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Lockdown + Dave Recap
10 Plays7 days ago
‘Lockdown’ brings one of the season’s most jaw-dropping moments as Locke finds himself trapped in the hatch and glimpses something that changes everything. Then in ‘Dave,’ Hurley’s mental health takes center stage, blurring the line between reality and illusion. Our uncle recalls the mind-blowing twists fans obsessed over, while Nick breaks down his theories about the hatch map, the button, and starts to question what is real and what is not.
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Transcript
Podcast Introduction
00:00:21
Speaker
Terrific.
00:00:24
Speaker
You're listening to the Lost with My Uncle podcast. I'm Aaron DS and I'll be rewatching Lost along with my nephew Nick who will be watching it for the very first time.
00:00:36
Speaker
So
Hosts' Roles and Podcast Theme
00:00:37
Speaker
come along with us and enjoy the journey.
00:00:42
Speaker
Let's get lost. Let's get lost.
00:00:51
Speaker
Hello, hello, and welcome back to The Lost with My Uncle. We are your Lost Rewatch and First Timers podcast. And I'm Aaron Diaz, a proud millennial rewatching Lost.
00:01:04
Speaker
And I'm the Gen Z nephew Nick, who has somehow, amazingly, survived another week on this insane island without losing my mind. Unlike some of our favorite characters that we're about to discuss.
00:01:18
Speaker
Maybe after this episode, I need be, you know, um and I need to join them. Maybe. Oh man, Nick, you're in for a treat with these two episodes. We've got
Upcoming Exciting Elements in 'Lost'
00:01:29
Speaker
Blast Doors, Imaginary Friends, and some of the most intense reveals about our mysterious prisoner, Henry Gale.
00:01:37
Speaker
don't Don't talk to me about Henry. Not Henry. Don't talk to me about not Henry. i I mean, there's no way that he's not an other of some kind.
00:01:49
Speaker
there's no There's no way in, like, the world. Mm-hmm. I mean, I have no words about Henry Gale. What I do have words about is Locke willing to sacrifice almost everything for his dad's acceptance, which is actually wild.
00:02:09
Speaker
Yeah, it is wild. And we're going to get into all that and more, plus we get to see Hurley's developing backstory, which, let's just say, gets pretty heavy this episode.
00:02:21
Speaker
Mm-hmm.
00:02:24
Speaker
But before we get into it, as always, we love hearing your feedback. Listeners, please feel free to send us your comments, questions, theories.
Listener Engagement
00:02:31
Speaker
Blow our minds at lostwithmyunclepod at gmail.com.
00:02:35
Speaker
Again, that's lostwithmyunclepod at gmail.com. So without wasting any additional time, let's get lost. Let's do it. So we have a couple of what I think are really good episodes here. And we're in episodes 17 and 18 of season two. Hard to believe we're that far already.
'Lockdown' Episode Discussion
00:02:54
Speaker
hey Episode 17 is called Lockdown. And Nick, you nailed this one. It's a lock centric episode that yeah really continues the off island dysfunctional relationship with his father while also sabotaging his chances with someone who actually loves him.
00:03:11
Speaker
but also gives us one of the most intense hatch sequences yet. So this episode starts off with cliffhanger from our last episode where we've got Locke and Jack staring unbelievably at not Henry or fake Henry, whatever we want to call him, who has just dropped psycho truth bombs all over them.
00:03:31
Speaker
And they want Henry to redraw the map for them. Henry's like, I was joking. I was frustrated. There's nothing out there but my balloons. And Jack looks at Locke and says, put him back in the armory, which Henry once again uses as fuel to get at Locke.
00:03:46
Speaker
I mean, yeah and and I know when I heard him say, i just don't know why you let him talk to you like that. It sets Locke off and he literally grabs him by like a collar and shoves him in that armory.
00:04:01
Speaker
He's not handling it very well. And He's got all these strengths in other areas, but he is having a extremely hard time with the idea that other people don't hold him the same leader or respect you know him as an equal to Jack.
00:04:17
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. And I'm sure, Nick, that you loved our Jack and Hurley interaction where he asks about Anna Lucia's crew and Hurley's like, it would help if you kept me in the loop.
00:04:30
Speaker
he I actually did. i did do that. I i wrote notes for this this first episode. The second episode, i was a little too involved to write notes down. But I actually wrote i wrote that down. I wrote, you know, maybe if I was in the loop, I could be more helpful. and No one tells me anything.
00:04:47
Speaker
I was a really big fan. Fun scene. And, you know, at the end, Jack going, there is no loop, Hurley. And Claire interrupts with baby Aaron. Hurley doesn't quit. He's like, loop, dude.
00:04:58
Speaker
Loop. Yeah. And I will say, um i think the show is kind of, in a way, and we talked about this, teasing the next episode, or who at least is the next character is goingnna be centric around.
00:05:18
Speaker
Because there's not a ton of characters that, like, like let's Hurley's not a regular character. like We won't see him in every single episode. So if we do see him,
00:05:28
Speaker
you know I feel like it kind of is like, okay. like I saw him at the beginning and was thinking like maybe the next episode's a Hurley episode. And bingo. yep Yeah, that's interesting.
00:05:43
Speaker
And this episode, Lockdown, was, dare I say it, Nick, it was a great one from my perspective. Do you agree, disagree? And also, what did you think when those blast doors started coming down?
00:05:57
Speaker
um I think in terms of on-island action, there was very little. Sure.
00:06:08
Speaker
However, i will say, for me, this felt like one of the most gut-wrenching episodes we've had in a while. At least with Locke and his squashbacks.
00:06:21
Speaker
I mean, he's had a troubled past. He's had an extremely
Locke's Leadership Challenges
00:06:25
Speaker
troubled past. I loved the episodes. I loved everything about the Blast Doors. i As soon as that happened... I i had two drop-jaw moments during this episode.
00:06:38
Speaker
The Blast Doors was... Or, sorry, three. The first one was the Blast Thorns coming down. I was not expecting that. I knew Michael, and and I knew that there was going to be something that had to do with him because Michael mentioned him yeah ages and ages and ages and ages ago.
00:06:54
Speaker
That was one of those moments where I was drop jaw. Locke episodes are always a a big fan. um like i'm I'm a huge fan. And then... getting Henry Gale involved as well with the, with the blast doors. mean, it's, it's, it's, it's a great episode, but I also feel like, i don't know. I, it's kind of hard for me to place it.
00:07:17
Speaker
It's very hard for me to place it. and That's all i'll say. That's fair. I mean, it's very contained to off Island and then the hatch. Like you said, there's not, there's not a lot of Island stuff. It's just the hatch really.
00:07:30
Speaker
Right, which I'm not complaining about. I feel like it's really hard to place it for me because ah have an episode like Maternity Leave, which was so good. And this was great, but it was so great in a completely different way.
00:07:43
Speaker
and it's the same thing with the episode Dave, where it's complete like it's a complete different ballpark. Like that episode, you know these i want to say those three episodes were very, very, very different from what we're used to.
00:08:00
Speaker
Yeah.
00:08:03
Speaker
Yeah, and it's it's kind of crazy how the whole Blastor thing came to to be this episode. One Minute Lock is investigating all those alarms and sounds, and he's really, you know, losing it with Henry, because Henry's being super annoying this episode also, just continually saying, John, what's going on out there, John? Yeah, yeah, no, he's extremely annoying.
00:08:26
Speaker
Sorry, not Henry. I'll correct you. Yeah, not Henry. That works. And Locke, of course, tries to figure things out once the the doors do come down, but he ends up asking Henry for his help, who turns around and is like, look, I need your word, John, that you will protect me no matter what.
00:08:47
Speaker
And so John's like, he opens the door. He's like, what's your name? He says, my name's Henry Gale. And he's like, all right, Henry, you have my word.
00:08:58
Speaker
Yeah.
00:09:01
Speaker
He said specifically, I'm Henry Gale. I'm from Minnesota. And that, like I said, last episode, I said I was 120% positive. I'm 150% confident at this point because no one's like, okay, that it just feels so unbelievably scripted.
00:09:21
Speaker
You know? Yeah. I'm Henry Gale. I'm from Minnesota. Right? Like,
00:09:29
Speaker
extremely, extremely scripted. If someone asked me who I was, i wouldn't say, ah you know Nick, whatever, and like just drop my entire like government name every singular time.
00:09:44
Speaker
Right? Right. yeah If I'd been kept prisoner with them for so long, they know who I am. If I'm innocent, they know who I am.
00:09:53
Speaker
So you wouldn't say Nick nick Johnson from Albuquerque? Yeah, I would
Speculation on Henry Gale's Identity
00:09:58
Speaker
not say Nick Johnson. I would not say Nick Johnson from Albuquerque, New Mexico. All right.
00:10:04
Speaker
Good to know. Good to know.
00:10:07
Speaker
And after Locke brings Henry, not Henry, fake Henry into the equation here, they're trying to pry the blast doors up and they...
00:10:18
Speaker
stick a huge steel toolbox under it to kind of hold it. Locke has the bright idea to try to slide under it. And all of us watching this were like, don't do that, dude. And, you know, the timing couldn't have been worse as the doors come down, he gets his leg pinned and the 108 minute countdown timer is about to hit zero and it starts speeding up. And and so he has to trust Henry to go input the numbers. So talk about being stuck between a rock and a hard place there.
00:10:48
Speaker
I mean, there's a lot to unpack. First of all, extremely, incredibly stupid move by John Locke.
00:10:56
Speaker
Second, let's not forget, not Henry had an arrow shot through him like four days ago. How in the world is he going to help, you know, lift a blast door?
00:11:12
Speaker
And third, how in the world is John Locke not bleeding out with the way there's a steel peg lodged right in his leg? Right? Yeah.
00:11:23
Speaker
I mean, that's that's one of those things, or that's one of those moments where, you know, when you're watching a television show, sometimes you just have to suspend your... What's the saying? just Realism.
00:11:36
Speaker
Your disbelief, I guess. No, I don't know what the saying is. Yeah, I don't know. But just basically saying like that there's there's fantastical things that are going to happen because it's TV and we have to just like forget it, right? Yeah.
00:11:49
Speaker
Yeah.
00:11:53
Speaker
And before we get into the big reveal at the end, let's talk about those flashbacks. So we finally get to see a happy and content Locke who is getting ready to pop the question to his girlfriend, Helen. We've seen her and previous flashbacks this season.
00:12:07
Speaker
And he's got a ring and everything, and then his dad finds a way to basically slide back into his DMs and ruin everything, Nick.
00:12:16
Speaker
His dad's the worst. actually like I actually have no words besides the fact that I hate him so much. yeah So, so much. Agreed.
00:12:30
Speaker
I thought Locke had, you know, problems, like, daddy issues before, But seeing how manipulative Anthony Cooper was makes me so unbelievably furious.
00:12:46
Speaker
Like, fake death. and And, you know, it's so unbelievably sad because it's like, literally, he's going to propose to Helen and then he comes up.
00:12:59
Speaker
You know? Mm-hmm. They go to the funeral, but there's no one there. No one except two suspicious guys.
00:13:12
Speaker
And then it turns out, you know, fake death. Avoid paying back $700,000 that he stole. And he's using Locke to help him with this con.
00:13:25
Speaker
And so I thought that he was going to get conned by um Anthony Cooper. And that Anthony Cooper was going to get him in trouble with the two guys.
00:13:36
Speaker
And John falls right back into the, you know, the trap of lying to Helen. And I, I, it's just unbelievable.
00:13:47
Speaker
Yeah. It's sad. He threw everything away in an attempt to please his father. And think the hardest scene was where Helen shows up at the hotel and finds him with Cooper and turns down his proposal, and it's just heartbreaking. And kudos to Terry O'Quinn, who just nails Locke's devastation in that moment.
00:14:08
Speaker
I keep thinking about like Locke's life and how it could have been so much more different if he had chose a Helen instead of Anthony Cooper. And you know maybe he would have never ended up on that walkabout.
00:14:26
Speaker
And what put him on flight 815. So.
00:14:31
Speaker
And that's the tragedy of Locke. He keeps choosing the people who hurt him over the people who actually care about him. he but Let's get back to the island while Locke's trapped under the blast door. What did you think of the whole Jack versus Sawyer poker game subplot?
00:14:50
Speaker
It was great. I'm not going to lie. It was great. Seeing Hurley, Kate, Jack, and Sawyer play poker was amazing. ah
00:15:00
Speaker
I think it was, I mean, it was one of those saw ah subplots or side plots that that did its job of literally just being a side plot and not adding litter, like like didn't add anything to the episode at all.
00:15:11
Speaker
Yeah. Like they they just played poker. And you could argue like, okay, Jack got the medicine back, but you know i really don't think it was that you know important. But I still love it regardless. Sawyer's all, you know, I don't play for stuff. I play for answers.
00:15:28
Speaker
yeah And he's curious about Jack's tattoos, which I am too. But apparently Jack's been to Thailand. Yeah, we did learn that. And I wonder if that little tidbit of information will come back around.
00:15:43
Speaker
Bet you it will.
00:15:46
Speaker
But anyway, Jack puts on an absolute show and school Sawyer and Sawyer asks him, why didn't you ask for the guns? And Jack's reply was was so cool and nonchalant here. And he says, when I want the guns, I'll get the guns.
00:16:00
Speaker
But the real action is still happening when Locke is sending Henry to input the numbers and Henry's been gone for way too long.
00:16:10
Speaker
okay, I thought Henry was just going to leave. not Henry, was just going to leave and betray Locke. And I think the timer does hit zero when those UV lights come on and illuminate the blast door map.
00:16:26
Speaker
Yeah, that map is is so cool looking and and mysterious. and And Locke only gets to see it for just a few seconds before the lights come back on. But you can just see the look in his eyes as he's like taking it all in and trying to memorize it.
00:16:40
Speaker
So have to ask you, did you pause the episode and look deeper into the map or like i look it up online after you watched it? I'm literally going to do that right now. I'm going to go to the Netflix map and we're going to hear a live ah live reaction to my thoughts and and everything on that map because I i do i do want to.
00:16:58
Speaker
right, do it. What I'll tell you about the map now is... the the only So it's on the blast door. is is The map is on the blast door, which is interesting because that means in order to see the map, the blast door needs to be down.
00:17:17
Speaker
Right? And so the blast door is down. Blast doors are down for some reason. We don't necessarily know what reason the blast doors are down for.
Blast Doors and Mysteries
00:17:29
Speaker
But we can we can glean that they've been down before for other periods of time if yeah they have that stuff written on them. Yeah, okay, i'm I'm looking at it now. Let's see if I can get it better. Yeah, it was clearly like written by someone. It wasn't like something that was painted on there when they built the hatch or anything, is is my interpretation. Possibly Desmond?
00:17:50
Speaker
Possibly, yeah. Or Desmond's hatch. Didn't he mention that he had someone else working in the hatch with him? Yes, he did. Kelvin, maybe?
00:18:01
Speaker
Yes, Kelvin was his name. You're right. Okay.
00:18:06
Speaker
right, I'm looking at this now. There's a lot of like, i mean, it's not all map. Like when you look deeper into it, there's a lot of just random text that doesn't make any sense to me when I look at it.
00:18:19
Speaker
Okay, so I can't see it well enough to read any of the words. Okay. Okay, yeah, you'll have to ah you'll have to look on Lostpedia after the episode because they have a whole page dedicated to the Blastorm map.
00:18:34
Speaker
And it has it has all of the scribbles that whoever wrote it has on the sides also. Okay. i'm I'm getting a picture of what this is. Okay, so there's a giant hexagon.
00:18:50
Speaker
Which, by the way, all the Dharma stuff and has a hexagon on it. So there's a giant hexagon here. And it looks like there's what appears to be seven hatches or bunkers or whatever surrounding one big thing in the center.
00:19:07
Speaker
Yep. The one on the bottom appears to be Swan. There seems to be one towards the top left, which seems to be the arrow. ah I bet you one of these is the medical facility.
00:19:20
Speaker
Yeah. So there's actually seven. I've been talking about how I think there's four or maybe five. There's actually seven. And this is a map where the other bunkers are and whatnot.
00:19:31
Speaker
Yep. Okay. Interesting. All right. We're getting answers. We are We're getting answers. I love it. and I think that you'll, you'll really enjoy, I'll send you the link to that after the podcast. And I'm sure you'll enjoy taking a peek at the image a little more.
00:19:50
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. So... So... Question. Yeah, yeah. Did Henry push the button or not?
00:20:00
Speaker
But I don't know. You know, I think he waited. i think he waited until it hit zero, because how else would he know about the... I mean, we kind of get an answer to this in 18. But he says that he saw the hieroglyphics.
00:20:13
Speaker
Uh-huh. So... My thought process, there's there's one either one of two things that happened. Either he didn't push the button, and nothing happened. But, judging on the fact that the blast doors came up after he didn't hit the button doesn't seem very likely.
00:20:37
Speaker
I think what he did was he waited, saw the red hieroglyphics, then inputted the code and clicked it later. Okay.
00:20:49
Speaker
That's my thought process right now, just because I don't think... I think something I do... I actually believe something would happen if it got for to zero for too long. But nothing necessarily happened when Henry didn't push the button.
00:21:05
Speaker
So maybe what they do is they have someone... you know, get to that map again, because I'm assuming there's definitely going to be a time where we see that map again.
00:21:21
Speaker
and that I highly doubt that would be a one-time thing. I mean, you can't imagine that it would be, but here here's the thing for me. I don't remember, and maybe you do, but did we hear the numbers click when the doors came up? Like, when it normally resets, you hear that, like, clicking sound?
00:21:40
Speaker
You what i'm talking about? Oh, yeah. i
00:21:44
Speaker
I don't think so. Yeah, I don't think we did either. And it's very interesting that, you know, towards the end of that episode, that immediately after that happens, Jack and Kate are in the jungle, and they find a parachute with pallets full of Dharma food. So maybe...
00:22:02
Speaker
And given that the episode's called Lockdown, maybe this lockdown is like a scheduled thing so that they don't leave the hatch when they drop the food. Why that would be, i don't know. Again, all of that quarantine stuff is really weird also.
00:22:16
Speaker
bet you that's totally what it is. Oh, that's totally what it is. Yeah. Again, i don't know why, you know, and unless it's just like a safety thing for when they're dropping the the pallets.
00:22:29
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know.
00:22:32
Speaker
but But it was okay. Something. the um the package of the Dharma food was opened. It had an opening. I don't know if that's just like a little bit. that that's Kate was able to grab the food because there was a tiny opening in one of them.
00:22:50
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Interesting. I don't know if that literally could be like it just could have been open, but maybe someone had something to do with it. Interesting. Yeah.
00:23:04
Speaker
And that brings us to something else that's very interesting as Anna, Lucia, Saeed, and Charlie um connect with Jack and Kate in the jungle as they're returning from their trek. And what an ending to the episode here, Nick.
00:23:17
Speaker
Yeah, they found the balloon. Which brings me to my, I guess i will say the map was my second drop drop drop jaw moment. This is my third. with Saeed digging up the grave and finding the real Henry Gale's body. Yep.
00:23:37
Speaker
And this isn't Henry Gale. And he is another. And I was right. Yep.
00:23:46
Speaker
But man, dang, the the level they had to go to to confirm that, though, right? Seriously, like they found the balloon and they found the body.
00:23:57
Speaker
That's insane. and And I love the Saeed saying in the next episode, bringing out the dollar that has the note about his wife, because he was right about the wife's name being Jennifer.
00:24:09
Speaker
He was right about that, which means and he didn't have he didn't check his wallet because he didn't read that note. So he had to interrogate him and kill the real Henry Gale.
00:24:24
Speaker
That's what happened.
Revelation of Henry Gale's Identity
00:24:26
Speaker
Or maybe not maybe henry you know maybe maybe not Henry Gale wasn't the one who interrogated him, but whatever. He definitely wasn't what he said, which was dead.
00:24:38
Speaker
I really want to watch the next two episodes because I literally just want answers. I feel like we we had this great finale with this episode and we got no answers in the next episode with with henryn with not Henry Gale.
00:24:52
Speaker
Yeah.
00:24:55
Speaker
And the look on his face when they confront him in the hatch is just pure annoyance and hatred. He's like, man, the nerve of these plane crash survivors that they literally dug up the body and didn't believe my awesome story.
00:25:08
Speaker
Yeah, no, it's insane. And there's so many questions. Like, okay, you're another, but he doesn't seem like he's an other and in a similar way. Now that he's been found out,
00:25:25
Speaker
He doesn't have that creepiness that the other ones did, you know? oh So it makes me think, is it possible that he was a taily and, you know, maybe he got taken on the first night or whatever, right? Like, i but I highly doubt that. I feel like Anna Lucia would have noticed that by now or Echo or, you know, would would have noticed that by now.
00:25:51
Speaker
But yeah he doesn't seem other like in the same way where you know when Goodwin and and Ethan were found out, they're the creepiest people on the planet. Right. But Henry Gale, not Henry Gale, is very scared and intimidated.
00:26:09
Speaker
And like, you don't know what he'll do to me. And like, whoa, whoa. whoa I'm so intrigued and i have so many questions.
00:26:25
Speaker
Why didn't he run? Locke was pinned down. Why didn't he kill Locke? And I, you know, I think the answer is yeah not Henry Gale had said, um you'll vouch for me, right? If I help you with this, you'll vouch for me.
00:26:40
Speaker
And he was like, yeah, I'll vouch for you. So if he helped Locke out and he earns Locke's trust, he's good. And Locke was going to trust him.
00:26:51
Speaker
I was going to trust him. i was going to trust him for a little bit. And then they proved us wrong. So... i don't know. so It's amazing. Is his ultimate endgame just to infiltrate them, then?
00:27:07
Speaker
I don't even... a Yes. So I think it's the same thing that happened with Ethan. where ah we the a tiny clip that we get from maternity leave, I actually don't think we talked about this in our maternity leave episode.
00:27:21
Speaker
The guy, Zeke, is talking to Ethan and says, like, you were supposed to lay low and get a list. Right, right, right. The same thing that Goodwin did.
00:27:34
Speaker
So maybe Henry's going there to earn some trust and get another list.
00:27:40
Speaker
That's what I'm thinking. is that he's there to get another list and they're not having it.
00:27:49
Speaker
Gotcha. Okay.
00:27:53
Speaker
Yeah. Great episode. Anything else in your notes that you wanted to bring up quotes or anything else we missed? Uh, let's see. I've been faked out by rain twice now. When Anna, Lucia, Charlie, and Saeed were looking for the balloon, they were in rain.
00:28:09
Speaker
And I was very, i was very, very, very s skeptical. um
00:28:17
Speaker
I have one quote in here. or I guess two, two things. I say, quote, no matter what, quote, which is what Henry Gale said or not Henry Gale said before, ah John Locke was like, will you help me? And will you trust me or whatever? And he's like, yeah, whatever, whatever, whatever. And I was like, okay, no matter what was like, if you're going to extremes like that, that's not a good look. And then right after that, I wrote what I was saying earlier about his Minnesota thing. I wrote scripted response.
00:28:52
Speaker
Oh, I said Locke might have to get back into a wheelchair.
00:28:58
Speaker
Yeah, that part was pretty interesting. And then I said... guys i said... this is This is actually how this is written down in my notes.
00:29:08
Speaker
Henry is innocent, period. And then in all caps, I have... What? No. No woman. It was a man because Saeed was talking about how the person buried wasn't a woman. It was a man. i was like I was like, holy crap, it's not Henry. He got caught.
00:29:29
Speaker
And the next thing I said is, i love Saeed. move on And then i I started taking notes on the next episode. And then I i was done. Like, I couldn't keep up.
00:29:42
Speaker
Well, let's let's get into it. Let's talk about why that is. Because it's... Because it's... Mind-altering. It is mind-altering.
00:29:54
Speaker
Our next episode is episode 18. It's called Dave, and... It's a Hurley-centric episode that gets really heavy really fast. And
Hurley and Themes of Reality
00:30:03
Speaker
also, i just want to apologize to you, Nick, if you feel like I misdirected you at the end of the last episode when you asked if it was about Libby.
00:30:10
Speaker
Because as you started watching it and you saw Libby you know yeah trotting across the beach, you were probably like, wait a minute, what? Yeah, I was like, I was right. um But I guess not.
00:30:24
Speaker
Well, and I almost said close, but I didn't want to give away who it was, you know. Right. Yeah. But this episode deals with mental health, reality versus delusion, and obviously has a very shocking reveal about Libby. So let's start, though, Nick, with what was your reaction when Dave first showed up on the island?
00:30:47
Speaker
Um... What? What? He was really creepy. He was really creepy in the first scene, like really, really creepy. Like he was just a bald guy, like smiling at Hurley. Oh, like it was like, it was genuine, like it was genuinely chilling.
00:31:03
Speaker
Like that's, I think the scariest part of both episodes that I watched was just that chilling image of Dave. It like is like, like it keeps like replaying in my head and it's not a fun image.
00:31:15
Speaker
But yeah I was like, we've never seen this guy before. And there's a lot of people on the island that we haven't seen before. So that's not surprising. What's surprising is that they would focus on this new person that we've never seen before all of a sudden. And, you know, a really good example of that is Arst. You know, he was on the island and then they all of a sudden started focusing on him. Well, kind of makes sense that they started focusing on him because he died in the next like...
00:31:44
Speaker
two episodes. Right. So, you know, like they don't really introduce new characters. Right. The convenience of being able to tap into the other pool of survivors when needed.
00:31:58
Speaker
Right. That was my thought process. Yeah.
00:32:05
Speaker
So the episode opens with Hurley opening up to Libby about how he's sick and she's like, what do you mean? What's going on? And, He's like, I don't really want to tell you, but he finally ends up agreeing to share with her and takes her to his food stash.
00:32:21
Speaker
And he's got this this whole shelf of food just like stashed in the jungle behind some bushes and trees. So old Hurley, you know, i think it was episode four was his other centric episode for season two. Yes. Everybody hates Hugo.
00:32:36
Speaker
Yeah, and obviously, you know, that one ended in such a positive way for Hurley where he was sharing the food from the ah hatch with all the survivors. At least at that time, we thought it was all the food, but apparently he's been holding out this whole time he's got his own little stash. and And then I have to say, Nick, I appreciate what Libby was trying to do, but why would you waste all that food? You're on a basically deserted island and no one has food. completely agree. I completely agree.
00:33:07
Speaker
I'm a huge Hurley fan, but that was insane. And and it was kind of like bad karma with the food dropping right after. And he doesn't want to be in charge of food again.
00:33:18
Speaker
and then Dave shows up encouraging him to you know, start binge eating again. And Dave looks exactly like someone who would be a bad influence.
00:33:33
Speaker
Exactly. Yeah, back to that smile. That smile is just yeah a wicked smile. Serious, seriously. seriously You know, and and he's kind of like manipulating him. You deserve to be happy. You want food? Eat food. You know, like it's it makes sense.
00:33:52
Speaker
Yeah. And the flashbacks, of course, reveal that Dave was Hurley's best friend at Santa Rosa Mental Health Institute. And we learn why Hurley was there for the first time as yeah he's meeting with Dr. Brooks throughout the episode and and he blames himself for a debt collapse that killed two people and yeah has contributed to to more weight gain for him and his reliance on food.
00:34:16
Speaker
he And that's where he meets Dave, who is enabling all of his impulses and sneaking him food, encouraging to eat when he was supposed to be following his doctor's diet plan.
00:34:29
Speaker
yeah
00:34:31
Speaker
Yeah, and it's interesting. the The first scene that we see, Dave, was the scene where they're on the basketball court together. And it kind of foreshadows the whole thing, right? Because Hurley steps out onto the court and they pass him the ball, completely ignoring Dave.
00:34:50
Speaker
Oh, that is cool. Yeah. I didn't think about that. and And you wouldn't, like, when you initially watch it, like, you wouldn't think anything of it. right But then when as you get to the end of the episode, you look back and you're like, ah.
00:35:07
Speaker
Makes a lot more sense now. And of course, throughout the episode, Dr. Brooks, Hurley's psychiatrist, was trying to help him see that Dave was a manifestation of his own self-destructive tendencies, but Hurley couldn't let go of his friend who told him what he wanted to hear.
00:35:24
Speaker
Right. And the scene where Dr. Brooks takes that photo of Hurley and Dave, ah As soon as he took that photo, I was like, Dave's not in the photo. was like, he's not in the photo.
00:35:35
Speaker
was like, it's just Hurley. And then we actually see that later. And I was like, Dave is not real. He's a figment of your imagination that's helping you eat more food. Yeah.
00:35:48
Speaker
Yeah, he was he was representing all of Hurley's self-doubt and destructive impulses. And now of a sudden he's back and he's on the island trying to convince Hurley that nothing that's happened is real.
00:36:01
Speaker
And I loved when Hurley tries to tell Dave, you're not here. And he throws a coconut at him. And I'm not really sure how to interpret Dave's presence on the island, Nick. We've obviously talked about this before with other characters, how things have a tendency to manifest themselves on the island.
00:36:17
Speaker
But the fact that Hurley physically touches Dave's slipper and the coconut hits him makes it hard to comprehend what's actually happening here.
00:36:28
Speaker
have no words this is when things actually started to mess with my head like insanely messed with my head he you know hurley being all like this is all made up and i was like was like what do you mean what do you mean so i made up and you know that's when i like i was like clueless i didn't know what was going on You know, I was in shambles and I honestly still don't know how that's working.
00:36:58
Speaker
And like I said, I don't really know how the island is, you know, how magical the island actually is. And like, sure, it brought back brought back John Locke's walking. But again, i don't know what that could be.
00:37:13
Speaker
Right. And it also plays into any potential narrative that some some viewers of Lost might have where they're maybe asking themselves questions like, is this real? Like, is what's happening on the island real?
00:37:27
Speaker
That's exactly what I thought. Yeah.
00:37:33
Speaker
Time will tell. Yes, it will. And then we had a fun scene this episode where Hurley asks Sawyer for some anxiety meds. Clonazepan, I think it was. Something like that.
00:37:47
Speaker
And Sawyer pretends to see a bald guy in a robe and Hurley tackles him. Yeah, and theyre pre preservably so. um He deserves it.
00:37:59
Speaker
A whole, you know, the whole scene was great. Sawyer being Sawyer.
00:38:09
Speaker
Hurley asking, what can I do for your deep dish? and made a very mean comment by, you know, saying he had enough food to open a mini mart. You know, like, hey, do you think Saeed needs a job? You know, like, the i I mean, oh ah Sawyer, stop.
00:38:24
Speaker
But Dave's stuff on and off island is insane. Hurley finally makes the decision to lock Dave of mental institute on island after the reappearance of, you know, Dave.
00:38:37
Speaker
You know, they start communicating again. and Dave starts telling Hurley what I start to believe as well. you This is a figment of your imagination.
00:38:48
Speaker
You're still at Santa Rosa, man. You never left the hospital. yeah And I was like, what? You've got to be kidding. Like, you've got to be kidding.
00:38:59
Speaker
And all this, the plane crash, the island, the other survivors, it's all in your head. Yeah, the super hot blonde chick just up happens to be have the hots for you. And it's like, you need to wake up.
00:39:10
Speaker
and and And to ensure you wake up, ah jump off this cliff. I'll go first. And Dave goes right off.
00:39:19
Speaker
Yeah, that scene was was terrifying. And Dave's trying to use Hurley's own insecurities against him. I mean, I was i was scared Hurley might do it. And I think he was.
00:39:31
Speaker
And then Libby shows up in time, convinces him that she's real and she cares for him. But here's the kicker. We get the reveal that she was also a patient at Santa Rosa.
00:39:46
Speaker
That's just like comes out of the blue and punches us in the face.
Libby's Complex Character
00:39:51
Speaker
And she looks really out of it in the flashback where we see her in the background as they're replaying that same scene where Dr. Brooks is taking the picture of Hurley and imaginary friend Dave.
00:40:01
Speaker
And then there's Libby in the background and she just looks insane in that moment. Yeah. Wow. Like, wow.
00:40:13
Speaker
Like, wow. ah It really really, really, really, really makes me think that like, Maybe they're both insane. You know, maybe he still is in Santa Rosa.
00:40:24
Speaker
You know, like, that like whoa. So Libby, so I guess the other alternative is that she got better as well. and Hurley got better. They both got better. And yeah Libby's been keeping this secret.
00:40:37
Speaker
Or maybe she just doesn't remember. Yeah, that's true. And, you know, every time Hurley's like, oh, yeah, I've seen you from somewhere. And you're like, she's in discomfort.
00:40:50
Speaker
And she like pivots and she's like, oh yeah, you stepped on my foot um on the plane.
00:40:58
Speaker
Yep. I mean, it's insane. Yeah, it's it's it's wild. You know, like, what I mean, ah obviously, like, if you had that past, you probably wouldn't want to openly admit it especially if you're going around telling people you're the clinical psychologist.
00:41:17
Speaker
Exactly. Exactly. But yeah, it's wild.
00:41:24
Speaker
And then we get into the on-island hatch interactions this episode. So we've got fake Henry locked up in the armory.
Manipulation and Island's Reality
00:41:30
Speaker
And while everyone else is dealing with the food drop situation and Hurley's dealing with this stuff, we have some interesting continued interactions with fake Henry.
00:41:40
Speaker
We start with Saeed and Anna Lucia in there with him. And he's, of course, lying, saying Henry Gale was already dead when I found him. Right. Right. And Saeed takes that and says, nope, I've got receipts right here.
00:41:55
Speaker
You know, where we we talked about where he writes a note to Jennifer telling her he had crashed and where he was headed. So Saeed, you know, basically figured him out real fast And it got really intense where Saeed threatens to shoot him and actually would have totally shoot him if it wasn't for Anna who pushed his arm off at the last second.
00:42:22
Speaker
He's, yeah he's crazy. He's, he's fueled by Shannon. That's what he is. He's way too angry. That whole thing was crazy. And I loved the conversation there also, where they're asking how many others there are and,
00:42:39
Speaker
Not Henry's getting freaked out saying, if I tell you about them, you have no idea what he'll do. And interestingly, Nick, Anna Lucia makes the assumption that he is referring to Zeke as the leader and fake Henry replies him. He's nothing, a nobody.
00:42:54
Speaker
And he seems yeah literally terrified when talking about whoever the the real leader is.
00:43:01
Speaker
I'm so unbelievably curious. I need to know who the big but boss head honcho is. Like, I need to know.
00:43:16
Speaker
Yeah, me too. And then later, Locke, who is on crutches at this point, he asks Santa Lucia for five minutes with Henry and ends up alone with him in there.
00:43:28
Speaker
And so he's you know he's asking him questions. He's trying to find out his real name. He's trying to find out why he didn't leave him, essentially. And this is where things get really psychological because Not Henry starts messing with Locke's head about the hatch and button saying, this place is a joke, John.
00:43:44
Speaker
Yeah, it's kind of crazy. i mean, Henry tells Locke that he never pushed the button and that the timer just reset itself.
00:43:56
Speaker
trying to convince Locke that everything he believes about in the button is meaningless. And the way that Michael Emerson, or not Henry, delivers that line about God not being able to see the island, you know, God doesn't know how long we've been here, John.
00:44:12
Speaker
He can't see this island any better than the rest of the world can. ah is so good it's so good it's as creepy as we've gotten him so far and i want to know more i want them to interrogate him and i want it to see it i want to see it in the next two episodes agreed and what's so brilliant about that scene is that henry is exploiting lock's deepest fear that his purpose his faith in the island might all be a joke right Yeah.
00:44:40
Speaker
Locke has always been this true believer since he landed on the island, kind of pushing everyone to have faith in the island's plan, but Henry's planting the seeds of doubt. that Nothing will happen if he doesn't push the mud.
00:44:54
Speaker
okay And you can see Locke starting to you know have a breakdown and accuses henry not Henry of lying. and he says, nope, I'm done lying.
00:45:10
Speaker
Like, I'm telling the truth now, and I don't even know. i can't even tell. i don't know if he's lying or if he's just trying to mess with John Locke's head. Because he said he wasn't lying, but then he lied about, you know, Jennifer and stuff like that.
00:45:21
Speaker
So, clearly he's still telling a few lies. Yeah, you would think. But that's the genius of it. And it really ties into the broader theme of the episode with Hurley's hallucinations of Dave both Hurley and Locke are being confronted with the possibility that their reality might not be what they think it is.
00:45:46
Speaker
Hurley's questioning whether Dave is real Locke's questioning whether the button is real and and even deeper than that, the island and and everything. And I mean, I love that parallel.
00:45:58
Speaker
Both characters are having their foundations shaken and the way Henry delivers that psychological attack is extremely calculated. He's not just saying the button doesn't work. He's saying Locke's entire sense of purpose is a lie. And he's been there long enough to figure that out.
00:46:17
Speaker
And it's devastating for someone like Locke, who is finally found like meaning after being paralyzed and dismissed by everyone in his life. And now it's happening again, where he's he's paralyzed again. He's you know being dismissed.
00:46:31
Speaker
Exactly. And we know from previous episodes that that Locke's relationship with his father has left him vulnerable to manipulation by father figures. So Henry, even as a prisoner, has somehow managed to kind of position himself as this almost omniscient presence who knows the truth about the island. And so it's textbook psychological manipulation.
00:46:54
Speaker
Mm-hmm. What's even crazier is that even though we know like even though we know henry is lying, you know, about who he is, there's still the doubt about whether he might be telling truth about the button.
00:47:09
Speaker
And that's what makes it so effective. It plants the same doubt in us that it plants in Locke.
00:47:17
Speaker
Absolutely.
00:47:20
Speaker
Any closing thoughts or anything that we haven't talked about for Dave? Um... Just one little thing that I forgot to mention. Not Henry being an other. And using that manipulation, that psychological attack is something he most likely learned from the others and, you know, was trying to get at.
00:47:49
Speaker
feel like that was all calculated. You know, like his his goal was to, like, get in their heads. I don't know if that makes sense, but no, I think it does. think the only other thing I would mention on these two episodes that we didn't call out is I believe there was a scene where Echo and and Charlie's helping Echo build yeah something.
00:48:10
Speaker
Yes. That, yeah, I did forget about that. um I think Echo's building a house or maybe he's, no, he's building a church. Echo's building a church. It's Echo. He's building a church. That's absolutely what it has to be. Yeah. Yeah.
00:48:22
Speaker
Yeah. He hasn't come out and said it, but that's got to be what it is. Especially if Charlie's helping him too. It's a church. Yep.
00:48:35
Speaker
Awesome. Well, let's jump into our most loved, most hated segment here, the portion of our show where we talk about what characters are trending up these episodes and which characters are currently the most hated or trending down. So Nick, let's not change the format.
00:48:51
Speaker
You start us off here.
00:48:54
Speaker
and Don't tell us it's going to be hard this week. Yeah, it's going to be hard this week.
00:49:02
Speaker
Well, ah okay, for most love, for three at least, I feel like this is a pretty easy one for me, is Saeed. Because Saeed's a little crazy, but you gotta admit that what he did worked.
00:49:16
Speaker
Like he figured out who Henry Gale really was and everyone was ready to believe him. And he said, no oh And I got to give Saeed props for that. I got to put him in the top three at my number two.
00:49:31
Speaker
I got to put Libby, which kind of sounds a little crazy, but I think she did a lot of work to save Hurley. Yeah.
00:49:43
Speaker
And she was really supportive throughout the whole Dave episode of Hurley. and Absolutely. you know i think I think she actually does like Hurley. and She's not just doing it just because.
00:49:54
Speaker
I think she does really like Hurley. Now, number one, I've got to pick between Hurley and Locke. Hmm.
00:50:05
Speaker
I'll go Locke, just because I think Hurley had his downsides with the way that he sometimes treated Libby. And like, obviously, he was hurting and he was feeling insane. But he also, you know, was kind of rude at some points to Libby. yeah That's not cool, because Libby was trying to help him out.
00:50:26
Speaker
So, yeah. yeah For my most hated, i feel like I have no one to hate. You know, I feel like there wasn't enough... characters that I could actually hate someone.
00:50:41
Speaker
Well, let me go first on my most hated. Maybe you'll, maybe you'll figure some out as I go. Okay. There's, there's two very easy ones this episode. Anthony Cooper. Oh, oh, oh, oh,
00:50:53
Speaker
anthony cooper anthony cooper anthony cooper most hated anthony ever most hated one hundred percent second most hated i don't know if this counts but i'm gonna go dave yeah you have to I'm going put Dave in my second most hated because he also sucked.
00:51:08
Speaker
I guess my least most hated out of the three would have to be... Let's see. Who would it be?
00:51:21
Speaker
I guess I could put... I don't know. I don't want to put Sawyer down there.
00:51:26
Speaker
I could, but I don't want to. I was thinking about it. I was considering it. The Saeed with the mini-mart comment... Yeah, that was rude. yeah I'll put Sawyer down there.
00:51:39
Speaker
Sawyer. Yeah. The bad boy has made it back to the most hated. Yeah. Not good, Sawyer. Not good. For me, I agree with... I've got i've got Anthony Cooper and Dave.
00:51:54
Speaker
unequivocally for the first two spots. For number three, it's going to to be a tie for me this episode for the third most hated. Sawyer. And don't crucify me yet when I tell you who the tie is because I'm going to explain and it's going make sense.
00:52:11
Speaker
a tie between Sawyer and Locke. Oh! ah Why? But I'm also, so here's what I'm doing. I'm decoupling Locke into two individuals. So he's also going to be in my most loved.
00:52:26
Speaker
Okay. I'm okay with that. He's existing in both realms. I think that there, there's plenty of reasons for him to be in the most loved. The way that he completely self-sabotaged his relationship with Helen.
00:52:43
Speaker
Yes, that's bottom three material. I agree. I have to throw him in the bottom. if I get you. That's where my mind's at on that. So he is in my, my top three. He's, he's probably, he's lower, probably the lowest in my most loved side.
00:53:00
Speaker
I agree with you. Libby is in the top.
00:53:04
Speaker
And then, wait, who'd you have for your number one? Uh, her, uh, lock I had for my number one. So you had Saeed in your, yeah. So, okay. So Saeed is in mine. um Honestly, order-wise, I could go either way this episode. They're all kind of just up in there. Saeed, Locke, and Libby.
00:53:26
Speaker
Yeah. feel like Jack could be an honorable mention. For Most Loved, do you think Jack could? I think he could be an honorable mention for Most Loved, yeah.
00:53:38
Speaker
Yeah.
00:53:42
Speaker
All right, awesome. Well, that's a wrap for a deep dive into Season 2, Episodes 17 18.
00:53:48
Speaker
And these episodes really pushed our characters to their psychological limits while revealing huge secrets about their pasts. And I'm still left with so many questions. Like, who is really... who who's fake What's fake Henry's real name?
00:54:03
Speaker
and we trust Libby? Hurley crazy? What's the deal with Dave? Will we see him again? What's the Blast door map all about even more? And my brain hurts. I want to say that. And it's about to hurt more when I go and watch these next two episodes.
00:54:17
Speaker
It might. It might hurt more. It might hurt less. You will find out. But I understand why you understand why you really took to the
Episode Wrap-Up and Future Previews
00:54:27
Speaker
Claire episode, because that episode finally like gave some closure and some really good answers.
00:54:34
Speaker
These episodes like opened up a whole other can of worms. Yeah, they did.
00:54:42
Speaker
But before we close out this podcast episode, let's play another round of let's guess which characters featured in our next episodes. i I literally have no idea.
00:54:53
Speaker
I'm looking at them right now. i have no idea.
00:54:58
Speaker
So for our listeners' benefits, episode 19 is called SOS. So no no guess on what that is? Well, hold on. I'm not saying no guess.
00:55:09
Speaker
Okay, SOS... Okay, so here's what I said. but Okay, hold on. Let me look at this. What was episode five of Lost, season two?
00:55:21
Speaker
Episode five was... Let me look. I'm looking right now. Let me look. Because episode three was the lock episode and episode four was the Hurley episode. Five was and found. So that was the Jyn episode.
00:55:36
Speaker
Okay, so... and No, SOS is not... SOS is not Jen. Michael! Michael, Michael, Michael. I'm cashing in my Michael one. I'm cashing in my Michael. Or my Michael slash Walt. I think it could be either or both.
00:55:52
Speaker
I'm hoping it's the Walt episode. I'm going to guess Walt. Okay. And then before I reveal, let's go ahead and talk episode 20, which is called Two for the Road. Two for the Road.
00:56:07
Speaker
Two for the Road.
00:56:11
Speaker
um For the Road makes me think Kate vibes.
00:56:20
Speaker
Yeah, I'll go Kate for Two for the Road.
00:56:24
Speaker
Okay, so you Walt for SOS and Kate for Two for the Road. Walt slash Michael. i'm I'm doing both because we haven't seen Michael in forever.
00:56:35
Speaker
Gotcha. So I will reveal that neither one of those are correct. england I went 0 for 2.
00:56:47
Speaker
oh two i think that's a first. 0 for 2 today. i think that's the first time I've gone 0 for 2. I usually get one. Yeah. Dang. I think that you... can I think you will be pleasantly surprised what SOS is about.
00:57:05
Speaker
i think I think you're really going to like SOS. s I'm really going to like SOS. I don't think you'll be as surprised once you realize who the character is centered around for two for the road. Okay.
00:57:20
Speaker
But yeah, I do hope you watch those tonight. I probably will. I have nothing better to do tonight. So awesome.
00:57:30
Speaker
Well, thank you listeners for joining us. Don't forget to subscribe and leave a review. And until next time, do not mistake coincidence for fate. Until next time, don't get your leg stuck under a blast door.
00:57:43
Speaker
and I don't plan on it, and neither should you. cool