BBBC Reads Ward - Episode 5

Transcript

Speaker: you

Speaker: And we're live. Welcome back everyone.

Speaker: Good evening. Megalopolis. I don't have a good intro for this. i was about to say, what was that?

Speaker: Good evening. evening. That's the the tired, ri the tired reporter from Brockton Bay is like, Good evening, whatever this place is called.

Speaker: Good evening, citizens of the city formerly known as Brockton Bay. I'm your host, Chuck Manley. With us tonight, we are in our 238th day under siege by the Undeciders.

Speaker: The city has condemned, and they're wondering if they should pull a raccoon city and just nuke us. Yeah. It was on the table. ah Is that a Resident Evil reference?

Speaker: Yes, that is a Resident Evil reference. We have been declared an HOSV. What that is? Find out tonight on the Brockton Bay Book Club. da that that ah but but but ah Anyway, hungry club this is ah podcast ah where we essentially are just live streaming us doing our book club that we would be normally doing. But, you know,

Speaker: It's a fun community, so we've got other people involved now. um I'm your one of your hosts, Alan. We have Hannah. Say, and we need voice.

Speaker: Oh, hi. Hello. Yes, my mic works. can you ever all We have audio-only listeners sometimes. Oh, that's right. I'm sorry. I forget. I did i do forget about the audio-only people. my apologies to the Spotify's and the Apple podcast, etc. Cheers.

Speaker: Nick, for those who can't see, Jacob looks like he's about to put me on hold for a very long time.

Speaker: In the best And I would. And of course, our producer, Michael. Hello. Welcome, everyone. Thanks for coming.

Speaker: Yes. Thank you for everybody in chat. Of course, uh, we love you all. Um, just as a heads up that we are doing our book club. Uh, I'm the only one who has read this before. Um, I know a lot of you in chat have, uh, but the other four on the podcast have not. So, uh, watch your spoilers in chat. If you'd like to, uh, talk spoilers, we have a word spoilers, uh, discord channel for our patrons.

Speaker: Uh, on top of that, we also played bingo every week with the podcast. and Link is in the description of the YouTube chat. And if you want to contribute to the bingo, ah by all means, hop into that Ward Spoilers chat on our Patreon.

Speaker: um I think lowest tier is $1 a month, just to let you know that you love us monetarily. And ah money goes towards us getting better mics. And um although we've been slow about it now, making some more Patreon content and contributing ideas to that Patreon content as well.

Speaker: But all that aside, let's get into it. Rockton Bay Book Club. Arc 4. General thoughts overall. Hannah.

Speaker: it

Speaker: There's so much happening all the time, constantly. And I'm... I am having trouble keeping track of things. ah Yeah.

Speaker: But, you know, we're we're getting there. We're chugging along.

Speaker: Jacob, thoughts?

Speaker: So I wrapped up the last like two chapters we had to read today. And as I finished it, I realized that for me right now, Ward is...

Speaker: very much like The Last Jedi, Brian Johnson's Last Jedi, where as I'm reading it, I'm going like, man, this is this is good. This is like the evolution of this world that Worm deserves.

Speaker: like gets It's bold, it's different, it's fresh, but it feels so familiar. like It's a really nice direction that Wild Boa has chosen to take it.

Speaker: But where's the lightsabers? You know, like, it's at some point, like, I'm just getting a little bored. Like, I hate to say bored because I'm not really bored reading it. It's really good.

Speaker: But I don't know what it is. It's just not quite invested yet into the ah threads. There's lot of cool stuff building, I think. And I think we're going to get there. But it's just taken a little bit longer.

Speaker: Like, we talked about, like, where am I was invested first chapter. First chapter I was in the story, we're sold. So it's just taking some time to get the ball rolling here and it's just slowing things down.

Speaker: I'd kind of agree with that. And in terms of interest, it's kind of like a ah like a heart monitor for me where it's like, eh, ooh, eh, ooh. And those oohs are typically Rain's interludes because he's the most interesting character of this arc.

Speaker: um And yeah just in terms of multi-triggers, how they're working, getting an insight into how his power works, how they share it with each other.

Speaker: um You know, they give each other a little pieces. Like, we'll get into that in the specifics later, but... Oh, man. it's It's so interesting and everything with the Fallen. We love a good cult. Like, a good cult story. um And...

Speaker: it I don't know. it's It's hard. I'm kind of with you, Jacob. It's a bit of a slow...

Speaker: It's a bit of a slow burn to me. And like you said, I'm not bored while reading it, but I think we'll talk about with some specific arcs that I feel like could have been cut completely and I wouldn't have lost much.

Speaker: right yeah It just feels it's a bit long-winded maybe. i don't know if that's right either though, because it's also interesting. don't know. Yeah, I definitely had some moments where I was like, ah I'm only on 4.2-ho.

Speaker: Yeah. It's weird because, like, I'm such a fan of world building. And, like, I'll sit and read a wiki for hours on some world that I've never read before. Because, oh, this seems cool. And I'll get lost forever.

Speaker: And so, like, that aspect of this, like, I'm loving all this stuff. The little bits and pieces we're getting about Earth, um... What's the other earth that they're seeing? yeah pchi Yeah. All of that. That's kind of brewing.

Speaker: get the little bits of like the machine, ah sentient machine armies or whatever that like, all that stuff is so cool. I'm so here for it. And no one's just want to kind of get, get to it.

Speaker: Let's go. Yeah. For me, comparing it to the last jet is a pretty great one. Cause I came into that movie. ah Once again, it's 50% of the best of Star Wars, 50% of the absolute worst of Star Wars.

Speaker: But it did have me very hyped for the movie. And it didn't pass the fridge test. By the end of the night, I was you know up, looking, and going, huh.

Speaker: ah And Bernard Co., keep that thought in mind, because I have notes on that specifically. um And hey, Vic, good to see again. Uh, yeah, I didn't pass the fridge test for me. And this is like me currently standing in front of the fridge.

Speaker: Like I know that there are parts that really get me and really resonate. And we are in the middle of that. We are in the middle of that. Like you said, all the rain arcs, they get me.

Speaker: Um, but there was definitely like, I read half of this and then the other half. And I forgot that the first half was in the same arc. because it just felt so divorced from each other. And it was like, man, that was so long ago. And I was like, that was like two two chapters ago.

Speaker: Like, man, this just kind of drags. um this This was a long arc, too. i mean Yes, word-out-wise, we've been reading about 50... um fifty yeah thousand on average for these, like 51, 58. Last one was 47. It was a slower one.

Speaker: This one was 83,000. And we will be, the next one will be 107,000. We will be cutting that in half, obviously. um It's got a very good divisible point. And then ah we're back to normal numbers. But this was a long one 83,477.

Speaker: That's crazy. sure, sure felt it. he's seventy seven it's crazy it's sure if we sure felt it And for those who wondering why I don't have any opinions, it's because I am here to facilitate and ah do things. But I have actually not read any of this. I'm just support.

Speaker: So that's why I'm always quiet. He's sort of our Victoria, you will. yeah Yeah. He's 100% our Victoria. He's wrangling us. Cheers to that. All right. we kind of and Yeah. Yeah. our you share Also our Natalie. Also our Kenzie.

Speaker: Our Kenzie. Yeah. Oh, thank you. Just like here a little bit of dragon in there to as we ask you to look things up. Yeah. There you go. Really quick. if you If you had to describe yourself on the ah the therapy team, who are you?

Speaker: On the therapy team? What's the therapy team?

Speaker: That is the... Kids who are in therapy? hi grow Yes. Yes. The people in therapy? Wait, what? I don't think... Are you talking about the team? Like, the team we're reading about.

Speaker: Yeah. Victoria's team. Who are we? Who are we the most like? but No, no who who do you who is Who are you in this podcast? who What's your analog? Oh, what's the analog?

Speaker: Michael's our Victoria, sort of Kenzie. Michael's our Victoria. um I feel like Hannah's got the energy of Kenzie, maybe, sometimes. I was actually going to say that. Yeah. Our Kenzie Ashley mashup.

Speaker: Our Kenzie Ashley mashup. um Gotcha. Okay. I'm going to, I'll throw out that I'm, I'm our ah Tristan Byron only. but It's my introverted and my extroverted self at war.

Speaker: Inside you. There are two. mores No, No, no,

Speaker: Yep. I'd probably be the Chris analog, I guess, like where, I don't know, I'm just... You would. I'm just kind of here. Yeah. because

Speaker: I'm just here. And sometimes I'm... It's the eye. Yeah. Sometimes there's, you know, sometimes I'm higher and and energy, sometimes I'm not. It just really depends on the day. Yeah.

Speaker: How much have I indulged myself that day, you know, so to speak. ah say I also vibe with Chris a lot ah for the podcast specifically because there's no way that ah rain is now too sad.

Speaker: yes yeah Rain is a bit too sad. um Yeah. Yeah. No, i it's interesting. Well, shall we get into it?

Speaker: Let's do it. Chapter. Alrighty. 4.1. four point one Damsel infiltrates Hollow Point and has a polite discussion with Prancer.

Speaker: With Kinsey's help, the team watches the after effects and discusses how to use the information. Nailbiter and Natalie show up.

Speaker: So, um I liked the first half of this chapter where Damsel was talking to Prancer and they were watching Damsel talk to Prancer.

Speaker: um I really liked that part. That was fun. and don't really remember the rest of it, to be honest. Yeah, I'll be honest with you. i don't remember these first couple of chapters.

Speaker: was struggling. And I only read them less than a week I don't even remember. Who is Nailbiter? I don't remember. Nailbiter is just one of the randos. She's got what essentially looks like nails. Like rusty nails in her mouth.

Speaker: Like for teens. Oh, okay. um Because the the way they said it made it sound like, I know Natalie is the, Natalie's the lawyer girl, kind of. You're the paralegal.

Speaker: but So the fact that they're included in the same sentence, I'm like, okay, yeah, it's a law student. Nailbiter is a villain though, right? Isn't she or no? Natalie has yeah nothing to do with Nailbiter.

Speaker: They're included in the same sentence. I was like, I didn't think they had anything. Okay. know Nailbiter is just a villain. Yes, Nailbiter is one of the villains talking with Prancer because Ashley has her little confrontation and then you know shops and leaves.

Speaker: um ah Bernard, good good soft hint? No. No, she has not. um

Speaker: ah She hasn't done anything but except show up. I guess the fact that she's name-dropped in the summary means she'll show up again later. Yeah. um This is also where we had the team workshopping names, both for the team and the for themselves. So just out of curiosity, um what would be the worst possible team name for them?

Speaker: And maybe the worst, worst possible cake names for any of the people in this group.

Speaker: I mean, I think you were close when you were like the therapy group. like Yeah, I was going to say group therapy. Group therapy is pretty bad. Group therapy is just the name of their team. Yeah. All right. Try to go in with all all the different things.

Speaker: Something like... um trauma and fetish or something like that. You've got... yeah obviously Obviously, you've got Tentai. Tentai. See, I was going to go with like Huggsy Wuggsy kind of thing for Sveta, right?

Speaker: Yeah. It's like an absurdly cutesy name. It's like, oh that's death. but just Death in a bottle. Beyond Stables. Yeah, that would be a good one. They have not decided on a name yet.

Speaker: um They've just been brainstorming that. um Tetanus mouth. I like that even if feel like Chris came... Yeah, tetanus mouth for Nailbiter. yeah ah chris Chris came up with one for himself that I thought was funny. was a Hodgepodge.

Speaker: i like That's not a great name, but I kind of love it. I kind of like it. good name yeah fun But then he he was going to shorten it to Podge. That was the one where I was like, okay, maybe not though. Don't Podge. Maybe not Podge.

Speaker: Don't be just Podge. That's funny. Hodgepodge is fine. Podge is just... Yeah. He sounds like you're a penguin. What? Why?

Speaker: Yeah. I think Kraken would be a good name for Sveta, actually. Just a decent name. I like Kraken. I guess it's not really hero vibes, though, maybe. Kraken could be considered... We're not looking for hero vibes. We're looking for worst possible options. Yeah, well, yeah. Worst possible, yeah.

Speaker: Uh... vi ah Victoria's would be something like like the human condom or something like that. What? Because she's holding it.

Speaker: she She already has. I mean, ta of Tattletail already gave us that. It's Gloria. Gloria. That's the old her, you know, new name. New name, you new tease.

Speaker: yeah new name my gosh alan get get a little closer to your mic please i think you're ah you so far away baby there we go how about that that's bad i think i think kinsey's worst name would just be shut up kid because that's what everybody tells her yeah no uh her name's actually look away but go say no That's pretty good. I like that. I mean, it's bad, but that's the point. ah

Speaker: All right. ah

Speaker: Anything else in this? yeah ah I like seeing a bit more of Damsel. I like ah seeing her. We got like an ever so slight POV section of hers and i was like, oh, ah.

Speaker: yeah Just a tease. Yeah, that threw me off for a second when it started, and I was like, are we in an interlude? Wait, what's going on? Yeah, same. um Weird. Yeah, and I really like, um I really do like, ah yeah, Damsel's a little bit there, buying the dress, pretending to be a villain because she's known as a villain.

Speaker: i thought that was really cool. Oh, yeah, two plus four, Misfit Toys. ah That's a great... That is a great song from Arcane Season 1.

Speaker: i was in the um yeah aisle of misfit toys, led by the coolest character in any stop motion, King Moonracer, who is a winged lion, not a griffin, nor any of those Androsphinx bullshit.

Speaker: um Yeah. ah So people know in their D&D lore, he's a winged lion. There you go There you Yeah. I don't know. I don't really see... i kind of like this general plan of slowly harassing the villains.

Speaker: Yeah. That's kind fun. I feel like there's a plus and negative here. I think Wildbo's taking his time with Ward, which is cool. But it I kind of feel that time where I feel like between this moment and when Houndstooth Teams does something and when Ozier does something...

Speaker: It's a little bit too long. Like 4.2, the only note that it has for it is, ah planning and strategy, Kinsey steps into the limelight.

Speaker: And like, that's what 4.2 is. don't remember 4.2. I think... i don't remember four point two i think um Yeah, i don't know. I don't remember. I mean, i think it I think it says something that we're all, we all literally just read these chapters like a week ago or less if you waited till the last minute to read your chapters. so ah And we can't fucking remember. like I've seen this. There's a lot of talking.

Speaker: Yes. I think I'm just kind of sick of all of the talking, which I understand is like, we're seeing more of the paperwork. i don't even want to say paperwork, but more of the like strategizing paperwork side of having a hero group as opposed to the like action-packed, you know, Taylor kind of just did whatever she wanted with her ah with her territory. And a lot of it was like, well, we need to rebuild shit. So we're fucking going. We're going to do it.

Speaker: And this feels like a lot more like, spreadsheets and paperwork and making sure everything's lined up. And I don't like spreadsheets and paperwork. Yeah.

Speaker: I will say, so I, this would be more like if we got worm from coils perspective, in Tattletail, right? Because they were the ones who planned everything.

Speaker: Taylor was just the the executioner, so to speak, of the plans. And even Tattletail, to ah to an extent, is just the executioner. Like, I think if we had Worm from Coil's perspective, it'd be a lot of dialogue because it's him planning everything. Yeah. But... So i think that's the downside here, right? Is we have... Now we are following the character who is that Coil, so to speak, for this hero team who's doing all the planning and the plotting and...

Speaker: you know We're not just following the character executing on the plans. um yeah Worm is... no I'll start with Ward. Ward so far has been like watching The Wire. the like The Wire is just so much set up for Ultimately, like, they don't exactly get what they want. You know, slight spoilers for The Wire. or wire But that is The Wire. It's it's tapping phones. It's spending a lot of time.

Speaker: People just talking. Takeouts and waiting. Takeouts and waiting and trying to set stuff up. That is the whole show. um and And it is interesting. And Worm, at least pacing-wise, is Brooklyn Nine-Nine.

Speaker: Like... yeah Yeah. Yeah. All the characters, there's always something happening. Um, and so it is, it is definitely a change up and you know, this was an entire book.

Speaker: Um, and don't get to the thoughts at the end, but essentially nothing happened. Um, yeah. For an entire arc.

Speaker: Yeah. For two entire, yeah, yeah, for an entire, yeah. this I think this is this is also the downside of writing in web serial form, I imagine. For sure. I could see, um if you wrote this as a more traditional novel, you would have a good editor be like, okay, we need to cull some stuff.

Speaker: But granted, that's part of what we love about Wyrm, right? I would argue that we don't need to cull stuff. We can do everything. yeah I would actually argue that like, so i'm i'm I don't care if anybody judges for this.

Speaker: Sarah J. Moss, she writes fantasy. When she first published her first series, it was like grabs you right out the gate because it was her first series. She was a brand new debut author. And then her first two series blew up. And when she like,

Speaker: Her publisher basically gave her free reign with her third series. The books were insanely chonky, like way too big. it it moseyed around. You had no idea where you were. I truly hated it. And it was like, this is a perfect example of like, the publishers went, oh, we know that you have readers and they're going to read whatever you put out.

Speaker: You can just... run with it. And I'm kind of feeling that vibe here. Like Wild Bill now has people who loved Worm and who read Worm and want more. And it's like, well, I can i can take my time. i can explore certain aspects of this world that I didn't really get to lean into before. And I don't think there's anything wrong with that, especially when you're, you know, basically indie publishing.

Speaker: Like, you yeah you can do whatever the fuck you want to do and you should, but also... I'm dying here just a little bit. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. You don't want to, you don't want to choke out the creative, you know, nature by having somebody there strangling. Yeah. The creative potential, but also you do want somebody who can balance that with wrangling the writer in.

Speaker: And in this case, why I think that like at some point in time, Jacob and I will sit down and do at the very least, maybe not a TV adaptation, but, uh, I'll at worm or ward should have gotten edited down.

Speaker: Um, I think worm, you know, we were trying to edit it in our, uh, our other podcast. Um, you know, it needed to be different. There needed to be a reason for the changes.

Speaker: Ward needs, way more changes, just basic level, not even as an adaptation. Just to start out, it needs a ton of re-editing.

Speaker: yeah um Yeah, and that that's more my point with the with the web serial thing, is that you are typically, you probably give your work, I mean, I don't know Wild Bill works. I imagine he gives his works at least a passing edit, but he's not got that long-term editing voice of somebody being like,

Speaker: hey, let's look at the book as a whole. Let's skip things around. Or slice things apart. and To keep with the Star Wars comparison, there was the george ah George Lucas, your first trilogy was amazing. Fans love it. What do he got for us next? And he goes, we're going to open on a trade embargo.

Speaker: And nobody said, no George. Not a good idea. Yeah. Sometimes you want to let the brilliant mind cook, obviously, but you know, every, every cook is a food critic.

Speaker: A sous chef. Yeah. yeah um grand Yeah. Fran says in the chat that this is a fairly common opinion of word. So it, it kind of makes sense yeah that I imagine this is fairly common, but we can move on to 4.3. Oh, I was going to latch onto that. oh this So far, um,

Speaker: much like my opinions of the time skip, which is, I don't remember it being that bad. And even the chapter that, it or the arc that it's in, wasn't that bad. The time skip, literally that singular interlude or whatever is the reason it's so bad. And it is bad.

Speaker: Worse than I remember. Ward might be that for me, where I have been holding that. I love Ward a lot from what I remember. And so far having gone, gone through it detail by detail,

Speaker: it's It's really on a downward slope. um So hopefully hopefully all of the ah the hype I had in my mind does eventually meet up with what I'm reading.

Speaker: ah So far it is is not. yeah But you know what? We're doing it together. Well, one of my... ah yeah We will experience it together.

Speaker: um Yeah. And it's not like my story. Oops, sorry. I was just going to say, it's not like the story itself is bad either. It's not like, like when I sit down and I'm reading, it's not like I'm like, oh, this is so boring.

Speaker: I'm here. I'm reading. yeah I find myself moving through the chapters. But what I don't find is myself thinking during the day, oh, I can't wait to sit down and read Ward later. which is how I was with warm.

Speaker: I'm like, Oh, I can't wait till I'm done with work. I'm gonna sit down. I'm going to read. It's going to be great. Or like books that I love that I'm thinking about it all day. And then I sit down and I read, this is more of like, well, I have to read three chapters, you know, by next week. So I'm going to sit down and spend a Saturday finish reading.

Speaker: So here we go. Jacob, actually like your comparison with, uh, with the first three Lord of the Rings. Um, Star Wars. Star Wars? Yeah. I'm sorry.

Speaker: Star Wars. Careful. The first three Star Wars. They're like, yeah, those are pretty darn good. And then you're like, what do you have for us? And you know what? the the pre The prequels are bad.

Speaker: um But the amount of lore in them that like is explored and gives us more room to jump off of is incredible.

Speaker: I know that the Clone Wars is like, are you to be the worst one by far? um I like it because the clones are introduced and, you know, lot of cool, all the coolest stuff revolves around the clones. Like, and, yeah you know, yeah, 100%.

Speaker: ah yeah hundred percent I agree. didn't know. and You said clones, but I heard cologne and colognes.

Speaker: An army of sense. That's a long day. Sorry. Continue, Nick. No, no. All good. All good. um Okay. 4.3. This is one of my favorite scenes in the arc.

Speaker: Flying on villains. with with with That was 4.2. We didn't remember. Oh, I was still on 4.1. Oh, no, no. oh ah but no no We had circus confirmed as a multi-trigger. I know that was mentioned the chat before, but we hadn't confirmed that circus was a multi-trigger confirmed.

Speaker: um And then let's see. Houndstooth seems cool. And Enzi's description of her trigger, which I thought was an interesting one. How would get a kid like Kenzie to trigger?

Speaker: Dang, that was pretty sad. Also, I do want to give a shout out to Beefaroni, who says they they read Worm in about nine days, which is wild.

Speaker: Wait, what? How? They said, literally all I did, I woke up, read Worm, then went to bed. that's That's what you'd have to do. Goddamn, son.

Speaker: Oh, fantastic. Well done. well yeah um Yeah, impressive. Okay. um Yeah, I think 4.2, I just didn't remember much, so I didn't have much to say. think it's just the initial talk with Houndstooth being like, hey, that cool?

Speaker: Cool. And then they're gonna meet later. That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. they They decide Houndstooth. That's right. Kinsey's nervous about them talking to Houndstooth. There's that prior relationship.

Speaker: um But we'll get into that a bit more with 4.4, I think. Yep. 4.3, though, has one of my favorite scenes in the arc. um Spying on villains and the dangers of Revelation, Victoria's wretch wrecks Velvet's boy toy.

Speaker: Love, Lost, and Snag have plans for Rain. My favorite scene is Moose and Victoria talking with Moose being like, Hey, look, we're going to fight. Like, we got to...

Speaker: You know, you're going to beat me, though. So, like, we can get to, like, you can really beat me and then my friends will come and fight you, too. ah you can just beat me up a little bit and then we'll move on and you fly away. Yeah. but Yeah.

Speaker: I love Moose. ah like Moose a lot. Strong. Favorite side character for sure for sure so far. Yeah, yeah. ah he He, that is 100% if I were to be a villain.

Speaker: that That's me. It's just like, man, I don't want to like, I've got to do my job. You know, I'm a villain. That's what I do. But like, you're going to get me at the end of this. So can we just skip to that part and be done with it? It's such a hassle.

Speaker: Yeah. um Yeah. No, i I like that part. That was one of the fun ones. um And then she gouges it a bit. The wretch. Yeah, yeah. She kind him bit. feel like that was the hit harder than intended kind of moment of like, ooh. Yeah, because it grabs his face and like, ugh.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. Feel bad for the guy. You need to get this wretch under control. Jeez. Causing damage, crashing cars, ripping up the... He's got little grabby bits all over the place. He's got a lot of grippers there.

Speaker: At this point in time, we have... We have Rain's Cluster... Have y'all figured that out yet?

Speaker: Yeah. Okay. wow yeah Wait, wait, wait, wait. What do you mean by figured that out yet? Who has what power, kind of, generally speaking?

Speaker: No! I don't! Like, who has the main power? We've gone through them all. yeah Right. So let's start with Rain. Okay, Rain has the...

Speaker: okay so rain has the laser power is his main one, right? Shattering ability. Right. but he's like a blaster, I guess. Yeah. Yep. um Cradle is the tinker.

Speaker: Cradle is the tinker, right? Cradle is the tinker. um Which we know nag probably has something to do with arms. Right. Yeah. The crazy arms when they fought the first time.

Speaker: um Snag is the mover power, right? That is correct. Oh, right. Yep. Okay. And then love lost is the emotion power. Correct. Ah.

Speaker: Makes sense. And then there's a fifth one that, you know, passed away, probably. Yeah. Yeah, that we don't know about. Yeah. Mr. Hands. Hand boy.

Speaker: Oh, is that what we call Cradle? I thought we called Snag. Snag. No, Snag and Cradle different. Not Mr. Hands. Not Mr. Hands. No. ah e yeah That is Rain's cluster.

Speaker: Yeah. yeah yeah yeah And they... i i It's interesting overhearing that conversation with Snag where he's like, hey, we're hiring you guys because we need an army, but we also really want to kill this kid.

Speaker: yeah Yeah. they're like We need an army. We're going to take on you know a large group of people. Also this one kid. Yes. You need to kill him. but Fuck that kid. Primary target.

Speaker: you know if there's one Everything else is second down. Fuck them kids, bro. Arms power, hand boy, arms master. Coincidence? I think not. yeah Also, Bernard, a good point. When Victoria's in Arc 2 and she's beating up that Nazi, she can't avoid... brought Well, or is that... Yeah.

Speaker: She can't avoid property damage, but doesn't. Now she wants to avoid property damage, but can't. But can't. That's funny. Yeah. The irony. yeah Oh, Victoria. and An army.

Speaker: yeah So stupid. I love it. So No, it's great. ah To Bernard, how do you think the name Cradle reflects his power?

Speaker: Well, based on the Tinker arm things, I'm thinking of like, you know, the grabbing, the holding that arms would give. also kind of thought of like Cat's Cradle, like that kind of they give it the same thing It's abandonment dad issues.

Speaker: That's the trigger event because cats in the cradle and the silver spoon. Little boy blue and the man on the moon? Coincidence? I think not.

Speaker: hi I think so. Yep. yeahp yeah weird But yeah um yeah. Very cool little moment there. um yeah Arms master is behind everything.

Speaker: Confirmed. So wait for him. He's out there somewhere. Do Illuminati thing. Do the A for Armsmaster. Oh my God. A's in the chat. Am I right?

Speaker: All right. A's in the chat for Armsmaster. Y'all. With just the 1A, remember? Just the 1A. Yeah. One arm. One arm. for arm. Yep.

Speaker: one arm one arm one arm one a fur arm me ah What's the singular of Illuminati? Illuminat? Illuminat. Illuminat.

Speaker: Illuminat. Oh, no. I'm to clip that. That's our first clip that chat. Here we go.

Speaker: She's dragging on these balls to lie Illumina. Oh, no. I'm adding a stream marker for later on this moment. Oh, yeah. ah go Yeah, we can't forget about teasing the chat for Tattletail as well. Thanks, Chad. yeah ah yeah Yeah. But we we're not talking about her. Oh, my gosh. It's all good.

Speaker: She'll come up. But don't ever forget. She'll come up. We're going to talk about her. All right, on to the first interlude. Yes, please. Yes. 4.8 interlude, Cluster Snags Night.

Speaker: ah Rain lives up to his name and has a dreary day. I feel like that doesn't quite describe it. ah So from what I remember, I'll give a bit more. We open in Snag's Dream, not knowing it's Snag's Dream initially.

Speaker: We open in Snag's dream of the mall. of Something has happened in the mall. There's a stampede of people rushing for the door. He's recognizing that this is bad. People are going to get crushed and hit. he He tries to rescue a young girl, but she gets pulled under eventually anyway.

Speaker: ah he reaches up to try to climb and cuts his hand and then falls, and then things kind of go black. um That's what i recall from his dream. And then they they go into that weird dream in-between area where they can all see each other, talk to each other. They've got the little podium in the middle where they can put their powers to share them.

Speaker: um And yeah, Fran's comment about the Black Friday Traeger event, it does remind me this one time. um in In great earnest, a person I knew posted an article on Facebook saying,

Speaker: saying the title of the article was One Million Dead and in Worst Black Friday Night Ever. And his comments were just like, I can't believe somebody like this would happen in America. Is this what it's come to?

Speaker: It was from the onion though. So it's just, it wasn't a real article. And he like, he fully, fully fell for the the satire onion. yeah remember all the comments were just like, brah, but not explaining anything. And finally somebody was like, you know what the onion is, right? one No, bro, don't tell him.

Speaker: We are like, don't tell him. He doesn't know still. ah Greatest tragedy in history. Yeah, greatest, yeah. million One million dead and worst Black Friday ever.

Speaker: Lord. No, but yeah, i I assumed these are all dreams of the trigger events by the end. um Yeah. Sort of like yeah what caused them all to trigger simultaneously.

Speaker: Yeah. so I think I would like to reread the interludes now having finished them. I feel like I might appreciate the early ones a bit more.

Speaker: i so I always love the interludes. They're always great. But um but yeah, now knowing kind of that we're seeing the shared ah shared dream and vision of the trigger is is interesting.

Speaker: And a lot of... yes I was just going to say, it seems like whatever happened, based on the other interludes, I'm going to bring a bit of the other inter interludes into it as well.

Speaker: It sounds like the reason they blame Rain is because the Fallen caused whatever caused the Stampede. That's that' what I was thinking. yeah but yeah I'm pretty sure that's what he said. um And so, yeah, so there's... That's why they blame him, because he's the member of the Fallen who is still part of their cluster now.

Speaker: Plus, you know, the whole kiss-kill thing. They just probably want to kill him more than normal anyway. ah Give him smooches. Smooch him up. And if he's dead, then they can't smooch him up. I'm gonna kiss you. And then I'm gonna kill you.

Speaker: Yeah. ah The Dream Realm actually gave strong ah Dishonored vibes. Like when they're in the Outsiders place. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I could see that. Interesting. Like where he's getting his powers from the weird god thing.

Speaker: Yeah, because like there's like scenes in that area and like it's all broken apart and like shardy and dream space. Yeah. Strong Dishonored Outsider vibes.

Speaker: Also... I like that they get like tokens for their power. Oh, sorry. Go ahead. Yeah. i was going to say, we've also got a lot of ah people losing fingers and other things in hinges and holding tables. And I just... Every single one of them.

Speaker: This one was the finger in the hinge, but... Even just the hand... Yeah, the hand injury. I had a... I had a cousin who was trying to reach for something like on a roof once and she got her hand caught on the gutter coming back down. And that like that, like that kind of stuff is really visceral. Yeah. It's a big no.

Speaker: Very visceral. Falling into a yeah stampede is very Mufasa. i I'm surprised no one said that yet. That's true. Yeah.

Speaker: Also, I'll warn you about tattletaling right now. And, I mean, we'll leave that for the next arc. Mufasa was a fallen. Yeah, exactly. rock There you go.

Speaker: Cut his hand and fell into a stampede. I mean, that sounds very familiar. That's true. and I'm getting a scar and Simba, our cluster trigger.

Speaker: yeah Even even the the main the main line works, right? Because we're talking about this like weird incest-y cult. you know love Long live the kink. It's just perfect. That's exactly what Scar said. Did you say long live the kink? That's what Scar said, right?

Speaker: Yep. How do you think he got that, Scar? How do you...

Speaker: that's I'll see myself out. We just started, the guys. We're already losing it. It's good. No, we've been going. We're due this time.

Speaker: Yeah, that's fair. 45 minutes in. I did like the ah trading trading chips to trade away like pieces of power. yeah you know Cradle's like, well, I can give you guys you know each a couple of my chips. I don't really need them. But then... and It's got to be so...

Speaker: mind screwy for rain to be there as they're all plotting his demise yeah like oh oh it sucks and he's just like got his three little tokens and he's like you're all i have thats also say He even says at one point here that he tried giving them away at the beginning, like tried to like talk to garner some goodwill, like to try anything. They all just ignored him like, oh man, like this is every single night. Yeah. It doesn't let up, man. Yeah. um

Speaker: He got a very upset that Jacob has not mentioned the elephant in the this world's room. which is that they got three ETs.

Speaker: Wait, what? Did I miss something? What is this? Three ETs? Yeah, well they have three ETs movies. Yeah. Did they mention that? I didn't catch that. I can't believe that Jacob didn't catch on to that. I'm very disappointed.

Speaker: I'm also disappointed. Listen, it's that's fair. I'm sorry. Stricken from the list. You know what, Kat? Doesn't count in bingo.

Speaker: Doesn't count in bingo. He didn't notice it. Doesn't count. um so so Doesn't count. That's funny. um no So this is the one. So this this interlude, because Rain's interludes, his non-dream parts are kind of bleeding together.

Speaker: This is the one, though, where we see ah he kind of wakes up. It's that weird, eerie morning where all the girls are serving Um, they go out. Aaron's brother is being taken to church and we have that first sermon that we get to hear.

Speaker: um and we, ah trying to think of what happens after that, which is kind of like general vibes of like what, oh, he talks to Lachlan in this one, right?

Speaker: Or is that the next one? That is the next It's the next one. It's the next one. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So it's more just getting a sense of like what the society is like. I don't feel like.

Speaker: Yeah. Again, it's not like much happens, but this one was much more interesting to me just because of how. interesting. Twisted the fallen are. Yeah. Yeah. It's, um, yeah, it's, it's, uh, it's interesting.

Speaker: I mean, look, I love a cult. I love a cult as much as the next person, but, um, Ew. Just... Ew. I felt greasy after reading this. it um Also, um when they're describing the kitchen, i was telling Alan this.

Speaker: I ah totally imagined it as the... that I don't know which Star Wars movie it is, but since we've mentioned Star Wars. ah But there's this bar in one of the Star Warses where it's like the bar is like in a big circle and the All the people are bartenders like on the inside and then all the patrons are on like the outside of the circle. And it's like the bar is basically a giant ring. That is how I imagined their kitchen.

Speaker: They're like weird hodgepodge kitchen in this compound thing. It's like all the girls are in the ring cooking and doing dishes. And then like it's not a compound hodgepodge. It's a single cabin.

Speaker: I know, but that is how I read it at the time. Just a bunch of baristas. It's how I saw it in my mind's eye. Yes, thank you. That's exactly how I saw it. Just a Starbucks. Meanwhile, Chad is writing the third E.T. movie and I am loving it.

Speaker: i did just, I went back and had to find that in the interview. The 50th Diner with, I forget what the guy's name is, but the six arm, Jax. Jack's Daxter.

Speaker: Except di thought he just had a diner set up. He just had a diner. You're probably thinking of Mos Eisley in episode four. the cantina. And if not that one, literally every cantina they show in those the live the longer ones in some of the other ah shows rather than the one they initially lop off the one dude's arm who's like, he doesn't like you. don't like you either. Yeah, that's episode four.

Speaker: Dexter Jetster is the bar is the diner guy. Dexter Jetster. um If you want a... or not... um I will say to reply to a 2 plus 4.

Speaker: I didn't notice ET3. I will be honest. I haven't actually seen ET before. Me neither. That's a... Oh, my God. Fuddled.

Speaker: Yeah. and ah I'm sorry. I missed that one. I got Jurassic Park. I got Star Wars. I just missed... I missed E.T. I know what I'm doing with my book.

Speaker: That's true. There we go. Don't make me. But if you want... I can't be that drunk. Oh, my God. The... Hang on. I may have a child sneaking in. One second.

Speaker: No problem. Everybody's got a cancer. Oh, did... I did go and look. ah I looked back at where it's at ET3 and i I just read right past it. So I'm sorry. Let's take a punishment chat. what What do we do to know that the bar is enough because we had that for a trivia night not too long ago. And one of our people who knew nothing about Star Wars just could not believe.

Speaker: the music and the cantina. Oh, yeah. That's true. That was fun. Classic. Yeah. George Lucas. E.T. has one of the weirdest... Oh, George.

Speaker: One of the most savage ah insults from a child in a movie. And it's like the one of the only... for you probably the the bill believe The little tiny kid, youngest brother or whatever, insults their older sibling by calling them...

Speaker: Calling them penis breath, which is... It's when they're outside of shit....comes out nowhere in the movie. Dang. And when I was a child watching it, I was like, holy... I don't think I'm supposed to hear this.

Speaker: No, no. And my parents were... parents turned that movie My parents were appalled at a child saying penis breath. And that's pretty much the only part about that movie I remember. I need to rewatch it. Because that's that's pretty cool. It's that entire age of terrible. Yeah, a lot of those like late 70s, early 80s movies, what i what I didn't know is that... um PG-13 wasn't invented until 1984. Yeah.

Speaker: yeah And so, like, i I worked at a teen, like, hangout place at a an army base, and we put on a movie, and they had a movie library of G and PG movies because they didn't want to show anything too crazy. So I pull on the Goonies.

Speaker: In the first, like, 10 seconds, somebody goes, yeah what the shit? Or something like that. And we're like, what? No, famously, the shit. Yeah, he was going to play with that. So... it's My parents put it on for my sister who was like six and I was like, no, no, no, no no no no no And they were like, no, it's fine. We were loved this as kids. And like immediately it's like talking about the sex dungeon in the attic.

Speaker: ah like what the chip like yeah apple i like And then my parents like yeah shaking, turn it off and being like, I don't remember it being like this. I'm like, all your movies were like this. All your children's movies were like this. Yeah.

Speaker: and like the The original Pink Panther movies, same thing. Sounds sounds and innocent. very very like not the very first scene of can't remember which one is like ah bunch of naked women pressing like stepping on on grapes to make wine just like in the third one i don't i don't remember because i only saw that part and then uh we turned it off but right my dad was like i don't remember in your mind The thing is that a lot of times they watch it on TV.

Speaker: So everything was edited to go on tv So that yeah that that was the whole thing back in the day. But anyways, I digress. and And there's also just as as a parent now, ah I can say that there is parent brain where you're like, oh, I love this movie as a kid.

Speaker: And then... You know, even like, um it's not even that bad, but I watched Wreck-It Ralph with my kids recently. And, you know, the scene where Ralph smashes the car, my son bursts into tears and like, why did you make me watch this?

Speaker: I was like, it gets better. It gets better. Don't worry. It's got a happy ending. The low part's too low for me, Dad. I was I got drag we forgot how intense this was watching Ralph smash the car while Vanellope screaming no. This is terrible. That's pretty It's pretty hard. You got to take all those emotions. You got to ball them down.

Speaker: Keep them down there. Never come up. yeah That's the thing, right? is' like there is a You do need to lightly traumatize your children. Speaking of which. 4.4. Yeah. yeah sort it fallen um the phone yeah Well, before we get out of the interlude, um I did want to say just as a quick book recommendation, if you're wanting to read some nonfiction um and you're like, how are there any groups like the fallen in real life?

Speaker: um I read a book called Educated, which is a memoir by Tara Westover. Oh, my God. Someone was just telling me about this book. Yep. Pretty, pretty great memoir. I read it for grad school.

Speaker: Um, but her parents were part of a certain extreme survivalist Mormon cult. Um, and she was not taught. She had to teach herself to read and she wasn't taught to read until she was like 12 or something like that.

Speaker: Um, and just very extreme. Like they, they were constantly worried that the government was going to come and take everything away. They, you know, we're very, very conservative and traditional and abusive. Like, it's just a, it's a very sad memoir, but very enlightening.

Speaker: and And it happened in the United States, so it's not even something that's that far away. So, just as a small nonfiction recommendation for any of our nonfic readers out there. ah Interesting book. Really enjoyed it.

Speaker: Yeah. On top of that, if we're just going to get into the Fallen, I have the notes for you, Bernard. God the Fallen are such a good, conclusion like inevitable conclusion of what cult Christianity already looks like.

Speaker: It's the obsession with people in power, or in this case, having powers. um The weird sexual kinks, which nobody will talk about, but um yeah having lots of children is a breeding kink.

Speaker: That's what it is. People don't want to talk about it, but that's that's what it is. And the power dynamic kink of like the man being in charge of everything is still a kink. um the obsession with the end times, they're literally an end bringer cult.

Speaker: Like, right. And right. ah Something that I thought about recently is I don't hear nearly as much talk about the end times now that like ah people are in power.

Speaker: So, but when they're not in power, the end times are always right around the corner. um And then ah the ease of absorbing other cultures into their own. This started as an end bringer cult. They,

Speaker: you know, worship for all intents and purposes or, know, have their focus on the end bringers, which are not, you know, Jesus Christ. And yet they have subsumed the Christian aspects into themselves so that they can keep rolling on and use that as a vehicle for, you know, what people are comfortable with, which is very much in line with like how a lot of the American cult national Christianity uh, already works. I mean, Christianity over a whole has absorbed, you know, all the Greek and Roman doctrine into itself for concepts like hell and Hades and, you know, and just keeps rolling and picking up different holidays and traditions through other cultures.

Speaker: And eventually you get to, um you know, you get to America today and there's so much that has been picked up along the way that isn't, you know, not there OG Christianity, if you want to call it that, but has done it for just culturally. It helps them propagate um and and pick up stuff.

Speaker: It does help that the end bringers are named after biblical creatures. That is true. Yeah. yeah And it's it's a very... poignant example of the us versus them mentality.

Speaker: um And that gets and brought up in later arcs as well, where it is both in the sermon and the way they're talking. It's the, hey, it's us versus them. And, you know, very much if you, ah if you aren't with us, you're against us. Vic, to answer your question, Simr, if she can step on me.

Speaker: Yeah, I was going to say the same thing. It's if I had to worship an Endbringer, it would be the Simr. Not the real cult of this, but Simmer. The question was, if you had to worship Ben and Ringer, who would you worship for those who are reading this? I was going to say, it's not question.

Speaker: Educated. it's always important i don't need to even worship all of her, just her feet. um it was It's called, a to answer your question, two plus four, it's called ah Educated by Tara Westover. The question was, what was the name of the nonfiction memoir, ah Educated?

Speaker: um I read it because I have a master's degree in English education. Nerd. Big brain. um It was one of one of the classes we talked about the importance of literacy.

Speaker: Everyone's agreeing with you about Simmer. Everybody's saying Simmer from the chat, big lady. Simmer from the chat. how do How do I do the feet emote? Where's feet? but No. No, why? I just need to like the view of the bottom of the chat. I will say.

Speaker: do I do an ask? will say. Ever since yeah Lady Dimitrescu was revealed in that one Resident Evil trailer, everybody got way too comfortable talking about getting stepped on, I think. I think i think it just helped a bunch of people awaken. I think it was good, you know.

Speaker: them to have that no not all the feet emojis yeah you're welcome that's what i'm here for plus why michael that's a great reason to worship bohu uh i stand with you i hate yeah i'd worship bohu because i hate real estate that's real real okay we got to keep rolling you guys we forgot a lot to tell you anyway 4.4 for the third time Yeah, 4.4 for the fourth time.

Speaker: ah Victoria and Tristan give Ashley an impromptu lesson on public relations. Houndstooth reveals that Kinsey is even more awesome and caring than she first appears, and that's why that's worrying.

Speaker: um Yeah, so this was... ah I don't remember the conversation with Ashley, I'll be honest. It's them talking to the girl Presley.

Speaker: Yeah, so Presley approaches Vic on the train, ah Victoria on the train. Right, right, right, right. I liked that scene. either way it was yeah The way it was phrased, I didn't remember what it was about, but I liked that scene. I thought that was... Look, this is why Vicky is a pro, okay?

Speaker: I will say she handled that very well. If conversations like this go like, damn, she's good. She does the first whole like, you know, first, let me take a selfie kind of thing. yeah If you go to that chapter, ah what is it, 4.4? If you go to that chapter on the wiki, there are multiple renditions of that selfie, by the way.

Speaker: um Oh, fun. Which is really, really nice. Yeah. ah Yeah. it's ah shec yeah She's good at like public relations. She's good at the like drumming up the social media, too.

Speaker: Like the, hey, we're going to do this. We're gonna send it out to this one person. like It is kind of being nice, but also she knows what she's doing in terms of like, groundworks trying to get public like sway on their side like she's good at this it also feels very much like you know victoria interests and teach ashley to be a little bit more human like here's how you do human a little bit i did like the rejection when what presley was that the girl's name like yeah yeah yeah which iss which is like very hesitantly is done with is done with victoria and then like

Speaker: Turns to Ashley is like, would you sign it? to No. Just like, okay, I'm sorry. Like my, that's my anxiety every time I think I see a famous person in public. Yeah. yeah But then Ashley had a real, had a good reason. It was like, ah well, I can't right now. My arms are, you know, yeah not working.

Speaker: Yeah. yeah Yeah. Which is a big, big move on her part admitting weakness since she's somebody that yeah really despises that. That's true. like She didn't say it to the girl, but, you know, saying it to her teammates is still a big step.

Speaker: Like, we'll take it. For sure. Which kind of implies, like, I would have done it, but I didn't want to embarrass myself by just holding a pen. The more this goes on yeah, the more I'm getting, like, Dread Pirate Roberts vibes from Ashley, where she's every day is like, I'll kill you in the morning.

Speaker: You know, and then more it goes on, it's like, that's what she has to do. Yeah. yeah Well, good work, team. Good night. I'll most likely be a villain in the morning. yeah yeah 20 years actually said that. Turns out she's not even the first Dread Pirate Ashley. It works. It works.

Speaker: and word It too well. yeah No, I, again, i think this is why characters like Ashley are a red herring, right? They're not the problem that Mrs. Yamada was worried about.

Speaker: Like, yes, they could be an issue, but i i feel like from their first meeting, Mrs. Yamada probably pegged her as like, you're fine. Like, you just, you need some help. Like, becoming a human, but you'll be fine.

Speaker: But Ashley thinks that she's the biggest issue in the group. Like, Ashley's like, yeah, if we don't succeed, it's going to be Like, yeah, she's like very proud of herself. Like, oh, yeah, I know that Miss Yamada's worried about the group. have a lot of big issues in this group. And she's like, I know.

Speaker: I'm a big issue. Kind of a big issue. It's me. It's me. Hi. I'm the problem. It's me. We got to make sure to say that kind of a big issue.

Speaker: ah to merch yeah That's a good idea. and But instead of like, I'm kind of a big issue, it's I kind of have a big issue. kind of have a big oh But just the words big issue are just big on the rest of it's real time.

Speaker: Yeah. um Yeah. And speaking of big issues, Houndstooth reveals that Kinsey may be a bit of a problem. um Yeah.

Speaker: Poor child. I think about the people addict talk so much in my everyday life.

Speaker: Um, where he gives the description of much like food and early, you have to do to survive. So you can't cut it cold Turkey, like other substances or things.

Speaker: And people are kind of the same way that there is, it is such a incredibly difficult addiction or balance to have. And Kenzie is that, and I, you know, in part get it, you know, being a naive rag doll of a social person, sometimes just like go with the flow, go along with whatever anybody says, and then realize in retrospect, like,

Speaker: oh, that was terrible. I should just put my foot down said like, no I'm not going do that. And just moved on. It would have been way better. And for somebody who just goes through life, yes, manning it, like, but is a child, um that's really, really dangerous um for everybody involved.

Speaker: Yeah. yeah

Speaker: Yeah, um and she is the ultimate people pleaser, right? She's the one who... Yeah. She will do whatever you ask above and beyond. She just wants to make you happy.

Speaker: Yeah, even if works for another ground. Yeah, yeah. oh Oh, and I think that's... You know, it's sad that Ashley... kind of takes it badly. I think, you know, there's that interesting part to you.

Speaker: That's again, why I don't think Ashley's a big issue because she's so defensive of her friends already. Yeah. Okay, you're fine. You're going to be fine. Like, um, but i get, I get where she's coming from where she's like, well, you're just reducing her to a problem. And he's like, I'm not, but you also need to know she kind of is.

Speaker: Um, and I get, I get this vibe that um she, yeah, it's that people addiction. She needs to please people to survive. She needs to think that you love her, you care about her, ah you pay attention to her, you're grateful to have her around.

Speaker: You know, we talked about how her least favorite thing is being left out. um And I can, Mountain's Tooth made implications, and maybe this isn't quite where my quite the right space, but I feel

Speaker: like can lead inappropriate behavior as well. Yeah. not I also come to that little bit. yeah It didn't sound like it was explicit. yeah It didn't sound like it was explicit sexual behavior per se, but more just like kind of like how Vista felt about ah Gallant, but cranked up a lot, right? Where it's just like the fawning, the crush, the You're drawing his name and her name with hearts everywhere. And Kenzie has none of the filters.

Speaker: Yeah, exactly. And that's... None of the filters and all of the camera access. I was about to say, that's something that Houndstooth said really early on. He was like, have you like did you were you near here near her earlier?

Speaker: and it like or or he said to him, did you touch her? or something. He made a ah comment and it felt really like, what what's the point of that? But I realize he's talking about having something basically that they're bugged, you know, as they're talking to him or whatever.

Speaker: and I, yeah, that's, I mean, she makes such big boxes, but also, who's to say she can't make more subtle.

Speaker: i would go I mean, we get a lot of hints in this arc that that her tech ability is far more than she. Oh, yeah. I mean, we even have the message at the end where they like come back and they're like, oh, how was it?

Speaker: And then they're like, oh, it was fine, you know? And then she goes, well, at least I got to see him on camera. And you're like, whoa. Yeah. Like, yeah, we said Kenzie no bad and you still did it because she can't help herself.

Speaker: yeah No boundaries. Yeah. Bernard makes an interesting point. Her bots and glow worm are members of her team and houndstooth too. ah That's something I didn't catch on um Something I didn't catch on to. I didn't go back to that scene, but yeah, that's interesting too. Yeah, very interesting.

Speaker: Yeah. ah it's It's just rough. um And again, yeah, like you said, you can't, you know, cold turkey people, you know, going off of people, then...

Speaker: You know, yeah, as Fran says, everything is boxes or cameras, if you think about it. So like, yeah, everything. Yeah. Everything. Everything's a box. If you're square.

Speaker: was to say in Minecraft, you'd be going absolutely nuts. Hmm. Yeah. Put a pin in all of this. Just invents Minecraft. Definitely. So. you know, there's a theory that Hannah has about Kenzie that I think we've talked about before.

Speaker: My theory changes constantly about Kenzie. Which one? ah the Kenzie is a bot. Oh, yes. So I... Okay. Well, yeah. No, i I really do feel like Kenzie's...

Speaker: We said it about her dad. and We talked about that. Yeah, we talked about about her dad. I'm not too... It doesn't make him much really exclusive. Right, right, right. i there's there's a There's a point even later on in this arc. I think it's in chapter seven or six.

Speaker: I can't remember. um Where Victoria walks in and she like sees... Kenzie, and she's like, Kenzie, were you here all night? And then you hear the voice being like, oh, sorry, no, that's just a projection.

Speaker: And the image like flickers. And Victoria couldn't tell the difference. So I'm kind of convinced that Kenzie that we see isn't even Kenzie. Like maybe Kenzie has reduced herself down or maybe we see is the avatar. Yeah.

Speaker: you know. The Dragon Defiant Theory is pretty good. Yeah, we see her face ah um holograms that she can she can, like, mask her face and her body as well.

Speaker: Victoria's like, and you should turn that off. So I know, I think she even says, like, that you're not, you don't have black eyes. You're not asleep. You've slept. That you've slept. Because the circle's under the S. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah, so obviously her tech is really, really good and yeah easy to fool people. Even though I had to know what to look for. Yeah. So I had a note on that. So if Kenzie is a bot, allegedly, allegedly the people addict makes a lot of sense, especially if she was perhaps created to be a very literal social media platform.

Speaker: But what happens if social media platform is starved of it of people? All right. Like, if you're literally programmed to be a platform in which socializing happens, and you're cut off from that.

Speaker: So is Kenzie Defiant and Dragon's daughter? Is that what we're getting at? We're looking at hard light constructs. Circular box is also a box.

Speaker: Look, like you said, box, you know, is ah is a box-shaped, you know, person still a box? You know, person-shaped box? Listen, you eat enough square pizza and eventually... yeah You are what you eat? Is that the point there? Al's grays in the cocoa field? Chocolate milk.

Speaker: That's all saying. Can't explain. Ooh, is she Parahaman's online main sentient? ah I would imagine perhaps something like that.

Speaker: Maybe. Yeah. and I'll be honest, I forgot Parahumans Online is spelled that way, so I'm like, what you mean she's pho? Like Vietnamese food sentient? I know, right? but so She's sentient pho.

Speaker: She is c sentient pho. I mean, you know. and We talked about bad names. That's Kenzie's bad cape name. She's the pho king, you know.

Speaker: ah ah that she's ah she's the fucking you know No, no. Which is a real restaurant we had back where used to work. know Yep, yep, yep. Lindsay's ex and Instagram fused together in a super AI body.

Speaker: Oh, jeez. Also, at this point in time, since nobody has asked about it, and we won't count this on the bingo either, because once we have to bring it up, does anybody know what HOSV stands for without looking it up?

Speaker: H-O-S-V. Can you use in a sentence? They designated a a ah Brockton was under a scrutiny of perhaps being designated an H-O-S-V.

Speaker: Or a small town that has been taken over by villains. Holy-Ockin-shit, evacuate.

Speaker: Also, ah only wrong answers in chat, please. um Wait, wait. say so right Tell me what the what the word with the letters are again. H-O-S-V.

Speaker: Okay, hold on. Because I'm not going to fucking H-O-S-V. Heroes out space vacated. Hyper Orion, Hyper Onion Sector Virgin.

Speaker: Possibly. Very possibly. I like that one.

Speaker: High on some Vaseline. that Holy oof Superman victory. i love it.

Speaker: I love it. Hot octopus squeezes Vicky. That's just the name of the Glory Girl X Sveta fan fiction. Yes, it is.

Speaker: Absolutely. um ah You want the correct answer now? No, I'm thinking. I'm going to guess SV is supervillain. Oh, that's good. It is not supervillain.

Speaker: Never mind. House of supervillain. Home of supervillain.

Speaker: ah Whole outhouse. Y'all are killing Bernard right now.

Speaker: Okay. I don't know. um Okay. Jacob, for you. What if I told you that this was a Star Wars reference? Oh, God.

Speaker: what if i What if I said it was in regards to Mos Eisley? This wasn't a podcast and I had time to not entertain people and sit down and think. to read religion, a Mos Eisley?

Speaker: Mos Eisley. Hive of scum and villainy. Oh my God. That is correct. It is the hive of scum villainy. Nice. yeah Wow. that's funny. Never a more hot wretched hive of scum and villainy.

Speaker: That's pretty good. I like that a lot. I still think holy auch and shit, evacuate is pretty good. I like that one lot. Hell stupid village. Hell on stupid village. Yeah.

Speaker: Hot dog, onions, sesame seeds, viigrys vinegar. What you're saying is that that town is well done. Saving it might be rare. Weld on? What was that? Weld on. Weld Weld on.

Speaker: Weld mentioned? Alright. 4.5. 4.5. well done well done ah meld mentioned well but all right and our welmar four point five were point five The team discusses various things. Kinsey designs her mask.

Speaker: Ashley and Kinsey argue about Houndstooth. Zveta and Vicky assist Houndstooth's team in Cedar Point. um There you go.

Speaker: It's probably one of those long chapters. yeah yeah Yeah. I did like, though, This one and later when they're talking about Ashley's costume, how Kinsey's like, I can make like moving masks. I was like, that is cool.

Speaker: Yeah. it's Like as a concept for a costume, i was like, oh my gosh. Kenzie's given me like just huge Mysterio vibes from from Spider-Man. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker: Especially the Marvel MCU, the visual of that, of just having these projections that can just move with the crowd and totally like just rewire the whole scene is is so cool.

Speaker: Also, two plus, no, they did not ask about the HOSV. I had to bring it up. We didn't get it. We did not count that one. We don't count the three ETs either. So far, it's a pretty dry bingo run.

Speaker: I'm sorry. We could be benevolent. You've got a pretty dry arc, my dudes. did see cat in the background, if that helps. I saw a cat. What? There was a cat in the background? There was a cat. There was cat. Jumped down behind you earlier. I watched it happen on Discord, and then I turned, and I watched it happen online.

Speaker: Because they're just going to delay. Camera one. like Camera two.

Speaker: I mean, Jacob did get it, so he could be benevolent and let him have it. you know i mean did You did prompt me for it, though. It took it took some prompt. At least he got it. depends yeah You didn't reveal it.

Speaker: It was more so that if anybody was going to bring it up. Alan edged the answer like 90% there and Jacob just took the last time. Okay, we'll allow the HOSP, but no three ETs.

Speaker: How benevolent. What a sweetie. what us yeah all right i do I do get strong um crush vibes from Kinsey here with the yeah kind of the like Vista Gallant thing where it's the like, you know, Ashley's like, I hated that guy.

Speaker: Like, what an asshole. And she's like, no, no, he's not. He's the best. He's not. He's great. And she gets like, she gets actually mad. Like she runs up, does a dodge move, and then like grabs Ashley like pull her off balance. It's like, don't you fucking do this.

Speaker: Listen here. Yeah. Yeah. Because Ashley has a soft spot for or Kenzie. Because she's going to be her henchman one day when she goes villain. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker: and I did. the um no ah Go ahead, Nick. No, you got it, Jacob. Okay. I did take note of how quickly everybody stepped in once like voices started to get raised.

Speaker: It gave me the sense that for this group, at least probably early on when the therapy started, there might have been some tension before. And they were kind of... you like Because as soon as they started to get in on it, everybody like got into position about like how to break them up like they had been there before.

Speaker: just felt It felt familiar to them, which I thought was interesting. Yeah. with type of that yeah This ride or die moments with Ashley that make her extremely likable. I find her annoying 90% of the time.

Speaker: And then she pulls shit like this, which is still kind of annoying. But like the switch of like, somebody talks bad about Kenzie. I am to merc this fool. And you're like, damn, Ashley. that in it i like I knew you had that in you, but I didn't know you had it in you for other people.

Speaker: And ah it makes you extremely likable now. um Yeah. You're still wrong, but likable. I get the... That's the ah what's the quote from from Community. I feel like Ashley being like, this group might be a toilet, but it's my toilet.

Speaker: Only I get your shit in it. You know? Yeah. It gives, um it does give kind of Rachel, Rachel bitch vibes, right? Where it's like, what you know, once she's on your side, you're like, oh okay, cool. Like, no, please don't kill them dogs, but loyal to the end. Yeah.

Speaker: Um, yeah. And then we get this cool. Oh, go ahead. Another shout out for good things that I love. Uh, Tristan, which knowing his, flame you know, it was very, uh, uh, like just assertive personality.

Speaker: Um, I put down the ability to shut the fuck up mid stride is a rare one. And i he did that. And i he was like, you know what? Nope. we're We're done. I'm just not going to say anything else.

Speaker: And, uh, it's a thing that I've been trying to practice more. And I really liked that he did that.

Speaker: Nice. Attaboy. Yeah. Absolutely. Please laugh it up. i'm I love you so much. That's all I'm going to say. Yeah. it's It's hard having somebody who knows you as well as a spouse in the room when you're like, I'm trying to be better about this. And they're like, are you though?

Speaker: Practice me, Sperry. I didn't say that. Let's remember. didn't say if I would like the record to show that I'm laughing at Jacob, not laughing at Alan.

Speaker: And I was the one who said it. Nick was. And I just would like the record to show that all I said was that I love Alan.

Speaker: Wow. The audio podcast is just enabling him.

Speaker: yeah Oh, man. What were you going to say, Nick? i It's just a small thing, but Houndstooth... I cannot say that word. Houndstooth's group going into Cedar Point.

Speaker: they just I just imagine they like walk down Main Street um and the villains confront them. And all I can think of is, because they were mentioned earlier, the the laugh that Danny does in the Ninja Sex Party song, If We Were Gay, at the beginning,

Speaker: I love it. It makes me want to be friends with him so bad just for that laugh. Yeah. They've got such swagger. I imagine they're doing it like up like like blind like high five. like Slap, slap. Yeah. like You got him.

Speaker: You got him, daddy-o. Yeah, exactly. You have the one in the background just doing the... Yeah. yeah a guess your well and Turns out that's not what your mother said last night. Hey-oh! Ha-ha-hoi!

Speaker: Oh, yeah. From the Aquaman. Oh, yeah. We're so villainous. yeah Yeah. I imagine he's that, but he's a hero. He's that, but he's a hero. Yeah. and Love it. um the Just the Jeff Goldblum laugh from Jurassic Park. I ah all right ah love it so much.

Speaker: Oh, my God. It's so good. but Before, I really like Houndstooth. Yeah. yeah is Yeah, I don't... No idea what he and his crew do, but vibes-wise, I think they they pass the vibe check, right?

Speaker: um Just fantastic. And then, though, they are about to get blown up, though, by Wei-Hang. s Sink and... What are their names? Kitchen... Kitchen Sink?

Speaker: Is it Kitchen... Kitchen Sink. Kitchen Sink. Kitchen Sink. Is everything but the Kitchen Sink? Is it Kitchen and Sink? Are those to the two names? Nope, that's Kitchen Sink and... remember Hook?

Speaker: Hook line. Hook line. It's hook line and sink. That's right. Hook line and sink. Hook line and sinker, but they're hook line and kitchen sink. Nice. Yeah. Yeah. yeah I did always want to say hook wolf, which was throwing me off every time.

Speaker: And not nearly as dangerous. I was going to make the same joke. You mean air wolf? I was about to say that. Fran, we hadn't gotten the side piece yet. Thank you for taking that out.

Speaker: Very nice. um Just imagine we're entering the old Woust, like a cowboy movie. That is exactly what I was thinking. But in like a comedy cowboy movie.

Speaker: They whip out, they they draw, you know, pistols. Those are some Garbo names, and I love it. Get the fuck out of here. These are the best names. What do you mean? Okay, wait, I actually have a question. Listen, can't all be Mouse Protector, okay? Like, we gotta... That's true.

Speaker: Or Rat Catcher. Or Rat Catcher. So, what was... Did we find out what Houndstooth Power was? Houndstooth's Power was? Houndstooth's Houndstooth.

Speaker: He doesn't show it. i We have not shown it. Yeah, we haven't seen yet. yeah Okay, because houndstooth is a fabric pattern. That is correct. Oh, is it? That's funny. Yeah, like argyle or plaid houndstooth. Interesting. and here I was just thinking like like little little dangly things in mouths.

Speaker: Chat? No, I think... That counts. Oh, okay. I'm going to admit that they don't know what houndstooth is. Nice. Nope, we did not. I will say I think houndstooth is most commonly used on chef's pants or ah in like fancy vests. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker: Interesting. I'm trying to look at powers now. Yeah, Houndstooth is used for... Oh, I've seen that pattern. you have. It's very very business business jacket, but for women pattern yeah is what I've seen it on, I think.

Speaker: Huh? Hey, we have a bingo! Shout out. Two plus four. Let's go oh I'm going to take a guess that it is ah cats on camera.

Speaker: houndstooth what counts as a camera and hive of scum and villainy let's see oh uh oh rain is the most pitiful someone know we didn't worry that about ashley versus houndstooth and cats on camera very nice nicely done bravo well done winner two plus michael we need a good bingo sound effect just for the future okay Hey, we have another one from Wonderland who had we haven't.

Speaker: Well, I don't know if we've gotten to one of those yet. But. and You know what? We'll probably will. So Wonderland, we'll come back to that.

Speaker: ah No, um only kitchen sink has showed up. Bernard side piece has not made an appearance yet. yeah Yeah, Kitchen Sink is the only one who's showed up. And we didn't really even get to see him do anything.

Speaker: We just hear about what he can do later that he can create and throw random objects um and kind of explode them around. Hookline's power seems really interesting to me as well.

Speaker: He's got this long... Yeah, he's he's got the ah the the get over here power from Mortal Kombat, I think, is my understanding. Strong, what's the June...

Speaker: the Roadhog guy from... Oh, Overwatch Roadhog, I think is his name. Oh, there we go. Roadhog. The Roadhog guy. But I imagine that hook, like... Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker: That hook. um Yeah, so... But then Sveta and Victoria... hook line gets stuck under a car right like that's oh that's good special like yeah because that's just drags him back get him under a car which i love if they weren't heroes that would be horror horror movie villain level stuff of like oh yeah no no don't take me under the car fuck She's like yeah every slimy alien tentacle thing. Yeah, so she drags him under the car and then Victoria piles cars all the way around so that he can't like climb back out. like He's stuck under this car until someone can like move shit and he can escape it. Until Moose kindly comes over and helps out.

Speaker: And has to explain to him how that was the basis best case scenario.

Speaker: yeah Yeah, I love that Moose is like, listen, I've met Victoria before. I know her real well. like

Speaker: That's just how I imagine Moose would talk about her. It's like, look, me and Victoria, we go way back. Listen, you don't want to mess with her. Way back. In my mind. She messed up his face, but he's still like, I think of her fondly. You know what?

Speaker: Chat, count that. You can mark off Moose X Victoria. and yes ah What? and we that here to or Is that a fan fiction? either Is that one? That's hilarious. It better be. That's like an actual healthy fan fiction that I could Every ship is possible. You you have a a bay full of these ships and they any one of them could set sail.

Speaker: Now, are some of these even boats? No. They're not even in in the in the water. I'll cut it off there.

Speaker: That's so silly. Gosh. Can you say that about all of Alan's bits where you're just like, I can cut it off there. I could keep this going, but let's just cut it off. We probably should stop. Damn.

Speaker: That's so good, though. I'm under a car. and i'm Sorry, Alan. Catching a lot of strays here tonight.

Speaker: You know, I bring this on my smell. Well, 4.B. 4.B. well four point b b Oh, one more thing. eight Rain is just what if you had to defend, we'll say Madison. I think that was who ah all the way back in the glow worm.

Speaker: Yeah. Vicky has the conversation with. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Madison. Rain is just what if you had to defend Madison from the undersiders? Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. yeah They were a little more little more blood bloodthirsty. was like, oh, what if ah what if i they found out that like they didn't get the, hey, I don't want you to bother my bullies.

Speaker: um And like, you know, Madison is kind of with them, the periphery, and is like, oh, they're coming for me. They're going fuck me up. Yeah, for real.

Speaker: I'm trying to be a good person, sort of. I don't know. I'm figuring that out. what we prepared I don't want to die. and God. Well, speaking of the person whose life is terrible, Rain 4.B. Cluster.

Speaker: So this is Cradle's Night. Rain's life continues to be a public service about announcement about why you shouldn't be in or join Colts. Or, in his case, have parents who join Colts because he was taken in as a wee lad. Just don't have parents. If there's anything every Disney movie shown us, don't have parents.

Speaker: as As one kid says in ah the book Great Expectations by the great Charles Dickens, if you have to marry somebody, you should marry an orphan.

Speaker: but So you don't have to deal with their parents. You know? He's got a point. Damn. Okay. Oh, wait. Beefroni says, can we talk about how Moose's initials in the interlude a couple arcs back were MK? His real name is Moose Knuckle.

Speaker: No, no. Is his name Moose Knuckle? Is his name Moose Knuckle? question I hope not. I really hope not. Who's to say? No. And Fran, that is the Undersiders coming after Shadowstalker is kind of what happened. Yeah, that's pretty what happened. Shadowstalker was not repentant in the slightest.

Speaker: So, true. Yeah. Also, Taylor didn't want to murder her. I was just goingnna go i was going to go a bit more into detail. From what I remember for Cradle's Night, um very similar starts in the dream, as I recall, with the stampede at the mall.

Speaker: um Cradle's Night, I feel like we don't get as much of, if I recall correctly. Yeah, it's a lot of just blurred images and then we're... Yeah, blurred images and things.

Speaker: um Rain, this is this is the scene where, if I recall correctly, Rain asks his uncle to fight him. Yep. ah Basically, train me how to fight. He lets his uncle beat him up because he wants to know if my life is on the line, can I survive?

Speaker: No, he doesn't let him. He just gets the shit beaten out of him. No, he doesn't let him. i mean What I mean is he he does um get beaten up. um We find out his power is both more dangerous and less dangerous than we thought it was because he hits his uncle in the head with one of the lasers.

Speaker: He's like, please don't move. I don't want you to die. His uncle pauses, freezes for like 10 seconds, and then he's fine. But then he hits him in the stomach. And he realizes the way his lasers work, they stop at first contact.

Speaker: Yeah. So it hits his shirt and it does nothing else. It cuts his shirt off. Yeah. But he doesn't cut his skin. um Yeah, exactly.

Speaker: So basically we find out his power. We knew it was powerful, but it's not as good as we thought it might have been. i feel like. It's like a good... here alternate manton effect thing they we're like oh it could bypass the manton effect as long as they're not wearing clothes you know whoopsie yeah yeah gotta get a headshot every time rain um And hope they're not wearing a helmet.

Speaker: so black you also Or glasses. Or glasses. Or literally anything. A scarf. Mesh. now Mesh. You know. Yeah. you know Wait. Oh wait. Capes wear masks most of the time? Oh.

Speaker: This is also where we see a little bit more of his relationship with Aaron. Aaron has been confronted by Sayre, one of the leaders the fallen, ah super creepy guy who wears a horse head.

Speaker: um And she's debating, like, my parents brought me here, but they've been taken in, but I don't... Can I leave? I don't know what to do. ah Rain also has a bit of a heart-to-heart with Tristan, where Tristan talks about, like, hey, you used to be a terrible person, ah you know, but you've grown. You used to think I was horrible because I'm gay, but, you know, guess what?

Speaker: You've grown out of that. You can do better. um You have done better, and... you know basically just kind of showing him a bit of support ah there as well.

Speaker: so Yeah, rough rough interlude for sure. All of these are so interesting, but so painful. yeah you know This was the interlude. i you know One of the ones that is drawing me in. you know yeah As mentioned by one of our patrons, like this is the arc that finally pulled them in. and ah For me, these interludes are also doing it.

Speaker: it's really good for me uh ally turns out to not be the worst um yeah just a poor girl in a really fucked up situation and has some of the most banger ass lines so far um yeah the one where she's like hey rain if you really want to be helpful you really want to do something for me you want really want to do something nice get your shit together like stone cold stunner Steve Austin into the ground after he's already been beat up.

Speaker: Like, but you know, he needs to hear this. And then possibly one of the like most, I don't know, just hit. Gut punching. Talking about if you don't give up on Aaron, I won't just be the pity incest wife.

Speaker: I'm going to be the pity incest wife with a heartbroken husband. And I was like, holy fucking shit, Allie.

Speaker: Yeah. yeah I remember her being kind of a bitch before, like a complete, you know, you know, bitch for you know no reason. And this is her like, no, she's a stone cold bitch for good reason. And I love her.

Speaker: It's great. Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

Speaker: This is also the chapter. Go ahead, Anna. I was going to say this is just the chapter also where what's his face gives him a ride. Right. Lachlan. Lachlan. Yeah.

Speaker: And and they talk about Ali.

Speaker: Yeah. that Just the way they're talking about it. Lachlan's new tattoo that he's got with the Christian imagery tattooed all over his back and mixed in with other stuff. Yeah. and He's like, well, I like Ali, but I don't know if she likes me. And this other girl, I know she likes me, but I don't know if I like her.

Speaker: it's just like what it would be a sweet like bro scene of like, you know, rain being like, hey, man, you know, you gotta, you know, weigh your options and talk to people and I can do some talking for you.

Speaker: If it weren't in the middle of a cold where this is like not, hey, I have a crush on this girl. I want to ask her out. And instead is who can I tell the leaders to force to become my wife? Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. and and And with all the pairings, the talk of pairings, and literally Allie having just recently talked about the the the pity incest wife, like, oh no.

Speaker: Well, one of the things that Lachlan points out is that he would he wants to know what Allie thinks because he doesn't want to force yeah a marriage went on her. He's like, I really like Allie.

Speaker: she's the one I would prefer. But if she doesn't want me, I don't want to make that happen. Like, because I could, obviously, and I don't want to do that. um

Speaker: He's... Yeah. Yeah. I feel... I feel dirty. Yeah. And I mean that in the best possible These chapters are the best of the arc.

Speaker: Oh, okay. yeah Yeah. I feel dirty, but in like a really good way. Yeah. and I'll say it. and You can count it. Saying that immediately after mentioning the incest wife thing, Hannah, it's just really got me.

Speaker: No! No!

Speaker: Bingo, you can count this just because I... Beefaroni Lachlan is not a cape. um no I didn't think so. He just really hot. He's a dude.

Speaker: He's man. You can count this in bingo. um Lachlan's just an earnest boy. yeah Yeah. Yeah, I think so. Do you think she'll like it? Turns around has just the most horrendous tattoo on his back. Like,

Speaker: oh Oh, well, actually, you know what? The lines are drawn really nice. Like, I've seen some people get some really shittily done tattoos. At least it's... The ink settled in nicely to your skin, I see. Yeah. It's like Jesus...

Speaker: it's like jesus Virgin motherfucking Christ. And then two middle fingers on either side. Like, whoa.

Speaker: That was a choice to put that on your body. All over your back, my dude. That's... ah care not that Not that I would ever eat even remotely be tempted to get something like that. But yeah, there is that like... Just that that fear I do have with tattoos of like you get one and people are like,

Speaker: um mix um Oh, literally mom. That's a choice. is Any of my tattoos. oh You have great tattoos, though, Hannah. You too, Alan and Michael.

Speaker: I do. I do have great tattoos. My mother doesn't like them. And Jacob, we share unblemished skin. Also, Wonderland, I will definitely count that. if i If it wasn't counted before, if somebody did say something nice about Lachlan before, it's definitely counted now.

Speaker: Wonderland has a mango. Yay. Bingo baby. Go back to that. It is a bingo baby. Zoom in enhance.

Speaker: ah Somebody missed on know town's tooth. Lachlan's a good lad. Cats and camera. I've scum and villainy. Let's go. Let's go. All right. 4.6. Yeah, we got to All right.

Speaker: Four. point six it sticks yeah we got where to go right ah

Speaker: Victoria deals with the law and family issues and finds she does not like the intersection. The group keeps trucking and Ashley explores her identity. um Yeah, so I... Natalie, with your... Fuck Natalie. Yeah. Fuck her.

Speaker: Yeah. Why? Why? Why? one thing right why why We're not understanding the boundary that Victoria has placed and then places again and then places again and then places again. And Natalie just, bam, rhymes right through all of them. Like, stop.

Speaker: Here's the thing. i I don't know that I have, but I feel like I could have been Natalie before. In the sense of... Somebody comes to you earnestly, genuinely. You don't know the whole story, but they're like, hey, you're hanging out with so-and-so soon. Would you mind just talking to them about like what's happened between them and i like Just you know see if they're willing to... check like And you know Carol...

Speaker: Carol also, is also like your boss coming to you and being like, hey, ah personal favor. I'm so sorry. You know, and you know, Carol's talking like that to this poor girl. Natalie has no idea what's going on. Right. Like i I, I more feel bad for Natalie because I, I get the sense that she's genuinely like, this is a mom who's concerned about her daughter.

Speaker: And now I'm concerned because, you know, like I feel bad and Victoria is reacting so negatively. Like, oh man, i I don't know. And Victoria even is self-aware enough to realize in her eyes, probably like the immature one.

Speaker: Yeah. And that sucks. Yeah. As Fran says, I like Natalie, so I'll blame Carol for the summer. Oh, absolutely. but This 100% Carol's fault. Yeah, 100%. I just don't like... Absolutely.

Speaker: I can understand her coming into the situation with that like mentality. But Victoria tells her like four or five different times like, stop. please stop.

Speaker: Please stop. Like you shouldn't have to be told four or five times. I didn't feel like that was the case. I felt like Natalie navigating the first time situation for this.

Speaker: Now the next conversation they have this, then yeah. But otherwise Natalie's trying to figure out like, okay, she's having a really adverse reaction to this. And I just asked like a simple, like, do you have a job right now?

Speaker: And I, Don't like I'm trying to figure out what's going on. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, yeah, for sure. i I still i feel bad for her at first, but you get to a certain point where it's like, I feel like I feel like Victoria is being very clear. Yeah, there is a there is a read the room connection.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. There's a read the room kind of moment where you're like, OK, you asked one too many times, I think. Like, clearly, Victoria doesn't want to talk about this. Move on. Yeah. Oh, and I would say we get to that.

Speaker: I'll retroactively go back. I have noted Wild Bo must also fucking hate Natalie because every time she gets mentioned, it is just about how she doesn't look very good. How her outfit is kind of shit.

Speaker: And oh, yeah, I think I'm a catalog. Literally every time I've noted in here. noticed that too, actually. Why? Why, Wild Bo? Why do you fucking hate her so much? she And when he describes her, it's just like, she's just a person wearing an outfit. It just sounds like the most, like, she wore an outfit for her job and you're like, so fucking shitty. Well, we know how Wild Bo is with describing outfits.

Speaker: I know. And it would it stood out so much. This is one of those, if it wasn't clear before. Yeah. Yeah, you guys had mentioned that before that Victoria was really nitpicky with people's outfits. And i was like, I haven't seen that yet. And then this this arc slapped me in the face like, oh so it's just like yeah it's It's just not good, honey. yeah just very It's like you picked it out of a catalog but had no understanding of like how that would flatter your body.

Speaker: Yeah. yeah Yeah. For sure. i see i i see it as natalie ah Victoria judging her because of her mom. It's also very Taylor thing. Yeah, I think at this point we've decided it's not just the main character of view. It's a wild though thing. It is wild though. It might be thing. Because this has been consistent even in the interludes and stuff.

Speaker: It's gone beyond the person. it's I don't know what beef he has with a Natalie in his life. but yeah why i mad You know what it is Maybe Wildbow just really... Wildbow just missed... it Maybe Wildbow missed his calling as like ah somebody who does like, you know, Project Runway stuff.

Speaker: And just really... Yeah, fashion consultant. See, Wildbow needs to take notes from Derek Guy. Because Derek Guy gives scathing fashion critiques.

Speaker: But without being as like judgy of a bitch. like it's just very yeah for those of you who don't follow their guy on uh on the socials you should um amazing fashion bernard's saying that because she doesn't like this person then she's describing her outfit more heavily because that's kind of a thing she does there's also a moment in one of the interludes where there's actually a couple of, I think it's one or two moments in the interludes where talking about trashy outfits and how these girls look, you know, slutty because they're wearing tank tops. and I was like, except when Aaron wears them, then they're not trashy. I'm like, oh my.

Speaker: Oh yeah, that's right. Because she has the cutout sleeve and you can see like a hint of her bra and he's like, oh, I must look away. Yeah. It's okay if she does it, but if other girls do it, they look trashy. You know, I kind of get that. All right. kind of get that though. You've definitely...

Speaker: As a teenage boy, especially, like, those moments of, like, ugh. but Once again, this isn't, like, one of those things I understand.

Speaker: I understand what he's saying. All the way back to, like, the imp thing like, I understand how you can wear, like, the neon fishnets and look kind of like, ugh, like, what what are what is going on with that color?

Speaker: But I feel like it's extremely judgy when Yeah, there's some definite judgment going on. It might be a little bit of the author's bias and hinting through, I think.

Speaker: um Speaking of fashion, though, I did like the conversation with Ashley. Yeah. You know, that was kind of fun. And like I said, the the eye mask thing sounds really cool. but yeah quite like Is this when Ashley yeah like it just blows up her head to see if her hair would stop her power?

Speaker: Is yeah that how that read to everybody else? Where she was just like, let's find out. just saying I think she knows it will. She knows it will. She's proving like, you know like oh when I use my power, it turns my hair white so I can't dye Look, watch.

Speaker: That was great.

Speaker: great

Speaker: Yeah. um yeah yeah yeah Yeah. Yeah. Great. Great conversations there. the The funny thing of her being like Victoria is like, well, you could cut your hair short and then you have to be a good guy for as long as it's short.

Speaker: As long as it's short. It's pretty funny. yeah I'm like, okay, that's clever. And she's like really obsessed with dresses. I love that. I think that's really fun. ah knows what she likes. She's like, this is what I want and I'm going to wear it. And I've determined this about myself and it's dresses or die.

Speaker: Victoria being like, well, know, you got this kind of like alternate goth thing going on. She's like, I'm not goth. I'm not goth. Why would you take that? So So funny to me. as she is a walking hot topic.

Speaker: love it. Oh, so much. i love it ah so much yeah But I love the idea ah that Kenzie's talking about, about blacking out her eyes or if she's like wearing all white, like whiting out her eyes or like having like smoke trailing from her eyes. Like that's so cool.

Speaker: Like that's such a cool, like unique thing to have as part of your costume. Like that's just a bonus of having Kenzie on your team, I guess. Yeah, true. The interesting conversation about the way Manton affects that interact with costumes too, about how you could weave a thread of hair through your costume so the Manton effect, like it doesn't, your power doesn't affect it.

Speaker: It's really fascinating too. um Like how with Victoria, eventually her force field adapted to include her costume um before she, you know, had the whole wretch thing. um And so there was this like, oh, like at a certain point, my skirt stopped getting blown up every time something happened and I used my force field.

Speaker: because it my in my mind, that was who I was. part of me. Yeah. So, kind of cool. All right, we have second bingo here. Poor Reigns Cluster, Wild Though Hates, Why Does Wild Though Hate Natalie, Moose X Victoria, and Somebody doesn't know what Houndstooth is.

Speaker: see does there Very nice. Alan, didn't you bring up the Wild Bow Hates Natalie thing, though? Does that count? I did. I couldn't let that one go i couldn't I wrote it so many times in this notebook.

Speaker: I mean, I was talking about how much I hated Natalie. so we were as We were getting there. we were We were close. We were getting there, yeah. okay and sam we'll get eging um So, they actually mention a hair parahuman ah that makes...

Speaker: mix so yeah you got a pair air out out of hair um yeahtta this is actually a named character from the uh from a document that i found that wild bow drew up maybe for probably for one of those one shot things um uh from the wichita fallen believe it or not uh hair pair human is called deness

Speaker: So that parahuman does have a name and is out there. It's not Harry Potter. Fascinating. rose now I'm surprised they they went with it. From Wichita, get it?

Speaker: I don't. Ah, it good. i like one

Speaker: I liked it. Nice. Weaver dice. Yes, that's the word I was looking for. Thank you, Fran. To answer your question, Bernard, only Alan does the bingo sheet because he's the only returning.

Speaker: so It's just Alan. Yep. That's spelled D-N-E-S-S. D-E-N-E-S-S.

Speaker: Den. Wasn't sure. Wasn't sure. Harry Dredson. Harry Dredson. Wasn't sure if this was a D-Nice situation, you know. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: Shout out, Key and Peele. Substitute teacher sketch. I'm imagining substitute teacher with all of the with all the warm characters. or

Speaker: Scatter. Is there a scatter here? A skitter? Yeah. Skyter. Skyter. Where? Skyter. 4.7? 4.7? four point seven Yep, 4.7. The first thing that came to mind was how to mispronounce a Glory Girl and the best I came up with, Galigoral.

Speaker: Galigoral. yeah I don't like it. ah Anyway, 4.7. Ozier shines a light on Cedar Point. Rain drops the big news.

Speaker: Victoria senses something bad in the group and flies away. um okay Can we just talk about how stupid the name Ozier Especially as they revealed what it meant. That was so funny. This poor old man on the phone. It's just like AU, the chemical symbol for or you know letters for gold. And ah as you're like blue, the man on the phone just like, what? That's so funny.

Speaker: love that they've worked in the description to their introduction. like they're Like, their name, they're more proud of their, the meaning of the name than the name itself.

Speaker: It's great. It's so funny. Exactly. And I love that they have a little meaning behind it, but yeah, ah explaining to someone is stupid. Yeah, and Victoria's like listening in like, yeah, I think that's just making things more confusing. And the guy's like, look yeah what are you talking about? If it makes it easier for you to remember AU, like the chemical name for gold, and blue for azure.

Speaker: but What's that? but so I mean, it does end up working out in the end. like He is like, it is something with blue and gold. I don't know. You guys are like, mirror gold that Yeah. Prancer names the wrong team first and he's like, he's like, I don't know. Yeah, maybe. yeah

Speaker: It's not Azure, is it? And he's like, yeah, yeah, that's it. I'll wait that one. Yeah, that sounds right. Yeah. but I was thinking, though, I was like, you know it that was really clever because that is probably one of those things that would probably trip up.

Speaker: Because worried about Tattletail sort of cluing into everything. But like that level of disconnect between who is asking and then who is reporting to Tattletail. Like I was like, I bet that is something that would slow her down. Like she probably wouldn't pick up on that.

Speaker: I don't know. Well, I guess we'll see. But it made me think it was like that was kind clever. That was smart. Like trying to play a game of telephone to trip up Tattletail. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I do. It is funny. This guy's like knows where to find the villains in charge. He's like goes immediately knocking on the door.

Speaker: Prancer's like, what the heck, dude? Just call me. What are you doing here? why it's It's the, you know, this meeting could have been an email, man. What are you doing? Yeah, absolutely. Also, just the the no awareness. Like, oh, no, I just hung up with this group that's on to us.

Speaker: Let me go walk over to find them right now. They're not watching. Like, just yeah i was no awareness. yeah And then the the little thing where they they barely hear him say, just like,

Speaker: but the fuck is going on yeah I love that so much I do get I imagine like he's a villain leader and he's like okay what's a what's a place in this new world nobody cares about Cedar Point nobody cares about Cedar Point and then like a week after moving in three different hero teams have come to check you out and you're like no what's happening yeah leave me alone I love it so much I haven't even done anything yet It's like when somebody puts posters up and they're like, for a good time, call. And it's, you know, their friend's number. And you keep getting these. and you're like, who gave out my fucking number? Like, come on.

Speaker: all I did was move in lower rent. I'm a fine person.

Speaker: Rent's never been cheaper. Yeah. um But the more important part of this arc is Rainn. Reign of Fire.

Speaker: Lord have mercy. Reign of Fire. That is a name. Yeah, that's... Sheesh. That's the kind of name you give your kid and you're like, he'll grow up to be a great man one day. It's like he just gets bullied in high school instead.

Speaker: oh no. This was another scene where like... the And I get that they're children and this is painful. But for me... having Rain confess everything and then have like Kinsey be so upset, having, you know, Sveta be so upset, like at one level, I get it.

Speaker: But also you've known him for these past few months. You know that he's grown. He's not like that. He's clearly coming to you to admit this because he upset and wants to fix it and doesn't know what to do.

Speaker: So I don't know. i I was a little frustrated with the group receiving this one where it's like, okay, get that. you know i've I've not been the victim of prejudice or anything like that.

Speaker: ah Like you know many people have. And so i I can't understand what that feels like. So maybe I'm coming at this from a you know kinder life that I've lived, so to speak, than Sveta and Kenzie have. But I don't know. I just felt bad for him because he's like, hey, my life sucks and it sucks worse than you think it does because I'm in a cult.

Speaker: And they're all like, they kind of give him the like, oh, I don't know how i feel about you now kind of treatment. Yeah. Again, I get, but it's like, just feel bad. I just feel bad for him, I guess.

Speaker: Yeah. feel like Kenzie's response makes sense. um Yeah. The most. I think in terms of like who's overreacting and who isn't, I think Kenzie is like her react response is valid. Sveta's response, I feel like is pretty valid, especially with the example she gives with Ken and... and

Speaker: What's the name? that Basically, the two that were brutalized. yeah um but After telling that story, I'm like, whoa. So her response, also understandable.

Speaker: Honestly, the one I was kind of surprised about was Victoria's. That Victoria was like, I just have to leave right now. It felt... um Like, honestly, well, she is coming into it with the most, you know, filling in the blanks in terms of people's backstories and stuff.

Speaker: But it felt a little bit like of anyone to be upset, I would have thought Victoria would have stayed and, like, maybe, like, given him the silent treatment or, like, been visibly upset but not have, like, actually had to extract herself from the situation.

Speaker: But then again, like, to be perfectly honest, I didn't really... All through this this arc, we're talking about the fallen. And I'm kind of like, okay, yep, they're a cult and they're not good. And they've got bad practices and we see bad shit and it's really bad. And it's like, okay.

Speaker: But to my knowledge, in my head, I was like, well, they seem also kind of like contained a little bit at least. And it's not until Sveta tells the story that I'm like, holy shit. Like, okay.

Speaker: I don't think I... mentally realized how bad the fallen actually were until like yeah you get a ah broader picture here. And then you're like, oh maybe the response is,

Speaker: i Yeah, I mean, i I felt like I didn't get anger. She was a little angry, but I didn't get it mostly angry from Victoria. Because when she flies off, that's the very end of the chapter, right Because then she goes and talks to ah ah Yamada.

Speaker: Miss Yamada. Yeah. it It felt like to me, especially with the way the chapter ends, that it was more her... realizing that there's more to this there she's here for more than just to give guidance to this group was like the realization that um there's some there's some deeper issues here that uh yeah she because because she's angry at yamada like a little bit like a lot of that is the angry the anger towards that at the end where she's like

Speaker: feels a little betrayed. Like, you didn't really tell me why you wanted me here, did you? You were kind of hoping I was going to figure it out. And I think I did. you know yeah um And I think that would an interesting point. I think she found. but yeah There's a specific scene in Worm that she mentions it feeling like. I'm trying to remember exactly what scene it was.

Speaker: um I was going to see if I could scroll and find it real quick near the end. But there's a specific moment where she's like, this feels a lot like the moment my life. And I don't know that I'm ready to face that.

Speaker: I'm trying to think of what it was. While thinking about that, I also agree. I think for me, I think a lot of the reactions were overblown.

Speaker: But I'm also, i would argue, a relatively healthy individual. And these people are superpower beings that with a lot of trauma and a lot of, yeah you know, ongoing trauma and all sorts of stuff. So, um,

Speaker: It just reminds me of a recent thing that happened. Hannah, if you remember where ah we had an interaction with a couple of people and it was just like, oh, this is kind of awkward between two people.

Speaker: ah Like you realize that just because somebody's in like this profession or something doesn't mean that they've personally wronged you or like wronged Yeah. One of those things of like, oh, you you know you're a landlord, which you know maybe not great. That doesn't mean that they are trying to actively kill you. like Maybe I'm going to notch down a little.

Speaker: Yeah. so it's um to To go back to what you said, Hannah, Pete and Finn are the two. Pete and Finn, yeah. Yeah. um So that the moment that Victoria relates it to is the bank robber bank robbery.

Speaker: Yes, yes. That's when Tattletail revealed a lot more about, you know, with Amy and everything. Right. And she's like, that was point of no return where nothing was the same between me and Amy after that moment.

Speaker: And so she's feeling like this is a similar moment of like, this could be in in, because in Victoria's life, the bank robbery probably felt like a major moment, but not the biggest moment of her life.

Speaker: But as she looked back on it, she was like, that was a pretty significant moment that changed the course of history for me. Yeah. I think she's seen this in that same way. We're like, this is a major moment and these people maybe don't realize it yet.

Speaker: And I'm not sure that I'm ready to try to explain all of that and try to understand all of that. And, see if we can change the course of history because all she's thinking is the truth has come out.

Speaker: The course of this team's history is changing forever for better, for worse. I don't know yet. And I don't know what to do. So I just need to take time to think and talk to Miss Yamada. Yeah, no, that's good.

Speaker: That's really good. I thought that was a really good callback to that moment of like, interesting. Yeah. Cause you would think it would be the moment, like the bone saw moment, right. Is what we think of probably as Victoria's biggest moment. right Right. But it,

Speaker: it goes back to the bank robbery because there was a lot of the tattletale revealed. Yeah. If you look at the dominoes, where do they, start where do they start falling? Yeah. You know? yeah Yeah.

Speaker: That's, i this I think that's one of the highlight of highlights of the slow burn of this book is these moments here were like the callbacks to other things, the reframing them, the, the inner turmoil with these characters. Like this isn't the bank robbery. It's not a fight.

Speaker: between people physically this is ah confrontation between people who you understand all of them all of them you know you might agree or disagree a little more or a little less but like you get it why they're upset you get why people are reacting and certain ways and you know yeah it feel for them yeah yeah and i think um I will say I'll take back what element what I said at the beginning about the pace of word kind of being this arc being like the heartbeat thing.

Speaker: It really is like a slow rise because by the time we get to 4.7 for 4.6 and 4.7 are great. And then, you know, ending with what it does. It was great. Yeah, I agree.

Speaker: And I think to the point getting a little bit into the last intro, but to the point of why are the fallen that bad? Bernard mentioned as well, Victoria's interactions with them. Early on with the interview. So we know that she does have some experience with them.

Speaker: and think the difference is. The fallen. Unlike a lot of cults that may or may not exist today. Or that existed in the history of our country. The fallen are a steady.

Speaker: Persistent. Large group. Backed. Backed by superpowers. Right. They're not just a ragtag group of rednecks out in the hills. They are. you know They were and still are a persistent and powerful force.

Speaker: And I think that's what makes them so bad, right? Is that it's not just, oh yeah, like if you go to the the boonies of Alabama, you'll meet some racist people for sure. It's like, no, this is like a roving gang of racism. and Yeah, this is this is what if ah what if Scientology was a biker gang.

Speaker: yeah That's a great way to put it. Do you know what? Not bad. Sons of Mathers. Oh, nice. oh To get into four point ah Yeah. Shall we? Shall we 4.C it up and then finish up?

Speaker: Yeah, let's do it. ah Interlude cluster love lost night. ah Rain sees many ways to his doom, then has his decision making heavily compromised by an interlude with Mama Mathers.

Speaker: And I'll just add, love lost dreams are the worst. They're the worst. My God. My God. Wow. Brutal. Way to absolutely just wreck me at the end of this arc.

Speaker: Holy shit. Holy cow. You know what it gives? it gives Dan to Dan season one, episode seven vibes for me. abs to fuck Oh my God.

Speaker: Yep. the one hundred percent 100%. What an excellent. Yeah. yeah i have I have mixed feelings about Dan to Dan as an anime, but season season one, episode seven literally made me sob and I had to stop working and like go cry for a while.

Speaker: oh

Speaker: It's a true story. And then I tried to tell Chris about it later and cried telling her. it's ah Ruined my day.

Speaker: That's awesome. ok Get wrecked in the best possible way. Right in the feels. Anyways. right Yeah. Rough. Rough. Rough. Yeah. that's That's really...

Speaker: Do we think... Okay, just like... Is Carol the worst mother now? Are there worst mothers out there in the ah in a fallen sphere?

Speaker: We haven't seen them. You're talking about Mama Mathers? It's like... You're talking about love lost or Mama Mathers for No, not love lost. Love lost yeah is a tragic moment.

Speaker: Whoa. Whoa now. Yeah. Still kind of psychotic, but no, no, no. Yeah. No, going past that. Mama Mathers is the... ah Yeah. My theory is that love lost daughter was the fifth trigger.

Speaker: Ooh. That's one working theory I have. That's a good one. There was a thought that occurred to me is that there was a brief moment maybe where she triggered and then face hit the table and she died.

Speaker: Interesting. Yeah. Oof. God, that's... Maybe. Maybe. I'm not sure. The trigger maybe happened after she died. It's not quite clear, but... um

Speaker: Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. um Yeah, no, Mama Mathers, that's creepy. Oh, that was horrid. Oh, that was... all oh Nothing like an old lady in a white nightgown. Just, you know... yeah Here's the thing. She's not old.

Speaker: She's not old. She's mid-30s. no um yeah yeah one like The vibes are old lady, but they're but she's not actually an old lady. Which makes it creepier. She's gray hair, and she's willowy and tall. Like, like really tall.

Speaker: tall and spindly. and just um and indeed I just can only imagine her as an old ah though I can't see her as young. Like even if she's 30 she's like a smoker's 30 you know what I mean?

Speaker: Yeah. Absolutely. No, I did get a lot of, if anyone's seen The Leftovers, ah the the The Cult, which name escapes me at the moment. I don't know why. The Leftovers?

Speaker: Yeah, The Main Cult and The Leftovers. ah They all wear white, and it's like a matriarch-led, and just huge, huge fallen vibes as I was reading this this this whole chapter.

Speaker: It was just like, yeah, super creepy. and

Speaker: don't like cults. I'm not a fan of them. The Guilty Remnant? Yes, the Guilty Remnant. Thank you. Yeah. ah Mama Mathers has not quite this time around, but I remember the first time I'm reading it.

Speaker: Mama Mathers gives me the same ick that Bonesaw does. m Especially once we, but especially once her power starts to come out.

Speaker: Yeah. Because it's it's i don't I don't like it. I don't like it one bit. It is just jump scare the power. Yeah, I was going to say, her power... It was kind of throwing me for a minute. So, like, she can...

Speaker: Did we get a good sense of what it was or was it supposed to be? she I would say if somebody would like to explain it, not you, Chad. Somebody on here would like to explain it and then I will. Can I try? So what it sounds like is if you see her, she gets inside your head, kind of like a brain worm that's like weasels its way in And you like, so he had this whole conversation with her and then she was like,

Speaker: He was like, okay, I'll go. And she's like, what do you mean you'll go? You've been talking to yourself this whole time. um Like, ah from what it it it sounds like is that she's like, if you see her, she creates this, like, link with your brain, like some kind of psychic thing. And she, like, she's latched in now.

Speaker: And she can... be in your head and also do her own thing. So you can, like, he's having this whole hawk conversation with her. He sees her later and she's like, you know, looking around or like, here's him say something and she smiles. Like, she is...

Speaker: In his head. And I don't know if that's like... a It's that with like a a limited understanding of what... What I call them would be like apparitions, right? She creates apparitions that follow you around when you think of her. Or when you when something triggers a thought of her. Oh, crazy. And yeah she can see and hear through those apparitions to a limited extent.

Speaker: Yeah. Like where... um Because she says like, oh, you've been talking to yourself. But... i got I got an understanding of what I was saying to you. Like, I know what you were saying, even though, you know, you weren't really talking to me. Yeah.

Speaker: That's pretty good thing. Yeah. Creates the apparitions that haunt you, basically. She haunts you, and she can see what you're seeing and hear what you're hearing. Yeah.

Speaker: So, if you notice, there is a process of sensory impact. That she goes through with him.

Speaker: She talks to him and he can hear her as close as up in his ear. Yeah. When he looks at her, he can now see her whenever she wants him to.

Speaker: When she touches her touches him, she can feel him up anytime she chooses. Like she can make him feel the sensation of her touching him at any point in time when he thinks about her.

Speaker: So every sensation that you interact with her, she can then do that for as long as whenever you're thinking about her. um And it feels like it tapers off over time, maybe.

Speaker: But he's also clearly like... Yeah, he's been working at it for months to get her out of his head. And I imagine that she recognizes when she's like, she's like, my grip on him isn't as strong as it used to be.

Speaker: Call him in no. And the fact that she could the like, Oh, Oh, just a the, the, the touching and like the, like, you know, you're, you all sudden you think about her and she's like running her finger along your neck or something like that. so And because of those, like you talked about apparitions, um, the reference somebody used is Dybbuk.

Speaker: Um, which is a jewish essentially ghost that possesses people um i was talking in a metaphysical store today with a uh a jew witch and they were telling me all about the dybbuk so i got all the down low on this um but it is those apparitions they can see independently it like they are in that area kind of um and And so, you know, you are summoning them sort of into that space when you think about her.

Speaker: And, yeah. Yeah, i just like the chat's talking about how Mama Mathers is Santa. She's like, I see you when you're sleeping. I see when you're awake.

Speaker: I know if you've been bad or good. Stop jerking at you, horny kid.

Speaker: Mama Mathers just needs good a good you know Coca-Cola sponsorship. and right na real The real question is, as was asked, Mama Mathers, smash or pass?

Speaker: Damn it. You can't smash. You can't hit it and quit it. You smash. You've all played Gate, right?

Speaker: Yeah. I know what you're talking about. You remember what happens when you sleep with Raphael's succubus. Flash for me. What happens is you get what you deserve is what What happens is you after you do that, then wherever you go, whenever the pleasures themselves, they can call upon your body and use it.

Speaker: And you feel it. Okay, hear me out. We'll say this ideal scenario. Once you've done it once, she can make you feel that sensation. um Listen. Whatever you think. That's what I'm saying. that's i know, right?

Speaker: Three or four. That's what saying. More like mommy mathers. Am I right? I know. know. I hate it. I hate it so much.

Speaker: You know sometimes flat is justice and it feels like the flat is justice Lady Demetrest do right now. but

Speaker: ah so Listen, listen. that That lay so good you feel it for months after. You know what I mean? That's right. That's right. Like she's whispering in my ear. Whispering sweet nothings in my ear right now.

Speaker: Everywhere I go, I see her face. What do you literally what do you mean? Literally. but do you mean? It doesn't have to be. Oh, yeah. off in the quarter all hour yeah yeah

Speaker: oh yeah I'm just going to hide under my desk. I'm taking my mic with me. I don't want to. We've reached the end. We've reached the end. On a real more realistic point, someone made a good comment that I don't want to over because we got goofy.

Speaker: Um, who said it. ah B. Ferroni said, oh, she's religious guilt and I think that's a great way to think of her. She is the manifestation of religious guilt. That's super fucking good. I like that a lot.

Speaker: and That's legit. yeah Nice. I'm sorry you had to get through the Sleeping with Mama Mathers talk to get to that great point, but you know, that's the BBBC in a nutshell. we is ah That's awesome.

Speaker: BBBC in a nutshell. Keep the show. don't like BBBC busting nuts in this show. No! All right. We're at the end here.

Speaker: yeah ah We made Michael cry. so Yeah, we made Michael cry. Favorite people or powers?

Speaker: Moose. Favorite person. Moose. Moose, pretty good. Moose gets a good, yeah, I mean. power are probably is cool, too, but Moose, just as a person, he he was my favorite this arc.

Speaker: Yeah. um ah Him and along with ah our boy, the other hero, Kenzie's former ah leader. Houndstooth.

Speaker: Houndstooth, thank you. Gosh, yeah. Houndstooth gives a shout out for sure. Fran, we did not talk about Kenzie's smile. um I don't feel like it stood out all that much this go-round, but Kenzie is like nervous, smiling the entire time during the confrontation.

Speaker: I did catch that, but like... but I probably noticed it at the time and then promptly forgot it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I just took that as like her just being totally overwhelmed and not knowing what to do or react or say. And like when you're in that much of like a brain panic fight or flight mode, like you don't necessarily have control of or over if you're smiling or if you're laughing. Like people nervous laugh.

Speaker: I kind of just took it as that. But now that you guys have mentioned it like three or four times in the chat. Yeah, there was a bunch of mentions in the chat. Do I need to go back and read that just in case? I'll tell you right now, you don't. She just smiles. It's just that she's smiling the whole time. They wanted their bingos. You weirdos in chat. What are you doing? um Was it on the bingo card?

Speaker: It was not on the bingo card. Oh, okay. So, ah let's see. ah For me, since I'm surprised nobody talked about Seer more, just with the creepy like backwards horse head mask. the backwards horse head? And that they have a person that makes masks. And the grape apes?

Speaker: They have a ah parahuman that makes animal heads. Out of... Specifically... like Look like people kind of. No, no. They make them look like people before they kill them.

Speaker: Before they kill them, which is the fucked up part. That's crazy. Yeah. And the fact that it's like on backwards so that it's like the side of the head with the eyes. Creepy. It's so creepy.

Speaker: It's so creepy. But ah my special one, Mama Mathers, I think is... Just because think about it. Every time he thinks about her, she can be present in all of their therapy sessions and meetings and stuff.

Speaker: Oh, no. In terms of the creativity of the past, like, yeah. What a fantastically written character. Absolutely. I love it. I love the creepy ones. And like, no wonder she's kind of in charge because like she can that to what? The entire place? She's Santa.

Speaker: She's Santa. She's... I wonder if... eva answer So, like, what happens if Rain thinks about her during his, like, dream sessions with his... trip I was wondering the same thing.

Speaker: If he thinks about her while he's dreaming. That's a really good thought. How deep does the psyche well go? Yeah. Well, we did... We did, just to tie this back in, because since we're talking about it now, at the end of the interlude, when he's getting escorted out by the blind guy, that guy...

Speaker: assumedly gouged out his own eyes, right? Wait, was that, um, uh, Nazi Mama Mathers? No, it's that that felt really familiar. And I'm trying to remember why Who do we know that I know have their site anymore?

Speaker: I know. And I'm trying to remember his name. i was like, is that who it is? But I kind of read past it. Is am i on the right track? You're on the right track. We've only encountered the fallen one other time.

Speaker: before. Oh. Oh. ah Did he get his eyes eaten out? Maybe. but Maybe. Oh my god.

Speaker: my god. Yeah. Oh my god. Because he's down and then... Yeah. Wait. Okay. What was his name? It's right after the incident. and Or it's close to the incident that happens at the school and then later... T.T.'s. T.T.' 's and chat.

Speaker: wait Wait for them to get it. ah tea yeah oh I don't remember his name. i can i can remember the scene kind of. ah God. Elijah is his name.

Speaker: Yes. Elijah? Oh, that's not. So. Oh, no. It's too many characters. it It's the section where. i found it I remember.

Speaker: Valafor. ah Ah, yes, Valifor. Valifor. Brandy is so close to... Thank you. was about to say... yes all Okay, so but I was at him... That's supposed to be him at the end. yeah um Chat, this is why we have teas in chat. Let them fail or remember at their own pace.

Speaker: I appreciate you taking it back out. Yeah, Valifor. He... um He had the hypnotic sight power. I mean, I had to listen. That's right. Oh, my God.

Speaker: He's still eyeless, still hanging out. He's still eyeless, still hanging out. Fun fact. That is his mother. Oh. Yeah, when I looked it up, his name is Elijah Mathur.

Speaker: Yeah, and I wouldn't look any more than that, Nick. Nope, that's all I looked. That's all I saw. All I was like, i want to know his name and his powers and that's all I got. Yep. It's alright, guys. don't Don't be too mad in the chat. We'll we'll get there eventually.

Speaker: Yeah, that is... that is a it's hard It's hard because half the time we're asking you guys for help and half the time we're telling you to stop helping. yeah another it's another Another good question that we've kind of revisited every episode that was asked earlier by Bernard is update on who we think is the most worrisome member in the therapy group.

Speaker: Ooh. I think it's Rain. This, well, ah kind of feels, this kind of gets what I was thinking of, like, at the end of of of chapter seven, when Victoria's like, I think I know why.

Speaker: um and it that's, like, kind of the cliffhanger. Yeah. Like, it feels to me like it's the whole group. Like, this whole arc feels like it's built towards this this dynamic that they have where they're sort of codependent. It's not the right word, but like they're fiercely loyal to each other, but not in a healthy way necessarily.

Speaker: yeah And it feels like I'm trying to, I'm trying to read into the mind of wild bow. Like yeah what would he do to fuck us up? And the thing I keep coming back to is like, he's going to kill one of them off.

Speaker: Somebody in this group is going to die. You've got to kill somebody. And the group is going to kind of implode a bit around that. Feels like the time bomb that Victoria is picking up on. something who if he Who would be that person, though? like Who would be the most poor person and that if they died, the group would lose their shit?

Speaker: Yeah. Sveta. it's Oh, I was going to say Kenzie. Ken, the child goes. like yeah Holy fuck. Everybody's like, I can't hero again because I got a child killed. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah, that's true, too. um Yeah, I mean, I would say that it it's basically everybody but Ashley, I think, is the thing. It's like everybody but Ashley is like actually a problem.

Speaker: um Yeah. It's kind of how it feels. Where, like, okay, Kinsey's clearly got some emotional social emotional issues that are really potentially dangerous for herself and the team.

Speaker: Sveta has still a lot of, like, she hides it well, but she's got a lot of emotional issues, and she could also accidentally kill people at any time, like, if things got out of hand.

Speaker: um You've got ah Tristan and bri Byron who are, you know, doing doing their creepy twin thing having a hard time with that. And let's not forget the Hitman that they hired. Yeah, the Hitman as well. There is a Hitman who's... Especially as much lower on the danger scale, I think. She's closer to Ashley, probably.

Speaker: And then I think problematic, Rain reign is in the center of a war that's about to start between two gangs. Like, that's... You know, whether or not it's him personally who's problematic, he's at the center of all of that.

Speaker: Mm-hmm. So... I feel like rain is the most immediate problem. but Like yeah when I think about who is the actual problem here, i still am like not totally convinced that it's not Kenzie.

Speaker: There's like some weird shit going on there. um Yeah. Long term might be the worst thing. Yeah. Although Chris, we really don't know all that much about Chris, but I feel like we saw it twice in this arc where ah Victoria went like, hey, you you like regulating evening out okay? And he basically told her to fuck off.

Speaker: And like, hmm. I can't wait to hear more about that. Yeah, we don't know much about Chris, yes so I won't say anything. But from what we've seen, that feels more like an Ashley.

Speaker: Like, okay, long term... we're going to have some things to work out with you about your own health and taking care of yourself. yeah Yes. Yes. Yeah, for sure. In short term, we need to stop the gang war that reigns at the center of. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah, exactly. yeah Good thing. Good. Oh, man. Good stuff. The correct answer, of course, was, Vic said, Miss Yamada.

Speaker: Because she triggers finally probably because they just drive her up the wall so much that she can't take it anymore. Yep. Blessed. you know but I was going to say, just to to kind of tie it off to bring it full circle, back to talking about how we're been a little just sort of slow to get into things, it is moments like this that that are really good. And I really liked how this arc ended.

Speaker: Like you said, Nick, it it really it really kind of was a slow build. And when you get to this point, it's Like now I want to read the next chapter, which I haven't felt for a few chapters. So it's like, it yeah it's, it's, uh, I can see where the story can, can get good here. So I'm i'm excited.

Speaker: Well, that about wraps it up for tonight. I wanted to thank all of our patrons. for sponsoring us and keeping us going and letting it, you know, helping us, encourage us to do this. We will be working on Patreon content um next week.

Speaker: ah Our next book reading, we will add. Yeah. Hold on. well yeah yeah Our next time, ah because arc five shadow is over a hundred thousand words long.

Speaker: We're going to split that into two. we will be reading 5.1.

Speaker: to 5.6. There is one interlude in there, but I think 5.6 is the correct spot to end on, not the interlude. 5.1 to 5.6. It is 53,000 words, which leaves another 53,000 words on the other side.

Speaker: um but Almost an even split. Also, is that um speaking out of turn, is that also the ah night we have to reschedule? That is. We will be doing it just next fortnight, but we will be doing it on the 11th, which is a Wednesday.

Speaker: um So change up just for that week. ah So we will see you in two weeks on the 11th of June on a Wednesday.

Speaker: will be halfway through arc five by then. yeah. and um yeah Otherwise, thank you so much for being here. Thank you, chat.

Speaker: ah We love you so much and we love all the good questions. Honestly, the more questions you ask, the the more fun ah we can like pose to hear. Yeah. I like the the fun questions in there.

Speaker: um Those are good. Yeah. um They're fun. And like I said, if you want to ask more questions or do more, ah we've got some ideas for some Patreon content that we ah need to do. Vic has D&D, so you can't join.

Speaker: Man, see, the thing is, you know, D&D, a worthy thing to ah to miss out on. But luckily, you can hear us. how When does the podcast go up after? usually Usually, it's um right before we live stream the next one, honestly.

Speaker: That's when I've been... Okay, so it's about a week late. Usually, like, the Monday before. Like, the last one came up yesterday. Okay. It's going to be a while, but... By then, you know, you could hear all of five basically back to back.

Speaker: Yeah. That's true. And the live stream is live. I mean, a lot of people watch us on YouTube, so they got that. They get it right away. just I forgot about the VOD. They can watch the VOD. Most, a lot of people just consume us that way. But if you're a Spotify, Apple um lover, then, then yeah, it will come out usually the right before are about to stream the new one.

Speaker: But yeah. Well, that's perfect. Anything else before we close out? Just our favorite song. ah Just blasted, Michael. Yay! Let's go.

Speaker: Join the Patreon. Please come on and join the Patreon. Why don't you just join the Patreon? Come support us and join the Patreon. Please help and join the Patreon.

Speaker: We have fun. Join the Patreon. It's great to join the Patreon. Why don't you just join the Patreon? Come Sometimes, just for fun, I'll cancel my Patreon subscription just so I can have the pleasure of signing up once again.

Speaker: Yeah. Every time. love it so much. So good. oh All right. You're the best. You're the best. We love you so much. And we'll see you on the 11th. Love all.

Speaker: See ya. Bye.

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