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FC2O Episode 2 - William Wolcott
58 Plays6 years ago
For the past 40 years, Bill Wolcott has been pretty much doing little else but researching, developing, applying, and teaching Metabolic Typing
Alongside authoring his best selling book, The Metabolic Typing Diet, Bill has provided technical consulting services to all manner of health professionals and developed online, customized Metabolic Typing® screening helping hundreds of thousands of people all over the world.
Bill has Certified Metabolic Typing Advisors in over 40 countries resulting in a huge database documenting the remarkable effectiveness of metabolic typing in helping to resolve all manner of chronic health disorders.
Recommended
Transcript
Metabolic Individuality and Health
00:00:00
Speaker
Metabolic individuality is real. There are no two people who are identical. Everyone is unique on every single level of the body. And they're also unique in terms of their health issues and the underlying causal factors that apply to those issues. So in one person, you may have a situation where they only need to change their diet.
00:00:30
Speaker
And that cancer tumor will disappear within three or four weeks. And we have seen that happen many times. When you develop true health, then life becomes very simple.
00:00:44
Speaker
Yeah. The whole idea is to develop that optimal health to unfold your genetic potential and to live life the way it's meant to be lived. We're not meant to live life where we're watching every little thing and counting calories and weighing out our food and doing all those things. Totally unnecessary. We just need the foods that are right for our type, understand how those foods are affecting our body,
00:01:08
Speaker
and monitor that and make adjustments as your body changes. And these are very simple things that become second nature. And when you get to that point, life becomes very beautiful and very simple.
00:01:43
Speaker
to order
Introduction to Bill Walcott and His Journey
00:01:51
Speaker
Welcome to FC2.0 with me, Matt Walden, and my guest today, Bill Walcott. I'd like to have Bill joining us on FC2.0, author of the Metabolic Typing Diet and owner of the registered trademark called Metabolic Typing, which I think you'll come to see is quite a thing. So for the last 40 years, Bill's been pretty much doing little else but researching, developing, applying, and teaching the concept of metabolic typing.
00:02:13
Speaker
He's provided technical consulting services to all manner of healthcare professionals and developed online, customized metabolic typing profiles used by hundreds of thousands of people all over the world. Bill has certified metabolic typing advisors in over 40 countries, resulting in a huge database documenting the remarkable effectiveness of metabolic typing and helping to resolve all manner of chronic health challenges.
00:02:36
Speaker
In this episode, we jump into some fairly technical detail early on. So to help provide some clarity, I've added a couple of diagrams to the show notes available at mattwalden.com under the podcast tab. Enjoy the show. Here we go.
00:02:58
Speaker
So welcome to FC2O with me, Matt Walden. And today my guest is Bill Walcott, the author of The Metabolic Typing Diet and the founder of HealthXL and the whole system of metabolic typing, really. I know you've had many other influences as well in that field of metabolic typing, Bill, but you're really the guy that I think has brought it to the world in what I see as its most complete form. So thank you for that and welcome to the podcast.
00:03:27
Speaker
Yeah, thank you, Matt. It's great to be here. I'm always excited to talk about metabolic typing, so this is great.
00:03:35
Speaker
Fantastic. Fantastic. Well, I first heard about metabolic typing in 2001. And it was, it won't surprise you to hear it was in a lecture from Paul Czech. And, you know, I had, I recently just finished my naturopathic degree and osteopathic degree. And so I'd learned a fair bit about nutrition as, as part of that process. And
00:03:58
Speaker
you know, I heard Paul talking about the idea that, you know, some people needed more meat, and that some people needed less meat. And I've really been sort of enculturated into the idea that vegetarianism was the best way forward, because of the whole kind of heart hypothesis around cholesterol at the time, being kind of prevalent, you know. So I thought, well, this guy, Paul Chet, you know, he's good at exercise, but I'm not sure he knows too much about nutrition. He
00:04:25
Speaker
but he mentioned your book. And the reason I wanted to sort of give that introduction was that, you know, I got hold of the book and I read the book.
00:04:34
Speaker
And I was blown away by it. And, you know, I had obviously, you know, like I said, just come off the back of four years of study and then a master's degree after that. And so I've been fairly entrenched in all the sort of current thinking and research papers and so on. But when I read Metabolic Typing, The Metabolic Typing Diet, it was the most naturopathic book I've ever read. It really struck me that this I was almost almost angry at the fact that I hadn't been taught this stuff at college.
00:05:05
Speaker
Yeah. So I'd love to get a bit of background. I know you describe the background to metabolic typing in the book. So there's a kind of full version, technical version of it there. But for our listeners, if you could explain a little bit about, you know, your kind of career journey and where you started and then how that led into your realization of metabolic typing as it is today.
Evolution of Metabolic Typing
00:05:30
Speaker
Yeah, sure. I'd love to. But fair warning, it can be kind of a big story because it's been spent many years. And so we'll get into a little bit and I'll try to keep it as brief as I can. But you know, Matt, it actually started when I was a kid because as an infant,
00:05:50
Speaker
I suffered from really, really bad allergies. I mean, terrible allergy. So that I was pretty much on antihistamines round the clock and year round. And that really lasted most
00:06:06
Speaker
of my life up until the time that I came into contact with metabolic typing, which was I think when I was 30 or 31 years old. So I had been suffering with these really horrendous allergies and never found any help in the medical community other than just suppressing the symptoms. And even that very often didn't work very well. And then in 1977,
00:06:32
Speaker
My mother died at a very young age, I mean young relatively speaking. She was in her early fifties and she died of bone cancer and it had been diagnosed as arthritis. And she was gone really before we even knew it hit us. And I was totally, totally uneducated about really medicine and about nutrition at that time.
00:06:58
Speaker
But it was really a really horrific experience because she died the type of death that everybody fears with cancer. It was a really horrific death. And I now know from where my journey took me that that was totally unnecessary. Cancer is really not that big of a deal to deal with. So it really was something that
00:07:21
Speaker
was so tragic, but it also was kind of a catalyst that really turned my mind and heart into searching for answers about health, about disease, about medicine, how this mistake could have been made. And so that was in 1977. In 1978, I stumbled upon this thing called metabolic typing.
00:07:47
Speaker
And I don't recall exactly what it was about it, but there's something about what I read about it that just lit a fire inside and I just had to know more. So I attended a training course on metabolic typing given by the originator at that time, Dr. William Donald Kelly.
00:08:07
Speaker
And he was a real pioneer and had really acquired quite a name for himself because he had such phenomenal results using metabolic typing and cancer. He kind of became known as the cancer doctor, but what's really funny about that that I learned later was that he never treated cancer.
00:08:29
Speaker
He had this unbelievable success with it. In fact, he had better success really with pancreatic cancer than anyone else and even to this day. So it's amazing because he didn't treat cancer, but what he did do
00:08:44
Speaker
was he truly treated the person who had the disease, not the disease that had the person. So anyway, that was his reputation. I read about metabolic typing and I just couldn't wait to really learn about this. I didn't even understand why. It was just this compulsion of, wow, what is this? So the training course and one thing kind of led to another. And by the end of the course, Dr. Kelly, much to my
00:09:12
Speaker
really mind-blown astonishment, asked me if I like to move to his town and become his assistant. Oh, wow. So what had your background been before that? What field had you been working in? I was working in the field of meditation. I was teaching meditation at the time. Oh, wow. I really kind of a stopgap measure because all I knew was that I wanted to help people.
00:09:40
Speaker
But I didn't really know how to do that. So at the time, I was teaching meditation. But anyway, I moved to where Dr. Kelly lived and became his assistant. And one of my functions at that time was to be the troubleshooter for his program. So for five hours a day, five days a week, I was on the phone to all the doctors who were using the program and having trouble with their patients.
00:10:10
Speaker
And he had hundreds of people he had trained in his system at that time. So that alone was really almost like a full-time job because there were lots of questions that were coming in at the time.
00:10:24
Speaker
And so that was an amazing experience because I got through that in education that I really could not have gotten anywhere else because I had to obviously learn the philosophy completely, learn the clinical application completely. Because Dr. Kelly, even though he was available to help me if I ran into trouble, he was turning that over to me. So it was really
00:10:45
Speaker
up to me to solve these issues that the doctors had. So that did two things. One, it gave me a phenomenal education, but at the same time, it really gave me insight into exactly how well the program was doing. It was doing amazing. I mean, we were working with people with every condition
00:11:07
Speaker
imaginable, including serious terminal cases, and doing so well and totally reversing these conditions in people completely getting back to a state of phenomenal health. But the second thing it showed me was that there was also a significant segment that were not being helped. And those were the people that I had to deal with. I was dealing with the doctors who were telling me, look, we're doing the recommendations from the program.
00:11:39
Speaker
The patients aren't getting better. In fact, they're getting worse. The buck stopped with me. It's like, well, what do I do? At the time, Dr. Kelly and I would talk about that. His feeling was, well, either they're just not following the program,
00:11:57
Speaker
Or they're not taking it strongly enough. Or they're something that we don't understand because that really was the only option. So, you know, I addressed those things with those doctors and said, let's increase the protocol. And for some of those people, that was the only problem. They got better, but for, again, significant segment, it made them worse.
00:12:23
Speaker
I can't really convey to you how difficult that was. I'm really in that hot seat every single day and I'm the type of person who doesn't take that sort of thing lightly. It was really disturbing to me and I lost sleep over it at night trying to figure out what was going on.
Dominance Factor Theory and Biochemical Individuality
00:12:43
Speaker
Yeah, of course. Somehow I stumbled upon a book at that time by a man by the name of George Watson.
00:12:51
Speaker
He was a PhD psychologist and he wrote a book called Nutrition and Your Mind. And it was a phenomenal book and anybody hearing this podcast or this interview, if you get a chance to find that book, I urge you to read it because it's one of the most wonderful books that I've ever read. And Watson was an absolutely brilliant guy and he had spent
00:13:21
Speaker
I forget exactly how to, I believe it was around 15 years or so doing objective clinical research on what he talked about as the oxidation rate and using nutrition to correct mental illness by addressing the oxidation rate. And he had tremendous success. And that's what his book was about. But the reason I'm bringing this up,
00:13:48
Speaker
is that every single thing that Watson said about nutrition was the exact opposite of what we knew to be true through Dr. Kelly's system of metabolic typing.
00:14:06
Speaker
Again, it's hard to convey that experience. I mean, I immersed myself in metabolic typing, which in Kelly's system was based exclusively on the autonomic nervous system. And what I mean by that is the effect of nutrients and foods on the autonomic nervous system. Metabolic types were determined by the various strengths and weaknesses within the autonomic nervous system in each individual.
00:14:32
Speaker
And foods and nutrients were used to balance sympathetic and parasympathetic imbalances according to their metabolic individuality. So everything that Kelly said about nutrients, whether a nutrient was stimulating or sedating,
00:14:49
Speaker
whether a nutrient was hypoactivating or hyperactivating, whether a nutrient was acidifying or alkalizing, everything that we knew about foods and nutrients to be true. Watson said the exact opposite. So when I read this book, it was like I entered the twilight zone. It's like, what? How can this be? This cannot be.
00:15:18
Speaker
Yeah, and I imagine that's the experience that a lot of people get in this day and age where they pick up a book on, I don't know what diet it would be, but you know, let's say a plant based diet and then others picking up a book on keto and they just they see all these supposed amazing results. But they don't know which way to turn. So it sounds like you had your own version of that back in the 70s.
00:15:42
Speaker
Very similar. The difference, of course, was that we worked clinically with people every day that we saw proof that what we were doing was working. Right. Here I am, you know, my mind is completely blown. I cannot understand how this could be. All I could think of, well, who's right and who's wrong. And then it occurred to me, maybe that's the wrong question. Maybe they're both right. You know, maybe both systems are right.
00:16:11
Speaker
So I sat with that hypothesis and I worked with it and thought, well, how would I apply that? And then I realized that I had this whole segment of our population that was not doing well on our program and that they were getting worse. And so I devised a way to analyze what they were doing in relationship to Watson's work on oxidation. Right.
00:16:41
Speaker
expanded our system of metabolic typing to incorporate the oxidative component. And when I applied that information to these people or to these patients that we were working with that were not getting well, it was an unbelievable response, 100% of those people.
00:17:02
Speaker
instantly started to improve. So that was the basis of my theory that I developed, which I called the dominance factor.
00:17:12
Speaker
Yeah, I think that's a really fascinating and important concept. I don't know if we've had this discussion before, but I see that having read your concept of the dominance factor in this context, then I've seen it in so many other aspects of biochemistry and even in things like muscle physiology. And one of the examples that springs out is that
00:17:39
Speaker
in rehabilitation, there's a lot of discussion about tonic muscles versus phasic muscles and the idea that tonic muscles hold tone and are postural in nature and the phasic muscles are fast twitch and they tend to move you and mobilize you. And it seems like what's happened is that people have almost mistaken the notion that
00:18:00
Speaker
actually, all muscles are a combination of both tonic and phasic. And there's a dominance within the muscle group. So a muscle may be more dominant in tonic fibers, more dominant in phasic fibers, but it's not the case that you actually have a tonic muscle or a phasic muscle. And, you know, I wonder if sometimes because we're trying to make sense of things, we simplify them right down and make them too simple sometimes, so that
00:18:26
Speaker
you know, they become inaccurate, and you need some kind of system that is more true to life, which is what the dominance factor is. Right. Right. Yeah, the dominance factor, it changed everything. And basically, what that is, is the understanding now, and this is some 30 years later, that this has been applied
00:18:49
Speaker
and found to be absolutely correct, absolutely true in clinical practice. So we're not talking about philosophy, we're talking about clinical application. But what the dominance factor says basically has to do with the effect of nutrients in the body. And this is a really
00:19:11
Speaker
big topic because it really gets to the entire realm of science and scientific research and why research with nutrition seems to have always conflicting results. You research a nutrient on a specific condition and you will always see, well, X percentage showed a positive response, some percentage showed little or no change, and another percentage had a negative response.
00:19:40
Speaker
And so why is that? And I submit that the reason has to do with the dominance factor, which basically says that the effect of any nutrient or food on the body, on the biochemistry, is not due to an inherent or an intrinsic factor of that food or nutrient. Instead,
00:20:08
Speaker
It is due to which fundamental control system is being stimulated by that nutrient in that individual. I mean, you say fundamental control system, just to clarify for people what would be examples of that.
00:20:26
Speaker
So the body is organized in a hierarchy, right? There's the organism as a whole. And then there's the systemic level, the organ level, gland level, tissue level, cell level, nutrient level, sub nutrient levels, and so forth. And all of these levels and every function in the body is regulated through a handful of control mechanisms where we can call them fundamental homeostatic controls.
00:20:54
Speaker
the autonomic nervous system, the endocrine system, the oxidation or the rate at which nutrients are converted to energy within the cells, acid alkaline balance, catabolic, anabolic. These are all fundamental homeostatic control mechanisms that respond to the environment. So that's what I mean. So in the dominance factor in metabolic typing, talking about food and nutrition,
Nutritional Complexity and Individualized Approaches
00:21:22
Speaker
The primary fundamental homeostatic controls in the body are the autonomic nervous system and the oxidation rate. Those two are primarily what responds to food and nutrition in terms of how the body reacts. So let's give you a specific example.
00:21:44
Speaker
in the autonomic nervous system, if you consume potassium, potassium stimulates the parasympathetic system. Calcium stimulates the sympathetic system. Magnesium inhibits the sympathetic system and thereby has a parasympathetic effect by default.
00:22:09
Speaker
Yeah. Phosphorus stimulates the sympathetic system. So we find that foods and nutrients have these very specific stimulatory or inhibitory influences on the autonomic nervous system. In the oxidative system, we find that those same nutrients have an opposite effect. So where potassium stimulates the parasympathetic system in the autonomic system,
00:22:40
Speaker
And the result of that parasympathetic stimulation is an alkaline shift. We can talk more about that if you want, but for now, just realize that potassium stimulates the autonomic nervous system by stimulating the parasympathetic division. And that stimulation results in an alkaline shift. However, in the oxidation rate that takes place in the mitochondria,
00:23:08
Speaker
with glycolysis and citric acid cycle and beta oxidation, these processes that take place within the cells and within the mitochondria that convert nutrients to energy, potassium will increase the rate of carbohydrate metabolism. And the result of that fast oxidation, that faster oxidation, that increased oxidation is an increase in acidity.
00:23:37
Speaker
So here we have one nutrient, potassium, that in one individual who is an autonomic dominant person, they will go through an alkaline shift. But you get that same nutrient potassium to an oxidative dominant person, and that individual will go through an acid shift. So the same nutrient in one person will be hypoactivating,
00:24:04
Speaker
Another individual with a different dominance, it'll be hyperactivating. So it's an incredibly significant discovery because it means that nutrients themselves do not have an intrinsic effect on the body. And yet, almost all of medicine and all of alternative medicine thinks about nutrition with intrinsic effects. In other words, what nutrient do I take for this condition?
00:24:33
Speaker
Yeah, this is one of the things that that, you know, struck me straight away when I when I read the book was that, because of course, we were moving into quite a kind of nutraceutical era, I suppose, where, you know, where the
00:24:49
Speaker
of course, supplements have been around for a while, but it was really becoming a science in inverted commas and obviously a big level business. And so I had done some of the training around nutritional supplementation and what to take for different conditions and all of the naturopathic texts, especially the ones from the US and Canada were very strong on their research and on their sort of references for supplementation to the diet.
00:25:17
Speaker
And I remember reading the metabolic typing diet and seeing that the chart that you've got in there, which says a standardized grab bag protocol for osteoporosis, and just showing how, you know, actually, for a lot of people, the standards sort of mix of nutrients that you've got there,
00:25:36
Speaker
it's just going to create further imbalance and potentially, of course, worsen the osteoporosis. Whereas for other people, it might actually work. But this is, I suppose that's another aspect to, maybe we'll get on to later. So you've developed an entire supplementation range that's based on the different metabolic types to stimulate them in the right direction, right?
00:26:01
Speaker
That's right, because we've discovered or learned or come to understand that diseases are really not the problem that needs to be treated. In other words, if you have a disease, let's just say arthritis,
00:26:24
Speaker
you cannot treat arthritis by thinking, how do I treat this arthritis? Why? Because two individuals with different metabolic types who have arthritis, those two individuals have completely different imbalances. And it is those imbalances in the fundamental homeostatic controls
00:26:48
Speaker
that have resulted in the arthritis. So if you're dealing with someone who is an autonomic dominant and who is, say, a sympathetic dominant, that person needs potassium to strengthen the parasympathetic system to bring it into balance with the sympathetic system. So that person who has arthritis, if you give them potassium and all the foods and nutrients that go along with that sympathetic dominant metabolism,
00:27:19
Speaker
then you balance the autonomic nervous system and that arthritis no longer then has a basis to exist in that person's metabolism. But if that person is what we would call a fast oxidizer and you give them potassium, potassium is the last thing you want to give to a fast oxidizer because it exacerbates or imbalances or worsens
00:27:48
Speaker
their existing imbalance of fast oxidation. Instead of balancing out their oxidation rate, it's making them more of a fast oxidizer. Right. So at a really simplistic level, is it simply that the cells, let's say, in the bones and in the cartilage are not able to function effectively because they are going too fast or too slow as a result of that supplementation?
00:28:16
Speaker
Or is it much more complex than that? But yeah, I mean, we can talk about it in different ways. Basically, it boils down to all chronic degenerative conditions boiled down to defense or failed defense. The body has the ability to defend against any condition.
00:28:42
Speaker
And what is a chronic degenerative condition? What does that mean if you get a chronic degenerative condition? It means that function in the body has begun to fail. But function only fails when defense fails. So if there is a stressor in the body and the body rises up to deal with that stress and defend against that stress,
00:29:10
Speaker
If it defends successfully, then the stress is resolved and the body settles back down to normal. But if the body tries to defend against a stress and it's unable to resolve that stress, then the body is stuck in a chronic defense.
00:29:26
Speaker
And that chronic defense begins to weaken those defense mechanisms, whether it's the adrenals or the thyroid or whatever it might be. Over time, the body begins to weaken. It's like a motor that's on the pedal to the metal and you never take your foot off the gas. So that motor is going to burn out, right? So this is the same thing in chronic degenerative disease. The body's defense is in full blown defense. If it can't resolve the stress,
00:29:56
Speaker
then the defense mechanisms begin to burn out. And at the same time, nutrient stores become depleted. So when defense begins to fail, then adaptation fails. And when adaptation fails, function fails. And as function begins to fail,
Chronic Diseases and Individual Imbalances
00:30:15
Speaker
then degeneration sets in and eventually disease sets in. So it's a chronic cascade of step-by-step failed defense that results in a degenerative condition. So talking about that condition of arthritis, in one individual, that
00:30:37
Speaker
condition can be due to an autonomic imbalance between the sympathetic and parasympathetic system. And you restore that imbalance, now that condition no longer exists because the basis no longer exists. But in another person, that condition could be due to the oxidation rate being too fast or being too slow. So you treat that correctly. And again, that fundamental homeostatic control mechanism is restored
00:31:08
Speaker
and that disease condition can no longer exist. So what that tells us, and again, this is not philosophically speaking, this is clinical experience. What this tells us is that diseases cannot be treated as a disease. You have to treat the person or the fundamental homeostatic control imbalance in that individual
00:31:31
Speaker
And if you do that, then the disease will go away because the disease really is a symptom of the deeper underlying imbalance in that individual. But this really billboards something really important, which is why scientific research is so confusing. It's confusing because it's never done on a homogenous metabolic type population.
00:32:01
Speaker
In other words, if you want to test the effect of, say, calcium on arthritis, then you need to test it with only sympathetic dominant people, and then only parasympathetic dominant people, or only fast oxidizers, or only slow oxidizers, then you're going to get 100% consistent results. It's either going to improve the condition in 100% or it's going to worsen the condition in 100%.
00:32:29
Speaker
So that's why in scientific research, you always get this confusing result because it's never on a homogenous metabolic type population. Yeah. Yeah. I've mentioned that and I did a preview to the podcast where I was talking about the idea of heterogeneous and homogeneous groups or homogeneous as you say. Is it probably a better way to say it? Heterogeneous.
00:33:03
Speaker
I remember when I was working with a professional soccer team here in the UK and one of the physios there had just done his master's degree on
00:33:14
Speaker
on hamstring strain or hamstring stretching. And he had essentially been seeing if he could stretch the hamstrings of professional footballers effectively, but without first assessing all the other factors that can cause the hamstrings to type in the first place. So, you know, some people are going to benefit from a stretch and some people aren't. And I just saw that again, because I think I'd had the framing of it from the metabolic typing, it really carries over
00:33:39
Speaker
to the biomechanical world as well and i guess that was a point i wanted to bring up because you gave the example of osteoarthritis and you know it might almost sound to this sort of new listener that
Holistic Health Assessment
00:33:55
Speaker
that you're just a biochemistry guy, but you're very holistic in the way you work and very holistic in the way you think. And you talk about biomechanics and TMJ dysfunction and seeing someone for good structural work within your book. So that was another thing that attracted me to the whole process. But sorry, I jumped in and
00:34:19
Speaker
sort of, I guess, Story of Thunder a little bit. So you're talking about this homogenous research and why it doesn't work. Yeah, yeah. So, well, you know, I think that leads in quite nicely to the notion of the fact that I was looking at Amazon earlier. And there's, I thought I'd do just a quick search to see how many diet books there are out there.
00:34:47
Speaker
And I mean, I'm sure it's not all of them, because there were 70,000 plus. It kind of said more than 70,000. I didn't say there were only 70,000. But you know, this really reflects what you're just saying, doesn't it? Oh, it does. And you know, Matt, this is one of the strangest situations to me. And for the life of me, I cannot understand
00:35:11
Speaker
Why this is the case? Because since the 1800s, there have literally been hundreds of thousands of books written about diet and nutrition. And pretty much they're all saying, you know, this is what you need to do to eat a healthy diet.
00:35:28
Speaker
It's like, how long is it going to take for people to catch on that there is no such thing as one diet that is right for everybody? I mean, if there were, these books wouldn't keep being written. And if there were, we wouldn't have this common daily experience that is in every person's life. It's either with themselves or friends or family members,
00:35:54
Speaker
that they try a nutrient or they try a superfood or they try a protocol or they try a diet that works for them and their friend tries it and it's a disaster. They eat a diet and lose weight and their friend tries a diet and their friend gains weight. This is the reality and it's true even within the same family that you can see one child who is lean and
00:36:19
Speaker
kind of hyperactive and has very little appetite. And the other child is a little overweight and kind of laid back and lethargic and eats all the time and has a big appetite. So even within the same family, we have these dramatic differences in physiologies and in biochemistries and in dietary requirements. And it all makes sense really when you look at it from an evolutionary perspective. And I think that would be worth mentioning
00:36:48
Speaker
you know, where this idea of metabolic types originates, you know, where it really comes from.
Geographic Dietary Adaptations
00:36:55
Speaker
And it really comes from the geographical locations on the planet that are so different from one another, and how human beings have evolved to be perfectly adapted to those environments.
00:37:12
Speaker
So, you know, in the Arctic we have the Inuit or the Eskimo, and it's very harsh conditions, obviously very cold in the winter. But the types of foods that are available in that climate and in that geography are very limited. And as a result, the Inuit have become perfectly adapted through forces of nature, of evolution, of adaptation and survival of the fittest and genetic mutation.
00:37:41
Speaker
to be perfectly adapted to an all protein and fat and almost no carbohydrate diet. And it's not a matter of surviving on it. They thrive on that. They thrive on it even to the extent that in their language, they don't have a word for cancer or diabetes. More heart disease. I was reading. Nothing but protein and fat, right? Which flies in the face of the belief of many today.
00:38:12
Speaker
I was reading about I think it was tuberculosis in that group and you know the Inuit and it was I think it was from Western Aid prices I think I was reading it in the vegetarian myth but she was quoting Western Aid prices but nutrition and physical degeneration but they were talking there about a surgeon and doctor who had gone to that region and was working with the indigenous people there
00:38:40
Speaker
and how this was obviously the early 1900s, and there was partly because of the spread of civilization, as it were, in the inverted commas into that region. There was increasing outbreaks of tuberculosis.
00:39:00
Speaker
And what this guy found, what this physician found was that the best way to get the Inuits to survive and recover whale from tuberculosis was to get them back onto their indigenous diets because they had started to eat the more processed foods of westernized culture. And the moment he got them back onto organ meats and whale meat and seal meat and so on, they would naturally recover
00:39:28
Speaker
close to 100% of the time and with a very full recovery. But while they stayed on the more sort of newer processed industrialized foods, they really struggled and the response was terrible. That's a great example. That's a great example of something like tuberculosis not treating the disease, just treating the metabolism of that individual and providing the body
00:39:54
Speaker
with the genetically-based requirements. So that's another thing that's very important to understand about nutrition, that it really is not a matter of philosophical concepts. It's a matter of genetic requirements. Nutrition is based in genes. It's not based in anything else. It's not based in belief. It's not based in expert opinion.
00:40:18
Speaker
It's based in your genes. And the body is designed to function perfectly. It's designed to function optimally. We're all designed to have incredible energy, incredible well-being, incredibly functioning minds, incredible emotions, to live life fully and with great zest and with great energy. That's what we're designed to be.
00:40:41
Speaker
But in order to be that way, we have to give our bodies what those genetically based requirements dictate. And if we do, then miraculous things can happen.
00:40:54
Speaker
And you know, one of the things that really fascinates me about the whole story of the Inuit is that, you know, when you look at what food is available, it's thermogenic foods, right? The further you go into, you know, temperate and ultimately polo zones, the food becomes increasingly thermogenic. And it's just amazing the way nature provides what you need in those environments. I think that's absolutely fascinating.
00:41:20
Speaker
Absolutely. And then you look at the indigenous people, the Tuka-Senta, Papua New Guinea, and they are almost the exact opposite of the Inuit. The Tuka-Senta, their traditional diet is over 90% carbohydrate, very little protein and fat.
00:41:43
Speaker
So, you know, this high carbohydrate diet, and yet the people are lean, they're healthy, they have absolutely no symptoms or indications of blood sugar dysregulation, and yet they are on a high carbohydrate diet. Right. All of these absolutes that you find in nutrition, you know, high protein diet bad for you or high protein diet good for you, or high carbohydrate diet bad for you, or high carbohydrate diet good for you. None of these things
00:42:13
Speaker
are true in terms of absolutes. What is always true has to be relative to the genetically based requirements of each individual. That's the key to diet and nutrition and health and wellbeing.
00:42:29
Speaker
Right, right. And staying on that evolutionary theme, I know you mentioned the dharmos, is that how you pronounce them?
Homeostatic Controls in Metabolic Typing
00:42:36
Speaker
The guys that came up with the blood typing? Yeah. So it was a father and son, wasn't it? I think the father obviously initiated the line of research and then the son popularized it, I think is the way it went, but I might have that wrong.
00:42:51
Speaker
But so when did you so this is another nuance isn't it to nutritional sort of individuality and You know, when did you first? Recognize that and start to build that into your system Well the
00:43:12
Speaker
The system started out, as I mentioned, with the autonomic system and then the oxidative. And at that point, when I understood the dominance factor and began to apply it, you know, I felt so great. You know, I felt, oh my gosh, this is it. My work's done. I can retire. I don't think about this anymore. This is the be all and the end all. And, you know, anytime you have that kind of thought, you usually get hit by a two by four one way or the other. Nature finds a way to, you know,
00:43:42
Speaker
bring you back to reality. So these two fundamental homeostatic controls were just the beginning, because once I understood that concept, then suddenly I began to notice that, oh, well, there's some people now that are coming to us that we are not helping. And the question became, well, why are we not helping these people?
00:44:07
Speaker
And it was from there that we discovered additional fundamental homeostatic controls that were specifically linked to nutrition. So today, in my system of metabolic typing, we deal with and we recognize 14 different fundamental homeostatic controls.
00:44:27
Speaker
So somewhere along the way, we added the blood type component because of the influence of lectins. But the blood type component is a kind of a, I guess I would call it a passive influence. It's there in the blood and it never changes.
00:44:49
Speaker
but it's not a dynamic one that has to do with how your body creates, maintains, and controls energy. It more has to do with a consideration of certain foods that are specific to your blood type that you may need to omit from your diet if you have
00:45:09
Speaker
issues with your gastrointestinal tract. So it's an important component for certain people under certain conditions, but it is not the profound mover and shaker, if you will, as the autonomic nervous system, the oxidation rate, which again, have specifically to do with how foods and nutrients are converted to energy and regulated in the body.
00:45:37
Speaker
And really, energy is the common denominator at every single level of the body, whether it's the organism, the systemic, the organ clan, cell, tissue, subnuclear level. Everything has to do with energy and how it's being created and regulated.
00:45:55
Speaker
And so food then becomes so critical. It's not just about calories. It's about the stimulatory or inhibitory influence in each of these control mechanisms that regulate all processes in the body. And that's really how food becomes our medicine or our poison, literally. Food can heal you, but food can also make you sick if you eat foods that are wrong for your metabolic type.
00:46:23
Speaker
Because when you do that, you prevent your body from defending properly, from adapting and resolving stress.
00:46:31
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Well, I was just going to say, I think the definition, the medical definition of a drug is that it's any substance that alters the physiology at the cellular level, something like that, or alters physiological responses in the cell. And so therefore, everything we eat is a drug, isn't it? And I think we've got this idea of drugs as something that comes in capsules and is coming from a doctor or a pharmacy.
00:46:57
Speaker
But really, everything that we eat has a drug-like effect on us and is both as potent as a drug and can have the side effects of drugs as well. Was it the Hippocrates quote, let food be your medicine and medicine be your food? Exactly. Yeah, that's it. I would submit that food is more powerful than drugs because food, unlike drugs, has a cumulative effect
00:47:27
Speaker
the more you consume a food, the more powerful the effect of that food becomes, either for good or for ill.
Impact of Wrong Foods on Health
00:47:37
Speaker
So you can eat a food that's wrong for your metabolic type. And I'll give you a specific example. If you are a parasympathetic dominant,
00:47:46
Speaker
then you don't need foods in high quantities that are high in potassium because potassium stimulates the parasympathetic system. So if you already have an autonomic imbalance where your parasympathetic system is too strong and your sympathetic system is weak, then you don't want to eat foods that are stimulating further your parasympathetic system, right?
00:48:09
Speaker
So green drinks, vegetable juice, using green vegetables, making water known as green drinks, are touted to be highly beneficial foods. But once again, in metabolic typing, we've come to understand that you cannot speak in terms of absolutes. It has to be relative.
00:48:32
Speaker
So yes, green drinks are powerfully beneficial foods, but only for certain metabolic types. If you give a green drink to a parasympathetic, at first that person might feel fine, might not feel any change, might not feel any different. But over a period of time, whether it's a few days or a week or two,
00:48:55
Speaker
maybe a little bit longer, but pretty soon that parasympathetic dominate is going to start feeling tired. They're going to start feeling depressed. They're going to start craving sweets. They're going to wonder what happened to their energy. Why? Because the sympathetic system is becoming increasingly weak by default by strengthening that parasympathetic system.
00:49:17
Speaker
The more you consume a food, it'll become either more and more beneficial if it's right for your type or it'll become more detrimental to you if it's wrong for your type. So in that sense, food is even more powerful than the medicine that we take.
00:49:35
Speaker
Well, and also one of the things that Paul Czech talks about is the way that a food behaves in the body is a kind of harmonic effect on the body as opposed to a drug being more linear. And so he gives the analogy of a rack of pool balls and that a drug is like firing the cue ball in and just creating chaos and disarray because it's a linear effect.
00:50:00
Speaker
Whereas, you know, eating organic food is far more harmonic, whether it is an organic food site that he uses to illustrate the notion. But I guess any whole food is going to have an array of harmonising effects on the body, but only if it's right for your metabolic type.
00:50:22
Speaker
Well, one of the examples I was going to bring up, which is a personal example, and I remember I dropped you a line about it because whenever I've tested myself, I've always come up as a faster oxidizer. And that suggests that to have things like citrus is going to push me in the wrong direction, and sugar as well.
00:50:47
Speaker
from time to time, obviously, as a treat, I would grab myself a lemonade, like, you know, a kind of lemon, you know, sort of a natural one, not another sort of fizzy pop soda one. But, but, you know, I get that as a treat from time to time. And I remember thinking, you know, I don't feel too bad on this. So, you know, I think I'm okay. As long as you know, I was I was eating, I was drinking it with with a meal or something. Yeah.
00:51:13
Speaker
And then I had a situation where I had to take an antibiotic for an infection which came on quite aggressively. And then I reacted to the antibiotic. And the response to the antibiotic was essentially I was getting panic attacks. And I didn't really know what it was because I just had my heart was going crazy.
00:51:33
Speaker
my breathing rate was up. I didn't feel anxious, per se, apart from the fact my heart was doing something strange. And, you know, ended up in the hospital, because that was the advice of the doctor. They did all the ECGs, everything's normal. And they said, you just had a panic attack. And I said, well,
00:51:50
Speaker
I don't really understand why, because I don't particularly feel anxious, and I've never experienced it before, but I have just taken this antibiotic over the last 24 hours, and they said, oh yeah, maybe you should come off that for a bit and see how you go. So I did.
Stress, Food Sensitivity, and Balance
00:52:07
Speaker
But this kind of state of, I guess, hyper-arousal stayed with me for a few days. And it just so happened I was up in London and going to a venue and thought, oh, I'll just grab one of these lemonades from this shop that I knew that sold them.
00:52:25
Speaker
And I'm drinking this lemonade and suddenly I feel this anxiety coming over me and my heart starting to go crazy. And it was like, you know, I was obviously sensitized enough at that stage that my body couldn't handle further stress. And at that stage, the lemonade was too much for me. Under normal circumstances, it's probably not an ideal choice, but my body could handle it and could compensate for it, I guess. So is that a good sort of example?
00:52:52
Speaker
Oh, it's a great example. And that's exactly what we're talking about. It's just amazing how this all works together, that every food and every nutrient has these specific effects on our control systems. And the effects of these foods and nutrients are cumulative. So that's exactly what happened with you, that your system had shifted
00:53:18
Speaker
a little deeper, a little stronger into that fast oxidative imbalance. And by consuming the citrus, which is very high in potassium, that cumulative effect then produced that anxiety attack. For lack of a better term, it produced that hyperactivated state within you because it was imbalancing that cellular production of energy.
00:53:47
Speaker
Everything in our metabolism and physiology and biochemistry yet all has to do with balance.
00:53:55
Speaker
And it has to do with this interchange between these dualistic diphasic systems within our body. And again, it's autonomic, sympathetic, parasympathetic, the oxidation rate, fasten cell oxidation, catabolic and anabolic, or aerobic anaerobic acid and alkaline and so forth. These control systems can get out of balance so that
00:54:21
Speaker
you cannot get back into a normal homeostatic state, or the homeostatic state that you are left in is a state of imbalance. So when you're in that state of imbalance to begin with, and you consume something that pushes you further out of balance, then you become more and more sensitive to those foods that have that effect on you. So it's all about balance.
00:54:47
Speaker
eating foods and nutrients that balance your body chemistry, the foods that are right for you. And if you and I are different types, and we are, by the way, you're a fast oxidizer, I tend to be
00:54:57
Speaker
slow oxidizer and a sympathetic dominant. So for me, citrus and potassium and green drinks, all those things are great. I can consume those till cows come home and I feel great. But you give that to a parasympathetic or a fast oxidizer and they will have very bad results that will get worse and worse over time if they don't change what you're doing.
00:55:23
Speaker
You know, one of the things that surprises me in some ways and in other ways, it really doesn't surprise me is that a lot of the information, as you've already alluded to, a lot of the information that you've built your understanding around is not new information,
Historical Basis of Biochemical Individuality
00:55:35
Speaker
is it? I mean, the Biochemical Individuality book by Roger Williams, his name is 1950s book, I think, and then you've got
00:55:44
Speaker
Francis Marion Pottinger and Weston A. Price, who were around in the earlier half of the 20th century. I know obviously there's a lot of new information you've also built into the system, but a lot of those fundamental tenets of the system were somewhat understood, weren't they? A fair bit earlier on, but just not applied or put together. How did you amalgamate all of that information?
00:56:13
Speaker
You know, I don't even know how to answer that. I think it came from that discovery of the dominance factor. I mean, once I understood that, then everything else fell into place. I think the problem comes, and this is a universal problem really throughout medicine and scientific research in nutrition. But once I understood that it was not a question of either or, but rather an all inclusiveness,
00:56:43
Speaker
then things began to make sense. But the problem in scientific research and the problem in medicine that has to do with alternative nutritional medicine is that it's this mindset about what is the ideal diet for everybody? What is the ideal
00:57:02
Speaker
protocol for arthritis? What is the protocol for cancer? What is the protocol for diabetes? It's looking for this one-to-one correspondence between food or supplements and symptoms and conditions, but that's the wrong question to ask.
00:57:19
Speaker
And yet, that's what all scientific research is based on. It's looking for this holy grail, this perfect diet for everybody, or this perfect protocol for everybody for a given condition. But that doesn't exist, and it never will exist because of metabolic individuality. I think that's the key. I mean, all of these researchers in the past were absolutely brilliant. Emmanuel Ravisi did 60 years of research
00:57:47
Speaker
aerobic anaerobic or catabolic anabolic and cancer and it was just the most brilliant unbelievable scientific mind and research and yet his vision was a tunnel vision he was consumed with that one fundamental control system but here's somebody else looking at the autonomic system here's somebody else looking at the oxidative system but it's always through that that one lens and
00:58:14
Speaker
So the key is to understand how these different fundamental homostatic control systems work together in terms of how foods and nutrients behave. And when you have that understanding, then you really have something.
00:58:29
Speaker
Right, right. Because I guess a lot of the diet books that are out there are people are looking to often to lose weight, aren't they? They're often looking for the weight loss solution.
Metabolic Typing and Weight Issues
00:58:39
Speaker
How does that factor into the metabolic typing approach? How would you explain that simply to someone who comes to you and says, you know, I'm 40 pounds overweight or 20 pounds overweight and I want to lose
00:58:52
Speaker
lose that. But you're telling me to eat more fat and protein. How is that going to help me? Surely I need to cut calories. Right. That's a really great question because it covers so much of our metabolic typing philosophy. So first of all, let's talk about one level first. And this is really, really important. And that is
00:59:17
Speaker
that we need to understand that any given condition, doesn't matter if we're talking about cancer or diabetes or arthritis or heart disease or just headaches or chronic fatigue or lack of sleep, any symptom, any condition can have numerous causes, numerous causal factors.
00:59:38
Speaker
And those causal factors can be at any level in the body. It could be at the organism level, the systemic level, the organ system, or organ gland tissue cell nuclear level. It could be structural. It could be physical. It could be due to the environmental factors like environmental toxins like heavy metals or chemical toxins.
01:00:05
Speaker
So it could be because the body is not getting everything that it needs, that it has a genetically based requirement for, or it could be due to the presence of what we would call stressors and blocking factors. These would be elements that are impacting the body that are having an adverse effect on the body.
01:00:28
Speaker
doesn't matter what we're talking about. If we're going to talk about being overweight, we have to understand that, yeah, weight problems in the majority of the cases come from diet, but they also can come from any of these other levels. It could come from an emotional stressor. It could come from a trauma from childhood. It could come from a structural imbalance that is accelerating the parasympathetic system and decreasing the metabolic rate.
01:00:54
Speaker
It could come from any of these stressors or blocking factors that we've identified in metabolic typing, or it could come from any of the imbalances in the fundamental homeostatic control systems.
01:01:05
Speaker
So the way to resolving the weight problem is to address the causal level. So that's what our system of metabolic typing is all about. It's all about getting to these specific causal levels. But talking about the diet itself, talking about food itself, if diet is the problem and food is the problem, what is going on? Well, what is happening is it's not a problem of the caloric intake.
01:01:34
Speaker
The problem is, what is the body doing with the calories that it's taking in? Is it burning those calories for energy the way it should? Or is it ending up storing those calories as fat because it has no other recourse? And that's what gets to, again, the heart of metabolic typing, that each person's body
01:01:56
Speaker
has genetically based requirements for nutrition, which means it has a need for specific types of foods and nutrients in order to fuel those cellular engines of metabolism, in order to provide the right kind of fuel
01:02:12
Speaker
for that person's body to function optimally. So if you get the body the wrong kind of fuel, it's not going to be combusted. It's not going to be oxidized. It's not going to be burned properly. And as a result, much of the calories that's taken in will be converted fat. So that's why different diets have different effects on different people. Some people need to eat high protein and fat
01:02:38
Speaker
in order to maximize their energy production and convert what they are eating to energy. So that would be somewhat like the Inuit, right? So if you put the Inuit on a vegetarian diet that's high in carbohydrates and low on protein and fat, do you think they're going to lose weight? No, they're not. Why? Well, because the fuel that they are getting
01:03:04
Speaker
which is high carbohydrate, low protein, low fat, that's the wrong kind of fuel for their genetically based requirements, which are high protein and high fat and little or even no carbohydrate. So it's all a matter of fuel, what kind of fuel you're giving your body. So foods and nutrients, all proteins are not the same, all fats are not the same, all carbohydrates are not the same, different metabolic types,
01:03:32
Speaker
due to those different genetic requirements based on geography and climate and the different types of foods available in their ancient history, they require different types of proteins, different types of carbohydrates, different types of fats. So that's all based on your genes. That's why there will never be one diet that's right for everybody. It's impossible.
01:03:59
Speaker
Yes, it's really interesting, you know, the whole concept of blocking factors, which is, which is, you know, it was, again, a real refreshing thing to see in your book, because it pieced a number of things together that I was beginning to understand. And of course, pull check has several good models of, of understanding the stresses on the body as well. So I was learning his work, and I was reading your book. And obviously, you had a few years of clinical experience, and it all really fell into place and made so much sense.
01:04:27
Speaker
But the interesting thing is that in the world of musculoskeletal medicine, particularly over the last five, maybe 10 years, but probably mainly the last five, there's an increasing awareness of how allostatic load, which is of course the kind of medical terminology for
Cumulative Stress and Health
01:04:44
Speaker
cumulative stress on the body or the effects that cumulative stress has on the body from multiple sources. How that is perhaps the key driver behind persistent pain and persistent or recurrent injury or a lot of these kind of often almost dustbin diagnosis type conditions like fibromyalgia or chronic fatigue syndrome, these kinds of things.
01:05:07
Speaker
And a little of it is driven by allostatic load, or you could say blocking factors, which are creating central sensitivity in the body. And then this array of symptoms emerges. So it really fits beautifully with with what you've been talking about for quite some time now. Yeah, I think it's exactly the same, the same idea. And in terms of nutrition and diet, and foods and nutrients,
01:05:36
Speaker
It's important to understand that stress is not universal for everyone, or a given experience is not universally experienced the same by every person. In one person, that experience can be a tremendous stress. In another person, it's just nothing at all.
01:05:58
Speaker
But how the body responds to stress, that's the key. But the body cannot respond to stress properly if it's not getting the kind of fuel that it has this genetically-based need for. And that's the key. I mean, there's very few stressors. If we had a long list of stressors that we could come up with, and it doesn't matter what we'd come up with. I'm looking at a list right now.
01:06:28
Speaker
aluminum cookware, air pollution, air fresheners, computer radiation, off-gassing of carpets, alcohol, cigarettes, pesticides. We can just list a very long list of stressors, but you will find very few stressors that we experience as human beings.
01:06:50
Speaker
that cannot be resolved by the body if the body has the proper food and the proper nutrients. If the body does not have the proper foods and proper nutrients for its genetically based requirements,
01:07:05
Speaker
then it cannot resolve that stress. It can't respond to the stress. It's like the body goes to the cupboard to get certain nutrients to respond to that stress, and those nutrients are not there. The cupboard's bare. So what can the body do? All it can do is keep trying, but it's going to get into that state of chronic stress defense, which in itself then becomes the major stressor that can lead to disease.
01:07:32
Speaker
And I guess this ties in with performance sports performance as well. You know, I think, of course, a lot of people think of nutrition, like we said, in terms of weight loss in terms of perhaps trying to improve their health. But but as you as you're explaining, you know, if the cell is unable to perform its role, because it doesn't have the nutrient densities and the nutrient proportions, ratios, etc, correct.
01:07:57
Speaker
then sports performance, work performance, concentration, all of these things are going to be inhibited as well.
Optimizing Performance with Nutrition
01:08:05
Speaker
Totally. This is kind of an overly simplified analogy, but I think it's effective. It really boils down to thinking in terms of the cells in your body as engines.
01:08:18
Speaker
We can call them engines of metabolism, right? I mean, that's where all the action takes place. I mean, what's the purpose of eating? We eat in order to take in calories, right? That's true. But what do we want to do with those calories? We want to convert them to energy.
01:08:37
Speaker
The purpose of eating is to consume nutrients to be taken to the cells, those 70 trillion cells in our body, which are like these little engines of metabolism, and get those nutrients converted to energy so that the cells can function normally or function optimally. And then when the cells function optimally,
01:08:58
Speaker
then the tissues and the organs and the glands and the systems that they comprise have the opportunity to function optimally.
01:09:07
Speaker
So in terms of sports performance, absolutely, that's the total key. So it's like thinking of an engine. You have to put gasoline into a gasoline engine. You have to put diesel into a diesel engine. You can't put diesel into a gasoline engine and expect to get the energy output. It's not going to happen. And the same thing in the body. So that determines the function of everything that takes place in the body, whether it's your mind and how quickly your mind works.
01:09:36
Speaker
or whether it's your emotions. Are you in control of your emotions? Or do you have an experience like you had, Matt, where you suddenly get this hyper state where you develop anxiety or you develop depression for, quote unquote, no apparent reason? Everything that takes place on your body, mentally, emotionally, physically,
01:09:57
Speaker
Everything in terms of sports, your drive, your energy, your motivation, your competitiveness, your quickness, your reaction time, it all depends upon energy production. And your ability to repair as well after a sports and to recover. Exactly. Exactly. And so those also depend on energy production.
01:10:18
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was gonna say that's the holy grail for a lot of sports people, isn't it? I mean, this is the very sort of principle under which anabolic steroids work, isn't it? It's not so much that they make the muscle grow quicker. There's a little bit of that as well. But it's that it allows you to get back in the gym and work harder. And so if you're eating
01:10:41
Speaker
macronutrient ratios that are inappropriate or imbalanced for your physiology, then your ability to recover from your workout or your training session or whatever is going to be compromised. That's right. That's right. Yeah. And one of the control systems that we work with is catabolic anabolic. So if you were eating a diet that is too catabolic and you're not supplying enough anabolic nutrients in your diet,
01:11:05
Speaker
you're going to slow down that recovery time. If you are eating a diet that is accelerating the sympathetic system instead of supporting the parasympathetic system, you also will slow down your recovery time because the sympathetic system is your catabolic system. It's the system that uses up your energy. Parasympathetic is your rest and digest and regenerate and rejuvenate system. So if you have an autonomic imbalance,
01:11:31
Speaker
where you're too sympathetic dominant and your diet is stimulating your sympathetic system and not your parasympathetic system, your recovery time is going to be exponentially slowed down. Absolutely. Yeah, for sure.
Adapting Diet Trends to Individual Needs
01:11:49
Speaker
One of the nutritional approaches that's been popular recently, probably for about 10 years, is this idea of the paleo approach. For me, when I saw it come out and was being labeled paleo, it was, I guess, because I'd heard you speak and I'd heard Paul speak and I had this general awareness of evolutionary principles,
01:12:11
Speaker
It didn't strike me as particularly anything new in the way they were talking. But what they were typically saying, and I think the pennies are beginning to drop now, is that they would say, we ate X amount of protein, X amount of fat, and this is the paleo diet. And I think it's only taken a few years and people have started to realize, ah, this isn't working for everyone.
01:12:38
Speaker
And I'm sure that came as no surprise to you, Bill. Right, for sure.
01:12:46
Speaker
What have you seen in terms of the sort of popular trends and where you've seen things perhaps come and go across your career? Is there anything that struck you as a great concept that you need to build into the system? I imagine there's plenty that you've looked at and just sort of shaken your head and gone, well, this just isn't taking into account biochemical individuality.
01:13:12
Speaker
Right. Well, how, how, why don't we do this, Matt? Why don't you, why don't you tell everyone what the paleo diet is or what your definition of a paleo diet is?
01:13:25
Speaker
All right. All right. Okay. Well, okay. So I think one of the fundamental principles is, if it wasn't here 10,000 years ago, you shouldn't be eating it in, you know, a loose sense, of course. But it should be all natural whole foods. Okay. Yeah, I think, I think, certainly what I was reading in the early days, was, you know, no grains, no dairy, minimize beans, because of the high lectin content.
01:13:54
Speaker
And in the in the earliest iterations it was a case of people talking about you need to eat more Game meat because it's low in saturated fats relative to farmed meats Yeah, it's somewhat lower in saturation. So they were trying to essentially try and make it fit with the heart hypothesis and then it switched to actually saturated fats are probably very healthy for you and
01:14:21
Speaker
then I think people are supposed to eat too many saturated fats. But the point is that it's gone through various iterations. But I think because people are realizing, oh, this doesn't quite fit, this doesn't quite work, this isn't for everyone. So maybe I answered your question for you. Yeah, that's good. No, that's good. So I think one of the foundational components of the paleo diet that I would agree with
01:14:49
Speaker
is this idea of eating foods in their natural state that were like they were 10,000 years ago. And we can take that back forever, 100,000 years ago, a million years ago. And that's an extremely important concept that I believe 100% in. The human body has existed on this planet for billions of years. And
01:15:19
Speaker
it has become adapted perfectly to the foods that come from the Earth, period. When you say the human body, you mean life has been here for billions of years? Right. But I'm... Or you mean human for millions, presumably. Right. And I just mean human beings and all life on this planet have adapted to the environment and have their
01:15:43
Speaker
they're natural foods. Human beings are different because we have free will, we can choose what we eat. And unlike certain species that may be located in certain parts of the earth, we're everywhere on the earth. But the point is that the human body
01:16:04
Speaker
is programmed genetically to utilize foods in its natural state. The foods that people are consuming today, you know, were not here 500 years ago or a thousand years ago or a million years ago. And that's, you know, that's a really big problem. But after that, except for that,
01:16:29
Speaker
I don't agree with the paleo dictates simply for what we talked about early that different geographical locations have made available different types of foods for different types of metabolisms. And the two groups that we talked about, you know, as kind of a shorthand are the Inuit with the all protein and fat and no carbohydrate and the two Cassinta who is all carbohydrate
01:16:59
Speaker
and very little or no protein and fat. So from that perspective, if we think in those terms and we imagine all the different geographical locations on the planet, all the different climates, all the different foods that were naturally available, I think what we would have to say is that if there is such a thing as a paleo diet,
01:17:25
Speaker
then we would have to say that there are different paleo diets for different metabolic types. So if we think in those terms, then I think paleo makes total sense.
01:17:41
Speaker
with the name itself, there's a little bit of a problem, isn't there? Because if you stop at the end of the Paleolithic, which was about 10,000, 12,000 years ago, and you ignore the fact that there's been evolution in the last 10,000 to 12,000 years, then you're missing quite a big chunk of the puzzle, right? That's right. That's right. Evolution continues. Not to mention the fact that
01:18:03
Speaker
Supposedly, you know, these ancient ancestors consumed around 1100 different types of foods. And we're consuming, you know, 10, 20, maybe 50, 60 different types of foods. Most people don't consume that many different types of foods at all. So if you're trying to eat that way, we can't even come close to eating that way. But I think the key really and the gem
01:18:31
Speaker
The Golden Globe in Paleolithic concept is the idea of eating foods in their natural state and then eating foods
01:18:42
Speaker
that are correct for your genetically based requirements, which really is about as close to paleo as we could ever hope to get, in my opinion. Yeah. And speaking of genetics, of course, this is a real buzz thing, particularly since the Human Genome Project was completed and increasingly the last few years where you've had things like 23andMe becoming available so people can actually
Dynamic Nature of Genetic Testing and Phenotype
01:19:08
Speaker
take their own genetic tests at a reasonable price. What's your view on genetic testing for metabolic type or for nutritional requirements? Well, that's a really great topic. I love that topic, but it's a really huge topic.
01:19:31
Speaker
Yes. So first of all, I think we have to understand that a gene test is testing your genes and your genes, that's set, that's immutable. Your genotype, which is what's being tested, that never changes. But what changes is what is called your phenotype. And phenotype really is a metabolic type, but we can talk about that
01:19:58
Speaker
terminology a little bit more later. But what scientists have really come to understand is that the key to genes and genetic testing is the environment because it's all about genetic expression, right? I mean, a single gene we know makes like 200 different types of proteins depending on its environment.
01:20:27
Speaker
So that's a real paradigm shift for those who thought that you could do a gene test and identify nutritional requirements because this means that your genome is like a warehouse of options just waiting to respond to the environment. The human genes themselves
01:20:49
Speaker
are not determining the outcome of biology. It's the effect of the environment, the epigenetics, the diet and the lifestyle and the stressors and the toxins and so forth. It's the effect of those factors on the genes that really determines that. So if you do a little math,
01:21:09
Speaker
and you calculate that one gene out of 25,000 genes, one gene creates 200 outcomes, and you multiply that by 25,000 genes, then there are millions of potential outcomes. Yes. Based on your environment. And then when you realize that there are literally thousands of
01:21:37
Speaker
genetic expressions or silencing that are going on every second in the body, then how can you possibly think that testing the genome alone, which is a set immutable entity, can tell you what your requirements for nutrients are? So it's really pretty ludicrous. And I quite honestly, Matt, I don't understand what's going on with people who are doing that either.
01:22:07
Speaker
Either they really don't understand the reality or this is just simply a way to make money because it's a very attractive concept that everybody would love to be true. But you cannot understand your phenotype, which is your metabolic type or your functional type or what your body needs right now based upon the effect of epigenetics, based on the effect of the environment on your body. You cannot understand that.
01:22:35
Speaker
Yeah, because it's such a dynamic. Yeah, it's dynamic. We have to change based upon the environment. Otherwise, we would die, but we couldn't survive.
01:22:47
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's fascinating. It's really it's really good to hear you talk about it in that way. Obviously, I've been aware of Bruce Lipton and his work since since around 2003 or something like that. I think his book Biology of Belief came out in 2001 and he I think really sort of led the charge with the discussion around epigenetics.
01:23:07
Speaker
And he obviously provides many examples of why the Human Genome Project was a huge disaster. And one of the examples he gives was that a lot of their earliest research was done on a parasite, which I forget the name of, but it was quite a small organism and it had 16,000 genes.
01:23:31
Speaker
And so then the next organism that they started to map the genes of was, I think, Drosphilia, which was a fruit fly. And I think they came up with something like 24,000 genes for this Drosphilia. And so they calculated that for an organism as complex as a human being, they'd expect about 125,000 genes.
01:23:55
Speaker
And then they found, is it 25 or 26? I forget what it is. 26,000, isn't it? Something like that. And then further studies found that the rice plant has 50,000 genes. You're like, it has a bit of a problem here with thinking that the genes are the be-all and end-all. And of course, he uses that to point to the fact that it's the epigenetic situation that determines which genes are activated or deactivated and so on. So, yeah.
01:24:24
Speaker
Yeah, it's how things get expressed. And in fact, a really beautiful example of the importance of understanding the metabolic type or the phenotype or the functional type, whatever name you want to give it, came really from Ravisi's work, Immanuel Ravisi, who did 60 years of research into cancer. And one of the brilliant things that he did was implant electrodes
01:24:51
Speaker
into tumors so that he could measure changes in pH based upon therapies that were applied to the person to deal with the cancer. And what he discovered, actually that all came about from him observing that patients would report an increase in pain at different times during the day.
01:25:17
Speaker
We ran some preliminary tests and found that he thought, well, there's probably a change in pH that's going on. So he wanted to confirm that, and so he implanted these electrodes, and indeed he found that when the pain got worse, the pH in the tumors would change. But what he discovered was that in some people, the tumors were acid, and in other people, they were alkaline. And that
01:25:46
Speaker
the pain worse got worse, the tumors either became more acid or they became more alkaline. But the important thing to understand about epigenetics and this whole discussion about metabolic typing is that he discovered much to his amazement and surprise that
01:26:07
Speaker
a tumor, an acid-based cancer, an acid-based tumor, when the correct therapy was applied that began to change the body's environment into an alkaline environment where the cancer could not survive because it was thriving in an acid environment. When that happened, the cancer could change its own metabolism to be alkaline-based as a defense against that alkaline therapy.
01:26:37
Speaker
Well, this shows us the importance of epigenetics, it shows us the importance of metabolic typing, and it shows us the fallacy of thinking that we can treat a person based upon genotype.
01:26:51
Speaker
which is a fifth type. You can't do that because the body is constantly reacting to the environment. You must understand the functional type, the metabolic type, the phenotype, the way it is now at this moment in time.
Tracking Phenotype Changes
01:27:07
Speaker
and be able to track its change through a methodology of retesting. And that's what we call metabolic typing. This is what we do. But if you can consistently and accurately track the changes that take place in a person's metabolic type, where the metabolic type changes and shifts, and then you change the protocol diet supplementation accordingly, then you can be highly effective with any degenerative disease. It doesn't matter what it is.
01:27:37
Speaker
Excellent, excellent. So is there any kind of carry over to the whole discussion around the microbiome? And, you know, obviously, there's there's been a few discussions that I've seen online and a YouTube TEDx talks and this kind of thing about the microbiome and how different different microbiomes will allow for
01:28:02
Speaker
different absorption of different foods, you know, different impacts on blood sugar. And the one I saw a few months back, this guy, an Israeli researcher was looking at how I think it was he was saying, you know, some people's blood sugar will stabilize when they eat ice cream. Whereas for others, it will sort of send their blood sugar rocketing upwards. Sure.
01:28:29
Speaker
And he had made a correlation with the microbiome. Now, do you think that there's likely to be a correlation between the microbiome and the metabolic type? Absolutely. In fact, I can tell you some clinical examples.
Addressing Microbiome Issues with Metabolic Typing
01:28:45
Speaker
One of the more common experiences that we see
01:28:51
Speaker
with metabolic typing is so many people these days have microbiome problems. They've got gastrointestinal issues, poor digestion, belching, burping, stomach pains, constipation, diarrhea, bloating, all of these types of symptoms that relate to the microbiome.
01:29:17
Speaker
It's really amazing to me, and I shouldn't be amazed by this, but honestly, even after 40 years, I still get blown away by metabolic typing, by what we see. Because so many of these people, when they come to us, and we tend to be way down on the list, they've been to many other practitioners before they find us, but they've been dealing with these bloating problems and microbiome problems for so long.
01:29:45
Speaker
and literally within even like 24 hours or 48 hours of starting foods that are right for their type, those symptoms go away. There's no bloating, there's no gas, there's no pain.
01:29:59
Speaker
their constipation changes, their diarrhea goes away. I mean, it's absolutely extraordinary. So again, it's all about finding what one person's body needs, what that person's genetically based requirements are for nutrition. If you do that, the microbiome takes care of itself. But if you don't do that, if you eat foods that are wrong for you,
01:30:26
Speaker
then you've got real problems because all kinds of bad things start to happen. And there's so many different scenarios that we could use to illustrate. For example, let's say you are a parasympathetic dominant and you are eating a diet that is too high in carbohydrates. And as a result of that, you're increasing that parasympathetic innervation, which is causing your blood sugar to become low
01:30:53
Speaker
So you're developing hypoglycemia. Now, as a result of that, your sympathetic system kicks in, the alarm reaction takes over, fight or flight takes over, cortisol is released to elevate blood sugar. And you don't know what you're doing.
01:31:08
Speaker
So you continue eating the wrong foods. You think vegetarian diet's good for you. Keep eating the wrong diet. This situation perpetuates. The hypoglycemia continues. The sympathetic cortisol high blood sugar elevation continues. Now you're developing
01:31:24
Speaker
diabetes. And the chronic cortisol elevation is breaking down your microbiome. Now you're getting ingress of bad substances, pathogens. You're developing food sensitivities and continues. Now you're developing autoimmunity. And why did all this happen? Why did this cascade happen for one reason?
01:31:48
Speaker
you did not give your body the types of foods that it's designed to utilize. So that then influenced the microbiome, and off you go. You've got a whole cascade, like Domino's falling, of adverse reactions.
01:32:03
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, amazing. Amazing. It is amazing. Well, yeah, yeah. And I think for some people, it's almost too simple to be true. And, you know, when I say simple, I'm not saying that in any disrespectful way. There's actually, again, I mentioned it in my preview, there's a lovely illustration of simplicity and complexity where you've got this kind of, what's it called?
01:32:30
Speaker
inverted U shape graph. I'm trying to think of the term for it. My brain's just not quite firing on all cylinders just all of a sudden, but bell shaped curve. Yeah, that's what I'm thinking of. So you got this bell shaped curve and on the left hand vertical axis, the y axis, you've got complexity.
01:32:55
Speaker
And then on the x axis, the horizontal axis, you've got elegance. And so it starts out the curve is labeled simplicity on the left hand side, but with a bracket saying dumbing down, okay, so you're kind of dumbing it down, your elegance isn't so good, the complexity is still pretty low.
01:33:14
Speaker
And then as you move up that bell shaped curve towards the peak, of course, you're getting closer and closer towards complexity, you know, sort of optimal or maximal complexity. And your elegance is still improving, of course, because you know more or you know, you can apply more concepts and information. But then you go over the peak of that, that bell shaped curve, and you're going down the other side. And now your elegance is improving even more so. And it strikes me that metabolic typing is on the other side of the curve, right? There's a lot of simplicity there.
01:33:44
Speaker
But you have to almost work through the complexity first. It's not a case of, you know, you can't just guess or jump to the end of the curve. There's obviously, as you've just explained over the last hour and a half, there's been a huge amount of detail and thinking and research that's gone into this. So you have to work through the complexity. But ultimately, at the other end,
01:34:10
Speaker
often the solutions are relatively simple. Now, have you got any other sort of examples you can think of or could you explain that perhaps in your own words as to how we can find the order from the chaos or simplicity within the complexity through metabolic typing? Well, I think first of all, that's a beautiful concept and I agree with it. And I think that, you know, nature
01:34:39
Speaker
is on one hand infinitely complex, but at the same time there's always simplicity in nature.
Simplicity and Effectiveness of Metabolic Typing
01:34:48
Speaker
Everywhere, on every level, there's that principle of least action. Nature will always take the shortest access possible for any situation. So I think that that's a principle that is found throughout nature.
01:35:04
Speaker
And so on one hand, we are talking about a concept that appears incredibly simple, and it is, but its clinical application is complex in the sense that metabolic individuality is real. There are no two people who are identical.
01:35:25
Speaker
Everyone is unique on every single level of the body. And they're also unique in terms of their health issues and the underlying causal factors that apply to those issues. So in one person, you may have a situation where they only need to change their diet.
01:35:48
Speaker
and that cancer tumor will disappear within three or four weeks. And we have seen that happen many times. But in somebody else, they may have the wrong diet, but they also have an emotional trauma of some kind or an emotional stress or maybe a marriage or maybe something at work. They're doing work that makes them so unhappy. They hate going to work every day.
01:36:14
Speaker
and they may be exposed to serious amounts of environmental toxins. Maybe they've got air fresheners in their car and in every room in their house. There's complexity in the metabolic individuality, and yet the principles couldn't be simpler. And those two principles that we work with in metabolic typing are, number one,
01:36:39
Speaker
give the body all of the right things, everything for which it has a genetically based requirement. And number two, get rid of all the stressors and blocking factors in that person's lifestyle, in those epigenetics that that person encounters on a daily basis. And if you do that,
01:36:59
Speaker
then the innate intelligence of the body that's in every single cell that knows what to do and knows how to do it perfectly, then that computer-like program runs to fruition. Then it really and truly is possible to experience your full genetic potential and live the way it's supposed to be lived. Wow. Fantastic. Fantastic.
01:37:27
Speaker
Lovely. Well, you know, I guess from my perspective, one of the things that struck me is that, you know, one of the things that you've recommended for a long time is to eat healthy, cold, clean, organic foods. And that's
01:37:44
Speaker
that cuts out so much kind of detail is to you know or not detail but again complexity in terms of what if you to buy just standard commercially grown or farmed foods there's so many factors there that are going to be affecting you nutritionally not just from
01:38:04
Speaker
the nutrient densities within the foods but from the chemicals that are used to grow the foods or medicines, steroids, whatever it might be, right your way through to the various
01:38:19
Speaker
chemicals that used to store the foods and to preserve the foods and also the emotions of the animals and the care of the produce and so on and so forth. There's so many factors there, but if you just eat organic whole foods or fresh locally farmed foods from someone you know, that's just such a simple thing that you can do that cuts out a lot of complexity for people.
01:38:45
Speaker
And also, I think within the metabolic typing framework, one of the things that you encourage people to do is to do a diet check record and to really begin to listen to their bodies. So they're really starting to have this enhanced awareness of how their body responds to foods.
01:39:07
Speaker
And I think in this day and age where everyone's got apps on their phone for exercise and for diet and for all kinds of other funky gadgetry for trying to do the right thing in their lives, just to actually listen to the body and to train yourself to have that awareness is such a simple thing to do. It's almost
01:39:29
Speaker
too difficult to believe that it could be that simple. But that's part of the process as well, isn't it? And I assume that was part of your key goal from the word go was to help direct people with the testing that you offer, but then to make them self-sufficient, essentially. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. And that comes with health. When you develop true health, then life becomes very simple.
01:39:59
Speaker
The whole idea is to develop that optimal health to unfold your genetic potential and to live life the way it's meant to be lived. We're not meant to live life where we're watching every little thing and counting calories and weighing out our food and doing all those things. Totally unnecessary. We just need foods that are right for our type. Understand how those foods are affecting our body.
01:40:24
Speaker
as you mentioned, through our diet check records and monitor that and make adjustments as your body changes. And these are very simple things that become second nature. And when you get to that point, life becomes very beautiful and very simple. And I guess the whole thing with
Balancing Foods and Macronutrients
01:40:45
Speaker
having an increased awareness or enhanced awareness of how the macronutrients respond in the body, which is really the focus, isn't it, of the nutritional coaching that we take people through in metabolic timing? Well, there's two things. You have to use the right foods. In other words, if you are a sympathetic dominant, there are certain types of proteins that you should have in certain proteins you should stay away from. Yes. And if you're a sympathetic dominant, the reverse is true.
01:41:13
Speaker
or a fast oxidizer, slow oxidizer, whatever it may be. So it's really two things, the right kinds of foods and the right macronutrient ratios. You need both of those things together. And the right macronutrient ratios has a lot to do with that oxidation rate with the conversion of nutrients into energy. If you get the wrong macronutrient ratios,
01:41:40
Speaker
then that energy production will be completely disrupted. You'll either become very hyperactivated, anxious, nervous, irritable, uptight, short-tempered,
01:41:51
Speaker
maybe hungry, maybe craving sweets, or if you eat too many proteins and fats, you'll go the other way. But it really doesn't matter in terms of the symptoms. It's all a matter of getting the right balance of proteins, fats, and carbohydrates for your metabolic type, for your body. And when you get that dialed in,
01:42:14
Speaker
It's amazing what happens. Then you really don't have any cravings and your energy doesn't drop from one meal to the next. You know, you don't get that afternoon slump where you feel like taking a nap or you don't feel exhausted and tired when you get home at night. You can really enjoy your evening. I used to have those slumps when I was a vegetarian. What's that? I used to have those afternoon slumps when I was a vegetarian, but that's not as surprising as a fast up today. That's right. Exactly.
01:42:43
Speaker
Yeah. And not to be in a vegetarian. It's okay if that's right for your metabolic type. Yeah. And how do you know by how you feel? You know, everybody who's listening, who's wondering, gee, I wonder if I'm eating right for my metabolic type. It's really easy to answer that question. Just see how you feel after you eat. How do you feel between breakfast and lunch? Do you feel great? Do you have plenty of energy? Do you have no cravings? Are you not hungry before you need to eat at lunchtime? Are your moods good? Does your mind work well?
01:43:13
Speaker
or not? Does your mind get spacey? Do you lose your track of thinking? Do you get angry? Do you feel irritable? Do you feel short tempered? Do you feel depressed? Do you get anxious? How do you feel?
01:43:27
Speaker
So if you're eating right for your type, you can just check off all the boxes. You feel great. You've got plenty of energy. Your mind works great. Your moods are great. You know, everything is copacetic. You've got a skip in your step, a song in your heart. You know, you just feel terrific. And that's the way we're supposed to feel.
01:43:45
Speaker
Yeah, fantastic. And I guess also, if you get the macronutrients right and you're eating the right types of macronutrients, the right foods for you, then the micronutrients tend to take care of themselves, don't they? Because they tend to be packaged in with those macronutrients if you're eating whole foods. That's a good question. Yeah, go on. You know, the answer to that is yes and no. Yes, in the sense that you're getting the right balance of micronutrients, but
01:44:15
Speaker
Depending upon your lifestyle, and depending upon how much stress you've got, depending upon how many environmental toxins your body is dealing with, you may need nutritional supplements to really get to that optimal state. Because remember, it's all about defense and adaptation to stress. And stress increases the need for nutrients, or say it differently, stress depletes nutrients in the body.
01:44:45
Speaker
So if you're living a really kind of sedate lifestyle, maybe you're out in the country away from stress for the most part, maybe you're kind of retired, have plenty of money, don't have to work, you're just kind of living a nice lifestyle with not very much stress. And you're already to that point of doing pretty well in terms of your health.
01:45:09
Speaker
then yeah, I think food is gonna be sufficient. But if you're leading a pretty active lifestyle and you're living in the city and you've got a lot of stress going on for a lot of different reasons, food alone may not do it for you. So it's an individual consideration. And so you've got a chronic degenerative condition and you're on medications or needing to see doctors for some reason,
01:45:35
Speaker
then food alone, it may not be enough. It just depends. Again, it's metabolic individuality. There's no answer that is going to be exactly right for everybody. Yeah. Yeah.
Foundational Metabolic Processes
01:45:47
Speaker
One of the concepts that I talk about in my introduction to the podcast is the idea of attractors or attractor states.
01:45:59
Speaker
It struck me as you were talking earlier about the fundamental homeostatic control systems of the body that really, proteins, fats and carbohydrates are essentially attractors for the homeostatic control systems. Because they are what create the stability for the systems. And that's what that's the definition of an attractor status is a stable state that a system returns to. And so, you know, in this
01:46:25
Speaker
scenario, it's the proteins, fats and carbohydrates. And of course, as we've just discussed, the micronutrients associated with them that create the balance for those systems to then work around, as it were. Would that be a fair comment? I think so. I think so. And
01:46:49
Speaker
There are other factors also that really have to be taken into consideration. We refer to those as fundamental metabolic processes. And these processes are, did I say fundamental? I meant to say foundational metabolic process. Right. Yeah.
01:47:08
Speaker
And in these processes, if they are not what they should be, those in themselves can have an adverse effect on the fundamental homostatic controls. So these are things like sleep, exercise, circulation, digestion, elimination, detoxification, things like these that are foundational metabolic processes. If those are disrupted,
01:47:35
Speaker
then they're going to adversely impact the fundamental homie static controls and lead to imbalance and inefficiency in those control systems. And that is going to lead to failure to adapt to stress, which leads to chronic degeneration.
01:47:53
Speaker
So we're reading more and more about these types of things these days. We're reading how important sleep is to our microbiome, to our brain, to inflammation. So these fundamental or foundational metabolic processes are
01:48:11
Speaker
incredibly critical. And these are also elements that we deal with in metabolic type. We want to optimize each of those in every patient that we work with to assure that these control systems are going to be free to function the way they're designed.
01:48:28
Speaker
Yeah, fantastic.
Future of Individualized Nutrition
01:48:30
Speaker
Well, to round off, I'm wondering what you see as the future of nutrition and holistic health. I kind of think I know the answer because we've just been talking about it. But how would you encapsulate the future and where you see things going? You know, it's an interesting question. I can tell you what I hope will happen. I hope that all of the good things that are happening these days
01:48:57
Speaker
with functional medicine and that type of approach, even though I think it's really lacking in some areas, it's the right direction that things are starting to turn. If it continues to move towards really focusing on asking the question, what is right for this person as opposed to what do I do for this condition?
01:49:25
Speaker
that I think the future is very, very bright.
01:49:28
Speaker
But if the scientific minds, if the scientific research are going to continue to ask those allopathic questions about, what supplement do I take for this condition? What diet do I need to take to lose weight? What medication do I need to address this disease? Then we're not going to change. We're not going to get anywhere. But I would say in the last 40 years,
01:49:59
Speaker
that I've been involved, there has been a shift. It's the beginnings of a real paradigm change that is looking to the individual and asking the right questions. And if we can ask the right questions about that individual, then we're going to get the right answers. And we're going to really enter kind of a golden age of health care. That's what I hope and that's what I work towards.
01:50:25
Speaker
Fantastic. Fantastic. Well, thank you very much, Bill, for all your time today and your wealth of experience and wisdom. That's fantastic. I always love to communicate with you, whether it's via email or on Skype or whatever. You're a font of knowledge. Thank you. It's a real pleasure. Thank you. Appreciate it.
01:50:45
Speaker
Thank you. And if people want to know more about your work, learn more about your work, obviously we've mentioned the metabolic typing book, which where's the best place to get hold of that? Get that on Amazon. They want to reach us. You can just go to metabolictyping.com and follow the links accordingly. Excellent. Fantastic.
01:51:10
Speaker
Thank you very much. I hope we get to chat again further down the line. Very good. Thank you so much. All the best.
01:51:20
Speaker
Thank you for listening to FC20. If you enjoyed that and found it useful, please do feel free to share it with any friends, colleagues, or loved ones that you think would benefit. If you'd like to learn more about metabolic typing itself, then Bill's book, The Metabolic Typing Diet, is an excellent resource, or you can go to www.metabolictyping.com. If you want to learn what your metabolic type is, you can do that online at Bill's site, or with any certified metabolic typing advisor, including at my own site, mattwalden.com.
01:51:50
Speaker
Thanks for listening, see you next time.