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CMCL Interview: Wesley Hamilton
86 Plays1 year ago
Wesley shares his personal journey of overcoming lifestyle changes and health struggles after his injury. He describes how these experiences helped him uncover his true passion and pave a path forward to a successful business. Wesley also discusses his work with major companies, promoting accountability for accessibility and inclusion efforts.
Wesley Hamilton is the CEO of the Disabled But Not Really Foundation, an organization on a mission to help people living with disability build independence through health, fitness, and community. He is a global public speaker and social entrepreneur who champions disability and diversity rights.
Changing Minds and Changing Lives is produced by Disability Solutions, a non-profit consulting firm helping forward-thinking employers create world-class hiring and retention programs for people with disabilities.
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Transcript
00:00:00
Speaker
Right.
Introduction to Wes Hamilton
00:00:01
Speaker
Welcome to the next episode, probably my most favorite episode, um, maybe forever. I don't know, uh, changing minds, changing lives podcast. My name is Julie. So I'm the executive director of disability solutions. And if you've listened to our last few pods, which I highly recommend with some amazing guests.
Wes Hamilton's Journey and Activism
00:00:19
Speaker
Um, you've heard me talking about Wes Hamilton joining us today and how I am such a, um,
00:00:27
Speaker
fan girl for lack of a better word. So I don't want to waste any time because Wes is finally here. I'm just so glad and thankful to welcome Wes Hamilton to Changing Minds, Changing Lives. If you don't know Wes, he's a community activist, adaptive athlete, and the founder of Disabled But Not Really.
00:00:48
Speaker
And in 2012, Wes was paralyzed from the waist down. And he has since worked through this amazing physical rehabilitation and mental transformation to start his foundation, Disabled But Not Really. And he's also an ADA consultant, a DEI consultant, obviously a founder and a CEO of an organization.
00:01:09
Speaker
and a public figure out of Kansas City, Missouri, but I would say he is an international figure. If you didn't catch him, he was also on Queer Eye in 2019. That's how I got to know him, but he's been in the game a lot longer than that. So Wes, thank you, thank you for joining us.
Identity and Representation
00:01:27
Speaker
I'm so excited. Give us your Twitter bio. What's something that everyone doesn't know about the Wes Hamilton?
00:01:36
Speaker
Well, absolutely. Thank you for having me. It is an honor to just be having this conversation. What is my Twitter bio? I am the representation I could not find, and I am a student of life. When I break that down just for anyone,
00:02:03
Speaker
I wear a lot of hats, but I like the ownership of who I am, the identities that I represent, and what that impacts others. But then I also like to reference myself as a student of life because I don't know it all, and I want to be an open book to learn daily without feeling like my opinions or my perspectives are the right thing. So, yeah.
00:02:29
Speaker
That's pretty good. And congratulations to your Kansas City Chiefs on their Super Bowl win not too long ago. I saw you celebrating on your TikTok, I think. Absolutely. Awesome. Yeah, it was a good game.
00:02:45
Speaker
Um, so I, you know, I've been kind of catching up on some of the things that you've been doing lately. Um, some of the speaking you've been doing, and I was listening to an interview you did with Lolo Spencer. Um, and it was, it made me laugh because it was like a, a, a noble shit. Like, absolutely. Here we are. We're going to say what we think. And that's what I love because she, she said it spot on influencers in our community.
00:03:12
Speaker
the disabled community are sad and we're mad and we're like sort of where this like woe is me on our on our chest a lot and I was thinking about it today and it almost seems like we're wearing that internalized ableism that if we aren't solely our disability then people might think it's not real they may think it's not impactful they may I don't know forget about it um which I don't think we need to worry about but
00:03:40
Speaker
What I loved a lot about that conversation and what we're starting to see with disabled Black influencers being seen in our community so much more is that you have created a different approach.
Diversity and Intersectionality in Disability
00:03:57
Speaker
It's joyful, it's driven, it's motivated to like, let's get living.
00:04:03
Speaker
I'm just curious as how do you think, I mean, as a white woman with a disability, I can tell you how I think, but as, how do you think that that growing recognition, recognition in the disability community as more than just white, um, is influencing our conversations about ourselves at a community level, how we approach life, um, with like a fully human experience?
00:04:26
Speaker
Absolutely. You know, I think that for so long, disability has been white-lensed, and the representation of it has never really shown the diversity within it. So because of that, that's allowed the Black community to really lack ownership of disability. You know, when you go around individuals that are from diverse backgrounds,
00:04:52
Speaker
majority of them will say that, you know, this might have been their first interaction with someone that looks similar to them.
00:04:59
Speaker
you know, most facilities, rehabilitation centers, there are most of them, you really don't see diversity in there, you know, as well as a lot, just frankly, a lot of African Americans, they don't have insurance. So they're not going to the best rehabs to be able to see different community of people. They're going to some of these other hospitals. So what I think that the approach that has happened is,
00:05:24
Speaker
at least for me and my perspective, and even some of my peers like Lolo and Stephanie Thomas. I think we just understood that we wasn't seen. And to the point of not only just not being seen, but we're still gonna be seen as black first. And when you look at disability, sometimes people just have that identity because that's what's been portrayed for so long.
00:05:54
Speaker
And I think for us, it was kind of like, at least for me, it was like, well, you know, I do want to own all my identities that I represent.
00:06:05
Speaker
And I want to show what that looks like because I don't see this as a problem. When I look in a mirror, I don't look at the medical or charity type of model. I speak a lot about those just because that's what we've always seen. I think society has been, you know, projected in a sense to be able to see disability as a sick thing or feel sorry for sympathy.
00:06:29
Speaker
instead of thriving. And that's been such a defeating mindset for us, you know. And then again, so I think for myself in particular, I started to understand that the way that I was living was based off of the pains of others. And
00:06:53
Speaker
So my thought process of what I couldn't do was what other people told me. And when I started to take control and try, just try something that someone told me I couldn't do, my mindset started to evolve into, I can do whatever I want, despite my physical limitation. And the good part, I mean, at least, you know, the part that I'm even more proud of is that I'm Black doing it because I do know that even being Black has its own level of discrimination here.
00:07:23
Speaker
So to be able to be different in so many ways and know like odds are stacked against you Systemically or you know publicly however that looks only and I think that's what we did We just owned it because when you got everyone looking at you in different ways, you don't know sometimes how your judge Well, I'm gonna give you something to look at
00:07:47
Speaker
I love that, right? It's like, I'm not going to apologize, right? And I think we've gotten in this, in this place where we're apologizing for being disabled or we're apologizing for asking for a seat at the table. You know, as a, as a white person, it was really hard for me because I was like, I want to find the right way to support intersectionality without taking over the conversation and also make sure that sometimes when I worked with, you know, DEI people who
00:08:17
Speaker
didn't want disability at the table because they wanted to work on other identities. I had to just like kind of level set myself, but also say, you
Founding Disabled But Not Really
00:08:26
Speaker
know what? Like it's just not a white people thing. It's an everyone thing. And as soon as we like get that together, we'll be much stronger. Um, but like trying to also just take kind of that backseat sometimes.
00:08:38
Speaker
Um, I think is really interesting and I, I have appreciated like you and you've got peggish, if you don't follow her on TikTok, she's fantastic. Um, just telling a story that is very different, um, than mine and, and really raising up, um, people in, in your community. Um, so tell me about, tell me about disabled, but not really. When did that start? What is the mission, um, or around that?
00:09:06
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Disabled but not really was created in 2015. For those that might have heard the bio earlier, but if you missed it, I acquired my disability in 2012.
00:09:21
Speaker
You know, during the time that I acquired my disability, one, I was a product of my environment. I do believe that. So my mindset wasn't evolved. But on top of that, I was overweight. Like, I had never done physical activity. And I joke about it in my speeches where I'm like, I was big bonded.
00:09:44
Speaker
people who used to use that term and it's that comforting level of, I don't think that I'm going to be able to change. And that was me. And so when I acquired my disability, I kind of went into that image that people see, right? Like, and so
00:10:02
Speaker
And I tell people with the image, at least for me was it was I was overweight. I was on like 14 different meds. You know, I have a spinal cord injury. So, of course, they're trying to help me with pain and bow and bladder and all of these different things. So.
00:10:18
Speaker
But I also wanted to still be the same person I was before my accident. So I was in this fight of trying to accept something that I didn't want to accept, as well as still trying to live on who I used to be so everyone else could be comfortable with that.
00:10:36
Speaker
it didn't work for me. After hike within my first year of just constantly trying to not accept and do all these other things that wasn't right for me, I ended up getting what most people with spinal cord injuries get as a pressure ulcer. And it led to 21 hours a day of bed rest for two years. And so when I say I was overweight, I was 200 and about 250 pounds max, but I'm five, five, well, I'm five four, but I'm five five on a good day.
00:11:05
Speaker
And so, you know, at least you can kind of put that height and weight together. And I was just definitely not doing good on the healthy side. And so acquiring this and on top of that, I'm a single father.
00:11:20
Speaker
I try to throw that nugget out kind of in the middle of things. Because when you hear all the stuff I'm doing, it's like, oh, and I'm a father with a disability, and I raise her on my own. Like, what? So I got so close to my daughter a few months before my accident. So literally during this process, I am definitely still trying to be a father, still trying to not
00:11:42
Speaker
be weak, but I was weak. And so there was a moment, there was a moment where the doctor told me that I needed to start to eat more protein to be healthier. And to kind of fast forward that I ended up going to a
00:11:59
Speaker
a community college and took up some, a dietician program. And I, because I didn't understand protein, I mean, I lived in what they were referenced these days as food deserts. So there was nothing healthy around me. And I didn't understand what protein was really, but I wanted to be healthy for my daughter, right? Like I just wanted to be active, you know, and you didn't see parents with disability. So I didn't have that representation to really feed off of either. And so,
00:12:30
Speaker
So by January 2015, I mean, I'm doing all these practices that I'm learning through this course. I'm eating healthy, but I'm in the now because I didn't believe I could ever lose weight. I was big bounded, right? So clothes getting smaller, everything, whatever.
00:12:47
Speaker
January 2015, I had my last surgery. And after all this time, the people don't know when you're in a wheelchair, the hardest thing is to get weighed. So you think about trying to lose weight, but never know exactly what you're losing or what you're gaining because you have to go through a whole process. That was my life. So that now was real. But once I got in the hospital bed for my last surgery, they got to weigh me in a hospital bed and I was 130 pounds.
00:13:17
Speaker
Wow. And I remember, and again, like, I knew pants was falling down stuff. I'm like, this ain't real. Maybe it's the wheelchair, right? And I remember just thinking to myself, like, when I got injured, I was 24, I had already accepted that I was never going to be healthy. Like, I was a big guy, all of this. And I, it just hit me that I had did something and I couldn't even do walking.
00:13:44
Speaker
And I was limited in so many ways. And so I was so empowered by that moment. I was so empowered by the change that I did when I truly believed I had to do it for me.
00:14:00
Speaker
And I did it paralyzed. I did it when the doctors and physiotherapists really couldn't tell me what to do because there wasn't any running or jogging or walking that could be implemented. So it was kind of like eat healthy, but we still can't tell you how to do that in the best way. And I did it on my own. I did it by teaching myself. And it was like and I and I had this level of gratitude and confidence within myself that I embrace my disability and I didn't look at look down on it anymore.
00:14:30
Speaker
And by April of 2015, I saw I had six weeks of healing. And during the six weeks in the hospital, I mean, I was so confident. I'm like, I'm small. I'm going to start going to the gym. I'm like, none of my adaptive athlete, like that lifestyle didn't happen until after I left the hospital.
00:14:50
Speaker
I did create disabled, but not really there. And it was because while I was in that hospital, I took a picture because I was really proud. I was really proud. And I don't know if people understood why I was so proud, but it was so I didn't know I was getting to where I made it. Right.
00:15:08
Speaker
And I just hashtag, I said, I'm disabled, but not really. And the but not really was because I overcame the limitation that so many people believe that that's where I was going to stop. Like no one, family, friends, everyone doubted me because they never knew there was something that could be evolved from a limitation. They didn't know like I could, you know, become in shape and be happy to the point I wasn't dwelling on my situation anymore.
00:15:37
Speaker
And I just started to educate myself and I had a nurse tell me like, you know.
00:15:43
Speaker
you know, you should think about, you know, philanthropy. And I'm like, what is that? Literally. And I wasn't a reader before that either. And I got onto audio books while I was doing my six weeks. My first book was how to start a nonprofit. And I learned about it and I started it while I was in the hospital. And right before I got out, April, 2015, I established disabled, but not really. And the goal was, was to instill a limitless mindset that breeds courage, confidence and competence into the those that we serve.
00:16:13
Speaker
And it wasn't about the physical aspect as much as it was the mental. I did a mental shift when I was on 21 hours a day of bed rest, and I was determined to change, and I changed. That is incredible. Again, just seeing the videos, seeing some of the competitions that you all have done, like the fitness competition, like incredible. Trust me, every big-boned person, every pussy person, as we call them in my childhood,
00:16:42
Speaker
It understands just how hard it is to do when you can go get on treadmill or you can go do whatever And and they give up we give up so fast And and so that's such an amazing story And if my math is right, you're about to or just entering the teenage girl years. Is that what I heard? 14 out here You
00:17:05
Speaker
for a while. Yeah, I'm here for it. It's the best and the worst all at the same time. We gave it to him. We became empty nesters not too long ago. And I'm like, Oh, those teenage years, I hated them. But I love them. So good luck with that. And congrats on having a, I'm sure a lovely, beautiful young lady in your life. So right, you
00:17:30
Speaker
You've been through your own kind of journey, which I think also is important to understand that that journey for you never ends, right? We don't get in shape one day. We don't fix our head one day. We don't do DEI one day. It's a lifetime's worth of work. You've got the foundation. You're transforming people's lives in our community, people who have disabilities, giving them a set of confidence and competence that
00:17:54
Speaker
they probably didn't think was feasible before.
Awareness and Inclusion Efforts
00:17:58
Speaker
A lot of times probably despite their disabilities and then influenced or exaggerated by them. And I've seen now some of the work that you're doing at the organizational level.
00:18:09
Speaker
to increase inclusion. And I noticed that you've worked with a lot of universities alongside names like Google and Deloitte and some pretty big dogs that we'd all like to have on our website. Kind of tell me about your work and where kind of this journey as you as a human with a disability has taken you to think about how we need to change at either the university level and the corporate level or both. Well, I think that
00:18:40
Speaker
The work that I've been focused on and the work that I've been doing is truly going into these institutions and
00:18:51
Speaker
raising a level of accountability on the lack of awareness and the lack of effort in trying to become more inclusive or diverse. And for me, it was my whole journey and all my work is based on personal experiences. And when I acquired my disability, I was still in the workforce before I got injured. And within months, I was offered a severance because they really couldn't
00:19:21
Speaker
adapt or adjust to my disability. And on top of that, there was no acceptance in my change after coming back with a group, like going back to a group of people that knew you before your accident. And so that culture was definitely something that started to become defeating as well, because people are judging you now instead of embracing you.
00:19:44
Speaker
And so, how do we change that? We go in there and we teach the individuals that are able-bodied that it's not if, but when you acquire disability and that the changes that you're trying to make for me is going to help you later on in life. It's going to help your family, it's going to help your friends, it's going to help your grandparents, you know, access.
00:20:04
Speaker
And then when you think about intersectionality, like the power of that, like you can't, you know, and that started to become more effort within after 2020 when the conversations really started to be able to be brought up and people started to wanting, wanted uncomfortable conversations.
00:20:25
Speaker
But again, for me, it's just from experience. Even being in the CrossFit world, it wasn't very diverse when I was there. Fitness, anything when it comes to sports and things when it comes with disability. So how do we make sure that all people can be seen? When you think about universities, how many of them are accessible?
00:20:46
Speaker
you know, most people with disabilities are already at home due to the lack of access. They don't want to do online school. Some of them want to be social, but they don't want to go into a place and not be accepted for who they are and then have to face some type of barrier due to the lack of access or due to the lack of knowledge to keep the access updated, right? Like, and so elevator's always down, you know,
00:21:13
Speaker
there are just so much societal barriers that we do based on our internalized ableism. And so I try to go in and allow people to see that, you know, and provide examples. They're speaking engagements. I do where the only ramp they have is just super long and steep. And so by the time I get on stage, the first thing I'm like, is that ramp, right? Like I'm addressing it as I go.
00:21:40
Speaker
Um, I went to one event and the ramp must have never been used because my hands was dirty by the time I got all the way up to the top. I'm like, hold on. Yeah, I gotta go. And it was thousand people in a room. And it's like, you need to see this like.
00:21:57
Speaker
this is my life right now. And we need to be conscious because eventually it will be yours. And I think that when we can shift our perspective and think that we're creating barriers for our community that we want to be a part of, we're also creating a world that we wouldn't want to live in. And so I think being conscious to teach people from the human aspect, what type of world would you want to live in?
00:22:26
Speaker
Rather, it's because you're physically able now or you're moving like your grandparents later on. Either way, go. What world would you want to live in? So that's really the work that I'm doing. And I think most people are leaning to an inclusive and diverse world that we can constantly learn from people from different cultures, races, religions.
00:22:50
Speaker
gender identities and ethnicities like everything when it comes to that level of intersectionality in one person. You know, sometimes we've created identities that we can only own one. This is me. No, there are so many things that represent you as a person, whether you have a disability or not, and you should be able to be free enough to bring all of those out.
00:23:12
Speaker
Yeah, 100%. I think I saw a t-shirt that you have, I identify myself, or I identify me. I identify myself. I like that one a lot, probably on a future episode. Again, I love the different perspective and the different
00:23:34
Speaker
kind of invitation that you get than I do, which is you force people to think about things in a different way. I force people to think about mental health in a different way, mental illness, cognitive processing disorder. You force them to think about, not only do I need the
00:23:54
Speaker
ramp, right? This very basic thing that should help anyone get up. But I also need you to see me as a black man, a dad, a person with a disability, a worker, an employee, a business owner, all the things that you are. And you can speak to that, I think, in a way that people are receptive to. Because
00:24:17
Speaker
So often we just haven't had engagements with people with different types of disabilities in our life. And it humanizes when you can tell your story. So I want to ask you, I'm going to go to my two questions. I actually have three questions left. I'm going to go to my two questions that I like to wrap up every interview with because you've been so gracious with your time. And everybody wants to know, I was late for this interview that I've been waiting for. There's still a lot.
00:24:47
Speaker
has been very gracious with this time. So I always ask two questions as I wrap up the show is, what would you tell a hiring leader or decision maker that would change their minds about the talent value that black disabled people can bring to their organization? I think, well, first we look at it as
00:25:14
Speaker
If we already know the talent that Black individuals will bring to our organization, just know that disability as a unique layer to that. So if you're already diverse, you just need to expand it. I mean, that's the easiest way. But if you're just trying to become diverse all the way around, understanding that individuals that are Black and disabled, that identify with maybe Black first,
00:25:44
Speaker
represent a community and a culture of people that if you have products and services that are for service to humanity in a sense, then you want to be able to bring representation that allows not only people to feel welcome in your space or to your community, but also for you to be aware of some of the issues and things that you can maybe help
00:26:14
Speaker
create solutions for. I think that's why we expand and become diverse, because it allows us to become aware of what's happening in the world. We are sometimes always in our own box.
00:26:29
Speaker
And so when we can learn from other people experiences, it doesn't just bring them value, it actually brings you value. And so again, the thing is, do you want to grow? Because becoming more diverse will help you with so much growth. And it will also help you probably become a better human being.
Achievements and Future Plans
00:26:52
Speaker
100%. Okay, so outside of Queer Eye, what is one action or event that someone else has done for you that changed your life as a person with a disability? Oh, you know, I've had a lot of amazing things happen to me in life after I believe
00:27:13
Speaker
I took ownership and accepted who I am as just an individual. I will say that, and there has been milestones that I'm so proud of, some that I keep forgetting. But in 2021, I was acknowledged as a Craig H. Nelson visionary. Wow.
00:27:40
Speaker
It was based on my service to the spinal cord injury community. And it came with a $1 million grant. That was after, like,
00:27:58
Speaker
That was something that I'm still speechless for because all I do is breathe service and that's all I care about. I changed my life and I just wanted to help others see the same light and life that I see today.
00:28:13
Speaker
And someone seen that and wanted to help me continue to do that. And I think that it wasn't about me. It was about all the people that I chose to serve. And to be able to be seen as a visionary within the community that I represent just was just still a big deal for me.
Wes's Favorite Travel Destinations
00:28:35
Speaker
It's a proud milestone that I think I would take forever.
00:28:41
Speaker
I would like humbleness because it's something now I can teach other people to aspire to that as long as you do the work, you never know who's watching. We do the work, right? Just do the work. The recognition comes. Thank you so much. This has been incredible. My last question because I am a travel junkie. Where is your favorite place that you have traveled?
00:29:11
Speaker
America or otherwise? Oh, can I give you two? Can I do America and otherwise? Just for people to know, I didn't even travel before my injuries. Now I just consider myself a world traveler. In America, Oregon. Okay.
00:29:34
Speaker
Oregon was one of the most breathtaking, beautiful, calm places that I've ever been. And I went in the fall as well. So it was just amazing. International. I have this love between the UK and Canada.
00:29:55
Speaker
Really? Okay. I love the beauty in Canada, the kindness. But the UK has so much history that I'm just like a bookworm too. Like every corner you turn, you find something new. And that's exciting.
00:30:13
Speaker
And so what I love about Europe is it's so old. There's just something to learn. Well, if you ever want to come to Portugal, we will happily give you the tour, set you up in a condo, whatever you want. We'll be there. I'm here for it. I'm coming. No, I love it.
Conclusion and Call to Action
00:30:29
Speaker
Please do. Thank you so much for joining us. I so appreciate you coming on this episode. Tell everyone where to find you, how to donate to or become a part of all the work that you're doing.
00:30:42
Speaker
Absolutely. All this stuff, you know, disabled but not really, is just how it sounds. Disabledbutnotreally.org is where you can learn more about our mission, our programs, donate, volunteer. And if you just want to know me personally, I am Wes Hamilton. Across all social media, it's a good way to find me.
00:31:04
Speaker
Awesome. You can call me. I know where to find him. I know all the socials. Thank you all for joining us for another fantastic episode. Thank you, Wes, for joining us. I am so pleased to meet you and find you to be as nice and wonderful as I had hoped you would be. So until next time, keep changing minds and changing lives.