Transcript
Speaker: Aliens watching reality TV.
Speaker: Welcome back to Aliens watching reality TV.
Speaker: I'm Erica.
Speaker: And I am Josh.
Speaker: And we watched the Love is Blind season four finale.
Speaker: When did you watch it, Josh?
Speaker: You say like two in the morning?
Speaker: Literally, I was within 30 seconds of it.
Speaker: It got posted and I was launching it.
Speaker: I tried and then I fell asleep.
Speaker: And then I woke up at like 9am in the exact spot on the couch where I had been sitting before.
Speaker: And it was not like the kind of spot where you would normally sleep on a couch.
Speaker: And I was just like freezing and I still have my makeup on.
Speaker: I'm like, oh my God.
Speaker: And then I just immediately watched the episode instead of like taking care of any of those issues.
Speaker: Yeah, no, I was like, I needed to watch the episode.
Speaker: I needed to know certain things.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: I couldn't wait.
Speaker: And I feel like we kind of nailed it this season, honestly.
Speaker: Like, a lot of things went sort of the way we thought they would.
Speaker: I mean, we kind of predicted everything perfectly, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: For real.
Speaker: We were right about everything.
Speaker: We knew that Micah and Paul were not going to end up together.
Speaker: The details, however, let's get into the details of that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So let's I will say briefly, I wouldn't have gotten this right.
Speaker: And I wouldn't have purchased anything right like five years ago.
Speaker: I'm not just like magically good at it.
Speaker: That's why I feel okay bragging about it.
Speaker: Yeah, like, I don't know.
Speaker: I saw your tweets about that.
Speaker: And I think I think I'm still pretty bad at it.
Speaker: I'm trying to figure it out.
Speaker: But it helps to know that I am not the prototype.
Speaker: You know what I mean?
Speaker: Don't base your interpretations of other people on yourself because it turns out we're not that normal.
Speaker: Yeah, or just – I mean, and by normally, it's just like humans don't really have a normal.
Speaker: Yeah, there is no prototype.
Speaker: There is no – Everyone is going to be wrong a large percentage of the time if they are interpreting other people based on themselves.
Speaker: But we all do it.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: But it was pretty cool.
Speaker: I mean, I was, I think, yeah.
Speaker: I mean, I was really, really surprised about a couple of things.
Speaker: But we'll get to that when we get to that.
Speaker: Do you want to tackle Micah and Paul first?
Speaker: No, let's go in order.
Speaker: So the very beginning is we get to finally find out what Kwame's answer was.
Speaker: And they do a couple long shots of his face just to keep us in suspense.
Speaker: And then he says yes.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: I mean, we were kind of led to believe that there was some kind of tension over there.
Speaker: And there was tension, but it wasn't tension of the kind that is relationship-breaking.
Speaker: The kind of tension that it was was very beautifully described by Chelsea in that, you know, they kind of expressed their opinions, you know?
Speaker: They talk about shit.
Speaker: And I did notice just that, like, a lot of the scenes...
Speaker: between them started having tricks of editing that meant like i was like we can't really know what's happening here because even like right then at the altar the way they made it seem like he took a long pause before saying i do if you look at the editing they could have just put those in from other moments where he was just like standing there listening to her talking there's no way to know that he actually paused that long and he probably didn't
Speaker: No, no, you probably didn't.
Speaker: Like, they were clearly very in love.
Speaker: And, I mean, you could just see Chelsea, like, doting over Kwame.
Speaker: Just the way she looked, she was so in love.
Speaker: I would say Chelsea is definitely very in love.
Speaker: I think Kwame is.
Speaker: Dude, they made out, like, real hard.
Speaker: But also, I think he's a little self-involved, like a little too self-involved to maybe really have his love be about other people.
Speaker: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker: I mean, I cannot.
Speaker: But also, I don't really know.
Speaker: I don't want to judge beyond the fact that we were right.
Speaker: We were right and Chelsea and Kwame were going to get married.
Speaker: Yeah, it's true.
Speaker: And a lot of people thought they weren't.
Speaker: Nah, that happened.
Speaker: That was going to happen.
Speaker: Suck it, everybody else.
Speaker: Suck it, everybody.
Speaker: Yeah, totally.
Speaker: I was a little surprised that Brett and Marshall were not at Kwame's wedding.
Speaker: But Marshall... They never really do that.
Speaker: Like...
Speaker: I think, honestly, Marshall coming to Brett's wedding is the first time that we've even seen one of the cast members at another one of their weddings.
Speaker: I don't know if that, like... They kind of wanted to tie it all up, you know?
Speaker: It's kind of weird.
Speaker: I mean, I think Marshall would have gone.
Speaker: But I think he probably was only allowed to go because he wasn't also getting married.
Speaker: Like, for whatever reason, they just don't go to each other's weddings.
Speaker: I mean, it was... How did you feel about him showing up at Brett and...
Speaker: I thought it was great.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like they made him look like he was sad, but I don't feel like that was the case.
Speaker: Like he was probably there.
Speaker: He was, he looked normal.
Speaker: I saw somebody thought that it was inappropriate that he was being sad and they thought he was all like boohoo me and that they would have been mad if somebody came to that at their wedding but I didn't think that at all.
Speaker: I felt like he briefly addressed the fact that like yeah of course this makes me think of myself and that's sad but he and Brett have a very honest friendship.
Speaker: It would be weird to not acknowledge what
Speaker: Brett already knows he would be feeling.
Speaker: But then he says that, but I'm here for you.
Speaker: And that is the truth.
Speaker: And so I feel like that was a completely normal thing for him to say to Brett in that moment.
Speaker: And it would have been weird for him to pretend like he didn't have any of those feelings.
Speaker: And I think Brett was happy to have him there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I think so, too.
Speaker: I was happy he was there.
Speaker: I love their friendship.
Speaker: I think it's great.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, I think Brett kind of took Marshall under his wing.
Speaker: You know, Marshall is like 10 years younger than Brett.
Speaker: Maybe, yeah, like eight or something.
Speaker: Yeah, but I was not expecting the kind of tantrum that ran through.
Speaker: I mean, I understand the way he just went after it.
Speaker: I wouldn't have called it a tantrum.
Speaker: And I wasn't surprised by it.
Speaker: I mean, I'm not surprised in that.
Speaker: He did it.
Speaker: This is Brett we're talking about.
Speaker: He's very particular about everything.
Speaker: He likes his shoes a certain way.
Speaker: He likes his clothes a certain way.
Speaker: He likes his luggage a certain way.
Speaker: So he pays, what, $1,500?
Speaker: $1,200 for luggage?
Speaker: Anyway.
Speaker: So I understand.
Speaker: But yeah, I wouldn't have done it like that.
Speaker: Are we done talking about Kwame and Chelsea then?
Speaker: Or are we officially just moving?
Speaker: I mean, Kwame and Chelsea... I say...
Speaker: Let's do the little analysis bit at the end.
Speaker: Okay, sure.
Speaker: Let's just go at once we go from couple to couple to get through all of them, and then in the end we can do the more analysis version.
Speaker: I just needed to know if it was time for me to move my brain on from –
Speaker: Yeah, we're moving on from Chelsea and Kwame.
Speaker: Kwame's just standing there smiling and like, like Chelsea's just like looking at him like as if he's a prince and she's just so in love.
Speaker: We're going to leave them over there.
Speaker: Tiffany and Brett.
Speaker: They really had some great moments that they showed even before the wedding.
Speaker: I honestly, it was nine in the morning and I was watching them get ready for their wedding and I was already crying.
Speaker: Aww.
Speaker: There's just lots of great moments.
Speaker: They're just so real and genuine and in love.
Speaker: And they have some really beautiful moments with their families too.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, Brett's dad's crying towel.
Speaker: I was cracking up.
Speaker: Like a crying towel.
Speaker: That's so funny.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But like sweet too.
Speaker: The brother and his hair.
Speaker: Oh my God.
Speaker: He talked about it with Brett.
Speaker: Remember?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, and Brett was like, I don't really care today.
Speaker: Today's not your day.
Speaker: I understand that.
Speaker: He also was like, asked Tiffany if she was like, what is your opinion about the hair?
Speaker: And she was like, yeah, I think she was like, yeah, that's cool.
Speaker: Yeah, cool hair.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But yeah, okay, well, let's talk about the suit not fitting right.
Speaker: So we knew that there was going to be some wrinkle because they have used this clip of Brett being like, this just shouldn't happen on your wedding day.
Speaker: Surprises.
Speaker: And they have made it seem like it was going to be some big deal, which is part of how I knew it was definitely not going to be a big deal.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And I was like, there's no way in hell that is like him talking about their relationship or anything like that.
Speaker: It's going to be – honestly, I just thought it was going to be some practical type of thing and a –
Speaker: like what it ended up being so I wasn't surprised I didn't know what it was going to be about but I wasn't surprised and I didn't feel like he threw a tantrum I didn't feel like I didn't feel like he overreacted honestly I felt like just he expressed his frustration and he had to get it out sure but I feel like he he only says like
Speaker: three sentences about it.
Speaker: And he just has to get the frustration out.
Speaker: He's just like, this is the kind of thing that can be arranged ahead of time.
Speaker: And I totally get that when it's just frustrating to know that like this could have been done right.
Speaker: There's no real reason why it wasn't.
Speaker: And now it's like not only does he not look the way he wants to, but I mean, we've talked about before for a lot of people, the way your clothes feel and your body is a big deal.
Speaker: And it affects how much you can be in the moment, how much you can enjoy what you're doing.
Speaker: and i even though we haven't really talked about brett and tiffany being neurodivergent i think they are i don't like i don't know enough about them necessarily to really go any further than that this was like the neurodivergent season par excellence which i even started wondering like is that a seattle thing is there like maybe a higher percentage there yeah it just attracts neurodivergent people yeah
Speaker: I mean, LA does.
Speaker: So like, it makes sense.
Speaker: Austin does.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: They're hubs of us.
Speaker: And so I bet like it's important to him how his clothes fit in a way that other people maybe just wouldn't understand.
Speaker: It's not just about how he looks.
Speaker: It was probably just about also, yeah, being able to have the comfort so you're able to completely enjoy what you're doing.
Speaker: Brett, if you're listening to this, that was not a criticism.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Also, I think just sometimes you use the word tantrum and I never really use it.
Speaker: And so I was like, I guess part of it is because, yeah, I shouldn't use that word.
Speaker: Because people do misidentify autistic meltdowns as tantrums and that makes them really misinterpret what's going on.
Speaker: By any stretch of the imagination.
Speaker: I think that's just why I have sort of an immediate like reaction to the word itself.
Speaker: That's all.
Speaker: I'm not trying to be like, Josh, how dare you say anything about Brett?
Speaker: I mean, I bet if Tiffany was this thing.
Speaker: Although, how dare you?
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: And I just also thought like –
Speaker: You can see how in love with each other they are all the time, whether they're together or not.
Speaker: They always speak kindly about each other.
Speaker: And they knew for sure the other person is going to say yes today.
Speaker: And like I cannot imagine getting married without that.
Speaker: You know, if you don't, for sure the other person is going to say yes.
Speaker: I need the other person to sit with my family and their family present and vow that.
Speaker: To marry to say yes, while their hand is on the holy book upon which they have faith.
Speaker: OK, so you shouldn't need that.
Speaker: I will only show up to the way if that person has.
Speaker: I will do the same thing in return.
Speaker: But like, yeah, the whole.
Speaker: Listen, the way Kenny felt after Kelly said no was really sad.
Speaker: Yeah, I once again just don't remember those people at all.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: What happened was – I don't know why.
Speaker: I'm sorry.
Speaker: I'm not going to get to how things went.
Speaker: But like Kenny was very, very into Kelly and very sweet about it.
Speaker: And he had this diary in which he kept writing things.
Speaker: And we were supposed to find out about it after they got married and they never got married.
Speaker: Like writing nice things about Kelly or something?
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Like about their life and whatnot about the experiment.
Speaker: He was really, really sad.
Speaker: And when they she said no, he walked out and like the camera was taking video and he was just like, James, please stop.
Speaker: Like, this is really serious.
Speaker: I'm like, really unhappy.
Speaker: So yeah, it was just sad.
Speaker: Yeah, it was too sad.
Speaker: I don't remember that.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, it was very sad.
Speaker: But I
Speaker: But yeah, we knew that this was not going to be a no.
Speaker: Like this was like the Cameron and Lauren of the season.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I didn't hear a single person who watches Love is Blind express any doubt that Brett and Tiffany would get married, honestly.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And they were all like, if they don't, I don't understand anything about the world.
Speaker: And maybe the world is wrong and it's time for it to be over because nothing makes sense anymore.
Speaker: Like these people love each other.
Speaker: Everyone can see that.
Speaker: Yeah, clearly that's, they love each other.
Speaker: There's no question.
Speaker: There's no doubt in my mind.
Speaker: And I love other interactions with their family members.
Speaker: They're already like becoming family together, you know, like they're already understanding the other person's family is my family.
Speaker: And Brett talking to Tiffany's dad ahead of time and just everything.
Speaker: That was so sweet.
Speaker: I need to say this.
Speaker: I must say this.
Speaker: That was a very nice touch.
Speaker: the the the fact that brunt asked tiffany's dad um it was like really really nice like like the little adding the little tradition bit in there you know asking the parent um i thought it was a nice touch also because to me the way he did it took away like the sexism that is inherent in the tradition because like the tradition comes from
Speaker: you, you know, it's a business transaction with the dad.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so still the like asking permission, um, is sketchy, but like clearly they're going to get married no matter what, but he still wants the dad's blessing.
Speaker: That's what he asked for.
Speaker: And blessing versus permission are very different.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so I do think like it's respectful and beautiful to do it the way he did.
Speaker: And, um,
Speaker: Yeah, I thought it was like a subtle twist on a tradition that made it not problematic, you know?
Speaker: The dad was like so ready for it.
Speaker: He was like, oh, fuck.
Speaker: Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker: I'm totally about it.
Speaker: Yeah, it was really sweet to see that everyone totally agreed upon the fact that they were totally good together and they had made the right decision.
Speaker: And throughout the different episodes, as you and I watched this, like it became clear, like you said, like they were always smiling.
Speaker: when they were together and they're always smiling when they were looking at each other.
Speaker: That is a very clear sign that the two people love each other when they cannot stop smiling, when they look at each other.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: This is, this is like a dead giveaway.
Speaker: Yeah, that's true.
Speaker: But I guess I'm not even necessarily always noticing that.
Speaker: There's just something in their eyes.
Speaker: It's just the way they look at each other.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Like, when they look at each other, they're happy.
Speaker: They're just looking in their eyes.
Speaker: They're happy.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like, even if they're sad, I feel happier when I look at you.
Speaker: Yeah, like, I'm less sad because you're around.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's really nice.
Speaker: And, yeah, I thought the wedding was beautiful.
Speaker: I think her dress was the best dress.
Speaker: Oh, she looked gorgeous.
Speaker: Yeah, she looked gorgeous.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: Great dress.
Speaker: She looked wonderful.
Speaker: We're going to discuss.
Speaker: He looks great.
Speaker: I didn't remember what he had picked out.
Speaker: Oh, my dad is calling me.
Speaker: That's interesting.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So any, any final thoughts about Tiffany and Brett's wedding before we move on to Mike and Paul?
Speaker: No, let's get to Mike and Paul.
Speaker: Me neither.
Speaker: Just perfect applause.
Speaker: I love them.
Speaker: Oh, I guess I will say, I only found out today that I've been spelling Tiffany's name wrong all season.
Speaker: I don't know why, but I thought it had an I, even though I know that's not the more normal spelling.
Speaker: And it just really bothered me.
Speaker: And I'm just, I'm sorry, Tiffany, I spelled your name wrong all season.
Speaker: I apologize.
Speaker: Wait, wait, how did you spell her name?
Speaker: Like with an I at the end instead of a Y. Oh, okay.
Speaker: Probably it was spelled that way in like the subtitles one time early on in the season and then that just stuck in my brain because I wouldn't have made it up on my own, I don't think.
Speaker: Anyway, not important, but important to me.
Speaker: Michael and Paul.
Speaker: Mike and Paul.
Speaker: Yeah, they show up for the wedding and Paul is not ready.
Speaker: Very clear.
Speaker: Like, he cannot hide it.
Speaker: He's neurodivergent.
Speaker: He's just, he's very open about the fact that he doesn't know.
Speaker: And honestly, he makes the right decision, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, I also felt like it really bothers me when somebody knows they're going to say no, but they're basically playing out the wedding as if it's a normal wedding where they would say yes up until that point.
Speaker: And I think that's very cruel.
Speaker: And while, of course, he did make it all the way to the altar, I felt like he didn't do that.
Speaker: You know, he like.
Speaker: He seemed like somebody who was going to say no.
Speaker: And I felt like he didn't do all as much of the false hope stuff, except for the going to make the rings a couple of days ahead of time.
Speaker: Like that was kind of weird.
Speaker: Yeah, because like Bartiz did that last season where like he got these like permanent bracelets.
Speaker: Obviously, they're not totally permanent, but they like got them on like welded around their wrists like right before the wedding.
Speaker: And it's like, dude, why would you do that if you knew you were going to say no?
Speaker: So I do think these like big gestures before a wedding you're not interested in are pretty strange.
Speaker: Yeah, there was just like you kept watching and watching throughout the episodes to see if there was something genuine between Micah and Paul, something other than sex and, you know, hanging out, because literally that was all that was happening.
Speaker: Yeah, you never saw it.
Speaker: You never saw anything beyond that.
Speaker: They had no interest in common.
Speaker: They had no interest in having a space together.
Speaker: It was just all Marshall and Jackie had more plans that looked realistic than Micah and Paul.
Speaker: Micah and Paul, I never saw them look at each other with love.
Speaker: And I never even saw them look at each other with horniness in their eyes.
Speaker: I didn't even feel like there wasn't much between them at all.
Speaker: It seemed like it.
Speaker: No, I felt like there was.
Speaker: There was.
Speaker: They were definitely having sex.
Speaker: Once again, that's having sex and having good sex and being really horny.
Speaker: Not the same.
Speaker: No, I mean, what I meant is that they had sex and it was good sex and they kept having sex, but there was really nothing beyond that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I just, I feel like...
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: With his data.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh, my gosh.
Speaker: I can't believe I forgot to... Or did I talk about it yesterday?
Speaker: About what?
Speaker: My new theory that it's only neurodivergent people say the word data and just listen.
Speaker: Like, yeah, I did talk about it already.
Speaker: But I think only...
Speaker: And I might, I don't know yet, but I might even go as far to say only autistic people use the word data, like when we're just talking about our regular lives.
Speaker: It's a fairly unique thing we do.
Speaker: Yeah, we keep tabs on interactions and try to change your behavior in the future.
Speaker: And just the fact that we see it that way.
Speaker: That's how it makes sense in our brains.
Speaker: I think that would sound really weird to a neurotypical person.
Speaker: They're not looking at everything as data.
Speaker: That's strange.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But to us, those are the building blocks of everything.
Speaker: Just data.
Speaker: Everything is data.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But yeah, I feel like Paul has been, the way he's been talking the last few episodes has more been about like, I just don't know that.
Speaker: If I'm going to do it.
Speaker: This, like, the risk reward ratio is worth it.
Speaker: Yeah, I love the way he kept saying risk reward ratio.
Speaker: Just like.
Speaker: I think that he has been pretty open about the fact that like he isn't sure that this is a good idea.
Speaker: And I do respect that a lot more than the people who act like they're all in and they're secretly not.
Speaker: That's that sucks.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, that was just, for me, the whole, yeah, for me, it looked like he was trying at least in his mind to do the right thing, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I feel like Micah would have said no.
Speaker: Yeah, I don't, it's really hard to know, kind of, but...
Speaker: You think she would have said yes?
Speaker: I don't think she wanted to marry Paul.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I think there's a chance that, like, if he had said yes, she would have said yes.
Speaker: Because, like, if that had been the best storyline for, like...
Speaker: her burgeoning fame at this point like then maybe that's what she would have done like I don't believe she had any real interest in like yeah being in a long loving marriage with Paul yeah but listen there was one thing that was very very important at one point Paul said
Speaker: I just tried, kept, I kept trying, he kept trying to see her as a mother, you know?
Speaker: And she just couldn't do it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Which, like, that comment pissed a lot of people off.
Speaker: Yeah, I feel like at one point, Micah might see that flip and get really mad.
Speaker: If you want to have kids with somebody, and you can't imagine...
Speaker: that, then, like, that does matter.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like, how the fuck do you know how... what a mother is like?
Speaker: Like... Well, um, she doesn't seem to have a genuine ability to really love other people.
Speaker: So, like, yeah, I wouldn't want to have kids with her either.
Speaker: But... I mean, the way he put it was just pretty cruel sounding, TBH.
Speaker: Um... Okay, so let's just sort of go through how... what happened.
Speaker: So, like, um...
Speaker: They're getting ready, whatever.
Speaker: I didn't find any of the pre-wedding stuff all that interesting.
Speaker: No.
Speaker: And then... Micah is walking down the aisle.
Speaker: The dress, it doesn't look that good.
Speaker: It doesn't seem to fit that well either.
Speaker: She should have had Brett's dedication to tailoring, honestly.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: And then... She's also, like, giggling...
Speaker: It's like, it's not, okay.
Speaker: You know, it's not like Chelsea.
Speaker: Chelsea was getting married and was just could not believe the fact that she was getting married.
Speaker: You know, she was just like almost.
Speaker: Just because it was so great.
Speaker: She was so happy.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: This was like, it was almost like she was at a party, like at a surprise party or something.
Speaker: You know?
Speaker: Or like, you're going streaking for the first time.
Speaker: I can't believe I'm doing this.
Speaker: This is so crazy of me.
Speaker: Like.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's, it's just not the reaction of somebody who's like,
Speaker: really excited that they're marrying the love of their life, you know?
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: It was just... That was just not there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, I... And Paul... I mean, it was...
Speaker: Unlike Jessica, they had invited all their family members.
Speaker: Like her mom was there.
Speaker: His dad was there.
Speaker: Everyone was there.
Speaker: Shelby was there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And the fact that they, yeah, the fact that they were all there made you think that it probably will go through.
Speaker: But you and I. It is really weird to invite your family to a wedding you know you're going to say no to.
Speaker: Yeah, it was kind of like everyone was just... His family didn't necessarily seem very surprised, so like... Yeah, I think he told his family, but I don't think... I mean, I don't know what she told them, but I have some ideas.
Speaker: The sort of idea that I have is when I saw Shelby say that's exactly what she wanted to happen, you know?
Speaker: I feel like Micah probably told her friends that he was going to let him say it first.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And, and then she would say no.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, I don't know.
Speaker: I think, um, cause I'm assuming they didn't know.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Um, um,
Speaker: I feel like I don't know that Shelby necessarily meant it quite so literally that I was hoping she would get rejected at the altar.
Speaker: But she definitely wanted them to not get married.
Speaker: And I I feel like
Speaker: The question of like what would Micah have said if she had gone first is maybe just like there is no reality in which that would have happened.
Speaker: She was not going to go first.
Speaker: And so she probably didn't know either he's going to go first or –
Speaker: I'm going to go first and then I'm going to make him go first.
Speaker: Like she wasn't going to do it because also she is a manipulator who plays off of the situation that she's in and just making a bold move when you don't know how other people are going to react to it.
Speaker: Like that's not as effective as like that's putting your cards on the table before you know what someone else's cards are.
Speaker: That's not like it's,
Speaker: That's vulnerable.
Speaker: That's not what somebody who's trying to control the situation would ever do.
Speaker: Yeah, she was trying to control the situation.
Speaker: And I was like, you know, you clearly don't love him.
Speaker: Like, if you did, you would immediately say yes.
Speaker: Because, you know, Chelsea.
Speaker: 100%.
Speaker: Chelsea loved Kwame.
Speaker: Okay?
Speaker: Brett and Tiffany, real connection.
Speaker: Chelsea wasn't going to say, Kwame, you go first.
Speaker: Like, fuck that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If you love someone, then...
Speaker: You are going to say yes because, first of all, that's how you feel.
Speaker: And, second of all, you put your heart on the line because that's worth it because you love them.
Speaker: And even the idea of if you love me, then I'll love you.
Speaker: Like, that's not – that doesn't count, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So even if Paul wasn't sure what he was going to say ahead of time, which maybe is the case, that moment where she's like, your turn –
Speaker: Yeah, I would have been like, okay, if you're going to put it on me, if you want me to be the one breaking this, then here I am.
Speaker: Obviously, we're not ready to do this.
Speaker: Yeah, clearly.
Speaker: I mean, you clearly do not love me enough.
Speaker: I think part of it was, here's the thing.
Speaker: I think part of it may have been that he was thinking if she had said yes, you know,
Speaker: it would have somewhat proven to him that she's at least somewhat serious about starting the kind of life that he wants, you know?
Speaker: But the way she put it back to him, it was like, no, this is just not serious to her.
Speaker: Like, she's not taking it as seriously as, you know, as somebody who would be, who wants to get married would.
Speaker: And it really was like...
Speaker: It's a no in itself, declining to say yes.
Speaker: But it's a no that then puts the onus on him, and then it makes her into the victim role, and it's going to put the backlash on him instead of her.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I don't feel like the backlash is really on him, though.
Speaker: I mean, from my side, I don't feel like that's not what I hate.
Speaker: I don't think it worked out as well as it usually does for her.
Speaker: Because I think a lot of people saw through it.
Speaker: At least people on Twitter.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, for me, the thing was, the thing that I really didn't like was, like, after it was a no, and she, like, ran away to, like, go, like, basically handle it, Paul went over there and just, like, stands over there like a little dummy.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, I think it's good to go because he does still care about her.
Speaker: He wants to comfort her, talk it out with her if she wants.
Speaker: But the second she says, I don't want you here.
Speaker: You need to leave.
Speaker: Paul, you need to leave.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: But he doesn't because now he feels bad.
Speaker: And he is wanting the person who he just hurt to comfort him, comfort his feelings.
Speaker: And like, fucking grow up, Paul.
Speaker: No, you don't get to do that.
Speaker: Like, you don't get to hurt somebody and then be like, please comfort me now.
Speaker: So I don't feel bad for hurting you.
Speaker: Like if she says, go away, go away.
Speaker: That, that is the part that I was like, I don't like that.
Speaker: But I think most of how he handled it, I totally understand.
Speaker: But like, I don't know, he's got some immature traits.
Speaker: They all got issues.
Speaker: Bliss and Zach.
Speaker: Oh, hold on.
Speaker: I'm not done.
Speaker: One thing I have seen a lot of people say about Paul is that he is emotionless and emotional.
Speaker: That I think is just an unfair misreading of his neurodivergent style of communication.
Speaker: I don't think he was emotionless at all.
Speaker: Because you got to listen to his words instead of expecting him to- Man, the part at the end when he was like, I'm going to go drown in a river now.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I really felt that because I've done this with somebody where I've said no.
Speaker: And I've wanted to literally go drown in a river because you feel like shit.
Speaker: You feel like you've-
Speaker: you're causing so much deep pain to someone.
Speaker: And you can't do anything about it.
Speaker: And I never have figured out like what...
Speaker: Other people are what they want to hear to like believe you that you're sad or like I don't know how to do that either.
Speaker: I'm just going to talk about it.
Speaker: Like I it's I don't know.
Speaker: I don't know what people need to in order to believe him when he's saying that he is sad or you know to believe that he has emotions.
Speaker: I know that they don't just believe your words but I like it.
Speaker: I truly don't think we're really able to do like the display that they want.
Speaker: Well, it's sort of like if you're in pain and you go to the hospital, there's a huge problem for autistic people, especially that like, we just don't express our pain in the same way.
Speaker: And so that will make doctors not believe us.
Speaker: And I had a big problem with that when I was sick and I was in really bad pain because I'm just telling them like,
Speaker: This is the worst pain I've ever felt.
Speaker: It is excruciating.
Speaker: But I'm not like screaming or crying or laying on the floor.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It's like they want some big display.
Speaker: They want you to be a lot more emotional about it.
Speaker: But it's like I'm emotional because I'm telling you.
Speaker: I don't know how to like – It's just not how our emotions – our emotions just don't work like that.
Speaker: We express it by carefully thinking about what are the exact words that define this emotional experience I'm having.
Speaker: And then we try to say those.
Speaker: But that doesn't count for neurotypicals.
Speaker: Apparently, you need to be louder.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And like, yeah, I don't know.
Speaker: More just like, I don't know.
Speaker: So are we moving to Bliss?
Speaker: Because I want to get to the point where Bliss is walking down the aisle and her dad is still being a fucking douchebag.
Speaker: Okay, well, let's first talk about before the wedding because they've got some before the wedding moments.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Zach is talking with his bros and they are grilling him a bit.
Speaker: And asking him like, why, why this girl?
Speaker: How are you so sure?
Speaker: I did think it was kind of fun that he said they both identify as an owl.
Speaker: And he, for him, it's because he stays up all night and is a little different from the other birds.
Speaker: I was just like, okay, so he knows, he knows, he knows.
Speaker: And I did find it interesting that he said that he likes Bliss's dad.
Speaker: And I was like, geez, I didn't.
Speaker: And I wasn't even like the focus of that conversation.
Speaker: He's already manipulated him, I guess.
Speaker: Or Zach is just like has a more generous rate on people than I do, which I'm sure is true because I used to give everyone the benefit of the doubt until I just found out that that's not an accurate way of interpreting most people.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: But yeah, so then Zach goes up at the front.
Speaker: He's waiting.
Speaker: He does look a little nervous.
Speaker: Then Melissa's getting escorted by both her parents, one on each side.
Speaker: I like that because also her mom is so great.
Speaker: Why only have your dad walk you when he's not the parent who's nicest to you?
Speaker: And we don't need to follow those sexist traditions to the letter anymore.
Speaker: And yeah, her dad is still sort of like, you still have time to run the other direction.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: I mean, for me, I think seeing his sister, I just could not stop thinking about Irina.
Speaker: She looks so much like Irina.
Speaker: I don't know how it happened.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's fascinating.
Speaker: They really look a lot alike.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Because I tweeted about it.
Speaker: I tweeted a picture of each of them.
Speaker: And then I always write alt text for my photos and descriptions of what's in the image so that blind people can still know what pictures you tweeted.
Speaker: And so that required describing in detail why they look similar.
Speaker: And I felt very creepy doing that.
Speaker: But that also made me just more sure that, yeah, no, they really do look alike.
Speaker: It's like...
Speaker: yeah all of their features were very similar i could describe them in basically the exact same way yeah i don't know what are the odds weird yeah like how do you i just i kept looking at them the first time that they met the first time you met the sister i was like holy shit this is gonna be awkward and yeah the awkwardness just didn't go away
Speaker: Also, if they'd met the normal way, we would be like, whoa, Zach's a little creepy, like dating a girl who looks like his sister.
Speaker: But he had no idea what she looked like.
Speaker: Yeah, that was the thing.
Speaker: Like, I just, that's the thing.
Speaker: He didn't have any idea what she looked like, but he didn't at one point did.
Speaker: And he was still interested in her, but like, you know, he loved her from the inside, as in he had been manipulated.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, thoughts about Bliss's dress?
Speaker: I thought she looked great.
Speaker: I thought she was going to, and she did.
Speaker: What did you think?
Speaker: I thought it was great.
Speaker: It was just a little too much.
Speaker: Like the, I don't know, the sleeve things.
Speaker: I know you didn't like the sleeves.
Speaker: The sleeves were controversial.
Speaker: I did.
Speaker: It did look at one point like they weren't connected to the dress.
Speaker: I couldn't tell.
Speaker: That I thought would be a little weird.
Speaker: I just have no idea what the hell is going on with that.
Speaker: i'm getting on board if they're like she was happy with it she looked listen bliss honey if you're listening to this podcast i want you to know that we like you and that dress you looked gorgeous okay absolutely also like i like extra and over the top there's no real there's no such thing as like too much for me um so yeah i thought she looked great
Speaker: Yeah, no, I'm gonna say she looked good.
Speaker: If the sleeves were standalone, I think that's a little strange, I'm gonna lie.
Speaker: But, in general, still, I thought she looked really good.
Speaker: In general?
Speaker: yeah like overall i thought i thought when they yeah i thought while they were walking there i i was thinking about his mom and then he started talking about his mom um when during their like before the wedding um oh yeah he was talking to his grandma that was pretty sweet yeah yeah and his grandma seemed pretty sweet
Speaker: Yeah, I really, really, like, I felt like they had a really genuine connection.
Speaker: And there was, like, no doubt in my mind that they were both going to say yes.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh, for sure.
Speaker: Like, originally, I thought it would be pretty wild for them to get married just because, like, if it was me, I wouldn't want to get back on the expedited timeline if I had already gotten off of it.
Speaker: Like, but I see why, like, they...
Speaker: They basically had an opportunity to just do the show together the way they would have if he hadn't done the detour with Irina.
Speaker: And so, yeah, I kind of get why they just decided to do that.
Speaker: Also, as we said before, it means a wedding that Netflix pays for.
Speaker: And if you think you're going to get married anyway, then fuck yeah, have Netflix pay for your wedding.
Speaker: The question I have is, did Irina return the ring?
Speaker: Probably not because you don't have to.
Speaker: So why would you?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Alright.
Speaker: I'm going to be... I sincerely doubt she did.
Speaker: Because... Yeah, there's no requirement.
Speaker: I learned this on the... I think it's like Out of the Pods podcast with Deep D and Natalie.
Speaker: Because they've both been on Love is Blind so they can... Natalie's the one who said no to Shane, right?
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And she got to keep her ring.
Speaker: And...
Speaker: Deepsea got to keep her ring.
Speaker: And yeah, they said, you don't have to give it back.
Speaker: So I feel like maybe I kind of, unless it's just a great ring, Irina probably didn't keep wearing it.
Speaker: But like, why wouldn't you at least sell it if you could?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh, I mean, I'm happy.
Speaker: I am happy that I am happy that at the end of the day, Zach's mom is happy.
Speaker: Oh, you think this like brought her spirit some peace?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I did think it was beautiful that like she definitely – like her memory was included in the day because you're right.
Speaker: Like they talked about her beforehand.
Speaker: And then obviously they did their first dance to I Hope You Dance, which they had agreed upon in the pods.
Speaker: And I did hear some people like –
Speaker: They just thought it was weird to do that as your first dance because it's not about romantic love.
Speaker: It's about like Leanne Womack wrote it about her daughter.
Speaker: I'm like, no, that's exactly the point.
Speaker: Like it's because that song is about both of their relationships with their mothers, which is nice.
Speaker: Yeah, I was, I really, like, I really, really liked the fact that their relationship just grew from sort of, like, this very deep respect to, like, this nurturing relationship where they were, I think, Bliss understands just how much Zack relied on his mom.
Speaker: And Zack knows that Bliss loves him despite all his weirdness.
Speaker: I think they just really understand each other.
Speaker: They understand each other fairly effortlessly, especially now that they get to just have a normal relationship and see each other and talk things out and stuff.
Speaker: Um, you know, that's like, they built that in the pods, but then it would, you'd always still wonder like, but how can you be sure when you haven't actually met them yet?
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: But I think also like Bliss has got – I think one of the things that made it so that they did get married is I think Bliss has gotten to a point where she totally understands like why the breakup happened and, you know, because also she understands that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, I think after knowing everything and the way that Irina, like, talking to Zach about what Irina told him and knowing what had happened behind the scenes, she knows that Irina was a manipulative little dick.
Speaker: And, yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And especially just finding out more about just the depth of his fear of his loved one's family not liking him.
Speaker: that like that was a huge factor.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I, um, honestly, I think their relationship is so good that they've won a lot of people over because I've heard a lot of people be like, I'm actually really like happy for them.
Speaker: And like people were in general, like not on board.
Speaker: Cause also so many people just really didn't like Zach, but I've also seen people say, wow, he's so different with her.
Speaker: And, and that's the thing too.
Speaker: It's like, yeah,
Speaker: She's not telling me he's a cartoon character.
Speaker: That helps.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's always like, what are you... How are you seeing us?
Speaker: What context are you seeing us in?
Speaker: What are you comparing us to in order to interpret us?
Speaker: Because, like, neurodivergent people...
Speaker: If you're putting them in like a neurotypical context and judging them as a neurotypical, then it's easy to like make a lot of negative judgments.
Speaker: But then you see a neurodivergent person in a context where they're comfortable, surrounded by people who are like them.
Speaker: And it's like, wow, all those things that seemed like social problems or emotional problems, those aren't there.
Speaker: because they're context dependent.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Like, as soon as we're around other neurodivergent people, stop seeing us as cartoon characters.
Speaker: Like, we're no longer cartoon characters.
Speaker: We're no longer, it doesn't look like the other people with us are uncomfortable from our stare, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because they're looking at us in the same way.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: He and Bliss make the same kind of eye contact.
Speaker: It makes perfect sense.
Speaker: So yeah, you put me in the wrong context and I seem pretty awkward and weird too.
Speaker: But very clearly, obviously.
Speaker: Because I'm in general cool and suave.
Speaker: This is true.
Speaker: In general, very, very suave.
Speaker: Very, very cool.
Speaker: Yeah, suave is probably a perfect word to describe you.
Speaker: You get paid to be cool and suave.
Speaker: I do?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Who?
Speaker: Who's paying me to be suave?
Speaker: I mean, you were being like suave little people over here discussing other people's lives.
Speaker: So, of course, their first dance was to I Hope You Dance.
Speaker: And I thought it was kind of cute how then that was like the end of that episode.
Speaker: Just went and revisited the other couples but still played that song.
Speaker: And I thought that was kind of cute.
Speaker: Also, good for Leanne Womack.
Speaker: She's getting those royalties.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: I mean, do we wrap up this episode?
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, I guess we can make some predictions about, you know, if people are still together.
Speaker: And then on Sunday, there is the live reunion and it is airing at 5 p.m.
Speaker: Pacific time.
Speaker: 8 p.m.
Speaker: Eastern time.
Speaker: So for me, 7 p.m.
Speaker: Central time.
Speaker: We will be watching it and then we will podcast immediately afterwards.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so we'll have an episode up about that on Sunday.
Speaker: And we're going to just learn so much about what was going on behind the scenes, what's happened since then.
Speaker: You know, like, well, I know we're going to h ave a lot to say at that point.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But what are your guesses?
Speaker: Who do you think's still together?
Speaker: Let's see.
Speaker: Brett and Tiffany are together.
Speaker: For sure.
Speaker: Bliss and Zach are also together.
Speaker: I think so.
Speaker: Tough one on Chelsea and Kwame.
Speaker: I'm going to say they're still together.
Speaker: My guess is they're still together, but...
Speaker: That might have gotten rocky since the show came out because I think watching that and like watching all the inappropriate shit Kwame said to Micah like at Chelsea's birthday party and stuff like that has probably caused some problems.
Speaker: There's going to be drama.
Speaker: There's going to be drama.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I really hope the Lachez.
Speaker: Oh my gosh, my dog.
Speaker: Yeah, I hope the Lachey's actually like ask some hard hitting questions and ask the couples like what it felt like to watch the show and like see what had happened that they didn't know about because I'm so fucking curious about that.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, I kind of want to see what happens.
Speaker: I'm very, very curious about what's going to happen to Micah and Paul.
Speaker: I don't really particularly want to see Jackie.
Speaker: Yeah, I hope she doesn't come, honestly.
Speaker: Yeah, I don't really care for her after that homophobic bullshit.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But yeah, I'm curious to see what's going to happen.
Speaker: I think there's going to be at least some drama.
Speaker: Oh my God, I think without a doubt.
Speaker: Um, and so, yeah, so we'll have an episode up Sunday and then next week we are having, um, Casey who is domestic blisters on Tik TOK.
Speaker: If any of you guys follow her, we're going to have her on just to sort of talk about the season as a whole and, um, get a different neurodivergent perspective, you know, instead of just Josh and me.
Speaker: And, uh,
Speaker: Yeah, I think that will be really interesting, sort of like looking for broader themes and what we've learned, you know, because we're just not ready to be done talking about Love is Blind season four.
Speaker: No, we're not.
Speaker: We're not.
Speaker: We're not.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: You can also send me a message.
Speaker: You can find me on social media, Twitter or TikTok.
Speaker: If you DM me with an opinion about this season and you say that I can read it on the podcast, I will read your neurodivergent perspective on the podcast.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And guess what?
Speaker: We are looking to podcast more shows and we want your suggestions of what shows you want us to podcast about.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Especially if you know a new season of a show is coming up.
Speaker: We would love to podcast, you know, along with something as it is airing the way that we've been doing.
Speaker: And I just am not like in the know enough to have any idea.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: what we might uh podcast about next but we are yeah open to suggestions um i'm gonna put our social media links in the description you can find me at erica heidewald erica's with a k heidewald is h-e-i-d-e-w-a-l-d and you josh i am jsharyar j-s-h-a-h-r-y-a-r
Speaker: Also, I want to say thank you again to everybody who's been leaving us ratings and reviews.
Speaker: We love them.
Speaker: If you haven't done that yet, we do really appreciate it if you just click that little five star.
Speaker: And if you've got a few more seconds, write a little review.
Speaker: I also got a comment from someone.
Speaker: Any kind of engagement helps.
Speaker: Yeah, it really does.
Speaker: I got a comment today from someone saying they started watching Love is Blind just so that they could listen to the podcast.
Speaker: And I thought that was just the coolest.
Speaker: I love that.
Speaker: So yeah, thank you so much.
Speaker: We sort of, we started podcasting out to nobody basically for ourselves and it's a little, it's more fun to actually have people listen to it for sure.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: And I guess we will see you on Sunday.
Speaker: Heck yeah.
Speaker: I can't wait.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Peace out y'all.
Speaker: Enjoy the episode and enjoy our episode.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Till death do us part.
Speaker: Amen.
Speaker: Bye.
Speaker: Bye.
