Transcript
Speaker: Hey, hey, you're listening to the Let's Heal Already podcast for the sometimes impatient, sometimes cranky person doing some healing.
Speaker: And I'm your host, JR. I'm an author, actor and speaker from Far Rockaway, New York.
Speaker: And on this podcast, you'll hear me cover ground on a variety of topics from mental wellness and emotional literacy to blackness, to masculinity and femininity, to ending misogyny and patriarchy, to last but not least, bisexuality and ending sexual shame.
Speaker: Hey y'all, and we're back with the Let's Heal Already podcast.
Speaker: And if you can't tell by the title already, I'm probably going to get into some things in this episode that...
Speaker: you know, you know, you know, could ruffle some feathers is what I will say.
Speaker: There is this clip of Taraji P. Henson floating around the interwebs, going viral, making its rounds.
Speaker: And lots of people are talking about a lot of different things concerning this clip.
Speaker: And I've seen some amazing input from many of the people I follow and many people I do not follow.
Speaker: And I think a lot of people have said some really brilliant things, so I will try not to repeat the things that I've heard them say and kind of take a different approach or have a different angle on this conversation than I've seen discussed, at least on my side of the Internet.
Speaker: So the clip basically Taraji P. Henson is being interviewed by Gayle King on Sirius XM radio.
Speaker: And the reason for the interview is because, you know, the new color or the remake of the color purple film is happening.
Speaker: And so they're on their press run.
Speaker: They're on their press tour.
Speaker: She's with Daniel Brooks and she's with her director as well of the film.
Speaker: And yeah, it was just this sort of earnest moment, this honest moment that happened after Gayle King asked Taraji P. Henson a question.
Speaker: And so I'm gonna play the audio so that you all opt to speed on what I'm talking about.
Speaker: And I heard on the street, Taraji, you had the audacity to say, you're thinking about getting, stopping acting.
Speaker: We said, stop talking.
Speaker: Are you thinking about it?
Speaker: I'm just tired of working so hard, being gracious at what I do, getting paid a fraction of the cost.
Speaker: I'm tired of hearing my sisters say the same thing over and over.
Speaker: you get tired.
Speaker: I hear people go, you work a lot.
Speaker: Well, have to.
Speaker: The math ain't mathin'.
Speaker: And when you start working a lot, you know, you have a team.
Speaker: Big bills come with what we do.
Speaker: We don't do this alone.
Speaker: The fact that we're up here, there's a whole entire team behind us.
Speaker: They have to get paid.
Speaker: So when you hear someone saying, oh, such and such made $10 million.
Speaker: No, that didn't make it to their account.
Speaker: Know that off the top, Uncle Sam is getting 50%.
Speaker: Okay?
Speaker: So do the math.
Speaker: Now we have 5 million.
Speaker: Your team is getting 30% or whatever your team is off of what you grossed.
Speaker: Not after what Uncle Sam took.
Speaker: Now do the math.
Speaker: So I just, I'm only human and it seems every time I do something and I break another glass ceiling, when it's time to renegotiate, I'm at the bottom again like I never did what I just did and I'm just tired.
Speaker: I'm tired.
Speaker: I'm tired.
Speaker: I get that.
Speaker: It wears on you, you know?
Speaker: Because what does that mean?
Speaker: What is that telling me?
Speaker: What is it telling me?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And what does it tell me?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know?
Speaker: And if I can't fight for them coming up behind me, then what the fuck am I doing?
Speaker: I'm sorry.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Don't apologize.
Speaker: Don't apologize.
Speaker: I think it's an important message for people to hear because we see the lights, camera, actions.
Speaker: And then they tell me we don't translate overseas.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I'm tired of hearing that my entire career.
Speaker: 20 plus years in the game and I hear the same thing and I see what you do for another production and when it's time for us to go to bed, you don't have any money.
Speaker: They play in your face.
Speaker: And I'm just supposed to smile and grin and bear it and just keep like enough is enough.
Speaker: That's why I have other things.
Speaker: I have my TPH brand.
Speaker: I have my mental wellness.
Speaker: I have other things because this industry, if you let it, it'll steal your soul.
Speaker: But I refuse to let that happen.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Okay, so that was the clip that I wanted to play.
Speaker: So it's about a two minute clip and it goes on much longer like there's a longer interview that this comes from.
Speaker: But this is the clip that has gone viral and has people talking.
Speaker: And I mean, obviously, when you just listen to what she's saying, really what she's talking about is being exploited.
Speaker: Really what she's talking about is misogynoir, which means the combination of facing misogyny and also experiencing racism creates a new experience that is greater than what misogyny on its own would be.
Speaker: or racism on its own would be, it creates a new experience.
Speaker: So it's not like sort of stacking oppression on top of each other, right?
Speaker: It's more of you're at these various intersections of oppression.
Speaker: So it's not like stackable identities and it gets you like a negative score.
Speaker: It's more of you are at the intersection of various places or accesses of oppression.
Speaker: Now, she's talking about workers' rights, right?
Speaker: She's talking about capitalism.
Speaker: Taraji P. Henson is a 53-year-old actress who has been in the industry for over 20 years.
Speaker: She's been in the industry straight out of college.
Speaker: She went to college for this.
Speaker: And she is having similar dilemmas.
Speaker: that I am having as an actor.
Speaker: I am 34 years old.
Speaker: I went to school for acting, for theater, and specifically, like, my concentration was acting.
Speaker: While I was in undergrad, I was in a feature film.
Speaker: So I would go back on the weekends because I went to school like away from home.
Speaker: And so I would come back into New York City and film in Brooklyn and then go back during during, you know, the end of the weekend.
Speaker: And I was doing that and I was auditioning for things.
Speaker: And right out of college, I like started booking things and booking, you know, theater things and
Speaker: all kinds of stuff and i my entire life has been structured to support acting really and over the last how many years has it been almost 15 years yeah so
Speaker: I've been doing this for a long time and I am not where Taraji P. Henson is in terms of her career.
Speaker: And yet we are still experiencing very similar feelings.
Speaker: We have very similar experiences of feeling exploited.
Speaker: We both have made this the center of our lives in a lot of ways, at least like career, career wise.
Speaker: And
Speaker: we are both being exploited.
Speaker: Now, let's zoom out a little bit, right?
Speaker: You know, 2023 is probably going to go down in history as, you know, one of the largest workers' rights movements in American history where so many people went on strike.
Speaker: You know, SAG-AFTRA and WGA, the Writers Guild Association, they were in a very long strike, you know, with the executives over...
Speaker: contracts over correct pay and you know things are not actually fully resolved with that uh just to give you all a heads up and uh things are looking quite abysmal actually um but i don't want to necessarily go down that road uh to talk about this today right but the reason why i'm saying this is because yeah exploitation capitalism
Speaker: No good.
Speaker: It requires exploitation.
Speaker: Capitalism requires somebody's labor to be exploited for a very, very, very few years.
Speaker: to reap the benefits capitalism destroys the environment capitalism destroys community and people's energy for community even though we are an attachment seeking species and we thrive when connections are healthy in our lives right
Speaker: capitalism requires a a boom and a bust sort of cycle and model uh so in addition to labor labor rights movements across the country we've also seen recessions that have have not quite like the news and and a lot of media is like
Speaker: You're not really in a recession.
Speaker: You're not.
Speaker: I mean, yeah, you're broke as hell.
Speaker: And the economy is terrible.
Speaker: And there's a housing crisis and increase of homelessness and decrease of wages and.
Speaker: But you're not in a recession per se, like not until people's houses start getting foreclosed or not until, you know, we are kind of in this space, this weird space of like, oh, this feels like a recession.
Speaker: Everything at the grocery store is a lot more expensive.
Speaker: Why do eggs cost $7 or $12 when eggs used to cost $2?
Speaker: Hmm, this is interesting.
Speaker: But it's like, oh, no, you're this is not that you guys, you guys are being dramatic.
Speaker: You guys are being soft.
Speaker: This is not a recession.
Speaker: Don't even don't even say the R word.
Speaker: Don't even say that word.
Speaker: And.
Speaker: This is something that I'm hearing across industries, right?
Speaker: I've heard so many people say, well, if it's so bad, why don't you just leave it?
Speaker: Well, I think that it's far more complicated than that.
Speaker: But even if, you know, let's say we take that advice, leave it and go where?
Speaker: I'm still black and queer.
Speaker: We are still in a economic decline.
Speaker: There's tons of exploitation that happens in various industries that
Speaker: Can you tell me an industry for me to go to where I will not be exploited for my labor?
Speaker: Can you tell me an industry where I will not face some sort of macro or microaggression or
Speaker: some form of human rights violation.
Speaker: You point me, point me to that place.
Speaker: No, I'm actually kind of serious though.
Speaker: Like I need, I need more, um, ideas.
Speaker: I've been writing a list of other careers and things like that to consider.
Speaker: and it's not going so well i mean i have a couple things written down and i have a couple of like work from home sort of options written down as well but no uh please send those in um yeah please for real i actually really mean that yeah so there's all of this stuff right and
Speaker: As I've been saying this entire season, identity, identity, identity, and this piece of identifying as an actor for so long, identifying with showbiz for so long, and going a couple layers deeper and realizing what that really means.
Speaker: meant to me and what that was really about and you know doing some of the work to kind of get away from you know some of that and figure out other ways where I can feel like oh no I'm whole and I'm good and like you know things like that and that's been wonderful right that's been wonderful that's been great right but
Speaker: it's like back to circle, back to square one.
Speaker: What industries exactly would you say, I'm not going to be exploited for my labor?
Speaker: And at least with acting, I'm at least already passionate about it, already good at it.
Speaker: I already know how it sort of like, like what it does for me and
Speaker: You know what I mean?
Speaker: So it's like this, this not quite catch 22, but kind of, it kind of feels like that.
Speaker: It's like, okay, well, if not this, then what?
Speaker: You know, I think I also needed to really talk about how.
Speaker: Capitalism is alienating.
Speaker: I've already spoke about how it's the antithesis of community, which we need as human beings.
Speaker: It is literally anti-human.
Speaker: You know, capitalism really is.
Speaker: It's unstable.
Speaker: it's unsustainable right it it's horrible for the environment it creates so much economic inequality which then creates crime as we know it right and we could definitely get into what is crime and who gets called a criminal what gets called a criminal what kind of
Speaker: crimes are seen as really bad or worse and blue collar crime and white collar crime and who's more likely to be actually caught when they do crime air quotes crime right because I know that at least in New York and I think it is for the same in a lot of states things like loitering were made illegal um specifically because of black people
Speaker: But yeah, loitering, like that just means standing outside and not spending money, standing outside in one spot, standing outside in one place or standing somewhere or being in a neighborhood essentially where the people in the neighborhood or the police feel like you don't belong.
Speaker: Oh, you're loitering.
Speaker: That's illegal.
Speaker: We can arrest you.
Speaker: That's been made.
Speaker: That's that's that has been illegal, like for a very long time.
Speaker: And there are so many other laws and awful things that I will not regurgitate right now.
Speaker: But.
Speaker: that is that's that's that's quite that's quite alarming to me you know it creates and uh like it creates this idea right that people and our labor but more so us as human beings are commodities right it commodifies us it turns us into oh your identity you are an actor that is your identity and not just your identity like you
Speaker: Not just like, oh, this is just what you do or this is what you studied or what you're good at.
Speaker: No, this is who you are.
Speaker: You are a package.
Speaker: You are a product.
Speaker: You are an item.
Speaker: And, you know, a couple of episodes ago when I had DJ Dimple on and I was talking about the ways I was kind of shocked to see how the like with social media, you know, over the last more than decade.
Speaker: I was kind of surprised because what I saw happen is as an actor, like I saw how like how showbiz could be, you know, it commodifies you.
Speaker: It commodifies your image and your voice and your likeness and all the things that you're doing and everything.
Speaker: I recognized that as a job though.
Speaker: And I turn on and I turn off.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And then I started to see how social media was going and then, you know, influencers and, and even outside of influencers, just how social humans are.
Speaker: I was like, wow, like it has left just the showbiz is left just acting or being a musician, whatever.
Speaker: And now it's just in day-to-day life.
Speaker: Now everyone is now like a commodity online and on their socials, not just for their job, not just influencers, not just models, but everyday people.
Speaker: Like, wow.
Speaker: And I think that was like very like shocking.
Speaker: I didn't, I didn't really predict that that was going to happen.
Speaker: And I was like, wow, like y'all are kind of like me.
Speaker: Do y'all know that y'all acting?
Speaker: Do y'all recognize that?
Speaker: Like, like with the pictures and the videos and what you post and what you don't post.
Speaker: And the camera's on and the camera's off.
Speaker: Do y'all know that?
Speaker: Do y'all recognize like, oh, y'all are acting.
Speaker: Like, that's what I do.
Speaker: Like, y'all are doing what I do.
Speaker: Y'all are actors now.
Speaker: And I think that it has been really trippy to watch that happen over the years, over the decades.
Speaker: And
Speaker: In addition to all of that, capitalism, you know, is anti-democratic and it leads to human rights violations, as I've said before, and it also bolsters
Speaker: imperialism and expansion of war and, you know, commodity, commodifies natural resources.
Speaker: And so there's a finite amount.
Speaker: And so you have to go get more from somewhere.
Speaker: You have to go somewhere where there might be people living and you have to get it from them somehow, some way.
Speaker: And, you know, I think that this moment with Taraji P. Henson that's happening and in the larger sort of conversation of labor movements and what we need as a human species, what we need on our planet to continue to survive.
Speaker: We're not even talking about thrive yet, right?
Speaker: Which is really sad.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: is immediate an immediate end to capitalism immediately it needs to stop yesterday so i now wanted to shift into the next part of the episode and the next part of the episode is one that i have not seen anyone talk about and i'm really happy to talk about this stuff uh i feel like it's the perfect intersection of
Speaker: all of the things that I do.
Speaker: It's nice to be able to talk about the showbiz and the acting industry a little bit and my experience with it.
Speaker: And also talk about these mental wellness topics too, right?
Speaker: It's like, it's like, cool.
Speaker: This is like my world.
Speaker: This is my thing.
Speaker: Basically, I wanted to talk about toxic positivity.
Speaker: Now, if you're a real one, you already heard me talk about toxic positivity season one, I think it was.
Speaker: And if you are a newer one, welcome.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: I'm going to define it for you so you don't have to worry.
Speaker: Toxic positivity is the excessive and ineffective overgeneralization of a happy and optimistic state in any situation and the denial, minimization, and invalidation of genuine human emotional experience.
Speaker: Basically, what that means is when a person exhibits toxic positivity, they deny any and all negative experiences that make us human and
Speaker: and allow to have a wide array of emotions so for example if you're a person who's ever heard someone say oh look on the bright side or it could be worse people who have those kinds of messaging um all the time and can never just sit with uncomfortable moments or horrible things that happen or um
Speaker: Yeah, that is toxic positivity.
Speaker: And it's very, very, very common.
Speaker: You like it's extremely common and certainly more common, I would say, with certain sort of groups.
Speaker: But I do see it consistently across.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: throughout society you know throughout ages throughout races throughout cultures throughout ideologies and for me as a person who has read about this topic a little bit more and understands some things about the human brain and emotions and things you know a lot of times if you were never taught how to sit with uncomfortable emotion and
Speaker: and how to witness your own uncomfortable emotions let alone other people's uncomfortable emotions you just want to get over it you want to get through it you want to push the uncomfortable emotion away you don't want to give it too much time you don't want to air quotes dwell on it you just want to okay this bad thing happened let's accept it and move on let's get to problem solving mode or let's let's well that's the past and the past was five seconds ago the past was five minutes ago you know
Speaker: And I see this.
Speaker: I see this all the time, all the time.
Speaker: The reason why I'm bringing this up in relation to Taraji P. Henson is because of the comments I've seen under people's posts, the comments I've seen on YouTube under this video, and even some of the things said in that interview.
Speaker: If you go back and listen to it, I will not play what I'm talking about.
Speaker: But if you listen to things in the interview that were said,
Speaker: it definitely falls under toxic positivity.
Speaker: And I know, I know that this is an interview.
Speaker: I know that this is radio.
Speaker: This is TV.
Speaker: So, you know, we have to package it a certain way and like, oh, like, you know, what sells?
Speaker: Sadness doesn't necessarily sell.
Speaker: What sells is the hero's journey.
Speaker: What sells is, oh, how you overcame and how the Black woman who was held down
Speaker: overcame some things and triumphed in the end okay okay okay
Speaker: when do we get to really analyze structures and talk about structures and like not just activists right not just theorists not just essayists not just people who read but collectively not just right not just people who have had the ability to go to college or even if you didn't go to college and you just read or whatever and you were media literate or whatever
Speaker: Like, great, great.
Speaker: I see it in my circles all the time.
Speaker: You know, I spend lots of time in those circles.
Speaker: I spent lots of time around wonderful, brilliant minds who know how to critique systems and and create other things.
Speaker: I love that, that that is happening in my peripherals.
Speaker: I love that.
Speaker: I love it.
Speaker: Love it means I'm I'm doing something right.
Speaker: I'm hanging around the right people.
Speaker: I'm following the right people.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But I'm talking about collectively.
Speaker: I am talking about people who have not gone to college.
Speaker: people who do not read every day, I am talking about everyone being like, huh, we are using this idea of triumph.
Speaker: We are using this idea of being the underdog, the underdog story.
Speaker: And I know that's how humans learn, right?
Speaker: We learn through stories and feeling and perspectives and all kinds of different ways.
Speaker: Love it.
Speaker: I love a story.
Speaker: I'm an actor.
Speaker: I love a story, right?
Speaker: When are we collectively going to be like, you are using this underdog story just to get Taraji P. Henson back on the horse, back on the acting horse, back on the being exploited horse, back on the capitalist rigmarole.
Speaker: When are we going to talk about that?
Speaker: When are we going to talk about the ways in which, you know, motivational speaking and these motivational speakers and speeches are being used as a tool to get you to go back to work?
Speaker: And you think you're going to be the person to outwork everybody and you just need to outwork everybody.
Speaker: You need to outlast everyone and you're going to be the one to make it through.
Speaker: Wonderful, wonderful.
Speaker: And I'm not going to be the one to tell you not to because I know you're going to then you're going to hate me more than you're going to hate the system.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I'm not even going to say that.
Speaker: But what I'm going to say is that you don't think that's not you don't think that's fair.
Speaker: Like you don't think that's unfair.
Speaker: And like I know some some people are like, yeah, life is unfair.
Speaker: Oh, well.
Speaker: What I'm trying to say is that these systems are unfair.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And we can do something about it.
Speaker: That's what I'm trying to say.
Speaker: That is what I'm trying to say.
Speaker: These things are unfair, unjust, create crime, create inequity, are exploitative, are anti-human.
Speaker: And we can do something about it.
Speaker: We can do something about it.
Speaker: We can change it for everyone.
Speaker: So you don't have to be the one
Speaker: Up until 4 a.m., grinding your 20s away, grinding your 30s, your 40s, your 50s away until your back hurts, until you don't see your kids no more, until you haven't lived the life, until you haven't, I don't know, fallen in love.
Speaker: I don't know, like made friends, like made a community of people who care about you.
Speaker: That is not right.
Speaker: That's what I'm trying to say.
Speaker: And like I said before, you know, I understand how the human brain works and how it clings to like, oh, I need a story to connect to and how sometimes that can be a diversion, right?
Speaker: That can be a diversion from uncomfortable emotions, right?
Speaker: That can be a, because it's so uncomfortable to literally witness the unjustness of these systems.
Speaker: So it's like, oh, well, I'm going to be the one to break out or, oh, I'm going to be the one to get enough money so that none of this stuff hurts me.
Speaker: I'm not black.
Speaker: I'm OJ.
Speaker: I'm OJ.
Speaker: I'm OJ.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And I know who I'm quoting.
Speaker: Don't get me started on him.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Don't get me started on him.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But really, and like, I think that this is so all of these, all of these things are so connected.
Speaker: This idea of like discomfort and the inability to sit with discomfort is so connected to people's drive to buy more, to consume more, to this,
Speaker: disassociate from the feelings and from being in their bodies right it's so connected to all of this stuff it's so connected and you know i would just urge you i would just urge you you know take some time take some time take some time look into toxic positivity
Speaker: and how it is very different than empathy and how toxic positivity actually makes people feel resentful of you and resentful of others, whether they recognize it in the moment or not, right?
Speaker: And I guess what I'm trying to say, or I guess I should give more context with what I just said, essentially our subconscious and unconscious mind
Speaker: collects about 1 billion bits of data per second, if I'm not mistaken.
Speaker: It's either 1 billion or 1 million, but I strongly believe it's 1 billion.
Speaker: Whereas our conscious mind, what we're consciously aware of, collects about 20 to 40 bits of data per second.
Speaker: Now...
Speaker: that's a enormous difference.
Speaker: And so what I'm referring to is the subconscious mind, you know, it's all feeling, it's all imagery and feeling.
Speaker: And though you may not recognize that someone consistently either invalidating your feelings or not being able to be present with them
Speaker: And telling you that other people have it worse or to look on the bright side or some other phrase.
Speaker: While you might not right in this moment be aware that, oh, it's actually causing me like emotionally like, oh, that doesn't feel very good.
Speaker: Your subconscious mind is aware of it.
Speaker: Your subconscious mind is feeling that.
Speaker: And the subconscious mind, the thoughts, the beliefs, the feelings, the things that are in the subconscious mind, for the most part, that is what is running the show.
Speaker: You might be in opposition to your subconscious mind.
Speaker: You might be in resistance to it.
Speaker: But literally, if you are not doing the work to...
Speaker: really sit with your subconscious mind and really take inventory of what's in it, what beliefs you've heard repetitively, what things you've witnessed, the way you've witnessed love be, who you think is capable of love, who you think is capable of gentleness and care.
Speaker: What is in there is literally what's most likely going to dictate your actions, your words over time.
Speaker: You know?
Speaker: That's the area you want to examine.
Speaker: That's the area you want to clean up.
Speaker: That's the area you want to do the work at.
Speaker: And I guess very, very, very lastly is I will just talk about
Speaker: you know, empathy and what some of the ways you can counteract toxic positivity are, you know, empathy is not about you.
Speaker: It's not about, and it's not even about putting yourself in other people's shoes.
Speaker: From what I understand, that's more like sympathy, like sympathizing with other people.
Speaker: Like, oh,
Speaker: I can imagine how bad it would feel for me if I was all alone on my birthday.
Speaker: You must be so sad, so let me come over to your house.
Speaker: That's sympathy.
Speaker: Empathy is...
Speaker: you're not a big birthday person.
Speaker: You've told me that.
Speaker: Your history says that.
Speaker: And actually, you love being with yourself.
Speaker: You have a plan for what you're going to do on your birthday, or maybe you don't have a plan.
Speaker: Maybe you're just going to sit home and smoke weed and watch TV and drink or whatever you want to do.
Speaker: And you really are looking forward to that.
Speaker: And you really love that.
Speaker: And you need that time to yourself.
Speaker: And you don't want anybody to disturb that time.
Speaker: And actually for your birthday, it sounds like you're going to have a really lovely birthday and you need maybe need me to just respect that boundary.
Speaker: Like, oh, no, I'm going to be with myself.
Speaker: So empathy in that situation would maybe even mean being happy for you.
Speaker: Like, oh, wow.
Speaker: Like.
Speaker: you're probably going to have a great day.
Speaker: You're probably going to feel really good, like good for you.
Speaker: Maybe like to help you have an even better day.
Speaker: Maybe I can like buy you a candle.
Speaker: Are you into candles?
Speaker: Oh, maybe I can like buy you a candle the day before your birthday and give it to you then.
Speaker: And then like you can be with yourself and your room can smell good with yourself.
Speaker: And like, yeah, I hope you have a great birthday.
Speaker: That is empathy.
Speaker: Sympathy is, oh my God, you must feel terrible because I am
Speaker: If I was in that situation, I would feel so bad.
Speaker: And I can't stomach the idea, the thought of you feeling as bad as how I would feel.
Speaker: Because if I was alone on my birthday, I would feel terrible.
Speaker: So do you hear how different that is?
Speaker: That's all about me.
Speaker: That's not being present with another person's emotional reality.
Speaker: And another person's emotional experience.
Speaker: And obviously, like in societies and in different cultures, there are obviously certain social cues and certain sort of agreed upon, I guess, things that are sort of like normal, like, oh, like, yeah, like, oh, I don't know.
Speaker: I don't have an example right now.
Speaker: And so I guess from those social cues, we kind of like assume how other people must feel.
Speaker: But the thing about cultivating intimacy and relationships and community is over time you get to, if you're paying attention, you start to learn what
Speaker: like people's patterns and like, oh, this lights you up.
Speaker: And this thing that society says like, oh, everybody feels this way about this thing.
Speaker: No, actually you don't feel that way about this thing.
Speaker: This is how you feel about that thing.
Speaker: And so it becomes more you, like your life is about you, your feelings about you.
Speaker: And so getting closer to people is like,
Speaker: oh, this is how you, this is how maybe a lot of other people would feel on their birthdays being alone, but this is how you feel on your birthday being with yourself.
Speaker: So it's like, you have to pay attention is what I'm saying.
Speaker: And every person is a unique individual is what I'm saying, right?
Speaker: Empathy is about
Speaker: listening with interest to others empathy is curiosity to help the other explore their experience more deeply so you come in and you don't know you don't know the answer right it has to be that humility of like oh i don't know i wonder what what is what is going on what is the answer i don't i don't know though
Speaker: You come in with curiosity to help the other person explore their experience more deeply.
Speaker: And you're not doing this for you.
Speaker: You're doing this for them.
Speaker: It's about empathizing with them.
Speaker: Attunement to their emotional state, not what you assume their emotional state must be because of cultural cues of what culture says, oh, this is what you should be feeling.
Speaker: No, this person in particular, you're attuning to their emotional state.
Speaker: You're suspending judgment.
Speaker: And you're reflecting back your understanding of the other person's perspective.
Speaker: So like, oh, so let me get this straight.
Speaker: On your birthdays, you feel best when you're left with yourself and you get to do whatever you want to do.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And when people infringe upon that, it makes you feel uncomfortable.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I got it.
Speaker: I got it.
Speaker: So I just wanted to mention that last little bit that I was talking about with empathy and stuff.
Speaker: It was a concept created by Natalie Martinek, PhD, for Hacking Narcissism Substack.
Speaker: So yeah, she just asked that I mention her platform, Hacking Narcissism Substack, and mention her name whenever I mention this.
Speaker: yeah that's all that was and I just want to thank y'all so much for listening to my take on this whole thing and appreciate y'all and I I actually really like topics like this that sort of intersect many of my uh I guess interests yeah that's a good way to describe it
Speaker: and I hope it was an interesting episode okay so I'll see you on exam thanks for listening peace
Speaker: Here's a quick announcement.
Speaker: My new book is available for pre-order now.
Speaker: Dear Bi-Men, A Black Man's Perspective on Power, Consent, Breaking Down Binaries, and Combating Erasure is being published by North Atlantic Books and distributed by Penguin Random House.
Speaker: This book is a powerful resource for Black bi men to reclaim their identity, counter biphobia, and get empowered, and an offering to all readers looking to thwart the erasure and dehumanization wrought by patriarchy.
Speaker: The anticipated publishing date is April 16th, 2024.
Speaker: but you can pre-order it now.
Speaker: Also, Sometimes Impatient merch for people who are working on it is now available too.
Speaker: We got tote bags, t-shirts, hoodies, and pillows.
Speaker: Lastly, we have Patreon.
Speaker: If you like the podcast as is, there's way more in-depth podcast episodes and other goodies over on my Patreon.
Speaker: Tap in.
Speaker: I want to thank you for taking the time to listen to the Let's Heal Already podcast.
Speaker: To be clear, I'm not advocating for an emotionally intelligent patriarch or for more men to begin and end their work at feeling comfortable painting their nails, wearing dresses, or expanding what falls under the fold of masculinity.
Speaker: Similarly, I do not want to be a highly efficient, well-adjusted worker under capitalism, which is often the aim of Western therapy models.
Speaker: I am calling for the system to be abolished.
Speaker: That system is imperialist, cisheterosexist, white supremacist, capitalist, patriarchy.
Speaker: Please leave a rating or review on the platform you use to listen to this podcast and feel free to share this with your friends.
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