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Writer and Actor Vann Weller
12 Plays2 days ago
This week's guest is neither a horror guy nor neurodivergent. He lends his perspectives on TV production, neurotypical creativity, the early days of the internet, and Elon Musk. There's a live song, and a spirited discussion on whether or not suffering is required to make impactful art. Also The Last Broadcast, psychedelic therapy, and a Mad Lib.
Find more from Vann Weller here.
Find a complete transcript of this episode here.
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Transcript
Introduction to Neurodivergence and Art
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Speaker
You are listening to The Mentally Oddcast, where we talk with creatives about neurodivergence, trauma, addiction, and all the other things that impact and inform our art. Our goal is to show everyone that no matter what you're going through, you are not alone and you can make art about it.
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Music
00:00:40
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You are listening to the Mentally
Introducing the Host and Sponsor
00:00:42
Speaker
Oddcast. My name is Wednesday, leave Friday, and we are brought to you by Sometimes Hilarious Horror Magazine. Find us on Ko-fi.
Guest Introduction: Ben Weller
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Speaker
This week, we have Ben Weller, who is a writer, musician, actor, and a TV production assistant, actually, currently living in New Jersey.
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He's written several novels, at least one of which is Hilarious Horror. He's produced multiple documentaries and worked on well-known shows, including Good Morning America and The View.
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He is currently retired, and his focus has switched to, well, he's finishing his third novel and dabbling in songwriting and short stories. He's been published in sometimes hilarious horror, and he appeared in one of my favorite horror movies of the 90s, The Last Broadcast.
00:01:31
Speaker
Welcome, Van. Well, hello. Thank you. I love your theme song, by the way. oh thanks. Our music is by Peter Alway. He's been so generous with his music, so I probably should learn how to say his damn name.
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Speaker
All right.
Ben's Early Horror Influences
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put the We like to start by asking guests to tell the story of the first horror movie that they remember seeing, so I cannot wait to hear yours. Okay. Well, I have three impactful horror movies I can tell you about, but the first one, I think, was The Blob.
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Okay. And I was probably like eight years old. And for some reason that movie just freaked me out. Uh, I had trouble sleeping for a couple of days after that. And then, uh, around that time, also saw something called Dr. Terror's house of horrors.
00:02:24
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Oh, wow. And, uh, I think there's like five different stories in this movie, but one of them involved a chopped off hand that was moving by itself and terrorizing a guy. And it that freaked me out too, ah big time as a little kid.
00:02:43
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Okay. And then the only other real one was later on, and like in college, when I saw The Exorcist. And in that was very impactful. Another sleepless night after that.
00:02:57
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Are you religious? Uh, no, no, not, no, not in that way. Well, it's curious to me because obviously people who are, who lean that way, like that type of flavor of religion, handle the exorcist much worse than people like me who have never been able to like sincerely follow a religion because i was so sure that everybody was pretending.
00:03:27
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um So, yeah, I just wonder if, if like, if The Exorcist scared you, was it the general creepiness or the... Yeah, it was... The movie, it got so much scarier later, like that new release with the crab walking and everything.
00:03:41
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oh I don't know. There's just a lot of elements in that movie that were disturbing to me at the time. and Okay. All right.
Ben's Relationship with Horror
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So would you say that you have a strong connection to horror?
00:03:55
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No. No, not really at all. um It's not my favorite genre. I don't really enjoy being grossed out or, you know, scared if I can avoid it. I'm trying to think the last one that's and even like that, that i did watch. It's been a while. I usually avoid them, I guess. um
00:04:20
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ah What's the? similar with Julia Roberts where they go on vacation and ah all the technology gets screwed up.
00:04:32
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I don't know. I don't watch Julia Roberts movies. Well, it wasn't her fault she was in that, but anyway. So yeah, it's, it's not, it's not a big thing for me, but um
00:04:49
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so, yeah yeah, but I can answer this next question.
00:04:55
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Okay, tell me the next question. About horror writers that I particularly admire. I was actually pretty heavily influenced by Dean Kuntz as far as like storytelling and, you know, between him and Stephen King, I guess, I i sort of lumped them together in the same boat.
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And, but, you know, I liked the way both of them write. And to me, it was more about that than the actual horror.
Influences of Koontz and King
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Okay, so you just, you're like their their style of prose. Yeah, you familiar with Koontz at all?
00:05:34
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um I'm gonna have to admit that I don't remember offhand if I've ever read anything by Dean Koontz. Okay. Tons of King, tons of it. Yeah, I bet. Well, you know, I was reading horror novels when I was like 10.
00:05:49
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You know, cause I saw the shining when I was about 10 and I had already read it at that point. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. King and and flowers in the attic, you know, all the BC Andrew stuff were, were my big reads as a, as a kid.
00:06:04
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Like I also read kid stuff. I read like the Roald Dahl books that are for kids. It wasn't for a long time that I realized he wrote adult stuff and it's like, Oh, holy crap. This is filthy.
00:06:15
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i I was reading Danny Dunn books when I was a kid. He was a kid that got into science stuff. He was like a, he hung around with Professor Bullfinch and they did all kinds of science stuff. That was fun to me. Oh, wow.
00:06:35
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Did you read um Cyclopedia Brown? No, I didn't. Oh, yeah, that was something I liked as a kid too. I also read a lot of the Beverly Cleary stuff, which is definitely not horrific.
00:06:49
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Yeah, actually, h H and I just went through this whole thing, um like parsing the differences between Nancy Drew and Trixie Belton, because he grew up reading Nancy Drew, but I had both series, because i got all my books came from garage sales, so someday you would you would just come home with like a set of 30 books in the same series.
00:07:08
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Nice.
Journey into Film Production
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So... What was your initial plan when you decided to get into film production? Well, it sort of happened by accident. I was more interested in television production when I first started.
00:07:23
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I went to Ithaca College and they didn't have room for me in that program. So i enrolled as an English major and sort of switched over to the television and radio part.
00:07:35
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When I was a kid, I was intrigued by the behind the scenes workings of media production. I mean, in third grade, we had like a play that I wasn't in, but I was backstage, you know, pulling the curtain and turning on lights and stuff. And I just thought that was so cool.
00:07:54
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And also around that time, I was watching the Dick Van Dyke show and i was very intrigued by the behind the scenes of putting on a television show.
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So it was sort of always in my mind and that's where i you know leaned, was it came time to choose a school and I went there and ah eventually switched over to the film side of things in that program and ah worked on, you know i made some films in school.
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And I sort of got sidetracked over into the audio aspect of that. And so I ended up becoming more of an audio guy than a film guy.
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Although much later in life, I did do some more film production or video production. But for actual college, I just sort of ended up in the film department and I liked it.
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And, ah you know, it went on from there, got into the, audio end of things and ended up doing a lot of live sound for local bands and some
Highlights in TV Production
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recording. We had a little recording studio that I operated and then eventually I got back into doing audio for video production, doing a lot of corporate stuff.
00:09:18
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Uh, Unisys was a company, you know, computer company back in the day. And they had a department for making videos for training, you know, internal stuff.
00:09:32
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And they would actually have like do these scenarios with actors and stuff. So I got a lot of experience working with actors and doing the audio end and then i I would think if you have to work with actors, you'd get less attitude making training videos for workplaces as opposed to doing... Well, yeah, I mean, these weren't very full of themselves kind of people. I mean, they were doing that. So they were all cool that way. So I was...
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i will i In my intro to broadcasting class in college, one of the my classmates ended up being the executive producer of the Mets games on Channel 9 in New Jersey here.
00:10:26
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And I saw his name in the credits one day. said, hey, well, I know him. I'll call him up. And it was right around the time they were going to start doing a new show with Joan London, who was like the host of Good Morning America at the time.
00:10:39
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and she wanted to do her own show. it was like a daytime talk show. She would go be Good Morning America. you know She had to be there like four in the morning or whatever. And then in the afternoon, she would come over to New Jersey and we did this talk show. And I was on the audio crew there. I you know was micing people up and dealing with any music we ever had and stuff like that.
00:11:05
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And then after that, They were also producing the Howard Stern show there, the TV show he had for a while. ah did Did you ever know about that show?
00:11:20
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Yeah. Oh, okay. Well, I worked on the second season of it, and that was that was interesting. And then then I got a job at ABC.
00:11:32
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TV in New York at the network and went on, you know, to do the view for 10 years and then good morning America and then world news. And then I got downsized out of there.
00:11:46
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When did you stop working for the view? Yeah. In 2006, I think. Okay. So before it got all, when Don Jr. Was there, had to ask.
00:11:58
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No, no. That's the only episode of the view I ever watched. Well, good. so I'm sorry I had to sit through that No, back when I was
Experiences on The View
00:12:09
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working on... It not to my taste. I mean, I don't want to sound all like anti-woman. I really liked Whoopi Goldberg for a long time.
00:12:16
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um She said some things in recent years that I... found puzzling and not endearing. so So, you know, I'm little more ambivalent about her than I used to be, but I mean, come on, Whoopi Goldberg. She's done so much. I mean, cinema, theater, oh, her. Yeah,
00:12:37
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yeah i I have a lot of respect for She was, I was gone by the time she got there. When I was there, the show was a lot different. It wasn't this political nonsense they're up to now. It was, you know, we had a lot of live music on that show back then.
00:12:54
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that was saying kind of why I was there because I would interface with the musicians and you know, do monitors and stuff. i was I was running the PA system for the audience for the regular show. And then we had music. I mixed that for the audience.
00:13:08
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you know, someone else was mixing it for the air upstairs, but I was doing it for the audience and I was involved in setting up all the mics and everything for the bands and dealing with their monitors or whatever else they needed.
00:13:24
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So, I mean, that... That was a good gig. And I left um after the first year of Rosie O'Donnell being there. okay.
00:13:34
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And ah so I, you know, I missed, I missed Whoopi being there. When I first saw her being there, she seemed like, and I heard from, you know, coworkers that she was real nice and, you know, great to work with.
00:13:48
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And ah Rosie was a challenge for most people, but I think I was the only one there that actually liked her. Oh, wow. And I was the one that got canned, but oh well.
00:14:00
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If that didn't happen, I'd probably still be there, which that sounds horrific to me now. So moving on to your beock more current work, um the 13th book.
Ben's Novels and Themes
00:14:13
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Now, I have had a copy of this book in my possession for some time. um And I have read some of it and got just into it enough to be like, okay, I need to give this thing my full attention because something is happening here.
00:14:27
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And then I set it down and I cannot find it. Can't find it? I know. It's killer. If you saw my apartment, my God, it this place is just nuts with stuff.
00:14:38
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ah that's We look like hoarders, except that everything is useful and we need it But there's just like stacks and boxes of stuff everywhere like we just moved in. and that's That's really funny to me because ah I'd actually like to start with Urge to Merge because 13th book is related to that. The story of the 13th book is related to what happened with Urge to Merge.
00:15:04
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So Urge to Merge is my first novel, and it was based on my experience in the very, very beginnings of online chatting in the early 90s. Like I was on CompuServe doing this.
00:15:22
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And then I switched over to a couple of it and There was a thing called Bix at the time, which had, you know, chat facility. And then I think I ended up yeah on Yahoo!,
00:15:34
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near the end. But back then they would have actual chat rooms where you could go in and there were very few bots and, you know, people could just actually talk with each other about, you know, and each room might might have a specific subject or some were general purpose, but it's a lot different than it is now. I can't even find anything like that right now.
00:15:58
Speaker
But, ah so I was doing that and i just developed a lot of stories from that realm. And at the same time is when I was working at Channel 9 TV and one of the shows I worked on there was the Richard Bay, who don't know if anyone's ever heard of him, but he was like a local Jerry Springer wannabe kind of a act.
00:16:24
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So he had a show like that going on. And so I sort of merged those two concepts into this, story about two coworkers at a TV station who also go online at night and they know each other online at night, but um the guy decides he wants to get to know this girl better by being someone else online. So he, you know, pretends to be someone else and there's there's a whole relationship and hilarity ensues.
00:16:59
Speaker
And at the same time, the reason it's called urge to merge is because there's also in the background while these guys are at work and at night doing their stuff, there's the TV station they work for is merging with the internet provider they use.
00:17:15
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oh okay So it's a kind of prescient because that has happened since, you know, a lot of that kind of stuff has been going on. So, all right. So I wrote this book about all that.
00:17:28
Speaker
and I decided i was going to make my own books and I printed them out and I made covers for them. I used a inkjet printer for the cover and laminated it and bound them together with glue. And I made like 300 of these things and I'd send them out to people trying to get somebody interested.
00:17:52
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And every time I sent one to somebody, you know, something would happen like, oh, my, dog got sick or I'm getting divorced or something would happen, some reason they wouldn't read it.
00:18:05
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And, you know, I tried to find an agent and that didn't work out too well. And so I decided that
00:18:17
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this would be a good idea for another story. And that's where the 13th book comes in. And that's about a guy who writes a book about internet relationships. And every time he sends it to somebody, something bad happens to them.
00:18:33
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And he's trying to, he's frantically trying to figure out what's going on. And then he himself is in the very first chapter, he gets struck down. He gets stung by a bee and he is dead.
00:18:47
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So the detective he had been talking to about all this has to figure out well what's going on with these books. So that's the genesis of that story.
Detached Writing Style
00:18:58
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And it ended up being, ah you know, kind of horrific in places, which isn't my normal style, but I went with it.
00:19:09
Speaker
And, you know, it's more of like a detective story-ish. But um so that's that's how that happened.
00:19:21
Speaker
So is it really detached, like your short stories? Detached? Yeah. um Emotionally. Emotionally. Well, I guess I a yeah try to take an objective view of most things when I write. Okay. and Like in Urge to Merge. I mean, it's romantic.
00:19:47
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ah
00:19:50
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But it's more from the perspective, like trying to see in the head of each of the people in this relationship. And it's not like, ah like a gooeyly romantic, but ah it, I think it does have some romance too, especially very end. I think the very end is very romantic, but it's still, it's still written in a ah kind of a,
00:20:20
Speaker
I don't know, observational way somehow. Okay. I get it. You should, you should read the last couple of pages of that. Why are you, are you spiffing them up to, for a new edition or what what are you doing with them? No. Well, okay. I think both of those books have some historical value, especially urge to merge. And I would like to, I would like to re release that or re really, I'd like to,
00:20:47
Speaker
Nowadays, i think it has some potential as a retro 90s nostalgia kind of thing. I think people of all generations can relate to it. so like Boomers like me will have some... there's There's some little things in there that nobody would get unless they lived at that time.
00:21:09
Speaker
So younger people might not get some of these references, but that's okay. The boomers will. ah People of your generation who are just getting started with this back then will relate to it. And then I think newer generation... a just want to make that clear. No, no. I said your generation. Your x I believe.
00:21:27
Speaker
Yes. Right. So, i mean, that generation would also find things to relate to. and And then I think newer generation would just be fascinated by...
00:21:38
Speaker
you know, the limitations of technology. This is a time when we were using dial-up modems and floppy disks and only rich people had cell phones. Right.
00:21:49
Speaker
So I just think that maybe younger people might find that interesting. I don't know. So I'm trying to... to think about. Yeah. It's kind of weird to think that something you wrote as a younger person is now considered historical fiction. Yeah.
00:22:04
Speaker
But I think that has value these days. And what I had said before about changing it, ah ah you know, both of those books have things in them that don't line up with today's sensibilities. You know, there's some, you know, you might be an occasional epithet that no one would ever say now some,
00:22:25
Speaker
some mild misogyny here and there and just it was a different time and i just want that to be preserved i don't need to you know worry about i actually i actually paid a friend of mine to do a sensitivity edit on it and uh she flagged a bunch of stuff and the more i thought about it the more i'm thinking can yeah so what i mean isn't going to hurt anybody. And I think people should see what things were like back then. So that's, that's where I'm going with it.
00:23:02
Speaker
I see.
Debating Elon Musk
00:23:03
Speaker
I see. Well, that actually brings me to the next topic. Um, because you and I, you know, we, we have a pretty good rapport on most things. Um, but we do disagree on Elon Musk.
00:23:15
Speaker
So I'm going to let you go first. Because you have corrected me several times when I have referred to him as a Nazi and a fascist.
00:23:26
Speaker
Yeah. and And you don't you don't agree. So please. don't. I look at Elon through a completely different lens. First of all, I've been investing in Tesla for years now.
00:23:38
Speaker
And I've always thought of Elon as... ah a visionary and, you know, basically the Edison of our time. And I think he genuinely wishes to make life better for humanity by, ah working on sustainable energy, a you know, transport electric car. I have a Tesla car and I love it.
00:24:07
Speaker
Um, i It drives itself. I use the full self-driving like 90% of the time now. And it's only going to get better. And when they, you know, finally get to the point where everybody can do that, I think everybody would and should do that because that's safer. I feel safer. I don't consider myself a terrible driver, but I think the car drives better than I do.
00:24:33
Speaker
So i I really like that. I'm very just impressed by the way Elon runs his business. He's a forward thinker.
00:24:44
Speaker
e um I'm sorry. when When you say you like the way that he runs his business, can you be more specific? Like what specifically do you like? Well, he's...
00:24:56
Speaker
he's he's a hard taskmaster. He makes sure that people do what needs to be done, but he yeah he he encourages the people around to do the best they possibly can, and he attracts really good engineering talent, and he makes things happen. ah You know, this whole doge thing, I don't know. I have mixed feelings about it, but he's applying a lot of his business sensibilities to the government, which may or may not be the best thing to do. But his his philosophy in his business is like, he'll he'll do staff cuts. And he his feeling is that if you don't if you cut so if you don't have to hire 10% of the people back, then you didn't cut enough in the first place.
00:25:49
Speaker
That's kind of his line about that. And I think he's trying to apply that to the government now, which I understand is troublesome and problematic in a lot of ways, ah but I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt because I, like I said, I see him through a completely different lens. I'm not, you know, there's people that probably never heard of him until now.
00:26:09
Speaker
And for me, it's it's not like that. So I defend him and I don't, you know, worry about a lot of the things that people like you know and, you know, seem to worry about.
00:26:25
Speaker
Well, I have trouble with the idea that he wants to but help humanity. And the most obvious argument for that is that he said that he would solve world hunger, that he could afford to do it.
00:26:44
Speaker
And if someone showed him the numbers, that he would do it. and several organizations got together, including Amnesty International and the World Health Organization, and they got together a list of numbers, and it was well within his budget, and he changed his mind and reneged on ending world hunger.
00:27:06
Speaker
he literally could have ended world hunger, and he did not even try after telling everyone that he would do something. Okay, yeah, I...
00:27:20
Speaker
I looked into this a little bit last night cause knew this was coming and he actually does have some philanthropic initiatives going on. And part of it is related to that. ah You know, his brother is I think he has some restaurants and he's, he's into, you know, food for people. And I think they're working together and there's, there's,
00:27:44
Speaker
It's maybe not being talked about a lot, but I think there is stuff going on. ah Like I said, I can't defend everything he says or does.
00:27:56
Speaker
I can see why you'd latch on to that. I mean, I'm sorry. it it That's indefensible. You're not a good guy after you do that, and you're not trying to help humanity.
00:28:07
Speaker
Well, okay. ah You know, right now, he's talking about the concept of sustainable abundance. And, ah you know, it gets crazy because he's starting you know talking about robots and how they're going to all the work and nobody's going to have to do anything, but there'll be plenty of everything for everybody.
00:28:27
Speaker
It gets really... It's not for everybody, though. It's for rich people. Well, no, no, no, no. no I mean, that's... yeah he's not motivated by money.
00:28:37
Speaker
He's got, he's got no, seriously. I disagree. Well then disagree, but I don't see it that way. I don't think he's motivated by that. He's not, what he's doing now is costing him money. If anything, at this point, uh, he's really trying to make a difference for people. He's trying to make the government more efficient and save everybody some money. Now,
00:29:01
Speaker
I get that, you know there's no immediate results. And so everybody's freaking out about it. But I well there i think it's got to be more long term. What's that? There are immediate results to what he's doing in the government. And they're terrible.
00:29:14
Speaker
As you know, I have a relative who works for the IRS. Yeah. When they were told. that they all had to return to the office or be fired. One of her disabled coworkers died.
00:29:28
Speaker
They had a heart attack and died from the stress of being told that they were gonna lose a job that they had excelled at for decades.
00:29:39
Speaker
Because some idiot who isn't even from here that no one elected decided to haphazardly fire and change the work conditions of thousands and thousands of loyal government workers.
00:29:53
Speaker
okay I get that. I do. i hi it's ah ah It's not cut and dried, though, I don't think. and It's not?
00:30:05
Speaker
I don't think it is. I think there's a lot more ah nuance to all this than people want to consider. But I understand. Well, no, I would genuinely like to know what I'm not considering.
00:30:20
Speaker
If there's a facet of this that is beyond my knowledge or experience, beyond just common sense and how to run a business and things like that. I mean, if if there's more, i would like to know.
00:30:33
Speaker
but Well, each I think... Elon, as you know, is quite neurodivergent. As am I. I think he's detached from individual personhood in some way, you know, as far as like so-called caring about individuals, you know, like a situation like that. you know He's a sociopath.
00:31:00
Speaker
so see
00:31:03
Speaker
I mean, you're you're saying he lacks empathy, right? He does not have interpersonal connections. um that That is what a sociopath is. Okay. um What I'm saying is like empathy for individuals, maybe, but to be clear, I'm not arguing. I agree that he is a sociopath. I'm just yeah surprised to hear you say it.
00:31:23
Speaker
Well, i I didn't really say he's a sociopath, but he's ah
00:31:29
Speaker
ah he's a much more of a big picture thinker and i think and in the long run there's potential for his way of doing things to actually help out in the long run.
00:31:44
Speaker
I cannot deny that there's there's a lot of problems with all this. you know i didn't I didn't vote for this, just so you know. i i did not vote for Mr. Trump.
00:31:58
Speaker
ah But since he's there, and we all are stuck with it. I'm trying to
00:32:08
Speaker
be optimistically fatalistic about it. I mean, here it is. gotta, look, there's a lot of problems with that whole scene, I understand.
00:32:19
Speaker
But at the same time, there's a lot of people that I respect that feel differently. And I'm trying to listen to more of that because here we are. i mean, we're stuck with it. So I can be...
00:32:34
Speaker
miserable or I can be hopeful. So I choose the latter because I'm so old. I just don't have the energy to freak out about every little thing that's being said and very few of the things that are actually being done. So, you know, what can I say? I'm, I'm. Well, but you, you've said that he's not a Nazi and I'm legitimately flummoxed as to how one could arrive at that. king What do you think a Nazi is?
00:33:02
Speaker
Someone who throws up Nazi salutes. Oh, for fuck's sake. That was not a Nazi salute. God damn. Freaks me out when people think that. Really?
00:33:13
Speaker
Yeah, I don't believe that. One second.
00:33:18
Speaker
why why would he speak to it Why would he embrace Nazism? What is Nazism? His family money comes from slavery. Why wouldn't he His family money. I mean, decency, but yeah, that there, what? Of course, but their family money comes from apartheid and slavery.
00:33:38
Speaker
His dad was partially involved with an emerald mine. His dad as has his own problems and I'm not a big fan of him either, but, and neither was Elon for a lot of his life. I mean, i don't know if he still is or not, but ah He did not have a great relationship with his dad. He took off from after South Africa.
00:34:01
Speaker
Most of the people in the cabinet now, the like wife-beating, addicted, fascists, did not have good relationships with their dads. That's why they're like this. Well, right.
00:34:12
Speaker
I get that too, but...
00:34:17
Speaker
I don't know. You're talking to somebody who would have bet my last dollar that Don Jr. was going to turn out to be good. I believed it for most of my life. and And the so i I don't want to be spoken to as if I have just a knee-jerk hatred for these people that I've never considered.
00:34:36
Speaker
Because I was raised by conservative blue-collar rednecks. I did not see a black person in person until I was a teenager. Okay. Okay. So I am not like bleeding heart liberal. Oh, I hate Elon. Cause I CNN told me to, and that was a Nazi salute.
00:34:57
Speaker
There's no way that it was anything else. And he did it twice. two But he's not,
00:35:06
Speaker
Nazism as you know, we know it, you know, had a completely different agenda. And this isn't that. it' it there's there may You know, maybe it echoes. What do you think is different about the agenda, except that it targets a different minority?
00:35:29
Speaker
i don't think Elon is targeting any minorities. ah You don't think he's targeting trans people?
00:35:38
Speaker
He said that he was. Targeting? All right. I mean, yeah i know that's what's up with with his child. I know that gets complicated, too. oh look I can't defend everything he says or does. I get that.
00:35:52
Speaker
But I just think why you would defend anything he says or does, because there's nothing happening at any of his companies that wouldn't be happening without him there.
00:36:03
Speaker
Ah, that's not true. remarkets them and uses the work of other people. Ugh. I mean, we all thought it was cute and funny when he sold flamethrowers and called them not a flamethrower. Like, ooh, what a rebel. How fun. Edgy, edgy dude, bro.
00:36:20
Speaker
But the the shit that they're doing is is hurting people right now. And if you will pardon my saying so, you and I are very different people.
00:36:31
Speaker
in terms of how insulated we are from government goings on. You know, when, when Trump makes a bad call about healthcare, my literal life is endangered by that.
00:36:44
Speaker
When he tells people that DEI is optional and that I don't need a ramp to get in and out of my building that impacts me. Yup. I know. And it, it, uh, I mean,
00:36:57
Speaker
you know, I like you, you know, we're friends, right but it is galling to hear your plan to grin and bear it when what you're bearing is so very different than people that can't leave the country because they can't renew their passport because they're trans.
00:37:16
Speaker
And it's not because they're trans. It's because the government has decided to oppress trans people. i know it's look, I don't agree with that. I,
00:37:27
Speaker
I get it. I get it. I get it. I just don't know what to do about it myself. I'm not going to sell my car because of it.
00:37:39
Speaker
Well, has anyone asked you to sell your car? Well, I actually went to a Tesla protest a couple of weeks ago outside the Tesla dealership or the showroom that I got my car at. I just went up there to see what it was like. And, you know, they were saying, you know you should sell your car. And I'm like, well, who am i going to sell it to? Someone else that you're going to complain to? I mean, well what's the point of that?
00:38:04
Speaker
It doesn't hurt Elon. You know, and no, I mean, the point is that we all have to make those decisions for ourselves. You know, we all have to find those lines. You know, I'm not going to sit here. Like if you ask me whether or not I support slavery, i do not support slavery.
00:38:19
Speaker
Guess what? But guess what? I eat chocolate and I know that some of the chocolate that I eat must come from slavery because non-slavery chocolate costs a whole lot more. and Okay.
00:38:32
Speaker
So, you know, am I a terrible person because I, by eating chocolate, I support slavery. Some people would say yes. Some people would say, well, what are you going to do? Do without chocolate?
00:38:43
Speaker
You know, cell phones, computers, same thing. The labor practices are not good and we're not all collectively going to do without cell phones and that's how they get away with it. So I think that if you want to drive a Tesla, that's your choice.
Ethical Consumer Choices
00:38:59
Speaker
If you want to say it's good for the environment and that's worth it to me to support this company, then it is and stand by it. You know, and don't think that people necessarily have a right, like Jeff Bezos is a bad man.
00:39:13
Speaker
But I'm a disabled person who didn't drive even when my health was better. i get shit delivered. So I give Bezos a lot of money. Until pussed out on the election, subscribed to the Washington Post because i I think it's important to pay for good journalism.
00:39:31
Speaker
But after that shit, I couldn't. So it is not my point to judge you for decisions that you make. You know, i kept all my Harry Potter stuff. I didn't get rid of it when I got rid of some of it and I took it off display.
00:39:45
Speaker
You know, it no longer is a part of my aesthetic in my home, but I'm not going to burn my books. I'm not going to destroy things that I've already purchased just because one, the most, you know, the most prominent person associated with the franchise is terrible now.
00:40:03
Speaker
Cause you know what? Dan Radcliffe is still great. David Tennant's still great. Rupert Grint named his daughter Wednesday. i mean, I've got nothing bad to say about the bulk of the cast.
00:40:15
Speaker
Right. Oh yeah. I mean, we all, we got to decide where those lines are certainly. But, uh, the, the Nazis thought it was a Nazi salute and I have no reason to disagree with them.
00:40:29
Speaker
so I have a lot of reasons to disagree with Nazis, but um yeah yeah, I mean, you see what you want. You see what you want to see. You know, Nazis saw that and said, oh, good. He's part of us. You saw and said, oh, good. He's horrible. He's part of them.
00:40:42
Speaker
I look at and say, oh, he was expressing his love to the audience. You really bought that? I did. I do. So, you know, yeah we're going to have to agree to disagree at some point here because i Neither one of is gonna convince either of us of anything.
00:41:02
Speaker
And I'm really trying to convince you, but I am trying to, you know, maybe it makes me a less enlightened or something in your eyes, but you know, all I can say is, you know, how I feel about it.
00:41:17
Speaker
I mean, I'm um' legitimately baffled. I cannot imagine how someone could see that twice and not see it as as anything but what it was.
00:41:28
Speaker
I just, I can't say, I mean, and I'm not saying you have to explain it to me or justify it. I'm saying, I don't see what you're saying. I really don't. All right. Well, I. This might be a good time to move on, actually. Okay. Yeah. I'll just say that I, i did ask, well, I asked Grock, but you can ask g chat GPT or anybody, you know, and one of those things, just, just type in the question and see what they say about Elon being a Nazi.
00:41:54
Speaker
Grock said that Elon was one of the biggest spreaders of and misinformation on Twitter. Okay. Well, that's what Grok said. Okay. So ask Grok about whether Elon's a Nazi or not. and just, and I, I only check in at Twitter once a week, so I won't be able to do that for a few days, but, uh, Oh, you can just go right to Grok online.
00:42:16
Speaker
Oh, really? You don't have to go through? No, not anymore. At least not now. Interesting. That's what I did last night. I think it's weird that he could just steal that name too. I find that was sort of offensive.
00:42:30
Speaker
I thought it was great. but I thought it was very appropriate. I mean, you can steal name. Come on. Well, of course. What? That is a Heinlein word. headline I know that.
00:42:40
Speaker
I know that. That's one of my favorite novels, actually. Well, but, I mean, it's it's neat that he referenced it, but he just straight... it Because he's never mentioned it.
00:42:52
Speaker
Who has? never... Elon. Yes, he has. Yeah, I've heard him talk about it. I have. Really? Yeah, yeah. Now I'm going to look again because I did look for it at one point. There was an interview. He did not. He did an interview not too long ago and he did actually mention it.
00:43:08
Speaker
Well, that's that's slightly better. I will say that. Okay, you know, he has a Mars connection and he's he's trying doing unique and useful things with space flight.
00:43:20
Speaker
You know, his company rescued those astronauts. I mean, that was a thing, you know. So, you know, there's it's not all bad. And I don't disagree that there's some troubling things to be found here and there.
00:43:34
Speaker
But overall, big picture to me, it's I'd rather support him than not. so Here we go. So you've mentioned not necessarily being a big horror guy, but yet you're in one of my favorite horror movies from the 90s.
Role in The Last Broadcast
00:43:53
Speaker
ah All right. Well, I knew Stefan. um I got a job at a place called World Phone.
00:44:06
Speaker
And that's where I met Stefan. So what this place did was the guy that ran it was from India. And he had this business going where he would get horoscopes each week.
00:44:25
Speaker
And ah we would get cassettes of these horoscopes in like 12 different Indian languages. You know, there's several languages there, right?
00:44:37
Speaker
So we'd get a stack of cassettes and we would digitize them in a computer. We'd play the cassette into the computer and make a file, you know.
00:44:49
Speaker
So this week, you know, Aries in Gujarati is a file. um You know, Pisces in ah Hindi is another file. You know, so we'd have all these files of all the languages and all the horoscopes and we'd put them up in this server and he would advertise in India, call this number for your horoscope.
00:45:12
Speaker
And it was a number in the U S. So the idea was that he generated so many long distance minutes for AT&T that they gave him a kickback and that was his revenue stream.
00:45:26
Speaker
Wow. Isn't that crazy? Yeah, it is. So my job was to sit there and, digitize these files and you know sort them out and put them where they needed to go. And Stefan was doing the same thing. And there was like three or four of us in this little office doing this.
00:45:42
Speaker
And so we all got to be friends. And then at that time, Stefan was working on his first movie called The Game. Did you ever hear about that or know anything about it?
00:45:56
Speaker
The Game, like the Michael Douglas movie? It's the same title. Actually, we changed the name because of that. money It ended up being called The Money Game. and It was about these young guys that figured out how to counterfeit money and they got involved with some ah mobsters or something. it was it was a cool story and it was fun. and I worked on that movie. I did the sound for it.
00:46:20
Speaker
and We spent you know like a month shooting it and then editing it. ah He was editing it at home on a, he had this giant flatbed film editor in his bedroom in this house that he had for like a month doing, you know, editing this thing.
00:46:37
Speaker
And so that's how I know him. And that's how, ah you know, he, we, you know, we're friends and he was doing this new project and he thought that I would be good for the forensic pathologist. So,
00:46:53
Speaker
ah he sent me like an email, I guess, with some information about what this guy would know and how he, you know, what what he was adding to the the story of that movie.
00:47:07
Speaker
And so they came over and set up a camera in my office. I had to put on a jacket and tie, which I never wear. That was my house. Yep. I think they liked my messy office look. Yeah.
00:47:21
Speaker
And ah so I just sort ad-libbed all the information they needed to convey. And they were there for like, you know, maybe an hour. And they left. I was never involved with any other aspect of the production.
00:47:37
Speaker
Okay. And it do you know if that is the case for anybody else? I mean, do you have any like inside dish about that? Because it seems like it. All of the performances seem very natural.
00:47:49
Speaker
but then you look at the cast and it's all people that aren't actors. None of them have ever been in anything else that could see. Right. Well, he was like, um, the, a few of the people were just, you know, other friends of his and he would just, I think he did the same thing. He'd tell them pretty much what they need to say and they would just sort of ad lib it.
00:48:13
Speaker
Um, So, and I didn't really know any of them except for Stefan. And I sort of knew Lance, who was his partner in crime on that film.
00:48:25
Speaker
ah But the other guys were in it. I never really met. Maybe Mark Rubley I might've met, but ah the rest of them, I just, you know, we never interacted because it my only association with that film was they came to my house for an hour.
00:48:41
Speaker
Wow. That is wild. Because, I mean, I know people that make small films, and we usually end up, like, you go on set, and everybody's just there, hanging out, because most of them are friends anyway, and they're partners or whatever. Well, that was that's what was like for that first one, the money game.
00:49:01
Speaker
But for this one, you know, was at least for my part, it was it wasn't like that. But, um you know, that... Movie was also history-making in a way because it was the first thing that was ever like digitally released. Did you know about that?
00:49:16
Speaker
Not really. I encountered it because I was managing for Hollywood Video. So you saw it on video? Yeah, it was an exclusive there, so we had it on VHS. Okay, well, i I think what they were trying to do is how have like digital distribution for theaters back when that it wasn't really a thing. So he sort of...
00:49:37
Speaker
I think he pioneered that concept at the time. Yeah, well, that would make sense because I know that it took longer for but it.
00:49:49
Speaker
Like the the tricky part is that at the time, smaller theaters didn't necessarily have digital projectors yet because they were expensive. And so it was something that the bigger chains had and the bigger chains are going to be less likely to pick up independent films.
00:50:06
Speaker
You know, because they're big chains and they make all their money from concessions and not the films itself. So you got to get the people in the seats buying food. Right. That's why movies for stoners do so much better. Because for the theater, they they love us.
00:50:25
Speaker
Okay. So did you end up doing like any of the promotional stuff? No. No, no. I went to premiere of it, I think in Philadelphia.
00:50:37
Speaker
or Okay. And let's see, you would have got to meet everybody. Cause I'm sorry, but the villain, I don't want to like give it away, but the villain in that movie is so spooky.
00:50:47
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. ah I mean, speaking of sociopaths, my goodness. Yeah. That was, that was, that was a great story. And, uh, so I like it.
Comparing Film Innovations
00:50:58
Speaker
And I think for for viewers or listeners that they don't know, the last broadcast actually got really eclipsed by the Blair Witch Project.
00:51:07
Speaker
And I would say as someone who has seen both of them lots of times, I think the last broadcast is the superior film. It makes the most sense. It has fewer glaring errors.
00:51:19
Speaker
um Because the last broadcast, the thing about the Blair Witch is that It's about three people that went into the woods to do a project. And we are to believe that one of them forgot that they had an entire pack of cigarettes.
00:51:37
Speaker
It's not possible. It simply isn't. Because the real story is the director felt bad for them. for the cast because the shooting conditions were so difficult that he gave them a pack of cigarettes and just had the character say oh i forgot i had an extra thing that insults my intelligence as a viewer and a smoker that's fine i don't know smoke cigarettes now but back in the day i did i smoked camelites in my 20s oh boy yeah well um filters they were the light ones
00:52:09
Speaker
The last broadcast was actually produced first, you know, before Blair Witch. And I don't know if there's any real speculation about anything nefarious going on with those people as far as co-opting something that was already there. but No, I wouldn't think so. I wouldn't think so. But, you know.
00:52:32
Speaker
yeah but like Spaghetti got invented in two different parts of the world around the same time. and Right, there you go. so it's not like early theft I just wouldn't want anyone to think Stefan saw the Blair Witch said, oh I got an idea.
00:52:46
Speaker
ah wasn't it wasn't like that at all. I wouldn't think so. i would not think so. um but but Do you know like whatever happened to Jim Seward? because i I can't find any trace of him online.
00:53:00
Speaker
I don't know. And I've looked. Because at the time, i did I was sure I heard he was coming out with an album. And I was fully prepared to purchase it and never found it.
00:53:12
Speaker
Huh. Well, he might be using a different name or something. i can ask Stefan. Please. Please. Because I must have asked him at some point, but he didn't say.
00:53:22
Speaker
okay. Okay. All right. So when we did your pre-interview questionnaire, yeah you described yourself as uninterestingly neurotypical.
Neurotypical Outlook and Creativity
00:53:32
Speaker
Yeah.
00:53:33
Speaker
Well, I mean, from where I'm sitting, like everyone I know either has occasional depression or anxiety. They're on the spectrum. They've lived with trauma. Um, it's so I, that what, what you've got going is, is actually pretty exotic from where I'm back.
00:53:51
Speaker
You know, like how, how is that going? Well, i mean, so far so good. i i keep it together for the most part. I really am. I mean, I've been pretty well blessed in a lot of ways in my life, you know, both you materially and and emotionally and even physically, I guess. I mean, nothing terrible has happened to me, but...
00:54:18
Speaker
Now, I have been the only sober person at a party full of drunks, and I find it irksome. Is there like a mental health equivalent to that, where you just feel like you're surrounded by crazy people?
00:54:32
Speaker
oh well, not in a bad way. I mean, i you know, um,
00:54:45
Speaker
i I understand that everybody has their struggles and I feel bad about it. I have family members that have struggled with addiction I've been, you know, spared from all that.
00:54:59
Speaker
ah I haven't had any real bouts of depression. I got a good, solid relationship at home. i got two great kids and you know Obviously, there's going to be things here and there where you're worried about things for whatever reason, but I'm not suffering from any you know crippling depression or anything because of anything.
00:55:24
Speaker
ah I'm not... ah I don't know. I guess compared to a lot of people, I'm in pretty good shape. Now, what I wonder is...
00:55:37
Speaker
For a lot of people that have some of the conditions that I was describing earlier, um creative work is is a necessary
Detached Creativity
00:55:47
Speaker
outlet. And it's something that we use to to process a lot of the things that make us stand out from the population at large, ah you know mentally and emotionally. So is that is any of that a factor for you? Are you like working through things with the work?
00:56:05
Speaker
ah
00:56:10
Speaker
not Really? i mean, I guess mostly I just like to play with words. And that's my motivation for writing, whether it's a story or a song.
00:56:25
Speaker
ah But and i i I wouldn't say it's like that. and In fact, that's maybe some of the stuff I write isn't genuine enough because I don't have that.
00:56:42
Speaker
I don't know. um I mean, is that is that why it's detached? Maybe. Maybe so. Yeah, yeah. That's good insight there. I don't know.
00:56:53
Speaker
um I guess, you know. ah Because, yeah, when when i read I read things, because some of the things that you've written are, I mean, there's bad things that happen to people that don't necessarily seem to deserve bad things.
00:57:09
Speaker
Mm-hmm. And yet it is written with a detachment that like, you know, I, obviously when you read something, you think about how you might write it if it were you. And I always think of like, you know, like I wish he was hitting that emotional spot. I wish that that was grounded in something that we already knew about the character. Like, you know, the, the stuff that makes a story rip your heart out.
Emotional Depth in Writing
00:57:33
Speaker
And, and I was saying that to H at one point and H said, uh,
00:57:37
Speaker
you know, not everybody wants to rip people's hearts out. yeah Like, well, what? well why why? What are we here for? What are we doing this for? Because, you know, like to me, if you're not feeling it and relating to it with every ounce of yourself, what are you even doing here?
00:57:56
Speaker
Like, what is, what's the point of that? Because for me, everything is a coping mechanism. Everything I read, everything I watch, all of it is like, You know, it's it's all mentally and emotionally related to my life and and things that I've, you know, which isn't to say like, you know, Tony Soprano reminds me of when I used to be in the mob, because that's not the case.
00:58:20
Speaker
But, you know, the the things that are relatable, the the family strife, the frustration and co-workers and, you know, all that there. so I just wonder what it's like to be, I mean, that's kind of why you're here.
00:58:35
Speaker
but why why a self-described sane person would be involved in the arts. Like, what is that like? How is it different? And it seems like it is different. Like, the desperation isn't there.
00:58:47
Speaker
Right. And so, yeah, most of my writing is not does not come from pain. um So I did mention the ah a third novel that I've stopped working on, but...
Novel Idea: Communicating with Past Selves
00:59:05
Speaker
That came from the idea of... all right, so when I was 12 years old, I broke my leg going to the bathroom, um which actually means I was walking towards the boys' room at summer camp, and I fell and snapped my femur, and that was very painful.
00:59:27
Speaker
And that was, you know, the biggest trauma I've had in my life. And I, I got through it and here I am. But, uh, about 10 years ago, i got the idea of writing a story about the idea of being able to talk to your former selves in different ways.
00:59:50
Speaker
And, uh, so I actually came up with this concept of being,
00:59:59
Speaker
dimensionally diminished so that all of your, each day of your life is happening at the same time.
01:00:09
Speaker
So this character goes to this place where all his former daily iterations are all in the same place and they can all talk to each other. And each one of them that's there only has experience from before they got there.
01:00:26
Speaker
other than talking to the new people that come in. So it's like a progression of, you know, a person's life all interacting. And one of the central characters is the 12 year old self who had broken his leg and he made a deal with God or the devil or whoever to,
01:00:48
Speaker
with the idea in mind that, look, I don't ever want to have that dynamic pain again. was terrible. Here's what I'll do. I'll suffer through little minor discomforts every day for the rest of my life, as long as I don't have to have anything severely happen to me like that again.
01:01:07
Speaker
So it's kind of a weird concept, but I was running with it. And I think... yeah I've sort of taken that to heart because it's sort of worked out that way. You know I always have some little thing that's bothering me and then that goes away. And then before you know it, something else happens, you know, like um muscle a muscle ache or tooth or whatever.
01:01:28
Speaker
But I think that that same concept also applies to me emotionally where I don't have a lot of highs and lows of emotion But I just sort of have this burbling of like, I'm okay. You know, sometimes I'm a little depressed. Sometimes I'm happy.
01:01:50
Speaker
But I'm never really like ecstatic or or horribly depressed. So I've just become, you know, mediocre. Yeah, I was on a medication that made me like that once.
01:02:04
Speaker
Really? But I stopped taking it because I couldn't get any writing done.
01:02:11
Speaker
Interesting. Wow. that I just realized that. Yeah, because it was when I was writing, i was writing Kiss Me Like You Love Me, my my serial killer book, and I couldn't figure out how to end it because I wasn't sure what the theme was.
01:02:26
Speaker
And I couldn't, I just couldn't get there mentally. Like I couldn't figure out what the the point is, what I was actually saying with the book, because it's, you know, it's a pretty good story. And It's got point of view stuff from the, like half of it is POV of the serial killer.
01:02:45
Speaker
And it's gross because he's killing like young teenage girls for sexy, sex not sexy, but sexual reasons. blood okay And it's, it's a rough read in that way.
01:02:59
Speaker
And there has to be a reason to put the reader
Impact of Medication on Creativity
01:03:02
Speaker
through it. And I couldn't decide exactly what, I mean, because the point is about, you know, having empathy and paying attention and realizing that even though situations seem messed up and hopeless and and you're detached from them, you still have to do something. You still have a responsibility to to take the steps that basically...
01:03:23
Speaker
when there's a serial killer and they're going out about their business, a million different people had opportunities to, to stop things from progressing and they didn't do it for reasons that seem reasonable.
01:03:35
Speaker
Like that's the theme of the book. But I wasn't clear on whether or not the killer should live or die and whether or not they should learn anything from it. And that was the part that I was stuck on.
01:03:49
Speaker
And I ended up cold turkey in my meds and having like just a full on breakdown. And it was not good, but I did finish the book and it's a great ending. It is a wonderful ending, but I sacrificed my mental health for it.
01:04:03
Speaker
And so I, yeah, I had to promise H I would never do that again. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Well, ah yeah, i guess I've never really ah properly suffered for my art.
01:04:19
Speaker
Well, I don't know that it's required, but I will say that I have very much romanticized that bullshitty, like, my suffering is what makes my art.
01:04:31
Speaker
And I'm sure that it's possible. like I mean, there are plenty of writers whose work I admire that do have you know characters that are torment tormented or really brave because of their trauma or You know, like, as far as I know, John Mayberry, for example, is not is not someone who lives with mental illness. Like, maybe he is, I don't know.
01:04:54
Speaker
But i I don't know that he is. Like, if he is, it's not obvious. And that's actually one of the things that I have issues with on the show, because thematically, do invite people that are neurodivergent, or they have some sort of mental illness, they're, you know, they're they've lived through addiction and recovery or, you know, trauma. So if people are not already outspoken about those things and I don't know them personally, i haven't found the right way to say, Hey, are you a wackadoo of some sort?
01:05:30
Speaker
Because we talk about wackadoo-lory on my show. Please come on You know, I don't know what the polite way is to, to go about it. And I, I worry that I'll be offending people because, uh,
01:05:44
Speaker
Because Brian Keene never hit me back. so Oh, well, ah yeah. ah From what I've seen of the way you present yourself, I don't see anyone would be have a problem with it unless, you know, they they just have a problem with it. and that's part of their problem. so Well, but, you know, that guy called me a terrorist.
01:06:06
Speaker
So some people obviously have... have Wait, did you did you hear about this? No, who called you a terror? for I mean, for why? He said I was terrorizing him because I joked about something that we had talked about earlier. And I guess he didn't remember that we had joked about it or something.
01:06:22
Speaker
And he told a bunch of people that I was terrorizing him. okay. It was crazy. It was somebody who was on the show. And, yeah, it was nuts. That was a while ago now, a couple months ago. That sounds like ah an element of paranoia or something, maybe, as part of the whole scene.
01:06:43
Speaker
it It turned out that, actually, one of the all these people started contacting me after it happened, like you know DMing me and saying... Oh, I guess it's your turn. I guess, like, you've arrived. Because now that, you know, he, like, has done that with so many people, just, like, taken an errant comment and multiplied it into some crazy, twisted, like...
01:07:07
Speaker
you know, but bunch of accusations and he'd apparently done it to a whole bunch of people. And then, you know, I didn't know that because when I met him, he was saying that somebody had just screwed him over really bad and they were trying to ruin him. And I was like, Oh no, why don't you come on my show and talk about it? You can set the record straight. And then like, you know, a month or two after that, he did that to me.
01:07:28
Speaker
was like, Oh yeah, that's kind of sad. and Actually. It's not your crazy exes. It's your crazy. You know, ha yeah Yeah.
01:07:40
Speaker
So, you know, like when you find out that everybody is, you know, like you have your friend and they had a crazy ex, but then it turns out all their exes were crazy. And then you realize, no, no, it it was him. Actually, it was him the whole time.
01:07:56
Speaker
So, um, You have a song for us, I am told, that you are going to sing live. and We've never had a live music performance on the show. We usually check it on the end, but you're going to do it live. We'll try this.
01:08:09
Speaker
If it doesn't come out good, you can edit it out. oh this is about okay This is just a little thing I've been playing around. I think, you know, lyrics need some work or whatever, but I just want to play it because I like playing it.
01:08:23
Speaker
Okay, cool. Okay. ah Is there a title? Tentatively, I'm calling it, where did the time go?
01:08:33
Speaker
Okay. I'm
01:08:36
Speaker
going to take off my headphones for this so I can hear what I'm doing. So I'll be right back, but I'm still here. Okay.
01:08:46
Speaker
Okay.
01:08:50
Speaker
Oh, no.
01:08:54
Speaker
Open the door and let us in It's time for
01:09:19
Speaker
Come over here and tell me about what's going on.
01:09:26
Speaker
Nobody cares what you've done. Nobody knows where you've been. You've got to present in a way they will remember.
01:09:39
Speaker
It's not who you were, but who you They need to see.
01:09:48
Speaker
This place needs to be livened up I've got some magic in my cup What do you say we both go insane for a while Close your eyes and let it find you Pretty soon colors could talk We went outside for walk Why do we go Why do we go anywhere?
01:10:23
Speaker
Time's on our side for now, but it won't always be there. Then what do we do with the time you have left?
01:10:44
Speaker
Time is the school in which we learn And time is the fire in which we burn But I still believe in love life
01:11:09
Speaker
Yay! So yeah, i I don't know. Somehow that just sort of came to me. went to a play with my wife, and the director of the play wrote this whole long ah director's notes about this show. It had something to do with time travel.
01:11:33
Speaker
And at the very end of what she wrote, is a quote from somebody named Delmore Schwartz. And that's the the time is the school in which we learn and time is the fire in which we burn. ah That stuck with me. So I decided to write something around it.
01:11:49
Speaker
Okay. All right, I get it. so So, yeah, hold on a second. I gotta, hold on, I gotta detach myself here.
Psychedelia in Therapy and Creativity
01:12:00
Speaker
it's Okay.
01:12:02
Speaker
but but Okay, I'm back. All right. So what about psychedemia? Oh, okay. ah Yeah, you mentioned nine per, it has nothing to do with that. I don't know okay why you thought that, but.
01:12:17
Speaker
Well, the the premise seems similar because that's, night have you did you watch or read? I watched the trailer. looked pretty disturbing, actually. ah We're talking about nine perfect strangers. i I knew nothing about that. Psychedemia is a documentary.
01:12:33
Speaker
and it was an actual conference that took place at the university of Pennsylvania about 13 years ago. and they gathered together all these, um, educators and doctors and people that were using psychedelics as part of therapy and people that are studying the, you know, effects and usefulness of these substances. And they're,
01:13:01
Speaker
There were artists there talking about how it influenced that. There was doctors talking about how it's used in various kinds of psychotherapy. um And it was fascinating. And it was, I think it was the first time they did this. I think they've done it a couple of times since.
01:13:21
Speaker
But there's ah there's a whole community out there people that are really studying this stuff. and think that it's, you know, can be useful if, you know, done carefully and properly.
01:13:35
Speaker
So that's what that was about. And it came out really good. My son and I worked on that together. His friends were the people running this thing. And he and I produced it and shot it and edited it.
01:13:48
Speaker
And it was it was a great experience. And it came out really well, I think. so i think i'm a great fan and proponent of that i use mushrooms uh microdose mushrooms yeah various things i use them short term i don't do it all the time but yeah when i'm when i'm like working on mental and emotional things in particular i'm very interested in that curious about i'm a little trepidatious i i did some
01:14:20
Speaker
stuff in college and I never really liked it. I had friends that were like into the whole scene, but it... Well, you know, recreational as opposed to microdosing, or it's a world of difference.
01:14:31
Speaker
Yeah, I assume it is. i don't I don't know how much of an effect a microdose would have, but I guess I should try to find out sometime. Well, so I would never say on the show that I would hook you up, but... No, I get it. We've talked about it before, but ah Does it last a long time?
01:14:52
Speaker
It can. I mean, because actually, if I microdose in the morning, by the time i like it's dinner time and I eat dinner, I'm not really feeling it feeling it after that. So it's all day, basically.
01:15:06
Speaker
It can be, yeah. yeah But like if you take mushrooms... they tend to, like if you're tripping on them, they tend to last less time than lsd Because LSD is like a solid 12 hours before you start coming down.
01:15:23
Speaker
Whereas I think mushrooms closer to like a day at the office, like eight, seven, eight hours. No break. No break. man
01:15:35
Speaker
All right. Let's see. I'm just looking over my notes, making sure that we got to everything.
Celebrity Encounters in TV
01:15:41
Speaker
You actually describe yourself as having a couple of brushes with greatness. Other than Joe London, because you did mention that. But like, who else?
01:15:50
Speaker
Right. Well, you know, I worked with Howard Stern. That was fun. and Wait, did you work with him when he was still a complete dick? Because I don't really remember where he was at that point in his journey. Oh, back then, yeah, most people considered a complete dick, but I knew him when he was not being his persona.
01:16:09
Speaker
I mean, even then, was still, you know, but I've definitely caught glimpses of him being like a normal person and yeah because i mean back in the day he was really the the foreshadowing of of like the programming that we have now like the charlie kirk the joe rogan yeah all that that crap yeah that the whole like hey let's treat women badly they love that and then you guys were like oh my god really one one day my wife came there because she was in the area for something else and
01:16:41
Speaker
She got to meet She was afraid to meet him because she didn't know what, you know, how he would treat her or anything. But he was really nice to her. And she was pleasantly surprised. he He was so nice.
01:16:53
Speaker
When you say nice, do you mean he was polite or like he was genuine? Well, he was polite. ah It was funny because she had just been at a photography seminar. That's why she was up there.
01:17:07
Speaker
And that day he happened to be doing a skit where he was going to be a fashion photographer. And so my wife said something to him about, you know, and you might want to tell some of these girls when you photograph them to turn a little bit sideways because it'll make him make them look a little thinner.
01:17:27
Speaker
i guess that was a tip she had just picked up. And so she said that to him and then he used that in his skit. So I thought that was pretty funny. I see.
01:17:37
Speaker
So, but yeah, no, he was, he was nice to her and he was generally ah nice guy. mean, fool around. Like I, I, my job was Mike everybody. So I'd go into his dressing room and I have a belt pack that I'd put on the back of his pants.
01:17:53
Speaker
And every time I did that, it accused me of trying to feel his ass or something, you know, just silly little comments like that. But ah he's actually, generally ah ah ah nice guy, I think. And i haven't listened to him very lately, but in the past few years, I know he's done some really insightful interviews with people and he's, you know, he's a thoughtful guy. Yeah. I mean, he certainly seems different now than he did when I,
01:18:20
Speaker
yeah well you see I saw the movie Private Parts in the theater. I swear I am not making this up. I went with my friend Lydia. and because she She had wanted to see it. I was not particularly into that.
01:18:35
Speaker
um But it was it was her turn to pick. Because when it was my turn to pick, I think right around that time, i picked the what turned out to be like the worst Batman movie ever. oh And it was the one with Poison Ivy in it. And she was so terrible. Like it was just the whole movie was so bad.
01:18:52
Speaker
And so I was like, okay. And i had to sit through private parts and in front of us, like two rows in front of us, there were four dudes and they left an empty seat in between each one of them.
01:19:04
Speaker
And I did not, I was like, Oh, they must be waiting for their dates. But they, they were not waiting for their dates. They were doing, um, you know, the the no homo thing. They had to make sure everybody knew that they weren't weren't dating.
01:19:21
Speaker
you know just And yeah, that was a thing at that time. and Just this homophobic thing of putting a seat in between each one of you. I'm like, oh wow. And it's a Howard Stern movie. I get it.
01:19:35
Speaker
Okay. So, man, I never forgot that. Do you know what movies that didn't happen UHF. a jeff I call the nerd movies, Batman movies. People can just like, yeah, I don't know that, that whole toxic masculinity thing. Okay. um So was there anything that we did not talk about that you wanted to talk about?
01:20:01
Speaker
ah
01:20:04
Speaker
I don't think so. ah I mean, just you're asking about, brushes with greatness. I did, you know, when I was at the view, we had a lot of musicians there.
01:20:17
Speaker
oh okay. And so that was fun. ah You know, I got to meet Ringo was there and wow Tony Bennett. You know, I just heard that Zach Starkey got fired from the who did you hear that? No, I didn't.
01:20:30
Speaker
Yeah. I just found fire a few days ago. Yeah. I don't know anything beyond that, yeah but I read it online and made a mental note to look it up. And then I forgot until just now. Well, I can't imagine why he would get fired unless he wasn't crazy enough.
01:20:47
Speaker
Well, he's been with them forever. I mean, when saw The Who, the last time I saw The Who, I was still living in my mom's house. So that would have been about five years before I met H. Oh, gosh. And my boyfriend at the time took me to Pine Knob to see The Who, and I was like,
01:21:04
Speaker
And i've I actually recognized him. I'm like, I did not know this, but I think that's Zach Starkey playing drums for the Who. And then, you know, later on they introduce everybody. So yeah. yeah How about that?
01:21:16
Speaker
um So yeah, that was, that was, you know, fun meeting guys like that. I said, Tony Bennett, my favorite personally was getting to meet Alanis Morissette.
01:21:29
Speaker
Oh, is she cool in person? Yeah. I mean, she was, I, I just always loved her songs and her music and it was good to get to, you know, meet her. I know when I say meet these people, i don't talk to them. I mean, like, is your monitor okay? You need anything? You know, it's not like I'm conversing, but it was still nice to, you know, be in the presence of some of these people.
01:21:51
Speaker
Well, sometimes it doesn't take very long to notice if somebody is a rude ass. Oh yeah. You know, the, The country acts we had, and they were always the nicest people. And then we had, think we had Britney Spears and her crew were just assholes, you know, but the the country people were much more chill and that was fun.
01:22:16
Speaker
Okay. All right.
01:22:20
Speaker
Yeah. I always hoped that Alanis would turn out to be cool in real life. Cause I always liked Alanis and I always really liked Liz Phair. And I don't like Liz Ferrer now as much as I did in the 90s.
01:22:34
Speaker
I try not to throw around the word sellout because it's actually two words. But yeah, I don't. I mean, you know, I mean, not not a sellout on the level of like LL Cool J or anything, but still kind of a bit of a sellout to us ladies.
01:22:52
Speaker
Um, so, you know, I also like to give guests a chance to ask me something
Exploring Mental Health and Resilience
01:22:57
Speaker
if they want to. So is there anything you want to ask me?
01:23:02
Speaker
Um, yeah. Okay. Um, are you okay?
01:23:12
Speaker
Um, no. Not really. mean, you know, my day to day is all right, but I'm, I'm pretty confident that this is the year I'm going to die.
01:23:25
Speaker
Oh, like pretty confident. Although I got approved for the medical charity thing that, uh, you know, so they're going to cover my, like, we won't go broke for medical bills this year.
01:23:36
Speaker
ah Good. Yeah. Well, yeah, we got it in 2022. Cause remember I got really sick. And then we got that hospital bill for $149,000. And forty nine thousand dollars and it it's funny too, because our insurer is UHC.
01:23:52
Speaker
So a couple months ago, I woke up one day and checked the news and was like, oh my God, H, the of her insurance company got got shot to death. And he's like, oh, yeah, I could see that. Oh, geez.
01:24:06
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So we applied for the program again, because I need to have a thing for my heart. It turns out that like, I had apnea.
01:24:17
Speaker
I was born with obstructive apnea, but it wasn't treated until I was 37. And one of the impacts of that is that my heart is like wrong. And in addition to like, you know, but some other health problems, and then like also but like led to like weight gain and, ah the you know, the things that that exacerbates and,
01:24:38
Speaker
It's a whole rich tapestry. So I got to have like a procedure. But I don't know, man. I'm one of these people that anytime anything decent happens to me, I'm sure I'm going to die. Like I never thought we would make it back alive for our honeymoon.
01:24:53
Speaker
I was positive that we would be a story where we like died tragically on the road trip back from Chicago. Oh, gosh. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, I'm mentally ill. but Yeah.
01:25:06
Speaker
but Like, it isn't just that it's also, it's, you know, the, the lifetime of trauma, like the things that happened to you in your formative, formative years, you kind of low key expect those things for the entire rest of your life.
01:25:21
Speaker
Like I've been living with H for over 25 years at this point. And it still strikes me someday that that just like, that nobody screams at me in my home. Nobody raises their hand to me in my home. I'm still not like used to it, you know?
01:25:39
Speaker
so yeah no, I mean, as a general rule, no, I'm i'm absolutely not okay. Plus like I do all these projects and everybody that sees my projects or reads one of my books or listens to my show says, wow, you're really good at this. And I go, oh my God, what? Thank you.
01:25:56
Speaker
And I'm never sure if they're just being nice. because i don't really get any notice, which is a nice thing. It's nice to not get any notice because I can say whatever the fuck I want and nobody knows.
01:26:09
Speaker
I just called Elon Musk a Nazi. If he doesn't think he's a Nazi, he might sue me for that. like But that's also the nice thing about being poor. It's like, you're going to sue me for what? I got a tank full of lizards and a five-year-old computer.
01:26:23
Speaker
is it at god i wouldn't even be worth it to send a car to pick it up. Well, but But thank you for asking though. Yeah. Well, I, you know, or did you mean because I had the flu last week?
01:26:36
Speaker
No, I meant in general. Okay.
Show's Purpose: Giving a Voice
01:26:40
Speaker
I know you've, you've had a lot of struggles and I just wanted to see how you are in general. Cause I mean, that's kind of why we do the show is so that people can give voice to those things and and explain like how it it goes.
01:26:57
Speaker
But I can relate to you. You know, not feeling noticed or, I don't know, appreciated or whatever. i got the same You know, like like I said, the story of that one book where every time I try to get someone to read it, something would happen.
01:27:13
Speaker
And and then you lost it. No, no, I want to be clear. I did not lose it. H does this weird thing he calls cleaning.
01:27:23
Speaker
No, it's like all the stuff that's where I put it and he puts it to a different place that he calls out of the way.
Humorous Anecdotes and Games
01:27:32
Speaker
And don't where the fuck out of the way is. Well, that's where I belong, bunch my stuff is there.
01:27:37
Speaker
And one day I will discover it. Okay. So it's it's in this apartment. and And H will eventually remember where he put it. Okay.
01:27:49
Speaker
Well, good. So so it's it's time for the Mad Lib. Are you ready for this? Oh, sure. Okay, good. Let me get my pen. So you you know Mad Libs. I don't have to explain any of this, right?
01:28:00
Speaker
Okay, so we're going to start with a bunch of nouns. Holy crap, I need one, two, three, four, five, six, seven singular nouns. Oh, okay, you're doing it that way.
01:28:13
Speaker
Do all the nouns first. yeah i want yeah Okay, no, i never did it that way. That's cool. ah Singular nouns? ah Okay. Hmm.
01:28:27
Speaker
Okay, tiger. are Rubber ball.
01:28:34
Speaker
um
01:28:38
Speaker
Shake weight.
01:28:42
Speaker
um Teacup.
01:28:48
Speaker
Oil can. How many more we need? ah Two. Okay, ah bowling ball.
01:28:59
Speaker
And, uh, let's see. One more. Graham cracker.
01:29:09
Speaker
All right. And, uh, one, two, three plural nouns. Plural nouns. Oh, okay. Um, chickens,
01:29:25
Speaker
uh,
01:29:30
Speaker
Okay, hold on, spacing out here. Just looking around for nouns here. Pillows.
01:29:40
Speaker
And...
01:29:48
Speaker
Screwdrivers.
01:29:53
Speaker
Should we think of the tool or the drink? Oh, ah let's go with the drink. ah Adjective. Adjective. Incorrigible.
01:30:05
Speaker
ah How many of these do we need? i don't know. I'm just going down the rest. a Part of the body. Oh, part of the body. Nostril.
01:30:17
Speaker
A verb, past tense. Um...
01:30:27
Speaker
Drove.
01:30:32
Speaker
Okay. And a verb ending in ing. ah Cooking. Two adjectives. Two more adjectives.
01:30:46
Speaker
Pickled.
01:30:49
Speaker
And flagrant.
01:30:54
Speaker
And finally, a place. ah place. ah Like a location? I mean a geographical place or a... Your call.
01:31:06
Speaker
Okay, bowling alley. Bowling alley. Okay, cool. So this is called Playin' by the Rules.
01:31:18
Speaker
Uh-oh. We all know the basic rules of baseball. Each team tries to hit the tiger and score as many chickens as possible. However, there are many incorrigible rules that even a knowledgeable rubber ball might not know.
01:31:37
Speaker
For example, there's the infield shake weight rule, which states that when a player hits a pop teacup into the infield, there are pillows on base, and that player is automatically out.
01:31:53
Speaker
The umpire... throws his nostril into the air and shouts, Infield fly, oil can out. Another lesser known rule of baseball is the drove third strike rule.
01:32:08
Speaker
The rule is used when the catcher fails to catch a bowling ball for a third strike. The umpire shouts, Graham Cracker still in play. The batter cooking as fast as he can all the way to the bowling alley.
01:32:24
Speaker
Now that you know the pickled rules, you can go out into the ballpark and impress all of your screwdrivers with your flagrant knowledge. Oh, my God.
01:32:37
Speaker
Yeah, see, mad lips. Oh, okay. Well. I love those. Very silly. Thank you. Yes. Well, of course, we always like to end on a silly note when we can.
01:32:47
Speaker
Good. You know, i mean, the mad lib rarely turns deadly serious. Yeah. yeah Well, Van, thank you for being here. it was great to have you. I knew it would be.
01:32:59
Speaker
um
Season Finale Announcement
01:33:00
Speaker
Thank you. And i want to let listeners know that this is actually our season three finale. I'm going to be taking a break for a couple of weeks and getting the new issue of the magazine out.
01:33:11
Speaker
If you want to follow us, we are on Ko-Fi. That's K-O-F-I slash sometimes hilarious horror. ah Sometimes hilarious horror. is a quarterly fiction mag, and boy do we have some great stuff coming up.
01:33:26
Speaker
Bunch of new writers you've probably never heard of that have great stories to share. So check that out, and we will see everybody next season.