
Speaker
This, I've been wanting to get your opinion on this all along. So it's a set much like Weekend Update, you know, like a 1990s news desk kind of setup. And like a lot of news sets back at the time, you have a number of clocks. Like you might normally have like a, this is the time in Los Angeles. This is the time in New York. This is the time in London.
01:27:17
Speaker
His gag here on screen is there are four clocks visible behind him. And each of them has a label underneath it. One is labeled 10 minutes slow. One is labeled the time yesterday.
01:27:30
Speaker
One is labeled incorrect time. And one is labeled five minutes fast. Mm-hmm. from a comedy writing standpoint is all four of those being jokes, a problem. And considering you're seeing them all at the same time on screen, and there's no way to clearly escalate in terms of which one you will read or spot first.
01:27:52
Speaker
Does that work as a visual gag? How to me, it felt just like, well, that's the same joke told four times. Yeah. Simultaneously.
01:28:04
Speaker
that didn't bother me. like I'm okay with having like a bunch of like little background side gags like that. That's fine.
01:28:16
Speaker
ah It's just that they're not good enough. Yeah. yeah Yeah. Like, you know, they're just kind of, it's just like, okay. Like, I don't know. it To me again, i think it's a question of context. Like, I think that,
01:28:37
Speaker
if the Muppet show had a weekend update, a bit ah in it, that could be the background. And yeah i would yeah, okay. If, if, if, because the joke there is that it's corny.
01:28:52
Speaker
Yes. um Like, think these are meant to be real jokes. That's exactly it. Like, like this. The show that this is needs, if you're going to do jokes like that, needs them to be funnier.
01:29:10
Speaker
Yeah. How about Miller time? You know. what so here's Here's something. is ah If they had different labels like every week.
01:29:24
Speaker
Yes, clever. like Now we're in a territory where it's like. mighte That might be a way which. I don't think they did. i don't recall. um But I think that might be a way to do it. Like, or it's like, if you moved them around, like, you know, each night, like there were different ones or something like, you know, because you can maybe start there and then like, get really stupid with it or surreal. Yes.
01:29:51
Speaker
Chevy. Yes. Get a little surreal like your heroes. Yeah. um but but anyway So speaking of this is ah speaking of this is a thing that Chevy should be able to do in his signature bit. Let's signature let's let's let's play a clip of how this starts.
01:30:09
Speaker
Good evening. I'm Chevy Chase.
01:30:18
Speaker
Now, oh, my God, I endeavored. to pump up the volume you might i'm gonna play more time pump the volume pump up the volume dance i so i endeavored you don't quite hear it uh there's someone in the audience and you know everybody everybody is is just listening to us this is you know just a straight audio podcast so they probably heard this but once again please good evening i'm chubby chase
01:30:50
Speaker
one human being and an audience that I believe was 1000 people. I don't think it was. a I think I read that somewhere. This was a giant theater, which is also part of the problem.
01:31:02
Speaker
It is. It is definitely way too good it is just that so It's really a foul. I can't. I think I've read that. I mean, I don't know. Uh, yeah. Like the that is a problem. face but I mean, if it really is that big, uh, yeah. Um,
01:31:20
Speaker
Is it the Avalon theater? No, that's not what was called. That's not it. That's in Chevy Chase, Maryland. Ha. um No, we'll have to we'll have to have our fact checkers check this out. um But.
01:31:35
Speaker
No. Yeah. I don't know. i had to look this up. I was trying to look that up yesterday when I was preparing. I think I read somewhere it was a thousand, but I think that could have a vulture article or something. Who knows? I think it's a big theater, but you have a massive crowd and a hot crowd. Who's wanted to yell things up to this point.
01:31:53
Speaker
Chevy chase delivers his signature opening. I'm Chevy chase with the expectation that the entire audience will shout. And you're not. Well, okay.
01:32:05
Speaker
Or you think he was pausing playing to say it himself. Let's go to the tape. Well, actually, let's go to the authorized biography. Oh.
01:32:17
Speaker
Chevy sees the opportunity to reinstate his famous news feature so familiar to Saturday Night Live audiences, writing every word and gestures of the sketches.
01:32:28
Speaker
Many times after his opening line, I'm Chevy Chase, pause, the audience filled in the missing, and you're not, which Chevy had deliberately decided not to include in the 1993 version. So he was just going to say, I'm Chevy Chase, and then pause, and then begin? That would be the joke.
01:32:50
Speaker
The absence of a joke. So it is it is unclear. Because I don't know, because I'm going to tell you something here. This biography, this authorized biography, like acknowledges that this show was a flop and that it wasn't the show they wanted.
01:33:12
Speaker
But it's it's it's pretty nice to its subject. ah And ah so i don't, it is it is a real question.
01:33:25
Speaker
And they never get this right through the entire round of the show. yo they don't. And actually, that is the most entertaining part of watching the Chevy Chase show is that every night there's no, you have no idea what's going to happen. a different way every time. it It zigs and zags because...
01:33:52
Speaker
he like and you also don't know what's pissing him off about it like is he pissed off because he wanted everyone to yell and you're not is he pissed off because one person yelled it is he like is he pi like you don't know yeah it's impossible to tell he's inscrutable yeah you can't screw him but but but yeah um it ah his It is the most entertaining part of every Chevy Chase show is him saying, I'm Chevy Chase.
01:34:27
Speaker
Because also there's a way if you want, like, here's here's what I'm saying. if you if If he wanted the audience to say it, you gesture to the audience.
01:34:38
Speaker
If you go, I'm Chevy Chase, or you go, I'm Chevy Chase, and... Yeah. Or you have a producer come out before you start to film that segment and you say to the audience, guys, he's going to do his new segment next.
01:34:52
Speaker
When he says, I'm Chevy Chase, we want a big, loud reaction. Everybody say, and you're not. And it'll be a great moment and it'll sound great on yeah on camera. It'll be perfect.
01:35:04
Speaker
That's how you get reactions in this sort of I'm filming a TV show setting. The fact that none of this happens, that he doesn't do it as the performer, that his producers don't set him up for success by coaching the audience.
01:35:15
Speaker
it it I almost wonder the fact that they never fixed this. If Chevy decided he liked the awkwardness of it, he never seems to like it. no it doesn't seem like I'm going to tell you right now, he does not like it.
01:35:29
Speaker
He's not that good of an actor. He is not. Yeah, no. yeah He is not feigning the frustration in that setting. That is absolutely what he's feeling. But this is...
01:35:41
Speaker
bizarre It is unbelievable that he cannot get this right. and Let me ask you another question, but do you think there's any small chance that he was not legally allowed to say the full catchphrase? Could this have been intellectual property of NBC or Lorne Michaels?
01:36:01
Speaker
You know, I mean, well, he uses it the title of his book. I was just like to say that. Yeah. So he must have, i mean, probably if you looked at the frontispiece of that book, it might see if that's like used with permission of NBC universal or something that might have. I bet not. I bet he has that phrase. It probably wasn't trademarked because I mean, it was the seventies. They were too busy doing Coke to trademark anything.
01:36:27
Speaker
you know like when uh david letterman went over to uh cbs um you know like he had he couldn't do stupid human tricks anymore and some things like that right they they they had to rename like certain stuff and you know all that like yeah it wasn't there like the top 10 there was some drama with and Yes, they weren't sure they were going be able that. I think there had to be an argument made legally that that was the concept of a top 10 wasn't intellectual property, that it was just something that already existed in the world just so he could take his top 10 over to CBS with him. So, yeah, I mean, at don't think that's going to be the case. Again, I think this is just something that they never landed, but just inexplicably kept doing. And then he immediately goes, I mean, he's trying to play the hits Immediately goes into a Michael. Oh, wait, well, he does the the Franco joke.
01:37:19
Speaker
Yeah, Franco is still dead. You know breaking news, you know, General Lisa Mo Franco is still dead, which is a famous bit from SNL that is even less relevant in 1993. So this is 20 years later.
01:37:33
Speaker
What, 15? Wait, but what year? 72? 82? It was when Franco died? Is that right? No. that's not right. Anyway, anyway. Who knows? Yeah, it's Spanish history.
01:37:44
Speaker
Well, no, I mean, I don't know what, like, I'm not actually as familiar with when he was doing on an SNL. Yeah. Like, I was like, was that a first season? I think it first season thing. Yeah. I mean, but it, I mean, it's not very funny here. And this is such a step down from the quality of, I think, any era of Weekend Update. The writing isn't there.
01:38:07
Speaker
The delivery isn't there. He's insisting on reading from the papers that he's holding rather than a prompter. And I think it throws his timing off. He looks like he's having trouble reading his notes, his script. It looks like he's having trouble finding his camera. Yeah. they're He's having trouble with the camera. He's the jokes aren't good. Like this is what I, what I wrote was is it's like, mean, we don't have to do like a blow by blow of the jokes or whatever. It's just, they're not interesting.
01:38:38
Speaker
I, what my takeaway from it was, is it was like, if you're going to do this, you have to like, you know, weekend update exists like at this time, Kevin Nealon's doing it.
01:38:50
Speaker
Um, yeah. Like, and he's doing a perfect, like Kevin Nealon's weekend update was okay. Like that's middle of the pack weekend update. Yeah. Um, you know, like, I mean, if, uh, you know, in exactly one year, Norm would come and just blow everyone away.
01:39:05
Speaker
um but, um, uh, like i we, you know, it's like, if you're going to do this, this either has to be a very technically proficient uh, like perfect weekend update, uh, because it's like, well, we, we got the, the guy and this is what made his career.
01:39:34
Speaker
Yes. So he's going to come in and we're going to see Babe Ruth and he's going to swing the bat a few times. And this should also be murder easy comedy. Yeah. Fake news is something that a lot of different programs have done pretty successfully, you know? Yeah.
01:39:51
Speaker
And so either he's going to come in and just show everyone why, like, he's the greatest of all time at it, or he's going to do, like, you know, change it up and do something new.
01:40:05
Speaker
Instead, it just looks like somebody doing low-budget, shitty weekend update. Yeah. that Same approach, worse material. And and this is this is what I will say, is that when it's over...
01:40:21
Speaker
This was actually the one thing that I kind of liked. Okay, this is interesting. and the The way that he closes out weekend update. i i kind of, I kind kind of like this. And then it ran too long. So he tells the last joke and he signs off.
01:40:38
Speaker
And then like the camera just holds on him. yeah And he just, and he's like shuffling his papers. Like oftentimes you do at the end of weekend update. And then he's like, you know, like picking up his coffee cup to take a sip of water.
01:40:51
Speaker
And then he's just smiling down the barrel of the camera. But he shuffles his papers a little more than he plays with a pencil. Yeah. For a second. I i thought that this, i was like, this is this is the one thing that's working for me.
01:41:06
Speaker
This is interesting. Ben, I timed this. And then it ran too long. And then I was like, I'm over it. Two full minutes of no talking. It needs to be one. It's almost total silence.
01:41:19
Speaker
It's two minutes. The audience eventually is just confused. I think they don't know what they're seeing. they don't know whether to clap or nervously laugh or what they're supposed to be doing here. Oh, I'm sorry. Um, let me, uh, ring ring ring. Oh, hold on. Let me pick up the phone. Hello. Who's this? Oh, oh, hello. This is, uh, this is Jeff over at, uh, at Nike marketing. How's it going?
01:41:41
Speaker
Um, well, let me just cut to the chase. yeah I'm watching the show right now. Yeah. Great, great, great. Uh, yeah. We're just about to run your ad. We're, we're wrapping up the news update, but what I'm seeing right now is two minutes of absolute silent dead air.
01:42:00
Speaker
is this a production mistake well is this a but but you have that air that's leading into your nike ad but are isn't this daring the audience to change the channel before my no no it's daring yeah you know just period this is dan i think you have another call bring ring oh sorry let me put you on hold just one moment okay hold on i'm picking up hey hi hi hello Hey, this is Jeff. I'm a different Jeff from over at NBC. Oh, I'm sorry. At Fox. At Fox. I forgot what network I work for. You know how the late night wars are these days. they that's crazy Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I'm watching the program. Great.
01:42:38
Speaker
How you loving it? I mean, yeah. I mean, Chevy. He's the, the, the, the
01:42:50
Speaker
i had a quick question for you so i'm watching the show right now yeah there Yeah, yeah there there are two minutes of absolute dead air here. right Why the fuck aren't you airing four ads instead? Because that would make me money. This is losing me money right now. Why aren't you airing ads right now? you know what Because that would be better.
01:43:08
Speaker
that I'll tell you what's not funny it is a two minutes of dead air. That's what's not funny. but no i'm ki to you why don't you you know i mean You're the professional. I'm an executive. Why don't you tell me what's funny? Yes, please. The other line is an advertiser that's pissed off.
01:43:30
Speaker
This, i agree. Like for me, this is the closest the show I think gets to like an anti-comedy thing, which I think is what it aspires to a few times in this, in this program before anti-comedy was really a a clear thing in in mainstream pop culture.
01:43:48
Speaker
i think it's aspiring to this and this is the closest it gets. I think this would be infuriating. I mean, it almost reminds me Like in those waning days the Conan O'Brien show where he was just doing silly things like how can I spend the network's money in ridiculous ways? It has a little bit of that sort of flipping the bird to the network. And that's something David Letterman made a career out of too. It's like daring NBC and later CBS to tell him he couldn't do something. even And I like that series of like anarchism. That's that sense of anarchism. That's part of this, but two minutes is a long time. so Let's let's sprint through the rest of the show.
01:44:26
Speaker
We got to, I mean, and I will say it gets a lot less interesting from here. We we bring out after this ends, we bring out our next guest whoopie Goldberg. I gotta say whoopie does better.
01:44:40
Speaker
Absolute pro. She babysits Chevy way better than Goldie Honda. She is. She, yeah, good because, because Whoopi is a host. She is coming off as they discuss, she's coming off of, uh, her own like talk show. And as we all know, like she, you know, it like, you know, she was, she's been on the view forever.
01:45:04
Speaker
Like, you know, Whoopi, is like a beloved, ah like kind of like personality performer in addition to being an actor. And she brings him a gift. yeah She, brings him a gift she, she, she brings him, uh,
01:45:24
Speaker
A pair of ah the the high heels that she danced in on the premiere of the Whoopi Goldberg show, which was just canceled.
01:45:36
Speaker
So she gave him, if you aren't following the story, a pair of cursed shoes from a canceled late night talk show. This is a second bad omen after the missed basketball shot. This is like the sign that is like when you literally get curse shoes from a failed talk show host in your first episode.
01:45:57
Speaker
That's a failed talk show that lasted like over 100 episodes. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, it yeah does not fail nearly as hard. um And what's funny is he's 30 minutes into his debut episode when she comes out. When she mentions that her show was canceled, says... yeah, what does he say? It's almost like you have a clip.
01:46:15
Speaker
What are you doing with yourself now that your your show's going the way mine is about to go? No, no, no, no. Oh, he knows. He knows. He knows. He's again. He, he knows this is terrible. They're awkward pauses. He's looming over whoopie again, kind of like he did Goldie Han. There is one, I think his best piece of improv in this whole episode though, oh comes during the whoopie.
01:46:41
Speaker
Yeah, okay, I think, I bet we're on the same thing. yeah She's talking about Sister Act 2, which she's just started. And, of course, she plays a nun in Sister Act 2, and she says, after filming Sister Act 1, Sister Act 2, back-to-back, basically, she's ready to not have a crucifix around her neck for a change.
01:46:57
Speaker
And Chevy responds, I think Linda Blair would say the same thing. Which is a nice, quick-witted response, referencing The Exorcist, of course. Mm-hmm.
01:47:09
Speaker
But it's so awkwardly delivered. And then both he and Whoopi lampshade how awkwardly delivered it was and how it failed to land with the audience, which is just sad. Like Chevy still has that quick wit somewhere in there.
01:47:28
Speaker
I was going to say he has he has a gag with her where he says, all right, well, you know, enough of that. Like, there's actually something, you know, really serious I want to, like, talk about with you.
01:47:40
Speaker
which is which way do you think Clinton should go? Like, should he focus? That's a good idea. Or should he focus on healthcare? And then she just stares at him. And he goes, of course, I'm like, I don't I want to I don't know. Like, yeah and that's a good bit. Like, he actually builds that one up. Yes.
01:47:58
Speaker
I didn't see it coming. I did. Yeah, I mean, it was like a legit pretty well delivered bit and he's actually talking to her and not at her in that moment like it feels like a real like it's a moment that almost feels like a real talk show gag and then it just gets so weird again goldie comes back out and this looks like it's unplanned she's like got her bag full of all of her brings out goldie i want all right all right yeah i want to to say a couple things which is that before we get there uh uh chevy fixates on that whoopi is a mother and how could she possibly have a career and be a mother to which would be like my daughter is 19 years old um so that's one thing um and uh the other thing is like um can you imagine if chevy had kids and a job at the same time oh wait he does yeah um and then also just a note like
01:48:57
Speaker
you know, again, after, after those two jokes that he, you know, then he's done, that's all he has. And then it's just whoopee. And she's just like, she does really well. And then ah she's fantastic. Yeah. but Then we commercial break, we bring back, uh, she brings back Goldie. Yeah.
01:49:18
Speaker
And Chevy has pretty much nothing to do with this. He like, she's just like, I just want everyone to know. Sometimes people call me Goldie. This is Goldie.
01:49:30
Speaker
I'm what I'm Goldberg. Whoopi Goldberg. Yeah. She's Goldie. I'm Whoopi. She's Goldie. Like, and then like she, Uma. Yeah. Like she does a whole bit. Like she just kind of takes over the show for a little bit to do a a comedy sketch that she invented with Goldie Hawn.
01:49:48
Speaker
yes yes yes no this is and i mean she is so much more comfortable in this moment i mean you can tell that she has 100 episodes of late night under her belt that she's a season stage performer and comic and she do stand up too yes she did yeah i mean she and i mean i think that is part of What's lost here is, you know, Chevy doesn't have that standup background, but you don't have to. Not everybody who's successfully hosted that late night show has done standup necessarily, but I think it helps. I think he has live performance experience, but it's not coming through here. And right away, he's lost in his own show at this moment. He's not in control.
01:50:31
Speaker
He's not part of the conversation, really. He's just there and he's a non-presence. Yeah, I, you know, it's just so... now I'm just thinking about how much I like Goldberg, you know? she's just She's just great, and she's really, really entertaining at that Have you seen her on Star Trek The Next Generation? No.
01:50:56
Speaker
She's quite good. I've only seen the first season of it, and I didn't care for but it didn't continue. yeah What if I told you that not only does Whoopi Goldberg eventually show up but what if I told you Riker?
01:51:08
Speaker
Grows a beard. Oh, he looks so handsome with that beautiful face. Oh, you think he looks handsome with that baby face, Ben? Yeah. Once he has a beard. boyish and cute. Oh, no, no.
01:51:20
Speaker
He's going to become one of the sexiest men on TV once he grows that beard. um Anyway, all right. But then, all right, then commercial, and then he comes back. He reads a couple notes of congratulations. There are all these, like, little, like, corny little one-liners, and then it's over.
01:51:34
Speaker
Doesn't land. Also, that that last segment doesn't land. Yeah. He's not confidently delivering it. i mean, this is the problem with a lot of the show. He isn't confident in the material, which admittedly is pretty weak from start to finish, but weak material delivered without confidence makes 42 minutes feel like a lifetime. You know, we, yeah. Yeah.
01:51:57
Speaker
This podcast is like over twice the length of the Chevy. Yes. But we are hilarious. Yeah. And we're incredibly confident. though That's true. And um anyway, so I want to... I I have so much to Like, i could I could go even longer, but like,
01:52:17
Speaker
what you know what i Like, you know, I'll say my my little piece about ah ah the Conan, which is that I watch i went after I watched this.
01:52:30
Speaker
I went and I rewatched a bit of Conan's first episode. um Late Night with Conan, which was also 1993. see what. Yep.
01:52:41
Speaker
Was that around the same time? I think I have the dates here. Let's see. I can give you kind of when everybody debuts, I think. So I have this in my notes. So I debuted September 13th, 1993. And the.
01:52:54
Speaker
um and the A week later. so it was a week after Chevy Chase. A week after Chevy Chase. um And Chevy Chase debuted a week after David Letterman on the late show on CBS. well That was a great. hope Like the.
01:53:10
Speaker
yeah That was hot as hell. Like that was like the, as everybody, if you can imagine this, everyone hated Jay Leno for taking over the tonight show. Nobody would make that mistake again. um well, but like and um you know we we we this can't become like a late night wars podcast it could it could but uh what if we had what if we occasionally did special episodes of the chevy chase show that just focused on late night you know wars like just like a little spin-off where like we just like spin episode like recapping some other late night show hosts show just like as a gag
01:53:49
Speaker
Well, we would talk about the episode of the Pat Sajak show that Rush Limbaugh guest hosted, which is like an absolute spectacle. Yes. But it's one of my favorite hours of television. It truly must Because you love Rush Limbaugh.
01:54:05
Speaker
It must be seen to be believed. A real ditto head, Ben. Anyway. Um, but, uh, uh, uh, the, so I, I watched a bit of Conan's first episode after this and it's, it's funny because Conan had a rough start also famously like, and, you know, he talks a lot about it too. And he's also very nervous on the stage.
01:54:40
Speaker
And if you've ever watched early Conan, the first episode is on, on YouTube. i don't know how much of the other early episodes are, but uh one thing that the early reviews like dinged him on and they are absolutely right is that he has a nervous laugh that is very unpleasant to hear um that he trained the fuck out like you do not hear that like you've listened to his podcast you've seen him on like all of his shit yeah that nervous laugh was like you know electroshock therapy out of him anyway yeah i imagine like
01:55:15
Speaker
Brandon Tarkanoff or whatever the guy at NBC's name was at the time. Like I'm guessing there was some sort of like clockwork orange scenario set up for Conan O'Brien to break him of that nervous laugh because once it's gone, it's gone forever. But it was the only thing reviews talked about during those early weeks of his show. It's just like this guy, there was lots of this guy doesn't belong on TV talk. And so much of that focused in on this nervous laugh that he could not,
01:55:42
Speaker
get out of initially but he got out of it but well he kept trying to make an effort like and you know this might be said with you know years of love and appreciation for conan but it's like you watch it and you're just like yeah it's all there like one is that it has a very funny cold open in comparison.
01:56:04
Speaker
Um, like, I mean, it's not even in compare, like, I'm not like, it sounds like I'm provisoing it, but it has a a very funny, uh, a cold open, especially in comparison where it's just like, he's just walking on his way to the studio and everyone is like threatening him, ah because, uh, saying that he better be, uh, as good as letterman.
01:56:28
Speaker
Um, yeah and it's it's pretty funny. Like, there's there's craft and interest in doing a good show yes and it's obvious that conan is a guy that up to that moment had spent his career in writers rooms being the funniest guy in the writers room and not as a live stage comic yes but two very different things but
01:57:02
Speaker
Like that would be expected if you pulled a former SNL and Simpsons writer and made him a late night television host. ah It's a little bit more of a shock when you take an established megawatt star.
01:57:21
Speaker
who has a live television career and has hosted the tonight show. Yes. The biggest stage of them all and have him come out and just immediately eat shit and then yeah never get better.
01:57:39
Speaker
I mean, that is remarkable is the fact that I think it would be hard. How many episodes do you make total of this? How many episodes of the Chevy chase show exist?
01:57:51
Speaker
It's the Chevy Chase show ran for 29 episodes. How can you do 29 episodes and not get appreciably better simply through the act of repetition?
01:58:09
Speaker
Late night is such a formula. How can you not at least find comfort in that formula as you settle into it But Chevy Chase, just having skipped around and watched random episodes throughout this run, he never settles into it. He just never feels at home.
Analyzing the Chevy Chase Show's Decline
01:58:27
Speaker
There are brief moments where you see signs of what this show might have been, but they are fleeting. And it never gets much better than this disastrous first episode. I think as much money as was invested in him,
01:58:43
Speaker
for this show. I think there's a good chance nowadays they might have scrapped this first episode and said, take a week or two to retool this.
01:58:54
Speaker
We need to postpone this launch. I think nowadays a lot of television networks would say, we've got too much riding on this to send out a product like this. I can't believe this made it to air. I mean, when we say it's bad, it's bad in a way that big budget television is seldom bad.
01:59:15
Speaker
i mean, it's really singular. Wouldn't you say? It's, it's incredible. It's, it, I mean, put in a time capsule, bury it, have people dig it up 500 years from now and try to make sense of it.
01:59:30
Speaker
It is I think what is like, it's why I've watched as much of it as I can. is you you just it it it's fascinating it's fascinating to see it's it's like it just something like this shouldn't be like this no it no if you hear that like a show like this is a flop and you're like oh is it boring
02:00:06
Speaker
Like, or is it like, are the jokes like just kind of corny? Like, what is it like, yeah like Jay Leno? Is it just kind of like, ah like, and people love Jay Leno. um But like, you know, is it, and it's like, no, it's, it's like, we took one of the biggest comedy stars and he just came out and like wet himself on the stage for 29 episodes in a row.
02:00:36
Speaker
like um and and like and it's a mercy killing like you know that they canceled the show after spending that much money we like i'm surprised after a week or two they didn't shut down production fire some writing staff, put in a new producer, hire somebody away from one of the other late night shows to where I can't believe again, with the amount of money they'd invested from the theater to attracting these advertisers with promises of giant ratings that you wouldn't try to salvage this, but maybe it was just seen as unsalvageable. I think that if you were an executive watching this first episode, you're probably saying, okay, we're fucked. This isn't, this isn't going to be fixable, but
02:01:29
Speaker
I don't know. i don't know how if you're this deep into it, you don't try to fix it. before you give up on, unless you're just convinced there is no fixing And who knows Chevy's going through a tough time in his career. From what we know, Chevy chase is going through a pretty tough time in his personal life.
02:01:49
Speaker
Maybe you just bet on the wrong course here. Maybe he's not the man at this point in his career that you could build a successful show around, even if you had the right plan of attack to do so. I don't know.
02:02:01
Speaker
Um, So I'm looking at the New York Times story. is October 18th, 1993.
02:02:12
Speaker
um ah So ah this is ah quoting from, let's say, Lucy Salhoney, the chairwoman of Fox Broadcasting.
02:02:27
Speaker
We expended a lot of time and energy on the show, Miss Salony said. And unless you have hope for positive growth in the long term, there's no reason to continue. ah Then...
02:02:39
Speaker
um ah further ah later on in the the story quote she said that many Fox affiliates had called to discuss the performance of the chase show but that quote it wasn't really pressure it was concern I was very touched by the support of the stations oh that's a bad sign um he's like yeah i mean I'm hearing um excuse me ring ring ring yeah oh hi yeah Hey, this is Jeff. I'm the station manager at the at the Fox station in Omaha, Nebraska. how are you doing? Oh, I'm good. hi I'm ah and what's her
02:03:17
Speaker
Lucy Salony. Yeah, I'm the chairman. Oh, hey, Lucy. Lucy, how are you doing? Yeah, yeah. You just call me straight up, not even through my secretary. That's cool. What's up? No, no. I mean, yeah, I mean, that's part of the privilege of being part of the Fox family. Yeah, thank you for being, you know, taking a a leap.
02:03:34
Speaker
Yeah, I just wanted to call, like... is chevy okay ah well so here's the plan we're replacing it and this is true we're replacing it with reruns of in living color and uh and so don't worry about that like uh and and chevy he's got cops and robertsons uh he's got something lined up he's that's all i needed thank you sandy But it' Lucy, but thank you. All right. Okay.
02:04:06
Speaker
and all right okay these snapper bam look It premiered to an audience of 5.4 million. Those are big numbers for late night television. Nowadays, a TV show on a network game, 5.4 million viewers. There would be like people dancing in the streets. that That's amazing. That's an amazing number. 5.4 million for this.
02:04:29
Speaker
By the end of week one, that's on a Monday, 5.4 million. By the end of week one, 2.3 million. It hemorrhages more than half of its audience in the first week of airing. It'll eventually settle in closer to about 1.5 million by the time it's canceled.
02:04:52
Speaker
So, That kind of drop off though, losing half of your audience, tons of people tune in for curiosity's sake. The vast majority of them are going to choose not to return for more helpings of the Chevy Chase show.
02:05:08
Speaker
Disaster. Yeah. Disaster. People think this is just like a ratings flop and it is. But it's hard to stress what a creative flop it is, too. I mean, this is not just a case of audience wasn't ready for it. Wrong show at the wrong time, whatever. It is a disaster on every front. Yeah.
02:05:31
Speaker
All right. Well, this has been Chevy Chasers. Thank you so much for joining us. We'll be, ah you know, we're we're always always doing more, but be sure to give us a ring, ring, ring, harry ring. Yeah. Hold on.
02:05:45
Speaker
Hey, ah this is Jeff over at over at Google. How are you doing, Ben? Hi, Google Jeff. What's up? Yeah, um i was I saw your email, first of all. I was just saying your Gmail. That's why we call it here at the office. is saw your Gmail. um And I know that you said you were looking to change your email address, that we'd had that error with the login and everything. You were wanting Chevy Chasers pod at gmail.com.
02:06:13
Speaker
i No, no, don't email. ah no You know what? Let's just keep it at questquestpodcast at gmail.com. I'm sorry, but you are hosting a show called Chevy Chasers. Yeah, but you know what? I just want to keep it I just think you sent several requests. Yeah, but let's, you know what? Let's keep it.
02:06:32
Speaker
You called me an asshole in this most recent Gmail. The email for this podcast is questquestpodcast at gmail.com. But it's. and also, show Jeff, be sure to rate and review this program. Oh, I'm not a listener. I'm simply, I'm. Thank you, Jeff. I'm head of Gmail technologies at Google. And also, Jeff.
02:06:56
Speaker
Yes. Be sure to join us next week when we start Community.
02:07:12
Speaker
did you Did you ever watch the... were Are you community guy? I'm a big community guy. watched it live. It was one of those shows, especially when it came out, that for me...
02:07:25
Speaker
it was one of those rare moments where you feel like, Oh, this is a show made exclusively and specifically for me. And I'm probably the only person watching it.
02:07:36
Speaker
and And it turns out it was me and a small number of people for this, that first season or so. ah But like and me edy how about you, Ben? No, I think it was you and a small group of people for the entire run of the show.