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Episode 69: Parenthood and Business
152 Plays5 years ago
Today Jamie Findlay, cofounder of Evolve Workshops, joins me for a conversation about parenthood and business. While Jamie might be most recognizable in the context Evolve, she actually runs four businesses and has quite the entrepreneurial background—which I think makes this conversation about parenthood and business that much more interesting.
Jamie is a mom and four, and we dive into chatting about how becoming a mother impacted her business and tips she has for running a business while raising a family. I really enjoyed our conversation, and as I think you’ll hear during the episode, Jamie’s insight led me to do some reflection on fatherhood and business.
Before we get to episode, if you’re a photographer looking for a community oriented conference or workshop that also provides great education, check out what Evolve has going on. I’ll link to their website in the show notes, but they typically hold conferences and workshops in some pretty awesome places—think Palm Springs and Greece.
For the show notes, go to https://daveyandkrista.com/btb-jamie-findlay-episode-69
Recommended
Transcript
The Guilt of the Young Entrepreneur Mom
00:00:05
Speaker
When I was a young mom, I kind of had a cycle. If I would give it my all, I'd grow really fast. I'd feel guilty about the time I was taking away from my kids. I would either stop cold turkey or I would sell off the company. It was really just about doing what was right for my family during that time and creating a system for us. Systems changed my life. So there wasn't always balance, but my kids have also never known anything differently.
Introduction of Guests and Themes
00:00:31
Speaker
Welcome to the Brands at Book Show, where we help creative, service-based businesses build their brands and find more clients. I'm your host, Davy Jones.
00:00:43
Speaker
Today, Jamie Finley, co-founder of Evolve Workshops, joins me for a conversation about Parenthood and business. While Jamie might be most recognizable in the context of Evolve, she actually runs four businesses and has quite the entrepreneurial background, which I think makes this conversation about Parenthood and business that much more interesting.
Motherhood's Impact on Business: Jamie's Journey
00:01:03
Speaker
Jamie is a mom of four and we dive into chatting about how becoming a mother impacted her business and tips she has for running a business while raising a family. I really enjoyed our conversation and as I think you'll hear during the episode, Jamie's insight led me through some of my own reflection on fatherhood and business.
00:01:20
Speaker
Before we get to the episode, if you're a photographer looking for a community-oriented conference or workshop that also provides some great education, check out what Evolve has going on. I'll link to their website in the show notes, but they typically hold conferences and workshops in some pretty awesome places. Think Palm Springs and Greece.
Feedback Invitation and Social Media Engagement
00:01:40
Speaker
Be sure to check out the show notes at DavianChrista.com for the resources we mentioned during the episode. And like I said, I want to hear from you. Let me know what kind of content you'd like to see on the Brands at Book podcast as we move forward. To leave your feedback, head on over to the Davian Christa Facebook page, send us a message there, or you can also DM us on Instagram at DavianandChrista. Now onto the episode.
Meeting Jamie: A Podcast Story
00:02:06
Speaker
Welcome back to the brands that book show. We have Jamie Finley, founder of many businesses, but I met her through evolve. And I actually met her at United this past week. So Jamie, I'm excited to have you on the brands that book podcast. I'm really excited to be here. Thank you, Davey.
00:02:22
Speaker
It was great meeting you at United because I've heard so much about the Evolve workshops and the Evolve conference and so it was great to finally put a face with the name. I'm excited to hear more about that and we'll talk more about that.
Balancing Family and Business
00:02:38
Speaker
We're today talking about motherhood and business and especially working as a husband and wife team, Chris and I are asked about
00:02:46
Speaker
sort of family stuff and working from home. And since we've had Jack asked about parenting and business and stuff like that, I feel like I'm really still very much figuring this out. But you have four kids and so you've had some time to reflect on this a little bit more. So I'm excited to dive into that with you as well. Good. Yeah, I'm excited to talk about it. It's probably the question I get asked the most.
00:03:10
Speaker
probably for good reason because it's just one of those things I've said on the podcast before, especially I just feel like Jack's changing so much. I mean, everything, nap schedules in particular. And so it's definitely interesting to balance working from home. So I'm excited to dig into that with you a little bit more.
From Mary Kay to Photography: Jamie's Entrepreneurial Path
00:03:30
Speaker
We always spend the beginning of each episode, especially with new guests, diving into a little bit of your entrepreneurial journey. So I'd love to hear about your background in, you know, where you started, you know, what was the first business you started and how did that lead you here today being the owner of four different businesses? Oh, man. So, you know, my story, I feel like how do I compact 20 years of being a serial entrepreneur, but
00:03:56
Speaker
I guess it all started when I was younger, I always had to take care of myself. So based on the way that I was raised, there was a lot of responsibility put on my plate. And so I always had a job from the age of 14 on, I always had a job. I worked and danced six hours a day. I was taking care of my home, doing all these different things with responsibility. And I don't know if something there infused in me, this need to go do my own thing, but it wasn't very long into college where I was working three jobs, trying to stay out of debt.
00:04:26
Speaker
that I decided to try at home sales. And that's kind of where I started. I was a Mary Kay rep back in the day when it was still super cool to be a Mary Kay rep.
00:04:36
Speaker
And I loved it. The hustle of going out there and getting every free trip I could get and the free car I could get and all the money and the girl time, like there was just something about it that I loved. And I had actually gone to school for apparel and textile design. So I wanted eventually to start my clothing company, which took about 10 years. And during that time I ran several small businesses and about 10 years into my entrepreneur journey.
00:05:01
Speaker
I started a clothing company. And so I did that for seven years. Design and manufacturing had two boutiques, 30 girls selling for me. During that time, I was shooting all of our commercial imagery because I loved photography and I started with film. And so I loved the challenge of doing that. My creative outlet was definitely to take pictures for my clothing company. And so I continued that and about seven years in after we went online, I started to burn out.
00:05:28
Speaker
I was having a really hard time figuring out how to balance being a mom with running this business that never ended slash trying to do photography and being asked all the time to do photography.
The Growth of Jamie's Photography Business
00:05:40
Speaker
And so, um, that was kind of my journey was trying several things and we'll talk about it a little when we talk about balance, but eventually it led me into making the decision to go into photography full time. So I sold my company and went in.
00:05:55
Speaker
So you sold your clothing company and you went into photography and you were primarily being asked to shoot people's weddings, portraits, family sessions. Was this because of the work you were doing shooting your own line of clothing? Yeah. So initially I was seeking it out. I was looking for local families or portraits that I could practice lighting techniques on. So I was always asking to just shoot for free to create content to better my own
00:06:21
Speaker
knowledge of how my camera worked, especially coming from film into digital during that time. So from there, it became, oh, well, you know, I heard you shot Davies family. Do you want to do our family? And at some point, something clicked. I thought, yes, it's $100 to do this. It's going to cost you $100.
00:06:39
Speaker
And they paid me $100. And I was like, what? Nobody works for me. I don't have a warehouse. I can just walk outside and go do something I love and get paid $100. And we were doing big business in my clothing company, but something about it just seems so much more fulfilling.
00:06:56
Speaker
So that's how it started. I didn't shoot commercial for other people for a long time. And it was probably a year into doing weddings or doing portraits before somebody asked me to a wedding. And my first wedding was like $1,100. And I thought that was insane. They're giving them $1,100 to go shoot a wedding. And so from there, it just kind of morphed. But I do think it helped coming from business into the mindset of this is also a new business.
00:07:23
Speaker
Yeah and I wonder even to your experience as a Mary Kay rep, one thing I've noticed among people that I talk to who have some sort of sales background, I do think just that edge of being willing to talk about what you do. I mean and as a salesperson like
00:07:39
Speaker
People know a pitch is coming, right? But I think that people who have some sort of sales experience, they're just way more comfortable talking about what they do and talking about things like pricing. So I have to imagine that helped get this business off the ground as well.
00:07:54
Speaker
Oh, absolutely. And Mary Kay wasn't the only direct sales I did. I mean, I went from Mary Kay to several other ones. I burned that list to the ground, Davey. I was like, hey, I got this new thing. I'm going to pitch this to you. And I'm going to win this trip. And I'm going to be on that stage. And I want you guys to buy into what I'm doing. And I always had so much passion about what I did put my time into that it helped. But transitioning to photos, you're right. Nobody was talking about money.
00:08:20
Speaker
Nobody was talking about, I had no idea. Was it good I got paid $1,100 on my first wedding? Was it bad? Was I supposed to be making a certain number? My first wedding was $400 and we thought we're gonna be rich, you know? And it's always funny looking back on that. So, I have respect for the fact that your first wedding was $1,100.
Challenges of Work-Life Balance
00:08:41
Speaker
Hey, you know, I was a hustler, if anything, but I didn't know. I mean, there really weren't conversations around it. Like you said, nobody was talking about it, but it has always made me more comfortable, which is how I ended up where I am now, which is
00:08:54
Speaker
So let's back up. So I am a photographer still full time. So I specialize now in lifestyle editorial and I do a lot of wedding destination weddings and I still shoot commercial. I still take local families and clients cause I've had clients here for a very long time that I continue to serve. But from there I started getting asked a lot to educate. And so I do my private coaching for that reason. A lot of people don't want to have conversations about the reality of business and what it actually takes to run a successful business.
00:09:22
Speaker
and to make it past that two year burnout point, a lot of photographers hit. So it was all those years of running my own company that has transitioned me into helping other people do that. Yeah, and I have to imagine that running the clothing business really helped in that regard because you very much have to know your numbers when you're managing inventory, right? Absolutely. Whereas with photography, the barrier to entry is a little bit lower. I mean, sure, cameras and lenses definitely cost
00:09:49
Speaker
significant money. But it's I think a different kind of significant win of having like a warehouse with a bunch of inventory in it and understanding your margins. And a lot of people can get into photography with cameras that aren't crazy expensive. So I think there is this, oh, well, oh, I already have this camera and somebody's asking me to shoot their family session for a couple hundred dollars. This is great. But there's not that awareness
00:10:13
Speaker
of the numbers, they know they like it, it's fulfilling. So I can definitely see how that would help you, I mean, grow your business, but then also why people would come to you and say, I really need help with the business side of things. Absolutely. You know, and I even having run a business for a long time ran into that for a while of the money just continues to come and I think
00:10:33
Speaker
The momentum is what throws most of us off as a photographer because it's like, oh, you shot one person, then you have another person. I have another wedding. And it seems like everything's going so great until two years down the road. You're like, I have no idea what my cost of doing business is. I'm actually making $5,000 after my hundred thousand dollars I brought in in revenue. Like it takes a while sometimes to learn those lessons when you are self-employed, especially in a creative industry, the way that it is. We don't have traditional overhead. We don't have,
00:11:02
Speaker
We have very little monthly expenses. And so it has to come into pre-planning and organization and understanding what you're trying to work towards. But I think that's normal. I think most people run into that.
00:11:15
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. And is this kind of what led you to start Evolve?
Birth and Evolution of Evolve Workshops
00:11:20
Speaker
The first time I heard about Evolve was through Sean Gordon, and he was telling me that he was going to Greece for an Evolve workshop. And of course, my first question was, can I come? As a member of KISS, he told me no. But anyways, people should be familiar. Sean did an episode with us back somewhere in the 20s, so check that out. But tell us how Evolve sort of came about.
00:11:44
Speaker
Yeah, so Evolve was kind of a blend of many things. Like I said, I had my photography business. I also had a full service studio, which I still have, which I was subleasing to other creatives that couldn't afford their own space. So that was already kind of in existence. And I had transitioned into photography after having a full staff. And like I said, I had sold my company and I was really lonely. And it seemed to me that things were very,
00:12:10
Speaker
Singular everybody was kind of on their own island doing their own thing not communicating about it And so it actually started with an invitation from me to another girl who became one of the founders of evolve To try to build connection and friendship. I was super lonely in my profession. And so from that simple invite I Decided to host an event at my studio. I said let's open this up. Let's see how many photographers come and I
00:12:36
Speaker
community events were formed, connections were made. And then after about two years, I realized I'm spending all my time helping this co-founder. I'm spending all my time helping other members of my community learn how to make money in business. But all these attendees would come to these community events and take beautiful pictures and leave broke with no idea where to go next. And so about two years into evolve, we morphed into educational based events.
00:13:02
Speaker
trying to help people who were struggling figure out how to make ends meet. And so it started very much as a community-based business and it's still today is very much a community-based business. And you all host workshops all over the world, right? We do. We do anywhere from four to eight a year. It kind of depends on the different locations and the number of attendees we take. But we do those all around the world. Some are 15 or less, some are 50 or less. And once a year, we do a conference, which is a couple hundred people.
00:13:32
Speaker
And you have a conference coming up in San Francisco, right? We do. In February, we have our second annual conference. And just so people are aware of that, because we typically mention these kinds of things at the end of the episode, but after the content's done, I feel like not everybody hears about it. So I'd love to ask now, is that something that people can still sign up for this February or is that have registration already closed for that?
00:13:55
Speaker
We actually just reopened registration. So we did Palm Springs conference back in April. We opened up a hundred tickets and they were gone in 48 hours and we shut it down while we built our speaker list until the first of November. So it just opened up in three days. The full speaker list is out. So November 15th, everything's out, all the shoots, all the details, but yeah, we still have probably about 75 seats is all for this event. Like I said, did just open back up, but,
00:14:22
Speaker
We're loving filling our community to a fuller capacity than we've been able to do when we have cut it off at 50. So it's going to be an amazing event. And we have phenomenal support from our community there. Some really good representation. All right, awesome. And I'll have to check back in with you when this episode goes live and share an update about that. And hopefully, for those of you listening, maybe ticket sales are still going. And you'll be able to sign up for that. But you're still doing workshops throughout the year, right? In addition to this conference.
00:14:51
Speaker
Yep, even if this goes out and we're sold out for that event, we do events throughout the year. So we still will have probably four to five other events that we have on the calendar that will announce it the first of the year, but they can join us in the US and also internationally. Any fun places? I feel like everywhere you go is fun. So that's not a fair question. Like, Palm Springs is awesome. Paris is awesome. Any hints? Any hints? Well, you know, okay, I'm not going to spill the beans on all the locations we're going yet, but warmth.
00:15:19
Speaker
There is something that I have incorporated in every other company I've ever owned for 15 years, which is a humanitarian aspect. And so for 2020, we are bringing that into evolve and we're putting on a really amazing community event, humanitarian event out of the country. So that's probably what I'm the most excited about.
00:15:37
Speaker
Well, I'm excited to hear about it. And when you do release the dates and locations, we'll share them here on the podcast so that people can check those out, especially considering maybe the San Francisco event might be sold out by the time this episode goes live. But I do want to get into kind of the content for today.
Motherhood Lessons in Business Strategy
00:15:56
Speaker
You had mentioned along the way, you became a mother, and now you're a mom of four. And you're still running for businesses.
00:16:05
Speaker
So that sounds like a lot. We have several dogs. We have a lot.
00:16:12
Speaker
Yeah, no, I mean, I am just excited to dig in and hear about how you manage all of that. Because I'm managing two businesses now and I feel like sometimes I don't know if I can manage it all. So I'm really excited to dig into this. What are some of the ways that I guess how did becoming a mother impact the businesses that you were starting? I mean, did you take any significant time off during that time period? Or is this, you know, having a business was just kind of always a reality of your life? Kind of a mix of both. I feel like
00:16:41
Speaker
Being a mom was something I'd always dreamt of since I was little. I had this vision how I was going to do things differently from how I was raised, how involved I wanted to be in their lives. I had this vision of what it would be. What I didn't realize was that this vision I had for myself as a mom would always be in direct competition with this inner need and desire I had to run my own company. And so it took me a very, very long time to find that, you know, elusive balance.
00:17:08
Speaker
that everybody talked about. And when I was a young mom, I kind of had a cycle. If I would give it my all, I'd grow really fast. I'd feel guilty about the time I was taking away from my kids. And I would either stop cold turkey or I would sell off the company. It was kind of this wash, rinse, repeat for a long while until I finally learned there really wasn't a balance. It was really just about doing what was right for my family during that time and creating a system for us. Systems changed my life. So if there wasn't always balance,
00:17:38
Speaker
But my kids have also never known anything differently. So it is kind of a mix of both what you asked. They've never not known mom running a business. They've never not known me traveling for my work. And people always ask that, how do you travel all the time? And don't you feel guilty? And you know, the mom guilt. Sure. But that's all my kids have known. And really essentially and wonderfully, I am gone maybe once a month for four to six days. And the other 25 days of the month,
00:18:04
Speaker
I'm present. I'm sitting in my office. Right now I'm sitting in my office. My daughter's walking past the glass doors. I can see her playing with the nanny bike. I'm still here. I'm still mom. But we had to find what worked for us. It doesn't work for everybody. But we had to figure out what works for us. Yeah. And I you know, when before Jack was born, Kristen, I always
00:18:25
Speaker
I guess we didn't anticipate how challenging it would be to work from home. I mean, it's definitely a blessing. So I don't want to sound like I'm complaining. I think just as you said, it does give us this opportunity to be present in a way a typical nine to five really doesn't. But at the same time, it's like some work has to be done and Jack at 17 months old definitely needs like when he's awake,
00:18:48
Speaker
he needs attention. I'm interested in hearing what systems you put in place and just hearing a little bit more about what you mean by they're not being a balance because honestly, I don't really love that word either.
Systems Over Balance: A New Perspective on Work-Life
00:19:02
Speaker
Could you tell us a little bit about some of these systems that you put in place and what you mean about they're not really being a balance? Yeah, I think for a long time, I would look at others and I thought that there was this balance.
00:19:15
Speaker
I always felt like I was behind. I was always frustrated. I was never getting things done. I was working really inefficiently where I felt like I worked all day, but they were in five minute increments. And so it truly took my entire day. I was short with my kids. I was irritated when they came in. Nothing felt right. I just felt out of whack. And so when I realized that it was okay to set limits, it was okay to ask for help. It was okay to find systems that I could automate and hire people to help me.
00:19:44
Speaker
That's when things started to make a difference for me because everybody talks about this balance and I think you can feel balanced, but I think balance is elusive. It's truly customizable to your situation and what works for your family. And that's setting time limits and consciously working in specific time frames to accomplish one task and, and just being a little more focused.
00:20:10
Speaker
is one of the best things you can do as far as systemizing things. But systems as a whole, you can automate anything, Davey. You know that. It just takes time and organization. Do you feel like there's sort of an added pressure on those who are entrepreneurs? A lot of us, I know who listen to this podcast, work from home. Do you feel like there's a little bit more pressure on us, whether it should be there or not? I guess in terms of parenting, because we are always at home.
00:20:37
Speaker
Do you feel like there maybe there's even like a little bit of guilt there? Like, I mean, Jack's right now he's sleeping. And I try to schedule these things during it's one system I have trying to schedule as much while he's napping. But you know, in an hour, he'll be up and I'll still have work to do. Do you feel like there's some added guilt there built in for us entrepreneurs who work from home?
00:20:54
Speaker
for sure guilt on ourselves or guilt others put on you probably both. Yeah, probably both. I think it's probably more on ourselves. You know, I think if we all were to, you know, I mean, just the conversation we're having right now, I doubt there's probably many other people who are putting guilt on us because I think most people, especially my friends who work nine to five, you know, they understand that they're at work from nine to five, they don't have a choice of
00:21:15
Speaker
you know engaging with their kids at three o'clock in the afternoon because they're at work you know so i would say it's probably more on us but there's just this idea of be an entrepreneur in general where it's like oh it's the four-hour work weekend you can just you can just take the afternoon off and be with your kids.
00:21:33
Speaker
And it definitely gives you some flexibility to do that. I can do things during the week that some of my friends who have nine to fives can't, but I also have businesses to run. So how do you, I guess the best thing that we can do is get into maybe some tips that you have for mothers in particular who are raising children while
00:21:55
Speaker
running the business because I'm just be interested in hearing about, you know, I guess for lack of a better way to put it how you balance being engaged or how you manage that tension of being engaged with your kids and being the mom that it sounds like you want to be with also making sure that your businesses are running well and that you can put food on your table. Yes, it's one. I think the number one thing I had to learn was to give myself grace. I can't do it all and I can't do it all well all the time.
00:22:24
Speaker
I had to release myself from that expectation that I was putting on myself. I had to release myself from the projection I was taking from the community and what I assumed they thought about what I did. And I had to become okay with asking for some help. And when it comes to the tips, there's been a million things that I've tried over the past 15 years. And one thing for me before I go into the tips was for a good period of my life, I had the word present, just be present.
00:22:52
Speaker
on my computer, on my mirrors everywhere so that when my kids walked into my room, I would not be typing while I talked. I was not editing during our conversation. I was putting my hands down and turning my body and my attention towards them, even if it was for 30 seconds. And that helped a lot with feeling like I was fully engaged with my family. But as far as tips go,
00:23:17
Speaker
I really, really appreciate that point. And I think maybe because it's something that I struggle with, I remember talking with Nathan Holrich. So I don't think I've had him on the podcast, but he was at United as well from photographer's edit. And maybe it was for his podcast. He had asked me like, Oh, you know, how do you and Krista kind of turn it off at the end of the day and transition from work
00:23:38
Speaker
to, you know, just being at home as a family. And this might have even been before Jack or it definitely was before Jack because I thought to myself, oh yeah, it's easy, you know, like we close the computers. But I think one thing I realized after Jack came was maybe I didn't shut it down as much as I really thought I did. You know, like when it's you and your spouse and the end of the day comes, yeah, sure, you can put the computers away, but I can kind of maybe in the back of my mind
00:24:05
Speaker
be thinking about work stuff. And I like work. I like what I do. So I feel like it's not difficult for me or it's not something that I want to avoid. But it's kind of in the back of my mind. I feel like with kids though, since Jack's come, he needs, when it's time with him, like at the end of the day and it's time with him, he needs somebody to be fully engaged with him.
00:24:25
Speaker
You know, and so for me, I feel like that's been something I've been really trying to work on, I would say over the last 17 months of his life, just, you know, at the end of the day, truly shutting it down, you know, not letting my mind wander with, oh, you know, I want Oh, that'd be a great idea for a Facebook ad or, you know, whatever it might be, and trying to be fully engaged with him. So I really,
00:24:46
Speaker
Really appreciate that advice of being present and really do think it makes a huge difference whether it be 30 seconds or longer So anyways, did it mean to kind of go off on a tangent there? I do think to add on to that I feel like my kids felt more fulfilled when I started implementing that practice because it is as a business owner I truly love to work like you said that is my fun is coming up with things for work and
00:25:11
Speaker
But the older my kids got, and this was kind of an illusion, and I might burst your bubble here, Davey, I thought things would get easier the older my kids got, and it got harder the older my kids got, because they have more things that they want to talk about, more activities they're involved in, and they need more focused time. I can't just sit and play Barbies while I'm doing phone stuff anymore. She knows if I'm talking and engaging with her versus working and just being a body. So the older my kids got,
00:25:41
Speaker
I started to realize, you know what? Time is my only non-renewable resource. I will never regret putting my phone down and snuggling in the morning with my daughter. I will never regret sitting and playing Barbies with her while 10 people are texting my phone asking about conference passes. I won't regret those things. I can always work and I can always work when they're gone.
00:26:03
Speaker
That's such a good reminder because again, that was a bubble that was burst for me pretty early. I remember talking to Krista and Krista, I didn't do any babysitting or anything like that growing up. My siblings are close enough to me in age where I was never really – I didn't have a younger sibling where I was taking care of them in any similar capacity as I do take care of Jack. But I remember looking at Krista and being like, oh, it's going to be so much easier when he can walk
00:26:27
Speaker
you know, and her literally just laughing at me. Yeah, like, and as so many people listening to this podcast, I know a lot of them have families and kids are probably laughing at home to like, little did you know. So yes, I guess that is a good reminder for me going forward. But also, let's dive into those tips. So tip number one. Yes. Tip number one. So for me, and it took me a while to become this because I'm not naturally a morning person, but I realized that creating a morning routine really changed my effectiveness during the day.
00:26:56
Speaker
Having that time in the morning to do something that was just for me to reassess my goals, for me that looks like meditation, prayer, scripture study, education, affirmations, anything for me that helps me put my mind in the right place. If I can start my day that way, I feel like I'm much more effective in my time management for the rest of the entire day. When I skip that, I'm doing the five minutes here and there.
00:27:22
Speaker
It's like the sprint that never ends, the 24 hour work day that I only probably needed two hours of conscious effort. So a morning routine for me, it is hard for moms, but I promise it is worth it to have even just an hour for yourself. Is this something that you do before your kids get up? I do. Yep. I do that before there are some days that, you know, you got to have flexibility in your schedule. And so there are days that it doesn't happen before. Sometimes.
00:27:50
Speaker
It's while my daughter's eating cereal and she's watching YouTube. I saw a thing on Instagram the other day. It says, you are not a bad mom if your kid watches Netflix. And I thought, you know what? It's not. Sometimes I need 30 minutes to catch up on what's important to reassess my life a little bit and my mindset for the day. And it's okay. But as a whole, I try to do it before my kids are awake.
00:28:12
Speaker
Yeah, I think that's great. And that's something that's been a vital part of Krista's routine since we had Jack. As she gets up at 5.30 an hour and a half before Jack gets up, she's able to do her quiet time and then dive into some work just so that she feels when the day starts and Jack wakes up and needs whatever he needs, that she is in the right mental space to handle that. And again, I feel like I say this all the time on the podcast, but something that she's definitely taught me and I've been grateful for.
00:28:40
Speaker
I don't think I would get up at 5.30 if it weren't for Krista turning over and literally making me get up. But I'm grateful that she doesn't and really does make a huge difference in the day. So morning routine, what about the next step? The next step that I wanted to tell them is to be flexible. Be flexible in your schedule. Realize that as moms, we seriously have 20 things in the air at any one time. And we feel like anything can drop at any second if we're not careful.
00:29:08
Speaker
Life is so busy. We're moving so fast. There's so many things that we're trying to accomplish that I've had to learn. It's okay to be flexible. It's okay if my son forgot something at home and I have to drop what I'm doing to go take it to him. It's okay if there was a conference call that I am now 15 minutes late for. It's never ideal, but it's okay. And I had to give myself some grace and some boundaries of, you know what? Having a schedule is great, but I do need to be flexible when things change and not be so stuck on the rigid
00:29:38
Speaker
of it and allow for that flexibility or I will go crazy and you'll go crazy. Do you feel like you were a flexible person before having kids or do you feel like this was something that you were taught or learned after having kids? I think I was always flexible just because my life was so chaotic. I was always kind of go with the flow. I would just figure it out. I kind of thrived on the chaos of all right, it's go time. I got this. I can do it.
00:30:07
Speaker
I think the hardest thing for me was when it comes to business, you have to have some type of schedule built out for yourself to function. And so I felt like I was failing if I wasn't sticking to that schedule. And so I had to realize at some point, it's okay to be flexible. It's okay to be a combination of who Jamie was before kids and combine it with who I feel like I need to be as a business owner somewhere I have to fit in the middle right now.
00:30:31
Speaker
Yeah, again, and maybe I'll just end up saying this has been a challenge for every single one of your points. I'm definitely heading that direction right now. But you know, flexibility for me, I just feel like I'm the kind of person that either puts everything into it or nothing into it. And since having kids, I think a definite improvement is, you know, like when it comes to working out, you know, for me, it's important to have some sort of routine in place. So I don't have to think about, hey, what I'm going to do today, you know, like, I'm going to go to the gym and I'm going to do this.
00:30:59
Speaker
which is great. But you know, with kids, I mean, like, it might be, oh, Jack really needs something. So I have to go to the gym 15 minutes later, which means I only have 30 minutes to work out today, maybe. And I think in the past, I would have told myself and this is pre kids, well, you know, 15 minutes is already gone, I might as well not go. Whereas with kids, or with Jack, if I approached it that way, I would literally never go to the gym.
00:31:22
Speaker
Exactly. Yeah, and it's just taught me to, you know, okay, I have 20 minutes here to do this and so I'm going to take advantage of that time. So, you
Parenting and Flexibility
00:31:31
Speaker
know, I agree. I think that's definitely something that even if you're not flexible, you know, it's a great tip, but I feel like you're gonna have to learn it as a parent. Like there's just no way not to. Yeah. Exactly. Kids are so wonderful, but they're so disruptive.
00:31:46
Speaker
And you know, I had to learn that. So we fostered for a short time and we will go back to it, but we had a teenager living with us. I have never had that principle be more pushed and stretched in my entire life than having to be flexible for another child. I thought I was used to what I was dealing with with my four. And then to bring in another child, I was like, okay, I'm learning. I have to be flexible. I have to reprioritize what is important to me.
00:32:15
Speaker
And sometimes my goals don't align with my priorities. And I have to take a step back and reassess those. But being flexible plays a big part in that. And that's awesome that you fostered. I feel like that's something that Chris and I have been trying to discern a little bit more lately. So we'll have to chat about that at some point. I would love to.
00:32:33
Speaker
I feel like there's just so many, and there's been so many great examples in our lives of people who have fostered. So even at United, Todd and Elisa Watson have fostered in the past. G.A. Watson, she was also at United, currently fosters. So, Devon Robinson was at United, he fosters. Yeah, Devon, I had a good conversation about it. Yeah, it's challenging, but we started with a family member, which was, I don't know, harder or
00:32:58
Speaker
harder or easier. I don't know what it was. I'm sure it has plenty of its own challenges. Yes, it did. So we'll have to have a conversation about it. But it is a blessing. But the point is, there's always things that are going to change in our life. And we just have to be okay with making sure our priorities are in alignment with our goals. And that includes being flexible. Yeah, yeah. So we have morning routine, we have be flexible. What about the third tip here? So my third tip was using a task list effectively.
00:33:27
Speaker
I'm a list maker. I am an obsessive list maker. In fact, if you could see my desk right now and my console, you would die laughing because I buy notebooks just because they're cute and I find them and then I have conversations and I can't find my notes. So that's obviously something I need to automate. But making a task list has never been hard for me.
00:33:46
Speaker
The hardest thing for me when I became a mom was using it effectively because there's so many things that happen throughout the day that I'm constantly thinking of that I need to do. Or I'll be in the middle of a project and I think of something else to add to the list.
00:34:00
Speaker
The best tip that I always teach my coaching clients and I implement myself is if I think of something that goes on the master list, it does not go into day's list unless it is truly an emergency. And when I created that boundary for today, this is my list and this is what I'm going to tackle and anything else has to go off until tomorrow, it helps me actually feel like I was accomplishing something. The list actually had an end.
00:34:25
Speaker
every single night. I felt more accomplished. I felt like I was working in a more cohesive and structured way than if my list continued to be added on or if I continue to lose focus on what it was actually needing to be done to do something new I had just thought of in the moment. So I think having a task list and making it for each day and only adding to it if it's an emergency and adding it secondary to the master list is one of the best things I've ever done as a mom.
00:34:54
Speaker
Yeah, again, another great piece of advice I think a bad habit I had to kick early in starting a business was adding things to my list the day of, which would distract me from like bigger priorities. But it was almost like a form of procrastination. It was like, oh, I'm going to do this and add it to my list. It's something easy and I can cross it off. And it makes me feel like I achieved something. But really, it was just I was adding to my list to procrastinate from some of these bigger items that I had to tackle.
00:35:23
Speaker
Totally. Does that make sense? Totally. I do that with editing is probably the worst thing. Have you ever had a session that you just don't want to edit? You're just not feeling it and you can find everything else in the world to do, aside from editing. If I just finished it, it would take me 30 minutes. I feel like that's what happens with my task list is I do start to prioritize the things that sound more fun versus the things that actually need to be done.
00:35:47
Speaker
Do you have any tips on like, I guess, how to create this task list? Do you have? It sounds like you're a paper and pen kind of person. So you prefer the physical, you know, like a physical journal or planner to do this. I do. But I'm a huge weirdo. I even if I do something that I've accomplished, I forgot to put on the list, I'll write it just to give myself a checkmark. It's that crazy of an obsession. So I am very much a paper person. But I do have running lists in my phone, like in the notes section.
00:36:15
Speaker
I will keep on a list of different things and transfer them to paper, but they do always make it to paper. Even my mood board I'm staring at in front of me, I write out my goals and I go and I'll scribble it in. I love checking boxes. I'm such a nerd that way. I prefer paper and pen too. There is one app that I love though. It's called Todo and it's spelled T-E-U-X-D-E-U-X. Basically, it was
00:36:42
Speaker
Whoever created it was trying to get as close to something simple like paper and pen, but it's the one app as far as like to-do lists go that I've used. I mean, I've had other stuff, project management tools and things like that come and go, you know, changing them up.
00:36:59
Speaker
But to do is something that I've used for as long as I can remember, might be something that you would really like as a kind of list paper and pen person. But it has lists automatically by day of the week. And then you can create kind of your own custom list under that. I have a feeling that you would love it. So it sounds like I will. I use a sauna for my team lists. But I use paper and pen just for myself. So I'll check that one out for my own day to day. That's phenomenal.
00:37:25
Speaker
And it's super simple. And it's not like a team thing, you can't, they're not building more features for it. But there is a great app, you know, that can be on your phone. So very much I love it instead of something like notes, just because I feel like it keeps me better organized. But anyways, and for anybody else out there, I can't say enough great things about to do. So check that out. Any other kind of tips for to do lists? Or should we move on to? Yeah, well, I have a different tip for number four. But
The Role of Systems and Assistance in Business
00:37:51
Speaker
in that I do think this could be number four or number five is creating systems and having things like that that you can automate where you know where your to-do list is where you know where your notes are is really great because you're talking about systems here that change your business like honey book a sauna these things that I use in my business I know how they work within my workflow for every aspect of all four companies and that's allowed me a lot more time to do these things like be flexible
00:38:18
Speaker
and be present and have my morning routine. So we definitely can't skip over the fact that having organized systems is a massive part of being able to accomplish these things.
00:38:31
Speaker
Yeah, and just off of that as well, I think systems, things that you can automate in your business using different tools like that, super important. I know you have an assistant that helps you out. I just brought on an assistant that helps me out. That was really hard for me. I don't know if you had a similar experience. You had a team in the past, so that might have been something that you just knew the value of a team and business. I guess I should ask, was that you? Was it hard bringing on people to help you achieve the goals that you set out for your business?
00:38:58
Speaker
I'm laughing and I promise you anybody who works on my team is laughing because I'm still a massive control freak. My immediate thought is do I take 30 minutes to teach Davey how to do it or do I just do it? They're always like, what can I do? What do you want me to do? I got it. I got it. I got it. So releasing control is actually what my fourth point is. So it's funny you said that is you have to be okay asking for help. It is not natural for a lot of people.
00:39:26
Speaker
And I felt so bougie having a nanny for a while. And I thought, I don't want that. I don't want people to think that of me. I have to have a nanny. But I had to have a nanny, especially when Channing, our youngest, was little. Our kids are quite spread out. So we have 15 who's a sophomore, 12 who's a seventh grader. And then Cash is a third grader, and Channing just went to kindergarten. So we had a big gap. And when my younger two were little, I couldn't continue to work at the volume.
00:39:56
Speaker
without having help. I also hired a housekeeper about two years ago that comes every other week in deep cleans. I had to relinquish control. And that comes with my team. Like I said, they do laugh because I'm still not great at it. But knowing that they can take any system that is in play and run it if I have to leave town or I need to just be mom or I don't feel good or my kids don't feel good. That is helped. That always keeps things running. And so it's hard to do.
00:40:25
Speaker
But it's definitely one of the top four things I would say. You've got to figure out where you need the help and be okay asking for the help. I'm so glad to hear you say that because I think we had a very similar experience. You know, when Jack was born, just thinking, oh, we can do this. I mean, he's at home. We can split up the day and take care of ourselves. We don't need to do, you know, childcare or hire a nanny or anything like that.
00:40:48
Speaker
And I think we quickly found out like, no, we actually do need at least a few hours a day of uninterrupted work time that we can count on. But having that same fear of like, Oh, what are people gonna think? You know, I think in both ways to like, oh, and nanny does sound like maybe a little bougie, but then also, like,
00:41:05
Speaker
people saying well you work from home like why do you need this and almost justifying to ourselves like you know why do we need this but really has made a huge difference in in our workday and just kind of reminding ourselves to that most people go to work for the day you know and they have this dedicated time to work and so building out time in our day to do the same and then and while this is something that I know I personally and Krista does a much better job of this than I do but like you said at the beginning of this episode just being present as well
00:41:35
Speaker
I just brought on an assistant. It's something that I joke, you know, this is our like our most recent team member hire and it probably should have been my very first team member hire but I was the same way like I just you know, it's easier for me to do it and it's funny. I mean, she's only been on the team for she's been on team for less than a month but I'm like, why did I not do this years ago? It just makes such a big difference.
00:42:02
Speaker
It does. And I think a lot of people don't actually care what we do. We just assume they care what we do. And, you know, even today was funny. I had the same system for years, but I'm sitting in my office and the cleaners are cleaning around me and I already feel guilty. Like, what do they think of me sitting here in my office? You know, you're cleaning my house and they don't realize that I work a 60 hour work week. And then in comes the nanny to take care of Channing so I can get on this call with you. You know, and I'm sitting here thinking this guilt of
00:42:31
Speaker
What do people think that I need it? And it's okay to say that I need it.
00:42:37
Speaker
The thing too that I want to touch on, and as you were talking, you guys are really blessed to work together. So you understand the challenge from working from home. I think a lot of moms are listening to this and they don't have the help in that way. They don't have a spouse who understands what they are taking on. And that was really hard for me. Ryan is great. It took us a long time to get there, but for a long time I was working more hours than he was working. And I still had to be a mom full time.
00:43:06
Speaker
I still had night duty. I still had a house to clean. I had laundry to fold. I had church callings that I was trying to hold. There were so many things that I was doing that weren't equal because I was afraid to say I couldn't do it all. I wanted the assumption that I could do it all. And I think a lot of moms are in that boat. They're trying to run a business. They're afraid to tell their spouse how much time it actually takes to accomplish their goal.
00:43:31
Speaker
And a lot of them are working really ineffectively. So they're stressed and they're overwhelmed. And I think that's why I know that's why we have a two year burnout rate is because we don't ask for help. We're not communicating effectively. And we don't have systems in place to help us continue a business when we're exhausted.
00:43:51
Speaker
Yeah, that's a dynamic I didn't even think of because like you said, Kristin, we work with each other and we spend 99.9% of our time with each other. So I think we very much realize the attention that certain things in our lives need. But I'm thinking about some of my friends who work a more traditional 9 to 5 and they don't even really understand like, what do you mean? You can't just like you go to the gym anytime you want. Why can't you go do this? This and that. It's like, no, I actually like I have
00:44:20
Speaker
meetings and I have obligations and I have a you know, a business to run so I mean I didn't even think about that dynamic of people who have a spouse I could see how that being that's difficult for somebody who's not in it somebody who's not running a business and thinking about all components of it to really understand how much goes into it, you know, especially when working from home seems so glamorous I do my dad did at some point my dad had worked from home and
00:44:46
Speaker
But he worked for a big company but he just happened to work from home and I remember him and my mom getting in a few – not anything crazy but a few arguments about it because my mom wondering, why can't you just do this with the kids? And my dad being like, no, I actually have worked. I actually have work to do. Even though I'm at home, I actually have work to do. So that's such a good point and I'm glad you brought that up. Yeah. I would venture to say most of your listeners that are parents fall in that category.
00:45:14
Speaker
And I want to encourage him, just have that conversation with your spouse because I felt guilty telling my spouse, I can't do it all. I literally cannot keep up my business and accomplish my goals and do everything by myself. And I felt like I was failing him by not making sure he had underwear in his drawer every time he opened it and, and not making sure there were never dishes in the sink or whatever it is the family dynamic is. And it took me a while to be okay, asking for that help.
00:45:43
Speaker
but it does help. And secondary to that, and I hope it's okay and I hope you have time, but my thought is thinking of a lot of us chase goals that aren't actually in alignment with what we want to do.
Aligning Business with Personal Goals
00:45:54
Speaker
And I think that's kind of this new trend of, not even a new trend about the last year of let's become six figure photographers. Well, being a six figure photographer is a lot of work. And I recently had a coaching client that we sat down and I said, what do you really want to do? Well, I should be a six figure photographer. I've been in business this long. I said, but what do you want?
00:46:14
Speaker
what works for you and your family. And when it came down to it, $2,000 a month changed their financial trajectory for their family. That when we broke it down was 13 hours a week. That was all she needed was 13 hours a week to accomplish a goal that changed her family's life and gave her back the freedom that she wanted. But in her head, she thought one, I can't ask for help. I can't tell people I'm drowning. And two, I think this goal is what I'm supposed to work towards. And so,
00:46:43
Speaker
As a mom more than ever, you have to know what do you really want and what do you really have time for and how much do you really need to make because your kids will grow up and then you have all the time in the world, right? And I think we forget we don't have to do everything in a compacted two or five year plan. But being clear on that and not trying to create a task list based on what we think somebody else is doing is essential to our own mental health.
00:47:14
Speaker
Yeah, that's such a powerful question and I wonder too, I bet that could be applied to all sorts of different areas of business because I do think, you know, whether it be six figures or something else that we set these weird arbitrary, you know, goals for ourselves that don't actually match up with success. So, you know, one thing that I've noticed, I think that at least the business people that I admire the most seem to ask kind of the best questions like that.
00:47:44
Speaker
Yeah, I think and it's okay to it's it's okay to redirect and pivot in our business. I another example I had a mom had called me and she's a good friend of mine and she is just this close to seven figures and trying to stretch herself. She is so stretched so thin that she's sitting in a closet crying. She's exhausted with trying to balance it all. And that's what I asked her. I said, okay, so what happens at seven figures?
00:48:10
Speaker
What changes when you hit that goal? She says, I don't know. I'm going to probably want eight figures. I said, OK, but is that in alignment with what your priority is? What is your priority? And she says, being a mom, being present. So do you need the money? No, I don't need the money. OK, then you have to be OK.
00:48:29
Speaker
being clear in what it is that you need and then reassessing and pivoting from there. It is okay to be a $500 a month photographer if that's what you can handle right now. And it's okay to be an eight-figure business owner, but it is totally okay to give yourself permission to pivot when those things become out of alignment.
00:48:50
Speaker
Yeah, and have you noticed this as well? One thing that Chris and I sometimes talk about or we see a lot of people really saying, oh, I want to shoot 40 weddings a year. I want to do X. I'm really trying to do this or that in terms of volume and then getting there.
00:49:08
Speaker
And then realizing, no, I really don't want to do this. And I feel like in photography, especially we see this where there's this building ton of volume and weddings in particular, getting there, realizing maybe we didn't want to give up as many weekends as we thought. And oh, well, maybe I'll try to do something like family or brand photography that doesn't take my time on the weekends. Is that something that you've noticed as well? Yeah, especially when it comes to destination. I think that's probably
00:49:36
Speaker
I always get asked in coaching, how do I become a destination wedding photographer? I say, why? Why do you want to be a destination wedding photographer? If I could go make the same amount of money and drive down the street and come home to my kids each night, I would do that a hundred times over. I definitely don't do destination weddings for the enjoyment of it. I do it because it allows me to work less. And so if that's the case, then yes, I'll teach you how to do that. But if it's this illusion of success,
00:50:06
Speaker
and what other people are chasing, you gotta let those things go. It's not the same for everybody. It's not a one-fit. It's not a one-stop shop. We all have to be able to be okay with that. But you're totally right. Those are the questions people get trapped in.
00:50:22
Speaker
And that's so funny too about the destination wedding stuff because I remember getting our first destination wedding and thinking to myself, oh, this is awesome. Then going through everything that just goes into that and looking at Krista afterwards and being like, and we're fortunate to live in Annapolis.
00:50:37
Speaker
ton of great wedding venues 15 minutes from us. But in that moment, realizing how nice it is to go 15 minutes down the road, make pretty much the same amount of money after you consider some of the overhead that goes into or at least how we were pricing ourselves. I'm sure you do it in a much more effective way to take into account a lot of that overhead. But loving going 15 minutes down the road, being home at like 9.30 at night and sleeping in my own bed. But anyways, I digress.
00:51:04
Speaker
I would love to ask you just as we close here, if there is any piece of advice or anything that you could go back and tell yourself prior to having kids, what would that be? What's that kind of one piece of advice that you'd give yourself? You know what? I'm going to shift it a little bit and I'm going to talk about what I would have wished I would have learned being
Community and Connection in Entrepreneurship
00:51:23
Speaker
a creative. Yeah, absolutely. Is that okay? Yeah. Because there's 100%. I'd like to learn. Yeah. It's an unfair question. Being a creative. If I could go back in time and tell myself, you know,
00:51:33
Speaker
how to better prepare for having a family and doing this and what I needed. I would say it took me a long time to learn that I did not have to stand on an island and die alone. And what I mean by that is you do not have to be alone in your business. I know you take photos alone with a client and then we get trapped in this mental belief that becomes a physical scenario that we're doing this on our own. You know, we're an artist, we're a creative, we're whatever, but we're alone. And being alone is overwhelming, especially when you don't have the answers on what
00:52:03
Speaker
you're doing if it's right, how to scale, how to spend my time, how to grow. And having a community connection really is what changed our industry. And I wish I would have known that when I started as a creative down a photography journey, that I needed others. I needed other islands to come together. I didn't have to die alone. I didn't have to have the answers by myself. And it was okay to ask other people what they were doing and then learn from that. I don't know if that's the answer that you want, but when I think of that, I think,
00:52:33
Speaker
I really did come into this thinking, here I am on my island. I'm going to die on my island. I'm all by myself. And as I've grown my community, especially through Evolve, but as I've grown it with other people like you and friends that I have, I wish I would have learned that lesson sooner, but it was okay to have conversations and to ask.
00:52:52
Speaker
Yeah, and I wasn't looking for anything in particular. And I think that's a great piece of advice. And I guess one follow up from that, if you have a minute, what are some of the ways that you would recommend people doing that? And I think it is something that so many people struggle with. And I think most people at some point in starting their own business, most entrepreneurs, I would say, at least in the creative industry, have at some point felt sort of that
00:53:16
Speaker
I guess that sense of loneliness, you know, especially if we're a small team or working for ourselves, and that often takes place at home, we're not going into an office. So what are some of the ways that you would encourage people to sort of seek out this community and collaboration? Yeah, I always say I'm an introverted extrovert because people think I'm more extroverted than I am. But for me, it was really just starting by reaching out to another photographer in my community, trying to find a friend
00:53:44
Speaker
When I go to these events, like you and I were just at United, my natural go-to is to sit in a corner and to people watch. But to force myself outside the box and have conversations with people like you and different people that I want to surround myself with, it's okay to seek out people who are like-minded because it gives us strength. And I was afraid to voice that. And I think really it comes down to getting outside that comfort zone.
00:54:10
Speaker
and just finding some touch point, which is people in your local area or connecting with podcasts that you love or getting online and watching live things like find something that creates community for you. You can do that however it works best for you, but there's so many options out there.
00:54:26
Speaker
to force yourself out of that bubble. And Evolve is one of those options. I think conferences in general, you know, I think conferences like Evolve and United, you know, just do such a great job. I mean, it's like you're almost being at like summer camp for for adult business owners, you know, just because you get to see so many friends. It's finding the right one for you, though, because different communities have different vibes, and you have to find where you fit.
00:54:50
Speaker
And that's, we went to United because Todd's a good friend. He's a supporter of Evolve and show it's been a sponsor of Evolve.
00:54:58
Speaker
I like Todd because what he believes in as far as community with United is very much what I believe in and what resonates with me as far as building people. So you have to find what resonates with you. And it could be a totally different vibe. It could be something that's just business and work yourself to the bone. It's got to resonate with you, but there's a lot of options out there to find a home and to find your tribe. And there's a lot of people like myself and Davey that are creating these
00:55:25
Speaker
these outlets for people and Todd, because we're not doing it for ourselves. I don't have extra time. We're doing it because we know that community really is what changes our industry and we all need it, whether we know we need it or not.
00:55:38
Speaker
Absolutely. Well, Jamie, I thank you for your time today. I mean, so much great stuff in there. I think so much practical stuff too. I know that I appreciated, especially hearing from somebody who has just a little bit more experience than I do, especially in the parenting realm. Can you tell us where people can follow along? Of course, Evolve is one of those places. And for Evolve, that's going to be at EvolveWorkshops.org. As always, you can find all this information in the show notes as well. But where else can people follow along?
00:56:09
Speaker
Yeah. So Evolve is also on Instagram at Evolve workshops. My personal account is The Landlocked Mermaid. I'm a California girl who got displaced into Idaho. So it's easy to remember The Landlocked Mermaid. And then I also have Jamie Finley Photography on Instagram as well if you want to just follow work.
00:56:27
Speaker
Awesome. Well, all of those places will be linked to in the show notes if you are one of those people who like listening while you are running or working out or driving. So you can find all of that in the show notes. I will also be sure to link to the next Evolve conference. And when the schedule is released for 2020, I'll link to those workshops as well in the show notes. And Jamie, can you remind me those are being released at the beginning of the year?
00:56:52
Speaker
at the beginning of the year. Yeah, we want to close up the conference first before we announce everything for the new year. But we have some amazing, really cool locations that we haven't done before. So I'm excited to share those with your listeners. Yeah, I'm pumped to see him as well. I mean, you set the bar high with places like Palm Springs in Greece. So excited to see what you have in store for 2020 and hear more about that. We have Davey there this next time. Yeah, I hope so too. Thank you again. And I really appreciate your time today. Absolutely. Thanks, Davey.
00:57:24
Speaker
Thanks for tuning into the Brands That Book Show. If you enjoyed this episode, please consider subscribing and leaving a review in iTunes. For show notes and other resources, head on over to dvandchrista.com.