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Delving into Star Wars A NEW HOPE | 001
38 Plays5 days ago
Join Branwen and Seah as they deep dive into all things Star Wars! This season, join us on a rewatch of the OG Trilogy, Prequels, Sequels and maybe a cheeky spin off! Follow along as we fly off exploring all the wonders and geekery of a Galaxy Far, Far Away, chatting nostalgia, worlds, lore, music, story, behind the scenes, and much more with each other and some very special guests.
In our first episode we celebrate the film that started it all, "Episode IV - A New Hope", or simply "Star Wars" as it was titled on its original theatrical release in 1977.
Sisters of the Force is a weekly, UK-based, Star Wars podcast, produced with joy and love by Seah and Branwen.
Follow us on instagram @sistersoftheforcepod, bluesky @sistersoftheforce.bsky.social, or at www.facebook.com/sistersoftheforcepod
Transcript
Introduction to 'Sisters of the Force'
00:00:16
Speaker
Hi and welcome to Sisters of the Force, a Star Wars podcast where we delve into the world of Star Wars. I'm Branwen. Branwen. And I'm Seah. And we have no idea where this podcast journey is going to take us, but we're going to find out.
00:00:31
Speaker
We'll find out together.
Personal Star Wars Journeys
00:00:33
Speaker
We're both Star Wars fans, um in quite a big way, I'd say. Do you agree with that? Quite a big way. Different degrees, different directions. Yeah.
00:00:42
Speaker
But still in big way. Yeah, I think so. We've both gone down different Star Wars rabbit holes, definitely. So we thought to to make a kind of logical start, we're going to kick off by talking about the original original, the OG of Star Wars, A New Hope, episode four from 1977 when one of us was alive.
00:01:04
Speaker
And the other very much was not. Yeah.
00:01:09
Speaker
Yeah, so Seah, you have any like specific memories about watching the original set? Was it the first one you watched? Well, ah sorry this is where I'm not sure because...
00:01:22
Speaker
um As far as I'm aware, it would have been the first one, but that's only if ah if my parents actually showed them to me in order. Because who knows?
00:01:33
Speaker
Because I've been watching them since I can remember. So since I have conscious memory, I know about oh my god yes the original trilogy was definitely part of that. Yeah. Were the prequels out when you were born? No. No. No.
00:01:47
Speaker
They didn't come out until I was seven. Ah, okay.
Early Memories of 'A New Hope'
00:01:50
Speaker
So that would have been like ideal Yes, i exactly. That's Yeah. So remember the original trilogy. I remember from from conscious memory.
00:02:03
Speaker
There was no like, I don't remember a time before it. That's cool. Because I was watching it from before I was conscious. Yeah.
00:02:11
Speaker
You were unconsciously watching Your parents were like intravenously giving you Star Wars. And I don't know who it was. i don't know which one it was, which parent it was, but they were always there.
00:02:22
Speaker
And so I was trying to work out whether it was, whether it would have been in the right order, but it could have been any of the three characters. Yeah. And I wouldn't have known. But what I do remember most is Tazos. Do you remember Tazos? Tazos? Do you know you're about Tazos?
00:02:39
Speaker
I don't know, but I do. know You used to get them in crisps and then they were like little disc things. Oh, yes. You do remember Tazos. So I remember collecting Tazos and swapping them with the boy who lived next door and We moved out of that house when I was but four.
00:03:00
Speaker
yeah So I remember this from being four. and And so they were like Star Wars Tazos with different characters on. Yeah, different stills from the trilogies. We're all on them Amazing. Amazing. I never had any, but I know what you're talking about now. I've definitely seen them, but I guess that wasn't a Chris Beating era.
00:03:17
Speaker
like the mid ninety sever that was Mid-90s were not a crispy ting. I did not really partake in crisps during that period, no. Oh my goodness, missing out. and That was the best era for crisps. That's when they still put things in crisp packets. They don't do that anymore.
00:03:33
Speaker
I'm actually surprised but that knowing now that Star Wars things were inside crisps, I was not like getting all of the crisps. yeah because i love I've always loved Star Wars. I have a similar thing of like about four is when I can remember um because I'm so old. I remember, I actually remember going to see it for the first time in the cinema when it was out first time. At four? At the age of four, yeah.
00:03:56
Speaker
1977. Wow. And I think I saw it in Cardiff. i I'm pretty sure I was on holiday with my parents, obviously, at the age of four. I wasn't on holiday on my own. um And my cousin, who's the same age as me, was there and we got taken to see it. And I was in the queue outside.
00:04:13
Speaker
Obviously, it was the film of the time. um I was terrified of Darth Vader. There were pictures of Darth Vader on you know the big screens outside the you know the posters advertising the film.
00:04:25
Speaker
yeah And I was genuinely terrified. But my parents were like, no, come on, you're going to like it, you're going to like it. And I came out a changed person. I mean, not there was much of my person to start with, but I was obsessed.
00:04:41
Speaker
um And yeah, that has and what's really weird to think is that that's probably, i think I might have seen it twice. Like I might have been able to blag my way to go and see it twice at the age of four.
00:04:54
Speaker
And then after that, I probably didn't see it again until about 1983 or something when videos came out. And we could actually, I know whether it was on, might have been on TV before then, not sure.
00:05:07
Speaker
But then once it was on TV the first time, i obviously videoed it like it would have been at Christmas. yeah And I know I've had multiple VHS copies of it over the years. And I definitely remember...
00:05:19
Speaker
in my teens at school, um I would get up early in the morning before going to school and have breakfast watching about half an hour of it, just on a loop.
Star Wars in Different Media
00:05:30
Speaker
so Was it always the same half an hour? yeah thank I would get through the whole film in a week. How do VHS's work? Yeah, it would mean you just stop it wherever you got to and then the next day you go. no, I do work, I'm joking.
00:05:49
Speaker
But it mean I was probably watching it once a week and then in the summer holidays I would watch it like in full whole weeks of holiday school holidays watching it. um the The other reason this particular film is embedded into my DNA so much as if that isn't enough is that in 1982, I think, or 1983, someone around then, an American company did a radio adaptation of it, which was like half hour episodes. And there were
00:06:21
Speaker
12, I want to say, maybe 13 half-hour episodes. So if you do the maths, that's pretty long. It's like yeah six hours or something of just that first movie. And well they added lots of scenes. There were scenes from the novelization, which you can't actually get anymore, which I've still got a copy of, I think, um which George Lucas is credited as the author, but he absolutely did not write.
00:06:44
Speaker
I mean, like most of it is a pretty faithful adaptation of the film, but there's loads at the beginning. And in fact, in the radio drama, like the first two half-hour episodes, I think, are nothing to do with the film at all. It's like Leia before she gets on the Tantive IV and she meets Vader out in a battle somewhere.
00:07:06
Speaker
um and There's a whole load of stuff with Luke and his friends on Tatooine and they go and do what we now know is the pod race in Phantom Menace. We kind of get that with like you know teenage Luke and his mates flying out in their sky hoppers.
00:07:22
Speaker
um They did shoot some footage. i don't know if you've seen any of the ah deleted scenes. I think they've got them on Disney. Potentially, at some point. There's some good deleted scenes that they shot on Tatooine where Luke goes to... ah He's out fixing a moisture evaporator or something and he looks up through his macro binoculars and he can see flashes in the sky. and He's like, oh my god, there's a battle going on. He races off in the land speeder leaving this poor old treadwell unit by the evaporator.
00:07:54
Speaker
and gets to his, there's there's like a kind of a mechanic store, I think, with some characters called Deke and Cammy and Windy and Fixer. God, how do i remember all these names? friend bit his friend Biggs is there and Biggs has been off joining like the Academy. Yeah.
00:08:14
Speaker
Wait! Yes. oh See, this is one of my questions. yeah Why the bloody hell did they let Luke just join in straight away? Well, I think they were desperate for pilots. Okay.
00:08:27
Speaker
How many of them does he know? Well, he doesn't he he only knows Biggs. It's pure chance that he meets Biggs in the audio drama, which is absolutely not canon at all. you know It's like now considered a relic. Right. But it's got a pretty good sequence when he arrives and he sees Biggs and they reunite um because obviously we don't get that in the movie now. We do get Biggs in the movie now.
00:08:49
Speaker
Yeah. ah We didn't in the original cut. He wasn't there at all. That was one of the additions in the special edition in the late 90s. Okay. Yeah. He arrives, he meets Biggs. Biggs introduces him to like the kind of captain of the wing, you know the X-Wing squad whatever.
00:09:06
Speaker
yeah And they put him through some like simulator tests. And he does really, really well. And they're like, you're amazing. We need you. There's an X-Wing free here. Off you go. Okay. Because I watched it this morning.
00:09:22
Speaker
like was i'm I'm a freelancer. I do what I like. But... And what you like is watching Star Wars. her What I like is watching Star Wars in bed on a Tuesday morning.
00:09:32
Speaker
with No. I was doing my admin at the same time, to be fair. But I was thinking this is a little bit of whiplash because I was like, this is just seems very soon that they're just like, yeah, hi, guy that we haven't met before. Here, have a...
00:09:48
Speaker
have an X-wing, off you go. Yeah. And I mean, frankly, he's like a 18-year-old brat who just turns up yeah as though he owns the place. Yeah. I mean, yeah I think that is weird. like I can't remember watching the film because although I do have vague memories of seeing it like pre the radio play thing, yeah um my most of my memories about Star Wars in the early times of, like as I really got to know the film, were through the audio play because I had it on cassette. As they put it on Radio 1.
00:10:16
Speaker
at lunch times like every day for a week or so as they do like they serialized it on on radio one anyway and i obviously taped it and um just listened to it on repeat i had a cassette as well but i don't think it was the radio play did you have the thing where you have to turn the page and there's like yeah I had the learn to read one. Yeah, that was a very abridged.
00:10:38
Speaker
this it This is the opposite of abridged. This is like, this isn't even unabridged. This is like extra abridged. Super abridged. More bridges. So i I guess I'm used to that part of the story of him getting like tested and everything, which of of course is not in the film. In the film, no he's just like, they arrive, they get the information from R2.
00:10:58
Speaker
Next thing is the briefing. And he's sitting in there next to Tom York out of Radiohead, I think. Yeah, yeah. The guy who's telling about the one frat. Obviously. This looks a bit like Tom York. Next time you watch it look out for Tom York.
00:11:16
Speaker
watched it this morning. dear. I didn't see Tom York. but but Yeah, he's he's being a bit moody to Luke and saying, how are we supposed to hit it? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. I did i remember that line.
00:11:31
Speaker
Don't let me get started on these kinds of details. Fair enough. right. So what did you love about... so I mean, clearly you love Star Wars because you keep coming back from more. I do. what What do you think it was about, particularly the original trilogy then, knowing, you know, back then, what grabbed you about it? don't know. I think...
00:11:52
Speaker
I've got very, very early memories of playing pilots. Yeah. they're Like um being left with a childminder and she had to play TIE Fighters with me all day. Amazing. That was just what happened. So you were like piloting things yourself? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Again, I was a child. I have no idea what was going on in the context.
00:12:14
Speaker
But also... I remember getting those books with the turn the page yeah cassettes that went with them. So I did teach myself to read with those. And I remember getting those. And that must have been third or fourth birthday, I think. yeah So there was already ah deep love then. yeah and Oh, we found... Tangent. We found a Star Wars figure on the garage roof.
00:12:40
Speaker
And it was the little guy, he's got three eyes. Three E's. it Ree E's? maybe. he had like a brown suit Brown suit on, yeah. And fleshy pink head with three, yeah. Three little stalk eyes. Yeah, we found him on the garage roof and I don't... I just remember climbing out on the roof to get him. That's such a niche figure to find.
00:13:00
Speaker
and Just randomly. Not like Chewbacca. It was in my collection. But reused the Gran from Jabba's Palace.
00:13:10
Speaker
So he was in my collection. um And I did build up quite a collection. um So I think it was just like It was all the space stuff. I liked the imagery yeah and the being able to fly and its kind of go-kartiness. Yeah.
00:13:26
Speaker
Yeah, it was very exciting.
The Cantina Scene's Impact
00:13:28
Speaker
I just found the whole thing really, really exciting. And it was quite interesting watching it back and going, oh, this is really quite like tame by a lot of standards.
00:13:40
Speaker
It just seemed so sweet and innocent when I watched it today. was like... but It's really weird revisiting it. I mean, I've probably seen it like way over 200 times. And when I come back to it, it still feels like I've never seen it. It's really weird. It's like this kind of strange phenomenon where like I know every word of it. I know every shot, yes like every single detail.
00:14:04
Speaker
Well, not every single, but lots of details. But it still always feels like a new film. And I still get like anxious. um I noticed we were watching it and in the trash compactor scene, me and my mum were getting really edgy. yeah like And we know what happens.
00:14:18
Speaker
It's all going to be fine you know that But i I wonder if that's something to do with watching it so young though, because that scared the absolute bejesus out of me. That whole scene and that whole sequence was so scary. We'll get onto it, but like Bender, it has a lot to do with that. like okay that that That droning sound effect, yeah and it's gradually going up in pitch, yeah and you don't really notice it, and they keep cutting away to 3PO and R2 and then back.
00:14:46
Speaker
But every time the sound has gone up a gear, it's so unrealistic, because if there was a motor driving those walls, would just be a constant thing. Yeah. But it's like as it gets closer, it goes up a semitone or something. It's super cool.
00:14:58
Speaker
But yeah, we'll get onto the sound. That's another thing. Yeah. Sidebar comment. Sia and I are both sound people. We both work in sound. We're both musicians and um we're both into recording. And Sia's done quite a bit of film sound. I've done a little bit of that. So we are very geeky on the sound side of things.
00:15:17
Speaker
Yeah. So you can expect us to be going in a bit more detail maybe with that side of it, which I love. talk more about that. Yeah. Yeah. So have you got any like favourite moments or characters or lines or Favourite moments?
00:15:33
Speaker
ah I just, I love the drama. LAUGHTER
00:15:41
Speaker
I love how like dramatic a lot of it is. And there's just some like, I wrote down one of my favorite moments. It made me laugh so much today. Where is it?
00:15:51
Speaker
oh just Darth Vader going, I sense something. It's a presence I've not felt since. And then he just walks away just flounces off. The detective guy is just like, what? And they're all just looking at him like,
00:16:09
Speaker
Imagine doing that in real life. Your boss just says something like that and then just walks off dramatically. Oh. ah But to be fair, now we know what we know about Anakin and Kenobi's history. Yeah, it makes sense. We just wanted to get away from whatever.
00:16:28
Speaker
it's just ah it just cracked me up. it made me laugh so much. And also, loved
00:16:37
Speaker
how human the droids are in this one. i think like yeah maybe maybe in the later ones when they're more CGI, they feel less yeah yeah less human and it kind of it kind of ruins it a bit. But like there's a lot of r two and C-3PO banter that I really enjoy. The banter is like unsurpassed.
00:16:55
Speaker
It's flawless. From the moment we see them. I mean, the first like third of the movie is pretty much their story. them, yeah. Have you seen a Hidden Fortress, by the way? No. That's a Kurosawa movie that it's based on. No, no, Yeah, the the two droids are like two villagers, I think. Okay. I've not seen either, have to admit, although I'm a Star Wars fan, I've been not watched Hidden Fortress. But one day I will. Maybe, maybe one of our episodes is going to be we can talk about like Hidden Fortress pre-watch.
00:17:27
Speaker
Yeah, they're the storytellers in a Hidden Fortress, yeah really. and and And it kind of is in this. They are like the continuous thread. yeah Like we meet them before we meet Luke and yeah we follow them to Luke. But yeah, the banter is off the scale. It's just so funny. but the The bit where they're on Tatooine when they first can' come out the escape pod and they go separate ways.
00:17:49
Speaker
Threithio's losing his mind. And I'd say, he's just like, screw you, I know what I'm doing. yeah. Truth was, neither of them knew what they were doing. And they both got picked up for scraps, so.
00:18:04
Speaker
the the Yeah, the robots are brilliant. they And I know what you mean. The humanity of them is great. I think all of that stuff, like i was going to say one of my favourite bits of all Star Wars ever, I think, is the cantina scene. I mean, it's like oh god that's amazing such a standout scene.
00:18:22
Speaker
Like as a kid watching that, you're just, oh, it's just incredible. The costumes yeah and the... The languages, that was one of the things that was like, oh my gosh, all of the different languages that are going on around them. yeah just You're tapping into tiny little bits of conversation. It's like someone's had to go and make all of that. Yeah, yeah.
00:18:42
Speaker
I'll tell you what, before watch the next one, I've got the Galactic Phrase book, which is book, I think it's by Ben Burtt. I think Okay. He certainly compiled it, I think. um And it's got like, like phrase, it's just like a, you know, a phrase book for all different races and like there's Hutties in there and Ewokies. Yeah. um Yeah, they did go deep, I think. Okay.
00:19:05
Speaker
Yeah, and it's not just like languages, it's the tones of the voices. There's a couple of Duros speaking and they're just like, got this weird metallic tone to their voices. And then there's like the spy that's following them to Docking Bay 94, the Kubaz with the kind trunk. And he's just got that weird squeaky sound. Yeah.
00:19:24
Speaker
It kind of almost doesn't suit him. No, you imagine have this kind of really scary growly voice and it's just like... Yeah, yeah. ah I've been watching re-watching The Mandalorian recently, and there's a couple of Kubars in season one of that. There's one in the ice planet that it starts on. I can't remember the name of the planet. And he summons speeders like taxi.
00:19:45
Speaker
He's kind of like a taxi hailer. Yeah. And he just plays a little flute. Like he serves the flute at the end of his Kubars snout. um Yeah, they're they're amazing. yeah But yeah, the different tones and it's so imaginative. Like it's imagination run wild, which I absolutely love. There's just so much detail in it.
00:20:02
Speaker
and Yeah, you've got the walrus creature, the Ponda Baba and Doctor, whatever his name is, I can't remember off the top of my head, who threatened Luke at the bar and they've just got their own ways of speaking and...
00:20:14
Speaker
every Every different alien has got a story. You've got the twins with the long black wigs on yeah like the barkeep and the band figuring down the modal nodes. And they're all so chill and there's there's a lot of like things happening and an arm gets cut off and people are being shot and everyone's just like, yeah, whatever, but carry on. is the classic saloon. You keep waiting for like a bar fight to break out. but Yeah, yeah.
00:20:44
Speaker
But like now, like stuff has been written about all of those characters. of course There's like a book series called a Certain Point of View where they take each film and then it's a collection of short stories from a New Hope, for instance.
00:20:59
Speaker
And why like a load of different authors take on different stories. So like the cantina section of the New Hope from A Certain Point of View is massive. like my god There are so many stories about all of those characters and who they are.
00:21:12
Speaker
And I think that's become canon, you know. yeah. All their backstories. It's wild. You can buy the figures of a lot of them. um Hasbro, who like obviously manufacture the kids, the action figures and stuff. Yeah. um They do this thing called Haslabs, where collectors can like crowdfund specific um designs of toys. Oh, wow. And they've just done the cantina. It's about $250 to buy.
00:21:36
Speaker
But it's like a cantina set, and you get like four action figures that go with it. But you can obviously fill it with your own. Yeah, they're they're all out there. You can find action figures of loads of those characters. um I mean, it was an iconic moment. like nothing i mean, the film generally is iconic, obviously.
00:21:54
Speaker
But that particular scene, I think, in terms of the way they use the music, the costumes, like you were saying before, like the languages... it nothing it had been diverse and and filled out. Yeah, yeah.
00:22:08
Speaker
Which I think that's something else that I love about Star Wars is that you get a sense, and this is by design. Lucas has spoken about how it's on it his initial feeling, he wanted everything to feel used and lived in, yeah which is why all the ships and speeders and weapons and everything all look beaten up. yeah like Everything's distressed. Everything's had a life.
00:22:27
Speaker
We're out in the Outer Rim, particularly in the original trilogy. um And so he wanted everything to feel like ah it was real without having to give you some clunky exposition explaining who this alien creature was. It's like, here's Chewbacca. He knows a ah pilot who might, you know, no explanation of who Chewbacca is. He's this gigantic, hairy beast that could be terrifying.
00:22:51
Speaker
But like, he's just, you just brought into him, you know, as though he's an everyday. He's just there. He's an everyday recurrence.
Evolution of Star Wars Storytelling
00:22:56
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. And I just love that lived in thing. And it's obviously become a thing with Star Wars fans, like where we, we analyze everything in the background. we be yeah Yeah. We're renowned for being rewatches. And I guess that's one of my questions as well is how much of it at the time when that one was made, how much of it was thought out?
00:23:16
Speaker
That's a very good question. Yeah. ah Some is my non-commital answer. I think I've heard that he didn't know, spoiler alert, that Leia was going to be Luke's sister. Yeah, I've heard that.
00:23:29
Speaker
They set up a love triangle to start with. I think so, yeah. And then I think during Empire, they were like, we need another hook for for the third film. Yeah. um because Because obviously the end of and Empire Strikes Back is the biggest cliffhanger in cinema history. I challenge you to find me a film with a bigger cliffhanger.
00:23:48
Speaker
um believe I don't know if you've been on YouTube, but you can find like footage from the cinema in 1980 when people were watching it the first time. I not seen like i'm watching it i remember that feeling.
00:24:00
Speaker
like I can't remember not knowing. you know like it's I was probably seven by then, but like I can remember hearing it and being i'm very much reacting like Luke.
00:24:11
Speaker
Like, me no, no. This can't be true. But thinking, but it probably is us. Why would they have told us? You know, even my seven-year-old brain was doing the sort of screenwriting maths of like, that yeah he is, isn't he? Oh my God.
00:24:25
Speaker
um So I know, I'm pretty sure that he had that in mind. I think he had a vague... I mean, the story goes that he had like a nine film saga in his head. Yeah. um He didn't mention that he was starting partway through. Yeah. But I think you can tell by the way he writes writes that scene with Obi-Wan in Obi-Wan's home. Oh, yeah, yeah. And he's he's telling Luke about the Clone Wars and like yeah years ago, your father and, you know, all that stuff. he did, yeah.
00:24:50
Speaker
You know that Lucas has got, he knows what the Clone Wars are. Yeah. ah Which is amazing because we didn't until like, 1990 something. yeah long time after.
00:25:02
Speaker
um So yeah, I think he had the big picture. Yeah. Pretty sure. We'll never know really what he had for 7, 8 9 in his head.
00:25:14
Speaker
yeah I think he had written some of it, but I don't know if any of it's out there. Obviously, we've ended up with what JJ and and Ryan you know yeah came up with. But Yeah, I think he probably had a fairly good idea of the big picture of what he wanted to do.
00:25:31
Speaker
yeah But I'm sure he was also just like coming up with stuff on the fly. like i i know he in his original idea, which he did have in his head, because I think when he wrote the original film, he I've read some of the early bits of it. I've got an amazing like The Making of Star Wars book, like a big coffee table book, and it's got some like screenshots or copies of like his original sketches of scenes and sort of outlines and stuff.
00:25:56
Speaker
And I think he was trying to cram more into that first film yeah like and get to what the end of now, we what we know now as Return of the Jedi, and yeah into the first film.
00:26:07
Speaker
And that they were going to go to the Wookiee planet and the Wookiees were going ones that the Empire were like, you know. invading which we then see in episode three yeah episode three yeah yeah that's back in but then like they but i don't know somebody's idea it was to make them ewoks because they appealed to kids more and um like the marketing possibilities of ewoks are pretty phenomenal which is odd because there aren't like i never had an ewok cuddly oh i did not only what cuddly toy but it was the uh the figure yeah definitely had lots of ewok oh yeah yeah yeah had them
00:26:42
Speaker
And I tried, oh my gosh, I wonder if it's here. I did try and make an Ewok once. Wow. It will be here because my dad's just dropped off a whole load of cuddly toys that belong to me. And I think it is in there. It's like a cross between an Ewok and a Womble. And it's really badly made because I was probably about seven.
00:27:00
Speaker
An Ewomble. Yeah. ah but Yeah, you definitely need to find that. We'll definitely have that on our social media. We've found our social media.
00:27:12
Speaker
Oh, it's ridiculous. But yeah, I was very fond of Ewoks. but i say Yeah, it's interesting because when I was 10, when Jedi came out, so I would have been a bit old for soft toys, although I never have been. And I still have soft toys.
00:27:25
Speaker
um yeah But I don't remember ever having a soft toy Ewok. And what an absolute missing opportunity. Like, how wicked... Like, yeah you know, a ah sort of 18-inch high wicket to cuddle in bed. yeah Come on. That would have been perfect.
00:27:39
Speaker
You probably can get them now if you go looking. But yeah one has never stumbled its way into my life, unfortunately. ah You haven't found one yet. Yeah. But we can come back to it we can come back to you all. We'll come back to that later. We'll come back to that later. So, yeah, rounding back to your question. and It some of the story. Some? Yeah. Okay. But not some of the big details. Yeah. I don't know if he had in mind that Yoda was going to be small and, you know, elf-like yeah, or yeah there there were lots of things i think he still figured out as he went along. Yeah.
00:28:12
Speaker
And he did obviously work with screenwriters as well yeah um after the first one. So they would have had some influence as well? I'm pretty sure, yeah. i think it like The first one was very much his baby. He was doing it on a small budget. Nobody had any expectations. In fact, the expectations were that it was going to be terrible. That it was going to be terrible. um I think it was probably saved. And this is going to lead me on to my next topical conversation. Go on then.
00:28:34
Speaker
Probably saved a bit by Marsha Lucas, who he married. um And she she was one of the later editors. And I think she pulled it together, ah which is really cool. I love that. yeah And John Williams.
00:28:47
Speaker
yeah And in my breakdown that i scribbled notes on as I was watching the film the other night, my third point of note was John effing Williams.
Iconic Soundscapes of Star Wars
00:28:58
Speaker
ah Because I noticed when I put it on the other night and we have like the 20th Century Fox ident at the beginning. yeah And then it's silence and you see a long time ago and out of your way over silence. yeah And then you get that, ah and my mum literally jumped off the sofa.
00:29:15
Speaker
I jump quite often. And and it's designed to, I've heard John Williams himself say it's supposed to make you like, well, where are we? supposed to jump. Wake up. And from that moment, I mean, you know, it's cinema history, isn't it? It's ridiculous. yeah um You're in Are there any any particular bits of the music in and You Hope that you loved? I've got one. Yes. It's amazing. Go on, tell me what you're saying. I've got one too. And I wonder...
00:29:39
Speaker
It'd be funny if it's the same one. It would be funny if it's the same one. I don't know if it will be. Probably not. and my One of my all-time favourite bits is um while they're like right at the end when they when they're off trying to blow up the Death Star...
00:29:55
Speaker
ah It just is so dramatic. It's so intense, isn't it? It's so intense and it's so driving. Yeah. And it's like, but it's kind of, there's loads of random stabs and you don't yeah really know when they're going to happen. yeah And that's kind of like, but yeah and it matches all the chaos that you're kind of seeing. Yeah. And it makes it even more chaotic because,
00:30:15
Speaker
it's less, it's not as chaotic as they then are later yeah you with CGI effects and stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So the movement is coming from the music rather than from the visuals. Yeah.
00:30:26
Speaker
And it's really, really cool because if you look close enough at the visuals, it's just people being shaken around and... in that sense really isn't it but The music is like all over the place. And I was not watching it on a, on a big sound system. I was watching on my laptop, and but I was still like kind of jumping with all the stabs and The like choreography of the editing in the trench run yeah and the music, the way they cut back to the rebel base and the way they cut to Tarkin occasionally. um And then like the internal shots of Vader and the other TIE pilots and Luke and all of Red and Gold Squadron. You're seeing all of those different perspectives of what's going on, but it's so seamless yeah and so intense. yeah
00:31:13
Speaker
And I totally know what you mean. like The way... I don't know whether Williams, at what stage he was scoring it, because I know that edit would have been changing till, I mean, I think as far as the story It's potentially been changed again since, hasn't it? Yeah, lots of times. Yeah, definitely. But even at the time, the story goes, Lucas was in Hollywood somewhere doing yet more last minute edits. And he looked out the window and there was a massive queue of people. And he was like, what they queuing for?
00:31:41
Speaker
And he went out and they were queuing for the first screening at the Chinese Theatre. Yeah. And like, he's still making changes and it's out, you know, which is typical Lucas, very on brand for George. still happening um So I don't know which point Williams would have been scoring that bit, but the music does shift from location to location. Yeah. But it is all like this beautiful segue. Whoever did the sound editing, like the music editing, because that was the job, you know, back then with tape, you know, what? Yep.
00:32:12
Speaker
Yeah, I know exactly the bit. you When Luke is you know he's going down the trench run, Vader's behind him. He's not there yet, but we're getting that junk, junk, junk, junk. And you're thinking, yeah anyway, now, and then it all stops and we get the dreamy flutes and he turns off his targeting computer because he is Obi-Wan. And it's like, we're still not there. It is incredibly well scored. like The pacing of it is brilliant.
00:32:36
Speaker
um My favourite bit, and it always has been, and I've got memories of listening to my vinyl copy that I got for Christmas. Oh, you're seventy seven 77. But unfortunately, my parents didn't quite know what they were buying and they bought me a kind of electronic disco version of the score, which I've still got.
00:32:57
Speaker
And I didn't know, you know, because like I was four, I couldn't really tell the difference. I played it endlessly. Excellent. But it's, yeah, this weird, like, it's not even like the disco. vote There's a definitely a disco version of it. Excellent. There's like typical disco, live ah instruments, live strings and all that.
00:33:14
Speaker
This is electronic. It's like early techno. It must have been way ahead of the curve. Yeah. um And the bit that I listen to the most is called TIE Fighter Attack. And it's as they've escaped the Death Star, they've been let go, basically. They've been let go. And they they come across the four TIE sentry ships.
00:33:33
Speaker
yeah um And Luke and Han run into their, like, the top and the bottom gun turrets. the little gunner pods thing. Yeah, and where the gravity shifts, which I love, that detail. And Leia stays in the cockpit with Chewie.
00:33:45
Speaker
yeah And we get... so good! Like, oh, it's just like magnificent orchestrating, which I know John william Williams isn't necessarily responsible for that.
00:34:03
Speaker
He would have had a team of orchestrators like But the two the themes of it, it's so good. It gives me goosebumps every time. Every single time I watch that scene, I'm just like, this is so good. Nice.
00:34:17
Speaker
i' mean, looking back on that scene, it's ridiculous. It's like four TIE fighters. i mean And to be fair, the script, Leia says, that's that's the only explanation for the ease of our escape, you know, that they're being tracked. And Han's like, well, that was easy. And she's like, have you just seen what we've just escaped from? And they say four TIE fighters. They're rubbish, basically.
00:34:37
Speaker
They've got fleets of Star Destroyers, as we now know. What about sound? TIE fighters! The TIE fighter scream! TIE fighters! Yes.
00:34:49
Speaker
that's the That's the turn the page sound in the book. Oh, yeah. yeah So when you hear the TIE fighter scream, that's when you turn the page. Yeah. It's a wonder I can read a book without it now. but Yeah, yeah.
00:35:02
Speaker
Ben Burtt, I mean, he's yeah the godfather of sound design. Is he the first person credited as being a sound designer? I think so. Yeah. Yeah. I should know this. I think they did. I think you might have told me that, so i think you do know that.
00:35:15
Speaker
Okay. I'm glad one of us is paying attention. and Yeah, I think they invented the the name for him, I think, because he was doing so much more than like your average sound editor. Yeah. Or whatever, Foley artist, you know, he was going so far beyond. yeah I heard there's, by the way, I mean, obviously keep listening to our podcast.
00:35:35
Speaker
um But if you like Star Wars podcasts and you're into sound of music, there's a podcast called Star Wars Music Minute. and Already plugging other podcasts. So. So good. Chrysanthi Tan. she's She's like a music scholar um and she's really into sound. And she breaks down in each episode her podcast, five minutes of a film and talks about all the music and all the sound of it. And she said that Ben Burtt to do this, because this is obviously a long time before digital.
00:36:03
Speaker
yeah And so he I think he was working on like 10 minutes of the film at a time. yeah And he had to like perform that 10 minutes of sound effects with tape machines and yeah mixing desk and effects units like live. There's bits of video out there. I've definitely seen some bits of video of him doing I'd love to see that.
00:36:21
Speaker
I need to find that. I can't remember where I found it, but there's definitely like, it might be him recreating rather than actually doing it Yeah, yeah, yeah. I would imagine it's probably recreating. Yeah, because I think still at that point, everyone thought it was going to be a flop. So nobody would bothering to film.
00:36:36
Speaker
No one was filming. Doing this like pioneering work quietly. Yeah. um ah That can only be how he did it, is just having like various tape machines with different sounds and loops and things queued up and having to do it all live through a mixer yeah into a stereo mix or a mono mix. Which is wild. It's unbelievable. spoiled today. We are. People have no idea, unless you reckon sound, how much we are spoiled now. Like, lining up things, like how we've got like blaster bolt shots, which have to be specifically timed. Lined up. Yeah.
00:37:13
Speaker
I can't even imagine. Yeah. So, yeah. All hail Benvert, the father sound. um I'm sure most of you listening know this already, but there are some brilliant stories of how he came up with the sound. you happen to know how he made the TIE Fighter, for instance? TIE Fighter is a it's an animal of some sort. Is it an elephant? I think it's an elephant. Yeah, I think it's an elephant. Mixed with something. Mixed with something else. And it's like it's kind of a similar process to like convolution reverb, I guess, but different.
00:37:48
Speaker
but Good. that was ah have a master's in sound design. um Just so we're clear. Yeah. ah For the record.
00:38:00
Speaker
For the record. No pun intended. No. That doesn't mean I know what I'm talking about. ah ah It's like a mix of it's a mix of an elephant and something. I've probably got three books over there that would tell you exactly what it is.
00:38:15
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Detailing how he did it. He did some brilliant stuff. Somebody pointed this out to me very, very recently that the lightsaber deactivating is just the reverse of the activating.
00:38:27
Speaker
yay Yeah, yeah. but How did I not know about? I don't actually know what that noise is. I think I have heard, but I've forgotten what the... I don't know what that noise is.
00:38:39
Speaker
The hum is like an overhead projector. Yeah, the hum's a projector and just pointing things at it. a tube, yeah. Directional mic inside a cardboard tube, and you just swing it around in front of the... Which is genius and sounds so good. The blaster bolt sound, which I think is probably my favourite sound effect.
00:38:59
Speaker
Okay. Slinkies. Slinkies. Slinky's... Is it the stretched Slinky? And then you hit one end of it and it goes all the way down.
00:39:09
Speaker
Yeah. I think it's that mixed with something. Mixed with a wrench against a cable that's holding up a telegraph pole. There's a famous photo of him out in the California desert somewhere.
00:39:20
Speaker
And there's like, you know, like a pylon type thing or a telephone mast or something. And it's got those really tight um cables that keep the thing from falling over. And he's just hitting that. in it With a wrench. With a wrench. Yeah. And if you do that, if you take your wrenches out, guys. Don't do that.
00:39:39
Speaker
Don't do that. Very, very dangerous. was um out walking last year and there was kind of a like one of those wire fence, you know, like a deer to keep deer out of farmland or whatever.
00:39:50
Speaker
And I was tapping that with something metal and it wasn't a million miles away. Okay. And I got very distracted. I was trying to vlog at the time and i was holding my little vlog mic next to it making Star Wars sound design out in the field. Yeah.
00:40:05
Speaker
um You wouldn't believe how often on walks I get distracted by tapping things. um I really want to find out more about the alien voices. um i need to do yeah research on that because we've already talked about this earlier. Yeah.
00:40:22
Speaker
I'd not noticed actually until we just had that conversation about how significant those alien voices from Jawas to the Kuvas' squeak to the two Juros having a conversation.
00:40:33
Speaker
like yeah it's unbelievable how many alien voices and some of them are human voices that have been processed. Like how do they make yeah the Jawas? Are they just pitched up?
00:40:44
Speaker
I think the Jawas are pitched up, but they're also, that it's it's kind of, the equivalent is Minions, I think. yes Yeah, yeah. yeah I mean, if we're talking about pitching up, it's almost um Munchkins as well, because that's, I think, how they did the Munchkins. How they the Munchkins.
00:41:00
Speaker
Yeah. gy But then it's the fact that they're like speaking. It's a brilliant delivery. I don't know who does the performance, whether it's Ben Burtt himself or whether he's got other people, voice actors and stuff. don't know. I have a feeling I've heard that he did quite a lot of stuff.
00:41:15
Speaker
A surprising amount. Yeah. Yeah. And like there's a few in the cantina as well that is kind of it's just reversed speech with yeah with some effects on it. yeah it's like yeah You don't really notice it until and until you know what reversed speech sounds like. Yeah.
00:41:30
Speaker
I mean, so many of those things have stood the test of time. like So many things from 70s cinema have not stood the test of time. No. But the sound in Star Wars, and the fact that we've still got like C-3PO's voice and Vader's voice, for instance, are still yeah like are so perfect. And yeah they were done using like analog, literally putting people in boxes and, you know,
00:41:54
Speaker
ah did The basic techniques that we use are just so grounded and so yeah real, which again is part of Lucas's whole philosophy. Everything needs to feel and sound real, unlike most other sci-fi that was out then and kind of it is true of sci-fi now. like since It doesn't have that like lived in realness that Star Wars does. It's keeping it real.
00:42:15
Speaker
What about the ah Wilhelm scream in that one? Oh, yes. Is it in the Death Star, like, canyon, not canyon, shaft, where they're about to, like, Leia's, Leia is, Leia.
00:42:29
Speaker
we We need to talk about Leia because we do need to talk about yeah pretty much the first time we properly see her, she's shooting stormtroopers. Yeah. I mean, she's a badass. um Yeah, so at that point, she's grabbed Luke's blaster pistol and she's just, yeah, firing. The troopers up on the other level, yeah.
00:42:48
Speaker
Up at the top. And one of them one of them does the Wilhelm scream. but So the Wilhelm scream. Is it worth saying what the Wilhelm scream Yeah, I was going to say We know what the Wilhelm scream is. We know what the Wilhelm scream Can't do it probably, but you know.
00:43:00
Speaker
So do you know the story? I know a sort vague version of it. um It's from an old Western film. Yeah. yeah And it's become a meme amongst sound designers. Yeah. It's almost fair to say it's like the first meme yeah of anything. I can't think of anything that's like littered through so many things yeah like so many intellectual properties.
00:43:25
Speaker
Yeah. It's in most eighty s and 90s action films somewhere. Yeah. Yeah. Lots of um video games as well. Yeah. Yes. Yes. shows up in games all the time. I'm pretty sure it'd be safe to say it's probably in all of the Star Wars movies if you listen out carefully. It is. there is It is in every single one. and you Some of them it's really hard to find. yeah Some of them it's in twice.
00:43:47
Speaker
Oh really? oh wow. yeah i youre after like As we do the rewatch now i'm going to have to look out. Yeah, to look out for them. Some of them are really hard. I remember finding all of them bar one and i was like this one is not in this one and then i was like oh it is. Sneaky sneaky. I used a YouTube video though so. Cheating. That's research. We're fine.
00:44:04
Speaker
it's called research refine Yeah. Yeah. So if you want to listen to The Wilhelm Scream, it's a reasonably clear um version of it. It's, yeah, the the first trooper that Leia shoots in the Death Star shaft um while Luke's trying to sort out whatever he's trying to sort out, his belt, he's unrearing. Trying to get the grapple hook thing out. um And she shoots and a trooper falls down and does a spectacular scream.
00:44:30
Speaker
And it's from that Western. Yeah. Yeah. That is The Wilhelm Scream. So is Wilhelm, I wonder, well is Wilhelm the actor? I can't remember. i figure it I think it might be the name of the character, but I can't remember. there is Yeah, I think it's the i think it's the character.
00:44:47
Speaker
yeah And then it's just just so used everywhere. Once you've heard it, you can't unhear it as well. Yeah, it's very distinctive. That's a warning. It's surprising how like how it has to become so interesting when it is so distinctive. Yeah. Yeah. But then it's just become a thing where sound designers will hide it in things and edit it slightly and yeah, try and get away with it. There is another scream.
00:45:12
Speaker
It's a woman's scream. I don't think I've heard it in Star Wars stuff, but it's another one that pops up all over the place. And it's the first place I heard it was time splitters, the PlayStation game.
00:45:24
Speaker
but I heard it so much playing time splitters that now, whenever I hear it, I'm like, Oh, it's that scream again. um Do you know about Diasire? Not sure I'm pronouncing that very well.
00:45:36
Speaker
I don't know. Do I? Diasire is a it's a piece of music. Okay. i think I think it's like Renaissance era music. This is ringing bells. And it's like a theme of death.
00:45:47
Speaker
Yes. And it's been used um multiple times in, again, it's become a meme. Yeah. In fact, maybe Diasire is the first meme. wilhelm The is the second. Okay, the Wilhelm Scream is the second one.
00:46:00
Speaker
About 500 years apart, it's fine. and There is the DSE rate is used when Luke goes to the farmstead. um Yes. Because he figured out that his uncle and aunt are in trouble.
00:46:13
Speaker
and Sadly, worse than in trouble. What a brutal scene. my God. That is really brutal. And he underreacts. Yeah. Yeah. Like that's the biggest underreaction I've ever seen. Yeah.
00:46:26
Speaker
He just kind of turns away. Yeah. And that's... It's an emo Luke.
00:46:33
Speaker
that You've just seen... Your caregivers. It's not that they've just died. You're actually looking... You've just witnessed these charred corpses. It's horrifying. It's horrific. And the music during that has the GSRE theme.
00:46:47
Speaker
John Williams kind of wove it into the theme at that point. I won't sing it because I'm not very good at singing. i I won't because I can't remember it. It goes... did da are they yeah And then he throws what we now call the Force theme. du and and yeah the I mean, I don't think Williams intended that to be the Force theme necessarily, originally. yeah It's just become like ah ubiquitous Star Wars theme. But yeah, now it's often associated.
00:47:17
Speaker
And i think it's in The Force Awakens, I think, when... um Kylo tries to summon the lightsaber yeah from where it was lying and she catches it.
00:47:29
Speaker
Yeah. And the camera like, you know, pushes in on her. And I think we hear that same theme then with the DS era as well, which is completely misplaced because Finn is not dead. Although suppose we're meant to. Yeah. think is spoiler alert by the way if you're listening to this podcast please stop listening if you've not watched at least the main nine Star Wars films because if you've watched at least the main nine then you are up to date with me yes because that's pretty much as far as I've got oh we have some work to do this is my secret reason for doing this podcast just to force me to watch everything to watch all of it
00:48:12
Speaker
um Yeah, I've watched everything, almost everything with Ewan McGregor in it. Let's go. this Talking of Kenobi, also wanted to like another favourite moment is Hello There.
00:48:26
Speaker
The first yeah Hello There, which has now become Obi-Wan's catchphrase. Yeah. To the point where if they do it one more time, think it'll be too much.
00:48:36
Speaker
Too much. It was perfect in the series of Obi-Wan Kenobi. Isn't that how he ended? I'm not sure. of that was that's how he i think that's how he ends it, yeah. um yeah I particularly love the general Grievous hello there. um But yeah, Alec Guinness. mean, I think Alec Guinness, having those actors in, I think were the only real kind of insurance that Lucas had that this had any chance of being a hit. Yeah, yeah. It was because he had Peter Cushing, who's lesser known, still a famous actor in the UK, certainly.
00:49:07
Speaker
And then Guinness, who was, you know, a Shakespearean icon. Yeah, yeah. Just absolutely. But he didn't really know what he was doing, did he? I think he did, but he just he didn't really it. He didn't what was... known i think you he knew I think he knew enough to know how to be that character.
00:49:24
Speaker
Yeah. But I don't think he was interested. i think he was just doing it as a job kind of thing. I love him, though. I do. And what I love is that he did come back and play Obi-Wan again two more times, which he you know he could have got Lucas to write around that.
00:49:40
Speaker
um Yeah, yeah. i mean, when we hear in at the end of a New Hope, we hear Obi-Wan's voice and we don't see him. Yeah. So Lucas could have continued to do that and just done a bit of like because of a voiceover job or something. But for him to come back and do all the, you know, the ghost Obi-Wan was awesome. Yeah.
00:49:57
Speaker
he He does bring so much to the film.
Dueling Dynamics Across Films
00:50:01
Speaker
like He's my favorite. I love him. So much. Yeah. Yeah. Either Alec Guinness or Ewan, you know, they're both, I think they're both great Obi-Wans.
00:50:10
Speaker
And James Arnold Taylor as well in the Clone Wars, all three of them. Yeah. but I heard actually on, i think it Pod of Rebellion, another Star Wars podcast about Star Wars Rebels. Stop plugging the podcast.
00:50:21
Speaker
Yeah. James Arnold Taylor, I think, has played Obi-Wan, can't remember the percent, but it's considerably more than either Alec Guinness or Ewan McGregor put together, but just from the sheer amount of episodes of Clone Wars there are. that he's in yeah So he's really made that character part of his own as well, which I kind of love. the and Yeah, yeah.
00:50:44
Speaker
ah That's another one of my favourite moments. It was like the lightsaber battle between Darth Vader and Obi-Wan. And Obi-Wan just does a little twirl at one point, no apparent reason. He just kind of vaguely spins around. And it's just like, I suppose the the backstory to this is that I watched Revenge of the Sith very recently as well. I'm just overlaying those battles. Compare and contrast.
00:51:11
Speaker
It's only 20 years apart. apart. He just does a little twirl. But then also he gives up so fast. Well, doesn't give up, but he he knows that it's time for him to go. Yeah, I think there's probably multiple reasons for that. he's I think he's reintroduced Luke and Leia.
00:51:29
Speaker
Yeah. And in hindsight, I mean, I don't think Lucas knew that at the time, but in hindsight, like he probably knew it was safer for him to die. as somebody who knew in the jaws of the Empire, you know where he was at that particular point, knowing how difficult it was going to be for him to get out of that.
00:51:44
Speaker
yeah um And also, I think he knew he probably couldn't beat Anakin at that point. yeah Conversely, I was a bit more startled at how physical a fight it was.
00:51:55
Speaker
yeah like In my memory, they just stand there facing each other and you know move their lightsabers back and forth. yeah But there is a fair amount of movement There is a movement. Yeah, there's a lot of movement. It was just the twirl. Cracked me up. Yeah, it's quite funny.
00:52:08
Speaker
And like you say, like comparing and contrasting with Ranger of the Sith, which is the most like intricately choreographed, over the top. physical prowess of the lightsaber duel.
00:52:19
Speaker
Yeah. and Yeah. I think we should check in with lightsaber duels as we watch future things. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Just keep going. We'll track the lightsaber duel and see how it evolves. See how this goes. See how ridiculous.
00:52:31
Speaker
um Did you have any other light questions or? Yeah. Where are all the safety rails in the Death Star? Safety rails. I wrote down safety rails. I think. Did you? Yeah. And I think it is a thing I've heard people talking about in other podcasts. There are no safety rails in Star Wars. There's no safety rails ever. And it's so dangerous. They've got these massive gaping holes in their space station. Yes. yeah no They must be losing troopers all the time. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. And the other... There was something else related to that was not quite related.
00:53:05
Speaker
But stormtroopers in general, What? um there's a line right at the beginning and Obi-Wan says, only Imperial stormtroopers are that precise. Right, okay. i I have thoughts on this.
00:53:21
Speaker
um Right. And I can't remember which podcast it was on, possibly Pod of Rebellion again. ah Recently they were talking about this, the the fallacy that stormtroopers are not accurate. okay.
00:53:33
Speaker
And how do they compare to clone troopers, which is very difficult to gauge because most of the clone action we've seen is in animated series, which is like there's a mind boggling amount of ah clone shooting droids. um Apparently, statistically, stormtroopers are considerably more accurate than human soldiers in actual military combat in in the world.
00:53:54
Speaker
Right. Yeah, there's somebody's tracked it, of course. um Of course. I can't remember what the percentage is, but it's something like they they have a reasonably good percentage rate of hit hitting off targets. Okay. um yeah Yeah, I don't know where the illusion that they were so terrible at shooting came from.
00:54:13
Speaker
I mean, yeah, they miss a lot, but soldiers generally do. like It is actually quite hard to hit somebody in the heat of battle at long distance. Yeah. Maybe with Jawas, that's why they were so accurate.
00:54:25
Speaker
They were shooting up the the sand crawler in the context of that line, Obi-Wan's line there. Yeah. Yeah, but I think they are not as bad as the kind As we've led to believe. The zeitgeist has led us to believe, yeah.
00:54:39
Speaker
i'm giving I'm going to stand up for the troopers. You're standing up for them. but i I personally don't think as accurate as clone troopers. No. But they've probably got harder targets because clone troopers were generally fighting battle droids.
00:54:51
Speaker
Yeah. They're not the smartest of opponents. So, again, I guess that's something we should track. Like, let's watch the Okay, we'll track the... I have to admit, they weren't great in the Death Star Shaft. They didn't manage to hit Luke or Leia once. They were terrible. They were pretty bad, yeah.
00:55:08
Speaker
And running after Han, yeah, not really. And Leia shot three of them. Yes. that that To me, that speaks more to Leia's prowess as a warrior than taking away from Stormtroopers.
00:55:23
Speaker
All right, okay. um But we will track that. I'll take that on board as ah as a thing that we need to... Okay. Watch out for that. Watch out for that and safety rails. No, there's never any never safety rails. I think in Mandalorian season three, I think they made a bit of a joke about that almost. um Okay.
00:55:41
Speaker
Or is it season two? Somewhere in the Mandalorian, there's a very similar looking control unit that's out above a shaft. Yeah. and it's equally ridiculous how narrow the walkway is. Now there's Completely unsafe.
00:55:54
Speaker
I think the Empire were just so specific about saving money. You know, limited resources. Or they were all about the aesthetics. Yeah, yeah. Those hard, cold grey lines. Yeah, yeah. All about the really imperial aesthetics and no safety. Safety goes out the window.
00:56:13
Speaker
No one's ever wearing any high-vis. I feel like there probably should be more high-vis. Yeah. I mean, troopers white, to be fair. Yeah. That's true. But so is so much of the background. It's true. They can easily disappear. Okay, last thing. My last question for you is... Do you have any more questions or thoughts before i do have some more questions.
00:56:37
Speaker
One of the things I wanted to know was I'll ask you that one later. I think that one will come up again. if you Yeah. Okay. That's cool. Yeah. Sand people, Tusken Raiders.
00:56:49
Speaker
Yeah. How do I know that that's what they're called? And I think we hear both names in the film. Do we? Yeah. I didn't hear Tusken Raiders once, but maybe I wasn't paying attention. Yeah, I'm pretty sure we do hear both.
00:57:01
Speaker
And I actually wrote this down as well. Note number 42, Tuscans Sand People on Bantha. is another and And there's a very similar related topic as well.
00:57:13
Speaker
I love that they have two names. Because on a planet like Tatooine, there's going to be colloquial names. There's going to be more official names. it depends who you speak to. I love that they have multiple names. um Yeah.
00:57:26
Speaker
I think Luke might say both, maybe. Something we need to double check, I guess. Yeah, yeah. i think I think he only ever refers to them as sand people. yeah I then ended up going down a bit of a, what's this kind of space racism thing that's going on with them? Yeah. And then also...
00:57:44
Speaker
Because there's a lot. Yeah. And then they they were something also that I found really, really scary. And then do we ever know what they look like underneath their hoods? Not yet. what they look like Not yet. Not yet. You've not watched Book of Boba Fett, have you?
00:57:57
Speaker
No. I haven't finished The Mandalorian. I'm going honest. Yeah. Watch. I mean, watch it in a like if you're watching in season one, season two Mando, then watch Book of Boba Fett. because it's very much a continuous story. Yeah.
00:58:08
Speaker
And the first two or three episodes of the Book of Boba Fett go deep into Sand People, Tuscan lore. It's really awesome. And it's implied, I think, um that Tatooine was once a water planet.
00:58:23
Speaker
Oh. And yeah, it goes into a lot about like... Tuscan communities and how they work, and it looks at them in a way more sympathetic way. Right. In that they are kind of like you know indigenous people.
00:58:40
Speaker
but I think the the kind of law is that they're indigenous Tatooine and everybody else is an off-worlder that's come and settled there. Yeah. And they're you know just desperately trying to eke out ah kind of um a life from the hard desert waste. um But yeah, I think there is a bit of sympathy. I think even in the prequels, he clearly didn't get that far in A New Hope and that's the only time we see them in the original trilogy. like yeah um But definitely in the prequels there's more about like the the whole kind of Anakin slaughtering.
00:59:16
Speaker
It's quite brutal and it's quite brutally shot. And I mean, it's not nice what they were doing to Shmi as we'll discuss probably when we get there. But um it was a different insight into Tuscan life.
00:59:30
Speaker
yeah But definitely yeah Book Boba Fett And the Mandalorian himself has a bit of a relationship with them too. Okay. So they are portrayed in the Star Wars universe in a different way as we move- As we move through. Into the 21st century and Disney and everything else, which is kind of cool.
00:59:47
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. The other related thing I i was going to refer to is their weapon, the gaffy stick. Yes. Which I remember when I first read about them in the various like books I would have had.
01:00:00
Speaker
at age five um as Gadify, G-A-D-E-R-F-I-I, I think. Okay. That's how it's spelled, which is another name for a gaffy stick. So again, it's like they're giving it like almost a technical name and then what the... And then they've got a... So maybe like Sand People is what the off-worlders call them and the Tuscans are what they yeah refer to themselves as or people who respect them. I'm sure Kenobi refers to them as Tusken Raiders.
01:00:24
Speaker
at one point at some point yeah but then they're calling them raiders which is not yeah very politically nice thing to call them no um although they are but again book of bug effect you kind of find out why like their desperation yeah and their anger having their planet kind of you know populated by off-worlders yeah yeah it's interesting My last observation was was all of Obi-Wan's interactions with Luke about training him and stuff.
Philosophy in Star Wars
01:00:57
Speaker
like that We don't see much of it, yeah and we assume that there's kind of more going on
01:01:02
Speaker
at some point it's a dubious timeline i'm very confused yeah traveling through hyperspace ain't like dustin crops good now we don't really know how long it takes to get from tatooine to alderaan fair amount of time because alderaan i don't think is it's certainly not in the outer rim think it's mid-rim maybe but it's know going to trek Yeah, because then it seems like he seems fairly well trained for what we get to.
01:01:27
Speaker
So I assume there was a little bit more time that we're not seeing. But ah just kind of all of his teachings are like, trust your feelings, use your feelings. And it just felt very unlearning of toxic masculine bullshit. Yeah, yeah.
01:01:43
Speaker
yeah I was like, oh, this is actually quite lovely. Which is lovely. And interesting that then in the prequels, we find out the Jedi were a pretty horrific, yeah toxic group of people people by that point. I mean, that's again being explored in different um media in the Star Wars universe. um At the moment, there's like, you know,
01:02:05
Speaker
going back in time and seeing what they were like 250 years ago and yeah so like how the jedi have changed and it's going to be interesting to see what they do with the new ray movies yeah um and where they take that are they going to be called jedi and like what philosophies is ray going to bring to it yeah she's very detached she's had a bit of time with luke yeah But yeah, it's very interesting. I think Obi-Wan has always been ah good Jedi and he was trained by Qui-Gon.
01:02:31
Speaker
Qui-Gon is like the apex good Jedi. Good Jedi. He's like the Buddha. Yeah, he is very philosophical, much more so than like Mace and Yoda and the rest of them.
01:02:41
Speaker
um yeah So Obi did have a good background. yeah Yeah, it is nice. I think and terms going back to the timeline thing... It's hard to tell. because there's There's one slightly jarring thing in that we cut to Luke practicing with his lightsaber and Obi-Wan's training him.
01:03:00
Speaker
Han comes in and says, you can forget your troubles or your worries about the Imperial. I i remember the exact line. um As though they've just blasted out Mos Eisley.
01:03:12
Speaker
But it does look like Obi-Wan and Luke have been there for ages. yeah So maybe Hans has been in the cockpit for ages faffing about yeah checking systems and repairing things possibly.
01:03:23
Speaker
And then he finally comes in and stumbles upon this, which has been going on for two hours. yeah I remember in the Star Wars role-playing game, there was like a gazetteer that told you how long in light year, don't know if it told you about the light year distances, but it told you how long in hours it would take at one light speed.
01:03:42
Speaker
The Vulcan's like 0.5, like a quicker... so you can get there in half the time. Yeah. And and it was like... quite a lot of hours to get from one place to another. I can't remember anything. have to look them up at some point because I've still got the books.
01:03:54
Speaker
um But it was like 20 hours to get from Tatooine to wherever and yeah so on. So I think they probably did a fair amount. Again, in the radio drama, the audio yeah drama, there's pretty much an entire episode of Obi-Wan teaching Luke okay the different light postures. and yeah yeah It's not as exciting as it sounds, but it's quite a well...
01:04:16
Speaker
created like a bit of audio drama. Right, okay. The noise of the lightsaber moving and Luke's getting more and more like, ah. And Obi-Wan's getting more like, and the fourth position, and the fifth position. It's quite exciting. Yes, radio drama, that incredible thing for battles. Yeah, yes.
01:04:41
Speaker
But yeah, i think Luke's training generally has some iffy timeline factors. Yeah. As we will discover on Empire Strikes Back. um Yes. Which is and kind of a nice place to... ah kind of roll off where we're at.
01:04:57
Speaker
We didn't talk about Leia, but we will have to next term. Yeah, Leia, we see a lot more of Leia. I mean, she's just awesome. She's awesome in this. If it wasn't for Leia, they'd be in the prison block.
01:05:10
Speaker
like yeah There's no way they'd have gotten out of that with without Leia. They'd run out of ideas. They were you know it way past the end of the plan. And Leia's the one that figures out how to get them out, which is get out pretty awesome.
01:05:24
Speaker
yeah Oh, I meant to look at another detail. Sorry, we're on. We're on later on the trash compactor. I meant to look up yeah the piece of metal that Han pulls out of the trash.
01:05:39
Speaker
Oh, this is going to be geeky. Go on. And uses to try and stop the walls from closing. It's like a kind of metal rod with like some like grippy bits on it. Yeah. When you watch Booker Boba Fett. All right.
01:05:52
Speaker
All right. By the time I get there, you'll have told me a lot the about it. Yeah, no, I won't. I'm not going to spoil any book about Apart from to tell you that that particular episode, which I think is episode...
01:06:05
Speaker
five or six. It's called The Return of the Mandalorian. Okay. Boba Fett doesn't appear in the episode at all. In it at all. Yeah. It's my favorite episode of anything in television history. All right.
01:06:21
Speaker
It's so good. Okay. And a tiny part of that is this metal bar from the trash compactor. The metal bar from the trash compactor. All right. We love it. I'll remember that. um So how does A New Hope rank for you, like in the world of Star Wars, of what you've seen so far? like Of what I've seen so far from i mean of all of my experience of it. Yeah.
01:06:43
Speaker
oh i I loved it. i I love how sweet it is. Yeah. It's just quite sweet. It is lovely. It's a lovely film. It's a really lovely film.
01:06:54
Speaker
And so it ranks quite highly, I think, for me. Yeah. And it just feels like it feels like a nice beginning, yeah even though it's the fourth one. Yeah, yeah.
01:07:07
Speaker
I mean, it didn't matter that it... And it wasn't the fourth one originally. It was just not that Star Wars. It wasn't even a number. um yeah It's very wholesome. And I think it's such a beautifully constructed...
01:07:21
Speaker
film and bit of storytelling it' it's really unusual if you can like step out of the whole of star wars and just watch it from outside if you know what i mean yeah like it's really interesting how nothing much happens no for a good long stretch like okay we have the bit at the beginning with like on the tantam before and yeah you know layers that getting the droids off once the droids have gone Nothing really happens then until they blast out of Mos Eisley.
01:07:51
Speaker
yeah like There's a whole lot of farming. whole lot setup. And talking and droid banter. yeah I mean, there's the canteen scene, which is quite cool and everything, but not nothing really happens action-wise. It's a very slow burn opening, which I love.
01:08:08
Speaker
um But once it gets going, it's unrelenting. like and then it's just hard i I'd forgotten the blowing up of the Death Star happened that early on. I was just like, what?
01:08:20
Speaker
Yeah, like our perception of film structure, I mean, not our perception, but film structures have changed considerably. Yeah, yeah. And like what is expected to take a certain amount of time was very different then. Yeah. it'd be interesting to watch it alongside some other 70s, like late mid to late 70s movies um from a similar genre. Yeah.
01:08:41
Speaker
I mean, there's nothing really like it, which is why it was such a standout film, because the other sci-fi that was going on then, some of it was cool, but a lot of it was quite slow and yeah definitely not as intense and rollercoastery as this.
Nostalgia and Star Wars Favorites
01:08:55
Speaker
When did Logan's Run come out? I think about two years before, I think. Okay. I think about 75, maybe 76. I mean, I love Logan's Run. Yeah. Like, it's such an iconic film.
01:09:08
Speaker
That's a bonus episode. Yes. I can't believe you brought that up, actually, because most people are like, have we talked about Logan's Run before? i turn I've only seen it once. Have you?
01:09:20
Speaker
Yeah, we definitely, I've seen it lots of times. I've only seen it once with Ollie. I do do love it. i seem to remember having spoken with one of you about it at some point.
01:09:32
Speaker
I would have regularly brought it up in the past, I'm sure. You probably told us to watch it. I maybe did, yeah. um but It's brilliant, but it's more typical of the rest of the sci-fi. like Structurally, it's quite unusual. and and It's a good one. It is a good one among quite a few that weren't that good.
01:09:55
Speaker
Yeah, but Star Wars was in another galaxy. Another league. Another league. Yeah, it really was. um I have trouble ranking it myself. um I always would say it was my favourite Star Wars.
01:10:06
Speaker
Okay. But some of that is nostalgic. Yeah. It's the Star Wars I've known the most. It's the Star Wars I know the most. Yeah. But... Recently, I've fallen in love with Rebels, which is an animated show. And it's kind of interesting because I've never been that bothered about animation in the past. yeah I mean, I've not disliked it, but it's never been a big thing for me. Like some people get really, really into it.
01:10:28
Speaker
But having watched Rebels through a couple of times now and listening to the podcast that goes with it, I feel like that is my favorite Star Wars. okay Partly because it's very central. There's there's tendrils of rebels in everything.
01:10:44
Speaker
yeah um like it It kind of reaches forward and backwards in time. It's connected to the Clone Wars with Ahsoka. It's connected to the original trilogy in loads of ways with Tarkin and Vader and all that. um yeah It ripples out a lot.
01:11:00
Speaker
um And it's just really good. It's really like crystallized Star Wars. It's got droids and aliens and lightsabers and ships and planets and all of the things that not.
01:11:15
Speaker
It's got Mandalorians. yeah you know is's It's got the Empire. It's got smugglers. It's got pirates. like It's got everything that Star Wars is yeah all in one show, which not everything has all of those things when you actually start looking at it.
01:11:33
Speaker
But i know and New Hope is definitely up there still. I think in terms of films, if someone said you can only watch one more Star Wars film for the rest of your life, it would be that. would be that one. Yeah. Oh, I don't know what I'd pick it was... Oh, that's hard.
01:11:46
Speaker
Well, as we go through, you can see... And I might change my mind. You never know. Well, yeah, you might change my... i I'm re-watching them for the first time in a long time, i think. I'm trying to remember when the last time I...
01:11:58
Speaker
actually sat down and watched them was and it was probably when we did them all one day that was ages ago that was ages ago a long time ago and that is potentially the last time although there might have been a lockdown star wars day but i don't remember much of that yeah it's a stiff but ah blank i've blocked out lockdown ah so wow this is cool i'm glad we're doing this then um okay cool Well, I hope you've enjoyed episode one of yes Sisters of the Force.
01:12:29
Speaker
I have. Good. Have you? Yeah, I've enjoyed it. It's been good fun. I've learned some things. My question was directed at listeners, but I think we should answer that too.
01:12:40
Speaker
Well, I'm also... You've learned some things. Also letting you know. i a Yeah, I think so. Cool. Maybe.
01:12:48
Speaker
And it was just a joy to watch it again this morning. It's so good. i mean, I've been telling people we're doing this podcast and it's like, it's Star Wars and it's podcasting. Two things which I love.
01:12:58
Speaker
And you. Good things. Perfect. Yay. Okay. So thank you for listening. Thank you for listening. Yeah. We'll be back next week with our journey into Empire Strikes Back.
01:13:11
Speaker
ah Which might be my favourite. I don't know. Controversial. Controversial opinion. It's a popular film. It's a very popular one among Star Wars fans. um I can't wait to re-watch it and I can't wait to talk to you about it. Yeah, same. Cool. We'll see you next week.
01:13:28
Speaker
Bye for now. Bye.