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Nos Audietis, Episode 308: Slow start to offseason
59 Plays6 years ago
We're now a few weeks into the offseason and we have to admit that it's been pretty slow. The Seattle Sounders have mostly been checking the required boxes by declining options, protecting players from the expansion draft and the like. Aside from the 18 players they have on roster, most of last year's players remain in a sort of purgatory with only backup goalkeeper Bryan Meredith officially leaving to Inter Miami and only backup goalkeeper Stefan Cleveland newly joining the team in a trade.
Still, we felt compelled to give you that sweet, sweet content most of which comes in the form of answering your questions.
This week's music: Perry Como - "Seattle", "RVIVR - "Ocean Song", Woody Guthrie - "Roll On Columbia", "Your Journey Begins" - OurMusicBox (Jay Man) (CC BY 4.0)
Thanks to James Woollard, Sounders Public Address Announcer, for doing our sponsor reads. You can follow him on Twitter at @BritVoxUS - if you’re looking for a British Voice to advertise your business or non-profit, please reach out to him.
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Transcript
Introduction to Full Pool Wines
00:00:00
Speaker
This episode of No Sadietes is sponsored by Full Pool Wines, a Seattle-based wine seller who recently released their first book, 36 Bottles of Wine. The ethos of the book, a highly curated look at wine categories that provide exceptional value right now, should be familiar to full pool readers. But there's loads of fresh content, and since it's not trying to sell any wine through the book, there's a bit more of a sass factor.
00:00:21
Speaker
And there's food! Lots of it! Fulpel's unique writing styles apply to recipes like Leftover Thanksgiving, Turkey, Smaltziball Soup, and Pregnancy Nachos. This book can be purchased through Sasquatch Books.
00:00:47
Speaker
Whoa! Morris runs right by him and sticks in and slots him in for a goal. Fantastic for George Morris. Look at him, he did it! Oh, my God! Here's Morris! Morris! Oh, thank God for that! What do tigers dream of? They take a little tigers in. For this action.
00:01:18
Speaker
The bluest skies you've ever seen are in Seattle. And the hill is the greenest green in Seattle. Like a beautiful child. Welcome to another edition of Nosed Audio, sponsored by Football Wines.
Sounders Off-Season Developments
00:01:36
Speaker
This is episode 308, and we're recording on Monday, December 2nd. I am your host, Jeremiah Shannon. As usual, I'm joined by my co-host, Aaron Campbell, and our engineer, Lickett.
00:01:45
Speaker
So it's, uh, it's like the third week of the off season, fourth week of the off season. And, and, and there's not much that's been happening, but we've wanted to record because I don't know, like recording, uh,
00:02:00
Speaker
A quick recap of the off season, I guess would be the Sounders signed someone named Steven Cleveland, who is a goalkeeper, apparently with Chicago Fire, presumably to be their backup. And that's like it, basically. Oh, they lost a brand Meredith, I guess.
00:02:20
Speaker
Oh, they did. They, yeah, they'd last Brian Meredith to the inter Miami in the expansion draft. Um, but like no other official, I don't even think they've officially lost anyone yet. They declined the options on Roman Torres, who looks like he's probably going to leave. Uh, they declined Victor Rodriguez's option. It looks like he's going to leave. Uh, Brad Smith's loan is up. It looks like he'll be gone at least temporarily.
00:02:47
Speaker
But then, like, Jonathan Campbell essentially moved out, so we assume he's leaving. Harry's ship had his contract option declined, but it looks like there's a possibility he could be back. Kim Ki-hee was at a contract, I think.
00:03:06
Speaker
maybe he's going to be back. So there's just a lot of questions right now on this roster and we haven't gotten a lot of answers yet. Uh, we'll going to do a lot of, we're going to answer a lot of these questions during our Q and a, which is frankly going to probably be the most of the show, but I don't know. This is off season to you strike you as how you would expect it to have gone. I mean, it's pretty rare. I guess that we get much action early in the off season. Yeah. I mean, I think
00:03:36
Speaker
There was kind of a flurry of activity, as there always is. It wasn't even really activity, but it was stuff, right? When like- Flurry of announcements. Yeah. Yeah. They had to, like, that were mandated essentially by the league. Right. But I don't think there was anything unexpected necessarily. I mean, I think some of the
00:03:55
Speaker
some of the decisions on who to protect and who not to protect in the expansion draft were a little strange, but ultimate or not even strange, just there was a lot of discussion about that. And I think, yeah, some unexpected names on the list, but like Roland Morris even bothered maybe that he was left unprotected. Yeah. Um, ultimately though, it didn't matter. I mean, Brian Meredith got taken. So
00:04:19
Speaker
Right. And there was no world where the Sounders were going to protect Brian Meredith. Right. And I think it seems pretty reasonable now to say that the odds of veteran players on big contracts are just not going to be taken in the expansion draft anymore. Because they just never do. It used to be kind of happened occasionally when MLS was a much different league than it is now, but it's just not something I think.
00:04:47
Speaker
that's going to happen. The Sounders won't even be involved in the next one, which is nice. But yeah, nothing else really has happened. And I don't expect much to happen until probably after the holidays. I think there's going to be a lot that does happen in this window. I think it's going to be a pretty busy offseason. But I think for now, it's
00:05:12
Speaker
sort of in the information gathering phase to, I guess, for lack of a better way of putting it, where teams are figuring out who maybe they can target, who's available in the league, whether or not there's interest on the part of the players they're looking at on the transfer market. So I'm sure there's a lot going on. I just don't think we're going to know about much of it until next year.
00:05:37
Speaker
You know, that's okay. It was a pretty eventful season. So we could, I think we could all use a little bit of a, of a breeder. Well, let me ask you this where the one maybe big surprise or the one, the biggest surprise put it that way of the protected list from the expansion draft was Jordy Dellum being on there. And I think a lot, I had kind of assumed that he would be exposed and I thought he would likely be taken.
00:06:02
Speaker
Maybe the sounders saw that, like saw the same thing I did, which was here's a player who has a clear role, who's got a clear skill set, who's not making very much money, isn't young necessarily, but he's not old. It could be a really useful player for an expansion team. Let's just not even entice them.
00:06:24
Speaker
Yeah, and I mean, I understand the reasoning of them doing that. I think we kind of talked about this and sort of expected him to be taken. I think that I was, you know, before the expansion list or the product list came out, I was kind of prepared for that to happen because he's the kind of depth player that is actually really, really valuable in MLS, where you can trust him to do a job to perform pretty well at a position that's important.
00:06:53
Speaker
for very little money. And he's probably never going to make a ton of money. He's probably... I mean, I think he probably could have started for one of Nashville and Miami and maybe that could have bumped up his income bracket a little bit. But he's almost certainly never going to be a guy that's making more than a couple hundred K a year.
00:07:14
Speaker
And those are really valuable players to have around. And I think there's going to be a lot of roster turnover. And I think a lot of that roster turnover is going to be on the dissensive side of the equation. And so I think there's a case to be made for having a little bit of consistency from year to year. I think that there's plenty of evidence that suggests that roster turnover is a big contributing factor to teams having a decline in
00:07:40
Speaker
in quality from from year to year. So, you know, I understand not wanting to disrupt
Focus on CCL and Roster Strategy
00:07:45
Speaker
that too much. And I'm glad he's around. It probably wouldn't have been, you know, a soul crushing loss, but I'm much happier to lose Brian Meredith than than I am dirty to limb. Yeah. What are the other players I was maybe I wasn't surprised, but he was one of the players who I felt like a lot of
00:08:06
Speaker
people around the team who covered the team thought might be gone was Kelvin Lirdham. Um, but I, I'm kind of glad it make, to me, it makes a lot of sense to bring him back, especially as a, as a, as a, as like, uh, for the early part of, for the champions league, part of the campaign, like he, like you're not going to, to me, it's unlikely you're going to find a short term upgrade over Kelvin Lirdham.
00:08:32
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, it's a tricky one because he had a, he had a very weird season. Um, he did. He had a weird, weird, he had a great start. Right. And I thought he finished well, but he had a very rough middle. He did. Yeah. Um, he scored a lot of goals, which is probably not something we can expect him to do again. And he ended up having seven goals, including the, and we'll skip final.
00:08:58
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, including that one seven, um, which is, you know, that's, that's a lot of goals for, for anyone that's not a striker, honestly. So, um, I think it was like
Expansion and Conference Changes
00:09:08
Speaker
fourth on the team, third, third or fourth on the team and goals court. So, um, so that's probably not going to happen next year. Um,
00:09:14
Speaker
But I think he did play pretty well down the stretch. What I would like to see is some competition for that position. Maybe, um, maybe a backup plan for that position where you can go into the season with him as your expected starter. But maybe you don't feel as if he hits a rough patch like that, maybe you don't feel like you have to keep running them out there. Um, like they, I think kind of did last season. So I think that would be nice, but, um,
00:09:40
Speaker
You know, he finished pretty well. I'm certainly not disappointed that he'll be back, especially after he scored a pretty important goal for us in the Cup Final. You know, a player who I wonder if might be available is Nick Lima, who kind of came in and out of favorability at San Jose. That's a player who I wouldn't mind maybe the Sounders going after.
00:10:09
Speaker
No, not at all. I mean, I think he's a, he's a high upside, um, high upside player. Uh, he could be, if things work out, they'll, they're well for him. He could be, you know, the, an option there for a number of years. Um, he's, he's 24, I believe just turned 24. In fact, I think, yeah, he just turned 24. Um, so, you know, that's, uh,
00:10:32
Speaker
I think that that's definitely the kind of player I would like to see them target for sure. Um, because if he doesn't pan out, I don't think you're, you're going to be out too much. Um, and I, and I, I do believe he has some experience playing left back as well, if I remember correctly. So, yeah, he did. He, well, he played, he also, he played kind of like as a, if I remember correctly, almost like an inverted left back for, uh, for Greg Burrell halter. Right.
00:11:00
Speaker
Yeah, they were running that weird system. Right. At the US national team. But yeah, I mean, it'll be like, I think this could be a year where the sounders bring in a few kind of MLS veterans to bolster the lineup early on. And then, and I think that maybe make one notable foreign signing.
00:11:24
Speaker
but they did create some roster flexibility. They, I think they have 18 players under, under contract going into, going into the off season. Some of the players who were out of contract, presumably we'll be back. Uh, so I'll do dual salon with someone who I was a little surprised to see not picked up, but then I, I, my understanding is he had a big option number. So it made more
Youth Development and Future Prospects
00:11:46
Speaker
sense, but I wonder if he might be back, if there's a way to bring him back potentially as a, as a backup. I liked him a lot.
00:11:54
Speaker
in the role that they had them in anyway. Yeah. I mean, I think that it's, it's one of the things that doesn't get talked about. Um, well, I guess we talk about depth a lot actually, but I think that there's a misperception of what quality depth in MLS actually means. And I, and I don't, it's not being able to do the exact same things you do with your starters.
00:12:17
Speaker
or even 80% of what you do with your servers, right? Um, like I think it's, it's, we're not the worst. Yeah, it's not, it's, we're not the worst team in the league when we're missing a bunch of players. Right. Um, and yeah, so he's a, he's a, he's a guy, I think that is definitely a quality depth option. Um, I was definitely in the camp of being kind of disappointed that the women with him over McCreary, um, going into the last season. That turned out to be a good one, I think.
00:12:44
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, it did. He's a, he's a much different player, I would say the McCrory is, but he's maybe a little more well-suited to what you really care about getting out of, out of that role. When you're, you know, forced to start depth in defense, maybe you're not quite as concerned about their attacking capabilities as you, uh, as you would be in a starter. Um, and I think he's definitely a higher quality defender and you know, he's got some flexibility complacent center back, which ended up
00:13:15
Speaker
weirdly, despite the sounders having a ton of quality center backs ended up being important because they kind of ran into some depth issues there as well. So yeah, I would definitely like to see him back because I think you can get a replacement for him and it's probably not going to be the end of the world, but I think it's going to be difficult to find a replacement that gives you what he gave you at that level.
00:13:39
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, that's, and I think he ended up being a much more flexible and useful player and even factored in, in a few big moments for the sounders.
00:13:51
Speaker
And I, he may have actually played himself into a bigger role with a big and different team. Um, yeah, when the sounders picked him up, he really was not seen as a center back at all. He hadn't played, I don't think at all there. And just the fact that he showed that he can do that makes him a much more marketable player. So I would like to, I'm sure someone will, he'll end up somewhere. Um, it would be nice if it's in Seattle, but I can also see the sounders moving on. Um,
00:14:17
Speaker
One of the other big players, I think that it, I don't know. I'm not sure how to feel. Uh, Harry ship is a player I like. I think that he does like in the role, the sounders used him in. I thought he was really great, but I could also see how if you're a Harry ship, you're
Former Players and Potential Coaching Roles
00:14:33
Speaker
28 years old. You're coming off a pretty productive season on a permanent basis.
00:14:39
Speaker
you probably aren't looking at the prospects of getting more minutes. If you stay with the sounders, I would guess the sounders would be happy to bring them back, but they definitely aren't going to bring them back. And under the impression that he's going to get more minutes. Um, is that a player? Like, would you want to send, like, would you rather the centers gamble on potentially getting a higher upside player or
00:15:03
Speaker
would you want them to bring him back? Like, I don't know. What do you think is going to happen there? I guess is the question. I know it's a tricky one because I like Harry ship a lot. I think that he's exactly the kind of player I want. And
00:15:19
Speaker
that sort of rotational attacking midfield role. I like his flexibility, his ability to play centrally. I mean, he can play pretty much every midfield position except as like a true six. I really like that he has a skill set that the Sounders are kind of lacking. He's a very cerebral player, certainly not the most athletic player, but he just sees stuff on the field that
00:15:41
Speaker
Even at times, Nico Ledero doesn't see. I mean, I think that he's a really, really intelligent player with great vision. He's great in possession. I just, I like him a lot. And I think it's rare to have a player like that, that you don't feel like you have to start. But, and it's a pretty, it's a pretty significant, but Brian Schmetzer doesn't seem as enamored with him as I am.
00:16:06
Speaker
Yeah, that's the big question, right? Yeah. I mean, that's the rub is that he's not making a ton of money, but it's a not insignificant amount of money for a bench player to be making.
00:16:21
Speaker
So wildlife, part of the reason I like him is that he's much different than the other options the sounders have at that position. But if that means Brian Schmetzer sees him as disruptive to the way he wants to do things, which is another way of looking at it rather than he's a change of pace is that
00:16:42
Speaker
we can't do the things we're good at doing when he's playing because he plays so much differently, then maybe you do try to find another option that's a little closer to what you want, ideally, from that position. I don't know that I necessarily agree with that outlook on things, but I can certainly see that being
00:17:02
Speaker
the approach that the club takes. And frankly, I think that they've kind of bought some credibility over the last couple of years.
00:17:15
Speaker
And I could also certainly see how he would, he, you know, could feel like, Hey, I'm 28. I'm not going to be doing this forever. I'd like to go somewhere where I can start and, and, you know, play, um, regularly and not feel like
OL Reign FC Stadium and Fan Engagement
00:17:27
Speaker
I'm out of the rotation. Um, even if it means going to a much worse team, which, you know, but if I'm Nashville, if I'm, if I'm entered Miami, that's a player I'd love to have to sort of not build around necessarily, but, um, you know, to, to be able to count on for 1500 minutes or so.
00:17:44
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I kind of, I guess I'm, I'm kind of hoping he comes back in a sense, but also hoping for his sake that he's able to find someplace that maybe values him a little bit more. Yeah. And I like, I like him and I think that he, he does a great job with what he's given, but, um, I, the sounders got to figure out a way that like how, where he fits, I think if they're going to bring them back.
00:18:11
Speaker
Definitely. And I think there's also the reality that he's making like $300k, close to that probably, which is not a ton of money, but it's
00:18:26
Speaker
You can find players that are probably more likely for Brian Schmetzer to play and to trust and to want to give minutes to for that money. And I'd rather see those players than say Wanna or somebody like that. So it might make sense to make a clean break, which will be unfortunate because I like him a lot, but it may be one of those things that's just kind of best for everybody.
00:18:53
Speaker
Well, we have a ton, and I really mean a ton of questions. And I think this is probably a good place to end this segment and bring in Likit. And we'll do that after the break. You're listening to No Sadietes.
00:19:12
Speaker
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Speaker
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00:19:52
Speaker
Welcome back to nose. We have a lot of questions, a lot of fun off season type of questions and, uh, look at, go ahead and, and take it away. Sure. Tom Glantz starts us off with, uh, are you more excited for Nashville or Miami away? And why, what's the fate of the supporters shield beyond the season with unbalanced schedules seemingly coming?
00:20:16
Speaker
So I would say that I'm, I guess I'm more excited about Nashville because A, we know that the Sounders will definitely be traveling to Nashville. We don't know that they're going to go to Miami. So I guess that's, that's one reason to potentially be more excited about Nashville. But honestly, I'm probably more inclined to do the Nashville trip than like, I don't know that I would do the Nashville trip.
00:20:40
Speaker
But I don't really, I've never really felt super compelled to go to Miami. And I am kind of interested in going to Nashville. So.
00:20:51
Speaker
Yeah. Um, I, Nashville is the best, the third, uh, best city in Tennessee, but I, I still think it would be a more fun away trip to Miami. Um, so who's it? Well, let's, let's get into this Memphis. I'm assuming is number one, right? Yeah. Uh, and then who's number two, even though it's a, it's like UT town, which isn't great. It's still, I still like it better than Nashville, but Nashville, are you from, are you from Tennessee?
00:21:17
Speaker
No, no, never been. Oh, okay. Never been. And you have a ranking and you have a power ranking of Tennessee cities. Okay. I like this. No, uh, natural specials fine. It's like, uh,
00:21:33
Speaker
I don't know, man, I can't. It's like it reminds me a lot of Bellevue, but instead of like high end shopping, just replace it with like Kid Rock Bar and Grill or whatever. It's like a really cheesy city, especially to downtown parts. But but outside of that, it's pretty cool. And Miami is cool, but it seems cool. I haven't actually I haven't actually been to Miami. That's that one's true. But I'd like to go, but it doesn't seem like
00:22:03
Speaker
I don't know. I feel like it's like cool because you sit on the beach and hang out. Not necessarily like cool is like a place to go to. Yeah. I would say I just don't know a lot. Like for all the like stuff you hear about Miami, I don't feel like I know it very well. Even though I've seen it in like pop culture a lot and I'm with you. I get the sense that it's got a great nightlife I suppose. And it seems like the beaches are nice, I guess. Uh, but
00:22:33
Speaker
I've never like those. That seems like an awful far away to go to like, get those things when I feel like I can get those things here are not necessarily here, but near here. Uh, as far as the supporter shield, this is an interesting debate. Uh, I,
00:22:49
Speaker
I have not, I have not really, I always like to remind people that in the entire 25 year history of MLS, there have been exactly two seasons where we had a balanced schedule. And that was back when MLS was an 18 team league. Uh, I don't remember who those 17 and I guess that was like Orlando city in New York city. Maybe we're the team 17 and 18 teams. That seems, that seems right.
00:23:16
Speaker
And so for two seasons, we were blessed with a double round Robin and all seemed right in the world. But other than that, we've always had unbalanced schedules. Now this will be the first time where every team doesn't play each other at least once. So that will be kind of new. And I suppose there is a fair argument to say that that further devalues the supporter shield. But the supporter shield is always to me been the measure of like,
00:23:46
Speaker
quality over a long period of time. And it's still that. Now, does that mean that you're the best team simply by winning the supporter shield? There's a fair argument to be made that you're not because you haven't necessarily beaten every, you haven't had to beat every team. We haven't had to play every team. And that's more so true now than it ever was before. But I don't, to me, it doesn't change it a lot. It just reinforces the reason that we have a playoff and we're not a single table.
00:24:14
Speaker
Yeah, I think the only real change would be that there's any plausible case you could make for the Supporter's Shield being a legitimate way to determine a champion. I think even that's gone now. But that's, I mean, otherwise I'm kind of with you. Like, I would love to have a Double Ground Robin single table, no playoff.
00:24:34
Speaker
Well, actually, I don't know if I would love it. There was a time when I thought that was the best way. I don't know if I feel that strongly anymore, but it would be fine. But we don't and we're not gonna have that. So I think it's still a cool thing to award. I still, you know, I'd love to win it. But I don't think you can make a plausible case anymore that it's the
00:24:55
Speaker
you know, that that team should be recognized as the champion. I just, I don't see it. I'll also add that I've seen it kind of posited around a few different, by a few different people that like, should we not be giving a Champions League birth to the winner of the supporter shield? And, and I don't know if people realize that
00:25:15
Speaker
that we don't necessarily give it for winning the supporter shield. You get it for winning one of the two conferences. And if you win the supporter shield by default, you've also won one of the conferences. It is kind of weird that like, that's not going anywhere. But yeah. And to me, it's kind of weird that, that they do award it for the regular season conference title, but not the playoff.
00:25:40
Speaker
Well, I mean, I understand because you want to, you want to reward regular season performance, right? And so like the, since you're giving it to each conference, it was a little weirder. I think when the supporter shield won it and the, and, and then the other two spot, then it was like the MLS cup winner and the MLS cup runner up. Um, but then I don't know. I mean, I guess that you could go, like if you got rid of the regular season entirely, I don't know what you would give that other spot to.
00:26:10
Speaker
Yeah, I think it's a good, I mean, I like it. I think it's good that that's how they, they determine who goes to the champions league. I'm just, I find it a little surprising. Um, you know, I like it. I think it's, I think it's a good, I think it's a good, uh, a good enough carrot to want to win the, uh, to want to perform well in the regular season.
00:26:30
Speaker
Yeah, I, I, this is totally off, off subject, but one of the things I thought was funny was someone was saying how, well, you get a champions league spot for winning open cup, but what do you get for winning champions league? And this is under the impression, I guess, I think there is going to be a club world cup this year, but this person was on the impression that there was no club world cup. And I thought that was a weird, that's like saying, well, you get into the playoffs for winning, uh, for regular season performance, but what do you get for winning the playoffs?
00:26:55
Speaker
Well, you get to be the champion of the league. It seems like a pretty good carrot. I don't know. Yeah. I mean, I, I would, I think winning CCL would be worth it more than no other. Like that's to me, an end, an end of itself. Like it's nice that you get to go to the club World Cup, I guess, but I don't honestly care about the club World Cup. I care a lot more about winning Champions League than I care about winning going to the club World Cup.
00:27:24
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I think, uh, I think that there is like a subset of people who are really super into the idea of going to the club world cup and like, that that gives the team some legitimacy. And, and I just, I'm not saying it's wrong to feel that way. I just hate to break it to people that I like.
00:27:41
Speaker
there's a bunch of teams in the club world cup that aren't Barcelona or Real Madrid or whoever else. There's like the champion of Asia every year. There's the champion of Africa every year. And I don't think my guess is that the people in those countries don't suddenly look at their teams differently because they played in the club. Like there's a Mexican team that goes to the club world cup pretty much every year. And
00:28:05
Speaker
No one's, I mean, I guess maybe they are getting excited about playing Real Madrid in a real competition, but I don't think people who are fans of Real Madrid suddenly look at like, oh, well, they played Santos Laguna and now I'm going to be a Santos Laguna fan or something. Right.
00:28:23
Speaker
I have no idea who is want any of the cold world cups. So I don't either. I have no idea. The only year I've ever seen fans of European teams care about it is when Rafa was the coach at Chelsea and he lost the final and Chelsea fans hated him so much that it was like another thing for them to be mad about. But outside of that, like I don't think anybody actually cares.
00:28:48
Speaker
Okay. Moving on, actually still staying with, uh, natural questions. Uh, J max. Oh, two, oh two S Nashville in the West would have made more sense to move Chicago for the season.
00:29:01
Speaker
Uh, so I, I talked about this a little bit in my, my story about it today. And I had originally argued that it made the most sense to move Chicago. And I, and I, I mean, that's by default, they're the most Western team it's, it's not as different. I think as people think though, it's like a 40 mile difference. And, uh, there's a guy named Dan Dickinson, who's very good Twitter personality. Uh, and he wrote, he did like a little map.
00:29:25
Speaker
that showed like the, you said the Garber line instead of the Mason-Dixon line. And it has like a slight curve. And I'm thinking, you know, I don't know if that's the own that you think it is because it actually makes it seem like it's not that ridiculous. That like the difference between the way, like they're both in the central time zone, the difference between like Tennessee is a really wide state and Memphis is like, or Nashville is on the complete Western end of Tennessee.
00:29:55
Speaker
It's pretty close. No, it's not. Memphis is as far west as Tennessee gets, but Nashville is, it's pretty central. Well, in any case, apparently there's only 40 miles of difference, of like longitudinal difference. Yeah, between Chicago and Nashville, yeah. But yeah, Nashville's
00:30:20
Speaker
Well, you tell me, how crazy is this? Nashville seems to be in the West more than they should be, or Tennessee seems to be in the West. No, I mean, the way our geography works and our terminology for our geography works is pretty weird.
00:30:40
Speaker
Because a huge chunk of the population, especially historically, has been clustered along the eastern seaboard and then there's nothing for a good thousand miles there once you get out of the Midwest and then it's the West Coast. So they're all kind of fungible terms. I think that it makes
00:31:02
Speaker
It doesn't make a ton of sense necessarily for next year, but I think just moving Chicago around like two years in a row is a good enough excuse to put Nashville in the West. I don't think it makes the travel that much worse. It definitely doesn't make the travel that much worse, especially when you consider that
00:31:21
Speaker
They aren't playing three of the teams in the, like the, the most, they took five trips to the Eastern time zone in the centers and made five trips to the Eastern time zone in 2019. That's the most they can make in 2020 is, is five. And so it doesn't end up making that much difference in terms of like adding a ton of travel. Um.
00:31:43
Speaker
Although, I guess they only had to go to Chicago, I guess, already last year. But you're obviously right. Nashville is right in the middle of the state of Tennessee. But I guess what confused me, because I'm an idiot, is that Tennessee is not actually on the Eastern Seaboard.
00:31:59
Speaker
It's no, it's not. No, it's it's a good way. In fact, there's a whole. Yes, it's great. There's a whole state between it. Yeah. Yeah. You really should go to Nashville. I think I think that would be a good learning experience for you. Yeah, I would. Right. I guess the one I'm Nashville, if I'm Nashville, I think I'm probably more upset about being like, I don't think it affects the West, the other Western Conference teams too much. It's like, I think the other Western Conference teams probably
00:32:25
Speaker
are fine with this. Nashville kind of gets the shit end of the stick. And I would imagine Chicago fought pretty hard to stay in the in the in the East. Yeah. And I think like they're trying to do the big rebrand thing. And so shuffling them around is probably going to I don't know that it would matter that much, but I can kind of see them being like, look, like gross bone here. We're trying. Right. And I think that that's going to affect an expansion team less than it would a. Right. You know, so.
00:32:56
Speaker
Okay. But I hate them because they're natural. So it's fine. There you go. All right. Buckle up. This is a big one. Big, chunky one. Interpiercing. Alas, the F O is talking like CCL is their big goal next season, but some of the four league MX teams have a big talent advantage over our current roster. Is there a good chance that we go all in by adding a DP and Tams this winter? If not, how is targeting CCL more than wishful thinking?
00:33:22
Speaker
It's I mean, I don't think there's any compelling I don't think there's any plausible
00:33:30
Speaker
number of roster additions that the Sounders could make that would make winning the CCL a... I don't want to say a reasonable goal, but something you could expect. I mean, it's the League MX teams are better from top to bottom. And that's just kind of the way it is. But that doesn't mean teams can't make runs.
00:33:53
Speaker
But you do have to kind of balance the likelihood of making a run like that against the opportunity cost of making moves in the offseason rather than the summer window. I personally, I would rather they make the right moves when they feel like it's the best time to make them than if that means waiting to the summer or not.
00:34:14
Speaker
starting as strong of a team in the CCL, I'm willing to live with that. But I think it's reasonable to be on the other side of that equation. And I think especially now that the Sounders have won two MLS cups, they've won an MLS cup at home, they've won a supporters shield. I mean, this is really the last thing left. This is the last mountain to climb.
00:34:36
Speaker
You know, I think you have to recognize that you're going to be most likely, depending on who their targets are, obviously, but most likely you're going to be leaving some flexibility on the table. You're going to be limiting the quality of player potentially that you can get. You're not going to be able to be as reactive as the sounders have in the past.
00:34:56
Speaker
few windows in the summer, which I think is probably the most compelling case for waiting is that if you need to do something drastic in the summer, you might punt that opportunity. But I think there's a reasonable case for going for it. I just think we have to acknowledge that even if they push all their chips in on getting the best possible roster, the odds of them winning the competition are still relatively low, I would say.
00:35:25
Speaker
Yeah. And I think that's probably accurate that there's like, if let's just say the high end, they could make two big signings this, this winter, right? Like, I suppose you could, they could sign like a DP center back and they could sign like a DP attacking midfielder type, like a Victor Rodriguez type of player, but
00:35:49
Speaker
healthier and presumably better. And you make those two signings and and if you stay healthy, I think you your top 11 are going to match up really well with any team in most teams, I should say in Mexico, you're probably still not the favorite. And you're also probably one injury away from
00:36:16
Speaker
like not even being that good of a matchup for that team. And so from that perspective, I understand not pushing it all in and going for broke kind of a champion for Champions League. At the same time, I think there's a fair point to be made here that if
00:36:32
Speaker
if the Sounders are really serious about winning Champions League. And, you know, there's I've argued for a long time that like the transformative event about this franchise would be hosting MLS Cup at home. Like it was the transformative event that signing Clint Dempsey was not we, you know, for all that as big of a deal as that was that didn't move the needle, I don't think as much as a lot of people thought it would. Same thing with Oba Femi-Mortons and
00:37:01
Speaker
winning the supporter shield and doing all these things. Like none of that really moved the needle as much as, as frankly, it felt was moved when Sanders won MLS Cup. Now I suppose the one thing that you could do to build on that, and I think this is, if I'm the sound, if I'm talking to the Sounders front office and I'm trying to get them to like maybe take a big risk this off season, it's, it's, if you can stack up playing in a champions league final on top of
00:37:29
Speaker
winning MLS Cup at home, all of a sudden, I think you really have the possibility of just absolutely winning over a generation of fans and cementing it in the psyche of Seattle sports fans in general, that this is a team that's very serious about competing on the biggest stages. And I don't know. I don't know if playing in a Champions League final would even be a bigger deal than
00:37:55
Speaker
for the average sports fan, and maybe it's not. Maybe it's even a significantly less deal. But I'd like to think that they could probably pack another 67,000 into a Champions League final leg. They'd only be one of two legs. Especially if it was the second leg and they come into it, let's just say they're tied or something. There's potential there for that to be a pretty big event. And so I guess from that perspective, I think
00:38:18
Speaker
I would urge the Sounders to kind of go for this and try it out. But I don't think that they will go all the way, like make two DP signings. And for the reasons that you said that I think they probably still want that flexibility. They don't want to totally sacrifice the regular season. But I will say this, as far as it being just words,
00:38:43
Speaker
I think the other part of that is you see the way that they play lineups for Champions League and clearly they're treating it like a priority. They aren't treating it like the only priority, but they are definitely treating it like an important thing. And I suspect that we'll still see like their best lineups playing in Champions League as opposed to early regular season games. But it'll be interesting. I mean, I really do hope they make at least one big signing this summer or this winter. That's what I meant, this winter.
00:39:14
Speaker
Yeah, we get it. Okay. Uh, game coug asks, how about some percentage odds? Okay. He's got lists to Jamie is on the team on opening day.
00:39:27
Speaker
Well, let's go. Let's go through them one by one. Well, let me read them first. And I'll go back through them. Tachini's on the team on opening day. They sign a replacement for Victor during the first window. That replacement is Dearly's Granzales. They assign a TAM level CDM during the first window. TAM is still a thing as of opening day. Okay. So Tachini on the roster. I'm putting that at like 10 or 15%.
00:39:54
Speaker
Oh wow. Okay. I was going to say 30, but I think that this is something you definitely have a better sense of than I do. I mean, I think 30 might be right too. I think the issue is going to be how, how likely they are to be able to find someone to take him. That's true. Yeah. But I like hearing the, I mean, I don't know. I'm very much reading between the lines. I don't think nothing they said off the record makes me think that this is definitely the way they're going. But it did feel like one of those situations where
00:40:24
Speaker
in a worse, like they might be willing to use their buyout to get out of this loan. And I don't think it's because they think he's a bad player. I think it's just because they don't, he's not the player that they hoped he was going to be. And maybe it means it was a bad signing, but it ultimately wasn't that big of a gamble either.
00:40:45
Speaker
Yeah, I think the way I saw you put it once was that he, they basically wanted to know, they'd seen him enough to know that he was a good player. They weren't sure if he could play as a six and they didn't want to commit a transfer fee to him until they knew that he could play as a six. Right. And yeah.
00:41:02
Speaker
Right now, they don't think he can play six. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think he's basically now they look at him as a player who's going to be competing for minutes with Danny Leyva and and Christian Roldan, and they probably don't foresee a world where they would rather give those minutes to him than one of those two. Yeah. OK, now they sign a replacement for Victor during the first window.
00:41:31
Speaker
I'm going to say 70%. I think that they're going to make a big attacking signing, whether it's a direct, you know, like that guy is going to take all the victor's minutes and play exact same position. I don't know, but I think that they're going to make an attacking signing of that caliber during the, during the first window.
00:41:49
Speaker
I'll, yeah, I don't, I think that 70 feels about right there. Maybe, maybe a little higher, but 70 feels about right. I would say that the, that 25 of that 30% is something false through rather than they're just not interested in doing it. Yeah. Like I think they're slow playing their interest in making that signing. Yeah. Speaking of falling through, uh, is that replacement is Dearly Scranzales.
00:42:17
Speaker
You know, I asked Adrian about this maybe a year ago or something. It was probably, it was like the, not this most recent transfer window, I don't think, but the one before that. And he jokingly said, I told Garth to make a million dollar transfer offer for him just to see the look on their face.
00:42:40
Speaker
And I don't know if he was serious, but I, I kind of, I mean, I would think that the centers probably like wouldn't mind getting them. And he's, I guess he's out of contract in the, in the summer. And if they can get them for pennies on the dollar, you know, like I would assume their assessment of them hasn't changed that much in the year and a half or whatever. I actually may was this last summer that he told me that. Um, but it must've been, um, but.
00:43:11
Speaker
It's, it doesn't, it wouldn't blow me away if they, like, I know Matt Doyle put this out there that they, he thought they would sign him. I don't, I'm not convinced that they're actually going to go after him, but it wouldn't be completely out of left field if they did it. And it would make some sense if they could get him at the right price.
00:43:32
Speaker
Yeah, I think his, uh, his reasoning was pretty good. I'm going to put this pretty low though, at like 10, 15% because I kind of feel like that bridge has been burned. Um, dynamo Q that he's still there, right? He's not, he's still under contract. He's on loan. He's on, he was in London. I think it was in like Brazil or something. He was like playing in Santos. Which division was this is, is that, I think, don't know. I can look it up.
00:44:01
Speaker
They're the first division. I'm pretty sure. Oh, they are. Okay. Well, because I think he was getting a bunch of minutes with their like B team or something, but, um, that's not good. Yeah. I mean, I, 10% feels about right. Like it's not a complete completely out of the realm of possibility, but I just, I don't.
00:44:22
Speaker
I think you're right. The same thing that kept him from the signing completed the last time, which was basically Dynamo Kiev saying at the last minute, no, we want more. When you're dealing with that kind of personality, I think you end up
00:44:44
Speaker
like the same people are going to be like, no, I don't want to, I don't want to sign them. I don't want to give them away either. Right. So like, I think it's probably more likely that he, they just let his contract run out in the summer and then maybe the sounders can sign them on a free in the summer. But I think that's probably more likely than, than Dynamo. It's just going to give them away. Yeah. They don't seem to be interested in, you know, helping other teams out.
00:45:10
Speaker
No, and I guess he had one goal and 16 appearances for, uh, Santos, which, which is in their top, their top tier. And I mean, that is, you know, that's one of the biggest clubs in Brazil. So it's, um, you know, he's definitely going to have quality players. He's competing for playing time against, but, um, I don't know.
00:45:33
Speaker
Oh my God. This is, this is just something I'm like tripping out on. So according to transfer market, uh, Oh, maybe this is the whole league. Oh, nevermind. This is the whole league. I thought Santos had a billion dollars worth of players. And that's insane. That's the whole, it's the whole league. Nevermind. They do have $83 million worth of players. So that's, which is a lot.
00:46:00
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, it's, it's a, is that, is that salary market? That's like, so there's supposed to market value based on, you know, transfer markets. I'd buy that. Um, if for no other reason, then teams pay a lot of money for Brazilian players. Yeah. And flamingo, which just, they, they just didn't, they just win, uh,
00:46:35
Speaker
They sign a TAM level CDM during the first window. Uh, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know.
00:46:49
Speaker
I think that if the right player is there and available now, I think that there's no reason to wait. But I think that they're probably pretty happy with their defensive midfield going into the season. And I think that they're a lot more likely to want to
00:47:10
Speaker
wait for the right player because that's going to be a long term, probably reasonably big money signing. So I would expect that to happen in the primary window or sorry, the secondary window. And so actually, I'll bump that down to 30%. Yeah, I was going to say, I'll say like 20. I know this is what
00:47:32
Speaker
Garth said at the end of your press conference, he said that, you know, we could go out and sign a defensive midfielder and he made it sound like that was their top priority. And I do think like that might be their top priority, but I, I just have a hard time. Like it makes so much more sense to me to go out and sign a Victor Rodriguez type of player who's more of a short-term solution.
00:47:54
Speaker
then that they'd go out and spend a bunch of money on a defensive midfielder in the winter who when you're kind of set at that position, like it just doesn't like knowing that the better players are probably going to be available in the summer. Yeah, I'm saying like 15, 20 percent. I don't think that's I think it's much more likely sign of Victor Rodriguez type. And the last percentage, Tam is still a thing as of opening day.
00:48:27
Speaker
Uh, I think that's high actually. Well, I guess it depends. Are we, it depends on how he's asking the question. I realize he wrote Tam and I don't know if he means it as that allocation money is a thing.
00:48:40
Speaker
Or if targeted allocation money is a thing, meaning specifically the money that MLS, this like separate pot of money that MLS is putting aside for specific kinds of signings. I think there will be allocation money, like 90%, 95%. Like almost certainly, like I know the players union has talked about wanting to get rid of that. I don't think there's any way that MLS is just going to get rid of
00:49:06
Speaker
a tool that they think has been really successful. And I think that the league really even likes having TAM, but maybe they are convinced that just having one kind of allocation money works, and you don't need to have these different kinds of allocation money. So I'll say like 60% that it's still around, assuming TAM.
00:49:29
Speaker
Yeah, I would actually put it higher. And my reasoning is basically that I think that the owners really like having a mechanism that allows them to
00:49:41
Speaker
spend more on a specific kind of player. If they're just dumping general money back into the salary cap, right? Because what the players are asking for is get rid of TAM, get rid of GAM, and raise the salary cap amount by that much plus 5% or 10% or whatever it is, right? I think the owners would probably rather spend more money overall
00:50:08
Speaker
then lose the ability to give that money to a specific kind of player. Now, I guess teams have started kind of spending that money on players like Christian Roldan and Jordan Morris. And so, you know, those aren't necessarily the kind of players I think Tam was originally supposed to pay for.
00:50:29
Speaker
Um, Jovan Jones, you know, was famously, uh, who was being paid with Tam now was famously, um, not able to be paid with Tam in the past. So maybe the owners don't care as much about that anymore. I don't know. Um, I know that this is a big issue for the players, but I think that the owners are going to be willing to give on other things that maybe ultimately are more important to the players. Um, and that they're just kind of using this as a cudgel. Um, so I don't know. I would, I would.
00:50:58
Speaker
expect it's like 80% likelihood. I think the owners are really in a dig in on that one. Yeah. Um, and I'll, I'll add that I think that the concern and, and I don't know if it was ever literally articulated this way to me, but I think there's this general concern that the owners are happy to spend money on players. What they don't want to do is be spending
00:51:26
Speaker
You know, money that you could get us, you know, effectively at a replacement level player, like a $75,000 player. And suddenly you're going to have to pay that guy $150,000. Like, and that might be, maybe that's where we get to, but I think that's what they're reluctant. Like they don't want to be paying guys money just because it's there. Like they want to get value out of it. And that, I think that's what they saw Tam as was like, well, we're going to spend a bunch of money, but
00:51:51
Speaker
that investment will be very obvious in the way that the games are played and they don't want to basically be spending more money for the same quality of players. Yeah, and I think that you can make a very compelling argument that
00:52:10
Speaker
given the amount of money MLS is bringing in, the players that are being paid the least amount of money at the bottom of the roster deserve more. Yeah, absolutely. And I understand the labor case that the players are making. That being said, because being a sports fan involves being hypocritical, I kind of understand the owner's perspective on this, which is that, look,
00:52:37
Speaker
we want to improve the quality of play and we have a limited amount of money that we can spend. And so pain bottom end of roster guys, that money isn't the best way to improve the quality of play. So I understand the arguments. Ultimately, I think I kind of side with the players, but
00:52:56
Speaker
But I understand the reasoning behind it from the owner's perspective. It's not that they're not willing to spend, like you said, it's just that they don't want to spend more than they have to unless they're improving the quality of the league. Okay, a couple of questions about young guys. First one, M. Jamon asks, what does the immediate future of Trey Muse look like?
00:53:22
Speaker
I think he's going to be the starting goalkeeper for the Defiance. I think he'll probably get something closer to 20, 25 games at the Defiance level. I think this year he had like 15, something around there.
00:53:37
Speaker
But he's still, I don't think he's the backup goalkeeper for the Sounders right now. I think, you know, if both him and Stefan Cleveland, I think is how you, I'm gonna guess is how you say his name. I've never seen this guy play, but he has a little bit more MLS experience. He's a little older, four or five years older.
00:54:02
Speaker
My assumption is he's going to be the backup and he's going to play in most of the open cup games and maybe even in Champions League. So I think the Sounders are going to take it slow with Muse. He's so interested in improvement, but he's still not. I think his distribution especially is not an MLS level. Yeah, I have nothing to add to that. I think that's spot on.
00:54:26
Speaker
Okay. And then, uh, just gail asks, can we expect Leyva and or AOC to get ship slash dilemma minutes in 2020, or are they still at the Alex roll Dan Buana level? And what's the future for Buana?
00:54:40
Speaker
I think that they'll get more minutes. I think Leyva has a real shot at getting a decent uptick in minutes and being maybe not a regular rotational guy, but somebody that gets a decent number of minutes.
00:54:58
Speaker
I don't feel like I know enough about where he's at development wise to say for sure, but I think he's probably still a year or two away from getting significant minutes. But I'd love to be wrong. In terms of Wanna, I don't know.
00:55:16
Speaker
He showed some signs of improvement down the stretch I think last year that were encouraging. If he can build on that, I think he's got a good shot to be a rotational guy maybe in the next couple of years. If he kind of stalls at where he's at now and given his age and experience level, I don't think that that's an unlikely scenario. I think he's probably a USL guy. I'd love to be wrong because if he develops into
00:55:43
Speaker
the kind of player I think where his ceiling is. He could be a really fun, exciting, valuable player for a long time. But there's a lot of guys with his skill set that just never kind of make it past where he's at now.
00:55:59
Speaker
Yeah, you know, I was just looking at their numbers and both ship and Delham played about 1400 minutes. I think that's probably the high end of what you might expect Danny Leyva to get to that feels like a stretch still to get 1400 minutes. That's, you know, they both played in like
00:56:20
Speaker
20 games or more. And you just kind of do the math and it's hard for me to see Leyva getting 20 games. Like he might get, you know, he might get a 10 starts. Like that wouldn't be totally shocking to me, but that's just a lot of games for him to get into, to get to 1400 minutes. And I don't, I don't see it. I, I could see AOC weirdly
00:56:50
Speaker
getting, he's not going to get, I mean, he, I think half that would be a pretty good step forward for him in terms of minutes played. He's clearly developing. I think his future is probably as an outside mid, but, and he came on really, really strong at the end of the U S L season. Like he was, he was taking guys on, he was scoring all sorts of different kinds of goals. He showed a lot of promise. He's still, he's still 17, I think. Uh,
00:57:17
Speaker
Both those guys have a ton of upside. I think they'll I think they're both probably best served by getting a full season of like they bounced around so much early on last year that I think that that probably hurt them. You know, AOC, especially he basically started producing once he was on a team for a consistent period of time and training with the same group of players. I would love to see him really just allowed to star for for Defiance next year.
00:57:47
Speaker
And I think like somewhere in the 500 to 700 minutes would be a pretty massive step forward for him. And that's basically where Boana was this year is at 500 minutes. But Boana, I'm a little worried that he just did not, he didn't show up at all. Like he didn't play down the stretch. He, like he'd made
00:58:08
Speaker
He made one appearance over the Sounders like last 10 games, including the playoffs. And that was a game that the Sounders were very, very short-handed against Colorado and he got pulled at halftime. That's not a great sign. I'm a little worried that maybe he just wasn't making the right
00:58:32
Speaker
You know, he wasn't showing up and training the way he needed to be. You know, he didn't play a lot at the end of last year or two years ago either, but that was mainly because of an injury, I think. Well, actually, no, he was he was he played in the he played in the last playoff game. I take it back. He scored a penalty in the in the shootout. So that was, you know, it seemed like he was poised to take a big step forward this year and he really didn't. He made the same number of starts this year as he did in 2018.
00:59:00
Speaker
And I think he's got a very, very attractive skill set, but he's got to do some of the little stuff to make sure he's getting minutes. Sticking with the young guys, 206Hometowners asks, what are the odds that Sam Rogers is part of the center back core going into 2020? It doesn't strike me as likely.
00:59:25
Speaker
I don't know. I was a little disappointed in what I saw from him after he came back from Belgium. I know there's some personality. I know he and the Sounders don't really see eye to eye on his development. And so I don't necessarily think that he's suddenly not a talent, but I'd be a little surprised if he's part of the actual rotation next year.
00:59:54
Speaker
but I'm, I'm loved to be wrong on that one because I think he's, he's got a lot of upside. Sorry. I was giving you a shot, but I figured you didn't have anything. Uh, stick, you speaking with the center backs, a bill Jones, S T R P T S. What will next year's center back pairing look like and who will be the bench options there?
01:00:21
Speaker
So I think one of, I think Kim is back. I don't know why I think that, but I do. I think that too. I don't have anything to, other than they protected him in the expansion draft. I think that that's the biggest hand. I just, man, changing.
01:00:39
Speaker
Going from Kim Torres and Marshall being your center back rotation for the better part of two years to a guy that wasn't on the team until mid-season last year being the only... That's a lot to change over in one year, especially since they've got to go straight into CCL. So I think that they'll probably...
01:01:05
Speaker
I could foresee a situation where they pay more for Kim than they maybe would otherwise, just to have some consistency there. But I don't know that he's necessarily going to be the starter with Ariaga. But I don't know.
01:01:21
Speaker
I think that that center back pairing got better towards the end of its time together. I think they started learning each other a little bit more. But it's still kind of a like for like center back pairing. So I'd like to see somebody maybe a little more in the Torres Marshall sort of mold to play alongside, you know, Ariaga most likely, I think is the starter going into next season.
01:01:49
Speaker
But outside of that.
01:01:52
Speaker
Man, I don't know. I mean, I assume they're going to get somebody from in the league. Probably not start. Probably not start. One of the, the interesting rumors that hasn't really, that I've just heard whispers about and seems like it would make some sense is Axel soyberg, I think is how you say his name from Colorado is, was released or one of them waivers or is, was not picked up by the rapids and he is a,
01:02:21
Speaker
few years now, well, yeah, a few years now removed from being one of the best center backs in the league. But he was at one, you know, like three years ago was considered one of the better center backs. I still relatively young.
01:02:37
Speaker
So that might be an interesting kind of in the Jonathan Campbell space on the roster. Yeah, I think that's a big upgrade on Jonathan Campbell too. Yeah, that would be a big upgrade on Jonathan Campbell for sure. But if he's your fourth center back, I think you're in good shape. Yeah, you're in very good shape. I've heard that rumor too and I like it a lot. I'm a big fan of reclamation projects for center backs, especially when they're young and they've been in a bad situation like he has.
01:03:06
Speaker
I think people kind of forget that now Chad Marshall definitely had not slipped as much as his actual, uh, I thought it was Schuberg, but sort of makes more sense. Um, I don't, uh, you, whatever the big, the big guy, the big, big Colorado guy. Um, he, Chad Marshall certainly had not slipped to that level, but there were a lot of people that were like, eh, he's in a pretty heavy decline phase. Um, you know, Columbus was selling high. Um,
01:03:34
Speaker
And we all saw how that turned out, I think, and it turned out pretty well. So I'm a big fan of trying to get those guys that have the talent to be elite or at least very good defenders in MLS that have demonstrated it and get them into a better situation. I think it's a good way to go because at worst, you've got a veteran center back to put on the bench. So I like that one a lot. I hope that ends up happening.
01:04:01
Speaker
Yeah, it might be axle show bird show show bird show. Depends if it's a new mode on his own or not. Yeah. So anyway, there is, there is an amount. So there is. Yeah. I'm sure I butchered it worse than anyone else. Can you say the color times where you have samples of your audio? Yeah. Hmm.
01:04:26
Speaker
Okay. Let's skip ahead a couple. Uh, Tim DeBerge asked, who was the next Sounders player that you could see returning to coach at one of the teams that they previously played for, for the sake of fun. I'm taking Gonzo off the table for this one.
01:04:42
Speaker
I don't think I understand the question. I mean, I think the question is who could pull a Freddie Lindberg and end up being a coach for a team they were at before the Sounders. I guess Tyro Marshall, I think, has been rising up the ranks. Pat Noonan. Pat Noonan is probably the most likely answer, actually.
01:05:03
Speaker
Like he's been, Pat Newton's been bumming around, uh, MLS and American coaching circles for awhile. He was with the galaxy for awhile. I think Newton's probably pretty close to getting a head coach and gig relative at some point.
01:05:16
Speaker
Yeah. And he's a, he's an RSL assistant timer. Sorry. Tyra Marshall is an RSL assistant now. Right. So I think so. Yeah. Both of those guys are, I would think those are probably the two former sounders who are closest to like, that's their career trajectory is, uh, like we're going where it's going. Yeah. That would make, I like, I always liked Tyra Marshall. I think it would be a,
01:05:42
Speaker
I think he would be a good coach. I'm not basing that on anything other than me liking him when he was here. Yeah. He seemed like an interesting guy. I never really got to know him. He, he was one of the players that I, that kind of, uh, I, like I was not, I was, I was just, was not really covering the team that closely when he was still here.
01:06:07
Speaker
Uh, let's see. Dave W. Montgomery asks, chances of getting Kellen Rowe? Who will be, uh, we already talked about Victor, but chances of getting Kellen Rowe. Uh, they seem.
01:06:21
Speaker
Not as good as they did last year, maybe. I don't know. He did not set the world on fire in KC. And he definitely, it would seem like the opportunity would have been there based on how that team's season went and how many injuries they had at the positions he plays.
01:06:43
Speaker
So, yeah, I mean, I think there's still a chance. I mean, I think that it's an obvious fit for some reasons. You know, mainly that he's from here, but also that I mean, I think. Positionally, he plays. Yeah, he he.
01:06:59
Speaker
plays the right positions. But like you allude to, he also is coming off of a season where he played less than a thousand minutes for two teams that weren't very good. Right. But I mean, it's not super dissimilar, I guess, from from Harry ship. Harry ship was definitely kind of on the down the downswing a little bit when he when he came in.
01:07:22
Speaker
And he's been a good rotational player for us. They're actually the same age, so it kind of works. But I think Cullen Rose, the scary thing for me is that his skill set is a little more dependent on athleticism and a little more physical. And those skills, this is when they can start to decline pretty significantly.
01:07:50
Speaker
So yeah, I don't know. I mean, I think that it's possible, but I don't think I would say that it's likely necessarily.
01:07:57
Speaker
Yeah, I, I would have said if he was in, if row was a free agent last season, I think he would have almost certainly ended up with the sounders. I would imagine the sounders explored the possibility of picking them up. Uh, but sporting Kansas city ended up paying quite a bit in a trade to get them. Uh, and the sounders probably looked at it like, why are we going to pay this much to get them when we could probably get them for free next year. Um, and now it's next year and.
01:08:25
Speaker
I don't know, I don't know that they're quite as...
01:08:29
Speaker
as enthusiastic about trying to pick them up as they were, you know, the last two years, frankly, and, or longer than that, they've been interested in killing row for a long time. Uh, I hope, I kind of hope he ends up here because I think like, like he, there's some upsides still there. I think there's like a reclamation project there, but I think it would have to be like the right price. Like the sounders aren't just going to throw a bunch of money at them. I would imagine they'll make a decent offer.
01:08:58
Speaker
Or, you know, like if he's willing to come in at, you know, like at a number with a one in front of it, probably. Yeah. And probably not six more numbers. Right. Right. Right. Like I would think. $199.99.
01:09:16
Speaker
Yeah. Like if it's a low risk signing, I think the sounders would be happy to have him. And there's a lot of, you know, he's, he's got some upside, but I think you'd be hard pressed. You know, you look at what Harry ship did last year, five goals, three assists in about 1400 minutes. And you look at what, what Kellen road did, which was no goals and two assists in about a thousand minutes, um, less than, you know, the 900 minutes, uh,
01:09:42
Speaker
That's like, which one of those two players are you more likely to want to bring back like sign? Harry ship, uh, scored the five goals last year. Um, Colin Roe has scored three goals since Harry ship signed for the sounders.
01:09:59
Speaker
I mean, yeah. And he and he's always I mean, he was always more, I would say, a goal scorer than than Harry Ship was. So he's gone from, I mean, he was six to seven to five to one to one to zero. That's not a great trajectory, I would say. Yeah, that's a bummer. It is. I mean, I I still like killing row. I like and it was what, just last.
01:10:25
Speaker
Was he in, I think he was at last the, yeah, it was this last January he was in the U S national team camp. So it's not like he's that far removed from being a promising player, but the last two years have been rough on him. Didn't really rough on him. Definitely. Maybe Jeremiah just needs to write a skating article about how Kellen Rose out of soccer and he'll just become a really good player. Yeah, that's usually how it goes.
01:10:52
Speaker
Moving on, Podfish asks, are rain at sea headed for a local relocation, for example, Federal Way, Renton, East Bellevue, et cetera, or will the 5,000th Stadium in Heidelberg in Tacoma serve for the next decade? It's an interesting, putting it that way, it's hard to imagine the rain being at a 5,000 seat stadium for another year, or another 10 years, sorry, another decade, that feels
01:11:22
Speaker
Like if they're still playing at a 5,000 seat stadium in 20, 29, I would imagine they, there's some problems. Like there's probably not a path to where they want to be in 10 years that ends with them at a 5,000 seat stadium. That said.
01:11:43
Speaker
I wonder if there's a way, like, I don't know how expandable the Heidelblad facility is. And I suppose there's, you know, with, with Olympic Leone money, maybe that facility suddenly becomes a 10,000 seat stadium.
01:12:00
Speaker
Uh, and I don't, and I honestly, I don't know that there's going to be, I don't know what communities around Seattle are going to be throwing money at the rain to build them a 10,000 seat soccer specific stadium. Right. Especially until there's like a sustained, um, a sustained evidence of, of that level of interest in the team. Um,
01:12:24
Speaker
It doesn't feel small though. I mean, there's no question. It definitely does. It definitely does. Um, it's, it's, it's such a tricky thing because, um, public funding of, of stadiums has, has really fallen out of favor. Um, and the, the areas, the cities that
01:12:46
Speaker
would potentially be interested are, I mean, I think Seattle is just a non-starter, right? There's just not enough land and it's too expensive. Yeah. I mean, where would you even, like even in a perfect world, like there's nowhere in Seattle you could put a 10,000 seat stadium, right?
01:13:02
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, probably not without tearing down a bunch of stuff. Well, I mean, that's feasible from a financial standpoint. Yeah. I mean, there's really not, no. Maybe out at Sandpoint or something like that, but that's just a logistical nightmare. So, I mean, it's probably more convenient to put a stadium in Bellevue than in Sandpoint from just from a getting their perspective. Right.
01:13:26
Speaker
Especially by 2029. At that point, presumably you'll have real light rail out in the east side. Right. And I think that Tacoma is culturally a good fit because a lot of the other options are satellite cities of Seattle that
01:13:46
Speaker
they're much closer to Seattle, for one. But they also, I mean, a lot of their identity is dependent on Seattle in ways that I think Tacoma maybe isn't. And so I can see Tacoma being willing to maybe foot a little bit more of the bill for a stadium like that to have the community involvement. So I don't know. I mean, I think that
01:14:07
Speaker
If the rain move, it's not going to be because they're more likely to have a better stadium situation somewhere else. Um, yeah, I think if they move somewhere in this area, I will say, yeah, right. Yeah. And I, I mean, this is, I think for me, what it comes down to is if I'm having to gamble, if I'm at, if you're asking me to predict where are the rain playing in 10 years, it's probably at Heidelberg, but in a bigger facility.
01:14:36
Speaker
Like if that, I think that's probably more likely than them playing somewhere else in the Puget Sound just because it's the, it's the place where they are building momentum currently. And we're already seeing, like they're trying to build a 5,000 seat stadium in Tacoma on land that is essentially owned by the parks that's built. That's like ready for this kind of development. And it's taking three or four years to get done. Right. Like where, like, is, do we think there's a, like,
01:15:06
Speaker
Like for that to happen in 10 years somewhere else, that process would have to start in a few years. And that just doesn't seem very likely to happen. So my, I think more likely is that the Heidelberg stadium will potentially get bigger either before it's even built or it's built in a way that can be expanded. Yeah.
01:15:31
Speaker
It's crazy. I was just looking at Tacoma places and stadium high school can fit 15,000 people for a football game. Yeah, that's stadium. That stadium is really cool to the stadium. Insane. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I, I think, and I think I'm with you though. I, I really hope Ray, I think Tacoma makes a lot of sense for the rain. Like I mean, I'm planning on moving there in the next year. So I really hope they say that I'm kind of banking on that. So.
01:15:59
Speaker
And I, and I, I mean, they had their best year of attendance ever at Cheney Stadia. Like that was, I, there's a lot of reasons I think to be bullish about their future in Tacoma. I'll put it that way. Yep. Okay. Moving on. Uh, M Rathkeberger 22 asks,
01:16:21
Speaker
You only ask questions on like every time. I butchered every time too. Sorry about that. What to expect or look for in business in the business meeting tomorrow. And also how do we feel about having it in a largest room to the 90 to a comp? How do we feel about, I'm guessing he's asking, how do we feel about it going from the 90 just to a conference call?
01:16:43
Speaker
or from, I guess what he's really saying is going from the Paramount, which was kind of like peak to the 90, now to a conference call. Yeah, I guess. I think that's what he's asking. Maybe, but those are two different, those are like three different issues. They are three different issues, but I guess that's what the question is. So I don't know. How do you feel, Aaron?
01:17:08
Speaker
Do you want my honest answer? Yeah, be honest. I don't I don't care at all. I really it's not it is not for me. I've never. I'm going to get in trouble if I.
01:17:24
Speaker
I've always thought that the Alliance Council and that whole thing was more PR than anything else. I don't think it's meaningless, but I think that the trajectory of it is evidence of
01:17:41
Speaker
how seriously maybe the club takes it. It's not that I don't think that they care. It's not that I don't think that they want fan involvement that goes beyond what most clubs have.
01:17:55
Speaker
But I think realistically, this was always kind of the end game. And I think that a lot of the newness and a lot of the novelty wore off for a lot of people. And this is kind of what's led to that. Now, I do know that the conference call is more a logistical thing than a priority thing. I mean, I think that they would likely be having it at the 90 if it weren't for just some of the, like I said, logistical things. Ultimately, though, I don't...
01:18:22
Speaker
I'm not sure how productive the business meeting is. I think it's a good time to announce things. I thought the year they did the jersey launch at the thing was cool. I just don't know how much it actually matters. Yeah, I'll push back a little bit from that in this way.
Fan Event Discussions and Attendance
01:18:44
Speaker
I don't think it's just a PR move in that, in that this was like an inevitable trajectory that they would be having it on a conference call because for sure. They were not only were they not going to, they were, they weren't going to have it at the 90, I guess they were going to actually going to have it at century link, the same place where they had the, the Brian Spencer year, which was 2016, 2016, where it was like kind of in the, in the, uh, right. Well, no, in the concourse. Right. Right.
01:19:15
Speaker
Um, they had it at the event center in 20 when they did the reveal that was in 2010, I think they also did the 23rd after the 2013 season, they did it at the event center. Um, but, and they've had it a bunch of different places. The Paramount was obviously the biggest one that was, uh, during the 2014 season, uh, right before the playoffs against the galaxy and.
01:19:41
Speaker
And in some ways that was the peak, but it also, I think it's important to note that there were only like a few hundred people that have showed up to any of these. Maybe the first, maybe in 2010, there were more, maybe like maybe in the very early ones or more, but every year since then.
01:19:57
Speaker
No matter where they have it, it's a few hundred people, like five, six hundred people at most. And so I think that the demand for it to be at a big facility like the Paramount was there was never that level of demand.
01:20:13
Speaker
which is fine. And I don't think it's like that important to have, I think that the fan event that they do at mid-season where they accomplish a lot of the things people wanted out of the, they used to like about the meeting anyway. And I think it's an important thing for,
01:20:32
Speaker
non-soccer personnel to stand up in front of a crowd and kind of give the report. And I think that's actually the core of what this event is, is the people that are managing the season tickets. Last year, there was a lot of discussion about how they avoid the scheduling conflicts that led to the car show thing. And that, to me, is the core stuff that we should be getting from these.
01:20:59
Speaker
annual business meetings, because that's the stuff that we aren't going to get otherwise from all these other, you know, end of year press conferences and all these other things. And, and so in that way, I think it serves a very specific purpose. And, and so I'm, I think it's good that they're, they're holding themselves accountable. And I hope that that continues to be a public event and that this is just a one off thing. How important, like, is it the most important thing that they do? Obviously not. And,
01:21:26
Speaker
I don't, I'm not super passionate about the event itself, but I'm glad that they continue to do it. And I hope that it goes back to being a more public event in the subsequent years. Yeah. I mean, I guess to clarify, I don't.
01:21:44
Speaker
I don't think that it's necessarily all PR, but I do think that the number of people that actually care to go and be there and ask questions is very small. And I think it's a lot smaller than a lot of people want to believe it is. I think it's good that they have it. And I do think that the club is invested on being transparent on certain things. And they wouldn't do it if they weren't, right? They could very easily just say, no, we're not going to do this anymore and find some way to
01:22:11
Speaker
get around the charter or what have you. And for the people that do care, I think it's nice when it is a public event. But for me, it's definitely not for me. So in terms of how much I care, I can definitely read the recap and catch the important notes. But whether it happens on a call or at the paramount, it's kind of irrelevant to me.
01:22:38
Speaker
I'm actually curious what Lickett thinks of this. What do you think? I mean, do you think that this is like, and I guess for me, it's a two part question. Would you rather this be during the playoffs the way it is almost has been almost every year or do you like it this way where it's after the season? Do you think like, I don't know, how do you feel about this whole thing? Well, I think
01:23:04
Speaker
that I like it at the end. Personally, I like it at the end of the season. I mean, obviously the end of the season, if you don't count the playoffs, uh, is something that is up for debate, I guess, but I don't have a problem with it being after we win an MLS copy, you know, that's, that's a good trade off. Right. Uh, the thing about, I think what people are most up in arms about
01:23:28
Speaker
because it's a conference call at the time is I think they get a little, they've been a little bit spoiled with some of the things that have happened at recent ones. Like for instance, Metzer was announced as the coach basically at 2016, um, conference. Um, so the thing is, is that, you know, we wouldn't have the fan fest. The fan fest basically came about because of the, of the annual business meeting and because
01:23:56
Speaker
The reason that they started adding fanfists like things to the business in the first place was to get people to go in the first place. And then the reason they moved it to a larger venue is to attract people to go there. And like you were saying, I don't think they've ever had more than a couple of hundred people, maybe close to a thousand a couple of times or something like that show up to these things. So it feels a little disingenuous when people are like,
01:24:22
Speaker
I mean, I recently outraged that it's called this year. I was at the Paramount one. And for all the talk, people talk about how great that thing was. There really weren't that many people there. I mean, it was a few rows. It was a few rows full of people, essentially. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think that the I'm overly cynical about this kind of thing, but I think there's a very small cadre of people that
01:24:49
Speaker
think that the whole fan base is totally on board with this idea of like the mess cave and club where we're going to be like Barcelona fan involvement thing. And I just really don't think they're that I think most people sort of engage with the Sounders as they do with with every other sports team that they're a fan of.
01:25:09
Speaker
And I think that that's been borne out by the way the attendance has been at these events. I think they're cool. And I think that the people that do care, I'm glad that they are really invested. I'm glad that the club is holding up their end of the bargain because those people are keeping the club accountable and they're making the experience for everyone better, I would say. They're putting in the work and I appreciate that.
01:25:36
Speaker
I think most people are just, you know, once the season's over, that's kinda their level of involvement. I actually think more people pay attention to it now that it's a stream, a live stream.
01:25:49
Speaker
And you know, maybe it's just a conference call, but they're going to listen to it anyways, but they're not going to go to it. It'll be, it's a video conference. It's, I think my understanding is that it's, it's, I mean, the, the, from the viewer perspective, it probably won't be any different than for most people who watched it online last year. Right. That's the assumption I get. I could, maybe I'm wrong, but no, yeah, that's what I heard too. So.
01:26:12
Speaker
Okay. Uh, one more question about the business meeting is Twimberly 23 asks, odds, we get an update on the training facility in or Tacoma stadium during ABM. Lots of odds tonight. Yeah. I think we'll get an update. Um, I'm, I'm honestly, I'm a little surprised that, that we haven't got a more material update on the training facility. Like I thought for sure, like,
01:26:38
Speaker
We would have a more material update on the training facility than we've gotten to this point. And so maybe, maybe they're holding it for the annual business meeting. I doubt that they
Future Facilities and MLS Cup Impact
01:26:51
Speaker
are. I think we'll get some updates. I wouldn't, I'd be less surprised to see more material. Like I think there's, there's potentially some material updates that we'll get about the.
01:27:02
Speaker
about the stadium in Tacoma. I know, you know, it's funny, there is these, I just recently saw these renderings of the stadium that apparently have been out since May. Oh yeah. Like there's all these, these like really detailed renderings that are out in the public. Like they are on the Tacoma parks website in like the, in the, what do they call it? The, um,
01:27:30
Speaker
Like the assessment, I don't know what's that, like this, the feasibility study, the feasibility study, and it has like really detailed, like it's as best I could tell it's like they have the stadium designed. Um, and so I bet we'll get a lot of those images that I guess haven't been super well distributed, but they were, they were sent to the press. Like I'm feel like an idiot for not having seen these before. Um,
01:27:57
Speaker
But so I think we'll get some, we'll get to see those. Uh, I, I would love to get some training facility updates cause that feels like something that something to me, it feels like something stalled. Yeah. And I think that in a salary capped league, having a really good training facility is one of the few competitive advantages you can have. Um, so I'm, I'm kind of antsy about that getting done.
01:28:24
Speaker
Yeah. And Adrian, I mean, Adrian said it himself, like when the centers came into the league, they were, you know, top third in training facilities. And I mean, I think they're probably now somewhere in the bottom third in terms of training. It's not like the training facility is bad. And everyone I've talked to still says letters is like better than the timbers, for instance. But all the, all the expansion teams, I think,
01:28:49
Speaker
Although all the recent expansion games seem to have nice facilities, the New England Revolution look like they might actually have an, they're building, they're getting ready to build their store. They're getting either ready to build it or open it. Um, and that looks like it might be a decent little facility. So it's high time. We still don't know, like the centers haven't even announced for sure that it's going to be at, at starfire. I think that's the assumption that we're all working on, but they haven't made that commitment yet. So.
01:29:20
Speaker
Who knows? Who knows? Okay. Uh, let's end it on two questions. I'll ask both of them and you guys can answer them. Waller, Rosito asks, will the championship equate into an uptick in attendance next year? And then he, Steege asks, any good winter beer suggestions for a cold wait for the 2020 season? Uh,
01:29:45
Speaker
I don't think attendance is going to change dramatically. I think that it might be less rough than it was at the beginning of last season, maybe. I mean, because there were some pretty mediocre crowds, but I don't think it's going to equate to more than, you know, an extra 20, 30, 40,000 over the course of the season.
01:30:14
Speaker
I am really curious about this one. I don't have any data and I suspect that we will hope. My hope is that this is one of the questions I really hope we get an answer to is how much of a bounce on season tickets was there really from? I'm really curious. Was hosting MLS Cup a
01:30:38
Speaker
How big of a deal was it? Because it felt like a really, really big deal at the time. And it felt like a big deal after. And it felt like it was the first time that the sounders were the event in town.
01:30:54
Speaker
very, are very remotely interested in the sounders were asking me about it. We're asking if I had a way to get tickets, all this kind of like, all the little things that tell you, okay, this is a big deal. And, and so I'm really curious if how many season tickets they sold based on Emma's cup.
01:31:13
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, I guess that's the caveat that I would say is that if, if there was a noticeable uptick in their season tickets, then I think it could be a pretty sizable difference. Yeah. I mean, I mean, you make a good point though. I mean, how, how many, like if they sold 2000 extra season tickets, that would, to me, it seems like a lot, but that wouldn't necessarily have a huge impact on overall attendance. Right.
01:31:36
Speaker
But if it does equate to them, you know, getting, they've got an extra 2,000 and then they sell over 50 for a few games, they could have a very good attendance here. I just don't think it's going to be a situation where we're contemplating opening a full stadium for every game. Oh, sure. No, it's not going to be that. Yeah, it's not that. But I, you know, I could see
01:31:59
Speaker
you know, they'd have to get to like 45,000 to break their, their record, the team record that seems within the realm of possibility. And that would
Beer Preferences and Closing Remarks
01:32:11
Speaker
feel like a pretty significant change in course. Cause last year was, I think the third straight year their attendance was down and they're just barely over 40,000. It was barely, it was just only down a little bit from the previous year and they stayed over 40, which seemed
01:32:26
Speaker
kind of like for narrative purposes seemed good. But yeah, I mean, it'll be I'm really curious to see what kind of impact it had. I don't I don't I have not. I don't think either one of us have been drinking nearly as much as we were. I haven't I have not had a beer in eight months as of today. So good for you.
01:32:44
Speaker
Well, it's not like I chose that point. Um, I can have a beer soon. Um, but one, one beer, just like sit in a dark corner in a chair by myself and have a beer. Yeah. Um, but yeah, I mean, you know, it's the usual suspects. I'm sure again, Jubal and, um,
01:33:05
Speaker
Jolly Roger was always a favorite of mine. Uh, I, I would imagine that after eight months of not drinking and, uh, losing a pretty significant amount of weight, that one Jolly Roger would probably knock the hell out at this point in time. But, uh, you know, uh, I don't know, I'm looking forward to finding out. That'll be, that'll be nice. But yeah, yeah. If anybody has any though, you can complete them at me, um, in like two weeks though. Wait until you tell me, cause that's when I can drink again.
01:33:34
Speaker
I'll crack an A-bomb when you're able to drink in your honor. That's good. I appreciate that. Have those gone on sale yet this year? That's a good question.
01:33:45
Speaker
Yeah. It's fun because it feels like the last few years, winter beers were coming out in September. I feel like I remember seeing a powder hound or something on what it was like 90 degrees last year or something. But it seems like they've come out late this year, at least by the end caps at Friendmire or whatever. Yep. Yeah, let's end it there.
01:34:14
Speaker
Yeah. That's like a whole show. Yeah. That was like a whole show of questions, but, uh, thanks for listening, hanging out with us all this time. We had a lot of stuff to catch up on. So.
01:34:28
Speaker
That's the show. I'm Jeremiah Shan, signing off on behalf of Aaron Campo and Lickit. Thank you to our sponsor, Full Pulled Wines, sticking it out all this time. We love them. This is Nosarietes. Remember, you'll never yell alone.
01:34:45
Speaker
Green Douglas spur where the water's cut through. Down to wild mountains and tangents you flew. Canadian Northwest to the ocean so blue. It's Roll On, Columbia Roll On. Roll On, Columbia Roll On. Roll On, Columbia Roll On. Your power is turning our darkness to dawn. Roll On, Columbia Roll On.
01:35:23
Speaker
We love you. Let's win another one!