Transcript
Speaker: All right, Dustin. Glad to see you today as always. Glad to see you too. We're going to be talking about something that was. more controversial a number of years ago than it is today but i think it's still controversial and sure evangelicalism and uh All circles, I guess, um but particularly maybe Baptist circles. I don't know, but we're going to be talking about Calvinism.
Speaker: And. um you know i don't think it's any secret we've said we're we're baptists on the one hand but we're part of that larger reform tradition on the other and what we mean is ah We're Calvinist. Does that mean we agree with everything Calvin said and did? No. No? No, we really don't.
Speaker: Yeah, Calvinism is this term that's given to basically these five points that we're going to discuss. There's an acronym of TULIP. yeah that we often go through um this can also be called the doctrines of grace Yep. Basically, it's just... um An attempt. to to summarize. the theology of our salvation yeah um and God's sovereignty in it and and and all of those things. yeah so um Yeah, again.
Speaker: there are labels that get used and we're not afraid of labels on one hand but at the same time um you know Like I said, we we agree with what most people would classify as Calvinism and in terms of...
Speaker: um salvation, but... That doesn't mean that we wholeheartedly endorse every single thing that Calvin ever taught. Sure. um Most earthly Bible teachers, we would say we probably can't endorse every single thing they ever taught. That's right. um But we do believe that there's... definite biblical truth that we can talk about and hopefully encourage one another and those who might be watching or listening. Mm -hmm.
Speaker: yeah in our conversation. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, nobody's perfect. um I often say from the pulpit, I don't agree with myself all the time. so And so even my heroes, I don't agree with everything.
Speaker: But one of my heroes is Charles Spurgeon, the Prince of Preachers, you know, that great Baptist preacher. But he was a Calvinist. He says just a nickname. Yeah. And that's what you're saying. And um historically speaking.
Speaker: ah The reason that it's it's a nickname, it's not that Calvin wrote out the five points of Calvinism per se. Uh, he You know, he wrote the institution, the Christian religion, pretty big. Volume. Sure. um one of the most prominent writing theologians of the Reformation.
Speaker: But. um ah really Really, the term Calvinism comes sight in the aftermath of the Synod of Dort. I don't want to go down this road too long. We're we're just broad brushing all this stuff.
Speaker: But, you know, Jacob Arminius, you know, the the churches. In that particular that particular time, they were they were mainly... you know, Well, we got to say Calvinistic. They'd never heard of that term. They believed in the doctors of grace. Right. And Arminius comes along, and he comes up with five points. And he basically...
Speaker: It's the emphasis on man's free will. You know, that man is is not so sinful that he can't respond to God on his own. that Um, election has to do with foreknowledge and not God's decree.
Speaker: that Jesus died for every single person. uh, ever born. that people can resist the Holy Spirit. And that you can lose your salvation. And so the theologians and pastors and...
Speaker: you know the civil magistrate was in on this they all got together and this this synod was I don't even remember. I think it. did off and on over the course of six months, maybe longer. So somebody can check me on that, but it wasn't like, you know, they got they got together one afternoon and came up with this stuff.
Speaker: But because Jacob Arminius had... Come up with five crucial points. ah They came up with five points to respond, and that became known as the five points of Calvinism because of his Um.
Speaker: yeah You know, the fact that he was a well -known writing theologian and he dealt with these issues. Not in exactly the same way, but he dealt with these issues in the institutes of the Christian religion. so That's just a historical dynamic there.
Speaker: And also, and I know you're going to want to talk about this and I don't know if we want to do it now or. maybe at the end if we'll save it to the end that's fine make sure we don't forget but We don't deny the free offer of the gospel. We don't deny that.
Speaker: In fact, we embrace the free offer of the gospel. Let me put it in a positive ah way, a positive light. We believe in the preaching of the gospel. We believe in evangelism. We believe that...
Speaker: Men and women, boys and girls won't be saved unless they respond to the gospel. Well, what does Romans 10 say? ah But how are they going to hear? Yeah, how how can they believe unless they've heard? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker: How can they hear unless someone preaches to them? That's right. How beautiful the feet of those who those who preach good news. yeah so got gotta ah We're set. We're going to take the gospel.
Speaker: We're not ashamed of the gospel because it... is the power is the power that's right of ah for all who believe yeah exactly um and Um, you know not to Not to sound like I'm embracing third -wayism or anything like that. or led to ah to to try to indicate that that these discussions aren't important because I think they are very important. sure But um basically, you know, the issue that we're discussing today and when we use labels like Calvinism or Arminianism.
Speaker: um Obviously, most... a conservative Bible -believing. protestant christians are going to fall on either side of this, one of these two camps, essentially. But just like we said.
Speaker: ah that we would affirm. Uh... Calvin's five points. um that doesn't mean that we agree with everything that Calvin ever wrote. I would say that most people that would identify themselves as Armenian.
Speaker: would also not agree with everything. that armenius ever wrote a chart And I do think that there is maybe... um Because... that We can always...
Speaker: I'd be guilty of creating an us versus them. within the Christian camp. right um to where if you don't agree with every point of theology that I do.
Speaker: then then we have to be enemies. right And again, I think these discussions are important. I think we need to come to... good biblical understanding of things. um But at the same time, I think there is ah maybe a little more nuance than we sometimes give credit for, for those that are on either side of the issue.
Speaker: um And so I think. um There are a lot of things that... We're going to say, coming from a Calvinistic point of view. that Most people that would identify themselves as Armenian or not Calvinist would agree with in large port. Sure, sure. And so.
Speaker: Um, Again, we're not we're also not saying that we've we've got it all completely nailed down and got the answer 100 % right. um But we do want to. encourage these type of conversations so that we can.
Speaker: We can... even if we're coming from different angles that we can come to an understanding of what does the Bible say about salvation and how we are saved. and what our role is, it what the Lord's role is in it, all of those things. Yeah, that's right.
Speaker: Yeah, and I think... um to one of the points you just made. You kind of look on social media these days, X in particular. Somebody disagrees with somebody else. Two Christian brothers, they disagree.
Speaker: And in many, many cases, they're calling them names just. excoriating them. and even sometimes declaring an anathema on them. Yeah. That's just, it's it's not a ah ah biblical way to approach one another. No, no. We don't want to do that. As you said, we don't feel that. We're brothers in Christ, even if we you know disagree on on these issues.
Speaker: um We're more like... ah George Whitfield and John Wesley. Whitfield was a Calvinist. Wesley was an Armenian. um And someone asked George Whitfield one time, you know the story. Yeah. um You think you'll see John Wesley in heaven? Like I said, nope. He said, no, of course.
Speaker: Wait a minute, what? You know, Calvinist. And Whitfield went on to say no because he's far more holy than I am. He's going to be so much closer closer to the throne than I will. Yeah, that's it. so That's the spirit we want. I know many, many, and I've said it over the years, and this is not just saying it.
Speaker: it's It's an absolute fact. I know many, many Armenian brothers. We disagree on these issues. But... They seem to be far more godly than I, far more mature, and and I respect them as pastors. and Men of God, so...
Speaker: Anyway, we always want to approach, I mean, any theological issue, but especially an issue like this with a tremendous amount of humility yeah and and not to necessarily bury the lead or bury the conclusion too early, but...
Speaker: Um, I think if if if we truly... ah believe in the sovereignty of God as as we claim to. I think Calvinists should be actually actually in fact even more humble. Yes, yes. Because if I believe it really has nothing to do with me, then how could I how could i be arrogant about that? Right, right. um And so, yeah, we want to we want to approach this with humility and with love and with just a desire to.
Speaker: To try to encourage one another and and help one another along. yeah Even if we disagree on something, that we can lovingly discuss these things instead of just setting each other up as enemies. enemies Yeah, that's right. And. um You know, Tulip.
Speaker: It's kind of an oversimplified way, you know, because these these are. nuanced and complicated issues. when you really get to reading the literature, historically speaking. So we're we're trying to keep it simple.
Speaker: Um, We're not going to really get into the difference between, you know, Pelagianism and semi -Pelagianism and Arminianism. We're kind of lumping it all together. We know that's not what we're supposed to do. This this is a...
Speaker: A friendly conversation. That's what this is. That's why. And I think, you know, Tulip. ah Let's just go ahead and wade into it at this point so you know now that we're finished with all the... You know?
Speaker: caveats or whatever, but they're important. Yeah. But... total depravity the sinfulness of man the sinfulness of human beings I think. You know... You'll never understand the doctrine of election.
Speaker: without understanding what we regard as the biblical teaching on the sinfulness of human beings. So not only do we start there because it's the tea and tulip. But we start there because it's foundational. yeah And if you see, I... I fully believe.
Speaker: Because whenever I talk to people, they're always objecting here, objecting there. But if if if you can really take seriously. See, that sounds pejorative. I don't mean it, but if you... If you see what the Bible says.
Speaker: about our sinfulness and and and our deadness apart from Christ. Um, It's going to be a whole other... Maybe you embrace it. Maybe you don't. Hopefully you do. But I guess my implication is if you see it like we think you should see it. Is that fair to say? Um,
Speaker: If you do that, then everything else, it it just it almost has to be. It makes sense. Yeah, it truly is foundational. I mean, we have to start with... Um, you know, I know you used to...
Speaker: different evangelism training and stuff, you've got to give them the bad news before you can give them the good news. But we really do have to start with. Our condition and why why do we need salvation? Salvation from what?
Speaker: um And I do think that. Um, the The flip side of understanding total depravity, understanding our... Total sinfulness. um links to that is.
Speaker: having a a true understanding of God's holiness. and yeah his righteousness. Yes. um Because I think this is the, obviously. It's the first point. But I think it is where a lot of people immediately get tripped up. Because it's hard for us to...
Speaker: Uh... to be able to grasp. how good and perfect Totally good and perfect. and holy god is yeah and how Far from that, we are.
Speaker: as human beings. um And. any Any type of consideration of... election and and those types of things that we're going to get into in a little bit. yep the reason that it The reason that so many people can bristle at it is because it's so hard.
Speaker: to take. my morality out of it and and my perception of the way things should be. Um, Because I... I can't Understand.
Speaker: how wicked i am yeah yeah and so um I'm trying to hold. what god what I think God should do. to a standard that I've created. without realizing that I have fallen. short of the standard that exists. Because it's God's nature and how far.
Speaker: Man falls away from that. Yeah, that's right. So... um I think. um you know We can look at some scriptures here. ah You can throw some out. I'll throw a couple out. I'll just start with one.
Speaker: that you know lands on me as as much as any of them. but and And if you have it in front of you, you can actually read it. but I think Ephesians... um 2 verse 1 and following is a...
Speaker: is a big one. um If I'm not mistaken, that's the verse that says we're born. dead in trespasses and sin. And of course. The implication there is if you're spiritually dead, how can you make yourself alive?
Speaker: um And not only are we born dead in trespasses and sin. But, um... We were. We were going our own way. We're following the course of this world. which of course is is evil. um the it said e Paul says there, and you can just read it, but the spirit of...
Speaker: ah Satan is at work in in those who are not saved. We're by nature children of wrath. So, you know, this is our nature. This is who we are apart from Christ. Yeah, sure. Ephesians 2 starting with verse 1. Yeah. And you are dead in your in the trespasses and sins in which you once walked.
Speaker: following the course of this world. following the prince of the power of the air. which we know to be Satan. Right. the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedient. ah disobedience, yeah among whom we all... once lived in the passions of our flesh.
Speaker: carrying out the desires of the flesh and the mind. and were by nature. children of wrath. Like the rest of mankind.
Speaker: yeah we can We can stop there with the with yeah discussion we've got here. That's right. um as ah as As you know, it... goes on and yeah Paul actually kind of... creates a and one really long run -on sentence. that I'd love that. Yeah, I know you would. Absolutely. yeah um But, you know, obviously the the back half of that, ah Paul does give us that good news that we talked about. but those first four verses kind of are laying out what we're talking about here
Speaker: um And, and again, you know, just to highlight. Some things here, you know, we were dead, as you said. um so Um... ah Dead means yeah dead, dead right right? What can a dead man do? right Absolutely nothing. um He says, when in which he once walked.
Speaker: Following the course of this world, um I think it's interesting to use that phrase there, ah the course of this world. um Because, as as some of our brothers will... Try to counter argue.
Speaker: Let's say that that Christ died for the world. And in that case, the world they would say the world means the world. yeah Well, I would say here the world means the world. yeah And so everyone follows after this same path. That's right. yes And we'll get to that. yeah But you're right. um And. um He said, ah um among whom we all. once lived, um carrying out the desires of the flesh and the mind.
Speaker: And we're by nature yeah children of wrath. So our nature. Um, Who we are yeah was sinful. That's right. um and ah You know, you you can't you can't undo your your own nature. Right, right. um None of us can do that. That's right. um And so, yeah, but I mean, that pretty clearly lays it out there that.
Speaker: there's There's no good people. Right. No, yeah, exactly. And in Romans 3, Paul says that, right? There's none good, none righteous, none seeks after God. They've all gone.
Speaker: astray the poison of snakes is under their tongue, etc., etc., etc. No one seeks after God. Um, but But going back to what you were saying. just before that statement.
Speaker: which is absolutely true. Um, You know, this is why you know, the fact that we're born dead in sin. This is why the Lord Jesus said to Nicodemus, you must be born again. You've got to be born of water and the Spirit.
Speaker: You're born the first time, that's that's you're okay, you're born dead in sin by nature. what Why? Well... We can talk about that, but... ah Let me come back to it. But you're born dead in sin.
Speaker: And you have to have a new birth. and And this... this You have to be born spiritually. And so this is this is what Jesus is communicating to Nicodemus. You have to be born of the Spirit or you will not see the kingdom of God. You won't understand the kingdom of God.
Speaker: And a lot of people think, well, once you repent and believe. ah You'll be born again. But that's not what the scripture says. How can you repent and believe if you're dead? We're going to tell you what the Armenians say, and we're going to kind of push back on that.
Speaker: But just think about it for a minute. Like you said, how can you repent and believe if you're dead? So the the new birth comes first. You're born again. All of a sudden, your eyes are open.
Speaker: ah you've You've got a new heart. You've got a new nature. you You're regenerated or made alive by the Spirit. And God gives you the twin gifts of repentance and faith. Now, he doesn't repent and believe for you. Right.
Speaker: But you can't repent and believe unless you have those gifts by grace. This is why. Paul said, for by grace are you saved right in that Ephesians 2 that you just read. yep Not a word, unless anyone should boast.
Speaker: So... you You repent and believe. And you're justified. and And we could go on and talk about the other some other aspects of salvation. That's not really our purpose today.
Speaker: But... I'm just making the connection. If you're dead in sin, that's why you need a new birth. And to your point. You know, Paul says things like, all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. What else does he say? The wages of sin is death.
Speaker: um Jeremiah, the heart is desperately wicked. Who can know it? Um, We come we spring forth from the womb speaking lies. Every inclination of man's heart is only evil all the time. Genesis 6, maybe? I'm just...
Speaker: I'm just pulling from memory here. Right, yeah. so And John 6, 44 says, No man can come to me except the Father. uh who sent me draws him there you go um so again that's highlighting our inability right to repent and believe on our own yeah inability to come to the father right
Speaker: um We have to be drawn. by the Spirit, that new birth. That's right. Again, this was a controversial statement when Jesus made it to Nicodemus, right? Because who was Nicodemus? you know He was a teacher of the law. That's right. and um he was he was he was a good jew right as far as we're told and um he He followed the law.
Speaker: ah To the T. And so he probably was coming with an understanding that he had a righteousness of his own. yeah And so that's why Jesus immediately. ah goes to the heart of the matter with him and says, you know, you have to be born again. Yeah. um Because you're you're dead. Yeah. And even all of the works that you think you're doing that are good and righteous.
Speaker: They're not. yeah um You know, ah Paul tells us our righteousness is filthy rags. ye yeah um So even the things that we think that we do that are good. Um, if if we're not in Christ, even those things are sin, right? The Bible tells us that. That's right. Because we don't do it with a heart to glorify God. Yeah. so eat It's not just our actions, but it's the attitudes of our hearts as well. right And so if I do something that is considered a good deed, but I do it out of a selfish motivation.
Speaker: Even if that's just to get the pat on the back and everybody to tell me that I'm a good person. that's actually sin right um And so... Uh, All of that speaks to that fact that Jesus, as Jesus said, we have to be born again. We have to have that new heart. given to us.
Speaker: um Otherwise... Nothing that we do, even if it looks like repentance or fate, right? um it it can't be because we don't have that new heart everything that we do is sinful yeah until Christ awakens us and draws us into himself. Even the... The plowing of a field, the Bible says, is sin if you don't know God.
Speaker: Because you're not glorifying God in that, as you said. And. ah Contrast that again to your other point. You get the Jesus condemning the Pharisees. who are praying in public. they're They're doing these great looking things to everybody. um You got one Pharisee, or at least a Jewish religious leader, I think it's a Pharisee, comes into the temple.
Speaker: Uh... What did he say? I thank God I'm not like these sinners and tax col collectors and all this. This tax collector over here. Yeah, there you go. yeah yeah And, of course, tax collectors were reviled by the Jews primarily because they They had sold out their Jewish brethren. um And basically, the the Romans were... ah They were, they were agents of the Romans of Rome of Roman. Yeah. yeah And so here's this.
Speaker: tax collector who all of a sudden all he He says, Lord, forgive me a sinner. or what a wretched man I am or something like that. Have mercy on me, Lord, a sinner.
Speaker: And what does Jesus say? I tell you the truth, that man. Left. Left and went down to his house justified. Because God had opened his heart. I mean, that right you got a narrative there. It's not just that, oh.
Speaker: This Pharisee's doing this, and the tax collector's doing that on their own. I mean, he's making a point that... Like the the point that you're making. um We're dead in sin. and And even the plowing of a field or even righteous things. None of that saves us.
Speaker: Romans 8 says that it is impossible for the lost man to please God. Well, wouldn't it please God to repent and believe? Well, sure, but it's impossible for that to happen apart from right the effectual working of the Spirit.
Speaker: of of the living God. Yeah, I think it's part of the reason that ah you know Jesus calls the Pharisees whitewashed tombs, right? And he says on the outside that they look clean and polished, but on the inside they're full of dead men's bones. yeah um um A very vivid picture there.
Speaker: especially when we're talking about being dead in sin yeah um the dead bones are on the inside um And I think it's important for us to understand that that's not just. and admonishment of these first century pharisees and teachers of the law and scribes um But that that is that is applied to all of us. Yeah. In the sense that because I think that's another thing where people can trip up sometimes.
Speaker: is that... Um... There are bad people in the world and they're easy to identify, right? Yep, right. There are people out there that It's... We know. yeah They're wicked. yeah it's It's not hard for anybody to identify that. right But there are people who are what we would call good people who do good things, who benefit society. Yeah. um But.
Speaker: Again, without that new birth. All of us are no different than these Pharisees. so he can We can polish up and look clean. On the outside. Hmm? But on the inside, we are dead until we're made alive on the inside by Christ. That's right. That's right. And I would just encourage folk. you know to think on all those verses maybe there's some verses we could hit that we haven't Touchstone, unfortunately, we can't.
Speaker: be exhaustive here, but... You know... um Think about it. maybe Maybe you are a good person compared to your next door neighbor, compared to. you know, whoever. But look in your heart. I mean, man When I start thinking about my my wicked thoughts, my wicked motives.
Speaker: my just my selfishness i don't want to be burdened by this i don't be burdened by that i mean it's yeah It's just sin. It's all wickedness. yeah And hopefully I'm being conformed to the image of Christ over time.
Speaker: But there's still so much. ah you know, sin in my own heart. i I have no problem and admitting to to God I'm um i a sinner or to others. I'm not proud of it. It's just not, oh, well look at me. No.
Speaker: you know i've figured this out no that's not where i'm coming from Um, It's just that. Yeah, I don't. I don't think I'm a good person. You know, like you say, you you could.
Speaker: you know roll out some You know serial killer or whatever. Well, he's obviously bad Well, I'm i'm bad too. You know, that's why. Uh, You know anyway I was going to quote somebody, but I won't. But I will say this, and then I'll kick it to you before we move on.
Speaker: By the way, we're going to. give as we go some Some objections from the Armenians. I don't know if we want to do that. Yeah, I mean, do you want to do that as we go? Let's do it as we go. And I will say this.
Speaker: Total depravity does not mean that we're as sinful as we can be. um God prevents that. restraining grace. We don't have time to get into all that. But it does mean total, total depravity.
Speaker: It means we're sinful in every aspect of our being, which is what we you and I both were alluding to. Yeah, to where even the things that we do that might seem good are still sin. And, you know, I can't compare myself to my neighbor like you said.
Speaker: Because what's my neighbor doing? He's comparing himself to his neighbor yeah and and on down the line. but right So that means that everyone is comparing themselves to a different standard. But um we can only compare to one standard and that standard is God himself. Yeah. and And again, as... Scripture clearly tells us all of us fall short. that's right of that standard. That's right.
Speaker: Yeah. um Yeah, our thoughts are sinful, our words, our actions. Like he said, everything is sinful. And of course, when we're born again, we still sin. We can actually do something.
Speaker: properly motivated once we're saved because of the power of the Spirit and because we're in Christ. um But I think most of the time, even the good things I do are still tainted with sin. That's just something I'm working on. But now you can repent of that as well. Yeah, yeah, that's right. But that's the work of the Spirit. But before you couldn't. That's right. I couldn't before. I didn't even know before. Didn't care. Right. Didn't care. Didn't even know.
Speaker: If I was thinking something bad about... somebody that that's that's a problem. It's a sin against God. Yeah. ah You know, I think what the Armenians would say, we don't want to dwell too long on this.
Speaker: they but They would say a couple of things. um one, and you tell me uh because we you know we've been in this context for a long long time i think some of them would say well you know Everybody has a spark of goodness. and Bye. There's no Bible verse that says that, so that would be, my I guess, my greatest argument. All right, show me in the Bible.
Speaker: where where you see that. Mm hmm. Some would argue a little bit more theologically, and it's almost... Similar, but... They come from this notion of prevenient grace. John Wesley talked about prevenient grace, among others.
Speaker: Prevenient grace would be the notion that God... Yes, people are sinners, but God gives everybody. Enough grace. to Have the.
Speaker: the ability to either choose Christ or reject Christ. and Again, you The concept of prevenient grace is just... i mean I don't know where you'd go in Scripture to show that to me. Right, yeah, and and again, we want all of our arguments to be rooted in what the Bible tells us. Right.
Speaker: um so So, yeah, I mean... on On the one hand, they would agree with us that man is sinful. yeah And that because we're sinful, we can't save ourselves. They would agree with us on on that point.
Speaker: But again, as as you said, they would they would argue that. In some way, man can still... Uh... Come to the Lord on his own Yeah. And then and then ask for that. grace Yeah. You know.
Speaker: Um... But again, we don't we don't really see that. laid out in Scripture. Oh. No. A couple of verses. I don't mean to interrupt. A row head couple of verses that they might cite. I was trying to pull up. a couple so yeah yeah well you got it No, you can go ahead and mention them one. Yeah. um And I think we'd probably want to deal with this.
Speaker: under limited atonement as well. But, you know, I think they would go to something like John 12, 32, where You know, Jesus draws all people to himself. Okay, well...
Speaker: First off. What does that mean? Does that mean he gives everybody the ability to believe? I mean, is that how you're interpreting that verse? um I don't know how you'd get that interpretation out of that verse, but some do.
Speaker: But essentially... Um, Is that the verse? where Where if Jesus is lifted up on the cross? Yeah, yeah, I was going to say. He would draw all men to himself? Actually, the verse, the passage. interprets the verse for us. Please. So in John 12, and we'll we'll start with...
Speaker: ah Verse 32. But he's he's in the middle of a discourse. where he is he is basically foretelling his his death and the manner.
Speaker: Of his death. Yes. And he says and I. When I am lifted up from the earth. will draw all people to myself. um And then the next verse, verse 33, says, He said this to show By what kind of death?
Speaker: he was going to die. Um, and so. Um, Again, that doesn't take away the phrase. all people right but uh the point of what he's saying here Is he is. predicting his own crucifixion he was lifted up on a cross yes yes um and uh he's he's foretelling how he was going to be executed. right um And. ah
Speaker: So then but then when you put that into that context and he says I. We'll draw all people. to myself um again this was where i guess the argument comes up does all mean and all yeah yeah yeah yeah right We've had that. discussion in the past before. Right.
Speaker: um But. ah It's it's not in the context of a discussion where he's saying that That. all people are going to come to me well yeah think of it this way Yeah, he didn't say all people would come.
Speaker: But if he says, I will draw all men to myself. Do you believe, not you, but... the the The you, the general you. Do Armenians really believe? that Jesus, what he meant by that is, I will draw all men, every single person to myself.
Speaker: Excuse me. If Jesus is drawing you to himself, And by the way, go back. No one can come to the Father except the Holy Spirit. Draw him, John 6. You quoted that a little bit earlier. The word draw there.
Speaker: uh there and and i don't know what it is in this verse it may be the same i don't know but it the the idea is ah drawing like drawing water out of a well. So you dip the bucket.
Speaker: You draw it out. So... it's It's an effectual drawing. Um, So... ah You can't come to the Father unless the Spirit is working. That's number one.
Speaker: And I guess maybe they'd say, well, that's prevenient grace. Well, if you look at in context. a he's He's talking about his sheep. He's talking about the elect and all that. We'll get to some of that.
Speaker: But two here. Do you believe that Jesus is drawing all men to himself? you'd have to say, okay, every single person is drawn to Christ. Well, I think all of us would say, well, there are a lot of people that don't seem to be being drawn to Christ.
Speaker: I mean, there's some people who never even heard of him. And then you've got, which is a whole other discussion. Then you've got. Um, You'd have to come up with some kind of...
Speaker: well, I guess they would say, but Christ is drawing, but they're rejecting, and we'll deal with that. under irresistible grace. but here's Here's what I would say, and I know you would say the same thing.
Speaker: What does Jesus mean? You say he's talking about the crucifixion, 100%. What does he mean? He's talking about the cross. Think about that. That's so key, and I'm glad you brought that out because I didn't have the passage in front of me.
Speaker: But. He's talking about the plan of redemption. when you When you're doing... Bible interpretation. you You got to understand not only the the immediate grammatical context. the the The genre.
Speaker: um the historical background, all of that. But you got to understand. John's message. ah You got to understand the New Testament. You got to understand the whole Bible, everything in the context.
Speaker: And one of those things is understanding the. the epochal context. In other words, when you're looking at at the contours of redemptive history You've got type and shadow.
Speaker: In the Old Testament, you've got fulfillment in the new. So anyway. In the Old Testament, The people of God. Basically, it's Israel. It's national ethnic Israel. People can be proselytized, but it's it's the Jews, right?
Speaker: The whole, you and you see this right throughout the Old Testament. And you see it in the new, the Great Commission. Make disciples of all the nations. The whole point is that when Jesus comes on the scene,
Speaker: And that new. covenant age, we'll just use that, is ushered in without getting bogged down. Um. The gospel is now going not just to the Jews.
Speaker: It's going to all men. And it's certainly not saying, and and we don't none of us believe, Armenians don't believe. that every single person is going to be saved. Right. Right. So that's why we get into this discussion of awe.
Speaker: what What does all mean? Well, in the context of the New Testament, Um, depending on depending on the context but one of the major contexts of the old testament is this jew Versus Gentile.
Speaker: Right. And so that's why. I mean, we quoted it a moment ago when Paul said in Romans 1 .16, I'm not ashamed of the gospel because it's the power of salvation for all who believe. First for the Jew.
Speaker: and also the Greek, also the Gentile. Because that is an astounding statement to the Jews. Gentiles are dirty dogs. Right. They're, they're...
Speaker: How are they going to be saved? But this is the... the unbelievable message of the gospel. This is why you can look at all the servant songs in the book of Isaiah. Listen, you coastlands, hear you islands. and ah The coastlands wait for the law of the Lord.
Speaker: and And the law in that context refers to the word of the Lord, just like... If you go to Psalm... They're all these. different synonymous phrases that refer to the Word of God. This is the law of the Lord. is perfect converting the soul.
Speaker: Wait a minute. Does the Ten Commandments, does the law convert the soul? Well, no, all the law does is condemn. right Paul says that over and over again. other Other prophets and apostles say that. Can't be saved by the law. No no flesh should be justified by the works of the law.
Speaker: well Well, David just said that... The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. What does it mean? In context, the law of the Lord there is the word of God. The word of God. The word of God, the gospel. So anyway, I know I'm rambling a little bit. well and we even see that begin to be fleshed out at the crucifixion itself yes yes you know the thief on the cross um we're We're not entirely sure if he's a Gentile.
Speaker: A Jew, I don't think. um I don't think it tells us. Yeah, I don't yeah i don't know. yeah um but But we see him. ah turning to Christ in faith. um We see a Roman soldier.
Speaker: uh standing at the foot of the cross and saying surely this man was the son of god yeah um you know expressing his his faith in jesus so we already are At the crucifixion, we already see that. yeah start to happen where.
Speaker: Um, people that that, again, would have been walking in darkness under the old covenant. have been shown the light. And then I think it's interesting if you continue to read in this passage and almost get too bogged down here. No, that's good. but um if you So we were in verse 32, right? And then 33 says, he said this to show. what kind of death he was going to die.
Speaker: Then in verse 34, the crowd that he's speaking to. um And again, this crowd, they've just heard a voice from heaven um ah speaking to Jesus because Jesus is troubled, you know, yeah because.
Speaker: um He knows that his time is near. and And so he's he's dealing with the weight of that, right? um And this voice from heaven. comes and speaks and the people hear it.
Speaker: And he's telling them. This voice is for your benefit. basically to know that I have been sent from heaven. Um, But my time is near. And then that's when he says.
Speaker: I'm going to be lifted up. I'll draw them into myself. So then in verse 34, this crowd asks him, they said, we have heard from the law. that the christ remains forever How can you say that the son of man must be lifted up? So they understood he was talking about an execution. Yes. um And they said, who is this son of man?
Speaker: Jesus answered them, The light. Hmm. is among you for a little while longer. Walk while you have the light. lest darkness overtake you.
Speaker: The one who walks in the darkness. does not know where he is going. While you have the light, believe in the light that you may become sons.
Speaker: Of the light. Yeah. And so. That's all of us are walking in that darkness, right? Until the light shines on us. Yeah. um To use that imagery. um And he's even saying to these people here, I am the light. Yeah. you know thats yeah That's what we're... that's what we're told uh all throughout john you know um i am the light and i'm with you now But he's saying that.
Speaker: That after his death and after his resurrection and and ascension. They're going to be walking in darkness unless yeah the Holy Spirit. who comes is is shines the light in their heart. And so.
Speaker: there are going to be people that are walking in darkness and don't know where they're going. Right. So if they're walking in darkness, don't know where they're going, how can they come to the light? Yeah. Yeah. So again, we would say that that that clearly shows to me that.
Speaker: that light has to be. shine in your heart right in order for you to be able to come yeah to the light. yeah um You can't find it groping in darkness. Yeah, no, that's right. That's right. Hmm.
Speaker: Paul says that... you know Satan is blinding the the minds of those who don't believe. But Christ has shown in our hearts. the light of the gospel, the same light that shone out of darkness.
Speaker: at creation, not not shining into darkness, shown out of darkness. This is the light of the Lord, His illuminating light, as you're as you're saying. maybe Maybe let's just take... um Couple more minutes and...
Speaker: flesh out this whole world and all for just a minute since we're here. and and And it'll apply to... the atonement when when we get there. but Um, You know, you you look at John's gospel.
Speaker: or John's writings. And we do the same, brother. He uses the word world. in seven different ways. World, you know We can mean, hey, the entire world, and we mean the universe. Or we can say the entire world, and we might mean all the people on the planet. Mm hmm. Or we could say the entire world, and we might just mean Earth. Mm -hmm.
Speaker: Or we could say... The world is wicked, and we mean the world's wicked earth earthly, wicked, pagan system. Um, Or we could say, you are my world. You know you are my everything. Thank you.
Speaker: You know... I guess one of the things that we would urge. is Don't just read a verse and inject what you think it means into it without wrestling with that. that whole context. How is John using the word? or Paul, whoever. Peter.
Speaker: how what What are they trying to communicate? right And this whole... Jew -Gentile thing. It literally is the entire New Testament.
Speaker: it's It's probably. I haven't done a study, but I would say it is It is the major theme. you know Aside from you know Jesus and aside from... salvation in him. but You know that that The gospel goes to the Gentiles as well as the Jews. So you look at Paul's argument in Romans, from Romans 1 all the way through Romans, what's he saying?
Speaker: You Jews think you're privileged. But no. The gospel is going to the Gentiles as well. ah You know, for all have sinned and come short. Well, all who? Well, Jew and Gentile. um you know so Again, even the word all, the word world.
Speaker: It has a context. when when we come to yeah You know, John's saying the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. Mm hmm. and Well, nobody believes, and I'm talking about Bible -believing Armenians and Bible -believing Calvinists. Nobody believes that Jesus takes away the sin of every person that's ever lived. That's right. Right. He takes away the sin of Jews and Gentiles. He takes away the sin of those who believe. and uh it's it's that context and and and we could go on but i just think It's important to...
Speaker: to to see that. and and Anyway, we'll we'll say more, but we could get bogged down. here So, um Total depravity. Maybe we should move on to... The election. Yeah.
Speaker: Well, the U means unconditional election. Right, so... Armenians would believe in election. But they would see it a little bit differently than we do. They they would they would say conditional election. Well, what does that mean?
Speaker: Well, those who believe are elect is what they would say. And we would say, well, it's the elect who believe. ah Right. We say it's unconditional. God is the one who chooses. And, you know, they would.
Speaker: basically say, well, God looks down the timeline of history. And he sees who will believe. and therefore he chooses them. Um... And we're saying, well, that that makes God a reaction.
Speaker: reactionary. He's reacting to what humans do. That's not how the Bible you know describes God. God is sovereign. God is in control. God has declared the... The end from the beginning. Um...
Speaker: And it's not just God looking down the timeline of history. You know, that's how they define foreknowledge. Excuse me. But for knowledge, means to know beforehand. this It doesn doesn't mean...
Speaker: Like if you're talking about people like whom he foreknew. He predestined to be conformed to the image of Christ. that That's Romans 8. Mm hmm. So, for knowledge... In that sense, for whom he foreknew,
Speaker: It doesn't mean whom he knew about or whom he knew what. what they would do. It's those whom he knew at a personal level. he He knew them in a relational way. um Oh, hi.
Speaker: I know about. Um, John F. Kennedy, but I've never met him. right He died several months before I was born. um but But I know about him. yeah But I don't know him. But I know you. right you know I know my my wife. and ah Of course, Adam knew Eve, and she conceived.
Speaker: So there's an um even more intimate intimate kind of yeah knowledge. So again. I think what I'm urging here is. Make sure you understand how words are being used.
Speaker: Look at that larger context, whether it's the grammatical, the historical. The point of the text. What testament are you in? And then the larger concept of redemptive history and what the what the trajectory of the Bible is all about. That's what we're urging. Right, yeah. um Because I would say...
Speaker: that if if If we want to say it's based on a foreknowledge that looks ahead. to see who will believe and then therefore based on seeing that or knowing that.
Speaker: He then elects them. Then aren't we? truly saying that it is based on something that i am going to do in the future yeah so it's it's works that's works It's works based. yeah um And so.
Speaker: Um, That flies in the face of of what Scripture teaches us. That's right. um And, and also. If we want to talk about foreknowledge, which I believe, yes, God has foreknowledge. God does know who's going to believe and who doesn't. sure Can God know anything that's not true? Right.
Speaker: right If God knows something, that means it is going to happen. yeah We would say he knows it's going to happen because. He has declared that it will happen. He has ordained for it to happen. That's right. um And so, yes, he has foreknowledge.
Speaker: because he ordained it. And so again, we would say that God is the one that's declaring this to to come about. yeah He knows that it will come about because he said it's going to come about yeah and everything he says. comes true that's right um and so yeah um Again.
Speaker: they're still putting some degree of power In man's. hands right when you when you look at it in that way. Yeah, yeah, that's right. Um, the The other thing I'd say... um Gosh, maybe just went right out of my head.
Speaker: Because I got riveted by what you were saying there at the end. So sorry. Um. Yeah, god God's foreknowledge. We'll just have to come back to it. I don't know what's happening that's okay with my brain lately. but um you know, We do have verses.
Speaker: Like, you know, you got Romans 9. You know, you've got... God choosing and... and You know, I don't have the verse in front of me. I don't know if it's some of the ones we jotted down.
Speaker: I don't know if there's one you got over there, you jotted down, but... ah you know before You know, Jacob and Esau. Before they were born, and it literally says before they had done any good or evil. Oh, I know what I was going to say a moment ago. Let's come back to the to the Romans 9.
Speaker: Okay. what would good We'll we' just finish the Romans now. Before they had done any good or evil, it was said to the... to the older. Uh... You shall serve the younger.
Speaker: And and you know this is Paul's argument. Uh... that he's raised. he he he His argument is that Salvation is my grace. And it's it's those whom he's predestined, those whom he's chosen, those whom he's elected.
Speaker: And he uses all kinds of illustrations. But um you know a lot of people interpret that as, well, he's he's electing groups and not individuals. like Israel in Romans 11. Well,
Speaker: First off, that's still God choosing. You know, out of all the nations of the earth, he chose Israel. I mean, it's not because Israel. was better than the rest of the nations he literally says that over and over and over He chose them. for his own glory, and that is the argument that he's making in Romans 9, 10, 11. He's answering the question, well, aren't most of the Jews being saved right now?
Speaker: Part of that is because the fulfillment is not in... an ethnic Israel. The fulfillment is in a spiritual Israel, right which is comprised of Jew and Gentile who believe, but who are those who believe?
Speaker: Well, it's those whom God has chosen. And he says, you know, for this purpose i've raised up pharaoh that's another illustration he gives in in Romans 9. Um,
Speaker: that that I might demonstrate my power in him. and And, you know, Pharaoh's the quintessential bad guy, I guess. But he said, I i raised him up for this purpose. um i I wish I had all those verses in front of me. I probably should have written them down. but Nevertheless, he he talks about he quotes ah the Old Testament. Hosea.
Speaker: where it says ah where they were declared not my people, there they shall be declared my people. Well, he's referring to the Gentiles there, Old Testament. He's referring to Jews.
Speaker: New Testament, he's referring to Gentiles. And so... I guess the whole point. I'm making is when when you get to Romans 9, we don't have to you know read through the whole chapter. I think most people who...
Speaker: are in on this kind of debate. ah They've come to Romans 9, and they know it's about election, and they're wrestling with what it says. And I think, again— if If you just read through it, it becomes very, very clear.
Speaker: that a couple of things are going on in the book of romans one is like we said earlier Um, Gentiles are included. And it's all of grace. it's Because why? Because men are dead in sin. None is righteous. No, not one.
Speaker: And so God has to do that work. He explains. you know, in Romans. You know... Romans 8. I could go all the way through chapter by chapter and give you the theme. I don't want to do it.
Speaker: But real quick. I'm not going to do this, but just a couple of things that'll get me there. Romans chapter one. verse 18 the wrath of god is revealed against everybody right because we're all dead You can almost see the Jews cheering, yeah. Look at those dirty, rotten Gentiles. God says to the Jews in chapter 2, You're just as guilty. You're part of that group. That's right. Chapter three. None is righteous. No, not one. You need the righteousness of Christ.
Speaker: Doesn't come through the law. comes through faith. He proves that. Chapter 4. by dealing with Abraham. Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. Then in chapter 5, he explains.
Speaker: The representative work of Adam in Adam All Die. That's why we're born dead in sin. And then he explains the representative work of Christ. In Christ, all are made alive. Wait a minute.
Speaker: Is he teaching universalism? Well, no. well i thought all meant all and i'm i'm not making fun all does mean all but what does it mean all those whom Christ represents. Adam is the federal or representative head. of all humanity.
Speaker: Christ is the federal representative head. of those He chose, of those He redeemed, and the Father chooses. The Son redeems on the cross. The Spirit applies it in regeneration.
Speaker: um So that's chapter five. Chapter 6 You know, Now that you... you you Christ has done this for you. Your old man has died. You've been raised up to walk in newness of life.
Speaker: So don't let sin reign in your mortal body. It doesn't have to reign anymore because you're a new creature in Christ. Romans 8. There's an... Who will deliver me from my sinful inclinations? Romans 8. There's therefore now no condemnation for those who are aware.
Speaker: In Christ Jesus. and And that's when he begins to give us all these ah you walking in the spirit. and And all these assurances that nothing shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Why?
Speaker: Because... We have been predestined. in the Lord Jesus Christ. and and And that's why he says in Romans 9, He says, i'm I'm not lying.
Speaker: I mean, because it's so incredible, the doctrine of election. It's so... Incredible. And. um I know in Romans 9 somewhere, and this may be what... you're patiently waiting on.
Speaker: So i'll I'll let you take it. If not, we'll have to come back to it. but but roman Romans 9, he makes an argument that I think... Um, Any, any good Armenian. If he hasn't read Romans 9, when we say God chooses.
Speaker: he He's going to have to raise this question. Yeah. And I think it's right there. I um i was just going to read. Again, we're not going to read all of Romans 9. even though it's all great. Yeah. but um I'm going to read several verses in a row.
Speaker: And part of that is because... um You know a lot of times uh if we if we come up with a certain theological position and we can get kind of off center with it.
Speaker: ah is because people will... will Pick and choose verses. Yep. And they'll take them out of context. um But really what we have here is an entire. dialogue that takes place here.
Speaker: that's laying it out. And so I think it's important to see that this is all written together. This is all part of the same argument. So... um I'm just going to start at Romans 9 verse 10. Okay. He says, and not only so, but also when Rebecca had conceived.
Speaker: children by one man, our forefather Isaac. And so we're talking about Jacob and Esau here. Yep. um Verse 11 says, though they were not yet born. and had done nothing.
Speaker: Either good or bad. In order that God's purpose of... the election yeah might continue. Not because of works. future works or... Present works.
Speaker: But because of... Him who... calls She was told the older will serve the younger, as it is written, Jacob I have loved. But Esau I hated. Before they'd done any good or evil. Before they had done anything. Go ahead. Period. Right.
Speaker: Uh... So then... yeah This is where this dialogue comes up. He's he's talking to this hypothetical. Objector. What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God's part?
Speaker: To choose some, not choose others, right? That's not fair. By no means. Hmm. For he says to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I have mercy and I will have compassion.
Speaker: on whom I have compassion. So then... Verse 16, it depends not. on human will or exertion but on God who has mercy.
Speaker: For the scripture says to Pharaoh, yeah For this very purpose, I have raised you up. So now we're talking about an evil man. who was raised up by God for a purpose. Yep. He was still an evil man.
Speaker: um But God raised him up for his purpose, right? That I might show my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth. So then he has mercy on whomever he wills.
Speaker: And he hardens yeah whomever he wills. Because we if we remember. If you read in Exodus, The story of Pharaoh. mm -hmm It says what? That God...
Speaker: harden Yeah. pharaoh's heart yeah So. You will say to me, why then does he still find fault for who can resist his will? But who are you, O man?
Speaker: to answer back to God. Will what is molded say to its molder, Why have you made me like this? And that means for whatever purpose you've been molded for. Right, right. So none of us has any footing to stand on to come back to and say to God. you're not being fair. yeah um Has the potter no right over the clay to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? yeah What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power,
Speaker: has endured with much patience Vessels of wrath prepared for destruction. in order to make known the riches of his glory. for vessels of mercy. which he has prepared.
Speaker: beforehand yeah for glory. Yeah. Wow, and I'm glad you read that because I was batting all around it. Number one and number two, it's just so so clear when you read the word itself. It's way better than a summary, even if I were doing a good job.
Speaker: And. hum And the other thing that that just strikes me as I listen to that, number one, I can rejoice in the grace that God has given me. And that's why I smile when you're reading it. But it's also.
Speaker: Oh completely humbling. Right. like you said earlier, and Paul said, we have no reason to boast. If if God hadn't chosen me. I'd still be lost. I wouldn't even know it.
Speaker: whether i was a religious or not religious i wouldn't know i was lost right And. um but but but And that's why it's grace. It's not works. It's not merit. It's not religion. It's not ritual. It's grace. That's that's the whole point.
Speaker: And I'll hasten to say. Because, again, we're trying to you know answer certain questions and objections. um and we're certainly not we didn't you know write them all down so just as they pop in our head But...
Speaker: First off... Paul answered. Two or three, maybe four questions there. that human beings, you know, would typically... as well Wait a minute. If election is true, why does God hold people accountable? Why does he yet find fault?
Speaker: ah Is there unrighteousness with God? I mean, that seems like it's unfair, unrighteous. You know, that seems wicked. And see, I... By the way, just as a side issue, I do appreciate. ah The Armenians that I know.
Speaker: A lot of the the the ones that I know think that we're making God out to be evil by by the doctrine of election and predestination. And they know God's not evil. We know God's not evil. Right. And what they're trying to do is uphold the character of God. So I admire that motivation. They love God. They know he's not evil.
Speaker: they they We just see the Scriptures differently in that. We think we're right. They think they're right. so we'll we'll you know We'll stipulate to all of that, but... um So I think, though, where I was going with that is is these objections that that Paul raises in Romans 9, it is literally the exact objections that Arminians would make. And so that says to me that.
Speaker: That we're understanding Paul correctly to say that he's talking about... unconditional election. And then the last thing I would say with the reference to the passage that you read.
Speaker: You know, it does say in Exodus but multiple times, as you pointed out, that... God hardened Pharaoh's heart. ah That doesn't mean that God worked evil in his heart. James tells us God. God is not evil. He can't tempt anyone to evil, right? um And of course, we know that when it's all over the scriptures, he's holy, he's righteous.
Speaker: But it's a judicial hardening because not only does it say that that God hardened Pharaoh's heart in Exodus. It says if they were hard in his own heart. And essentially... What do I mean by judicial hardening? What does it mean to say God hardened his heart? God is like.
Speaker: Have it your way. Pharaoh did exactly what Pharaoh wanted to do. That's right that right. He wasn't compelled. against his will that's right to do the evil things that he did to the hebrew people Yeah. um And to Moses.
Speaker: um he He did exactly what he had in his own heart to do, and God... said. I'll allow it. That's right. He did not work grace in his heart. Right. Didn't have to. Because what do we call it when we say that God saves a person? as a softens yeah heart right that's right that's right and so um all of us And again,
Speaker: I would say that that's why. I know we're on the U right now, but that's why the T is so important yeah to truly understand. that and again they go hand in hand the team hand in hand all five of these go hand in hand But. We have to truly.
Speaker: wrap our minds around. the fact that there is no human being. that is worthy or deserving of mercy. yeah None of us deserve it. No. And if we.
Speaker: Get. If we get... something stuck in our crawl over the fact that god would not choose some and allow them to to have destruction.
Speaker: at the root of that is still somewhere deep down inside where we're we're convincing ourselves that that human beings are deserving of mercy yeah and none of us are no uh you weren't i were i wasn't none of us no human being throughout all of history has ever been worthy or deserving right of mercy.
Speaker: And so any of us that receive mercy, It's... That's exactly what it is. It's mercy. It's God's grace. It's a gift that we cannot, do not, will not.
Speaker: deserve. And so. for any that don't receive that grace and mercy. They are getting what they deserve. Yeah. yeah um And so.
Speaker: Again, we've we've talked about this all the time. and you know how Instead of asking ourselves, how could God send a person to hell? Mmm. How could God send anyone to heaven? How could God save anyone? That's the question. um Why would he save anyone is the true question. And the answer is for his glory. But does he?
Speaker: is a merciful God. he and he And he's also just, and he has to put both of those attributes on display because it is his nature to glorify himself. Exactly. And the reality of who he is. And to go back to that issue real quick, because it it made me think of this. ah We were talking about foreknowledge when God looks down the timeline of history, the Arminian.
Speaker: is Again, trying to defend God's character. And so, well, he's just choosing people who chose him. and And they're trying to let get God off the hook. yeah You know, for...
Speaker: condemning people to hell. you know It's only people that... that God sees don't choose him, and and and they go to hell. But you... you're still not getting gone off the hook because you Okay, well, then why did he create them in the first place? yo what you You're really not defending a new...
Speaker: I'm not being ugly, but I know you think you're defending his character because... Oh, well, God didn't choose these people. Well... N -no. But again, if he knows they're going to reject him and and creates them anyway.
Speaker: He still creates them to go to hell. I mean, if you look at it that way. and um So I think we just stick with the scriptures, even though. there's There's some mystery there. wait yeah there's some mystery here and there there's no doubt about that Excuse me.
Speaker: um It may not satisfy us immediately. I mean... These doctrines satisfy me. I know why they might not satisfy someone else. And when you first hear them. just That's why Paul's answering.
Speaker: These objections, but... um We come to realize, wait a minute, it's all of grace. Like you were saying. a moment ago, so... Anyway, I could ramble on about that. I don't i don't need to.
Speaker: You want to ah kind of segue? It is. Do we need to talk about election more? i mean it Ephesians 1, I mean, it's all over the place. Yeah, I mean, yeah. Everywhere once you start seeing it. Yeah, we get we could talk for another hour about it. Yeah, want to. I'd love to yeah um but i think I think for the sake of of of where we are and and um giving ample time to to everything else. I think oh yeah maybe going to have to come back.
Speaker: Well, the part two, um yeah that's going to shock a lot of people that listen to us regularly. Yeah. um But yeah, I think I think that's a good place for us to kind of. Put a bow on it for this one and and we'll come back.
Speaker: and and talk more about the gospel. and and Yeah. and and what what all it entails and and what what the scripture truly says about.
Speaker: Yeah. Um, limited atonement, irresistible grace, perseverance of the saints, all of those things. Yeah. Um, that limited time, that's a big one it is for folk for folks. yeah Yeah. That'll be, that'll be fun. Sure. Sure. But, um, again,
Speaker: Just as we said at the onset. um Our whole goal with this discussion is. um it's It's humility. It's reminding ourselves. And that's why I think it is so important to start with.
Speaker: um with the total depravity and even unconditional election. um is uh It's just a reminder to us, again, as we've said. None of us have deserved. a grace None of us have deserved salvation.
Speaker: um And so how great a mercy is it that that he has? Indeed offered it. to to his elect. Yeah. um and And so... you know our our invitation would be.
Speaker: Um, to to anyone is is to to truly... Um... ah examine and understand. yeah um Where we stand as sinners yeah before a holy God.
Speaker: and And the fact that... um His mercy is still greater even than that. And that if he draws you, if you're feeling a drawing, he's drawing you. Yeah. um And ah to to fly to Christ.
Speaker: Yeah, and and I would just just add to that, if you if you don't mind. um You know, because we... we What you just did, we mentioned at the top of the broadcast.
Speaker: The free offer of the gospel. If you repent and believe, you shall be saved. So don't examine, you know, oh, am I elect? Am I not elect? What's going on?
Speaker: Don't. Election, by the way, does not mean... that god Because a lot of Armenians will think. Well, you guys teach that if somebody wants to be saved, that God keeps them from being saved. That is not the biblical doctrine of election. No, no, no.
Speaker: If you want to be safe, you just said it. Yeah. You know, if you want to be saved, you said, if you feel your drawing. Well, maybe you feel it, maybe you don't. But if you want to be saved, just believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. Come to Christ. fly You said fly to Christ. i I love that. The old old preachers used to say that. Fly to Christ.
Speaker: um He's your only hope of salvation. Don't. Don't try to figure out the mind of God because... he He literally says, whosoever will. Doesn't he? Do we believe that verse? We do. We do. We're Calvinists, and we believe that whosoever will may come, so come. yeah Come to Christ and feast and be saved. that's If you're wanting to come to Christ, if you're wanting to be saved.
Speaker: You're not coming up with that on your own. Yeah. the lord's drawing you and so respond to that. That's right. Alright. Next time on... Answering pilot. We'll see you next time. The Answering Pilot Podcast is a ministry of Randall House Church in Greer, South Carolina.
Speaker: You can learn more at www .randallhousebeer .com. slash church You can also find us on Facebook and Instagram. at at Randall House Church. Don't forget to like and subscribe.
Speaker: and we'll see you next time.
