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Episode 6: The Throat Goat of Hanover
52 Plays20 days ago
This week, the boys sink their teeth into the grisly crimes of windpipe-muncher Fritz Haarmann, aka the Vampire of Hanover, and dish on the horniest film of the year, Robert Eggers' Nosferatu.
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Transcript
Casual Drinks & Viral Podcast Talk
00:00:36
Speaker
I like how your immediate, you like the cigarette and it's like, let's do this. Yeah. I've got my drink. I'm literally drinking laxative tea you right now.
00:00:48
Speaker
I'm drinking, um it's like, it's this like really chavvy girl drink called a u and it's like blue raspberry vodka stuff. and But it looks like that Drano stuff from Heather's that she drinks and then falls into the coffee table and dies.
00:01:04
Speaker
It looks amazing. It looks like the, it looks like what that woman, that Irish woman who's always doing the drinks on Tik TOK. And then she goes, that's incredible. You know talking I know what mean. Yeah. She does drink this, but she would mix it with like 10 other things and then drink it one gulp.
00:01:20
Speaker
Yeah, I would definitely, 100% no questions asked if I ever ran into her in any situation would break sobriety to have the crazy and have the craziest night of my life with her for sure. and would be I wouldn't even hesitate. I'd be like, i'd be like this is this is the night to break it. This is the time, you know. It's gotta be done. It's gotta done. um Yeah, well, you sound incredible. good job on the mic.
00:01:47
Speaker
Thank you. Yeah, the last episode, like... Your vocal fry was insane. And then my mic was terrible, like the Gacy episode. So when I listening to it back, I was like, oh my God, everyone everyone's going to hate this. But it actually got the most listens of any episode that we put out. Yeah, I need to practice. I actually said I was going to attempt to sound less faggoty on this one.
00:02:09
Speaker
Because now we got, I think last episode, because of my viral tweet, we got more listeners than typical. So people are... people are here. Yeah. So hi, new listeners. Hi, new listeners. There's probably and like 10 new listeners total, but that's still more than before.
00:02:28
Speaker
Exactly. And we will figure out how to get it on Apple podcasts too. So yes, all all of that is in the works. Yeah, we hear your cries, one man. Although, I mean, the funny thing is, whatever, I'm not even going to get into it. I feel like most people listen to podcasts on Spotify at this point anyway, but whatever. It should be it should be everywhere. I agree.
00:02:49
Speaker
Yeah. All right, you introduce, because we we're doing two things today. We're going to do Nosferatu and a serial killer first.
Fritz Harman's Troubling Early Life
00:02:56
Speaker
um And they're kind of like vaguely linked by the theme of vampires and Germany.
00:03:02
Speaker
So the serial killer that we're going to be looking at today, i can't see your face while I'm looking at my show notes, so you can do any expression that you like. um Yeah. So we're going to be talking about the vampire of Hanover. um Not to be confused with the vampire of Dusseldorf, who I had heard of, but this guy i had never heard of and yes i started researching i'm glad you i'm glad i sent you that and you stopped me because i was pretty deep into the vampire of dusseldorf and i was like this isn't gay at all well i feel like he's the more famous of the two at least outside of germany but yeah judging from the the crimes of this guy i think he's like pretty well known like within germany anyway um
00:03:46
Speaker
Okay, you keep going. Okay, so the guy that we're talking about today, his name is Fritz Harmon, and he was born in on October 25th, 1879 in Hanover, Germany.
00:03:58
Speaker
So that makes him a Scorpio, if you're an astrological head. I don't know about you, but I'm like a astrological narcissist. So I know like almost everything to know about my own star sign, but I know like nothing about any of the others.
00:04:13
Speaker
um But I'm also a Leo. So that's probably a very Leo trait. I'm very like not a millennial in the sense that like I truly feel retarded. Like in this, I don't understand whenever anyone's talking to me about...
00:04:26
Speaker
astrology i don't understand and as much as i've tried to get invested in it i can't although i have seen a very good psychic um five or six times and i do enjoy hearing her talk about my own stuff so i guess i'm a narcissistic yeah it's one of those things i like i like hearing about it but if it's not related to me then i Why would I care? yeah Um, but yeah, so he is a Scorpio, um, who apparently are known for intensity, secrecy, and passion. So we'll see if that crops up.
00:05:00
Speaker
Um, so yeah, he was the youngest of six children. Um, his dad, Ollie Harmon was kind of an abusive guy, notoriously unfaithful, frequently engaged in extramarital affairs that caused a lot of tension within the family and his mother, um, Johanna,
00:05:20
Speaker
Johanna or Joanna? I don't know. um She was like, yeah, sort of typical, like, overindulgent, doting, like, mother. um So already he's got, like, all of the sort of, like, telltale signs of a faggot emerging. um But whether or not they're the telltale signs of a serial killer, like, I'm not sure.
00:05:42
Speaker
I mean, it's also worth mentioning that his mother was... um she was older than his dad by seven years, which would have been uncommon at the time. so um and she, and she's the one who had the, money that had some money. So that's, that's, I think all of that adds to like kind of faggot, like,
00:06:03
Speaker
mom stuff. She's like girl boss. She's like a girl boss cougar. Girl boss cougar. Yeah. um yeah So like from what I've like researched, he was quite a sort of quiet and effeminate child. um He played mostly with his sisters, didn't really play with boys at school.
00:06:23
Speaker
um From what I've learned about when he was at school, his behavior was very good, but he wasn't particularly like academic. um So he wasn't like the brightest guy. We have to, I mean, I do feel, i maybe you're getting to it, but I do feel like we have to mention he showed early signs of like autogynephilia.
00:06:41
Speaker
Are you getting there? with the what With the dressing and like girls' clothes and stuff. Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's like, it's a common thing. Okay, I don't want to say anything controversial, but it's like it's actually a lot of serial killers have this sort of ah thing in their childhood. But yeah, he was dressing in women's clothing and it seemed not in like a gender dysphoria way and more of a sexual arousal sort of way.
00:07:07
Speaker
Or at least that's what ah the a lot of the stuff I was reading said. yeah And he he struggled a lot in school because he was bullied for his demeanor. We'll get onto this later when we get into the actual crimes that he committed. But like he's giving like big bottom energy, and which doesn't necessarily tie in with his like crimes like later in life. But we can chat a little bit more about that later, i think.
00:07:33
Speaker
So... When he turned 16, he was put in a mental institution because there have been lots of accusations of him sexually assaulting like other young boys much younger than him.
00:07:45
Speaker
I also read that he himself had likely been molested by a teacher. yeah does Yeah, there are a few. I think he he didn't talk like too much about that but i read that as well that he'd like been like touched i mean i feel like this might be like a stupid assumption but i feel like with how prevalent sexual abuse is now probably then it was just like fucking like every you know what i mean because there was no like i don't know anyway yeah there was no like no one ever talked about it you know what i mean so yeah it didn't mention um
00:08:24
Speaker
whether it was a male teacher or a female teacher. But what i found interesting, so we both kind of watched a little bit of a movie today that was like, and it was based on the transcripts of the interrogation that he had with the police when he was eventually arrested.
00:08:38
Speaker
And he mentioned in that something about like a woman like grabbing his crotch. And I was thinking like, ah is that like a reference to the teacher? So I was wondering whether it was like a woman that touched him out when he was younger, but, but this is all like speculation. We don't actually know this. So yeah.
Harman's Crimes & Police Informant Role
00:08:54
Speaker
16. I don't want to derail you. 16.
00:08:57
Speaker
Yeah, so 16, he was placed in a mental institution after accusations of sexually assaulting young boys. And he was diagnosed with like mental instability.
00:09:09
Speaker
He actually escaped the institution with the help of his mother and fled to Switzerland while he was still a teenager. And then they returned to Hanover the following year and he started working at his dad's factory. I can't remember what the factory makes.
00:09:27
Speaker
I didn't write that bit down, but it's kind of a boring, like menial job working a factory for his dad. And they are not getting along at the time. They've never really gotten along the whole time, but um they've got a pretty sort of tumultuous family relationship.
00:09:42
Speaker
His dad, I think, is about a bit of a crook. And he's like, quote, he does like often trying to get his dad in trouble with the police and his dad is always trying to get him put back into a mental asylum.
00:09:56
Speaker
And that it it just seems like they have a very light toxic family dynamic between the two of them. As he sort of grows into adulthood, he starts kind of engaging in like petty crime and then briefly joins the military in 1898. I think he would be about, like I don't know, like 20 by this point, maybe 1920. Yeah.
00:10:19
Speaker
I also want to just say that, and I know I'm not going to get too into this because I know you haven't read it, Bicky, but for some of our listeners who are like really conspiracy pilled, like so far, this dude has followed the program to kill Dave McGowan. Yeah.
00:10:35
Speaker
like serial killer early life playbook down to a tee, molested overbearing mom, um early, early crimes, and then joining the military.
00:10:47
Speaker
It's like, um those four things are pretty much like, every serial killer is like so i don't know if you're interested in dave mcgowan you you might be following that he's this dude is following that exact trajectory yeah so he described his time in the military as like the happiest time of his life i think he was there for like maybe about a year or so but he was discharged early due to health issues so i'm I don't think they would have known what epilepsy was at the time, but like based on sort of the symptoms and stuff that he seemed to have had, like a modern kind of doctors have sort of said that he probably suffered from epilepsy because he was having like seizures and stuff.
00:11:29
Speaker
So he gets kicked out of the military, ends up going back home. and then he's turned to like petty theft and fraud to make a living. So he's engaging in like sort of petty crimes and stuff.
00:11:43
Speaker
And at this point, he develops quite a close relationship with the Hanover police and becomes sort of a prototype fed, as Q called it when we were talking about it earlier.
00:11:57
Speaker
um I don't know. Do you want to talk a little bit maybe about when he was a... Well, I mean, yeah, I guess it's i guess it's just worth... Like, Bicky's about to go into a lot of the stuff that, like... he was doing, obviously he's about to start raping and murdering like crazy, but part of the, part of how he got away with it for so long is that he was, um a police informer.
00:12:20
Speaker
um so they knew that he was a homosexual. Um, this is in Weimar, Germany. So like, you know, the idea of homosexuality existed. in fact, famously, this is what right wing Twitter people like to reference as like the,
00:12:37
Speaker
most degenerate time in Germany. So like the police are aware he's a homosexual and um like, he's kind of doing it, you know, to redirect the, um I guess, yeah, like to redirect the that it away from all of his other, um yeah, like activities. But it's just interesting, like the line between a police informant and just like a literal,
00:13:04
Speaker
member of the government is a pretty thin line. yeah, you can kind of argue that, and you know, was, he, he was sort of like literally a fed it's just like, this was sort of before we would have thought of thought of it in those terms.
00:13:23
Speaker
Yeah. It was interesting as well, like quite a few of the sources that researched, um, when they were talking about like how the, informant role would kind of work. Like he would kind of like snitch on somebody for a crime and then ah he would also get arrested by them at the same time. So it didn't look suspicious. And then they would like release him without charge and then charge like the other guy.
00:13:47
Speaker
Or he would, um, tell people that they could store like stolen goods in his apartment. And then he would tell the police that the goods were there and they'd arrest both of them and then release him. And the other guy would go to jail or whatever. So I say it's very like sneaky, like underhanded stuff. He clearly doesn't, by the way is exactly how it works.
00:14:09
Speaker
ah a So that's why, that's why people are constantly accusing, you know, like big giant Twitter accounts of being feds because it's like, if they were at something like January 6th or whatever, and they're not in jail, like, what the fuck?
00:14:25
Speaker
but But they, but typically that's what they do. They arrest, they arrest everyone all at once. And then, um and I also think there's an element of like, cause he's reporting on sort of like the criminal underworld,
00:14:36
Speaker
They know that he's a homosexual. And, you know, I think the idea, and you're about to get into his crimes, which, you know, didn't escalate to murder right away, but the idea that he would have been like raping men or boys, like was not probably not something they would even care about or have any, you know, inkling of what that would mean. so Yeah.
00:15:00
Speaker
So kind of around this time, he's he's meeting a lot of like young guys for sex and raping them and stuff. And most of the crimes of that nature at this time, like they would have gone unreported anyway because guys would have been too embarrassed to go to the police. and Which I think still is the case today in a lot of cases. like ah Guys don't really want to go to the police and admit that they've been raped by a man.
00:15:23
Speaker
especially not Especially not in the context that... like it's happening, which is like, he's in, it's kind of like very, you know, whatever, like he's inviting them over They're agreeing to go over and hang out with him.
00:15:36
Speaker
And then he's raping them, but it's not like they're being like pounced in this or something, you know what I mean? Like, I don't know. So there's, I could see even in that situation feeling even more, Like you don't want to go because it's like, yeah why were you going me out of this old like faggot's house?
00:15:53
Speaker
Yeah. a lot A lot of them were poor, of course, um very young and wanted things like booze and food and yeah. Yeah. So he had a tendency to like, um, hang around the railway station and pick up lot of guys there. So you'd have a lot of um, we talked about this a little bit in the Gacy episode, like that was sort of a time period where there are a lot of sort of like transient youth and like runaways and people who,
00:16:23
Speaker
and could go missing and maybe wouldn't necessarily be missed right away. um so like there was a lot of that same kind of energy at the time. There are a lot of sort of teen runaways and stuff, and he'd kind of pick them up in the station with like promises of like food or like alcohol and stuff and take them back to his apartment.
The Vampire of Hanover's First Murder
00:16:41
Speaker
And the first guy that he kills, was a 17-year-old runaway boy called Friedel Roth. I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly. But he disappeared in September 1918 after reportedly seeking work and shelter from Fritz.
00:17:02
Speaker
Um, so Harmon laws Roth to his apartment. This is when we get into like the gory stuff. So he killed him by biting into his throat. And this is obviously where the moniker of the vampire of Hanover comes from. Um, some other outlets called him like the Wolf man.
00:17:23
Speaker
I heard one call him, oh, what was it? Like the windpipe muncher, which I thought was like particularly funny. Yeah, like, yeah, it's really gross to think about what he did. But like, yeah, that what I read is that he would literally bite apple like out off the like out of their throats.
00:17:41
Speaker
Yeah. I don't even, the amount of, yeah, anyway. I don't even know whether that's like, I don't know. The mental fortitude that it would take to be able to like do that and continue with it once you'd started to the point that it like kills a person. Like, I don't know.
00:17:58
Speaker
I can't, I can't even fathom like being able to do that. But anyway, so Roth's like personal belongings were, some of them were kept, some of them were sold, which is a pattern that we will see with later victims where he's,
00:18:14
Speaker
using his kind of like connections in like the black markets, like get rid of the the stuff that these boys have, like their clothing and their belongings. um But we'll we'll get into that a little bit more when we talk about the next one.
00:18:28
Speaker
So not that long after the murder of Friedel Roth, um he encounters a guy called Hans Granz, who will become kind of a, quite an important like figure in his life.
Complex Relationships & Killing Spree
00:18:41
Speaker
Granz is initially a potential victim. He's like a sort of young, like handsome guy. And I think initially he's thinking like, oh, this will be like the next guy that I kill.
00:18:52
Speaker
But he he manages to win Harmon's favor and sort of becomes kind of like not gay TM lover slash accomplice. What did you think of Grands?
00:19:05
Speaker
I mean,
00:19:08
Speaker
i I actually like kind of didn't think of them as not gay TM lovers because I was reading their his like their history. it Like there was a lot of like calls to their residents for like domestic violence. And there was a lot of like, um,
00:19:27
Speaker
you know, breaking up and getting back together and breaking up and getting back together. So honestly, they seemed like just two like dramatic Queens, um, sort of fighting it out. And their age gap is actually like pretty standard for a lot of gay relationships. Um, certainly ones that I, I'm aware of, but, yeah, I mean, i guess I, I, I like,
00:19:56
Speaker
You know, the big question, I guess, is always like how, um, like, it seems like the reason Granz was able to live and he did refer to Granz, like a son to him and all that stuff, like is because Granz himself was like pretty intelligent and manipulative as well.
00:20:15
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. He probably more intelligent and manipulative than him. Yeah. Yeah. The impression that I kind of got was that Hans Granz is, I mean, he was a prostitute at the time. So he was, he was actively like selling himself to men, but he continued like sleeping with women throughout their relationship as well. um So I don't think he was necessarily like i a gay gay, but I kind of got the impression that Fritz was like really quite enamored with him and like loved him. And he was kind of just sort of using him for ah place to stay and a means of making money.
00:20:49
Speaker
Well, yeah, I mean, it was like a pretty typical, like, you know, hustler story. Like, I mean, this is basically what like queer, queer was about the William Burroughs movie um or William Burroughs book. And then recently got made into a movie. It's like an older woman.
00:21:07
Speaker
washed up homosexual sort of paying for this like young trade. um and you know even though the, yeah, I mean like the young trade, like actually does have a lot of power because, you know, they have the thing that's desired and wanted um So, yeah, I mean his complicity in the crimes though, like, I don't know.
00:21:33
Speaker
not like, 100% sure about that. I guess no one is. Yeah. It's interesting that his, like, attachment to Grand, like, just seems to, like, contrast so starkly with the, like, brutality that he shows to, like, the other boys.
00:21:46
Speaker
um And I was thinking about this in terms of, like, I don't know. A lot of the times when you hear about these like serial killers, you can tell that they're like complete sociopaths and they're like not capable of love and they don't have like close relationships with people in their life.
00:22:02
Speaker
But like I never really get the impression that like Fritz is... like that. like he The way that he speaks about his mother, he's always very so of kind about her. It's obvious that he loves her a lot.
00:22:13
Speaker
um he He obviously loved this like grand guy. So he's clearly not incapable of love. So I don't know. It's interesting to think, like well, where does the the like the drive to kill come from if you're somebody who's like capable of building connections like that with people, even if it's one-sided? Well, I would imagine that the only way you could do it is if you have some sort of, ah way of separating of thinking of your victims as like not human in some way.
00:22:45
Speaker
You know what I mean? Yeah. Like maybe he was able to do that. I mean, I'm just speculating here. ah you know, he's able to think of these like young, like runaways, often prostitutes as like,
00:22:57
Speaker
but and and disposable. Yeah. I mean, i could i could i could see someone who's capable of emotion still being able to kind of convince themselves that that is, you know, yeah.
00:23:11
Speaker
So like we mentioned before, there was kind of this volatile dynamic to their relationship. They were known to argue frequently and their tension sometimes would spill into their like criminal activities.
00:23:23
Speaker
Um, there was one case of a boy, this is actually an unconfirmed victim. So he wasn't actually charged for this at trial, but they did discuss a trial that I think was quite a sort of striking example of, I think it's quite a good example of the volatility in their relationship. So this was a boy called Hans Kimes, who was a teenage boy and he was found, he hadn't been dismembered in the same way as the other boys, but he was found bound and naked in the river.
00:23:52
Speaker
with a handkerchief lodged in his throat that had Grand's name on it. And a lot of people speculate that Harmon had killed Haynes during a period of discord with Grand's, um, potentially as an attempt to implicate him in his crimes. He'd like stuffed his handkerchief like down his throat.
00:24:14
Speaker
Um, so that kind of, it kind of gives you a flavor of the dynamic of their relationship. Like that it's not, It's not all lovey-dovey all the time. And when they fight, they're they're like really fighting.
00:24:25
Speaker
Yeah. Um, at this, I mean, I guess we should also, so at this point it's like, this is during world war one, right? It's just after world war one, I think just after world war, which is probably part of the reason there were some, there were so much like itinerant, um, you know, people and young people around. Cause that's kind of what, a you know, war does.
00:24:47
Speaker
But yeah, I mean, basically between 1923 and 1924 is when he's like really, really ah killing at, um you know, like at a pretty rapid fire speed.
00:25:03
Speaker
um i mean, he kills up to 27 victims in those couple of years. Well, that's what we know about. When he was...
00:25:16
Speaker
interviewed by the police his number his number was like fifth between 50 and 70 but they they they only managed to pin him for i think it was like 23 victims in total and there's lots i mean lots of boys i mean it's kind of crazy to think about because this i mean but lots of boys like in his neighborhood that were around him were like sort of like disappearing like constantly so yeah even if it was only like 20 something boys the rate at which they were disappearing was like two boys a month yeah so it's it's not like it's not like they're like months apart they're weeks apart if not days apart um so it's it's amazing that he was able to sort get out get away with it for so long without people sort of noticing but
00:26:06
Speaker
And part of it, like, is this, like, you know, his, like, relationship with the police, which is, like, which makes you wonder, like, how much the police, because certainly this man was not the only informant in the city of Hanover at the time. There were probably many.
00:26:23
Speaker
um And I'm sure his activities were, you know, somewhat known. I mean, I don't think you could, I mean, I don't know. It's just interesting to me because I know this is the conspiracy person in me, but it's like, it just seems like it's impossible that he was acting um completely hidden, you know, especially with just like, I mean, I'm just trying to imagine like a city this, I don't know how big Hanover was at the time, but let's say it's like a city of a hundred thousand people. Like, yeah.
00:26:52
Speaker
two boys missing every couple of weeks. mean that would be That would be like a really noticed thing, you know? Yeah. and thus There's too many victims for us to go through like one by one and talk about them all.
00:27:06
Speaker
So I just wanted kind of like, just give the listeners like a generalized idea of like who these boys were and how he was kind of getting away with it and what his methods were. So he was mostly targeting like young men and boys who were often like homeless or runaways between I think the youngest was age 10 and the oldest was about 22.
00:27:25
Speaker
So the majority of them are like young Twinkie sort of guys. um So I think he's he probably wins for like ultimate like Twink Dad Champion. but i don't know. I mean, you and I haven't done Dahmer yet. So we'll see. That is true.
00:27:39
Speaker
That is true. So he would strangle the victims and bite into their throats, hence the vampire nickname. And then he would dismember the bodies and dispose of the remains in the Lane River.
00:27:52
Speaker
There were also allegations that he was selling flesh on the black market as pork. But that was... I wanted to talk to you a little bit about that because I'm... That's one of those things where they they couldn't prove it in court, but it seems like there's... I think that he was doing that. I don't i don't know what you think. Well, yeah. I mean, that's at the time, Germany had a huge meat shortage. Again, i'm i I'm guessing because of the war and just, you know, the general poverty and...
00:28:19
Speaker
ah They were a defeated nation. but So having any sort of access to black market meat um would have been profitable. i mean, yeah, it seems like he was doing that. People were getting sick from eating the meat.
00:28:33
Speaker
um You can't like... from what I understand you, you actually cannot really eat your own species. Like you will, you that will make you sick. So, yeah, ah there was even, um there was even an incident where like a girl who worked for him, like was suspicious that he was doing this and took some meat that she found in a bucket in his home to the police station.
00:28:57
Speaker
And, the policeman just said, oh, it's pork and didn't really do anything about it. But I sort of think if he's got the police on this side anyway, because he's informing about stuff, they're probably not really going to take any notice or something like that.
00:29:11
Speaker
um So, so I don't know. i'm He does go on. Oh, I was just going to say, that i mean, they clearly just didn't want to look at him very closely, but like, to me, that's kind of why I'm implying that like, it's possible that like police were like, I don't know. Like I think often when there's like mass, like child abuse there it's, it's done in groups of people. So I'm not ruling out.
Body Disposal & Granz's Involvement
00:29:39
Speaker
I didn't find any evidence of this, but I'm not ruling out that there were police officers involved in some of these rapes and murders and things like that.
00:29:48
Speaker
he does talk about finding the process of getting rid of the bodies particularly difficult, like way worse than the actual killing. Like he seems to get some kind of like sexual thrill or gratification from the process of killing them themselves. But like the process of getting rid of them, he talks about finding quite difficult.
00:30:10
Speaker
um And just, I've got like a bit of ah quote about, how he would get rid of the body is just for anyone who wants some like real gory details. I know. And I actually, I did, I like skipped around the film and I think I heard this part of the film. So, but anyway, go ahead.
00:30:26
Speaker
So he would, um he'd fortify himself beforehand by pouring himself a cup of strong black coffee. He'd place the body of the victim on the floor of his apartment and cover the face with a cloth.
00:30:37
Speaker
Cause he, he didn't like the idea of them staring at him while he was like going about his work. He'd make two cuts in their stomach and remove their intestines, which he would then place in a bucket.
00:30:52
Speaker
A towel would then be placed inside the abdominal cavity to soak up the collecting blood. Then he'd make three cuts between the victim's ribs and shoulders.
00:31:03
Speaker
And then, and I quote, take hold of the ribs and push until the bones around the shoulders broke. ah The victim's heart, lungs, and kidneys would then be removed, diced, and placed in the same bucket.
00:31:16
Speaker
The legs and arms would be severed from the body and stripped of meat, and the surplus flesh would be disposed of in the toilet or in the nearby river. So...
00:31:28
Speaker
Yeah. um Pretty grisly stuff. That's grisly enough to be doing to, like, one person a month, but, like, two a month? I don't i don't know.
00:31:38
Speaker
yeah Apparently, it would take him about two days to do this, um and he'd take, like, regular breaks to have, like, naps and stuff because it would be quite tiring work. um i i I can't imagine doing this to one person, let alone, like, 20 plus.
00:31:53
Speaker
I mean, I have thought about this because I have a morbid mind full of intrusive. Same. um And I've thought about if I could, if I would have the ability to like cut up a body. I don't know. And i I always have to like imagine it's like some situation, like one of my sisters, some guy tried to rape her and she like shot him and...
00:32:16
Speaker
You know what I mean? Like I always have to like, I always have to like imagine it's like I'm helping someone I love and I need to do this. Like, could I do it um The only way, the only conceivable way I could imagine doing it is I'd have to be really, really, really heavily um sedated. So I would need like,
00:32:35
Speaker
I would need like serious ah pills ah and like, I would need to be like, basically like, I would need like opiates and like alcohol. and And I would need to be as like, I would need to be as like detached and disassociated as I possibly could be to even achieve it.
00:32:52
Speaker
So I, coffee would be, coffee would be the exact opposite of what I would want. Cause I would, I would want to be as, I'd want to be as like fuzzy and you know, so I don't know.
00:33:03
Speaker
it's it's it's disgusting and insane to imagine, but... Yeah, it's disgusting. Like, this is what kind of makes me think that that there's no way that he wasn't selling some of this meat, because the idea that you could, like...
00:33:19
Speaker
flush the majority of a human body down the toilet and then, like, throw the bones in a river. Like, it just... It's not... It's not realistic. Like, your toilet's going to get blocked at some point with all the, like, fingers and scalps and ears and God knows what in there. So I just... It also is just, like...
00:33:36
Speaker
I don't know. i mean, the idea that he didn't have any help just also seems insane. Cause like I could see you getting rid of like, I could see like getting rid of like one body, you know? um but getting rid of like,
00:33:52
Speaker
multiple bodies it just i don't know it just it just feels like he would have at least needed someone to help which maybe was his like lover you know i mean that's yeah i mean will get along to the arrest in a little bit but i should mention that like grans was arrested alongside him and and accused of complicity in the crimes and I think it's hard to say, like, I think he was, he must've been aware that he was doing this.
00:34:18
Speaker
Um, there are some sources that state that he actually walked in on him disposing of one of the bodies at some point. Um, and he just sort of went away and asked him like, when should I come back and just came back later when it was all done. But there are other reports that say that he sort of helped him choose victims, people,
00:34:37
Speaker
People at the time of his arrest um reported that they'd seen him at the station with Harmon pointing boys out. um How much of this is just people getting...
00:34:49
Speaker
caught up in the media frenzy and wanting to sort of have their say, it's it's hard to say, but, um but yeah, it's definitely not unreasonable to think that Grant was probably assisting him at least in some way, given how frequently he's disposing of these boys.
00:35:09
Speaker
Onto sort of the capture and then the subsequent trial.
Arrest & Sensational Trial
00:35:13
Speaker
so It all kind of comes to a head in 1924 when human bones start washing up on the banks of the lame river and sparking investigations.
00:35:26
Speaker
So the police start linking these remains to missing persons and Harmon and a lot of his known associates are sort of suspected of being involved somehow.
00:35:38
Speaker
And when they've kind of gathered enough evidence from speaking to different people that they, they feel like they know that Harmon is the guy responsible, they plan a sting operation where they're going to try and sort of like catch him in the act. So they send two undercover police officers to the Hanover train station where he's often sort of scouting for victims.
00:36:01
Speaker
And these are like, Cause he knows most of the police at the time. Cause he's got that sort of informant relationship with them. Um, they choose these like two young guys that he wouldn't know. And they like dress them up in like regular clothes. They send them to the station and they're just kind of observing him to sort of see what happens.
00:36:20
Speaker
And coincidentally, Harmon is there with a 15 year old boy who has been staying at his apartment for a few days and they get into a heated argument in the train station and Harmon himself ends up approaching the police and accusing the 15 year old boy of using forged travel documents.
00:36:46
Speaker
So the police think, okay, well, at least now we've got an excuse to take them both in. So they take them both into police custody. And once they're in police custody, the boy who's been staying with him blabs to the police and says, he's been raping me.
00:37:00
Speaker
He's been abusing me. And they think, right, okay, we've got him. So they arrest Harmon for the crimes. And that was how they arrested him. Yeah, and the and the movie that we watched is basically just a ah German film that was made, which is just ah actors acting out the exact transcripts from the interrogation.
00:37:20
Speaker
It's a really unpleasant film, so. Yeah, i I made it, like, I think I made about one hour ten into it and I was like, I can't carry on watching this. I don't know if you made it all the way through, but.
00:37:31
Speaker
Oh, no, absolutely not. I mean, hey I watched maybe... i but Well, i watched the first, like, 15 minutes because at first I was like... okay, I'm going to, um you know, watch this. What else am I doing today besides napping?
00:37:46
Speaker
And then I, um which is like my priority on every like Saturday. um And then I got bored because the first 10 minutes they were just asking him like stupid questions about like geography, which I didn't really understand.
00:38:01
Speaker
um But I guess that was like to get, so then I was like, whatever, skip, skip, skip. And then like the first thing I skipped to was his description of how he chopped up the body. Yeah. And then I was like really over watching it. i was like, oh, it's like so one of the,
00:38:17
Speaker
one of the interesting things, and this kind of goes back to his relationship with Hans Gran is that eventually like under duress, he confesses to killing these boys, but he also uses sort of his, he doesn't want to die alone. He knows that he's going to be executed, but he doesn't want to be executed on his own.
00:38:36
Speaker
So he uses the trial as an opportunity to try and get Hans Gran's sort of on the line for the murders as well.
00:38:48
Speaker
So I think in court, he accuses Hans Granz of some of these murders. Hans Granz, who has also been arrested for sort of helping him, is also sentenced to execution. And he only ends up getting off because they find a letter where he...
00:39:08
Speaker
confesses that actually he wasn't involved in the killings and it was all a sort of plan to get him executed. Um, so even, even once he's been arrested, he's like, that they're still like trying to fuck each other over. It's, it's interesting.
00:39:23
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, I wish that this had, I mean, i wish that this had happened in a time when there could have been like significantly more, uh,
00:39:35
Speaker
you know, like interviews with these people and stuff. I mean, we have a lot, of course, it wasn't that long ago, but you know, I would have so many more, i would love to see these two go under like, you know, modern criminal profiler,
00:39:51
Speaker
type interviews and stuff um because i think that would be really revealing um he but he is eventually executed though i mean that's that's how this yes that's how this ends yeah um but the the trial itself was um it was like a media frenzy the public were obsessed with it um the first few days of the trial they let members of the public into the courtroom Um, but in the end they just had to say like, no, you got, you can't
Social Impact & Homophobia in Germany
00:40:18
Speaker
come in anymore. I love that was due to the like grizzly details of what he'd been doing to these boys, but it was, I don't think they'd ever, I don't know. When was that the printing press invented? That must've been like, not that long before.
00:40:33
Speaker
Because I think this is like the first like big. No, I think it was a long time before. Oh, I don't know. I'm not a scientist. But anyway, but I think this is like the big, like the biggest like media thing that had happened in Germany. The Okay, never mind. From the 1400s on, they could make like pamphlets and things like like that was possible. ah okay but the This is the first like big like media story that everyone was obsessed with. like It was a point like radio already exists. Yeah.
00:41:06
Speaker
Oh, it doesn't. Yes, it does. is the World War one Yes, there was definitely radio. I don't know if every whatever ort know if every house had a radio, but like, you know, that exists.
00:41:19
Speaker
But well whatever, this is that this is like the Johnny Depp and Amber Heard of the day. Like everyone was obsessed with it. Everyone was talking about it. Well, okay, there are some other, I think after his death, interesting things to mention too. So like they actually preserved his head, which Vicky sent me without warning um and then while I was laying in bed.
00:41:38
Speaker
um Very disturbing, but um they kept it for until 2014 when they finally cremated it. So they were trying to study his brain. They found ah ah they found traces of meningitis in his brain. i don't really know what that means. i'm not a doctor.
00:41:52
Speaker
I don't know. I feel like that meningitis, I don't know what i like in America, but like when you're a kid in the UK, like that was what they would always, that was like the boogeyman disease. They would always be Oh, don't do that. You'll get meningitis. I mean, I mean, I literally, I mean, i don't want to actually, this could be too doxy to talk about it. Anyway, I know someone who got meningitis did not die, but had severe, severe, severe like health.
00:42:15
Speaker
Um, major lifelong health complications so i i don't know anyway whatever guess we don't we don't support meningitis on the pod no i just i just meant like my understanding of meningitis is like most people die and if you don't die you have like like, yeah, like serious lifelong shit. But I don't, I don't really understand how he could have had meningitis, but maybe I don't know. Maybe there's different types of meningitis.
00:42:44
Speaker
I have no idea. oh ah Yeah. And then the other thing i think is worth mentioning is that like, you know this is Again, this was during Weimar.
00:42:58
Speaker
So it's like right before ah Hitler's you know beginning of his rise in Germany. And so there was actually at the time like a modern, a semi-modern like homosexual like rights movement. um And this definitely like sent a wave of... like homophobia like through uh germany germany which i kind of like it's i understand you know like so definitely i could see why this would definitely make people wary of um you know like yeah homosexuals and you know it was used in this kind of propagandistic way to uh
00:43:37
Speaker
to ah to kind of like combat like, you know, modern sexual politics that were emerging at the time. So basically you could say that he was responsible for the Holocaust.
00:43:50
Speaker
Maybe. how um No, but that is, that is true. and They, they do touch on that a little bit in the, the film that I watched. um Cause the, this is one of the things that I found like researching this is like, I think, i that it Wait, before you go to that, can I mention another crazy thing I just found out?
00:44:11
Speaker
Hans Grahns actually ah lived through World War two was interred and was interred at a concentration camp for a period of time to get through his ah the final sentence, but then he lived and he did not die until 1975. Oh, wow. that's crazy to think about, too.
00:44:28
Speaker
I wonder if there are like any interviews with him, like talking about it. Anyway, what were you saying? completely interrupted you. I just thought it was crazy that he lived into like, like he would have been alive at the time John Wayne Gacy was alive.
00:44:41
Speaker
Yeah, that is, that is crazy.
Nosferatu: From Classic to Modern Remake
00:44:43
Speaker
Um, no, I was just going to say that like the, in the film that we both watched, what was the name of the film? Cause I feel like if people want to go and watch it, we should know the name. Um, let me find out.
00:44:57
Speaker
right, did you find it? Yeah, it's fine. Yes, I did find it. I'm also drinking my third drink, so I'm probably going to be wasted. getting darker. Yes, this is um black grape flavor.
00:45:08
Speaker
Okay. i So yeah, the other thing I want to talk about briefly was like, and so you were saying before about how there was like a modern gay rights movement already and this was yeah yeah this kind of like sat back a little bit like they they they mentioned that a little bit in the movie that we both watched which is called tot matcher or or death maker in english um they kind of touch on that a little bit where the guy who's like interrogating him is talking about homosexual acts and which ones he thinks are bad and which ones he thinks are not bad.
00:45:45
Speaker
And the responses that the killer like gives in the interview is that like, um, having like gay sex with children is bad, but adults are okay to do it.
00:45:57
Speaker
And, um, like anal sex is bad, but like sucking is okay. It goes into quite like, uh, gross detail about this stuff it's really funny as well i don't know whether this was just like a direct translation but they use the word like shag ah for like fucking which is a very very like british term for like shacking someone so that i'm sure that's just the translation yeah i actually took a screenshot because this was the one part where this guy is just saying like when's the first time you shagged a boy and it just came up in the subtitles and i was like oh my god that's
00:46:32
Speaker
I did, this I did like think while I was watching it, I was like, this guy has like fairly progressive views on, on gay, on gay sex.
00:46:44
Speaker
But like, yeah, I mean, once I like knew the time period, like, but I mean, again, this is like famously a time, like this was famously a time period of like, sexual liberation and stuff um in europe oh mean this is like post-proid this is post like a lot of the stuff that like set the the framework for like modern like sexual politics like has been set at this point so yeah i feel like a lot of the because i listen to quite a few different um like podcasts and like youtube videos like talking about this
00:47:16
Speaker
And everybody is, like, so reticent about, like, seeming homophobic that it felt like they were really cautious about what they would say about this guy. And I'm just like, no, we can... We're both gays. We can have a completely honest conversation about it. It's fine.
00:47:30
Speaker
um Because the... Yeah, I don't care. I mean, like, to me, like, of course, gay people do bad, like, have done horrible things. Like, every... every group of people has done horrible things.
00:47:41
Speaker
but Yeah. And I think, I think for me, like what was interesting about it was like, I'm obviously not a serial killer, but the, the parallels, like ah between like my experience as a kid and like his experience of a kid. And I think a lot of the stuff that he went through as a kid is stuff that a lot of gay kids go through.
00:48:00
Speaker
yeah, So it's kind of knowing that you can, like, come through all of that and be a totally normal, like, functioning adult. and But you could also become this, like, horrible monster, I think, is quite an interesting sort of thing. so Yeah, I mean, i i don't know.
00:48:17
Speaker
i like... I think that's true. I mean, i don't even think that's unique to, like, homosexuality in any way. i mean, like, you can... I don't think there's always...
00:48:31
Speaker
I think is as much as we want there to be a clear cut explanation for things, there just really explanation for these things like there just really isn't and like the human nature, and now I'm getting sort of like deep, but like human nature, just yeah like evil and the, the, the capacity for like evil and like profound good, like within it. And that's probably in some way locked within every human. And like, who knows what like unlocks good and like what unlocks bad. Exactly. Like, it's very difficult to,
00:49:05
Speaker
you know, to know that. And I don't think there's like ever going to be like clear cut answers. We're never going to find a serial killer gene. And the same way there's never going they're never going to find a gay gene. You know, it's just, yeah, that's true. These things are just sort of unexplainable.
00:49:21
Speaker
I did find interesting that the... um Because I was Obviously, the reason that he's sort of known as like the Manpower of Hanover is because he would bite the throats of these boys.
00:49:32
Speaker
But he also had like a ton of other nicknames. As I mentioned before, they call him like the Wolfman or the Windpipe Muncher. And it was interesting, like the... one of the main reasons why he had all these nicknames was so like serial killer wasn't a thing at the time.
00:49:47
Speaker
Like there were obviously serial killers before him and after him, but they didn't, the phrase like serial killer didn't exist yet. So the media couldn't really use that. So I think that kind of explains why they came up with all of these like weird nicknames and stuff to describe him, which I thought was cool.
00:50:04
Speaker
I mean, i will say that, like again, as someone who's read who's very conspiracy-pilled and read a lot about serial killers, like but read Program to Kill there and like just know just know that there like is a reason that serial killers seem to have existed almost exclusively between the years 1850 1985.
00:50:26
Speaker
yeah And there's a reason that there's not really any now. um But we should talk about Nosferatu. Okay, so I think that we're both um solid fans. um I love Nosferatu. If you're not familiar with what it is. It's basically, so Nosferatu is a film from 1922 originally. It's a German film.
00:50:51
Speaker
It was a complete ripoff of Dracula, um like unambiguously so. It was such a ripoff that the heirs of Bram Stoker were were able to sue for copyright infringement and get the film effectively banned.
00:51:06
Speaker
um And so ah you know, the only reason it even, note the original Nosferatu even survived was because like, I don't know the whole story, but like someone managed to save like one copy of it and,
00:51:19
Speaker
Anyway. I think it was, it had been shipped to America and an American had kept hold of it. So America wins again. yeah like um And then, you know, since then it's become like, kind of like lauded as like this, like classic of the silent film era.
00:51:35
Speaker
If you're ah from New York, I've, I've been to the, what they call the procession of the ghouls, which is this, like, I'm sure it's like deeply satanic and like, how, heretical to do this, but at St. John, the divine cathedral, which is like a beautiful, beautiful, beautiful, like I can't even believe like it exists in New York. It's like so huge.
00:51:54
Speaker
Um, it like looks like Notre Dame, you know, but anyway, this huge cathedral in New York, um, they have this, uh, every year on Halloween, they show Nosferatu. Um,
00:52:05
Speaker
inside of it. And there's this procession of people in these crazy costumes dressed as like demons and stuff. Again, I'm sure this is like, you know, sorry, Jesus, we probably shouldn't be doing that.
00:52:18
Speaker
Anyway, so it's like a, it's a beloved film and it's like, ah you know, very well known. um And Robert Eggers remade it. um He's known for the witch. He's known for North man. He's known for the lighthouse. I loved the North man and the witch, the lighthouse. I remember being like, I don't know what the fuck this movie's about.
00:52:36
Speaker
Not even like, not even like ah Robert Pattinson, like jacking off and stuff. Like none of it could really even get me that into it. so I don't want to interrupt you away on your tangent, but like I have pretty much the same Robert Eggers experience. So i I've rewatched... I've probably watched The Witch the most. I've seen The Witch probably about six or seven times by this at this point.
00:52:59
Speaker
um And that's definitely my favorite. But like I feel like Robert Eggers makes like films for girls and films for boys. And because we're gay, we like the films for girls the best. Because I feel like the The Lighthouse is a film for boys.
00:53:13
Speaker
Because everybody that I know who likes it is a guy who's like straight. um And everybody I know who doesn't like it that much is a gay. The North Man's definitely filmed a film for boys, too.
00:53:26
Speaker
That's true, but it's, I, I, the Northman, I think at least has like a coherent plot that I think makes it easier for regular normies to follow. I mean, the Northman is like basically um like a Marvel, like, or something like, you know what I mean? It's like a it's like a high budget, like action film.
00:53:44
Speaker
um You know, it, it would have made a lot more money, but it came out like kind of peak COVID. um Yeah. I have, I've only seen the North one once I watched it in cinema and, um, there's kind of a running theme on the part now, but I had a really bad cinema experience and the, the sound mixing in the cinema that I went to was really bad. And the music was really loud and the dialogue was really quiet. Like you could barely hear what they were saying.
00:54:12
Speaker
Um, and I also found Nicole Kidman's botched face, extremely distracting. Like, I don't I like, I love Nicole Kidman. I know you love Nicole Kidman too. Like we we are, we are definitely Nicole Kidman fans on Twink Death, but I think you kind of reach a point in your plastic surgery journey where you're no longer convincing in period pieces anymore. And I think Nicole Kidman hit that a long time ago. Yeah. So I did find that element of, of the Northman kind of distracting.
00:54:45
Speaker
But she' is she is very dimly lit the whole way through also, which is quite interesting. It's only candle lit. I'm obsessed. We're going to move on from the North Bend really fast, but I loved Bjork in it. Her cameo was insane.
00:54:58
Speaker
um and I loved seeing Anya Taylor-Joy and... ah whatever scars guard that is, um you know, get it on in that little, like, like, like, is that the trees, the tree blood one, the vampire from true. Yeah. and Alexander, I think is his name.
00:55:15
Speaker
I always, i always forget all the scar guards scars guards, actual names. I just call them the scars guards. Do you have a favorite? Well, I like the creepy the one who's the Pennywise clown. Yeah, I like him too. He is literally Nosferatu, so I guess we'll come back on to that. Yeah, that's good segue. So he's in Nosferatu.
00:55:33
Speaker
I mean, i will say... okay let's talk about Nosferatu I loved it I will say that like whatever that Skarsgรฅrd's first name is is like a total waste I think he's Bill Bill Skarsgรฅrd he's like a total waste in this because like honestly like anyone could have been Nosferatu like it's so it's so heavily like costumed and makeuped and then like CGI'd that like it doesn't even matter who's underneath. Yeah. You, you never really like, you never really see him ah fully on screen until like the end of the movie.
00:56:07
Speaker
It's like the very, you only see him in like the death scene, essentially like the very final, that's like the, but then again, that's like, so CGI. It's like, you're, you know, um I don't think we need to go through the plot. I mean, I just, I, again, like, I feel like the plot is so well known, but whatever. It's like, it's the Dracula plot.
00:56:26
Speaker
The guy has to go off and sign these papers at this haunted castle, blah, blah, blah. The only, the only thing that's different in this film, which I think is worth talking about is that they center Lily Rose Depp's character, the wife character much ah more heavily. So like, and in previous Dracula iterations, you know,
00:56:47
Speaker
Yes, she's a part of it. of You know, Dracula's obsessed with her, wants her, all that. But in this one, Lily Rose, they gave Lily Rose Depp like a significantly expanded role. And what the the addition they add that wasn't in any of the other movies is that she had called this like demon character,
00:57:08
Speaker
onto her when she was like a teenager and had had this like love affair. um And then, um you know, he's searching for her again. And she has, she's the one who has to make the ultimate decision about like, you know, whether or not she's going to like destroy him. um And she decides to do that in this like,
00:57:34
Speaker
Yeah, I think like from, cause I, I don't know about you, but like a lot of my friends did not like this movie. Yeah, a lot of people, I mean, it's made a shit ton of money. So clearly it's been like, like, you know, people are seeing it, but yeah, it's gotten a lot of blowback. so Yeah, one of my, my closest like IRL friends really liked it, but my, like quite a lot of my like online friends in like film group chats and stuff like didn't like it. And a lot, and one of the main, It's made $139 million dollars on a $50 million dollars budget. And I'm like, ah I'm a film nerd. So I pay attention to stuff like that. So it's a box office hit.
00:58:10
Speaker
That's for sure. But yeah. But one of the main things that they didn't like it, one of the main criticisms that was sort of leveled at it was that in the original um sort of the, the reason that he like wants her so much is because she's like virginal and pure. And in this, like, she's kind of,
00:58:29
Speaker
she's already fucked him once maybe, or like, do you know what mean? And it's sort of like, it kind of like turns the idea of her as this like um virginal, like pure woman on its head.
00:58:40
Speaker
um But that didn't bother me. Like I i i just didn't give a shit about that when I was watching it. I thought I was really reticent going into it because I'd only seen Lily Rose Depp in one of the movie and I didn't think she was that good.
00:58:53
Speaker
And I know the role was originally supposed to be Anya Taylor-Joy and she dropped out. So I was kind of, is she going to be good? Is she going to be bad? But I thought she was fantastic. like I thought she was so compelling and the way she who was able to kind of like morph in and out of like these insane, like fits of gooning and then be normal again for a minute and then go back into it. I do.
00:59:18
Speaker
It looks like an exhausting performance, but she did such a good job. i love it. She does a lot of like physicality and like, ah some people pointed out on Twitter that like, there had been kind of a lot of, there had been a couple movies like that this year because Sydney Sweeney did, um you know, that like,
00:59:35
Speaker
whatever, uh, non-movie, non-movie. So there had been a few actresses who had like kind of done the like convulsions fit thing, but like Lily Rose Depp, like far exceeded them. Like, yeah, absolutely. I would, the only, the only one I would say was, is would come close would be, um,
00:59:56
Speaker
I don't know what her name is, but the the actress from the first Omen. Yeah. But Lily even beat her. Like, you know what i mean? Like even that chick, like I still think Lily Rose Depp. And I think part of it is her, to be perfectly honest, it's like her body. Like she's so thin. um So I think she's able to like kind of do things with her body. Like, even though like both those actresses, Sydney, sweetie and the first Omen actress are also very thin. Like, you know, Lily Rose Depp is like a,
01:00:24
Speaker
skeletal. She's like, ah she's like emaciated. So she's able to do um some pretty insane and like her face, the stuff she does with her face is very brave um because it's so um ugly. or attractive So I think, I think it's cool to do like, yeah, for her to have like really gone ugly, especially for such a young, you know, hot actress. um And also I loved her BPD scene.
01:00:51
Speaker
where she like kind of, ah what is the word I want to use? When she like gets him to fuck her by being like, you could never pleasure me the way that he did. Like that was so funny.
01:01:04
Speaker
um And that really cracked me up. Like all of her like BPD stuff was like very funny. Like when he gives her the flowers and she's like, they're already dead. I've talked about this obviously when I went on nice with Mac and Bonnie, but like I have such a spot, soft spot for Nicholas Hall as well. Cause I was a skinned teenager.
01:01:21
Speaker
um it's, it's so satisfying to me when I see him in like these like big movies and I'm just like, Oh, it's Tony from Skins. But I thought he was really great as well. This was the first time I ever like thought he um look looked hot. you know like i've always I've never really thought of him as like super hot, but like I thought he looked pretty hot in this.
01:01:43
Speaker
I also thought Aaron Taylor Johnson looked super hot too. um And yeah, I mean, they were all so good. I do think, I will i will say...
01:01:55
Speaker
ah Like I, cause I saw it two and a half times. One of the times I had to leave the theater suddenly. um by like, okay. Like one thing I'll say is like, it's a little long. Like there was, there were a few parts where like I was a like, especially the second time I got a little bored. i think they could have sliced out like 15, 20 minutes.
01:02:18
Speaker
Probably the easiest, that the easiest part to slice would have been Orlok's castle. um by I love all that stuff, though. I don't know. i Yeah.
01:02:29
Speaker
I've only seen it once in cinema. I'm going to go and watch it again this week. um But, like...
Mixed Reactions & Film's Aesthetic Appeal
01:02:33
Speaker
i mean, I'm just... I'm being picky because, like, whatever. We're, like, we're talking about it on our film. You just you just want to cut that because you love Lilia Rose Depp so much and you don't want to cut anything with her in it. But... Yeah, I want to see her do the most stuff. Um...
01:02:48
Speaker
But yeah, I mean, oh, I did think though, like on his journey, I loved the gypsy scene. I loved, I wish there they that he had done, there had been more with the gypsies, but I thought that was a super, super cool sequence where he comes in and they're dancing and then he follows them into the woods and,
01:03:07
Speaker
I thought all of that was very cool. Whoever that actress is who was on the horse, her body is fucking snatched as fuck. um Can we talk, can we talk a bit about how horny this movie is? yeah I mean, the movie is very horny. I mean, Lily Rose Depp is constantly in a state of like,
01:03:25
Speaker
kind of like, or like semi orgasm, almost the entire movie. And Aaron Taylor Johnson and his wife are clearly like a young couple. There's a lot of references to their fucking, um you know.
01:03:41
Speaker
I have to say like, as well, i like, cause i there's been like some outrage on like Twitter other spaces about like, and like,
01:03:53
Speaker
A lot of the people that I've seen like criticizing the movie have been criticizing how disgusting Nosferatu is, but I thought he was like hot. and I know he's like covered in like open wounds and stuff, but i still i still thought he was pretty hot.
01:04:07
Speaker
I don't know what you thought. Yeah, I mean, he's pretty hot. um He's big. um i They do show his... like It's obviously a prosthetic, but...
01:04:19
Speaker
Show his dick. um I mean, I thought the horniest element, and again, this is just like my like soft spot was Lily Rose Depp's performance. I thought she was like the horniest um kind of element of the whole thing. Cause she's kind of like always in a semi, I mean, she's like,
01:04:37
Speaker
being infiltrated by this demon in her mind. Yeah, for sure. She's like possessed, but she's kind of always in like a semi-seductive state. I mean, even the scene where she like asks to sleep in bed with her like best friend, you know, she's kind of always sort of,
01:04:53
Speaker
um Yeah. Like she's like an erotic presence in the film. And, and obviously like the final act to kill the vampire is, is actually her fucking him. I mean, yeah absolutely literally that's like what, that's like what she does to,
01:05:10
Speaker
keep him in bed long enough that he stays until the sun comes up. I did find, I'm not going to name names, obviously, because I'm not a meanie, but I did find like some people's criticism of the movie was that it was like too much like Dracula. And I'm just like, yeah.
01:05:25
Speaker
And like, it's supposed to be like that. Just, that was just retarded to me. Well, it is, I mean, it is a Dracula ripoff, so it's... it But it's, like yeah, it's literally a Dracula movie. It's fine. Yeah, it's another movie in, like, a long line of, like, Dracula films. And, I mean, i get it. Like, I mean, some of the critiques I, like, that I see, like, I do understand. Like, it obviously is, like, a movie sort of, like, made for...
01:05:51
Speaker
it's like made to be super memeable. It's like, it's, it's like made for like that sort of internet culture. But I mean, like, I'm not going to say a movie is bad because of that, because at this point in like where we're at culturally, like, of course, movies are going to be referential to things that are happening online because that's like, oh yeah, that just a whole. And like I, like, I valued that there was a lot of comic elements in it. Cause I, I was worried that it was going to be like too dry. And,
01:06:21
Speaker
And there are so many like comic elements in this movie, especially with like Willem Dafoe's character and stuff. And I thought all of that stuff was really funny and great. Can't remember what i was saying now, but like, it feels, it knows that it's like funny in places. It doesn't feel like that was not intentional. It feels like that was very intentional. And, and I, I liked all of those like aspects too. I thought they were good. Yeah. I mean, it's a self-aware film.
01:06:48
Speaker
It's, it's aware of what it's doing. It's, um it doesn't like, it just doesn't, I don't know. I mean, that's like, that doesn't make it a bad film to me. No.
01:07:02
Speaker
I feel like on a, like, I feel like on an aesthetic level, it was like, tailor-made for my like tastes like it's everything that I like like it's kind of Victorian it's kind of gothic it's kind of like the that's the cinematography obviously is great which is fine I mean it's it's like it's like I mean that's the thing it's like that I wish people were okay with like it's fine for something to be made like that's purely for entertainment like I don't I mean do I think this is like a great film that will like go down in the history of like the greatest films of all time like no I don't think that
01:07:35
Speaker
Um, but I think it's also totally fine for a film to be just like pleasurable and fun to watch and like fun to consume. And i think that that's like also okay. And like, not every film has to be making like a deep, like political commentary or something to be good. You know, like we did get films like that this year. Like we got Anora, like we got certain films that had these, like, you know, like speaking about like, well,
01:08:02
Speaker
what's going on in society at the moment. But, like, that's not what this movie is, and that's okay, in my opinion. Yeah, and also, like, I get more of a kick out of something like this than, like, The Lighthouse. Like, I would rather watch this, like, ten times than watch The Lighthouse again. i watched it recently again. And, I don't know, it's like it's, like, compelling, and I can see why people like it.
01:08:25
Speaker
But I... I would rather Robert Eggers make things like this than things like that. I mean, I literally had I'm going to be completely honest, and I don't think I've seen The Lighthouse since I saw it in theaters, but I truly had no idea what that movie was about or what was going on. No, I don't either. I've watched it twice now.
01:08:44
Speaker
I've only seen it twice. bre I don't think I'll ever watch it again, and it's fine, whatever. I'm like... But like I like looking at the stills of it. like I like looking at pictures of, like... Robert Pattinson fucking that mermaid and stuff. But like, I just, yeah, I don't really know what it's about.
01:09:00
Speaker
I'm really excited. Cause I know that probably pretty soon, like in the next couple weeks, they're going to, they're, they're going to say what Robert Eggers is doing next. Cause I'm sure he has like a few different things in development.
01:09:12
Speaker
Um, so I'm ready to hear what they are. I'm also excited to compare this movie with, um, Guillermo del Toro's. We'll definitely bring this to you guys. I mean, this is like way later this year, but Guillermo del Toro's Frankenstein with Jacob Elordi is coming out in November.
01:09:27
Speaker
um yeah, I'm ready to I'm ready to compare the two because I do think of like Dracula and Frankenstein as like the, you know, the two greatest horror classics and, i'm Yeah, of course. And I'm curious to see um another sort of incredible director like adapt it for a modern using these sort of like zoomer stars like jacob alordi um so i'm very curious about how that's gonna look and jacob alordi being frankenstein is so funny because he's he's it's crazy i don't know it's funny because people were moaning about lily rose depp being in this movie and having like instagram face but i didn't i didn't like
01:10:09
Speaker
I don't think Instagram face is real anyway, but like... She definitely has it if it is real, but who cares? Like, I mean... She she doesn't look out of place in this movie. Like, her forehead had is huge. It's never been bigger, but it was good.
01:10:21
Speaker
I mean, do I think she like believably looks like a Victorian woman? Not really. but I don't really care. No, I don't carry that. Like, I mean, i she definitely has ah the face of someone who was...
01:10:38
Speaker
like bored into like aristocratic wealth and like the late 20th century in the sense that like, I'm sure she's had a ton of like expensive facial treatments and things like that. But I mean, like who cares? Like, I mean, I don't know. To me, she kind of looks like Robert Pattinson to me as a girl. Like, I don't know if anyone else thinks this, but she's got that kind of like, I don't know, sort of like flat face and the nose is very similar. And I don't know. I love Robert Pattinson. I think he's gorgeous. yeah Have you ever heard her really talk? What is her accent like? Because she's like,
01:11:16
Speaker
I don't think she grew up in America, really. I've never heard her actually talk. I watched that. Actually, I have. I watched... um She did that Hot Wings thing, you know, where they eat the chicken wings? Oh, does she have an marriage does she have like an American She has an American accent. Yeah. She did it with them Nicholas Holt and they had a really cute chemistry. I was just curious how she would talk because like, she's actually, her mom's French and obviously her dad's Johnny Depp. And it seemed like she grew up mostly, yeah mostly in Europe. So I was just curious, like what her, what her, uh, yeah, she, she does have an American accent, but it wasn't like a super heavy one. it was nice. Yeah. Yeah.
01:11:56
Speaker
fine I'm sure she's had a, I like that she's a lesbian too. Is she? I didn't know this. You've never seen her and girlfriend? No. Oh, well, they're very, they're very hot. She has like a butch Latina,
01:12:11
Speaker
like lesbian girlfriend who's like a minor like SoundCloud rapper and they look really hot. Okay. They look like really hot. Yeah. And they've been together for four years or something. Like they're like, they're like a legit like couple, you should look at pictures of them. They're really fun to look at.
01:12:28
Speaker
They have like a really fun, like aesthetic, like the, her girlfriend, girlfriend's always in like i don't even know like how to describe her clothes like yeezy like big like sneakers and shit and then like yeah lily rose deaf is always in like super super feminine showing off her like hot body clothes set i actually i actually have a bit of a soft spot for like dyky lesbians because i generally find they're usually quite based when you get to know them um So yeah, I don't mind her having a Latino dyke for Oliver. But I had no idea that she was a lesbian at all.
01:13:06
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, she's a lesbian. It was funny too, because I was saying, i was talking to a lesbian friend of mine um and I said, ah her her oh, here's here's her what her girlfriend's Wikipedia page. I'll send it to you.
01:13:20
Speaker
0070 shake. Anyway, I'm emailing it to you. But yeah, I said to a lesbian friend of mine, I was like, she kind of like, I could see her being lesbian. and Like I said that I was like, I could that like that. That would be in my friend was like, she is a lesbian.
01:13:38
Speaker
And I was like, oh, it' like i know I was just like kind of her vibe. I could see it. But anyway. Yeah, I'm looking at them right now. They're kind of cute.
01:13:49
Speaker
Yeah, they have like a fun aesthetic together. ah we Before we finish, can I just plug the episode of Here Comes the Backlust that you did with...
01:14:00
Speaker
house on my sweet audrina because i listened to it yesterday and i thought it was really good um ah but the pool house and i did an episode on my sweet audrina it's actually very twink death coded yeah it's really fun i love here comes the backlash uh you should listen to it and vc andrews was a weird ass bitch so if you haven't ever read my if you're a gay guy and you haven't read my sweet audrina you're a ah bpd girl and you haven't read My Sweet Audrina, you should read My Sweet Audrina. Yeah, I feel like she's it's not really a thing in the UK, like V.C. Andrews. So i didn't I wasn't really aware of it, but I'd seen the...
01:14:38
Speaker
I'd seen the awful um Flowers in the Attic movie with Heather Graham. Yeah, there's like a really bad, but I would actually recommend My Sweet Aldrina more than Flowers in the Attic um to people. And it's just, yeah, it's just so fun to read and so campy and insane. so But yeah, if you enjoyed this, obviously you will definitely enjoy that because they kind of go into a true crime tangent. So give it listen to that.
01:15:03
Speaker
All right, twink deathers. We'll see you soon. Bye.