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Season 3 Ep 16 - How Can I Trust God? a Conversation with Karen Ehman, Ruth Schwenk and Courtney Joseph
248 Plays2 years ago
Mentioned in this episode:
Trusting God in All the Things
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Transcript
Introduction to Ruth Schwenk and Podcast Mission
00:00:02
Speaker
Hi, I'm Ruth Schwenk and I'm so thrilled you're listening in with us at Root Like Faith. It is our deepest desire to encourage and equip men and women to be rooted in God's word, transformed by the love of Jesus and moved by his mission in the power of the Holy Spirit. Nothing is more important.
Excitement for Conversation with Friends
00:00:20
Speaker
Well, today we are mixing things up a bit and I'm really, really excited to share this with you. It is a conversation that I had with two of my very best friends, Karen Eman and Courtney Joseph from WomenLivingWell.org. And we had this conversation for the people who pre-ordered Karen and I's devotional, trusting God in all the things.
00:00:49
Speaker
And I'll just tell you that this is a very, very candid conversation. There's a lot of tears, but it's very real and raw. And I think after the conversation, we were like, wow, we really just laid it out there. And I just I think you'll be encouraged.
Context and Purpose of the Devotional Discussion
00:01:09
Speaker
And I hope
00:01:11
Speaker
that it gives you hope no matter what you're walking through. And I asked their permission to share this with all of you. So you'll hear a little bit of language about pre-orders for Trusting God and all the things. And that's because we recorded it originally for the people who pre-ordered our devotional Trusting God and all the things. But it was so, so good. I had to share it. I'm like, please, you guys, can I share this with my Root Like Faith community?
Trusting God Through Life's Challenges
00:01:41
Speaker
So it's all centered around that topic of trusting God in all the things and our devotional art is 90 devotions for finding peace in your everyday. And we really talk about in this episode, just that whole idea of finding peace.
00:02:00
Speaker
and what that looks like and what it really looks like to trust God in all the things. Whether you've lost someone, whether you're going for a divorce, whether a health diagnosis like cancer has entered your story, whatever it is, we really dive deep. And so I hope again that your heart is encouraged and that you're given hope as you listen in on our conversation. I can't wait to share this with you. Let's go.
Meet Karen Eman and Courtney Joseph
00:02:29
Speaker
Well, welcome friends to our conversation today about learning to trust God, despite the circumstances of your life. I'm Kieran Eamon. I'm co-author, along with Ruth Schwank, of a devotional actually on this topic. It's called Trusting God in All the Things, 90 Devotions for Finding Peace in Your Everyday. And I am joined today by that co-author. Hey, Ruth.
00:02:51
Speaker
Hey, because it's not just you and I, but we also have our other dear friend joining us, Courtney Joseph. She is a women living well and good morning girls and she is our friend. And in case you're listening to us for the first time and you haven't heard of one, two or all three of us, we're going to just start by telling a little bit about ourselves. Well, I'll go first since I am
00:03:17
Speaker
I'm kind of all like to talk. I was thinking, you know, the three of us probably could do a whole hour with no topic, but we're going to stick to the topic today. And I'll go ahead and tell a little bit about myself. I'm Karen Eman. I am a speaker and author. I've written 18 books. I write and speak for Proverbs 31 ministries, both in their first five
00:03:37
Speaker
app that's a Bible study app and I also write for encouragement for today. Devotions that are online daily devotions. I'm married to my college sweetheart Todd and we have five all adult, all out there children. Now I say five, three are biological, two are in-laws by marriage, but I kind of forget which are which because I just love them all so much. And I live in the middle of Michigan, right in the middle of the mitten. So that's a little bit about me. How about you, Ruth? Tell us about yourself.
00:04:07
Speaker
All right. Well, I am an author and a blogger. I have written several books, a few of those. I've had the pleasure of writing with you, Karen. We've written a few devotionals together and a book and that's been amazing. And Courtney also has joined us. We do my mentorship courses. So if you ever are looking for a course to learn and grow in your walk with God, be sure to check out my mentorship courses.com.
00:04:34
Speaker
I have four kids that are almost all teenagers, one in college. I can't believe this. I'm not sure how this time goes by so fast. My husband is a pastor. We've been married for almost 25 years. And I also live in Michigan, except for I live in a very, the best city, Ann Arbor, Michigan. And the reason it's the best city is because that is where the University of Michigan is. And the Michigan Wolverines are the best.
00:05:02
Speaker
And we're going to stop her right there. We're going to stop her right there, Noah. Michigan State. I root for Michigan State. She roots for Michigan State. I have a state. I'm a black guy. Now, here comes Courtney. Go ahead, Courtney. Tell about yourself. You're going to mention the black guys. Go ahead. Let's let everybody know about you. I am an Ohio State fan from the great state of Ohio.
00:05:23
Speaker
And I have a son who is 18 and a daughter who is 16. And I write at womenlivingwell.org. And that is the home of Good Morning Girls, which are accountability groups for reading your Bible. And so I'm blogging through the Bible cover to cover one chapter a day. And we are about 30 books in the Bible in. And so that's what I do.
00:05:46
Speaker
out online and at home. Like I said, I got a son and a daughter, a son who's about to graduate and a daughter who's right behind that. And I am a single mom. I was married for 19 years. And we'll talk a little more about that as we get into here today. But I am recently, after being single for six years, newly engaged. So I will soon also have
00:06:09
Speaker
to stepdaughters who are adults and a son-in-law. That would be a stepson-in-law. But we'll talk more about that as we go on.
00:06:18
Speaker
See, and then you're going to be able to say, and I have five kids, biological three are my marriage, but I forget which are which. Well, before we kind of go through some questions, I want to toss out to the two of you and have our listeners ponder. I just wanted to tell a little story that kind of introduces this topic.
Story of Universal Challenges
00:06:35
Speaker
Not too long ago, I was with my mother-in-law at one of her medical appointments and we were sitting in the waiting room.
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An ice storm was on its way, as often happens here in Michigan. And so we were hoping to get out of that appointment and get on the road before the ice and the snow came. And there were two elderly women sitting across from us.
00:06:54
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And they were talking about the snowstorm. And one of them was just like all in a tizzy about it. Like, you know, I gotta get home. And what if I'm out on the streets when it starts to snow? And what if my car goes off the road and I just hate this weather. I hate this weather. Why do we have to have snowstorms and ice storms in Michigan? And her friend kind of like patted her on the leg trying to settle her down and said, you know, Bernice, I've been all over the place. I've lived all over the country. And guess what? Everybody's got something. And I thought,
00:07:24
Speaker
What is she talking about? So I didn't want to make it too obvious that I was listening to their conversation, but I said, can I ask you what you mean by that? And she told me that because of her husband's job, they had relocated all over the country multiple times. And she said, you know what? When we lived in Kansas, it was the tornadoes and the dust storms. Once we lived in southern Florida, it was hurricanes. We had to prepare for the hurricanes. And then we were stationed in California once, and it was the drought and the wildfires. Everybody's got something.
00:07:53
Speaker
It'll be all right. And I thought, you know, that's kind of a lot like life, like even with the three of us here that are talking on this call and with the people that are out there listening, everybody's got something, something out there that they're afraid of or something that interrupts their day or causes them distress and anxiety. We all have something. So I want to start off with talking about, you know, what are your somethings? What areas of life are you currently having to trust God? So let's, let's ask you that, Courtney.
00:08:23
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Where are yours? What are your somethings?
Courtney's Journey Through Divorce
00:08:25
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Well, it's interesting as you were just telling that story, it came to mind the thought that someone once said to me, I don't even know who it was or where I heard it, but they were saying it doesn't matter how pretty that product versus even she's got junk inside her purse. You know, like we all know that's good. No, like Nancy, we all got junk in our purse. You know, we all got stuff. And so my stuff really began about six years ago when my husband walked out the door and left me for another woman.
00:08:53
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I was scared to death. Like, what would my future look like? Would I lose my home? Would my children misunderstand what happened? I had an elder at my church who said, you know, your son might choose to go live with his dad and you might end up with your daughter. And him just even giving me the idea of that of like, I could lose one of my children as well, scared me. And so financially, I didn't know what was going to happen. I didn't know if I'd be able to keep writing online. I was already doing ministry online and I thought,
00:09:21
Speaker
Who's going to want to listen to a divorce Bible study writer? Like, will people still want to do Bible study alongside me? Can I keep doing what I love to do? And God has been so good and gracious to me and my readers, too, to allow me to still do what I love. And then the big question of will I be single the rest of my life? At the time when he left, all I longed for was to reconcile with my
00:09:45
Speaker
with my husband. I was like, let's go to counseling. I'll do anything. I will forgive you. As long as he was humble and surrendered and repentant, I wanted to work on our marriage so badly. But some may already know my story. We did try multiple times. But no matter how hard we tried, he kept on falling back into the same habitual sin. And we ended up having to, we have not reconciled. And so for the last few years, I've just been
00:10:14
Speaker
just plain single. And seeing God, though, work, I now have learned so much about how God provides in so many ways. At first, it was just I thought financially was what I need to worry about. But emotionally, spiritually, physically, God has provided by bringing friends into my life in different seasons to help me and
00:10:33
Speaker
by opening doors that I never imagined that would be a blessing to do new things. And even now, I don't think that I am newly engaged. God has brought a godly man into my life, but that doesn't mean that my life is all wrapped up neatly now in a bow and all my problems have disappeared, poof. We have new things that we have to now work through, and I still need God just as much as the day that he walked out the door. But I just see how faithful God is, and he has never been closer to me.
00:11:03
Speaker
that he's been during these alone years. And I just have been so blessed by, yeah, it's really been good for me actually to grow on my walk with God through even these hardest things. Yeah, that's so true. Those things that we all have on the other side of them, often we can look back and see growth. That's so true. How about you, Ruth? What areas of life are you currently having to trust God? What are your somethings?
Ruth's Personal Trials and Trusting God
00:11:28
Speaker
Everybody's got something.
00:11:30
Speaker
Well, I love how Courtney said, you know, just because this was resolved or some seems resolved doesn't mean there's not, you know, new things that's not wrapped up in a bow just because something's been taken care of and.
00:11:44
Speaker
You know, that just kind of, I think about actually my whole life and just the trials I've faced throughout the years and I go back to when my kids were really little and I had a span of about
00:12:01
Speaker
10 years where I had five miscarriages in those 10 years and I was having babies and then I would have a miscarriage and a couple of those were at about 20 weeks. It was just like it's really kind of a blur to me because I think it was so traumatic. And that was just a really, really hard time. A time where you're supposed to be happy doesn't feel happy for me. And so that was a really, really hard time. I think
00:12:29
Speaker
You know, even something going through motherhood and your kids getting older and you're questioning, am I doing this right? Like, like even those to me seem maybe a little smaller compared to some other things I've faced, but those are still, you know, in those things, we still have to learn to trust God. And, and then, you know, about five years ago, my husband was diagnosed with a blood cancer and that just, you know, that's a whole nother area where
00:12:57
Speaker
you know, that's like unchartered territory. Like what is going on? We are, you know, 40 years old. We shouldn't have to be thinking about this. And so I think, I guess the lesson in all of those things is that there's just throughout our life, throughout this journey of life, there's so many ups and downs, so many times, um, that we have to learn to trust God in all the things. Yeah. Yeah. Boy, you have been through it. You know, it's, it's interesting to me hearing both of you talk.
00:13:24
Speaker
The situations are different, but the effect is kind of the same. For me, I'm going to go back just like the last three years. So three years ago, the horizon looked great. We were moving to a new town. Our kids were out of the house for the most part. They were out of high school.
00:13:41
Speaker
And we were moving to a new town, just one town south of where we were living, but it was to be closer to my mom and my dad and stepmom who were getting up there in years and needed some help, you know, being taken to medical appointments now and then in areas of town, they didn't feel comfortable driving. But for the most part, they were pretty self-sufficient. And I was really looking forward to spending more time with them. And so we moved. Three weeks later, our first child got married, our son.
00:14:07
Speaker
And then three weeks after that, my father passed away. He fell, suddenly was in hospice, and just gone, like in three weeks. And then since that time, in the last three years, okay, just wait for it, 10 people between my husband and me, I've lost, we've lost four parents, my mom, my stepmom, my dad, my mother-in-law, two aunts, three uncles, and two cousins, 10 in the last three years, including, you know, four parents. So my kids lost all four grandparents.
00:14:37
Speaker
you know, right boom in a row. And even during those times of grief, there were happy things happening. Another child got married to someone we'd been telling her she should marry for 10 years, who was like her best friend and now he's her husband. And then we had our first grandchild born just four days after, this just happened two weeks ago, just four days after my mother-in-law, the oldest member of my family passed away, our youngest member made his entrance and it was a happy thing. And you know what? I've learned that even in the happy times,
00:15:07
Speaker
there's still trust issues. There's still having to learn to rely on God, not only when you're going through grief and losing a marriage or miscarriage or a husband's illness or parents passing away, but this new baby is like, yay, Joy. Oh, I hope he's all right. What's the future going to be like growing up in a world now? Even happy things bring issues in our life where we have to trust God. So let's go on to
00:15:34
Speaker
The next question I wanna throw out there is these things we've just mentioned, these hard things, when they come, how do you usually respond? I know for me, I'm just gonna be real honest, I tend to pick up the phone. I call one or two really close friends, I may be talking to them right now, who I think are really solid as far as their faith, and they can help me process the hard thing I'm going through. But as much as I need support from other believers, it's very helpful, it's very needed, I need to learn to run to God before I grab my phone.
00:16:03
Speaker
So I want to ask the two of you, you know, how do you usually respond? What is your default response to these hard things? And second part to that question, what should our response be? Like, what should we do? What do you find? What have you found that works? How about Ruth?
Ruth's Tools for Processing Challenges
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You go first on this one.
00:16:20
Speaker
Well, I'll be really honest in my first tendency is to shut down. Like I, I can't talk to anybody, which is so funny. Isn't that Karen? Like you, you need to pick up the phone and call someone. I need to, I need to be away from everybody and I need to process. Um, and, and I just need time to think. And I think what that does for me actually is I, I need to reorient my perspective. I need to have a better understanding, which is ultimately leading me.
00:16:49
Speaker
to trust God, because I think what happens when we face hard things or suffering in our life, it really exposes what we believe about God. And so in this, I have to remind myself of who he is. I need to step back. I need just time to process and remind myself of who he is, who he's been, and who he'll continue to be for me. And then, of course, some of the practical things, I have this little pocket cross
00:17:20
Speaker
that I still keep with me often or even at night under my pillow that I will hold. It's like it's called the pocket cross and it fits in your hand. That's just been so comforting to me to hold on to that. And I feel like right while I'm holding on to it, I'm reminded to pray and just trust God and then
00:17:39
Speaker
Another thing that has been very helpful for me as I've been going through hard things is just a Bible verse written on a note card and having that with me just again to continue to remind me of who God is. Oh, that's so good. I love that pocket cross idea. That's wonderful. So good. How about you, Courtney? Well, I'm a little bit like Ruth in the sense that I do pull back a little too, and I'm a little bit of an information seeker. So I'm the type that starts
00:18:06
Speaker
looking for, if I'm going to talk to someone, it's not necessarily always my first like bestie friend. It's going to be like, who else has gone through exactly what I'm going through? And so one of the things that happened, I felt like when I went through my divorce was that I did not, I was in like, I'm blessed by having a circle of friends who have amazing marriages. So I'm like, oh no, none of my friends are divorced. None of them are single moms.
00:18:29
Speaker
who do i talk to that would actually like get it you know or whatever and so i found myself you know looking up youtube's of godly you know women who have been through this looking up books looking on google like information seeking like even now a dating and dating and being engaged to a widow i don't have any friends who are married to a widow
00:18:50
Speaker
And so there's like little things that come up that are unique in this situation. And so like, you know, how comfortable should I be with pictures around and, you know, and, and just different things that I like, I'm adjusting to like honoring her and, and, and, and things like this. And so her memory. And so, um, I find myself, you know, going out online and just like Googling like how to, you know, like, you know, like, what are the things that, you know, how to deal with those different things of dating a widow and being married to one and
Courtney's Approach in Tough Times
00:19:19
Speaker
and how to do this well or whatever. So I tend to be an information seeker in that sense. But then I also do go to my friends for sure, because I am a talker. I'm an external processor. I need to talk things out to even know what I think, I guess. And I'm a journaler, which is another way that I externally process. So if I'm reading a book or listening to a YouTube, I'm taking notes usually on it as I learn from it. And then exactly what Ruth said, I put my favorite memory versus on note cards.
00:19:49
Speaker
and I'll have them beside the bed. And just yeah, my journal is also a prayer place and a place where I write those memory verses, a place where I write those things that I want to remember or read back through that helped me. So yeah, that's kind of how I work through my questions of life and my like getting the nitty gritty out so that I can rest in Jesus and trust him after I kind of work through all that stuff, all the emotions.
00:20:14
Speaker
No, that's so good. Yeah, I remember when you were in that information-seeking stage. I think you called me a couple times, not because I've been divorced, but because I'm a child of divorce. And I do think it's really helpful to talk to somebody that's walked the road before, yeah. One thing that I do that works, I already said what doesn't work always is hitting the phone before I hit my
Karen's 'I Spy Journal' of Faithfulness
00:20:34
Speaker
knees. But I, when my husband and I were first married, I'm talking decades ago,
00:20:40
Speaker
We came up with this idea of having what we called an I Spy Journal. I spy the Lord working. I spy him taking care of us. For us, the concerns then were financial. He was a youth pastor. We were living on a budget so tight it squeaked. I was a stay-at-home mom. There were so many times where we didn't know where we were going to get the $350 to pay off the medical bill or whatever.
00:21:07
Speaker
Out of the blue, something would happen. One time, my college, I had been out of college five years. They gave me a rebate.
00:21:13
Speaker
for my tuition. And it was the exact amount that we owed on a medical bill. And so we would write these things down. And so for me, when I'm going through a hard time, not just financially, because eventually I started writing down all kinds of stories, I'll go back to the iSpy Journal, and I'll read something from 20 years ago. And I'll think, you know what, I remember how terrified I was about that situation, how worried and filled with anxiety I was. And look, God came through then, what is to say he's not going to come through now? And I think we see that even
00:21:43
Speaker
scripture, I was just reading this morning in Psalms. I was reading Psalm 43 and it talked about just the anxiety that the psalmist was feeling and then he says, I will go to the altar of God. This is verse four of Psalm 43 to the source of all my joy. I will praise you with my harp. Oh God, my God. Now I don't play a harp, but maybe I'll
00:22:07
Speaker
play something on Spotify, right? I'm a praise song. Then the last verse, it says, why am I discouraged? Why is my heart so sad? I will put my hope in God, I will praise him again, my Savior and my God. And there's so many times if you read through Psalms, that the Psalmist will say, I'm going to praise him again, I'm going to trust him again. It's like, you see their emotions played out on the page, like they're all fretful about something, and then they kind of calm their hearts down. I call it
00:22:34
Speaker
soul control. Like sometimes we need to just boss our souls around and control our soul and think, wait a minute, he's done it in the past, he's going to do it again, I will praise him again, because he is my God. And I love that verse four, he's the source of all my joy, not other places, but he is the source. And reading that song makes me think of
00:22:53
Speaker
scripture and how rich it is and how much it speaks to our situation. So let me ask both of you, are there any passages of scripture or verses that you've found in the hard times that it's really helpful to read or to remember or even to memorize?
Comfort of Psalms During Difficult Times
00:23:08
Speaker
How about you, Courtney? Do you have any? Oh, I love what you just shared in Psalm 43, because I'm sitting at Psalm 46, which, you know, so I flipped over just one page. And you know, what I love about the book of Psalms is that every emotion that a person can go through is
00:23:23
Speaker
talked about. David, you know, just writes. I mean, you got the praise and the joy, but you got the lament and the sorrow. You got the fear. And so, you know, when I flip over to Psalm 46, which has been like key verses for me, I've memorized them. They're hanging right now on my refrigerator. My kids, I want them to see them. I used to in the car before my children got out back when they weren't driving yet. I used to in the morning where we were waiting for them to get to the bus to pull up to pick up the kids.
00:23:49
Speaker
I would read through Psalm 46 verses 1 to 10 out loud to them every single day. I was just like, everyone be quiet. I'm going to read this. And I tell you what, I'm sure they were rolling their eyes in the backseat and weren't wanting to hear it again. But I'm like, I want this so deep in your hearts that it oozes out of you when you go through trouble. And so Psalm 46 verse 1 says, God is our refuge and strength, a very present hope and trouble. Therefore we will not fear.
00:24:14
Speaker
And I just love that because, you know, where do creatures go when they're scared? They run back to their whole, you know, and that God is our refuge. That's where we run back to, run back to Him. He is our strength. He alone is our strength. Nothing else is going to give me that strength. And we tend to run to all these other places, but He's our strength. He is present, a very present. He is there. He's a help and trouble. Therefore, we do not have to give fear when we go through crisis, when we go through disasters.
00:24:42
Speaker
And then that ends that chapter 46 ends with that very famous verse, be still and know that I am God. You know, and I just love that. He's like, I'll be exalted among the nations. I'll be exalted in the earth. The Lord of hosts is with us. The God of Jacob is our fortress, Selah. And it's just like, relax, be still. He is great. He loves us. He is with us. I mean, that just brings me so much peace. I have to read it every day to reset my emotions because my emotions go everywhere.
00:25:11
Speaker
And then God's word, though, gives me that, like, core strength to weather through tough storms. So good. Psalm 46, 1 through 10. I love that. How about Ruth? Do you have any scriptures that have been especially meaningful to you? Yeah, well, I have two that I wanted to share. And the first one is my life first. So this has been since I started following Christ in high school. And it's John 3 30. He must become greater. I must become less.
00:25:40
Speaker
And the reason this really I feel like applies to trials and suffering is because in those trials and suffering it's all about surrender. I think in understanding again who God is and when we fear God, the more rightly we see who He is and then we fear other things less.
00:26:02
Speaker
And I think so he must become greater. He must become less reminds me. I mean, he must become greater. I must become less reminds me that he's he's in control. So I don't need to be in control because he's got it all in his hands and he will take care of me. And then the second verse is Psalm 9 10. And this is one that is more recent over the last five years since my husband was diagnosed with cancer, which he is in remission now. Praise the Lord. But it's still an ongoing battle.
00:26:31
Speaker
And so Psalm 9 10 says those who know your name trust in you for you Lord have never forsaken those who seek you. And this is this is the verse I had written on the note card and I memorized.
00:26:46
Speaker
because I was reminding myself, when you know him, this says those who know your name trust in you. So when you know who God is, when you know that he is faithful, he is loving, he is just, he's a defender, all the things that the Bible tells us about the Lord. When we know his name, we know that we can trust him and he can be trusted and we can rest in that. So the second one then is Psalm 9.10.
00:27:14
Speaker
Wonderful to remember in hard times. Thanks for sharing those Ruth. I thought of immediately Psalm 62 five in the Christian Standard Bible version. It reads this way. Rest in God alone my soul for my hope comes from him. And this is kind of echoing a little bit what Courtney said when I looked up the Hebrew meaning here of the word alone. Rest in God alone my soul. The Hebrew meaning of alone
00:27:42
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actually means this. I just love this definition. In stark contrast to any other idea, the only solution that works, the real one rather than counterfeit. And I think of how many times, you know, I go to counterfeit things.
00:27:57
Speaker
I think, you know, oh, I just need a spa day. Not that I take them, you know, for me, a spa day is, you know, taking a bath in my own bathtub, but I just, you know, not that there's anything wrong with spa days or that there's anything wrong with other counterfeit means like, you know, calling a friend or processing out loud with, you know, a trusted pastor, whatever. Those are all great things, but really the true place, the only place we are supposed to go to is to God. We are to rest in him alone.
00:28:26
Speaker
He's the only solution that works. He's the real one rather than the counterfeit. So even though we try to go to some things that are good, they're not always the best because they're not God. And often we go to things that aren't good. For me, I rent a food. I rent in my fridge sometimes instead of running to God. Those are counterfeit means. Those are ways we try to soothe our soul that aren't gonna work. We need to go to the one true source to God alone. And that again was Psalm 62.5. So here's our final question and our time together.
00:28:57
Speaker
I want to ask you both this.
Advice to Past Selves on Faithfulness
00:28:59
Speaker
If you could go back and sit down with a cup of whatever it is you drink, coffee, tea, whatever it is, and talk heart to heart with your pre hard things self, you know, you before the trial or the troubles happened, what advice would you give yourself? What would you say? How about you, Courtney? Well, I have to be honest, I am getting choked up to answer this because
00:29:25
Speaker
Because I didn't see it coming and looking back at it um Like I'm so glad I didn't know it was coming. I'm so glad that I Had developed a walk with God that was deep that I had been in God's Word and in prayer because that has been what has sustained me But um if someone had told me that life as I knew it was about to be I'm sorry
00:29:51
Speaker
It's okay. It's all right. You want me to let Ruth answer first and then you can listen. I was now Courtney's got me crying. But this is the reality of hard things. You know, this is the reality of hard things. I had known that I was going to be betrayed and rejected over and over by the man that I love for 24 years and that my kids would be hurting so badly and that my status would change from divorce to
00:30:16
Speaker
from Mary to divorce and single mom and that I would be alone in bed and alone in the pew and alone at my kids day, you know, games and how, you know, just everything that would be changing in my life. I don't think I could have handled being told that, but the part that I know now that I didn't know then was that, you know, I, I would go back and I would tell her, God, you're going to be okay. Even though it's not all.
00:30:40
Speaker
that God provide that I will have so much joy. I've had so much good in these last six years. It's not like my whole life was literally destroyed. Like God is so good. I have had so much laughter in this home with my children. We are so close and we have so much fun together. And God has been with us and he has been gone before us. And
00:31:00
Speaker
Even when I feel alone, I know I'm not alone and I am okay. And so he's just been so faithful. I would tell myself, tell that girl out there that there will be beauty from ashes. So keep believing, keep trusting that the pain and the sorrow won't be wasted and to stay surrendered and that Jesus loves you. And I have experienced that and I believe that with all my heart, but I can't say it's not without a lot of pain and sorrow. God is faithful.
00:31:28
Speaker
Oh, thank you for sharing that Courtney. How about you, Ruth? What would you say to your pre hard things self? Well, I don't think I would have wanted to know either. Great. Courtney has me crying. Oh, no. Are we going to have to pass out free tissues with this podcast? My goodness where I cried. But I think that God gives us grace in the moment to handle what's happening in our lives. And that's why
00:31:58
Speaker
we don't want to know beforehand because I don't think I could have handled it. But a couple of things I would have told myself and I would tell anybody, you know, anybody who's listening is that
00:32:15
Speaker
Your faithfulness for today matters for tomorrow. And I think this goes back to Psalm 9, 10. And the choice today to get into God's Word and to know Him deeper, to walk with Him closer day after day, it matters. It's preparing you. It prepared me and continues to prepare me.
00:32:34
Speaker
for the trials that are to come. And again, when we know him in those trials, not that it isn't really, really hard and not that there aren't times that we don't doubt and we don't question, but when we know him, we ultimately know then that we can trust him in that. And then secondly, I would say you'll get through this and God will use it. And I think
00:32:59
Speaker
You know, this goes back in my mind, you know, we're told that God only gives us what we can handle. But really, I think that's a myth. We can't handle what we're given because that's where that we need Him. You know, we need God. And that's where our growth comes in.
00:33:16
Speaker
And I think in suffering and in trials and in pain, when we walk through those things, we're never the same again. And God really changes us. And a couple of ways I've seen that, and the first way is just my eyes have been opened to the way that others suffer. And here I'd been in ministry with my husband for over 20 years and walked through.
00:33:39
Speaker
horrible things with people but once when I went through especially the last five years it it made me empathize in a way that I never could before and I remember like at a stoplight looking over and thinking I wonder what that woman is going through mm-hmm because when you've experienced suffering to that depth
00:34:06
Speaker
You your eyes are open like all the sudden you're like, wait a minute. I'm walking by all these people every day and you have no idea what they're going through. And I guess that reminds me also that I'm not alone in it. And I would say that to the woman listening right now, you're not alone in that suffering.
00:34:24
Speaker
And then, you know, you will get through this and God will use it. I think just learning in your suffering, learning to cling to Him in ways that really I've never experienced before because there is nothing else you can do but cling to Him in that. And so it's really, I'd say, you know, we'll deepen the relationship with God. Wow. Okay. Well, you know, it's, it's,
00:34:53
Speaker
what you say is so impactful and right where I'm living, Ruth, because I'm telling you, if anybody would have told me that I was going to lose my dad in 2019, my stepmom in 2020, to whom I was extremely close, she'd been in my life since sixth grade, then my mom in 2021, and then my mother in 2022, I would have run for the hills. I would have been like, nope, can't live through that, you know?
Empathy Through Personal Suffering
00:35:19
Speaker
But
00:35:19
Speaker
It's so interesting to me how now I look back and I think, not only has God met me, my brain goes there, that he's done there. It's been hard, but he's been there, but my brain also goes back to my past and I think, who in my life lost someone and I thought sending a card in a casserole was enough? Because I mean, it's important to send those cards to send those casseroles, but I'm telling you the people who have ministered the most to me in my grief,
00:35:50
Speaker
have been people that have gone through it that remember you know not just at like the first Mother's Day without my mom that was last year I actually did pretty good that day but it's on a random day you know when I go to the cupboard to pull out a cup of a mug to get a cup of coffee and I grab what was always her favorite mug and I lose it you know and so those people that have continued to show up in my life and
00:36:15
Speaker
Um, remember, you know, one, two, three years down the road, you know, and say, I'm thinking about you today. You know, I bet you miss your parents. How you doing? Those are the ones that mean the most to me. And it makes me just really want to be that kind of person. And like you said, looking over at the stoplight, you know, everybody's got something, everybody's going through something and we don't see it. You know, we see the person, the stoplight that come on, go Hong Kong. Cause you know, the lights turned green, get going, but we don't know what she's going through. You know?
00:36:42
Speaker
And I think if I could tell myself before going through all this grief in the last three years, and the happy things too, I could tell myself one thing, it would be what this sweet little old lady in my Sunday school class used to say when I was back in my 20s and early 30s, there was this woman that I'm telling you guys, no matter what prayer request someone gave, it could be something very dire. You know, someone had
00:37:05
Speaker
really a bad diagnosis, or you know, it could be even something that was not so bad, but whatever the circumstance was, whatever the prerequisites was, she always answered the same way. And she wasn't being flippant, although it's going to sound flippant, she would say this, she would say, well, that don't surprise God, none, let's all pray. And she wasn't being flippant. And when I think about that statement, none of this, none of what the three of us, what anybody listening
00:37:33
Speaker
has gone through, none of it surprised God any. He's not up in heaven wringing his hands, wondering how it's all going to work out. He's in control. He hasn't handled. His job is to work all of those things, those somethings that we have, all of them out according to his purpose. That's his job and our job is just to trust. That's what I would tell myself. No matter what comes ahead in the future, lies ahead. Remember, it's not surprising to God. So let's all pray.
00:38:03
Speaker
That's so good. Thank you so much. Wow. Oh, okay. We got through it girls.
Conclusion and Encouragement
00:38:10
Speaker
Oh This has been so so good and Courtney again Thank you for joining Karen and I am I would just say that watching you walk with God as you've gone through so much over these last several years has encouraged us and given us hope and we wanted our friends to be encouraged by your faith as well, so
00:38:29
Speaker
Thank you so much for sharing so candidly and sharing in this time with us. Well, friend, we are so grateful that you have joined us as we discussed learning to trust God in all the things. This is a topic we talk about a lot because it's a lifelong journey of learning to trust God through the ups and downs. And it's why Karen and I wrote our devotional, trusting God in all the things, 90 days for finding peace in your everyday.
00:38:57
Speaker
If you want daily hope as you learn to trust God and find peace or know a friend who you'd love to encourage with this devotional as a gift, you can grab a copy wherever books are sold. Again, thank you so much for joining us. We pray your heart was blessed by our time together today.
00:39:15
Speaker
Bye everybody. Thanks for joining us. Well, I wasn't kidding when I said that it was going to be a very real and raw conversation with lots of tears and just very candid. So I hope that your heart was encouraged and that you were given hope as you listened in. If you want to
00:39:37
Speaker
to continue to be encouraged and given help by trusting God in all the things. You can pick up a copy of our devotional trusting God in all the things. 90 devotions for finding peace in your everyday. You can pick that devotional up anywhere books are sold. Amazon, Barnes and Noble, christianbook.com. You can just either Google it or head to your local bookstore. But I just want to say that in this devotional,
00:40:06
Speaker
from Karen and I, we really, we get deep. And so these are short devotions to really lead you to our father, who is the only one, the only one that will give you peace in all the things.
00:40:21
Speaker
And there's a time for reflection in each devotion, a time to, it's called points to ponder. And then there is a response time called pausing to pray where we start the prayer with a prayer prompt and let you finish it for whatever is, pertains to you, whatever's going on in your life. So I hope that you'll pick up a copy of trusting God in all the things.
00:40:46
Speaker
Well, friend, I am so, so grateful that you joined us today. If we haven't met yet, we want to get to know you. So be sure to follow us on Instagram at Patrick W. Schwank and at Ruth Schwank. Don't forget.
00:41:01
Speaker
Everything we talked about will be at rootlikefaith.com forward slash podcast. And again, I just want to welcome you into our family here at root like faith. We are so, so grateful, grateful that you are here. We wanted to feel like you're in our living room hanging out with us and we are learning and growing together. So we just love, love, love that you're here with us. All right, friend. Well, we will chat soon and we hope you have the best week.