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Chatsunami's Top Five Christmas Films
273 Plays4 years ago
In this episode, Fraser (Satsunami) and Adam discuss some festive favourites, from what makes a good Christmas movie to a rather special announcement at the end. We hope that you have a fantastic Christmas!
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Transcript
Introduction & Episode Milestone
00:00:05
Speaker
Welcome to Chatsunami.
00:00:17
Speaker
Hello everyone and welcome to episode 6. Well I can't believe it's episode 6 already. Technically 7 if you encode the special.
Preview of Christmas Film Discussion
00:00:25
Speaker
But yeah, today we are gonna be talking about something festive because in 9 days something very special is gonna happen. Do you know what it is Adam?
00:00:35
Speaker
Well, I just did a little wee when you told me it was nine days away. That is remarkably quick. I know. I really should be more organized, but oh God, now I'm too terrified now to answer the question. Do you know what I believe? I believe it's that small little regional celebration called Christmas? Christmas? Christmas.
00:00:55
Speaker
Yeah, it's a regional thing, you know. It's probably something you've not heard of, you know. Like presents, elves, you know. It's a very niche thing. What are these words you're saying right now, to be honest? Yeah, exactly. I mean, what... You know, to be fair, when I come on Chatsunami, even I don't know the words I say. Best way to go about it, I find. Pretty much, yeah. Just blast right through it.
00:01:22
Speaker
So yeah, as you can see by the screen, today's topic is going to be about something, well of course something festive, because as I said, 90's till Christmas, cannot believe it at all.
Selection of Top Christmas Films
00:01:35
Speaker
But yeah, before we get into it, so basically what we did was, we both went away and we chose our top 5 Christmas films in no kind of particular order.
00:01:46
Speaker
What we didn't realise was that our films, or our idea of what makes a good Christmas film kind of cross between one another, which I was quite shocked when you told me your top five list. I couldn't believe it when you told yours. I was like, oh my god, we're so in sync. Yeah, it was like... We just know each other so well. I know. It's like what the kids call 20s, probably.
00:02:13
Speaker
yeah it was just like oh okay except for one there was one that was kind of like i don't know whether to include it but it was your persuasion i think i'll beat you into it yeah you dad yeah kind of a spoiler for that one we're very obvious when it comes to i think oh yeah yeah absolutely what the outlier is yeah so yeah before we get into talking about our top um christmas film i have a question for you Adam
00:02:40
Speaker
and it is one that keeps me up at night around this time of year. There are thousands of Christmas films that get released and everyone has a different interpretation of what makes a Christmas film a Christmas film.
Key Principles of Christmas Films
00:02:55
Speaker
So my question to you is what makes a good Christmas film?
00:02:59
Speaker
Well, in my informed and totally not biased opinion, I got a couple of key principles that I think make for an excellent Christmas film.
00:03:11
Speaker
So number one, I would say it has to be universal. I don't mean universal studios. I mean universal as in the way like it has to appeal to like basically every like all people, all generations, all ages, decks of religions, whatever way you want to like define it. Because chances are you're going to sit down and watch these films.
00:03:30
Speaker
you're probably not going to watch them, but you might watch them by yourself at times, but you're more likely going to watch them with friends, with family, people from different backgrounds, different ages, everything. So I think for a really good Christmas film, it has to have that kind of universal appeal that everybody can relate to and everybody can kind of get drawn into.
00:03:47
Speaker
I definitely think a Christmas film has to be uplifting. I think it has to make you feel good. It doesn't mean to say that it has to be, you know, all saccharine and it has to be, um, feel good, kind of fluff at all things. Like there can be like moments of like, you know, adversity and things, but it has to be uplifting in the end and really kind of, this is supposed to be a happy time after all. I think, I think if you want to make a good Christmas film, you have to reflect that. I think as well, there has to be an element of magic about it because, you know,
00:04:12
Speaker
Even as we get older, we get a bit more jaded on Christmas. Oh, totally. You know, all the negatives get attached to it. But they're instantly, I don't know, for me, there is still that little kind of element of magic and you always remember.
00:04:22
Speaker
as a kid, for the most part, that kind of element of magic. So you want that in your film. And I do think as well, I was talking about having uplifting, but I think that kind of triumph over adversity as well is always a kind of important thing for a Christmas film to have, of like, you know, dealing with troubles and dealing with problems, but pushing through and, you know, finally getting through it and getting to that kind of uplifting ending.
00:04:45
Speaker
And as well, like I would say, his last two things, I always think having a little element of nostalgia is always good, you know, kind of reminding you what it was like when you were younger, Christmas and everything. And then maybe having a bit of a miracle as well. You can't go wrong with including a miracle element in your Christmas film, because it is the season of miracles.
00:05:00
Speaker
that is very true though and kind of just going back to what you were saying about the idea of having like overcoming adversity and things like that in films like i mean one of the like classic examples of like a really i mean i suppose like there are a lot of films because i mean let's face it christmas is like at the end of every year and let's face it a lot of people go through like really tough times during the year so it's kind of that like
00:05:29
Speaker
festival or that holiday where everyone comes together kind of reflects and yeah especially for the films they almost kind of condense all of that into like one kind of like i don't want to say like a michael bay quick action film but you know it's like it's like it's not bad
00:05:47
Speaker
Yeah, it's like, right, we've got a conflict, okay? We've got to run with this. Go, go, go, go, go. Happy holidays, happy holidays, go, go, go, go. You've got Santa right down that shirt, you're like, go. And yeah, it's, I mean, as you were saying about adversity, I mean, I think one of the best examples is Joy Noel, the
00:06:11
Speaker
You're the one about the World War I soldiers. Oh, yeah, yeah, the Christmas trees. Yeah, it's where they come together. I mean, obviously let's ignore what happened after that day. But it was, yeah, as a moment in time. Yeah, as a moment in time it was like, yeah, kind of like the peak almost of, yeah, like the peak of, you know, like adversity then kind of setting that aside and then
00:06:38
Speaker
bringing people together. And I mean, the idea of being universal as well. I think this is kind of
The Necessity of a Christmas Setting
00:06:46
Speaker
something I think we talked about last week with our childhood video games and things like that. About the idea of universality. Can't even speak tonight because I'm so filled with festive cheer.
00:06:59
Speaker
That too, I actually bought some quality streets before the stream. I meant to send you a picture, but I'll do that after. Oh, you teens. Yeah. Yeah. Just waving those toffee pennies around. What can I say? Anyway, gruncheonness aside of me. So yeah, it has to be universal. I do agree with that because if something's too
00:07:24
Speaker
I don't want to say too kid-friendly, but you know what I mean if it's too... I mean, films like Arthur Christmas, I suppose, is like a good example. Like, it still focuses on the Santa element and everything like that, but it kind of reigns that in. Ha ha, reindeers. Yeah, but um, chh. You know, these puns aren't intentional, by the way. I'm trying to bring my A-game, so... Got a whole list of them you're just working your way through. Taking them off.
00:07:52
Speaker
Yeah, it's like Santa's naughty or nice list, but instead it's just a whole list of puns and there is no naughty or nice. They're all classics and maths.
00:08:02
Speaker
But yeah, it's gonna appeal to everyone. You can't just have... I mean, you're getting me wrong, there probably are a lot of nihilistic Christmas films out there. I think one of the films, before we go on to our top five Christmas films, I think one of the films that really puts me off is A Nightmare Before Christmas. So spoilers for anybody who thought that made the top five.
00:08:26
Speaker
Yeah, I would have vetoed it if you brought it up, I would have vetoed it. You don't think it's a Christmas film? No, no, I think it definitely qualifies as a Christmas film, but I think it's too nihilistic to it, and I can't believe I'm saying that about a stop-motion Tim Burton film.
00:08:48
Speaker
The only thing I remember is Santa being tied up and nearly getting gutted by the boogeyman, and I'm like, Christmas!
00:08:58
Speaker
Adversity! That's the adversity. And then we get the triumph for it, where Jack Skellington, that's the guy's name, isn't it? He's realising that he should just stay in his lane. He's the king of Halloween. Remember kids, if you... Tell them about segregation.
00:09:15
Speaker
That's exactly what I was thinking. It's like you belong to one holiday. So either pick Halloween, pick Christmas or get out and be one of those Easter people. Sorry of anybody, this is like some of his favourite films. Yeah, I am. Jesus.
00:09:38
Speaker
Yeah, I apologize, guys. Sorry, that's me saying, oh yeah, Christmas songs should be upbeat and cheery, and then immediately I just went for the throat, like, now let me tell you about why I don't like...
00:09:51
Speaker
Anyway, moving on. So yeah, no, very good points. And before we go on to our top five list, Adam, was there something that you wanted to bring up before we went on? Thank you very much. I wanted to pose a counter question to you. It's not really along the same theme, but does a Christmas movie have to be set at Christmas? No, that is a million dollar question. I mean... I don't know if there's a right or wrong answer to this one, because I'm not totally sure what I think.
00:10:30
Speaker
So does a Christmas film have to be, say, Christmas for it to cooperate? Yeah, I'll tell you where my thinking is on this. OK. It's because there's a lot of films I associate with Christmas, but I don't think they wouldn't be termed Christmas films. I don't know if anybody else would. Like a lot of the Pixar films I like are associated with Christmas in my mind, because that's when a lot of them used to appear on the BBC when I was the younger and stuff. And I'd sit down and watch them with the family and everything. Casablanca is another one that always comes on at Christmas.
00:10:47
Speaker
It's a good question because I know the obvious one here is Die Hard.
00:10:59
Speaker
Snow White, I think, usually, you know, the old Disney ones, Snow White appears quite a lot of times. So these are films that you could argue, Wizard of Oz is another one. They appear at Christmas time and, you know, they maybe have many of those elements that we just talked about, about making a good Christmas film. But, you know, in that way that they're not set at Christmas, does it have to be, does your film have to take place in and around Christmas to be a Christmas film? Is that like the starting point?
00:11:24
Speaker
Which is why I was wondering. I don't know, I was going to say no but now I feel like I've talked myself out of it. No, I know what you mean. For me, usually those kind of films are on at... They're usually on at Hockmaney for me. I remember years ago...
00:11:43
Speaker
spending it with my family and everything and turning on the TV and the Princess and the Frog, I think, was running on BBC One. And that is, you're on the money there. It's always a Disney film that they bought the rights to. And I think, yeah, usually it's like a film that's maybe a year or two out of date and the BBC, they'll go and they'll be like, yes, we've got the rights to this Disney film.
00:12:10
Speaker
and yeah they'll just like they'll keep playing it and playing it and playing it and you're just like oh my god just why and it's like they they really make a big meal about it i mean you know christmas big meals so kind of one point but they always they always like advertise it hype it up and go yeah this is the film but yeah i would say in a like subjective standpoint obviously objectively you could probably say
00:12:38
Speaker
It doesn't count, but see if it's subjective, like if it's a film that you've watched with your family or someone special. Yeah, I don't see why you couldn't class it. It's like a personal Christmas film, if you know what I mean. It's a very subjective, it's not a kind of subjective sort of question, isn't it? And, you know, yeah, you're totally right. You've convinced me you're right. It is sort of how you view it, isn't it? And how you feel about it. So, yeah, I couldn't agree more.
00:13:07
Speaker
And speaking of Christmas films, I don't have sound effects or any music yet, so if anyone has, if anyone knows anyone out there who would like to make music for Chatsunami, please let me know.
Appreciation of 'Jingle All the Way'
00:13:23
Speaker
Yes, this is my Christmas request here.
00:13:27
Speaker
coming to you live so yeah without any further ado let's just jump right into our first film let me get the list up because I have completely forgotten it it was that memorable a list it was that memorable list I completely forgot it
00:13:43
Speaker
So the first one, I'll start with an upbeat one. The one we've kind of chose is probably going to be a controversial choice. We chose Jingle all the way. I don't see why this would be controversial.
00:13:58
Speaker
Well, see, I absolutely loved this film. See, when it was out, I loved it. It was one that was always on at Christmas. I just really enjoy it. It's so sullying over the top. I was about to say stupid, but I wouldn't go that far. It's so sullying over the top, but it's a lot of fun. It's definitely a lot of fun, I would say. It did? Yeah. Sorry, I was just going to say it didn't really rate very well.
00:14:25
Speaker
Oh god, oh no, it's terrible. I think it's sitting at like 19% or something. Is it? I thought it was. Something like Metacritic or Roger, maybe it's lower to be honest. I think that's it. Yeah, I can't remember what the exact percentage is but I remember I was looking at like a list of films and it actually fell under worse Christmas films more than it did in best Christmas films. Oh, that's a real shame.
00:14:50
Speaker
yeah it really is because you think it's it doesn't deserve that hate i don't think it does not deserve that hate it definitely it definitely does not it's that it's that thing of it the way i look at it is if it's into that kind of category of being so corny it's good
00:15:07
Speaker
isn't it silly and it's just stupid but it's so good and here you go this is why it doesn't deserve the hate this is a mod like we've got all these kind of um all these films that rely on the kind of old kind of stereotypes of christmas yeah all kind of historical things about this is a modern christmas tale for our times this is this is probably the most relatable like film a plot of this is probably the most relatable that anybody maybe even if you haven't been a parent so if anybody doesn't know like the plot revolves around
00:15:36
Speaker
Arnold Schwarzenegger is this workaholic dad who's desperately trying to make up. He's hardly around to spend time with his wife or his son. But to try and make up for some of that, he's desperate to get this action figure called Turboman for his son. And it's the must-have item of Christmas, like Furbies.
00:15:55
Speaker
Cabbage patch kids or whatever like what was it was a BB-8 the robot? I think it was that last couple of years. Yeah. Yeah, it's always says I mean, I suppose technically this year it's probably the new Xbox. Oh, that's true. Or a PS an Xbox would be the ones now. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, sorry.
00:16:15
Speaker
No, I was just going to say, it kind of takes the magic out of it. If you look at a film like Jingle All The Way and it's about all these parents going to ridiculous lengths to get a toy action figure and nowadays it's more technology based. Don't get me wrong, you still probably had things like that back then, not obviously to the same extent.
00:16:36
Speaker
Yeah, it's kind of a shame. It's a really refreshing slice of holiday cynicism, I think, to compare to all the kind of saccharine and sweet films that we get typically all the time. This film has black market toy rings run by like Santas. It has absolute crash capitalism. All these parents don't get any time to spend with their kids. The only way they can make it up is to go and get this consumerist item to get for them.
00:17:03
Speaker
It has mail bomb threats in it. One of the holiday films has a letter bomb in it.
00:17:11
Speaker
I forgot all about that scene. I know, I know. It wasn't done. I was like, my God, there's a mail bombing in this film. What other Christmas film has these elements in it? And so I think it is actually a really, it's really different and actually quite refreshing. It's not going to win any classic film of all time thing. But from what it is, it's so much fun. And what other film as well has somebody punch a reindeer and then get drunk with it?
00:17:40
Speaker
Name me another film that has the two elements. I think what really completes it for me is that Arnie is so badly miscast in this film. He should not have been in this film. We should have been somebody like... I was going to say John Belushi was dead by that point. Somebody like that, Jim Belushi. It would have been somebody like that, but for some reason Arnie was in this film. He's so miscast, but it's what makes it great.
00:18:04
Speaker
He's just not this, he's just not believable as this average like workaholic dad. Some of the lines he has in it are great like the classic, he got tools! He got tools! Put that cookie down! It's turbo time! There's all these great lines. I do. So just like the kind of throwaway joke I do love, and this is going back to like the cynicism kind of jokes, is so and the fellow man we were saying Arnold is looking for like this toy turbo man which is like a
00:18:33
Speaker
It's like a superhero, isn't it? And he's got a sidekick called Booster. And I always burst out laughing at the Booster scenes because all the time, whenever he goes to any of the shops...
00:18:48
Speaker
like nobody has like a turbo man but they've got a booster doll and they've got like shells upon shells and nobody's buying it and even at the end like they're like on this parade and there's this guy like one guy dressed as turbo man spoilers and the other guy dresses booster and the other guy gets like punched into the crowd and all these kids start beating on them saying nobody likes you
00:19:15
Speaker
That's such a funny guy. It's just like Jesus. Preface is like comic book nerd rage as well. He has so many great critiques of our current society. That's why it's a gem and should be appreciated more. Do you want a fun fact about that parade scene? Yeah, do go. So it took three weeks to film that parade scene.
00:19:37
Speaker
And basically, for the most part, the film was filmed in Minneapolis, I think, because Minneapolis is known for having a really long winter, so they could get down a lot of snow scenes and everything. So they were filming, I think, around springtime, going into summer. But they had to film the parade scenes in LA at one of the studio lots. I can't remember which one. Maybe it's Universal or something. And this was when summer was happening. So those parade scenes were supposed to be at winter. For most of the days, it was about 37 degrees Celsius.
00:20:04
Speaker
Jesus yeah so and I don't remember but like the um Sinbad who were who like dressed he was like the the postman yeah yeah the postman yeah who dresses up had dressed up as the bad guy oh I forgot what turbo man's nemesis is called destructor or something like that destruct yeah he's the guy with the big brain and the brain so that's got water in it that water actually like started to like boil apparently it was presumably that hot and stuff and it was like it was like evaporating and everything because it was that warm
00:20:32
Speaker
so in three weeks of that um so i think the turbo man suit had to be like washer cooled or something like there was like special water and there were like cooling bits all the way through it because it was that like just unbearable to be filming so hey guys a fun fact for you to appreciate next time next time anybody watches you can go all the way yeah just like watches on like bubble people like roasting to death in their winter clothing
00:20:55
Speaker
walking in the winter wonderland. Anyway, actually sorry before we move on to like our next film on the list, just like one thing about the film where as you said it's like kind of nihilistic I suppose like a kind of satire of capitalism almost it's like all these like as you said all the parents going out not spending time with the family trying to get like this turbo mando. I think
00:21:19
Speaker
I think like a similar thing actually did happen in real life. Oh, what film was it? Toy Story. That was it when Toy Story came out. Because a lot of people draw parallels between. I can't remember if Jingle, I think Jingle All The Way came before Toy Story. No, no, no. Do you know that actually that's what apparently inspired the story of Jingle All The Way. See, that's what I thought. As you said, the rush for the Buzz Lightyear toys. Yeah. That's when Toy Story came out in 95.
00:21:43
Speaker
So that would have been Christmas 95 and Jingle all the way, I think was released in 96, I think maybe 97. So it was a couple of years after, but you're actually exactly right. That was what the, I can't remember if it was a screenwriter or if it was a director, one of them anyway, based it off that their experience of trying to get this, they were trying to get this toy to base it off that. So you're totally right that the exact parallels are there.
00:22:05
Speaker
Yeah, oh god, I can imagine doing that. It's like, kind of standing in line and, you know, like obviously if you're a parent and, you know, you would do it, you would get out of love. But yeah, I'm sorry Adam, I'm not waiting in the line for you. For a Buzz Lightyear or a Turbo Man. Not even any doubt, they were just straight off the bat. Nah, I'm not doing it. Yeah, right on Amazon, just like, I'm sorry, they were out of stock.
00:22:33
Speaker
i tried my hardest i sat down for five minutes and i'm all out of ideas
00:22:40
Speaker
Yeah, on that note and my Scrooge-y-ness. Yeah, so the second film, which is quite an interesting one actually.
Analysis of 'Home Alone'
00:22:50
Speaker
This is one that's got a lot of trivia as well. And that is Home Alone, which I actually did watch again recently and I forgot how good a film it was. Such a good film. It really is. I don't know, there is a debate right enough between is the first one better and the second one.
00:23:09
Speaker
I don't know. Did you know where you fall down on that on that debate? I used to say I preferred the second one because it was the one I saw more on TV.
00:23:18
Speaker
fair enough. Well on that it was definite with the one that's all more on TV so I was like oh yeah the second one's the best and then I re-watched it again and I was like yeah no the first one's definitely the first one's definite with the better one I think. They're both kind of like on par but the less we say about like the re-onwards the better.
00:23:40
Speaker
Yeah, they don't exist. What don't exist? I think the first one is the best. I think the only place the second one has it be is just like, I remember watching one time a video on YouTube where this doctor analyzed
00:23:57
Speaker
how many like Harry's and how many Marv's it would take to survive the events. And there's just just the point like how many Marv's were killed in the making of the movie where he's just getting hit with like he gets hit with four bricks in his face. Marv is dead. Marv is dead continually. And so I think the first one is the perfect blend of fun peril and then like Christmas.
00:24:21
Speaker
It's those three things, you know, it's got all the things which make a really exciting, a really fun romp. It's got a good dose of sentimentality and, you know, to tug at your heartstrings. And to be honest, I only actually, I only actually saw this film, like I'd seen bits of it, but I only ever watched it fully last year. The first time I'd seen it through. So I was, when I watched, I was like, Oh, maybe I'm too old now. I got that fear. You know, I was like, maybe, maybe I've missed the point where, you know, this will really have an impact on me. And perhaps I'll just sit there and be like, just really be like, I wish I'd seen this when I was younger.
00:24:50
Speaker
but no still still great you know i still absolutely enjoyed it watching i look forward to watching it again i think just really as well it embodies that magic of christmas just talking about like whatever was like an important thing with christmas film to have it embodies that magic you know and seeing it from this like kids perspective and just everything and you know defending home like home house
00:25:10
Speaker
I was going to say, child neglect aside, this is one of those films that is whimsical and magical if you don't think about it. Definitely, if you think too deep into this. I remember thinking to the second one, there's a scene at the very end,
00:25:28
Speaker
and the first one is just about a kid who's left behind while his family goes on holiday and he has to defend the house against these robbers which oh he does strike up when the police doesn't they and they don't believe him oh yeah he does early on yeah they just yeah
00:25:43
Speaker
or something like that yeah but then in the second one it's just the same story but the difference is it's like he's in New York and he's in a hotel room and then he goes to like a relative's house or something like that and I remember I was talking to my brother about this and at the very end this is a this was like a moment that really made me like tear up because I was like this is such like a lovely moment at the end it's when in the second one he's with the bird lady and he gives her a turtle dove do you remember that one?
00:26:12
Speaker
think i do it's like he meets like this homeless woman who like runs i remember her i don't remember the title of that like at the end like i think he gets uh what is it it's like he goes to a toy shop and the owner gives them like two sets of turtle doves and it's supposed to be like a sign of friendship you know and then at the end when he meets the or sorry when he meets um this woman for the last time he gives over like this turtle dove
00:26:38
Speaker
to say, you know, oh, we're friends and all of that because she helped him out so much. And you know, it's a really touching moment. I was like, my God, that is so nice. And I remember watching it with my brother. He was a bit of a grinch. He was like, right, so Kevin can spend all that money from his dad's credit card on a five-star hotel, but he gives her a lousy Christmas tree ornament. And I'm like, but that's not the point.
00:27:07
Speaker
It's the symbolism! It's the symbolism! Well, yelling through the tears was not the point! But yeah, going back, like, you kind of dialing back the onesie into the first one. My god, there are so many, like... Is he rewatching as an adult? I don't think it has the same impact as a kid. When you're watching, like, you know, him throwing, like, bricks and them, like, falling over and things, you're like, aha, very funny slapstick.
00:27:37
Speaker
But then when you rewatch some of them, like, I mean, one of them, like, steps to do a nail? Yeah. Like, quiet place style? And I was like, oh god, like... You know those pain cans are gonna hurt when they hit your face up. Oh yeah, exactly.
00:27:53
Speaker
I think the worst one for me was one of many. See when he grabs the door handle and he gets the M burned into his hand? That's the kind of thing you see in those Oscar bait films. It's like they get branded at the beginning.
00:28:10
Speaker
And in this one it's like, oh he's stopped a robber. It's like, aha, how funny. And like at this stage you could have like a whole like, I mean we could have like a whole chat tsunami philosophical debate or say moral debate about like how far is too far for defending your home.
00:28:27
Speaker
You should go watch that. You should go watch that YouTube video. I think it's like I think it's called Honest Action and Home Alone. But just going through that and just seeing like the punishment these two like taken. Okay, fair enough. They're criminal. But at the same time, like they are non-violent. They are non-violent criminal. They're like in the whole thing. Well, they do a lot of property damage, mind you, by turning on the taps. They do a lot of property damage, fair enough. But yeah, I know. I don't know if they deserve to get, I don't know if they deserve to get four bricks.
00:28:56
Speaker
Yeah, and nails through the hands or the tarantula and everything. I think the funniest thing about this film, when you watch it as an adult, is watching Joe Pesci just try as hard as not to utter any swear words at all. And apparently he had a real problem with that on set. Cos they're used to playing these gangster films where the F word is every fifth word that you would say. He really struggled with it. This is a fun fact for me. I genuinely didn't know he was part of those kind of films.
00:29:26
Speaker
like genuinely that was the first time I saw Joe Pesci in like a major film and it was like it was like I watched it and I was like all right he must be you know haha comic relief and everything and then when you watch him in some of the other like um
00:29:41
Speaker
Goodfellas or something. Or Casino. Oh, God, in Casino. Yeah. It's just he is a bad man. Well, his characters are bad, maybe, you know what I mean? Like he is a right. Like you look at him and think, Jesus, it's like he's made such a duality of those. I can't think of an actor who's like most famous films are so diametrically opposed, you know, in that way. I think quite incredible. You can do both those things.
00:30:07
Speaker
It reminds me of, I don't know, have I told you about the Tyson effect? Oh, what was that? I can't remember if I told you about it before. I was like, so this is like completely random off of like Christmas films, but I remember I was watching this Chinese film ages ago called Hitman, or like the third Hitman film, and it's a good film, like good martial arts. Yeah, and there's a scene in it where they got Mike Tyson in to like speak out really, you know, bad Chinese and everything and
00:30:34
Speaker
it's like on the one hand it looks goofy like when he's fighting them but if you were in that position and you were fighting them it's like you would not want to be in that position you could and I feel as if it's the same with Joe Pesci it's like it's like you can kind of laugh at him but if he was in your house trying to steal your shit like yeah I would be in like Camp Kevin I would just be throwing bricks and everyone just like get out of my house Joe Pesci
00:31:03
Speaker
Throwing the quality street down, just like here. You can have it. You know what he was? You know, if Joe Pesci was at my house, I'd probably just move and be like, nope, you have it now, Joe. It's your house now. I wonder if that's how he gets. He's like, oh, we'll do homes now. He just walks in. Look, Joe Pesci's at my house. He's like, oh, Joe Pesci's like, oh, man, we're not dealing with that, sir. You're on your own. Yeah, it's like, yeah, no, no. We're police. We're not risking that. Oh, God.
00:31:33
Speaker
Do you want a fun fact? Absolutely. As you said, there's a lot of trivia behind this film. But I actually found out one today that I didn't know about. I mean, just know, you know about this. Do you know that there's a lot of people believe that, well, I say a lot of people, a section of people believe that Elvis Presley is still alive. And a lot of people that said that he actually appears in this film, which was 13 years after his death. So apparently in one scene in the airport,
00:32:01
Speaker
i think where kevin's mum is trying to like get a flight back maybe just before she like meets that like traveling band yeah you know and goes in their van so when she's at the desk talking a lot of people swear that there's an extra behind her who is elvis presley that is there you go i look to them and i do not know where they're getting the resemblance from i'll see if i can take out a picture and picture and send it to you later on but i don't quite know where they're getting the resemblance from but i thought wow that's crazy
00:32:26
Speaker
Actually, I've got a fun fact to give you as well. Well, I have to admit, when I was watching it again, I looked up the IMDB page and honestly, there are so many facts about this film. I think there was a lot of cast and things as well. I don't know if Robert De Niro was meant to be in this film. He was meant to be Harry, I think, was he? I think so, yeah.
00:32:47
Speaker
but yeah he didn't which is probably for the best I think. I think by now yeah they're definitely more iconic I would say because I don't know it would come off as like a child's version of casino.
00:33:02
Speaker
And also one more fact, before we go into our third film, that you know the scene, so this is quite kind of a wholesome fact, you know the scene where Kevin's like looking through his cousin's like photos and things like that? And he comes across a picture of a, it's like of a girl who's meant to be like one of his cousin's girlfriends. And he says something like, oh, what a dog or something like that, like something really derogatory. Apparently the director was like really
00:33:31
Speaker
like sensitive to the idea that he didn't want a girdle in that picture so like everyone was gonna look at that and go oh yeah that's the girdle from Home Alone who's meant to be the ugly one and things so he got like the boy to dress up as a girdle. Oh really? Yeah so like basically so they weren't insulting like a randomly lassie to call it ugly. I thought it was kind of nice in a way. Not at all what I expect from Hollywood.
00:33:57
Speaker
Yeah, I know. Apparently, this idea was really nice, though. There's Christopher Columbus, isn't there? I think so, yeah. A couple of Harry Potter's. Oh, yeah. He seems like a nice guy. Good for you, Chris. Good for you, Chris. Good job. That's some wholesome. See, that's why it's a perfect Christmas film. That's the kind of wholesome. Yeah, exactly. To balance out the crass consumerism of Jingle all the way.
00:34:18
Speaker
That is true. So going on to the third one. I'm kind of looking through the list to see what we could do for it. You know what? We'll go for like a Quintessential film before we come on to like the last ones. So the next one, which is one I actually talked about with Craig, who you might have heard on Chatsanami before. Yeah, we were talking about the Muppets Christmas Carol, which is third on our list. I have to admit, it's a film you can not have Christmas without, personally.
00:34:44
Speaker
yeah couldn't agree more and yeah it is it's just like so iconic i feel as if like this is definitely the first version that a lot of kids get introduced to that story a christmas candle i mean especially sorry this might be the this might be the only version of a christmas car i've ever fully seen
00:35:02
Speaker
I've never read the original and I don't think I've ever sat down and watched another version because there's no need to ever make another version of Christmas Carol again.
Praise for 'Muppets Christmas Carol'
00:35:14
Speaker
It was made perfectly here. The perfect Christmas story and the added Muppets by keeping the spirit of the original.
00:35:21
Speaker
Yeah, I have to admit, I've watched like, I've watched different versions of it and a lot of films like Good and Bad, they all try to like, they all put their own spin on it, like some modern, some good, some bad and it's just, ugh, it's, some of them you just want like, the one with Jim Carrey, have you seen that one?
00:35:44
Speaker
I had some really good elements but overall it's just nightmare feel and then they expect you to be happy at the end and you're just like no that's ain't it
00:35:56
Speaker
I mean with the Muffin's Christmas Carol, at least there's the music, there's the upbeat tone and everything and then at the very end you're just like, you're filled with that sense of resolution and everyone's come round and had a character arc. I mean especially Scrooge, he's the quintessential example of a character arc.
00:36:17
Speaker
going from a grumpy old you-know-what to a grumpy old Scrooge. We're practically coining the phrase but yeah absolutely adore this and fun fact about this one actually in the film like if you haven't like heard of the story by now which if you haven't by the way go read it go watch it amazing story one of my favorite Christmas stories but yeah it's like yeah it's about like a very greedy
00:36:43
Speaker
I would have put it like just a greedy industrialist. Back to this capitalism thing again. This is the thing. Perhaps we need like capitalist critique for a good Christmas film. Perhaps that's the underlying thing. Next week Chatsunami discusses capitalism. I think actually capitalist critiques are in all five of the films that we've picked.
00:37:05
Speaker
I think you're right if I'm honest. You add that to the list. He is though, he's a greedy industrialist. He doesn't care about other people's feelings and then he gets visited by three ghosts to show him the error of his ways.
00:37:20
Speaker
it's all happy at the end and you know they all start singing and dancing but the one thing that threw me off so he gets visited to begin with by his friend Jacob Marley who basically says if you don't change you're gonna be like me you're gonna be a ghost and then he does the woo and then runs away you know I'm oversimplifying
00:37:38
Speaker
This is my speedrun version of A Christmas Carol. But yeah, in the film he's visited by the two, like, heckling Muppets. And for the longest time I thought, you know how they come in and they sing the song Marley and Marley. Like honestly, I genuinely thought that Marley and Marley were like two separate characters throughout all the versions. I didn't realise it was only one character.
00:38:08
Speaker
And when I was watching the other films, I was so confused. I was like, okay, there's one coffin, where's the other one? I was like, oh!
00:38:17
Speaker
That's the Muppets. Oh, God, yeah. Yeah, that's my own baddest in fact for this film. Oh, it's it's so I mean, what I think was really interesting about this film as well, this was the first Muppets. There had been a couple of Muppets films before this one. Yeah, this was the first one, though, to actually focus on a human character. I mean, and then subsequently, like that has been a trend. You know, Treasure Island was a couple of years after that. And then obviously, like the recent Muppet films as well had a focus on on human characters.
00:38:44
Speaker
And this was the first one to do it as well. Also, this was the first film without Jim Henson, who had died, I think, two years before. And so the original creator of the Muppets, everything he did, the original voice of Kermit and everything he died two years before. And it was his son who was directing. And it's actually like, it's actually a really kind of sweet, you know,
00:39:01
Speaker
yeah behind it because so when like he was obviously because it was a really unexpected i think Jim Henson died of like complications of pneumonia or something he was only like 15 years he was quite young yeah he was a really like a really shocking death and like especially for his son you can imagine and so his son Brian directed this film
00:39:19
Speaker
And i think he was and he was still trying to process his dad's death and stuff and so when this idea first surfaced with the way he kind of was thinking he was kind of thinking like he wanted to do like a really kind of irreverent parody like you know just kind of like taking the taking the novel to task and everything and just doing like a kind of like you know i say parody kind of shit take of it almost but then like the more he thought about it and the more he was like
00:39:40
Speaker
What would my dad want to do and everything? And then he kind of came and he thought, that's probably not what my dad would want. So he came around to his idea of actually, you know, treating the story with reverence and, you know, still having that kind of the Muppets wits and, you know, the humor, the reverence of it, but like meshing it with the original kind of like the ethos and the kind of themes of the story. And actually it's really interesting because Gonzo quotes like great lengths of the text, actually, because he kind of always he plays the role of Charles Dickens.
00:40:07
Speaker
Yeah. And there's so much like lines lifted from the text that he says and it actually helps to give you like really gives you that kind of why it's the best adaptation because it does so well taking the words actually set the scene and everything that no other adaptation that I can see has done that in that way of actually like lifting from it. So it's a perfect, it's just actually perfect blend of these two things. You know, it's got everything. It's got the humor.
00:40:30
Speaker
got the humor of the Muppets you know you have you have the terror the terror which is quite like elements of one's horror in the Christmas story. Oh yeah. A ghost of Christmas features and it features the kind of scary one. I'm gonna admit it sorry I was just gonna say I'm gonna admit it see the ghost of Christmas past I find her so much creepier than the ghost of the future ghost because we're gonna say the ghost of Christmas future but is it not the ghost of things yet to come or something or
00:40:56
Speaker
Oh, that's something, that probably bit, no, same thing, but yeah, yeah, I think she is so creepy. Like, everyone's like, oh, is this a fan, you know, a fantastical ghost girl? And I'm just like internally screaming the entire time, like, begone!
00:41:13
Speaker
But that's probably what it should be as well, because these are ghosts. There should be an element of terror, and I think that's maybe something that's in the original, like, novella as well. So they just hit everything. They hit everything, but it's a perfect film in so many ways. Yeah, all I'm saying is, like, don't watch this film and then watch the Jim Carrey version and expect the same thing. That thing ramps up the horror to, like, a living for some of them, especially with the ghosts of A Christmas Present.
00:41:40
Speaker
The Ghost of Christmas Present in the Muppets version is just very cheery and jolly and talks in a very soft way and something I didn't notice as well. I was actually watching a review of it the other day.
00:41:55
Speaker
And the guy pointed out that he's quite absent-minded, like, about things in the past. And I thought that was quite a neat touch. It's something I never really thought of. But it's quite a neat touch that he's kind of, you know, he's walking around and he's, like, talking. He's like, oh, oh, did I say that? And, you know, he bursts into song and it's like, OK, but how did I get home?
00:42:18
Speaker
But yeah, I do agree, and going back to your point about mixing the lines from the book compared to some of the other, or what could have been if it was just a straight-out parody, because one of my favourite lines is definitely from the book where he says
00:42:35
Speaker
where he's convinced that the ghosts are just like, they're a fragment of his imagination and it's like indigestion that he's got and he goes in this huge rant and he says it could be a bit of um undigested roast beef yes there's more gravy than grave about you or something and it's like for 1800 standards I'm like that's such a slapdown I'm like bravo!
00:42:58
Speaker
Just great. More gravy than great. I love it. There's just so many moments where I'm just like, oh, great line, great line. It's like writing them down like, oh, dick and you're genius. Next line. It is. And I do think it is good that Michael Caine, he plays it quite seriously as well. Yeah. Rather than, again, it's like he's not mugging to the camera. He's not going, oh, look at me. And yeah, he's not like,
00:43:26
Speaker
He's not taking it for granted, or not taking it for granted, but he's not making a parody of it. Yeah. He is, as you say, he is treating it. Seriously, in the bits that are meant to be serious, it shouldn't be serious. Especially then. Yeah, especially for the end though. Like, at the very, very end. I don't know if you remember this, but throughout the film, like Gonzo and, is it Rizzo? Rizzo, yeah.
00:43:50
Speaker
Yeah, they narrate the whole thing. And then as soon as it gets to the ghost of Christmas future, yet to come, whatever.
00:43:58
Speaker
they disappear, they're just like, boop. They're just like, yeah, peace out, we'll come back later. And it's that moment that it allows the film to kind of just go at its own pace, you know? That and the Tiny Timbs scene, that is just tragic. I mean, can you imagine being the puppeteer who had to make that tiny crutch and be like, yes, this is Tiny Timbs crutch.
00:44:22
Speaker
I mean, that is true. There's actually some really impressive puppetry in it as well, because I mean, I don't even remember, it's quite a short scene, but it's when Scrooge is with the Ghost of Christmas Present, and he's at Bob Cratchit's house. And then Kermit, who plays Bob Cratchit, in his version, is strolling down with Tiny Tim on his shoulder to get to the house. And it's actually a full scene of Kermit walking. That apparently took 10 puppeteers to make that work.
00:44:49
Speaker
Okay. So what they had was they had like a rolling drum and you can actually, if you go back and watch it, I think it, I think the scene is like, it's called tis the season or something. So you can type. Oh yeah. There's this rolling drum that was kind of Justin and fake snow that's rolling beneath it, belief, uh, Kermit's legs. And so it was, there was 10 other puppeteers like moving his legs, moving his arms, doing everything else. And it's really complicated scene. It's only about like 30 seconds long, maybe even less than that, but just like, wow, some of that for some of those special effects and you know, physical puppetry was really impressive as well.
00:45:19
Speaker
because I mean there's a lot of um like if you look at the behind the scenes you can see a lot of them dressed like power rangers like in the full green suits like moving the puppets and everything is really impressive it's a great film and I don't think yeah without without it I don't think Christmas is really the same
00:45:35
Speaker
We can't say it's happened. So, speaking of films that aren't the same without it at Christmas, and this is one that I've got a confession about as well, but the fourth one that we did agree on, this is one I wasn't sure I put none, but yeah, I'm going to rip the bad news off.
00:45:53
Speaker
Yeah, it's Die Hard, it's Die Hard, right?
Debate on 'Die Hard' as a Christmas Film
00:45:56
Speaker
I am gonna confess now. So, as you guys may know, I am very bad at watching things, people recommend. People recommend something, I'll be like, yeah, I'll watch it, I'll watch it, and then I never do. I was on a flight over somewhere, and it was taking hours and hours, so all I could do was sit there and watch films, and I saw Die Hard was there.
00:46:18
Speaker
So yeah, about three years ago. That was the first time I watched Die Hard. In fact, no, two years ago. Sorry. Bordering on three. Yeah, that was the very first time I watched Die Hard. And not a blessed moment too soon. Yeah, it's an interesting one. And this is the one that's like, hotly debated as a Christmas film.
00:46:34
Speaker
This is the great philosophical question of our age. Is Die Hard a Christmas film? Or is it not? Well, if it's on this list, then yes. I think as I said to you, it perhaps isn't a Christmas film, but damn it, it's a Christmas film to me.
00:46:51
Speaker
It's a Christmas film to many people though, which I'm really surprised at. Although I think a survey this year, a survey of US adults this year apparently found that 51% did not consider it a Christmas film. So I think it's slightly more considerate not a Christmas film than do.
00:47:06
Speaker
Yeah, but I mean, 49. They'll have to admit, like, ever since, like, I've watched it. I don't think I've watched it since. Or if I have, I've watched bits and pieces of it. Never watched the sequels, though. Which I know they are technically, they are just, like, straight action films, aren't they? Yeah, like, certainly, like, two and three, I think, are worth one. If you want to go further into Die Hard, I would go up to three and then just forget about the other ones. Sounds about right. The second one is set at Christmas as well, so the second one is set at Christmas as well, so the second one is set at Christmas film.
00:47:36
Speaker
The third one is not after that, it moves away from being Christmas. I don't see how this is in the Christmas film. It's got all the Christmas themes in it. We've got redemption and reconciliation, which are classic Christmas themes. The importance of family and friendship. That is true. We have the importance of getting shiny new gifts like machine guns. That is very true.
00:48:02
Speaker
Also, here's the two incontrovertible bits of proof that Die Hard is a Christmas film. John McLean's wife is called Holly. I mean, what more do you need? And there's a pregnant woman in it as well. Okay. I rest my case. It took me a minute, but okay. I mean, and there's a man with a beard who came through the journey. Came to give presents to his European friends.
00:48:33
Speaker
does as well, doesn't it? It's a perfect reflection of a Christmas party, probably as well. That is true. I've been to a raucous Christmas party and see what's got all the elements of that. I mean, minus the guns, that is definitely like... I don't know. Maybe it's not Christmas. Maybe not as glamorous, but I'm just thinking back to my own experiences with office parties, and it's just a lot of standing around in awkward small talk.
00:49:00
Speaker
It's like you basically, the rule of thumb is if you're trapped in like an office party that Bruce Wallace isn't going to gate crash or Hans Gruber then yeah basically what you want to do is just pile up with the pizza or whatever food is there and yeah just tuck in and no one's going to come near the guy with like a full pizza.
00:49:22
Speaker
That's true. You were too mistaken to make small talk. Yeah, exactly. You just walk on, just don't make eye contact. And if worst comes to the worst, take a leaf out of Bruce Willis' notebook. Climb the vents, okay? Climb the vents, don't look back, just keep crawling. And sooner or later, you will make it out. I believe in you, everyone. I believe in you. You can do it. Yeah, and on that note,
00:49:49
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, do you want a fun fact about this one? Yep, absolutely. I don't know if you know, but Die Hard was based off of a novel. Really? I think it's something like Nothing Lasts Forever. I've forgotten the guy's name now. So it's a series of two books, as far as I know. And the first one was called The Detective, which was made into a film back in the 60s. And then so it's the same character of John McClain. So when they wanted to make Die Hard,
00:50:18
Speaker
a historian to die hard. They were obliged to ask the actor who played John McLean in that 60s film if he wanted to reprise his. They really hoped he would say no because he was quite old by this point, but they were obliged to ask him. So I was gonna ask you if you know or if you can guess. So I'll give you a clue. He was a very famous actor but also a very famous singer through like the 40s, 50s and 60s.
00:50:44
Speaker
Was it Elvis? It wasn't Elvis, no, it wasn't Elvis. He was part of a very famous trio. 40s, 50s and 60s. He might have even been into... certainly I think those were his peaks. He might have been into that as well. His nickname was Old Blue Eyes. What was it? Oh no, that's really... No, I'm drawing the blank. No, do tell.
00:51:09
Speaker
It was Frank Sinatra. Really? So Frank Sinatra played John McClain in that first one, and they were obliged to ask him if he would want to reprise his role. Now, I think Frank Sinatra was maybe in his 70s by the time of Die Hard. Yeah, he'd have been in his late 60s, sorry, his late 60s. So thankfully he said no. Yeah, I was just going to say it.
00:51:33
Speaker
He was just like, yes, no, my my weirdial bones won't take that. We're not going to be doing this, you know. So that freed them up to go try and they wanted obviously they wanted to try and get Sylvester Stallone or Arnold Schwarzenegger with the original picks, but neither of them did it. And so they kind of eventually settled on Bruce Willis. The film is better for having Bruce Willis. Oh, yeah. So incidentally, Bruce Willis doesn't think it's a Christmas film either. So there you go. But fun fact for it for what is what I think is one of my favorite films is it's so good.
00:52:02
Speaker
Oh yeah. I was just going to say, just when you were sitting there, he was considered too old. I mean, how old was Roger Muir? Like in his later films? 120 or something. Jesus. He looks it by the time of, what was that last one? View to a kill. View to a kill, yeah. I think he was late 50s actually. I think I'm being hard.
00:52:22
Speaker
Yeah, it's more like when he's doing kind of the old magic, like for the record, absolutely lovely, his films, but yeah, it was getting to that stage where it is just like you look and you think, yeah, this isn't working, something's wrong. 58, I think he was. Yeah, and it's like, it would have been the same, a diehard look, can you imagine? Like him trying to rescue his wife and just being like, yeah, no.
00:52:44
Speaker
Do you know how the end of the novel ends? The ending of the novel is brutal. It's not his wife, it's his daughter who gets caught up in the building heights. The novel ends up with his daughter hanging off the roof of the skyscraper and John McLean trying to rescue her but not being able to, so she falls to her death. Jesus.
00:53:07
Speaker
Imagine that as the ending tour if it wasn't Alan Rickman. Also a fun fact about that scene, the Alan Rickman scene. They obviously had suspended him across a green screen thing. But nobody told him when they were going to release it. So they just released it at one point. So that actually shock on his face is like real. He's not expecting it at all. So they got that actual reaction.
00:53:29
Speaker
So yeah, our final film. Yeah, I think we both decided to go for more of a classic one for their final one because yeah, the other ones have kind of been quite fun and upbeat but as this one's definitely got more of a serious tone.
00:53:45
Speaker
and that of course being It's a Wonderful Life and I have to admit like I'm curious to hear how you came across it like first but like for me anyway I went to so there's a local movie theatre that shows Christmas films every year I don't know about this year but you know for obvious reasons but yeah usually it shows like The Muppet's Christmas Carol you know all the classic classics and I'm not talking about Die Hard this time
00:54:14
Speaker
is more or less the classic films and one of the ones that they showed when I absolutely fell in love with it was It's a Wonderful Life.
Legacy of 'It's a Wonderful Life'
00:54:23
Speaker
So yeah, sorry, before I go on to like praise this film to the hell. No, no, no, it's a really good point because I was just trying to think there how I came across it. And you know, I think the first time I watched it, it wasn't Christmas time. I think I might have just read another. And yeah, I think it was one of these films is when I filmed that I came into how old did you say you were when you
00:54:40
Speaker
be fair it probably was only like oh good question i think it was probably when i was at university maybe kind of relatively like relatively like about five maybe five seven years ago maybe do you know it's it's the same i think it's the same for me like i was i was certainly a teenager when i pushed it because sometimes i saw when i was a kid that i can remember anyone
00:54:59
Speaker
think I just happened to watch it because I'd heard so much. I was kind of in a phase where I was trying to watch a lot of like kind of classic films and so like I watched it and no I really enjoyed it. I don't think I quite appreciate it but it's having watched it subsequently and I watched it actually not long ago again and just I've got such a bigger appreciation for it and so I think we can now just go into just phrasing this amazing solid goal of the film which is just perfect in every way.
00:55:24
Speaker
Because it's weird, it's like there's a lot of old Christmas songs you watch and they're always so cheesy and over the top. They're like, oh god bless Christmas, am I right? And it's like, oh Jesus. Get out of here, you. Great, great, great. And yeah, you're kind of like...
00:55:41
Speaker
it's kind of hard you know when it sounds bad to me because like oh we're so used to like the nihilism of like jingle all the way and home alone die hard and things like that but I mean the film if you don't know what it's about it's about this guy called George Bailey who's in like a it's like a small American town isn't it and like the 30s I think yeah it's it's through like it's through his life so yeah so it's like kind of from the
00:56:09
Speaker
end of the First World War I think. So the 1910s all the way through to the Second World War and just after that up to the 50s I think. Give or take I think it is. Yeah I think it's about mid-46 or something. That's when the film came out. Yeah because the only reason I'm thinking that is because of his brother in it that goes off to war. It's only after the end.
00:56:31
Speaker
yeah but yeah sorry so it's about this guy called George Bailey who lives in like this town and he always tries to be the best person he can be and he always tries to promote himself and help people and you know he's just the quintessential good guy and you would think okay this is like one of these cheesy you know like run-of-the-mill films it's gonna be like a you know a really upbeat message but then there's a turning point where
00:56:57
Speaker
he hits rock bottom and i do think it's like something that a lot of people experience in their lives there's always that one moment where it just everything seems to break down nothing is going right and then he starts to ponder like it's a really serious moment where he starts to think what would the world be like if i just didn't exist at all and he starts like spiraling down this hopelessness and just this utter you know anguish and
00:57:23
Speaker
and then eventually this is kind of where the medical part comes in where an angel is sent down to actually show him what his life would be like and you know it shows him that essentially the time would be nothing like it is when he's alive and eventually he sees the error of his ways, he comes together with his family at the end
00:57:42
Speaker
you know all happy and everything but it's just so well done like it's a long one but I don't know yeah absolutely I mean that is just one of those films where I mean it's not one of those films you could stick on and watch over and over again yeah and you shouldn't I think yeah it is meant for that to watch like once a year you know just to remind yourself just you know of the important things you know yeah you know your life does matter and you know you are you are important yeah
00:58:12
Speaker
that you do impact more people. And that's why it's the ultimate, it's the ultimate Christmas film. It takes every, like all the things that we were talking about earlier on about what makes an excellent, what makes a good Christmas film, it takes everyone in those boxes. You know, it's got the magic, it's uplifting. There's the triumph for adversity. It's universal, like every, I think most people could appreciate this film, you know, it doesn't matter your age or whatever. There's something that you'll recognize there, because it is such a human story. And, you know, George Bailey is just the ultimate hero in cinema.
00:58:41
Speaker
Oh, totally. You know, just the nicest guy who is just surrounded by just so many dicks, like his brother, his uncle, all these people who are just incompetent or like selfish or just take advantage of him. But he's just the nicest guy and like, you know, he just, oh, he always just manages to get through and just thinks about other people. And we should all be more like, more more like George Bailey.
00:59:05
Speaker
I mean it's like what you were saying earlier about the adversity thing because a lot of films like especially nowadays a lot of films are basically the adversity is like not getting the right present or maybe in Die Hard literally like having to fight a terrorist or having to fight robbers you know like they're all kind of situations which I hope that a lot of us probably won't experience
00:59:33
Speaker
like in terms of you know maybe with jingle all the way but to like a lesser extent like not being able to get the right present i hope no one's like dove off like a skyscraper as it blew up yeah please tell us um oh you know like had to fight like a muppet for christmas you know but yeah with it's a wonderful life and again i could like i could honestly gush a bit of song for ages but
01:00:01
Speaker
It is very human, I think. I mean, don't get me wrong, no matter the time period, obviously a lot of things have changed since the time that came out and everything. But I mean, there's even moments where he is such a selfless person. I always remember the scene where he
01:00:19
Speaker
I think, does he not come back from his weight and he's about to go in his honeymoon? Or does he come back from his honeymoon? I can't remember. No, no, it is before he goes to his honeymoon. It's every time he's about to leave the town, you know, like strike out on his own, you know, he wants to go to college, he wants to, you know, travel the world, he wants to, you know, he's going off to his honeymoon, as you say, he just can't get away.
01:00:40
Speaker
Yeah, because the time keeps bringing them back, especially that scene where they're about to go away. He's about to do like one selfless thing for himself and then all of a sudden they're all talking about the villain of the film, Mr. Potter, who does it really well. It's like the typical very
01:00:57
Speaker
portly, egotistical, you know, banker kind of guy. And he's, you know, he's like, basically milking the town for what it's worth. And they're all saying, oh, we're going to borrow money off this evil businessman. Again, looking back to capitalism.
01:01:14
Speaker
it really is and especially in this one because he ends up like giving away his own money to make sure that that is speaking of when you're said to surrounded by dicks i remember there's one guy so basically he's like i can give you the money but just enough to tide you over and there's this one dick at the beginning who's just like no i want all my money i want all my money
01:01:38
Speaker
And it's like, oh, you dick. And then the next woman behind is just like, well, I only need $50 or $20, something like that. They're only taking what they need and things. And again, it's like, despite that, despite so many horrible people, he's still willing to help. And I do think it's so human because they don't make him out to be invincible or
01:02:02
Speaker
invulnerable and I mean especially like with you know with I'm going to probably go a bit deep here so apologies but you know with 2020 especially and the whole like issues of like mental health and things like that going around and it shows like because usually in a film like this maybe if it's made nowadays it's like the main character would kind of wander off maybe look at a show up and then go you know what things aren't that bad you know
01:02:26
Speaker
and then like kind of skipped to the end but with George Bailey he doesn't he kind of he has this breaking point and it's like a lot like his kids are you know driving them up the wall he's got like a kid that's sick bloody Zuzu
01:02:42
Speaker
and yeah it's just like everything's just going wrong and it's just it just shows like even the best of you know like people can just kind of break down and he just goes to such an extreme so much so that God has to be like yeah here's an angel. That's intervene, you know exactly. But I think he misses right enough does he not? He like throws the angel in the water, I'm a stick. Oh he can kick all Clarence as well, maybe just as incompetent in many ways.
01:03:10
Speaker
Even characters crash straight into the... Actually, I think he does mean that, doesn't he? Yeah, yeah, he does, yeah. They're gonna guess George back then. No fair, sorry. No fair, sorry. BSR, what were you gonna say there? No, I was just gonna say, I was just gonna agree with everything you said. He's a human being through and through. He's got so many good points, but he's flawed as well because we all are. Both human beings at the end of the day.
01:03:37
Speaker
You know, it's such a human story and like, it's one of these, I know we often say like, this film's like, oh god, you hope they never remake them. But this is one of these films that you just hope they never do touch and never remake. I don't think you could ever, nobody could play the part of George Bailey any close to how Jimmy Stewart does it. It was just like the perfect, the perfect casting, you know, perfect moment.
01:04:01
Speaker
What I find so interesting about that as well, so this was 1946 when this film came out, so one year after the end of World War II. Jimmy Stewart had been a bomber pilot. He was a bomber pilot during the war, so he'd been through a lot of bad stuff with that. He was suffering from what they would now term post-traumatic stress.
01:04:21
Speaker
at the time and that really comes through I think in his portrayal of this like although the character George Bailey doesn't you know so yeah he's a guy he's been really physically and mentally damaged by what's happened and that really comes through because Jimmy was trying to deal with his own sort of demons and his own experiences and this is why it's such a perfect like casting and you can just see everything like his face and his acting and everything about it yeah but what I find so interesting about this film as well is that like I don't know if you know this but at the time it was a box office bomb
01:04:51
Speaker
Yeah, I have heard that. It did not do well at all. It was not well received. I think it did well in the awards and things, but Critic, I don't think it did that well. And commercially, it certainly did not. The director of Frank Apra lost a lot of money on it. And then what really got its popularity going was that the copyright, I think, I don't know what the word is, but it ran out, basically. So lots of TV channels could start showing it.
01:05:15
Speaker
And so that's where it really started to pick up traction in the kind of 70s, the mid-70s when it started becoming like, shown at Christmas and things, because so many TV channels got the rights to it, to show it. And that's where its popularity just really swept up and soared from there to where it's become this staple of Christmas time now. So just a fascinating film through and through. And for my interesting fact for this one, so obviously this film now has like,
01:05:38
Speaker
many many fans and people who just think it's amazing ourselves included oh yeah but there was there was one group of people who did not like this film when it when it when it came out and that was the FBI who cited this film as an example of potential communist infiltration of the motion picture industry um i don't know if you can see if you can hear the question you know you know what bit of the film they took most issue with oh wait let me think what was it when he was trying to claim the moon for his girlfriend
01:06:07
Speaker
was it they were like, oh communism right now. The moon is ours! In fact, no sorry, it wouldn't have been at that time, sorry, I'll take that back. Not yet, not yet. Not yet. Let me think, there wasn't anything to do with the angel was it? No, it was nothing to do with the kind of religious aspect to it, they were all fine with that. It was a portrayal of Potter
01:06:30
Speaker
the banker. As we just said, such a stereotypical evil banker. This is what the communists think, this is what the communists do. At the time they probably weren't that far off. That was quite funny actually. So this film was potentially dangerous.
01:06:53
Speaker
when it first came out, which is hysterical to think about now. There's certainly a classic of American cinema, but a world cinema as well, probably at this point. It's spread that far. I mean, just kind of one final point before we finish up, but
01:07:11
Speaker
That is quite an interesting thing because if you watch it, it's a very American film. You know, it's like the character grows up in a small American town. He faces a lot of issues that are very... I don't want to be like America festive, yeah. But you know, it's like a lot of... Yeah, sorry. I was just gonna say it's like, it's very American-centric, yeah. It's like a struggle and a journey that I think everyone can relate to.
01:07:40
Speaker
yeah that you kind of forget about it you don't really think oh this is an American you know like struggling you think this is a human being yeah that it's like something that you can you know relate to yeah I just think it's really well done in that regard it's just perfect yeah as you say the context is universal as much as it's like an American American man you know setting America setting small town America the context is universal oh yeah absolutely certainly so yeah can't say enough about this film it's amazing
01:08:09
Speaker
It really is, yeah. Next week. More on why this is so great. So before we kind of wrap up, is there any other Christmas films that you would say in the ownerry mentions list? I think Elf has to go in there. Because Elf is great in its own right. It's got really hard. Are you not a fan?
01:08:34
Speaker
Yeah, this is my turn to be the controversial one on the channel this time. I don't know, I like the film but I think it's because when it came out I never watched it and the hype kind of like, you know when it came out and the hype just like absolutely ran away with itself.
01:08:54
Speaker
And I feel as if, for me, it was kind of too hyped up to the extent when I actually saw it. I was kind of like, it's okay. I mean, it's still a good film. I'm not going to bash Elf at all. But for me, I was kind of like, yeah.
01:09:10
Speaker
But yeah, that's my controversial Christmas opinion. I know it's a fair point, I respect your opinion. But I had Santa as well as one. It wouldn't be good in the top one, but it's one that I think is another quite refreshing, cynical take on Christmas and the holiday period. It's a nice counterpoint.
01:09:28
Speaker
It's not quite as good, I think, as Jingle all the way, but it's all milk and it's enjoyable. Deck the Halls is quite a good one. I've never seen that one with Danny DeVito and Matthew Broderick. I said it's familiar, but I can't see it. The one where Danny DeVito is a really extroverted neighbor who wants to make his house the brightest so they can see it. Oh, yeah. Matthew Broderick's the kind of neighbor across who wants his privacy and they get it. It's pretty good. Yeah, so there's quite a few Christmas with the Cranks. There's a lot of honorable mentions there, but I don't think they would just quite crack this.
01:09:58
Speaker
It's the same for me, I mean the one I thought of was the Grinch, the Jim Carrey one which I've got like a very fun spot for it but at the same time I feel as if I went back and watched it without having watched it while I was growing up it wouldn't have been the same Fair enough, my confession is I've never seen it
01:10:17
Speaker
I would recommend seeing it once. I wouldn't say it's a film that's going to blow your socks off or anything, but it's still a film that I think is beloved because people grew up with it. I'm just trying to think if there's any other ones. Obviously other than the sequels to some of these like Home Alone 2 and things like that, there's a lot of rom-coms I have to admit.
01:10:44
Speaker
Yeah, that's true. Which is, I feel as if, you know, again, that idea of adversity and all that, it's like, yeah, what's more perfect than Heartbreak and a Christmas film? It's like, yeah. Just what you want. Yeah, exactly. I mean, I think Love, actually, is probably like one of the... Oh, yeah. Yeah, that is definitely one of the popular ones.
01:11:05
Speaker
But maybe that's for a different podcast. Don't worry, I'll ask you after. I'm just trying to think, but yeah, there's loads of films like that. Four Christmases as well, that's one. Do you know, funny enough, I think one of the last films, and this is going to sound really weird, but one of the last films that I actually went to see in the cinema was Last Christmas. Oh really? Yeah, must have been.
01:11:31
Speaker
Cos it was like, it was, you know, we were going out, like, me and the family, and it was just like, oh, is there anything on at the cinema? And I feel sorry for the cinema because they had, like, refurbished their whole, like, their whole building. I think this was a couple of months before the lockdown, so I feel really sorry for them.
01:11:51
Speaker
But yeah it's like we went in and after that the most memorable bit was like having so much room because I am a tall guy like although my avatar is a red panda I'm a very tall person. Yeah I'm like three red pandas in a trench coat.
01:12:08
Speaker
but yeah it's yeah that was like one of the last films and haha last Christmas I watched last Christmas haha oh god yes it's like it's like long so short it's like about a woman who I think
01:12:23
Speaker
Yeah, she's one of those typical quirky, like it's Emilia Clarke from Game of Thrones. Yeah, and it's her falling in love with someone and there's twists and turns and blah blah blah. I mean, it's an alright film, but it's not something that would make the top five list. But yeah, no, that was just a fun aside that I was probably one of the last films I saw before the lockdown and everything. Oh my God, before everything took that massive U-turn. That is very true.
01:12:52
Speaker
Before we end, a little announcement. So first of all, thank you all so, so much for sticking with us and listening to our top five Christmas films. Thank you again, Adam, for sticking with me. No, thank you for having me and thank you everybody as well.
01:13:07
Speaker
Yeah, thank you so much. And yeah, before we sign off, as always, it's been a pleasure. Yeah, we have a bit of an announcement. So next week, of course, we won't be doing a Chatsunami live, but we will still be publishing an episode. Do you want to explain that, Adam? Because I'm really excited for it, but I feel it was a fear, probably. Right. I'll explain. And if I miss any key points, you can jump in. Go for it.
01:13:33
Speaker
So since we've been talking about good Christmas films here, we thought we'd balance it out and get the karmic opposite and talk about some bad Christmas films. But rather than coming up with a top five or doing a similar format, we thought we'd do something a little different. So Fraser and I have both selected a film that we think is probably the worst or maybe one of the worst Christmas films we've ever seen. And we're going to make the other person watch it.
01:14:00
Speaker
And then we will come up with our own reviews of it, our own thoughts, our own feelings on it. And that will be our chat tsunami next week. We'll be us discussing that and dealing with the fallout and trauma, I imagine, in these terrible, terrible films.
01:14:15
Speaker
Yeah, to basically see if our friendship still stands after this. Essentially. We've basically chosen one Christmas film. One very bad one. One kind of bottom of the barrel. Not a great film. And we're both going to go away. We're going to watch our respective films. We're going to record the episodes. And you guys will get to find out our opinions next Wednesday. So before... You know what? Because, you know, you're such an awesome co-host. I'll let you talk about yours first.
01:14:45
Speaker
Don't talk about this, reveal what it is. We both haven't picked the same one, but here we go. So the one that I've selected for you to watch, to review, and to delve into is 1984's horror slasher film, Silent Night, Deadly Night. Oh my God. Okay, that is not the same as I've got.
01:15:10
Speaker
You're in for a treat, my friend. You're in for an ultimate... Do you want me to give you a little... Do you want a little, like, synopsis? Like, a little kind of summary of the general part? Or do you want to just go... You know what?
Fun with Horror Films and 'Bone Alone'
01:15:20
Speaker
No. I'm gonna go in twice. That's gonna be a better way to do it, actually. But you're in for a treat, my friend.
01:15:25
Speaker
Well, I've also got a horror film for you. In a different way. So, this is a film I watched at university of all things. So, one of my old flatmates and I watched... Like, we had this period where we just binged a lot of terrible films. And I remember Green Child, I can see in the chat, used to say to us, oh, why are you watching so many bad films? And you know what it's like. See if you watch it with friends. It's a lot of fun.
01:15:54
Speaker
I don't know how much fun this is gonna be for you watching it. So yeah, the film that we watched, because you've already seen Santa with muscles and things like that, so I haven't chosen that, but one film, I don't know if you've seen it, it's actually got two titles.
01:16:11
Speaker
Oh my god. The first one is Alone at Christmas but it's colloquially known. I can't even speak because I'm so excited. It's Bone Alone. Bone Alone, yes. It's the dog version of Home Alone. Oh my god. I did not notice anything exist. Oh it exists!
01:16:36
Speaker
ever really exists and I was so worried though when you said that second title I was like oh my what are you making me watch here so I'm at least slightly relieved to know oh absolutely
01:16:48
Speaker
The bone in the title refers to a dog at least like God. Fortunately. I cannot wait for this. It is by far one of the weirdest films I genuinely have ever seen in my life. I remember watching it in some scenes or like you watch them and it's supposed to be like you know in Home Alone when there's some traps that they set and you're like oh my like when you revisit them as an adult and you look at it and you go my god that could have killed him.
01:17:16
Speaker
Yeah, that's all I'm saying. So yeah, I'll make sure you've got a copy tonight and yeah, enjoy.
01:17:33
Speaker
Oh, I cannot wait. So, yeah! On that, like, cheery festive note.
Future Episode Plans & Social Media Wrap-up
01:17:39
Speaker
Yep, nine days away, as of recording. Yep, nine days away from good old Christmas. And, yeah. So, as I said, next week we will not be recording Chatsanami Live, but we will be recording ahead of it. So we're gonna post, we'll probably post the Christmas Films episode, along with our very special episode of Bad Christmas Films.
01:18:03
Speaker
I agree. Oh you're gonna love it. If you love bardemic and ice cream, trust me, you'll love this. So yeah we will be recording that, we will be posting it and yeah if you want to see any more information about that and Adam's eventual spiral in the rabbit hole of bad films, yeah you can see me on Instagram, Twitter
01:18:29
Speaker
YouTube, Twitch, and of course, TikTok. Still don't know what a TikTok is, but you know what? We'll get there. But I am under the name Sassanami42, so you can check me out there. And thank you again, Adam, for putting up with me tonight. Oh, no, thank you for putting up with me.
01:18:45
Speaker
Yeah, no problem. It's always a pleasure, especially to talk about Christmas films. Nice. And yeah, as always, stay safe, stay awesome, stay very jolly and most importantly, stay hydrated. Bye guys. Bye.