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Call of Duty: Black Ops Series Retrospective
270 Plays4 years ago
In this episode, Fraser (Satsunami) and Adam discuss their thoughts on the highly divisive Call of Duty: Black Ops series. From best moments to hot takes on certain entries, the duo dive in to pick apart what truly made the Black Ops series one to remember.
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Transcript
Introduction and Guest Welcome
00:00:05
Speaker
Welcome to Chat Tsunami. Hello everyone and welcome to Episode 4 of Chat Tsunami. I'm Sat Tsunami and today we are going to be talking about, sorry before I go on, by we I mean myself and my good friend Adam. Thank you again for returning.
00:00:34
Speaker
No, thank you so much for having me back again. I must be doing something right if you keep inviting me back. So, third time's a charm if it keeps going. Here's to many more episodes. Unfortunately for you. Yeah, if I had a cup or something, you know, in the hand, I could just be like, here's to you. We could have a virtual clink of the glasses. Yeah, I'd only need a sound effect for that. That'd be awesome. Yeah.
First Exposure to Call of Duty
00:01:03
Speaker
So yeah, today we are talking about something that I'm really excited to talk about and I know you're really excited to talk about. A series that is very near and dear to our hearts then.
00:01:20
Speaker
in terms of the gaming world. That being of course Call of Duty, but not just Call of Duty. Today we're going to be kind of focusing in because over the last couple of months, you might have seen if you are intrigued with the gaming news, that Call of Duty Cold War has just come out.
00:01:37
Speaker
And you might have seen myself streaming this game. It was a very interesting experience but all in good time we will definitely come to that to discussing it. But before we go on to any of the games in particular, I'll let you start first Adam. What was your first kind of exposure to Call of Duty to get into the series?
00:02:05
Speaker
Yeah, so I started, I didn't start with the very first Call of Duty, the first one that I played
00:02:12
Speaker
One that was called... I'll see if anybody remembers this one. It was called... Oh, I forgot my name now. It was on the original Xbox PS2 and it was... Was it Red 1? No, it wasn't Big Red. It was the one before... Oh, that's terrible. It's just got out of my mind now. It was just... It was the one that was before Big Red. Oh, no, I should have looked up before. Oh, no, I'm embarrassing. My first flub. Because it was made by... This company only did this one.
00:02:39
Speaker
the the
00:02:52
Speaker
I was terrible. Call of Duty. That's how much of an impression it made on me. I can't even remember his name. But that was the first one I played. I loved it at the time. I really, really enjoyed it. That was when I was getting into... I played Halo by that point and I played, I think, some of the Medal of Honors. But this was when I was really getting into first-person shooters, especially World War II ones. So I really enjoyed that. And then from there, I got basically every other Call of Duty when it came out.
00:03:18
Speaker
like year after year I went back and played the original one and yeah and I like I was every year I was like on release day I was eagerly waiting it was like my favorite game series of all time like you know I couldn't wait for the next one and everything and that was still the case when the when the Black Ops series started so yeah so not quite there from the beginning but like about a year I think it was a year in I think it was 2004 I think it was a year into the into the Call of Duty series so I was quite near the beginning
00:03:43
Speaker
Yeah, I got into
PlayStation 2 and Immersive Gameplay
00:03:44
Speaker
it. Oh yeah, I have to admit, I was probably the same. You're honestly going to think very low of me. I could never think low of you. For all these FPS series like Halo and Callwood you say,
00:04:00
Speaker
I came into them very very late, especially with Call of Duty. I think I played Call of Duty probably just a couple of years before I got into Halo and yeah it was very, I think it was, yeah it was, it was Call of Duty 3 was the very first one I played on the PlayStation 2 and I remember being blown away by the graphics and being like genuinely startled like in the very first level. You basically have to go into a house and
00:04:27
Speaker
There's this one of the enemies anyway like pops out and grabs you and I remember like being absolutely terrified I was kind of like oh my god These graphics are so real. It's almost as if he's in my face and it was definitely How to put it
00:04:48
Speaker
It was just, it really enamored me. It put me into the experience, you know? Playing it back now, you're kind of like, oh, it's...
00:04:59
Speaker
it is like which pixels the allies and such but like back then it was really immersive and you just thought oh my god does bullets flying get down get down so that was like my that was my very first introduction into the series and that's when i started getting into it and after a minute i didn't keep up with it i played three then i set it aside then i kind of came back into it a couple of years later
00:05:29
Speaker
for Modern Warfare 2, I think? Yeah, it was. And then I kind of did the machete approach where I backtracked Modern Warfare 1. My drone chronology. Pretty much, yeah. And then I think at that point, so it was about 2010, so I was looking this up before we started, 2010 was when the original Black Ops came out. So like 10 years ago, and if that doesn't really feel old.
00:05:59
Speaker
I maybe felt so old when I thought about that. I was like, my goodness. Because I was looking at the page and I was like, no way.
00:06:07
Speaker
This can't be 10 years old. So that was probably about the same time like I was kind of on the verge of leaving school. So it seems like, it just seems weird thinking of it in that kind of way. But it was, it was, I mean, we might use, I was gonna say, because we've mentioned it now. Yeah, I remember, I kind of remember if it was just like peer pressure or what it was.
00:06:29
Speaker
But, you know, it's the same for all these kind of games, you know, where it's like all your friends are getting them. And, yeah, you're like, oh, I want to be a cool kid. And it's like, yeah, let's buy black ops. And, you know, it's like the most stereotypical gamer thing ever. Let's go together and buy black ops. And, you know, and that's when like they really put their all into like the adverts. Yeah. Back then.
00:07:00
Speaker
Oh my god, yeah, I just remember having an absolute blast though with Black Ops. So I think the first like, after Call of Duty 3, the first one that I really got into was like Modern Warfare 2 and everything and
00:07:16
Speaker
That was one of the ones I first played online. It was interesting, but I think the one I played the most was definitely Black Ops 1. That was the one that really solidifies my love of the franchise at the time. Then again, as I said 10 years ago.
00:07:34
Speaker
So yeah, I wouldn't have known any better. I mean, what about yourself though Adam? What got you into black ops?
University Memories and Black Ops
00:07:44
Speaker
Was it just kind of a rolling thing? Or, you know, like that in the next stage? Oh yeah, yeah. This was the height of my life.
00:07:54
Speaker
my like interest and like my love really of like the Call of Duty series was this like you know late 2000s early early 2010s so that this was the one I remember this was my first year at uni uh when this one came out yeah and like I think I ordered it off amazon or something so like and I vividly remember it arrived well actually no because it didn't like I didn't think it was going to arrive actually on the release date but it did and I vividly remember because I had a politics essay due the next day
00:08:20
Speaker
So I was like, right, this is my evening, right? After like class, whatever, I came back to like, I was in student halls at the time, came back to like, came back to the halls and stuff. And I was just like, right, you know, I'll chill out for a bit, get some dinner, then I was just going to head back to the library. Just like crack out my, well, start, probably start writing my essay.
00:08:39
Speaker
I know me and start writing it, you know, and then like finish up the wee hours of the morning. And then like, uh, like one of my flatmates was like, Oh, by the way, there's like a package downstairs. It used to be like kind of like mailbox thing downstairs, like downstairs for you. And I was just like, Oh, I remember.
00:08:56
Speaker
I sprinted downstairs, got it, opened it. I was so excited. I didn't even care that it threw all my plans in disarray. I was like, well, this changes everything. This was the point where I was like, I have to play. I'm always like this for Call of Duty. I always got to play the campaign first before I jump into multiplayer or anything like that. I was like, right. I'm going to sit down and play this campaign. I was like, I'll play just a bit of the campaign.
00:09:19
Speaker
Then I'll go off and do my essay. So yeah, so I started playing the campaign. I played about three quarters of the campaign, and then it got to about nine or 10 in the evening. I was like, I actually have to go and write this essay down. So left, I was like, right. But off to the library.
00:09:35
Speaker
Went and did my essay, got back at about like two in the morning or just after two in the morning and I was like, right, I'm just going to finish off the campaign now. So I went and finished all the Black Ops campaign and then, I don't know, grabbed some fever to sleep. But yeah, like, I was just going to say, yeah, just like, so this, this was just the absolute like.
00:09:50
Speaker
height and like when i was just like really into the series and i totally agree with you as well this is probably the multiplayer i played the most of i would say of any certainly like up there and it was the one that i actually it was the first one i actually really got into the online multiplayer because i had not really played much of it in the previous college i played a lot of like split screen multiplayer in modern warfare 2 yeah so i was i was at boarding school at the time and had next at the 360 and like you know that used to be like a
00:10:17
Speaker
a favorite game, playing that kind of split screen. But I'd never really touched the online multiplayer too much until this one. And so this really got me into it for a good few years. It holds a special place in my heart, this one. Looking at the series as a whole, it's probably still my favorite, I would say, out of all the games. I still would rate this one the highest.
00:10:40
Speaker
I've got to agree with you there, I have to say. For me especially, I remember just going back to what I was saying about Halo 3 and Modern Warfare 2, I did play them online. I didn't have as many friends who had the games, so it meant that I couldn't really play as much with them. Or if they did have the games, they didn't play as much. But Black Ops seemed to be the one that
00:11:08
Speaker
It seemed to be the one that was like everybody seemed to have, which is really weird. And I think it was building off the popularity, so to give a bit of context to people who might not be into the series, initially it was made by a company called Infinity Ward, wasn't it?
00:11:28
Speaker
Yeah, that was really cool, yeah. And then they ended up splintering off into two groups. So you had one group called Infinity Ward 2 made, they ended up going on to make the Modern Warfare series in a lot of the games. And then you had a second company that focused on the Black Ops series called Treyarch, and then later on they
00:11:51
Speaker
had other companies that came in and made like other games but don't worry we're not gonna like delve into that today um but yeah it was like Activision had these two companies that were making games for them and they seemed they seemed to like a lot of people i don't know about you but i think like a lot of people seem to favor Treyarch over infinity ward yes infinity ward like had this
00:12:19
Speaker
they had this kind of reputation of being like the old guard because they developed a lot of the World War II games then they went on to the modern warfare games and the modern warfare games were really well received but then Treyarch came in and they were just like yeah, home of dog tacks let me show you how it's done and then they came in and they were just like so loud and bombastic and they had like such good campaign well
00:12:49
Speaker
They started off well, but we will get into that. So it was like this huge competition
Infinity Ward vs. Treyarch
00:12:55
Speaker
within the franchise. And I mean, like before we go on to the actual game itself, or the Black Ops series, technically you could say that it was started off in Treyarch's first game, World at War. Well, actually as well, do you want to, it's actually, I was thinking it's a fun link because you said your first Call of Duty was Call of Duty 3, right? Yeah.
00:13:19
Speaker
That's actually Treyarch's first main Call of Duty game. In the series it was. They'd done Big Red 1 before that, but that was considered a spin-off as opposed to an actual main series game. So they did three, was the first one they did. But then, as you say, three kind of received... It was mostly well received, but it was more mixed reviews compared to... As I'm sure you're going to talk about, World of War was their first one that people were like, okay.
00:13:48
Speaker
kind of their real statement game yeah i mean i have heard mixed things about three like i really enjoyed it at the time because it was my first game but i remember going back and everybody was just like oh call of duty three oh it's bad you know have you noticed like i do the same voice so i don't want any straw men
00:14:10
Speaker
Mr. Manned first time straw go no I don't like it. It's just it's it seemed to be one of those ones I think maybe because the other ones were better I don't know I haven't played the earlier ones but you're right. In my opinion they're better.
00:14:26
Speaker
It comes down to like, you know, it's not a bad, like I played Call of Duty again recently. It's like, it's not a bad game. I don't think it's as, it's not one of the best in the series, but it's not like a, I think it suffered from a bit of rush development time, which is a little rough around the edges. That's true. But I mean, I always remembered like going back to World at War just before we go on to like the Black Ops series. I remember, of all things, I don't know why I remember this, but the first time I saw it was when I was at a university open day.
00:14:57
Speaker
And I remember, yeah, there was a group of us and we went to the Uni and we, you know, did everything. And then a group of us just went into like the city to like look at, I think it was like, you know, the game shops and things. And I remember I was just looking around and then I went over to someone who was playing this weird game. I was like, what is that? And like, oh, it's the new Call of Duty. And they were using, I can't remember what the gun's called, but it's the one that looks like the Starship Enterprise.
00:15:26
Speaker
And it's like, you're the one at Cem and World at War where it's got like the big disc on top. Oh, the Russian one, yeah. Yeah, it was that one. And I was kind of like, what? That can't be a world, you know. That can't be cold, would you take it? And then it turns out it was. And that was really well received. And I'm actually really surprised that Treyarch actually held on to like a couple of things from that game.
00:15:53
Speaker
Because usually, other than, you know, like before the Black Ops series came along, it was more or less like single games. It was all focused on World War II and everything. And then it ended up that the, I mean, the modern warfare series is when they started kind of going chronologically, like with an extended story. To which I think Treyarch probably looked at that and went,
00:16:19
Speaker
to complain at this game oh yeah so that led to first of all they had um the just trying to think yeah it was it was world at war first yeah and then it went on to yeah world at war and then it went on to our topic of the day which is the black ops series and i have to admit they didn't like bring everything over but they brought two like specific characters over
00:16:48
Speaker
They brought the best things over. Ah yeah, Gary Oldman is a Russian. You can't beat that. He has actually one of the better parts of it. Trust me guys, if you haven't played it, trust me, he is a very good character. But yeah, that leads us then on to Black Ops 1.
Black Ops 1: Action and Narrative
00:17:05
Speaker
So I'll let you kick off with this.
00:17:08
Speaker
like in a kind of brief summary how would you describe like the first game not even like delving into the story or anything like oh fuck that's good i was just thinking i think if i had to describe the story i'd be like maybe what like if you if you locked like 13 year old me in a room with like i don't know like Rambo the Rambo the Rambo trilogy a powerpoint and like copious amounts of Red Bull is probably the story that i'd come up with
00:17:56
Speaker
For the most part, Call of Duty 3 did a little bit of that. But the others, by and large, you were given a name, but your character was there to win the war. The war was the story. It wasn't an actual narrative story that we're used to now in our Call of Duty games. So definitely borrowing that.
00:18:00
Speaker
Oh my god.
00:18:19
Speaker
It's funny looking back at it because I think this is maybe what happens when a series goes on for a long span of time and you get used to it and stuff, and you kind of actually forget what it was like when you first saw it and stuff. Actually, when I was thinking back to when I first played Black Ops,
00:18:38
Speaker
the actual I think I'm gonna have to sort of talk about the story cuz I'd like I think Sorry, I'm gonna I'm gonna deviate off the from the group the ground rules that you've laid for me. No, no But like like a proper black ops agent, but like just the way the story is done and everything was so like I've ever been really gripped by it. Mm-hmm
00:18:58
Speaker
The fact that you open up and your character is like... First of all, your character is talking, actually. That might have been... I actually wonder if that was one of the first times that actually happened in the Call of Duty game. I can't think of a game before that that had actually the character you played that was actually talking. So that in itself is a unique thing. It's obviously used to it now, but that was a unique element. And just the way it opens up with the story, you're being interrogated and stuff, and you don't know what's happening, your character doesn't know what's happening.
00:19:28
Speaker
It's a really interesting way to then delve back and you dive into these different missions and stuff. It feels very fitting with a kind of Cold War setting of like paranoia and espionage and who do you trust and everything. Really, the more I think about it was a really actually, say revolutionary is probably too strong a word, but it was a big kind of shake-up.
00:19:50
Speaker
you know, obviously building off the Modern Warfare series and stuff as well. Like, and yeah, just actually that freshness I think was really maybe what drew a lot of people to it. Why is it probably something they remembered? I totally agree with you. I think it was a nice change of pace. Like nowadays there's this kind of like, I suppose Call of Duty's kind of memed on and joked about because
00:20:12
Speaker
they thought that the way to kind of go forward, I mean the Cold War itself is like a natural progression, everything like a historical sense and the game franchise because at the stage like Call of Duty 3 came out and even World at War like a lot of World War 2 shooter games were getting very old and tired and
00:20:33
Speaker
no one really wanted to play that anymore. They were all kind of just like yeah what's the new thing you know and of course initially as I said Infinity Ward brought in
00:20:46
Speaker
modern warfare which was maybe like a bit of a leap over so it was kind of good to see Treyarch kind of rein that in and say okay we're not going to go that far we're just going to go maybe to a bit more like closer history in terms of the Cold War
00:21:04
Speaker
so it's nice that they didn't just do like a carbon copy just like go into the modern age as well because a lot of games I think at the time were just doing the same thing um with that they were all just because that's so what it seems like with the kind of cod franchise as a whole and I won't go too like deep into it but
00:21:22
Speaker
Initially, of course, it was a World War II game, which then evolved into a modern shooter. And of course, the Cold War side by side. Then it became a futuristic shooter. And now it's kind of like flopping back and forth. So it's kind of having a bit of an identity crisis right now. But yeah, it was kind of nice to gently ease players into the next
00:21:52
Speaker
evolution, I want to say. I don't want to sound too dramatic to be like, the mixed evolution of power to it. And then, you know, if you want, you can buy your Doritos at www.satsunami.com.
00:22:04
Speaker
and you get your double XP token honestly like oh god but yeah like even before like Dirito I was gonna call it Dirito Gate or something you know before all of that kind of advertising it was like a nice easing in
00:22:24
Speaker
easing in to the next stage of the franchise. And I think Black Ops definitely, Black Ops the first one definitely reminds me of more of like a B-movie. Like you were saying Rambo earlier. That's kind of what it reminds me of. It reminds me of one of these films. So the kind of basic plot is, as you were explaining Adam, basically it's about a
00:22:52
Speaker
Yeah, it's about a CIA agent or a Black Ops agent, role credits, that ends up getting interrogated and it flashes back to missions that he was on. And they're basically trying to stop this chemical weapon called Nova-6 being set off by the Russians. Really, really like... I mean, it's definitely more of an action film.
00:23:22
Speaker
that you would see in the 80s. But that's the entertaining thing. It's so, like, you're supposed to be black ops, you're supposed to be covert, undercover, you're supposed to be, you know, sneaking in. No, no, no, no. You just, you just blow up. Like, there's literally a mission where you have to sneak into a Soviet base and then like two seconds later, you blow up a missile that's like, like, I'm a massive missile and you're like, yeah, black ops.
00:23:53
Speaker
Deniability! Ora! It's so silly and over the top but that's what I love about it. I think it's just so... oh there is, there's such an enjoyment and I think I was talking to someone else about this earlier but I think that's what... oh sorry before I go on there are going to be spoilers for these games
00:24:14
Speaker
So we are going to be talking about the original trilogy and such and we're also going to be talking about Cold War. So just a heads up and we'll let you know like when we're about to kind of spoil but just in case then you've probably played it because it's ten years old.
00:24:32
Speaker
So yeah, I was talking to someone else about it and I was telling them about how it makes the twist in the game all that more satisfying. So basically throughout the game, you're haunted by a guy called, well not haunted, but you keep bumping into a Russian called Viktor Reznov, played by Gary Oldman of course.
00:24:54
Speaker
and he ends up like helping you along and he's like a recurring character from World at War so that's like where the link is and it was really interesting them bringing him back to establish some kind of continuity but yeah you get through the game and he's always popping up in really random places and then it turns out you know it's a sixth sense
00:25:18
Speaker
tear. He was a ghost the entire time. He's not like literally a ghost but he's just like a hallucination from... And planted into your mind. Yeah and the main character Mason thinks that you know this guy has been here the entire time and he's not and that's what kind of I think separates it from a lot of colleges to games with like weird twists and things.
00:25:44
Speaker
Because it is, it's like, it plays, it knows what it is, it's like an 80s action film with the evil Soviet Union who are about to like blow up this chemical weapon unless the good guys can start, you know, it's like, it's that over the top. And then when you get that twist you're like, oh shit, I did not see that coming. Good going to Gary Oldman.
00:26:07
Speaker
It really gets you the first time, it's actually surprising. But the first time you played you were just like, oh my god, that was... And that is, it's something you didn't expect. But I think that definitely leads us into our first recap about the Black Ops series. What would you say is some of your favourite moments in the first campaign?
00:26:33
Speaker
I mean, I definitely in the campaign itself, like definitely that first, that moment when it got revealed, like the twist gift revealed, that was a big thing. Whereas I was very sleep deprived at that point as well. As I said, but like still, I've just been like, oh, it made me really want to replay it. And it's actually, remember replaying the campaign and you get all those moments where like, you don't, I didn't really pay attention to the first time. I don't know if you did, but as you say, like Reznov keeps showing up at points.
00:26:59
Speaker
And you keep talking to him, he talks to you. But it's funny that you don't actually realize that no other character like converses with him. And like often at points like, you know, Mason will say something to me, and people will be like...
00:27:11
Speaker
the hell are you saying like you know like come on what are you doing and there's one bit in the in the tunnel I don't remember that level in the tunnels where like red knob drops in and then like your mason starts talking to him and the guy in front of you is like what the f are you doing like you know come on you're heading the game and it's stuff like I just didn't it didn't didn't like yeah I didn't pick up that at all the first time but going back you're like oh it's actually really clever yeah so that definitely has stand out because yeah there's like just following up from what you were saying there is another scene like that where um
00:27:40
Speaker
What is it? It's like you have to go to Vietnam for a couple of missions and you end up coming across, well you have to look for the Russian defector that's going to give you all the information and then plot to a story, oh it's Reznov and he's going to give you all the information and you kind of play it and you're like oh right okay that's a bit contrived but okay fair enough and then it turns out like when you go back to play it
00:28:03
Speaker
the defector, and you can actually see his body. He was actually killed because the building that you're in was assaulted, so the body's there, like he's been shot and he's dead, but because Resinov comes out of the blue you're like, oh, okay. He paid no attention to it really. So it's really interesting in that regard.
00:28:28
Speaker
It's, oh man, I do adore this game. I think it's so, so good. I think it hits that perfect balance as well of like, this was as this, this was as Call of the Ecology series was beginning to ramp up and like, you know, it was becoming very much kind of like, as you say, kind of action movie, like very action movie-esque, sort of almost Michael, Michael, kind of like a Michael Bay film almost, but like in a good
00:28:52
Speaker
away and there's a lot of like really big set pieces in this but it was at that point certainly i felt this way it was at that point where like i was really excited i really liked those set pieces and i really enjoyed playing them whether whereas now you you feel like you've you've seen so many of them and it almost feels like oh it's contrived now but it was at that point where like
00:29:10
Speaker
you know, all these things like helicopters crashing and like, you know, assault buildings and like, as you say, blowing, blowing Russian spacecraft out of the air and everything like that. It was really, I remember really absolutely like, exhilarated playing it and stuff. Really loving all that kind of like, going back and everything. So it was at that perfect moment for, for that, like, you know, before like the four RM
00:29:31
Speaker
I can't think of the word, but before we kind of tired of it and our kind of cynicism setting about it. Yeah, because I mean that was definite with the height. I think Black Ops came out about the same time as like the Modern Warfare series. So it was kind of like, yeah, the sandwich between Modern Warfare 2 and 3. So it was like that perfect balance of when college was at its peak.
00:29:54
Speaker
And after that I do agree with you I think the set pieces like even the bad ones I'm gonna admit this now even the bad ones had excellent set pieces Oh, yeah, but decent ones that you kind of remember I mean a few of my favorites have to be well, there's one where you have to break out of a Russian basically a Russian Gulag and
00:30:18
Speaker
Oh that's such a good level isn't it? So yeah you have to escape from a place called is it Vorkuta? Vorkuta yeah. Vorkuta yeah and yeah it's like you have to go and do this massive jailbreak and it's just so again it's so over the top something that would not look at a place in the 80s action film. Yeah. So so good. There's a Nova 6 flashback where you find out how the Russians got their hands on Nova 6
00:30:44
Speaker
really, or not the Russians, the Soviet Union, sorry. You've got like a mission where you're in a hazmat suit and the whole place is covered in like Nova Six, so you have to have a hazmat suit on and if you get shot too many times, like usually in Call of Duty, you get shot, you hide and then you're healed and you go away. If you get shot in this level, then all the cracks start appearing in your suit and obviously if you get shot too much,
00:31:11
Speaker
then your suit's going to break and all the chemical agent just goes into your body. I thought that was a really cool idea for that level. Really good idea. Honestly, I could not praise this game enough. It's funny, just you saying that. Just thinking about that, what's great about that prison escape level as well is the way it's structured. I don't know if you remember, but at the beginning, as you're starting the level, this is when Resnov is alive as well. This is actually alive, Resnov.
00:31:40
Speaker
And he says the different steps of the plan and everything. Everybody's like, he's like, step one. And everybody says the other things. And that's the whole way the mission is structured. And if you look at your mission objective list, it's like step one, step two, whatever. And it's got the things, and it's the way it's all done. And you never quite know, it's great as well, because you never quite know, there's one bit that I remember where it's like, I think it's step four or something, it's like, skewer the winged beast. And you don't know what that is. And then it's like, you get that,
00:32:06
Speaker
shotgun with the grappling hook in it and you fire it to take down the helicopter and things and there's just like there's a great ones like ones like rain fire and stuff that you'd so it's it's a great way of building anticipation i think for what you're going to do as the level ramps up but not exactly not telling you like you know go get shotgun with grappling hook to shoot down helicopter you know that like kind of spoils it so it's actually like i'm quite i think quite a really clever way of like actually designing a level yeah
00:32:31
Speaker
It was very... it was definitely immersive. I will give it that. It was so immersive. It wasn't just like... I don't know. I'm not gonna compare it to the other ones too much, but it was, as you said, instead of saying go to point B and shoot down the helicopter, it is. It's like...
00:32:50
Speaker
skewer the wing of beasts and do this and that and it really drew you into the story which is really weird because I actually don't remember the last time I've actually praised a Call of Duty game as much because usually I'm kind of like yeah because like I mean I've been hurt before what can I say and so I'm like I was kind of like reserved about praising it but no I can't like not praise Black Ops
00:33:17
Speaker
I mean it was like not only am I kind of biased because it's a game I grew up with but it was just such an impactful entry into the series and that as we were saying there's just so many memorable moments but that actually and I know this is where um so like after the height of um Black Ops um in both like media and gaming circles and things
00:33:46
Speaker
Then Modern Warfare 3 came out and this is when, just for context, this is when the series kind of started hitting Call of Duty fatigue because it was the same as the FIFA games where they were bringing one out every year.
Black Ops 2: Futuristic Shift
00:34:01
Speaker
So people were kind of getting tired of having to upgrade every year. It's the same with any annual franchise like Pokemon or
00:34:08
Speaker
you know those kind of games or as I said FIFA and such. So after Modern Warfare 2 the next Call of Duty game that came out in 2012 actually was Black Ops 2 and I know you have an opinion about this. Do you want to go first or do you want me to do it? Do you want me to summarise it first?
00:34:33
Speaker
Yeah, you summarise it, but I think it's probably better you give a kind of a- Okay. So basically, the second game, I just realised, because you summarise the first one and I'm summarising the second one, and then I'm leaving the worst one to you.
00:34:48
Speaker
Aww. Yeah, sorry. You've played this very well. You've played this very well. Well played. You're playing three-dimensional chess here. I'm playing the Black Ops game. I paid attention. So yeah, we'll get to the third game. So say a prayer in the background as we get to that. But the second game is pretty much a direct sequel.
00:35:10
Speaker
And this is where Call of Duty started dipping its tool into other genres of shooters. So initially the first one, all about the Cold War, you had the Vietnam War, you had all the Bay of Pigs invasion, you had all these significant events during the Cold War. But there was a lot kind of missed out.
00:35:33
Speaker
And then when the second game came out, I remember it was like advertising, like this is when Call of Duty 2 was like really cool with everyone. Like I know that sounds weird saying, but I remember like prominent kind of YouTubers advertising this game.
00:35:49
Speaker
like ones who you know like gamers and people who had like kind of related I remember there was a guy I don't know if you remember this one I think his name was like FPS Russia or something it was like a guy who used to like um it wasn't a gamer I think he just used to shoot guns on YouTube and be like oh look you know quirky me but he was like and at the time he was like
00:36:11
Speaker
one of the bigger stars and things on YouTube. And honestly, it was like they had everybody coming in to advertise this game. Everybody loved it. And the weird thing about it is, as I said, they dip their toes into different genres. So half of the game is following up from the story of Alex Mason, the protagonist of the first game, trying to hunt down this Nicaraguan drug.
00:36:39
Speaker
a smuggler. And then the other half is playing as his son in the future. So half of the game is your traditional boots on the ground college or two, you're playing through the cold war and then the other half is like a futuristic shooter which I know at the time was quite divisive but I have heard a lot of praise for it. I have to admit though like I had like a weird exposure to it
00:37:03
Speaker
because I think when Call of Duty like Modern Warfare 3 came out I was kind of getting tired of the franchise so I didn't pick up Black Ops 2 right away but I saw people play it and funny enough I didn't have
00:37:19
Speaker
I didn't have like my Xbox at uni because you know like you know that I'll just you saw I don't want to be distracted and again I was just getting bored anyway so I ended up downloading it on Steam instead and playing it on the PC you know when there's a well there's a call would you to game for it and
00:37:41
Speaker
I really enjoyed it. I don't think I enjoyed it as much as the first one but I really enjoyed what they did. It was different for sure but I didn't like the... so basically as I said it's like on the one hand you're
00:37:57
Speaker
trying to in fact it kind of over arcs and it overlaps with one another but you're just trying to find this guy called Menendez who's trying to bring down the US and both like in the past and in the future and everything really kind of well done for what it was but then they did a thing where
00:38:15
Speaker
do you remember what they were called it was like the side missions you had strike force missions or as i wrote down and as i wrote down i was writing notes down oh yeah under the under the black ops 2 heading i wrote down strike force missions oh my god dot dot
00:38:33
Speaker
Yeah. Basically Strike Force missions were like tower defense modes where you had an objective, you had to carry it out, you had to defend a base for so long, you had to escort another
00:38:49
Speaker
like fruit carrier or something you know it's like it was really weird missions and literally say the only payoff is like a png and correct me if i'm wrong but i'm sure it's like either a png of like saying china joined the fight with america or like a throw a country would flash up a different color in a map yeah essentially it was like risk but with none of the risk
00:39:20
Speaker
It didn't feel like the effort was worth it if you know what I mean. It just seemed like, I mean the rest of the game I really enjoyed personally but sorry I've been rumbling too much.
00:39:37
Speaker
were your opinions on it? Like both? I don't know. Both on everything about it. I don't know. You know, I wrote down this might be a controversial opinion, but I don't actually know of it. Maybe so much time has passed now that this really isn't a controversial opinion. It's okay, you're in a safe space.
00:39:54
Speaker
I'm going to save space here. Don't hate me. This is my least favorite game in the series. What of the Black Ops series? This is my least favorite of the Black Ops series. And it's very close to being my least favorite of all the Call of Duty games, I think. It's down the bottom. I don't like this. I'm not a fan of this game. And I am definitely the minority here because this game, I think, did review very well at the time. And I think it still, I think, would appear in a lot of people, close to a lot of people's
00:40:24
Speaker
Favorite og especially the more like the multiplayer was absolutely I think you guys like the best og multiplayer has been But so like and the multiplayer was good. I can't really remember too much about it Like I have to I have to admit so I won't talk much about that I'll talk more about it and it's if what for me did it is it's the campaign like I'm sorry like The strike force missions like college duties and a lot of things that maybe are morally questionable Effortly questionable and stuff in terms of what we depicted in campaign the strike force missions are the worst thing that's ever been done
00:40:55
Speaker
I can't think of anything worse. You know, take all the ethical dilemmas of moral things, but Strikeful Permissions are awful. Worst thing has ever been put into them. I find the story confusing. I've played it again recently, and I think it's the way the story is told. I feel it's done in a kind of way, and I'm just like, wait, what?
00:41:15
Speaker
Why is this happening? There's a point where, again, can I go into spoiler territory? No, go for it. So basically it turns out that basically the main character, Alec Mason's son, David Mason, has met Menendez before and Menendez is responsible for the death of Alex Mason, his father. And there's just one point where he just remembers, he's just having a boxing match, then all of a sudden he gets punched in the face. He's like, oh my God, I met Menendez.
00:41:40
Speaker
And okay, these games are B-movies. We've established that these games are B-movies. This for me was a point where I was like, this is just dumb. And I was just like, this is just ridiculous. And all of a sudden, he's like, oh, now I remember everything. And as well, they took the character of Hudson from the first game, who was one of my favorite characters in the first game. So I thought he was just like, so he's such a damn cool badass and stuff. And they completely changed him and made him this really
00:42:06
Speaker
uh like duplicitous character and everything and then he but like he betrays them at the end and i'm still not entirely sure why um like so i just found the story confusing and i didn't like the shift into the into future gameplay this was where this for me was where the ecology fatigue hit and it was when i realized that like
00:42:25
Speaker
I wasn't a fan of the futuristic gameplay. And in fairness, compared to what's come since, the gameplay is still actually, as much as there's futuristic elements, it's still pretty grounded.
00:42:38
Speaker
Nobody was double jumping and wall running and everything at this point. I remember at the time being disappointed when I heard that because I much prefer it when it was in a historical setting or a modern day setting. I'll give the game some praise. There were some interesting changes they made to it and I think having a branching storyline is an interesting idea.
00:43:01
Speaker
I don't think it doesn't quite work, I don't think, because I don't think it quite works. But it's an interesting idea, at least. And I like the fact that they put some things in. The levels felt a bit more open and stuff, and they had that you could choose your loadout, which was quite cool, and you could take in different perks and stuff and equipment, and you get that thing, like an access kit, that would open up different options for you. That was quite a cool idea, and I think that's... It'd be cool if they brought... I don't think they've brought that back in again, but that would be a nice idea.
00:43:31
Speaker
And that was the first game as well for the multiplayer that brought in the kind of pick 10 system.
00:43:36
Speaker
Is that still what they use now? Have they changed it where you had 10 different slots and you could customize your loadout to that level? This was the first one to do it, which I think was actually quite a good and interesting system for the multiplayer. I don't know. There's something about this game. I've played it. I played it fairly recently. I was going back through the apologies again. I just don't like the levels. I find the story just annoying.
00:44:05
Speaker
There's something about it, and I don't even know if I can fully put my finger on it, but there's just something about this game that I just don't like, and I just don't have a desire. I get a desire to go back and play some of the other Call of Duty's, but this is one that I just...
00:44:16
Speaker
I don't get that desire. I was just going to say, I think it would be a wasted question to ask you what your favourite moment was. We can talk about that. It's not a bad game. I've just kind of wrapped on a bit, but it's not a bad game. I fully admit I'm in the minority here. It's a serviceable game. It plays fine. It's not a piece of garbage. I just don't like what they did with it.
00:44:42
Speaker
And if I was picking like moments like I think actually know my favorite moments of of this game are the lawsuits that Famous people against it. So there's there's two there's I knew about one of them I just found out about a second one here. So Manuel Noriega people know who man. Oh, yeah, yeah, Panama who was like moved in a basically American
00:45:03
Speaker
as you mentioned moved him in 1990 I think he's appeared in the game as like quite a like he's quite an important character and he sued he sued Activision because he for like using his liking like likeness and the fact that he didn't like his depiction it's like like you know kind of personal so he sued him he sued him for that um which he lost and then also I just found out that the family members of um
00:45:28
Speaker
There's a guy called Jonas Savimbi who appears in the first mission. He was quite a controversial, I'll say African warlord, during the Angolan Civil War, who led one of the factions. He was quite a notorious reputation for a lot of nasty, a lot of bad things. So his family, some of his family members sued, also sued Activision for his portrayal, which to be honest, I think actually, to be honest, that's actually probably it.
00:45:56
Speaker
one of the nicest portrayals Jonas and Wimpy will get, I think, in anything. But they apparently didn't like it, so they sued. They sued, actually. I think my favorite moments were those two. I was just going to say, I'm kind of confused about that. Like, no idea. I can totally understand. They just... Yeah, they did not portray him in a nice light, but I mean... He was a nice guy, I think, to be honest. I mean, you end up getting rescued by... Yeah, it's like your buddy buddy. Oh, it's like...
00:46:24
Speaker
Yeah.
00:46:42
Speaker
There was quite a cool level on that kind of really fancy holiday resort in the Cayman Islands or something where you've got the kind of watches and the adverts as you go by change to put your face into it. That was quite a cool concept. Yeah, that's definitely going to happen in the future. It's not a matter of efforts, it's a matter of when that's going to happen.
00:47:06
Speaker
That was a cool moment. Some of the guests, the wingsuit bat, she's quite cool. The wingsuit bat, I think, is the first futuristic mission. Yeah. Like, that's quite cool, like, doing that a bit. So I'll pick those moments. Yeah, I have to admit. Yeah, just hold on, yeah, I can find them. Yeah, I would have to say, between that, so what I've got, weirdly enough, what I've got written down is probably the same as you. The island. I've just written the island, which, yeah, that resort, I like that mission a lot. And any, that's actually what I've written. I wrote down any cold war moments.
00:47:34
Speaker
because actually I thought all the Cold War moments that they focus on so it's like they're scenes where they take them to I mean there's Afghanistan, was it Paraguay? They go to Nicaragua. They go to Nicaragua as well but towards the end I mean
00:47:51
Speaker
Panama as well, they go to Panama. I like those moments because again, it was almost reminding you it was giving you a bit of a taste for the last game. So I liked it in the way that it kind of anchored itself in a way that it was still a continual story. Even with the futuristic stuff, at least you could tell it was in the same universe.
00:48:18
Speaker
unlike a certain other game which yeah brings us to oh my god so i don't even know how to like start this like will i jump in and try and start it yeah i was just gonna like before you before you do and trust me okay i'll give you like a couple of seconds to prepare yourself but
00:48:39
Speaker
After Black Ops 2, there was like a kind of shift towards more futuristic games. So it started kind of easy with Call of Duty Ghosts and Advanced Warfare. So these were the kind of two games that they weren't modern shooters, but they weren't futuristic either. They were like in this kind of weird limbo of, oh, I heard once that the Americans have this kind of weapon. Let's enter a game around it. For ghosts.
00:49:09
Speaker
And for advanced warfare as well, it was all to do with prosthetics and the military complex and all of that. And yeah, it was things that were semi-realistic, things that could happen essentially, things that could happen but weren't
00:49:27
Speaker
too far that they couldn't. And then Black Ops 3 dropped and I'm gonna hand it over to you because I have watched several videos explaining the plot of Black Ops 3 and I still, I'm still getting my head around it.
Black Ops 3: Confusing Plot
00:49:42
Speaker
I played through the full game, I've watched several videos of guys going, what's up guys, today we're going to be explaining all the tidbits of Black Ops 3. And then by the end of that half an hour, I still don't understand. But sorry, over to you. I'm laughing, I'm crying because I have no idea how to do this.
00:50:06
Speaker
I don't know. Anyway, I'll give it my best shot. I'll try and summarise the plot. You don't even have to summarise the plot. I'll talk more about the game. It's set 40 years after the end of Black Ops 2. It's 2065. Basically, the world has been divided into this third Cold War. Technically, Black Ops 2 is the second Cold War.
00:50:33
Speaker
But they started Cold War between these two sides, and basically they're so advanced. The sides are so advanced with defensive weaponry and stuff. The only real way that war can happen is with these more small-scale Black Ops covert missions. So that's what centers on, and that's your character as part of that. It's always missions undertaken, and it plays a lot with...
00:50:59
Speaker
It plays a lot with different themes of like, you know, cause every, all these soldiers are for the most part are like cybernetically augmented as well. And they've got kind of like robot limbs and they've got what's called DNI's which are implanted in their mind to like help them better in combat and everything. And the story kind of goes with those themes of like,
00:51:19
Speaker
I don't even know how I'd describe the themes, but it's a lot of cerebral kind of... I guess free will? Yeah, it's almost Matrix-y in a way. Free kind of ideas of free will and I guess choice maybe is a thing as well.
00:51:34
Speaker
like I'm really strong sorry I'm doing a terrible job of fixing it. Do you know what it reminds me of Jane? I'm not saying like against you I just mean the game in general it reminds me of you know you would get that one book in English class and it was so like over the top and confusing you would do your best to try and explain the themes and you would be like yeah so um um the um
00:52:01
Speaker
Yeah, the blue curtains, yeah. The symbolised sadness. You do know that was in the first couple of sentences of the book. Yeah, I know.
00:52:13
Speaker
I mean that's about all I could go into. Oh my god, so as I said like I watch so many videos trying to think what is like a concise summary and I think you definitely summed it up of it's like a radical war and everything but it basically follows at the very beginning you're tasked with finding a okay in fact oh before I go on Adam do you remember the name of the main character in Black Ops 3?
00:52:42
Speaker
Oh, it's just player, isn't it? It's not their name. Yeah, they literally just call you player.
00:52:50
Speaker
They don't call you, they don't like to say it out loud, but in the subtitles they just call you player. You've not got a name, you've not got an identity, you are just a robbery player, man or woman you could actually choose. And that was another thing. They're like, oh, it's the first Call of Duty game you can play. In fact, no, that's not true. I think you can play as a woman. Finalist hour. Finalist hour, the first one I had as a woman in the campaign.
00:53:14
Speaker
but yeah it was like they made a huge deal about like that as well and everything and it's like well that would be good if the game made any sense like oh i'm i'm still struggling like so yeah basically in the first mission you have to rescue this i think it's like the egyptian like an egyptian minister you have to rescue it you know i've got i've got i've got the wikipedia up here as well
00:53:38
Speaker
Oh God, it doesn't even tell you? It just says rescue hostages? Yep, there you go. So it's like, you rescue him and it ends up you literally, well not literally, well no, you do literally get robocop'd because this robot, it's a really, it made me uncomfortable considering what goes on in the Black Ops series. This was like the only scene that I did genuinely, like once I go, ooh, that's nasty.
00:54:02
Speaker
because basically you get beaten down by a robot and you think right that's fine well not fine but you know I mean it's kind of like fade to black or something but no you get your arms ripped off you get your legs ripped off and then the game has the cheek to like rescue you at the last second and the guy turns round to you as if you know you've just been like shot in the leg or something he goes come on you're gonna be fine it's like
00:54:29
Speaker
amputated him. Oh it's just it's just like it is shocking the level of I don't even know like between pretentiousness and just downright confusing like at worst it's pretentious at least it's just downright confusing because I honestly like so apparently
00:54:51
Speaker
the subtext of the game. At the very beginning, they hide information in the scroll and text in the background. And yeah, spoilers there, but basically they tell you that you have died, but you still play the game.
00:55:07
Speaker
as this player. And to make matters worse, something I didn't realise, apparently all the levels that you play are out of order. So it's not even telling a coherent story there. So it's like the last couple of missions are meant to be at the beginning and like the first level's at the end or something.
00:55:28
Speaker
I'm completely lost when it comes to it because I do not understand it whatsoever. It's just a mess. It's an absolute mess. I will admit, I did have fun playing it, I suppose.
00:55:39
Speaker
but that was about it. Like at the very end, you're, so as you were saying Adam, they, all the soldiers have a thing called DNI's in them and I think it's like a direct neural interface to call, you know, they beef it up. No, I watched the video before coming on.
00:56:01
Speaker
I should have done that. That's the only thing I remember from that video. But yeah it's like at the very end basically you're trying to like bring in these rogue agents who have all these DNI's and like they can basically it means it can control like
00:56:17
Speaker
you know, like robots and things like that. It's basically an excuse for the gameplay. They've got robotic limbs, they've got powers over robots, you know, that's it. It's just a gameplay excuse. But the thing, and I don't know if you all agree with me on this, but the thing that I hate most, and this is the thing that's a huge slap in the face, more so than Black Ops 4, which, and we'll kind of briefly touch on it, but
00:56:47
Speaker
The worst thing for me is the fact that it's not a Black Ops game. I'm gonna call it outright. It is not a Black Ops game for me anyway. I think that the only reason they put the Black Ops name on it is for the marketing. I think that's the only reason they did it. And there's only two references to the past games. There is a reference to Nova 6, which is the chemical weapon gas and
00:57:14
Speaker
There's a reference to Raul Menendez, who's the villain, from the second game. And that's literally like a cutscene, like a blink and you'll miss it. I mean, at least like, although as divisive as the second game is, at least it had some connection to the first one.
00:57:32
Speaker
It had the same characters and everything. It had some kind of progression. But with the third one, it was just like, oh yeah, we're totally related to that. You know, look Nova Six. Why would you still have that around?
00:57:47
Speaker
I don't know. We've got robots now. Oh yeah, we've got robots which we're going to use the assets from for other games. Sorry, I know I went off on like a personal rant there. No, no, I mean I had my rant before about Minecraft 2.
00:58:08
Speaker
I think it's a fun game. Story-wise it is completely broken. It is probably one of my least favourite stories and that's coming in with ghosts as well because again we'll touch on that in another day but
00:58:26
Speaker
that's for another time yeah that is for another time because i won't go off on another rant but yeah i'm not a big fan of college or two ghosts um but i would prefer to play that because at least i remember laughing at it
00:58:39
Speaker
than playing through the end to I mean that's the other thing like at the very end you go through like this matrix kind of world where you link up with someone and then you're shooting zombies and then you're shooting Nazis and then you're shooting it's just a mess it's an utter complete mess of a story and as I say gameplay wise it's fun I can't fault it for that but yeah in terms of everything else nah nah
00:59:10
Speaker
So in other words, nah, not great. It was just so disappointing because I think Black Ops 3 came out in 2015. That's three years he had to wait between Black Ops 2 and 3. And between that we had Ghost and Advance Warfare, which whether you like them or not, I think they were received kind of mediocre.
00:59:34
Speaker
at the time. It was worth it. I think it was a sweep quite well. Yeah, I think people quite liked it. Ghost was certainly, I think, lukewarm. But I don't know, it's just such a disappointment. We're waiting so long for another Call of Duty game and then that's what they bring out.
00:59:55
Speaker
Like I love sci-fi, don't get me wrong, I'm a huge bloody nerd. I would be all in for that. But when it comes to a Black Ops game, nah, that's it, definitely. Which then kind of briefly, now we, I mean, I'm probably safe in saying this for you as well, but we haven't really played any of Black Ops 4.
01:00:21
Speaker
Have we? Yeah, yeah. No, well, I don't know. I'm the same. And the reason is because I think we are like a small minority of people who, we're a small minority of people who play the campaigns in Call of Duty, because I know a lot of people, like especially nowadays with war zone and things, they'll just jump straight into the multiplayer. They won't play the campaign. So like when I hear, you know, oh, there's not going to be a campaign, I just I didn't bother with it.
01:00:50
Speaker
and the fact it was a battle royale. Yeah, it was just, it wasn't my cup of tea, personally. I know people who have enjoyed it, they've loved it. I think for a pure multiplayer experience, I hear it's like very good multiplayer, which you'd expect because they put so much focus into it. So I do think in that way, for a multiplayer shooter, it probably is really good.
01:01:15
Speaker
And it seems like they made some interesting changes to it. So, but I just, I'm with you on that one, like, you know, I was out the minute I said no. I was sort of out buying Call of Duty games on release anyway, kind of by this point. And I'd just been burned by World War II the year before I'd kind of got back into it, but like, yeah, I wasn't. Yeah, which again, that's for another. I guess we want to talk about that one. But yeah, no, so I had no interest in playing it.
01:01:44
Speaker
Which then brings us back to I...
01:01:48
Speaker
I don't know whether it's optimistic to say that it might be reigniting our kind of interests because, I mean, at the start of the lockdown, I don't really have much of an interest towards Call of Duty as much. I played through some of the older ones to kind of rekindle that long lost happiness that I'm looking for. But I never really played any of the new ones until then, you and I,
01:02:18
Speaker
Stephen as well, like some of our friends just got into modern warfare, playing it online. Which again is like another thing. And then the year after, in this glorious year of 2020, they announced that College of Two was going back to grassroots and it was going to go back to the Cold War. And there was no futuristic stuff, there was nothing like that.
01:02:44
Speaker
and yeah it was really interesting that they were gonna go back to just purely cold war stuff but yeah I'm kind of worried because this is the game I've played recently like I played the campaign multiplayer is great like I'm just gonna throw that out multiplayer is a lot of fun yeah but the and I can't comment on the zombies as well but we're probably we'll get round to that yeah we will we're gonna we're gonna try and play it together and
01:03:12
Speaker
You've played some Warzone as well, haven't you? Yeah, Warzone's fun. It's a Stockholm Syndrome mode. It's one of those modes that you have to play more of it to enjoy it, which is something I normally wouldn't recommend, but generally for this one, definitely.
01:03:29
Speaker
But for the campaign, I'm going to turn it over to you first because I know you're really into, or not into, but you were really excited about this to talk about it. So yeah, what were your thoughts, say for the campaign for Cold War?
01:03:49
Speaker
Yeah, so again, like, we're going spoiler territory here. Yeah, spoiler. Just another warning. So, yeah, like, I really enjoyed, like, large parts of this campaign. And I really like some of the new kind of elements they brought into it. Like, I really like the... And it's very like, it's very surface level. It's not... Oh, yeah.
01:04:10
Speaker
customization in the slightest. But I really enjoyed the ability to be able to customize your character and give them a name and a backstory and then put in some perks. You could choose the perks and it was related to psychological traits, which I thought was quite cool. I enjoyed it as well. They put a bit more of a focus on stealth. Again, this is still an action game. There's plenty of action set pieces.
01:04:31
Speaker
when your gun fights, but I felt like there was a slightly bigger focus on stealth, which, you know, being a black, that's kind of maybe what you'd first think you're in black up things like, you know, not ability and things like that. So it was nice that they brought a bit of that kind of bit of that kind of focus back to it.
01:04:47
Speaker
I also really, really enjoyed the kind of puzzle elements to the side missions that they had. I thought that was a really kind of cool, actually making you think in a Call of Duty game, like having to actually use your brain and work things out, I thought was really actually good. I do hope, for me personally, and maybe you disagree with me, but I really hope they bring that back and I really hope they actually kind of carry that out because I thought it was a really cool element to it.
01:05:08
Speaker
and some really, really good missions in there as well. Like I really enjoyed the one in East Berlin, like the one in the KGB headquarters. And I love the kind of Vietnam, I called it Vietnam mind palace level near the end. That was kind of cool. I was like, that's kind of cool trippy kind of level to do.
01:05:24
Speaker
So lots to really, really like there. And then the ending is what I really wanted to talk about. I don't know if there's anything you want to say before we kind of dive into the ending? Yeah, just before we go on to through spoilers spoilers, I honestly have mixed feelings about Cold War. Don't get me wrong, I think... How to even put this?
01:05:52
Speaker
Like, the first one is always gonna be my favourite. Two, I didn't think was good, as good as the first one, but it was still enjoyable enough. Three, as I've said, utter abomination. Let's not go there again. Four, never played. Five, eh, Cold War rather.
01:06:15
Speaker
The thing that kind of put me off the campaign was it almost felt as if they were so close. I feel as if they focused on the new characters more. If they had Adler and
01:06:32
Speaker
Sims and laser and all of the cool... I'm blanking on who the other... Yeah, if they had more focus on them and to develop them, which you might be thinking, oh it's a Call of Duty game, you know you just point and shoot, but you can tell they were trying to go for something deeper here because they had the dialogue tree and things which really threw me off.
01:06:56
Speaker
I was really surprised when I first saw that and I was like, oh, sorry. I was like, I'm streaming that. And I was like, oh, sorry, chat. I've clearly put in Fallout 4 instead. I only speak in bullets in a Call of Duty game. I speak with words. Yeah, exactly. Because I'm so used to just jumping in a game and being like, oh, yeah, pew, pew, pew, which is really weird for me to say because usually that's not like
01:07:22
Speaker
That's not who I am. That's not what I'm like, man. Yeah, usually I love a game with a good story that you can get just immersed in, but in Call of Duty or in Black, it's got so many titles, it's like in Call of Duty, Black Ops. A bit too many. Yeah, Call of Duty on Alpha.
01:07:40
Speaker
Yeah, so in Cold War. Yeah, it felt as if there was a lot that was kind of stunting the action. Like say what you have about like Black Ops 1, like saying, oh they're supposed to be, you know, they're supposed to be Black Ops but, you know, they're blowing up things all over the place. At least it was fun and fast paced. And even for the second game it was fun, it was fast paced, it was
01:08:03
Speaker
No, except for the Strike Force missions, but we won't get back into that. They'll bring me back to their hands. It's like Vietnam flashbacks from me, like, no, man, don't make me go back. Yeah, exactly. But yeah, for the third, or sorry, for Cold War.
01:08:22
Speaker
I just felt as if they were like bits of a different game. Do you know what it reminds me of? See you were saying about stealth earlier, about like the emphasis on stealth. One of the things I found interesting was I drew a lot of parallels between that and did you ever play the campaign for Battlefield 1? Yeah yeah. They had a very similar... do you remember the tank level? Yeah yeah. Yeah it was very similar to that so basically like in that level you have to sneak into like a encampment
01:08:52
Speaker
and there's like a stealth system that they did and it's very similar it's like a wee meter that fills up and then you know if they notice you then it's gonna like beep off and they'll start shooting at you but it was kind of similar to that. It almost felt as if there was no consequences if you know what like I I mean you can see it on the stream but I did bugger up royally so in West Berlin
01:09:18
Speaker
let's get that clear, East Berlin. Yeah I buggered up royally in that mission because I think I can't remember what I did but I hid and then there was like literally nowhere to go so I like had to shoot my way out and yeah I just walked into the building and the guy was like oh you were too loud and it's like but you know what
01:09:42
Speaker
maybe if i had some support laser which is a dumb name but definitely leaving you on that rooftop yeah exactly oh god i feel like that but yeah that's the thing though like i was really disappointed just because like you had all these new characters right i can understand that you had all the new characters coming in to save the world from you know the pesky Soviet Union you know saturday morning cartoon okay i'm all game
01:10:08
Speaker
But then they brought back two reoccurring characters from the Black Ops series.
Cold War's Returning Characters
01:10:13
Speaker
Almost as a three. Hudson as well. Of course. Actually the first person I thought of was the president in that game. And I was like, he wasn't in there. That was Kennedy.
01:10:30
Speaker
Oh god yeah. So yeah you're right it's Hudson, Mason and Woods and all three of them that's what disappointed me the most I have to say because we know those characters and they kind of made like they made references to the previous games like there's a kind of throwaway line from Woods when he's talking about Fidel Castro and like one of the first missions in Black Ops in the first game where you have to like assassinate him and
01:10:56
Speaker
Yeah, that was just like that whole back and forth kind of referring. I liked those bits. But I felt as if almost they were just... they were like third wheeling the game. It's like they were there as if, oh, remember us, we are here because it can't be a Black Ops game without us. Well, it can be. That's called Black Ops 3. If...
01:11:17
Speaker
I mean, even Black Ops 4 has them. Jesus. Yeah, they're everywhere. I know, but I know it's again, it's not like brand recognition and all that. Does this not make you a bit of a hypocrite though, Fraser? Didn't it distinctly you say when the big problems of Black Ops 3 is that it wasn't like tied into, you know, it wasn't tied into anything like, but now you say because they brought characters back like it's too much. It's not even that, it's like they gave them nothing to do.
01:11:44
Speaker
That's a fair point. You do play as them in side missions. But beyond that, they don't do anything. And again, I'll kind of wait to go more in depth about the ending. But even at the ending, they don't really do, they're just there. They might as well be like, you know in the very first games you get random NPCs like Private Thompson or Private Zakeyev or whatever.
01:12:13
Speaker
yeah i'm just i'm plucking like actual character from the game but you know what i mean it's like well he's in this game as well exactly i did like that though i will say that um i did like the fact um i was really surprised at that like i did uh actually i don't think anyone else was too impressed but i was just like no way like i couldn't believe they were linking those two games together i was really surprised at that but i thought
01:12:37
Speaker
Okay, that's pretty clever. This is like Earth 2's a cave, you know, where we're in like different multi-dimensions. Yeah, exactly. It's true. But yeah, you know what, I've put it off for long enough. Let's dive into the ending of Cold War. And again, spoilers, if you don't want it spoiled, feel free to mute. Yeah, I'm gonna let you go for it. So should we explain like the two types of endings you can get?
01:13:06
Speaker
Yeah, well, so the first thing is there's another twist, there's another reveal, and basically it's revealed that the character that you've kind of customized, Bell, who you've kind of been playing as for most of the game, it turns out that they are, or they were, sorry, a high-ranking member of that
01:13:30
Speaker
very close to that guy, Perseus, who's the main antagonist of the game. And in the very first level, like...
01:13:37
Speaker
One of the character like Woods Mason and Adler are chasing shoots some people and it turns out that the character you're playing, Belle, was one of them and then they were taken by the CIA and basically brainwashed into thinking there was somebody else who had a shared history with Adler and everything. Adler and his team were trying to unlock your memories so that you could find out where Perseus is.
01:14:02
Speaker
So that's the first reveal. And then once you find that out and everything, you then get a choice. You can either help your new allies to stop Perseus, and Perseus wants to basically detonate all these nuclear bombs underneath all these European cities to discredit the USA. So you can either help to stop Perseus' plan, or else you can turn against your new allies and basically lure them into a trap.
01:14:26
Speaker
Which in the case you can either then tell Perseus about the trap or your allies will die, or else you can just lure them there and then I think you get killed, but your allies survive, but all the bombs get detonated. So yeah, that's kind of the, have I missed anything out there? Sort of like the rough. Yeah, pretty much.
01:14:46
Speaker
be very petty which is what I did thanks to the chat at the time of that stream or yeah or you save the world which I'm not gonna lie I wasn't a big fan of the ending no I didn't think it was bad
01:15:02
Speaker
I just felt as if it was a bit... I mean, ecologist is no stranger to, like, you know, controversial topics or anything. It's not at all. It's very, you know, it sometimes leans into it, I think, and for a good reason. I think it's because, you know, the more scandalous it can be, the more sales and everything.
01:15:23
Speaker
so like I mean people will start talking about it so that's probably what they're kind of looking for yeah for this it just felt very underwhelming for the end yeah I think sorry no I was just going to say it's
01:15:39
Speaker
The fact that, I mean, don't get me wrong, props to them for actually going all out and being like, oh look at the lengths that America went to, you know, to try and stop these bombs going off. You know, like the whole idea of like stripping someone of their identity and planting a new one in. I mean it does, it feels like quite a betrayal of like the game saying, oh you can create your new character and you can be
01:16:04
Speaker
like this or that and then it's like oh well actually you're not you're just you're just gonna get shot I think yeah I think that's the problem is I think for me one of the big problems is that only one of those endings is really like canon there's no like at least with black ops 2 like as much I'm not a fan of the story at least like all of those endings I think kind of make like
01:16:26
Speaker
Maybe one is a definitive ending, but it feels like all of them could logically happen. There's only one ending that can logically happen here. I know history's a bit skewed, but this is still generally skewed. As far as I'm aware, I've not read any textbooks where all the European capitals suddenly get exploded by nuclear bombs. Unless they're going in a completely different direction.
01:16:50
Speaker
It doesn't seem to be since it's still tied into the series and nobody makes reference to this at all. Nobody mentions that all the European capitals were exploited by American nuclear bombs. So it has to be that ending where you go to stop them has to be the one canon ending. So it's a bit like, kind of what the other ones, deleted scenes. I don't know, for me it feels like they're kind of like sideshows.
01:17:14
Speaker
And I think because, oh sorry Holly. No sorry I was just going to say, it just reminds me of, I don't know if you've played like Silent Hill 2 or like seen the endings for them but there's like one ending for that that it's clearly non-canon but it's like one way you go into this room and it's a dog that's operating all the machinery and it's just the main character Yeah he's just like, how was you the entire time?
01:17:38
Speaker
i know it breaks down there's a dog like wardles up to him and that's almost what it feels like here it's something that's kind of so over the top and ridiculous that i can't believe i'm comparing like a dog controlling silent hell to well might as well be it might as well be for all like the nuclear bombs of like detonate it feels about as ridiculous you know in one go yeah
01:18:00
Speaker
I think part of the problem is the mind control element, it's been done. And I kind of like the way they did it, but it may be it would have had more impact if that hadn't been the story of Black Ops 1. But I think as well, on a personal level, I think what bugs me about the end of Cold War is that, as I said, I really enjoyed being able to customize character and stuff.
01:18:23
Speaker
sounds a bit silly, but I kind of got into, I really got into kind of role playing as that character and I'd like built this like rogue MI6 agent and I kind of had like taken the, given him the part, given them the perks that I thought like I was trying to think, well, if I was in the situation, what would, what would like, what tendencies would I show in like what way? So I'd given him like the one of being like paranoid and the one of being a lone wolf. I was like, I reckon if I was in that situation, that's where my like brain would go to like, oh yeah, kind of like was role playing to an extent. Again, it's very surface level. It's not
01:18:52
Speaker
but I kind of really got into role-playing like that and then to find out that it is just like it like oh no that's not you it's just this is who you are like I felt disappointing to me I was a bit like it kind of guided me a bit I think that's really what kind of annoys me about the ending of it
01:19:06
Speaker
No, I totally agree with you. It does, it seemed... I mean, I suppose it kind of ties into the themes. Like, I'm not trying to give the game credit, but I suppose it does tie into the theme of you thinking that you're someone else, a bit like the main character thinking they're someone else. They're this character you're building this persona, this kind of lore around them, and then all of a sudden you're getting that stripped away from you. Which I will admit is effective in a way, because I was just such a petty bitch.
01:19:34
Speaker
towards I was just like oh no you're getting betrayed and it was like chat backed me up and they're like yep we agree I think this was the way forward but yeah it was yes it does well on that it does well on like
01:19:51
Speaker
gutting you in a way, both with your character and everything, you're like, how could this happen? But I don't know, it seems, I mean even the actual ending is really depressing because you do, you stop the nukes.
01:20:07
Speaker
happy ending everyone's happy and then they want to tie up loose ends so it's like they cut to like a soprano blackout where both of the the main character and he's i want to see his handler draw a gun and then it cuts to black and you just hear the gunshot and that's it like you don't find out who shot who and everything which is fair enough i suppose if they're leaving it open to like another thing but it felt quite underwhelming
01:20:35
Speaker
especially for a game that, personally for me, I mean it's been like eight to ten years since the last Good Call of Duty game. Or sorry, the last Good Black Ops game. Yeah. Like eight to ten years or so. Eight years if you think Black Ops 2's good or ten years if you think Black Ops 1 is.
01:20:56
Speaker
Black Ops 3, I'm sorry, I'm never gonna admit it's a good game. As I said, fun to play but no, we're not. I was gonna say like...
01:21:07
Speaker
Yeah, I do agree with you. I think there are definitely elements in it that are really good. Like, as you said, walking around the KGB headquarters. I mean, that was good, but at the same time, it reminds me of the way, like, other franchises like Battlefield were going. Like, for... can't even remember which one. I think it's Battlefield 1.
01:21:29
Speaker
that did it and never played five but in the sense that they were trying to give you other things to do in the game other than running around and shooting and it's just it's really jarring because you're so used to like running and gunning and all these games and it is it's good to have like different gameplay elements but i feel as if with this kind of story sorry like one more thing i actually forgot about this before like we kind of wrap up
01:21:56
Speaker
The one thing that I actually, going back to the mind control thing, the one thing that I never thought of until someone brought it up in a comment.
01:22:04
Speaker
but I never actually realized like see Mason throughout the entire game. Initially I was like I was wondering if this was like a soft reboot or something until you speak to Woods and Mason and they are talking about the like their past adventures and you know Cuba and things like that. So it's clear the past games are linked to this game. So why is Mason so happy that his government's
01:22:30
Speaker
like brainwashing someone when he went through like hell on earth like there was no point in that game there was no kind of clues or hints that he had any objection towards it do they know though that's the one they did are they aware um i know hudson's hudson's away hudson's definitely aware maybe they are like i can't remember like i can't remember if there's a moment where
01:22:52
Speaker
Mason Woods actually knows so the only thing I'll say in defense I think you're right like it's an important point like if they do know but if my only defense they'll say is perhaps they don't know yeah that's true yeah if they don't know then that's like fine but if they do know then it seems like a massive plot hole
01:23:11
Speaker
Yeah. I hope someone was fired for that blunder. Nah, I'm only kidding. I think it's definitely one that could have been expanded on. It would be interesting. It's made me curious to see where they're going to take Call of Duty 2 from now on.
Impact on Call of Duty's Future
01:23:30
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, as I said, it's definitely not one of my favourites of the Black Ops series. I would probably say it's the third best, personally. Fair enough.
01:23:39
Speaker
Hey, don't get me wrong, it's a game that looks gorgeous and everything but I am interested to see where they take the series from now on. Oh yeah. It will be really interesting. So yeah sorry, just before we kind of wrap up to the end, is there anything, any closing thoughts?
01:23:58
Speaker
It's probably my second favourite. After the original Black Ops, it's my second favourite of the series. I don't think it's a perfect game. I think you've outlined a lot of issues with it. I've got to be honest, I really enjoyed the campaign, even the ending aside. I really enjoyed playing it.
01:24:15
Speaker
and it has felt like a bit of a renaissance of my interest in college again because I again will not this is for another time as well but i really enjoyed last year's modern warfare as well so i feel a bit more like i'm kind of getting back into the series again so i think in that way it's it's keeping me it's making me more intrigued about the series yeah can't wait till we do our end modern warfare podcast
01:24:35
Speaker
It's an interesting one. That will be a very interesting one.
Rapid-Fire Black Ops Questions
01:24:39
Speaker
Before we wrap up and go to the chat for any further questions and comments, Adam, you said, and I'm putting you on the spot here, I'm like, Adam, did you not say? Did I say again? As I get my paper out and I'm like, on December 2nd, 2020,
01:25:02
Speaker
quarter of college or two. Yeah you said they had some questions. Yeah so I've got I've got 10 quick fire questions here so this is just like gut reaction most are like yes or no like oh got a one-word answer so if you're good for that.
01:25:17
Speaker
Yes. Just about the kind of series in the Black Ops series in general. So we'll start then without further ado, we'll go into round one, which I've titled Personal Reminiscence. So first question, best character in the Black Ops series? Woods. I also said Woods as well. I think he's the best.
01:25:35
Speaker
Best level? Oh sorry, you weren't saying anything to that? No, no, no. I was just actually gonna say, like, quickly, did you see the thing? So I didn't realise that the voice actor who plays him in the first game didn't return for Cold War. Oh, is it the whole same one? Apparently not, because the guy who, if it is, like, if...
01:25:53
Speaker
yeah correct me if i'm wrong but i'm sure it's like a different guy and the only reason i know is because someone like paid him he's on that cameo site and someone paid him to talk about the there's a line which completely went over my head where you're like sneaking through a base and mason says to woods all you need to be quiet and they turned round and he says something like
01:26:16
Speaker
I'm an onion, Mason. And the guy was just ripping into it, saying, what the hell? My woods would never say, I'm an onion. I've got layers. I'd just say, I was like, what is this weird Call of Shrek game we're going into? Oh, really? But yeah, sorry. Yeah, that's what I was going to say. No, no, it's not. I didn't actually realise that the guy does a very good job of actually emulating the first guy's voice. No, totally. All right, so we were in agreement there, right. Question number two, best level, favourite level.
01:26:45
Speaker
like for the entire yeah is there like a level that you that you stood out from like all the games that you just thought yeah i would say it's a toss-up between vorkuta or um the i can't remember the specific name but it's the one with the hazmat suit oh yeah yeah another one i think it's called like rebirth or something rebirth that's it or is it like rebirth part no it is rebirth you're right because there's like two parts to that level two parts the level yeah
01:27:11
Speaker
it's a nice and part and then there's like the one after where you have to yeah like I really like it I mean don't get me wrong you get like all the helicopter scenes which are cool but I just thought that was like quite a nice twist yeah no they're they're two really good levels like Vracuda is a great level I also went with the original black ops I went for the one Victor Charlie which is the one where like it's I think it's like the third Vietnam level where your helicopter crashes and it ends with you crawling through the tunnels oh everything which is like I just such a stand-up move me and I really really enjoyed that part so I went I
01:27:41
Speaker
level. Okay, that's a good shot. Third, okay, third one. What's your favorite memory of playing the Black Ops? Anything from the Black Ops series that you like, that's the memory that I like really treasure?
Memorable Black Ops Experiences
01:27:52
Speaker
That is a good question actually. I suppose the zombie mode really. Like when I got Black Ops it was one of the first games where all my friends started playing that at the same time. Yeah. So I had a lot of good memories with the multiplayer and doing like the dolphin dive and everything.
01:28:08
Speaker
So sorry, just to explain quickly, it's when you're running and then you have to press a button instead of crouching, you can basically leap through the air. It used to be really annoying for people. In fact, I'll tell you a good memory. So you know how, and it's not the same nowadays, but
01:28:25
Speaker
like back in the day they used to show you like the final kill yeah multiplayer there was one time i remember there's a perk you can get called oh i can't even remember it's like second chance or something oh yeah last chance last chance that's it last chance and it's basically you get downed but you've only got a pistol so remember within this hotel level and someone shot me and i fell through oh it was behind this balcony and i fell under
01:28:50
Speaker
So I just started firing blindly into the wall that was in front of me and for some reason I got the guy. There's no video evidence of this because I was like, I can net Xbox 360 days but yeah I just shot the guy constantly and I got him and that was the final kill on camera. And I have to admit like I was sitting there very awkwardly because I kept thinking to myself
01:29:16
Speaker
Oh my god, there's someone halfway across the country screaming his head off going, I can't believe that, you see him? I was just like, yeah, everyone eggs at the low bay. You ruin somebody's day. I ruin someone's day. And that's honestly a best memory to have on a cauldron. To be fair, it was probably a child.
01:29:36
Speaker
They probably had it coming. Probably. But what would you say? For me, it's the ascension zombies level, which we've played on, which you can see us on stream. I played that quite a few months ago now, but me, you and Stephen played it. And I don't know if Stephen's in the chat or not listening along, but me and Emma played a lot of that. I played it with flatmates. I obviously played it with all of you on stream and everything. So that one for me always stands out.
01:30:02
Speaker
had so much fun on that level. Definitely. Yeah. Right, so number four, most disappointing moments of the series.
Disappointments and Standout Moments
01:30:11
Speaker
Black Ops 3. Fair enough. I'm just going to weave it there. Fair enough. I mean that and the strike force missions. Yeah. I expected more to come out of that. I expected more to come out of those, but it was literally just a throwaway line of whether or not, as you said,
01:30:32
Speaker
whether it lights up or not on a board. The amount of pain that you had to go through to get to that, to get to that like throwaway line, yep, strike force missions for me. Also I said no campaign being in Black Ops 4 was... Oh that too, yeah. But strike force missions is the obvious answer. Yeah. And then final question in this round, stand out moment. So is there a moment, no it doesn't have to be like a favorite moment, but is there a moment that you're just like, that just sticks with me, like for good or for bad or whatever?
01:31:02
Speaker
I'm gonna sound so biased, but definitely the Reznov moment. Like, in terms of the first one, the Reznov moment, for the second one... After a minute, the second one probably the gore.
01:31:14
Speaker
Which is gonna sound really weird, but it was so... I was so used at the time to seeing all the graphic messages saying, there's gonna be graphic violence, and you're like, okay, okay. Right, okay, video game violence. But the second game was so bloody. At the very beginning, the first level just shows you a guy burning to death, and you're like, jeez! Yeah, that's pretty horrifying.
01:31:38
Speaker
it's like between that and the there's a level where you take control of the main villain and initially they give you a shotgun and you're supposed to fight your way to find your sister and you're like oh great okay we're gonna just shoot our way up but all of a sudden the screen just tints red and he drops the shotgun brings out a machete and starts hacking everyone to get back to his house and it's like
01:32:03
Speaker
What? Jesus! It was just like so shocking. And three, yeah, they listed about three there. Four, Cold War, I would definitely say the Zakayev moment. Because I was just really surprised that the link and the two were mixed together. But yeah, sorry, that's me done.
01:32:24
Speaker
No, actually, I'm going to pick that my stand-up moment is going to come from the one game that you didn't have anything for. It's Black Ops 3 being delimbed by that robot always remained me as being the most horrifying moment. Horrifying, first-person experiences in a video game I've ever had. I think I didn't want to get in because you were in full-time in Black Ops 3 discussion. I think I prefer the story a bit more to you.
01:32:50
Speaker
But it's not my favourite, but being delimbed by that robot will always remain. I'll give you that. I know I mentioned it earlier, but I skipped over it because I was just so mad. That is definitely the moment I felt most uncomfortable with a Call of Duty game.
01:33:10
Speaker
I mean, the first game has its violent moments, the second game ramps it up and the third one just with that one scene. I think everything else is more or less. The thing is a couple bits, but there's nothing that visceral. Yeah, no, it's just you have to watch helplessly. Is this robot just dealing with you? It's horrible. I don't know. I feel as if it's just the game that went too far.
01:33:36
Speaker
Perhaps, perhaps. You might have a fair point, you might have a fair point. Nonetheless, a standout moment, I think. Okay, so that was it. So, our second and final round, which I've titled, if we ruled the world, rackets perish the thought.
Theoretical Black Ops Dilemma
01:33:52
Speaker
So, question one, so follow me here, right? Okay, so you're in a hot air balloon. So you've gone out for a ride in a hot air balloon, and you've taken with you all the games in the Modern Warfare series, and all the games in the Black Ops series.
01:34:05
Speaker
As you're going along on your hot air balloon, it starts to descend rapidly. You're going to have to throw one of the game series out to stay in the air. Which one do you... Which of the game series do you chuck? Which one do you keep? Black Ops or Modern Warfare? Is it all the Modern Warfare? It's all the Modern Warfares and all the Black Ops, so they're all bundled together.
01:34:23
Speaker
You can't separate them out, you've got to chuck one or the other. God, this is the worst choice ever. I don't know if I would go for the Black Ops series. Because I would say... No, that is a hard one. Because on the one hand, I'm thinking Black Ops is definitely the best. It's one of my favourites.
01:34:42
Speaker
but I don't know if it's worth it for the other ones. Whereas at least modern warfare, for all the jankiness and things in the early days, at least it kept consistently okay. I would probably have to say Black Ops. You're chucking it, you're throwing it out. I'm not saying Black Ops is the worst game, I'm just saying its predecessors are.
01:35:08
Speaker
Yeah. And I didn't enjoy them as much, so sorry, Black Ops. You're out of the balloon. I mean, it's a tough choice, but I would do the same as you. Yeah. I'd keep Modern Warfare and the Modern Warfare series. I just think it's a better, Modern Warfare is a more consistent series overall. Yeah. No, definitely. Yeah.
01:35:26
Speaker
Which is something we'll discuss. Yeah, we'll certainly get around to that one. All right, question two.
Removing Elements from New Games
01:35:32
Speaker
So you're in charge of designing the next Black Ops game. I'm just saying it's a Call of Duty game. But it comes, so the Activision executives come around to you and they say, look, we're pressed for time. You're going to have to scrap one of the three parts of the game. What do you scrap? Do you scrap the campaign, the multiplayer, or zombies? Which one are you asking?
01:35:54
Speaker
I suppose it would have to be the, like, in a business sense, like, see if it was personal. Yeah. Maybe the multiplayer. Because I feel as if, like, nowadays there's so much multiplayer that they can build on instead. Fair enough.
01:36:09
Speaker
Because I mean, you know my rants about the updates for Call of Duty. It's true, we save a lot of those. Yeah, so it's like there's a lot of scope that they can develop on those games rather than sitting with the same game or like a new one. Because it does, it feels as if like every time you buy a new Call of Duty game it's like your progress from the last one is wiped, except for Warzone, but that's a whole different kettle of fish.
01:36:38
Speaker
but yeah um nah i would i would have to go for multiplayer but if i was a shrewd businessman you know with the yeah if i was a shrewd businessman i could see i don't know why i'm laughing at that like i'm you probably should be a shrewd businessman i'm not my i don't so i don't mean to mock you it's not like i'm kind of like you know why would start laughing at business man i don't see a shrewd businessman oh oh the last week i thought you're not getting the check for this one oh no
01:37:08
Speaker
If it was a business sense and I can see why they would cut out the campaign. Personally it would be the multiplayer because I know at least you could have fun with the zombies. But if it was a business sense and definitely the campaign. Fair enough. I would cut the zombies. I'm going to be very personal here. I want there to be a campaign and I think
01:37:33
Speaker
I don't know, I probably prefer the... I love the old zombies, but I don't know, I feel a reason it's maybe gone a little buffer, so it's a little bit not as good now, so I feel I would probably cut the zombies. You know, I can understand that, because...
01:37:47
Speaker
I totally agree with you, I do think it's kind of gone over the top. I prefer the simple zombies in World of War and even to an extent the first Black Ops, but I feel as if anything after that is like, oh, you've got a perk and you've got crazy wacky characters and it's like, I just want to shoot zombies. Can I not shoot zombies, please? I know, they've got a bit too much. Is it too late to change my answer? No, you can change it, you can change it back.
01:38:17
Speaker
Initially, I was just thinking of the co-op side as well, because the amount of times I've had so much fun in multiplayer or in zombie mode. But if there's a choice between only multiplayer or zombies, definitely multiplayer would keep. But if it's between the three, that's definitely a harder call. But no, I totally agree with you in the zombies, which is something we can definitely talk about. Yeah, we'll get into it more. Oh, totally.
01:38:47
Speaker
Alright, question three.
Future of the Black Ops Series
01:38:48
Speaker
Should the Black Ops series be continued, rebooted or ended? I would say rebooted or ended. Fair enough. Which I think technically they're rebooting up. It's like a soft reboot, it seems. There's some of it. Yeah, it's exactly the same.
01:39:07
Speaker
I feel as if it needs something to kind of shake it up but I feel it's kind of hard when they're shackled by the past games but at the same time now they're getting closed in because they have to link it to modern warfare which is going to be really interesting. I don't know. I would definitely say reboot.
01:39:26
Speaker
if it had to keep going, but it's too popular of a household name to outright can. Definitely. I was kind of tempted to say continued. I don't know. I feel like there's still some scope and it depends where they go with it. So I, you know, I'm just going to continue because I want to see where the next one goes. And then maybe depending on the next one, I might change my answer to say ended or like, I don't know. I'm not sure about being rebooted. I almost kind of think like just
01:39:53
Speaker
maybe try something new like you know do you know i probably wouldn't yeah do you know i mentioned it like at the start of the podcast but that's almost what it feels like like remember how i said that infinity award went from world war two games and they just jumped right to modern shooters whereas i feel as if in like from world at war to black ops it was kind of a soft progression of like historical events
01:40:20
Speaker
So from the end of the Second World War, going into the Cold War, even though they started late in the 60s, but still, it was like that kind of natural progression. But then in the second game, they went from natural progression in the Cold War to, oh, we're in the future now. And then three and four just kept jumping and jumping and jumping further ahead because that was the trend at the time.
01:40:43
Speaker
And I know they've kind of dialled it back now, so I kind of hope if they do continue it, they keep it kind of on the level, if you know what I mean? They keep it... Not... I'm not saying like they should keep it like year by year kind of thing, but...
01:40:56
Speaker
keep it in an actual progression like go for the 90s or go for you know whatever don't just jump right into you know don't just jump right into the future and be like oh hope for the best because it's personally i don't think that's how it works but or i don't think it'll work but then again i'm not i'm not paid the big bucks you know i know unfortunately unfortunately despite the title of this segment we don't know the world sadly we don't get to
01:41:27
Speaker
Alright, penultimate question here and I think you've kind of already mentioned your answer maybe to this one but I was going to throw in another moral dilemma here. So you've gone out on a pleasure cruise and decided to take all the games in the Black Ops series with you.
01:41:45
Speaker
However, at some point during your pleasure cruise, the ship begins to sink. You've only got time to save two games in the Black Ops series. Which dude do you take? One and two. Fair enough. I remember you saying no. That gets a very lonely cruise. I thought I'm taking my time. No, you keep taking it. Not even the X-Box. Just the desks. No, you've just got the games with you. Just to get them some fresh air to let them see the world. It's like, my God. It's like putting them to sea.
01:42:14
Speaker
sending them off. For me, it's Black Ops 1 and Cold War. That's who I would save.
01:42:21
Speaker
All right, so that takes us to our final question, which actually Green Shields sent in a question. I'd also come up with a similar question. So I'm going to amalgamate the two of them. So thank you, Green Shields. Great minds think alike, as they always say.
Historical Settings for Future Games
01:42:34
Speaker
So Green Shields was asking us what our favorite setting for Call of Duty games in general was. And so putting that into the Black Ops series specifically, what setting would you want the next Black Ops game to be in? The past?
01:42:49
Speaker
present or the future past definitely like I know that was like I don't know I feel as if modern warfare has got the present covered it's definitely kind of exploring that and I mean it's interesting but I feel as if for modern even like modern warfare I feel as if they kind of have the danger that they're gonna stray too much into oh did you know this technology existed in your leg
01:43:14
Speaker
Yeah, I know, but I'm playing modern warfare. I'm not playing modern warfare with a hint of prototype weapons that's going to come out. And I know Black Ops does that as well. Black Ops is very infamous for that. But at the same time, I would say the past, especially for the Cold War, they have explored a good number of events, obviously Vietnam,
01:43:40
Speaker
Panama, the Bay of Pigs invasion, things like that. But there's so much more in the Cold War that they could explore. I feel as if as well they missed their chances with a lot of them, with a lot of moments in history. Even that bit in Berlin, in East Berlin, where you
01:43:59
Speaker
and sneak through in Cold War. It seemed underutilised, I feel as if they could have put more into that. It felt more as if it could have been anywhere, honestly. That's maybe a fair point. Didn't really feel like you were actually like, you know, didn't really feel like, kind of,
01:44:17
Speaker
Yeah, you could sneak around the guards, but almost hell, it did feel as if you were in East Berlin. It felt more like, oh there's guards here. They could have easily been replaced by the Soviets themselves, or it could have been a Soviet base, which is what they did in the level after, or a couple of levels. So it's like, I don't know.
01:44:38
Speaker
if they kind of made it a bit different or there was more variety in the way, which I know is ironic because they do have variety in the game. But I feel as if they have time to expand on it then definitely. As I said it's a game that I'm kind of lukewarm towards but I don't think that's a bad thing. I think it's an interesting start to what this reboot could be about.
01:45:06
Speaker
which I'm excited to see where they go with it, I have to say. No, that's fair. It's a good point. It does seem like there is potential there. Just never really squander it or utilize it. And for me, I'm the same as you past. I love history, obviously. That's my favorite ecology of the game, really. But in historical, and I'm all in. I'll definitely buy it. You've got my own. I'm the same. No, history all the way. You're asking the wrong people here.
01:45:37
Speaker
No, no, no, no shrewd business to say, well, certainly not for me. Just give me what I want. Anything to do with
Closing Thoughts and Farewell
01:45:45
Speaker
that. I mean, we've still got the Korean more. That's true. That's still very, that's a very untapped historical event. If you're looking for something, Activision, give us a call. Yeah, exactly. We're always free. My number is 12345.
01:46:03
Speaker
Just get in the chat, get in the stream chat and we'll find a way to get up from there. Yeah, let's start copying them in to random tweets. Hashtag chat tsunami suggestions. Come on guys, we can do this. Hashtag let's, that's tsunami talk.
01:46:23
Speaker
Why are you censoring me? What is this, a black ops game? And on that note, speaking of censorship, would you probably wrap up there? Oh dear. And yeah, I think that's it for me. Is there anything else you have? No, no, just thanks for thanks for listening. Thanks for thanks for participating.
01:46:46
Speaker
And yeah, thanks again for having me on. I really enjoy it. So yeah, thanks for having me. As always, stay safe, stay awesome and most importantly, stay hydrated.