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Lauren LoGrasso and Billy Joel's Vienna
70 Plays1 month ago
Singer, podcaster and producer Lauren LoGrasso drops by to talk about one of her favorite pieces of music, Vienna, by Billy Joel.
The song is having a bit of a renaissance for its age-positive message and it's had a huge influence on Lauren's own work in music.
The Michigan State grad is a creative best known for her work as a singer/songwriter, public speaker, actor, and Webby Award Winning podcast host. She also interned on the Ellen DeGeneres show.
The three have a great conversation about her work on some of Joe's favorite podcasts, she dispenses some advice for young podcasters, and shares her hopes for her music.
For more information, check out the show notes for this episode.
Re-Creative is produced by Donovan Street Press Inc. in association with MonkeyJoy Press.
Contact us at joemahoney@donovanstreetpress.com
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Transcript
Introduction and Initial Jitters
00:00:09
Speaker
Mark A. Rayner. I think I got your initial right this time. Joe Q. Public. Close enough. Okay. I knew I was going to get the middle one wrong, so I got the last one wrong too. So you had told me before we started this podcast that you didn't have a question. I did not. So I pretended that there was a technical issue with the podcast. And I came up with a really lame question. Actually, I think it's actually an interesting question.
Favorite Buildings Discussion
00:00:36
Speaker
Capital city.
00:00:39
Speaker
Favorite building. Do you have one?
00:00:44
Speaker
ah Okay. Sorry. And of course you're referring to the capital of New Brunswick. Any capital, any capital of any oh any jurisdiction, anything. Yeah. Because I think that's going to relate to our conversation today. And do you have a building that you like in that and that city? Who doesn't love the Flatiron building in Toronto?
00:01:04
Speaker
yeah you know the flatarded building Yeah, that's a good building. I like that one. Isn't that a cool building? Like whenever I'm driving down French street and you come across this weird wedge shaped building, I'm always like, that is a cool building. That is a cool building. Yeah. What about you? I don't have one. I know. it's I asked the question and then I realized, I don't have an answer for this question. But you're counting on our guest. Yeah, to have an answer to this question.
Meet Lauren LaGrasso
00:01:29
Speaker
Yeah. Lauren LaGrasso, welcome to our podcast Recreative.
00:01:32
Speaker
Oh my gosh. Thank you for having me. And I honestly can say I've never heard this question posed before. It is very creative. that is why we Thank you. on this yeah I have a weird brain. I can't help it.
00:01:43
Speaker
I love it. I love it. So are you asking me the question? Yeah. i We're asking, you I mean, maybe I'll come up with an answer while you come up with yours. Cause I actually posed the question and I can't think of one. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's kind of, um, I don't know if you mean like something that's beautiful, but there are like two things that come to mind. I went to school at Michigan state and Michigan. ok Um, and so that's in East Lansing right next to the capital of Michigan, which is Lansing.
00:02:07
Speaker
And so one thing that came to mind, the first thing, honestly, I do love the Capitol building there. It's quite beautiful. But the other building I love, honestly, is this store called Better Health. I used to shop there when I was a student at Michigan State and they gave me 10% off for being a student and I was able to get really high quality groceries.
00:02:26
Speaker
for a lot less expensive than some of the other stores. And so I'm always grateful to them. And so that quite honestly, besides the actual capital building was the first thing that came to my mind. That's awesome. See your question, Mark is like a Rorschach test, right? See, whereas I get this like completely off the cuff superficial, I like to look at the building. She has like a compelling, you know, economical reason.
00:02:48
Speaker
Well, i now I have an answer to this, um an amalgam of both. So it's superficial and, you know, pretentious because as we have already established, I lived in Prague and I'm not going to name one of the obvious things like, you know, Wenceslas Square or like the Cathedral. There's this little tiny pub called Konirna and it was like a hole in the wall. It was maybe 20 feet wide, but it was like this medieval building.
00:03:16
Speaker
And they had taken, konirna means, as my understanding is, it means stable in Czech. And it was an old stable. So all of the lighting fixtures were old mangers.
00:03:31
Speaker
Oh, okay. Built into the walls. So they like they would put oats and stuff in for the horses, and that's where the horses ate, and that's where the lights were, and then the tables were just below that. And that was my favorite place in Prague, actually, because- Because you felt like livestock when you were- I felt it was appropriate, because that's where I met with my writers group, and that's kind of like where we got drunk, and yeah, we felt like you know livestock, yeah.
00:03:55
Speaker
Okay so Lauren I think we need to for you know the handful of people in the planet earth who don't already know who you are and we're not professional enough to introduce you we we ask our guests to introduce themselves.
Lauren's Journey from Acting to Music
00:04:07
Speaker
Would you mind yeah just giving us and you know two thousand words or less who you are.
00:04:12
Speaker
Yeah. So that's such an interesting question because when people say like, who are you? I feel like at least in Los Angeles, which is where I currently live, they actually want to know what you do. So I'm going to try to answer it like twofold, like who I actually am and what I do. like So I grew up in Detroit in Michigan. I know you all are in Canada, so ok close neighbors. My grandma was actually born in Windsor.
00:04:34
Speaker
Okay. yeah down I'm from London, Ontario, which is just up the street from you guys. Okay. So we're neighbors. A lot of times when I'm home and I look something up on Yelp, I'll get answers over in Canada. I'm like, well, I'm not going to cross the border to get my nails done. But I do appreciate that there's a five star place that I can look at across the lake.
00:04:53
Speaker
So that's where I grew up. So Midwestern in in America influenced a lot of like who I am as a person. I'm also Italian American. So very strong in my culture, family oriented. I grew up loving theater when I was three. I went to the theater with my mom. I turned to my mom and said, Mommy, I want to be up there doing that. And performing arts creativity has been a driving force in my life ever since then. And anytime I've tried to shut it down,
00:05:21
Speaker
my life has become ah sad dark place so that's why i'm now committed to helping people unleash their inner creative and i went to school i got a bfa in acting at michigan state bfa and acting b in communication i needed three more credits to get my two pieces of paper the two degrees And so I applied for an internship on the Ellen show and I ended up getting it. And that's what originally brought me out to LA. I was supposed to be here for four months. I've been here for 13 years. The last few weeks I was on the Ellen show. I ended up getting an acting gig and I thought like, wow.
00:05:55
Speaker
I am going to be a star i'm going to go home for christmas because it was like a fall internship but go home for christmas i'm going to come back and everything's going to be amazing that was not the case t ended up really hurting my soul deeply the rejection was really difficult i had a lot of myself worth tied up in it and Acting kind of broke my heart, but music healed it. And I didn't realize when I first moved here that I was a musician. And so I would fall asleep like in this stage when I was really like reevaluating my relationship and my desire for acting. I was falling asleep writing songs, which was really bizarre because it was not something I had ever done in my life and started playing guitar.
00:06:36
Speaker
met up with this guy. We started playing all these gigs. Within a year, I had played like House of Blues, ah Hard Rock Cafe, wow Viper Room. It really took off quickly. And while I was driving to these gigs, I started listening to radio.
Exploring Creative Struggles and Inspirations
00:06:51
Speaker
And I'd done radio DJing in college, but it wasn't like a huge part of my experience.
00:06:55
Speaker
And I just fell in love with the medium of talk radio. And there was this guy who hosted on SiriusXM on one of the stations there. And he happened to be from Detroit. And he would talk about all these local Detroit things. And I was so homesick at the time. And I'd be driving down the 5-3 way and I would pretend like I was on 696 back in Michigan. yeah And it really made me realize like radio, audios, healing power to make somebody feel less alone.
00:07:21
Speaker
So I started saying, I want to work on SiriusXM someday. I ended up getting an opportunity to. And now I do like a hybrid of all these things. So I do podcasting, music. I'm getting into public speaking now. I do creative coaching. And I'm also very committed to, like the reason why I answered the question the way I did, realizing and like remembering that who I am is the best thing about me. Because I think when you're in any creative industry,
00:07:48
Speaker
It's really easy to tie up your worth with your output and what you do. And so always trying to hone my inner knowing and my inner worth versus searching for it outside of myself. so Absolutely. Yeah. That's a long short story. That is super healthy. That's great.
00:08:07
Speaker
As I pursue writing and and podcasting this one myself, I'm completely in the same place. It's completely uncoupled from success or wealth or fame or anything like that. It's the joy of doing it itself. I think that's critical.
00:08:21
Speaker
Right. And it's hard because like you can still be an ambitious person. This is what now I'm i'm you know struggling to balance. I have a lot of ambition, but realizing like whether or not I get to those ambitions has no bearing on my worth as a human being. And it's a lot it's very easy when you're young in your creative career, any stage, but especially when you're young to really mix those things up.
00:08:44
Speaker
Yep. I can think of it as a distortion field. It's like the distortion field of seeking success and fame and, and, and completely forget him ah about the joy of actually doing it, what you're really doing it for. And as soon as you get rid of that distortion field, then all of a sudden you can be happy doing this stuff again. Yeah. To me anyway. Yeah. No figure. We're like doing something that's supposed to be fun and we're like, ah,
00:09:07
Speaker
Torturing ourselves over it and that is so I mean what's awesome with that is that that's exactly kind of the message in The song that you wanted to talk about today, right? Like that really is the message of that song Billy Joel. Yeah, right. Yeah. Yes. Yes the song because I think this piece of me this kind of like this tortured like back and forth between myself has been going on since I was a little girl. I discovered the song, I mean, not little girl, but little to now. I i discovered Vienna when I think I was 16 or 17. And it brought me to my knees then because even then I felt like I was in this race to like get to some sort of finish line. like I had to have everything figured out. And if I didn't, I was bad and nothing good was ever going to happen to me. And that song was and continues to be a wake up call
00:09:58
Speaker
that as long as you're breathing, you have time. like You have the rest of your life to do something. You don't have to have everything figured out right now, and this present moment is important.
00:10:10
Speaker
Yeah, that's exactly, yeah. I love that song and actually I knew you wanted to talk about it, so I looked it up today because I remember that album. I'm a little bit older than you. Yes, The Stranger, my favorite. My favorite Billy Joel album for sure, like me and the guys would listen to it, along with Bruce Springsteen and a bunch of other guys. But I always liked the song and it was interesting to me that he never really, Billy Joel didn't think it was going to be a big hit.
00:10:37
Speaker
But it's become one of the most played songs in his whole hoof room. It's a sleeper hoof room. Yeah. Yeah. Like it really has lasted. And I just think it's because of the message, which is, yeah, you don't have to cheat. And it's a beautiful song. It is. And it's catchy, too, actually. Yeah, it's wild. It's had a huge uprising on TikTok. I don't know if you guys have seen that. Oh, no. I didn't know that. Yeah, there were a lot of covers done of it in the last couple years. I'm like, wow, I really feel ahead of my time right now.
00:11:07
Speaker
It's like nobody knew what it was when I was 16 and I'm sure when you guys were listening to it. And so for it now to be so much part of the zeitgeist and for people to associate with it so much and to even see like younger, even females musicians doing covers of it, it's really, really cool. And it's interesting that his song that's about like, don't worry, you have the rest of your life. You don't have to have it all figured out right now. Enjoy where you're at.
00:11:33
Speaker
is the one that's kind of slowly crescendoed into this huge hit. I think it's rare with songs, you know, that it should have such a long tail. Right. It is. It is, but it also like it's so encouraging to me as an artist and a creative to know that you never know when your project or your creative output is going to start resonating in a different way or in a bigger way.
00:11:59
Speaker
Yeah. Although I'm pretty sure that this podcast will start resonating in about a month or two. Right, Mark? Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Why not? Yeah. So we'll get back to the song, but I want to ask you more about yourself because your, your bio, the one that you told us and the one that I've read online generates a lot of questions.
The Power of Podcasting and Connection
00:12:15
Speaker
Oh, wow. Can't wait to answer them. Yeah. The first one is, because it really seems like you're you know fairly successful in what you're you're pursuing you know in the podcast realm, you've worked with a lot of ah lot of people, produced a lot of podcasts. You've worked with ah the host of one of my favorite podcasts, Guy Raz of ah The Great Creators. So the the question that immediately comes to mind is, why are you slumming it with us? What brings you to this podcast?
00:12:41
Speaker
Well, I really like your premise, and I like the question you ask. For me, too, I mean, yeah, I've done a lot of things, but I still feel very much in my grind. And I believe in taking every inch as long as it aligns with your morals. like When you're trying to build something, like you never know if one person listening to something could become your number one fan or like open up a world to you. Also, through listening to your podcast, I was telling you before we jumped on,
00:13:10
Speaker
I heard this amazing producer right now, one of my goals as an indie musician is to get my latest single in film and TV. And so this last podcast that you did with Jen Prince, the producer and director of indie movies and a lot of other things.
00:13:25
Speaker
She could be somebody who I could connect with and say, hey, like I have this song. What do you think? So for me, if I have the time and if it feels warm to me, I say yes to anything that feels that way. I think you're doing something great in the world and you're having interesting conversations. I want to have more interesting conversations.
00:13:44
Speaker
Well, Mark and I were reflecting on the podcast a while back and and we were, you know, like, ah you know, this is not a podcast that, you know, generates that millions of dollars in in revenue, but what it does generate, what we think it does do very successfully is um getting to know people. And, uh, you know, like we've, we've made friends through this podcast.
00:14:03
Speaker
It seems like everyone that we talk to pretty much we wind up friends with. That's one of the top reasons I tell people get a podcast because it is one of the most underutilized networking opportunities and friendship opportunities. Like I just went to Australia for a woman's wedding who I met on my podcast.
00:14:24
Speaker
And we've become very, very close friends. We've collaborated on a bunch of things. like Having a podcast is one of the most underutilized tools to build your network and to build like really strong, genuine friendships. Because how often are we actually dropping into conversations where we're sharing our heart and our lives in a way that's not guarded, in a way that's not like, what did you eat for breakfast? What's the weather today? like We're actually dropping into real questions right now. yeah And that creates closeness. so Well, we're certainly looking forward to our invitations to your wedding or whatever. Well, I did just get engaged, so hey. Congratulations. There you go. Congratulations. So it's coming. Excellent. It's coming, yeah. 2025. That's so cool. And I love, yeah, and I think there's something about audio too, like obviously we could see each other on the video, but there's just something about audio that's so intimate. So for the listeners, I really feel like the listeners
00:15:19
Speaker
get to know us as the podcaster. And I'm ah also a fan of podcasts. So I mean, Mark Marin would have no idea who I am, but I know who he is. I listen to his podcast once or twice a week. So yeah, like it's really a very intimate medium too, which is one of the things I love about it. and Totally. If you're doing it right, you make the listener feel like they're another guest or a co-host with you. And they're along for the ride. Yeah. Yeah. It's a beautiful medium. Like I'm happy to have people write in and say, here's my answer to your stupid question, Mark.
00:15:55
Speaker
And now I don't think my question is stupid. It's like, actually, what is, that's an interesting- I thought that was really a great question. on I truly have never heard anybody ask it before. It was interesting. I love Mark's questions. Yeah, it's just because it just gives you like a little tiny weird insight into the person's history and mind and yeah yeah the experience they've had.
00:16:13
Speaker
But now you are the first. Maybe I'm wrong about this. Maybe there's other people that we've had who, who are podcasting as well, but I think not at your level because you're really doing it professionally. So my next question would be apart from what we've already talked about, what tips would you have for a podcast like this? Having heard an episode?
00:16:33
Speaker
Do you guys post about your show at all? Like do you post on socials? Yep. Oh yeah. Okay, great. So yeah is the question like, how could you grow? Is the question like, what would I have you do differently? Like what? No, no, I don't think we're like, it would be great if we grew, you know, but that's not, you know, in keeping with your, what you mentioned earlier about not worrying about external values. I'm thinking in terms of the quality.
00:16:59
Speaker
Well, honestly, I really enjoyed what I listened to. So i wasn't writing the bunch to another career yeah but what I would say is just keep inviting people that you're genuinely curious about that you want to meet. Um, and that maybe you would even be interested in collaborating with down the road and that you want to learn from. And it seems like you're doing that. So I don't really have a lot of notes. I thought it was a cool concept for a show.
00:17:23
Speaker
Excellent. I have a question then for, cause I also teach at a journalism school, journalism and communication program. And I know that some of my students would kill me if I didn't ask the question, would you have advice for them as they're sort of just starting to feel their way into their careers?
Advice for Aspiring Podcasters
00:17:42
Speaker
Some of them are definitely interested in audio and doing podcasts. So what would you have in terms of for someone like just starting their career?
00:17:51
Speaker
Yeah. Well, the first thing I would tell them is sweet young one. You have more time than you think. Like the song says, back to so I just tortured myself all throughout my twenties. And I think it's, it's, it's so interesting to me that so many people write about the teenage years, because I think if you have a really, if you have a nice family life and your basic needs are met to me, the teenage years weren't the hardest, the hardest years of my life were my twenties and so far.
00:18:18
Speaker
Um, and so I would just say, please be kind to yourself. Like know you have time to make mistakes. Explore like what's interesting to you. You don't have to just go down this rigid path that you thought you were supposed to go down. When a door opens, if it feels interesting, if it feels warm, feel free to walk through it. And then with podcasting in general, it depends what area of podcasting you want to get into.
00:18:42
Speaker
If you want to host the question that I always ask people because it's it's not really an era unless you're already a celebrity where you can have like the Lauren LaGrasso show. I would love that. It's just not the era for it. So you want to have something that is more specific. So when I'm coaching people on what it is that they want to talk about, I asked them to tell me their greatest pain and their greatest joy in life so far and i really believe the topic you're meant to speak on is the midpoint between those two things that's what's going to get you coming back week after week because podcasting is a slog as you guys know it seems like it shouldn't be but like somehow putting together this like 30 minute to hour long show takes so many hours
00:19:26
Speaker
And so it has to be something that you feel so passionate about. So that would be my question I would pose to them. And then I would also say you got to get the equipment. I mean, like have good audio equipment to this day. It's something that I see people making audio mistakes with. You don't want somebody to shut you down because they don't like the way you sound. Like you can't do anything about if they don't like your personality or they don't like your topic.
00:19:51
Speaker
but you can do something about having really great sound quality, great editing, listen to shows that you like, like figure out what it is that they're doing that you like and how you can do that in your own way. And I would just say like, yeah, like become a fan of the medium.
00:20:07
Speaker
A lot of people want to get into podcasting because it sounds cool, but like aren't genuine fans. I literally got into audio because I was a fan. yeah so Passion takes you a long way. Network, if you do start a podcast, like I get said to the guys, like invite people you genuinely want to learn from. like A lot of times people might not have time to meet with you for an hour or two.
00:20:28
Speaker
But most people will say yes to their podcast because here's the thing, people like talking about themselves. And after that, you might form a genuine connection. Maybe that will lead to a job even if the podcast isn't generating income for you yet. So those would be my initial thoughts. And I think you can start there. It's great advice. Great advice.
00:20:48
Speaker
Absolutely. and Can I ask you, i'm I'm getting into the weeds now, but I'm just i'm just curious you know because you are a high functioning ah podcaster. How do you do yours? You make it sound like alcohol is over. you know I'm a high functioning podcaster. yeah like so i just yeah Technically in production, do you have a producer? Do you edit yourself?
00:21:09
Speaker
I do have a producer for the first two years. I did everything myself or the first year and a half. Here's a story of like creativity, begetting creativity. I was producing a music video for one of my songs and my associate producer on the music video was super interested in podcasting express that to me. And I'm like, well, why don't you come like intern with me for a while and then I'll teach you what I know and you can help me. And she ended up just like being great. So I ended up hiring her as my associate producer, moved her up to producer. And then I found another person who now actually works at Michigan State as like the director of radio for where I started my career wow in ah in audio.
00:21:48
Speaker
And so she does, she produces my podcast now, but it's just the two of us. We're a two person operation. It's super lean. But I basically, when I hire people, I like to look at it kind of like an apprenticeship. Like I train people up so that they edit exactly the way I do. And then like now I basically Rachel, wonderful, wonderful producer. She's my ah current producer for Unleash Your Inner Creative.
00:22:11
Speaker
but she like sends me the episode and I barely have to change anything because we step by step trained her on how to produce. The luxury of having somebody edit your podcast for you. Yeah, yeah but you know I will say like it was hard work to train somebody to be what I wanted them to. I could have hired somebody who was already there, but I really like mentoring, so that's why I do it.
00:22:36
Speaker
My daughter is ah also in in broadcasting, following in my footsteps, working for the CBC. She's now in St. John's, Newfoundland. And I did manage to cajole her into editing one episode and she did a great job, but I haven't managed to suck her into doing anymore. Oh man. It's heavy work. It is heavy lifting. Yeah, try to get her to come back. It really is. Yeah. No, she's actually making a living now. But actually speaking of you, speaking of your podcast, Lauren, I actually, I want you to pitch the podcast a bit because I haven't heard it yet. I i didn't do my homework.
00:23:06
Speaker
i did ah But we haven't heard your song. But I have listened to both of the songs that I had access to on Amazon Music, and I love them both. ah So what is the podcast about?
00:23:17
Speaker
Yeah, the podcast is called Unleash Your Inner Creative and it looks at creativity through the lens of healing and self-development. So the goal of the show is to give the listener tools to love, trust, and know themselves enough to claim their right to creativity and go after whatever it is that's on their heart. And I started it because I really do believe the root cause of a lot of unhappiness is repressed creativity. And I saw a lot of people in my life, in the world,
00:23:46
Speaker
pushing down that piece of themselves that I actually believe is an innate part of every human being. And I just saw the depression, the the stuckness people were suffering with. And I didn't want to see that anymore. So I started the show to help people in that situation and also myself. Like I've been there many times. And so each week we give people tools to get out of that state of repressing their creativity, of being owned by fear, and stepping toward their authentic self. That's beautiful. Yeah, that's great. Because Vonnegut had that advice for people. Kurt Vonnegut's my literary patronus. And he's like, yeah, just do something. Do some kind of art. Doesn't matter what it is. As long as it makes you happy, just do it. Yeah, so true. And you don't have to have ambitions for it. Just create. Yeah. So would you say that you're in a good place now?
00:24:37
Speaker
As far as what? Yes, I think overall I'm in a good place, but like, of course there's things I'm working on. I'm in therapy for sure. Always working on myself, eternally like committed to my own personal development. I definitely want to be in a better place when it comes to music. Like that, that part of my career has not grown the way the podcasting has.
Music Goals and Alternative Revenue
00:25:02
Speaker
And so, like I mentioned, my goal right now for my song is to get, for the most recent song, my cover of Genie in a Bottle, is to get to 10,000 streams on Spotify and to get it on a movie or in you know on a TV show. So those are my two big goals with music. The way it's going to be in my life is evolving right now. I'm also like incorporating it into my public speaking, which is really cool. But yeah, like I'm happy, but always still like chipping away at something.
00:25:32
Speaker
So yeah, so let's talk further about your your music because it it is ah very well produced. it's ah Where did you have it recorded? So Genie in a Bottle was recorded at my producer, David Stevens Studio, who's here in L.A. and And so what does he have for a studio? Like talk to us. Give us the technical chops. I'm a former recording engineer. Oh my God, Joe. yeah I should know didn't do any of the producing of the song, so I couldn't tell you ah down to like the technicalities, but he has a huge board. I think he produces in Pro Tools. um He is an incredible guitarist. The guitar solo you hear on the song yeah is him just shredding. Yeah. um He's got drums. He's got a keyboard. that He did a lot of the the keyboard sounds you hear on there. Obviously a microphone for recording vocals. And I mean, basically everything you could need. You were in good hands. I was in great hands. David is amazing. So that was a cover, right? Yes. So why did you choose that zone?
00:26:31
Speaker
So I had been performing that song here in l LA and in venues across the country for the past decade. And I met with this woman who used to work in A and&R and as a manager in music, and she does consulting now. And she was like, well, if you want to get your songs on film and TV, which is a huge goal of mine, and I've done, I've gotten them into indie movies, but like, I really want to get the song into a TV show. She's like, you should do a cover. Like, do you have any cool covers?
00:26:59
Speaker
And I played her that song and she was like, you need to record that. And so I was like, okay, you know, it was something that had been on my mind for a long time, but I didn't know how hard it was to release a cover. It turns out it was pretty easy. I had to get something called, I think they called it a mechanical royalty.
00:27:14
Speaker
But basically, you have to like go to the publishing company that owns the song in that way. like They give you like a little form saying, like you have the right to put this song out. But yeah, that's that's basically why I did it and I love it. i think you know the song I'm in this phase where every song to me has like a spiritual meaning. And to me, like the deeper meaning between behind Jeannie in a Bottle is unleashing your full self and your creativity to the world. Like, think about the first line of the song. I feel like I've been locked up tight for a century of lonely nights waiting for someone to release me. Like, that's what it feels like when you're pushing down aspects of yourself that are vital to who you are or pushing down your creativity. And so I really look at Genie in a Bottle like, I am coming out to the world saying what I want, saying who I am and not apologizing for it. No, I should know this, but who wrote that?
00:28:03
Speaker
So there's a few different writers. Christina Aguilera was the person who made it popular, but I can't remember how you say the one woman's last name, but her first name's Pam, for sure, one of the writers, but there's three different writers on this one. Oh, okay, cool. Yeah.
00:28:17
Speaker
Okay, any of these questions, you can tell us later to cut them. Yeah, just dumb questions from Mark who doesn't know anything. No, no, no. I was thinking of my questions, Mark, because I'm about to ask some potentially intrusive questions, oh but respectful, respectful questions. and the But the question is the conflict between economic self-interest and creative expression.
00:28:38
Speaker
how Do you manage that? Are your creative pursuits enough to, to live on or do you have to supplement your income and in some other way? Yeah. So I make all my money from podcasting and coaching right now.
00:28:53
Speaker
so music definitely has I mean, I've made money from gigs and stuff, but music, I've invested so much more into it than it's paid me back. My goal with this song is an attempt to start to like generate money from music. I have also been doing children's music. By the way, for anybody interested who has like any desire to get into any sort of thing involving like kids' creative stuff, it is a goldmine, okay?
00:29:22
Speaker
And also, more importantly, it really is like healing to your inner child and just so satisfying. But yeah, the goal right now is to make music at least like I'm getting as much back as I'm investing into it. It pays for itself.
00:29:37
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, that's the goal with music right now. But podcasting is paying the bills as well as creative coaching. And you've produced some really big shows. Can you talk about some of those? Because I actually I did look at your bio. So I was actually kind of interested in like Oh, that's an interesting show to be producing. ah Yeah, what which one would you think is the most interesting you've produced?
00:30:00
Speaker
Oh my gosh. Most interesting. I mean, they all have a different place in my heart and a different place in, uh, in the world. I mean, I produced Brené Brown's podcast, Unlocking Us, like during the pandemic. Like, ok so she now is over at Vox, so I'm no longer doing her show, right but that was an interesting one because it was like the world was shutting down and like our podcast was like number one on the charts and it was.
00:30:24
Speaker
just going going going and i was working so hard while everybody was like not working was like it's just a confusing interesting time but also her show was so hopeful during that time and it it really helped me get through the things i learned from it what i learned from her and what an amazing person and mentor she was to me.
00:30:42
Speaker
So I feel like that one, that that holds a special place in my heart just because it was happening during such a weird, traumatic time in the world. And it was kind of like a safe place for me to exist and to grow.
00:30:55
Speaker
And it was such a a wonderful thing to be producing podcasts at that time because there were a bunch of us who just
Reflections on Producing and Hollywood's Future
00:31:03
Speaker
were living on it. I mean, like it was one of the things that kept us going was like, at least I can listen to my podcast. Yeah. you know Totally. Yeah. Especially podcast by Bernie Brown. Yeah. That's yeah. She's a positive force in nature. Yeah.
00:31:15
Speaker
Oh my gosh, that one too, like, yeah, during the pandemic gave so much hope and we were responding to things in real time. I remember we did an episode about grief and the the guest was talking about like the grief of like losing human contact and not being able to shake each other's hands. And I had never thought about grief in a more nuanced context. I only thought about it when you lose someone, maybe when you lose ah a romantic relationship, but not for those smaller moments. And so, yeah, it really was like a vital podcast for a lot of people's healing during that time. So it felt very purposeful for me. Did you guys know one another before? How did you wind up with that gig?
00:31:57
Speaker
Yeah. So I worked for this company called Cadence 13 and she partnered with them. And so I ended up getting placed on her show because of some of the other shows I had produced. And that's how we ended up together. and Okay. And are you still, yeah it sounds like you're still friends and.
00:32:16
Speaker
Yeah, we're still very friendly. I mean, like she sent me her book when it came out. She's been very, very supportive and always asks me about my music. Very kind, wow beautiful human being. Okay. And more importantly, how do we get her on this podcast? ah Give her a call. Well, you know, honestly, she, she has a forum on her website. So I would reach out on the website. I think she has one that's like media inquiries and they look at that more than even emails. We have a forum too.
00:32:42
Speaker
See? You're not so different from Brene. Yeah, that's funny. That makes me laugh. Now, I have to to ask this and this again is another question that um you just tell me if I can't go there. But you said you worked on Ellen. You were an intern on Ellen. I just watched Ellen's one hour comedy special post the show and I thought it was, um you know, she was she was honest and funny and talking about the hard experiences at the, at the end of her show where she was accused of just that and the other thing. And I'm not looking for dirt here. Cause that's not, this is not a looking for dirt podcast, but can you tell us what was that experience like? It's so interesting. You asked that cause I was literally talking with my fiance about it earlier. So I was an intern there, you know, I worked there for four months.
00:33:30
Speaker
And I want to preface this by saying like, I don't know anybody else's experience. I'm only speaking from my own. I personally had a great experience working there and that's the honest to God truth. Now I was an intern, so I wasn't as integrated into the program. Like we had strict hours. We worked to like 9 AM m to 6 PM.
00:33:50
Speaker
Uh, with like a one hour lunch break, whatever like the regulations are in Los Angeles, I was able to like say hi to her a couple of times. And it wasn't like I was best friends with her, but I've worked a lot in this industry. I've worked in it for 13 years now. And I don't think.
00:34:07
Speaker
It's that different from many other Hollywood institutions. I think the wake-up call is that this industry is it it needs to change. like There's no need for us to work the way we do, to have some of like the weirdness that there is, like the power dynamics, the power struggles. And I think that that's like the bigger problem, is like there needs to be not a singling out of one person, but ah kind of like a cleaning up of this entire industry.
00:34:36
Speaker
There's just no overall standards for like what work is, boundaries. like you know and so yeah Personally, I think it's like it's less Ellen specific and more about the entertainment industry needs to heal.
00:34:53
Speaker
And there need to be people in power who have gone through therapy. like i I think in general, like nobody should be in a leadership position if they haven't done the work on themselves. Because otherwise, you end up hurting people. And so again, I'm going to be very clear. That was not my experience with Ellen. It was actually a lovely, fun experience. I met a lot of great people. I got to work in the talent department. And I was like fielding calls from celebrities. All the producers I worked with were wonderful.
00:35:22
Speaker
But I think in general, entertainment absolutely needs to change and has to have like a reality check that people usually don't get into this industry because they feel good about themselves. It's because they're searching for something outside of themselves. And healing needs to happen at the level of leadership in order for these weird toxic situations to not exist.
00:35:41
Speaker
What a great answer. Something really interesting there. Is it possible that if everybody was actually okay with themselves and not seeking those external values, that there would be no entertainment industry?
00:35:58
Speaker
I think there would be no entertainment industry in the way it is now where it's like about power grabs and like people controlling other people. And if the focus seems to be a lot less about art than it does about money and power.
00:36:11
Speaker
I think it would be about making good work. I think it would be more like a community theater where we happen to get paid. Hopefully be more like this podcast. Yeah. I mean, honestly, cause there's like, there's a glimmer of it. Most people are driven toward art cause some part of them, like a pure part of them loves it, but often too often there's also a part of them that is seeking the applause. And so I think that's the part that ends up.
00:36:38
Speaker
getting twisted and weird and not not healthy. you know And so if people could work on that part of themselves prior to getting into any leadership role, I think we would have a much better situation. So much about art is ego, though, too. So like it's it's it's a really challenging problem because, I mean, you're no different from me, Joe, that you know we're we're egotists in the sense that we are writing things that, we're writing books.
00:37:08
Speaker
Like, here's 350 pages. I think you should read. and Is that ego or no? Or is it, to me, it's not ego. It's like a sense of self and a sense of I'm worthy and I have an important voice, which I think everyone can and should have. Yeah. And I think you've got the healthier take on it, which is that that's true, that that everybody has something worth saying. But I think a lot of authors especially have this sort of egotistical idea that this is worth reading. And it usually is. I mean, quite often there's lots of good stuff in there, but I think that's part of the issue is just like, where does the art come from? Matters, I think a little bit. So it's, I like art that comes from
00:37:55
Speaker
kind of a pure place, like, and sometimes it comes from a pure place just from the process. Like last week, we talked with Ruth Abernethy. And so she's, she's a sculptor, a Canadian sculptor. And she's done some of, frankly, the most famous sculptures, public sculptures in Canada. And she has almost no ego.
00:38:18
Speaker
about it, really, she's just about the process. So it doesn't have to be about ego. It can be about- She doesn't want to be known. No, she doesn't care about that. She wants her sculpts to be known, her bronze to be known, but not her. Yeah. And that was really charming to me, to meet an artist who's like, eh, it's not about me. It's about, and some actors are like that too, I find.
00:38:41
Speaker
that there's some actors who are really, i'm I'm here to serve the project and I'm here to do what I can do to make the story better. And that's cool. And a lot of a lot of people, like I did theater too in my undergrad. So it's interesting how that keeps coming up in this podcast. So many people we've talked to have some kind of connection with the theater.
00:39:04
Speaker
And I think there's a reason for that, which is because it's that ego thing. It's, you have to have a little less ego when you're doing things as a group. It really is so much a group thing. Yeah. Yeah. It's a beautiful thing that we all come together. And I think it's also the first thing, at least for me, that I could see, like it was the first path toward creativity that I could see. I didn't understand.
00:39:29
Speaker
Even though I like intellectually could understand that people wrote music, yeah when I was a kid, I didn't know you could be a songwriter. like Nobody I knew was a songwriter, but theater was all around me and I could see how I could get up on the stage and do that. It was the first path forward and then I think a lot of us kind of branched out from there.
00:39:48
Speaker
but So I want to get back to your music, but are you comfortable talking about your acting experiences? Um, cause you alluded to the fact that it was, uh, that it was painful, didn't work out as you expected. Can you tell us about that? Totally. I mean, so I had my first gig, like I said, the last week or two, I was on the Ellen show and through that I was able to join
Embracing Creativity and Personal Growth
00:40:10
Speaker
SAG. So I was in the union very early on and I had ah an agent when I got back, uh, the casting director who cast me in that introduced me to someone. She was not great. She, um, she actually left town without telling me. And I found out from this other guy in my acting class that she was no longer in the business. She just didn't even bother to tell me. So there were a lot of, and I would go to all these like open calls that I would find on actor's access or backstage dot.com.
00:40:38
Speaker
or on the actor's equity website, but it just wasn't going the way I thought it would. Now, when I look back on it, you guys, I realized I did not fail. I just had no tolerance for disappointment. And so I was so deeply disappointed and brokenhearted over it not going the way that I thought it should.
00:40:58
Speaker
that I rebranded my disappointment as failure. So I think if I had had a little bit more resilience and again, not been so attached to outcomes, not have my worth so integrated into what I was doing, I would have made it in some capacity as an actor because I do know I have the talent, but the process just hurt too bad. So what what actually happened? I just stopped auditioning.
00:41:25
Speaker
So, okay. So you were going to auditions and, and not getting the parts. Was that, yeah, I got a few parts. Like I, I acted in a couple of plays. I was cast in a lifetime show called my haunted house. Like.
00:41:37
Speaker
But here's the other thing. I got that role. like I've been dying to get like a co-star role. And I got it. And I was like, this is what I've been waiting for to get up here, say five lines about like a fake ghost in the bathtub. I'm like, this does not feel worth it to me. like I want to tell stories that have deeper meaning. And when you're just pursuing being an actor, it's very different if you're you know writing, producing,
00:42:01
Speaker
directing and acting like if you're in a ah power player position, but when you're just acting, you're literally waiting for somebody to tell you you're good enough to even try to do the thing you want to do to even get an audition. So I didn't like how unempowering it felt in addition to how much the trying was bringing me down.
00:42:22
Speaker
I relate to this so much. It is one of those things where, yeah, if you become successful as an actor and become famous and well known, then you're kind of in in the spotlight and everyone's like, wow, look how cool this person is. But before you get there, it's incredibly demeaning.
00:42:39
Speaker
Kind of. Yeah. Like if I could go back in time, I would tell myself, like, don't take the audition so seriously. It's like, have fun with it. It doesn't matter. Like so much of it isn't about you. Isn't about your talent. It's literally like an energy with the other person they're trying to cast. You're not the right height. You're not the right size.
00:42:57
Speaker
whatever, like leave that alone, but make your own work. Like, and that would be my best advice for any creative listening. Do not wait for somebody to give you an opportunity, make your own work, because then at least you'll always have something that you're doing. Like you can always feel passionate. You can always be in the process.
00:43:14
Speaker
um But you're not just like holding out, like praying, clenching for somebody to like deliver something to your doorstep. Yeah. And wasn't it ah Billy Wilder who told Billy Bob Thornton that, which propelled him to- Oh yeah. I love that story. I can't remember where I heard it. Probably Mark Marin actually. ah So yeah, he met, he was working a job as a caterer.
00:43:36
Speaker
So he was serving tables and I guess he was in the kitchen and Billy Wilder was there and they just ended up having a conversation about, you know, how things were going for him. And he said, yeah, not so well. I'm not getting any additions. He says, well, you got to write your own thing. And so.
00:43:51
Speaker
He went home that night and started writing Sling Blade. Wow. So that's why Mark is on this podcast. I sort of know things, but he completely knows things. Oh, you are a great team. We are a team for sure. yes Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So moving forward then to your music, have you written original material?
00:44:10
Speaker
Oh yeah. That's like my main thing. So I have, I think there's six singles out that are my originals. So, and then I have about like four more that I'm going to be putting out next year. And that is my main thing. That's what freed me. Cause I started out with musical theater. So it was always trying to fit into the box of somebody else's song. And when I realized I could write my own songs to my own voice with my own story,
00:44:35
Speaker
And that I could affect somebody the way Billy Joel had affected me or Fiona Apple, Ani DeFranco. Like it just felt like, wow, I can't even believe I get to do this. Writing music is probably still the purest part of my creative soul. It means so much to me. And no matter what happens with music, it will be forever. Like one of the greatest gifts of my life. And you have a beautiful voice too. Yeah. so you're fabulous yeah Thank you. um Have you considered doing a cover of Billy Joel's Vienna? You know, I have. It means so much to me. I would have to make sure it was like perfect, but I would love to. I think that would be great. Okay. I got a question as a singer. Do you ever yeah start to cry when you're singing?
00:45:21
Speaker
Yeah, which is really bad because I really can't sing and cry at the same time. Yeah, I know. I can't either. Some people are like so beautiful, like they just have one tear falling off. I'm an ugly crier. I can't do that. But yes, I do. Yeah. And it's, you know, you know, it's weird. The little drummer boy makes me cry so hard and I'll tell you why. Because if you listen closely to the lyrics of that song, what it shows me is all God wants us to do.
00:45:51
Speaker
is be ourselves and share our creativity. Cause he's like going, I don't have anything. I've got nothing to give. Should I play the song for you? And then Jesus smiles up at the little drummer boy. And that just like every time I sing that song, I can't make it through without crying. And like, I do choke during that part. Wow. Okay. This is going to be a Christmas episode. I think, Mark. Perfect. It's pretty close. Yeah. Why not? Yeah.
00:46:17
Speaker
Boy, um, well, this has been a great conversation. Mark, do you have any other, uh, I have one more question for you. It's okay burning in my mind for about 30 minutes now. You've said the word curiosity at least three times. And you alluded to it many more times. How do you foster curiosity?
00:46:37
Speaker
This is a question for my students as well. Sorry. yeah The professor in me is always thinking about this one especially because I do worry that sometimes my students aren't as curious as they could be. Yeah, this is an amazing question. Speaking of curiosity, I don't think anyone's ever asked me it.
00:47:00
Speaker
So the way I've started to do it, well, first of all, like life is so interesting. I don't know. So I think I have a natural curiosity because it's not a fair question. I just can't believe all the things that exist and like how much there is to know. and I think to be curious, like I'm an eternal optimist and in order to be an optimist, I have to be curious because I always want to know more and I always believe like the best possible thing could happen even if things are really bleak. I call myself an angsty optimist. um and I think like curiosity is inherently optimistic because
00:47:35
Speaker
Yeah, like you're just you're you you know that there's so much more to learn. But I will tell you, like the the more specific answer that I've really learned in this relationship, this beautiful relationship I'm in with my fiance, is um getting humbled. you know i I think I came into this relationship very much like a know-it-all in relationships because in my last one, my ex-boyfriend was always screwing up and I always was like doing the right thing. And now I'm with an equal.
00:48:04
Speaker
And so I came in very much being like, I'm going to tell him what to do. I know what's right. I'm going to lay down the law. And he was like, aren't you curious about me? like Why don't you ask me a question instead of like giving an order? And and I was like, you know you're right. And so that really humbled me in an important way that I take into other parts of my life now where it's like,
00:48:29
Speaker
I might think I know the right thing and maybe I do know the right thing for one aspect of whatever it is that I'm looking at, but I could not possibly know the full picture. And so if I stay quiet and listen to what somebody's saying and then ask a question based off of what I hear or take in or see, I'm actually going to get a lot more information and I'm i'm just going to become a better person because I'm not assuming I know everything about something that guess what? I probably don't.
00:48:57
Speaker
Like, I've been with my fiance for almost three and a half years. i There's so much more to learn about him. That's why I want to marry him, you know? So I think that's that being in this relationship has taught me so much about life in general. I have a tendency. I'm a talker. I want to fill in the space. I want to feel safe and think that I know everything about a situation. But the truth is, like, there's so little I know. And so staying curious is a way into more life, and I want that.
00:49:27
Speaker
Beautiful. I love that. Great answer. You won me. and You won me on that one. Is there anything else you would like to share with us about, uh, podcasting about, um, singing music, Billy Joel's Vienna before we part ways. Hmm. I mean, there's so much more, but I think the biggest thing I would like to say to anyone listening is that creativity is your birthright. It is not like reserved for a select few.
00:49:54
Speaker
It is something we all have, and there's actually scientific studies on it. Look it up. NASA did a study. 98% of five-year-olds are born as creative geniuses, but life can wring it out of us and beat it out of us. And so we don't have to like conjure creativity. It's really just something you have to remember. And so for you listening, I want you to remember creativity is your birthright.
00:50:16
Speaker
And you can go out and claim it today, starting in small ways, even writing for five minutes a day or starting to play music again or singing or do like making a new recipe. There's so many different ways to be creative. It can be the filter for your life. And yeah, I mean, I hope that you check out my music.
00:50:34
Speaker
I'm Lauren LaGrasso. You can get my songs all places where music is streamed, really trying to build up my Spotify platform. So definitely go check it out there. Follow me there. Stream all my songs. You can check out my podcasts, Unleash Your Inner Creative, wherever good podcasts are found, including Apple and also Spotify. And if you want a ah creative coach, that's something I do. And I would love to support you in claiming your creativity and putting out your next project.
00:51:01
Speaker
And I just thank you guys. Thank you for doing the show and for asking me some tough questions. You had me sweating over here. Gosh. Well, we'll put all those links in the notes too. So people can check out. That would be great. Yeah. You guys are awesome. And thank you for doing what you do and for inspiring other people to be creative. Lauren LaGracio. Thank you very much for being on our podcast. Recreative. Lovely to meet you. Great to meet you guys.
00:51:50
Speaker
You've been listening to Recreative, a podcast about creativity and the works that inspire it. Recreative is produced by Mark Rainer and Joe Mahoney for Donovan Street Press, Inc., in association with Monkey Joy Press. Technical production of music by Joe Mahoney, web design by Mark Rainer. You can support this podcast by checking out our guest work, listening to their music, purchasing their books, watching their shows and so on.
00:52:17
Speaker
You can find out more about each guest in all of our past episodes by visiting recreative.ca. That's re-creative.ca. You can contact us by emailing joe mohoney at donovanstreetpress dot.com. We'd love to hear from you. Thanks for listening.