Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Episode 356: Is this it?
70 Plays3 years ago
The Seattle Sounders aren't quite dead, yet, but they are very much on life support after dropping two points at home against FC Cincinnati. We discuss how big of a deal it is that this 13-year of playoff qualification might now end.
This week's music: Perry Como - "Seattle", "RVIVR - "Ocean Song", Woody Guthrie - "Roll On Columbia", "Your Journey Begins" - OurMusicBox (Jay Man) (CC BY 4.0)
Thanks to James Woollard, Sounders Public Address Announcer, for doing our sponsor reads. You can follow him on Twitter at @BritVoxUS - if you’re looking for a British Voice to advertise your business or non-profit, please reach out to him.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Full Pool Wines
00:00:00
Speaker
This episode of No Sadietes is sponsored by Full Pool Wines, a Seattle-based wine seller who recently released their first book, 36 Bottles of Wine. The ethos of the book, a highly curated look at wine categories that provide exceptional value right now, should be familiar to full pool readers. But there's loads of fresh content, and since it's not trying to sell any wine through the book, there's a bit more of a sass factor.
00:00:21
Speaker
And there's food. Lots of it. Fullpool's unique writing styles applied to recipes like leftover Thanksgiving, turkey, schmaltz-a-ball soup, and pregnancy nachos. This book can be purchased through Sasquatch Books.
Seattle Sounders Season Overview
00:00:32
Speaker
Hey, this is Christian Roldan. And Jordan Morris from the Seattle Sounders Football Club. And you're listening to... There's no study at this. Come on! Hey, Ocean! Let's go! I want to say bye-bye! The Seattle Sounders have done it! MLS Cup win!
00:00:52
Speaker
important the KSA's genius. Here comes Rui Diaz through the middle to crowd it for Seattle. They have climbed the mountain and now are masters of all that they survey. Michael Odero leaves absolutely no doubt the Saldars rule the region. Seattle Saldars is convinced
00:01:18
Speaker
Seattle Sounders, the greatest MLS team in history. How does this one feel? This feels fucking awesome. The bluest skies you've ever seen are in Seattle. And the hills the greenest green in Seattle.
00:01:53
Speaker
I didn't know what it was. Is that what you young people call twerking? I have no idea. I don't know.
00:02:04
Speaker
Welcome to another edition of no idea to sponsor by full pool wines and our newest sponsor Watson's counter. This is episode 355 and recording on Thursday, September 29th, 2022. I am your host Jeremiah Shan joining me as usual as Aaron Campo and look at P. Well, it's come down to this a season with at least one big high, but featuring lots and lots and lots of lows is officially.
00:02:26
Speaker
in the do or die portion. After Tuesday's tie against FCS Cincinnati, the Sounders are one point away from elimination. If they don't win their final two, and perhaps even if they do, they'll miss the playoffs for the first time in their 14 MLS seasons. Given what this team has done both at their best this year and in previous years, I'm not quite ready to write them write their epitaph until it's final, but things are looking pretty grim, Aaron. You know, we might as well start with this.
00:02:58
Speaker
Let's think about this 13 season playoff streak. Is it a big deal? Is it important to you that it continues? Are you ready to let it go? What are the emotions that you're going through right now? Understanding that nothing is final yet.
00:03:17
Speaker
going to end up probably going to win the MLS Cup. Of course. Yeah. I think that you could say that both of those things are true. Like I am a little bit ready to let it go. Like I'm prepared for that eventually. And I think everybody like the Sounders are not going to make the playoffs every year until
Playoff Streak Concerns
00:03:35
Speaker
forever. The key death of the universe. Right. I was going to say until like I die, but I don't want to jinx anything. Right.
00:03:43
Speaker
So, like, it's gonna happen eventually. And if it's gonna happen, you know, in a year, we've said this a bunch. If you're gonna miss playoffs, yeah. You're a UNCCL. You already won a big trophy. Right. That's not the worst thing in the world.
00:03:58
Speaker
But I also, it is something to be proud of it is something that I think that is you unique in American sports to have a streak of success and I think it's, it's one of those things that you can always point to what the sounders and say, look, like, as frustrating as things can be.
00:04:15
Speaker
that at times, like going through a rough patch, you know what, this team still makes playoffs every year. Like, and so that ending and kind of resetting things is a little scary because you don't have that, they don't have that feather in your cap anymore. But I think
00:04:30
Speaker
The scarier thing for me is not necessarily missing the playoffs. It's because I think the team could get into the playoffs and still have a lot of questions next year. And that's like that transition. What's what's happening with the core of this team? Who's back next year? I think it's going to be most of the team. And so how do they look after an offseason? You know, is this team as competitive as we thought they could be going into the summer or or is the team that we've seen down the stretch?
00:04:58
Speaker
closer to who they actually are. That stuff is all a lot more worrying to me than missing the playoffs at this point, because I think that this could, missing the playoffs once as a blip, because you kind of emptied the tank, winning the CCL, one thing, missing the playoffs because this is the start of a protracted decline, that's another thing. And I've always felt like,
00:05:26
Speaker
having that even in the bad years, even in 2013, 2015, even in those years, you felt like they got into the playoffs, they figured it out. They can reassess things, reset and come back stronger. And it's a little different to not have that, to ultimately to have failed in the league. I suppose, you know,
00:05:51
Speaker
This is maybe a discussion that we'll get deeper into at a later point, but there might be something to the idea that failing to make the playoffs
00:06:04
Speaker
this year might be the impetus to sort of take a deeper look at themselves, Nick, this offseason. But like you pointed out, the challenge is that this team is, as of what we know today,
World Cup and Transfer Hopes
00:06:23
Speaker
almost completely going to have to come back. I mean, there is some wiggle room with like the bottom end of the roster. A lot of kids, a lot of the young guys are on options, but like when it comes to like the core of this team, Jimmy with the Dranda is going to be out of contract. I think Will Bruin is the only veteran that actually has an option coming up. And so
00:06:44
Speaker
The other changes that you're looking at, you need to find partners. I think there's a sense within the Sounders that they're really hoping that a new who or Javier Arriaga can have a really strong World Cup that brings in transfer offers, not necessarily because the Sounders are dying to get rid of either player,
00:07:06
Speaker
they might be, but I think it just more that it's like, it would really give us some wiggle room because those are two players that are potentially on decent cap numbers and who could bring in a chance for revenue. And then like there's other, there's always trades that you can make and there's all these, you know, and who knows, maybe there's other surprise moves, but like,
00:07:31
Speaker
This team is sort of what it is. And it is that way for at least another year, if not two more years. And so, I don't know, I suppose maybe missing the playoffs now would be the impetus they need. Of course, you could also take the counter view and say like, well, the things that went wrong this year are maybe not structural and they are things that will
00:08:00
Speaker
improve with time. I mean, to me, I think there's a reasonable belief that Morris, for instance, will be better next year.
00:08:09
Speaker
you know, Christian Roldon probably, you know, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him kind of come back stronger from this last injury because he had been sort of going nonstop. And there's a, you know, there's other examples like that. If Raul Rodriguez can get, just kind of get right in the off season, there's, you know, so J.O. Powell will come back next year. You know, we can kind of go on the list. So I
Playoff Potential Analysis
00:08:29
Speaker
don't know. It's, it is an interesting, it's an interesting place for the sounders. And I don't want to make,
00:08:36
Speaker
be too much gloom and doom. First of all, they haven't actually missed the playoffs yet. And we kind of talked about this. Someone pointed, asked me, what's the point of making the playoffs? This team is sort of dead on its feet. And I countered with the point is that literally anything can happen once you're in the playoffs. And we've seen that happen, especially with the Sounders. If the Sounders can get in,
00:09:04
Speaker
Who are we really thinking is clearly a better team? I don't know that anyone really is. I mean, LAFC has been exposed for some serious flaws at this point. The Sounders just beat Austin 3-0. They beat Dallas earlier this year. They actually have a pretty decent record against most of the teams in the playoffs, weirdly enough.
00:09:26
Speaker
Yeah, I don't think that this team is significantly worse than last year's RSL team, for example. And that team made a pretty deep run if folks will remember. And I think the point is, you're right, that if the playoffs are a crapshoot, and to a large extent, especially with the format they have now, I think that they are. Yeah, and they've got
00:09:54
Speaker
you know, one of the best goalkeepers in the league. They have a defense that sometimes is really good. You know, like they're a team that can definitely win one off games. They're there. They have a lot of veteran presence. They've shown that they can win a knockout tournaments, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And also, it's just it's ostensibly it's fun to watch soccer and you want to watch your team play soccer some more. Although this this season, maybe not not as much, but and I think just going back to your point about
00:10:23
Speaker
you can look at a lot of the things that have gone wrong this year and say, is the structural or is it circumstantial and lean to the side maybe of more circumstantial? I think there are some situations where I think like Nico Lodera is not getting any younger. That's definitely one that I think is causing it to go on.
00:10:45
Speaker
But I think that in general, I don't think the Sounders right now, I think if you run this team back, they're fully healthy next year, they're not gonna be as good as they were three or four weeks after CCL when they looked their best. I think that guys have gotten worse in a way that they're not coming back from, but I don't think they're this bad. I don't think they're not a playoff caliber team,
00:11:14
Speaker
with a full off season and a chance to get healthy and rest up. So, you know, I think if they do have to run it, largely run it back, it's not the worst thing in the world. But I also think your point about even if they do make the playoffs,
00:11:32
Speaker
this wasn't a season that's up to par and they've made big changes. They've looked at a season and said this was disappointing and we need to make changes. So I think either way, if the opportunity to make those big changes presents itself, one potential possibility you didn't mention is maybe Nico decides, I don't like our chances next year. I feel like I've accomplished everything I can accomplish. I wouldn't mind going back home.
00:11:56
Speaker
that I think would be something everybody involved would jump out if he was open to doing that. And, you know, if you've got a DP off the books, I think that that fundamentally changes a lot of stuff. So the possibility for the team being a much different is there.
00:12:15
Speaker
But I think the most likely scenario is that it's not. And that's going to be the question of the offseason going into next year, is how big of a problem is that? Like, what is the real team? Is it the team that won the CCO or is it the team that couldn't get out of their own way in September?
00:12:33
Speaker
Yeah. You know, assuming,
Offseason Strategies and Criticism
00:12:34
Speaker
and it's, and it's a big assumption or I should, I guess I could kind of rephrase this. Whoever is in charge of player personnel this off season, whether it's Garth or Craig or some other, uh, person, this is sort of an off season where you earn, you earn your money. And I think that's the case, whether they magically win their last two games, get to the playoffs and make a run, or if they, you know,
00:13:03
Speaker
bomb out and lose these next two games because I think this team does need some change. It can't, I don't think they can afford to just come back as they are and expect everything to be better just with time, like with just everyone getting a little older. I, you know, I will say that I wonder if next year, if they, if they miss the playoffs, if that would almost be a blessing in disguise because
00:13:32
Speaker
I do kind of wonder if a lot of the, if some of the decisions they've been making this year were predicated on, we want to continue this streak of making the playoffs more than we're doing what's, what's really best for us. I, and I don't know if, you know, I don't, that's maybe circumstantial, but it did feel like at times this, like Brian was a little bit more.
00:13:55
Speaker
reliant on veterans than he needed to be. You know, I can think of, you know, Dylan Tevez is one player who I feel like a lot of people would have liked to have seen play more. And what's weird is it seems like he actually did okay when he got extended minutes, but he hasn't gotten extended minutes almost at all. But you know, he's someone who I wouldn't have mind seeing a little bit more of. And I think there are a few players like that who
00:14:23
Speaker
they could step into bigger roles next year and just sort of raise the level without, but they sort of need room to grow into. And there's not a lot of room for that right now because this team is still pretty veteran heavy. But I think there are, it's funny, the opinions of,
00:14:45
Speaker
Danny Leyva and Joshua Tenzio especially are all over the map. I'm of the mind that I would love to see them get an extended run. I think that they've actually done pretty well in this one. They haven't necessarily been game winners, but I don't think you can blame them for
00:15:04
Speaker
the team struggles over the last month or so. Really, the players who have fallen short, I think, are really mostly veterans. We just haven't seen the veterans step up and carry this team in a way that I think we should have expected.
00:15:32
Speaker
And you can kind of go down the roster. And I don't think there's any one player who was grossly underperforming what you would have expected of them. But almost everyone, especially the veterans, have underperformed like five to 10%. Yeah, I think that's the thing is that teams in MLS, like in general, you can expect that DPs and key players are going to play pretty well. And if they don't, then
00:15:57
Speaker
You know, you're kind of screwed, right? Right. The Sounders DPs, like Nico has not been vintage Nico, but he's been quite good. When he's been healthy, he's been quite good. Joao Paulo was injured. That's hardly his fault. But ultimately, teams live and die by the performances of their role players, their rotational players, their
00:16:17
Speaker
They're players that are not at like the TAM or DP level, but, you know, are solid veterans. And the Sounders have knocked out on what they needed out of those players this year, like you said. And then I think that that's been a huge part of it. I mean, I think that there have been lots of years where the Sounders were missing key players for extended periods of times where maybe it wasn't always pretty, but they gutted out results. They got
00:16:41
Speaker
point, they picked up points where you wouldn't have expected them to based on the lineup. Like I feel like the lineup they put out last night, that's a lineup that in years past wins that game 3-1 and just kind of shocks everybody. And they just haven't done that this year. And some of that is probably just like luck normalizing a little bit, but I think a lot more of it has just been performances haven't quite been up to snuff. I mean, I think
00:17:07
Speaker
People talk about how bad this team has been. I talk about it, but I think that's not really fair. They've just been kind of mediocre. Like the number of games that they've gone out and just completely, you know, shut the bed. It's not been a ton of games. They've only lost two games by more than one goal. That's a pretty, like even good teams, like, man, I would be willing to bet. I would be willing to bet they had the fewest
00:17:36
Speaker
multi-goal losses, at least in the Western conference. Yeah. I mean, I think that it's, they haven't been good by any stretch. I'm not, I'm not trying to say they've been good. I think they've probably been a little unlucky. I don't know what like the expected goals data is. Um, I don't think it's been like grossly unlucky, but I think they have had some bad luck. Yeah. And they have a, they have a positive goal. I mean, they do have a positive goal difference. Um,
00:18:04
Speaker
But go on, sorry. Yeah, but they've definitely been unlucky with injuries and all that stuff. But I just think ultimately, like...
00:18:14
Speaker
they just haven't had that second year that they have possessed in years past that kind of like allowed them to pick up points where they maybe shouldn't be expected to pick up points. I think last night was a prime example of that. And people have their scapegoats. People have the guys that they point their fingers at. God knows I do. I'm not blame casting here. But ultimately, I do think it's been
00:18:43
Speaker
sort of collective failure. That's like, that's a good way as any, I think, to describe it. Like they've just collectively, they just as a unit, they haven't been good enough. Yeah, no, I think that's a very fair way of putting it. And I think that we talked about this on the show that it just makes it very hard to sort of analyze and identify obvious problems because
00:19:15
Speaker
you're not supposed to lose 14 one-goal games. Right, right. You know, those are games that they, that's probably eight points in any other year.
00:19:24
Speaker
You know what I mean? Or they have two losses in games. They led by two goals, something they had literally never done before. That's six points. You add six points to their point owner right now, and they're tied for fifth. They're leading. They're actually on the verge of a home playoff game. Right. I think that
00:19:50
Speaker
Like, to the 95th percentile of performances, any other year this is one of those years where they're third and fourth and they're not blowing anybody's doors off but they're grinding out results and they look dangerous coming into playoffs and yada yada yada. But they just haven't had that extra that little extra to get them over the line this year, and it's.
00:20:08
Speaker
In some ways, I guess, looking forward, that's a little encouraging, you know, because maybe it means that you feel a little better about where they are coming into next year and that this lack of success has been unsustainable, but maybe not. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. It's.
00:20:32
Speaker
There are definitely changes that the sounders have to... And I don't even think there's specific players they need to swap out. They just need to bring... They just need to make some changes. They just need to shake up this group. And maybe they need to shake up the core of the group. If they were to lose... I don't know. There's a lot of...
00:20:58
Speaker
There's a lot of things they can do, I suppose, or they should be trying to do, but it'll be interesting. It's going to be an interesting last two weeks potentially might be really boring. I suppose they, if they get eliminated this week, it could be really boring next week, but it will be a very interesting off season. I don't, I don't know where to go. I'm, I'm sort of looking forward to being able to talk about it, to be honest with you.
00:21:23
Speaker
Yeah, it's, it's a, I think it's, we've kind of talked about this a few times this year, but I feel like it is a good year for a World Cup for the Sounders because it gives them. Well, it's a good distraction, but it also, it does give a showcase opportunity to someone like Nuhu and someone like, you know, like Zaviri, I get it. And, um, and, you know, I think a lot of people would maybe rather.
00:21:47
Speaker
Ariaga not being around next year for various reasons. Um, and, and so it'd be nice if there were a mutually beneficial situation that arose because of the world cup and, um, you know, it can just generally shake things up. I mean, maybe Jordan goes and scores a crazy goal that, that, you know, get somebody in Europe's attention and, and that frees up some space. Who knows? Um, it just, it's, it's, it's kind of a.
00:22:11
Speaker
it can create a lot of chaos in the transfer market. And I feel like the sounders are pretty good at finding ways to benefit from that.
00:22:18
Speaker
Yeah. Well, uh, I went and looked it up just because I was curious, uh, the sounders have the same number of multi-goal losses as LAFC and fewer multi-goal losses than Austin. So yeah, I really, I really, it's completely natural based on the results to feel like this team has been shitty. Like I think that's a totally reasonable way to feel about the season. I feel that way about the season, but I think if you look at like performances in the aggregate,
00:22:48
Speaker
They've just been kind of meh. Like they haven't been bad, but it's just kind of been a year where you need to be more than that to be competitive. Yeah. Yep.
Sponsor Acknowledgments
00:23:00
Speaker
All right. Well, uh, that's probably a good place to call this a segment. Uh, we're going to come back and, uh, answer some of your questions. Uh, you're listening to know how to get this.
00:23:14
Speaker
Full Pool Wines are based in Seattle, owned and operated by Sanders fans, and have been sponsoring Nota Adieira since 2011. They offer the best boutique wines of the world to members of their mailing list, with special focus on their home, the Pacific Northwest. Their model is simple. One, the email compelling offers.
00:23:34
Speaker
Two, you request bottles that sound appealing, and three, your wine arrives at their soda warehouse and is ready for pickup or shipping. Their soda tasting room is also open to the public. If you're interested in joining their mailing list or learning more about them, visit fullpaulwines.com.
00:23:53
Speaker
Thanks to Watson's Counter for sponsoring this episode. Located in Ballard, Watson's Counter is your neighborhood specialty coffee shop, brunch spot, and now, coffee roaster. Sourcing exclusively high scoring coffees, Watson's Counter has started their coffee roasting project to showcase amazing coffees grown around the world. Their first featured coffee is the beautifully complex washed Ethiopian Odola.
00:24:15
Speaker
Follow them on Instagram at watsonscounter to keep up with all the upcoming releases or check out their website at www.watsonscounter.com. Whether you want to stop by for your daily coffee to go or sit down for delicious Korean inspired brunch, Watson's Counter has got you covered.
00:24:34
Speaker
Welcome back to Noos Adiatus. We have some questions. We might as well just jump right into them. Aaron, you want to fire off the first one? Yeah, let's start with this one from M.G. Amini. I realized that last time I recorded I call him M.G. Amini, even though I know his last name. So, sorry about that. What is behind all of our increased red cards and penalties this year? Lack of disciplines, Bible reps.
00:24:57
Speaker
So I did some, some research into this, and it is true the centers have have four reds this year they had not received any reds the previous two seasons. But then if you go back to 2019.
00:25:13
Speaker
five reds that year. But anyway, they've also committed more. They've had more penalties called against them this year. The interesting thing is three of their reds this year have been second yellows. And even more curiously, I looked at the trends in the league and red cards are up actually quite a bit league wide. And
00:25:37
Speaker
The league has had something like almost three times as many second red, second yellow reds this year than they had last year, which almost makes me think that that's maybe a point of emphasis that like refs have been told to be less forgiving on second reds.
00:25:57
Speaker
I bring this all up, not to necessarily excuse the Sounders, but to just point out that it is part of a larger league wide trend and it might, it certainly feels spiteful and it feels, uh, but I, I don't necessarily think it's the lack of, I mean, you look at the cards, it's, it's not like they're going in for these bad tackles. Uh, and in fact, the Sounders have the second fewest yellow cards in the league.
00:26:26
Speaker
Yeah, the Sounders Reds this year, I'm trying to think, have any of them been for like serious foul play or have they all been either second yellows or like a dog. So like, like Rose. So Collins was the first straight red. And then he got, he also got a red card for tossing the ball in the stands. And then there was the Jackson Reagan red, where it was, you know, just kind of a sloppy right now. And I'm trying to, what was the other one?
00:26:55
Speaker
I feel like it was a long time ago. I think it was, but it was a second yellow also. It'll come to me probably. But yeah, I don't think it is, I mean, I don't think it's lack of discipline. And if you look at the penalties even, like an inordinate number of them were awarded by VAR. I wanna say three, three were awarded by VAR. And it's not like, again, it's not like,
00:27:21
Speaker
horror show type stuff. It's just kind of annoying. It's like the season. It's like lots of little annoying things. Yeah. It's when I think back to all of the penalties and the red cards, um, the, the only one that stands out, there's one penalty and one red card, and I'm probably forgetting a penalty, but Rose red card for throwing the ball was a joke. I thought the one last night was fair. I thought Alex got a red card too. I'm trying to remember that one.
00:27:52
Speaker
I think, I think he, he got like two yellows and like very quick succession of our directly. Yeah. And, and, and I think they were, and I think the second one was really hot. Like, what are you doing type stuff? Yeah. Like it was like two professional fouls on a row or something. Yeah. I'm pretty sure you're right. And so like the, the rose second yellow against Colorado was bad with bad call. Um,
00:28:22
Speaker
but the one last night I thought was fair, the other two I thought were fair. The penalties, the handball against LA I thought was really unfair. Everything else has seemed reasonable to me, you know? So, you know, it's just one of those things. It's been like just a lot of that this year of like a lot of not grossly upsetting stuff, but a lot of mildly upsetting stuff just kind of,
00:28:47
Speaker
pile on top of each other. So this is from Josh on the sound. Are you also feeling that the sounders need to be a bit more tactically driven? It was no secret what FC Cincinnati wanted to do, and yet they still courted that risk with a high line and ended up paying dearly for it. YCap's certainly a one trick pony, but we struggled against them too. I mean, I think the sounders have always kind of
00:29:14
Speaker
made it clear that their preference is to play the style that they want to play and to try to impose their will on other teams. And I think that that's a reasonable approach to take, especially at home. I mean, I understand the point about the high line kind of bite him in the ass because of the way Cincinnati's goal was scored. But ultimately, that's just really bad defending. I mean, that's yeah, I know not to cut you off, but I think one of the things that frustrates me is
00:29:46
Speaker
So when he says the high line, I say both center, but two of the center backs get really far up the field. But what's so annoying about it is that Ro and Sisoko are like kind of are not playing high, right? Which allows Brenner to, you know, be like if they had just stood at the midfield stripe and pressed along with the rest of their teammates, I don't think that goal happens.
00:30:12
Speaker
Yeah, I don't, I think that you can always nitpick tactics and I'm not saying that I think that the Senator's tactics are spot on every time, but I do think that it's a lot more about execution than tactical decisions this year. And I think
00:30:30
Speaker
Anytime you get bad results, it's fair to look at everything that happened. But I think there is a lot of times an overemphasis on tactics. I don't think the tactics were the problems against the Whitecaps. They just played really poorly. I don't think that tactics are what won them the game against Austin. They just executed, right? So I do at times feel like
00:30:56
Speaker
the sounders could be a little more sophisticated in their approach tactically. But I also think it's really hard to do that when you kind of have this sort of revolving door situation that they've had this year. And I think that that's something that gets overlooked is that these teams that play a style and a system that's identifiable from game to game and are really heavily tactically driven, they don't have the same kind of limitations that
00:31:20
Speaker
teams in MLS do, um, like there aren't that many teams like that in MLS, like there are teams that have an identity, but there aren't teams that are doing this, like really sophisticated stuff the way that they are in other, you know, other parts of the world. And I think a lot of that is just because of international call-ups and, you know, injuries and the caliber of some of the backend of the bench players and that kind of thing more than it is like a lack of tactical news as the English would say for some reason.
00:31:50
Speaker
That's a word that I only ever heard used in that way. It doesn't mean any. I tried to look up the etymology of it one day and it was like, yeah, it's just they say it about tactics. Nobody knows what to do. I'm sure somebody will tell me I'm wrong.
00:32:10
Speaker
The next one is from Pejota81. I think that's right, hopefully. Thinking on next year, what players should we let go, trade, or even dismiss, and which positions to focus on bringing in new players? Yeah, so we kind of touched on this earlier, and it is a real challenge because they can't really let go of almost anyone. And I think like Jimmy Madranda almost exclusively
00:32:40
Speaker
because he is one of those players who's at a contract. It's hard to imagine him coming back, even if the sounders like theoretically would like to bring them back, they'd like, they need to have some wiggle room somewhere. So I think he's probably almost certainly gone. Uh, as much as it pains me, I imagine, uh, I will might not is probably not going to be back, but those are, you know, we're really like neither one of those guys are going to open up a big, uh, a big,
00:33:09
Speaker
hole in the, like, they're not going to open up a lot of money, right? And so you've got to start looking at some of the bigger money players. And I think there's going to be a lot of pressure to figure out how to move one of the either Ariaga or Yamar, if only because Jackson Reagan is
00:33:29
Speaker
you know, a small step down, but like making a tenth of what they make. And so it's like, that's a big difference in terms of like salary cap space. So I think in almost a net, like one way or another, one of those guys, they're going to try to move.
00:33:50
Speaker
And then, you know, like, I think they would love to figure out a way to transfer new who again, not necessarily because they're dying to get rid of them, but because that would give them a lot more flexibility. I think they would probably also wouldn't mind looking at left back as a position to bring someone in. And I think they have to look at bringing in
00:34:11
Speaker
another attacking piece, like maybe not a starting attacking piece, but someone like one of the things that's been, I think, really frustrating this year is that they've just gotten almost no production out of their bench. And I'm, you know, in some, maybe some of those guys, like, I wouldn't say this may be alluding to a later question, but like, there are players who I think on the roster who could step into bigger roles. But yeah, I mean, it's gonna be really interesting. But
00:34:41
Speaker
So, I don't know, I guess those are, just give us something to chew on, I suppose. Yeah. I think you're spot on everywhere. I mean, I think if this is a different league and, you know, you can just kind of pick and choose who you want to replace, that's a different conversation, but structural realities are such that they're kind of limited in their options. And I do think the new thing is interesting because
00:35:07
Speaker
I knew who was like such, I'm not breaking news here, but he's such an enigmatic player because he's a good player with a lot of value. That's a horrible fit for this roster for the way that we play. And I think it's probably the best for everyone involved unless the sounders decide to make a tactical switch back to, to primarily being a three at the back team and he's playing center back again. Um, I think for the good of his own career, like that's a, that's a move that should happen.
00:35:37
Speaker
Yeah. Uh, this is from a bomb 88. Why isn't Dylan Telves playing more? Am I over-optimistic on how his speed could help on the pitch? Is he not as fast as I believe he is? Um, I mean, I think we did kind of talk a little bit about why Telves and just the youngsters in general weren't playing more. And, and I think it's.
00:36:02
Speaker
like the reasons are maybe understandable. You know, the sounders have been pushing really hard for a playoff spot and Brian has trusted his veterans more, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's good that the youngsters aren't playing more, that was included. So I would definitely would have liked to have seen him a little bit more. As to the second part, I think he might not be as fast as maybe he's perceived to be.
00:36:30
Speaker
Like, he's not slow, I don't think, and I certainly haven't watched him as much as other people have, but I've never gotten the impression that he's like a burner. No, and I almost wonder if this person is thinking of Leo Chu, who is quite fast, but
00:36:54
Speaker
I don't necessarily think speed is the thing that the centers have been missing, but I don't know. It's always nice, but having more speed on the field is not bad, but I don't think their inability to stretch teams is not just because they don't have anyone to run on to those.
00:37:24
Speaker
And I think a big part of the problem this year has been the Sounders falling behind early or getting into situations where the game state favors teams playing deep and speed's not going to help you too much in those situations. Yeah. The next one is from Jeffrey M. Williams. When thinking about off-season changes, how much would a club World Cup play in personnel decisions? Does the team prioritize that in making decisions or did the decisions focus on longer-term changes?
00:37:53
Speaker
Well, this was actually a question that Garth addressed specifically in our interview. So for a longer answer to this, I would absolutely recommend going back and listening to our interview with him a couple of weeks ago. But the short answer is, I don't think it's going to have that much of an impact. And I was a little surprised by that answer, but
00:38:17
Speaker
Maybe I shouldn't have been. He made a pretty good point, which is the Club World Cup is a small, is a short tournament. It might only be one game. At the most, it's gonna be three games. And sure, if you're gonna bring on someone who happens to help you in the Club World Cup, you do it. But you don't, it's not like Champions League where you're gonna build your roster around trying to compete in this tournament.
00:38:46
Speaker
And I think too, like they are pretty limited in what they can do anyways. Right. And the league isn't helping. It doesn't sound like the league, at least they're not expecting the league to help them out with any like influx of allocation money or anything like that. And, you know, Garth was also pretty confident that he thinks that they can compete if, you know, like they're not going to go toe to toe with Real Madrid or anything, but he feels like they shouldn't be embarrassed with the roster they have. And I think that's probably true.
00:39:16
Speaker
This is from Nick Payton. Any thoughts or predictions on next year's secondary kit will be over the top like Hendrix or something more astray, like Nightfall. It won't be white, right? Will we ever get a third kit again? So the third kit thing, as I understand it officially, teams don't have them, but sometimes they do. Well, I think they're coming back, actually. That's good. Third kits are fun. Yeah, they made a rule.
00:39:44
Speaker
a rule. Adidas decided that they, I think one team has a third kit this year and they basically created a metric by which teams could essentially earn third kits if they sell enough of their other kits. And it seems like the Sounders almost surely are the next team in line to get a third kit. It might not be this year, but there will be third kits again.
00:40:12
Speaker
Yeah, I would imagine the Sounders will be among the first teams get them.
00:40:20
Speaker
Am I jumping on your, were you ready to answer? Do you have any idea? No, that's good context because that's stuff I didn't know and it informs my answer. And I think if third kits are coming back, I don't know that the sounders will get a white kit necessarily, but I think if the trend previously was primary kit is what you'd expect, secondary kit is subdued, usually lighter color, third kit is insane.
00:40:46
Speaker
Uh, since the third kid's gone away, they've tended to go. Flashier wilder for, for the secondary kids. Um, and so I think there, there could be a return to maybe a more conservative secondary kid. Um, I still think that like a gray would be cool. Um, you know, but I don't know. I mean, next year, I don't think that they're ever going to do something. If they only have two kids, they're never going to do something. That's not, um,
00:41:16
Speaker
flashy in some way like right if you're always going to be wanting flashy yeah and if your idea of restrained as nightfall which was hot pink and in large parts of it like and compared to the others it is restrained but yeah um and i you know all of their black kids with a with a bright um accent color have been my favorites like
00:41:37
Speaker
pitch black nightfall. I've loved those. Those are my favorite kids of all time. So I hope that they do go in that direction, but we'll see. I don't know. It is exciting you hear about their kids coming back because I feel like they get as crazy as possible with those, which I fully support. Yeah. And, and keep in mind in 2024, they're going to have some sort of like re
00:42:01
Speaker
I don't think it's gonna be a fully redesigned crest. From what I'm hearing, it sounds like it will be a settler change. Like it will look very much as part of the family, but there's gonna be a visual update coming in 2024. So I would imagine they're probably going to hold some of their, you know, like they're keeping their powder dry, I think for 2024.
00:42:27
Speaker
So is that, is that sort of the outcome of all the rebranding discussions or is that just sort of a transitional thing? No, that that's like when the in 2024 is when they'll announce all that. Well, that's interesting. Uh, next one is from third string star. Is this team fine with JP starting without the knock on effects of him being out or does it run deeper in that you seems to have not worked out. Our attacking depth is getting too old and we don't have good subs in the full back position.
00:42:57
Speaker
Yes. I think it's like kind of legit. Like I think they are. That's that's actually it's a good question. I do think there is a belief that adding JP to the roster as it is would help immensely. Like it would it's not and I don't think it's a stretch to say that his presence was would have probably been enough to get them into the playoffs. Maybe not.
00:43:28
Speaker
competing for a top spot in the West, but, you know, the margins are thin enough where it's not that hard to imagine that a player like that could have turned some of the, you know, a handful of those one goal losses into ties or maybe, uh, you know, kept you from blowing two zero leads against San Jose and Orlando. Um,
00:43:50
Speaker
But there are bigger, I think there's a recognition that there's some bigger problems. I think there is probably some healthy debate as to whether or not Leo Chu is a bust. I think there's evidence that, like the more I see him play, the more I see the problems in his game. He doesn't really move into space as,
00:44:18
Speaker
easily as it feels like he should. He tends to dribble with his head down, so he's not really great at combining with teammates. And I think those two things really limit his effectiveness. Yeah, I think so. I think that we actually talked about this off-pod earlier. We probably should have saved it for the discussion to this question. But I think that it's easy to see the potential in his game. And it's also easy to see that
00:44:48
Speaker
it should have improved by now. Like the stuff that he, to me, it seems like the sounders saw his potential and said, there are these shortcomings in this game. We think there's a good chance we can coach him out of those. And it seems like that hasn't happened. Yeah, I think, yeah. Yeah, go ahead. I just think you're right. I think there was probably a lot of
00:45:16
Speaker
We like, I think there, I, I, my suspicion is the sounders saw his raw skillset and thought.
00:45:26
Speaker
if we can coach him up, we can make this into a $10 million player. And it might not work out that way. And so maybe it might just be a gamble that didn't paid off. And that's sort of what this roster spot is for, I suppose. Yeah, it's high risk, high reward. And if there's a spot that you can afford to not play it safe with, I think it's that one.
00:45:53
Speaker
Um, the last one, which, uh, I'm going to ask you, even though the rotation didn't work out this way, but I think you are going to answer it better than me. It's from Nick Yasinski. Can you help us understand the Garth interview in terms of how much flexibility we do and don't have an acquiring new players for next year? He seemed to say we had mortgage 2023 to one CCL in 2022. True. How true. Yeah. I mean, I don't, I don't know if we mortgaged.
00:46:25
Speaker
sign all these guys just because of the CCL. They gave a bunch of extensions to players because presumably they believed in those players. I don't think they had to give big extensions to Ariaga and Yemar just to keep them around for 2022, I don't think. Maybe you could argue really Diaz. That was part of the thinking there.
00:46:48
Speaker
2023 for the CCL run, they didn't have to
00:46:51
Speaker
uh but it regardless of what the thinking was they are kind of locked in uh or i shouldn't say that they aren't locked in but they have limited they're gonna have to they don't have the ease
00:47:07
Speaker
They don't have easy flexibility. They aren't going to just be able to walk away from a bunch of players. And they're going to have to get creative. If they want to make changes on this roster, they're going to have to get kind of creative with it. And we'll see what form that takes. Yeah, I think that mortgage in the future is like,
00:47:31
Speaker
I think a very specific thing and I don't think it's what the Sounders did here. I think that they were probably more aggressive than they would have ordinarily been with with locking guys up. But they resigned a bunch of players who had really good seasons, and really good for the team.
00:47:49
Speaker
If you don't feel like you have a chance to win CCL, maybe you don't want to commit as much salary cap space to center back or whatever. Maybe there's some marginal veteran guys that you don't bring back and you try to bank some allocation money. I'm sure there's definitely knock-on effects, but ultimately,
00:48:09
Speaker
It's just kind of happened that a lot of guys that are signed to big money deals didn't contribute this year. And as much as you want them to anyone. Yeah, for sure. And it's limited their flexibility and it's, if they didn't feel like they had a chance to one CCL, they probably don't do that. But I think it was just a lot of bad luck in the way things worked out more than recklessness. If that makes sense. Yeah. And no, it'll add.
00:48:35
Speaker
I don't think the gambles they've made, it's not like they gave a bunch of 30-year-old guys five-year contracts.
00:48:50
Speaker
year is a age 35 year, there's no reason to think he couldn't be productive until he's 35. Like lots of M1 strikers are productive into that age. Ariaga and Yeymar are both young enough that they can be reasonably, they can be, you know, Yeymar is 30 now.
00:49:14
Speaker
So, you know, he's a center back. Why can't he be productive until he's 32 or 33? Like these are reasonable guesses, right? They're reasonable bats. So yeah, I'm not ready to say that. I think it's a little harsh to say they mortgaged the future in order to sign these guys, but they definitely limited their flexibility. But anyway, all right, well, that's it. Those are the questions, right? Yeah, that was it. Yeah.
00:49:43
Speaker
Yeah, so I don't know when we'll, we will be back again this year at some point. At some point, we'll see. I hope, I hope we feel super compelled to record next week. That would be great. Right. I can't promise that we will be back next week if we're playing a dead rubber game.
00:50:05
Speaker
Yes, at the very least, we will have a season post-mortem. Yes, absolutely. But hopefully there's more episodes than that one to come. Yes, yes, exactly, exactly. And with that said, thank you to our sponsors, Fullpool Wines and Watson's Counter. I'm actually going to be going to, I'm taking my sister to Watson's Counter for brunch this weekend for her birthday. So that's a good one.
00:50:30
Speaker
And I'll probably be buying, I need to buy another case of wine from full bowl. So there's two plugs for you. Free, free of charge. Organic, they call those. But anyway, I am Jeremiah Jan signing off on behalf of Aaron Campbell and Lickett. This is No Saudi Yetists. Remember, you'll never get a loan.
00:50:51
Speaker
Green Douglas spur where the water's cut through. Down to wild mountains and tangents you flew. Canadian Northwest to the ocean so blue. It's Roll On, Columbia Roll On. Roll On, Columbia Roll On. Roll On, Columbia Roll On. Your power is turning our darkness to dawn. Roll On, Columbia Roll On.
00:51:29
Speaker
We love you. Let's win another one!