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S2 Ep51: VGBD - Bad Games
71 Plays7 years ago
Join Dave and Jake as they talk about the darker side of gaming...the games we don't like and the reasons we don't like them.
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Transcript
Chess Analogies and Personal Stories
00:00:21
Speaker
How's it going everyone? Welcome to another episode of Soapstone. My name is Jake. I'm joined by my co-host as always, Dave. How's it going, Dave?
00:00:29
Speaker
It's like it's like playing black in chess. Yeah, you know Because you always have like the first move you do the same thing every time right you push King pawns up King Kings pawn up to I'm like, all right. I have to react. Yeah, that's
00:00:45
Speaker
I don't actually know that much about chess. I know that there's a really fast way you can lose. There's like three turns or four turns or something. It's like the fastest you could possibly lose in chess. And I do know that that's how I would lose if I tried to play chess. That's about it.
00:01:04
Speaker
As a brief side thing I have legitimate like I have it in my car somewhere I think it's like slid under the passenger seat or something. Yeah But I do have a set and I do enjoy the game. I like that. It makes you think a little bit. That's what that's not you might get Pooped on an early game or two. Yeah, but I think nice fun mental challenge
00:01:25
Speaker
Chess is probably like magic and that there's a lot of depth there and it's probably like one of the best of its kind as far as like what it provides and then I'll never be able to get into it. But I do know that Magnus is the world champion forever.
00:01:46
Speaker
He's like 15 years or whatever. I think he's like 20 years old and he's been winning for the last 18 years. There's some nonsense world championships. It's insane. Look him up if you feel like it.
00:02:00
Speaker
That sounds like a dota personality. Magnus, yeah. Or like an RPG hero, right? It is I, Magnus. You know what isn't an RPG hero, though? There it is. That's not even a great transition. Bad games.
Bad Games and Appreciating the Good
00:02:16
Speaker
So today we wanted to talk about, I mean, we usually spend a lot of time talking about games we enjoy.
00:02:22
Speaker
Yeah, like literally every other episode has been yeah, we're repping something But as we're getting a little analytical if I'd be good to cover some Not so good games. Yeah, what makes them shit? Yeah, I think part of the inspiration for this is we want to identify more positive qualities of games but in order to actually
00:02:42
Speaker
Isolate those for you to know how bright the light is and we need to show you the darkest, right? We're gonna go dig into some trash cans and learn to appreciate a life for it. I guess So, yeah, we kind of just went through populated some some starter starter games here, I think a lot of people would agree have some faults
The Fallout 76 Fiasco
00:03:06
Speaker
So one of the ones I know I threw on this list really freaking early was, uh, fallout 76. What? No, which, uh, I, I feel like it's okay to enjoy the games that we're going to call bad. And in some ways I do as well. Um, like I, I actually played fallout 76 and had some fun with it for quite a long time, like a week, I guess video game time. That's not bad. Um, but I feel like this one you could.
00:03:36
Speaker
You'd have a hard time saying it's not a bad game. Yeah, it's fine to appreciate good qualities and something. Like, for example, Michael Jackson. Great singer. Yeah. But, you know, maybe you didn't always have the best life choices. Yeah. That's unsubstantiated. My bad. I guess it's liable. I don't need to be sued by the Michael Jackson estate, but Neverland, right? And that was his. Yep. Yeah.
00:04:07
Speaker
So what about Fallout 76 makes it makes it say makes it bad. So there's the first thing jumps to mind. The first thing that makes it bad is it was rushed out the gate. It was underdeveloped 100 percent. I mean, maybe not 100 percent because 100 percent would mean it's literally nothing.
00:04:24
Speaker
But it was underdeveloped 95%. Yeah. And I know like Bethesda has had a reputation for having buggy games and how it's kind of like their thing. Be like, but it's so open world and the Skyrim music. Yeah. I am the Dovahkiin. But then it just fucks up a lobby deck. That's fine.
00:04:45
Speaker
Yeah, but this from all reports I've heard and like youtubers have followed who like we're checking out this new game and making a meme video from me Just playing the game. Yeah, it was riddled, right? I think it's uh, it's maybe it's an indicator of how far you've kind of fallen as a game developer or publisher when your game is providing so much content for so many channels and
00:05:10
Speaker
Just because of how bad it is like like if you needed to make a YouTube video to appease your your patrons Around the time that this released jump on 76 like that'll get you the traffic. I don't know necessarily how we even saturated how like consumers Watched all of those follow 76 is bad videos and read all those articles Because like a lot of it was pretty much the same stuff
00:05:38
Speaker
But it was all over the place like I mean, it's the Donald Trump of video games But like there is a certain way like you're like, oh somebody fucked up because it made this shitty release But then you're like, I want to see something I want some vindication from like I want them to know that they did bad so then right sure They'll release good games. Yeah and like fix their bugs and
00:06:03
Speaker
And there's so many bugs, Jake. I think, I think part of it's also like, uh, uh, almost like a vulture syndrome where it's like, if there's a bad game and some people play it and they're like, this is a bad game and they just give it negative reviews on steam, that's not going to explode. But once like.
00:06:20
Speaker
there's so many people like like everyone pile on like to the game it becomes like self-sustaining you just got like a nuclear core on this pile people just generating heat that's a jake that's an orgy right uh but uh the the game itself was just absolutely riddled with bugs you could fall out of the world
00:06:46
Speaker
You could sorry you would you would fall out of the world Uh, most of there was this uh, the primary enemy would be these scorched Uh, which are basically like zombies essentially and they were um
00:07:01
Speaker
Until you like encountered them or attack them or they aggroed to you they detected you they would oftentimes just stand like a statue basically But like when I played that was a hundred percent bugged like almost never worked the way the game intended so they would just be like holding guns like out of their elbows or in like really weird positions and that was normal like that enemy type which was Probably like 40% of the enemies you would fight maybe more was always bugged
00:07:30
Speaker
it's like this was a launch title too and they did the whole the beta break it early thing where they were like that's the point of the beta so we can break it early and the i think everyone interpreted that as it will be broken early we will report report the things that are broken and then they'll fix and then we'll fix it right but they never explicitly said that that was just implied
00:07:56
Speaker
So, um, it was actually really interesting when the game launched. A lot of reviewers were like, we played the beta and we're not going to judge the game for that because like so much of this was probably fixed before it went gold. Hmm. And then they started playing the live version and like putting 10 hours in 15 hours in 20 hours. And then they're like, this is the same game. Like nothing's fixed.
Load Times and Player Immersion
00:08:24
Speaker
Yeah. That's, um.
00:08:28
Speaker
Not great. Yeah, that's pretty shit I think like one of the the major changes they did when they went live is they actually reduced everybody's carrying capacity Because they couldn't I think they're Their explanation for it was everybody has tonja junk as of like fallout 4 because the point was to collect junk And they move that direct system over and then they were like hold up We can't like store in our databases or whatever all of the players junk
00:08:54
Speaker
So here's a super limiting weight cap for all of your stuff. That's Again, really shitty. I feel like it should never be on the player For anything like that. Yeah, if your game cannot support The gameplay of the players especially like an online multiplayer that needs to be addressed first and foremost because I
00:09:20
Speaker
I'm sure you had dial-up growing up as I did. Right. Or maybe you were rich, I don't know. I had dial-up, yeah. I had it for a while. America Online. There it is, yep. Hello! But when you're setting all that stuff up and you have latency spikes, or you just drop connection entirely... You get a phone call. That's what it was for us.
00:09:40
Speaker
It was it's so Unimmersive. Mm-hmm. It's so jarring and it takes out of it. Yeah. Yeah It's like the full shepherds crook and like old tiny theater productions. Oh, they pull you out of stage. Yeah That's funny
00:10:00
Speaker
Cause like anytime like a game, it's not a little bit of lag or like startup time. I've complained about it. Yeah. Do you remember far cry growing up? Uh, I didn't play the original. I started with far cry three, I think no far cry to far cry to the one in Africa. I started around as I started, like I played other games. I rented from blockbuster far cry three primal.
00:10:27
Speaker
Okay. Oh, yeah. Yeah. That's a recent one. Yeah. That one came out after far cry three. They had, uh, there was, there was a controversy cause it was the same map. Yeah. But you played as like a werewolf or something else. Um, it had ridiculous load times. I was a fairly patient. I'm a fairly patient person in general until I'm in traffic. Right.
00:10:51
Speaker
But it took like two to three minutes to load a map. Yeah. On the Xbox. And you can hear like the disc frantically spinning like, where's the other memory located? And then after that, like in throughout the gameplay, it would lag and freeze up because it had the whole map. It was trying to allow me to see. Yeah. Well, I was trying to jump from point at point B and it's like, oh, fuck.
00:11:15
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, that comes up. That'll come up for another game we're going to cover. But loading times, anything that takes you out of the immersion in a game. And to be clear, your game doesn't have to be about immersion. Like there are really fun games that I'm entirely aware that I'm sitting there with a controller in my hands playing the whole time.
00:11:33
Speaker
Yeah. Um, but if you're going for one of these first person, kind of like sneaking through the grass, learning a story, ambushing your foes, like going across the narrative, going through the narrative type of games. And then you have like massive load times that encourage you to like take a break from the game, do a couple of pushups, like run outside, go to work and come back.
00:11:58
Speaker
You know, that's a sign that it's a bit too much. Load times in particular, right? Absolutely. Absolutely hate.
00:12:06
Speaker
Yeah. Like there are still some games today, whether either like I'm playing something on PS4, usually from like a digital game, not like a hard disk copy. Yeah. Or if I'm playing something online, like I, like destiny two is a good example. I'll like, Hey, I'm going to boot into the game, but like, Hey, I'm trying to boot in the game. I'm going to go take a piss and grab a beverage because I have the time.
00:12:30
Speaker
Yeah. And I don't need things to be instant. I don't need the instant gratification, but the technology exists for you to support things at that speed when people just connect and be able to play. It was worth noting for Destiny 2, they kind of subvert this as well because they allow you to do things while you're loading between areas. And that's like, holy crap, games implement this feature. One sick feature that game developers don't want you to know or something like that.
00:13:00
Speaker
That's amazing. I really enjoy that because even if I didn't have a super important thing to do between loading, I can spend a little time going through my inventory like disassemble some items or whatever. And then it's done. Yeah. Yeah. So it's like an idle hands syndrome to a degree. Yeah.
00:13:17
Speaker
But like so Something just in mind for me is a monster hunter fucking love the game gameplay is great. Mm-hmm like loading into an area or switching areas it can be like and Then and you're still waiting. Yeah, so being able to like go and modify your gear or like say hey I might be considering switching gear. What's the stat bonus of this eye patch versus something else critical hits But
00:13:44
Speaker
And blizzard does a good job of that for like overwatch. If you're setting up for a, you're ready to attack with your team, ready to push the payload.
00:13:53
Speaker
The defending team has to get from where they start to set up a defense. Yes. So you're just waiting in a room. Yeah. Which is better than, you know, waiting in a lobby. Just like we have all of our players here. What to expect. Yeah. It gets run around. You get to emote. You get to spray paint the walls or like destroy things in the room. Yeah. They subvert the whole just waiting behind the wall, you know, until you can attack.
00:14:19
Speaker
I mean a lot of people still do or browse write it or whatever, but there's things in the game to keep you occupied. Yes, and it's not a full You literally have to sit here and wait for the loading screen to resolve Which is super obnoxious especially in a game that has it a lot so like you mentioned Crap what game did you mention it was open world it was Monster Hunter
00:14:44
Speaker
I'm literally thinking of it in my brain. He'll get it. You mentioned Monster Hunter. Initial load times, kind of unfortunate. A little bit faster if you're using an SSD or something. But once you're in the actual map, they don't make you reload. And you can just hop into your tent, change your gear out if you know exactly what you want to equip, things like that.
00:15:08
Speaker
Old Monster 101, like Monster 101. Yeah. Anytime you switch between areas. So, you know, if you look at the map, you have like number, like one, two, it'll take up little sections of the map. Yeah. Those used to be separate areas every single fucking time. Gotcha. So, if you killed an enemy, like, oh, I killed my Rathalos and its tail fell over here, you might not be able to ever get to it because it was technically a different area. You'd have to go beyond the bounds of that to load into something. But the load times are also like,
00:15:38
Speaker
A good 10 to 15 seconds. I remember correctly. Yeah Yeah, I never played. I never really played the old one. So I couldn't say but yeah, I mean Monster Hunter world was I Think my my game of the year. So I mean just play that one
00:15:53
Speaker
It's just really good. But we're talking about bad games. I was like, we should just talk about Monster. I know, right? We already had that episode, though. Some other issues kind of plagued Fallout 76. On top of a lot of this, like I was saying, could be attributed to not enough time in the oven. They just did not fix a lot of the bugs.
00:16:16
Speaker
whether Bethesda ever ends up fixing the bugs, you could debate that a little bit. But theoretically, some of the critical things could have been resolved given enough time and development. And it's also kind of suffered from, I feel like, a lack of vision in what it was supposed to be. Because I honestly believe that this game exists because enough people said, I just played Skyrim and man, it would be super awesome if I could play that in co-op.
00:16:43
Speaker
Or I just played oblivion and it'd be super awesome if I could have like had a friend there is literally mod efforts There was I remember I remember there was a mod effort for oblivion to get multiplayer into the game Never finished like of course not you like you're literally taking a single player engine making a multiplayer
00:17:01
Speaker
Yeah, I feel like a lot of the strength of those titles are from the single player experience. You have to walk from point A to point B, you hear the ambient music, you kill some mud crabs along the way, but you have that character progression that you've earned throughout gameplay.
00:17:19
Speaker
Yes. And it's it's very difficult to make an immersive game, which the Fallout series has always been immersive in its own way. Even if it's breaking the fourth wall, it's in this hilarious like post-apocalyptic the world hates you kind of way that fit into Fallout.
Loot Boxes and Microtransactions
00:17:36
Speaker
But when you fall through the world, that's not entertaining in any capacity. When you lose gear, when someone's like killing your quest objective,
00:17:45
Speaker
We played with I played with my friend Ian when we were going through here and There is literally a bug Where the ultimate goal was to investigate the fate of this? This guy at the end of a quest chain without spoilers. I guess nobody cares Honestly, I don't remember because the quest in this game were not particularly engaging as a whole but once per server restart that guy spawned is a ghoul and
00:18:15
Speaker
If anyone else killed him, no one else could complete that quest unless they were there when he died, basically. And he was just in a basement somewhere. So you literally had like...
00:18:28
Speaker
like 10, 20, maybe 30 people with this quest incomplete. As soon as the servers crashed, because that is how this restarts in the 70s, you'd have an opportunity to log in. Hope you get to the basement first and kill the guy, depriving everyone else of their ability to finish the quest.
00:18:45
Speaker
It was like, it was sabotaged by the multiplayer and the bug, obviously, but, um, they really just, they took out all of these core features that we appreciated about the fallout series to like slide multiplayer in. It's like multiplayer is this giant block and you're trying to like make Jenga, right? And each of these little blocks is like.
00:19:08
Speaker
storytelling, quests, loot, frames per second, things like that. And then you're just like, let's just push that entire tower out and just slide in this single solid multiplayer Jenga block. And you're like, that's what remains.
00:19:24
Speaker
Yeah. It's a great example of something I always complain about, which is having something because like you heard it was cool or for the sake of having it. And I know I've complained for like in movies and you have your romantic relationships between like a boy and a girl who happened to be near each other. I don't give a shit. Don't put the love interest in because it tell the story you want to tell, have the characters develop how you want to develop, but don't be like, well, we got to grab this demographic.
00:19:53
Speaker
Dave, I don't think you appreciated the notebook for the right reason. That was a boring movie. But like they say, like you said, like they're going for like these tick boxes of, Oh, people really like followed as a series. Yeah. What else do people like? And you grab all these things and then you have a fucking Sonic remake, but like you're, you're missing the core material, right? You're missing the whole point of why people like something. You can't just make a Mario game and have it be good.
00:20:22
Speaker
Yeah, you have to make something like Odyssey where it's pushing the boundaries but also playing off the fucking core right that people like about people like that Mario is like fun and light-hearted but has some interesting mechanics and like they're pushing good gameplay and fun experience rather than just
00:20:39
Speaker
We'll have Mario And it'll shoot people be Mario Mario FPS Mario with a gun Yeah, no, it's kind of like you're going through a ritual to develop the game. You're like, all right, we got to put in blood We got to put in sweat, you know, we're like putting in long nights things like that. Oh
00:20:55
Speaker
And you get the, to the end of your recipe of this ritual. And the last one is like, and then the soul of the game must be sacrificed. You know, like, hold up. I should have read this before. Like maybe I would have picked a different ritual to develop a game. I didn't have to sacrifice the soul. I also don't want to give them too much credit because they obviously wanted to make this a game as a service with blue boxes. Like that's, it was, it was a platform for microtransactions, which they knew works in multiplayer.
00:21:25
Speaker
Another good thing to talk about for more recent stuff that also kind of detracts from gameplay is when you have ways to buy things in game rather than just like earn it over time. Like I remember back in the old days of Diablo 2, before people knew about all the possible hacks that you could exploit.
00:21:46
Speaker
They're like stone of Jordan became a currency currency. Yeah Back when like duplicating was a thing, but it was like a rare item and it dropped over time It felt really fucking cool to get something. Yeah, cuz you're like I've spent X amount of time playing this game and the game has rewarded me the heavens have bestowed upon me this magical item Yes, how cool is that? Yeah
00:22:09
Speaker
But nowadays, it seems like, did you want blue so-and-so? Here, gamble on this dumb shit. I hope you can get it. And I understand cosmetics in games, for sure. You've seen me play Dota 2. I sell for money in that game.
00:22:29
Speaker
It is just an open wallet like leading into their the game noels pockets. He's just got a siphon He just he's got a vacuum cleaner just follows around behind you up to here your pants, but I still think some of that stuff is better and More well managed and other things. Yeah, like blizzard. I think does an okay job versus something like I know like Mortal Kombat was a more recent one or there's some other ones where it's just
00:22:52
Speaker
Battle waterfront to yes. Yeah, exactly. They actually absorb it and shit They were so egregious with it that they may have impacted policy in the US. Yeah, like they were introducing the a Measure, I don't know the specifics of it, but basically to prevent access to loot boxes for children to prevent them from gambling
00:23:17
Speaker
So I don't know the specifics and whether that would ever have any effectiveness. My guess is no, because how could they ever make it like actually effective? But I feel like that that spawned largely out of a battlefront. And I mean, people went to Disney directly with that and were like, hey, what a look at what he is doing with Star Wars. You guys are Disney, right? Like Disney doesn't like that so much.
00:23:44
Speaker
But yeah, it's just another piece of the poop pie that became Fallout 76. And I love the series. I even enjoyed Fallout 4 a lot, which I have problems with. A lot of other people have problems with. But this is like...
00:24:03
Speaker
You can only get beat with a stick so many times before you're like, I should move away from the location where I'm receiving the beatings. Yeah. And that's what fall 76 is for me. By the way, I don't want to tell you in front of the other guys, but that is why I stopped attending Fight Club. First rule of Fight Club is you have to fight and it's just like you with your fist and everybody else has sticks.
00:24:30
Speaker
I'm just imagine that's actually not the first rule of Fight Club. You literally broke the first rule of Fight Club Right. I will you did well, I guess you did first. Yes. I just want to correct the rule number I guess. Yeah. No, you're right Apologies, was it was it the third rule of Fight Club as you had to fight? Because the second rule was also the first rule. Yes It was a tricky redirect as a little go-to line. Oh
00:24:53
Speaker
Yeah. Um, but those are some very like glaring examples. Cause I think if you ask anybody if they would rather have or have not for lag, yes, or like really long load times and interruptions in gameplay, bugs and microtransactions, people are like, probably not for me. Yeah. And like, look at even.
00:25:16
Speaker
Let's say five years back, I feel like it was less prevalent and a lot of things were more self-contained. Yeah. Even if they weren't necessarily great games, because a lot of stuff we grew up on was like early console era, not like Nintendo as much for me, but like PS2 and Xbox and GameCube was all, I feel like that was part of our heyday.
00:25:40
Speaker
Yeah. And there was, you go back just a little ways and like DLC barely existed. You gotta think like Horse Armor for Oblivion was like one of the first DLC and people absolutely hated it and rightly so. And eventually Bethesda like actually came back and made fun of themselves for it. They're just like, oh yeah, Horse Armor for Fallout 4 and like the workshop and stuff.
00:26:00
Speaker
People are like, it doesn't work if you're also actually selling garbage at the same time as you're joking about selling garbage. You don't get that rep. But yeah, I mean, we moved away from complete gain at launch as a model in a lot of cases.
00:26:23
Speaker
Hear me out. I still like Hades. Yeah. There's some things that can still be built upon. Yes. As long as it's built upon in a way where the consumer does not feel like they're being taken advantage of. Like she was like, Hey, we have a new patch. It's like, that would be another $10. You're like, why didn't you just make this game? Yeah.
00:26:42
Speaker
I think a lot of it comes down to trust. Trust from the consumer, in the developer, in the publisher. We've had, as an industry, a lot of trust in developers and publishers. And that's why there's been so many pushes like Steam Greenlight, Early Access.
Early Access Games: A Double-Edged Sword
00:27:02
Speaker
Obviously, Early Access is still exploding a lot. But at the same time, it's also kind of
00:27:11
Speaker
burned itself a lot so that people are more selective about what they go in on for early access I want to believe I want to believe and like Hades you could compare it to like say Kickstarter
00:27:26
Speaker
If it was just like put 20 bucks in, get Hades once it's done. You may or may not go for that, but you're objectively getting more value right now to be able to play Hades right now as a playable game than if you had to wait until it was 100% done to play it. Right. Yeah. So, and I don't know if I would play and played it.
00:27:48
Speaker
I probably still would have if they had all the content. But it's been nice to go iteratively and be like, oh, what's new? What do they add to it? What more fun will I have as he gleefully rattles his fingers together? Hee hee hee. And there's plenty of games that fall on the bad side of early access. Like taking it back to bad games? Oh, I'm sorry. Did you say Steam Greenlight and early access? Yeah. Yeah. This is a C you have to wade through, essentially, if you want to find gems of early access.
00:28:17
Speaker
and yeah there's just there's a lot a lot of mixed games on Steam I remember like you go back a couple years and honestly there weren't that many games on Steam that would have had a bad rating I think
00:28:32
Speaker
around the time Greenlight and Early Access started launching is when they had their own ratings on Steam. But Metacritic's been around for like a long time now. And there just weren't that many absolutely terrible games on Steam. Now there's a lot of mostly negative games. Like you could search for them and be like, this is significant. If there weren't any reviews, maybe I would fall for this for a dollar.
00:28:57
Speaker
Right. So you keep saying that there are these extremely bad games on green light and early access. I'm not denying that because I've been on a computer in my life. Right. But I was going to ask, what do you think makes them so bad? Is it just a lack of quality? Yeah. Is it a lack of vision? What comprises them being poor?
00:29:19
Speaker
I think it depends on where you would fall. If we were to use Steam reviews as the metric, mostly negative games are games that have had development completely abandoned, in which case it's just basically you give your money and it vanishes and you get almost nothing.
00:29:36
Speaker
with no actual hope of ever seeing a product. You've got like negative, which is like, actually I guess that would be, is it negative, mostly negative? Yeah, negative, mostly negative. Negative you basically almost never see. Mostly negative. And then you have mixed, I believe, is next.
00:29:57
Speaker
which is like a lot of games that have a spark of a good idea or a few cool systems but development's been abandoned so you kind of have to take the game exactly as it is or in some cases the game launched to early access really too early and it's not really playable
00:30:20
Speaker
And you're still hoping that someday it's good? Those games. We're not talking about 76 anymore. Yeah, I know, right? It would, it would have been, it would have been mostly negative, I think. Maybe mixed. So it sounds like for you, a lot of your issues with games are having a lack of content.
00:30:38
Speaker
Yeah, or being incomplete Yeah, I think incomplete is probably a better way to phrase it because they might have all the content that they intended But it might be missing some je ne sais quoi. Yeah, or I don't know what that means. But yeah Just equality. I think is French for us a certain little something. Ah, okay a little bit of something that makes it special jazz hands. Yes
00:31:01
Speaker
Yeah. As he hits the mic. Yeah. Because like for me, if in this day and age, graphics are like bad, bad. Yeah. It takes away. It depends on the game for me, but it definitely can.
00:31:20
Speaker
So I'm saying is somebody like in today's era made metal gear one. Yeah. I tell them to go fuck them. Cause it's, it's too far back and you're, they're not doing anything with it. Right. It just.
00:31:35
Speaker
I don't know. It's for me, a lot of video games, I always say should be like a visual novel. Yeah. So you're like visual novel video game. I don't want to clarify that. No, it's more of it needs to look a certain way to get you into the video game. Right. Otherwise you're just kind of.
00:31:57
Speaker
You're the input and that's it. I press the buttons to do the thing to make the thing go. Yeah. We've moved away since our Atari, right? Where it's like, I am these pixels. Those pixels are the bad pixels. I think I'm those pixels. Yeah. So it sounds like for you, a major thing is a lack of content or incompleteness in a game. Yeah.
00:32:23
Speaker
or value. Value is also another big factor for me. We were talking about microtransactions and kind of like, we've talked about it in the past, but nickel and diming the consumer. If the transactions themselves detract from the overall experience of the game, because I feel like I'm missing out on content, I'm going to take points off. That impacts me immediately.
00:32:49
Speaker
So it needs to be a good ratio of your investment in it and the payout. Yeah. And like, I can, I can deal with lack of polish if a game has features that I really love because I play like a bunch of broken games.
00:33:07
Speaker
or games that have a lot of issues, if they have something to keep me coming back. Well, it's fun at that point, right? Yeah. It has to be engaging enough for you to overlook any type of issue. Exactly. I'd have good examples of that. Play like the X series of Space Simulators. These games are notoriously bad at launch.
00:33:30
Speaker
Like there's their stories of like how bad these games are like crash constantly the last one came out I think is x4 The economy and the galaxy was actually stagnant so like it's supposed to be dynamic, but there was a bug so it was stagnant and Everything would just trend toward boredom essentially
00:33:57
Speaker
It's hard to kind of like describe, but it's supposed to be this living warfare kind of game where like the aliens will come up and invade these systems and build system like stations and things. But like all of the other starter races were like way too strong.
00:34:14
Speaker
So they would just like destroy the threat immediately like it would never never reach the inner systems And you're just like well that kind of sucks that that bullet point on the box doesn't mean anything And that's something that's something I hate if you say that your game supports X if that it's a major system, and then that just straight-up doesn't work like Yeah, I'm gonna back out. I'm gonna back away from that
00:34:43
Speaker
That fault that you could file that under incompleteness. So It's like a shitty tinder profile. It's like I'm really good with cars. And if I ask you for help the car you're like, what's a car? Hold up Yeah Like I've definitely had some of the opposite over time Where I spent very little on something and I play it way too much. Yeah, like binding of Isaac Oh, yeah, but again that goes back to I think it's a closed system. I
00:35:13
Speaker
It still adds content without charging me extra money. The music is good, the gameplay is good. The one thing that pisses me off about a lot of video games, which I do not think Isaac suffers from, or games like Mega MinX, is tight controls. I need to have tight controls. If I am inputting to do X, Y, or Z,
00:35:33
Speaker
It better fucking do X, Y, or Z. Because if it doesn't, I feel like I've been cheated out of something. So if I'm playing Jake and Smash and I press a button, I'm expecting it to do a thing. And if it doesn't, I don't feel like Jake beat me as much as my controller sucks or the game's broken. I can't admit defeat. Dave's playing with the mad cats over here.
00:35:59
Speaker
I feel like a lot of that comes down to latency. I can't think of any like recent titles that I've played in.
00:36:07
Speaker
Like I have max box for 60 control on the PC. I'm playing something and there's shitty input. Yeah. The requirement, I feel like as an industry controls and responsiveness have gotten better over time. There's definitely going to be examples out there. There's somewhere like doesn't really matter, but for the games where it seems to matter, I think people, people overall do it better now.
00:36:30
Speaker
Yeah. Um, I mean, a lot of the issues would probably be highlighted in like steam green light or early acts or somebody who's like, I'm learning to make a game using some engine, but it lacks so many of those other things where they're like, we did some very basic things.
00:36:47
Speaker
But then everything kind of breaks at the same time. I actually thought of an example. Slap City, which is a game we previously covered. I was thinking about it earlier this week, yeah. Its controls actually are not nearly as tight as Smash. No. And it's, I mean, like, clearly it doesn't have the budget of Sakurai, right? Like, so you pass over it, but...
00:37:07
Speaker
If you stop and you think about it, like I just died because like input was weird or something or like the frames just don't feel good. Yeah. Like that game had a lot more of that than Smash does. Yeah. But it was also borderline enjoyable enough for me to overlook it. Yeah. Good portion of the time.
00:37:27
Speaker
But a lot of times like I felt like I could not get through a certain character that you were playing because my options were limited and then like me having to input them at the same time was like, yeah, yeah.
00:37:39
Speaker
Yeah, no, it's it didn't feel as good and it can be important for some of these games. And if your game has action as one of its operative words in its genre, you should have good controls. Yeah. Like any type of FPS, like if you left click, yeah, shoot. If you press a button or feel like a grenade, it goes out.
00:37:59
Speaker
Right. If you're playing Call of Duty, you can unbind left click. Just hit V. Just commando, hit V. You're good. Just pull on knife. I guess a lot of people, I guess at one point, I bounded that to mouse too, because I mean, you're playing commando. You're not playing Call of Duty. It's like when you're that one guy in a Halo 2, he's like, I know what the sword is on this map, and you just get it. You're like, shing, shing. That's just no guns.
00:38:28
Speaker
Got him. Oh, man. All right. I need to pause and look at the list. I was actually going to talk about Call of Duty because we just we just mentioned it. All right. And what you got? This one's more controversial because a lot of people and to a certain extent, myself included, actually enjoy Call of Duty.
00:38:45
Speaker
But the reason I would can personally consider a bad game ish with like much asterisks is because they Refuse to innovate in the end the series. It's always the same Game that hits the same buttons and it never really feels You always feel like you could go back to Call of Duty 4 or 2 and have as much fun and
00:39:10
Speaker
Yeah. Um, or just modern warfare too. Yeah. It was like my college sweet spot. Yeah. I get you saying though. Um, I don't think it necessarily makes it bad in the same way you have like FIFA or NBA or Madden or forza. Like a lot of those things, it's the same formula. I don't personally enjoy those games, but I don't think it makes them bad games because I don't enjoy them, enjoy the format.
00:39:38
Speaker
I would take the counter opinion and say, I think they're bad games because I don't enjoy it. I'm just, I'm just kidding. It doesn't seem like I can appreciate certain horror films are probably good horror films. Yeah. I just can't watch scary things. That's just nothing I enjoy.
00:39:53
Speaker
But I would argue in the case of, so Call of Duty is a very iterative series with low vertical innovation, I would say.
Critiques of Popular Game Franchises
00:40:03
Speaker
So like, I feel like to be fair with the way that I believe games should be reviewed, every Call of Duty that doesn't add something to the series,
00:40:12
Speaker
Like meaningful should get a lower score than the previous. Like, like the first time that call of duty four came out and it's like, Oh my gosh, like this is amazing. We've got like all these, these, uh, there was literally a full conversion mod for star Wars and people were messing around with it and it was freaking awesome. And it had like a purity to like some of the kill streaks and it was just crazy. And then.
00:40:39
Speaker
Very very very minor kind of improvements on top of that where they're just trying to cash into that yearly those yearly cod bucks and I feel like they should they should fall off until you're just giving it irrationally low reviews Because yeah, it doesn't need to exist
00:41:00
Speaker
That's true. I'm trying to think of a counter example of something like Final Fantasy. That's something that's consistently built over time. It's not always like the exact same format, typically an RPG, but like going from 14 to 15, that's my little Final Fantasy joke. 15 was fun, but I had some issues.
00:41:24
Speaker
14 you could play with thousands of your friends in 15. It's a solo game. So zero out of ten. What have you done? The whole game is with my friends car ride across the country The people have gripes with us because they stripped out so much of the identity. Yeah of what freedom Final Fantasy kind of provided for you in the past
00:41:45
Speaker
Yeah. So I do think sequels do need to, as you put, be iterative. They need to build on the existing thing. Otherwise, if you're just asset swapping, like, well, it's not these characters, it's these characters and some other obvious trope story. Yeah. It doesn't really engage me. Yeah. Because I feel Jay, because I've played like so many games over time. I've ingested so much media. Yeah. Watch a lot of TV and movies and like,
00:42:13
Speaker
You want something fresh Fresh like a kill. Oh, yeah but It's amazing to play a game that you listen in a genre that you haven't experienced for a while. It is also a Exemplary of what that genre should be because you're just like, ooh This is nice. Like this is this is actually pretty fun and sometimes it's sometimes you can lose the fun and
00:42:39
Speaker
Games, especially if you're hopelessly addicted to them like I am you're just like I'm gonna be playing games no matter what whether you enjoy it or not but Sometimes you find something that really just absolutely stands out and I don't think you know Admittedly, I have not played the most recent Call of Duty, but I don't think that it has that spark wildly different from previous titles. Yeah, I
00:43:05
Speaker
Yeah, I really, if the multiplayer feel is still engaging and irritating, then I think that it's the same. I'd say that's pretty fair. Yeah. So it's important to, it's important to innovate. Always strive for something better and don't, don't always play it safe. Cause that's definitely what they do. A good example of something around this topic, which is also on the list.
00:43:35
Speaker
It's fucking mighty number nine. Oh, yeah Mega Man a series that I give a shit about Because it's just it's cool. That's really my only descriptive word there and I grew up with it. So I was talking about it Like they changed the art style the music the whole feel yeah, and it's just it's bad all around So much so that like I played it for like an hour was hopelessly depressed pre-authored it like
00:44:03
Speaker
Because I think it was the guy who had originally done Mega Man things, he was like, hey, I'm going to go do my own thing away from Capcom. We're like, oh, thank God. Because Capcom recently has had some some weird Mega Man titles. Capcom has weird titles in general at this point. That's very safe to say.
00:44:25
Speaker
But then it was so far off of the core material that I like, I gave a shit about. Yeah. And it changed the gameplay as well. And I just, it fucking nuked the whole thing for me. Yeah. It's, I know a lot of people felt similarly because refunds are real. Yeah. That, that game was not very well received.
00:44:46
Speaker
So that's an example of where they they might have tried to innovate but they lost the core feel they lost the identity of The series they were building off of yeah, it's like Eminem. I'll listen to your country album because I like you as an artist Like you don't necessarily want them to go back to the roots but you want them to
00:45:10
Speaker
Okay, let's use JonTron as an example. Okay, that's a good example. I like old JonTron. Right. A lot of classic things, a lot of classic memes and jokes. Old JonTron was better. Which is a good new JonTron joke. Exactly.
00:45:24
Speaker
And like, he still does stuff and it's not gaming oriented, but I still enjoy the content that he's making. Right. He's a different direction. Yes. I understand. Like there's a budget now. Yeah. I'm not here to defend him. I'm just saying like, I enjoy that his content has changed for sure. Yeah. In a different direction, but I still, it still has the core JonTronness to me.
00:45:49
Speaker
Yes. And that's what I appreciate about it. It's kind of like a sketch show, essentially based around whatever content he's covering for the week. Yeah. I think that's entirely fair. I still enjoy watching JonTron. Is it going to ever compare with the Halloween videos and ClockTowel? Maybe not, but it's still perfectly entertaining.
00:46:17
Speaker
Do you have an example of a game where they experimented that wildly went off of what the goal was? Besides 76. Yeah, besides 76. Yeah, that was kind of like a mad scientist experiment. While you're thinking, I will say like Mega Man X Command Mission was definitely
00:46:37
Speaker
Different in the Mega Man space But for how little I played it It was actually pretty fun. Yeah, cuz it's like is a very simple RPG, but it had a Mega Man stuff Yeah, I was like, all right. Okay, good shot. I like it
00:46:52
Speaker
I think that, I'm looking at our list now, so don't give me full credit for this. I can go in two directions here. I think I'll go with Metal Gear Survive, actually, at this point. Because Metal Gear, as a series, I mean, most of what I know about, I know about from the wiki, and MGS5, and obviously the best title, Revengeance,
00:47:19
Speaker
But in fact you did not say snake eater in that sense hurts me. I never played it unfortunately, but Jake I have a ps2 and three I I think at one point I had your ps2 that would have been my option When we were borrowing it I think for a while for devil may cry and it wasn't used for that anyway Yeah, I know ended up getting it on steam, but um
00:47:42
Speaker
Yeah, Metal Gear Survive. Metal Gear 5 was a massive departure for the series. Obviously, it's like the first really open world entry. They played around with a lot of the things that make games like Breath of the Wild really good.
00:48:00
Speaker
also we're kind of present in MGS 5 and by that I mean try a thing and the outcome is hilarious and if it's unpredictable it's unpredictable in an entertaining way yes and sometimes you just have a really good idea and it just works out like you strap c4 to a guy's jeep he drives into a village you detonate c4 and you're like mission complete we're done
00:48:24
Speaker
Um, or like Dunkey's video where he had tons of fake snake decoys. Yeah. Kept waiting, huh? All of that. And the guy had the, the enemy had absolutely no idea who like the real snake was just losing his mind. That's awesome. And that's an innovative and like pretty big departure for the series. Um, I mean, it's always had some weird humor and MGS it's, it's a very unique game for sure.
00:48:54
Speaker
Yeah. And then survive comes out, you know, and just, I don't know. Like it's, it's bad. Well, yeah, it was.
00:49:07
Speaker
So at least for Metal Gear 5, it still had a lot of core. It still felt like you were playing Snake in any other game. You just had more options to do things. And it had a lot of personality to it. You're like, nice. I'm going to play this theme when my chopper swings into the mission. He'll be badass. And then I'll run off with my wolf and we'll stab things together. And it survives like, but what if?
00:49:34
Speaker
you leveled up over time by stabbing zombies and it was the most if if you needed like hey think about a game over the weekend we need to yes have an idea by monday uh-huh this takes you two seconds yeah because it's just like well fight off horde of zombies has that been done yeah right and then it's like they used old focus test data from like five years ago and then they made a game based off of that
00:50:00
Speaker
So that's outside of the Metal Gear Solid space. Yeah. The gameplay is entirely different. They don't really have the characters at all from the Metal Gear series. They just kind of, hey, we have the rights to this engine. Yeah. And this stuff. So here you go. Give us that money. Give us those sweet, sweet save slot books. Also, I'm going to file that under bed. Yeah. Charging people for save slots.
00:50:28
Speaker
It's it's just one of those like At this point like hilariously egregious because That's never been done. Yeah, who the fuck would pay money to be able to save their game an additional time It's really innovation and evil
00:50:43
Speaker
Like Final Fantasy 7, how many save slots do you have? I have no idea. Like 99. Oh, that's right. Yeah, cuz there's the full kind of RPG maker list. What's if you have three, but then you could keep scrolling down. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And I think it was 90 or close to. It was pretty crazy.
00:50:59
Speaker
You would never fucking do it. Yeah, you would run out of like a memory card space before you're in this latest saves lots But it's nice that they tried yeah But yeah, I mean they they sacrificed the core identity of the games they Abandoned the plot that people cared about a lot of people at this point like we're really invested in Metal Gear's plot you could you could actually even say
00:51:25
Speaker
Like the latter half of five is a bad game. And I think few people would argue. Yeah. And to describe your example a little more in detail, Metal Gear Solid 5 was very open world and awesome. You got through a lot of cool things. Yeah. Take over encampments. Play how you wanted to play. Hook people up to balloons. Oh my god. Volden. Yeah. Extraction kit. But then like the later half, just kind of like with Fort Final Fantasy 15, sorry.
00:51:53
Speaker
It's already very open world kind of cool approach how you want and then it's like hey we have to do this story thing So they just made the game super fucking linear. Yeah, and that was it That was it. They just completely restricted. They put the the choker on your gameplay and they're like no mas. Yeah
00:52:11
Speaker
And you could tell that this is rushed development also for five because they're like, Oh, you want to do the next story mission? I'm going to need you to clear like five side missions, just run those. And then I think at one point they had you redo harder versions of previous missions to unlock the next.
00:52:30
Speaker
normal difficulty story mission it's it was it just kind of reeked of Rush and the fact that there was supposed to be like another chapter and there's literally like the cutscene and the game files for another chapter That kind of tells the story right like yeah
00:52:49
Speaker
And I mean that you can file all of that under bad game, but the mechanics, which were developed, you know, clearly much earlier in development because it is good and shows up through the entire game. Like made it worth finishing, right? Like for, in my opinion, it made it worth finishing. I have no regrets about that game whatsoever. Yeah. And I have no, like, I still consider it to have issues the same way 15 did.
00:53:13
Speaker
Yeah. Sometimes I'm just like, man, I'd like make a new save game, do some research, get the research going, uh, fill out the staff at mother base. Like it's just a lot of cool. Innovative ideas and systems and mechanics that just carry that game so far for me. Like I just wasted time collecting tanks and perfect soldiers when the game was just like, you should do like main story stuff at some point. Like, hold on.
00:53:45
Speaker
Gotta fill up the zoo. Yeah, or like just really stupid stuff. I've already mentioned I like farming in games Yeah, this game scratch that it's perfectly because it's like hey if you can go you can start a mission Go collect a bunch of soldiers randomly generated stats, whatever find the best one collect them grab a couple tanks and
00:54:06
Speaker
Maybe grab some oil containers because you really need that back at Mother Race. Hit a checkpoint and then quit. Just like quit out to like leave the mission and you say you keep everything that you collected. And then just do it again. Other people, that would be super boring gameplay for me. I'm like, this is satisfying. Well, you're always looking to, uh, gain the system in a way. You're looking to try and min max, find the most efficient ways to do things. Exactly. Yeah. I think that just.
00:54:37
Speaker
That's you? Yes. It's not a bad thing, but a good example is like Monster Hunter. Right. You could go between like mining nodes and they'd refresh like every X minutes. But you have like this route. Yes, I did have routes. But in that way, I think that's a good game design thing. Yeah.
00:54:53
Speaker
Because you can stay in there and just kind of explore without going on a specific mission. You're like, hey, maybe I need resources. And you can actually just go and do that. Yeah. Whereas other games might limit you in some way where you have to either log back in every day, try and wait for a bonus or try and grind something out. Yeah. It's nice that it doesn't force you to do that. It's got different play styles for people to diversify on, which is... Yes. Secura. That's pretty good. Yeah.
00:55:21
Speaker
Sakura's belongs in no place in the bad games list I know a lot of people Did complain that it did not have like other from soft titles various ways to Power character or do something. Yeah, that's fair. I think we talked about that a little bit a little bit. I
00:55:41
Speaker
But, I mean, that's part of their vision for it, was we will have a very difficult game and there will be a limit to how much you can prepare for a fight. You can prepare. And that'll make it a fight easier, but our intention is that it's difficult.
00:56:11
Speaker
Which is fine. Difficulties, it's own metric in a way. Yeah. I feel like if you try and make things, again, if you do something for the sake of doing something, if you make it difficult, just because you're like, my game is challenging. Right. Yeah. It's not good. Or it's like Cuphead, very challenging game, but everybody loves it. Right.
00:56:33
Speaker
Except some reviewers, but yeah. If you could get through the tutorial you made. It has a lot of good things about it, though. Yeah. But there are other games that I feel kind of just really shotgun, like, hey, we want to try and hit all buttons possible. Yeah.
00:56:49
Speaker
Which is like the spread very thin Mm-hmm instead of focusing on one thing Jack of all trades master of none I'm just imagining like someone's like what what kind of demographics do you think we should target for this game? and then they have like a pie chart and there's just like male gamers and power gamers and like female gamers and all this and someone's marketing person just like takes a Marker just circles the entire thing they start on the Sharpie on the wall, but like from outside the business room
00:57:17
Speaker
and castmate the whole building. Yeah. Yeah. I guess it's Tetris. All right. We're making Tetris. I feel like a way out is a really good example of this. That was the the two person. Yeah. It's like a co-op thing. And you are like two guys breaking out of prison and then like some other stuff. And it's meant to be like this whole cool story. And like it has some cool aspects. Yeah, I guess. But it's a lot of
00:57:46
Speaker
pretty basic mechanics, what I would argue are very tedious objectives, or like button mashy for like, you gotta lift the gate type sequences or other things like that. And it's just...
00:58:00
Speaker
It's not interesting to me. It seems like they just went wide and not deep. Yeah. And I don't know what the fuck it's supposed to be about. As a pet peeve, the mass button mash, like mash as fast as you possibly can. Quicktime events are like my least favorite thing now.
00:58:18
Speaker
Because it's not actually mashed as hard as you possibly can. Yeah, it's like, it's speed and then it also just makes my hands tired. Why would my hands want to be tired? Like, why would I want my hands to be tired when I'm playing a game with a controller? You know? Yeah. That's bad.
00:58:33
Speaker
All right. Let's extend that to quick time events real quick. Okay. Yeah. I don't like quick time events. I think they, they can be all right, but it depends. But so like, let's say Sekiro, right? Yeah. It's using an in-game mechanic through a kind of scripted sequence to stab the snake in the eye when you get a palanquin spoilers. Right. There are a lot of games where nobody knows what a palanquin is. You're right. Um,
00:59:02
Speaker
But yeah, the game is just making you...
00:59:06
Speaker
Do it for the sake of doing it. And if you fuck up, then like you, you lose the cut scene. Yeah. No, if you're going to show me something, show me if something, if you're gonna have me interact, have me interact. Like I like in God of war, you can get like a killing blow. You have to do like a separate interaction. Awesome. Great. Let's do that. Make it cinematic. Yeah. But don't fucking give me action. Like when I'm doing basic shit, like washing my hands and like, yes, I dropped the razor blade that I was also shaving with. I don't know.
00:59:35
Speaker
Did you ever play, uh, Fahrenheit? It's not Fahrenheit. It was, um, indigo process, indigo prophecy slash. No, I've heard you talk about this game more than once. This is a game that is entirely comprised of quick time events forever. You were literally talking about the shaver thing. Yeah. That's, that's this game, like open, covered, like take out pill bottle, clothes covered, open pill bottle, all with different modes of like.
01:00:04
Speaker
like uh move the mouse in like a left semicircle or drag it to the left or shake it up and down like the entire game was that that is a bad game it was it was not great i have not played that game that sounds like
01:00:21
Speaker
shit to me the problem the problem i think with quick time events in some cases and and this is actually um i think of a really egregious example i mentioned but uh it's not an alternative to gameplay you shouldn't use it as an alternative to gameplay you should only use quick time events
01:00:38
Speaker
if it enhances the player's engagement in the moment. Yes. And it makes them feel awesome. Quick spoilers for like end of not God of War, the latest PlayStation game, but I think it's God of War 2.
01:00:55
Speaker
I'm not going to correct it because I don't know. Yeah, anyways, it's a PlayStation 2 one, I think, or three. There's a point at the end where Kratos is literally smashing Zeus' face in. And that is a mash, like, as fast as you can thing. But it's not one you can lose. It's not like you're just gonna, I mean, you might be able to if you literally stop hitting the button forever.
01:01:13
Speaker
but you can just mash as fast as you want and you like obliterate his freaking face like entirely ceases to have a face and In the moment that is amplified for the player because they feel this sense of vindictiveness for everything Kratos has gone through and that allows them to tap into this kind of brutality of the main character and
01:01:38
Speaker
Bad example of a quick time event taking it to bad games and I might get a little bit of flack for this but Resident Evil 5 uh, yep, I heard about this I Absolutely hate the quick time events in that game and one in particular is burned into my memory um where you can be attacked by a man on a motorcycle who has like a chain blade behind him and it's just a cut scene with chris and cheva and
01:02:05
Speaker
I don't know about other people but normally when a cutscene happens in a game I put down my controller and I pick up my bag of chips for daily caloric intake and Not always literally but sometimes literally and this game doesn't let you do that because it'll have like a very short quick time event of like a few seconds or a second and a half or something like that maybe two seconds and
01:02:30
Speaker
and you can just completely fail it if you didn't have the controller in your hand and Die and have to redo that quick time event sequence Or if you hit the wrong button because you just picked up your controller you instantly fail And you die. Yeah, and then they do this in co-op. So two people have to hit buttons Maybe not at the same time but in the same cutscene or both people after you do it
01:02:58
Speaker
That's that's bad. That's that doesn't make people feel like they're working together That just makes people frustrated Yeah, I really don't like also that's like repeating content. Yes. Yeah It's like if you came into my party like hey, what's up? You can't the stairs and like really that's how you're gonna have your back positioned Yeah, you're gonna get yourself scoliosis. I'm like go do it again
01:03:23
Speaker
And no one feels like they're a better gamer. Like, Oh man, I was such a skilled gamer that at that motorcycle scene, I hit X when it told me to hit X and I didn't lose. High fives all around the crowd claps for you. Good job. You pro gamer you know, you're just like, I died. And then I rewatch the cut scene and I didn't die. Move forward. Yeah.
01:03:48
Speaker
I'm a little vindictive about that one. What's fair? Like those things that are really bad will really stand out for you because of such a negative experience that you associate with the game. Yeah. And it feels, it feels really crappy to like in co-op to like set somebody else, somebody else back. Cause you're like, ah, crap. Sorry. I didn't have my controller in my hand to press X. So we got to watch that one again. Don't do that.
01:04:14
Speaker
other things in that game good. That bad.
01:04:21
Speaker
Yeah, I think it's like we're at about time-ish. Yeah, I think that's pretty comprehensive. I think we've covered every single bad game, every bad game, every bad thing, every bad game. If your game has some of these aspects that we've called out as bad, change that before you launch, if you can, unless the thing that was bad about your game was because it was pushed out of development fast, in which case you're screwed. Good luck.
01:04:46
Speaker
Um, and hopefully at the end of it, you know, you don't end up with all of your cartridges in a landfill in New Mexico and you crash the game market. So that's also bad. ET. Yeah. I should know this.
01:05:06
Speaker
All right, well, I would like to thank everyone for listening to another episode of Soapstone. As always, you can reach us at facebook.com slash soapstone podcast. We're happy to hear from you there. You can also send in your feedback directly to soap some podcast at gmail.com.
01:05:23
Speaker
Have to think about that. I know it was like it was it's not it's not hotmail It's not Another type of mail. It's a gmail. Yeah, so gmail.com and We look forward to hearing from you. So we'll see you in the next one. Bye