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27: Spider-Man No Way Home with Snacks
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Welcome back, Hot Nerds. We're joined by our multiversal Ryan Variant, Snacks, to tal through Spider-Man: No Way Home in this episode of our Phase 4 Rewatch.
Follow the show on Instagram @realhotnerdpod and follow our hosts on BlueSky (or Threads) at @hellinpastels and @intuitiveblerd.
Opinions shared by the hosts and/or guests of Real Hot Nerd Shit are their own and do not represent any workplace or organization with whom they may or may not be affiliated.
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Transcript
Introduction and Episode Focus
00:00:32
Ryan
I just got so sad.
00:00:34
Snacks _he_him_
I'm sorry. Right when it came up, i was like, oh dear.
00:00:35
Ryan
It's okay. I can't remember.
00:00:39
Ryan
Welcome to Real Hot Nerd Shit, where pop culture podcast where real hot nerds have depression because Buffy the Vampire Slayer got canceled. I'm your host, Ryan.
00:00:49
Shauna (she/her)
And I'm also depressed host, Shauna.
00:00:52
Ryan
And on this episode of Real Hot Nerd Shit, we'll be talking about Spider-Man No Way Home in our Phase 4 rewatch.
Special Guest and 'Buffy' Drama
00:01:00
Shauna (she/her)
and to do that, we have our special guest nerd of the week, snacks.
00:01:06
Ryan
Oh, hi, honey.
00:01:07
Shauna (she/her)
Welcome.
00:01:07
Snacks _he_him_
Hello.
00:01:09
Ryan
for joining us.
00:01:11
Snacks _he_him_
It's me.
00:01:13
Ryan
ay A returning cycle guest nerd. You know, always always ah a pleasure. But, okay, so we'll get to the bummer stuff in a second about Buffy.
00:01:25
Ryan
But first and foremost, I am so thrilled. Actually, Shauna, why don't you share the news the
Dodgeball Championship Victory
00:01:31
Ryan
first time?
00:01:31
Shauna (she/her)
Well, we had our local Stonewall Sports Dodgeball Championships today, and I am proud to announce that our team won that Snacks and I were on together, the Dodge Duck Dip Dive Doll.
00:01:41
Ryan
Congratulations!
00:01:46
Shauna (she/her)
Thank you.
00:01:51
Ryan
long-awaited first and well-deserved championship.
00:01:55
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
00:01:56
Ryan
It's wild that it it is your first championship from dodgeball specifically, but congratulations to both of you. Snacks, how do you feel as ah the...
00:02:08
Ryan
Shawna, you didn't get to play because you rightfully rested your wrist. That was like a really wild...
00:02:13
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah, I had jammed my thumb the week before real bad. It bruised up in a way that I was not happy about, but I was very grateful. My team won it for me, and they I trusted that they could do it without me, that I didn't need to put myself in harm's way potentially, and I'm really glad I did, and it was great to get into watch.
00:02:32
Shauna (she/her)
I shagged the heck out of those balls, making sure, helping chase down...
00:02:35
Ryan
Yeah,
00:02:36
Snacks _he_him_
She did. She was running all over the place.
00:02:39
Ryan
Ry, how does it feel, champ?
00:02:42
Snacks _he_him_
That feels great. I'm glad I got Shauna's first ever Stonewall Championship. This is my first dodgeball one, so that's nice. um
00:02:49
Ryan
Congrats.
00:02:50
Snacks _he_him_
And i decided to I decided to play my best games during the playoffs.
00:02:51
Shauna (she/her)
And he played so well too.
00:02:55
Snacks _he_him_
I played very well. I had a one on two at the end. It was the game. We were up 1-0 in the game. upper bracket finals. So like if we won, we make it to like the actual finals and just wait for the loser's bracket to finish.
00:03:10
Snacks _he_him_
And we're up 1-0 and we were going, if we lost that, we would 1-1 and do a tiebreaker. And it got down to me against two others and i got it.
00:03:19
Ryan
Congrats. Who did you get out first?
00:03:20
Snacks _he_him_
won.
00:03:21
Ryan
ah ah
00:03:27
Snacks _he_him_
i don't I don't know. It was pretty quick. um It didn't last very long. um I threw two balls and got two outs. I knew kyle Kyle had been jumping to dodge most of his balls.
00:03:37
Ryan
Yeah. Yeah. Work.
00:03:37
Snacks _he_him_
So I threw high on him and he jumped and hit him right in the stomach.
00:03:41
Snacks _he_him_
um And then Javon had like a little like, I don't think he threw it at me. Kind of paused for a bit and it was down to like maybe like two on ball control. and I just threw it and hit his thigh it was over.
00:03:53
Ryan
Work diva.
00:03:54
Shauna (she/her)
And he was, it was the perfect throw too, because he was like playing from like a defensive position, like crouched down on his knees, and it went just perfectly right underneath the block. You couldn't have put it any better.
00:04:04
Ryan
Yes.
00:04:06
Ryan
Congrats.
00:04:07
Shauna (she/her)
It was great. And some clutch catching too.
00:04:09
Snacks _he_him_
Yeah, was was I did catch a couple.
00:04:10
Shauna (she/her)
Mm-hmm.
00:04:11
Snacks _he_him_
So it was it was a pretty good day.
00:04:12
Ryan
No, yeah, well-deserved. A reminder that you know y'all are fucking good. Man, I i really miss playing dodgeball with like people that I know how to play with. And like rebuilding in a new city is taking a little bit longer than expected. But ah you know it's really fun when you win with your friends.
00:04:36
Snacks _he_him_
Yeah.
00:04:37
Shauna (she/her)
It is. It really is. And it's a really good team for that, too. Just really happy.
00:04:41
Ryan
Yeah.
00:04:42
Snacks _he_him_
It just felt, it felt fun. Like I know like it's easy to say that being on this side of it, but like it was, it was everything like this was the most balanced season I've ever played.
00:04:47
Ryan
Yeah. Right. Yeah.
00:04:52
Snacks _he_him_
Like every, every single, not just every game, every round was close. No one was ever run over in any of the games. It like, it was anyone's game. Like anyone could have won that.
Cancellation of 'Buffy' Reboot
00:05:01
Snacks _he_him_
Like the person, the people who made the finals, they won one game through the season.
00:05:05
Snacks _he_him_
um And they were the only ones that took a game off of us. They took two games off of us. So it was a very balanced, and just a good time. It was a very good time.
00:05:13
Ryan
yeah
00:05:14
Shauna (she/her)
Mm-hmm.
00:05:15
Ryan
And you played well. Like, one of those moments where even if you don't win, you know, again...
00:05:19
Snacks _he_him_
I also told myself, I was like, before the playoffs, when was driving up, i was like, I'm just going to sit out a lot. Like, I don't want to get into my head too much. So like every game, I don't know if Sean, if you noticed that, like I sat out every every time.
00:05:31
Snacks _he_him_
Because I was like, I'm just going to,
00:05:31
Shauna (she/her)
i did I didn't like pay that it was every time, but i noticed that you sat frequently and like, but honestly it was helpful because they're like, well, it's like, okay, who do you want to sit? I was like, well, honestly, i want who to sit, who wants to sit because there's only 10, like we had 10 people.
00:05:43
Ryan
Right.
00:05:44
Snacks _he_him_
Right. And I know like
00:05:45
Shauna (she/her)
So only two people needed to sit.
00:05:48
Snacks _he_him_
I know how how like look our team is like stacked with people who play consistently throughout the year. And I was like, I know that there are people here that should be playing most of the time. And while I had a good had a good day today, i knew that like I, throughout the season, was struggling a bit. um So mentally and skill-wise. So I was like, I'm just going to sit out and it'll be good for me in terms of not getting too, in my head, too competitive. And I was pretty relaxed. so
00:06:15
Shauna (she/her)
See, and I wouldn't say that you struggled this season.
00:06:15
Ryan
Sure.
00:06:17
Shauna (she/her)
I think that maybe, i I think that playing on a team with so many good players, it can feel that way if you don't do X, Y, or Z when you get your shot.
00:06:28
Shauna (she/her)
And I think that's sometimes a, like, why, a I don't like, and this is some inner dodgeball workings, but why I don't like using a five ball format versus a six ball format, because I think then the decisions are a lot less if three balls throw one.
00:06:28
Snacks _he_him_
Interesting.
00:06:41
Shauna (she/her)
If four balls, throw two. But in six ball, you have the option to throw two balls to go down to two and then get back. You'll still get back to three or just to throw one and you can split it around.
00:06:50
Snacks _he_him_
interesting
00:06:52
Shauna (she/her)
Three people get the ball. It just, I think, is a better system for making sure more people get throws, in my opinion.
00:06:58
Snacks _he_him_
This is by far the most talented team I've been on. There was no weak spot. Everyone was everyone was good.
00:07:03
Ryan
Wow.
00:07:04
Shauna (she/her)
No. And we had newcomers, too, like which were in their first season, and they really picked up on it, and I was really happy for it.
00:07:05
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
00:07:07
Ryan
Yeah.
00:07:12
Ryan
Congratulations. I'm super, super stoked for y'all.
00:07:13
Shauna (she/her)
Thank you.
00:07:15
Ryan
This was our I think second to last kickball team that I played on. And I chose to wear this because it does kind of look like a spider, it kind of looks like, you know, Spider-Man colors, but because ah this is ah ah a Buffy reference,
00:07:21
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
00:07:32
Ryan
And we learned yesterday from none other than Sarah Michelle Gellar that Hulu's broke, ugly bitch asses decided to not pick up the Buffy reboot, New Sunnydale.
00:07:33
Snacks _he_him_
Hey.
00:07:47
Ryan
ah And I just keep having moments as the during the intro where I remember and I get so sad because i you know, we talked we've talked about it before, but Sarah Michelle Gellar was always very resistant to doing a Buffy reboot because she only wanted it to be done by, you know, the right people in the right circumstances and blah, blah, blah.
00:08:14
Ryan
And the fact that she said yes, and it was attached to a director who we'd just watched one of their films and like agreed that would be a really cool director to have. Like, it just...
00:08:27
Ryan
it it meant that I thought it would be loved by people who loved the show. And I'm really curious what the rationale is. what What did you think? You said something the other day or yesterday, Shauna, that did you have a rationale?
00:08:45
Shauna (she/her)
I think my rationale on it is i feel they want to just reboot it completely. i think that they want to, they did not like the direction.
00:08:51
Ryan
Yeah.
00:08:55
Shauna (she/her)
i think, I wonder if there was some potential apprehension because of how the Eternals performed. And I wonder if they were nervous that this would underperform in a way similar to that.
00:09:08
Ryan
Well, Eternals was so specific, though. It was like, you know, running in the pandemic and there's a built-in audience of people who are who have been chomping at the fucking bit to to see this.
00:09:11
Shauna (she/her)
Very true.
00:09:21
Ryan
I think that... um I think there's some truth to what you're saying, as much as I don't want to admit it. um I'm curious. The fact that Sarah Michelle Gellar announced it, like...
00:09:37
Ryan
that feels a little like, okay, so maybe they didn't like her in it. Maybe i have a feeling it came down to like them wanting to change it to a certain degree and Sarah Michelle Gellar saying no.
00:09:51
Ryan
And so it was ultimately, you know, like her decision to, and that's, I'm just but speculating, but um you know, I, I hope it's for the best.
00:09:58
Snacks _he_him_
Sure.
00:10:02
Ryan
If I'm being honest, like if this pilot leaks and it fucking ate, I'm going to be really pissed.
00:10:08
Shauna (she/her)
They really, I, like someone needs to leak it, is all I'm saying, because I think we deserve to know. We deserve to know, is it oh, and maybe we'll watch it and be like, I actually
Reboot Success vs. Struggle
00:10:17
Shauna (she/her)
get it. But i I doubt that.
00:10:18
Ryan
Yeah.
00:10:19
Shauna (she/her)
I feel like it's going to be where, and maybe this is just a problem with television these days, is that enough shows do, they have to be hits right off the bat. And if they are not, then that is that.
00:10:29
Ryan
Right.
00:10:31
Shauna (she/her)
And I think that is just such a absolute mistake.
00:10:32
Ryan
Right.
00:10:35
Shauna (she/her)
And so much of our recent televised history of the last 20 years is giving shows that need to feel their way out, need to find it through their first season.
00:10:45
Shauna (she/her)
And we can look at so many countless examples of shows that did that and then became great shows. So even if the pilot is a little rough and they need to do reshoots, they needed to kind of rework some things, they deserve the opportunity.
00:10:50
Ryan
Yeah.
00:10:53
Ryan
Right. I think, um, yeah.
00:10:59
Ryan
i think um
00:10:59
Shauna (she/her)
And that's a lot there is to it.
00:10:59
Snacks _he_him_
hard it's a hard gamble though you know there's this it's
00:11:01
Ryan
yeah
00:11:03
Snacks _he_him_
that Hollywood isn't doing great right now in terms of with all the, before with the strike and with less people watching TV, less people, there's like, there's less money involved in terms of like residuals and all that stuff. It's just, it's from like a perspective of like giving it a shot It's hard, you know, because while there are examples of like shows where you give it a chance and and they they they grow and they become what they are, there are plenty that did not.
00:11:29
Shauna (she/her)
Sure.
00:11:36
Snacks _he_him_
So.
00:11:36
Ryan
Yeah. Well, and I think you're the most um detached from it to be able to say, like, I can, it's, it is a reboot. So like, I think first and foremost, that was like the biggest risk is that it was a continuation, I think.
00:11:50
Ryan
And like, know.
00:11:51
Snacks _he_him_
Right, but there's been so many reboots that have been coming out lately.
00:11:52
Ryan
Yeah.
00:11:55
Snacks _he_him_
like Scrubs just restarted.
00:11:56
Shauna (she/her)
Scrubs.
00:11:57
Snacks _he_him_
Um...
00:11:57
Ryan
Well, not to fucking jump right into the next point, but it was revealed today that the final boy fucking Joss Whedon show is getting turned into an animated series.
00:11:57
Snacks _he_him_
um
00:12:11
Ryan
Firefly starring Nathan Fillion that got one series and a follow-up and or one season and a follow-up movie is getting an animated series. But we can't get...
00:12:22
Snacks _he_him_
that was canceled after for one season. So that was one that was.
00:12:24
Ryan
What'd you say?
00:12:24
Shauna (she/her)
It was.
00:12:26
Ryan
Yeah.
00:12:27
Snacks _he_him_
didn
00:12:29
Ryan
Yeah. Someone made a good point recently that Buffy would never have gotten made today.
00:12:36
Ryan
Like the first season is so mid.
00:12:37
Shauna (she/her)
Well, it didn't.
00:12:40
Ryan
Well, okay. You're out of line, but you're, you're not wrong.
00:12:45
Snacks _he_him_
yeah
00:12:45
Ryan
um But like the first season of original Buffy of Vampire Slayer is mid. It's tough to watch.
00:12:52
Shauna (she/her)
Absolutely. It's the worst season by far. And, but I think there's something also to that is this show that had female leads, female led, that is probably going to be queer.
00:12:55
Ryan
Yes.
00:13:02
Ryan
Totally.
00:13:04
Shauna (she/her)
That is with, you know, I'm sure they're looking to add people of color and i believe the, I'm not surprised that this didn't get picked up.
00:13:05
Ryan
Totally.
00:13:09
Ryan
Yeah. It's message in general. like So that was what that was one of the other things that i was definitely thinking is like, It is arguably an extremely woke show.
00:13:21
Ryan
And i mean,
00:13:23
Ryan
But it there's like a a monopoly of people who are making television right
'Buffy' as Societal Allegory
00:13:31
Ryan
now And so, yeah, it's like all the same people making fucking decisions about these programs. And Buffy would have been a very progressive, like you said, extremely inclusive. And like, more importantly, the entire, the entire message of the show, like where Slayerdom comes from is an allegory for how we fucking treat women in this country. Like the mission of the program is a problem itself.
00:14:02
Ryan
Anyways. Okay, so let's get into, any other thoughts on Buffy before we jump?
00:14:09
Shauna (she/her)
Look, and I'm not even, like, upset about Firefly getting a cartoon. Like, I enjoyed it.
00:14:13
Ryan
Sure.
00:14:14
Shauna (she/her)
Like, and I i think it's one of the ones that you have not seen, correct? Because did you watch Dollhouse?
00:14:18
Ryan
I keep trying, I tried. I've watched the entire first season of Dollhouse. and I didn't like the way that that season ended. and that's, like, knowing what we know now, we've talked about this before, knowing what we know now about Joss Whedon, I can't consume that show.
00:14:30
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
00:14:33
Ryan
that is just absolutely awful.
00:14:34
Shauna (she/her)
That's fair.
00:14:36
Ryan
But, yeah, it feels really weird.
00:14:36
Shauna (she/her)
Feels weird. I don't get it. But Fireflies, I enjoy it it.
00:14:39
Ryan
Firefly, I... i have I tried since I've moved moved to Chicago.
00:14:41
Shauna (she/her)
I don't know.
00:14:43
Ryan
like Within the last year, have tried, and I watched the first episode, and I'm just like, I think I'm going to watch Living Single start to finish instead.
00:14:45
Shauna (she/her)
Really?
00:14:52
Ryan
And that keeps happening. Like, you know, it just...
00:14:56
Snacks _he_him_
Does it remind you of it?
00:14:56
Shauna (she/her)
You just keep watching it living single...
00:14:58
Snacks _he_him_
okay
00:14:59
Shauna (she/her)
ah
00:14:59
Ryan
Oh, no. um I have since finished in living Living Single. Okay.
00:15:04
Shauna (she/her)
but
00:15:05
Ryan
Yeah, it's a bummer. I think that... um The reason I also really like the Buffy comics is because it gets so out there. Like, Buffy is out there. It gets even more out there in the comics. Like, there's a fucking dragon in season... Like, magic is... It it could be a really cool animated show.
00:15:25
Ryan
And it's just a shame that, you know... Buffy was right there. It was right there. you could You gave it to... But Buffy was right there and all the talent. And vampires... the Angel and Spike could have been in it without it being weird because they're old as fuck.
00:15:45
Ryan
Like...
00:15:45
Ryan
They're so fucking old.
00:15:45
Shauna (she/her)
They're so old.
00:15:48
Ryan
Like... One final thing in the very last episode of Buffy and in Chosen. i i think they are making like a tongue-in-cheek reference because ah when...
00:15:48
Shauna (she/her)
oh
00:16:01
Ryan
Buffy and Angel have their like final scene and they're talking about cookies and shit and like, you know, the metaphor cookies. That's like Kings of comedy reference. um Angel says, I'm not getting any, I'm not getting any younger.
00:16:16
Ryan
And he looks visibly older than when the show starts. Like he looks like um an old man. He's a businessman. And it just, to me,
00:16:27
Shauna (she/her)
He's a grown ass man. Like in the R. But like.
00:16:32
Ryan
That is a grown-ass man, and he has filled out... Okay, anyway, so speaking of grown-ass men, let's jump into our ah topic of today, which is Spider-Man No Way Home.
Marvel Phase 4 Recap
00:16:43
Ryan
Before we do that, this is part of our Phase 4 rewatch. um Rai, you are pretty much up to speed with all the marvelble Marvel movies, right?
00:16:53
Ryan
Okay.
00:16:54
Snacks _he_him_
Right, I haven't missed one.
00:16:56
Ryan
Okay. um what So phase four, I'm going to really quickly remind you what is in phase four. um Because I... I want to get your response to how phase four um has gone, so you know, how phase four went. Cause I think we're in phase five now, but there are a couple of movies in there. I'm going to name the movie and then I want you to just respond to what you thought of it.
'Spider-Man No Way Home' Reactions
00:17:23
Ryan
First time this time, it doesn't really matter. um Okay. Black Widow.
00:17:31
Snacks _he_him_
Oh god. That was so solid. remember liking that movie.
00:17:36
Ryan
Okay.
00:17:36
Shauna (she/her)
Thank you.
00:17:38
Ryan
um shang chi and the legend of the ten rings yeah yeah eternals
00:17:42
Snacks _he_him_
I loved that movie. I really did. i'm I'm disappointed that we haven't seen him since. i know we'll see him in Doomsday, but I did really like better than what people said it was going to be.
00:17:57
Snacks _he_him_
But I could see the problems. just i was supposed to care about all these characters I've never seen before very quickly, and it didn't feel like I get a lot of character development for all of them.
00:18:00
Ryan
sure
00:18:07
Ryan
Agreed.
00:18:07
Snacks _he_him_
It kind of felt like it was a bit of a a waste.
00:18:11
Ryan
Overload. m
00:18:12
Snacks _he_him_
Yeah.
00:18:13
Ryan
um Spider-Man No Way Home. Obviously, this is the movie we're talking about. What did what did you think about Spider-Man No Way Home?
00:18:19
Snacks _he_him_
ah Yeah, I remember watching it the first time and being really overjoyed and thrilled. But a lot, I think we can get into this later because don't want go too much detail. A lot of my joy and enjoyment from that movie was the nostalgia attached to it and being amongst a lot of people that were like the reactions to it.
00:18:33
Ryan
Yeah.
00:18:36
Snacks _he_him_
And watching it again, it wasn't the same.
00:18:38
Ryan
yeah yeah yeah the the sheen wore off from like you know seeing first time doctor strange in the multi-reverse of madness
00:18:39
Snacks _he_him_
So it kind just felt like it was pretty good.
00:18:45
Snacks _he_him_
Right.
00:18:53
Snacks _he_him_
Hit and miss, I think. There were some good parts on it. There were some really bad parts from it. And specifically that that fight scene with the music notes. I will never forget how I rolled my eyes. I rolled my eyes so hard. I don think I pulled a muscle in my eye socket. i was it was I will always remember that being one of my least favorite scenes in the MCU.
00:19:10
Ryan
Like, period. Agreed. Very much so agreed.
00:19:12
Snacks _he_him_
Period.
00:19:13
Ryan
What about Thor Love and Thunder?
00:19:16
Snacks _he_him_
Were these two in a row?
00:19:18
Ryan
Yes, they will.
00:19:19
Ryan
Yes,
00:19:19
Snacks _he_him_
Oh no, how are we surviving?
00:19:21
Shauna (she/her)
Hmm.
00:19:22
Ryan
they
00:19:22
Snacks _he_him_
That's one of my least favorite movies point blank period, not just in the MCU.
00:19:22
Ryan
Yes, they they will.
00:19:26
Snacks _he_him_
I hated that movie. It was so bad. It was so bad. Oh, okay. So forget forget the music note scene. The worst scene I've seen of all time was when Natalie Portman and um Valkyrie, who plays Valkyrie, this song, and they're holding up a speaker or some sort.
00:19:41
Ryan
Esa Thompson.
00:19:45
Snacks _he_him_
They were like grabbing things to like travel And they were like, it I don't remember for exactly what it was, but they like, so they he she held up a speaker. It's like, what oh, what is this? Does it have like a trick trick? Oh, but it's a speaker. And she turns the music on.
00:19:56
Snacks _he_him_
And it just like awkwardly like beat, like bopped to it for like four whole seconds. And I'm looking at it like,
00:20:02
Ryan
Oh.
00:20:06
Ryan
I low-key...
00:20:07
Snacks _he_him_
it's unfortunate because Taki, who's the director?
00:20:10
Ryan
Taika Waititi.
00:20:12
Snacks _he_him_
Taki Oachidi. He did Ragnarok, which was fantastic. And this was just, Trash.
00:20:18
Ryan
Yeah.
00:20:19
Snacks _he_him_
Real bad.
00:20:20
Ryan
I kind of want to have you on for that.
00:20:20
Shauna (she/her)
Well...
00:20:21
Ryan
We talked about having you on for that one. Just for fun.
00:20:24
Snacks _he_him_
That means i have to watch it again. Don't make me do that.
00:20:28
Ryan
um And then phase four ends with Black Panther Wakanda Forever. Yeah. Beautiful.
00:20:36
Snacks _he_him_
um Beautiful movie. um I will never forgive them for killing off Angela Bassett.
00:20:41
Ryan
Yeah.
00:20:43
Snacks _he_him_
I literally thought it was unnecessary. ah
00:20:45
Ryan
It was. All it did was just, it's like, you know, a specific trope. All it did was move the plot along. It made Shuri angry. We're going to do that movie. So, you know, we don't have to go too deep into it now, but okay. So what, how would you, how would you score phase four overall? Like a grade scale?
00:21:06
Snacks _he_him_
It's hard coming off of Phase 3, because Phase 3 was so good and ended with Infinity War and Endgame, which people consider like the peak of MCU.
00:21:09
Ryan
Mm-hmm.
00:21:14
Ryan
Yeah. Stinkers. Yeah.
00:21:14
Snacks _he_him_
um
00:21:15
Snacks _he_him_
They had some good movies in there, you know, the Spider-Man, the Wakanda Forever, But there's there's some there's some there's some stinkers in there that they have not experienced.
00:21:25
Ryan
st
00:21:28
Snacks _he_him_
like I remember when Eternals came out, it made a huge deal about how this being like the first like disappointment in the MCU, and it kind of continued. um So I would probably rate this maybe like a B minus, C plus.
00:21:42
Ryan
I was thinking, like, I would honestly, but it's not, you thank you. Thank you for your opinion. i don't have to share mine in return because we're going to keep doing these movies and I want to come back to it.
00:21:50
Snacks _he_him_
Are you carrying that?
00:21:55
Ryan
But like rereading that list, specifically Thor Love and Thunder. And um I love Dr. dr Strange Multiverse of Madness, but know.
00:22:07
Ryan
Thor Love and Thunder is bad.
00:22:10
Snacks _he_him_
So bad.
00:22:10
Ryan
Like, it it it drops the fucking average, like, way down.
00:22:11
Snacks _he_him_
bad.
00:22:16
Snacks _he_him_
What were the TV shows that were in phase four?
00:22:20
Ryan
will take MCU TV.
00:22:22
Snacks _he_him_
Because there was there was, I did not watch two TV shows.
00:22:24
Ryan
That was WandaVision.
00:22:26
Snacks _he_him_
WandaVision was great.
00:22:27
Ryan
Yeah.
00:22:28
Snacks _he_him_
It was okay.
00:22:28
Ryan
Falcon the Winter Soldier. Yeah, it was fine. Loki Season 1.
00:22:34
Snacks _he_him_
Bookie was good.
00:22:36
Ryan
What If Season 1.
00:22:39
Snacks _he_him_
i did not watch season two, but I watched season one though. Didn't really feel like it was part of it though.
00:22:44
Ryan
Sure.
00:22:44
Snacks _he_him_
i mean, it was was kind of, it kind of laid in with the,
00:22:45
Shauna (she/her)
What if had a... i
00:22:48
Snacks _he_him_
the multiverse and all that stuff but like a lot of the stories because they were so like trying stuff stuff new it didn't feel like it didn't feel like canon
00:22:58
Ryan
sure Well, it's not. it's That's the whole point of What If is like, it's a series of comics where it's like, what if you know Captain Carter instead of Captain captain America? um But yeah, that's, the next was Hawkeye, which I think I remember you liking.
00:23:15
Snacks _he_him_
i like hawkeye yeah
00:23:17
Shauna (she/her)
I liked it.
00:23:18
Ryan
Yeah, same. And then Moon Knight, Ms. Marvel, She-Hulk.
00:23:23
Snacks _he_him_
I liked Moon Knight. I did not watch Ms. Marvel. and I liked She-Hulk.
00:23:27
Shauna (she/her)
I liked Ms. Marvel.
00:23:28
Snacks _he_him_
I know there was a lot of discussion and rigamarole around it, but I really liked that.
00:23:29
Ryan
I love She-Hulk.
00:23:34
Snacks _he_him_
The breaking of the fourth wall all the time.
00:23:34
Ryan
Yeah. Yeah.
00:23:37
Snacks _he_him_
It was very, i thought it was very well done.
00:23:39
Ryan
She-Hulk, She-Hulk is literally just a victim of toxic nerd culture. Like, it it is a perfect, wonderful, funny, and not perfect, it is a very good, funny, consistently funny show that it's it's good if you don't have a bitch telling you it's bad in your ear, you know what i mean?
00:23:52
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
00:23:58
Shauna (she/her)
The nerds who are very excited about a Firefly animated series also hated She-Hulk.
00:24:06
Shauna (she/her)
Just saying.
00:24:07
Ryan
um i know one specific nerd named jake i don't know if jake listens but he's my we've gamed with him before um jake is a guy that loved firefly um but would not have hated she hulk i think he would have liked jake she hulk Okay, so let's, I'm gonna start with the first act and I included that cast list just because I think one of the things that I do wanna talk about is like, since it's multiversal, like, you know, this is the first introduction to the multiverse for real. Like, I think this is the first episode or the first movie where they acknowledge the multiverse, they acknowledge that, you know, other universes exist.
00:24:49
Ryan
um And so I kept finding myself being like, I love that Zendaya is MJ. Like, and I love that she's not Mary Jane Watson. Like, you know, she's Michelle Jones Watson. and Like it's a different character, but it still works. But, um,
00:25:05
Ryan
Yeah, let's jump right into it. So act one starts with, the film picks up immediately after Far From Home with Mysterio's dying message revealing Peter Parker as Spider-Man to the entire world.
00:25:19
Ryan
Peter, MJ, and Ned face intense public scrutiny and legal investigation by the government. Their futures are derailed. MIT rejects all three of them and Peter desperately seeks a way to undo the chaos.
00:25:33
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
00:25:33
Ryan
Thoughts about this opening act?
00:25:38
Shauna (she/her)
Man, it sucks to be Peter Parker.
00:25:41
Ryan
That is actually the, that's the theme of the other third Spider-Man movie. Spider-Man 3 with Tobey Maguire. It sucks to be Peter Parker. Like, that's the entire end of that movie.
00:25:50
Shauna (she/her)
No, really and truly. Well, and I guess I just don't understand how Like, I get there's controversy, but like, really? There's no Avengers in infrastructure that can pull a string to get this kid into a fucking halfway decent college and his friends?
00:26:05
Shauna (she/her)
Like, really? Really? That's what we're going to try and convince ourselves? Now, that's a fiction, that there is not a power in the universe to get a fucking superhero who saved the world into a goddamn college.
00:26:15
Ryan
Yeah.
00:26:16
Shauna (she/her)
Like, come on, what are we doing?
00:26:17
Ryan
Right. Right. um Okay. So I have, I took my own notes. I don't know if you all did. um My first note is i love Zendaya and Tom together. Allegedly they're really married in real life.
00:26:32
Ryan
Mazel tov to the happy couple. um And there's a funny part where, uh, someone says, oh are you Spider-Man's girlfriend? And I said, no, that's his wife, bitch.
00:26:45
Ryan
Oh, wow. um Okay, both of you played the original Spider-Man 2, right? On PlayStation 2.
00:26:52
Shauna (she/her)
Yes.
00:26:53
Ryan
Do you remember, did you say yes, Ryan?
00:26:55
Snacks _he_him_
No, I never owned a PS2.
00:26:58
Ryan
I thought that's like a whole thing that you've owned every...
00:27:01
Snacks _he_him_
No, I did not have any console as a kid. I only had handhelds. Parents wouldn't allow it. My first actual console was a PS4.
00:27:06
Ryan
Interesting.
00:27:10
Ryan
Interesting. Okay. um So, Shawna, do you remember the side quests that they started giving you in Spider-Man 2? It's still in the game now, but there is a of a voice note of someone going, hey, Spider-Man! And it sounded exactly like the Spider-Man 2 game, and I cannot help but wonder if they did that on purpose.
00:27:32
Ryan
um
00:27:33
Shauna (she/her)
Ooh, I could see a
00:27:34
Ryan
But I'm guessing you probably didn't um you probably didn't notice that.
00:27:39
Shauna (she/her)
No, I did not. That was not, unfortunately, something that I picked up on, but I like i hope that it is true.
00:27:44
Ryan
Yeah. So during this first act, we also are get a fun little sort of crossover, our first real crossover with Matt Murdock entering as Peter Parker's lawyer.
00:27:58
Ryan
ah Yeah. Me too.
00:27:58
Shauna (she/her)
Which, I love this scene.
00:28:01
Shauna (she/her)
i think this is a great, obviously, Matt Murdock is going to jump to defend Peter Parker in a situation like this. I love the way he reached out for The Rock, and he's like, well, I'm a good lawyer, and it's true.
00:28:13
Ryan
Yeah.
00:28:14
Shauna (she/her)
But just, I almost wish that he kind of let him in but i I understand why he didn't.
00:28:21
Ryan
Which, which.
00:28:21
Shauna (she/her)
But I love this, inner to let me let him know that I'm a superhero too, i got it.
00:28:27
Ryan
Yeah.
00:28:28
Ryan
Yeah.
00:28:28
Shauna (she/her)
But I just feel like there's, as I want more of a ground build of these street-level New York superheroes, and of course we're getting that because The Punisher is going to be in this upcoming Spider-Man movie.
00:28:40
Shauna (she/her)
And so really kind of continue that theme, which I'm happy for.
00:28:41
Ryan
Yeah.
00:28:45
Shauna (she/her)
But I love seeing Matt Murdock as a cameo. I think it makes so much sense.
00:28:50
Ryan
especially because Charlie Cox is a hottie. What did you say?
00:28:52
Snacks _he_him_
So hot.
00:28:52
Shauna (she/her)
That's true.
00:28:53
Snacks _he_him_
I just, I love i love him.
00:28:55
Ryan
Yeah. He's like so fucking hot. Um, so not actually blind, which is kind of problematic when you think about it.
00:28:59
Shauna (she/her)
Not actually blind. Yeah. An actor.
00:29:05
Ryan
They, they do need to get a blind actor for just to do martial arts stunts like Matt Murdock.
00:29:11
Snacks _he_him_
might be a dangerous death.
00:29:11
Ryan
Um,
00:29:12
Shauna (she/her)
Isn't Echo actually blind? If I'm if i'm not mistaken?
00:29:14
Ryan
Yes, no, no. Echo is actually the actress that plays act Echo is actually deaf.
00:29:16
Shauna (she/her)
or is that...
00:29:20
Shauna (she/her)
or or deaf. i Yes, that is the one I meant to say it and did not say.
00:29:23
Ryan
Yes. Yes, yeah.
00:29:24
Shauna (she/her)
Thank you.
00:29:25
Ryan
She's deaf and she also um uses a prosthetic leg, which I'm pretty sure is canon to the the character as well.
00:29:30
Shauna (she/her)
Oh, right.
00:29:34
Ryan
um
00:29:34
Snacks _he_him_
Do you think it'd be like difficult to try? Because like, yes, Daredevil is blind, but the the stunts that he does would be hard for someone who can see.
00:29:42
Shauna (she/her)
What?
00:29:43
Ryan
Yeah, well, you know, I don't imagine that the stunt person has to be blind too.
00:29:44
Shauna (she/her)
Very true.
00:29:48
Snacks _he_him_
Sure, that's true.
00:29:51
Ryan
But Charlie charlieley Cox does a lot of the, like, hand-to-hand combat.
00:29:52
Shauna (she/her)
Uh.
00:29:56
Ryan
Like, so, you know, okay, we don't need to justify using TV person.
00:29:57
Snacks _he_him_
Right.
00:29:58
Shauna (she/her)
Marvel what if.
00:30:00
Snacks _he_him_
I mean, I could about Charlie the Cox all day. he
00:30:06
Ryan
What if the actor that played Matt Murdock was actually blind?
00:30:10
Shauna (she/her)
No, what if the stuntmen were...
00:30:14
Ryan
Yeah, definitely not and not any more problematic Okay. Agreed. I'm sure you agreed.
00:30:21
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah, definitely the more...
00:30:21
Ryan
bought
00:30:22
Shauna (she/her)
oh Probably a good road they didn't go down. The the road less traveled.
00:30:28
Ryan
so yeah agreed
00:30:29
Shauna (she/her)
yeah
00:30:29
Snacks _he_him_
Where did you guys watch this, by the way? Did you guys like rent it from Amazon or did you, I noticed a lot of scenes that were not, that I did not remember.
00:30:34
Shauna (she/her)
I rented it.
00:30:37
Ryan
bought it
00:30:40
Snacks _he_him_
and i think there were like, just like extra scenes that they cut and put back, especially in the school scene. When they went back to school, there was like a lot of stuff that I was like, can't remember this.
00:30:47
Shauna (she/her)
You're right. I don't know that I remembered the scene with both JB Smoove and with Martin Starr.
00:30:53
Ryan
With the teachers.
00:30:55
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
00:30:55
Snacks _he_him_
Yeah, when they were giving the interviews and stuff,
00:30:55
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
00:30:56
Ryan
No, i I distinctly remember all of that.
00:31:00
Snacks _he_him_
Really, it's just been a while.
00:31:01
Shauna (she/her)
Hmm.
00:31:01
Ryan
Yeah.
00:31:02
Snacks _he_him_
You know, when um Tom and then, i remember, like, I remember when Tom and like Zendaya had their, like, you know, their Ruby Bridges moment when they were walking up to the school.
00:31:08
Ryan
Not Ruby Bridges, Ryan.
00:31:09
Snacks _he_him_
Sorry. Where everyone was like yelling at them while they're trying to go to school.
00:31:11
Ryan
Not Ruby Bridges.
00:31:14
Shauna (she/her)
Hmm.
00:31:15
Snacks _he_him_
as That's the first thing that popped in my mind. I was like, whoa.
00:31:17
Ryan
Turns out it was actually because they're an interracial couple.
00:31:17
Shauna (she/her)
Hmm.
00:31:18
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
00:31:19
Ryan
It had nothing to do with him being Spider-Man. It's because they're an interracial couple. People really hated it.
00:31:26
Snacks _he_him_
So I remember that part, but when they walked in and the guy was talking about how he believes Mysterio, like the PE teacher something, and even the PE scene where they were telling him to climb up the wall, climb up the wall. I was like, I don't remember any of this.
00:31:43
Snacks _he_him_
Do you remember that?
00:31:43
Ryan
didn't have anything. Mine didn't have a scene where... Peter's like climbing up a wall in gym class.
00:31:49
Snacks _he_him_
Oh, I had that. And I was like, this is you may have just like missed a couple.
00:31:50
Ryan
Okay, wait. maybe i Maybe I just don't remember it.
00:31:53
Shauna (she/her)
No, I don't remember this either. I don't know...
00:31:55
Snacks _he_him_
Okay, maybe I watched a couple, like I rented it off of...
00:31:56
Shauna (she/her)
Now I'm...
00:31:58
Ryan
Did you watch the right movie?
00:32:00
Snacks _he_him_
Yes, yes, I promise I'll write right I promise I'll watch the right movie i promise to watch my movie.
00:32:01
Ryan
Did anyone start having sex at any point? Okay.
00:32:05
Shauna (she/her)
o
00:32:05
Snacks _he_him_
I rented it from Amazon Prime. And there was like...
00:32:07
Ryan
Okay, got it.
00:32:08
Shauna (she/her)
No, not that web shooter.
00:32:10
Ryan
Shauna!
00:32:10
Snacks _he_him_
okay but
00:32:13
Ryan
Arguably one of the better parts.
00:32:13
Snacks _he_him_
But like the school, I remember the school...
00:32:15
Shauna (she/her)
Wait, yours is prosthetic? I used the one that I'm... No, anyways.
00:32:20
Ryan
Yeah.
00:32:21
Snacks _he_him_
I remember just like the the whole school scene for me took like 20 minutes. um There was, was there a part where like the, the girl who plays ah Katie in the, the yeah ah or in the, yeah.
00:32:33
Ryan
Oh, Betty, bet Betty Brandt, the reporter.
00:32:37
Snacks _he_him_
She did all the interviews with all the different um students and the teachers one-on-one where they were like sitting and she was like interviewing them.
00:32:37
Ryan
Yeah.
00:32:44
Snacks _he_him_
you know You see, this is this was this took like five to six minutes. And I was like, I don't remember any of this.
00:32:48
Ryan
I don't think
00:32:50
Snacks _he_him_
And I realized like this is probably stuff that they cut and it makes sense because it has nothing to do with the pods.
00:32:55
Ryan
Yeah, like you were describing it and i was like, yeah, I thought, I assumed you were going to talk about the part where she says like, go get him, Tiger. And like, no, that's like the only time you see Betty Brandt or whatever her name is.
00:33:07
Ryan
Interesting.
00:33:07
Snacks _he_him_
Yeah, no, there were a couple of deleted scenes that i that I definitely got.
00:33:10
Snacks _he_him_
There was like one like random 30-second scene where they were yelling at Peter Parker to climb up the wall in gym class, and he finally jumped up on the wall and did it. And it was like silent and like awkward.
00:33:21
Snacks _he_him_
And then it jumped to the next scene. and I was like, this was, I'm glad they cut that.
00:33:26
Ryan
Okay, well, um the let's jump into the next
00:33:28
Snacks _he_him_
so
00:33:32
Ryan
act um Peter turns to Doctor Strange, who agrees to cast a memory erasing spell so the world forgets Peter. Peter keeps interrupting the spell mid-cast to add exceptions, causing it to fracture and crack open the multiverse.
00:33:46
Snacks _he_him_
Electra.
00:33:49
Ryan
Villains from other universes, Doc Ock, Electro, Sandman, the Lizard, and Green Goblin begin arriving in Peter's world.
00:33:58
Shauna (she/her)
Okay, wait. Who are all the villains? Isn't it... It's a Electra...
00:34:01
Snacks _he_him_
Right.
00:34:02
Shauna (she/her)
like Electro...
00:34:03
Ryan
Doc Ock, Doc Ock, Electro, Sandman, the Lizard, and Green Goblin.
00:34:03
Snacks _he_him_
electra
00:34:10
Shauna (she/her)
why five villains? When literally Spider-Man's biggest thing...
00:34:14
Ryan
The Sinister Six right there. It's right there.
00:34:19
Shauna (she/her)
Like, what was what's his name?
00:34:20
Ryan
Great point.
00:34:22
Shauna (she/her)
The Vulture? Not available that they couldn't just bring him in so you have someone from the past and then... the like his past coming to attack him like
00:34:28
Ryan
Yeah.
00:34:30
Snacks _he_him_
What's his name?
00:34:30
Ryan
Yeah, they could have brought in the Rhino from The Amazing Spider-Man.
00:34:30
Snacks _he_him_
Michael.
00:34:34
Shauna (she/her)
yeah and actually had a sinister six because now we're just not going to get it
00:34:39
Ryan
Yeah. That's funny. I kind of didn't... I don't know that I put that together until right now.
00:34:42
Snacks _he_him_
think about that.
00:34:45
Ryan
OK, so Peter goes to visit Doctor Strange.
00:34:49
Ryan
um first and foremost, the Doctor Strange wig is bad. did Did anyone else notice how bad the wig was?
00:34:57
Snacks _he_him_
I did not, no.
00:34:57
Shauna (she/her)
Mm-mm.
00:34:58
Ryan
it was really, really bad. And maybe it's just because i you know, I've watched it a couple times, you know, since it's come out. um But something that I thought was interesting was...
00:35:11
Ryan
he uh dr strange says to peter that he's trying to live two lives like as spider-man and peter parker um and we know that that is going to be like part of the next movie but that is also again very much so what the third original spider-man with toby mcguire is is like he's really struggling to be peter parker he loses his powers for a little bit that's the third one right yeah um
00:35:37
Snacks _he_him_
I haven't seen them since they were in theaters.
00:35:37
Shauna (she/her)
I think so. Actually, actually i think he loses his powers in the second one. Doesn't he?
00:35:44
Snacks _he_him_
I don't remember.
00:35:45
Shauna (she/her)
I don't remember.
00:35:46
Ryan
Yeah, the third one is when vet he gets the Venom, the symbiote, so maybe it is the second one.
00:35:50
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah, because what's his name? um
00:35:53
Ryan
Not...
00:35:53
Shauna (she/her)
Topher Grace is Venom.
00:35:53
Snacks _he_him_
That's Felicia.
00:35:54
Ryan
Yeah, not Tobey Maguire. the The two white men that I do often get convinced, confused with each other. Tobey Maguire Topher Grace. Um... So the car that the admissions lady is in is the same car as mine. And I thought that that was really interesting. But the Easter egg that I picked up on, anytime I see a license plate, I always assume that it's some sort of not a nod to like a comic or something, especially in um Marvel movies.
00:36:21
Ryan
But...
00:36:22
Shauna (she/her)
Sure.
00:36:23
Ryan
the license plate was 63A5M, which is also not the standard format for a license plate. So I Googled it and it is believed that it's a reference to the 1963 Amazing Spider-Man number three, which is the first appearance of Doc Ock, who is the villain that returns first. um thoughts on seeing the the villains again the these these baddies from other universes did you all see the other spider-man so shauna you said okay you did you see the toby uh thank you did you at all
00:37:03
Shauna (she/her)
Andrew Garfield.
00:37:03
Snacks _he_him_
Andrew Garfield.
00:37:05
Shauna (she/her)
I actually didn't see the Andrew Garfield movies.
00:37:08
Snacks _he_him_
Oh, did. I did.
00:37:09
Shauna (she/her)
Not for any reason. Like, though, i kind of get the idea. Like, I got the idea. Like...
00:37:15
Ryan
I mean, it's, yeah, they were okay. They were, of the three Toms, or of the three Peters, that I think that that's string of movies was the worst.
00:37:15
Snacks _he_him_
They were okay.
00:37:26
Shauna (she/her)
Well, so I, my personal belief is that Tobey Maguire is the best Peter Parker. Andrew Garfield is the best Spider-Man. And Tom Holland is the best combination of the two. Because he's very, he is a great Peter Parker and a great Spider-Man because he has both the wit and the cleverness.
00:37:36
Ryan
Interesting.
00:37:42
Shauna (she/her)
But like, I feel like Tobey Maguire isn't very believable as this like witty, sarcastic Spider- He's he's dorky dad energy, like as we will see
00:37:52
Ryan
Yes.
00:37:52
Snacks _he_him_
and
00:37:53
Shauna (she/her)
Like even when he was 16, he had dorky dad energy.
00:37:56
Ryan
green Agreed. Agreed. um Okay, so these villains coming back, Doc Ock, I loved Doc. Spider-Man 2 was my favorite, maybe out of all of them, like, including the contemporary Spider-Men, like,
00:38:11
Ryan
I feel such a love for that franchise because like similar to the X-Men movies, like they were so important to me because they were good nerd shit. And like, especially that second one, I thought the second Spider-Man was like the greatest movie of all time.
00:38:28
Snacks _he_him_
I think Doc Ock is one of the coolest designed villains in all of comics. I love Doc Ock. Just the fight scenes are crazy.
00:38:33
Ryan
Interesting. Interesting.
00:38:34
Snacks _he_him_
I love Doc Ock. So seeing that, especially like the first, it was in the first Spider-Man video game on PS4, he was the bad guy. um
00:38:43
Ryan
Yeah.
00:38:45
Snacks _he_him_
I love Doc Ock.
00:38:46
Shauna (she/her)
Oh yeah.
00:38:46
Snacks _he_him_
So seeing him and him kind of having a redemption arc throughout the movie.
00:38:47
Shauna (she/her)
um
00:38:52
Snacks _he_him_
i love that
00:38:54
Ryan
when Spider-Man returns to Doctor Strange, they're they're talking about the multiverse and Doctor Strange says, the multiverse is something about which we know frighteningly little.
00:39:09
Ryan
And my note was, yeah, obviously we saw multiverse of madness. Sorry. ah
00:39:14
Snacks _he_him_
I don't know that.
00:39:16
Ryan
um
00:39:18
Shauna (she/her)
But the other nice connection, though, between those Spider-Man movies and Doctor Strange and the Multiverse of Madness, course, is the director, Sam Raimi.
00:39:26
Ryan
who directed Spider-Man 3.
00:39:27
Shauna (she/her)
Who...
00:39:29
Snacks _he_him_
owner
00:39:29
Shauna (she/her)
Well, no, or the he the the first three trilogy, I believe.
00:39:33
Ryan
Oh, he did all three?
00:39:35
Shauna (she/her)
Yes, absolutely.
00:39:36
Ryan
Okay, I think I remember.
00:39:37
Shauna (she/her)
It's why Bruce Campbell shows up in both of them, because he's the ring announcer in the first Spider-Man movie.
00:39:41
Ryan
Yes.
00:39:45
Shauna (she/her)
And of course, he's the guy who punches himself in Multiverse of Madness.
00:39:48
Ryan
Over and over again.
00:39:49
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
00:39:50
Ryan
Yeah, very important.
00:39:51
Shauna (she/her)
Which is very... There's so many great nods to Army of Darkness and the Evil Dead franchise when we get there. i'm very excited for it.
00:40:00
Ryan
So um Spider-Man and Doc Ock have a cute little fight on the bridge. He steals his nanotechnology, but then it kind of like works against him because Spider-Man can remotely take control of it.
00:40:11
Snacks _he_him_
Thank you.
00:40:14
Ryan
And ah then we also get the beginning of seeing the Green Goblin return. But before they can worry about that, Doctor Strange returns them to uh this little jail thing he has and mj and ned are there and um something that i thought was really funny was peter introduces them he says these are my friends mj and ned when he introduces introduces them to doc ock and i immediately thought he was gonna make black joke sorry okay
00:40:47
Shauna (she/her)
You go, what?
00:40:48
Snacks _he_him_
Why? Oh,
00:40:49
Ryan
I thought you were just making some kind of comment about MJ being black because his MJ is white.
00:40:50
Shauna (she/her)
if
00:40:55
Snacks _he_him_
because his MJ is white?
00:40:55
Shauna (she/her)
yeah
00:40:57
Ryan
Like, I just had this feeling that he And he's... Alfred Molina's, like, you know, older or whatever, so I just imagined him saying something about her being colored.
00:41:05
Shauna (she/her)
yeah
00:41:07
Ryan
Um... So...
00:41:10
Shauna (she/her)
Specifically saying it that way too, of course.
00:41:12
Snacks _he_him_
How would have said it?
00:41:12
Ryan
Yes, exactly.
00:41:13
Snacks _he_him_
It's like, oh, we dipping our toes, aren't we?
00:41:15
Ryan
Yeah, right, exactly. Right. Okay, so um during the second act, we get all the villains from other universes. who Who do we like out of these villains? So Ryan, you love Doc Ock in general as a villain.
00:41:31
Ryan
I've always loved Electro because that's like, I've always wanted to have electricity-based powers. I do think it's interesting, though, that they made him black in the amazing Spider-Man movies, because that is, like, sort of a...
00:41:44
Ryan
Not necessarily a trope, but there is a conversation around the number of black heroes that have electricity-based powers, and...
00:41:50
Snacks _he_him_
I think it's more than a trope. it's It's so expected to this point. Like there are so many, like it's hard to name a black superhero that doesn't have electric powers.
00:42:01
Ryan
i I recently watched a video where someone kind of like countered this and it was like, you actually know so many superheroes that black superheroes that don't have electricity based powers. We literally just watched wonder man. Like he's a black superhero, but he's also not black in the comics. um
00:42:17
Snacks _he_him_
And that was also recent.
00:42:17
Ryan
Like pluop
00:42:18
Snacks _he_him_
I probably thought of this a year ago before I even knew who Wonderman was.
00:42:22
Ryan
like I do think that there's something, um there is something to be said about the fact that they chose to make electro black in the amazing Spider-Man movie.
00:42:31
Shauna (she/her)
That that was the case. Right. It's you know, Kirk Connors. It kirk honororss
00:42:36
Ryan
Right. It's neither good nor bad. It just, like, that was a choice that they made that did fall into um a common trope.
00:42:40
Shauna (she/her)
is
00:42:46
Ryan
Or, you know, i don't know the right film word for it, but um but Jamie Foxx is also incredible, and I will watch him in almost anything, because his line later in the movie where he tells Andrew Garfield, he's like, I thought you were going to be black, and Andrew Garfield apologizes.
00:42:49
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
00:43:03
Ryan
Yeah.
00:43:05
Snacks _he_him_
okay
00:43:05
Ryan
Oh, I'm sorry, man. um Okay.
00:43:08
Ryan
it's
00:43:08
Shauna (she/her)
and Like the way you described it too was really great.
00:43:11
Shauna (she/her)
He's like, no, but like you always hope like, you know, like the underprivileged and then the people in your neighborhood.
00:43:14
Ryan
Four people.
00:43:16
Shauna (she/her)
And like, i just kind of would make sense. I'm like, well, just wait until the next movie. Cause spoiler alert, but I think that's where we're going.
00:43:22
Ryan
Exactly.
00:43:26
Ryan
You think Miles is coming?
00:43:27
Snacks _he_him_
It has to be.
00:43:27
Shauna (she/her)
i honestly do.
00:43:28
Snacks _he_him_
Tom Holland's done with Spider-Man.
00:43:28
Shauna (she/her)
i I, think Tom Holland, the actor's done.
00:43:28
Ryan
Yeah.
00:43:32
Shauna (she/her)
And I think that everything they're doing The way that they are ruining Peter Parker's life, there's no coming back from that.
00:43:32
Ryan
Yeah.
00:43:41
Shauna (she/her)
There's no happy ending for Tom Holland after this movie, knowing the little that we know about Brand New Day. I just think that it's all leading to the Brand New Day is going to be Miles Morales' Spider-Man.
00:43:54
Ryan
Ooh, I love that. And I mean, he does, Andrew Garfield does even say like, oh, I'm sure that there's a black Spider-Man out there somewhere in one of these universes. um
00:44:03
Shauna (she/her)
Mm-hmm.
00:44:04
Ryan
That was a cute little nod.
00:44:06
Snacks _he_him_
Did you hear the rumors that the, i don't know his name, but the the black kid from Stranger Things might be Miles Morales?
00:44:13
Ryan
in the comics it is kind of important that he is afro-latino think his mom is is um puerto rican yeah so i i love that i think that that actor would make a great black spider-man but i do think i i don't know that he is afro-latino so like yeah go ahead jonah we're say something
00:44:20
Snacks _he_him_
Latina, yeah.
00:44:22
Shauna (she/her)
Yes.
00:44:34
Snacks _he_him_
think he is.
00:44:39
Shauna (she/her)
No, I... I think that it's important to have that. I think it's an important part of the character as well.
00:44:46
Ryan
Yeah. Right. Yeah.
00:44:46
Shauna (she/her)
Like it's something that I immediately think of is the way that his heritage and his parents are celebrated in his life. And like, it's sort like, you think like the Spider-Man games and all of that.
00:44:58
Shauna (she/her)
Like, I feel like so much of the media about the character is about that aspect of himself.
00:45:04
Snacks _he_him_
His parents, yeah. They played good role.
00:45:05
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah. And so I think that to not have that would be a disservice But that's that that's really my only opinion.
00:45:13
Ryan
And even if you're not that immersed in the like sort of depth and breadth of the Spider-Man materials, like if you've seen across the Spider-Verse, you like there's like a whole bit where Miles' mom gets on his ass because he, you know, he is getting like a B in Spanish or something. Like it is really, it's in every aspect of that character. So I do agree. yeah.
00:45:41
Ryan
We got the lizard and Sandman who are not there in real life. um It reminded me of that woman. The woman and on that plane is a meme from a couple years ago. And she's like being asked to leave. And she's like...
00:45:58
Ryan
I don't know what you all think, but that person, that man back there is not fucking real. It's hysterical. And that's how I felt watching this. I was like, those actors aren't really there.
00:46:14
Ryan
That's AI. That's screen. I mean, it's not AI, but it's,
00:46:17
Shauna (she/her)
God.
00:46:21
Ryan
voice actors yeah it's it's reused footage i'm sure the guy who played sandman that like did the voice but i'm curious like did he actually do the voice stuff or did they just okay
00:46:21
Shauna (she/her)
Before ai
00:46:23
Shauna (she/her)
This modern iteration.
00:46:35
Shauna (she/her)
yeah he was a voice actor. Thomas Hayden Church was the voice actor. Same with Risa Fonz.
00:46:41
Ryan
okay so they were actually like they recorded new stuff it wasn't
00:46:41
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
00:46:45
Shauna (she/her)
Oh, yeah.
00:46:47
Ryan
So, um and Green Goblin, we get, ah we pick back up with her Norman, Norman his Hobgoblin cosplay, like with the sweatshirt.
00:46:56
Shauna (she/her)
Norman, yeah. i And I liked his casual cosplay goblin outfit. I thought that was cute.
00:47:03
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah. well no the Well, Ned is the one who becomes the Hobgoblin in the comics.
00:47:08
Ryan
Oh, does he really?
00:47:09
Shauna (she/her)
Absolutely.
00:47:20
Shauna (she/her)
Sunday night recordings. Not our best work.
00:47:23
Ryan
um So yeah, I really liked that Norman Osborn. um i thought I loved that actor. What is his name? Willem Dafoe. I have always thought he was creepy.
00:47:33
Ryan
I'm pretty sure the first time I ever saw him was as Norman Osborn. and I was like, that motherfucker is creepy.
00:47:40
Shauna (she/her)
Hmm.
00:47:41
Ryan
He scares me.
00:47:42
Shauna (she/her)
Hmm.
00:47:42
Ryan
He frightens me as a person.
00:47:43
Shauna (she/her)
Hmm.
00:47:45
Ryan
So his Norman Osborn is really good. um
00:47:51
Ryan
Okay, so rather than sending the villains back to their universes where they are fated to die, which
00:47:56
Shauna (she/her)
Because why would they just do that?
00:47:58
Ryan
Yeah, like, you know, they all pretty much, like, what they're when they're together, they discover that their last memories are all of them right about to die.
00:48:08
Ryan
So, yeah.
00:48:09
Shauna (she/her)
We're all from 20 years ago.
00:48:12
Ryan
um peter insists on curing them first strange disagrees and is sidelined when peter traps him in the mirror dimension peter brings the villains to happy's condo to rehabilitate rehabilitate them but norman osborne's green goblin persona re-emerges and violently turns the others against peter in the chaos aunt may is killed and a devastated peter is left alone there's a lot of good stuff that happened this is like really the fucking like
00:48:34
Shauna (she/her)
Okay.
00:48:39
Ryan
rising action getting to the climax and you're like, I was locked the fuck in. um I have a couple of notes from this part. One is Jamie Foxx is so hot. The next is LOL at the mask talking to Norman meme.
00:48:57
Ryan
um Sending to, oh, how this was a whole ass fucking allegory for refugees, sending them back to where they came from and the danger that it it would create.
00:49:11
Ryan
What a complicated way to view, not, what an interesting way to frame that because in this instance, literally they are like moments before their death. Like, I don't understand why they were like, you know what we should do Give them a clear conscious and then send them back to die immediately because like,
00:49:30
Shauna (she/her)
Because like if they're literally right at the precipice of losing their own like no no I don't have my powers like I'm not like what are we doing?
00:49:37
Ryan
Right, right. It kind of made it worse, now that I think about it. Just let them stay here and rehabilitate them. Although it would have really fucked up. that Oh, man. I feel like, again, bringing up the counterpoints, I'm not arguing against refugees being allowed to stay here. But, like, in the movie...
00:49:57
Ryan
them being there would have started creating incursions and shit like it they're not from that timeline they're not supposed to be there it would cause irreparable harm to the space-time continuum if that's the right use of space-time continuum and that's why metaphors you can't run with them forever um
00:50:12
Shauna (she/her)
And that's why metaphors are limited.
00:50:19
Ryan
So I love the, let's talk about the Spider-Man Dr. Strange fight. um I thought it was really cool that they had a spider senses be able to be like present even when he was in the astral plane when so when Dr. Strange kicks him out of his body. And did you all notice they did the like wiggly woos above his head?
00:50:38
Snacks _he_him_
Yes, I did notice that.
00:50:39
Ryan
I was so happy. I was like, look, that's Spider-Senses.
00:50:41
Snacks _he_him_
Spider-senses.
00:50:43
Ryan
um ah Just classic nod to the 90s cartoon. um
00:50:49
Snacks _he_him_
Rivals does that too.
00:50:51
Ryan
Does it really?
00:50:54
Snacks _he_him_
someone comes near Spider-Man, okay.
00:50:57
Ryan
I guess I have never played Spider-Man, so. So...
00:51:00
Snacks _he_him_
either way but and
00:51:03
Ryan
so The cape on Peter, I think that's a thing in the What If what if show, where Peter gets saved by the cape that Doctor Strange wears.
00:51:13
Ryan
um He says you're when he figures out it's a, what is it called? a Euclidean spiral? No, that's not it.
00:51:24
Shauna (she/her)
Some geometry, that it's geometry.
00:51:27
Ryan
Yeah, and Spider-Man goes, you're really good at geometry to himself to remind himself that he can figure it out, and that's how he captures Doctor Strange.
00:51:28
Snacks _he_him_
Thanks.
00:51:37
Ryan
um So we get the turn, which is that Green Goblin, when when Norman's Green Goblin alter ego is confronted with the fact that he might be eliminated by being cured, he comes to the forefront and takes over and basically starts fucking everything up.
00:51:57
Ryan
He fucks with the vibe around the other villains and then causes chaos. And we have the heartbreaking Aunt May scene, which... Let's first and foremost talk about Marissa Tomei as Aunt May.
00:52:12
Ryan
What are your thoughts? They made her younger, cuntier, cuter, funner. She fucks happy. What are your thoughts on Marissa Tomei as Aunt May?
00:52:20
Snacks _he_him_
Apparently she had no plot armor like the last Aunt Mays.
00:52:24
Ryan
That is true. Excellent point.
00:52:26
Shauna (she/her)
Well, because we also...
00:52:26
Snacks _he_him_
I remember being very surprised they killed her.
00:52:27
Shauna (she/her)
and think... Because it seems like this universe's Uncle Ben just died naturally.
00:52:35
Ryan
Or maybe there was never an Uncle Ben.
00:52:35
Shauna (she/her)
like
00:52:37
Snacks _he_him_
You didn't get an Uncle Ben death in The Amazing Spider-Man either
00:52:41
Shauna (she/her)
Interesting.
00:52:42
Snacks _he_him_
with um Andrew Garfield.
00:52:42
Shauna (she/her)
Well, yeah, but but but what you did get was a Gwen Stacy death, and in this you get the Mary Jane death, or well youre or you get the Aunt May death.
00:52:50
Ryan
Yeah, so, but doesn't... Does... aunt does does Wow. Do we get the with great power comes great responsibility line in the Andrew Garfield movies?
00:53:03
Snacks _he_him_
I'd assume...
00:53:05
Ryan
I don't remember, but...
00:53:06
Snacks _he_him_
don't remember.
00:53:06
Ryan
um Yeah.
00:53:07
Snacks _he_him_
But they bring it up later in the movie, so I just assume that's probably in
00:53:13
Ryan
Because that...
00:53:13
Snacks _he_him_
most
00:53:14
Ryan
I think what they are illustrating is from the, I think it's from Deadpool and Wolverine, but also in ah across the multi, the Spider-Verse, this idea of like a canon event, like Peter Parker has to lose someone as a canon event.
00:53:33
Ryan
And like, they are, they teach him that with great power power comes great responsibility. And I thought that that was a really interesting way of including that. um Shauna, what did you think of Marissa Tomei as Aunt May versus the older versions?
00:53:48
Shauna (she/her)
Honestly, I liked it. I thought it was a very modern take on it. And I think it made sense to the way that they changed the mythos. I don't like that they killed her though, honestly.
00:53:57
Ryan
Yeah.
00:53:57
Shauna (she/her)
I think that the loss that he suffered was his loss of privacy. He suffered a loss of self. And then to further compound that with how the movie ends with that, not only did he lose Aunt May, but then he lost himself.
00:54:13
Ryan
Yeah.
00:54:14
Shauna (she/her)
I feel like it's one too many things.
00:54:15
Snacks _he_him_
and his friends.
00:54:17
Ryan
yeah
00:54:18
Shauna (she/her)
He lost everything in a way that is so much harder to persevere from. It's so much less relatable in a different kind of way. And I think the way that Spider-Man perseveres through loss is part of what makes him so appealing and so relatable to so many people. And I think they took that from him.
00:54:38
Snacks _he_him_
But later in the in this in the movie, it kind of gives him... a like When he's fighting Green... i know we're going to get this, but when he's fighting Green Goblin at the end, he wants to kill him for what he did to Aunt May.
00:54:44
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
00:54:49
Shauna (she/her)
Rain. Rain.
00:54:49
Snacks _he_him_
And having Andrew stop him... Or was it pete was it um toby was Toby?
00:54:53
Ryan
It was Toby, yeah.
00:54:55
Snacks _he_him_
Having Toby stop him. like there's the That had to be the catalyst for him to lose his lose himself. He wasn't going to try to kill Green Goblin if he just lost...
00:55:04
Ryan
Yeah.
00:55:07
Snacks _he_him_
his privacy.
00:55:09
Ryan
Yeah.
00:55:10
Snacks _he_him_
So there was a reason, which I felt like there wasn't a reason when they Peter Parker.
00:55:11
Ryan
And I think the...
00:55:14
Shauna (she/her)
Well, but it's even his loss of his privacy as much as his loss of his personhood, is his place in the world that nobody knows him. Like, he lost his life in a way that I feel that having him...
00:55:23
Ryan
Yeah.
00:55:27
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah, like losing both Peter Parker and Aunt May. Like, if you want to be like, okay, he's going to lose Aunt May because Spider-Man has to lose someone that's part of who he is. And he then gets to use that as a way of relating to the other Spider-Men.
00:55:41
Shauna (she/her)
Okay. I don't like it, but I understand it.
00:55:41
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
00:55:43
Shauna (she/her)
But then to compound it with the ending, I think that is where... I think that is too much. It's too harsh. It's too punitive in a way that I think is unnecessary to punish a child in high school for poor decision making in terms of the way that he casts the spell trying to fix things. But trying to fix things for his friends, too.
00:56:07
Shauna (she/her)
I just think I didn't like that.
00:56:09
Ryan
So I do, I agree. the one thing i think i there is an interesting parallel though, because I think I mentioned earlier, that's very much so the Spider-Man three of Tobey Maguire.
00:56:20
Ryan
I remember making a joke, like there's a scene where everything goes wrong for him. Like Mary Jane is not interested in him. um Harry slaps him in the face a bunch.
00:56:32
Ryan
Like, I remember calling it that everybody poops on Peter Parker party because like, it's just, he gets hit after fucking hit.
00:56:37
Shauna (she/her)
God.
00:56:40
Ryan
And it's definitely like, you know, your best friend slapping you versus your maternal caregiver dying because of a series of your actions is not the same.
00:56:52
Ryan
However, i think It does, ah I can say that, again, we're we're a little farther ahead, but I can say what resonated for me as a person who, like, I lost my mom, I lost, ah you know, Bowser shortly after, my marriage ended, I moved to a new city, like, that part where he is kind of, like, rebuilding himself, and, like, he create he makes his new spider suit, like,
00:57:22
Ryan
That, I think that actually makes him extremely relatable, maybe to me, you know, specifically, but I know other people have felt that sort of like, wow, is there anything else that can go wrong at this point?
00:57:25
Shauna (she/her)
Interesting. Fair. Yeah.
00:57:34
Ryan
Like, I don't know that I can take it.
00:57:35
Snacks _he_him_
And it does.
00:57:36
Ryan
And you do, you survive. so
00:57:39
Shauna (she/her)
Right.
00:57:40
Ryan
i think I think the point is well made and I think he didn't Aunt May didn't have to die for him to get all of it. to your point, Ryan, I do think that revenge against Green Goblin is like very important though.
00:57:51
Ryan
um But yeah, it's it is definitely, it's tough to watch. that Her, okay, there are a couple of notes. um There are a couple of other notes.
00:58:04
Ryan
ah but Okay, to to pivot back into some funny things. um When Happy sees the Sinister Five walk into his apartment, he calls Peter. He says, you got a cyborg guy with robot legs in my house? Was one of those guys made of mud?
00:58:22
Ryan
Just absolutely sent me because I would be so pissed if you brought a fucking sand man into my home. What do you mean you brought a man made of sand into my fucking home?
00:58:33
Ryan
um There's also a
00:58:36
Shauna (she/her)
Friday nights at Mulberry's.
00:58:37
Ryan
Exactly, exactly.
00:58:39
Snacks _he_him_
And...
00:58:39
Ryan
um There's a scene, there's there's a bit where Jamie Foxx is like riffing with maybe spider someone and he says, these are Legos and it very much so feels like an ad lib that ah Jamie Foxx picked up.
00:58:57
Ryan
So the the scene where um Aunt May dies, when she said, knocked on my ass, it it felt very East Coast and it reminded me like a little bit of my mom, like the way that she said it, just very like, no, I'm cool.
00:59:14
Ryan
Like i i just, I got knocked my ass.
00:59:16
Shauna (she/her)
Very my cousin Vinny. Yeah.
00:59:17
Ryan
Yeah, yes very my cousin. um Her asking, are you,
00:59:23
Snacks _he_him_
Marissa Tomei is 61 years old.
00:59:26
Ryan
That's what happens when you mind your business.
00:59:31
Snacks _he_him_
Oh my god, good for her.
00:59:32
Ryan
So she was like 57 when this movie came out.
00:59:35
Shauna (she/her)
yeah
00:59:36
Ryan
I mean, no one would believe how old your mother is, Ryan, to be clear. Like, you know, I don't know that Marissa Tomei is brown, but um she's definitely spicy white.
00:59:44
Snacks _he_him_
Italian? Tomei's Italian?
00:59:46
Shauna (she/her)
Yes, she is Italian.
00:59:46
Ryan
She's spicy white. um Her asking, are you okay when she's actively dying is like such a, like, this is emotional labor.
00:59:58
Ryan
This is what women do. Like, she's literally dying and she knows it and she's still like, are you okay?
01:00:00
Shauna (she/her)
Mmm.
01:00:04
Ryan
um All caps, Marissa Tomei, give her a fucking Oscar for this. Like, her death scene was remarkable. um And I love, what did you say
01:00:13
Snacks _he_him_
It was really sad. It was really sad. Yes.
01:00:17
Ryan
yeah um when she grabbed that bag to put the cure for green goblin in it she grabbed a feast tote which is the name of her organization that she runs um and it did also kind of make me sad um thinking about the fact that he probably didn't get any inheritance from aunt may because she ran a homeless shelter and she probably didn't have
01:00:42
Shauna (she/her)
Well, and then nobody knew who he was.
01:00:44
Ryan
Okay, I do want to come back to that at the end, but, like, I have some questions. Does he not... Does Peter Parker not exist as in he does not have a fucking social security number? Like, the human does not exist?
01:00:56
Shauna (she/her)
I think so.
01:00:56
Ryan
Or is it that no one knows? It's like no one has ever been introduced to him. Like, he...
01:01:01
Shauna (she/her)
i um only imagine it's like the social security, unit like nobody's ever met him. the guy includes anybody at a hospital.
01:01:09
Snacks _he_him_
I think it was no one, everyone forgets him. I think the data of him still exists. Like, it's not like he deleted the social security number with that spell. I think it just affected everyone's memory. So all the, the other stuff.
01:01:19
Shauna (she/her)
Maybe, I don't know.
01:01:22
Ryan
I you don't have to be so sneaky about getting her off camera. du Are you drinking some coffee or some tea?
01:01:31
Shauna (she/her)
Some coffee.
01:01:32
Ryan
Yeah.
01:01:34
Snacks _he_him_
He's 45. five
01:01:34
Ryan
Okay, so now we get to the multiversal Peters. At his lowest point, Ned uses the sling ring to find Peter Parker and pulls in two alternate universe Spider men, Tobey Maguire and Andrew Garfield.
01:01:48
Shauna (she/her)
Again, Hobgoblin can do magic.
01:01:50
Ryan
Can he really?
01:01:52
Shauna (she/her)
I think so. I think he's more magical. Thanks.
01:01:55
Ryan
um The three Peters bond over their shared grief and experiences. They work together to synthesize cures for each villain and the two older Peters mentor the grieving younger Peter, helping him find the will to keep going.
01:02:08
Ryan
Some of, i so many of these notes are in all gaps. ah His one quote, I do have the tingle thing, just not for bread. When MJ throws a piece of bread at him.
01:02:22
Ryan
Uh, when they find toby mcguire and um ned says it's just some random guy and i have to imagine that that's how people who have never seen like spider-man the original three are just like who's this fucking guy um
01:02:22
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
01:02:38
Shauna (she/her)
Because he doesn't look like... He's not, like, actor handsome.
01:02:41
Ryan
right one of my
01:02:42
Shauna (she/her)
Like, he's, like like, when you think of, like... Actually, i read something really interesting on that kind of theory of where, you know, the difference in actors and, like, attractiveness these days is that the reason why there are actually more attractive actors from back then versus now is because so many attractive people who can't act just go into influencing.
01:03:06
Shauna (she/her)
And I was like, that makes so much sense that they are be they are not going into acting acting. Because they don't need to. Because...
01:03:13
Ryan
Yeah. But I mean, that's like, that's only a trend of so long though. Like, you know, a contemporary thing.
01:03:17
Shauna (she/her)
That's true. Just as... i was more just like... Just it made me think of that more.
01:03:21
Ryan
Yeah. It's more, I think it's very valid contemporarily.
01:03:21
Shauna (she/her)
yeah But you know, like, Tobey Maguire, like, it's not like, obviously an unattractive guy.
01:03:23
Ryan
Yeah.
01:03:26
Shauna (she/her)
But he's not really like this, like, oh, wow, like...
01:03:28
Ryan
Um,
01:03:28
Snacks _he_him_
He's not Andrew Garfield.
01:03:30
Snacks _he_him_
What is
01:03:30
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah. Yeah.
01:03:32
Ryan
um I just know that his Lola was saying these white men, like when his when his grandma is speaking Tagalong.
01:03:40
Shauna (she/her)
Oh my gosh.
01:03:43
Ryan
Is that the language of Filipinos?
01:03:43
Snacks _he_him_
that called? From Philippines now.
01:03:44
Shauna (she/her)
think it's... to I don't think that's how it's pronounced, but that is the language it is.
01:03:49
Ryan
Okay, got it.
01:03:49
Shauna (she/her)
But I could be wrong that I...
01:03:50
Ryan
I'm saying it like the cookie, um which is no disrespect to the Filipino language.
01:03:52
Shauna (she/her)
Yes.
01:03:56
Ryan
She's definitely referring to them as these white men over and over. Like, i I don't speak that language, but I speak fluent ethnic grandma, and she's referring to them as these white men. Yeah.
01:04:08
Ryan
So my question, how did they know about Aunt May dying? Like, how did they know? Like, they were the the TV said there's one casualty, but they did not say it was Aunt May.
01:04:22
Ryan
How did they know that she died?
01:04:26
Snacks _he_him_
I don't think they did. i think they just knew that he was, because they couldn't get in contact with him, so they probably, if they assumed, but they probably knew something was wrong.
01:04:34
Shauna (she/her)
Didn't they contact MJ? Because MJ found out.
01:04:39
Ryan
Well, MJ and Ned tell the other Peters that they need that they he needs them right now because he has no one left.
01:04:52
Ryan
Like they know at the on the grandma's house or something. So maybe they sent it maybe sent a text or something and just said something because even when they show up, she hugs him and it's like very much so brief hug.
01:04:59
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
01:05:06
Ryan
um
01:05:08
Snacks _he_him_
There was no deleted scene about that.
01:05:11
Ryan
Okay. A couple of notes that, you know, as a person who has lost ah a mother, the first time you get to hug someone after someone dies, like the way that Tom Holland acts crying when MJ hugs him is like such a specific feeling that like this scene was like very...
01:05:23
Shauna (she/her)
Hmm. Hmm.
01:05:32
Ryan
um
01:05:35
Ryan
I felt very emotionally connected to it. Like that is what it feels like the first time someone hugs you after you lose someone. um And I also wrote, I'm so grateful for Tobey Maguire's Spider-Man. Like I'm so grateful that that movie happened and that it was made.
01:05:49
Ryan
um That scene with the three of them on the rooftop, beautiful. um And then they go to the lab to start working on the, um,
01:06:02
Ryan
the cures and there's a part where mj is watching the three peters and uh tom holland goes what and she goes three yous you know that she was feeling the fucking vibe you know she was looking at him she's like oh i'm gonna fuck all three of these peters
01:06:22
Snacks _he_him_
it doesn't
01:06:25
Ryan
you don't think so you don't
01:06:27
Shauna (she/her)
I think that's much more the mj ah the Kirsten than the...
01:06:34
Ryan
Yeah, but she's... Kirsten Dunst, MJ, would see a young Peter. But, like, you're looking at your boyfriends. they're They're alternate versions, but the thing is they do kind of look similar.
01:06:49
Ryan
So, like, imagine being like, if that's what you're going to grow up to, you know, thumbs up. She was feeling it. It made me laugh. Yeah. The organic web fluid bit for a reference from earlier, um really hysterical.
01:07:07
Snacks _he_him_
I remember watching that movie, watching it in theaters and not realizing that both Tom Holland and Andrew Garfield had to build their web slingers and Toby just came out of his wrist.
01:07:19
Shauna (she/her)
Every Spider-Man on before.
01:07:20
Snacks _he_him_
I thought it all came out of the wrist.
01:07:23
Shauna (she/her)
No, much like Magneto's helmet blocking Professor X's psychic abilities, it is something that makes so much sense that was created just for those movies and has now become a trademark of the character.
01:07:32
Ryan
Yeah.
01:07:35
Ryan
I don't think there's a single other Spider-Man that has organic webs other than the
01:07:35
Shauna (she/her)
Like a staple aspect.
Climactic Battle and Character Moments
01:07:40
Ryan
Tobey Maguire one. I think like that's maybe even part of Across the Universe.
01:07:44
Shauna (she/her)
Hmm.
01:07:45
Snacks _he_him_
Interesting.
01:07:46
Ryan
and The Beatles musical movie. um
01:07:48
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah, it's a big part of it.
01:07:49
Snacks _he_him_
Where does he get those web fluids?
01:07:49
Shauna (she/her)
It has a major plot point.
01:07:51
Snacks _he_him_
You just make them up? Is it like synthetic?
01:07:53
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah, Ringo Starr created them in that movie, but...
01:07:58
Ryan
Um, I don't know. So he's a, you know, he's a genius scientist. So he built, he you just synthetic web fluid.
01:08:03
Snacks _he_him_
Right.
01:08:06
Ryan
I don't know. He's a genius.
01:08:07
Shauna (she/her)
But he probably would shoot it out of his butt. Like, he probably should have, like, a little, like, thing of...
01:08:11
Ryan
Yeah. it coming out of The organic stuff coming out of his wrist does not make sense. Um, but that's okay. We can, we don't have to question it. They do question it later and ask when it comes, if it comes from anywhere else.
01:08:24
Ryan
Um, So there's a funny line where he says, we're going to kick, let's go kick some ass. And Andrew Garfield says, cure, we're going to cure some ass. um I love that older people.
01:08:36
Ryan
Peter is all insightful. Okay. Wait, this is going into the fight team. Okay. Final battle and the sacrifice, the climactic battle.
01:08:43
Snacks _he_him_
Can I tell you, when he went when he said were gonna cure some ass, I was like, a penison shot.
01:08:47
Ryan
Yeah. T very relatable. um, The climactic battle unfolds at the Statue of Liberty. The Spider-Man cure most of the villains, but the multiverse continues to rupture as more people who know Peter Parker Spider-Man flood in.
01:09:01
Ryan
To save the universe, Peter asks Strange to cast a new spell, one that makes everyone forget Peter Parker entirely. Peter says goodbye to MJ and Ned, knowing they won't remember him, and Strange wipes the world's memory. Peter starts over completely alone with no one who knows him, but resolves to continue being Spider-Man.
01:09:22
Ryan
So, um, the fight scene where they first start working together, um I love that older Peter is insightful and like, you know, tells him to stop with the negative self-talk, like so endearing and very much so like how I feel like most of us would talk to younger versions of ourselves.
01:09:43
Ryan
Um, like I imagine having three years would i allow you to see your own traits that need work to be like, damn, I've gotten a lot better about that, but someone has to tell you, stop the negative self-talk.
01:09:44
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
01:09:55
Ryan
Um, i did all I did also note that when they struggle to fight the first time and they all are going after different targets and they come they all come together and someone says, let's pick one target. My note was that's us playing rivals.
01:10:14
Snacks _he_him_
It's
01:10:15
Shauna (she/her)
And it much more successful when we do.
01:10:18
Ryan
great uh andrew garfield going peter three just like always makes me laugh i rewound it and watched it over and over again because it just makes me laugh so hard i don't know why i think it's so funny it just makes me laugh really hard um what thoughts about the three of them coming together
01:10:37
Snacks _he_him_
a great fight scene. It really is a very good fight scene.
01:10:39
Shauna (she/her)
It is. It's emotional, sweet, loved the way that they integrated the villains.
01:10:47
Ryan
Yeah.
01:10:48
Shauna (she/her)
Like, I wish the villains had more interaction with each other as villains and not just in the cyclical setting of Happy's apartment.
01:10:56
Ryan
Sure.
01:10:57
Snacks _he_him_
Oh, and what made me tear up is when Andrew Garfield's Peter saves MJ before she falls.
01:11:01
Ryan
Yes.
01:11:03
Snacks _he_him_
And he starts to cry.
01:11:03
Shauna (she/her)
Very true.
01:11:05
Snacks _he_him_
i teared up at that moment.
01:11:07
Ryan
so i thought but i think So you haven't seen Spider-Man though, right? So you...
01:11:13
Snacks _he_him_
No, I have. Shawna hasn't.
01:11:14
Shauna (she/her)
Well,
01:11:15
Ryan
Oh, you have, oh, got it, got it, got it, got it. But you understood the the emotional the emotional beat of it because you know about Gwen Stacy.
01:11:22
Shauna (she/her)
well I mean, I know it.
01:11:23
Snacks _he_him_
Well, it's become a meme now.
01:11:23
Shauna (she/her)
I know it because I know the story. Yeah. Like, I know it just from the history of the character of Spider-Man. And I knew that was...
01:11:31
Ryan
Do you want to know really uh related like knowing the history of spider-man you know i was like a kid that watched the ninety s show but like i wasn't i didn't read the comics i didn't know a lot of the stuff um but when my parents bought me the spider the first spider-man movie dvd for hanukkah one year um it had a bunch of extras on it like the best part about getting you know movies at home um
01:11:55
Shauna (she/her)
Hmm. Hmm. Hmm.
01:11:59
Ryan
And that was how I learned a bunch. That's how I learned about Gwen Stacy, because it talks about the loves of Peter Parker. Like, that's how I learned a bunch of lore of Spider-Man was from the extras on the Spider-Man DVD.
01:12:11
Ryan
um
01:12:11
Snacks _he_him_
Thank you.
01:12:12
Ryan
I remember the MJ falling scene feeling so fucking long in the movie theater. And then when I was rewatching it, I was like, oh that was like four seconds. It was wild.
01:12:24
Ryan
Um, I also remember being in the movie theater and when the skyline was cracking and like there were like they were starting to show all the other universe things. um I leaned over to Uxie and said, there's mutants in there somewhere.
01:12:40
Ryan
And now we're getting them.
01:12:43
Snacks _he_him_
There we are.
01:12:45
Ryan
Um, I also wrote, beat that old man's ass, about when Tom Holland is fighting Willem Dafoe.
01:12:54
Snacks _he_him_
would have let him go. Mm-hmm.
01:12:56
Ryan
He fucks him up. He really fucks him up. And he should have killed him with his glider. if That would have been appropriate, because that's also how he dies in the Spider-Man movie. The first Spider-Man movie.
01:13:08
Ryan
Um... Tom Holland's fight choreography face is really fucking good. Like he needs to play ah ah a fighter in a movie. Um, I also was curious who were the figures that were coming through when it was cracking.
01:13:23
Ryan
Like you could tell that there were notable, there were like outlines of people. and I was really curious who else would have been in there.
01:13:27
Shauna (she/her)
yeah
01:13:30
Ryan
Um,
01:13:34
Ryan
Wouldn't this spell make other ah Peters... Wouldn't this spell make the other Peters people forget him too? So, like... Did they say everyone in this world or in the universe? Like,
01:13:49
Ryan
do
01:13:50
Snacks _he_him_
it was specific to Tom Holland's Peter Parker.
01:13:54
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah, but also why was Venom there? He doesn't fucking know Peter Parker, very canonically. Like it's neat, I'm...
01:13:59
Snacks _he_him_
Oh, the last scene, the end scene.
01:14:01
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
01:14:02
Snacks _he_him_
Did that ever come to fruition?
01:14:03
Shauna (she/her)
I'm...
01:14:05
Ryan
And it shan't.
01:14:06
Snacks _he_him_
another another another Another after scene that we'll never seek and
01:14:10
Ryan
Means nothing. Yeah.
01:14:13
Shauna (she/her)
Which again is such a shame because I kind of liked the idea of them getting to interact.
01:14:18
Ryan
Yeah, I mean, actually, it's kind of coincidental to think about, like, phase four is just a series of end scenes that never did anything.
01:14:27
Ryan
Like, they never...
01:14:27
Snacks _he_him_
Never.
01:14:28
Snacks _he_him_
one Harry Styles, Hercules.
01:14:28
Ryan
And they're gone now.
01:14:32
Ryan
That Hercules was so hot, though. Um... Okay, i of the I'll come find you, i swear, when Peter's talking about it. Imagine doing that memory for getting seen between Peter and MJ and that's your real life fucking spouse.
01:14:48
Ryan
Like,
01:14:49
Snacks _he_him_
they weren't married at the time, but yeah, yeah, yeah, for
01:14:51
Ryan
no, but they were together.
01:14:54
Ryan
um i have so many questions about how things get filled in with this magic shit. Like, how do MJ... So, okay, so everyone forgot that they knew Peter Parker. how did MJ and Ned meet?
01:15:08
Ryan
Do they not ever stop and think like, how did we meet? Like there has to be ways that it would, the spell would break.
Recording Challenges
01:15:20
Ryan
Ryan's internet dropped, so ah we're just gonna say that the spell that we were talking about returned him to his home universe, and now it's just me, the original Tom Holland Spider-Man, left after the other two. One didn't even get here, so that's okay.
01:15:37
Ryan
um
01:15:38
Shauna (she/her)
So you're already doing better.
01:15:40
Ryan
Yeah, so um let's just kind of wrap there because we were officially at the end of
Future of Spider-Man in the MCU
01:15:47
Ryan
the movie.
01:15:48
Shauna (she/her)
you
01:15:48
Ryan
I think my last couple of notes.
01:15:49
Shauna (she/her)
So what do you think happens in Brand New Day?
01:15:50
Ryan
Yeah, go ahead.
01:15:52
Shauna (she/her)
Because I've said a little bit of my theory that I think that this is the swan song for Tom Holland. I think we they introduced Miles Morales as the future, the new Spider-Man of the MCU. And I think that that is the brand new day in question.
01:16:06
Ryan
I am really curious because I swear I thought he signed up for five, but maybe it wasn't five Spider-Man movies. Maybe it's just five movies and Doomsday will be his actual last one. Cause I think Spider-Man brand new day leads into,
01:16:26
Shauna (she/her)
Is he in Doomsday?
01:16:28
Ryan
I don't know, but they keep, they have said specifically that like brand new day is going to lead directly into Doomsday or it's going to be like the predecessor because, um,
01:16:39
Ryan
We have Sadie Sink, who is going to be one of, she's a redheaded telepath, we're assuming is Jean Grey, the Department of Damage Control. We've got Punisher coming in.
01:16:52
Ryan
So I don't know. um But one of the things that I really liked was how I think tope Tom's apartment at the end kind of looks like Tobey Maguire's shitty apartment in the first Spider-Man trilogy.
01:17:09
Ryan
um the symbiote at the end ah with Eddie is never going to pay off but it was fun to see him there you know
01:17:18
Shauna (she/her)
It's never going to pay off and it's such a shame. Because again, they went with this weird direction of like, I don't know. I just feel like there was so much more Spider-Man.
01:17:31
Shauna (she/her)
Like, again, they could have told a Sinister Six story in that movie or then in a future movie. And they're just not going to now in a universe where they're specifically trying to build up him having a cadre of villains to fight.
01:17:36
Ryan
yeah
01:17:39
Ryan
Yeah.
01:17:44
Shauna (she/her)
it just, I'm a little disappointed.
01:17:44
Ryan
Right.
01:17:46
Shauna (she/her)
Like, and I don't even think it was a bad movie. I just think that it could have been better. There's more that could have been done.
01:17:52
Ryan
Agreed. um Oh, he's back.
01:17:57
Shauna (she/her)
Welcome back.
01:17:59
Snacks _he_him_
My memory went out for like 30 seconds, but it was enough to shut this thing down. So had to restart.
01:18:05
Ryan
Well, that's, That's perfect, because we were just wrapping up, um and we were kind of talking about Brand New Day and what we think, how the the end credit scene didn't really pay off for anything. But I did write in all caps, why would he be there?
01:18:20
Ryan
Not even, like i don't i don't know that I... I did not know that that's not really like canon that Venom would know that Peter Parker is Spider-Man, but in the Venom universe, there is no Spider-Man. There is no Peter Parker. Like he is, he is talking about Spider-Man to the bartender. He's like, okay, so this guy is what? Like some spider guy, like he just swings around or whatever. Like he doesn't have a Spider-Man. So how did he get there?
01:18:49
Ryan
We'll never know. Um,
01:18:51
Snacks _he_him_
Bad writing.
01:18:52
Ryan
Yeah, really and truly. ah So overall, Shauna was saying that, Shauna, you can say what you were saying again. i I'll piece this all together somehow, but what what were your thoughts on the movie overall?
01:19:10
Shauna (she/her)
I enjoyed it. i liked it. I think it was really good fan service, really good nostalgia. I don't love some of the story choices they made, and I think that it really put them in a position where they were painted into going one direction only in the future, and I just don't think it was needed.
01:19:28
Shauna (she/her)
i don't think it needed to be such a down-ending, and it's kind of a shame.
01:19:31
Ryan
Yeah. yeah Rai, what did you think?
01:19:37
Snacks _he_him_
I kind of disagree. um I actually think the the down ending was justified in terms of moving to a new Spider-Man, kind of getting a refreshed start on who Peter Parker is.
01:19:52
Snacks _he_him_
And I'm sure we're he's still going to find MJ and get back because she's in the next movie.
Critique on Nostalgia in Marvel Films
01:19:59
Snacks _he_him_
But what I didn't like, and which I think I'm a nervous that the MCU is kind of falling in,
01:20:07
Snacks _he_him_
is an over-reliance on nostalgia.
01:20:10
Ryan
Yeah. Sure.
01:20:11
Snacks _he_him_
Because re-watching those scenes, this is especially the scene where both Andrew and Toby show back up, um it kind of fell flat for me a little bit in terms of, um I know that it was it was that scene was specifically for your first reaction and everything like that, but that doesn't there that doesn't necessarily make a good movie.
01:20:34
Snacks _he_him_
It makes an enjoy it makes an an enjoyable flash in the flash in the pan moment in the theater, which we all appreciate. But i remember rewatching I remember rewatching Endgame and not feeling that way.
01:20:48
Ryan
Sure.
01:20:49
Snacks _he_him_
I still felt like a good movie, even though a lot of it, but there wasn't a lot of nostalgia reliance on Endgame. They weren't really doing that yet.
01:20:56
Shauna (she/her)
Well, it's not nostalgia, of a fan service, I think.
01:20:57
Snacks _he_him_
So, right.
01:20:59
Shauna (she/her)
Like, when I think of, like, here's all of Marvel women together, like, but also I'm like, no, I don't care.
01:20:59
Snacks _he_him_
right
01:21:02
Ryan
Yeah.
01:21:03
Shauna (she/her)
I still like it.
01:21:04
Ryan
Yeah, totally.
01:21:05
Shauna (she/her)
But I think for this nostalgia bit, like maybe that's just it is they're not worried about making this a good movie that will hold the test of time. They're making a movie that will make you go to the theater for the first time.
01:21:16
Shauna (she/her)
And then that's that.
01:21:18
Ryan
Yeah, I'm just, again, I always say like I'm such a maximalist with Marvel content. Like I want it all good, bad, ugly, like I'll watch it
01:21:25
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
01:21:27
Ryan
um And that's why sometimes it's hard to be like, it was bad or like I wouldn't watch it again. Cause most of these things, like there's not other than probably like I'm, I'm kind of dreading rewatching Thor love and thunder. But there's not, it's like that. And the second Thor are the only MCU movies that I'm just like pass. I don't need to watch that again.
01:21:47
Ryan
um But again, I, I love it all. So I'm just, I'm I'm torn because I definitely felt the nostalgia. I definitely thought that the those were the best bits of the movie, but I love the relationship between, you know, Peter and MJ and Ned. Like it feels very real. um And like specifically between those three actors.
01:22:11
Ryan
So I really, I really liked this movie. I think I've liked most of this, this iteration of Spider-Man. um So yeah, I, I would give it a pretty high score.
01:22:23
Ryan
um couple of final questions uh before we go out um what piece of nerd memorabilia would you steal from this movie
01:22:44
Snacks _he_him_
Uh, question.
01:22:48
Ryan
i would steal the feast tote i love a tote
01:22:52
Snacks _he_him_
Oh no.
01:22:54
Ryan
There's a lot of easy stuff, like, you know, the the Green Goblin helmet, to put it on my...
01:23:01
Snacks _he_him_
That box that they used to... Yeah.
01:23:04
Shauna (she/her)
Yeah.
01:23:04
Ryan
The spell box.
01:23:06
Shauna (she/her)
I like that. That's a good answer.
01:23:07
Snacks _he_him_
Be a nice little mant piece of my thing on the mantle.
01:23:07
Ryan
The spell trap.
01:23:10
Ryan
Yeah. um And the most important question of the entire podcast, who's the hottest character in Spider-Man No Way Home?
01:23:20
Ryan
We'll start with our bonus guest hot nerd, Ryan Snacks.
01:23:29
Snacks _he_him_
It might be Andrew Garfield, but though Andrew Garfield as Spider-Man never did it for me.
01:23:34
Ryan
Yeah, same.
01:23:36
Snacks _he_him_
um So Andrew Garfield as an actor, but as a character...
01:23:43
Snacks _he_him_
guess it has to go to Jamie Foxx.
01:23:45
Ryan
Yeah. My answer, I think, is Jamie Foxx. Shauna.
01:23:50
Shauna (she/her)
Marisa Tomei.
01:23:52
Ryan
are Right up there.
01:23:52
Snacks _he_him_
Oh, right. I completely forgot.
01:23:56
Ryan
Marissa Tomei is a smoke show in this movie.
01:23:59
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
01:23:59
Ryan
The way that she gets him together all the time, too. Love it. um Okay. That's going to wrap up this episode of Real Hot Nerd Shit. We will be coming to you next time for a Multiverse of Madness, probably featuring one Uxmal
01:24:19
Ryan
of the number one Wanda fan in at least our friend group. but um And maybe we'll do a short for some upcoming content. I think there's something that's coming up soon, but um I know Spider-Man is in June.
01:24:34
Ryan
We'll get some trailers and stuff soon for like X-Men 97 season two. When is um DC?
01:24:41
Snacks _he_him_
This is an MCU, this is an MCU, but the new Mario movie is coming out next month.
01:24:45
Ryan
The new Mario movie is coming out next month. um What is it, D23, 2026?
01:24:52
Ryan
i think D23 is like a big, no, D23 is a fan expo.
01:24:53
Snacks _he_him_
DC?
01:24:58
Ryan
um
01:24:59
Snacks _he_him_
Isn't that the Disney Expo?
01:25:02
Ryan
Yeah, which is where they announce a lot of the MCU stuff now because Disney owns Marvel Studios.
01:25:07
Snacks _he_him_
Mm-hmm.
01:25:09
Ryan
um
01:25:10
Snacks _he_him_
Disney owns everything.
01:25:12
Ryan
What'd say?
01:25:14
Snacks _he_him_
I said Disney owns everything.
01:25:15
Ryan
Yeah.
01:25:16
Snacks _he_him_
That's why they can do these multiverse things.
01:25:17
Ryan
ah
01:25:17
Shauna (she/her)
Including Hulu.
01:25:20
Ryan
Which,
01:25:21
Snacks _he_him_
Shut up.
01:25:24
Ryan
they fucked it up. 2026,
01:25:27
Shauna (she/her)
They fucked it up.
01:25:31
Ryan
state. August 14th through the 16th of 2026. Okay.
01:25:38
Ryan
Hopefully we'll have more good stuff by then, but thanks for joining us and bearing through this Sunday evening real hot nerd shit. We'll be fresh and ready to go for the next one and follow us online realhotnerdpod.
01:25:38
Snacks _he_him_
That's a lot.
01:25:54
Ryan
And yeah, thanks for joining. Bye.
01:25:58
Snacks _he_him_
Bye y'all.