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Daily Arsenal - S1-E113 : City Review CROSSOVER!
13 Plays24 days ago
In a first for the Daily Arsenal podcast, we have a follow up Crossover episode with our friend from the Daily Manchester City podcast Jools Jordan-Probert to get the Manchester City perspective on our devestating victory over the blues!
Host : Jools Jordan-Probert
Guest : Josh Vince
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Transcript
Introduction & Guest Appearance
00:00:09
Speaker
Hello and welcome back to the Daily Manchester City Podcast on the Global Sports Podcast Network. Today I am joined once again by Josh Vince from the Daily Arsenal ah Podcast. I'm sure he's not going to glow too much, although that is a distinct possibility. Hi Josh, how are we? Hi Jules. I'm great mate. I'm really good, you know.
00:00:32
Speaker
Yeah, I will do my best not to go too much is it's been a while since we've been in a position like this So it's gonna be hard to properly sort of you know, keep myself Tempered but I'll do my best. This is we work together. We're colleagues Technically, so, you know, I'm gonna be nice. I'm
Arsenal's Victory Celebration
00:00:49
Speaker
gonna be nice. I really appreciate that
00:00:54
Speaker
I'll tell you what, how about you get the gloating out early, I'm going to pass you the mic so to speak, pass you the reins and give you however long you want to rub it in, describe your thoughts and feelings as the full time whistle went.
00:01:12
Speaker
I'll be honest with you Jules, it could be summed up in two words. Two very, very simple words in the English language. I think you know what they are. I think everybody listening knows well what they are. So I'll get my gloating out in just those two. Stay humble.
00:01:30
Speaker
Honestly, it was it was just admittedly, Harlan still got one back on us by pointing to his shirt at the end of the game. you know and it was The thing is, I've seen a lot of commentators be really upset about Miles Lewis Skelly doing Harlan's celebration and things like and the team ribbing each other, but that's what the Premier League has been lacking for a little bit, like a proper, proper rivalry.
00:01:50
Speaker
And come full time, it was it was such a joy to see the Emirates so bouncing to see habits on the score sheet was excellent as well to see the performances of the youngsters. It was just a very. Let's call it a very positive last half hour, because there's a big chunk of that game, which was quite hard to watch.
Analysis of Manchester City's Loss
00:02:10
Speaker
Just I think for any football fan, it would have been quite hard to watch. What about yourself? What are your thoughts at full time?
00:02:16
Speaker
definite Well, I mean, stay humble is definitely on the brain, but maybe not and not not in the same way. Yeah, I think most most people involved with Citi will see then naturally losing to a main rival is never good. Getting hammered by a main rival is pretty catastrophic and especially on the back of what had been Bar the odd Champions League result an upturn in form and beating insects in the Premier League um Kind of solidified that fourth place at the time Looking up instead of down for the first time in maybe a couple of months. So yeah, I think that Arsenal results and has probably knocked a bit of wind out of the sails and have got the older side and I
00:03:04
Speaker
Yes, losing by four, conceding five. It's only the second time Peppers conceded five, by the way. Oof, that's not great. oh at At City, at least. And it is and it's his all-time, and not all-time, it's a joint record loss for City under his stewardship as well. So, yeah, it was quite quite a hammer-in, to be quite honest. But There will be another day. It's only three points. The season won't be defined by it. You probably get City entirely out of the title race now, but i that was probably already the case. yeah You mentioned quite a few things that we'll get into. and Just to preface a bit of the podcast, you mentioned the needle between the suicides and that the league needs that. We'll go into that in a bit more depth later on.
00:03:54
Speaker
um But first of all, I want to ask you, where do you think the game was won and lost for both sides? Firstly, I just want to mention something very quickly. Obviously, you say it was devastating being hammered by a rival. Welcome to the club. That's happened to us for the last seven years whenever we played City. I remember the first game back from Covid at the Etihad, Jacque got a red card and you thumped us. So it's one of those games that could throw up a brutal result.
00:04:22
Speaker
Where the game was won and lost, I think it was in two parts. I think it was in Arsenal's press, firstly. I think that was the most important thing. And I think it was, for some reason, Pep Guardiola decided that the midfield doesn't really matter and put a really weird configuration in the middle of the park. And I think, ultimately, that's where the game was won, the overwhelming of the midfield by Arsenal in that game.
00:04:52
Speaker
Yeah, i'd I'd agree wholeheartedly. I think you're not the first team this year to isolate that as a weakness for City because it definitely has been. Obviously we've on this podcast, we've talked to death about the the absence of Rodry and how important he is. And even we have discussed that.
00:05:10
Speaker
He is slightly adapted, finally, to put two a double pivot in there over the last week or so, the last couple of weeks. That double pivot was Bernardo Silva and Kovacic, experienced pros.
00:05:22
Speaker
that are good on the ball. But yeah, you could it it didn't fill many City fans with with a with optimism, seeing that on the team sheet. and Not that you ever know how the team is going to line up. There can be five defenders and you only play three at the back sometimes. so It's very true. so we You never second-guess the great bold man anymore. But yeah, this this performance and this result definitely leaves a lot of questions.
Young Arsenal Talent Spotlight
00:05:49
Speaker
You mentioned Miles Lewis Scali, of course, ah he he played a pivotal part in the match, um getting himself embroiled with some beef with the with the big Norwegian. Of course. You must be so pleased about how he has A, and found his feet in the Arsenal side and B, that special moment on Sunday.
00:06:11
Speaker
Yeah, please. And oddly, it's one of those things as a football fan, especially as you get a little bit older and you're sort of past the point where you could, as much as you would dream to physically play for your team. Like I'm 29 now, but my body's about 40. So there's no way I could play for Arsenal. But there's a sense of real pride in seeing a youngster, you know, as especially at the end, you know, academy graduate coming through the ranks. And I think Lewis Kelly has been the biggest surprise of Arsenal season, I think.
00:06:38
Speaker
I think one year he was always, we knew that he was going to be quite good. He's done fairly well, but Lewis Skelly, especially being a midfielder, the way that he's adapted into that left back role and has completely outperformed Zinchenko in the sense of being a left back who can invert. And the fact, Arsenal for the last couple of months, we've we've had a debate a lot on the Arsenal podcast about the number eight position.
00:07:03
Speaker
whether Declan Rice should be playing number eight, whether he should be playing deeper and Marino should be playing eight, if Marino's good enough. What I think we're starting to understand now about Miles Lewis Skelly is for an 18 year old he has so much awareness and confidence and ability on the ball that he's able to invert and really push forward giving Rice a little bit of freedom to either sit back Or if Skelly inverts into a more defensive role, giving Rice the opportunity to go and have a little bit of a run and go have a little bit of go, which he was doing against City a lot. He was making a lot of runs down the left channel, which just weren't being picked out by the Arsenal team. And so having a player with that much confidence, and I think there's a beauty to having a youngster playing for you as well. They're not held back by the system having been beaten into them. They go out there to show themselves and to perform to the highest level of their ability.
00:07:53
Speaker
And I think with him in particular, there's an arrogance there, which, you know, alluding to what he did for Erling Harlan's celebration. And he did that for one simple reason. Erling Harlan now knows who he is.
00:08:07
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, it's City fans, obviously, seething at it. But it it definitely caused a spectacle, that's for sure. I just want to defend the City perspective on this one,
Podcast Philosophy & Player Remarks
00:08:20
Speaker
though. Yes, go for it. And I also want to let everyone listening behind the curtain a little bit. So we all record on the same platform. And when I went to record an episode two days ago, I think Josh and the Arsenal team were the last guys there.
00:08:35
Speaker
And I noticed on our soundboard, there was a clip of the stay humble bed. So I haven't listened to your episode yet, but give me a 10 second summary of how you use that, please. Very simply the, uh, for those of you who've listened to any of the shows in the global sports podcast network, you'll know that there is, there's an intro clip. It's a little, uh, jingle effectively, which introduces every episode.
00:09:02
Speaker
And at the end of it, I just managed to find a little bit of audio of Erling Harland ah in the two-wall result, you know, not a win, a draw, in the two-wall result saying to Michel Arteta, a man who, by the way, was the assistant manager at Citi, admittedly before his time, but has tied to the club, looking at him going, stay humble, stay humble, yeah. And that was just the introduction to the episode to which I then said, yep, stay humble, Erling. Welcome to the Daily Arsenal podcast.
00:09:32
Speaker
Well, whoever's listening now, you've immediately made yourself a figurehead of hatred, which is exactly what I wanted. And now I'm going to fine i'm going to now i'm going to defend the city perspective. bring it So obviously, when you when when you look at the clip like that,
00:09:52
Speaker
The Stay Humble tagline is is ah is catchy and it's easy to to use that against someone, isn't it? Especially especially with the random city went on afterwards. It lends itself to comedy. The bigger you are, the harder you fall. The biggest and best teams and the biggest and best players are going to get the most ridiculed because most the most people are um to but care about them.
00:10:15
Speaker
but I think what he means by saying that is you guys haven't actually won anything with this set of players. You won one FA Cup and Rotate, but it's a pretty much a new squad since, isn't it?
00:10:29
Speaker
So as you say, and an 18 year old that has got 13 senior matches in football, you know, laying it on one of the, jet one of this generation's greatest players, even if Harland retired today, he would be one of the best players in this generation. Facts. And I don't think anyone other than the aliens of Massey and Ronaldo can really hold a candle to his goal of scoring, maybe Lewandowski, but that's up for debate. I think Harland will surpass him as time goes. Anyway, I understand why.
00:10:59
Speaker
Arsenal did it, of course, because there is so much needle and in this rivalry. and Gabrielle got asked about it but before the game. Arteta said there would be no emotion going into it, and Gabrielle said there absolutely will be. Of course there will be, yes. And of course there will be, but of course Arteta's got to say that too. But i yeah, i I can totally see why everyone is dunking on Holland and City because you know when when you've won so much in recent history people are going to want to but I think that was kind of the point that he felt that Arsenal were getting embroiled in
00:11:34
Speaker
a lot of extracurriculars, let's say, without anything to back it up. And this kind of feels like another moment of that. But I will say that these type of moments are what lead to the winning in the future, aren't they? so And if you end up winning, everyone in a lockback will back at it. This will be a seminal moment either way, probably, won't it? yeah and And that's the beauty of two of the country's greatest
Arsenal-City Rivalry Dynamics
00:11:58
Speaker
teams going against each other, is it provides us moments like this that we will talk to death,
00:12:03
Speaker
and for no one's amusement bar our own. But that's very much how it is. and Would you like a little rebuttal for MLS there? Do you know what? I can't wholly disagree with you. It's true. We've not won anything since the FA Cup when Arteta first came in. And that was five odd years ago. So, you know, it's been a long time coming. Arsenal haven't won anything with this group of players and City, no one can take it away from them.
00:12:28
Speaker
have done phenomenally in the last decade. why is it Is it seven in the last 10 years? yes seven Yeah, seven in the last 10 years. like That's an almost unprecedented record. It's phenomenal. I think where a lot of it comes from is obviously being pegged back to second twice, very close, hurt the squad quite a lot and gave them a real motivation to go on a win it.
00:12:52
Speaker
city have been painted as the big rivals for the title in the last few years and sort of it's built a bit of, I wouldn't necessarily even say animosity. It's not like us and Spurs.
00:13:03
Speaker
i would hate oh you I think either from your, I mean, come on, Sunday sunday proves that. And and the like the like the the last two seasons of league matches have all been absolute scraps, haven't they? They have been, yeah. But I think it's scraps, I think it's competitive scraps. There is definitely between the players at least, some disdain. And I think, like you say, when you're when you're the best and you're the biggest, you do open yourself up a little bit for ridicule if things aren't going great.
00:13:32
Speaker
And Harland is the figurehead of that. Realistically, he's the figurehead of the team, I think. You could very, very easily argue. So when when he makes a comment like that to a manager who is you know who's trying he's trying very hard to push himself up there, I get where the comment probably came from, and then looks at an 18-year-old, who even are you? Who even are you? Again, I do kind of understand the sentiment. I think it's very arrogant.
00:13:58
Speaker
but I understand the sentiment he probably has earn't the right to be arrogant but in the same vein i think there is every right to respond to that if a result goes the other way so i think,
00:14:10
Speaker
both instances are justified because let's be honest when Harland did that the first time round and when he threw the ball at the back of Gabrielle's head and when he said that to MLS you know the first time round it was all laughing at Arsenal because they've thrown up their bottling again the throwing the league away again he's Harling's right in this instance you know Arsenal beat Manchester City 5-1 no once we didn't see that coming we spoke before the game we did not see that coming at all And it's a moment of it's a moment of the players being able to rebut each other. And like you say, you know, it's realistically between the players. It is genuine. But for the rest of us, it it creates um it creates a real sort of excitement about the league and a real energy about the league and those water cooler moments, which we all love really deep down inside.
00:14:56
Speaker
Absolutely. And it creates a siege mentality, doesn't it, which every manager tries to impose on their team because desperate but it does spur sides on to create more than the sum of their parts. Not that your parts don't add up too much anyway, but, you know, the last couple of years you've needed a bit of extra and maybe yeah something like this. and that This very much could be a sliding doors moment, couldn't it? 5-1 win over the champions who you couldn't best for the previous two years. yeah Obviously, you're you you you're chasing a new challenger now, but you know I think if Arsenal do end up getting there at the end of the season, we'll look back at Sunday's game as one of the key moments. 100%. Without a shadow of doubt, it will probably... If it goes on to happen, and I'll be honest with you, Jules, I never thought we would win it. I actually predicted City to win the league at the start of the season. I'd still, I can't see Liverpool dropping six points, unless of course Everton do us a massive favour in the last ever, you know, Merseyside, Darby and Goodison Park. But if we do go on to win it, then this game and probably the game at Anfield will be the two big games.
00:16:05
Speaker
Definitely. And long live and big club rivalries in he yeah in in the Premier League. This is the thing. It's it's been so sanitised recently, hasn't it? when you When you look back at the last, let's say, five or six years, the big rivalry really was City Liverpool. And then all of the other Darby's and rivalries were just a bit sanitised and a bit dull. It's fun to have a bit ah bit of Aggie, you know.
00:16:28
Speaker
Definitely. There's so little of it. They've tried to make Brighton v. Palace one of the marquee games of the season, haven't they? They've tried. They've tried. I don't even think that, well, I don't think the Brighton fans care that much. I think Palace like beating Brighton, but I don't think Brighton care too much, to be honest. At this point, Palace like beating anybody, let's be honest.
00:16:52
Speaker
We're going to take a short break and then when we come back, we'll look at where this leaves both sides for the rest of the season.
00:17:01
Speaker
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00:17:29
Speaker
Hello and welcome back to the Daily Manchester City podcast on the Global Sports Podcast Network. We're joined by Josh Vince from the Daily Arsenal podcast and unfortunately we're dissecting everything that happened on Sunday. that We're just going to look ahead now to where that leaves both sides and for the rest of the season.
Arsenal's Season Prospects
00:17:50
Speaker
Arsenal of course are still in the league cap which they'll be playing a later today as we record.
00:17:56
Speaker
yeah and Just quickly, how ah hopeful or not are you of turning that one around? Do you know, it's a really good question. I think ah in terms of momentum, it's definitely with us and not with Newcastle. They probably have more to play for on this side. They haven't won a trophy in 80 years. And it's at St. James's Park with 2-0 down already. And we played a very, very demanding game against realistic let's not let's not be silly jewels it's been a rough ride but realistically still arguably one of the best teams in the world so shouldn't be getting beaten 5-1 that's for sure shouldn't in fact the last time you conceded five goals and open play was 2008 against Middlesbrough so you know it's it's been some time so i think honestly 2-0 at St James's Park is a massive thing to overturn if we can do it in an hour and a half time
00:18:48
Speaker
then wow it will be it'll probably be along with the city result our result of the season that but i'm not hugely confident if i'm being totally honest with you And I think it would be good for you to win another trophy, wouldn't it? Because it would it would signify growth and development for this squad. And a lot of the times, teams that enter, but you know, this new era of where they're at. So you, you know, you've been there or thereabouts, but solidifying themselves. If you think of Venga, Mourinho, these, these guys that took their teams on, they started by winning caps first.
00:19:23
Speaker
They did. Mourinho especially, he loved the league cap because he thought he'd set the team up well for the back stretch of the season, and getting in getting in that championship winning mode. yeah I think Newcastle have had their eye on this one for the last few results to be honest because yeah since since they beat you they've gone a bit wayside. But what would constitute a good season for you at this point is where I'm going with this. okay ah do you Do you think Arsenal will win the title off the back of such a good result that could you know catapult you further? Or have you left yourself with a little bit too much left to do? Six points off Liverpool. They've got a game in hand as well. 14 games left. There's still plenty of time, but they do look bloody good, don't they? They look they look fantastic and they look like they're on a march too. I think
00:20:13
Speaker
to answer To answer your question, I kind of have to relate back to something we actually spoke about a little while ago. Because in the Arsenal podcast, we've talked quite a lot about what would constitute a successful season for us. I think, ultimately, we've drawn too many games.
00:20:31
Speaker
effectively we've we've been a little bit too naive maybe a little bit too we played a bit too safe that's definitely a criticism that's been made of Arsenal this season that they're a bit risk of us and I think it holds it holds merit generally over the whole course of the season when I think about where we are as well you said earlier managers often you know kick start new regimes with a cup win Arteta won the Cup in this first year, and as you said, completely different squad now. So this squad... That felt like of an overperformance at the time, didn't it? if Whereas if you won the FA Cup now, it would be, well, you know, one of the top teams that won the FA Cup. Hugely. And this is part of my point. I still think we're ahead of schedule.
00:21:15
Speaker
Realistically, two years ago, when we were second, that should not have happened. That was a year where we should, well, I mean, it was amazing, but realistically, we were looking at fifth fourth. Like, get back into Europe. We've been sixth and eighth. And then it was like, right, we need to get back into Europe. Let's aim for fifth to fourth. you know Even if it's you know Europa League run, we'll take that because it's showing progression. We ended up second.
00:21:40
Speaker
Then the year after, again, Saliba was fully fit. We missed out on the league by two bloody points. And you know it would have been amazing because it would be the 20th anniversary of the Invincibles. So I still think we're ahead of schedule, really. I think this is the year that a cup would suit us best.
00:21:58
Speaker
I don't see us winning the league because that we've left it so long and all the draws and everything everything to do with that has been difficult to it's difficult to justify winning the league with that. I'm going to say something now which is going to sound absurd but I genuinely think it's a possibility. I fancy us for the Champions League.
00:22:19
Speaker
i don't I don't think that's that crazy. I think the type of football that you play lends itself to those tricky European games, doesn't it? You know, you don't concede many chances, you don't concede many goals. And I think with Saka out for, you know, he'll be back by the end of the season, sure, but will he be at full pace?
00:22:38
Speaker
So naturally with your but your most creative player on the sidelines, well you so I say that, you still scored five on Sunday, didn't you? Yeah, never and that's rare for us. like i Honestly, the way that we're playing in Europe at the moment, we can see the three goals in the league. and and the sort of league section, which is remarkable. We weren't scoring as free, but during that time, you know, we had Urdu Guard out for a brief period. We have Rice out for a little while as well. We had a lot of key players out. Now we've got Sakhar out. He should be back at the end of February. I expect it will take him a month to get up to pace. But thankfully, Ethan Wannieri is playing brilliantly on that right hand side. but what But what about you, Jules? Because obviously this is the City podcast, but where do you
00:23:18
Speaker
Obviously it's been a rough year for City. it's but It's been a really tough year. What would you now constitute a successful season for Manchester City at this point in time after this result?
Manchester City's Season Struggles
00:23:31
Speaker
a It's difficult because you always want to have the loftiest ambitions when you're following the loftiest club, right? yeah any Anyone any anyone at the start of the season would would think it was blasphemy if I said getting a Champions League place was a good season. But the fear of God has been put into City by just the amount of losses and the lack of control. Everything that made City so good feels like it's crumbling. And there's obviously it's still a fantastic team with the best number nine in the world and world-class players everywhere and the best coach
00:24:08
Speaker
Finally, we've seen Pep have of of of an off streak. We've never seen it before. That's why but that's why football is so brilliant, isn't it? So yeah, I guess so the long-winded way is me justifying saying fourth place would be a good season, but it would only be good because it would stop the free fall. And then with the summer would obviously be incredibly important.
00:24:33
Speaker
new director of football coming in as well. So you'd imagine he'd want to put his imprint on the club and Hugo Viana from sporting. oh Oh, that's a good, that's a good appointment. Yeah. But it means the cheeky Beggarstein who's been at the helms for ages and brought Papin is He's not done the best of the last couple of years, but he is one of them been one of the main factors in city's domination over the last decade and was pivotal to acquiring pep in the first place. And who knows what happens if you don't get, if you don't get that man, but it just feels like and a totally new era and, and, uh, new and unknown is scary, Josh, you know what I mean? ah So, uh, yeah, a long-winded way of saying, I think fourth, I feel sick saying it, you know, because it could have been a fifth fifth Premier League title in a row, which is what we all expected at the start of the season. I think everyone predicted it too.
00:25:28
Speaker
including yourself, as you said earlier. ah da yeah yeah Football is cyclical. It always will be. We just got too accustomed to the way City were dominating, but it had never been done before. It might not get done again.
00:25:42
Speaker
ah So, yeah, I think is the thing is just like, you know, you did four on the truck and that is the first time that's ever happened. Fifth on the truck would have been frankly absurd. I think we all guessed it because it was like kind of like you say, it's the norm. It's what we expect. It's what we're anticipating should happen. But realistically, like if you did five in a row, it would be non-human. It wouldn't be right.
00:26:10
Speaker
So I totally understand like the disappointment of not hitting the five and the fall off and everything like that. But I still think as if you're a City fan, ah goodness me, hold your head up high for that team because they've done insane things. Definitely. Four in a row, as we can look back on with hindsight, which is perfect of course, that was the straw that broke the camel's back.
00:26:32
Speaker
everyone got pushed and beyond what they, they're physically capable of generally in the travel season the year before. Yeah. Because that obviously played every game possible at the highest intensity, you know, and we see, we've seen a lot of the fallout from that season now, I think, especially with international tournaments in both that season and after the end of last one. So, so the players have had no opportunity to to rest whatsoever.
00:26:58
Speaker
The players have also aged as well in those two years, you know, they've tipped, tipped from that experience pro into the aging pro type of thing, you know, yeah and and it all happened at the same time that a lot of that comes down to squad planning because you're obviously aware that the bulk of your team at 29 to 30 were, um, and that some of them are injury prone and Pep still, Pep and Tiki chose to have a smaller squad because that's what Pep prefers.
00:27:28
Speaker
So he has to take some accountability for this. And I think we've seen that rectified somewhat in the transfer market. The city have made five sign-ins, three for the first team, um and then two that you'd hope would go on to be world beaters.
Transfer Talk & Future Strategies
00:27:43
Speaker
It was about 180 million, wasn't it? It was a huge amount of money.
00:27:47
Speaker
Papad signed, see the six or seven players in January in his entire tenure before the season. Wow. And now he's signed five in this January. City are normally so proactive, right? This is obviously a reactive position the club find themselves in now. 100%. Marmouche looks like a baller, so who cares? Very quickly on Marmoosh, I do have to ask you, because i I found this baffling in the game itself. I know what you're going to say, and I agree, yeah. What the hell was he doing in the middle? Like, him in the middle and Foden on the wing. he swapped He got them the wrong way round. It's surely simple. Classic pep overthink, that was, wasn't it? Yeah, we'd just seen Marmoosh tear Chelsea apart, making those direct ah runs from left from out to in on the left-hand side completely tore Chelsea apart.
00:28:40
Speaker
And then Foden has even done an interview over the last week saying about how England should have used him centrally. And then Pep puts him out wide. Yeah. Yeah. It was a bit baffling. And, and Momoosh looked like he was a bit lost to be honest. He did. Yeah.
00:28:57
Speaker
It can happen, man. like you know I don't think anyone expected him to be so good at the and in the in it on his debut. He could have easily scored. He had one ruled out, was pivotal in another, um and then folded and had found his scoring boots playing centrally again. So yeah, it really it really baffled me. but not forced baffling decision and even on the team sheets because photos on the right wasn't he he was on the right hand side so ah i kind of get it for the cutting in and he likes that special to be no be coming in as well but i do have to say sort of like if you even know lewis galley has been very very good. He's an eighteen-year-old still and he's not the quickest so my wish was surely a day yet honestly when i saw that it's all my mission the middle is like.
00:29:42
Speaker
oh Okay. Did you expect Momoosh to be straight up against MLS? Was that... I expected him to be up against Pate at right back. Thank God Timba was fit. And I have to say, actually, you know, as much of, you know, a very troublesome individual as he is, Pate was brilliant in that game. Yeah, yeah. Which hurts to say. And that's why I'm not going to i'm just not going to. I'm just not going to disagree with you. That's absolutely fine. We'll leave it at that.
00:30:12
Speaker
Well, before we do truly leave it, I just want to bring up that. Are you, are you aware of what Arsenal's XG was before I say this? Do you know what I'm not actually, I think we've all been enjoying it too much. Would you like, would you like to guess and sit and sit and like and when I said this on the pod that we recorded the other day, I mentioned it and, and.
00:30:33
Speaker
um i won I won't give the England because I'll okay kind of give it away. But it was surprising for for the, p well. I have a feeling that RXG was considerably lower than the actual school and because there was a lot of deflections and and of Havertz his chance was really tight as well. But then again, Havertz probably had a 0.99 when he missed the target. So I'm going to say that, do you know what, I'm going to say the city probably had an xg of about two and i'm gonna say arsenal about john i'm gonna say two three two three the distance between your gases is nearly bang on but arsenal's xg was one and six cities was 0.82
00:31:21
Speaker
How crazy is that? If you think, obviously there was that Harvard's chance, right? But you think of the party one, that's got to be like a 0.01 surely. MLS went through Ortega's hands with a defender in front of him as well. So that would have been the- Definitely should have saved that by the way. Yeah, I agree. It was good play by Rice initially and good movement by Emma Lesper. I can't understand why he was stood off so much and allowed to pick his spot. And even then, you could all see the spot was going to be to Ortega's left. And then Ortega even seen that as well. But I don't know, man. Speaking of standing off, the parte goal, no one closed him down at any point. No one closed him. Wanyeri, no one closed him down. Actually, that's a good point for the XG. Wanyeri's shot.
00:32:06
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. My nearest shot, awkward, difficult, like that'll be a low XG. So yeah, I see your point. I'm not i'm not using that. Well, i was initially I was going to bring it up and say, is that lack? And on another day, do we see a different result? Which I'm going to answer by saying yes, but I don't want it to take away from the fact that, you know, City were clearly worse than Arsenal, especially in that second half.
00:32:31
Speaker
Only in that second half, to be honest. Yeah. On this occasion for luck, I'm actually not. So normally I agree with you because football is such a such a volatile game. But on this occasion, I'm actually going to say no, simply because of Arsenal's press and the way they did it. They set so many traps. So Arsenal recently been pressing in a 4-4-2 and it's been OK. You know, it's been fairly successful. them In this game, they press in a 5-3-2, incredibly narrow, but with five at the back and part a screening the back line.
00:33:00
Speaker
that press from Havarts and Erdogan was so impressive and the way that they especially sort of you know attacking stones who's not fully fit and attacking Kanji who's having a bit of a kind a crisis of confidence at the moment I think he planned it brilliantly yeah sure a few of the shots definitely lucky but I think the way that Arsenal played the game I think deserved the victory probably not by that much But the like the score line itself is a fluke, but still wonderful to watch from our perspective at the very least. And I i think the sco the score line I think is a reflection of the capitulation in the second half. so and you know All the damage was done in like a 25 minute spell really.
00:33:43
Speaker
but Yeah, that that's the mentality seems to have gone from City, right? And these are all season yeah season and winners. that That's the last thing you expect to go. But to concede that goal, the party goal, immediately after getting back into the game, and deservedly so as well, in my opinion, it felt it felt like City had more chances in the first half as well, to be honest. and yeah The Holland goal felt like a fair reflection of of the second half up until that point. Brilliant goal, by the way.
00:34:14
Speaker
Yeah, it was classic. The scooped cross from Savino. Everyone's talking about Harlan's leap. Great. The cross from Savino was incredible. Savino doesn't even look anymore. This is a 20-year-old. He knows exactly where the space is and where Harlan's going to be. And I think the early signs of what I'm seeing between them two this year, I think Savino could have 100 assists for City, you know, if he doesn't leave in the next few years. He's a terrifying player. He's probably the player who scares me the most at sisy at the moment is Savino. Yeah he can go either way and his his intelligence to find space at such a young age is great as well and then you add in the pace and
00:34:55
Speaker
His finishing needs work, definitely, but he's got an eye for a pass and he's not one of these like no end product wingers. he he He's got vision and he's got execution from out wide. The weight of the pass and the style of the pass is always accommodating for the player ahead of him and that's a sign of a quality passer in my opinion.
00:35:14
Speaker
And also what we said as well earlier on, he's young and he's not afraid to make those mistakes, which often Pep knocks out a players quick. And he's still in team. Yeah, exactly. As a team that's low on confidence, but he's exactly the sort of player you need right now. When your team is low on confidence, you need a youngster who's just going to go, I'll sort this out and just yeah do things like that. So he's a real asset for City at the moment, Sevilla. I think he's probably your best signing in years.
00:35:41
Speaker
Yeah, I'd agree. And I go back to the lack of squad planning for that as well, because sid city didn't seem to miss in the transfer market, but they have done all the lack of the lack of signings have been the big miss really. But we're gonna, we're gonna wrap it up there. I'm just gonna quickly ask Josh first.
Predictions & Team Prospects
00:36:01
Speaker
oh I just want, I just want to know ah your predictions for both City and Arsenal at the end of the season, what positions are they both going to be? What silverware, if any, will either side have? And as a little treat, if you think any either player or any player from either the team is going to be player of the year, throw that on top as well. I don't think we can look past Sadler as player of the year, unfortunately. I think he's got that nailed down. I think it's going to be Arsenal second still, as and Arsenal fans don't kill me, but Arsenal second, Manchester City third.
00:36:35
Speaker
I think you can pull it back to third. i can so You're in the FA Cup still, aren't you? Yeah, i think yeah. I think you could win that and I think, do you know what? To hell with it. Arsenal winning the Champions League, first European trophy. What about you Jules? Where do you think things are going to go? oh i I've tried to remain so optimistic all season, I really have.
00:36:58
Speaker
And i I said on the the wrap-up show with all the English teams that we both were on, that and no one will want City in the playoff round. Maybe everyone except for Al Madrid. And that's who you get. And that that's a consequence of being rubbish in the Champions League, you know?
00:37:16
Speaker
they had After the first three games, 0-0 draw against Inter Milan, which set you with a dominant but dominant team, and then 1-4-0 and 1-5-0 win, no goals conceded, first three games, second place in the table. From that position, to end up in the last playoff spot is absolutely catastrophic.
00:37:37
Speaker
it but it But it was a good comeback win, you know, you can only play your up against Club Bruges beating Villa this year as well. So I think it was a good performance in the end actually to to scrape over the line. But the result of that is here you go. Here's bloody Real Madrid.
00:37:54
Speaker
they they' like there's three, four years in a row, City and Real Madrid have played each other now. Is it that many? Yeah. Wow. Wow. Okay. Well, I mean, realistically, probably beating Arsenal would have helped a little bit with that. Yeah. Yeah, yeah definitely. and Real are not at their absolute best. but what this that you know They're still Real, but they are. They are finding their feet a bit though. They started off rocky, but Mbappe's finding his feet. He's working well with Vinnie. Judas doing a really good job in defence at midfield. like Oh, you mentioned all his players.
00:38:34
Speaker
ah You know Val Verde's been okay as well. Modric still comes on every now. and It's going to be tough. I'll be honest. It's going to be, I'll definitely be watching the games. It's a shame, it's a shame that like in this round where previous years you'd have seen someone drop into the Europa League and then City would just clean that one up and get into the Champions League either way then, right? ah yeah doesn't that That doesn't happen anymore, so he could be watching a tough game against Madrid. City can still
Champions League Outlook & Wrap-up
00:39:00
Speaker
do it. Do not get me wrong, like, you know, all it takes is a solid performance and Holland to put away his chances and you can beat anyone.
00:39:07
Speaker
you know You have the firepower to see you have the firepower to win the Champions League. It's just whether that like you said earlier It's whether the mentality still there or not. And if that slips then it's gonna be tricky. Yeah So it got into my head. I yeah think Real Madrid will get over the line, but I don't think i don't think it's going to be a hammer-in. At least I say that, hopefully. I'm trying to forget about Sunday. And yeah and the end of the Premier League, guy i think I think I agree with you. Third seems third seems about right, but i'm not I'm not super confident about it. City will get a Champions League place because fifth yeah fifth should be enough, which is a good year for that to be the case. Yeah, definitely.
00:39:47
Speaker
for City but yeah third finishing above Chelsea would ah from this position would probably be a good season I think yeah so and yeah that that will do our pretty long-winded wrap-up of Sunday's match and it's been a pleasure having Josh here thank you Josh thank you for having me I've really really enjoyed it yeah maybe yeah when maybe we'll do ah some more often now we've become I created a good report over the last, over the last week or so. We have done. Yes. Maybe, maybe I'm a good luck charm for you and Arsenal, which can't go on for too long. So this is the last time I'm ever going to speak to you, Josh. You're welcome on the Arsenal podcast anytime.
00:40:30
Speaker
i turned I turned that down the other day and I might stick to that as well to be honest. Do you know what actually I'm going to get a little sound bite of you saying I'm your good luck charm and I'm going to add it to our jingle at the start so you're in every podcast from now on and you can see us through to the Premier League and the Champions League titles. Okay thanks for listening.
00:40:54
Speaker
Yeah, stay tuned for everything that we got coming up soon. We'll obviously have coverage of that massive Real Madrid fixture and City's pursuit of the Champions League places in the Premier League. I've been Jules Jordan-Probert for the Daily Manchester City podcast and the Daily Arsenal podcast on the Global Sports Podcast Network. Have a wonderful rest of your day.