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Balancing the Future Ep. 33 - The Science Behind Story-Driven Marketing with Toi Eshun
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In this episode of Balancing the Future, marketing leader Toi Eshun shares how purpose-led organizations can build trust, sharpen their identity, and inspire action through strategic branding. She breaks down the “science” of marketing—psychology, data, and audience insight—alongside the creative craft of messaging and visuals. Using examples from nonprofit work and the accounting profession, Toi explains why rebrands succeed or fail based on stakeholder buy-in and timing. She also offers a practical perspective on AI: powerful for efficiency and analysis, but not a substitute for human emotion, expertise, and judgment.
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Transcript
Introduction of Toya Sean
00:00:09
Speaker
Welcome to another episode of Balancing the Future. And I'm telling you, I am so excited to be here with Toya Sean. She's the Senior Vice President of Marketing and Communications. And Toya and i go back just a ways. And I know she is brilliant at what she does. And we're going to be talking about everything marketing. today and how you should be looking at the people who are providing that particular service. So, Toy, welcome.
00:00:34
Speaker
Now, I know i I don't want to spoil it by trying to um speak to your background and your expertise. Give the audience just a peek as to who you are, what you've done, and and why you are here in the role that you're in.
Toya's Background in Nonprofits
00:00:49
Speaker
Sure, so it is a pleasure to be here with you, Chris. Great to see you, even if it's just virtually. And um of course, so my background is is really rooted in nonprofit and mission-driven sectors where I've spent really a lot of my career helping organizations strengthen their identity, um deepen trust, and tell their stories in ways that inspire action. So um as senior vice president, and I will say that this is probably um one of my most defining roles um as a marketing leader, i have been able to support organizations through marketing. you know, comprehensive rebrandings, not just visually, but strategically and operationally. And i find fulfillment in doing this work because it's so directly um tied to community engagement. And I just really thrive in a space where I know that the beneficiaries are are the communities that that we live in and the the individuals that we serve day to day.
00:02:03
Speaker
So i've I've been in this space for over 20 years. um I have led um some really, really dynamic marketing teams. I have built award-winning campaigns. And I am continuing to just really drive impact in um the spaces that I have the privilege of serving.
00:02:30
Speaker
You know, when I think about professionals like you and and how you descend and you get to the position that you're in, i mean, what is that one thing? If you can go back and you reflect on your career, how did you get there? What was that one thing that motivated you or just allowed you to believe in yourself where you're at, where you're at today?
Shift from Law to Marketing
00:02:50
Speaker
You know what it is? It's when I finally was able, you know, i knew I was going to have a professional career. And um my career started out on a a journey to become an attorney, which i um shifted in my mid-20s, and I ended up on a journey to become an educator.
00:03:17
Speaker
And I'll tell you, fifth a group of fifth graders retired me from that profession very quickly. And um I've always been an artist. So I've always been an artist at heart. I do spoken word um art. I do some... um physical art.
00:03:39
Speaker
And I love the use, always had a passion for the use of words, right? And always understood how words shape um thoughts, how words shape everything around us, our perceptions of one another, our perspectives on on life. And um when I was able to merge, you know, a career that allowed me to look at words, to look at ah visual representations, et cetera, and use those in a way to really drive impact in sectors that I was serving in, ah fell in love.
00:04:26
Speaker
with with marketing and I went on and, you know, did my my master's and had a concentration in marketing. And, you know, a lot of people look at marketing as this artsy thing, but it's really a science.
00:04:38
Speaker
You know, when you get a marketing degree, it's a science degree. And the science merged with the art is what makes this a really powerful and really, you know, wonderful profession to grow in So when I was able to merge those two pieces of myself, my my professional journey, but also my personal um journey as as an artist. So um it it's just been very um fulfilling to be able to operate at the intersection of my passion and my career.
00:05:18
Speaker
You know, when I think about you use the language of of science. OK, because let's explore that. what do you mean by science? Because when I think about marketing, I, too, believe that obviously there's someone that needs to capture an audience or their attention for a brief period of time and get them focused on a solution or whatever is being offered. What is scientific about that?
00:05:41
Speaker
So what's the science behind it?
Scientific Elements of Marketing
00:05:43
Speaker
Yeah, the science behind it. So marketing, a big element of marketing and the psychology, understanding how people think, what motivates people to think a certain way, what motivates really the biggest um motivation, what motivates people to take action and either purchase um something or, you know, vote a particular way or, you know, take action, a desired action.
00:06:07
Speaker
So that's science when you think about the psychology of marketing and what motivates people based on, you know, all the demographics that that that make up our our community. So it could be race, gender, it could be age, it could be um religious affiliation, political affiliation, but how do you use those demographical identifiers and motivate people to take the action you want to take?
00:06:37
Speaker
That's not artsy. You know, that that's that's science. And um when we think about the current marketing environment, it's really driven by science because it's digital.
00:06:51
Speaker
You know, the marketing spaces now are all digital. So you have to have really educated people. analysts that are helping to to shape and drive, you know, your marketing vision aligned with your organizational um goals and objectives. So that work is not fancy. I mean, of course, we get to work with wonderful designers and and artists, but the images that you see, the the colors that you see, those are all well studied. When we we do walk through a rebrand, you know, it's not, we don't just say, oh, these colors look great. We really look at what the organizational mission is, what the vision is, um what are the colors that represent that particular sector and whether what are the colors that represents the essence. of that that organization. So a lot of um thought goes into it. What are the colors that can can um motivate
00:07:54
Speaker
people to feel a certain way about the organization, whether we want to create warmth or whether we want people to take action, whether or not, you know, you see a lot of blue in banking and healthcare because it's a very sterile color. So when you think about those aspects of marketing, i think you have to look at it more from a science-based um perspective.
00:08:22
Speaker
You know, one thing that stands out just based on what you're sharing, when I think about um marketing and I think about accounting. OK, but I want to jump into that, but I also want to back up. And you said nonprofit and I know you're passionate about the nonprofit space. Tell me why i like to learn, learn more about people, even you.
Nonprofits as Government Extensions
00:08:43
Speaker
Obviously, I know you, but right great nonpro why is it so important that we give back?
00:08:49
Speaker
So when you think about the nonprofit space, usually the work that's that nonprofits do are extensions of our government and where the government can't but really serve the um whole community.
00:09:04
Speaker
So most nonprofit work is focused on some element of society that needs additional support beyond what the government is able to provide. And that's why so many nonprofits work receive government funding because they are an extension of the government's ability to deliver um services.
00:09:24
Speaker
So I think um just me as an individual, I get so much attention. intrinsic reward out of knowing that I am helping to move people um sometimes from from poverty into you know jobs, into education, into you know career pathways. And sometimes it's, you know in my current role, moving people from trauma into healing
00:09:56
Speaker
and And thriving. So I think for just me as an individual, I can see the impact of my work. I know what my work is aligned to and I know how my work is going to show up in the lives of of folks that I served when I was growing up.
00:10:15
Speaker
i um I think part of my motivation for being an attorney is because I wanted to fight for justice, you know. And i think that when you look at nonprofit spaces, we are still fighting for justice and for equity for folks who don't necessarily have a platform, who don't have a voice, who don't have um the means to do the most basic things in life, whether it's, you know, to feed their children, whether it's to provide housing, whether it's to just go to school, you know, or or find employment that allows them to earn a livable wage, you know, so that that work, um it's it's hard work, but it's hard work.
00:11:02
Speaker
you know And i I thrive in knowing that my work directly directly impacts the lives of of individuals. You know, I know you because of your exposure to public accounting and helping brand with branding and just building out you know marketing campaigns.
00:11:25
Speaker
Why are we so weird in public accounting? I say that because I'm just teasing you. don't know. Why are we
Marketing in the Accounting Sector
00:11:31
Speaker
so unique? When you think about us and building out a campaign, what comes to mind? You were talking about colors and all this stuff earlier.
00:11:38
Speaker
What's special about us? I think that... when you look at accounting as a sector, right? People think of numbers, they think compliance, they think ah everything has to be, ah you have to be able to prove it.
00:11:54
Speaker
It has to be grounded in truth. And when i when I think about accountants, I know they're programmed to look for the discrepancies. No matter what it is, they're looking for the discrepancy, right? So it's a really challenging space to market and to brand and to make it kind of a sexy profession for clients.
00:12:17
Speaker
younger people, for students, for early career pre professionals, people that you really need to have engaged in the sector to build out the pipeline.
00:12:28
Speaker
So, um you know, my work in the accounting sector came through ah my leadership within a not within a national nonprofit that supports the accounting and finance industry.
00:12:39
Speaker
building the accounting and finance pipeline. So, you know, stepping into that role required a really deep understanding of the sector, but also of the professionals in that sector. You know, I had to come in and and learn what that talent landscape looked like. What are the challenges that What are the professional expectations of accountants and CPAs? And, you know, a lot of the the partners that we had in in that space that were also in the financial wealth management and adjacent um sectors. So um and to to really understand the evolution of the field. So um I was in a space where i had to learn the gaps in education.
00:13:31
Speaker
all of the communities that they served and the the inequities that that were faced by certain groups of people. And how do I look at the the gaps and take what the organization had as solutions and and constantly identify the gaps, position programs programs and programs as products for solutions while, you know,
00:14:02
Speaker
trying to navigate a very difficult post-COVID climate for a nonprofit organization. So um it was it was a very, and I think this is what attracted me to it. i I like to build things. So the organization did not have an internal marketing function. All of the marketing was outsourced. And i had to come in and build that function. And one of my first charges was to rebrand. When I came in, it was a sterile environment. It was that good old blue ah gold accent and um a very, very long standing logo that that um was very dear.
00:14:47
Speaker
to the communities that it served. And I had to think, okay, how do i engage all of the stakeholders and and all of the stakeholders being accountants predominantly and CPAs? How do I, for one, get their attention? Because they probably were perceiving a rebrand to be a big waste of resources.
00:15:08
Speaker
And how do I get them to understand the need to change things that had been around a long time? So um leading that rebrand and kind of helping redefine the organization's voice meant I just really had to immerse myself into the the needs and into those those spaces that were very new to me, that were very nuanced, because of you know the the compliance, the legal um guidelines, the um longstanding perceptions, et cetera, and and make this field more attractive attractive and more so accessible for more people.
00:15:53
Speaker
So that that's kind of my point. introduction into the accounting space. And um again, I came to organization that has been around and serve in accounting communities for over half a century. So I definitely had my work set out for me.
Rebranding Importance Post-COVID
00:16:15
Speaker
go So when I think about language like you use rebrand, why would you go through a rebranding process? Why is that important as an organization to think that way, especially a public accounting firm? Why is that?
00:16:28
Speaker
Why is that necessary? It's necessary because.
00:16:35
Speaker
Everything in the space is changing. So the the the ah guidelines are constantly changing, you know, compliance and codes are constantly changing, um perceptions. that kind So the way you show up as an organization It has to change too. And especially coming out of COVID, COVID forced a lot of sectors to to rethink how they show up um in the in the world. And for the accounting space, which is already very
00:17:10
Speaker
you know, secluded and siloed. um It was very important that we find a way to really breathe new life into the organization because it was, it had been pretty static for many years. um The organization had events, you know, they had great programs, but the biggest focus was an annual event.
00:17:38
Speaker
So, you know, you you have a whole organization existing and really focused on one event a year when the needs of individuals in the profession, especially coming out of COVID-19, were just so high.
00:17:55
Speaker
you know People needed opportunities to earn CPE credits. Folks needed opportunity you know to get support with with preparing for their CPA exams. and And the organization had all these resources, but the focus was really on one event. So I had to come in and really take inventory of the space and say, you know we have so much more to offer to the field as an organization, but we're not, no one knows. You know, you can't be like the best kept secret forever. You know, people really need to see the brand and people need to understand the influence that the brand had in the space. And and with the with over 55 years of building, you know, equity in this space, it was really um a huge opportunity to come in and leverage that.
00:18:46
Speaker
You know, it was there. It just was not being leveraged. So, you know, traditionally, the accounting profession has taken a really conservative approach to branding and the messaging off ah often focused on, you know, accuracy, um compliance and technical strength. And and those are all essential things, but it was not necessarily compelling when speaking to younger talent.
00:19:09
Speaker
You know, so um my work really focused on shifting that narrative. We wanted to show that accounting was it's dynamic, it's innovative, you know, technology infused and and offers pathways into leadership across every industry. So one thing that that was really interesting to me was that a lot of the individuals that were involved with the organization, while they started out as accountants, earned CPAs, many of them were serving in roles adjacent to accounting.
00:19:44
Speaker
Not necessarily, you know, auditors, you know, or or just accountants. You had compliance officers. You had folks that had um kind of merged into the technology space. You had folks that were leading in an AI.
00:20:00
Speaker
as accountants. So it was really taking those stories and bringing those to the forefront of the organization's marketing strategy so that we could attract the attention of of students and younger professionals and start to engage them, especially, you know, at a time where um representation in the field was low and we wanted to make sure that we kept a pipeline of qualified, available, diverse talent that our partners could could tap when they were looking to refuel their human resource strategies and efforts. So, yeah.
00:20:46
Speaker
Reframing the story, we were really able to increase awareness, visibility, and as excitement in those careers in accounting and finance. So when I think about the A, B, and Cs of marketing, and you say strategy, what's that plan look
Key Components of Marketing Strategy
00:21:02
Speaker
like? When you think about a marketing strategy, you think about a public accounting type organization.
00:21:09
Speaker
i mean, what do you what are you doing? I mean, what goes into that? What are the A, Bs, and Cs, the basics of it that we need to think about? so I think one the first thing you need to think about is who's your audience?
00:21:23
Speaker
You know, who's your audience? Who are your stakeholders? And then what are the business goals? You have to identify those three things, audience, stakeholders, and business goals. um You know, i have worked with individual CPAs all the way through, you know, your big four, right? And they all have to think about the same thing.
00:21:54
Speaker
their target audiences, their stakeholder groups, and then what are the business goals and objectives? If you can identify those, that that's the foundation of starting to even think about a marketing strategy.
00:22:08
Speaker
And then the next, um that would be the a The next, the B would be to identify the gaps. What are the gaps that your you as an individual CPA or accountant or your organization is feeling in the space? Whether you're focused on auditing, whether it's um you know taxes or you know what whatever your your your area of focus is, think about what are the gaps and how does your brand or how does your organization
00:22:40
Speaker
meet or fill those gaps. And then those are the messages that you want to play up. So if you are a tax accounting firm and you know that, um,
00:22:55
Speaker
the the tax laws, there's some tax law that's changing and you are uniquely positioned to support organizations in navigating the new tax laws, then first you want to start educating people on what the new tax laws are, how they can potentially present a challenge or a threat to your organization and then position yourself as the solution.
00:23:17
Speaker
So it's identifying the gaps and positioning your brand or your services um as a solution there. And then it's really identifying the stories. What are the stories that you can tell? Whether they're success stories that you've had or whether they're success stories that are just more generalized to the field. What are what are the success stories that you can use to demonstrate success?
00:23:44
Speaker
your company or your your individual products and services as as solutions. So it's a it's a systematic process, but I think it's very basic.
00:23:58
Speaker
It's very basic. Now, how those stories emerge and how, if if you're looking at rebranding, how that emerges, you you start out with Where am I today? So when i when I came in to rebrand this organization, again, it was blue and gold.
00:24:14
Speaker
and And the gold was used very sparingly. And I had to think about, okay, so accounting represents wealth building. It represents... um and And so I think about colors like greens or golds or um you know, power colors like reds and and yellows, you know. so you you think about what are the colors? Some people randomly choose colors and they work.
00:24:42
Speaker
But I think when you choose colors that really represent the sector or the field that you're in, it's more of a story to tell. And when you think about your logos too, you think about what represents your brand, you know, whether it's the the letters in your name and how you position them or or whether it's an icon that you find, you know, um appealing. Think about what's the story behind that, you know, because a lot of people don't talk about marketing in the accounting space. So it was very... um
00:25:16
Speaker
I think rewarding for me to walk through a rebranding in this sector and then be able to tell accountants why this is the logo and this is what the logo represents and why these are the colors. These are what the colors represent. I think if you can appeal to to individuals, um,
00:25:39
Speaker
logic and reasoning, especially in the accounting field, then I think you can, you get greater buy-in. Now, rebranding also is a timing issue. You know, um we went through a rebrand at a very challenging um time, but you have to think about how do I rebrand?
00:26:02
Speaker
and not give up all of the brand equity that I've already built, especially if you're thinking about a name change. How do I rebrand, maintains the brand equity that I've built, but really um surge, get this new surge of energy around my business?
00:26:21
Speaker
So that's ah that's a delicate balance. So you want to think about timing and rebrands can take anywhere from, you know, for smaller companies, six months up to a year or two for larger companies, because, you know, you want to engage every stakeholder in your business.
00:26:36
Speaker
So when I walked through the rebrand, I engaged, I had um board members. I had um some volunteers. I had, um you know, members from the community that we served. We brought in um folks from the the educational, higher ed, because we we served students. So you bring all of those stakeholders in and you you definitely want to identify who your influences are, because I think there are influences everywhere.
00:27:09
Speaker
And you identify the influences and you make sure they're part of it because they will be key in helping to gain buy-in throughout the organization. So if you're sitting in a ah big organization and you know you want to rebrand, identify who your influences are within the organization so that as you go through that process, you pull them into the work, they you they will become your best spokespersons to to get buy-in throughout the organization. Because anytime you change something, going have some resistance. But if you have your influences there to say, nope, we did that because, and really walk folks through the thinking and the the process, then I think you you have a greater success.
00:27:50
Speaker
So let me ask you a question about getting, that's how you get it right. What happens when you get it wrong? What happens? So when you get it wrong, you know, it's like playing, um,
00:28:05
Speaker
What's the game? Mommy, ah may I, you know, take two giant steps forward? Well, when you get it wrong, you can take several giant steps backwards.
00:28:17
Speaker
And um i think you get it wrong when you don't get the buy-in. You know, when you do not get the buy-in and, you know, you do things in a silo and you think that you've come up with this wonderful strategy and, oh, people are going to love this new approach and people are going to love these colors. And and then you put it out there and everyone hates it.
00:28:40
Speaker
you Now you're looking at how do i back out of this, you know, or you're going to end up with a total compromise, right? of what could have been a really wonderful um rebrand or a really wonderful change, you're looking at a waste of resources because you've you've probably invested, um if if you do it right, significantly in a rebrand. So you you don't get the opportunity to adjust as you go.
00:29:14
Speaker
So I think getting it wrong, you know when you when you talk about getting it wrong in marketing, it's because you have moved forward without the buy-in, you have moved forward without socializing the the strategy with the right stakeholders and and the right influencers. And um what started out as good intentions, what started out as a great idea can suddenly just feel like a sinkhole.
00:29:40
Speaker
So I think when you when you get it wrong, you find yourself paddling upstream You know, backtracking, trying to go back and and and get in front of the folks who probably have the loudest voices in opposition to whatever you wrote out. You're trying to get in front of them and you're trying to redo something that. um
00:30:04
Speaker
Oftentimes is not salvageable. When I think about campaigns that you've been involved with, and I think about the beauty of it, I mean, aesthetically, it was fascinating.
Role of Imagery in Marketing
00:30:14
Speaker
I mean, is it important to have it that captivating? I know we talked about colors and everything, but there are words that we like to see or that resonate with us. But there's also aesthetics when it comes to pictures and and and so forth that kind of ignite us and and drive us in a certain direction.
00:30:32
Speaker
What's that right blend look like? Because I think about what you've done in the past and been involved with. How important is it that the words overlay the or the picture come first or help me understand how that sequence actually works?
00:30:45
Speaker
Yeah. So when I think about a campaign. um
00:30:51
Speaker
You're really thinking about. a one or two word theme, right? With me, I try to keep a campaign theme to two words or less with a really catchy tagline.
00:31:03
Speaker
And you think about who you serve. People like to see themselves reflected in imagery. So, you know, in the accounting sector, when when i think about um the visuals, right?
00:31:22
Speaker
For me, it was like, I get to really, you know, it was kind of a blank canvas because they they don't do that in that space. in In the accounting space, again, it's about the the numbers. It's about the the guidelines. It's about, you know, all of the rules and regulations. And the focus is usually not on the people.
00:31:46
Speaker
You know, accountants are people and they're very fun people. So I got to really work with accountants and see them after five and see them in nontraditional spaces. And I think that they look for those opportunities to to kind of um let the hair down and and. and enjoy one another. But when I think about the space, I didn't see people represented in accounting. So it was really, it's always an opportunity when you can use visuals that represent the the folks that you work with, the folks that you serve. And knowing that
00:32:26
Speaker
they take great pride in looking up and seeing a poster or seeing some type of banner or ad that's a beautiful visual representation of them.
00:32:38
Speaker
So I think you have to find the right blend of what's the theme, who's the audience, and how do we tie those two together with the words? So when I come up, when I think about building a campaign, I usually like, I like to build things in threes. So let's say if I'm building a ah theme for an event, an event campaign, whatever the the first theme is, and it could be, and these are just examples, it could be,
00:33:12
Speaker
um Green, yellow, the green campaign, the yellow campaign, the red campaign. But they all are a set that represent one thing.
00:33:24
Speaker
You know, so I think about it three years out this year. This is the thing. This will be the thing. So I have a ah set of three things that I'm going to bring to life. Each year and each theme plays off of the other and you really tell a story. So when you're engaging, you know, of the same audiences year after year, you want them to kind of see a thread in the work that you're doing.
00:33:49
Speaker
and So let's say. I'll give you ah a recent example of a campaign that that I've worked on and I'm working with individuals that are really coming into um the space, right?
00:34:09
Speaker
Navigating a high level of trauma. And then the work is to get them to a sustainable space so that they can become independent and sustain themselves. So as I thought about that, I said, how do we move people from trauma to triumph?
00:34:27
Speaker
You know, just those two words, trauma to triumph. How do we move people? And that is reflective of the continuum of care that they receive coming in. That's what the programs and services of the organization do. They literally move people from trauma to triumph.
00:34:46
Speaker
So when when you're looking at the campaign, the campaign is really just a reflection of the organization's work. And I think that's how closely connected a campaign's theme should be with the work of the organization. It can't just be something that sounds good because that's the um the word that everyone likes. It has to be closely connected and it has to tell the story of the organization's mission. And and the mission here is to really end um domestic violence.
00:35:23
Speaker
So when you say trauma to triumph, that represents the mission, it represents the the programs and services, and it just represents the um vision of the organization. So I think that you have to have the right, um it's not the right words, it's just the right theme.
00:35:44
Speaker
that speaks to the organization's mission. And then you find the visuals that speak to your audience. And then when you merge those two, it can be really powerful. And I'm i'm not going to be remiss and say that you don't need, um,
00:36:02
Speaker
graphic designers that understand the communities that you serve, that understand, you know, if I want a campaign that uses visuals that represent hope,
00:36:15
Speaker
they're going to be able to create visions that represent, that literally translate hope. and And maybe it's just the positioning of a person's face into light or, you know, maybe some kind of a light aura around a person, but they're able to take those words and to take those themes and translate them into something visually powerful. And that's, you know,
00:36:42
Speaker
that's a special talent. It's that's a special talent. You know, when I think about one of the campaigns like that, and I'm going to talk about Nike because Nike does it well. Yeah. And you know which one I'm going to point to. You know, when I think about Nike and I remember the the or the orange background and the the white logo or black logo and it says, just do it.
00:37:07
Speaker
Just do it. And I mean, it was incredible. And I think about how it motivated folks to do something. OK, they didn't even know what that meant. I guess, when you know, triumph, whatever you want to call it. I mean, you said a lot with a very little.
00:37:23
Speaker
And that's what I think marketing is. And that's what it does. It's it motivates you in different way. it' sort think And you think about just do it. They're speaking to the athletes, obviously.
00:37:36
Speaker
They're speaking to the folks at home who are, you know, making New Year's resolutions to start their workout plans. They're speaking to people who are recovering from injuries. And just those three simple words, they're speaking to all of those audiences, motivating them to do something that requires a sneaker.
00:37:59
Speaker
You know, wow they require sneakers. But that's how simple, it should be that simple because the words should move. The goal of of marketing is to move people to action. So the words should literally move people to action. And I love Nike. I think when ah the swoosh, always wonder, it's like a Greek symbol that Nike swoosh. I went and researched that when I was in undergrad. like, why is this swoosh so powerful? Because you know they can just put it on a, it's like Coke.
00:38:32
Speaker
You don't even have to see the words. You see that little ribbon, you fill in the blank. So I think that's the goal of any organization is to just make that brand so recognizable that the the icon can speak for the whole brand.
00:38:48
Speaker
You don't even have to have words. Yeah, when I think about where everything is headed, and I'm going to toss this question, got a couple more questions. Okay.
AI in Marketing
00:38:57
Speaker
The the next one is in regards to AI, artificial intelligence. good morning How do you see that changing what it is that you do? Because you're creative. Okay, it's a science.
00:39:09
Speaker
All right. Everyone thinks that they can go to AI and get ideas and they can be exchanged the same way as someone like you, who has a tremendous amount of expertise and experience.
00:39:21
Speaker
But i I don't think so. So help the audience understand how AI can be used. And it's just not a replacement for talented folks like you. Yeah. So I love AI.
00:39:34
Speaker
Yeah. I'm a very, one I'll just tell you when I write emails, I usually have to take my email, I write it and I put it in ai and I say, make this softer because I'm so direct. So that's when I fell in love with AI. But as a marketer, a lot of people feel threatened by AI because they think ai is going to replace their their jobs. And you know with my team, I have content creators on my team and they they i encourage them to use AI, but I also um say to them that garbage in is garbage out.
00:40:13
Speaker
So you still have to have, ah you still have to be a subject matter expert in your field because AI will just, you ask it a question, it's going to spit something out to you and you have to be able to challenge those results. And it's so funny because I've used AI and I have to um debate it sometime.
00:40:35
Speaker
And it'll say your logic is right in this situation. So you have to use the AI as a tool to help you become more efficient. It does not replace creativity. It does not replace original thoughts.
00:40:51
Speaker
Now, it can become very educated if you sit down with it and you're intentional about educating ai on, you know, whether it's your role in the organization or whether it's the organization or a particular topic, you can educate the AI on it.
00:41:06
Speaker
And the AI can become better at supporting you in creating um documents or one pagers or, you know, even strategies. But AI won't have all of the nuances of the work that you lead. And i think that's where a lot of people, because it's so good and it it presents the information in such a organized manner that people feel like, oh, this is good enough for me.
00:41:32
Speaker
But if we're all using the same AI and it's not really um educated enough about the nuances in your organization, you're going to get a very generalized output from it. So I think you have to find the balance in how I use AI to enhance my my content creation to make it better, but not to create it for you. And I can tell you, I can read something that's that's AI generated and spotted really quickly because it it lacks the emotion.
00:42:06
Speaker
It lacks emotion. It doesn't move you the way... um something that's been written by a person or someone with soul is going to move you. But I think that you have to, and you have to lean into the AI because it it does, it's wonderful with creating efficiency in the work that you're doing. So you definitely have to lean into it. I still find that when you think about a lot of people are using ai for video,
00:42:35
Speaker
creation, people are using AI to illustrate books, all of these things. But one thing I know is that the AI is not perfect and it will still generate an image that might have three fingers instead of five.
00:42:47
Speaker
you know And it still will require a graphic artist to go in and either code or correct that in the AI. So AI is not perfect. It just means in order to use AI, you have to sharpen, continue to sharpen your skills, continue to educate yourself about um the different types of AI and the AI stacks that you can use in your work. I think that um when you look at... um some of the the analytics that we want to see. AI is great for helping look at analytics and and taking the analytics and identifying the patterns and giving you recommendations. you know So there there there are ways to use it to enhance the work that you're doing.
00:43:37
Speaker
But you if you become dependent on AI, you'll eliminate yourself. if you become dependent on it. But if you look at the AI, you master, you know, the platforms that you want to use and you build the right stack and and be transparent about it. A lot of people don't like to say that they use AI.
00:43:58
Speaker
People don't like to say it. You know, they they're not going to say, oh, i I ran that through chat.
00:44:05
Speaker
me and my team, we discuss all the different types of chats that are out there and which ones are better and which ones seem to, um, you know, give us more humanized responses to things. So you have to look at how you use it, be transparent about it because it's nothing to be ashamed of. It's nothing to hide. Technology should enhance what we do and make what we do better, you know, not eliminate your roles. But I think if we all become dependent on AI and then the AI output becomes the standard, then that's how you eliminate
00:44:39
Speaker
the need for for humans. But I think as long as we continue to let AI kind of challenge us, challenge our creativity, and and we use it to enhance what we do as opposed to replace, you know,
00:44:55
Speaker
thinking or writing, then it will continue to do just that. And we will continue to keep make it keep ourselves relevant. You become ah irrelevant if you don't understand the technology the technology that's driving um the work. And I look at the same thing with the accounting. I know I did several articles on um AI and accounting, you know, with people fearing that AI was going to replace people instead of looking at how does AI make the work of an accountant or a CPA more efficient?
00:45:32
Speaker
You know, it means you have to continue to educate yourself. You have to learn all of the different AIs that are out there, specifically the ones that are designed to support the work that you do.
00:45:44
Speaker
As opposed to looking at it, you know, like, oh, AI is going to replace me. It will if you if you don't learn it. you know, it'll replace you. So um I think it's just continued education. I'm constantly looking for um learning opportunities for me and my team because I know my team is not going to sit and write, you know, every press release, all the blogs for our blog space, all the social content for the social space. You know, marketing teams within nonprofits tend to be very small teams compared to the marketing teams that you find in the for-profit sector. So we have to use um technology to really meet the demand of our our department and to to really propel um the space forward. So we we have to use it.
00:46:35
Speaker
we You know what? This has been, i said a two questions, only have one. And appreciate all of your energy, all of your time. It's been great chatting with you. You know, we go back a ways. So just catching up like we've been able to do and understanding, you know, the intricacies of marketing and branding and what it really looks like and what how you package that and how you work with you know, those stakeholders to make sure that you're building out the right solution for their business. So it fascinates me. It is a science.
00:47:08
Speaker
You know, it is not a person that's a, you know, artsy. You need some skills, I believe, and how you get creative and and putting out the right illustrations. But this has been truly eye opening for me. So I thank you for your time to it.
00:47:22
Speaker
Thank you. Thank you, Chris. And i I just want to say to folks out there that have marketing teams, Don't tell anyone on your marketing team that you want them to make something pretty or you want them to make something look good.
Human Touch in Marketing's Success
00:47:38
Speaker
It's going to just go through the core of who they are. You know, a lot of thought goes into designing one pagers, into designing um social graphics, anything that that any marketing requests that you have, it requires a level of um subject matter expertise. and And it's not just making things pretty. So start to really look at your marketing team as a resource to help drive and support the business goals and objectives, because that's really what it's intended to do.
00:48:14
Speaker
You know what, I'm going to look into the camera and I'm going close this out, Toya, and I'm going to say this to the audience. ah Marketing is extremely important. You have to get it right. ah You can't gamble on it. AI will not replace people who have this skill set.
00:48:29
Speaker
It is necessary that you get organized so you can illustrate exactly how well you do your business, whatever that business is. So think about your own plan. Think about how you go about using expertise of someone like Toit to kind of help you with that vision so you can be on the right path. So thank you again for joining us on another episode of Balancing the Future. And I look forward to our next conversation.