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What D&I Leaders must get right when starting this journey w/ James Thomas
37 Plays2 years ago
This week, for Episode 3/Season 2 of “The 3D Podcast” I sit down with the Certified DEI Executive & Strategic Servant Leader - Alaska Airlines, James Thomas. During this interview James shares great insight into what you must get right as you start your new role as a Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion leader, as well as he will be talking about different steps, and also an amazing campaign that the company he is working for is doing. This is a great episode packed with a ton of gems, so get your notepads ready as we dive deep and “Discuss the Dimensions of Diversity”.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to the 3D Podcast
00:00:05
Speaker
Hey, I'm Cedric Chambers, and I would like to welcome you to another episode of the 3D Podcast, a masterclass where we share with you everything you need to know about how to transform diversity and inclusion in your organization as well as in your community. We're on a mission to amplify the voices of leaders that are making an impact in the world today so that we can have a better tomorrow.
00:00:28
Speaker
Our goal every episode is to keep it simple, honest, and transparent with you by uncovering the truths in diversity and inclusion with the hope of creating behavioral change all while presenting it from a unique perspective. So look, if you're ready, get your notepad out, pour you a drink, and let's dive deep as we discuss the dimensions of diversity.
00:00:59
Speaker
Hello, everyone.
Meet James Thomas
00:01:00
Speaker
Welcome to another episode of the 3D Podcast, where we speak to real practitioners who are making real change in the diversity, equity, and inclusion space. I'm excited for our discussion today because the person I'm speaking to is doing some amazing things in the DE&I space. And as we get into the conversation, you're going to see one of those amazing things that when I saw it for the first time, it literally blew my mind. Look for today's show. I had the pleasure of speaking to James Thomas, the Director of Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion for Alaska Airlines.
00:01:26
Speaker
James has over 20 years of leadership experience, with 13 of those years being in the DE&I space across various industries from fashion to wine to, of course, airlines. James has also worked with many prominent brands, including Nordstrom's, Starbucks, and most recently, style Michelle Wines. So get your notepads ready because we are about to dive deep as we discuss the dimensions of diversity.
00:01:48
Speaker
So James, look, thanks for providing that background of your career and your journey. And as we think about business and we think about DE&I, it's so important to have that business experience, right? Because as we look holistically at the organization, we look at how diversity and inclusion works cross-functionally. That is important for a practitioner. And so when you think about being in those roles,
00:02:11
Speaker
What were the two or three things that you feel really helped you and gave you that lens and that view and how to approach your diversity and inclusion roles?
Strategies for Effective DE&I
00:02:20
Speaker
Yeah. For one, it gave me credibility, Cedric. When I'm talking with leaders in the business and I'm trying to explain this topic around DEI and why it's important, it's really helped me be able to craft my message to be specific to saying what I need to say and tying it to the things that are going to help me bring along business leaders.
00:02:40
Speaker
And then it just gave me some perspective. I mean, I remember being at Nordstrom when I would be sitting in meetings with people who were in corporate and they come up with all of these different ideas and things that they wanted to do. And I remember pushing back on people to say, in theory, that sounds great, but in practical application, that's never going to work because this is what it looks like out there in the business and in the field. And I've done this every day and I know the challenges that come with trying to do this every day.
00:03:10
Speaker
We need to think about how is this going to look actually out in the business and practical application, and that's not going to work. And so it helped me have conversations with leaders that, again, I don't think I would have been able to have if I hadn't have had that experience out in the business where I could say, I like this piece. I don't like this piece. I think this will work. That won't work. Or we need to do this differently if we want to get this particular outcome.
00:03:35
Speaker
I love it. I love it. I love that experience and being able to just have that as a, in your toolkit as you move forward. And so look, knowing that we're focusing today on diversity and inclusion and looking at the journey, I want to start off before we kind of dig into it with, you know, what are some of those common mistakes that you see leaders make as they begin this work when it comes to diversity and inclusion?
00:04:00
Speaker
Yeah, one of the one of the biggest things I always see is what I call lack of strategy, all passion. Right. And so, you know, I think that sometimes people who are practitioners think that just because I'm passionate about this work, it means I can do this work. But what I always tell people is there's an art and a science to doing this.
00:04:19
Speaker
And so there's a strategic component, there's a change management piece that has to be done to move this work forward. There's the peeling back the onion and all that work that's that one to two levels beneath that you have to do to actually change systemic things that are happening in the organization that are preventing that movement and growth. And so I think that one of the things that people do
00:04:42
Speaker
in this space very frequently is they don't align, they don't come up with a strategy that really aligns to the business and the organization that they can articulate to leaders that really shows and explains the what and the why and what success looks like in the outcomes. And they drive it around passion, which, again, passion is great, but you've got to have that strategic approach. And if you can have passion while you're doing that, well, then you got the best of both worlds, but you can't have just one or the other.
00:05:12
Speaker
The second thing I was going to say is that sometimes I think that this work gets siloed. And when I say siloed, it gets managed like a project. And so DEI is not a project. I always tell people, we do leadership development. We do talent development. We do succession planning. We don't do DEI education or DEI succession planning.
00:05:40
Speaker
How do we marry the two things together so that it just becomes an inherent part of what we do each and every day? And sometimes I think practitioners, they do this work in a silo and they don't really bring along cross-functional stakeholders in the work that they're trying to do so that again, they can tell this bigger, more holistic story around what we're trying to do and how we're embedding it throughout the business.
00:06:04
Speaker
And I think that leads perfectly right into the next question. So I'll wait to comment on this. But in order to move the needle forward and really create lasting impact within the organization, what must DNI functions get right out of the gate when they're starting down this journey?
Common DE&I Challenges
00:06:20
Speaker
I think you gotta learn how to prioritize too and not boil the ocean. And I'll be honest, I think I was guilty of this when I first started in this space is again, if you lack kind of that strategic direction and you've got all passion, you wanna say yes to everything. You wanna be all things to all people and you find yourself kind of doing a little bit of this, little bit of that, little bit of that, little bit of that, but then you're not really making kind of
00:06:49
Speaker
sustained systemic movement. And so what I tell people is focus on one to two things that are need to have necessary things and then like work the hell out of that. Do all you can to be really successful at that. And then that nice to have stuff, you know, down the road, it's like, how do you prioritize that stuff so that maybe that stuff you get to, but it's not going to be the stuff that are going to be the foundational things that you need to do. So like for me,
00:07:18
Speaker
it might be, we gotta get our data right. Because if I don't get the data right and I don't understand what we're looking at and where the opportunities and gaps are, I can't do anything else. And so how do I prioritize these foundational one or two things, do those things really well, and then I can move on to other things. And sometimes that means saying no to people because in my list of priorities, that doesn't line up with the foundational first things that I need to make sure that I'm doing.
00:07:48
Speaker
Yeah. So understanding, you know, the journey and understanding kind of leader, a leader coming into the organization, they're new. And when they went through the interview process, everything sounded great. The leaders of the organization were like, look, this is the direction we're trying to go. This is what we try, we're trying to do. And we want you to come in and help lead this.
00:08:08
Speaker
But then you get into the organization and you find out that one, you know, there's things that the leadership team wants you to do that may fall outside of that process and that prioritization that you have in place. And then there's also this kind of thought that, hey, the organization might not be ready for this work. Like what do you do as a DNI leader coming into that type of situation as you're starting down this journey?
Assessing Organizational Readiness
00:08:32
Speaker
You know, that's an interesting question too, because I've honestly been in that space too. I think this is again why you have to make sure that you have a strategic approach and that you're tying it to the outcomes that the organization says that they want to do. But I think at some point it's up to the practitioner to really understand and decide whether or not that's work that they're going to be able to do.
00:08:57
Speaker
feel like I've promised one thing and I come into an organization. Based off of what I hear, I'm going to try to put together a strategy that aligns to helping us get there and then clearly articulate from a resources standpoint, whether that's budgeting people, primary foundational things that we need to do, I'm going to communicate all those things and I'm going to work to get leadership by on. But at a certain point, I think that if you discover that those things aren't happening,
00:09:25
Speaker
It's gonna be a personal decision where you're gonna have to understand like, okay, am I gonna be able to do this work in the way that it needs to happen to move it forward? Or to your point, is the organization not ready? And I need to personally make a different decision because the organization is unwilling.
00:09:42
Speaker
to take the steps that are gonna get there. Because if you don't have buy-in and you don't have that support from the leadership and from the organization, the people that you need to, it doesn't matter how hard as a practitioner you push, you're not gonna go anywhere. And so at some point, it's like the rubber is gonna meet the road and you have to understand that, okay, I call it like, I don't know how to, which is okay, if I don't know how to, I can teach you that. Like I can help you as an organization understand what do we need to do to get there?
00:10:09
Speaker
if you don't want to, well, that's a whole different conversation. And that's at some point something I need to make a personal decision around, you know, what's my deal breaker and how much is, you know, what is acceptable for me to continue to stay in a role where people are unwilling to move forward. And I think as practitioners, you know, we have to be able to make that choice and decision at some point if we find that organizations aren't ready to take the necessary steps to move forward. Yeah. Yeah. I like that the how to and the want to.
00:10:39
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know how to or I don't want to. Because again, those are two totally different conversations. I can teach you how. But if you don't want to, well, then that's a whole different conversation that we need to talk about. Yeah. So thinking about that for a second, the organization wants to, but you may have some key leaders that don't want to.
00:11:02
Speaker
How are you approaching that situation like, you know, hey, I'm a leader, I don't want to, like, how are we approaching this? You know, I think for leaders that don't want to, I always say I want to seek to understand. Tell me more around why you don't want to. Help me understand, because maybe it's a miseducation around, okay, there's a perception about something or there's something you don't understand that's impacting, you know, why you feel like you don't want to.
00:11:28
Speaker
And so I want to understand if that's something that I can help you push through and I can educate you in a different way so that eventually we can get to I want to. Or again, it could be, I just don't want to because I don't believe in it and I don't want to because of my upbringing or whatever my personal bias is. Again, I think those are two totally different conversations. And that's where having that leadership support, your executive team support,
00:11:56
Speaker
your CEO support is really going to come into play because with leaders like that, those leaders can in essence be toxic to the organization and being able to move the subject forward if they're in a place where they're unwilling to think differently about this subject. So I always first want to seek to understand because
00:12:16
Speaker
we all are at different stages of learning in our journey. And I don't want to assume that you are in the place that I'm in. And so in order to do that, I want to seek to understand, hey, is this just a disconnect of maybe there's something you don't know? Let me teach you, let me help you, let me explain it a different way and we can get there. Or is it you just don't want to get there? Again, it's the I don't know how to or the I don't want to.
00:12:40
Speaker
Yeah, I like that understanding which conversation to have. And I know that just from doing this work, this can take an emotional toll on leaders. When you have the practical and the business side of it and the passion right to do this work, and you see things just aren't moving the direction that you want to move it into, or you see leaders not approaching the way you think they should, I know sometimes it could be you want to lead with the emotions and the conversations. And then next thing you know, things are heated, and you really haven't truly understood from that leader's perspective
00:13:10
Speaker
how they were seeing things, where were they on that journey, and what you could have done, you know, to move them along as we go down this journey. And so thanks for sharing that. And so, you know, I want to take kind of a turn here when we think about representation, right? In a lot of organizations, right? You know, I go to pages on company websites,
00:13:29
Speaker
We look at leadership teams and they don't look like us. They don't look like me. I'm trying to understand where are those people within your organization? How far deep do I need to go? And knowing that those pages don't go those levels down into the organization, I truly can't find those folks. And so when we think about representation, and not to assume this right here, but when we think about representation, why does that matter?
The Importance of Representation
00:13:54
Speaker
when it comes to organizations? Why does representation matter when we think about leadership, when we think about the representation within your organization? Representation, Cedric, is so important because I think in many ways it's a reflection of what you're going to be able to do at that organization. I always tell people when you're looking at a company or an organization, and I've done this in the past too, I go and look at what their leadership team looks like. I go and look at what their board of directors looks like.
00:14:23
Speaker
I go and see if they've got anything out there in terms of DNI on their website. And what are they saying in terms of what they're committing to for people that look like me? And then when I look at their leadership, what does that look like? Because if I don't see people
00:14:39
Speaker
in the organization that look like me, if I don't see anything that you're talking about that's specific to me, in some ways it can be indicative of what would a career be like at your organization? Am I gonna have an opportunity to grow and be in a role if I don't see anybody that looks like me? And you can say it on your website, you can say it in your words, but if I'm not actually seeing it,
00:15:07
Speaker
then that also tells me, well, then how serious are we actually about doing it? I've actually told people who are looking at companies for jobs, if you go through those things and you don't see that, you should be concerned. You should ask more questions. Because again, that means when you get there, what is that going to look like for you and your development? So representation is important because
00:15:33
Speaker
It not only helps people who are our potential employees coming into your organization, but it also helps me know whether or not you're actually serious about what you're saying or whether it's just words on a piece of paper. Yeah.
00:15:43
Speaker
Yeah, like not even, if I can't see myself, then how can I see myself, right? Attaining those roles and those opportunities, especially if that's in my career path, right? It automatically makes me think that it's not possible if I can't see it at the top and then two levels down, I'm still not seeing it or a spotty. We're seeing very few, right? That already kind of gets me into that mindset that this might not be the place where I can grow my career.
00:16:08
Speaker
And then you have a lot of organization that when they change leadership roles and things, they just do the musical chairs inside the organization and not really bringing in talent from outside. So I think that's important when it comes to representation, right? And can I see myself actually see myself in those roles that I'm looking to go after?
00:16:25
Speaker
I'll tell you a quick story, Cedric. When I was a district manager at Starbucks, I was the only Black male DM in my region. And I was visiting stores with one of my counterparts in his district. And we walked into a store where the store manager was a Black female. And we spent some time with her. After that meet at some point down the road, that store manager actually ended up working in my district. She was a store manager in my district. And we had this conversation where she said, you know, James,
00:16:56
Speaker
until I saw you walk through those doors, I never thought that I could be a DM because I had never seen anybody that looked like you. But she was like, the moment you walked through that door, I thought, okay, I can actually do this, you know, because she had talked about wanting to be a DM, but it wasn't until she saw me walk through that door as a DM, somebody that looked like her, it really connected for her that this is something that I could do. That again, was that proof to me that
00:17:26
Speaker
people need to see people that look like them sometimes to know that it's possible. And we talk about that as a conversation all the time about how important that moment was and how that changed the trajectory for her in terms of believing that that was something that was possible for her.
00:17:44
Speaker
No, I love that because it makes me think back to even when I started my career because my undergrad was really focused in supply chain and operations management. And I ended up going to an event one time where I met someone in HR, black man. And we had a conversation. We were talking, you know, he was talking about the role, what he does, his career and all this other stuff. And similar, a similar situation happened where I was like, man,
00:18:08
Speaker
I see a black male in a senior role in a large organization right up below the VP for HR. And it was something that really changed the way I looked at the function of field and what could be possible because I saw him in that role. And he's leading another large organization right now, but it was the visual piece to where it was like, man, this is something different, right? I always think about coming from Georgia, from the South and going to, you know, I've lived in Ohio and Wisconsin and Boston.
00:18:38
Speaker
sometimes you just got to be exposed and you got to see different things and you got to understand like Things are a little bit different from what's around you But when you can see things it allows you to really craft that vision So when you see someone that looks like you it allows you to say okay, it's possible now. How do I get there? What do I need to do to make this happen? Like I got the motivation to move there So so thanks for sharing that and so that is what I would call an alley-oop
Alaska Airlines' DE&I Goals
00:19:02
Speaker
here
00:19:02
Speaker
because I'm excited about this next piece here, but the commitment is big at Alaska Airlines and you've had the opportunity to work on a part of something that's huge, right? That's probably never been done, at least not to my knowledge. So I would love for you to kind of dive into and explain the commitment that Alaska Airline has taken as it relates to representation, as it relates to equity and inclusion.
00:19:28
Speaker
Yeah. So, and this is kind of two parts, you know, Cedric. Earlier this year, we made a public commitment in terms of kind of some DEI goals that we wanted to strive to achieve in 2025. And it's really broken up into three parts. So the first is representation. So we want to make sure that our leadership is reflective of our frontline employees and that matches and that there's equity there.
00:19:51
Speaker
Secondly, we want to make sure that we have a culture that's inclusive, that's welcoming of people, where people feel safe, they feel a sense of belonging. And then thirdly, we want to make sure that from a public leadership standpoint, we're using our brand and our voice to weigh in on topics that are important to our employees, to our guests, and to our communities. And so how do we make sure that we're doing that? But then also how do we create career opportunities for 175,000 young people?
00:20:21
Speaker
So as part of that commitment, one of the things that we introduced last month was our commitment plane. And so for anybody that hasn't seen this plane, it's a plane that will fly throughout Alaska's network. And it has black and brown faces painted on the side of it. And this journey, Cedric, started about a year ago. So it started a year ago with everything that was happening last summer.
00:20:45
Speaker
we were really being challenged by our Black Employee Resource Group to really think about what we could do as an organization to really show our commitment to racial equity. And through that, we really also thought about our partnership with UNCF. And they were also really challenging us to think about how could we take our commitment to educational equity also to new heights. The great thing is that as an airline, one of our best assets is that we have airplanes.
00:21:12
Speaker
And so we decided with that feedback that we were really going to really kind of use our plane as almost like a public billboard to our commitment to racial equity and educational equity. And so we painted this plane with black and brown faces on the side of it. And we put a couple of quotes on there. So we have a quote from Martin Luther King Jr. And then we have a quote from Nelson Mandela. But really it's meant to just show our commitment to racial equity, to bring awareness,
00:21:39
Speaker
to racial equity but then also our partnership and relationship with UNCF which we've been partners with them for over 15 years and we introduced this plane to the general public and like you said you know I haven't seen anything else out there where a company has really made this kind of
00:21:56
Speaker
bold, taking this bold initiative to really kind of put something out there to say, hey, this is that important to us that we want to make sure that people know. And we're going to paint one of our planes to really help show our commitment to this. Now, again, this is just one piece of it. It's just this is just a plane. But our commitment goes, you know, deeper than just having a plane. But this is a big this is a big step for us. And we hope that it brings some awareness to something that's really important. Man.
00:22:25
Speaker
Look, this is huge. This is a humongous step. Look, just to think about...
00:22:32
Speaker
you know, using one what you have, right, planes, and then also having the courage being bold and thinking outside of the box as far as not only how do we, you know, do work in programs inside of the organization, but then how do we make sure that we stake our commitment externally? And doing that with a plan, I'm telling you, it is one of,
00:22:59
Speaker
the most magnificent things I've seen because it goes from airport to airport where thousands among thousands of people will see a plane pull up that is completely different than the white planes who typically pull up into that airport. They're going to see the faces, they're going to read the quotes, and they're going to immediately
00:23:21
Speaker
start to view and see things differently, right, than what's been shown in this industry before. So I think that being able to actually go in and do something that look, and my thought process here is that look, this is something to where y'all
00:23:36
Speaker
I can't just take this plane out of service tomorrow painting white, put it back out there and say, look, go for it, right? This is something that's there to stay right while it's in service. And so, man, this is amazing, you know, what you all are doing. And I commend you all for taking that step and doing something that, like you said, as we know, hasn't been done up until this point.
00:23:56
Speaker
Well, this plane is going to be in service for us for 10 years. And so for 10 years, this plane is going to fly throughout our network. And again, when we talk about representation, my hope, just even on a personal level, is that every black and brown person that sees that plane sees themselves in a different light and is inspired by what they see. And hopefully, it connects them also to our brand. And in some way, they see themselves
00:24:26
Speaker
being a part of Alaska because we are a company that they feel sees them and recognizes them and sees them for who they are. Again, I want to make sure I say that the plane is one piece of it and there's more things that we have to do. But I also think it's a big step in terms of
00:24:45
Speaker
publicly putting our commitment out there, what I call putting your money where your mouth is. And so this is part of that commitment that we're trying to show people that this is something we're serious about. And it's not something that we're going to stop talking about anytime soon.
00:24:57
Speaker
Yeah. No, Alaska Airlines had definitely put the money where their mouth
Agility in DE&I Work
00:25:02
Speaker
is. And so look, to sum up this discussion, right? As we come to the end here, you know, we've talked about quite a few things here. And so can you just help with like one or two or three things or two or three critical actions that DNI practitioners can take today to really reimagine the way that they approach DNI
00:25:21
Speaker
So that one we can get that impact that we're looking for but then two so that we can create programs that are sustainable and that will last as You know, we grow and as we change and that society changes these programs will be foundational So what are two to three actions that practitioners can take? Yeah, I one of them Cedric is I think that
00:25:44
Speaker
I think you always have to be agile doing this work. I think, you know, if you think about where this work was, you know, even just a year ago, before George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, all of that, Ahmaud Arbery, if you think about where this work was before all of that happened, you know, then go back two, three years ago, the way this work looks today is totally different.
00:26:07
Speaker
And I say that because this work is constantly changing and there's no one size fits all approach to this work. And one of the things that I found even having done this work for a minute is I always have to be open to reimagining how this work is done and learning something new and doing it different.
00:26:25
Speaker
So even though I've done this work for a while, you know, I always tell people, I'm not married to, it has to be done this way. And what else can I continue to think about to do it differently? Because the work is changing and as the work is changing, so too do I have to change how I do the work. And so I think when you come into organizations,
00:26:44
Speaker
Don't just assume that just because you have been doing it this way or just because you think that this is the way it should be done, that it doesn't mean that you can't reimagine it and do it differently. And every organization is at a different stage in their journey.
00:26:59
Speaker
And you have to really tailor it to make sure that you're building an approach that works for your organization. I mean, out of the four organizations that I've worked in, each one has been uniquely different in its own way. And so I think every organization presents a new opportunity to do this work differently.
00:27:15
Speaker
Secondly, again, I go back to you can't manage this work like a program or a project. Sustainable systemic change means you have to embed this work throughout the business. And sometimes that means you have to help leaders and people understand what that looks like. You have to teach them how to fish, so to speak, and what this looks like. And that's not always easy. It's going to take time. It's a journey.
00:27:42
Speaker
But if you continue to manage it like a project, you're going to find yourself sometimes oftentimes stuck in one place and not able to move it forward.
00:27:51
Speaker
I couldn't have said it better. Look, this has been great. Look, to cap off this discussion, this is one of my favorite parts here. Look, I believe that as we move through our careers, as we move through life, we have interactions with people. And the way that we approach those interactions, I feel, have to be intentional. We have to leave a legacy, I would say, in all of those interactions that we engage in, that we have. And so what I would like for you is in 25 words or less,
Leadership Legacy Vision
00:28:18
Speaker
Could you tell us what is your leadership legacy statement? And when we think about this, like if someone meets you one time and they meet you 10 time, like what, if I go ask somebody about James, what will they say about you? You know, Cedric, I want to be known as a person that gets things done, not just a person that focuses on activities, but I also want people to feel good about how I brought them along in the journey.
00:28:46
Speaker
That's awesome. I want to make sure that I get things done and I want people to feel good about how I brought them along in the journey. That's what I hope people can always say about me is that, you know, one thing I can say about James is, you know, he always got things done and he did a really great job of trying to make sure that everybody felt a part of what he was trying to do. If I can do that on some small measure, I think then I've made
00:29:11
Speaker
I will have hopefully made an impact. That's a lasting impact that people can look back and say, okay, he left it better than he found it. No. Awesome. Look, I love it. I love it. I love it. Well, look, this has been an amazing conversation before we go. Do you have any shout outs, any parting words? And then also where can people find you to connect with
Connect with Cedric and James
00:29:29
Speaker
you?
00:29:29
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know that I have too many shout outs, but I love connecting with other people who are passionate about this work. So, you know, I'm on LinkedIn. You can find me under James Thomas, you know, connect with me. I think at the end of the day, we're all trying to move this work forward. And so we are stronger together. So I always invite people to connect with me on LinkedIn. You can also find me on Twitter at J2 underscore Thomas. And as I'm going through this journey, you know, my hope is to continue to put stuff out there that inspires other people and really shows the work that we're doing here at Alaska Airlines.
00:29:59
Speaker
That's awesome. Do you really tweet? I do tweet. I need to tweet more. I need to tweet more. I need to tweet more, but I do tweet some and I need to tweet more and I need to continue to build a community of people. So there you go. Now we don't want to send them to Twitter and they ain't going to hear from you until 2022 now.
00:30:18
Speaker
Nah, look, this is awesome. Well, look, that does it for us. Thanks, everyone, for joining us on another episode of the 3D Podcast. This has been Cedric, and you've been listening to James Thomas, director of diversity, equity, and inclusion at Alaska Airlines.
00:30:33
Speaker
Awesome, well that does it for us. Thank you for joining us on another episode of The 3D Podcast. If you would like to connect on social media, follow me on Instagram, Twitter, or Facebook, at Cedric and Powers. And if you have any questions you'd like me to read or answer on the show, or just wanna know more about my thoughts around diversity and inclusion, entrepreneurship, or just overall business, you can text me, yes, I said text me, at 770-285-0404.
00:31:01
Speaker
You'll receive content straight to your phone on a regular basis and you can message back and forth. Not a bot or an assistant. All responses come directly from me. But look, this has been a great episode. Until next week, this has been Cedric Chambers and you've been listening to the 3D Podcast. We out.