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S3 Ep227: Talkcast - October 2022
74 Plays3 years ago
It's Talkcast time, where we talk about whatever! Join Dave and Jake as they talk about holidays, treats, and a whole lot about religion in this week's episode!
Intro:
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Intro:
- Satisfactory OST - Song 9
- Satisfactory OST - Song 8
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Like our podcast? Like our podcast! We'll post when new episodes are uploaded!
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Transcript
00:00:00
Speaker
Music Playing
Podcast Introduction & Co-hosts
00:00:31
Speaker
How's it going everyone? Welcome to another episode of Soapstone. My name is Jake, and I'm joined by my co-host, as always, Dave. How's it going tonight, Dave? Uh, terrible. How's it going, too?
00:00:43
Speaker
Well, I think okay. I know I turned my volume down for this episode. Now I'm looking at the little bar and it's like, yeah, it's a little tiny. Your bar looks like mine. We finally have the same bar girth. Oh, does it actually on your screen? Uh, mine, it shows the same. Yeah. Okay. Good. Well, I'll trust you. Mine is just the smallest wavelength out of everybody's and then yours is fluctuates. And then you have a guest who's like making their own little roller coaster tycoon over there. Uh-huh.
00:01:12
Speaker
Just because they're not like naturally starting to sound, but instead they lead into it and they calm down. Um, yeah, that actually literally did show up
Personal Challenges & Health
00:01:25
Speaker
on the bar. Um, but, uh, terrible, huh? Yeah. Health stuff's just been a nightmare for a very long time. Uh, coming to a head, hoping to get on a lot of cool drugs and we'll see where it goes from there.
00:01:42
Speaker
Well, it is. There's definitely a movie for this. There's like Nightmare Before Christmas, right? Nightmare on Elm Street, I think is coming up. That one is actually Halloween, right? Is that where one of the big ones came from? Nightmare Before Christmas is a Halloween movie, yes. That one is a Halloween movie. Is Elm Street a Christmas movie?
Movies & Halloween Festivities
00:02:03
Speaker
I got it. Are you familiar with the street?
00:02:11
Speaker
Isn't Nightmare on Elm Street also a movie? Yeah, it is. I don't know what the Freddy Krueger one's called. Is that Nightmare on Elm Street? That one's from that one's Nightmare on Elm Street, yeah. But there's like a miracle on Elm Street, right? Yes, that is the Jason Bourne. No, a miracle. Ask us about our pop culture knowledge.
00:02:35
Speaker
Miracle on 34th Street is a PG Christmas movie with a little girl in a bowl cut. My favorite look on anybody, the Gregorian saint. That's going to do you well in life. But yeah, I guess, you know, it is the season for Halloween. I don't know. This isn't really a segue. We can talk about something else if you want.
00:03:06
Speaker
I mean, I'm always fine to talk about Halloween. I can't divulge too much though. That's fair. I have to let certain things be surprises. I will say I've not picked a Halloween costume in the slightest. I haven't either. There's actually a very busy month for me. Yeah. It's like there's the wedding and there's a lot of puppy sitting. Um, and we got friends visiting and
00:03:36
Speaker
Then there's just everything I normally do. Um, and then a Halloween party naturally, which of course I won't try to pull secrets from you for good. I don't, I've made no plans as far as anybody's aware. I like, I like that. I like, um, well, I'm not going to try to get it out of you.
00:04:00
Speaker
Your turn to talk. I have some ideas brewing about a lot of more dumb, but I hope just like with the banner, it just, I'm going to, I want to make people smile and that's about it. So if I've achieved that, I'll be happy.
00:04:21
Speaker
Last Halloween, Dave was just ripping people's masks off. He's like, no, I must see the smile. Your teeth. Show me your teeth. It was terrifying. It was very successful. Yeah. Everyone got COVID. No.
00:04:43
Speaker
Now Halloween's Halloween's a pretty, pretty good time. Um, we were talking about, uh, getting sort of, sort of like skeleton maybe and putting it up in a tree. Just like lives up there in the tree. Yeah. Cause what else are you going to use a tree for? Honestly.
00:04:59
Speaker
You should pose the skeleton depending on how opposable they are, which is kind of like leaning on the tree, you know, skull and its bones. Kind of pondering, you know? Yeah. Whimsically looking outside. That would be the intent. And then it's just going to look terrifying to children, right? It's arms will disconnect. It's just like holding its head and its own hands in front of it. What is it? Headless horseman style or something like that?
00:05:29
Speaker
Um, ooh, ooh, you're gonna have to cut this. No, no, I don't think I will. Do I have the other deal? Um, pretty sure it's me this, me this time. Okay. You can do a pun with a last poor Yorick. I knew him well. Poor Yorick. I knew him well. I actually don't know what that means.
00:05:55
Speaker
Well, you know, like the Shakespearean, Alas, Poor Yorick? No. Okay.
00:06:04
Speaker
That was a weird place to put the cut, but anyways, we cut there. I can't remember what we were talking about. Um, something about Halloween. Oh yeah. It's Halloween. Um, candy's not normally that good, but the event
Holiday Treats & Traditions
00:06:19
Speaker
is much better. It's kind of ironic in that way, right? Deep. So I guess before I sway your, um, your opinion here.
00:06:26
Speaker
Christmas candy versus, or Christmas candy and treats, I should say, versus Halloween candy and treats. What is your preference? I grew up Jewish. What the fuck is Christmas candy? Right. Um, uh, so there's Saint Nick. Right. He's got Nick right there. And then there's like Texas. It's got like yeehaw. And then it's such a rough, uh, and then Nick.
00:06:59
Speaker
And that's it. Ah, Hanukk. Ah, okay. I see what you did there. We don't have anyone listening to this episode. We can talk about whatever. That's it. That's the end.
00:07:11
Speaker
But I mean, like, did you actually have Christmas candy? Because we did, like, because on my dad's side, it was, you know, like, middle PA Christian type stuff. But we did have candy canes. We had like the tubs of popcorn. Yeah. It was like caramel and two other shitty flavors. Yeah. Cheese, but not good. Cheese, popcorn. It's bad cheese, popcorn. Yeah. We did have, so candy canes, I guess, we got to start there. Candy canes exist.
00:07:42
Speaker
I don't think they're good, really. Classic peppermint is probably the best. Everything else is just pure sugar. Yeah. I like peppermint as a flavor, but give me your peppermint patty because I can get the flavor of it, but not have to worry about fashioning a weapon in my own mouth.
00:08:04
Speaker
Because consistently, you'd form a spike and then you try and stab your friends with it. The more likely you're going to stab yourself in the gums or cheek. I mean, you say that like it's a downside, but there's not that many candies that we give kids that literally do turn into weapons at the halfway point. Maybe there's a reason for that. I can't think of it.
00:08:26
Speaker
For me, it's anything peanut-related. It's a weapon immediately. Just self-weaponized. Candy canes, I guess. I wouldn't rate them highly. If this was a tier list, I'd put them maybe B tier. Probably C. They're more decorative than they are actual.
00:08:48
Speaker
Like this is a candy type thing I would eat. It falls under a stocking stuffer for me. Yes. Yeah. It's that and the orange. And I mean, that's not really, if I obviously as a kid, the candy cane would win, but as an adult, you're like, Oh, that's okay. And the oranges for me. Okay. Here's the thing. You fashioned the candy cane as a knife to open the orange. That's why they give you both. Now I have to know them. Do you open oranges with a knife?
00:09:18
Speaker
So back in the day we had a little plastic thing where it essentially was like a zipper wedge. So you kind of wedge it in and it should peel the skin. But really it's just causing tension on the skin level and you use that to facilitate peeling it apart.
00:09:39
Speaker
Nowadays, if I have any degree of nail or even if I don't, I'm just jamming my thumb in there and going hell to leather. I'm like, we'll find one in there. And maybe you have one wedge that's now not presentable eatable.
00:09:53
Speaker
Now, this is how I know that you grew up more upper class than I did. I didn't realize there was a tool you could use to open oranges. It was like a like if you saw it at a yard sale, you'd be like, oh, this is from the 70s and I wouldn't pay more than a nickel for it. That's the type of thing it was. It wasn't fancy by any means. Yeah, we use spoons, but that was also like not.
00:10:16
Speaker
I mean, you pretty much always destroy the orange to some extent or another, at least during the entry point, the impact of the spoon into this sphere. One of the benefits of the shitty plastic tool is if you could preserve the skin to be a little more whole, once the orange just peels, what are you going to do with this orange peel? Throw it away? That would be a waste when candles exist, because as any young boy knows,
00:10:43
Speaker
if you squeeze the skin of an orange peel it aerates all like the oil from the orange skin which is flammable when it's that aerated and also an oil so it made like the best flames just squeeze that into a candle that's pretty legit um this is where essential oil started probably also too it's magic you know causes flame
00:11:09
Speaker
Um, yeah, I guess oranges are okay. Chocolate oranges are amazing and Christmas also has those. Yes. Um, I like chocolate. Hot take. Oh my gosh. Uh, but you know, uh, the orange flavor is also pretty good.
00:11:28
Speaker
Yeah, I think chocolate orange is probably my first flavor mash where it's like, Hey, these two things don't commonly go together, but they taste really good. And I was like, Oh, I wonder how many other things you're like this. It turns out a lot, but yeah, that's where I like to get my sugar chocolate.
00:11:48
Speaker
Well, the chocolate orange specifically. Ah, yeah, yeah. If we're talking like Jewish candy, a whole different thing. You can monologue for that one. I definitely don't, I don't know much about them. Back when Pharaoh kicked the Jews out of Egypt. That was manna. It was manna. Manna Shevitz.
00:12:11
Speaker
Shout out to Manashevitz, the first wine I ever had as a youth and since probably. I forgot the company, but they do a lot of Jewish holiday common snacks, like the little
00:12:30
Speaker
Coconut balls. I don't know those are called Offhand but there is a brand of a like jelly slices Which is very common around Passover I want to say But if you imagine like if you go to any candy store, it's like a little half moon Yes, yeah
00:12:48
Speaker
It's just of different flavors. That's basically all it was, but they only had like four. Yeah. I think, I think of them as orange usually. Yeah. But not like actual jelly. It's like, that sounds a lot, that sounds a lot better than the crappy orange slices you can get. So the orange slices you're talking about, like they come in the bags. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I had a lot of those growing up as a kid too, just because I'm like, Oh, I have an allowance that I can use for whatever sugar.
00:13:19
Speaker
But yeah, these are a little bit more soft and they kind of specialize in flavors. So if you go to like an actual candy store, or it's like the candy section of like a Wegmans or a giant, they'll usually have more options like blue raspberry, watermelon, what have you. Yeah. Oh, it doesn't sound bad.
00:13:37
Speaker
I can't remark to that, although that does sound pretty good. So maybe we do have to put Hanukkah in the running as well. Should I start hosting Hanukkah? All right, guys, we'll see you tomorrow. Keep saying that.
00:13:53
Speaker
Yeah, that's one way you make up for like the blackout time of not seeing people over COVID times. You can just like- You can see people eight days in a row. People drive like two hours for like, let the candles like, all right, now fuck off.
00:14:09
Speaker
So somewhat less controversial into cookies or confections. I do think Christmas also tends to win out on cookies, snickerdoodles in particular, very popular. Now some of these you could also technically eat for Halloween, but I mean, you're not passing them out usually. It would be a dedicated party or something like that, which is common around the Christmas time on its own, right?
00:14:35
Speaker
So I would also favor Christmas cookies, I think, to the standard things around Halloween. As long as it's soft on game. I don't like those little brutal things they sell. Listen, I want to put in too much work if it's soft. Yeah.
00:14:59
Speaker
I don't like the, the brittle and heavily iced ones that just like snap. Yeah. Yeah. A controversial twist. How do you feel about eggnog?
00:15:13
Speaker
I like it in small doses, which is I think how God intended it because they gave it like the smallest carton ever. They're like, Oh yeah, please don't drink too much. This is actually poison and you'll die if you drink too much of this. It's like that and cider are just great seasonal beverages.
00:15:32
Speaker
Mm-hmm, but like eggnog is thick and rich and I don't really mix it with anything but it's just It's a nice little ooh a little once a year treat. Oh, yeah Yeah, but I would never like buy some and they'll like have it throughout the week. That seems uh-huh too much That's you're also pushing up against the how long eggnog actually lasts before it goes bad. So No, gotta watch out for that, too
00:15:57
Speaker
Here's what you do. You take some leftovers, put a little bit of eggnog in the pan. You got some scrambled egg. There you go. Easy peasy. I'm very curious what that would taste like. Probably terrible. Like French toast or something, maybe? I don't know. I don't know. I don't know how much egg is in it if you could just make it French toast versus how much dairy. You can grill nog. That's what they don't tell you.
00:16:23
Speaker
I'll be sure to pour some into my grill. I guess on the opposite side, this is also maybe not the best topic we've ever impromptu'd, but on the opposite side, Halloween candy, I think it's undercut by just like, it's trick or treat. That's what holds it back, right? Because trick or treat is the most prevalent way for candy to be distributed,
00:16:51
Speaker
We're not going to give kids the good stuff, right? So what's the best Halloween candy? It's actually just full size year round candy that you happen to get, right? You're like, oh, I got a full Butterfingers. Nice, right? Or Snickers, or unfortunately, some of the ones that are more Halloween themed, I think, are the peanut butter containing things.
00:17:15
Speaker
What I like is the candy or the common treat for the holiday of Halloween is not like, oh, this is something we always do with our family that's been passionate for generations. It's different brands of like, oh, we got Skittles. Oh, we got Reese's Peanut Butter Cups. And now we're talking as adults, so we don't give kids the good stuff. We're talking about gas station snacks that we would pick out for us.
00:17:41
Speaker
Like, that's basically what we're talking about. We're like, this is the good pre-packaged shit, you know what I'm saying? Right. Corporate America won, I guess, on Halloween. I also think, like, Thanksgiving kind of steals some of the adulty good food that otherwise could have made it into Halloween. Because we keep thinking things like, oh, well, I mean, like, Halloween's, it's got pumpkins and stuff. Like, yeah, it has pumpkins, but it's used for food in Thanksgiving.
00:18:11
Speaker
Right. That's where the pies are. There's no Halloween pie. Yeah. So there's not really like Halloween specific dishes. Cause again, it's not like celebrated in that way. Like it's not like a, Hey, get your family together and like have a meal type. So it doesn't have that. It would be a desperate meal. Hey mom and dad, what are you doing on October 31st?
00:18:38
Speaker
We were all just gonna go trick or treating for dinner. Eat all your skills before you have your chocolate. Uh huh.
00:18:47
Speaker
But I will say like, if I'm ever planning something around Halloween to like have people over a good deal of it would be like, Oh, this is just good party food or Hey, this is a good seasonal thing. So I think anything that involves like apples, pumpkins, if it's autumnal, like if it all falls under that. So I feel like it does borrow from Thanksgiving to a degree. Yeah. Yeah.
Holiday Decorations: Halloween vs. Christmas
00:19:13
Speaker
I agree with the seasonal, the seasonal call. Now, as far as like.
00:19:17
Speaker
actual holiday Halloween's like way better than Christmas I think particularly as you get older also if you're lazy you don't put out like a bunch of Christmas decorations like Christmas decorations oftentimes go outside and then you got to deal with the tree there's way much there's too much overhead in Christmas Halloween it's like
00:19:37
Speaker
You just put like a body bag in your lawn and you're good. That's all it takes. That's it. If you're lucky, you already have one. I'm trying to decorate a little bit more each year.
00:19:54
Speaker
Get more themed instead of just being like ah These you know these colors. No. Yes, it is truly the Halloween times Without like going like two out of budget, but I also don't want it to be like Hey, I fake murdered somebody here. Oh, yeah
00:20:17
Speaker
I mean, I mean, I think we've all seen probably news stories of people who like really were in the spirit for Halloween and they're like really trying to sell something terrible happened on their lawn and like the police show up and they're like, I know that this is probably fake, but.
00:20:32
Speaker
on the off chance you killed someone and put them in this bag next year you're like well last time i was gonna put the thing we know the fucking cops came yeah you're just we know terry we know exactly um i don't have anything else to say about this topic
00:20:55
Speaker
Okay. We can move on from Halloween. Halloween should be good. Um, it should be good. I think it's, it scales better as you get older. Christmas falls down. That becomes the child's, the child's thing and Halloween goes up. Um, but part of that's probably because I never trick or treat it really probably went like once.
00:21:15
Speaker
I went like once or twice. There's actually, it's either on Facebook or my mom has the photos, real life intact photos of me and like some other kids went as Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. We were like, you know, like the smallest little kids. So like, of course it just looked cute. I might've done Zorro one year back when that was a thing. That's good.
00:21:44
Speaker
But it's just, it's a memory making holiday versus like, you gotta see the fucking in-laws type thing. Actually, when I came to Pennsylvania originally, Jenny and I, we didn't go trick or treating, but we stayed out with candy as zombies. So we had like fake blood all over our faces and stuff like that. And it's a partial enjoyment. I think it's good for that.
00:22:11
Speaker
Did you try to scare the kids as you gave them the candy? No, we were very gregarious, but The problem was like the kids took the candy and so I never did that again I was like if I had candy, why would I give it to kids like now? I don't have candy anymore. Yeah, that doesn't seem like the play Okay, that's all I have to say As last thing I will say it's very weird to
00:22:40
Speaker
looking back, just in grand, like you knew all your neighbors to a degree in the development or wherever you were. But just so weird to like walk up to somebody like who you're not close with and you're not like, Oh, I know this person and just knock at their door and you're like, I hope they bring me candy. That's the expectation.
00:23:00
Speaker
It's really funny. The inverse here is like, don't talk to strangers. By the way, on this one holiday, make sure you talk to strangers as much as possible to maximize your candy profits. There's one pedophile politician who's like, I'm going to start a thing. Oh, no. Yeah. Yeah, it is kind of odd. Mm hmm.
00:23:24
Speaker
I feel like a lot of holidays have odd traditions that stem from somebody did it once. Everyone's like, yeah, okay, that's what it is. And you can just take stuff over. Christmas was like a pagan holiday and it's like now people are like, don't take Christ out of Christmas and stuff like that. And it's like, that wasn't even yours, but sure, whatever. I guess. That was literally done to try and override the pagan holiday.
00:23:49
Speaker
If I remember correctly, I believe it. This brings me back to my whole point. Christianity is a cult. It's a cult. All right. We are at the 23 minute mark. I don't know what it'll come out after the edit. We're like three minutes in after we cut that first segment. So how is Christianity a cult?
Religious Upbringing & Beliefs
00:24:14
Speaker
I sat back in the chair. I moved the microphone closer. I don't know. Is it against the spirit of the holidays to just dig on religion in a random talk cast?
00:24:27
Speaker
No, fuck him. Okay. I'm not them. I was going to say more of, do you remember any other specific traditions that you grew up with either around holidays or maybe just with your family? I mean, mostly the traditional stuff like visit grandma and Thanksgiving sort of things. Um, very traditional, I guess, for the most part, um, my parents were like, were like, they're still around as far as I know. Um, very,
00:24:55
Speaker
very kind of conservative, but not even like prior to political conservative, more like crazy religious kind of corner, then later more political. And so I honestly think that's probably the reason Halloween kind of died off is we just didn't really celebrate it.
00:25:20
Speaker
Cause why would we celebrate something that's associated with the devil and demons and witches and all this stuff, right? Like literally that is the reason that wasn't a thing. I feel like our lives could be so much more.
00:25:35
Speaker
fun and interesting or just at least not tainted if we didn't grow up with Christian parents. Because I know you've talked about your parents destroying your Pokemon cards because they're like, ah, evil. I'm sure I had a degree of some of that where certain things got judged unnecessarily.
00:25:57
Speaker
which at the time caused me to kind of more rubber band in the other way. When you get to those rebellious years of like, my parents don't know shit that to be fair, looking back, they probably didn't actually know as much. Um, that's yeah. You go through rubber bands of phases, but, um, I guess, I guess it is a phase, but I, I share the same impression. I want to agree with you on that as there was, um,
00:26:22
Speaker
My grandparents in particular, I remember one in particular, um, she's passed now, but I mean, I have fond memories of her in general. Um, and, uh, I remember her at some point saying, respect your elders. And I was like, okay. And then I thought about it when I was later and I was like,
00:26:40
Speaker
What does that mean, right? Like, because I get it, but also that's a very specific sort of respect and not to like all lives matter, black lives matter type thing, but I had that thought for respect. I was like, why should I disrespect other people and elders are just exempt from that or are elders more worthy of respect?
00:27:04
Speaker
than other people, which I think is the intent. She was trying to get across with that.
00:27:14
Speaker
I came to just like disagree with that, right? Like I'll be checking out like Taco Bell and try to consciously call the like 17 year old girl at the that's like handing me the soda ma'am or like the guy sir or whatever, right? Cause like I had one person do that for me once when I was working at Sears as a freaking teenager. And I was like, that felt kind of nice. That's cool.
00:27:41
Speaker
And so why not respect everybody until they prove they don't deserve it, right? Like that's a much better life lesson to tell people. Why base all of this on like some, this comes back to your point, right? It really feels like I've gone off in the left field, but like you're investing authority arbitrarily. Yeah, don't do that.
00:28:05
Speaker
And it's not like parents and adults know what they're talking about all of the time. They're just grown up kids. And some of them have gone through enough trauma that they don't have fun anymore. And that's it. Yeah, I feel like Respect Your Elders was just.
00:28:22
Speaker
I mean, granted, it's not like a terrible practice on its own, but probably more so for like a kids, please stop being shitty. I need a fucking minute, respect your elders type thing, which again, it's probably fair. Respect my authority.
00:28:41
Speaker
I don't know. I feel like if we're breaking it down, I feel like respect specifically needs to be earned. But at face value, I'll say I need somebody at social gathering or something or I run into them at the grocery store, they're checking me out type thing. You're just like, I am that good. These watermelons are free. Watermelons plural.
00:29:07
Speaker
But treat people with politeness and a degree of respect. Don't come and swing and not a stranger, ever. I was on calls with different insurances and stuff today to be like, what the fuck are you guys doing? But I was very polite and I talked to them and said, hey, here's my current understanding of what the thing is.
00:29:28
Speaker
Um, what information do you know? And like, let's come to an understanding or something. Do I necessarily respect those people? Maybe not, but like treat them as people, you know? Right. Yeah.
00:29:42
Speaker
Yeah, working in retail helps with that too. When you are basically reduced to a point of service for something, you start to see other people who have also been reduced to a point of service. You got to figure everybody's had minimum wage jobs or something at some point or something where
00:30:07
Speaker
They're just doing something to get by, and it's not what they want for their whole life, but this is just the interaction you have with them right now. I don't know. Don't be a cunt. Whenever I get off the phone with somebody or even on work calls, I'll be talking to somebody with something like, hey, thank you so much. I was trying to say, hey, thank you so much. I really appreciate that.
00:30:31
Speaker
Yeah. Regardless of what the degree of it is, maybe you answered, you gave me a number that I was looking for and that was it. Thanks. I really appreciate that. Yeah. Cause like, what's the other thing? Like, fuck you. I don't know. Try and leave it. Yeah. Just accepting as somebody who is often hurt. I know it's not received as, Oh, he's just busy and dismissive. He comes off as like, why does that person hate me? What did I do wrong?
00:31:01
Speaker
Uh-huh. Yeah. Yeah. So anyways, that's why your religion's bad. Um, no. Do we want to talk about the Crusades? No, there's more to it than that. I don't know. I, I, I think that there are good.
00:31:20
Speaker
Religions out there or I'm of the opinion that there's non harmful religions or beneficial religions or maybe even that many religions have beneficial aspects to them including community and Christianity and stuff like that, but I Don't know that the cost of
00:31:40
Speaker
separating one group from another group. We already talked about this, like we talked about tribal groupings and things like that. I think it extends beyond a lot of the benefits. But I also don't really want to convince people of something that they, the opposite of something
00:32:02
Speaker
I don't want to get people to turn away from something that is making their life better in the immediate term, if that makes any sense. I know people that are happy, that are religious, and I wouldn't really want to try to convince them anything else.
00:32:18
Speaker
Just like good on you. I thought about it a lot and I am not there So I'm fine if people have their whatever individual beliefs. I'm not trying to infringe upon that But Christianity just being the example I'm most familiar with There's a lot of stuff now this not everybody might subscribe to the exact same Christianity but it exists and pretty like the wide sweeping swaths who have the country and
00:32:43
Speaker
and other places is homophobia as an example, right? It's codified in the Bible that homosexuality is a sin. Now, as nice as pie as Christians may be on the surface, I had a friend who recently transitioned and he grew up in the church as well. I should say they grew up in the church as well. And they were talking to some friends and trying to say, hey,
00:33:12
Speaker
they were of the mind that they couldn't continue to be friends with somebody who, as much as they might say that they love that person at face value, as much as they might like when to spend time with them in the back of their minds, you're saying like, Hey, this person is a sin. I don't agree with their lifestyle. Yeah. And like, it's a constant. They could never be on the same page with that. Yeah.
00:33:35
Speaker
It's hard. It's hard to reconcile that. It was one of the, one of the hardest points I think of Christianity. Did I ever talk about, we must've talked about our, our, our religious backgrounds at some point on the episode. We have here and there. I don't know if we ever went into full detail, but it's one of those things that always just comes up intermittently, like Elden Ring.
00:33:56
Speaker
Yes, the Elden Ring and our religious roots right there. Religious roots? Oh, I see what you did there. Because the roots are actually from the tree. Yes, yeah. But I mean, that was a similar story for me. That was kind of like one of the insightful, not insightful, inciting
00:34:18
Speaker
uh, incidents or something like that, was I realized that I was being a jerk to someone online because they were, you know, um, I think she was, she was gay. And when I found that out, this person who was otherwise being friendly with, I was like, I instinctively as a teenager basically was just like, just reject this person. Like, like just reject them, get them away from you, all of this stuff. And I literally like got up, walked away from the computer.
00:34:46
Speaker
And then thought about it for a second. I was like, I wouldn't have used this word back then, but translating to current vernacular, am I a douchebag? And I came to the conclusion, yes, actually.
00:35:00
Speaker
I am being hurtful for no justifiable reason. Like this is a friendly person who is being friendly to me. And I started rejecting them because of my insecurity in this and what I've been taught about how homosexuality is a sin and things like that. And I went back and I thankfully had the opportunity to apologize and she was gracious enough to just be like,
00:35:22
Speaker
should accept it. And I mean, like, it's not like we talked a bunch. These were the early Internet years when you just kind of just met people online and you talk to them for a bit and then they just vanish into the ether. But it was an important moment for me where I was like, just because somebody else is different and your group tells you that you should that they should be treated a different way.
00:35:49
Speaker
or like they shouldn't be accepted as they are, that there is something wrong with them. That's not like a justifiable reason to actually treat them different in any way. And also, there's something wrong that people who are nice to you that are friendly, that you intrinsically think that they're sinful.
00:36:15
Speaker
and that kind of just started tearing at the, it was a little bit of tearing at the fabric of just like, what caused me to be this way in this moment?
00:36:30
Speaker
I know I've mentioned my cousin Kevin before. Kevin would never listen to this podcast so I can dunk on him freely. All Kevin's actually. If your name is Kevin, fuck you. I don't dislike my cousin Kevin. I think he can occasionally be like a bit of a wanker and I'm only borrowing that term because my dad would use it often to describe certain people. I'm like, I like that. I'm a bit of a wanker. It's a good one.
00:36:54
Speaker
But he was, as long as I knew him, very anti-authority, anti-establishment. So I did model his example a little bit to a degree. And I was like, why is he the way that he is? Another one was I was hanging out with, again, people who I don't normally associate with. I'm not super close with my aunt and uncle on my mom's side.
00:37:17
Speaker
I forget how it came up in conversation, but essentially I made the statement of I really hope that nobody gay hits on me. Now, again, I'm very young, so it's not like I was in the market or anybody was attracted to a 13-year-old me to my knowledge. And they just said, why?
00:37:41
Speaker
That's all they said, just why. And I was like, I don't know. And they provided good things of like, it's not a bad thing. And it's just, oh, somebody thinks that you're attractive, they're hitting on you. That's, if anything, a very nice thing. Now that I'm the age that I am and have a degree of life experience, I'm like,
00:38:00
Speaker
Oh, yeah, I was an asshole back then. Yeah, right. Because I remember the last time I was hit on at a bar, which is sad because it's been many years. Get to it, people. Thank you. But you stopped going to bars. That was the main problem. I should go to bars. It was also the last time I went to a bar. But I was out in Philly with somebody who was dating at the time. And it was like, maybe it's her birthday or something.
00:38:26
Speaker
But I went to go get like a refill on drink. So go back to the bar, trying to like order like some pretzels and cheese. And there's like a very, very drunk trans person with their friend. And like they kept hitting on me. They're like, Hey, and like they had a bit of like the drunks.
00:38:42
Speaker
sway. And they were very friendly and polite. They weren't overly aggressive, but they made it very forward and known that they were interested in me. And their friends were like, I'm sorry. I was like, no, this is great. Thank you. I was like, sorry, I'm not interested. I'm currently taken as well. But I did appreciate it in the moment.
00:39:02
Speaker
And it's such a shift from when I grew up and it's just gross. And then I later realized like, oh, it's not gross at all. It just was different. And I just couldn't comprehend that at the time.
00:39:17
Speaker
I think it takes, I think it takes an interaction like that. It takes someone experience, someone experience of someone asking you why or yourself asking you why you're reacting like that. Cause I really do feel like I want to interject to say, I think that's true. If, if you were brought up that way specifically, you need those experiences to check yourself. Whereas I feel if people don't grow up that way.
00:39:45
Speaker
they probably wouldn't default to that as much maybe. Yeah, and that's aligned around what I was gonna say, which was like, if you grow up in a society that's gonna treat these other groups, these other people as other people, as other groups, like it's just gonna reinforce that initial lack of a question.
00:40:08
Speaker
I don't want to be hit on by a gay guy or like she's different. She's gay. And I think that that's a sin. So I'm not going to be comfortable talking to her as friendly as I was before. Like if you're in a group that and surrounded by people that encourage that, there you go.
00:40:28
Speaker
50 years pass and you're in the same headspace. You've done nothing but cultivate that experience. Then it takes something like your kid comes out and you're faced with the question once more. You didn't have the opportunity earlier in life, now it's here. How do you treat the people that you don't understand?
00:40:52
Speaker
And I mean, that's the reason it's beneficial to have people that ask you that question. Why?
00:41:00
Speaker
You're acting out or you're being a jerk to this person. Why is that? That's how you get kids that start off just ostracizing others to stop doing that. You give them the opportunity for some introspection and if they think about it and they understand it and they're empathic about it, then that's room to grow.
00:41:24
Speaker
Yeah. Growing up, having empathetic people around you just, ooh, hollanders. Yeah. I think. Good. I, I was just going to say like, that was me talking to a lot of people online, right? Like a lot of different opinions. Some of them are Christian. Some of them weren't people from games, all that stuff. And I was just like, dang, people are different. Yeah. Did you ever have the phase of being
00:41:54
Speaker
and you're like, I've got to save all these Christian people. You became like the battle atheists. You're like, I'm going to use logic and reason to dismantle these fucking Christian cunts. Did you ever have that? I don't think I was ever like fedora twirling.
00:42:10
Speaker
But I definitely had a moment. It was probably after, I guess, falling away or it's not apotheosis that's sending to Godhood. That's definitely something in Isaac. Yeah. But it's also the, what is it? Apostate, becoming an apostate.
00:42:34
Speaker
Apostasis. I don't know what it is. Anyways, there was a moment where, because the thing that broke it down for me, it was like the three chair principle.
Questioning Faith & Personal Beliefs
00:42:42
Speaker
If God is all good and all powerful and all knowing why is the world the way it is, that's the core of it. I'm not going to break open the shell that is that.
00:42:53
Speaker
Because a bunch of people already have But that applied with Certain examples throughout creation and the Bible and my life and my family's life led me to be like Yep Doesn't add up Something something's wrong here, and I don't even know maybe God exists. I just don't think that he exists in the way that Christianity thinks he does and I
00:43:20
Speaker
don't think that he's particularly good if he is that powerful. And that's basically the side I landed on. And there's no reason to really believe he exists outside of. If you need something to believe, you needed something to kick it all off. But yeah, I struck, you know, who knows what that is? Yeah, I was about to put on my fedora for like a second there. I think a lot of my thing was initially
00:43:51
Speaker
Christianity was my whole life for a time because I did up through elementary school and then during the entirety of middle school, I was homeschooled because I didn't want to. It's just me as a kid not wanting to go to school and mom being like, this is an alternative. I'm like, okay, let's do that.
00:44:12
Speaker
And I was a smart enough kid and I succeeded with that. At a point, I'm like, I'm going to kill my parents because it was just I had no separation and I needed to integrate those people. So I went back to high school, but I still a Christian kid, right? And I would even invite my friends like youth group stuff. And it wasn't weird, but I was also the one guy. I was the only one in my friend group
00:44:37
Speaker
But people are like chill. We just hang out and stuff. I didn't like try and pressure people or anything like that. But it's just cool to hang out with people. And I'm glad that they were willing to come along with me to my weird shit. But when I eventually came out of that, I'm like, Oh, what is my God?
00:44:56
Speaker
And I was like, oh, it's probably logic and reason, things that you can empirically prove. So I definitely leaned more into logic and science and math to kind of determine who I was as a person and what I valued, things that made sense, things that could be understood and defined. So there's definitely a period where I wanted to validate my existence
00:45:20
Speaker
by shitting on other people who were in this incorrect train of thought to make up for the years. I'm like, no, it's me who was right. But I think we've simmered down since by a long shot. Yeah. I mean, I don't know you as a militant atheist or anything like that. I think it's
00:45:46
Speaker
I think I respect the people who think about it truthfully and honestly, and then come to a conclusion. Kind of regardless, I do have a measure. I'm not like, accept everything. So it's like, I do think that if you think about it logically, and you follow the same train of thought I had, and you have the same preconception of God that I had, kind of like in contemporary Christianity, there are some things that don't add up.
00:46:16
Speaker
But would I convince people of that? Like I have a friend in Australia and I hadn't talked to her for like a very, very long time. I talked to her recently, a couple of months back. And she said,
00:46:32
Speaker
I was just like, hey, haven't reached out in years. How are things going, basically? And she was like, oh, it's good and all this stuff. And she's very religious, hyper-involved with her church, married to someone who's also very religious. They have a baby who I assume will be very religious.
00:46:54
Speaker
And not necessarily in a bad way, always in a kind, loving, all of this way. I make all types of assumptions here, but I don't have anything bad to say about her for that, right?
00:47:06
Speaker
And I was like thinking about this and I was like talking about all these concepts, catching up and things like that. And here's this one. The last time we talked, I was a Christian and now I consider myself like an ex-Christian, essentially. And I was like, I kind of just want to brush over this.
00:47:27
Speaker
Like I don't feel any need to introduce complication or make you feel bad if you believe that my soul is in jeopardy now, right? Like, why would I put you in that position? Let's just talk about, you know, birds and chipmunks and stuff. Yeah, honestly, it's.
00:47:48
Speaker
I like the heart to heart discussions. If you remember the one time I went on that work trip in another country, I was with another coworker of ours who is religious. And we did end up talking about stuff. And it was nice having a drunken back and forth. We were just asking questions to each other. And it was a nice, honest, genuine thing. And I like stuff like that. I like to be challenged. I like to challenge.
00:48:16
Speaker
If it's an honest thing I hate though if somebody has like an underlying They're trying to get like a point across or like selling have an agenda yeah, and I don't know if you've ever noticed this with people but sometimes you can
00:48:32
Speaker
Their manner of speech or communication is in such where it's like, late some breadcrumbs, late some breadcrumbs, loaf of bread. And you're like, ah, that's what it is. It's almost like there's a script. They're reeling you in for the payoff.
00:48:51
Speaker
Look at their cue cards to memorize my Christian talking points. It's essentially that, but I mean, at least I was taught that to a degree of, if somebody questions you believe, how can you minister to them? How can you try and convert them? How can you have them join your cult? Apologetics. Yeah. Which is,
00:49:15
Speaker
different than what I thought it was initially. Yeah, it sounds like it's going to be the study of good apologies, but no, it's defending one's faith. What's the other one that's very confusing? Well, I don't know what we're talking about.
00:49:32
Speaker
Got it. It's basically like just talking to people, but the other version of the word or phrase, sorry, forensics versus forensic science, two entirely different things. I once went to like a forensics thing as a kid. I'm like, there's a class for this. That's so cool. Because like at the time was like, oh, science to figure out murders and whatnot. And there's just people talking. And I looked at my parents and like,
00:49:57
Speaker
Yo, I don't know who fucked up, but uh, that's funny. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. I don't, I don't think I have all of, I definitely don't have all the answers.
Kindness, Understanding, & Perspective
00:50:12
Speaker
I might not even be right, but I thought about it and was true to the conclusions I came to. And I think that's basically the most you can do. And then just try not
00:50:23
Speaker
This goes back to don't be a C, the lesson Dave was espousing earlier. Yeah, don't be a C or like don't be a jerk to people. It's, you know, golden rule unless you're a masochist. That's the way to live life. Treat others like you want to be treated. Yeah. And I listen to people a lot because I think in general, I just do not talk as much as other people talk. Also, people like to
00:50:54
Speaker
share stuff or just go on about things. So I've heard people talk about a number of things, whether it's people I know, people from work or other stuff. And sometimes I will hear people talk about somebody who, granted, they're complaining about something so minor, so so minor, so vehemently.
00:51:15
Speaker
And I try to tell the person, hey, I agree with you. They sound shitty. But honestly, if they're complaining about this, this is the biggest thing they have going on in their life. This is huge to them. So either the rest of their life is fucking peachy, or there's a shitty person. This is their one thing. But try and approach it with a degree of empathy.
00:51:42
Speaker
I don't know. Everybody has their own shit, their own backstory. I'm not saying as users, like a giant broom to sweep away people's bullshit. Right. I think you can love people without forgiving all of the things that they do. That's true. That makes sense. No, that's pretty profound.
00:52:05
Speaker
I think context, or not context, but scope helps for some things like that, right? You're describing people complaining about day-to-day issues. I think we talked about this recently. That is relative to scale. Rich people have completely different issues and they probably worry about them a fair amount.
00:52:27
Speaker
middle class people have a set of issues and they worry about them a fair amount. Poor people have a set of issues and that might be life threatening, you know, but they worry about them. But it's like, it's not like you're going to cross a threshold and then be like, that's it.
00:52:40
Speaker
No more stress hormone. I'm good. Like, so like people are dealing with all kinds of crap throughout their lives and you don't know. What like to them, like what scale their responses, right? So what seems insignificant to one individual could be very significant to the person and how they feel is valid regardless of, you know, the situation that they're in.
00:53:10
Speaker
Yeah. I was there. Okay. Go ahead. It, it felt like initially there was agreement, but then after you finished that, I was like, I probably phrased my thing a little bit poorly. Yeah. Well, I mean, no, that's all good. I think, I think he got it.
00:53:32
Speaker
I, uh, this is, this is completely random by comparison, but I remember when I was like a little kid, not a little kid, probably teenager. I was like, uh, we didn't live in like a big city or anything like that. It was a small kind of like urban area, not near a major city, but rural would be the word for it.
00:53:50
Speaker
I was like dang you ever like have those nights where it's outside. There's like no light pollution and it's just The cosmos you're just like here are The stars I was like looking up and I was like those are honestly like some of the most religious feeling moments I've experienced in my life It's just the concept like
00:54:12
Speaker
we're spinning really fast right now. And I'm like number whatever of seven billion. And I was really concerned about what grade I got on that final I just took. But man, I'm spinning really fast right now, right? Like everyone else is worried about something. And you walk down the street and everyone else is worried about something.
00:54:37
Speaker
Um, so much so that that's mostly what they focus on and they don't see you as much because of it. And it's just, it grants perspective. It's hard to like get as upset at the little things or try to like nitpick people or poke with people you disagree with when it's like, man, it's so small, right?
00:55:01
Speaker
That's what she said. But also, like, all of this is so scary. In the grand scheme of things, your penis is nothing! Yeah. I don't know. It helps.
00:55:12
Speaker
No, it does. I think we talked about this on a previous episode of getting upset at video games. I think that was the context. Oh, yeah. And just like sometimes even like step away from things because it really just does. You just need the recontextualization. Like the feelings you have are valid regardless of when you're feeling them. But at the same time, you should not let them
00:55:38
Speaker
your emotions should not control you entirely at any given point. You shouldn't try and like snub them. You should feel them freely. Um, but it shouldn't be your life. So like anytime I have, if I like feel like shit, either physically or emotionally, it doesn't magically go away. But a lot of times like I take it with a grain of salt and the other potions I take, um, salt's part of it. A little bit of sugar, a little bit of salt potion.
00:56:07
Speaker
Everything nice. That's just salt water, Dave. You will throw up. I don't swallow, I just gargle. Ah, okay. That's acceptable. But like you talk to other people and you hear about what's going on with them, or you're like, oh, there's a fucking hurricane happening. And you're like, my thing doesn't seem like the worst thing. You know? Yeah.
00:56:32
Speaker
I mean, it is, I think that like imagine starving children in Africa is a little bit played out at this point, but it doesn't have to go that far. It's just like, it doesn't have to be literally go to the extremes. No, it's just.
00:56:47
Speaker
It's very easy to have things go wrong and catastrophize them because it's easy to connect the dots of this thing's going wrong. This other thing's going wrong, which means this thing's going to go wrong. Yeah. And like life's not perfect by any means. Whole bunch of shit, whole bunch of fuck shit happens all the time. A stack.
00:57:08
Speaker
Yeah, it's in order. Oh, all right, everybody back out in reverse order But it's not the end of everything I don't know like I Feel like I've had so many of these conversations throughout my life and like my hard cut off as if my heart was cut off You know, like if I lost my dick
00:57:30
Speaker
I feel like that would definitely influence how I approach life to the point that I might not want to approach life or if I couldn't eat food, you know? But that's the skill for you. Other people have been in that position and they've still found other things to worry about. What's that situation taking care of? I feel like we're
00:57:57
Speaker
Are we circling? What's the opposite of the drain though? Like we're, we started at the drain and we've spun out since we're now somewhere. Yeah. Or rapidly just rowing backwards. But then I take the mic and I start rowing towards the drain and you become cognizant of how far we've been circling and you start rowing backwards. Yeah. Um, the TLDR is, um, Christianity is a cult as most religions are, but
00:58:25
Speaker
I don't know, try and interact with people in a positive way and try and understand where they're coming from, even if they're not the most approachable, even if you don't like what they're doing. Again, you don't have to be their friend. You don't have to do nice things for them. You just have to not kill them and harbor hate because it just burns so much of your time, so much of your time and energy.
00:58:49
Speaker
And enable made that mistake and we're you know, we're still here. It's so hard not to kill people. Oh my gosh Also, I grew up at a point not liking or understanding gay people Right now somebody just wrote me off like this fucking homophobe over here Okay, maybe I wouldn't be in the situation. I'm in now right where I
00:59:11
Speaker
I don't have a whole lot of gay friends. I'm sure I have a handful here and there, but I don't dislike anybody for who they are. And I needed somebody to check me, several people to check me and other life experiences to get to that point. So maybe you can be the life experience for somebody else. Right.
00:59:32
Speaker
Yeah, a friendly check. Sometimes all it takes, you know, kickstart, uh, you can't change people, but if someone has the potential for that empathy, you may be able to kickstart it. And that is pretty much what the world needs.
00:59:50
Speaker
A Kickstarter. A Kickstarter. Related. If you're a fan of the show, we have financial decision. We should just make a bucket that can exist for free and just see who puts money in it. Just like a coffee thing or something like that where people can just buy you coffee.
01:00:14
Speaker
Yeah. And you see how much money we can accrue. We'd only put it back into this. And granted, we could probably just buy a coffee. I don't think we'd make much. No. Yes. And not a flavored coffee or anything like that. It's going to be beans and water. That's where we're at. Oh, they haven't filtered the beans out of the water. They're just in the water as well. Just dump them in. Eat this. You mean drink. Oh. No, it would be really funny, though, to like
01:00:44
Speaker
talk about religion for the better part of an episode and then cap it off with like, we need you to send in your seed donations to our faithful faith-based organization. Got to have faith. Maybe you don't though. I'm not going to even ask you for words of advice because this was probably like words of advice and soul searching the episode.
01:01:09
Speaker
You know, also fuck candy canes the episode. Yeah, they're dangerous. Don't do that. But yeah, if you guys have great holiday snacks, what are your favorites or deep and insightful stories of how you found or fell away from religion?
01:01:28
Speaker
You can send those into soapstonepodcastgml.com or join the discussion on Facebook at facebook.com slash soapstone podcast. And as always, we'll see you in the next one. Have a good night.
01:02:06
Speaker
Oh.