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Episode 23 - STRESS and how to Handle It
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Do you feel STRESS at times in the shop? Many people turn to woodworking and other crafts to relieve stress but once sufficiently into it, those once stress-relieving hobbies can actually become a SOURCE OF STRESS. Today we talk about the stresses that each of us feel around the shop and making experience, what effects that stress has on us, and how we go about solving or alleviating that stress.
To watch the YOUTUBE VIDEO of this episode and the irreverent & somewhat unpredictable AFTERSHOW, subscribe to our Patreon: http://patreon.com/user?u=91688467
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Transcript
Introduction and Host Backgrounds
00:00:17
E what indabutt
oh That is a that is an audible way to start sir that is that I Love that ASMR energy right off the jump No, that's we're keeping that that's a live read.
00:00:17
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Hm.
00:00:18
Mary
What? What in the world?
00:00:23
Mary
I really don't know how I feel about that intro. and Deep breaths.
00:00:37
E what indabutt
We're not going back now
00:00:40
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I don't know if anyone knows this, but we don't edit our show. So like if shit happens, it sticks. Okay, well I just took the biggest breath known to mankind right in front of the microphone.
00:00:47
E what indabutt
Oh man.
00:00:50
Mary
Oh my god.
00:00:52
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Welcome everyone, this is Woodworking is Bullshit, your favorite irreverent podcast all about creativity, art, and design. I'm your host Paul Jasper, Woodworker by Day.
00:01:02
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
No, scientist by day. Whoa, I always get those confused. Scientist just by day, we're worker by night, and I'm joined by Eric Curtis, fine furniture maker and content creator, and married to Sayee, marathon runner, and ah half marathon runner, ah UX designer by day, and contemporary furniture heiress by night.
00:01:13
E what indabutt
Whoo!
00:01:19
Mary
not not Not full marathon.
00:01:22
E what indabutt
Half marathon runner.
Playful Dynamics and Personal Interests
00:01:31
E what indabutt
i love I love the Aeris label that we really bestowed upon her.
00:01:31
Mary
Yes, wow.
00:01:34
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh my god.
00:01:34
E what indabutt
That makes me happy.
00:01:36
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
What a hot opening that was.
00:01:36
Mary
You know, i that is one of the nicknames and like things that you guys have given me that I am actually okay with.
00:01:40
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Fuck.
00:01:43
E what indabutt
That feels right. That energy feels right.
00:01:45
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah What a hot intro that was. What a mess.
00:01:49
E what indabutt
That was...
00:01:50
Mary
I would also like to point out Eric's dancing to the music, but and on my video, you're kind of delayed, so it just looks like you're terrible with rhythm.
00:01:58
E what indabutt
I mean, I am a Northeastern European white boy. like i was i Dancing is not what we are known for.
00:02:04
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Well.
00:02:08
E what indabutt
drunk Drunkenly swaying, mostly, and eating cheese.
00:02:09
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right, Eric, what are you drinking?
00:02:10
Mary
That's okay.
00:02:13
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
You drinking anything?
00:02:13
E what indabutt
i'm drinking I'm drinking a scotch out of a glass that Mary got me for my birthday, which is a delightful little crumpled glass, rocks glass.
00:02:15
Mary
Oh yeah.
00:02:19
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, wow, Mary.
00:02:20
Mary
It's Japanese glass.
00:02:22
E what indabutt
Is it Japanese?
00:02:24
Mary
Yeah.
00:02:24
E what indabutt
OK, all right.
00:02:24
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Jepin.
00:02:25
E what indabutt
It's it's ah for for those who are listening because this is an audio format.
00:02:25
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right.
00:02:29
E what indabutt
It's basically a frosted glass that ah looks as though paper has been kind of crumpled a bit. It's got that nice texture to it. And part of the reason I'll be honest, part of the reason I do like this glass is because I know how much joy it brings Mary to have an object like this.
00:02:45
E what indabutt
Like this is the kind of shit that she gets her rocks off on. And I.
00:02:49
Mary
Oh, I got one for myself.
00:02:50
E what indabutt
Oh, I'm sure you did.
00:02:51
Mary
I have the same one.
00:02:52
E what indabutt
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You wouldn't get me a thing that you don't like.
00:02:55
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right.
00:02:58
Mary
Accurate, yes.
00:03:02
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right, so if we can head into our topic of the day, part the kimono as Eric likes to say.
00:03:08
E what indabutt
but By the by the way, by the way, I I learned so after that episode, I googled it because I just that's a phrase that just exists in my brain rent free.
00:03:08
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Is that?
00:03:09
Mary
Wow, topical.
00:03:18
E what indabutt
And I, I don't think that it is offensive, but some people take umbrage with it. And I just want to clarify, I wasn't attempting to be offensive with that terminology.
00:03:29
E what indabutt
It was just a phrase that came out of my mouth.
00:03:32
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Eric, are you starting this episode with an apology?
00:03:35
E what indabutt
It's more, ah we'll say it's a retraction.
00:03:35
Mary
ah
00:03:36
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, more clarification. I say, yeah.
00:03:38
E what indabutt
Yeah, yeah. But now let's let's part the kimono.
00:03:40
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right. yeah Let's part the kimono and get to it.
00:03:43
Mary
Ugh, I don't love this at all.
00:03:43
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
so Eric, that's terrible.
Stress in Woodworking
00:03:49
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So today's episode is about something that's equally terrible, which is stress and dealing with stress.
00:03:58
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And we thought this, what we're trying, I don't i don't know if anyone's noticed some ah pattern into our topics, but we tried to alternate between psycho-emotional kind of topics, like dealing with imposter syndrome and the emotional side of things, and then we pivot to a more nuts and bolts worldly topic. like Figured woods or a master series thing on Nakashima, you know, something a little less, you know, emotional touchy feeling. And we seem to oscillate between these two. So today, we're oscillating back to the more emotional side of things. And we thought stress is a good one, because who does not relate to this topic?
00:04:41
E what indabutt
we all We all have those stressful moments been in and out of the shot. And also just life is stressful right now.
00:04:48
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That's for sure. So ah so ah if you funny thing, if you Google woodworking and stress, those two words next to each other at the same time, what comes up, which I did, obviously, like what comes up is a whole bunch of results that say, well, woodworking is a great stress reliever.
00:05:10
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
It's such a great thing to just get out and make something.
00:05:11
Mary
yeah
00:05:14
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
you know use You know, you could consider art and you can make a thing and you see what you made in front of you.
00:05:20
Mary
It's not wrong.
00:05:20
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And it's it's such a great stress reliever. But, well, I think for many of us, it can turn the page. I think many people listening, ah it's it's often a stress reliever, but I think all of us know it can turn the corner on that, right?
00:05:38
E what indabutt
So... I wonder what I think the majority of people listening to this podcast have been making things for a while. there There may be some people who are just getting into it and they're like, let me dive in and find out what this dumb podcast is all about. And then they're surprised and confused, but I feel like the majority of people have been making things for at least some amount of time. And I can't. I can't help but wonder if the stress that comes from any endeavor that starts as a stress reliever is associated with the pressure that we put on ourselves, whatever, whatever form that pressure takes. So go be financial, right? Like you, you have a commission, like you start making things. You're like, Oh, I think I'm kind of good at this. Then somebody wants to pay me to make, you know, a piece that's just outside of my wheelhouse. And now I have to figure out how to do that. and You feel that stress.
00:06:32
E what indabutt
Um, it could be temporal, like now I have to figure out how to get a thing done before Christmas. And I don't know how I'm going to do that. It could be reputation, right? I've got, I've got a show coming up and I need to put this. I want to win that amateur award. And now all of a sudden it's not fun anymore because you're worried about the thing that's looming. So how much like in that, that, that can happen in any number. Like if you hike to relieve stress and then all of a sudden you're.
00:07:00
E what indabutt
competitively hiking. Is that a thing?
00:07:03
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
you're hiking like
00:07:03
Mary
I don't know about that Yeah, for sure
00:07:04
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
yeah
00:07:04
E what indabutt
ah But you know what I mean? Like there is whatever, as soon as you you put stakes on the thing, then the stress comes in.
00:07:14
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah, and I think for all of us, it you know, early on, it's probably a stress reliever early on, like, I just want to do something not in front of a computer, or I want to make something because like making things is not like from scratch is not that common today as it was in the 1950s or 1920s, where they
00:07:33
E what indabutt
Yeah.
Managing Stress through Activities
00:07:34
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
made everything everyone new basic electrical everyone new basic plumbing everyone new basic making you know with their hands and today it's not like that so i think so many people are just married sick as fuck of the computer right like you just get me off this computer for a while and i just wanna feel like a human again.
00:07:50
Mary
Yes.
00:07:52
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And so I think many of us start at that point. But then, as you said, Eric, there's so many overachievers in the hobbyist woodworking field, especially, because they come from like highly technical, like whatever, there's so many overachievers in the woodworking field, it seems like these days, that as soon as they, they go into it, they double down like, I want to be
00:08:13
E what indabutt
Mm.
00:08:14
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I want to be schooled in machines. I want to understand, you know, hand tool woodworking.
00:08:15
E what indabutt
Mm-hmm.
00:08:17
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I want to understand all the joints and they have these like incredibly high standards that re-imposes all of this stress again on what should be a joyful thing.
00:08:29
Mary
I can definitely speak to that. I mean, for me, a lot of it is because it's a hobby, because there's limited time, I then put stress on myself to make sure that I use that time as well as possible, as efficiently as possible, whatever I do there it has to be like, you know, something that I am ultimately happy with, which we all know is just never going to be the case, but it's a vicious cycle.
00:08:50
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
that's ah that That's a ton of pressure.
00:08:52
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:08:52
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That's a ton of pressure, Mary.
00:08:56
Mary
Because it is my stress reliever. Woodworking is supposed to be my stress reliever. And then I get stressed about being stressed as well.
00:09:03
E what indabutt
So do you, all right. So you also run. You like, you have other hobbies, right? Running is just the first one that comes to mind.
00:09:12
Mary
Mm hmm.
00:09:12
E what indabutt
And now you are training for a half marathon.
00:09:16
Mary
Mm hmm.
00:09:17
E what indabutt
So do you, I'm asking genuinely, do you feel stressed about the upcoming race? And do you, does that translate in any way to your mentality when you're running on a daily basis now?
00:09:31
Mary
Uh, yeah, I just want to make sure that I don't die. clearly Like I'm very cognizant of the things that, uh, would prevent me from achieving that goal, one my knees. So I want to make sure I take good care of them. I'm running out of speed and form proper form. And like always thinking about that isn't always great too. Cause the reason I, some well, I usually hate running, but when I do enjoy it, it's because you get lost in the moment. You can just kind of like relax and let your brain and.
00:10:01
Mary
Life just like glaze over Yes Yes runners high huge fan of that um but But yeah, it is it's something I think about
00:10:04
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah That's called the flow state.
00:10:05
E what indabutt
That is yeah also known as a runner's high.
00:10:12
E what indabutt
There's I'm going to leave that joke on the table.
00:10:17
E what indabutt
Well, I guess what, what I'm, what I'm getting out is. Do you, do you know how to relax buddy? Like, is there, like, is there, is there like.
00:10:28
Mary
Okay, that's a question that I think a lot of our listeners can relate to though.
00:10:31
E what indabutt
she Well, that's why I'm sure and that's part of the reason I'm asking it because it's like you you're saying I'm stressed about work And so I turn to woodworking to relieve stress and then I get stressed about designing and making the best possible object So in order to avoid the stress of the wood shop I go for a run which I don't actually really enjoy running But then as soon as I get into the flow of running now I'm gonna decide to do a half marathon and now I'm thinking about how my body is reacting to the 13 month
00:10:45
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Eric. Eric.
00:10:56
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Eric. such Such is the plight of the overachiever.
00:11:02
Mary
like i'm in therapy like god
00:11:05
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So Mary, coming back to your childhood. ah
00:11:09
Mary
Well, I something that I did, I do realize is that I really enjoy making myself physically exhausted at the end of the day.
00:11:18
E what indabutt
oh sure
00:11:19
Mary
And that is the feeling that I love when I'm in the shop for x number of hours straight.
00:11:19
E what indabutt
i think
00:11:24
Mary
And I am so tired that I get home, I shower and I lay on the couch and like this was such a good day because I am so tired. I think I get that I get that same thing through exercise as well.
00:11:34
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Hmm.
00:11:35
E what indabutt
I think that's the thing I, I feel the same way. And I think that is a thing that those of us with overactive brains need in order to unwind, right?
00:11:43
Mary
Yes.
00:11:45
E what indabutt
Like otherwise realistic without getting like, you know, too dark, like the the other options are. copious amounts of drugs to like stop the brain from, from working, you know, like because you can't shut it off.
00:11:57
E what indabutt
And the best way to shut it off is to make your body and consequently your brain so physically tired that it can't be overactive when you need sleep.
00:11:57
Mary
Yeah.
00:12:07
Mary
And it's probably a trend that is happening more and more now because you're constantly being stimulated mentally.
00:12:07
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That's an interesting.
00:12:14
Mary
Like there's so many screens, the younger generations, their attention span is shrinking as well. Like that its you're just kind of ingrained in culturally in your life that like you should always be thinking about something you should you always be watching and then it becomes a habit that you just don't realize and you can't kick it so like when was the last time you sat on the couch and you didn't look at your screen you didn't like think about anything for like 10 minutes because I can't I can like barely think of when I do do that except after exercising
00:12:34
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Today. Today.
00:12:42
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I do it routinely, but I don't have that overactive brain thing you described. So yeah, yeah.
00:12:42
E what indabutt
Hmm.
00:12:46
E what indabutt
Really? That's a little bit surprising.
00:12:50
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
No, I have a quiet mind usually. And so I can take a minute in this 70 degree weather in the middle of November to sit on my porch and just have a have five 10 minutes of quiet and just reflect.
00:12:53
E what indabutt
Hmm.
00:12:59
E what indabutt
Sure. Sure. Sure. Sure. Yeah.
00:13:02
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I would love it if my head was silent. It's not there's intrusive thoughts always, you know, I would just love a bit of quiet.
00:13:07
E what indabutt
Sure. Sure.
00:13:09
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
But if I can, and so if I could take a step back now, we've sort of, you know,
00:13:16
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
tickle the ivories about you know ah stress and and a little bit of how we feel about it. if ah But I want to give like some structure to how we handle talking about this. So ah we're going to handle this in a three-part structure. the The first thing is to talk about what stresses you out. And I think the three of us are going to have different answers.
00:13:35
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And I think that's awesome, because the listeners may relate to one person's answers or another. Okay. And the second is, what did it do that was negative to your life? Like, what does it do to you? Like, why should we even care about stress? Is being stressed all the time? Okay, like, let's play devil's advocate. Let's say, Oh, what's the big deal? It's yeah, I'm stressed all the time. So what? So let's talk about What stresses you out in particular? well All three of us will take a turn. What effects does it have? And then we're going to talk what to do about it, both from a sort of
Professional Stress in Woodworking
00:14:06
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
a we're going to do a round robin and both from like a very typical
00:14:12
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
typical answer point of view but are there any like really specific niche answers that help you and you know maybe the listeners will relate to one or the other so let's start with what stresses you are eric why don't you go first what stresses you out you seem like cool as a cucumber to be honest so let's let's let's start with you.
00:14:28
E what indabutt
Um, well, if you you are both two of my closest friends, like you both know there's a lot of things that stress me out. ah But in in the shop specifically, if we're if we're taking my love life off the table.
00:14:43
E what indabutt
ah
00:14:44
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Why would we want to do that?
00:14:45
E what indabutt
the
00:14:47
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Let's part that kimono right quick.
00:14:48
E what indabutt
that oh that's ah That's a dangerous dangerous ball.
00:14:51
Mary
I'm gonna, be I'm gonna veto that.
00:14:53
E what indabutt
um So the I think the thing that stresses me out in the shop in my work is expectations. And that could be my own expectations. That could be the expectations of a client. That could be um however you want to voice expectations, right? But the the idea of,
00:15:16
E what indabutt
there is a person expecting this exact thing X and I need to deliver X is, and I don't know how to deliver X. I've never done it before is a thing like that's when I catch myself in a lie of saying like, Oh, I can do that for you, but I don't actually know how to do it. That's when I get that knot in my stomach of like, I don't know. I don't know how to move forward.
00:15:42
E what indabutt
I don't know what to do in this situation. And I don't know how to then call them and say, I lied. I can't do it.
00:15:51
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Have you ever said that?
00:15:51
E what indabutt
That's not those words, but I've pulled out of commissions for sure.
00:15:56
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Really?
00:15:56
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:15:56
Mary
Mm.
00:15:57
E what indabutt
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:15:57
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I'm surprised.
00:15:58
E what indabutt
I just, I just pulled out. Well, well it's also like. It's, so I just recently pulled out of a commission. I've got, I'm working on one. I've got one after this. And then originally I had another one in line before I closed the books down. And I decided that I couldn't do it. Like I just didn't want to do it. um There's a lot going on. Like there's other things that need to focus my energies on. And I ended up having to to contact that client who had been patiently waiting for for months. And basically what I said was, uh, look, I, I just, I can't do it. I'm not in the right head space to do it. I don't want to make the thing for you. And it's going to end up disappointing both of us. Um, but the.
00:16:47
E what indabutt
articulating that to the client was a stressful thing to approach because they've also been waiting for, for six months for me to start this thing.
00:16:52
Mary
Yeah, of course.
00:16:53
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah ah
00:16:56
E what indabutt
And then I had to be like, and I'm not going to do it for you. You know? Um, and that just makes you fucking feel bad.
00:17:04
Mary
Yeah.
00:17:05
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
What made you so convinced you couldn't pull it off?
00:17:07
E what indabutt
It was, it, it's not that I couldn't pull it off technically with that one. It's, I recognized, um, that. I wasn't, I wasn't going to be able to fully invest in it and I knew it wasn't going to be my best work and I didn't feel right about charging them the the price point for something that I felt like I would just deliver for the sake of delivering.
00:17:23
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Okay. Okay.
00:17:30
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Got it. Got it.
00:17:31
E what indabutt
You know, um, no, cause then then it's not, cause then nobody, nobody wins in that, you know, no.
00:17:31
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Okay.
00:17:32
Mary
Would you ever consider like a lower price point and just like getting it done?
00:17:32
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right.
00:17:36
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That's not Eric style. That's yeah, that's not Eric style.
00:17:40
Mary
Yeah.
00:17:42
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right, Eric, that's a great answer. Wow, that's great. Mary, what stresses you out about the shop?
00:17:49
Mary
Um, also first i off, I'd like to say Eric said the word I pulled out so many times and
00:17:57
E what indabutt
You are a child and I don't wanna hear a single fucking person chastise me for the use of open the kimono after she's out here going pull out, pull out, pull out.
00:18:08
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah Oh my god, Mary, you did not just say that! ah You know we don't edit this show, right?
00:18:16
Mary
It was the first thing I heard.
00:18:16
E what indabutt
how How are those running gummies hitting, buddy?
00:18:23
Mary
Oh please, we've said so much worse. Erika said so much worse.
00:18:25
E what indabutt
we We have. Wow. All right. so So I mean, I wasn't going to throw myself under the bus, but anyway, I can't, I can't wait for us trying to force Mary to listen back to this episode because that will stress her out.
00:18:32
Mary
Anyway, um, okay, let's dress this thing up.
00:18:36
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Anyway! where
00:18:45
E what indabutt
This is going to be great.
00:18:45
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yes.
00:18:46
E what indabutt
And then we remind her that she made dick jokes.
00:18:46
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah.
00:18:46
Mary
Oh man.
00:18:48
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Carry on.
00:18:49
E what indabutt
Carry on.
00:18:51
Mary
um So what stresses me out is that I am a really impatient person. I don't like things being done slowly. I want things done as quickly as possible. So when I see that something is taking me a really long time to build, for example, a bookcase I'm doing, it's taken like three months where because I just literally have not had the time. But that stresses me out so much because I like working fast. I like getting things done and like moving on to the next project.
00:19:18
Mary
Um, that I think has been one of the most stressful things. Uh, as I mentioned before, like not having.
00:19:25
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
question Question, is the fact that you like moving fast and getting to the next thing, getting to the next thing, does that inherently imply you have more of a focus on the achievement of the final product as opposed to a daily enjoyment of the process?
00:19:26
Mary
Yeah.
00:19:41
Mary
Yes. A hundred percent.
00:19:42
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
a
00:19:44
E what indabutt
She's like, yes, I am a sociopath.
00:19:44
Mary
That is something I am well aware of.
00:19:46
E what indabutt
Next question.
00:19:47
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Okay. Cause, cause I feel like, yeah, I resonate with what you're saying, but once I was able to recast my brain into just like, I love being here.
00:19:59
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I love every minute of this. I didn't even, I don't even think about the final product. All I think about is like what today holds for me and I take it slow and I enjoy like the moments in the shop or I tried to.
00:20:12
Mary
the process.
00:20:13
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah.
00:20:15
Mary
Yeah.
00:20:15
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
but But that's not how you're wired, it seems. like you're you're more you ah You drive more enjoyment from the finished product, which which is fine, which is totally fine.
00:20:22
Mary
I think so. Yeah, that's always been the case for me.
00:20:25
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
OK, I mean, different strokes for different folks.
00:20:28
Mary
Yeah, and it's I mean, there are some times where I do enjoy Yeah, I there are times where I enjoy the process. It's just when it becomes so stretched out for me, I get super impatient with myself.
00:20:39
E what indabutt
Question. Do you find yourself from time to time and self critique and critique of past works aside, do you find yourself from time to time reflecting on the pieces that you've made or looking around your house at some of the objects that you've made in that house?
00:20:58
E what indabutt
And find comfort in their existence. Do you feel, whether or not you think they're good pieces, that's, that's a different question, but do you feel a sense of like when you say the thing that. Brings you stress relief is the accomplishment. Do you feel that same sense of relief when you reflect on past accomplishments?
00:21:24
Mary
Yes, I think so. Like, when I look around my house and I see all the pieces I've made, it does make me it. Yeah, it does make me happy to see them because I'm proud that I did it.
00:21:36
Mary
I mean, I might think that there's different decisions I could have made, etc. But that like, yeah, that's a different thing.
00:21:41
E what indabutt
Sure, sure, but that's a different that's a different conversation.
00:21:45
Mary
But yes, I think so. um Yeah.
00:21:47
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Mary, when you look at Hobbit Door, what do you think?
00:21:48
Mary
Why do you ask?
00:21:50
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Mary, when you look at Hobbit Door, when you look at Hobbit Door, what do you think to yourself?
00:21:51
Mary
Sorry.
00:21:58
Mary
Uh, what do I think to myself? It brings me joy.
00:22:02
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Good, yeah, that's awesome, great.
00:22:04
E what indabutt
Well, so that like, that's why I'm at it. So I, I, there have been a couple of times in, um, very topsy turvy, turbulent moments, uh, where.
00:22:17
E what indabutt
I think the reason I'm drawn to furniture, or I know at least part of the reason I'm drawn to furniture is the tangible reality of the thing. And like, it's here. It's like, I made the thing. It can't just disappear into the ether. It can't be taken away. Like this thing exists. And there is a, like, there's an anchoring in that knowledge that like at some moments in years past where it's like,
00:22:46
E what indabutt
the I'm lost in the anxiety and the confusion of like shit is upside down right now. And then I look around and I'm like, oh, there's there's tangible proof of the things that I've accomplished. And there is there is a paper trail of what I've been doing with the last 15 years that um Shows number one, I've done anything with the last 15 years and two, that there has been a pattern of growth. So I guess what I'm asking is like, when you have those moments and like the thing is done and you feel that stress relief, does that stress relief, like does kind of the sanctity of the object matter or is it just the moment of getting it done? And then after that, the object has no value.
00:23:34
Mary
Yeah, I don't think so for me. I think it maintains its value in my mind. um It's obviously easier when it's like in your own house and you're seeing it as opposed to so and like you see it every day and you interact with it and actually use it as opposed to like something something mean that you send off to a client.
00:23:49
Mary
I mean, I'm still proud of that too.
00:23:50
E what indabutt
Sure.
00:23:51
Mary
But yeah, I mean, I would agree with that 100%.
00:23:56
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That's a good question, Eric, about like, is it more like in the moment? Or is it like a constantly renewing joy that you know, for the rest of your life as you use it and see it?
00:24:06
E what indabutt
Yeah. Yeah.
Impact of Stress on Health and Sleep
00:24:09
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah For me, the stress in the shop comes from um when I get a backlog of promises.
00:24:19
E what indabutt
Mmm.
00:24:19
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
i You know, I have commission after commission after commission after commission, and it starts piling up.
00:24:25
E what indabutt
Mm-hmm.
00:24:25
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And what started as a hobby, what started as a hobby was, was you gotta to pull out.
00:24:26
Mary
Hmm, you don't pull out.
00:24:31
E what indabutt
You son of a bitch.
00:24:33
Mary
so
00:24:34
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
What started as a hobby to bring me joy is now like, There's a wedding present followed by a graduation present followed by another wedding present.
00:24:41
E what indabutt
ye Yep, ye yep, yep.
00:24:43
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And if these don't come through, someone's life, it will be meaningfully impacted. How do you tell someone, I don't have your wedding present ready?
00:24:51
E what indabutt
Yeah. Yeah.
00:24:54
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Like what? Like the kind that kind of pressure is like, Oh my God. Right. And Eric, to your point, I don't even know what some of the designs look like for these.
00:25:04
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Cause we haven't flushed it out yet.
00:25:06
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:25:06
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
It's in the moment. So when I see these things kind of building and building and building, and I start to get really stressed out and then on top of it, if the shop is a disaster, which it usually is on top of that.
00:25:19
E what indabutt
ah can't I can't attest to that.
00:25:22
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I'm just like, I go in there and I look around and I'm like, oh my goodness. Like, where do I even start?
00:25:27
E what indabutt
Yeah. Yeah.
00:25:30
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
What, like, what do I even work on first? My mind is like a blur of like things I have to get done. That's very stressful. And so yeah, for me, it's, it's usually a backlog of of commissions and promises because I know people's lives would be impacted if I don't deliver and I've never not delivered. So, so far so good. It's been 20 years. So I, you know, but still it brings me a ton of stress.
00:25:56
E what indabutt
Have you ever been disappointed with a piece that you made because the deadline was just so, and it was, it was good enough, but it, you wish you had had more time.
00:26:13
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
No, I know that's a weird.
00:26:14
E what indabutt
Really?
00:26:15
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I know it's a weird answer. No, I've always ponied up the effort even if it meant long nights to make Yeah, no.
00:26:20
E what indabutt
Oh, sure. Sure. Sure. Yeah. That's ah that, that wasn't, that wasn't me questioning yeah your, your work ethic, but that was like.
00:26:25
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
No, no, I it's a great question. No, no, no. It's a great question.
00:26:31
E what indabutt
The, the, I, for me, and I think similarly for you, uh, part of the, the stress of that backlog is we know in the way that we work, uh, a thing could take a month or it could take three months because the, the getting it right is more important than the getting it out the door.
00:26:47
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah.
00:26:52
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Right.
00:26:52
E what indabutt
And so when you have six, seven, eight commissions in a backlog, you're like, holy shit, I don't know if this is a year of work or if it's four years.
00:26:56
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah.
00:26:59
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So Eric, good point. So you know what I do? I think with commission work, I very much scope out the design with the client at the time, so that when it comes time to make it, I'm not out a drift drift at sea, like wondering, Oh, what the fuck do I do?
00:27:13
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:27:15
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I leave those really speculative, crazy projects for myself. I don't promise those to customers on timelines.
00:27:22
Mary
So you know that they'll like it at the end.
00:27:24
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Right, with myself, I'm like, who the hell knows how long this will take. The skull cabinet, which I just finished after a year and a half, and I decided not to sell.
00:27:31
E what indabutt
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:27:33
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I couldn't even sell it. I love it so much. It's in my dining room.
00:27:35
E what indabutt
yeah yeah
00:27:36
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I can't sell it, which is rare. i I normally never care about selling anything. I was like, oh, whatever, it's fine. I was ah thinking, like I can't sell this.
00:27:48
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
i never like I don't want to never see this cabinet again. I'm just, i fuck it. I'm keeping it. All right. It's that simple. Yeah.
00:27:55
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
It was like that.
00:27:55
E what indabutt
If you, by the way, if you don't make a real of like the overall building of that piece and it's and it's not set to like some strong 2000s emo music, like friendship over.
00:28:00
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I should, I should, I should.
00:28:09
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I know I have to, I have to do that.
00:28:10
E what indabutt
Like welcome to the Black Parade as you're laying that that Atlanta.
00:28:11
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I have to do that. Yeah. But but to come back to your question, Eric, I think it's. I've learned not to promise highly uncertain projects to customers anymore.
00:28:22
E what indabutt
That's
00:28:23
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Like when we talk about it, it's like set design.
00:28:26
Mary
do set Do you set a like a time minimum or maximum minimum for how long they have to request it?
00:28:34
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
No, I just if if it's too if no, if it's too close, I just tell them sorry, I can't do it in that time.
00:28:41
Mary
Okay.
00:28:41
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And then if it's re if it's reasonable, I'll take it. I guess there's one exception.
00:28:45
E what indabutt
Hmm.
00:28:46
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Recently, a good friend of mine from college ah requested a box for his lady ah friend. And it's pretty speculative. I don't exactly know what's going on.
00:28:56
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
But he's also an artist. He was a professional musician for 20 years playing bass and jazz groups. So he understands the creative process deeply. And he's like, look, I don't care about timelines, I just want it to be right.
00:29:08
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So with him, I could be like, okay, you know, I'll take it.
00:29:11
E what indabutt
Yeah, yeah.
00:29:12
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I don't know what this is gonna look like. And we've been going back and forth with drawings for weeks and weeks, like on and off.
00:29:18
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:29:19
Mary
Mm-hmm.
00:29:19
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And I know he's okay with that because he's a fellow artist.
00:29:22
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:29:22
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So with a fellow artist, I could i could leave it more uncertain.
00:29:26
Mary
It's also not like a day-oriented thing, like a wedding or a birthday or anniversary.
00:29:30
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Correct, right. And he was, he was, he's like, I want it right. I don't want it on the timeline. And I was like, wow, you know, but that's something an artist says, you know?
00:29:36
E what indabutt
That's big. that's That's a great client.
00:29:37
Mary
That's a...
00:29:37
E what indabutt
Yeah, it's a great client.
00:29:38
Mary
It's a double-edged sword, though.
00:29:39
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah, that's good.
00:29:41
Mary
I feel like it could get too in the weeds sometimes.
00:29:43
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Well, it could, but I'm more practical than that.
00:29:46
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:29:48
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah. All right, so now that we talked about what stresses us out um briefly, because we have to get to what to do about it, I think that's what everyone cares about. What effects does this stress have on you?
00:30:00
E what indabutt
Uh, when I, I know that I'm hyper stressed when I wake up in the middle of the night on a regular basis, like when I don't sleep.
00:30:12
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oof.
00:30:14
E what indabutt
And it's sometimes it's like, I can't shut it off and I can't fall asleep, but more often what happens is like, I'll get to that point, like Mary was talking about earlier of physical exhaustion and I pass out and then I'll wake up three, four hours later. And I know like, there's just that sense, like, as soon as I opened my eyes, I'm like, there's no, there's no more sleep in me tonight.
00:30:36
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, really?
00:30:36
E what indabutt
And like, yeah, like there'll, there'll be times we're all like, go to the shop at four o'clock in the morning because it's just like, uh, I know that I'm not going to sleep anymore. So I might as well go.
00:30:47
E what indabutt
There's no, there's no use in me sitting in bed, avoiding the stress. So I might as well go confront it.
00:30:53
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Wow, Eric, that's hardcore.
00:30:54
E what indabutt
You know?
00:30:55
Mary
Hmm.
00:30:56
E what indabutt
I mean, you know, this there's worse ways I could spend my stressed out hours in the middle of the night.
00:31:03
Mary
What?
00:31:05
E what indabutt
Sorry, Mary.
00:31:07
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ha What?
00:31:12
Mary
Oh, God. Okay.
00:31:13
E what indabutt
We'll leave that one over for interpretation.
00:31:18
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
What?
00:31:20
Mary
Oh, man.
00:31:20
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
What?
00:31:22
E what indabutt
So what do you guys do?
00:31:22
Mary
Okay.
00:31:25
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I'm so reeling from that joke. Mary, do you want to go next or should I go?
00:31:30
Mary
Um, you go.
00:31:33
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Okay. All right, what does stress do to me? Well, ah yeah, I get stomach aches.
00:31:43
E what indabutt
the
00:31:43
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
There's a very specific stomach ache I get. It's not like a general stomach ache. It gets like a very particular spot along the top, and it's a stress-related stomach ache, and I know it because it's got a unique location.
00:31:57
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
It starts with the stomach ache. um I don't feel joy. I don't feel gratitude and appreciation. It all evaporates all that like good stuff I feel most every day just to be alive and and living this wonderful life i have like it all evaporates i don't sleep well i wake up at three in the morning usually and i'm up till about 430 and i'm playing on my phone because i will go back to sleep eventually but i'm like up in the middle of the night and also as i'm going to bed my mind is racing with stupid thoughts like it totally stupid thoughts like not realistic
00:32:29
E what indabutt
Mm.
00:32:34
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
like fear thoughts as I go to bed, and it's racing, which is not normal for me, I hardly ever do that.
00:32:36
E what indabutt
Yep.
00:32:42
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
um And then when if I get in the shop, I just have this feeling of, of like overwhelming Like, what do, oh God, where do I even start? And I put my head in my hands and I, ugh, you know? So yeah, it's it's like a little bit of sleep, a little bit of physical ah symptoms, like stomach ache for me. Mary.
00:33:08
Mary
I have a hard time focusing because the stress is paralyzing for me, so i I'm like constantly distracted by things really easily.
00:33:13
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Hmm.
00:33:19
Mary
i If I see something on my phone, like I'll automatically start look like go look at it, and like notifications come in.
00:33:25
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I do that too.
00:33:26
Mary
I am constantly looking at it, and I can't bring myself to focus on the task at hand.
00:33:28
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That's good.
00:33:31
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That's good.
00:33:32
Mary
that's yeah It just becomes so paralyzing for me because I'm so stressed out.
00:33:37
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Mary the the checking your phone. I noticed I do that I checked my phone and 15 minutes evaporates and I didn't even realize I checked my phone or I stress eat I like I'm looking in the refrigerator and I'm not even hungry.
00:33:40
Mary
Yep.
00:33:44
E what indabutt
Mm-hmm.
00:33:45
Mary
Yeah.
00:33:47
E what indabutt
Oh, this is so.
00:33:48
Mary
Yeah, I'll do that too.
00:33:50
E what indabutt
ah So I've been known to stress eat, too. And when we were filming the show, ah there was I was at the tail end of ah a bad relationship at that moment. And there was there was a joke in the house.
00:34:01
E what indabutt
We all lived together where um they they knew that if I was eating carrot cake, that like they needed to check on me emotionally.
00:34:08
Mary
Oh no! Carrot cake?
00:34:12
E what indabutt
age it It was it it just happened to be available in the neighborhood that we were living in.
00:34:12
Mary
Interesting.
00:34:16
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Eric, next time you visit, I'm going to have a carrot cake for you.
00:34:17
Mary
yeah
00:34:18
E what indabutt
And so I just feel like I just feel like sad eating carrot cake at the on the kitchen counter.
00:34:26
Mary
about this yesterday, or a friend of mine, about how, you know how there's the oyster place near us.
00:34:31
E what indabutt
Yeah, yeah.
00:34:31
Mary
Whenever I have a particularly stressful day, I just go get a bunch of oysters and sadly eat them in my kitchen.
00:34:36
E what indabutt
Yep. Yeah.
00:34:38
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah um our
00:34:38
Mary
So they've become my like go-to.
00:34:41
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Aren't those aphrodisiacs, Mario?
00:34:44
Mary
Mmm, maybe that's why.
00:34:50
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right. Oysterfest. All right. So with with that, we talked about the effects of this dress. And now, what are you going to fucking
Strategies for Stress Management
00:35:01
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
do about it? So we thought we rather than just you know going through a boring list, ah we would go around Robin.
00:35:08
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
and we would hold each other accountable like you name what you do to help your stress and the two of the other people are going to be like yeah I do that or oh man I really should do that let's let's have some accountability here all right who would like to go first what do you do to handle the stress yeah like what are your solutions for stress
00:35:24
Mary
Okay.
00:35:28
E what indabutt
ah
00:35:28
Mary
Wait, sorry, what was the question? Like what what we what we do?
00:35:33
E what indabutt
remember Remember when Mary was just like, when I'm stressed, I avoid, I can't focus.
00:35:33
Mary
Okay.
00:35:38
E what indabutt
Sorry, what were we talking about?
00:35:38
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
did Did that just happened?
00:35:38
Mary
What? Me stressed?
00:35:41
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Eric, did that just happen?
00:35:42
E what indabutt
I think she's out here checking her emails. So ah so ah i I try to be mindful to exercise most days.
00:35:52
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Exercise.
00:35:53
E what indabutt
Yeah. Like either go for a walk.
00:35:54
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Okay.
00:35:56
E what indabutt
I go to the gym usually four times a week, uh, go for a hike, like whatever the thing is to like, not only get outside of like my house in the shop, but also make my body move, raise my heart rate, et cetera, et cetera.
00:36:12
E what indabutt
Something that, that requires physical exertion.
00:36:13
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Alright, exercise. Eric, how many times how many days a week do you exercise?
00:36:18
E what indabutt
Um, and depending on what you qualify as exercise, I mean, five to six.
00:36:24
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Good boy. Mary, do you exercise?
00:36:28
Mary
Yeah, I exercise most almost every day. Well, I give myself one rest day a week.
00:36:35
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Okay, Eric, you're going to the gym and or walks and stuff and Mary, you're running.
00:36:39
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:36:40
Mary
I run and I ah train strength train.
00:36:44
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Wow, good for you.
00:36:45
E what indabutt
See that in that, in that booty fitness camp.
00:36:45
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Boy, you guys are better than me. um Moody. um I exercise, but it's more like two days a week because it's it's it's beach volleyball and so like you gotta have a group of people together in a net and all that shit.
00:36:56
E what indabutt
Mmm.
00:36:59
E what indabutt
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:37:00
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah But when I do, it's like two, three hours at a time.
00:37:02
E what indabutt
Hell yeah.
00:37:03
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
you know Sometimes three days a week. um Otherwise, I'm in the shop. um Yeah, enough, enough, but it definitely helps.
00:37:11
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:37:11
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah Eric, that was your answer. Mary, so exercise. Mary, what's your next answer? Go ahead.
00:37:17
Mary
I clean.
00:37:20
E what indabutt
Mmm.
00:37:20
Mary
I think that it helps me feel like a sense of accomplishment.
00:37:21
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, before we came on, my wife was like mentioned cleanliness because like she loves everything being clean.
00:37:22
E what indabutt
Mm-hmm.
00:37:23
Mary
And i know I know for a fact, this is the case for a lot of people, especially in the shop too.
00:37:26
E what indabutt
Mm-hmm.
00:37:28
Mary
Like the shopping gets so dusty and dirty.
00:37:28
E what indabutt
Mm-hmm.
00:37:31
Mary
And like when you see it clean and sparkly, you're just like, oh, it feels so good.
00:37:41
E what indabutt
Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
00:37:45
Mary
Yes.
00:37:46
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
and I'm not a clean, like I'm not like a sort of clean, it's like, my shop, my shop gets pretty messy sometimes.
00:37:59
E what indabutt
It's pretty, it's pretty wild in there.
00:37:59
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Let's put it that way.
00:38:00
E what indabutt
It's pretty wild in there.
00:38:01
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah ah But, and then I reach a breaking point. I'm like, this is causing me stress. And then I clean it and then it's clean for a few months.
00:38:07
E what indabutt
Sure.
00:38:07
Mary
who
00:38:08
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:38:10
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So I have a, I have a complicated relationship with a clean shop, but there's something to that.
00:38:13
E what indabutt
You got a cycle. Yeah.
00:38:14
Mary
Everyone has different thresholds of like the amount of messiness they can handle.
00:38:14
E what indabutt
Yeah. Yeah.
00:38:17
E what indabutt
yeah yeah
00:38:19
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yes, mine is low and my wife's is high. So you can imagine that that we never fight about that. Eric, how's your cleanliness?
00:38:29
E what indabutt
uh my house is usually pretty clean um i keep it pretty clean i i think i think this is the the trauma of sharing a room with my brother for the first 15 years of my life uh who is
00:38:40
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Hm.
00:38:43
E what indabutt
one of the dirtiest people I know like like just oh even now his house is like there's just shit everywhere. um And I can't live my life like that.
00:38:51
Mary
Oh my god.
00:38:54
E what indabutt
So my house is pretty clean. and um But my the the shop does get
00:38:57
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
right
00:39:00
E what indabutt
like it will get chaotic messy ah periodically like especially when i'm like knee deep in a thing and i'm just really trying to get a thing done i'll let it get messy that doesn't that doesn't bother me but then there are those times where like first i can't let it remain messy for too long but then
00:39:06
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah got
00:39:19
E what indabutt
Mary, to your point, if I'm feeling stressed and or like I can't focus on a thing and I need to get back in the flow of of being in the shop and doing a thing and accomplishing a thing, usually my go-to is cleaning. I will just take 30 minutes to an hour and just clean shit up. or get like The other day I got back from from Switzerland and ah there was just the detritus of working on this cabinet was everywhere.
00:39:47
E what indabutt
And so I took the afternoon and like made a new cleat for the saws I got and like stored all of the finishes away and moved things around so that I could get back into a head space where the only thing that I had to focus on was the work in front of me.
00:40:01
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Great. That's a great answer.
00:40:02
Mary
It's so hard to like, when you're in your own shop, because when I was in a shared space, I felt bad and I had to clean every single day every time I used it.
00:40:02
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So we have...
00:40:08
E what indabutt
Oh, you gotta keep it clean. Yeah. Yeah.
00:40:12
Mary
But now I'm like, Oh, it's so easy to just like leave it.
00:40:15
E what indabutt
Yep. Yep.
00:40:17
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right, so we have ah exercise and we have cleanliness. All right, so my turn.
00:40:21
E what indabutt
Yeah, Paul.
00:40:22
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
um When I'm stressed, the thing that helps me most is to not think about the entirety of what I have to get done and just pick one fucking thing, shut everything else out and do the one thing.
00:40:29
E what indabutt
Yep. yeah
00:40:37
E what indabutt
Yep.
00:40:38
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
because the more I think about all the hundred things I have to do, the more paralyzed I get and I do nothing.
00:40:41
E what indabutt
Yep.
00:40:44
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
If I just think about one thing, I get that one thing done and I feel so much better. So it's like focus down, pick a thing, get it done. Do you guys do that?
00:40:54
E what indabutt
hundred percent
00:40:54
Mary
Is that thing usually something that's like super easy and achievable?
00:40:57
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah No, no, I actually, I tend to pick the hardest thing first because I know I do not want to leave that for last.
00:40:59
Mary
Hmm.
00:41:01
Mary
Okay.
00:41:04
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So pick one thing and it's usually the most difficult thing.
00:41:07
Mary
Hmm.
00:41:07
E what indabutt
100%. I very much fall into that. Like I absolutely do that. Um, I don't, I don't have a preference for easy or hard thing. Like it's just the next thing. And, um, it's usually like the, the.
00:41:22
E what indabutt
example I'll give is like during the pandemic and everybody was stressed and like that was when the, the road trips began. Um, and the first goal was just get to Denver and it was like, well, how do I get there? I don't know. I'll fucking figure it out. Like I'll go, I'll get as far as I can the first night and then I'll wake up the next morning and figure out how far I can get the next day and like the starting of the thing. And then that, you know, then looping around and going different places and seeing different things. But it's, it's the.
00:41:53
E what indabutt
If I can get to the next place, then the place afterward will reveal itself, you know, and and similarly in woodworking, if I can just, if I can get the fucking thing veneered, then I can figure out what the, what joinery needs to happen after that.
00:41:59
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah. Yep. It's the same.
00:42:06
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yes.
00:42:08
E what indabutt
And sometimes, sometimes that means that you do a thing and you go, I would have been more convenient if I had done this later or earlier, but you can still figure out a solution.
00:42:08
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That's it.
00:42:18
E what indabutt
Cause at least you're then getting something done.
00:42:21
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Got it. Mary. Did you do that?
00:42:25
Mary
Yes, I, yes, to a point, but I go a little more than that because, ah well, um this was gonna be my answer for the next round, but it's fine.
00:42:35
Mary
ah What I like to do is make a list and like have things that I can check off.
00:42:38
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, that's good.
00:42:38
E what indabutt
Mm.
00:42:40
Mary
And for me, that first thing is the first thing I can do so that I can move on to the next thing and the next thing.
00:42:40
E what indabutt
Mm.
00:42:44
Mary
And it just feels good to be able to like check things off.
00:42:47
E what indabutt
That accomplishment, chasing that accomplishment dragon.
00:42:49
Mary
Yes, yes, yes.
00:42:51
E what indabutt
Yep, yep.
00:42:51
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I was talking to my wife about that before as we were having drinks before the show. She's like, I make lists. And she's like, and I put easy shit on the list just to feel a sense of accomplishment.
00:43:00
Mary
yeah
00:43:00
E what indabutt
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:43:01
Mary
list check
00:43:04
E what indabutt
that's That's interesting. So I make lists too. Like I have a ah weekly to-do list and the first thing I do on Monday morning every week is I just write down what I need to accomplish on each day and how I need to get shit done and where my meetings are and everything else so I don't get lost.
00:43:21
E what indabutt
But the reason I do that is not to feel the sense of accomplishment. The reason I do that is because I know the way I work.
00:43:25
Mary
Yeah, make list, check.
00:43:28
E what indabutt
As we were just talking about of like getting to the next step, sometimes you accidentally go down three or four rabbit trails at a time. And then all of a sudden you're going 90 degrees to where you should be going rather than following the path straight.
00:43:35
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Hmm. Hmm. Hmm.
00:43:39
E what indabutt
And so the list actually helps me stay on track rather than, um, helps me gain momentum.
00:43:46
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Great. Okay, so we've heard exercise, um make lists, focus on one thing, and I'm forgetting one.
00:43:57
Mary
Clean?
00:43:59
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Clean.
00:43:59
Mary
Clean.
00:43:59
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Okay, ah Eric, you're up next. What's next?
00:44:03
E what indabutt
ah um Sometimes what I'll do is take, well, well, actually I was going to use a different example, but what I will say, cause it is basically the same thing.
00:44:17
E what indabutt
Um, small projects like do a thing that I enjoy doing set, set it aside for a moment.
00:44:19
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
You do that. You do.
00:44:22
Mary
Make a thing.
00:44:22
E what indabutt
Yeah. Make a thing.
00:44:23
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Make a thing.
00:44:23
E what indabutt
It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter what the thing is.
00:44:24
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah.
00:44:26
E what indabutt
And the thing I was going to say first is, is related to this is like, sometimes I'll just. do a small menial task that's related to like hand tools, right? Like today I went in, I didn't have a lot of time. I know I need to focus on this thing, but my mind is distracted by the the geopolitical goings on of the country at the moment. And ah so I just went in in and sharpened up my tools. so You know, that's all just like a thing to, to set things in order.
00:44:51
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah
00:44:54
E what indabutt
I guess that's kind of related to cleaning, but the, the small projects are really there as kind of a creative release and an ability to feel that sense of accomplishment that that Mary was talking about before.
00:45:07
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right Mary, you and me, do we do small projects to get us back on task?
00:45:13
Mary
um I used to not, but lately I have been because it's just easier. ah That's Eric's influence, I guess, coming off.
00:45:21
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah, i I do it too.
00:45:21
E what indabutt
You're welcome, buddy.
00:45:23
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And I do it in context of my house, like home renovation, Vicki's been asking for something and I haven't gotten around to it, but it'll only take a half hour, 20 minutes, get it done, you know, just get, yeah.
00:45:34
E what indabutt
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:45:35
Mary
Yeah.
00:45:35
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:45:36
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right. um ah Mary had list making.
00:45:37
E what indabutt
Mary.
00:45:41
Mary
Well, I have another one too.
00:45:43
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Okay, go ahead, Mary.
00:45:44
Mary
Uh, okay, I have one that I wish I did more and I know, I say this because I know Eric's gonna be like, bullshit.
00:45:55
E what indabutt
Bullshit.
00:45:55
Mary
But I think it's worth noting for our listeners, uh, is saying no.
00:46:03
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, ah Mary.
00:46:03
E what indabutt
ah
00:46:06
Mary
ah Eric just cackled so hard.
00:46:07
E what indabutt
Mary, Mary, you say no in that you're a naysayer.
00:46:09
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That's good.
00:46:10
E what indabutt
That's about as as much as you say no, dog.
00:46:14
Mary
I know, I know. I'm well aware of this. But I do think it is important to reducing stress and knowing your boundaries. I have a hard time with it. And I'm not saying that it's easy.
00:46:23
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Well,
00:46:24
Mary
But saying no is really important to producing that.
00:46:29
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:46:29
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Well, Mary, they say every time you say no to something, you're you're you're passively saying yes to something else at the same time.
00:46:32
E what indabutt
An angel gets its wings. That is what they say.
00:46:38
Mary
Okay.
00:46:39
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
You know, when you say no to a request for a commission, you're saying yes to a project you've always wanted to do instead or something else. You know what I mean? And I was like, wow, that's really a powerful way to to conceptualize it.
00:46:48
Mary
Yeah.
00:46:52
Mary
Yeah, I've been at work, they take it. Well, I guess I shouldn't bad enough.
00:46:59
E what indabutt
Nope, too late.
00:46:59
Mary
But there's just a lot of there's a lot of projects.
00:47:00
E what indabutt
Go on now.
00:47:02
Mary
And because I work quickly, often I get asked to do things. And lately, I've just been like, I'm so burned out. Nope, this none of this is happening. no No, no, no, like, I'm passing this off to other people.
00:47:12
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Good for you.
00:47:16
Mary
So, you know, it's a work in progress.
00:47:18
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right, Eric, how's your no?
00:47:19
Mary
Baby steps.
00:47:21
E what indabutt
Oh, I love telling people no.
00:47:25
Mary
Yeah, he literally, he literally just told us how I pulled out of commissions.
00:47:26
E what indabutt
I don't give a fuck. i don't
00:47:29
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
oh Oh, no, no, no. no
00:47:31
E what indabutt
i No, i I am very aware that the act of making things is a thing that I fell in love with and I want to honor that and and continue to be in love with it.
00:47:42
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
yeah
00:47:47
E what indabutt
And um there are lots of times people will ask me to do a thing and I'm like,
00:47:54
E what indabutt
for lack of a better way to say it in this moment. It just has zero interest for me and I'm not gonna waste my time doing that. There's no engagement in the thing, so no, I'm not.
00:48:06
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah Yep, I say it too. I say no to a lot of commission requests.
00:48:09
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:48:12
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And um I'm not as big of a dick as Eric to be like, this has no interest for me.
00:48:16
E what indabutt
ah yeah sit Listen, on air maybe, but off air.
00:48:16
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
But I'm just kidding. But what I'll say is like, I don't think I'm the best person to do this project for you right now. And if I think of someone, I'll let you know.
00:48:30
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
they they Yeah, they appreciate that. um Okay, so Mary says, say no more. ah my next My next is try to practice gratitude and appreciation.
Mindfulness and Personal Satisfaction
00:48:43
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And this is a daily thing because it's not easy.
00:48:43
E what indabutt
Mm.
00:48:48
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
It doesn't just happen. You don't just wake up and just feel this overwhelming sense of gratitude in your chest, right? It's like, I have to take a moment every day and think about like look around me. right i I see the beautiful colored leaves and I see the sunlight and I i realize my body is like great. like I don't have any aches or pains and I can go into the shop and I have all these friends and this family. and like I just try to take a moment to recenter myself, forget the stress, forget all the deadlines and all these details.
00:49:23
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
fuck all that fuck all right just like clear put it's like you take a desk and just sweep everything off it right and you're just like oh what a beautiful life this is I don't know how many more years I have
00:49:28
E what indabutt
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:49:37
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
um I'm about 50, so I got like 30 left?
00:49:43
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:49:43
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
30, 35, right? And so like it do I want to spend those remaining years stressed out? No, I want appreciation, I want gratitude, I want to feel
00:49:50
E what indabutt
yeah
00:49:54
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I want to feel that like good warm feeling in my stomach about my life and my choices so I try to practice gratitude every day and if I'm not feeling it I try to take a time out with no phone and just like sit on the porch and just like get my headspace right and that helps the rest of the day.
00:50:12
E what indabutt
Yeah. Put, putting the fucking phone away is big, man. Like that's really, really important. Um, I, so I think some of us, I feel like many of the folks listening could probably relate to this is like, I don't verbalize to myself inwardly about moments of gratitude or joy, right? Like they exist certainly, but they are, they're more moments that like,
00:50:43
E what indabutt
I don't often clock them as like, this is a moment to reflect with gratitude. It's just like I'm sitting on my porch. and the sun is shining, it's November and it's 70 degrees. And you can either be like, holy shit, the world is burning. Or you can just take three minutes out of the, yeah you've got the 23 and change other hours of the day to worry about the world burning. You can just sit there for three minutes and think, it's fucking, it's 70 degrees. Like I can sit on my porch and drink a cup of coffee and appreciate the sunshine. um And this was gonna be my next point, but the, the
00:51:19
E what indabutt
The way that I think that I often do that is through practicing silence rather than practicing gratitude necessarily. Cause like the putting the phone away, like getting actual earbuds or headphones that don't have Bluetooth or any other connectivity in them and just like putting them in and focusing on my work for a couple hours.
00:51:41
E what indabutt
and allows me to be present that sets aside all of the other stressors because it's not it's not right that like the phone isn't dinging every 30 fucking seconds with a new text message or you're not listening to a podcast about how the world is in shambles you know like it's just you and the work and the doing of the thing and the thing that presumably you started doing because you loved it
00:51:51
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Mm-hmm.
00:52:02
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Hmm. Hmm.
00:52:06
Mary
Yeah, I definitely do that. I right before this, actually, I realized I had been one listen to audiobook while driving, listen to audiobook and music while running, listening to something and there's just always something going on in the background that and it's something that I've gotten used to, too. Like even at night, I like having a background show on. And then I was like, I have had something in my ears this whole day.
00:52:30
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah, Mary, that's exhausting.
00:52:30
Mary
So then I just sat down and did laundry in silence because I am like, my first instinct was to go to my phone.
00:52:33
E what indabutt
Yep.
00:52:36
Mary
Like, what can I put on while I'm folding laundry?
00:52:36
E what indabutt
Mm-hmm.
00:52:38
Mary
But I was like, no, I've literally been listening for so long. that Like, I need to just do this in silence.
00:52:41
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:52:43
E what indabutt
Yep.
00:52:44
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Mary, there's something to that, right? It gives your brain a a chance to just rest.
00:52:49
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:52:49
Mary
Yeah, yeah, it's exhausting.
00:52:50
E what indabutt
Yeah. It's like a different form of rest. Yeah. Right.
00:52:53
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah, it's like we're exhausting ourselves by like a million little heroin squirts a day of like some kind of dopamine.
00:52:58
Mary
Yeah, exactly.
00:53:00
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And it's so exhausting that you can't recover your dopamine levels because you never have silence.
00:53:03
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:53:06
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
You never have a minute of downtime.
00:53:07
E what indabutt
Yeah. And, and I do also want to say for anybody listening who feels maybe be overwhelmed at the idea of practicing silence right now, um, you don't, you like, you don't have to do an hour of silence off the jump. Like often what I'll do when I feel myself in that moment of like, I'm overstimulated because I've done nothing but listen to music and podcasts for the last 27 hours.
00:53:30
E what indabutt
Like, I just be like, all right, I'll set a timer for seven minutes, 10 minutes, 15 minutes.
00:53:36
Mary
Mm hmm.
00:53:37
E what indabutt
And like, that's it. And I put my phone in a different room and when it goes off, like, then that's fine. Then I can choose to.
00:53:44
Mary
Or like do an activity, like when I was folding laundry, when I'm done, then I'm like, that's it.
00:53:46
E what indabutt
Yeah. Like whatever it is, it right. Well, yeah, I don't often go sit and meditate, but like, whatever the thing is, I'm washing dishes and silence, you know, going for a walk, like walk seven blocks down and back without your phone and just sit there with your thoughts.
00:53:54
Mary
Yeah.
00:54:04
E what indabutt
You know, that those, those moments don't take a long time.
00:54:04
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I love it. i
00:54:07
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
You guys are speaking my language. I love this shit. I love all of that. I'm like, let's do it right now. Let's stop the show and I'm going to go for a walk in the dark.
00:54:16
E what indabutt
Turn off this fucking podcast.
00:54:18
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Are there any more major answers you'd like to mention?
00:54:26
E what indabutt
Hand tool work always. seems to reset me and remind me of the thing that I initially fell in love with. And so while like it does come up in my regular work often, um but there are times when um if i if I need to to feel re-inspired or at least get back in the flow ah of a thing,
00:54:52
E what indabutt
Often my go-to is hand tool work. Cause there's just something about it that draws me in.
00:54:56
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yes.
00:54:57
E what indabutt
It doesn't, that doesn't have to be your thing, but there's something about it that it is my thing.
00:54:59
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
It's so visceral. Yeah.
00:55:01
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:55:02
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
It's like you in nature, like you do taking just like in your own hands, you're taking this piece of metal or wood, and you're you're you're shaping a piece of nature, right?
00:55:15
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Like one tiny shaving at a time.
00:55:15
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:55:17
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
It just seems so visceral, all of it. Like with your strength, you're using your arms. you're not It's not like pushing it through a machine, per se, and the loud and all the metal.
00:55:24
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:55:26
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
of your you It's just so quiet and and really calming. i totally i I totally get that answer.
00:55:31
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:55:35
Mary
Yeah, one last answer for me is as much as it is, I'm an introvert and it stresses me out, but socializing,
Social Interactions and New Segment Introduction
00:55:43
Mary
it gets you in a different mind space.
00:55:43
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, that was Mary.
00:55:44
E what indabutt
yes
00:55:45
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I was going to say that talking to my friends. Yes, go ahead.
00:55:49
Mary
Yeah, it I mean, it's gotta, it gets you into different mindset and it distracts you from your stress. So when you come back to it, it feels like it's something more achievable that you can tackle. So yeah, I think that's, that's essential.
00:56:04
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So I know many of the listeners like were like, oh, you know the podcast, we have a podcast, right? We we chose to do this podcast. Well, like we chose to do this podcast because the three of us love talking about this shit.
00:56:20
E what indabutt
Yep.
00:56:20
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And we thought, if we're gonna be talking about it, why not record it?
00:56:25
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:56:25
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And I always feel fabulous after I talk to the two of you.
00:56:30
E what indabutt
Yeah, same.
00:56:30
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
It's great. I just feel connected. I feel I don't know. It's just wonderful. And that's exactly what Mary is describing. And by the way, like this podcast, the the point wasn't to have a podcast. That was never our intention. the The intention was to talk about the things that we enjoy talking about design and all these issues we've you know ferret it into topics but we thought if we're going to be doing it anyway if we're gonna be talking about this why not record it and release it so that's how this podcast came to be for those of you who may not know and that speaks to Mary's point it's true we how that be how can that be
00:57:03
Mary
There's usually a lot more inappropriate jokes though.
00:57:06
E what indabutt
Yeah. and And surprisingly more profanity. I don't know. Sometimes I don't know.
00:57:14
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
um I have two more, ah eat better and sleep, try to sleep routinely. Like if I'm only getting six hours a night, no bueno. I could do it for one night in a row, but two or three nights in a row of six hours and I start to feel uninspired.
00:57:31
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
If it's seven or eight hours, magically I just feel like a different person.
00:57:31
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:57:35
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So of course eating and sleeping, right?
00:57:38
E what indabutt
Yeah, for sure.
00:57:38
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah.
00:57:40
E what indabutt
like like The emotional pint of ice cream every now and again is a good thing, but if yeah if you do that two, three weeks in a row, it's gonna take us toll, you know?
00:57:49
Mary
Do you guys have specific meals that you cook whenever you're stress specific?
00:57:49
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right.
00:57:52
E what indabutt
Oh, yeah.
00:57:53
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, go ahead, Mary.
00:57:53
E what indabutt
Oh, 100%.
00:57:54
Mary
Like there's one thing that I always, that I always cook. It's a Taiwanese beef meal soup. If I'm feeling stressed, like I know it tastes good and I know I love it.
00:58:04
Mary
And it's just, I don't know.
00:58:06
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Mary, Mary, can you describe
00:58:06
Mary
It's also very much what my mom. It's good.
00:58:10
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Sorry, your your mom used to make so like reminds you of like, yeah, sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you.
00:58:11
E what indabutt
Beef, beef noodle.
00:58:12
Mary
My mom make it. Yeah. Yeah. It's an nostalgia.
00:58:15
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Tell me, can you describe this Taiwanese beef noodle soup in detail? Because that sounds amazing.
00:58:21
Mary
Yeah, actually, Eric, have you had it? I think I made it for you once.
00:58:23
E what indabutt
I have had it. Yeah. It's fucking delicious.
00:58:25
Mary
Yeah, ah basically, you just ah make a broth, like a really, really beefy broth from letting beef soak in it with a lot of like aromatics, ginger, spices, a lot of, you know, stuff like that.
00:58:33
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
my god
00:58:37
Mary
And then the broth becomes the soup that you then cook the noodles in. It's just very savory. It's extremely savory. It's so good, especially in the winter.
00:58:45
E what indabutt
had a little, little kick to it too.
00:58:45
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I'm dying right now.
00:58:46
E what indabutt
It was fucking delicious.
00:58:48
Mary
Yes, the the key to any stew or soup is putting in sweetness.
00:58:48
E what indabutt
Yeah.
00:58:54
Mary
So apples, fruit, anything like that, just a little bit makes it so much better.
00:59:00
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Wow, I love that.
00:59:03
E what indabutt
Beef.
00:59:04
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah Go ahead.
00:59:04
E what indabutt
There's I'm really trying hard not to make a dick joke about beef noodle, but carry on.
00:59:09
Mary
Oh my God.
00:59:11
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Before Eric makes this conversation turn and entirely in the wrong direction. um ah Yeah, I've make like lasagna or chicken noodle soup at home.
00:59:21
Mary
Yeah.
00:59:21
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Those are like the ah feel good foods.
00:59:23
Mary
Very comforting.
00:59:23
E what indabutt
Yeah, my, my go tos are the classic Italians, you know, I grew up, my, my brother's family was all off the boat from Naples and it's just, you know, I'll make a, uh, Oh, I listen, I don't mean to brag about my Italian cooking, but it's pretty fucking good.
00:59:27
Mary
Oh, you can make good meatball, right?
00:59:40
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah Why haven't I had it?
00:59:40
E what indabutt
So.
00:59:42
E what indabutt
The next time you come down to Philly, buddy, I'm making some homemade pasta, ah nice, nice red sauce and maybe the baddest meatballs you ever fucking try.
00:59:45
Mary
Why haven't I had it?
00:59:45
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah you will.
00:59:50
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah Let's schedule a date.
00:59:50
E what indabutt
So I got it.
00:59:51
Mary
yeah
00:59:53
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Okay. um With that, let's wrap up our discussion on stress. I think we've talked about a ton of solutions. It's no one size fits all. Obviously different people gravitate towards different solutions.
01:00:05
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah Now let's do another segment. ah We want to keep the positivity rolling. So we named this our next segment. We named it fuck money.
01:00:18
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I did it for the good juju.
01:00:23
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That is our segment.
01:00:23
E what indabutt
Love that energy.
01:00:25
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That is our segment of the day. Fuck money. I did it for the juju.
01:00:27
E what indabutt
It's also a good t-shirt, I'm just saying.
01:00:28
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Um, we have so many good t-shirts, like, like parting the kimono, Aloha wood.
01:00:30
E what indabutt
um So many good... I love how it's a classic.
01:00:36
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Uh, what are some of the other, I swear there were three or four other t-shirts.
01:00:39
E what indabutt
Oh, man. I mean, beef noodle is now one of them.
01:00:41
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Um, ah beef noodle soup.
01:00:43
Mary
No! No! Don't ruin it for me!
01:00:49
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah All right. So what this segment is about, fuck,
01:00:51
Mary
So this means...
01:00:53
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Fuck money, I did it for the juju.
01:00:53
Mary
Yeah, what does this mean?
01:00:54
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah, so oh is Mary asking me to define it, Eric?
01:00:57
E what indabutt
Uh, she absolutely is.
01:00:59
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
She's like, can you define that segment name? um What that means is please tell me something you've done recently that doesn't make financial sense.
01:01:01
E what indabutt
Can you define Juju?
01:01:10
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
it You just did it because it made you feel good or you thought the world needed it and it it doesn't have to make financial sense all the time. We can do things because it makes us feel good and it makes others feel good.
01:01:23
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
So let's talk about.
01:01:23
E what indabutt
Does it, does, does this have to be woodworking related?
01:01:27
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
No.
01:01:27
Mary
No.
01:01:29
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right, I'll go first. I have one right on the tip of my tongue. So every year I get the the feeling around. I don't know why it's always in the same time a year or two around fall.
01:01:41
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I don't know why. Maybe because fall feels so warm and cuddly, you know, in New England.
01:01:46
Mary
It's definitely warm now.
01:01:47
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
um
01:01:48
E what indabutt
of
01:01:49
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
that that is uh i get this feeling like i want to put beautiful wood like natural like this natural resource that we have called wood right and it's so beautiful it's so so beautiful and i have so much amazing you know, resource in my shop.
01:02:07
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
How can I get it in the hands of more people? How can I just like, just because like, if I make these really ornate pieces that cost a lot of money, it's like a particular demographic gets it and only there's only one of them every month or every two months or every year or whatever, you know, however long it takes a piece.
01:02:09
E what indabutt
Mmm.
01:02:24
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
What can I make that is quick turnaround that would get this beautiful, beautiful wood in the hands of more people and make them happy? And it shouldn't cost them a lot of money. So every year i get this this thing in me around fall and i get happen again ah two years ago it was everyday trays i did and then last year it was art nature boards is big serving boards with like an architectural span under it but beautiful veneers and what on top.
01:02:53
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And I donated half the proceeds that year. And then this year is coasters. I decided to try coasters. I don't know why. um And I've been making coasters for the last month. And I have a whole new design with cork inlaid into the bottom.
01:03:09
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
and the most unbelievable figured woods on top and I've been just trying like turning and burning trying to get these out so that I can offer them like I was a low price point what I think for the amount of work involved with a stand with like solid brass rod and matching wood on the stand 50 bucks for four coasters with like you know uh
01:03:22
E what indabutt
Mmm.
01:03:30
Mary
Wow.
01:03:31
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Cork and brass bar and the whole nine yards 50 bucks like here you go and that that's my sort of good juju moment um You know just trying to make it low relatively low price point so like people can enjoy um People can enjoy the beautiful wood
01:03:48
E what indabutt
I love that as an idea of like, I want more people to have beautiful object. This is a thing that I think about with some regularity of like, I need to be able to pay my bills, but I also want people who can't ah afford the high end stuff to have things that are beautiful and worth having in the house. It's an interesting way to approach that. Um, have you ever.
01:04:12
E what indabutt
Out of curiosity, like have you ever considered a sliding scale approach to an object like that?
01:04:19
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I haven't. No. How would that work?
01:04:21
E what indabutt
Well, like say you have like, a so the the reason this is in my head, like Larissa, there's a metal worker in our city that Larissa really admires and has one of their pieces and just bought one from them a couple of weeks ago and um beautiful steel work.
01:04:40
E what indabutt
And they were like the, the necklaces, I think it was a hundred bucks, but you can pay ah between 70 and 120
01:04:43
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Hmm. Oh, hmm.
01:04:47
E what indabutt
And so like, if you can pay 120, then that helps offset the people who can only afford 70.
01:04:53
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, Eric, I love that.
01:04:55
E what indabutt
You know what I mean?
01:04:55
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I love that. And I've, ah I've also thought about giving a few sets away for free. Like, but you can't claim it.
01:05:00
E what indabutt
Sure. Sure. And that helps offset that.
01:05:01
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
You're for yourself. You have to give it away.
01:05:04
E what indabutt
um Oh, interesting.
01:05:04
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
You have to give it to someone. Yeah.
01:05:07
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I thought, I thought a lot, dude, if you have more ideas about like how to spread the good juju around like this, I'm all ears.
01:05:07
E what indabutt
Interesting.
01:05:14
E what indabutt
Hmm. Okay. What's the thought?
01:05:16
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
All right.
01:05:17
E what indabutt
Mary?
01:05:20
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Mary fuck money. I did it for the juju. What do he you got?
01:05:23
Mary
So ah I have been, I've lived in this house for a year and I don't really have much of my artwork up. So I have been investing in artists that I feel really passionate about and finding pieces of theirs that I want to populate my house. So I want to fill my house with artists that I admire and also art pieces from friends as well. So I have a good amount from some friends, um but also I'm just realizing like there's,
01:05:52
Mary
people, there's really cool artists on like Instagram that I keep finding and like, oh, like, normally I just like look at their stuff and admire it and then don't ever think about purchasing it. But lately, I've been like, you know what, I actually want that and I do.
01:06:06
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, good for you, Mary.
01:06:07
Mary
And like, I think that it's worth the investment. So one, I'm supporting them in their trade, but to like, I want to fill my house up with stuff that is really meaningful to me.
01:06:12
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
That's great.
01:06:16
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
I love that answer.
01:06:17
E what indabutt
Yeah. Yeah. That's good. Like supporting people is huge and having objects around you that again, like to what you were saying or or what we were just talking about, like the things that bring you joy that support other artists, like that's what else do you want to spend your fucking money on?
01:06:35
E what indabutt
Like that is the juju, you know?
01:06:35
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah.
01:06:36
Mary
Exactly. Exactly.
01:06:38
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yep. All right, Eric.
01:06:42
E what indabutt
Ah. I feel like I've been very financially responsible lately.
01:06:47
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah
01:06:48
Mary
Oh, someone's bragging.
01:06:49
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah
01:06:49
E what indabutt
ah That's not a brag like I was trying to think of something cool or weird that I've done lately and I feel like I've just been um
01:06:50
Mary
Okay.
01:06:58
Mary
You bought the the smoother.
01:07:01
E what indabutt
i did buy i did buy the smooth I was trying to think of something that wasn't work related. So I did buy an H and&T Gordon smoother because I've wanted one for literally for a decade since I got my Dado plane that's an H&T Gordon as a gift. And ah I was at the Hearn open house and my buddy Leslie Webb who owns ah Heartwood Tools was over there and and she's a retailer of them. So I did buy one for myself and it's fucking amazing and I love it.
01:07:31
E what indabutt
Um, but other than that, like, I dunno, my girlfriend, my, my, I mean, look, my girlfriend lives in Switzerland.
01:07:36
Mary
Don't worry, your friend's with me. I'll make you like go out to like a nice restaurant or something.
01:07:42
E what indabutt
Like I spend enough money flying over there four times a year, but like, you know, there's not a lot of, a lot of leeway for more financially irresponsible decisions.
01:07:46
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
yeah
01:07:53
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Alright, Eric, total swing and a miss.
01:07:57
E what indabutt
yeah
01:08:02
E what indabutt
Wow.
01:08:02
Mary
oh man
01:08:03
E what indabutt
Okay. All right.
01:08:05
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
ah Come on, people love when you but love when you and I bicker like that.
01:08:06
E what indabutt
try People, people, people love when you fuck the segment, Eric.
01:08:13
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
People love what you and I bicker. On that note, we will not shine a light on Eric's lack of answer and go to our patrons. Thank you, ah Juan Gabriel Freire Lopez, Nick Sawyer, who I've had a few conversations with, Profim Dover, Tony and Rick.
01:08:27
Mary
Oh man.
01:08:32
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
for signing up for our Patreon obviously that gives you access to all our yeah it's totally totally and I send like I send messages all the time like thank you really seriously thank you for supporting us it helps we we don't take it for granted um so with that we hope that you enjoyed our show on stress
01:08:35
E what indabutt
Appreciate you guys. Hmm.
01:08:57
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
um
01:08:58
E what indabutt
What?
01:08:59
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Yeah, it's a universal topic. I feel like we explored it in a very vulnerable fashion. of Mary, of course, you're like, stress is my middle name. and um
01:09:09
Mary
I don't know what you guys are talking about. I never have stress. I am perfect.
01:09:14
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And I think we covered a lot of possible solutions. Look, it's not going to be perfect. Even those solutions don't always work. We still backslide sometimes. So don't put too much pressure on yourself to to um be perfect about it, obviously.
01:09:29
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
And with that, we're going to wrap today's show up and we will see you in the after show.
01:09:33
E what indabutt
Or the slide into the after show. All right.
01:09:36
Mary
Oh, we can pull out to the aftershow.
01:09:38
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Oh, my goodness, you didn't say that.
01:09:38
E what indabutt
Wow.
01:09:40
Woodworking is Bullsh*t
Bye.
01:09:41
E what indabutt
You're so inappropriate, Mary.