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GenAI, Creeps in Roblox, and Learning Forgiveness for MGS5
19 Plays8 days ago
Join Dave and Jake as they talk about the ethics (and lack thereof) of using Generative AI in video games, the need to better protect kids in Roblox, how David Hayter is making us all better people, and even more in this week's episode!
Intro:
- Cult of the Lamb - Saviour
Outro:
- Cult of the Lamb - Enlightenment
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Transcript
Introduction and Energy Levels
00:00:30
Speaker
it going everyone? Welcome to another episode of Soapstone. My name is Jake and I am joined by my co-host as always Dave. How's it going today Dave?
00:00:39
Speaker
I'm so tired. How are you? I'm pretty awake but that is due to the modern marvel that is caffeine with no drawbacks.
00:00:49
Speaker
Well, that is unfortunately the exact boat I'm in, but I don't have caffeine. um I'll pray i ran out and then right i just haven't gone to the store if for that. That's fair.
00:01:03
Speaker
Yeah, there was
Caffeine Consumption and Costs
00:01:04
Speaker
a... This week was like a little bit spicy for... um sleep which is to say i didn't get like that much of it so i try to tailor my caffeine intake based off of the desperation of the situation right nice casual morning you're awake on time everything's going all right can make coffee right that is the more enjoyable form of caffeine for me desperation barely hanging on need to make it through the day energy drink um
00:01:35
Speaker
So we started with like a full pack, ah I don't know, six pack, probably energy, eight pack of energy drinks, um probably around the weekend or whatever. About towards the end of the week, um my wife mentioned, hey, we have more of those showing up.
00:01:50
Speaker
I'm like, good, because they've actually run out. That's that's perfect. um But i mean, it's the convenience factor, too, because like, well, I do appreciate a nice coffee and taking my time.
00:02:04
Speaker
If I can just reach in the fridge and grab something that's already caffeinated, carbonated. All right. It's faster. It is. but I just wish that they were cheaper. Yes.
00:02:18
Speaker
I mean, I know like with inflation and tariffs and everything, but like I remember, i don't want to do the old man thing. Back in my day. Also, ah for any convenience, like going to a gas station, it's also obviously going to be marked up versus a grocery store.
00:02:34
Speaker
But like all those things together, I'm like, why is this thing so many dollars? And then it's only going to last me this long. Yeah.
Currency Critique: Pennies vs. Digital Money
00:02:44
Speaker
I'm talking about like the big monster can. Some of the smaller ones are still going for like three 50 to four bucks. It's pretty crazy.
00:02:51
Speaker
Yeah. Back in my day, everything was a buck. Oh, five. That was very inconvenient, but we had nickels. Um, so yeah. Yeah.
00:03:03
Speaker
I remember growing up being like, pennies are dumb. Like, oh yeah, I think they're going to like get rid of pennies. I'm 34 now. They've done nothing. i mean, I don't use them.
00:03:15
Speaker
To be fair. Yeah, like, if I... I actually don't want to admit that. But I do think pennies are a stupid form currency. It's not a hot take anymore.
00:03:29
Speaker
They're literally more valuable in resources than their actual ah numeric wealth, like their actual value um as a currency. Value of the penny goes up in the United States. How do you think this is going to change the market for?
00:03:45
Speaker
For me, it's just kind of convenient thing. But I also don't really get paper money. I understand conspiracy theories or logical things about, you know, stuffing money in a mattress is only possible if you have...
00:03:59
Speaker
physical money. um It's also wildly inconvenient. And I don't know. I mean, like the times that I'm carrying money around, it's usually to be like, oh, I have to, you know, split a bill or something like that. I just want to throw some money somebody. But most of the time, even then, I'm using some sort of instant payment app or whatever. Yeah, the options become more available in in the last five, ten years. Yeah.
00:04:29
Speaker
yeah I don't like carrying around cash because even like with coins more so, but with cash as well, it's just dirty. Like because it's being exchanged between you and whichever vendor that vendor is using that for somebody else. And just the same money keeps getting passed around infinitely.
00:04:49
Speaker
And it either makes my wallet smell weird or it's crumbled up in my pocket. And then it won't be accepted by the ACM anyway. I'm
Future of Money and Digital Transactions
00:04:57
Speaker
just saying... In 2020, the COVID virus spread pretty quickly and we were still using paper money.
00:05:08
Speaker
That's all I'm saying. i'm yeah I'm not saying that I'm not saying they're guaranteed to be related. You know, do your research. so I'm saying.
00:05:15
Speaker
We should definitely do more digital stuff, I think. Yeah. um Although it is very like I can appreciate art or sorry, money is almost like artistic and the amount of effort that's gone into it. And they have all of these like anti counterfeit measures and things like that. And I'm just like, that looks really cool. And you should like put it in a museum for sure.
00:05:36
Speaker
Also, the ultimate anti-counterfeit measure is don't make a legitimate version of it, right? Then if people are trying to pass off paper money, you're like, I don't think that's real.
00:05:50
Speaker
We don't
Generative AI in Games Preview
00:05:51
Speaker
use that anymore, right? Yeah, it's a lot harder to send somebody fake money. Everything's monopoly money. Yeah.
00:06:03
Speaker
But anyways, I mean, we've got lot of fun, engaging topics. hopefully Hopefully wake you up on this fine day. Maybe we can jump into one of them. Why not? Why not? So
AI's Impact on Game Development
00:06:18
Speaker
this came up in a lot of things. Some of these we didn't cover.
00:06:21
Speaker
um But generative AI in games, as it turns out, also Dave and I just finished talking about AI for like an hour. so In preparation for this episode. It's diligence. It's diligence.
00:06:34
Speaker
um There was a study that was done for Steam games and in Steam, you're supposed to self report if your game uses generative AI. um It's a checkbox, basically, or something like that. When you submit your game and it will show up on the store page saying this game uses generative AI.
00:06:54
Speaker
um And we can hypothesize, we can talk about why that might be necessary or why why Steam even supports such a feature in the first place. But 7% of total Steam games when the study was done, which was pretty recently, I think were like last month, something like that,
00:07:12
Speaker
um found ah self-reported as using generative AI. What are your thoughts on that, Dave?
00:07:21
Speaker
I feel like I'm being brought on a morning show. I get all these things and it's like, now you respond. I'm like, oh, all the things.
00:07:31
Speaker
So I think it's kind of crazy high. That is, yeah. For that number. um Because that's just people who self-reported And so you have to assume that there's more than that.
00:07:45
Speaker
So let's say maybe round it off at like 10%. That's kind of crazy. um This is the total Steam library too, right? This isn't like submissions within the last two years or something.
00:07:57
Speaker
Like it's catching up in percentage. There's so many games being added. Which i do like the idea of ai as a tool to speed up certain parts of game development that might be monotonous or tedious i do not think it should be ever used for actual design and other stuff Just because it completely removes the human element. And it's just a picture of a picture of a picture of a picture of a picture type thing.
00:08:34
Speaker
And for me, that doesn't really carry any weight. It has no value. But
00:08:42
Speaker
yeah, i do expect that we will be seeing more of it. because of that utility. um I'm just very man shout shouting at clouds, worried that it's just at some point like a games can entirely be AI.
00:09:00
Speaker
i mean, that is that is already the case, but the games that are entirely AI are not considered anywhere near well worth playing, I think, is the current current perception.
00:09:14
Speaker
um true but again if you're lowering the the bar of entry for making a game it's like hey you at your computer listening right now you can make a game download this app above but but and you remember rpg maker back in the day i used it little bit i never got around to it but my thought was kind of that oh my God, i like RPGs back in the day I did.
00:09:42
Speaker
And oh, I could make my own. How cool is that? Like, I like the idea of that as a possibility that I could like kind of dabble in that space that seems so far beyond far beyond me.
00:09:56
Speaker
But I just don't want all those younger versions of me to then make like a billion piece of shit sloth games. Yeah.
00:10:07
Speaker
Because then you're just making trash for the sake of making trash. Yeah, i'd I'd like to play devil's advocate and like I could make an argument that there's enough forms of generative AI that it might be able to fill the gap in an otherwise capable team.
00:10:25
Speaker
Right. Where you're like, OK, we have a great story. We can make the combat system and stuff like that. We suck at art. We can't afford an artist or something like that. all right, let's let's do this.
00:10:37
Speaker
um and We'll use these generative AI assets. Or we can't afford ah we can't afford voice actors. Or we want to have more than one person voice this. We're going to generate some voice lines or something like that. There's different ways that you definitely could use it.
00:10:50
Speaker
It's just impossible to pick one of those things and not also... Like the proponents would say, okay, this is enabling us to do something that we couldn't do before because we didn't have the resources or whatever.
00:11:01
Speaker
The issue is that that's going to be used across the entire stack, right? Like maybe the next Grand Theft Auto doesn't use it, but the following one could for a lot of things, right? Especially once Take-Two realizes that spending a billion dollars to make a video game is actually a lot of money. um but Yeah, I mean, the the the issue is the arguments that could be used for this in micro or for the indie space or something like that to push some of those ideas over over over the edge, make them capable of completing it.
00:11:34
Speaker
It's still going to be used by larger scope things. And like you mentioned, um if people don't have other good inspired ideas and they're just relying on AI to follow fill in all of the work, basically, then it's garbage. Like it's it's just slop, like you said.
00:11:51
Speaker
um Yeah, there was a couple other numbers in this study that kind of conceptualize this a little bit. um So that was this year. That was a 7%. That's octuple last year's figure, apparently.
00:12:07
Speaker
um And a little under 20% of all games released in 2025 have disclosed AI use. So that's just all right. You're not looking at the total library anymore. We're just looking at like the actual trends for the year.
00:12:19
Speaker
One in five games. discloses AI use on Steam. um And that is. That's a lot.
00:12:32
Speaker
I mean, does it hit you with concern in the same way or. Are you more of the mindset of. million monkeys.
00:12:45
Speaker
ah Basically writing out the works of Shakespeare, like you could. You could strike gold with it. Mathematically speaking, eventually. Yeah. I don't, I don't think I would subscribe to the second argument.
00:12:57
Speaker
Um, or the first, I would, I would just restate like if someone had really good ideas for a game and generative AI helped them fill in the gaps, then it could still be a good game, right?
00:13:11
Speaker
Game doesn't instantly turn to trash just because they use gen AI at any point. Um, The issue with me is, or the issue I think is that it's never going to be as good as a talented person fulfilling that role, right?
00:13:29
Speaker
If you're using artificially generated music, it's not going to be as good as a dedicated composer, right? If you're using artificially generated music, uh images and things like that it's never going to look like um uh super giant games or something like that it's never going to be that good um maybe you could mimic an art style or something like that but i'm maybe i'm a romantic but like i think there's some soul to what people do that artificially generated art doesn't have
00:14:03
Speaker
I think a big thing, at least that I see in indie games, besides having like their very own unique designs and whatever story they want to tell, if it's that type of game, they will usually have certain artifacts kind of like skewn about the world, um, that are references to other indie games, kind of as like a, a nod of like to those who walked before me.
00:14:27
Speaker
um like some classics. um Celeste, Hollow Knight, seen a few others here and there. of And I guess AI could kind of replicate that.
00:14:42
Speaker
But then you're kind of back at that, a photo of a photo of a photo where it's just like that that hollow reprinting. Yeah. yeah I don't think it's going to push... It's not going to push the envelope for any of this.
00:14:55
Speaker
I don't think you're going an excellent game with Gen.A.I. features. right It's going to be like... A photo of a photo could still be a good photo, right? Like if there are other parts incorporated in the game that are worth playing, if they have interesting gameplay or something like that.
00:15:14
Speaker
um But I do think that if you find yourself in a position where you need to use Gen AI to fulfill some requirement for your game, that I don't know some of the best game developers and the most motivated ones, they found ways around that anyways.
00:15:32
Speaker
Right. They're like, oh, we don't have a budget for a massive ah like art team or something like that. We're going to use like ah sprites or pixel art or something like that. That's easier for us to create while maintaining a cohesive style.
00:15:49
Speaker
um The issue with AI is you're offloading the burden to someone else. And when you do that, you don't really have control over the creativity anymore.
00:16:02
Speaker
And I think that's where the the indie space shines the best is when, because they have full control over what's going in the game. So it's kind of like a monkey's paw, right?
00:16:15
Speaker
Like they can use it, but they're they're they're not going to have a 10 out of 10 kind of because they used it in a way. Yeah, I feel like it only caps so high.
00:16:31
Speaker
Yeah. Because again, like good stories are always going to be based off of things in real life, real situations, struggles, ah people overcoming them.
00:16:45
Speaker
And you can literally just parrot the same thing. ah But you can't. At this point in time, you can't actually do anything that crazy.
00:16:57
Speaker
But yeah, it's there's so many games that have been good and have not had huge budgets or huge development teams or are being published by some major studio. Now, I will say that makes stuff easier for sure.
00:17:13
Speaker
um But yeah, good things can still exist.
00:17:21
Speaker
Undertale, Toby Fox. One one person. Just a person and a Tem. That's all you need. Just a Tem. Well, Tem's trying to save money for dollars.
00:17:35
Speaker
The other one I was going to say is Omori. Mm-hmm.
00:17:41
Speaker
I think that was just a single developer and they worked on that as like their passion project for seven years. I'm a cat.
00:17:48
Speaker
By the way, I recommend that game wholeheartedly to anybody. We don't talk about it as much as Undertale because it doesn't have a continuing like second a series of games coming out related to it. But, um, still really good.
00:18:06
Speaker
Check out our episode for that. Um, The last thought I have, and this is just you you reminded me of this, is the great gate of game development that has basically held back subpar games from ever seeing the light of day was do we have the effort, the willpower, the um the commitment?
00:18:30
Speaker
to see this through to a gold launch, to see the game actually launch. And the gate has been got it's gotten smaller and they've reduced the number of guards on it throughout the years by having things like Steam Greenlight, which can be positive in early access, which can be positive.
00:18:47
Speaker
How are they getting through the smaller gate? They fly over it. That's the trick. They get over it because the gate's little lower. They just step over. um But AI is also a um reduction in the gatekeeping of ah what is necessary as far as willpower, resources, whatever.
00:19:11
Speaker
To see a game launch um Just like those other those other concepts. And like I said, that can be ah good thing um for people that have a good product and it's going to get out there.
00:19:22
Speaker
But there's going to be a swarm, right? There's going to be a flood that comes with it. And you're going to be searching through all of those games that really shouldn't have been created.
00:19:34
Speaker
in order to find the ones with the spark of creativity um in the midst of them that happen to use AI. Or maybe maybe say like you are a traditional game developer, you don't use ai at all.
00:19:47
Speaker
You're now still competing with the the flood, right? Making it
Child Safety in Online Gaming
00:19:52
Speaker
through the the the the gates to see a 1.0 launch um that is enabled by generative AI.
00:20:00
Speaker
And before there's a humble bundle that's specifically generate just like 2000 games for $2 or something.
00:20:09
Speaker
Yeah. Could be one day. But yeah, that's what i was kind of talking about with that. That fear of just they're going to be a lot of shit. Yeah. But you know, the, the thing that holds this in check is there is still a popular sentiment that AI games or ai generated games are inferior in some way. Like that is still the perception or else there would be no need for games to disclaim that they use generative AI, right?
00:20:41
Speaker
Like the reason that valve even has that option, and they're like, Hey, check this box. If you took the easy path, right. Um, is because there's the perception oh you use this for art the art's not going to be as good use this for voices the voices aren't going to be as good translation translation is not going to be as good etc so like if that changes then we gotta have another topic for this basically but um For the time being, it's ah it's a black mark on a game if they, like the alters, use Gen.AI for something, they don't disclose it, and then it comes out.
00:21:21
Speaker
And it's like, oh why are you guys hiding this, right? The reason we call them out for hiding it is because it is shameful in a way, right? Compared to not using it at all. Yeah, it's like...
00:21:36
Speaker
Shortcut isn't the right word when like a shortcut would be a shorter route, but this is like that second route doesn't exist and you just teleport there.
00:21:48
Speaker
I mean, like there isn't the steps taken along the way for that process. It's just this thing is done. Yeah. But see, I'm glad that sentiment still exists currently.
00:22:04
Speaker
and hope it stays that way forever, especially with more AI marketing. Yeah, AI replaces people, right? That's the thing to keep in mind through all of this. Whether you justify its use or not, that's what you have to admit is it replaces people.
00:22:19
Speaker
So we are trying to create machines in our own. I like it. Where have I heard that before?
00:22:28
Speaker
like any sci-fi thing ever. It's just, but that's a fun one. um Another fun topic here. Roblox. roblock As it turns out, kids play Roblox.
00:22:44
Speaker
louise I have heard this to be true. What's funny is when I talk to people, um including like last weekend, talk to like even strangers about video games and things like that. Social get togethers. I'm not like walking up to them on the street and be like, hey, do your kids play game?
00:23:00
Speaker
um But like, yeah. Roblox is the game that comes up probably more than any other as far as one that one's one that kids play and like kids know what Minecraft is that hopefully remains true forever because I actually kind of I like that. I want that to be in the video game curriculum for kids, right?
00:23:23
Speaker
I think it's a worthwhile experience to just be like, hey, let your creativity go loose. You can learn stuff. You just you make a a shitty thing in blocks kind of mimicking what you would do in the Lego.
00:23:34
Speaker
And then you start to understand like tools and things that interact together and then. Literally the world is your oyster. It's just the whole thing opens up. And there's an educational ah version of Minecraft actually that has learning modules and things like that baked into it, which is very funny to me.
00:23:53
Speaker
That's cool. I'm glad it's become more than just a game I got for 20 bucks over a decade to ago. Bye. Well, Minecraft is awesome for that. Roblox is, to my mind, it's basically like Gary's mod, which an entire generation will not understand.
00:24:12
Speaker
But the idea of here's the playground, build whatever you want. And Roblox exists in that space, right? People are making their own games. They're rec recreating Among Us or Minecraft or whatever else, you know, first person shooter, what have you.
00:24:28
Speaker
um Because they have the ability to program within the game, But the issue is this is a game that is predominantly marketed towards children.
00:24:41
Speaker
and anytime you do that, you have people that would market themselves predominantly towards children. And that's where this suit comes in um with Louisiana of all places suing Roblox over its child safety concerns, saying it's basically an open season for sex predators.
00:25:00
Speaker
um Bad thing. Good thing. I would say it's a bad thing to have an open season for predators. Um, I don't know if currently I could say that Roblox is that and it's facilitating that to that degree.
00:25:16
Speaker
Um, but there definitely needs to be something in place to make sure that adults are not trying to solicit minors off the the platform. Like, Hey, uh,
00:25:29
Speaker
The adults around here are kind of crazy. Hit me up on MSN or hit me up on AWOL Instant Messenger or something else. um Because initially I was saying, oh, maybe you could just search certain flags for words.
00:25:44
Speaker
um But there's always going to be a way around that.
00:25:50
Speaker
I think you're always going to essentially need an adult kind of monitoring, like basically acting as a lifeguard. Yeah. And I think like certain games have kind of gotten around this by limiting the forms of communication. Most of them, right?
00:26:02
Speaker
RuneScape and Club Penguin traditionally censor everything. Right. So it's like you're not getting any of that. Roblox has voice chat.
00:26:13
Speaker
And I think that's one of the big differences here is if someone's like, hey, all you have to do is go to this like bit.il or what? Ly address or whatever. it thought l y yeah um It's a lot easier to get people out of that security sandbox, you know, out of the the the safe place that's been established within the game.
00:26:36
Speaker
And. and I guess I don't have too much insight. for specifically the security concerns within Roblox, outside of voice chat. I kind of just think kids shouldn't be in voice chat.
00:26:51
Speaker
I don't ever want to hear a kid in my games, first off. I don't have an issue with, like, people playing... don't know how do i phrase this. Because, like, I've played, you know, Destiny and had random raids and stuff like that where people ah can just, like, jump in.
00:27:07
Speaker
I have no issue if a kid joins. um They have to... anybody proves their conduct from the point that they start communicating. Um, and I think that there's, there's kind of this trope that kids can't be,
00:27:21
Speaker
um but that they're going to be whiny or whatever. And sometimes that is the case, right? But I've also dealt with grown-arse adults that are miserable in online games too.
00:27:31
Speaker
If anyone's ever played a MOBA, you're probably in a similar situation. um So it's not exclusive to kids. So I want to judge people based off their content conduct in general. However, I do think that, you know, in a lot of these games, they specifically say you're not supposed to play under this age.
00:27:52
Speaker
Um, and you know, they're literally violating the Eula if they're playing, you know, some of these multiplayer games and they're under 18 or 16 or whatever.
00:28:04
Speaker
Roblox isn't like that, right? They're recognized it's for kids. And so they need to understand that protection should be in place.
00:28:16
Speaker
Um, And it seems like that's what this suit is about. It's coming from Louisiana. So maybe they probably to they're probably using the wrong arguments. I don't know. But like, um yeah, I mean, if I had kids and they were playing games online with other people, I would want to make sure that the communication channels those games enable are putting the kids safety above everything else.
00:28:43
Speaker
I don't feel like that's too much of a hot take.
00:28:46
Speaker
Yeah, I don't want anybody to be able to send my kids inappropriate things or or say inappropriate things, right? Like, yeah. Yeah. and Yeah, I just think you have to be specifically um specifically careful if it's marketed towards kids.
00:29:07
Speaker
um But, I mean, yeah. Honestly, i i get it. I've been a kid trying to convince my parents like, oh, I should play this game and this game and this game or whatever.
00:29:18
Speaker
But I also i grew up in an age where not all of those games were online. um And it was just starting to reach that tipping point where like everything was online. Right. Like my first and MMO was I was a young teenager for that.
00:29:34
Speaker
um That was Star Wars Galaxies. But I was playing like RPGs and text based stuff before then because I was like, oh, this is super cool. um muds and things like that so i realized that like i didn't have all of those safety uh like boxes around myself even as a kid now that i'm saying it but like i think there's to a certain extent you can't keep kids from experiencing the world But you should try to make sure that the places where, you know, you can't keep kids from going on the internet, I should say. But like, if there's a place that's specifically marketing themselves to kids, they should be held to account.
00:30:16
Speaker
Yeah, I think, like, let's say Chuck E. Cheese, family establishment, great pizza, etc. um But they're partially responsible for I would say not even partially responsible.
00:30:32
Speaker
If you leave your kids there, they're responsible for your kids, plain and simple. Um, so whether it's just keeping an eye on them or something else, like there needs to be something in place cause kids are stupid and they don't know everything that exists and certain things they should be kept away from.
00:30:53
Speaker
Um, pedophiles being always the case never let regardless of your child's age do not associate pedophiles um that's that's a hot that's a that's a call out for those parents right there be like hey if you know pedophiles and you're allowing them around your kids stop doing that i want to change our listenership base yeah you know but yeah like i don't have a kid i just have the dog but i'm actually going to share a brief anecdote
00:31:24
Speaker
ah There was a time I needed to be out of town. um Didn't want to bug any friends to watch the dog. So I found like a local sitter ah through a service and I had used them before and they seemed to be all right. The dog came back in one piece, etc.
00:31:40
Speaker
um And then this most recent time, they texted me that they were going to be out of the house for a little bit. And i was like, oh, yeah, they're like that's fine. If they're with other dogs, they'll be totally fine.
00:31:52
Speaker
But then when I went to go pick up the dog, the person still was not there. And I'm like looking around for my dog and I go into the bathroom and then there's my dog and another dog just like chill in there.
00:32:06
Speaker
And I'm like, did you just fucking leave my dog in this bathroom as like this will be the good holding spot? Fuck off. um And I took that very seriously and was upset. I'm never going use that person again because I wouldn't want to be locked in a bathroom.
00:32:22
Speaker
So neither should the dog.
00:32:25
Speaker
But if I have that level of fervor for like a fuzzy thing that purchased from a vet a couple of years ago, imagine with your kid. Right.
00:32:37
Speaker
Lock him in the bathroom. That's the takeaway. That's getting keep him off a game. Let's lock kids the bathroom. Yeah.
00:32:44
Speaker
Yeah. Now it's, uh, it's something people need to be aware of. And I think like maybe hopefully our generation, has a little bit more insight into this.
00:32:55
Speaker
I could see like being raised by boomers. Um, they didn't really understand what the internet was to the same degree. was just kind of like, ah, I don't know you guys. Okay. Like these are the people that were allowed to just wander the city or their town or whatever. They're like, okay, school got out. I'll be home at like for dinner time. You're like, okay, we'll hang out with whoever, I guess. I don't care. Go off in the woods.
00:33:21
Speaker
Um, But like, yeah, the Internet basically is that if you allow it to be so. Ultimately, this also does come back down to parents because, you know, regardless if it's not Roblox, like kids will go anywhere online. Right.
00:33:41
Speaker
The reason to catch a predator had any content whatsoever was because um there were all of these chat rooms people would just enter and like you could go back to the AOL days.
00:33:52
Speaker
and be like okay well this one's meant for kids okay so don't enter this chat room unless you're a kid and then that's a good idea everyone's like yes hello fellow kids um yeah it's so it's it's tough work but ultimately that is the parents responsibility and you have to find some balance between constraining the availability to these resources and um not just making your kids entire shut-ins that can't relate with any of their peers yeah i it definitely is a two-pronged thing because the establishment should be responsible while you're not there um but while you are there or specifically when you're not there and you're like at home you're responsible for your fucking kids and
00:34:39
Speaker
There's always going to be a degree of they're going to go out and into the Internet or the world and you can't account for everything. Right. But I think it is good to essentially educate them on like, hey, the online world is a huge place. It has some really cool things and some really horrible things.
00:35:02
Speaker
And one of the biggest things with um the online space is anonymity. Like you just see a screen name and some text. You don't know who that person is. You don't know what age they are. You don't know where they live.
00:35:15
Speaker
So you have to take everything with a grain of salt and not be like, I'm going to trust strangers at face value. Don't do that, whether you're online or not. Yeah. But a kid's not going to know that if unless you tell them.
00:35:30
Speaker
Tell them of stranger dating. Yeah. It's important to be a forthright. Educate your kids. It's very funny. As you're describing all that, I think back to like my years on MSN Messenger. And I literally just had contacts that were just like full arse adults through various games and things that I played. Or I found them in like different spaces and stuff like that.
00:35:51
Speaker
And like... I was just a kid. I chatted with them. like It turned out fine. I don't think any of them ended up being weird. right like I didn't have any of that, but they could have been.
00:36:03
Speaker
um and so i guess that's... i'm I'm very glad I don't have to walk that tightrope between being like, hey... Some of these people that my kid talks to online, they're actually just going to be like religious philosophers and stuff like that. And they're going to help the kid like explore lots of interesting ideas and religion and like identity and stuff like that.
00:36:28
Speaker
And Others are probably just like super weird and I'm not really going to be able to like pick the difference. and maybe that first group is also super weird. I don't know, but I had fun. ah Um, and like, yeah, it's, it's just really tough. It's really tough to do.
00:36:44
Speaker
Um, I'm not pretending that it's easy, but, uh, yeah, the platforms like Roblox can help out and just turn off voice chat. Come on guys. oh Like it's, uh,
00:36:57
Speaker
Then they they they probably should. They're made of money. They could just shut it down at this point. They'd be fine. Oh, yeah. They definitely could change stuff. But, hey, I'm going to say shout out to Louisiana. but If they're the ones proposing this.
00:37:11
Speaker
Because i I just kind of blanket assumed something like that was already in place. um Because I like to assume that in general, things are like honky dory, set up correctly.
00:37:23
Speaker
Everything's good. But... A lot of stuff is very much just fire and duct tape. And you kind of get to see like the pretty side from like one exact angle. Don't move your head to the left and to the right.
00:37:36
Speaker
um Also. Roblox sucks because of Robux, right? Like having their currency or their monetization that's used in the various games and things like that.
00:37:48
Speaker
That's not related to anything we're talking about. But also, from someone who's in the video game space you know and follows the industry, I don't want kids to get used to overly monetized live service systems as like their first exposure to games.
00:38:03
Speaker
Because that's the low end, to right? That's the garbage end. It don't have to be this way. If you're a parent listening to this podcast, the answer is...
00:38:18
Speaker
There are so many excellent single player games. Just have your kids play those and then they can go to the park and play with their friends or whatever. They can be exposed to multiplayer games and things like that in their own time at their friend's house. Like all of us were, right?
00:38:35
Speaker
But yeah. The only multiplayer game they should know at a point, definitely not at a young age, is Twister. Yeah. Have them play Undertale.
David Hayter and MGS5 Controversy
00:38:46
Speaker
make sure I was gonna say first first Dark Souls yeah I mean that will help train their hand-eye coordination to a certain extent um and it's definitely good to start with that one because if they play any any of the recent ones and then go back to Dark Souls they're gonna have a bad time I feel like as a kid I probably would not have had the patience for Dark Souls though I would have died instantly and then been like I have to start all the way back here I'm out sorry yeah
00:39:14
Speaker
That's how I felt about Gauntlet Legends. Whenever I would play it with people, they would have some idea of what was going on. And it's also meant to be like a quarter-eater game.
00:39:25
Speaker
But like I'd play for like a minute, and then I'm full dead. I'm like, okay, I'm not really seeing the appeal here as much. um But that's a fun one.
00:39:41
Speaker
The other one, this one's actually lighter, ha is MGS5 is actually ah great game. i but don't know if I would say it's excellent. And I feel like people, unfortunately, it kind of just like fumbles at the end.
00:39:57
Speaker
And that soured people in retrospect on perhaps the full experience. But I was like addicted to that game when I was playing. I put like a bunch of time into MGS5.
00:40:09
Speaker
I believe as I saw it happen. I mean, you were there with me in real time. Not in multiplayer, which apparently there is a co-op mod for MGS five now, but it's like buggy still. And they have things to work through, but that would be fun.
00:40:25
Speaker
mean, it was fun just to go on like random missions, pick out your soundtrack, your assistant buddy, your, your gear you want to start out with. And then,
00:40:36
Speaker
basically try and manufacture those scenarios where you get to play like this stealth operative and like sneak in or just throw grenades from really far away or punch with a flying fist It just felt like you had a lot of options to be a cool guy.
00:40:53
Speaker
And it was fun. It it always felt fresh. They let you collect people and not make it too weird. um You just tie balloon to them and waves are pulled into the stratosphere. Or eventually a wormhole.
00:41:10
Speaker
Which was helpful because I was like, why why why are these resource crates under like warehouse cover and stuff like that? Like these are literally useless. This could never mean anything in the game. Then I got the wormhole Fulton. I was like, oh, I see.
00:41:25
Speaker
mars Smart, smart. um But one of the controversies that was big 10 years ago ah when this game came out was um that David Hayter didn't voice Snake.
00:41:42
Speaker
And naturally, if you're a pure voice actor for a very important character like this, and also to some extent, your livelihood ah depends upon recurring work in a space.
00:41:56
Speaker
um That's got to suck. okay And it did suck. And um recently ah he he came out because I know that he's doing some more work with Konami for like MGS Delta um and promotional stuff or whatever.
00:42:13
Speaker
And he's like, I did did ultimately play the game. um and it's great. Like he he he really enjoyed it. He was able to get through it and not emotionally break down or anything like that, which is good.
00:42:24
Speaker
um But it was very funny because reading about this, he also talks about... um He talks about fans coming up and he'd be like, oh, what's your favorite Metal Gear Solid game? And they'd be like five.
00:42:37
Speaker
And he's like, I'm going to read this quote directly because I thought it was very funny. You'd be like, and this is this is verbatim. He'd say, what the hell, dude? Like, you know, thanks. Do you want to give me a paper cut as well? Maybe pour some lemon juice on it.
00:42:53
Speaker
hu and and then And then I played it and I'm like, I think this is my favorite gameplay of the series. And that's that's pretty big. That's a nice, um i don't know, closure to to that in a way.
00:43:08
Speaker
ah Because he he was he did get the short shrift, um not being the voice actor for that game. Yeah. Because I think they grabbed Kiefer Sutherland. They did, yeah.
00:43:20
Speaker
Who like... If you've watched 24, it's yeah that guy. If you don't know what 24 is, bless. Many, many years yet to live. um But yeah, it is wild that like he was Snake for all of the games.
00:43:40
Speaker
And then for five, you're like, get the fuck out. To grab somebody who I don't think really does video game voice acting as a a major part of their career. I'm not going to fact check it.
00:43:51
Speaker
It's just kind of like star power. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Yeah. There was a, there was one last quote here that I liked, um, which was kind of, it put the warm glow on all of this, which was, ah ah Hater bumped into ah Sutherland at one point and said, I ran into him at a bar in Dallas.
00:44:14
Speaker
We had a bunch of drinks. He's a great guy. And, you know, no ill will. All is forgiven. So that was that was nice. Capital off. um but it probably doesn't hurt that he's back and reprising his role as snake so you know it's easier to forgive once you know uh it's been remedied to some extent i think oh you made things better all right i guess i'm not as mad but was a good game i enjoyed that one and um
00:44:46
Speaker
I still, you know, Konami sucks for lots of reasons, but they've started doing some things that suck a little bit less and that is the road to recovery, I think.
00:44:58
Speaker
Do you want Metal Gear Solid Delta to be good? Or do you want to fail? That's tough. I mean, it kind of depends on the type of game that it is. I don't know that much about it. i haven't been tracking it too much.
00:45:09
Speaker
I know they basically did a ah a reprisal tour of remastering and remaking all of these games to be like, oh, you know, we're getting back back to our roots. You know, it's not going to be like survive or whatever.
00:45:21
Speaker
We learned our lesson. We're not going to charge you for save slots or we will charge you for save slots, but you won't care this time or something like that. But, I mean, if it if it's good, then I'd play it.
00:45:34
Speaker
But I am not emotionally attached to the series. like i i would I don't have like this initial buy-in like where it's like, they announced Prey 2. Okay, that means a lot to me.
00:45:45
Speaker
It's like, oh, or Deathloop 2 or something like that. be like, okay. I could probably think of some non-arcane games, but not right now. um But, like... I'm willing to give it a shot. I wouldn't like boycott it right off the jump, but it's also like Konami's pulled a lot of really scummy anti-consumer stuff and they have to be better.
00:46:13
Speaker
I will meet them where they meet me. Right? Like, so...
00:46:19
Speaker
What about for you, though? Because I
Game Reviews: Alters and Peaks
00:46:21
Speaker
know that you you did play MGS and Revengeance is not your favorite in the series. So you have some clout where I don't.
00:46:29
Speaker
I mean, three is pretty much the main one that I did. um But I really liked it at the time, trying to figure things out on like the PS2 controls and doing all that espionage stuff.
00:46:45
Speaker
But it was really interesting. And I did because it was my first exposure to it. That's the one I'm going to feel closest to the most. So when they do character redesigns and it doesn't match what I've had in my head as far as like picturing for years, that is always going to be a little bit knee jerk. Kind of like, why would you ruin this?
00:47:08
Speaker
Yeah. But at same time, like maybe it will be a better change or it won't be as drastic as I thought. Better direction for character designs of the future, et cetera.
00:47:19
Speaker
But yeah, I would say I'm in probably a similar boat where i would kind of like to see it do well for one, the consumer, two, hopefully Konambi can be less of a piece of shit.
00:47:34
Speaker
Three, love David Hayter and I want him to have more work. Um, But I just really don't like that Konami has this franchise where they don't even have like the main person who was doing all this stuff. Kojima.
00:47:51
Speaker
If they transferred it to Kojima, it'd be a different story. But it sounds like. Well, i I have heard. I mean, this is like a random article from my phone type thing ah that he is going to be working on a spiritual successor to me good Metal Gear Solid. Yeah.
00:48:10
Speaker
So this would be the start of his own IP at some point. so
00:48:16
Speaker
And maybe it can be a competitor in the future. i think that'd be kind of cool. Yeah, it's not bad. I mean, competition's always good. and um David's voicing all the characters for both sides. Yeah. That's what I was thinking, right? is how How excited is Konami going to be about this while he's actively competing with her IP?
00:48:35
Speaker
But... you You see him running across a busy street from like one skyscraper to another while actively changing his clothes. It's like 24, if you guys are familiar with that one. yeah it's um It sounds like we're both in the same place, though. we' We'll leave the door open for Konami, but they have to walk through it.
00:48:55
Speaker
Yeah, because like they did... I say they. The games industry. Some of the other remasters I have been pleasantly surprised by... Because I think a lot of remakes or remasters when I was younger, is just like, hey, this really old game, you can play it on this system now.
00:49:14
Speaker
And everything else was exactly the same. Maybe they upscaled some of the graphics, um but that was kind of it. But now like they're doing more design changes. They're taking some liberties on other things for how the game is.
00:49:30
Speaker
But it's not as long as it's not touching the core of it, so I think that's that's fun. yeah Yeah. um I agree. In short.
00:49:43
Speaker
Yeah. So I had one more topic here, but I don't know if I want to get into that. Maybe maybe we save that for a next time. um Because...
00:49:55
Speaker
It might take too long. So instead, I'm just going to talk about some stuff I've been playing recently. um Very. it We will be sued.
00:50:06
Speaker
The birches are powerful, Dave. We cannot we cannot we cannot stand toe to toe with them. um Yeah. ah The ah so.
00:50:18
Speaker
I can't remember if I ever talked about alters. It's a good game. um to check this off on this list um just so I can not have this be on the list forever. and But I enjoyed it.
00:50:31
Speaker
It's one of the games I would say is like a good single path pass through sort of story game. And I'm not going to give a full review on it, but ah there were interesting concepts in play.
00:50:43
Speaker
And at the end, I had some gripes for how the story organization sort of happened and um how meaningful some of the decisions would be in a game where...
00:50:57
Speaker
um You can seemingly work to really appease everyone, but for narrative reasons, it's not going to be interesting if you successfully appease everyone.
00:51:09
Speaker
Like, they kind of have to shoehorn in some of this drama. um And I'm like, ah I get it, because you have to have drama in this. But ah the other hand on the other hand, it felt like it was shoehorned in. It was like, okay, you're forcing me to piss some people off here. Where, like, I could think of reasons...
00:51:28
Speaker
they could this could absolutely be done better, right? um Yeah, it's never a good sign if you're in a situation like that and you're like, What about this other option?
00:51:40
Speaker
Like based on how I've seen this character behave, I think they would actually say something like this or provide this as an interaction instead of now the you did good or I'm mad at you.
00:51:53
Speaker
It falls. It falls afoul of one of my ah pet peeves for video games, which is like the protagonist is an idiot in a cutscene or an a-hole in a cutscene or something like that.
00:52:06
Speaker
And you're like, I get that you had to push the story in this direction, but like, I am now more distanced from the protagonist that I was playing because I wouldn't have acted this way. And I wouldn't have been an idiot in this cut scene or something like, I i can recognize this is going to alienate people or whatever.
00:52:29
Speaker
um But it's a very interesting idea and it's it is an ambitious game. I like the survival and base building aspects. um And we've had so many games that like experiment with identity and transhumanism and things like that recently.
00:52:47
Speaker
but i don't know if this one. Yeah, ah not. Yeah, not necessarily, but um If you would enjoy this type of experience or if it seems interesting, I would say definitely play it.
00:53:01
Speaker
um It was it was on Game Pass. It probably still is. So ah check it out if you're interested in it. um I think it's great and not excellent.
00:53:13
Speaker
So I'd rate it like an eight.
00:53:17
Speaker
8 out of 10. 8 out of 10.
00:53:24
Speaker
For those of you not familiar with JonTron, this is a cancelled internet personality. yeah um I've been playing...
00:53:38
Speaker
on and off when people started lobbies peak, which has been like the new multiplayer sensation. See a lot of people streaming on Twitch, et cetera. And it's essentially just climb a mountain with friends.
00:53:52
Speaker
You have your overall stamina bar, but as you carry things, that weight is going to kind of tick into your stamina. If you get hungry, it's going to the same. If you get poisoned, cold, too hot.
00:54:04
Speaker
So you're trying to like manage some of these things in a semi-survivably way as you're working your way Like survival light. Yeah, very, very light.
00:54:15
Speaker
But like you can find things as you go and there might be like scattered luggage that might have some useful items in there. You can also help people up by giving them like a helping hand.
00:54:28
Speaker
You can shoot people out of a cannon, which is one of the newer items. Like to ascend faster or descend faster?
00:54:37
Speaker
I mean, you always really want to ascend. I would try and set it in an upward direction if you can. You're not people off of the mountain horizontally or anything like that?
00:54:48
Speaker
Not in... Not usually. Like you can get up to fun shenanigans like where you fuck with your friends or you can be like, I'm going to go off on my own and go this cool way that looks easy.
00:55:01
Speaker
And then you may be slip and fall and then nobody's there to rescue you because this is one of those games where they use proximity chat. So the whole thing feels, I think, better in a group context.
00:55:16
Speaker
And it also makes it funnier for if you slip and fall and they hear you. a I do appreciate that. There's a word for it. And I can't ah can't recall exactly what it is.
00:55:28
Speaker
But the effect that it comes. Doppler. effect Thank you. Yeah. um Because the the the other game I last thought of that concept for was... um The hot crap ah spaceship expendable crew salvaging from a ah base or something.
00:55:48
Speaker
Lethal company. Doppler effect in lethal company when you like fall into a pit and you're like, all right, guys, don't worry. We're almost there. I don't think he made the job.
00:56:03
Speaker
But yeah, I do like stuff where there is kind of that. you don't really have a HUD, you don't have a great way to communicate with people. You really kind of have to be on the ball with that. like Oh, we haven't seen this guy in like two minutes.
00:56:18
Speaker
All right. now said Do we send out a search party?
00:56:23
Speaker
But ah there's been a multiplayer mod because normally it's just a four person lobby. ah But we've played with like eightish people before. um That's also similar to Lethal Company. Yeah. Hey, do you have too many people on this mountain?
00:56:42
Speaker
We didn't design for this, but here you go. Breaking things. But no, it's just been a very fun time where like there's always some shenanigan that happens. I found out early on that if you kind of climb to the top and you're away from everybody else, you get there too fast.
00:57:01
Speaker
um There's an enemy called the Scoutmaster, which will like hunt you down and like keep throwing you against the ground until you're dead. Just as like a punishment for being too much of a solo runner, I guess.
00:57:14
Speaker
um Because like you can't proceed into the next area until everybody who's alive is with you. So they're they're creating content for the person who's otherwise waiting at the top.
00:57:27
Speaker
um But also punishing them. Yeah. It's it's definitely punishment. Oh, that's fair. I mean, it sounds like... like Yes. As I say, it's still pretty early doors, um but I know they are still doing updates. I still think it's... I consider it to still be like the gaming zeitgeist for the moment.
00:57:48
Speaker
um And I would like to play it with ah that one server. Yeah. Because I think that'd just be a fun ah fun group to do that with. I think um it's probably probably doable.
00:58:01
Speaker
Like, it's easy to criticize the flavor of the month games as being that. Yeah. But usually the reason that they're the flavor of the month game is because it's a good flavor, right? Like it doesn't have to be.
00:58:14
Speaker
I'm an old man now. I don't need every game that I play to be like a home run. You're like, oh, this is going in the Hall of Fame or something like that. If it's fun for a bit and then we stop and I'm like, that was enjoyable.
00:58:28
Speaker
I had an enjoyable time. That's good enough. Right. It's the
Episode Conclusion
00:58:32
Speaker
same thing to like going to a social engagement or something like that. No one looks back and then're like, well, I left at 8 p.m. So it couldn't have been that great right here. Like, yeah. Listen, listen, dude.
00:58:45
Speaker
i i forgot the dog's food. I mean, we also, feel like left around that time until the last engagement. And if it's a longer drive, that makes sense too. But um also, I'm just, I'm tired at nighttime now. It's weird, but no, I, I agree with that. I don't like driving at night. Never have, but, but yeah, I mean, if it's, especially for like a social game where it's like, Hey, I haven't talked to these, these people for a while, let's get this together.
00:59:11
Speaker
um let's distract people from reality for a bit and have a good time flavor of the month games are great for that so no shade yes the other one i would give like a light suggestion for even though i've only really played it once is guilty as sock where you essentially play different roles in the courtroom but it's all kind of made up certain things as far as roles um might be assigned as far as um here you're gonna be your two witnesses and you kind of have to figure out what they're actually gonna do yeah no i i like that too right because these go back to like town of salem or among us the social interaction type games and even some of that jackbox energy i think with the um
01:00:01
Speaker
Yeah. it'd Make a presentation about this random topic or something like that. It was always a fun one for me. I don't think in general people like public speaking or performance.
01:00:12
Speaker
I know I don't. But having some of these avenues, I think, allows you to kind of dip your toe into that space. Because like when I was... playing the witness you essentially are playing for the defense and the offense prosecution think they're you say the witness i said oh okay like like okay i thought you're saying when i when i was playing the witness and i was like i don't remember this game working like this uh but basically it's like i had two characters of one the president of the united states and then two a dog
01:00:50
Speaker
So you get to play around with it and just if it's not great, Who cares? Like nobody's going to be perfect at their role. That's not the point. The point is just meant to facilitate silly interactions and then have people in the jury drawn penises or what. It's just like real life, honestly.
01:01:09
Speaker
of Yeah. If you ever want to complicate things at your trial, you just that's what you do. You say like for our next witness, we're going to call the president any minute now. Yeah.
01:01:22
Speaker
Maybe that's that's how courtroom works on TV. I realize that's not how it works in real life. But yeah. No, that's fair. um That's it.
01:01:34
Speaker
That's a full episode. That's it.
01:01:38
Speaker
them it's usually where i call it thank you guys for listening to another episode of super stone as always if you'd like to contact us our information is in the description or you can just follow along with the socials um so you're aware of when we post new episodes even though that happens at a regular cadence we don't ask you to keep track of that we just ping you via social messaging On Blue Sky, specifically.
01:02:08
Speaker
As always, we'll see you in the next one. Have a good night.