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Rachael Renae
51 Plays1 day ago
Rachael Renae is an artist, play enthusiast, and creativity hype gal based in Detroit, MI. She helps people prioritize play to overcome creative blocks, better connect with themselves and their people, and confidently live big, fulfilling lives. When she’s not facilitating play workshops or co-hosting the Chaotic Creatives podcast, she’s likely gabbing with pals over voice notes and making a papier-mache project.
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Transcript
00:00:02
Speaker
You are listening to Something Rather Than Nothing. Creator and host, Ken Valente. Editor and producer, Peter Bauer.
00:00:17
Speaker
Hello, everybody. This is Ken Vellante with Something Rather Than Nothing podcast. I have Rachel Verne on the show, and going hear some enthusiasm in my voice because Rachel's new book, Prioritize Play, is out. And in case you're wondering who Rachel is, Rachel is an artist, play enthusiast, and creativity hype gal based in Detroit, Michigan.
00:00:39
Speaker
She helps people prioritize play to overcome creative blocks, better connect with themselves and their people, and confidently live big, fulfilling lives.
00:00:50
Speaker
When she's not facilitating play workshops or co-hosting the Chaotic Creatives podcast, she's likely gabbing with pals over voice notes and making a weird paper mache project. Yes, Rachel, you're perfect for the show. Welcome on.
00:01:04
Speaker
Thank you so much for having me. Thrilled to be here. I, um, it's a weird note to connect on, but I very rarely ever see people chatting over voice notes, which is something that I do. And I think there's nobody in the world, not nobody in the world, you do it.
00:01:20
Speaker
But, um, I try to build up the habits and other people because my brain process, everything. And I'm thinking if I want to talk to you, Rachel, I'm going to leave you two and a half minutes, everything that's in my head and leave a voice note for you. So.
00:01:32
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, I love it. I love it. I feel like it's in today's age when when it's harder to connect in person, i feel better connected when I can hear my friend's voice and yeah update. you know It's like, yeah, we could do a phone call and we do those. But sometimes you just want to share a little piece of information, share a little thing that happened in a day. And I like to do that via voice note.
00:01:54
Speaker
Yeah, and we say it's a little piece of information, but could be a lot. It could be a lot, but no, I love it. um You know, I interview a lot of a lot of artists, guests, um and, you know, authors and and those who put out books. um Take us into, like, right now, I always get excited for an author. You know, you got your your book out there. I saw there was just an absolutely fantastic kind of, like,
00:02:19
Speaker
event that you put on ah book launch. But with everything that's going on right now with Prioritize Play just been out for um just a week or two. ah Rachel, tell us about what it's been like, you know, with this book out in the world and what's been going on for you lately.
00:02:40
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. It's ah two weeks today, and the day we're recording, that ah the book has been out. And it still doesn't feel real for me because this is my first book. um and But i'm I'm getting so much great feedback already, people saying that they're loving it, that it is impacting them, that they're sharing it with their people. And that's exactly what I hope to do. I just want people to realize that we are...
00:03:09
Speaker
in charge of creating the lives that we want and, and play, I think is a really approachable tool that we can use to start doing that. It's a great, um, it's a great guy. Like, I don't know what the term like guide, but like just listeners, um,
00:03:26
Speaker
As a book, it's it's it's a beautiful a beautiful, inviting book ah with illustrations and lots of activities. And like once you hear activities, like a lot of us like rush through books. and But like with the activities, like and going through it, there's things for me to do later. There's things that I can do right now. And even just what I wrote, like on one of these prompts, you have, I had this amazing experience when I looked at the prompt and I'm like, I don't even remember writing that idea down. And it was just like, it was just last week. And I'm like, that's a really strange idea. So just the type of thing where it captures, um, uh, where you're at.
00:04:04
Speaker
Um, we're talking about play here. And of course, uh, um I'm assuming with us being artistically inclined, like a play isn't so abnormal, but, but culturally, but culturally, I think you, you, you deal with this, right? Like you talk to people right now, everybody's busy, everybody's so busy, right? Like speed up in the world, you know, whatever it's moving towards. And then artists ah point to, as you do and discover, Hey, look, um,
00:04:36
Speaker
you're super creative by you being a human um and um in in re-engaging ah with with play, which you know some people might find frivolous. But what is what is it that you want to do helping folks, you know and whether it's going back in time or finding the activity that they want?
00:04:58
Speaker
Why play and and and what does what does play like lead us to it like as far as as a human artist? Yeah, yeah. i I started using the language of play because – I have always been a creative person, but I think I buried it to kind of chase these societal expectations that I didn't i didn't even realize I was chasing. Sort of like the career milestones and the the social milestones of of find a partner, get married, buy a house, mow your lawn. Like I think so many of us don't.
00:05:37
Speaker
fall into, especially into adulthood, like you said, we're so busy and it's easy to kind of get caught up in the urgency and the like, I have to spend all of my time being productive. I have to climb the career ladder. i have to do these things in order to feel successful. And without realizing it, our life is kind of passively happening to us. And I think that that is what was happening to me and my creativity that I was stifling to kind of chase those milestones, even even subconsciously. I don't think i it was a conscious effort.
00:06:11
Speaker
i The creativity was bubbling up. It was just like, you got to let me out. i need to i need to have an outlet. And i my story is interwoven in the book. And I talk about how I was using my career title as my identity without realizing it And I just don't think that humans are meant to identify with their jobs. I think we're we're meant to identify with the things that light us up and how we connect with people. Like we ask kids, what do you want to be when you grow up?
00:06:43
Speaker
And they say, and we expect, adults expect answers like fireman, teacher, engineer, lawyer, whatever. but You could ideally expect answers of, I want to be funny. i want to be a good friend. I want to be kind. I want to be creative. But the way that our culture is right now, it just that's not sort of the mindset that our society encourages. And so i explored my creativity and i got to a point where I was putting a ton of pressure on it to make money. And then I was like, I just want to do something for fun for me. yeah And when I gave myself permission to do that, my life changed. I was like, oh, this doesn't have to have any purpose other than making me happy. And when I started doing that, I started chasing more things like that. But when I started talking about it in this term in the terms of creativity, because like you said, we're artists. That's that's kind of how we think. Yeah.
00:07:42
Speaker
I got a lot of pushback from people saying, well, that's easy for you. You're creative. I'm not creative. And I just think that creativity is a natural human urge or experience. It's just that we have such narrow views of what creativity is. so people in general might think of creativity as making a painting or or dressing in a weird way, but it could be making a meal or it could be how you how you invite conversation over dinner. And I realized that if I use the language of play, it's ah approachable to more people while still getting at that creativity outlet. And that was a long-winded answer to your question. Oh, this is long-winded show. This is long-winded show. um
00:08:28
Speaker
No, like, ah i you know, so I've i've talked – towards over 300 episodes on the show. And I found it um fascinating for me that my interaction with artists develops the show and moves it to a different way. And one of the pieces it did is like, I started as like art and philosophy show, right? Like kick it around. it kind of means like I could talk to anybody who's a creative, but the piece that I added on like soon thereafter, people asked what the show is. I said, it's art and philosophy and liberation.
00:09:04
Speaker
And, like, for me, it was, like, everybody I was talking to, and nobody had it all figured out. We're humans. But they were liberating themselves from an idea, from the the childhood negative criticism, from the the partner that said, you have to make money this way and that. Like, there was...
00:09:24
Speaker
this liberation process, which for me, social activists and such is like so important. I love being around people where they're like, I'm going to shed this and I'm going to add that. And, it was a surprise for me to experience that through the journey of doing the show. It's like, you think you create the, like what it is and this is what it is. And then you're like, Oh, since I embarked on this, I'm in a different place. And I got to i gotta to recognize that. Talking about, like, when you talked about your shift, it's like ah the idea of a total transformation in in in in in in in in freeing.
00:10:02
Speaker
You were engineering, right? Weren't you? Right. So, yeah. So, like, I was reading that. i was like, oh, gosh, like, I can see that i could see the the hard, to not necessarily, but, like, a hard tension, right?
00:10:16
Speaker
building up there. ah I was talking about the podcast of my podcast, like in it like the sense of exploration, and I've listened to your podcast, Chaotic ah Creatives, and i I really, really enjoy it. I i wanted to ah ask you that particular way of going through the issues that you talk about. What has the podcast done like as a way of you developing your big themes?
00:10:44
Speaker
Oh, i love I love that you talked about your experience with like realizing that liberation came with it too because I feel the same way about about my journey but also about the podcast where it's like I have these ideas and general philosophies on my work or connecting with people or… art in general. And just through conversations with other curious people, and my podcast co-host is another curious person, yeah yeah these these through lines emerge and you don't even realize that it's happening. But I always go back and listen to our episodes so I can be like, what did we talk about? Because we it's conversational. We ramble, go on a side quest. But there are through lines that emerge. And I think that
00:11:31
Speaker
That is, that's what's so beautiful about conversations and like the sort of lack of expectation that we put on the podcast. It's just like, Hey, let's talk about the things that we're going through. Cause that's ultimately relatable to people. And I'm sure you've experienced that as well, but just through, through curiosity, um, there's so much learning that can happen in a conversation even.
00:11:56
Speaker
Yeah, and the ability to be wrong, which, you know, not wrong, but you know what I'm saying? Like, when when when you the expectations and you're off and stuff, you have to like, in the whole bit, like, you talk about it in a book, ah like,
00:12:11
Speaker
in that growth and the, like the cringe is what makes us real. Like, and, and for me, like, I want to, i want to read you little part of the book that was like super important um for me. Great. can't wait to hear Yeah. So you asked the initial ah reflection questions at the in the beginning of the book, and then you say, are there things you want to work on changing or evolving? I still frequently think of myself as, quote unquote, annoying, but I know that my enthusiasm is actually one of my superpowers.
00:12:44
Speaker
Being too much is relative. I'm obnoxious to some people, but but not expressive enough to others. Once we start to identify the traits we want to be perceived with and we identify which negative traits we associate with ourselves, we can start to work on them.
00:13:02
Speaker
And I think like, there's such like an affirmation of like the too muchness um that is there. And it's just the the language that you use just like really kicked to me because I've said that in my life. Like I like whether it's in relationships and like it can, when you have a lot of energy and and and enthusiasm, be like,
00:13:26
Speaker
when you're engaging with people and you see them trail off and they don't dislike you or anything like that, but you see that. So it really recognized a phenomenon, but also like going in and being like, you know what? Like I'm me and, and, in and, and I'm not too much or, or, or too little. That was like really pivotal, like ah for me to read. And I think it's really good.
00:13:51
Speaker
um Like as a, like as a basis when you're going and into play is like, Don't take yourself so seriously. Make mistakes. Who gives a fuck what other people are saying when you're going down to it and you're lining in with what you want to do? And um that was a great ah affirmation to me. How did you get to that point where you could say that in that journey you? How did you get to that point where you're just like, I am me?
00:14:17
Speaker
I mean, like I say in the book, it it's imp it's imperfect. I talk about imperfect action. And I think – I mean, I still feel that way. I still feel like I'm annoying. But it's like being aware of it is the first step. And then giving myself – like treating myself as if I were talking to a best friend where it's like – I don't think you're annoying.
00:14:44
Speaker
i think you're amazing. And the right people will find you as long as you're being yourself. And I think for so long, I dimmed a lot of my light and enthusiasm because I i wanted to be taken seriously and be a professional. And I think so many people do that. And we can be taken seriously When we are enthusiastic, I think when we can find the things like our our natural like gifts and talents, when we can be living in that world, it doesn't matter how enthusiastic or like obnoxious you are.
00:15:16
Speaker
You can still be serious. Like I literally wrote a book about play because I'm so excited about it. And worked hard on it. I worked hard. Yeah. and And one doesn't negate the other. And I think for a long time, I think I thought that it did. Like, oh, well, if I'm like giggly and asking silly questions and I'm wholesome, then I will not be taken seriously. And or I'm not attracting the the like cool, quote unquote, cool people into my life. And I don't want to attract...
00:15:46
Speaker
quote unquote cool people. I want to attract people who are authentically connecting with me because we have shared interests and they they value what I value in myself. So to answer your question, um I think a lot of it was therapy and self-reflection and thinking about like, okay, why do I feel insecure about this thing? Or like, can I name it? And I think that's what I try to get people to do in the book is like,
00:16:10
Speaker
just becoming aware of the maybe limiting beliefs that we have about ourselves and what we're allowed to have in our lives. And a lot of that is just like, you know, from like you mentioned earlier, experiences like getting criticized in in your elementary art school class or or, you know, you had a rough childhood or a bad partner or a bad boss. All of us have these limiting experiences And it's kind of like, how can we work to acknowledge them and be nice to ourselves and just like really think about what lights me up the most? What's going to make me happiest in my life?
00:16:48
Speaker
And like if judgment weren't an issue, if money weren't an issue, how would I want to live? And we may not be able to do that because we live in a world where judgment and money are issues and we have to pay our bills. um But what little steps can we take to kind of like just be in the direction of the life that we're craving or yearning for?
00:17:07
Speaker
Yeah. I love, love that spot. um Talk about some, some, some, some art questions. And what I wanted to ask you is when, when did you see yourself as an artist? When did that happen? Like,
00:17:22
Speaker
Was it a moment or... Yeah, that's a great question. and it's it's um when When I first started doing um talk therapy, ah maybe like six or seven years ago, i remember feeling this discontent with my life. Like, just like, oh, I just sort of feel like i'm i I want something bigger, but I can't articulate what it is. Like, this isn't the life I'm supposed to live.
00:17:47
Speaker
But I don't know what life I'm supposed to live. I just don't feel good. and um It's, you know, through classic therapy questions, we we got to the point where I couldn't even call myself a creative, even though anyone that knows me for my entire life would say that I'm a creative person. Really? You couldn't even say that? Yeah. i couldn't even say creative. and And so like to first admit, like, I want to be an artist. That felt like I'm not allowed to have that. I didn't go to art school. i don't have, you know, disposable income that I can just like live off of so that I can make art all day and lounge around in Southern France. Like I had, I had these like judgments and these like expectations of what it meant to be an artist. And so through a lot of reflection and I've read a million self-help books, the artist way was really impactful. I quote Julia Cameron a lot in the book. um
00:18:37
Speaker
I realized like, oh, it's not, it's not, selfish to want to live the life that I want to live. And that's okay and so i do this thing where I tell the people I work with, like, what what title do you want to have? And for me, it's like capital A artist. And um i I say, we got cosplay as that version until it feels real. So I was introducing myself as an artist. And I did this on the podcast. I said it. I was like, I'm on on my podcast, Chaotic Craves. i I was like, I'm going to practice introducing myself as an artist. Sure.
00:19:16
Speaker
And so I did that for like a season, still didn't feel real. um i think... I am still in the practicing phase. I think i know i know it's true I'm making art. i I make art every day. um But I don't know what it will take for it to feel like this is real. So I'm like, I'm okay with cosplaying as it if it takes forever. you know This is my armor. my it's It's my you know costume that I'm putting on of artist. And then eventually won't feel so much like a costume.
00:19:49
Speaker
Wow. Wow. I was just listening to your answer. as ah this is it's It's like a ah ah ah great surprise, but it makes um inherent sense. Well, let me ask, let me ask, um let me ask, we're using like art in like the big word art.
00:20:08
Speaker
What is our what What do you view as as as art in your relationship you know with you being an artist? Mm-hmm. I love this question. And I think i i I like being naive to like the capital A art world. like i Like you said, I was an engineer. I went to engineering college. That's what my degrees are in. um I have no formal art education. So I don't know how things work. And for a long time, I felt like that was – To my detriment, but I actually think like me being naive to things gives me freedom. Like it I have no idea what I'm quote unquote supposed to do. So I just do what feels good.
00:20:52
Speaker
and art for me in this exploration that I've been in the last couple of years is cross making the weird shit in my brain, ah but really processing what I'm feeling. And it doesn't have to be an exact representation of that, but art is a practice that I'm doing to connect with myself.
00:21:14
Speaker
It's not necessarily about the product. It's about the process of making. Yeah, yeah. i yeah i I just love that answer. what What's the... um I ask also, like, right now, ah anybody I talk to, i don't know, it's my own disposition, right? Like, let's take the world frame right now, 2026, like, temperatures getting hot ah getting hotter, and and and you got ah you got these fucking data centers that are gobbling up water, and... like
00:21:47
Speaker
like Everything like geopolitical stuff. And so the times feel different. They feel different to me. um I also know that humans always think the end is coming. It's always around the corner. I also know that too. But is there something is there something ah about ah the role of art right now as we're talking 2026? Is there something different about the role of art or is art just arting as it has in a different way?
00:22:13
Speaker
Ooh, that's a good question. I feel, again, because I feel so naive to sort of the like the corporate art world. Like, I don't know anything about galleries or what it means to be successful. I know what it means for me to be successful. And I think we all need to define our own level of success. um And that's just, like, I get to make my art.
00:22:36
Speaker
That's it. That's success for me. It's, like, I have the space, time, and resources to make what I want to make. um But I think... I think art is more, and maybe like you said, humans have always thought that the ends are the end is coming. We're living in the worst possible timeline, whatever.
00:22:54
Speaker
But I think it's so important because I think we're all, so many of us are like cogs in this late stage capitalist machine where we don't have time and we've lost our our sense of community and identity. And I think art and play for me are tools that we can use to reconnect with ourselves to figure out like, what does it mean to be me? Like, what, who am i What makes me happy? What do I enjoy doing? And then also by doing that, the more that we can
00:23:28
Speaker
figure out who we are and and live that version, cosplay as that version of ourselves that we want to be, the the more we'll be able to connect with others who feel the same way and and disconnect from sort of that productivity. I'm only successful if I'm making a lot of money, if I'm climbing the corporate ladder, like the liberation that you talked about, where it's like, we need to redefine what success in life means. And I think art is a huge component of that. that we have maybe lost, but many of us are finding our way back to.
00:24:03
Speaker
that make sense? Yeah, it sure does. i bet I've been... noticing, like even in our and talking in the conversation and talking about like the the like the lack of background. I'm fascinated that by that because um like my my trajectory and like using art or thinking about ah being an artist is um I can tell you for sure that I've literally never had a formal art class, like an extended formal art class.
00:24:39
Speaker
I know, and I've loved doing this as i've ah as I've lived, I've dropped into like workshops and stuff like that and been enthralled by that. um So it's been intermittent and absolutely enjoyed that.
00:24:53
Speaker
But even like art history, anything I would know, anything about that is completely self-taught. I don't know the biographies in general or creators, except for listen to other podcasts. i'm I'm interested in it. But it's like there's something about like this conversation with like lack of formal training that like is that it seems like just so cool. like um And even my approach to philosophy when I first started was like I took a philosophy of art class. It was still like... And I love the conceptual questions, but it was still like...
00:25:23
Speaker
what is this big thing art from from from the outside? um But i I find it so strange because it's a tough thing for maybe for me to overcome and you to overcome too of being like, why the hell do you say anything about art if you like if you haven't done this? And I think just kind of like disregarding that and put it back to like play and creativity as being like, Hey, whether it's a cosplay or not, we're looking pretty good. Like, you know, like we're we're doing our thing and and then talking about it um
00:25:55
Speaker
um in in ah in a real way. i wanted, ah because I saw the video of your book launch, I want you to tell, like, I want to like...
00:26:06
Speaker
Tell um the audience ah of ah of how you did that. it It had so many different components, but want you to drop in a little bit like about the book launch itself and some of the creative um activity that you built around the launch. Yeah, absolutely. And I think it ties into the sort of the conversation about like the lack of training and just like being okay with being naive. like So many adults...
00:26:32
Speaker
think they can't do something because they're going to be bad at it. And it's like, you're allowed to be bad. We we can be bad at things. We can be you know childlike at the things that we want to try. We don't have to be good. We don't have to aspire to be good at things to enjoy doing them. And that is what I told myself um with the book launch party. i was like, okay,
00:26:54
Speaker
There are traditional ways that people have launched books. This is a non-traditional book. It's creativity. It's self-help. There's a little bit of play. There's a lot of play. um But there's also a little bit of my story. And I want to have those facets in that that I talk about in the book represented in the book launch party. So I rented a warehouse in Detroit. I love...
00:27:17
Speaker
i i love attention to detail, which I talk about in the book. I think when we're paying attention and we're intentional about every part of our lives, it's more fulfilling. And so I wanted everyone to come to this party and feel like, oh my God, she thought of everything. And this is so silly and fun. So had all these stations. So people...
00:27:40
Speaker
Got at the at the door when they checked in, they got a goodie bag filled with dice and pom poms and a postcard and stickers and just like fun merch because I love that kind of stuff like custom merch. um And then they got a novelty cup that was either shaped like a smiley face, a basketball or a dice.
00:28:01
Speaker
And then they walk into the party and there's all these different stations. And one was I hired a face painter. And this is like – this is an adult's party. It's not a children's birthday party. And that face painter was busy all night. Like had to be like, I'm done. I'm sorry. hands hurt. Yeah. Yeah.
00:28:23
Speaker
And that makes me so happy because it's like how often are adults getting their faces painted? Like if there's a face painter at an event that I went to, I would be like, oh, I feel bad. The kids are waiting. I'm not going to stand in line and wait. And this was giving permission. And and I think giving permission is what the book is about. And so there's there was the face painter. I had a photo booth station. I had ah a collage table where I brought all my collage materials and people could make um laminated bookmarks.
00:28:49
Speaker
Um, I have this exercise in the book called making a playlist, like a to-do list filled with only play activities. And I do this seasonally because I feel like it's easy to kind of think back to what did I like to do in the winter as a kid, have a snowball fight, drink hot chocolate. And those little tiny actions are what can help propel us into this life of, of play and creativity. So I made big poster board with empty playlists and had people write their favorite seasonal activities. I had these silly questions for conversation. Um, I had, my friends are really talented chefs, uh, like, like home chefs. And they made this six foot long sandwich that we cut up into a bunch of pieces. So there's just this visual impact of a huge sandwich. yeah Um, and then the biggest part, and I think maybe this ties into the, like, when did I feel like an artist or, or when it,
00:29:41
Speaker
when am I feeling validated in that feeling is I was like, well, it's my party. I'm going to have an art gallery with all the work that I've created. And so yeah I had a corner that was all of the work that I'm stoked about. And I set it up like an art gallery on the white pillars and labeled everything. And it was magical. um I had a bingo card. So everyone had activities to do because at big social events, I sometimes get overwhelmed. I'm like, I don't know if I want to talk to a bunch of strangers all the time. so if there's an activity for me at an event, I'm so happy. yeah um And so there were things like check out the art gallery, right? Your silly question, get your face painted, eat a part of the big sandwich. And then if they got a bingo, they could enter in and I made these prize packs with lots of fun. So all of this, all of those stations represented this like playful energy that I'm trying to
00:30:33
Speaker
get people to realize like, we're allowed to do this in our lives. Like I made this party up. I made this book up. Hell yeah. And you can do it too. So it was a blast.
00:30:44
Speaker
Oh my gosh. I just want to hang out with you. You're up there. You're up there ah you're up there ah in Detroit and um It's so wonderful to hear about um the the the book launch.
00:31:05
Speaker
There's another iteration of your creativity ah that I saw, and I was late in coming to it, was fashion and clothes. And I just i lost my mind on this piece. like The other stuff is... I love that. I've lost my mind on this piece because like another another thing with like going through the show is... um two Two out of three guests are non-male genders. And I also have talked to a lot of different um ah indigenous guests over 30 and have moved into things that I didn't expect, like color and fashion. And I know you have this whole...
00:31:41
Speaker
I want to talk about clothes and fashion because it was it was striking when I first saw images of you. like Your clothes were like so wild and fantastic and like really cool. And then I was reading more about how finding yourself and your identity and doing that. And I do believe at the launch party, everybody was wearing monochromatic clothes.
00:32:05
Speaker
Yes. Close, which you had directed. Talk about the the the clothes, the fashion, wearing color. And also, like it seemed to me that you started to develop like a very large following like of people being like, oh, man, I'm going to follow up Rachel or be inspired by Rachel and what she's doing. Can you talk about that whole bit? Because that's so fun.
00:32:27
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. I forgot that part of the party. There's so many details of the party that I can. that's i was like I was like, even though this was a big one for me, this is number 20 detail. So I don't know if she's going to remember. it No. Yeah. I did say like, please wear color.
00:32:42
Speaker
And monochrome encouraged. And i was I was curious, like a couple of my friends were like, okay, who's gonna, what are you gonna do when people don't follow that rule? And I was like, it's okay. I bet most people will. And sure enough, most people did. And it was it was visually impactful. Like yeah it it was so...
00:33:01
Speaker
cool that people did it. And the photographer that I hired, like got the different color groups together. and it just, I think color is such an underutilized thing in adult life. Like oh my gosh to wear all black. We have like, you know, we had the millennial gray interior design aesthetic that was, you know, had so many of us in a chokehold and,
00:33:24
Speaker
For me, color is is creative expression. And yeah, I i have had many like creative iterations. So when I was doing my engineering job, I was doing hand lettering, and letterpress printing, and I had a stationary business, and I got really burnt out on that. And and I was putting a lot of pressure on that. So I was like, okay, I love getting dressed. I love thrifting. I love putting together outfits that feel like me that no one else has. And i really wanted to give myself an opportunity to explore that and accountability to sharing it.
00:34:02
Speaker
And so... During like you know a year or so after COVID started, we're all working from home. I'm wearing sweatpants and ah feeling pretty uninspired in my life. I was like, I'm going to do a creative challenge. And I decided to do these style challenges. I called them the Rachel Renee style challenges. And I was like, I'm going to post to my outfits online. And part of it was like me wanting to feel comfortable feeling seen online because so many people will say like, oh, I'm not comfortable
00:34:38
Speaker
with doing a reel on the internet or I don't want people to judge me. And it's like, that's going to happen either way. So if you feel called to share your version of creativity, you should do it. And so it was like, I i couldn't articulate that then, but looking back, I definitely was like, oh, I wanted to feel more seen. And so I created these style challenges. I made up prompts like monochrome Mondays or thrifted Thursdays, fancy Fridays. um Or they got weirder and weirder as the months progressed. Like we're doing barbecue summer as this week's theme. Like... Like I'm wearing hot dog colors, like just silly. But what it allowed me to do is one, feel more comfortable feeling seen, connect with people who were excited about the same things. Cause sometimes that's hard to do in person.
00:35:26
Speaker
um and so that's why I love like online communities too, is because it's like, we get to connect with people who are into the same exact thing as us. Um, and And then it was a practice in me showing up authentically, exploring my personal style. i was able to start articulating like, oh, I like these colors. I like these materials. um And it was a blast. But I very quickly, like you said, i I grew a following around these style challenges, people participating and connecting. And I made i made lots of friends online through that challenge. But then when...
00:36:05
Speaker
Maybe like a year into it, i got kind of like pigeonholed and people were considering me like a fashion influencer. And that's fine, but I was feeling stifled. I was like, that's not what I am. i don't want to tell people to buy this stuff. I want to give you permission to explore your style on your own. Like, let me help you with these prompts because – It's what helped me express myself creatively. And so that's where I started talking about creativity and creative expression and identity because I was like, these are clothes are tools for me to show up as the identity that I want. yeah Um, and then I got the pushback on the creativity terms with people being like, well, that's you, not me. And that's why i was like, but we can play, we can play with clothes.
00:36:49
Speaker
And so, yeah, clothes are very, very, a very important part of my, I think, identity. I really, uh, I know before we started recording, I showed you my, my vintage Green Bay Packers. Hell yeah. Shout out for that Green Bay Packers.
00:37:02
Speaker
ah shirt, Rachel. Just pointing that out for everybody. Yes. Yeah. um And so like I love style and I think style and clothes are tools to help us, again, cosplay as the version of ourselves we want to be. Like if I want to be an artist, I'm going to dress a little bit more kooky. I'm going to wear more colors. I'm going to wear weird wide-like pants because that will help me like step into that identity. So I think clothes are a really cool way to express ourselves creatively.
00:37:32
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Thanks for chatting about that. I think um clothes and color. One of the things that I've talked guests before is like um the development of my brain ah when I started painting and moving into, like I started seeing a lot more different colors. And so your activities where you're pulling things out for the environment were very much like in my head of like seeing and pulling out. And, um,
00:38:01
Speaker
Once I started to do that, they're talking about like change, change like physical change. like My brain started to to see differently. and that was like Once I realized that happened, I was like, holy shit. and It was really through ah painting, but I ah very much apply to... like Speaking of monochromatic, I got this...
00:38:24
Speaker
adidas track suit that's specifically the color is warm clay and that damn suit like i told i tell my people people joke with me about i said that's my foremost i wear that thing anywhere that warm clay adidas track suit i'm lined in i'm lined in when i got that thing too so yes And like, that's what style style is so cool because it's like, that is the piece or the set that makes you feel the most you. Like I have a couple of pieces where I'm like, oh, I'm feeling insecure today or I'm feeling low energy or I'm feeling low. I'm going to put on this, this eighties prom dress and go to Costco. It doesn't matter. It's like, they are tools that we can use used to like hype ourselves up.
00:39:09
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. um So much, so much to talk about. um What's been ah with the book being out? Any surprises as far as like surprises in the process or somebody ran into or things you're starting, starting to hear about your own book?
00:39:26
Speaker
umm I haven't heard a lot yet. ah All good things, which are great. I haven't seen any negative reviews yet, which is fantastic, but I assume they'll come. I'm trying to mentally prepare for that. um I think I'm just really excited to see...
00:39:43
Speaker
how this connects me with like more creative communities and, um, getting this in the hands of more people and realizing like, yeah, play and creativity are, are tools that we can use to live for ourselves. Um, I am excited to be doing some book events at some local libraries and local bookstores. Uh, I'm doing a virtual kind of workshop about play for creative mornings. Are you familiar with that? Um,
00:40:10
Speaker
ah So I think it originally started in New York. I don't know all of the lore behind Creative Mornings, but it's like a a group of designers started it, I think, where they would get together every Friday morning and just like chat about design work, being creatives. And then it expanded and there are chapters in different major cities. But then they do these online things called field trips where you can sign up and you can talk about whatever your creative interest is. And so I'll be doing a ah field trip, which I'm excited about. i'm hoping that
00:40:41
Speaker
when more people read the book and and like can understand what I mean when I say prioritize play, that it's not just like, oh, hey, go make time to go play basketball more, which if that's your play, do it. but um But really, it's like a mindset and lifestyle shift. And and there are easy ways to start to do this in our lives. I just hope that I get to talk to more people. like I would love to talk to like a corporate design team and be like, hey,
00:41:09
Speaker
I know you all are educated in the design world and I don't have any education, but like, what if we were pinatas? What would you look like and what would you be filled with? Which is one of the questions in the book. That is one of the questions. And that is the question that I read. i went back and I read and I'm like,
00:41:28
Speaker
Who did in God's green earth wrote this down? And it was me and my pinata, right? So it's a pinata, what's it shaped as? And what it's filled with, check this out.
00:41:41
Speaker
It's the shape of ah of ah a crucifix and filled with pomegranates. I'm like, I don't even remember writing that thing. It's a pretty wild idea, but I'm like, it's it's my hand is my handwriting and everything. I'm like this last week. So,
00:41:57
Speaker
It's like a simple thing for me. it It reminds me a lot of times, you know, like when you write something down or your creative ideas and you look at it, you're like, it's me. But it's like, i wrote, I don't even remember thinking or writing that. And so that one of the pieces about the book is like kind of like writing that stuff down, messing up.
00:42:19
Speaker
messing with the book, but I thought it was the strangest thing. I was like, I wrote that down. So um a lot of fun. Yeah. So the creative question, piñata and what it's felt. like I thought that was... I'm so glad you did it. Yeah. I feel like the... um That's what I was hoping to really put in the book where like questions like that where it's like you are being forced to be creative, but it's almost like I'm throwing you off so much with how weird it is that you you're limiting beliefs about like who you are don't come in yet. You just automatically answer. And I think like when we can sort of channel that like authentic version of ourselves, like I have – I journal every day. Yeah.
00:43:02
Speaker
And I have some examples like what you said where I'm reading back and I'm like, where did this idea come from? I've never thought about that before in my life, but okay. And I'm like, what was i did I not have my coffee? Like, was I still speaking? Who is this? Um, and, but I think like when we can sort of tap into that, like on, we're not filtering our thoughts, we're just answering. I think like that can help us tap into that creativity. Yeah.
00:43:29
Speaker
Yeah, I, um, there was a thought that I, uh, uh, I was thinking about and it maybe it was like Detroit that, that prompted it, you know? So I think in terms of like, when you talk about our system and, and creative places, you know, i come from like working class background and like, and it, People come from different backgrounds and art always has like a different station or place. But it's I think in the context of like general economics and survivability, like there's this kind of like really like dark corner where it's absolutely frivolous and and useless and not productive.
00:44:06
Speaker
And... Knowing that that's ah not the case in in and like learning over time like for working people. The reason why I was thinking of like Michigan, Detroit and stuff, like because I know there's – I don't live it, but I know there's a renaissance of likere creative activity and space and artists in that area – you know And it's like post-rollout of you know factories closing, everything that's happened to Detroit, which still stands as ah as as a fantastic city, but has gone through all that type of thing. There's such a tight connection in my head of like how like after this essential and semi-collapse here that –
00:44:49
Speaker
There was space, you know, it's political and social aspects to it, but there there was a space opening up ah around that. So it almost seemed like, almost like in my head, like the place for that to emerge in like, almost like reaction, reaction,
00:45:05
Speaker
or like of of like a new ah creativity. Is that authentic? Like, I mean, you're there and I'm not trying to overblow like the Detroit thing, but as you're interacting with people in the space in that city there, is that, did that kind of art renaissance or space or culture, is that, is that a real thing? And is it growing? Yeah.
00:45:23
Speaker
I think so. um i will say that I'm like kind of a homebody. So I don't know. I'm not like out and about a lot. um But yeah, absolutely. I've been i've been in Detroit ah since 2013. over a decade. And i mean, even in in that decade,
00:45:41
Speaker
plus that I've been here, it's changed a lot. Definitely. It seems like that it's such a creative city. And it's kind of like, um I read ah Just Kids by Patti Smith and she's talking about moving to New York and like, you know, they're living in these warehouses that don't have plumbing and it's like a supply closet bathroom is where they get their water. um And i it it gives me like that sort of vibe where it's like a very industrial city that is less industrial than it once was. There's still a lot of like the working class mentality. Like I think we all in the Midwest, we just like love to work hard and feel good about our hard work, you know? Yeah. and um
00:46:20
Speaker
And so there's there's space. Detroit is a huge city, like, land area-wise. So there's a lot that is not populated. And so there's space. Like, i was I would never be able to rent the space that I rented in Detroit for my book launch party, like, in New York, in Brooklyn. Like, that would be...
00:46:37
Speaker
you know, quadruple to 10 times the price for me to be able to do that. And so I think in spaces like that artists, it's like the natural progression, right? Like artists come in and we're like, all right, we can utilize this space. And then eventually that leads to like gentrification and then everything is Williamsburg. So, um, and, and that hasn't happened yet, but there are some neighborhoods in Detroit that that's, that's starting where it's like, Ooh, when I first moved here, I could, I could have bought a house in that neighborhood. And now i'm like, No way. um But I think that's pretty pretty common for for um cities. But to answer your question, yeah, there's a great creative energy here. And it's it's like, to me, it feels like a down-to-earth kind of grounded energy because of that of Midwest mindset. Yeah, so. that That makes a lot of sense to me. No, on the show, I like... um
00:47:28
Speaker
I like dropping into like whatever way I can, like the the area that folks are on or what's the vibe. And sometimes like like there's these different pieces that make you think. Because it's not just like for you, you're obviously like...
00:47:41
Speaker
you know ah hype gal hype gal for all this hype gal um for yourself. But overall, too, there are stultifying atmospheres and there are like expansive and creative atmospheres and not neither are perfect, but like you can be situated in a spot where rather than have to explain each thing you're doing, somebody's like, oh, that's cool. Yeah, go roll with that in this yeah like to help you.
00:48:09
Speaker
Totally. Yeah, I think like that's something that is interesting because I think there are... like For example, i went i have friends in Brooklyn. I have friends in Portland. You're you're you know not too, too far from Portland. Closer to Portland than Detroit, for sure. ah so i can go to Portland or Brooklyn and I can be like, oh yeah, I'm an artist. I do this. I make weird paper mache shit. And people are like, hell yeah.
00:48:34
Speaker
Around here, there are some community, like some people I talk to who who get it. And then there's some that are like, what? um Because it's, it's sort of that again, Midwest mindset where it's like, I um i don't know what it is about like the socialization ah of,
00:48:51
Speaker
people I grew up in Michigan's upper peninsula, so like very rural. UP. Yeah, exactly. um Closer to Wisconsin than Detroit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I think, and maybe it's like sort of the... the cold weather mindset and the immigrants that came in. like My family, I'm a fifth generation UPR, so it's it's quite a few generations removed since they they came ah to the UP. But just sort of the like, you put your head down, you work hard, you don't complain sort of mentality. And so I think growing up around that was a lot of the reason why I'm like,
00:49:33
Speaker
Oh, it's frivolous for me to want to be an artist, even though it's so core to my being. And so there is a little bit of that mindset. I think in the Midwest, it's just like, not everyone is like a weird creative, like they are in Brooklyn or in Portland or in even LA in a different way. You know, like yeah I feel very at home in those other bigger cities that are like freak culture. And that, I mean that as a compliment, fly fly your freak flag. Yep, exactly. um But Detroit has some of that. And also the cost of living is is very low. And that's lovely. And I'm from this area and my community is here and the access to nature and the different seasons. Like there are a lot of reasons to love it here. so
00:50:18
Speaker
Yeah. Grows and cons to everywhere, right? Yeah. Thanks. No, thanks for dropping us in there. I know in my head, I'm a huge horror film freak. And I think there was a couple filled in that kind of like almost like outsour outdoor liminal space like in Detroit. And I was like yeah just dropping into that. Like love that. Yeah.
00:50:40
Speaker
It's like almost like industrial horror, but just like that creativity of like what's what what is in that space? yeah What is hidden? What is ah um like ah beyond that door?
00:50:53
Speaker
So, um oh, wow. So we we covered a lot of stuff. Tell me, tell me, why'd you start a a podcast? And I know you do with the partner there.
00:51:04
Speaker
What about the podcast? Like what what's the podcast been for you? Yeah, um our podcast, I kind of pitched it to my friend Lauren. She's she's a designer ah and has been for many years and has has primarily, she worked for a marketing agency for like a year out of college, but then has primarily worked for herself. And she's been a great resource for me in terms of, especially when I was doing hand lettering, um I was like, oh, Lauren's done lettering. I'm learning a lot from from this friend. um And we always just had really great conversations about philosophy, about creativity, about, yeah, politics, about just all the stuff. ah And
00:51:47
Speaker
Many times we would have these hours-long conversations and be like, man, we should have recorded that. Like, we had some good nuggets in there. And as I was starting to kind of step into this role of of artist, of creative, of of doing more sort of education and encouragement online, talking about prioritizing play, I was like, I think we have – An interesting perspective that we can share because you have all of the, you Lauren have all of the background of like going to design to art school and and being a designer and working for yourself, being a freelancer for a decade. I am in this transition period where like I admire everything that you do. But I haven't been able to fully allow myself to do that. And so I'm kind of navigating these sort of like emerging artists or like new questions that she's been living for a decade. yeah And I was like, instead of just asking her and only me getting the answers, maybe we could share this. Yeah. And then we giggle a lot and we're we're very chaotic in terms of like we're working on lots of things. We love working with our hands, doing projects. And so we were like, let's do a season and just like see how it goes. And we really enjoyed it. And like we talked about earlier, like there there you learn from conversations. Oh, yeah. Even if with the same person, you know, it's just the the topics that we talked about, the little nuggets of wisdom, even the cringe that like if I go back and listen to season one, episodes and I'm like why did I say that somebody related to it and like I learned so yeah that's kind of where that came from just like let's we have great conversations about lots of things and we understand how like we're imperfect we want to be chaotic we want to be creative and we live these lives that we're talking about so yeah that's where that came from yeah I like the um well I mean I like the podcast format which I see is like
00:53:42
Speaker
in its essence, like populist and people-based and um ah accessible. And I think it was strange, like just in in in in working on the podcast and like what started develop, like as far as like connecting people, like my ideas and like where this came from and like, just like it was all organized into my head. So I realized one day I'm a labor organizer by by trade in my day job.
00:54:09
Speaker
So it was it was like the type of thing of like you think, the word sucks, but like transferability, right? So like you're talking about like what do you know and like how it can translate. But I realized like either like habitually or in a way that was even more exciting to me that I was like organizing around art. like At some point, I just stepped back and be like, well, I'm an organizer by nature and I'm like putting this here and this here and this here and encountering this. And how'd you get to this person? Cause I talked to that person. I saw them at a party and I didn't know they did photography. And I talked to them, you know, and it was all, it was, it all kind of, um, um,
00:54:45
Speaker
like I would develop like there was a conscious development of that but it was like um it was such a surprise to me that like oh I'm kind of like pulling it together like I would do with the workers that I that that i represent and i don't know it just felt a lot of fun it felt more powerful too because like there was a lot of ways I interact that was just like, oh, I'm i'm doing it in and in this way. And the number one question most people look about my show is like, how do you...
00:55:16
Speaker
Like, how the hell do you like find or invite these people? it's all developed over time. And it's all makes intuitive sense, you know, like talking to you and, and, and, and your book, it all makes intuitive sense to me. But like on the outside, I'd be like, how do you talk to like somebody who does like, there's an exotic dancer, like in LA and like, i god it and I said there's a path.
00:55:40
Speaker
There's a path that led to like all these expressions. And also, and I don't know if you find like sometimes in your conversations, having the first conversation with somebody who does like this art thing that you have no frigging clue what it is. like like For me, like I don't know like people working with metal and stuff like that and be like, I want you on the show. like Tell us the stuff and like what you think about. And um it's just really open. It feels really cool and like a curious like learning learnings for always like to learn you know and the podcast seems to me like a really good spot for that
00:56:13
Speaker
Oh, absolutely. And I love what you said about just like the connections because I think for so long, and especially when I did my engineering job, like networking was, we we we talked about networking all the time and it was like, I would go to these conferences and I would just feel just so like, oh, I don't want to talk to that person. And I like just want to go back to my hotel room, do my do my talk and go away. and Since I have quit that career and become this person now fully, it's like every conversation is an opportunity for connection. I'm like you, very curious, love to learn. And when you're not approaching it from the perspective of like, I have to network and like get on good terms with this person. And instead you're like,
00:56:59
Speaker
What can I learn about this person? Those connections just naturally happen. And then, you know, in five years when I'm thinking about, oh, yeah, like you said, metalsmithing, I don't know that person. ah oh this person does glass work, but maybe they know somebody who does metal. And it's just like naturally, again, when we're finding the things that light us up the most, we're curious about them, we're excited, we're meeting other people with those same values sort of naturally. And then that network just naturally expands instead of it being like, I have to force this connection because this is a person I should know. Yeah. And that's the, that's the, there's, there's a piece of that, like, and I totally understand that as well, but it's almost like how you go into it. And obviously you'd be thinking about that with intentionality, but like,
00:57:46
Speaker
it's like For me, it almost always seems like kind of impossible to get into things with the framework of it's just it's just such it's a transaction. like If I'm going to know, I'm going to be like, what's the last book you read that that blew your mind?
00:58:02
Speaker
Right. And then for me, that's going to that's going to open up so much stuff rather like, did you look at this protocol? And like, I know you're an expert. i God bless everybody for like learning what they need to learn. But like like in organizing or networking such this like, I always think ultimately it's like to know the human being and like how they're approaching even technical knowledge. Like, that's fine. Tell me technical shit that I need to know as well But There's a humanity, I think, like that we're talking about that's missed when like, I need you for this and you can't, if I can't make that transfer of what you mean to me, it's a failed conversation rather than being like, heard your kid plays baseball. is You know like know, like human wise, like you I don't know how to, I don't know how to open it up in those.
00:58:53
Speaker
Maybe that's part of it too. I don't, necessarily like quite know or maybe not deeply interested in just opening up the relationship in that way, you know? I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. And I think like everyone, want i I truly think everyone wants to be seen and understood for who they are. And when we're asking people about their personal lives, what do you like to do?
00:59:15
Speaker
What do you like to do for fun? What's the last book you read? What are your kids up to this weekend? You know, like those those questions make them feel seen as a human instead of a cog in this machine. and I think that's all we ah all want. And we all get bored with work. Like I'm a labor guy. Like I love labor. Like I cut my finger. I i bleed the labor more and all that That's not it for me. like It's a huge, massive, massive chunk. And I get bored with like i get bored with things. like just you know Not that I'm bored with it, but like it is not my first entry. It's not the first thing. like you know So um as fast as I am with like workers and what their experiences work and trying to to make it better, sometimes when you have conversations like...
01:00:00
Speaker
i want to I want to talk about a movie. like I really just want to. Or up. Or what people like for art and music. you know Music's an art conversation, right? so Yeah. Asking about like what what what you know what you really dig on and stuff. Yeah.
01:00:18
Speaker
ah So, and everybody, I want to let listeners know, ah Rachel Renee, is is is is your hype gal, as you say. How do you, all right, so let me ask you this question. I know you're hype gal, and and I like to be hype gal, hype guy for everybody that that I know.
01:00:37
Speaker
You say it even for yourself, or being for yourself. How the heck heck How the heck you be your own hype person? What do you mean? yeah what do you what are you thinking about? there's Yeah, there's a chapter in the book about that because I think especially growing up in a small town, like I, as a little freak artist, felt deeply misunderstood. And I think that's a pretty common feeling that a lot of kids feel whether you're from a rural area or not, right? Like we're all just trying to figure out who we are.
01:01:09
Speaker
And I think that – For so long, I was looking for permission externally. I was looking for someone to say, you're good at art, go to art school.
01:01:21
Speaker
You're good at this, do this. Oh, I'm expecting you to get married, have kids, buy a house, settle down forever, do that. And so i was not wanting to do those things, but I was waiting for someone to say, you should do this. Or like, this is what I'm expecting you to do. Or now you have permission to do this. And so I think what I realized in my own journey to getting here is that like, we're the only ones who can give ourselves permission to live the way that we want to. And so
01:01:56
Speaker
We have to hype ourselves up for that permission. We have to give ourselves permission first. yeah No one is going to pop into your house and say, okay, now you're allowed.
01:02:07
Speaker
you just It's not going to happen. And I don't think anyone... thinks, of course, like logistically that's actually going to happen, but it's kind of like we're all waiting for the right time. i don't I'll wait until I have more money or I'll wait until I have more time or I'll wait until my partner makes more money so they can support me doing my art. yeah And it just – there's never the perfect circumstance. And so we have to trust – in that yearning, that like desire for ourselves and give ourselves permission to chase it. Maybe you can't quit your job today. Maybe you never quit your job, but can you do one small thing in the direction of that life that you're craving? And so when I say be your own hype gal or hype pal,
01:02:48
Speaker
It's you got to give yourself permission first and then recognize that like if you're really excited about an idea and you're going to tell somebody about it, they're probably not going to get it. or if if they get it, they're not going to be as excited as you because it's your idea. so maybe you have an idea for a painting or like I have this idea for I ask the pinata question. I want to do these paper mache like representations of the pinata answers that people give me. And um the crucifix with pomegranate seeds would be an incredible one to make. um I think, um but in explaining a lot of my like creative ideas, I'm watching people's eyes glaze over and they're like, you know, they they want to be excited for me, but they don't get it yeah And so I think in the past I would have been like, oh, yeah, I probably shouldn't do that because like, oh, it didn't make sense to them. And now I'm like, I have to make it. People need to see it
01:03:48
Speaker
Yeah. First to understand it. And even if they don't understand it or like it, I made it because the process of making it was important to me. So it's like, we have to remove that, that desire for permission and expectation that like everyone's going to be as stoked as we are for our art practices. It's just not going to happen. Like, yes, we'll have people that are, are, are hype squad and I will be one of them. I will enthusiastically support when someone's telling me about a project, but we got to do it for ourselves.
01:04:18
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Thank thank you. yes it's It's, I don't know, it's just a really, ah in the times or in the spaces where it seems quiet, where you get lonely as an artist, no matter what, like those those those those spaces there and and and remembering that.
01:04:37
Speaker
Prioritized play is also an audiobook, I heard. Yes. You did the audio? I did the audio. What was it like? what it like It was so much fun. i loved it. there are part i mean like i you know You've read the book. i I wrote it very much in my voice. And so it made a lot of sense for me to to read it. And I'm glad that I got the opportunity. I don't think that's always the case with authors. Yeah. Yeah.
01:05:02
Speaker
And I just had a blast. I was like, can I do this as a job? Like, can I, can I be reading other people's audio books? Cause I, I think my enthusiasm comes across in, in the recording and there are things like I wrote like boo hiss and, and then the director, the audio director was like, do you want to actually like hiss? And I was like, yeah, I really, I really do want to actually just hiss into the microphone. So it was a blast. I loved it. Yeah. Yeah, that's my next iteration. I love um i love ah audio audio books. I actually became fascinated by my listening stats. oh like i checked I've been listening to audio books on Audible since 2015, and I checked my stats recently. So it's like 11 years. But for seven months of those 11 years, I was listening to books. Which I'm like, that's that's a pretty good waking time. That's a long time. I always enjoy... um
01:06:08
Speaker
audio book And a lot of times I'll but i'll read it and do the the audio thing because, like, they you know. ah So I get my next audio book is Rachel Renee. Yeah. Reads prioritized play and in hisses.
01:06:22
Speaker
Yep, exactly. You'll get to hear hiss. i um so I was excited. I think I had seen something ah there. And I i saw it. I was like, oh because I always like, you know, it's not always feasible or what have you for you know, for them to produce an, an, an audio book. and and and And, and of course there's an interactivity type of thing, you know, like, of, you know, like, like for me, the tactile, I want to experience both, but for me, the tactile and the fact that like getting in the book and writing on it. And I would say too, like, um,
01:06:52
Speaker
I found myself, like, really, and I'm saying messing with, like, like a little bit more of, like, um coloring in, like, your illustrations and stuff like that. Just kind of, like, a lot of, like, tactile stuff that... ah was very inviting, and which is why every single listener is interested in art and interested in in and play.
01:07:15
Speaker
You really need to get ah prioritized play, Rachel Renee. I do have a big question, which is the titular name of the of the podcast and might be like a bit more encompassing than everything we talked about. But I'm asking you, why is there something rather than nothing? Like, why is why is there something rather than nothing?
01:07:34
Speaker
Oh, what a great what a great question. um Because we make something. we make we We have the opportunity to make something out of every experience rather than allowing ourselves to not yeah experience anything.
01:07:50
Speaker
Oh, you got it in that short amount of time. Wow. like That's incredible. That's absolutely incredible. I'm only succinct at the end. Yeah. but sick so I mean, succinct is a beautiful thing. Perfectly timed. Mic drop. I get it all. Sure. It's not for me, usually. It's like, what are we doing with Dart? We're playing and shooting the shit and talking about stuff that's that's fun. Where do people find all all all all your stuff? um Books or podcasts, et cetera?
01:08:21
Speaker
Yeah. ah So everything, you can get access to everything through my website, which is rachelrenee.com. And it's, both names are spelled the non-traditional way. So it's R-A-C-H-A-E-L-R-E-N-A-E.com. And my Instagram is the same, Rachel Renee, where I'm sharing little little clips and and tips and stuff and and just parts about my life, you know, living this prioritize play lifestyle. um But you can get info about the book, about the podcast, about ah my online community, which is called the juice box, because I talk about living a big juicy life. All of that on my website. So yeah, thanks so much.
01:09:00
Speaker
Oh my gosh, uh, Rachel in, uh, uh, in, in, even on the book with the, with the picture of your outfit on fleek and everything, just so everybody knows. That is one of the dresses that I put on when I'm trying to feel good. So you got, you got, you got it. So everybody, um, I, I, I just ah truly, as you could tell, ah Rachel, it's, it's, it's great.
01:09:24
Speaker
It's great to talk with you. Thanks for putting this book out there. I think, um, you know, if people get out a pen or a pencil or ask, you know, answer funny questions or with their friends and stuff, I think like people are just on the path of doing something different, even if they just want to like, um like disrupt ah the norm. I think a lot of things we talked about are as like the momentum of how you're supposed to live, right? And exactly everybody has that and what's the job and you're thinking,
01:09:54
Speaker
you think, oh, engineering, you know, and it pays really well and you're smart and you can do it. So if you're smart and you can do it, then you think, well, that's what I'm supposed to do. And then you're like, well, I can do it. it it it But there's so many other types of things. So yeah ah thanks thanks for thanks thanks for your ah for your courage in in in the book. And ah listeners, I can't recommend it ah ah enough. And again, as we talked about,
01:10:22
Speaker
There's even ah and an audio version, if that's your that's your pleasure. ah Absolutely. Prioritize play. ah Rachel, thanks for coming on to the podcast. Thanks for your podcast and creativity. And you rock. What can I say?
01:10:39
Speaker
Thank you so much. This was such a lovely conversation. Thank you for inviting me and and yeah, getting to have just a fun conversation about it It was perfect. Thank you. Hell yeah.
01:10:52
Speaker
Talk to you soon. Okay, will do.
01:11:02
Speaker
This is something rather than nothing.