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What College and University Presidents Should Know About CACUSS
96 Plays1 year ago
This episode our on-air host Paula Jean Broderick is joined by Dr. Janet Morrison, Dr. Tim Rahilly and Sean Kennedy as we explore the topic of What College and University Presidents Should Know About CACUSS. We hope that you enjoy and choose to follow along as we release a number of episodes geared towards celebrating our past, present, and future as an organization.
About:
The CACUSS 50 Oral History Project is an initiative of the Canadian Association of College and University Student Services in recognition of our organization's 50 years of engaging student affairs professionals in Canada.
The series of podcasts is recorded and produced by: Sean Fast, Adam Kuhn, Nicholas Fast, Rachel Barreca, Stephanie Muehlethaler, Noah Arney, Sally Chen, Estefania Toledo, Paula Broderick, Jennifer Brown, Margaret de Leon, and Becca Gray. This podcast is recorded, produced, and published on the traditional territories of hundreds of Indigenous nations from across the northern half of Turtle Island, also known by its settler-colonial name, Canada. We are grateful for the opportunity to live, work, and learn on this land. For more information on the territories you may reside on, visit: https://native-land.ca/
Credits:
Music: Expanding the Limits | Performed by Audiorezout & Written by Oleksii Striapchyi | Stock Media provided by Audiorezout / Pond5
Podcast Cover Art by: Ravi Gabble (UTM)
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Transcript
Introduction to the Oral History Project
00:00:21
Speaker
Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of the Caucus 50th Anniversary Oral History Project, where we are collecting stories about our profession, our field, and our organization. My name is Paula Jean, or PJ Broderick, and I use she-them pronouns.
Guest Panel Introduction
00:00:36
Speaker
Currently, I work at Quantlin Polytechnic University. Today, I am thrilled to be joined by Dr. Janet Morrison, President and Vice Chancellor at Sheridan College, Sean Kennedy, President at Niagara College, and Dr. Tim Rayleigh, President and Vice Chancellor at Mount Royal University, for a conversation on what college and university presidents should know about caucus. Welcome, everyone. So, Janet, I thought we would start our first question with you, if that's
Leadership in Education: A Student-Centric Approach
00:01:06
Speaker
okay.
00:01:06
Speaker
How has your involvement in student services shaped your journey through the post-secondary sector? So thanks for the question and thanks for the invitation.
00:01:18
Speaker
You know, if I reflect on, for me, it's actually not about how student services has shaped my journey. It's about how being a student centric educator, professional leader has actually informed everything that I do. It informs my parenting, it informs my advocacy, it informs my volunteerism.
00:01:42
Speaker
I think there is nothing about my current leadership orientation that wasn't informed by my various roles across student services. I think a lot about having been in residence life or in academic advising and registrarial services and complaints.
00:02:01
Speaker
resolution adjudication and even some of the process on dispute resolution. All of that informs the way that I think about the work that we do. I'm so passionate about the transformative capacity of post-secondary education.
00:02:18
Speaker
But a lot of what we do teaches you about access. It teaches you about true accessibility. And so it's deeply entrenched in my leadership orientation, born from experience. And I hope that people see that every day in what I bring to the role of president.
00:02:41
Speaker
So interesting. Sean or Tim, over to you. Would you like to speak about how Student Services has shaped your journey, or as Janet was saying, that student-centered leader has shaped the work that you've been doing and your role? Sure. I'll jump in a minute. I think they're symbiotic, those two concepts. I think student affairs, having been in various student affairs roles,
00:03:11
Speaker
through my skills, I think, which, you know, just to add to what Janet has said, I think it gives me a skill set that I think is very helpful to my role as president and certainly informs my thinking. Again, clearly the student-centered component
00:03:30
Speaker
I always think we're in the human development, citizen development business. And that comes out of a student affairs mindset, where you see the person, you know the struggles that you may see and the struggles that you don't, but it's kind of a very humanist perspective. And I think that certainly infuses everything I do as president.
00:03:57
Speaker
And I can jump in, PJ, on this. I think that we all have our own paths. And walking the path of student affairs for a number of years, it was my cut at it, for lack of a better term. It's how I got a glimpse of the institutions that I've worked at.
00:04:20
Speaker
And as Janet outlined, I think that it really shaped my perspective. I think I started off student-centered, probably because I was a student, and then moving forward as a professional. And in my case, I became a psychologist, and I wasn't planning on being a student.
00:04:43
Speaker
affairs practitioner or professional. But having had the opportunity to work in the profession for basically two decades, it exposed me to so many different aspects and a diversity of students and just the human aspect of it. So for the three of us who have become presidents of institutions,
00:05:09
Speaker
It's a bit of a gift, really, when you get to be the head of an organization and people talk to you about their experiences and you can empathize. I think it goes a long way.
Complex Issues in Institutions & Leadership Strategies
00:05:20
Speaker
I think people believe you when you say you're student centered. That goes a long way. And I think it's really great preparation for dealing with very messy, complex, thorny issues that all of our institutions kind of have to deal with.
00:05:38
Speaker
Yeah, I might jump back in. PJ, I was thinking about it when Tim said, you know, he started, of course, as a student. I mean, we all did. And part of my thinking even today is influenced by the fact that I was also a student leader before I got into student affairs. And I know that it changes the way I approach and the relationships I build with our student leaders and how
00:06:05
Speaker
deeply respectful I am and appreciative of their roles on our campus. And again, all of those experiences do certainly shape my leadership as president.
00:06:17
Speaker
Yeah, it's interesting as I mean, the three of us have a lot in common anyway, and we've spent a lot of time together over the years. You know, for me, notwithstanding, I'm very clear on what caucuses mandate is, and I'm, I'm very supportive. But for me, being a student affairs professional is not about a job title. It's not about working in student services. It's actually it's about an orientation. It's about
00:06:40
Speaker
a sense of priorities. It's about how I contemplate the challenges on my desk every day. And I know Tim and Sean very well, and I'm proud to say that on many levels that differentiates us. Some days that's better, some days that's worse. I often think we probably sleep less well some days because of that orientation, but that's the path and what the path, I think, cultivates.
00:07:08
Speaker
So on that path, as senior administrators and presidents, how do you share and expose others to the student-centered approach? Obviously student affairs professionals often take that view, but you're working with different people, different cues, parties across the institution. How do you influence them to take a student-centered approach in their work?
00:07:33
Speaker
Well, maybe I could jump in and say, you know, I don't know that if, if this is a particularly student centered thing or a student affairs thing, I think that's, you know, the way I do my work. I think it's about relationship.
00:07:49
Speaker
You know, you have to walk that walk. I think people can sense how you interact with them. And, you know, while there may be some differences about how I might interact with a member of government or a student affairs leader or a member of my board or a faculty member,
00:08:08
Speaker
there's probably more in common than there is different in terms of how that relationship would go. And so I think it's a human approach, you know, probably tempered with some pragmatism in so far as, you know, everyone is happy to tell you what they think and they feel and
00:08:26
Speaker
I think in our roles, you know, we're looking for on a personal level, you know, to be, to have that kind of relationship or to help people out or get them to the right resource. But, you know, we're looking for kind of some themes and some directions for our institutions and
00:08:43
Speaker
and really helping people see the big picture of where we're going. So I think, again, I think student affairs and student leadership. I also, Sean, was a student leader. I was a keener and it seems good preparation for what we do now. So I think just kind of being a human, I think that's pretty consistent with student affairs.
00:09:04
Speaker
Yeah, so it's a good question. I was just thinking off the top, even the way I defer to coaching and modeling, mentoring, even that's a product of my experience.
Diversity in Leadership Roles
00:09:20
Speaker
You know, the thing about student leadership, you know, like my colleagues, I was a student leader, I was a varsity captain. There is nothing that cultivates leadership skill like peer leadership. And we afford as many students as we can and typically not as many as we'd like. We afford students that opportunity. You learn in those spaces how to focus on coaching and mentoring and modeling behavior.
00:09:47
Speaker
Ironically, Shawn and I just came from a meeting of our peers where I may not have only been modeling, coaching, and advocating. Shawn can judge, but I may have been a little more aggressive than that in some of those moments. But even, you know, I'll give you two examples. Paula, like we're having a conversation over dinner the first night about the absence of representation in the presidential cohort in our sector, in Shawn's and Mike's sector, the Ontario College sector.
00:10:15
Speaker
And I was just making the point, we have one racialized leader and we have fewer female presidents than we did when I started six years ago. That number wasn't sufficient then relative to our student enrollment demographic and that number has gone down. And the response from somebody at the table who I greatly admire was, well, that's not on us, that's on our boards.
00:10:38
Speaker
And I said, well, you've been in the presidency how long? What does your board look like? My board used to be predominantly white men from one of the catchments, one of the four catchments I serve. It doesn't look like that now. If you put a photo, and that's because students over time at George Brown, at York, at Bowling Green State, at Sheridan have taught me that that matters. Paying attention to those things matters and that I have accountability in those moments
00:11:07
Speaker
regardless of my position. And so I think there are lots of options or there are a lot of opportunities, little big ways to live the values that students teach us every day. Yeah, I would probably just add a couple of things. It's interesting Janet mentions coaching because for me that is a huge part of
00:11:30
Speaker
what I believe strong leadership entails as a coach first. And I do think that comes out of a student affairs orientation and background. It's a privilege to be in these roles, but there's a great responsibility. And I think, like Janet, continue to think about diversity across all of our senior leadership team and our board.
00:11:57
Speaker
We're making some real progress there. And also structure of the organization. One of the first things that did us when I became president is I created a vice president of student affairs role, whereas previously was kind of subsumed under a different VP portfolio. Well, that sends a signal across the organization. And then I felt very fortunate that
00:12:20
Speaker
We hired into that role an indigenous leader who was just exceptional. That also sent a signal that they had to have indigenous representation around the executive team table. But, you know, I think it's it comes kind of naturally to me. And I think that comes out of just years and years of being involved in different conversations around representation and why that matters and the importance of diversity. And how do you talk about diversity? But then how do you make a difference around that?
00:12:49
Speaker
I also was really proud of the fact that when I became president, we set up an EDI task force that was half students and half employees. And it was a joint effort with our students union.
00:13:05
Speaker
And I actually had questions about that because it was, you know, from the, one of our board members at one point, he said, well, I don't understand that. Like, you know, aren't these different? I said, no, well, this is, we're one community. But again, I realized, you know, I didn't, that was just natural for me, but again, I'm sure it was informed by the fact that I came out of two decades of working in student affairs.
00:13:26
Speaker
So we're going to shift the conversation a little bit.
Caucus Involvement and Career Impact
00:13:29
Speaker
And I just want to know a little bit more about how you first became involved in caucus and the role that caucus might've played in your career or in your development as leaders. Go for it, Tim.
00:13:43
Speaker
Yeah, you know, probably dumb luck on my part, Paula, in terms of this, you know, I had been largely in a couple academic roles and then took on an administrative assignment that had a student affairs component. And it was suggested to me that I attend the caucus conference. And I did so. And, you know, to the earlier conversation, I would just say that, you know, I looked around that room.
00:14:05
Speaker
and felt like I was conspicuously younger than most people in the room. I had hair then and it was a lot of gray hair, it was pretty male and I don't think Caucus looks anything like it did back then. But I became, I got involved,
00:14:22
Speaker
you know I just volunteered and said what's going on how do I get involved and maybe that's some of that student leadership stuff and got involved in under our old structure and became got involved in the student affairs the SaaS board as at the time I was living in Vancouver as a western rep and never really looked back took on some roles and volunteered and I would say that those relationships for me were pretty formative
00:14:48
Speaker
They help me professionally and they help me personally. And that network has served me and continues to serve me very well. And I am very mindful when I go to a caucus conference what it's like for the person who's going there for the first time and trying to participate in a way that people feel welcome.
00:15:07
Speaker
and because it's been hugely influential to me. I'm very grateful to caucus for the opportunities that I've had and, you know, eventually served on the caucus board and eventually was president of caucus at one point. So I believe strongly in the work of the organization.
00:15:23
Speaker
So my introduction to caucus was a little more structured than that. And probably, well, you know, again, reflective of, of our professional values. So I had awesome mentorship. I didn't know what student affairs was. I kind of stumbled into a job in student housing. I was at the University of Guelph. So in, in the early nineties and surrounded by
00:15:48
Speaker
really strong influencers, Peggy Patterson and Brian Sullivan, and worked on teams with Marty Williams and Heather Lane and, you know, John Conrad, Jason Hunter, all of whom continue to be actively engaged. Like Jennifer Kismatt, who's such a formative voice on urban planning and sustainability, these were all members of the Student Affairs Residence Life Team at the University of Guelph in that time.
00:16:17
Speaker
I, you know, the mentoring was incredible. I had no concept, no aspiration, no sight line on this opportunity. I had had a miserable undergraduate experience. And in part, you know, while I was doing my graduate, my master's degree at Guelph, this opportunity, I mean, I'm so grateful. Paul, I look back and think, like, I don't know what my professional or personal
00:16:44
Speaker
Journey would have looked like in the absence of that intervention. It really was You know, I was a part of the new professionals program when we had it and I had an opportunity to work on the on the newsletter back in the day the journal I Honestly don't know what my life would have looked like without and it was moments, but you know Peggy Patterson in particular. She was just so generous like unbelievably generous and I tried to pay that forward and
00:17:13
Speaker
But I'll never, I'll never repay that debt because my, you know, my life's been shaped by her kindness and her generosity. Yeah, I would just add to that. It's kind of a trip down memory lane in terms of those early years, going back now, decades. But I remember going to my first couple of caucus conferences and just feeling like, oh, now this, this, I found my people. It felt like, like, you know,
00:17:42
Speaker
I had arrived home where I didn't always feel that at my institution, but I just thought it was formative. It truly was formative. And you mentioned some of those same names, Janet, including Peggy Patterson. Like I just remember being awestruck by how she presented and how she talked about student development. And it definitely shaped what I did then.
00:18:11
Speaker
And it has been hugely important in my growth and development as a professional. It's so interesting that you all speak about others welcoming you into the space. And I think that for myself, I have been welcomed by all of you have met you in person at a caucus conference. But the fact that now as a mid-career professional, I also, when I go to caucus, I take that care to make sure that
00:18:39
Speaker
those newcomers feel welcomed and they can ask questions and they don't feel intimidated and they feel like they have a space to say hello and belong. So it's interesting. Sorry, going back to Tim, you had something to say. No, apologies. You know, in the spirit of, you know, 50th anniversary of caucus and some of what's being said, you know, I too have benefited from
00:19:03
Speaker
some of those folks that were named and worked for Brian Sullivan at one point. Peggy Patterson and I shared some graduate students at another point. Dave Morphy, Dave McMurray, my colleague Dave Hanna,
00:19:19
Speaker
Heather Lane, you know like just, you know, people who did an awful lot for the profession and and personally I benefited from those relationships I must say that, as I, as I now when I go to caucus which we had the opportunity to do this past summer, and you know I think people
00:19:37
Speaker
responded well to some former rank and file student affairs people coming to the conference. Locals done well, but I feel like I'm a million years old now when I go to the conference. But I also, as a president, I look at who's coming into the field. And Sean alluded to this in terms of some of his hiring. Janice talked about some of the concerns she has around diversity
00:20:06
Speaker
at the senior ranks, but I'm sure shares the concerns around diversity within our institutions. But the profession, I'm looking at the profession. I am simultaneously heartened to see who's coming in, who's in the middle, who's taking on some of these senior roles because it really has changed. But I'm also chagrined. I'm seeing people leave the profession. Some notable departures from the profession because it is hard work. There's a lot of emotional labour and it's not for everyone.
Key Leadership Traits Fostered by Student Affairs
00:20:36
Speaker
And so, you know, I my my mind turns to the work that caucus does and and its importance as a professional home for folks and a bit of a touch base touchstone for people. But, you know, the work ahead of us is, you know, how to do this work in a healthy way, how to keep people engaged in the profession so that we can do the work that we all care about for the students. Yeah, I would just add one thing. I realize what one of the things about caucus that I thought was so
00:21:06
Speaker
interesting and I continue to think it's so fundamentally important and Tim you just touched on it but it is that opportunity to feel supported. There's a little bit of a group therapy that occurs you know at any caucus conference but you know you realize sometimes I think depending on the size of the institution that different student affairs professionals come from
00:21:30
Speaker
you know, it can be kind of lonely, isolating work. And so caucus provides that broader, I think, sense of, oh, there's others out there doing this type of work and the chance to share and different experiences and hear different experiences. And also, and this is what I was just thinking about, it covers both colleges and universities. And I think that's also fundamentally important. And I think Tim, Janet and I actually all
00:21:58
Speaker
represent career paths that transcended both of those worlds in different ways. So for college and university presidents who may not be familiar with caucus, and I also recognize that we often call it caucus without naming it as the Canadian Association of College and University Student Services, what is one thing they should know about the organization? Well, maybe I'll take a stab at that. You know, again, I'm really clear with people about the
00:22:28
Speaker
tilt or orientation that the organization subscribes to. So the values-based proposition of being student-centric in your decision-making, you know, I talk a lot about, I talk a lot to presidents about how it informs my decision-making. So an example I would use is how I think about student success.
00:22:48
Speaker
So I think there are probably lots of presidents who are amazing and who I admire who probably look at enrollment data and may not dive deeper to look at things like mental health data or attrition at certain points or high risk courses or high risk demographic data around enrollment.
00:23:14
Speaker
I talk a lot to colleagues who ask for some advice or counsel around how to stay inspired and engaged. I talk a lot about some of the strategies I learned as a student affairs professional that keep me in touch with students without making them uncomfortable. So that's actually a bit of an art.
00:23:34
Speaker
you know, staying in touch and engaged with students without disrupting their autonomy or imposing on their student experience. That takes a little bit of curation and planning. And so, you know, I often kind of loud caucus as not just an organization or the conference as an experience, but
00:23:57
Speaker
But I talk a lot about the leadership in caucus, the professionals who are invested in caucus and what they can do to inform your leadership. Like ask them about how they're thinking about enrollment or about how they contemplate student experience, how they measure student satisfaction. Because the diversity, the thoughtfulness,
00:24:19
Speaker
The research focus that many of our new and emerging colleagues bring to the table I think has great potential to inform and inspire and help us navigate many of the challenges on our desks.
00:24:35
Speaker
I can maybe chime in. You know, I think, you know, Sean, to your earlier point about colleges and universities, I think we have lots and lots in common. I would point here to, I think university presidents, they're a little more deficient in the area, my sense is, than college presidents.
00:24:54
Speaker
And that's my perception. You can comment, but especially with the focus on research, I think there's an academic pecking order that is in place in universities, certainly something I deal with. And I think what I'd want
00:25:11
Speaker
presidents, and I do say this at Universities Canada, I see when people are hiring and I'm not shy about it. I probably annoy my colleagues greatly about this because I don't think they know that student affairs is a profession for some folks. While I'm theoretically open to lateral moves in institutions and I've certainly seen cases of faculty members who have made the transition,
00:25:34
Speaker
I think it's a tall order and it's not every faculty member who can make, who can slip into the role. So, you know, I'd want them to know that it's a profession, that there is a distinction to be made between a senior student affairs officer and a senior accounts payable person. And, you know, I think some of them don't know that because they haven't, you know, they've had very great careers, they've become presidents of institutions, they could have been great researchers, they could be
00:26:00
Speaker
whatever their path was, so no disrespect to them, but they haven't encountered it. The traditional pathway being a dean to a provost to a president is kind of shifting a bit, and we are certainly seeing a lot of the vice presidents research take on presidencies in research universities.
00:26:20
Speaker
And I think they need some support and help to understand the complexity of the student experience and to be student centered.
Engagement of College Presidents with Caucus
00:26:28
Speaker
So, you know, some of those folks that have been hired that I find questionable work out well, but it's a bit of a path and it's hard for them. And my concern is that they're not set up for success. So I just would hope that we can try to set folks up for success and institutions for success. Yeah. I mean, I would just add PJ, in short, I would say for any
00:26:48
Speaker
in terms of what other presidents need to know about caucus, I would just encourage them to both support their student affairs folks going to caucus for all the reasons we've talked about in terms of professional development and growth and support, but also they take the time to attend at least one themselves because Tim, you could be right around the university versus kind of college
00:27:16
Speaker
realms but I would say even in the college realm you know there's a lot of a lot of college presidents that really come out of a some of the corporate services background or an academic background or research even but you know just to haven't had some of the benefit that that we've had in terms of that student-centric comfortable kind of in the those
00:27:42
Speaker
in the ambiguity and in the gray spaces, you know, there's a lot of navigating that it's not black and white. And that would encourage them to attend a caucus conference and support their people being there because I think it's part of broadening their horizons and make them better presidents because I think it could, you know, depending on their backgrounds, truly it could.
00:28:07
Speaker
you know, give them the opportunity to experience a set of perspectives that they may not and be involved in conversations that may not have been involved in previously. You know, and maybe this is a, I suspect this is a shared experience. I am always flummoxed by leaders in our sector who aren't curious about students. Like, don't you think that's weird? Like, I just think it's weird. Janet,
00:28:37
Speaker
I couldn't agree more. Yeah, but I think that also comes, like when I think about there's so many aspects of who I am as a president, I realize probably did come out of student affairs, but I don't think of it in that way. So these, it's really helpful to have this conversation. No, that's why I'm saying it's an orientation, right? Like, so I remember when I worked somewhere, not here, but before here,
00:29:04
Speaker
where I always used to be told that if I wanted to engage senior leaders with students, I had to give them something to do because and I learned this lesson and it was great counsel. I just it just never occurred to me. So the lesson was that if you want senior leaders to talk to students
00:29:22
Speaker
you know, engage with them, you had to give people something to do so that talking to students wasn't the primary focus of that interaction, right? And where we landed was like flipping pancakes or burgers or whatever, then you're distracted by that. It's kind of like when you drive with teenagers in your car and you don't want them to have to look at you. They tell you more if they're looking out the front
00:29:46
Speaker
It was a great strategy, but I had to get over all the time. Like, what are you talking about? You're not just so excited about being able to have five focused minutes with a learner that's investing tens of thousands of dollars in the institution and the learning experience. Don't you want to know how long they commute and what their challenges are and what they aspire to do and whether or not they feel like they belong, where their point of connectedness with
00:30:13
Speaker
Like this makes me a freak show in some uh in some sets of company and I don't get it
00:30:22
Speaker
Yeah, you know, Janet, I realize I do the same. And I hear it all the time. We hired a new VP recently, and we went for lunch, came back. And I just did what I always do, which is I talk to students, and I'm so curious. So that's the word I always think. I just am genuinely curious. I want to hear about their experiences, all of those sorts of questions. Anyway, we went and came back. And he said, you know, he came from the university world. He said, that was incredible.
00:30:50
Speaker
I said, what? I said, well, you just had 10 conversations with students. He says, I've never seen a president do that. I said, oh. I said, well, that's just who I am. I'm curious. But again, I guess it's interesting to reflect on that in terms of this conversation and how coming out of that student affairs orientation, I think there's just a natural curiosity. It's a really good word and a natural, you know,
00:31:18
Speaker
I guess the intensity to connect with students. And you know, so sorry to jump back in, but a lot of that is about humility. So you cannot be a student service focused professional and not be very humble. When you acknowledge your own privilege in a space and talk to a learner
00:31:44
Speaker
you know, first-generation Canadian, first-generation participant, if you're curious and you ask those questions and you talk to racialized learners about the obstacles they've encountered, or right now, supporting transgendered members of our community, if you're not coming to those conversations with tremendous, genuine, heartfelt humility, you know, that's something that being student-centered has taught me from day one, and it is a difference in orientation there.
00:32:14
Speaker
I agree with what you're both saying. I think there is a humility portion to it, although I don't think my reputation is to be Mr. Humble. But as I think about it, I can remember early days accompanying a president
00:32:32
Speaker
to student events because the president needed to be guarded. And a student would come up and I would say, student, this is the president. President, this is the student. And the students would say, my name is whatever, Abdul. And I would say, president, this is Abdul. And the president would say, hi. And I'd say, the president says hi. It was almost like the bridge to communication between a student and the president because
00:33:00
Speaker
I think the president was scared. You know, I think you have to be somewhat brave in some regards because, you know, you go out and students will tell you what's wrong, how the institution is failing them. And I know when I came into my current role at Mount Royal,
00:33:16
Speaker
I would go places and I would have people accompanying me. And I'd say, what are you doing here? Is this how this works? Oh, well, we always go with the president to run interference. And I'm like, I'm OK. I can talk to these people. It's OK. Same with faculty. They want to rip your head off. They rip your head off.
00:33:39
Speaker
You live another day. So I think it's an interesting, I think the dynamics are changing. And I think that, you know, institutional leaders like ourselves, I think this is now expected of us. And going back, you know, to your first question, Paula, I mean, in a way, the student affairs involvement has helped us be able to do this work in this manner. And, you know, that's an incredible benefit of that student affairs pathway.
00:34:09
Speaker
So I'm really enjoying our conversation, but unfortunately we're at our last question of the day and it's this.
Caucus's Influence on Canadian Higher Education
00:34:16
Speaker
Tim mentioned having both hope and chagrin about the student affairs profession in Canada. And I'm just wondering from your perspective, what role can caucus play in the development and growth and the landscape of Canadian higher education and student affairs itself?
00:34:35
Speaker
Well, I'll just jump in and just say that, you know, I think caucus has been doing some great things. I hope caucus continues on those lines. I would say that student affairs has been the bellwether for much of what's been going on in Canadian post secondary education. We were talking about mental health before other people were talking about mental health. We were talking about sexual violence before people were talking about sexual violence.
00:34:57
Speaker
and on and on and on and on. And so, you know, in some ways I think caucus should continue to do that. I think that one of the greatest things that caucus can do is to essentially people the profession, to staff the institutions. I'm always pleased, you know, I said I was chagrin when I would see senior folks leave the profession.
00:35:21
Speaker
But I'm always delighted when people leave temporarily Student Affairs to take on another role in the institution and they go into the deepest, darkest recesses of the faculties or they take on some administrative role somewhere. They take a lot with them and they bring back a lot.
00:35:40
Speaker
And so I think a challenge for caucus is to think about that and think about the parts of the institutions that aren't represented in caucus. We have some academic advisors in caucus, but it's kind of a separate thing in some regards.
00:35:57
Speaker
International is in some regards, we have some folks in caucus who do international focus, but international can also be a kind of a different thing. And so I think it's those porous relationships and interactions where I think caucus could really help shape where Canadian post-secondary education is going. Yeah, I think those are great points.
00:36:21
Speaker
You cannot read the news or contemplate global affairs on any given day without being very concerned about the future of the planet and the future of whatever level of peace we currently enjoy and you know, I maintain again, you know, perhaps in a way that's Pollyanna, but I
00:36:44
Speaker
I honestly believe that post-secondary education has this unique capacity to transform not just individual learners but their families and their communities.
00:36:57
Speaker
But none of that happens if we're not continuing to contemplate access both in, through, and out. And so all of those outcomes rest on our colleagues' capacity to study, pilot, reflect on, revisit, remodel, reorganize, re-engineer what we do, why we do it, and where the impact can be greatest.
00:37:25
Speaker
And so, you know, kudos to those folks because, um, you know, that, that is what that, that, that, that for sure is going to be what sustains our organizations in the current context. And I really hope it's what propels the planet towards a, you know, safer, more secure, sustainable world.
00:37:51
Speaker
But it's kind of hard to follow up on that. I couldn't agree more. I mean, just to think about caucus in the future, I would certainly reinforce now that Tim's point around, first of all, caucus is really important. It has clearly played a big role for the three of us in our professional growth. I think it's going to be just as important in the next 50 years in terms of dealing with an ever more complex world and an ever more
00:38:21
Speaker
challenges that I think we're all just trying to wrap our mind around. But always with that sense of, and I think that, you know, pick up on Janet's point as well, that, you know,
00:38:32
Speaker
that the work that student affairs does, the work that post-secondary institutions do is hugely important and makes a phenomenal difference in the lives of our individual learners, but all of our communities. And student affairs is front and center in that. So my encouragement will be caucus to keep doing what they're doing, to keep finding ways of supporting each other, and really importantly, providing professional development for new professionals,
00:39:02
Speaker
And just to pick up on Tim's earlier point, to make the tent as big as possible. I mean, I think, you know, from the vantage point of being a president, you know, there's the group of individuals who do amazing work in, you know, in what we might call student affairs. But there's a lot of student affairs work that happens across our institutions and I think there's lots of benefit to
00:39:23
Speaker
to make sure that everyone feels that they have that chance to be part of caucus, to be part of that professional development, and to really take that broader perspective.
00:39:34
Speaker
I think there's a, I think if I can just pipe in and just, I'm sure we're short on time, but the, you know, there's a context here. I can't help but think of this question and reflect on, you know, Janet and Sean and myself and a couple others where we're the first, we're the first student affairs folks among the first, if not the first to be the president. And I think caucus can help the career path of others who might take those roles that would bring different perspectives as we move forward.
00:40:04
Speaker
And, you know, I'm excited for that. I think that that's really going to really help institutions who are thinking about doing things in different ways and really want to be more student centered. And I think caucus can really help with that. So I want to thank Janet, Sean and Tim for joining us today and taking the time from their very busy
00:40:31
Speaker
busy lives as presidents of institutions to join us today. I also want to thank our listeners for listening to the caucus 50 oral history project. And if you've enjoyed this episode, we'd love for you to share, subscribe, rate and review. And we want you to come join us next time. And thank you for joining us today.
00:41:11
Speaker
The Caucus 50 Oral History Project is an initiative of the Canadian Association of College and University Student Services in recognition of our organization's 50 years of engaging student affairs professionals in Canada. The series of podcasts is recorded and produced by Sean Fast, Adam Kuehn, Nicholas Fast, Rachel Barreca, Stephanie Mulettoller, Noah Arney, Sally Chen, Estefania Toledo, Paula Jean Broderick, Jennifer Brown, Margaret De Leon,
00:41:41
Speaker
and Becca Gray. Intro and outro music is courtesy of Alexei Stryapji. This podcast is recorded, produced, and published on the traditional territories of hundreds of Indigenous nations from across the northern half of Turtle Island, also known by its settler colonial name, Canada. We are grateful for the opportunity to live, work, and learn on this land. Miigwetch.