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Stanley, Shein and all Things Green! A Discussion with 2 Girls 1 Reusable Cup || PodPack Collective
126 Plays9 months ago
In this PodPack Collective exclusive, Satsunami is joined by hosts Marie and Beth of the 2 Girls 1 Reusable Cup podcast to discuss all things sustainability! From malicious marketing to the culture of the climate change movement, the trio discuss what it truly means to live a sustainable lifestyle as well as the hurdles that accompany it along the way.
This podcast is a member of the PodPack Collective. The members are as follows:
Chatsunami
Casting Views
Nerdstalgic
2 Girls 1 Reusable Cup
Review it Yourself
Seismic Cinema
For further information, please follow the link: https://www.chatsunami.com/p/podpack-collective/
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Website: chatsunami.com
Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/ChatsunamiPod
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Patrons:
Battle Toaster
Sonia
Greenshield95
Danny Brown
Aaron Huggett
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Stay safe, stay awesome and most importantly, stay hydrated!
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Transcript
Introduction and Collaboration
00:00:05
Speaker
Welcome to Chatsunami.
00:00:17
Speaker
Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of Chatsunami. My name's Satsunami, and joining me for this very special Podpack collaboration is none other than the amazing host from the Two Heroes One Reusable Cup podcast, it is Marie and Beth. Welcome to Chatsunami at last.
00:00:39
Speaker
Yeah, how are you doing tonight? Yeah, doing all right.
First Podcast Experience
00:00:42
Speaker
Yeah, excited on finally being here. I think we first talked about this almost a year ago. So it's a long time coming. I did a lot of Twitter stalking to get on your pod. True.
00:00:53
Speaker
That is the way to get on any podcast, Marie, is to stalk them first. This is really, really surreal for me because I've never been on another podcast before. I've never cheated on Marie, even though Marie is here with us. And even though I've cheated on you many times now. I know, I know. So I've lost my other podcast virginity. I don't know, but
Podcasting Challenges and Realities
00:01:12
Speaker
yeah, it's lovely to be here. Thank you so much for inviting us on to talk about our sustainable shenanigans and our other stuff we talk about on our podcast.
00:01:21
Speaker
Yeah, no problem at all. And Miri, you're completely right. I'm pretty sure I must have messaged you guys probably a year ago or so saying, oh yeah, we should do a collaboration. Come on the podcast. I've probably said that to, you know, I've said to people, oh, let's do an interview, let's do a collaboration. And I'm going to be honest, I am absolutely terrible. See when it comes to time management and things. So it's only taken a year. That's actually speed running for me.
00:01:48
Speaker
Worth the wait, I say. Worth the wait for us. Oh, thank you. Don't worry, your donation to the sustainability cause is coming through PayPal soon. Cheers. I did say when my dad heard I was going on another podcast, his first question was, and how much are you being paid? I'm like, it doesn't work that way, unfortunately, in the podcasting world. Being paid in exposure. Yeah.
00:02:13
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, the classic. I was going to say,
Origin of Two Heroes One Reusable Cup
00:02:15
Speaker
is that what the cool companies say nowadays? Oh, you're getting paid with exposure and likes and things. Especially in the creative industry. Yeah. Absolutely. That's currency in the creative industry is exposure. So, of course, as I said, you are both the fantastic host of the
00:02:31
Speaker
Two Girls Want Reusable Cup podcast, a podcast all about sustainability. And I have to say, I was listening to a couple of your episodes today as part of preparation. I swear to goodness, I think I'm unprepared. You have done loads of amazing topics, you know, you've done things about fast fandom. I thought that was great. You did the whole sheen uncovering that.
00:02:51
Speaker
stuff about smartphones. I even listened to the origin story one, which I have to say, I thought that was really funny. But before I go on, I've got two very important questions here. I apologise if you've heard this question so many times, but of course the first one is, what really inspired you to start a podcast and why the name? That's all I'm going to say. Who came up?
00:03:14
Speaker
the classic questions. I'm sorry, I feel as if people are listening to this and thinking why or where did that come from? Yeah, I'd have to ask. Well, I always say like the podcast was born out of depression. I think many of us it was the pandemic and I was having a pretty, pretty bad time and Beth decided to call me on WhatsApp. And I think I just ended up crying for the entire conversation. And just to cheer me up, Beth started talking about projects we can
00:03:44
Speaker
do and just said two girls one reusable cup just to try and get me to laugh and then suddenly was like hang on i think that's a funny thing is i tend to word vomit a lot and it came out as a joke and then we went hang on that's good that's really good and actually to backtrack a bit passed
00:04:01
Speaker
the depression. Me and Marie would voice no on WhatsApp a lot because I'm currently in the UK, Marie is currently in Portugal so we find it the easiest way to communicate and a lot of the things we were talking about were frustrations to do with how hard it is to be sustainable and things people weren't talking about. I think a big one which we've mentioned before on the pod is about sustainable toothpaste and let me tell you all the sustainable toothpaste I've tried tastes like ass. I don't want to taste like
00:04:29
Speaker
So I kept saying to Marie, where is the good toothpaste? Why is no one talking about this? Why is everyone on Instagram going, oh yeah, try this toothpaste. It's plastic free. It's all this. And it's like brilliant. No one's going to use that. It tastes disgusting. Why is no one talking about this?
00:04:44
Speaker
that's kind of where it was born was all these little frustrations or we kind of talk about what's now become sustainable sins so we'd be like oh we would try and bring our reusable cup or ask for something without plastic and then it would arrive in plastic and then we'd feel really guilty and then we kind of joked that we almost need a sustainable like a support group for going I'm sustainable but this happened and then out of that we were like no one's talking about this we should talk about it and then a podcast
00:05:08
Speaker
was born. We have almost 100 episodes of podcasts in our voice notes alone. Now we just have to rerecord them because this was an ongoing thing for years. And not just one, it's just like you go through our WhatsApp and it's just voice note after voice note after voice note. Just a rant about random things like just saw someone stick bananas in plastic. Bananas come in their own packaging. You don't need to put them in plastic. Most of these voice notes are screaming because I don't
Research and Educational Impact
00:05:34
Speaker
know how much content we could get from them.
00:05:36
Speaker
But that's the kind of general gist of what we were talking about. We were like, no one's talking about this. Sustainability isn't all pretty like eco wooden tupperware and bamboo toothbrushes. It's actually difficult and it's difficult to find out what information is correct or what is misleading. And that's why I think I really enjoy working on the episodes myself because I learned so much.
00:05:58
Speaker
from it. Maria, I've said on most episodes is an absolutely fantastic researcher. She does her research, she keeps her receipts, nothing goes amiss and it's really good. It's valuable for people listening. They actually learn something and then they can apply it to real life.
00:06:14
Speaker
Our first ever episode was about milk and actually which alternative milk is the best because there's so many and why should I care? Most people might have a coffee or a tea every day so actually it's something they can then apply to an everyday thing. So it's been, as we send the podcast, an incredible journey.
00:06:29
Speaker
Because I have to say, I was really surprised at how in-depth you both were going into these topics,
Sustainability vs. Consumerism
00:06:36
Speaker
since it's not really something you think about. The surface level, as you said, there's things that you notice like plastic packaging, which I do agree with you. Why would you wrap up a banana in plastic? Things like that, you wouldn't really think of until, as I was listening to a lot of your episodes, I kind of thought, oh, hold on a second. Why are they doing this? Why are they doing that?
00:06:57
Speaker
as you said you do absolutely a fantastic job, both of you of course you do a fantastic job in researching these things but one of the things that I find quite interesting that you brought up in one of the episodes and I can't remember which one it was but it was essentially the idea of a lot of people trying to make sustainability
00:07:17
Speaker
train day, but it almost feels as if it's a bit for show. One of the ones I remember recently, and I don't know if you've both seen this, is the Stanley Carcraze that was going around recently. After Sheen, it's almost the ones with S's. Sheen, Stanley, like the bane of my existence. Hyper-consumerism at its worst.
00:07:40
Speaker
I saw a video where it was this woman who had a standlick up, but then she had a cover for it, she had these plastic covers to put on top of the straw and everything, and all I could keep thinking was, you know what, I'm sure Mary and Beth would love this.
00:07:56
Speaker
We should do a whole episode on Stanley cups. Absolutely. But like Stanley cups are giving me like early 2000s Paris Hilton with her little dog in her bag. And then the dog's got a hat and accessories. It's ridiculous. And actually it falls into our narrative. We keep repeating on the podcast is just buy less.
00:08:15
Speaker
stop buying anything even if it is eco-friendly. We've said before, if you want to try shampoo bars, which as we all know, I hate shampoo bars, use up the shampoo you have first. Don't just go out and buy a load of new stuff. Any trend is not good because it's promoting buying more stuff.
00:08:32
Speaker
Yeah, and it also falls into both of mine and Beth's almost real world because the whole reason the Stanley Club got so popular is because of marketing and influencers and just it being in your face constantly. I mean, I think the whole reason it became popular, there was like a viral video of a burnt out car and the Stanley Club survived and the water in it was still cold. But since then, I've read that that has been faked. You talk about how in depth we go into this topic. That is just my brain.
00:09:00
Speaker
I just always just go down a rabbit hole researching these things. And I have looked into Stanley and Stanley was actually like, there's no such thing about a sustainable brand, but they were like their old target clients were backpackers. They're a pretty good thermos. But then like,
00:09:15
Speaker
one influencer saw the one the popular one the handle it has a stupid name I don't know what's it called but you know when we think Stanley Cup we now think the one with the handle saw it and then she fell in love with it and then she actually bought a bunch of them at wholesale and then started selling them
Sustainable Fashion Industry Challenges
00:09:30
Speaker
through her brand and it just became this whole thing it's just like this perfect case study how things just start to unravel and even though it had almost a good intent
00:09:39
Speaker
at the end because, you know, we don't want to have plastic water bottles. Having a good quality reusable water bottle is good. Having an entire cupboard full of them, well, that's, you know, when I want to punch someone in the face, you know that. That's it, you know it was going to come. For legal reasons, and I'm looking at my right pander, lawyer in the corner, yeah, for legal reasons, that's a joke.
00:10:03
Speaker
Otherwise, if you do have a Stanley Cup and you're listening to this, please run as far as you can. Otherwise, you're going to catch hands. I don't get the appeal. How do you do anything? You've got this huge cup you're holding. I don't like holding things. I just want to go about my day. It's another thing I've got to worry about. I've said on the podcast before, I'm really weird with things. If someone gives me a new thing, I'm like, great. It's another thing I'm accountable for. It's like a child. It's like I have loads of children running around. I don't want that. I don't want another Stanley Cup child running around.
00:10:32
Speaker
but they're just bulky and annoying. How do you go about stuff? They're not practical. Not practical things bother me.
00:11:02
Speaker
was cool. But that was the thing. I needed something practical. I bought it. I don't need 20 billion of them. One is enough. One is done. It just reminds me of a video where I can't even remember who it was, some influencer, and they had a whole wall of different colours than the cups. And I mean, another one had one of these mini dishes that quite frankly, it looked like it was for babies, but it was like a mini dish. They put the top of the cup and it was like they put
00:11:28
Speaker
fruit and food in. I get marketing for the sake of marketing but it's just where do you stop? Where do you stop when it comes to these kind of things? And that brings me onto my next question that obviously you'll both have your ear to the ground for these trends and things when it comes to sustainability but do you ever just see these trends pop up and roll your eyes and think oh god here we go again?
00:11:52
Speaker
all the time, all the time, especially in my job. I actually do marketing and I definitely have a love-hate relationship with it. I'm a big
Climate Change Content on Social Media
00:12:01
Speaker
advocate on, I have to be selling something I believe in. I do destination marketing and that's why I promote more staycations over actually selling things. And marketing is visual communication and it's an incredible tool.
00:12:13
Speaker
And I think it's, some people use it for evil, some people use it for good. I think if we're using it to promote climate action, it's a very powerful tool, but a lot of the time it's used to sell things. And it's very sneaky and it's very clever. And I've talked about this on the podcast before with targeted ads and emails. It's sneaky as fuck. It really, it's creepy. When I see these trends happen, I understand why people fall for them.
00:12:37
Speaker
because I know how crafted the ad campaigns are, I know how crafted even the project designers, the research they've done. Hell, like we have AI now, like Marie said in the Sheen episode, Sheen uses AI to see what will next be trendy or what is trendy now. It's crazy. So I really understand people who don't have this knowledge will fall for it.
00:12:57
Speaker
I've bought stuff before because the marketing campaign's been so good. I've gone, you know what? Good for you marketing team. I don't do that all the time, by the way. But yeah, I don't blame people so much, but it does annoy me because it is usually things people don't need, like the Stanley Cups.
00:13:12
Speaker
Recently, I saw Hailey Bieber has done phone cases that have a little kind of slit in them to hold her lip gloss she also sells. It's ridiculous. Oh god, yeah. It hurts. It really hurts because I look at it and go, landfill. You might as well just put it straight in landfill.
Climate Activism and Protests
00:13:30
Speaker
There was no point. Cut out the middle, man.
00:13:31
Speaker
I'm going to throw it straight in the bin for you, which is not good. Don't do that. But I mean, that's how I feel. I'm sure Marie is even worse. Marie probably just dies a little bit more inside. I mean, I work in the, I mean, not saying origin of trends, but I work in the fashion industry and it's just so, I mean, I enjoy fashion design. I enjoy making clothes, but I'm just like, we have enough clothes. And like even working in the sustainable fashion industry, I sometimes feel so guilty trying to sell someone a dress thinking, yeah, you already have a dress. You don't need this dress.
00:14:00
Speaker
It's a nice dress. It's made out of organic fabric. It's ethically made. It's a very good dress, but chances are you already have one. And it's just, there's this internal conflict, but it's difficult. And it's, I think just finding the little pieces of joy in the chaos, because at least this dress is better than any other dress from like a fast fashion company. And at least this one has quality. So it will last you longer. And the fashion industry is always vomiting out new trends. And I say this on the podcast all the time. Trends are made up bullshit.
00:14:29
Speaker
It's like there to make you feel bad about yourself and make you think, if I don't have this one thing, my life is not complete. If I don't look like this model or this influencer now, because that's the new culture, I am not a whole person anymore. And that's absolutely stupid. But it's just what these, as Beth said, these brands are so good at doing and making you think, oh, you will be happy if you buy this stuff.
00:14:51
Speaker
You will be. Your life will feel complete. Depression. Be gone. And unlike Beth as well, I've fallen victim to it. The most recent marketing campaign that I haven't fallen victim to it yet because I don't think they're out yet. And I'm not sure if you guys are having this ad where you are, but Doritos is coming out with a silent crisp. Yes. And I am so curious.
00:15:12
Speaker
I am so curious. And I know it's just a marketing gimmick, but I still really want to try it. I'm so curious. Honestly, I completely get it. This is why I say people don't feel bad because these are like experts in their field that craft these campaigns. I am not an expert in this field. I do marketing and I know I'm being marketing too and I still like go, yeah, I want to try the crisp. Give me the crisp.
00:15:33
Speaker
So I completely get it. This is one of the reasons like me and Marie have done this podcast. The more we're talking about it and people are going, oh, actually, yeah, yeah, this is what marketing is. The more maybe you will get marketed to and people kind of sit back and think for a second and go, hang on a minute. I know what this is. Do I actually really need this? We say this a lot when we talk about buying clothes, even secondhand fashion. The first thing you should think is, do I actually need this?
00:15:58
Speaker
Will it last? Am I gonna still love it in like five years time? That's constantly going through my head with everything I buy, which is kind of depressing and makes me really paranoid. But I think being a conscious consumer is the best thing you can do.
00:16:11
Speaker
You're completely right though, because going back to a point you were saying there about how companies are taking on new technology, for example AI, and I'm going to have to bring this up really quickly and I apologise in advance if you've heard it today, but Glasgow recently had a very poor Willy Wonka tribute, let's just say.
00:16:33
Speaker
it had to be mentioned, it was the elephant in the room. I mean I was tempted to do a podcast episode on this topic in itself as well because I was just so fascinated of this going on. Oh you should see the rabbit hole for this, it just keeps getting deeper and deeper and deeper and you're like oh my god how can it get worse? I switched on the news the other day and the two women who played Oompa Loompas and the guy who played Wally Wonka or Wonka McDuff
00:17:00
Speaker
as the AI seemed to call them. They were an ejigra for some reason with a photoshoot or something, and it is insane how famous they've gotten off the back of this. But that's another example, obviously not to the same extent as Sheen of course, but the fact is that there will always be a demographic of people who will get suckered into that. And I think the worst thing is people who say, oh no,
00:17:28
Speaker
I'm immune. I'm a smart person. I'll never fall for that and things but as you said Beth, excellent point. The fact is that these people are paid to do this. This is their job. They have studied all these trends. They keep an eye on what's going on because that's something I've noticed as well and I don't know if you've noticed that the fact that a lot of companies are more meme savvy
00:17:51
Speaker
So they start taking popular things, like especially for the Wonka thing as well, but there's other things that have popped up where they're like, oh yeah, we'll use this meme and we're cool with that. Like if you notice that. Oh, it's really cringy, absolutely. And they usually use the meme when it's dead, which is even more of an ache.
00:18:09
Speaker
What we are starting to see though is audiences are getting tired. They want authenticity. They're sick of this. They're sick of ads looking like ads and people are actually getting sick of influencers. So actually brands are going to have to be way more savvy and advertise to people in a more authentic
Social Media and Misinformation
00:18:25
Speaker
way. People are actually craving not influencers, but content creators, kind of like the old days of YouTube, who would have their own inside jokes and stuff and actually create some sort of community. So it'll be interesting to see how brands start to use that.
00:18:39
Speaker
something I will say it's obviously a bit depressing going these trends happen and really like clever people are behind them and people are falling for it. I'd say we should take inspiration from it and use it as like I said at all to promote climate action. I saw a sustainable fashion podcast say what if we had the marketing team behind the Barbie movie on like green keys or just promoting climate action
00:19:02
Speaker
Because that whole campaign was absolutely fantastic. Obviously the consumerism and everyone wore pink and now all the pink clothes ended up in the charity shop, which is quite ironic. What if we used them tactics? We should be inspired by this and use it to communicate to people about climate action.
00:19:17
Speaker
And actually that's what me and Maria are trying to do with this podcast. We've seen so many podcasts about sustainability and it's your typical like logos with green and save the turtles and all that. And we're like, we need to make this relatable and authentic and talk about problems people are actually having. People want to try and be sustainable, but there's so many roadblocks.
00:19:35
Speaker
We should be talking about them and bitching about them and kind of saying, hey, we struggle with this too. We're normal people. This is how you can overcome it. So that's kind of what I strive to do with marketing. I'm trying to not use it for evil. I'm trying to actually go, okay, I'm going to use what I'm learning from these bad guys and actually see if I can use it for good. So that's what I would say in terms of trends. Yes, I roll my eyes, but I also go, how can I use this? How can we do what Stanley Cup are doing, but with climate action? Yeah.
00:20:01
Speaker
That's how I see it. I know this is your podcast Satsu, but this is where I'm going to be a downer again, the common thread of our podcast. Because the sad thing about that is that unfortunately, even if we had those teams, it wouldn't actually in a way make a difference because climate change has, it shouldn't be, but it's viewed as a political issue.
00:20:20
Speaker
and Instagram does not promote political content. And I've seen actually like quite a lot of people talk about this by a lot of climate influencers, climate authors, where in recent years they have noticed that their view count has just gone dropped because they have the hashtag climate change or the hashtag sustainability in there because all these big social media brands are owned by big billionaires who are profiting off the climate crisis and they don't want the climate crisis to go away because
00:20:48
Speaker
it's making them money. And it's almost gonna be this, sorry, sorry, I'm going down, I'm depressing everyone, but it's gonna head towards almost this dystopian era where there is money in climate change, there is, but it's just for the wrong people. And it's all for the wrong reasons, in a way,
00:21:03
Speaker
It's just big corporations want this to happen because then they can sell us more stuff that we need because of course, if things get colder, we need more stuff to keep warm.
Influencers and Sustainability
00:21:13
Speaker
If things get hotter, we need things to keep more cool. And it's just, this is where individual action translates into political action because those two things do go hand in hand. And whereas I completely agree individual actions matter.
00:21:27
Speaker
and it is a very important part of your climate change journey. You also need to keep an eye on the bigger picture because it's like this difficult balance. Sorry, not to bring everyone down. I think that's the beauty though of the podcast Maria, is your very much glass is half empty, mine is very half full. I'm always that person you know where I go, well actually. It's the but, it's always we're like, oh, this is great. And then you're like, but.
00:21:53
Speaker
Actually, this kind of goes back to what you said before about is like being sustainable or trend. And actually, even though I said, yeah, we can like use marketing for good and stuff, like Marie said, they're just trying to sell us more stuff. So for example, I don't know, the Tupperware with the bamboo lids, you don't need them. They're just trying to sell you more stuff. The big thing is, like Marie said, is the overall big picture. It's not all on us, but it's also about buying glass as well. But they're trying to sell us more stuff.
00:22:23
Speaker
So that's where greenwashing comes in, which I think is the most evil thing ever, is they're then trying to profit off the planet of people trying to actually make a difference. And people fall for it. Again, like what we were saying, people take a lot of pride in going, Oh, I've got my bamboo toothbrush. I feel great. I hate that they've been misled. So like Marie
Personal Sustainability Journeys
00:22:41
Speaker
said, there is a very depressing side to it, which is again, why we have our podcast.
00:22:45
Speaker
cast because we do want to give the big picture like yeah we joke about all the little things we can do and how it's hard and annoying sometimes but we also talk about the bigger picture like if you want to make a different usual voice because some people don't or can't use their voice. No you're completely right though it is actually amazing how companies use these particular tactics
00:23:06
Speaker
to, as you said, warp the idea and, well, as you said, greenwash the idea that the product is the best because it's great for the environment, it's good for this and that. Oh, look, my Tupperware has less microplastics than your Tupperware. But one of the things I have to say has been quite interesting from someone who hasn't paid as much attention. I'm not saying I don't recycle or anything, I just want to point that out for legal reasons.
00:23:31
Speaker
You don't want me to go to Scotland and start knocking on your door. Oh gosh, she will, she will. A sustainable brick, thank you. Recycle or die. I feel like as well, Marie would swim because you'd be like, no, I'm not flying. I don't want the emissions. I will swim to your house with a sustainable brick.
00:23:53
Speaker
a couple more and I can build myself a sustainable podcast studio. But anyway,
Upcoming Topics and Engagement
00:24:00
Speaker
something that I have noticed, especially in social media, as someone who doesn't look at it from that side very often, is the fact
00:24:08
Speaker
that there's a lot of demonisation in regards to movements that tackle climate change. We've all seen the trolls and things saying, oh, it's not real, or oh, it's not this or that. But you see a lot of activists who, clearly, they're not representative. They'll do something very destructive or very obstructive and
00:24:29
Speaker
it's kind of opposite to what they're trying to achieve. But the way people perceive that, especially in the comments and things, is they paint the brush over the wider climate change community. That they say, oh, this person, like, for example, just stop oil as well, you've got those kind of protesters as well that because you see a couple of ones that maybe go a bit too far, that they say, oh, the whole organization's like that. They're not saying it's just about just stop oil, but, you know, just in general.
00:24:57
Speaker
So have you ever noticed that in regards to the way that people who are advocating for sustainability and better ways to tackle climate change are kind of skewed because of a vocal minority that seems to be putting blasts?
00:25:12
Speaker
I'll let Marie start with this one because we chat about this quite a lot and it does really frustrate us. Yeah, it does. I mean, there are like two sides of that question because number one is just the general backlash of just being a climate activist because I used to call this the vegetarian reaction or the vegan reaction. If, for example, if someone told you back in the day, told you they were vegetarian or now that they tell you they're vegan, you immediately have this reaction internally going, Oh, so you think you're better than me?
00:25:38
Speaker
And you immediately get defensive. And I've seen this happen so many times where suddenly the other individual feels self-conscious because they're not doing all this stuff. And then their reaction immediately is to just push back and be more hostile to the other one. Then there's the whole discourse within the climate movement itself. And I've talked about this on our pod as well. It is so frustrating because this is meant to be a movement, but none of us can agree.
00:26:03
Speaker
Everyone has different opinions on this, different opinions on that. And it's just all these different voices and none of us agree on it. It's just so frustrating. But at the same time, we need to remember that we're all working towards the same goal. And Beth and I have discussed just oil at length.
00:26:20
Speaker
And I think where that hits both of us, because me and Beth, both of us studied art and just oil targets quite a lot of art galleries. And for us personally, those pieces mean a lot to us as well, because we studied them at university. Originally, when I saw those types of protests, I was absolutely frustrated and angry. But then the more I looked into it, I realized, OK, the paintings are behind glass. They are protected. Nothing actually gets damaged and it just makes the news.
00:26:47
Speaker
And it got me thinking most recently when the Mona Lisa was targeted again. I'm not sure it was just oil or someone else, but the Mona Lisa was targeted again. And I think this was the second time someone targeted at the Mona Lisa. The first time I think someone threw a pie at her. And I think this time it was paint. Of course, everyone was in shock, but then it got me thinking, and this is where my brain goes down the rabbit hole. Okay, but why is the Mona Lisa so important? Like, why is this painting appointment? I studied art history.
00:27:16
Speaker
Honestly, I think the Mona Lisa is one of Da Vinci's worst works. I prefer The Virgin of the Rocks. But the reason, and this is actually a true story, the reason the Mona Lisa is so popular, and I'm sorry I'm going into a bit of a tangent in art history now, but I've got a point. Use your degree Marie. Exactly. I love it.
00:27:32
Speaker
So the reason the Mona Lisa is so popular is actually at one point they lost her. So the Mona Lisa was actually stolen because she was in the corner of the Louvre. No one paid much attention to her and she got stolen and only a janitor noticed that she was missing.
00:27:48
Speaker
This then led to a humongous marketing campaign where her picture was printed on every single newspaper to get her back. And suddenly everyone knew who the Mona Lisa was. So the Mona Lisa became popular because of marketing. Once again, we've assigned value to this thing. We've assigned value to a painting. And I think once I went down this rabbit hole, kind of got me realizing just oil's point. We're assigning value to a painting, but we're not assigning value to our planet.
00:28:17
Speaker
Once I've clicked that, my perspective kind of shifted a bit on them. I don't think it's still the best type of activism, but I think I still get it and started going down an even deeper rabbit hole of protests throughout history, like the civil rights movement, like the AIDS crisis, the feminist movement.
00:28:37
Speaker
All of those people were called radicals. All of those people were called disruptive. But at the end of the day, we've got the right to vote. A feminist back in the sixties were called horrendous names and weren't given the time of day. But in the end, they achieved their goal. Still not all the way there because it looks like America is going backwards, but it's once again trying to picture the broader picture. But then at the same time, there's just that immediate hostility, that immediate annoyance.
00:29:01
Speaker
For example, last year my aunt was flying to her summer holiday and her flight got cancelled because there were activists on the runway protesting air pollution and the pollution of planes. And I'm just like, I see your point, but there are so much like, I don't like flying. But what if you've been saving up your entire life to see this one place and then suddenly you cannot go because climate activists are protesting
00:29:27
Speaker
yes, you're gonna feel hostile to the climate activists, even though they're trying to basically save your life. Because if we don't have a habit to build a planet, we're all royally screwed. It's just been triggering like this discourse and also this internal like, I don't know, it is complicated. And I've been on both sides of this argument.
00:29:44
Speaker
I think Marie, you've made such an excellent point there, especially kind of going into the art side of things because I'm the exact same. It's quite sentimental to me because I've studied it as well. So I understand their message and their context. I also then understand from a marketing point of view, people who wouldn't get that.
00:30:02
Speaker
message and then become hostile and I think that's my problem with it is it pushes people away. At a time that we need as many people to come on board as possible, it's not inclusive and it's just pushing people away and making people angry. I understand it gets media coverage, brilliant, but then it's not appealing to people and I hate that but that's what we have to do. We need to get people on board. I was once asked by a sustainability company if
00:30:27
Speaker
I'd ever advertise them in the Sun newspaper, which I thought was a really interesting question. Obviously, I understand the Sun is absolute garbage, but then I kind of said, well, I would not want to exclude them people. I would want to try and target them and get them on board. That's kind of how I see it. But yeah, I think Marie kind of summarised both sides really, really well there. And it is a really tricky one.
00:30:50
Speaker
It's a double-edged sword, doesn't it? Because, as you said, I'm a massive history buff, I have to say, as opposed to an art. I mean, I appreciate art, but it's not what I studied. I'm just gonna make that clear before I go into this point, apologies. But I know what you mean, as someone who's studied history, seeing people try to
00:31:09
Speaker
well initially when you see that you do have a visceral reaction, you think oh my god they just destroyed the Mona Lisa and then you realize of course is covered in front of a pane of glass and it's just what you were saying Maria about for example the suffragette movement where I actually remember we could talk that history where women would smash windows and then they would just wait until the police came as a form of protest and things and it feels as if
00:31:35
Speaker
it's something that on the one hand you can see that a lot of people might be feeling quite frustrated that nobody's listening as a result they're turning to more extreme measures which again as you were saying that's something that I think
00:31:51
Speaker
probably excludes and infuriates just normal people going about their day because I have to say I actually do have a semi-personal experience with Just Stop Oil in the sense that I was down in London it was some time last year with my partner and terrible for the environment I know
00:32:09
Speaker
but we decided to get on one of the sightseeing buses and we looked out and we thought, oh that's quite weird, there's a lot of protesters there. And then two seconds later the bus came to a halt and of course the Just Stop Oil people were in front. The amount of abuse they were getting, it was absolutely ridiculous.
00:32:28
Speaker
again as you said on the one hand you can understand why people are frustrated towards these activists but on the flip side it seems as if it's a thing that's almost born out of desperation that if no one's going to listen and they're just going to react to I suppose as we were talking about there the surface level marketing then it seems as if they're not really going to get anywhere
00:32:50
Speaker
I really get their frustrations, like part of me wants to go out and do that because I don't think I've been as clear on this. We have got to this point. We are in an absolute fucking mess and that's like a light way of saying it. It's scary the point we've got to. So I understand this is the consequence of that and this is how people are feeling and this is how people are acting. I really get it. I'm not like, how could they do that? I'm like, I completely get it.
00:33:15
Speaker
that they're angry and they're upset because it's very selfish. We're not thinking about future generations. We're not thinking about us. We're not going to have a planet to live on and people are just ignoring it. I laugh every day because I go to a nine to five job to post on Twitter and I'm like the world's literally on fire. This is
00:33:30
Speaker
a dystopia so I really really get that but then the double-edged sword is I don't particularly think that that is working because it's pushing people away it's making them get angry we need them on board if we have more people on board that's amazing go shout at the government don't get angry at the protesters even though I understand why you're getting angry at the protesters it's really really difficult it really is I mean how did you feel when your bus came to a stop
00:33:56
Speaker
that's the thing. Initially you do feel annoyed and you're like, what the heck's going on? Because we were only there for a limited amount of time. It was inherently annoying and you kind of thought, ugh, surely there must be a better way. But it's one of these things that I feel as if
00:34:14
Speaker
it's something you kind of need to step away from and then think about the question of why are they doing this? Why is there a bunch of people standing in front of a bus walking really slowly? Because don't get me wrong, I don't think it's their ideal Saturday or Sunday to dress up all in orange and walk in front of a bus
00:34:34
Speaker
I don't think anyone, well maybe a select few, but not everyone wants to do that kind of choice if you know what I mean. But I feel as if the problem now, and I don't know how you both feel about this, is especially on the internet and places like Twitter and such.
00:34:50
Speaker
everybody seems to be a lot more reactionary nowadays, and I don't know if this is just because I'm getting older or because I'm just noticing these posts a lot more, but you see a lot of these pages that pop up and it's like man punches protester for blocking bus and you should see the amount of just horrific comments underneath saying things like oh I would have ran them over with my card or oh I would have punched them in the face no offense Mary.
00:35:19
Speaker
He stole my line. This is the beauty of me and Marie's podcast not being too popular yet, because we're not popular enough for hates, right? True, true. Trust me, I have a feeling vegans would have some quite choice words to say towards us. Just waiting for that milk episode to get discovered.
00:35:39
Speaker
But yeah, do you feel as if people are a lot more reactionary nowadays and not in the sense of, oh, that was a terrible thing I saw. Let me go away and think about this. No, just immediately seeing a thing and going. I'm going to think of the worst response possible.
00:35:54
Speaker
definitely. But I think that's just like the culture of communication these days, we are so used to instant communication, basically, and also anonymous communication, you can send the tweet and no one knows who the fuck you are. And it's just you can hide behind being anonymous. And then also, it's just how quickly we get information, which is a good in a way good, but also in a way bad, because it almost resulted to us of how quickly we process information. And
00:36:22
Speaker
And then it's also of how much information we process. I mean, there's this conversation going around like our attention spans are getting shorter. People no longer read the articles. They only read the headlines. Therefore, the headlines are catchy and are meant to enrage people.
00:36:38
Speaker
You can't do an hour-long video about climate change anymore. You have to condense it into a 30-second reel or TikTok just because it's just so you can grab people with a hook. You need to have a thumbnail. You need to have a catchy line so to draw people in.
00:36:54
Speaker
And so I think as a result of getting all this information so quickly, we itself, and also being anonymous, because you can say stuff and just have zero consequences. And also because there are so many people in the world, it's just people don't think about how one comment could affect someone or yeah, because it's just, well,
00:37:17
Speaker
I don't know this person and they don't know me, so I can be hateful. I can be mean. What's the big deal? It's like, that's how trolls got born. So definitely even like 50 to 60 years ago, if you wanted to complain about something, you had to write a strongly worded letter and then it took time to get to the person. So by the time you went through this process, you're like, eh, why bother? I wasn't that angry in the first place, but now you can just instantly send something without even having this cooling off period.
00:37:44
Speaker
I completely agree with Marie. People don't have to take responsibility for what they're saying online. There's a bit of a shield and it's instant. People literally just put the first thing they think of. I mean, I get it a lot of the time because I run a lot of social media accounts so I have to monitor them and see what people put. And the stuff we put up is quite neutral and wholesome. I do a lot of destination marketing so it's usually just, look at this pretty building or it's sunny today. And you will always get a comment going, this building's ugly. I don't like it.
00:38:12
Speaker
it. All sorts of random stuff like that and it's like, okay, cool. What do you want me to do about it? And that's quite light touch stuff. But yeah, there's no consequences for how people talk and actually not to keep going on about our podcast, but doing these podcasts. And I'm not sure if you've... I'm here. Go on. It's why we're here. It's why we're here. Milk it. Milk it. It's a safe space. You're okay.
00:38:33
Speaker
Thank you. I don't want to sell more things. I don't know if you've found this, but I feel way more responsible for what I'm saying now that we talk on a podcast because I do not want to spread misinformation, especially with the topics we talk about. This is why Marie does such an amazing job researching because we've built a platform for ourselves. We can't abuse it or spread misinformation or just not take responsibility for what we're saying because it's super harmful.
00:39:00
Speaker
I'd suggest more people start podcasts so they can understand that actually their words have a lot of consequences, which is daunting sometimes, I must say, but I think it's made me a better person, actually. So, yeah. I get an apology for the Smarter Untold Aren't You podcasting, but...
00:39:19
Speaker
Now that's what we're here for, we're here to listen. The amount of podcasts I've seen that basically griffed and they have all these controversial talking points and things and they'll say, oh did you know that you can do this if you do something very important or it's a whole back and forth and jumping in something you were saying earlier, it's that whole grabbing someone in 30 seconds, making them as emotional as possible and then hightailing it out of there never to come back in their life again.
00:39:48
Speaker
And it is quite a scary thing because the amount of things that pop up in my timeline and things and it'll be a manga bit up for protesting about something is like, oh no, that's terrible. But then you read the comments and they're all clearly bots, but it'll be completely different topics.
00:40:06
Speaker
around about, you've just seen a man get brutally punched in the face, but then in the next comment it's like, oh look at these puppies, and then the next one, oh look at this cool swimming pool, and it's like this has nothing to do with anything, it's just a whole sensory overload with no substance.
00:40:24
Speaker
I feel as if that is something that a lot of podcasters don't understand. The fact that when you start a podcast, you're probably putting yourself out there, you're putting your beliefs out there, how you present yourself as a person to the wider internet. As you say Beth, you're responsible for what you say, the facts that you come away with and everything because otherwise you're just talking a load out.
00:40:49
Speaker
I've already got enough bots like that, they just spout the biggest load of nonsense but I don't think people really realise that they've got so much power in the words that they're putting out there. This is the scary thing because obviously we've all put a lot of effort into starting a podcast but it can be done. I'm recording this in my bedroom with some gamer headphones. You can do it. And loads of people have access to Instagram and stuff.
00:41:13
Speaker
People now, it's easy for them to have a platform than ever before, which is why I think personally that if you have a platform you should use it for things like this. I don't have personal social media, I have an Instagram, which you can see my life on there, but I use it to promote climate action.
00:41:30
Speaker
And I think that's what we should be doing with our platforms. Some people don't have a voice. Some people don't have access to Instagram and things like that. I need to speak for them. That's what I think with that. But yeah, the power of social media is incredible. I think people really misuse it. People aren't taking responsibility at all. And I mean, I can't talk. I talk a load of rubbish all the time.
00:41:49
Speaker
I'm still taking responsibility for it. But knowing that has definitely made me better at this kind of thing. It's been a really good thing to be aware of. I'd encourage more people to use their platforms to talk about this kind of stuff. Obviously do your research, don't spread misinformation, but some people out there don't have these luxuries that we have.
00:42:09
Speaker
I think it's also just important on the other side is just it's a right to be wrong. It's a right to admit that you're wrong. And it's also a right to admit that you don't know anything. It's like just say, Oh, actually, I don't know anything about this topic instead of getting angry and defensive about it. And that's another thing I think people these days are so afraid of looking stupid that they just refuse to admit that they're wrong or just refuse to admit that
00:42:36
Speaker
Oh, I actually don't know anything about the subject. So they just dig themselves into this hole and keep spouting misinformation and keep insisting that no, no, no, I'm right. Even though they themselves know they're wrong, but they don't want to come off. It's stupid. And it's just, yeah, it's a weird time that we're living in.
00:42:52
Speaker
No, you are completely right there. There is a shocking amount of people that refuse to take experiences like that and turn that into something positive. I would never in a million years, and it's not just because you're both here, but I would never in a million years go into chat tsunami and be like, oh, I'm going to do an episode on sustainability without doing any research or things. And even if I did get something wrong, then I would happily say, oh,
00:43:21
Speaker
Well, I'm sorry for that. I'll try and edit it out or I'll try and do something to kind of make up for it. But it is quite scary how, and especially for content creators and people who really target themselves towards quite
00:43:37
Speaker
impressionable groups as well, as we were talking about before, in the nicest way possible, the emotionally volatile groups, as it were, they all hear one thing, suddenly take it as fact, and then they'll spread it on, and then it's a bit like a virus, it just keeps going on and on and on, and then all of a sudden you've got a whole group of people who are believing one particular thing and you're like,
00:44:00
Speaker
it could have been stopped by someone saying okay I was wrong for that particular point but it feels as if nowadays because there's almost and again this is wishful thinking here when I'm saying it's easier to get famous online but I feel as if it is a lot more easier
00:44:16
Speaker
as you were saying Beth as well, the fact that everybody's got that in their pocket. They've got a phone, they've got access to Instagram, to TikTok, to Twitter. All it could take is one particular tweet, one particular video, and that's it. Suddenly you become absolutely famous, you become viral, a bit like a Lally Wonka thing.
00:44:36
Speaker
as well you know there's one video and all of a sudden everybody all over the world was talking about it and it is just scary how not only is it easier to promote yourselves in that way but more in the sense that it's completely random. Do you ever feel like that with a lot of these sustainability influencers where you'll see some of them that just all of a sudden catapult into the spotlight but they're maybe the wrong person to be in the spotlight if that makes sense?
00:45:06
Speaker
Oh God, Marie, I know we've got a lot of feelings on this. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we see it all the time and it's just like, I don't think there is such a thing as a sustainable influencer because influencers make money off people buying stuff from your influence. It's in the title. And I think the second you reach that level of fame or you become the
00:45:25
Speaker
dependent on being an influencer. So if your full-time job is an influencer, then the only way to survive is by selling stuff. So I don't think it is. Yeah, it is very complicated. We spoke about this in our Sheen episode, because the whole reason we did that episode was because of the influencer trip.
00:45:41
Speaker
where these group of influencers were flown to a factory in China to show how sustainable sheen was. And these influencers clearly never heard the definition of sustainability and fast fashion. And it was just the wrong people given that platform. And then we've seen other influencers say, well, if I was invited, I would have asked about this question. But then it's like, but if I was invited, then I wouldn't have accepted it because A, it's sheen and two, it's a trip.
00:46:11
Speaker
across the world, which causes carbon emissions. So even if I was invited, I would have said no. So it was just like this whole thing. But like that was a perfect example of the wrong people getting a platform and spreading this misinformation. And it was just so
00:46:26
Speaker
frustrating to watch. And then the bigger content creators reacting to this, they were just like, oh, how embarrassing. They've been pulled in by Sheen's marketing and greenwashing, but then they also never said why Sheen was so bad because they didn't actually know the reason themselves behind it. And it's just it's frustrating. And I think it's the same working for a sustainable fashion label. It's just like we're sustainable because we produce small, but then the role of us producing small means that we can't break even. But the second we start doing stuff wholesale and producing more,
00:46:55
Speaker
and recall ourselves sustainable, but then if we don't produce more, then how do we make money? It's digging yourself into a hole. It kind of goes back to what we were saying about taking responsibility for what you're saying and doing, even as an influencer. And again, I agree, Marie, I don't believe in sustainable influences. They're not a thing.
00:47:12
Speaker
even if you're an influencer and you're selling something, surely you've been picked for that and you're gonna do it because your beliefs and stuff align with the brand's value. So surely you would then, I don't know, if I was selling a Stanley Cup, surely before I'd sell the Stanley Cup, I would at least look on the website and see what is a Stanley Cup, what are they about?
00:47:31
Speaker
I am then selling it and I'm accountable if I'm spreading misinformation or if people like find a fault in it or whatever it comes on me so surely people would be more aware of that but they're not which is why we talk about in the Sheen episode how it takes two to tango obviously yeah Sheen are the bad guys here for numerous reasons that we talk about
00:47:52
Speaker
But also, the influencers should take responsibility. They should have looked into this. And actually, as Marie says in the episode, if you Google Sheen, the first few things that come up are all about the environmental impacts of Sheen. It's not a hard thing to find out about. So there's lack of sympathy there I have for them. But yeah, you should always be taking accountability. But then when we were saying about people make mistakes,
00:48:16
Speaker
We're all human. We make errors. It's the basis of our whole platform. We talk about how sustainability is hard and we make mistakes, but then we talk about it and maybe what we could do better. We're not afraid of that. And actually people like that because it's relatable and it's authentic. It cuts through all the influencer crap of being perfect and this and that. We're like, Hey, look, we made a mistake. We're real people. We've now gone and actually researched what the right thing is. Don't just keep doing the bad thing. Make it right. It's okay. You learn from it.
00:48:45
Speaker
Again it's a really difficult one but as Marie said you can't be a sustainable influencer, you're selling something, you're promoting consumerism and I mean I've had my own experience with this. I've worked with a company that I do truly believe in, they're called Canopy and their whole values are based on buying better so don't buy loads of stuff. Buy one thing that will last you and they verify everything as well, they mean what they say. So I'm kind of like I don't mind promoting
00:49:12
Speaker
If you need bug roll, everyone needs bug roll, buy some good bug roll. I don't know. So that's kind of where I see the line, but I don't agree with, Hey, you need this now and you need this now. It's like, well, no, I don't need this now. You're just promoting overconsumption again, even if it's made a bamboo, it's not good. I mean, when I started this low waste lifestyle, I want to say around 2018, 2019. And you know what? The first thing I did when I decided to be more sustainable, I bought bamboo cutlery off of bamboo.
00:49:42
Speaker
Amazon. I now know the irony of this, but at the time, it just did not hit me. I was just like, oh, this is a cool idea, bringing cutlery around with you. Even though I had cutlery in a drawer a step away from me, I thought, no, I need bamboo cutlery.
00:49:59
Speaker
and I'm gonna get it from Amazon. And so I've also fallen into this trap going, oh, I need to buy all this and stuff like that. And I honestly didn't realize and I have to admit I did use the bamboo cutlery a lot. And then I moved to Portugal and Portugal is like more humidity than air. And then the bamboo cutlery just started to rot in my drawers. So that was just like a whole other thing. So just now I can't even use the bamboo cutlery because I don't think it's safe to put in near your mouth.
00:50:27
Speaker
So now I'm stuck with this useless thing. Sorry, this could be a whole other podcast, the journey of my bamboo cutlery. But the beauty of this is that Marie's admitting that she's not afraid to admit this and it's funny and relatable.
00:50:42
Speaker
And she's saying what she's learned about it and I think more people should do that. That's again why we have our podcast. We talk about when we've made an error and we've messed up and it's usually hilarious. And then we kind of talk about what we're doing now and what we could do better. It's being a person at the end of the day.
00:50:59
Speaker
As we were saying there though, it is just such an important thing to have that sense of A, accountability and B, being able to use your platform to admit those mistakes and to be able to say, well, next time I'm not going to buy bamboo from Amazon. And then move to Portugal. Very specific but it happens more than you think.
00:51:23
Speaker
There'll be someone out there that relates to that though, that's the beauty of it. It's going to be like, that happened to me! I know, it would just be your next own neighbour, Marie, if you're like, oh my god, there's another! But bamboo cut my reassign. I get the feeling that Amazon definitely wouldn't sponsor us anymore. Or not anymore, but they wouldn't sponsor us at all after. So we kind of ruined that for you?
00:51:46
Speaker
No, that's fine. They won't return my calls anyway. I bought a boombox off them just so I could stand outside, but they just won't reply to me. So they're lost. They're prime lost, not mine. I was going to say, having us on here is not going to make your podcast very profitable, I'm afraid. Nah, that's fine. It may be popular. Yeah. I'm a red panda looking up. I'm like, yeah, one day, but not today.
00:52:11
Speaker
I actually have a question for you. I wanted to bring something over from our podcast as we were talking about making mistakes and stuff. Do you have a sustainable fail that's happened to you? I have to admit, I'm one of those people as well that you do get suckered into reading these things online and you think, oh, I'm going to reuse this. I'm going to do that because I went to Aldi once and I bought one of those
00:52:34
Speaker
You know the bento boxes? Thinking, oh I'm going to get so much use out of this. And don't get me wrong it's a great box and everything but I think I've only used it maybe a handful of times. I mean don't get me wrong I still use the Tupperware that I've got and the cupboard and things and I have to say it's
00:52:53
Speaker
partly because I'm lazy, partly because I've already got good containers at home, so I'm kind of like, well, I don't need other ones. See, unless they're cracked down in the middle or whatever, I don't really get them. But I have to say, the only thing I would say I'm really good at in terms of sustainability is clothes, because I am not a fashionable person. And I mean, that's probably why I keep the camera off. But... Oh, don't say that. I mean, I can't see you right now, but I'm sure you look lovely.
00:53:20
Speaker
I appreciate it and the PayPal donation's on its way, bye!
00:53:26
Speaker
Yeah, after a minute. Even my family have turned around whenever I'm wearing the same hoodie or the same jumper or whatever and they're like, you've had that for years and I'm like, yeah, because it's comfy, it's practical, I don't really need it. Genuinely, I hate clothes shopping and maybe that's partly why. And the one hand I didn't go out my way to be like, I'm going to be sustainable through fashion, but it's almost like an indirect
00:53:50
Speaker
because I'm just comfy with the clothes I've got. And obviously I'll buy them if I need them, but I've really tried not to because I'm like, well, it's just going to sit in the cupboard. It's not really going to do anything. So I suppose that's more of a sustainability win. Absolutely. You should be the face of slow fashion. You do better than us.
00:54:11
Speaker
Well, I say it, oh yeah, definitely. And then I'm thinking, oh God, no. What if they try to get me to market hoodies and things like that? I'm like, okay, we've just got a full 180 there. Chatsunami, slow range.
00:54:26
Speaker
it whenever you want. If you need it, take it. I have to say in all seriousness, I don't know if you've ever had that thought where you're thinking about if your podcast gets famous enough that you've got merch that's flying off the shelves and things. And obviously, you know, I'm not saying you would, but
00:54:42
Speaker
you know, in the sense of if you are promoting yourself through that. And I always keep thinking if I was strong armed, not that there's someone from Sheen lurking in the darkness being like, oh, you're going to promote like a clothing brand or something. But honestly, see if it was me, it would probably just be like, that would be like the one piece of clothing.
00:55:01
Speaker
It's like to either hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. Oh yeah. I do think though, obviously this isn't going to happen, but if we had reusable cups of two girls, one reusable cup on, that would actually be pretty sick. That would just look cool, but... Beth already knows.
00:55:17
Speaker
Yeah, sadly, I think we're gonna be broke podcasters for life because I'm never gonna let that happen, basically, because there is enough ups in the world. And even if we do get big, air quotes, two girls, one reusable cup would only mean something to people on less than 1000% of people on the planet.
00:55:36
Speaker
No one knows. Even if we do get big, the podcast is just going to mean something to a certain amount of people. And what happens if that person is done with that cup and gives it to a charity shop and someone else picks it up and they've never heard of us before and they're like, what is this crap? So that generally keeps me up at night and it's.
00:55:53
Speaker
I'm just picturing some old woman going into a charity shop going, oh, I'm sure my daughter would love this. I don't know how we'd react if we saw our stuff in a charity shop. I'd be kind of proud, but die inside as well. I'd be horrified, especially since I know where most of that stuff ends up in. It's the thing, I know too much. I know too much to be happy. No wonder I'm always depressed.
00:56:17
Speaker
I was going to say it could be worse. That old granny who goes into the charity shop could be like, oh, I'm going to Google it.
00:56:26
Speaker
You know, you know what? We've been working on our search engine optimization and actually none of that stuff comes up as high anymore, which was our biggest achievement ever. If you search two girls, one reusable cup, we are at the top for once. When we first started, questionable things were at the top of that search, which I'm not, I'm not going to talk about. If you know, you know.
00:56:50
Speaker
Sadly, the exception to that is still YouTube. Yeah, yeah, don't Google us on YouTube. Yeah, just use our link. Yeah, don't type us in the YouTube search bar. It's become a bit of an issue. Hopefully the same thing will happen and our YouTube will get more popular. But yeah, now there are some questionable thumbnails underneath ours on YouTube and it's the curse of the name.
00:57:11
Speaker
It's a blessing and a curse. It's a great name, but yeah. It's a great icebreaker because I've gotten quite a lot of compliments on the name on Twitter. And I think, except for one person who got angry about us about the name, but he was a basement dweller. And I think he was more angry about the fact that I said the Snyder Cut of Justice League wasn't that good.
00:57:30
Speaker
Oh, so it was your fault, really? Yeah, I antagonized him and then he's just like, well, your name's disgusting. And it's just like, okay, calm down. Sorry, Zack Snyder isn't the god almighty. Sorry to burst your bubble. But yeah, that's the only negative comment we have received in the entirety of doing the podcast.
00:57:50
Speaker
I've had someone mid-drink and spit their water out and I told them, which is great. I think that's an accomplishment. It's kind of the good thing about being in Portugal because they don't really get the reference. But it becomes literal then because the whole funny thing about it is, what are we gonna do? There's only one cup. And then that kind of summarizes the whole thing with us struggling with sustainability. So it has double meaning, I think. I'm proud of it. I'm proud of us.
00:58:16
Speaker
It's certainly eye-catching, I'll give you that, because after Matt, when I first read it, I did a double take. And I was like, oh, okay. Reusable, okay, thank God. I don't need the trauma again. No, we don't want to do that to people. Between me and the old person at the charity shop, I've been through too much.
00:58:35
Speaker
Before we wrap up tonight, first of all, thank you so much. We have both been absolutely fantastic. But what is next for your podcast? Are there any particular topics or projects that you're going to be working on? Oh, yes. So exciting things in development. This year, we've actually got three new formats that we're trying out in addition to our usual content.
00:59:00
Speaker
We're going to have guests on for the first time this year, which is exciting. Exciting. And then we're pivoting towards a more casual conversation format as well because don't worry, the deep dives are going to stay. It's just, as you may have noticed, I've become a little bit jaded and I kind of need a break from all the research.
00:59:19
Speaker
I like my brain is full of information. And it's just to give myself a breather from all the deep dives, we decided to say more chat based content because that is essentially what a podcast is. But we've got more casual stuff in the works. And then the third one, I'm not actually going to spoil, but let's just say it's going to be interesting because we've never done something like this on the pod before.
00:59:41
Speaker
So it might be a triumph or it might be a complete disaster, but I can guarantee you it will be entertaining. And that will be coming out as our second year anniversary in September, which is exciting. Yeah. In terms of topics, we did one on palm oil. So that's, we'll be coming out soon. We've mentioned them a couple of times, but Amazon, it's going to be Amazon's time. Like we're doing a deep dive. Amazon's time. Amazon's trial. Exactly.
01:00:08
Speaker
It's time, but yeah, we're gonna be doing a deep dive on Amazon, which is not even gonna cover everything because it's Amazon, it's a massive company. Oh yeah, we could go on about that for days. We don't have a long enough Zoom subscription for Amazon.
01:00:24
Speaker
I think the limit is on Zoom because that's another new upgrade. We upgraded ourselves. We actually got a paid Zoom subscription this year. Shout out to Marie's mom. Exactly. Thanks to my mom. So it means it doesn't cut us off at every 45 minutes as we were trying to record. And it does make things a lot easier. But I think the limit on Zoom is like 45 hours that you can record. And I think we could go over that if we talked about Amazon.
01:00:50
Speaker
But and then there's of course going to be some fashion topics in the works because that is my background and I will never stop talking about the fashion industry because that is my life. So yeah. And hopefully I will be in the same country as Marie at some point as well. That's something to look forward to. But ironically, when me and Beth are in the same country, we don't do any work.
01:01:11
Speaker
Oh, we have the best time. But it's so funny because it's the holiday. It's the holiday from the podcast. So when we see each other, it's technically our holiday. And then when we're not seeing each other, it's when we're working and it's kind of funny. Usually people go on holiday to get away from their colleagues. We go on holiday just to see each other.
01:01:29
Speaker
Although I must say, when we're about to nod off to sleep, I then come up with all my ideas for the podcast. I'm like, Marie, we could do this. And you're like, Beth, go to sleep. For one, we're dying up a mountain. Oh my gosh, them nine hours.
01:01:43
Speaker
I think the only reason we started thinking about it then is we said on the podcast when we went to Madeira hiking, we got right to the top, we'd run out of water, bought some plastic water bottles and then saw a refill point and we were fuming. It was the biggest sustainable fail ever. To be fair, I think we were very close to dehydration at that point, I think. I was getting a bit worried for our safety. And hunger, you inhaled them Cheetos, it was great.
01:02:08
Speaker
Yeah, it's going to be a journey, as we say. It's going to be exciting. Got loads of fun stuff coming up. And yeah, it's exciting to be back in releasing episodes again. And obviously I cannot wait to hear them because as I said, I was listening to a couple of episodes today. They're absolutely fantastic. And obviously you both do such a fantastic job at what you do. So first of all, thank you so much for coming on tonight and talking about your podcast. But more importantly, before we wrap up,
01:02:38
Speaker
Where can these lovely listeners at home find your content? Oh Marie, you always do the outro, you're good at this. So you can find us on all major podcasting platforms. We're on Spotify, Apple Podcasts. We're also on GoodPods, Pod Tracers. As we just mentioned earlier, we are on YouTube and I've been putting a lot of work in YouTube, so please check out the YouTube and subscribe. Use the link, please use the link.
01:03:04
Speaker
And then you can connect with us on socials as well. We're on Twitter and Instagram. You can find us at 2G1ReusableCup or just 2Girls1ReusableCup. You can find me personally. I'm known on the interwebs as Life on Mars. For someone who hates social media, I'm actually now everywhere. I've got TikTok, Twitter, Instagram, just look for the crazy chick with the purple hair and Beth.
01:03:29
Speaker
I am also on Instagram. My hair isn't as crazy, unfortunately. I am under Sustainer belt. Once again, Marine Beth, thank you so, so much for coming on and talking about your podcasts tonight. If you want to check out more content from ourselves, you can check us out at our website, Chatsunami.com.
01:03:46
Speaker
I also want to give a huge shout out to my Pandalorian patrons, RoboticBattleToaster and Sonya, thank you so much as always for supporting the show, and if you would like some exclusive content as well as some, I was going to joke and say sustain about literally tips but for legal reasons that's a joke.
01:04:02
Speaker
yeah you can check us out at our patreon patreon.com forward slash chat tsunami yeah as i said at the beginning this episode is part of the podpack collective featuring a whole bunch of absolutely wonderful podcasters yourselves included of course we have seismic cinema review yourself casting views their nostalgic pod honestly so many we've also got weird horizons and the game club pod who am i missing
01:04:32
Speaker
No, I'm sure we're fine. I think you set them all. See, if I have missed anybody, they're gonna come after me with a sustainable brick. So, on that note.
01:04:44
Speaker
Thank you all so, so much for listening to this episode. Stay safe, stay awesome and most importantly, stay hydrated. Welcome to Chatanami, a variety podcast that discusses topics from gaming and films to anime in general interest. Previously on Chatanami, we've analysed what makes a good horror game, conducted a retrospective on Pierce Brosnan's run as James Bond, and listened to us take deep dives into both the Sonic and Halo franchises.
01:05:10
Speaker
Also, if you're an anime fan, then don't forget to check us out on our sub-series, Chatsunani, where we dive into the world of anime. So far, we've reviewed things like Death Note, Princess Mononoke, and the hit Beyblade series. If that sounds like your cup of tea, then you can check us out on Spotify, iTunes, and all good podcast apps. As always, stay safe, stay awesome, and most importantly, stay hydrated.