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We Are More the Same Than Different with Keenan Crisp
16 Plays7 months ago
A former Paratrooper turned Power Yogi turned Performance Coach, Keenan brings the Yin with the Yang.
Keenan trained & led troops in Australia, Thailand, Malaysia, Singapore and in East Timor.
He later took a five year sabbatical which included touring Europe on a motorcycle for 1 year, living in ashrams in India for 3 years & volunteering for Médecins Sans Frontières (MSF) / Doctors Without Borders for 6 months, where he logistically ran a hospital near the front line of a 10 year conflict in Congo.
On return to Australia Keenan led national & international yoga retreats, teacher trainings & he’s facilitated over 10k hours of philosophy, meditation, breath work & yoga classes to approx. 400-500 students a week for over a decade.
Keenan is a co-owner & master facilitator at Power Living Australia & he is the Founder & CEO of Foundations For Success Coaching.
Rigorously trained as a Certified High-Performance Coach™, Keenan has over the past six years helped hundreds of business leaders & professionals gain clarity, generate energy, increase their productivity, develop influence, demonstrate courage, live purposefully & strive satisfied as Happy Achievers.
Keenan has remained dedicated over the past 20+ years to studying, mastering & sharing the Science of Success.
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Transcript
Keenan's Journey to Coaching
00:00:07
Speaker
Hello, everyone, and welcome to Otterly Positive Talks. And today we got an interesting call coming ahead because I met Keenan Crisp a few weeks ago and we went down a really interesting journey of our view on life and where people are. Keenan is the founder and CEO of Foundations for Success Coaching. He's a former paratrooper turned power yogi.
00:00:37
Speaker
and into a performance coach. Welcome to the show, Kenan. Thanks, Geoff. Good to be here. Yeah, I know we had a great chat offline and I thought this is a man I need to have on utterly positive talks. But I'd like to know just for the listeners' sake, how do you go from being a paratrooper to a performance coach? Yes. Well, I think
00:01:06
Speaker
I think, you know, there was a real first of inquiry, firstly. I think I left the army with an intention to travel. In fact, I took a five-year sabbatical, which I was very fortunate to not have to work for four and a half of those five years. And in that time, I was on a quest for self-knowledge. And I guess in that process of inquiry, I discovered yoga. I fell in love with yoga. I also ended up working
00:01:37
Speaker
the Doctors Without Borders or Médecins Sans Frontières in the Conga. And it was there all providing fantastic medical aid for the people, but we weren't causing the root problem, which was specifically the behaviour, particularly of the men. And so it was there, I thought, well, Yogurt had such a positive impact on helping me. It really helped to balance my beliefs. It really had a whole new set of beliefs and perspectives that really shifted my way of thinking, which therefore shifted
00:02:04
Speaker
what I focused on, which shifted how I behaved, which shifted my results. So I thought, well, the best thing I could do would be to return to India and study more. I made it a full-time study. India became my university of life. I studied yoga, but I studied myself. I studied humanity, studied spirituality, yoga, Ayurveda. And yeah, I think I basically filled my cup.
Yoga and Personal Transformation
00:02:30
Speaker
I was pretty full and realized I'd
00:02:33
Speaker
probably had to head home after three years in India and came back to Australia and was very fortunate enough to team up with an old army friend of mine and he was running a yoga studio and we together co-created and our team co-created 11 very successful yoga studios. I'm still co-owner of three of those today. But somewhere along the way I thought well I was really enjoying delivering mindset work you know about really
00:03:01
Speaker
their behavior but the amount of time that I'd have to really deliver philosophy or mindset work was quite limited in a younger us and that posture of practice. So it was about six or seven years ago now I realized well the best thing I really want to do to be of greater service is to work more one-on-one with people and that sort of led me down the coaching path and I discovered certified high performance coaching and haven't looked back.
Presence and Societal Polarization
00:03:27
Speaker
I've been really
00:03:28
Speaker
in some ways still teaching yoga, but just not calling it yoga. I'm still tapping away and helping people break through their conditioned thinking, which we all have. We all have conditioned minds and helping people reclaim their presence and ultimately with that, their happiness, which I think lays in presence, which is the absence of polarized views per se. So yeah, it's kind of led me to where I am today.
00:03:58
Speaker
Yeah, this is definitely a topical conversation in 2024 where there doesn't seem to be any view that isn't polarizing anymore. The whole world has this black and white kind of mentality. It's either one or the other. There's no room for middle ground anymore.
00:04:26
Speaker
So yeah, just being able to find that makes a lot of sense. I think you're right, Jeff, but I think also there's a big movement. But interestingly enough, that movement aren't so vocal because they're not so polarized. But I think there is a big movement. There is a big awakening. A lot of people are becoming more conscious of connection and recognizing, as we used to say in the army, that opinions are like assholes and everyone's got one.
00:04:55
Speaker
and not necessarily needing to be attached to our opinions because they're just perspectives. And I think a lot of people are getting on board to realize that, well, it's just a perspective and it's not the whole truth. Yeah, you know what? As you were speaking, if I reflect, I think you're spot on. It's the traditional media, social media and
00:05:25
Speaker
the loud minority that gets all the airwaves, but you're right. I'm really active in Web3, but what attracts me to Web3 isn't so much the technology, but there's hundreds of millions of people who gravitated to blockchain, crypto, Web3 because it is a social movement.
00:05:54
Speaker
of making, and a lot of people just believe that there's a kinder, safer, fairer, more peaceful world awaiting for us all. And it just so happened that blockchain was really convenient to latch onto. But you're right, I do see it in a lot of other areas where people are trying to get, especially when you're talking about presence, like getting rid of
00:06:25
Speaker
this external noise and being able to focus on the moment, getting back to nature, all those kinds of things that just lead to a happier life.
Ego and Shared Human Experiences
00:06:36
Speaker
I think that Jeff, there's a lot of people that are still inclined, they want to make a lot of money, they want to make a name for themselves, they want to get some sort of
00:06:49
Speaker
the way to be heard is to create some controversy. And so from that perspective, I think many people taught, as I have been marketing, it's like this idea that if you want to be heard, you've got to take a stand on a polarized perspective, you know, and so you got to raise some controversy and that might get people listening in. So it's tricky for someone like me who chooses not to be polarized. And, you know, yet I still have opinions. Don't get me wrong. I just don't cherish those opinions, but, you know, I still want to be heard
00:07:22
Speaker
successful business at that, but it's tricky when it's hard to take a stand on something when I'm aware that in doing so it is creating a polarized view and there's seven or eight billion of us on this planet and I've really come to recognize that there's eight billion different ways of perceiving reality and perceiving life.
00:07:49
Speaker
What I have noticed, and like yourself, I was lucky enough to be able to travel a fair bit. I've lived in a number of different countries and I've met people from all, every walk of life, social, economic, different cultural backgrounds. And the one thing that I've come to realize is
00:08:17
Speaker
that the distribution curve is incredibly narrow, like in people's viewpoints and what they believe in and what they true, hold true to their hearts. It's, but unfortunately, like you said, like the ones that get the most noise are the ones on the tails. Whereas really you can go to any country in the world and the people are pretty much exactly the same. Everybody, um,
00:08:47
Speaker
Everybody wants to work less. They want to spend more time with their families. They'll do anything for their kids. They love getting around the kitchen table or the dining room table and having a nice meal. All of these things that make us human are the same no matter what country you come from. It's just the loud, extreme minority that makes us believe that we're different.
00:09:17
Speaker
Yeah, it's kind of a sad fact. I agree with you, and I had the same experience traveling. I think I mentioned that to you in a conversation offline. The one thing I really loved about traveling was, yes, I enjoyed the differences, the cultural differences in different countries, but it was seeing the similarities. It was seeing people laughing, it was seeing people crying, it was seeing people
00:09:39
Speaker
being caught up in romance, you know, and all these similarities that made us, it unites us. My teacher says, there's only one cast. He calls it the cast of humanity. He actually, in fact, and I'm also a big advocate of this, he also says, there's only one religion, and it's the religion of love. But all of these other world religions are, you know, have served a certain type of people, a particular location for a particular amount of time.
00:10:06
Speaker
People get carried away in religions as well and polarize their beliefs, even in Christianity, having Catholics and Protestants. And in pretty much every religion, there's breakaway, polarized perspectives and views. And I think that's the quality of the ego. I think the ego loves to live in separation. The ego loves to be unique, special, different.
00:10:31
Speaker
And you see that when you travel, there's, you know, people, you know, having various tattoos or markings or piercings or haircuts and clothes and fashions and what have you, trying
Oneness and Universal Consciousness
00:10:42
Speaker
to look different from everyone else. And I think that at the end of the day, it doesn't matter how hard we try, at the end of the day, we're all connected to the same source. We're all one on the same. And I mean, this is obviously talking much bigger picture, but I think
00:10:57
Speaker
It's like Kao Yong said, you know, that those islands may appear separate from above the surface level. If you look below the surface level, it's just one landmass. And likewise, though we may appear to be individual separate consciousnesses, you know, if we get to the heart of it, and I've been fortunate to have met a lot of really awakened conscious people, you know, like Claire Voines and psychics who have been able to know things about me that no one should have known.
00:11:27
Speaker
made me realize that there's one consciousness, and they're tapped into that. There are a lot of people that are tapped into that. They can tell you your past, your future, and they know everything about you, and it's mind-blowing. How do they know that? And I think that's just because they're in tune with something much deeper than the egoic self, which is the delusional notion of self being separate from the whole, whereas we're all parts of the same whole. Yeah, and I think they're very good at
00:11:57
Speaker
predicting probabilities because we aren't that different. I find that when people travel, one of the common things we hear is they'll go to whatever country, doesn't matter what country somebody will go to visit, and they'll always come back and the first thing they'll say is, so how was it? Well, the first thing they'll either
00:12:25
Speaker
say the weather was greater, they'll bitch about the weather. And then the next phrase will be, and the people were so nice and which, which is probably true, but I have this theory that everybody perceives someone in another country or another location as super nice if they are just the, the, just being nice because everybody has this,
00:12:53
Speaker
or a lot of people and most people have this beaten in ingrained idea that when they go somewhere else, that these people are going to be so much different. And when they turn out to be just the same and just as helpful and just as nice as they would in your own neighborhood, then because people were expecting the worst, they're now surprised.
Compassion in Adversity
00:13:20
Speaker
Oh, were they ever helpful? Were they ever friendly?
00:13:23
Speaker
Um, you know, I remember going, I was driving from, from Canada where I'm from down to Florida on spring break with a bunch of mates and our car broke down and in, in Georgia. And at that point I hadn't had a lot of experience in the States. All I heard was on the news and whatever. And so it's the middle of the night and we're standing on the, sitting on the side of the road.
00:13:53
Speaker
And a bunch of bikers, uh, showed up and they stopped. They, um, you know, we didn't know what to take of it. A bunch of 19 year olds and we're just like, okay, well, this'll be interesting. And all they did was they got off their bikes. They fixed our car, got it going again, said goodbye and put us, and we went on our way. And in the car, we're like, geez, those bikers were really nice because we had it in our head that
00:14:20
Speaker
that somehow they weren't human and that they were going to whatever, and somehow because we're in the rural US or something like that, that somehow they're not going to be normal human beings, but they were. And that's been my experience no matter what country I've been to, no matter what the situation. Yeah, I agree. People have just been nice. I think innately it's now...
00:14:47
Speaker
It's like there's a word in India, they call it, three words in fact, they say satyam shivam sunnam. It means truth, beauty and goodness. And that's our innate nature is one of truth, beauty and goodness. And I think there is an innate goodness in everyone. You know, when I was in Tanzania, I got mugged by six guys, they threw me into a car, but a long story won't go into how I got there.
00:15:14
Speaker
they threw me in your car and took me off and they wanted to rob me, of course. I just took the path of surrender and not anger, not fear, but I took the path of surrender to whatever may happen. I actually was able to even feel love for these guys strangely enough. I don't know how I did it, but I did. Sure enough, we went to
00:15:38
Speaker
four or five banks in a row and I put my ATM card in there and each time it just said, sorry, no funds available at this time. And they're like, you're messing with us. And I'm like, if I was trying to mess with you, it would say, incorrect pin. But I'm not messing with you. It's just obvious God doesn't want you to rob me right now.
00:15:55
Speaker
And that kind of struck the guy, and he's like, hmm. And he said, because they're pious, I think. I do believe they were refugees. And at the end of it, I actually had 50 euros in my belt, so I gave it to him.
00:16:09
Speaker
And I said, I'm going to give this to them as an act of forgiveness. I'm going to forgive them for that. And I realized that, as I've come to know throughout the world, is that when people are difficult, when people are being dickheads, it's generally they're the ones that are suffering the most. And they don't need me to be a dickhead back to them. They need compassion. And so I offered them compassion. And sure enough, they ended up dropping me just close by to my hotel. And all I wanted to do was go and check the thought of the day from my teacher on the internet. And I had no money because I gave them everything.
00:16:39
Speaker
And I'm like, listen, I just want to go and check the internet. Have you got a dollar? And the guy reached his hand to his pocket and he was like looking for a dollar. And then he kind of realized, I don't have a ticket, I'm robbing you. No, no, no, I don't have it. But you know, it's like, I know that even in these guys who are doing the wrong thing, you know, I still know that there was, there's goodness inside them and there's goodness inside of everyone. And it's just learning to be able to draw that out of people. And, you know, of course, as foreigners, when you go to a
00:17:09
Speaker
foreign land somewhere where money isn't so hot and so available. If you go to Asian countries, even in India in many ways, you're like a target and you attract some bad people. But if you manage to connect with those bad people, it turns out that they're actually good people, but they're just good people that are suffering.
00:17:33
Speaker
And, uh, it's, yeah, it's an interesting, it's yeah. And one of the things that, um, as Western countries in that, and if we wanted to stop all that kind of behavior, um, let's, let's, let's start looking at the source, desperate people in any country, in any culture, if you're just trying to feed your kids, you're going to do things.
00:18:02
Speaker
that you normally wouldn't. That's the whole point. I had a similar experience in Korea where there's an unfortunate practice. It's not widespread, but it's enough of a problem that it should be addressed. There are Koreans who will hire people from Africa and bring them over on a contract
00:18:31
Speaker
hide their passport or confiscate their passport and then they can't leave because the passport will expire or their visa will expire and so now they're stuck. We got to know this one, he was a really nice guy from Nigeria.
Cultural Perspectives and Unity
00:18:53
Speaker
He was in big trouble so he said, why don't you stay with me and my mate?
00:19:02
Speaker
And then he did, and he was there for about a week. And then about a week later, after he moved in, and I know it would have killed this, this fella, but he, he ended up leaving with about $2,000 and our passports, uh, because, and the next time I went to the airport, they basically got told, Oh, you're already left the country. Um, so, so he managed to use my passport.
00:19:32
Speaker
to get out and go home. So at that moment, I actually smiled to myself that I know, like the irony is if he had asked me, I probably would have gave him my passport. So I said, yeah, if it means you can get home to your family, yeah, here, take it. I'll wait till you're gone and then I'll go and report it lost or whatever. I probably shouldn't say that on a recording, but I would have helped him out.
00:20:02
Speaker
But I know it, I know it would have killed him that he was betraying us. But he's desperate. And I think to myself, what would I do if I was stuck in a place where I couldn't go home, couldn't see my family, couldn't, I can't feed my child? Like, you know, if I... Yeah, you know, Justin, I think purely the root problem
00:20:29
Speaker
And in fact, they have a teaching in this, in Yoga Sutra, as they say, there's five causes of suffering. And the root cause of all suffering, fundamental cause of all the issues that we have fundamentally, is called ignorance. Ignorance. And from ignorance comes ego.
00:20:48
Speaker
And, but it's the ignorance, obviously the opposite of ignorance is wisdom, right? And so it's ignorance, it's this perspective that it's like, I often use this example. You know, if someone bites their tongue, I'm like, did you, did you punch your teeth? And they're like, what? I'm like, did you punch your teeth? Because they, your teeth beat your tongue. Did you punch them out? And I'm like, well, you know, like people, you might hit someone else because they, they, they hit you.
00:21:19
Speaker
you know, or they hit your friend and so you go and punch them, but you won't punch your own teeth. Why not? It's because your teeth are part of you, right? So of course you're not going to punch your teeth there. But then if we start to recognise that everyone's a part of ourselves, we're all part of one, we're all part of a whole, we're the human race, if you want to call it, but even the animals, all of us are part of a collective consciousness. And I think it's the, you know, like world religions talk of this.
00:21:49
Speaker
Some people call themselves religious, but just don't practice their religion, or they talk the talk, but don't walk the walk. Understandably, they haven't had enough insight, maybe they haven't inquired, they haven't gone deeper enough, but I don't think it takes much. Certainly, I had deep insight through my inquiry. I had experience. I had literally miracles manifest that just
00:22:13
Speaker
It was enough to shake up the whole notion of separation, that I'm separate from you. And, you know, back to that idea of the guy that's suffering. It's like I literally did. I met a dickhead when I was in Nepal. It was a real dickhead. And I started giving it back to him and that was the first time I realized, hold on T, this guy's really suffering. Why would I be giving it back to him?
00:22:37
Speaker
I don't need to be more like harder on him. And since then I just call that the dickhead theory that I teach my children that as well. If someone's being difficult to you, someone's being a dickhead, just know that they're suffering and give them compassion. But it's like, well, how do I give someone compassion when I think they're a dickhead and I think they're separate from me? And so it doesn't take much to see that we're all made of the same stuff. We're all our bodies. If you want to consider yourself the body, we're all made of carbon and nitrogen.
00:23:05
Speaker
you know, and oxygen and the other elements were all made of the same stuff, a collection of stardust. But yet, still to this day, people live in separation. And, you know, people do focus on the differences and, you know, like another quick story if I may, but when I worked in Congo, I actually witnessed after 10 years of fighting, two armies come together. Because after 10 years, they sat and realized that actually we're of the same tribe.
00:23:33
Speaker
Because in Africa, in many parts of Africa, they are more racist than many other parts of the world. You might have a different shaped nose. Your tribe might have a different shaped forehead. And you're different. And there's a lot of racism based on that. But when these guys realize, actually, we're of the same tribe, why are we fighting? We need to connect and make peace. And they did. It was mind blowing to see that.
00:23:59
Speaker
But I think we all need to, you know, and it's really tricky to step back and see all the war that's happening at the moment and the chaos in the world. And it's so much of this us and them business, you know, focusing on the differences, rather than focusing on the unity, rather than focusing on what we all have in common, which layman's language could be simply, we all want to be happy and we all
00:24:25
Speaker
what can we do? What can each and every one of us do to help bring about this piece? And I think fundamentally the answer to that question is just make ourselves peaceful, make ourselves loved. It's correct.
Personal Peace and Broader Impact
00:24:41
Speaker
It is absolutely crazy how, I always say that, like, I don't know how to like, kind of how I phrase it is,
00:24:56
Speaker
as individuals were amazing, as groups were ridiculous. Because you'll have people who will go out of their way to help their neighbor who maybe is a different religion or a different culture or whatever and be best friends with them. But then the next day, they'll see on the news how all Muslims are terrorists and they'll go, yeah, yeah, oh, I agree with that. Oh, yeah, I can see that.
00:25:25
Speaker
Your neighbor that you just had a barbecue with isn't Muslim. You work with 50 Muslims. And it's amazing how we don't make that connection. But yet, if a child is crying or whatever, it doesn't matter who they're from or whatever, we'll try to help. And so individually, you just meet people who are so awesome and then
00:25:53
Speaker
But then as a collective, we make these ridiculous categorical... Us and them. Yeah, us and them. It's just... It's an interesting... It's interesting how people just do that. It's crazy. I noticed the first time I really noticed this was I bought a motorcycle.
00:26:21
Speaker
And, you know, when you're on a motorcycle, people start like nodding at you, like waving at you with the head, like when you drive past, like, because we are the motorcyclists, we're not a car. But then, then you drive past a Harley Davidson, because I'm on a jet bike, you drive past a Harley Davidson, no, no, no, no, no, they won't give you the nod. You know, because it's like, no, it's us and them.
00:26:47
Speaker
We've got the American ride, we've got the jet bike, you know? And so it is, it's evident throughout. It is a quality of the ego to perceive differences, to see the differences in others and put yourself in a category of us and them. But bringing back to your idea of, you know,
00:27:06
Speaker
goodness in the individual, but in the collective, it can be challenging. I think it does start with the individual. You know, like my teacher would say, if you want peace in the world, you must first find peace in the individual. If there's peace in the individual, there'll be peace in the family. If there's peace in the family, there'll be peace in your community. If there's peace in the community, there'll be peace in the country. If there's peace in the country, there'll be peace in the world, but it starts with the individual.
00:27:32
Speaker
And that's why, you know, a lot of people, I remember sitting in a Buddhist monastery in Sri Lanka meditating and we had this woman came through and we'd practice silence all day long until the evening, we'd chat for an hour and she's like, what are you guys doing? You know, like you're just sitting here doing nothing. You could be out there helping people. And the monk at the time, he was like, well, listen, this is our way of helping people by making ourselves quiet and making ourselves peaceful.
00:28:01
Speaker
This is our contribution to the world. And, you know, different strokes for different folks, as they say, different horses for different courses. Some people choose to be observed, some people choose to be quiet meditators. But I think the reality is, is if we focus on removing the ignorance of our own delusional notions, and that's not hard. It's just by realizing that, you know, your mind is a product of conditioning. You're just echoing, you're parroting what you've been told.
00:28:30
Speaker
So how do you know that what they've told you is truth? There may be some relative truth to what they're saying, but we have to understand the difference between relative truth and absolute truth. Relative truth is relatively true to you, but may not be relatively true to me, so it's not absolute truth. And as we start to let go of all these relative truths, or what I'd like to call conclusions, one of my number one teachings I'd say is the thing I'm most passionate about sharing is to have people question their conclusions.
00:29:01
Speaker
question your conclusions because when you say, this is the way it is, you're locking something down. It's imprisoning your mind. And so if you can open that up and you go, well, I'm not sure. It is what it is rather than labeling it as good or bad, rather than being polarized. It is what it is. When we say it's terrible, you say, well, is that true? Is it not true? Or are you wondering if that's true? No, no, it's absolutely terrible. So I'd often say, well, just sit with it for three days and tell me in three days time if anything good comes from it.
00:29:29
Speaker
And often people will come back and say, you're right, something good came from that. So, okay, so it wasn't terrible. It was an opportunity, you know, but it's tricky. And the work begins with each and every one of us. That's where it must start. A lot of people try to change the outside, whereas really we've got to focus on looking at our own, you know, concepts and beliefs and conclusions and opinions that we're so attached to.
00:29:57
Speaker
our us and them, our ideas of separation. And it is ingrained in us. I know when I went to Congo, I'd grown up on the northern beaches of Sydney, so I didn't really see any Africans. I may have seen the occasional Asian at the time when I was young. There wasn't many Asians. And so when I went to Africa, I saw black men. That's what I saw. And then after about three or four days, something
00:30:31
Speaker
I saw the human. I saw what we had in common. We're the same. We've just got different colored skin. You know? Yeah. No, it's a, it's, it's, it's a shame that it's a shame that we can't have the, um, the, the us component, which, which is, is a wonderful feeling to feel like you belong, um, and, and be a part of something without
00:31:02
Speaker
the negative of just because I like something, I have to, I have to, there has to be the yin to the yang where I now have to hate something. Um, like I'm, I'm a big music fan. And when I was in high school and growing up, if, if it wasn't classic rocker metal, then you were an idiot. And, but now as I've gotten older, I still love that stuff. Uh, but.
00:31:30
Speaker
Now I'm a big country music fan. I really like a lot of hip hop. I like a lot of R&B and jazz and I've really widened my spectrum. And as a result, now my enjoyment of music is a lot greater. So I've learned that you can like something without hating something else. Is it okay for me to like classical?
00:31:58
Speaker
Yeah, of course. This is the point, whereas when I was a kid, you know, I thought my father was a ratbag for just liking classical, you know, and it was us and them, it was my music versus his music. But I think this is the point is that, like, I think there is the yin and the yang. There is, there are opposing opposites in everything in the universe, there's an opposing opposite. But there's also, as you know, in the yin and yang symbol, there's a little bit of dark in the white and there's a little bit of white and dark.
00:32:27
Speaker
And it's that ability to accept other people's perspectives, to accept other people's opinions. Not have to right them, not have to wrong them, but to rather just say, well, okay, that's cool. That's your perspective. That's your flavour. That's what you prefer. That's cool. I respect that. But yet today, there's this, again, there's this ignorance, which is, no, no, your
00:32:59
Speaker
And the sad irony is most of the time when people are arguing, if you step back with an unbiased and watch the argument from an unbiased state, you realize that both parties are saying roughly the same thing and want to achieve the same goal. They might have just slightly different versions of how to get to that goal.
00:33:25
Speaker
But essentially they're saying the same thing and and I I found that in my life is that Most people yeah, most people don't want to hurt others most people want everybody to have a fair chance most people don't like violence most people and and and and just want to be happy and be left alone and enjoy their their their time on the earth and but yet we're drawn into these incredible arguments of
00:33:56
Speaker
where we're really all just saying the same thing, a perfect example. I don't know if it's it's on TV here in Australia, but it's like it's been on ESPN, I think now for 20 years, which is they have a show called Pardon Pardon the Interruption. And the two hosts will yell at each other for a half an hour of their opinions around sport. And they will be yelling at each other
00:34:25
Speaker
saying the exact same thing, but it gets views. But it's this whole idea of just, I have to be so right that even when you're saying I'm right, I have to still keep yelling. Ego lives in right and wrong. Yeah, and it's brutal. That's the ego. So the ego lives in polarities. I don't know how much they do it anymore, but when I was growing up,
00:34:55
Speaker
There was always the debating club. And that was a big part of school was, you know, learn how to debate and and you have to polarizing opinions and you had to argue what an absolute what an absolutely stupid thing to teach a child that it's like because the reality with most situations,
Political Systems and Division
00:35:18
Speaker
if people remove their like that, I have to win.
00:35:25
Speaker
In most cases, somebody will deliver point A, somebody else will counter with point B, and after a conversation somewhere around C, they'll meet and realize, actually, this is the best path forward if you just remove that need to be right. I think the lesson drawn from debating, like,
00:35:55
Speaker
I think the way I look at it is an opportunity to see that you could be on team A or team B, and you could be asked, okay, well now I want you to argue from position team A, and then they could also say, well now I want you to argue from position point B, and you could find an argument on either side.
00:36:14
Speaker
Right. So my hope is then that would help people go, okay, there are two sides to the coin. There are two different perspectives. And though I may want to debate this, the last thing I want to do is cherish my opinion to be attached to my perspective, because I'm just offering a perspective. But yeah, it's an interesting thing. That's right. And you see it in
00:36:43
Speaker
Throughout, we're in Australia, it's a two-party system, essentially, the whole idea of a ruling party and the opposition. It's so flawed. It's sad to see politicians going at each other all the time. Where's the unity? Yeah, there's no discussion of let's try to get to the best outcome for Australia, and Canada is the same, US is really bad right now.
00:37:13
Speaker
Uh, but all most democratic countries, um, are in that situation where, um, there's this, this need to maintain power without. And as a result, you can't give an inch on either side to actually come to an agreement of what's in the best interest of, of the people. Um, so, but that's, yeah. And, but again, this, all of these things, which goes back to our original point is.
00:37:43
Speaker
This exists in every country, which again, just highlights the fact of how we're all the same, trying to achieve the same, the same outcomes. And also we see that ego, again, I just bring it back to this idea that ignorance, which creates ego and ego is delusional notions. So all I look at is if ego isn't confidence and boisterous, as many people would say, Oh, look, he's very egoic. He's very loud.
00:38:11
Speaker
No, ego is when you're attached to these delusional notions of yourself or even just, you know, polarize beliefs and no, no, this is the way and everyone else is wrong. I think, you know, I don't like the word argument. I think sharing perspectives is important. I think we need to be able to share different perspectives, but not to be attached to them. And yeah, how, what do we do then when we need to make a decision? How do we, how do we judge? Well, that's where democracy comes in, right? We vote.
00:38:39
Speaker
we decide whose perspective is most nourishing, you know? Whereas when it turns into an argument, and I hope this doesn't go off topic too much, but it's something I'd like to leave your audience with, you know, is this idea that typically if you find yourself arguing with somebody, really what you're trying to do is you're trying to get the other person to change what they've said or done so you can feel better about yourself.
Validation and Self-Worth
00:39:04
Speaker
And that is a delusional
00:39:06
Speaker
It's a delusional idea to think that if you get them to change what they've said or done, you're going to feel better. The only way you're going to feel better about yourself is if you have better beliefs about yourself. You know, if you have a high self-esteem or sense of self-worth. But that's what arguments are. You know, literally, a couple of years ago now I was having an
00:39:24
Speaker
And I caught myself realize this is what I was doing. And I said to her, I know, I'm just trying to get you to change what you've said so I can feel better about myself. She was like, well, why are you doing that? I don't know. You know, it is this product of ego. Ego lives in separation. But if we move beyond ego, it's like if we use the cross as an analogy, cross the eye to eliminate the ego.
00:39:54
Speaker
you'll be left with unity. It brings to mind one of my favorite quotes, which is the problem with the world today is that ignorant people are full of confidence and intelligent people full of doubt. And another quote I heard recently in a valedictorian speech was
00:40:23
Speaker
or commencement speech was the speaker. He said one thing from his career that he noticed was the quietest person in the room is most likely the most intelligent person in the room. And I just like that. Like people who are willing to just sit there and listen and
00:40:53
Speaker
formulate an opinion based on the information provided to them, take the time to contemplate it and then voice their own opinion once all the facts have been shared and contemplated. It's a rarity. It's actually one of the big reasons I had to get out of the corporate world is I did fine because
00:41:23
Speaker
But what bothered me was how often you were expected to speak without thought or taking the time because there wasn't enough room, there wasn't enough time in the room with all the other voices that were going to be able to contemplate what others were saying and to really
00:41:50
Speaker
think about what, how do I really feel about this? And what do I really think and what is the best course of action? And so, um, yeah, it's just not a, I, I prefer taking something, walking away, contemplating it for a little while and then come, then come back with my thoughts. Um, talk about, you know, speech is silver silences goal.
Living by Core Human Values
00:42:19
Speaker
Yeah.
00:42:20
Speaker
And the other one I'm fond of is that those that say do not know and those that know do not say. Yeah. And there's a lot of truth in that. It takes humility to not say, to not have to wrong the other person when they're so attached to their opinion. It takes humility to go, OK, that's their perspective. I'm not going to try and fix them. I'm not going to try and right them.
00:42:48
Speaker
I'm just going to let them be. I'm going to let them be. If they want to be attached to that idea, that's up to them. If they want to be attached to this belief, you know. But again, that's, yeah, I mean, bring it back to this original idea that there is unity amidst the diversity. And I think one of the keys for me to really live in this is the recognition of what's often known as the cardinal human values.
00:43:16
Speaker
These are five human values from which all other values can be derived. I think turning your life to live with these values is what enables us to live in greater unity and that is peace, love, truth, non-violence and righteous conduct. Peace, love, truth, non-violence and righteous conduct.
00:43:44
Speaker
And not abuse ourselves when we're not living according to those values, but just catch it. Like they say, awareness is like light, it dissolves darkness. We bring light to those parts of ourselves where there's greed, where there's anger, where there's hatred, where there's jealousy, where there's pride. And replace it with, you know, I love that question. What would love to?
00:44:12
Speaker
I think if we start to live that way, then we'll live in greater harmony. You know, we'll actually be able to respect the differences.
00:44:26
Speaker
I mean, we're also very different, that's the reality. Physically, mentally, emotionally, we're all very different. Well, we all have same emotions, I guess. But physically, at least, we're all very different. We look very different, different noses, different eye shape, different teeth. But we all have, we're all made of the same things. So it's like surface level versus depth. And you can live on the surface level, or you can live with a greater sense of depth. And one last thing I'll throw at you is,
00:45:00
Speaker
You can look at all these people on the planet as being separate, different, individual. Or you can look at all the people on the planet being connected to the center of the earth with a thread. That every single person on this planet, every single species is connected to the center of the earth. We're all connected. And I think that can lead to a much deeper sense of love and connection, which is what we find when we seek unity in the midst of our diversity.
00:45:30
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. And for like for all the listeners right there, because I know I probably would have been one of them at one at some stage and probably I'm still to some direction like is there'll be people listening going, I'm going to buy it into that hocus pocus, yoga, meditation, crap, whatever. But even for those who don't want to go down that spiritual path,
00:45:59
Speaker
if they actually really look at their lives, it still comes down to those same five principles. Whether it's how you interact with your local sports team, like with your fans, your friends at the pub, who do you love? Who's being honest? Who's being kind? All of these things are the same no matter how deep you want to
00:46:29
Speaker
dig into it. They're in you. They're in every one of us. Yeah, that's right. The whole point of the education system, ideally, back in the day, I think the Latin word for education was et ducre, something like that, et ducre, which means to draw out. And fundamentally was to draw out these cardinal human values of love, peace, truth, nonviolence, and righteous conduct.
00:46:55
Speaker
And it is, you're right. Like you don't have to go down that spiritual path or the religious path. I'm not religious by the way, but you could start spiritual, but that's just another notion, another concept. But what I am is I'm committed to these innate qualities that are within us, which is peace, love, truth, nonviolence, righteous comedy. It is natural to be loving. It's natural to be, to tell the truth. It's natural to not want to harm others, you know? And I think that's,
00:47:25
Speaker
And I think we're, as much as the media makes us think otherwise, I think as a, as a, as a world, we are rapidly heading that, that space where this understanding that the, the similarities far outweigh the differences. Um, and that we all have those four, five core values. Doesn't matter. It doesn't matter where you've grown up.
00:47:54
Speaker
Everybody wants the same thing for themselves, their families, their friends, their kids. Um, and it's, it's, it is wonderful to see when, if you just turn off the news for a while, if you actually look around, um, well, I think here, here in Australia, about kids, same thing. The, the kids don't know racism anymore. They like, they, they're in their schoolyard. Um,
00:48:20
Speaker
There's my son's school, there's probably 50 ethnic groups in his school alone. And not one of them would even know that it's something they should be aware of. Even for me as a kid, I mean, yes, there was racist slurs thrown around when I was a kid. But as a kid, I didn't know what that meant. We just passed it on, passed on what other people were saying, but we didn't know what it meant.
00:48:49
Speaker
But then, of course, some people take to that deeper sense of separation and start creating that us and them, which again, is based on ignorance. Yeah, and one of the things that I think we should end this conversation with is the notion that so much of the hate and violence in this world is around desperation and
00:49:19
Speaker
And just like people not getting a fair start. And then they see others who are doing better than them. Um, I can see where that resentment comes from. Uh, the, my, my little brothers happens to be sailing around the world right now. And we were just talking about pirates one day. And, and whether or not he, how afraid he is of pirates, he says, well, it's definitely a concern in certain areas of the world. But.
00:49:49
Speaker
Like we were talking about earlier, there's a sympathy for them because the pirates, they basically say, if we had another choice, we would take it. But because of global nationals extracting all of the wealth out of their country and all the jobs going to foreigners and they're left with nothing, well, they still got to feed their kids.
Global Unity and Future Hope
00:50:17
Speaker
My hope is that for all the listeners who tune in is when you are looking at refugees, when you're looking at immigration, when you're looking at desperate people, crime, all those things, just think to yourself, what was it that caused that person to, first of all, have to leave their home and commit an act that they didn't want to do in the first place?
00:50:45
Speaker
And you'll probably find that in most cases, well, not you probably, you'll find in most cases that there's, it's, it's just, uh, survival instincts kick in rather than anything else. So if, if, if we want to, uh, if we create a situation where every human being gets a fair shot in life, you'll, so many of those problems go away. And the perfect example of that is.
00:51:14
Speaker
I'm from Canada. I now live in Australia. Both countries have a very strong social net. Education is free for all, well-funded. Teachers are paid well. There's a minimum wage that's above the living wage so that if you do have a full-time job, you can support your family, you can support yourself. As a result,
00:51:43
Speaker
Here in Melbourne, I would be happy to walk from one end of the city to the other at 4 a.m. without even the slightest idea that I will encounter violence no matter what neighborhood I go through. And that's because desperate people are dangerous. People who aren't desperate, they want to live by those five values.
00:52:06
Speaker
One last thing with relation to what we can do is to firstly recognize that everything you own comes from others. Some people say, well, I made this necklace. I'm like, well, where'd you get the gold from? Everything comes from others. Everything you have, everything you own. There's no way you could ever repay all the time and energy that's gone into giving you all the things you've got or had. So consider it as like you're in debt.
00:52:32
Speaker
and direct your life towards giving. I mean, it's important to receive. Receiving is just as important as giving. But a lot of people are very good at receiving and not so good at giving. So keep in mind to give more, to help the people in need. And I think if you live like that, then this world, if each and every one of us do that, this world will inevitably unify. And the golden age is coming.
00:52:57
Speaker
Oh, it is. And we are speeding towards it. I predict, my son's six years old now, I predict by the time he's 50, these conversations won't happen anymore. It's so improbable to think with the dissemination of information and the speed by which people can travel,
00:53:27
Speaker
to and from that I don't even like, I think within 20 years, 20, 30 years, we won't even have like, we won't have borders between countries anymore. It's such an archaic principle that is very quickly dissolving. But anyway, we had, we could probably go on forever, which we probably would. But I really, really enjoyed this conversation. I knew I would. Thanks for
00:53:56
Speaker
for being on the show. Now, your performance coaching, foundations for success coaching, where can people find you if they want to learn more about what you're up to?
00:54:09
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, you can search my name. It's Keenan Crisp. A good way to remember that is if you put a D in the middle, I'm keen and crisp and ready to go. Keenan Crisp is my name and the business is Foundations for Success Coaching. But yeah, it's been a pleasure. I've been really enjoyed speaking with you too, Jeff. Thank you for your time. Thank you for allowing me the platform to share some thoughts too. Yeah, no, it's been great. And I know this won't be our last conversation.
00:54:37
Speaker
To everybody listening, thanks for joining Otterly Positive Talks. Make sure you follow The Laughing Otter. We're on all the social media platforms, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram. You can find me, Jeff Bonsberger, on LinkedIn. Reach out if you have any thoughts. Great to hear from you. And other than that, just remember, we all deserve to be having a lot more fun. Thanks, and we'll talk to you soon.