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The Big American Telco Showdown
78 Plays1 month ago
In this episode, I am joined by Kristin Paulin, Principal Analyst at Omdia, to dive deep into the evolving landscape of the US telecom market—unpacking the assets that define today’s telcos, the structural challenges they face, and the strategic crossroads shaping their future. From infrastructure and spectrum to bundling and digital services, we explore what truly drives value in a shifting ecosystem.
We also examine the tension between strategy and technology: What is more important? A bold strategic vision or technology prowess? And where do emerging trends like 5G, fiber expansion, and FWA services fit into the bigger picture? And what about 6G?
And for those needing a break or an inspiration to turn the laptop off, here is the link to Kristin's own podcast "Kristin's Next Chapter", a journey into books, the world of reading, and emerging authors!
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Transcript
Introduction and Episode Focus
00:00:01
Pablo Tomasi
Welcome back to the Telco Drift, a podcast exploring tech, telecoms and other sci-fi stories. I'm Pablo, your host. And in today's episode, I'm joined by Kristin Paulin, Principal Analyst Omdia.
00:00:12
Pablo Tomasi
Kristin, welcome to the Telco Drift.
00:00:15
Kristin Paulin
Thank you, Pablo. I enjoy watching your podcast on a regular basis, and I'm really pleased to be here today as a guest. Thank
00:00:24
Pablo Tomasi
Okay. Amazing. And, you know, very, very, very good to have you here on the show. And we're going to discuss one of the biggest telecomarkets in the world.
00:00:34
Pablo Tomasi
So we're going to discuss what is happening in the US telecomarket, what different mobile operators are doing. But before we go there can you just provide a quick introduction about yourself, sort of a little bit of your sort of life as an analyst and then anything else that is relevant or interesting for the audience?
00:00:41
Kristin Paulin
you.
00:00:53
Kristin Paulin
Yes, of
Kristin's Role and Market Coverage
00:00:54
Kristin Paulin
course. So as you said, I'm a principal analyst at Omdia. I cover the North America markets, and in my role, I contribute to two different teams.
00:01:02
Pablo Tomasi
Thank you.
00:01:03
Kristin Paulin
We have a service provider markets team where I i contribute to the America's markets. And then I also work on our consumer five g and broadband monetization team.
00:01:14
Kristin Paulin
And my research covers various key developments in North America, focus a little bit on the service providers, strategic initiatives, looking a bit at market dynamics and a little bit of special focus on 5G and fiber.
00:01:31
Pablo Tomasi
And it's in the latter role that you're collaborating with one of the previous guests, Nicole from Australia.
00:01:37
Kristin Paulin
Absolutely. Yes, your your consumer roundup to, I think it was your first episode of the year, sort of kicking off the new year. And yes, she is one of my colleagues now. And we've we've co-written a few reports together in the past year or two.
00:01:54
Pablo Tomasi
Oh, nice. So, you know, like, bye Nicole, if you're watching, you know, she she's going enjoy the shout out.
00:02:00
Kristin Paulin
She'll watch. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
00:02:02
Pablo Tomasi
But anyway, so let's let's get back on the on the actual topic of the of the podcast.
Assets of Major Telecom Operators
00:02:08
Pablo Tomasi
So if you're looking at the three big American telcos because then then we can discuss whether we should say three or or any other number it was before.
00:02:17
Pablo Tomasi
But ah i'm I'm wondering, um what is the greatest asset, you think, that that each of the of the telco has in the market? So to what would you say is the key differentiator maybe that that we can see between the three of them?
00:02:33
Kristin Paulin
Yes. and um I think they can look at it in a few ways. First, if we just talk about their assets as far as bit more physical assets, just to kick it off.
00:02:44
Kristin Paulin
For AT&T, it's definitely their fiber network. They have the largest fiber network in the US. Verizon's certainly catching up now with their recent acquisition of Frontier, but AT&T is still ahead by a couple of million. And their fiber network is...
00:03:02
Kristin Paulin
huge in their mobile strategy as well because they are very focused on convergence. When they move into new fiber areas, their goal is to then pick up the wireless customers and bundle them together. And that's that's really been contributing to their growth in the recent years, especially since they streamlined their focus to 5G and fiber about five years ago now.
00:03:28
Kristin Paulin
And then for T-Mobile and Verizon, i think of it a little bit more in terms of the spectrum that they have. So T-Mobile has a spectrum portfolio that has allowed it to have an early, had an early lead in 5G, a sustained lead in 5G, and it's setting it up for an early introduction into
Market Personas and Strategies
00:03:53
Kristin Paulin
6G.
00:03:53
Kristin Paulin
So when I talk about the spectrum, I mean their mid band, the 2.5 that they acquired in the Sprint acquisition, as well as a nationwide swath of the 600 megahertz low band that they had free and clear to use to implement for 5G earlier than
00:03:54
Pablo Tomasi
Mm-hmm.
00:04:12
Kristin Paulin
earlier than the other peers in the market as far as a nationwide coverage. And then for Verizon, similarly with Spectrum, they won.
00:04:24
Kristin Paulin
They killed it in the C-band auction. They walked away with the largest amount and that has really set them up for both mobile and FWA ambitions. So they have been able to implement a great mid-band coverage and they still haven't finished. They,
00:04:43
Kristin Paulin
were sort of picking and choosing where they needed it in order to um make sure they had a great customer experience in whatever markets were starting to sort of get filled up.
00:04:56
Kristin Paulin
But then if I could expand a little bit beyond the sort of physical assets, I like to think of the three operators as sort of their own personas.
00:05:00
Pablo Tomasi
Mm-hmm.
00:05:09
Kristin Paulin
Nicole McCormick and I, did this in a report and i i think it it's just a perfect example. So we call T-Mobile the built-in VAS leader. They defend their best value position fiercely. Their 5G plans are chock full of VAS.
00:05:32
Kristin Paulin
And then you have Verizon sitting there as a more premium differentiator They have a high and growing postpaid ARPA, and they kind of still see their customers as a bit immune to the higher prices, although that's certainly been changing. and they focus on unbundling the VAS with their more innovative MyPlan, which is an opportunity for them to continually upsell customers who might choose to add on additional perks.
00:06:03
Kristin Paulin
And then AT&T, as I was mentioning with their Fiber, We consider them the convergence leader. They're really not concerned with the VAS, adding on any additional entertainment perks in with their mobile plans.
00:06:10
Pablo Tomasi
See?
00:06:17
Kristin Paulin
Instead, they're very laser focused on their convergence strategy, picking up the wireless customers as they expand into more fiber areas.
00:06:28
Pablo Tomasi
and That's quite interesting because, ah I mean, Fiber is is fascinating in a sense. We have few colleagues that cover Fiber, right? and And I found it like a very difficult topic to be excited about in a sense.
00:06:42
Pablo Tomasi
But it it it does make sense that sort of shows more of the practicality if you want of an offering, right? So you're bundling Fiber and mobile. You may not have particularly exciting value of the services, but at the end of the day, sort of makes rational sense.
00:06:56
Pablo Tomasi
from from you know from your wallet point of view. So I think that's ah that's quite interesting. And then you go all the way, as you mentioned, sort of Verizon somewhere in the middle and then T-Mobile all the way, sort of mobile heavy center with VAS so on.
00:07:11
Pablo Tomasi
And and and we know that Timo has been buying a couple of fiber companies, so maybe they're shifting little bit more in that direction.
00:07:13
Kristin Paulin
Mm-hmm.
00:07:18
Pablo Tomasi
But I think since the US s is such a large country, it was takes takes a lot to cover things. um But if we then... Okay, we've seen the assets, right? And we have these three personas of like what everyone is doing well in terms of getting the revenues, customers' numbers and so on.
00:07:35
Pablo Tomasi
If we need to think about challenges then, where do you see sort of the critical challenge for each one of the of these personas?
Challenges in the Telecom Market
00:07:45
Kristin Paulin
Well, first, obviously there would be similar challenges that they're all facing, especially right now, as far as, you know, continued elevated inflation, rising costs, hesitant consumer spending with the sort of economic instability that we're seeing today.
00:08:03
Kristin Paulin
and then it's a very mature market. So growing subscriptions and revenues is challenging for for all of them. And similarly, Gaining enough spectrum in a timely manner for 5G going into 6G. That's still sort of wait and see with the way the US regulator is. And then of course, they are seeing some competition, all of them from the lower end, from cable MVNOs.
00:08:31
Kristin Paulin
But looking at each of their challenges individually. I talked about AT&T and their convergence in a very positive way, but I really see this actually as a challenging situation for them too, because i feel like they have their blinders on. They're so focused on it and it's working for them.
00:08:49
Kristin Paulin
But at some point they're going to need to offer something in order to be able to poach the customers from their rivals. You know, I mean, at some point they are going to finish their fiber expansion and I don't know what's what's left then. So I really think they need to start thinking about that. And they're also the only one of the three that doesn't offer a network slice.
00:09:11
Kristin Paulin
Now, at this point, in in terms of the consumer side, we we don't have consumer network slices from T-Mobile. There's only one from Verizon, but but that's just an area that AT&T hasn't competed in, it doesn't have a first responder network like Verizon and T-Mobile do. So they're just kind of a little too laser focused in convergence for for my tastes.
00:09:39
Kristin Paulin
And then for T-Mobile, it sounds kind of positive, but they have been so so early to market with certain aspects of 5G, 5G standalone, network slicing, So they've had to spend a lot of time making mistakes, working through, you know, use cases, things that foster the ecosystem in general, which their competitors have benefited from in the sense that they can move quicker when when they do move.
00:09:45
Pablo Tomasi
Thank you.
00:10:11
Kristin Paulin
So I do feel like that could be potentially continuing for T-Mobile. And then for Verizon, yeah, please.
00:10:20
Pablo Tomasi
So if if I can just interrupt you a second, if effectively it's like a kid that has never learned the tough lessons on the street type of scenario for T-Mobile. Is that a good you know way of framing it?
00:10:35
Kristin Paulin
Yeah, I feel like they aren't an old guard telco, right? Like AT&T and even Verizon, they're the little bit more bureaucratic, slower moving. T-Mobile has been very agile and they've been able to be really innovative and move quite quickly in different areas. And yeah, I i think they're, yeah you could you could save money. save
00:11:01
Kristin Paulin
the the kid on the street that hasn't really had a lot of challenges to this point.
00:11:05
Pablo Tomasi
You can say if it doesn't make sense as a you know as visualization.
00:11:07
Kristin Paulin
okay No.
00:11:08
Pablo Tomasi
I just like to try to visualize things. But yeah it makes sense because TMO has had that incredible growth recently after after the merger with Sprint.
00:11:12
Kristin Paulin
Totally.
00:11:18
Pablo Tomasi
They effectively changed their DNA and the strategy.
00:11:19
Kristin Paulin
Mm-hmm.
00:11:21
Pablo Tomasi
We all know about the UNCARRIER they have moved from positives to positives. ah while while the other ones have sort of going through ups and downs a little bit more. So maybe they are a little bit better suited in a way of like kind of soaking up those punches that that eventually every telco is going to have to to take.
00:11:41
Kristin Paulin
Yeah.
00:11:41
Pablo Tomasi
But yeah, let's let's go back to Verizon then.
00:11:42
Kristin Paulin
it
00:11:45
Kristin Paulin
Okay. Yeah. One thing with with T-Mobile is I've been thinking a little bit lately about 6G. So T-Mobile has already said that they plan to, you know, they're looking at 2029.
00:11:56
Kristin Paulin
And from what I understand, 2030 is more the timeframe, maybe as far as standards.
00:11:57
Pablo Tomasi
Thank you.
00:12:02
Kristin Paulin
I'm not particularly versed on the, you know, technology technological parts there. But... we saw Verizon move with 5G bit ahead of standards and it did not end up making them an early leader in 5G. So there is somewhat of a risk to getting ahead of standards. So I'm that i'm not fully sure what the what their plan is for 6G, but that that could potentially, you know, end up being a challenge on the road.
00:12:35
Kristin Paulin
But yes, for for Verizon, you know, last fall they... they have ah gained new leadership that kind of wanted to shake things up. They wanna look at, you you know, some ah cost cutting in sort of slimming down sort of some of the things in a sense that we saw with AT&T when they decided against continuing to try to become a media company on top of a telco and and everything.
00:12:52
Pablo Tomasi
Mm-hmm.
00:13:03
Kristin Paulin
And then they kind of went back to streamlining. I feel like in a sense Verizon could be there right now. But they've always had this best network persona and it's like stuck to them like glue.
00:13:17
Kristin Paulin
But it's not it's not necessarily the case. So they're still seen kind of as premium. But what they really need is to evolve to something. Like their network, they can't be in that best network. They maybe don't want to live in the premium zone either because they have been struggling with some growth in subscribers, you know, over the past year or two. And so I think they need to find sort of what their their new niche is I saw that their new leadership said they want to delight customers with the best overall value.
00:13:55
Kristin Paulin
i mean, in a sense, that sounds a little T-Mobile-like to me. So I kind of, I think Verizon's challenge is sort of finding its it's new footing and know where how it
00:14:06
Pablo Tomasi
So it needs to find its new DNA in a sense. And it's interesting because I'm not from the US, but i I do associate Verizon with a premium brand in a sense.
00:14:10
Kristin Paulin
Yeah. Mm-hmm.
00:14:17
Pablo Tomasi
Maybe I've read too many of their marketing materials without knowing the plans, but because possibly they are so big and they've kind of dominant or maybe when I was covering telcos a little bit more, I do have that that perception.
00:14:18
Kristin Paulin
yeah
00:14:31
Pablo Tomasi
But yeah, if things are changing, maybe they need to find ah is a slightly different persona and they have the sort of very aggressive competition from TMO and then also that that very, as we mentioned, mature competition from AT&T. So it's difficult to...
00:14:50
Pablo Tomasi
be a premium provider unless it's clear-cut why you're premium provider. And by the way, I talk with all three telcos and all three telcos are telling me they have the best network.
00:14:56
Kristin Paulin
Yeah.
00:14:59
Pablo Tomasi
I'm not going to ask which one it is that really has it, but everyone is always telling me that, oh, we we are better than the others because of our networks.
00:14:59
Kristin Paulin
Exactly.
00:15:08
Pablo Tomasi
You got to love sort of the level of confidence.
00:15:10
Kristin Paulin
Yeah. There's so many different aspects, you know, that there you can look at can be the best network in this way or this location and
00:15:19
Pablo Tomasi
Yeah, exactly. and And it's very much sort of a way of how you're framing it. I remember when I was, you know, sort of when I'm covering Private Networks and I'm asking some some of the telcos like who's the best vendor and everyone is giving me like a different answer and they say, well, it actually depends on what are you measuring in terms of one or two different aspects of it.
00:15:43
Pablo Tomasi
Is that part of the technology stack is the whole technology stack is like, you know, how easy it is to work with them, so on and so forth. so always difficult to have those those absolutes but if we need to think about the market now um and like three companies I believe they're all doing fairly well like decently well with someone over performing but what do you think is most important to win in the US market?
00:15:54
Kristin Paulin
yeah
00:16:10
Pablo Tomasi
Is it sort of the tech leadership is the Is the strategy or is it just size that that at at the end of the day sort of helps you with economies of scale, so on and so forth? What what do you think is critical to to win now, but also win in the future as we then move on towards next generation of Gs?
Strategic Planning vs. Technology and Scale
00:16:34
Kristin Paulin
There's definitely something to be said for scale. We are definitely seeing that. there's There's much more on the fixed side right now because that's where the opportunities are, but definitely scale for you know cost efficiencies and things like that are definitely important. But if you're getting any options between strategy the money and and the technology, i go with strategy.
00:17:02
Kristin Paulin
And i can cite some examples that come to mind. But as as far as strategy, if you don't have the right strategy, the right roadmap, the right execution, you know even if you have the right technology, it's not it's not going to set you up to be winning.
00:17:20
Pablo Tomasi
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
00:17:21
Kristin Paulin
Now, money, that's different because in order to execute on that strategy, you do need the funding there.
00:17:24
Pablo Tomasi
yeah
00:17:27
Kristin Paulin
But the examples that I think of are, again, with with T-Mobile. They started with some some smart decisions. Maybe there was some luck in there too. But back when they acquired MetroPCS in 2013, it did give them some scale there. They were definitely a scrappy underdog back at that time.
00:17:50
Kristin Paulin
um And then they launched their un-carrier strategy right around that same timeframe. and that was really good idea. ongoing to today, but was very successful for them. And it really shook up the market.
00:18:04
Kristin Paulin
it gave them the sort of consumer focus. The consumers trusted their their message as being a consumer oriented company. And then they went on, as you mentioned earlier, to acquire Sprint 2020. And with that, not only came larger scale, but that huge amount of 2.5 spectrum that really allowed them to lay the groundwork for for their 5G sort of leadership in this era. And and and then since then, that that allowed them to then continue to sort of lead in other areas of 5G, the 5G standalone. And so it was really a lot of the the foresight that they had about what they would need.
00:18:52
Kristin Paulin
to to get to this point today. And we can look at the flip side. We can look at, can talk about Dish
00:19:00
Pablo Tomasi
We should talk about Dish I was curious to to hear your thoughts on great expectation of a certain point in time. um Probably not delivered, don't know how to say it nicely.
00:19:14
Pablo Tomasi
ah So yeah what what happened there is like there were a lot of talks about sort of how the network, because it was built, cloud native and so on and so forth, was going to make it more adaptable, better suited for like scales, coverage services and so on. what happened there?
00:19:34
Kristin Paulin
Yeah, I'll start with strategy, but just to first say that the technology, I think was a good was a good idea, the the open, the 5G open RAN network.
00:19:44
Pablo Tomasi
Mm-hmm.
00:19:47
Kristin Paulin
But first, they never really found their footing. And they were trying to become a fourth player in a mature market with three yeah strong leaders.
00:19:58
Kristin Paulin
And they didn't have any real expertise in the wireless market themselves. They also didn't really provide any sort of differentiator. And they also even had sort of a name issue. First, they launched a beta as Project Genesis, and then there was talk of them becoming DISH Wireless.
00:20:17
Kristin Paulin
but that But then they were Boost Infinite to separate it from their MVNO Boost Mobile. And then they decided to rebrand and put it all under Boost Mobile. It was just a bit confusing as far as, you know, they just never really found their footing there. And then as far as money, gosh it's really expensive to build out a 5G network.
00:20:39
Kristin Paulin
And the US is huge. And
00:20:41
Pablo Tomasi
Yeah.
00:20:42
Kristin Paulin
um And at the same time, their satellite bit TV business declin is declining. So the profitability is going on going down. They're struggling to gain subscribers to their new wireless service. All the while, they've purchased all this.
00:20:57
Kristin Paulin
They have all this spectrum costs, all these build-out costs. So they were struggling to meet these deadlines. It just, from the financial standpoint and the strategy standpoint, there was trouble. Now, like I said, the technology, I i feel like the 5g open ran that was great you know it can result in the vendor flexibility cost savings all of that and so it was a great part of the strategy but it was also complex and it was new and for them having only a 5g network did have limitations for them because they had limited device support there wasn't um demand for some of the bands.
00:21:38
Kristin Paulin
So, I mean, they didn't, the iPhone didn't support their bands, at least in the beginning.
00:21:41
Pablo Tomasi
Mm-hmm.
00:21:42
Kristin Paulin
i don't know if it ever did. um And they were having to deploy voice over new radio or depend on their MVNO relationships for fallback to LTE e for voice.
00:21:54
Kristin Paulin
It was just, it was just not, it just wasn't working for them there. So, I mean, as you know, the story, they had to give back some
00:22:04
Pablo Tomasi
Yeah. I mean, to to to be fair, when you're putting it like that, it seems that they so that they had like a lot of very large challenges. all at the same time and again, while trying to enter one of the most difficult markets globally, because again, you have like three of the largest, three among the largest telcos the world, it's never going to be easy to attract customers. And and i would imagine it also even just trying like price based competition is not probably going to be successful when you're spending money to deploy a nationwide network. is ah
00:22:38
Pablo Tomasi
Yeah, seems since tough. Good idea though. I i like the the idea of a fourth operator.
00:22:45
Kristin Paulin
Yeah, yeah. And, you know, definitely, I think the regulator did too, because The idea even came out of um T-Mobile acquiring Sprint. It was Sprint selling off their prepaid brand Boost Mobile that then was Dish's foray into the you know the wireless area.
00:23:07
Kristin Paulin
um But yeah, that that didn't set themselves up. And they're not the only market to struggle to add a a fourth player, which is often seen as is kind of the way to be and lowering prices in the market, you know adding that just enough extra competition.
00:23:24
Kristin Paulin
Jealous.
00:23:24
Pablo Tomasi
Yeah, and and I think i've I've seen sort of the UK has been going through consolidation in the mobile space. Italy has had four players with like, I mean, as a consumer perspective, I love how low the prices are here.
00:23:38
Pablo Tomasi
But sort of as, yeah, with my analyst hat, I'm thinking like this is not sustainable in fact.
00:23:39
Kristin Paulin
jealous
00:23:44
Pablo Tomasi
its It's absolutely not from their point of view, but yeah, it struggles a little bit all over the world.
00:23:45
Kristin Paulin
True.
00:23:48
Kristin Paulin
two
00:23:50
Pablo Tomasi
But so you touch on on Open Run and sort of how it had potential, but was complex and again, deploying a large network. If you look at some of the key technologies that could be shaping sort of success or failure to achieve success for American telcos over the next three to five years, what would you say going to be sort of something that, you know, will will move the needle for for any of these telcos?
AI's Role in Telecom
00:24:18
Kristin Paulin
So I would think of this in, i guess, a couple of different ways. have to say i have to say AI. Everyone talks about AI, I know.
00:24:30
Kristin Paulin
but it But it is true in the sense that AI, operators can use AI for network planning and optimization to provide the better customer experience. And you know if you're figuring out areas of your of your network where people are struggling to stay connected or more people are calling into customer service. If you can, know, if you're targeting that then and, you know, optimizing that, that's going to bring a better experience and you're going to be able to keep your customers longer. And so you have that part, you have the AI, I'll still call it a promise because I don't, I don't know how, how much it's there today as as far as helping, with some sort of personalization from the customer care aspect, you know things that can um
00:25:23
Kristin Paulin
satisfy the customer to then things like T-Mobile having their new AI platform and offering now in beta becoming soon the live translation. and they keep calling that the first of many services that will be offered that way.
00:25:33
Pablo Tomasi
Thank you.
00:25:37
Kristin Paulin
So there's um there's so many different ways that you know AI is gonna affect competition. But I have another little bit more basic technology, but I don't know if there's anything to talk about there before I go on
00:25:53
Pablo Tomasi
No, I just i think for for people that have listened to me, have I've always been quite skeptical about AI because it is is driving some revenues for for some providers, some OEMs.
00:26:07
Pablo Tomasi
And then the rest is promise, right?
00:26:08
Kristin Paulin
Mm-hmm.
00:26:09
Pablo Tomasi
It's all, we will be doing this, we will be doing that, and everyone is going to be making money. but But no one has ever shown me the money. And that's why I'm skeptical, at least you know that.
00:26:22
Pablo Tomasi
But definitely, I think...
00:26:23
Kristin Paulin
Hey, you're preaching to the choir.
00:26:24
Pablo Tomasi
Yeah, it's the type of everyone is going to have to do, you know, to use AI to to a certain of larger to a certain extent.
00:26:35
Pablo Tomasi
Like it's it's an unthinkable, right, that you're not going to use it. And and probably who's going to be better using it, had more innovative approach may as well. ah kind of you know have an advantage I don't think that ah AI itself will decide who wins the game but will definitely provide an advantage probably that would be how i frame it
00:26:50
Kristin Paulin
Yeah.
00:27:00
Kristin Paulin
I can agree. Good, good point.
5G Advance and Future Prospects
00:27:01
Kristin Paulin
So this next technology, like I said, the other idea I had was a little is a little basic, but 5G Advance, hear me out. they're As far as I understand, and you can tell me if you have any other sort of you know understandings, but 6G is going to be more evolutionary than revolutionary the way that i I read it. So much of what operators can be doing right now with 5G advanced, it can be setting them up for 6G. The 5G advanced and the 5G standalone architecture can be like the task bed for
00:27:49
Kristin Paulin
you know service providers to kind of gain early experience. And so it would be more more of the first to to market type of advantage then than the only one to have that technology. Because like you say, everyone is eventually going to get there. But you know as far as like early leadership, I think what what operators can do with 5G Advance in the next three to five years can set them them up for early successes and leading to 6G.
00:28:25
Pablo Tomasi
yeah Currently, T-Mobile is the only one that has deployed to a certain extent 5G Advance. that correct, as far as I know? But i don't I never understand to what extent. I know they they made some announcements, but...
00:28:42
Kristin Paulin
Yes, exactly. And that positive of the extent either they did about a year ago announced that you know, the 5G advanced technology, I think was nationwide for them, their capability. um Both T-Mobile and AT&T have 5G RedCap I know that's still very nascent, but I am not positive if, but I believe that is considered within 5G advanced.
00:29:15
Kristin Paulin
I'm not positive.
00:29:15
Pablo Tomasi
ah i I should know this because it's part of the enterprise market. i i
00:29:20
Kristin Paulin
same but
00:29:21
Pablo Tomasi
I think it depends how you see it in a sense. Does it need 5G Advance? No. Is it part of the same release as 5G Advance? Yes. I think that is sort of the the line that is a little bit blurry if I remember correctly, but if I'm wrong, someone comment and let me know that I that i got it wrong.
00:29:32
Kristin Paulin
that's yeah same okay okay
00:29:41
Pablo Tomasi
And I believe that the RedCap itself is is more of a RAN upgrade rather than core, if I remember correctly, but who knows?
00:29:53
Kristin Paulin
Yeah, that's... yeah
00:29:55
Pablo Tomasi
but But interesting that you're seeing sort of 5G advances, you know, like a necessary stepping stones to to learn those those lessons before 6H arrives
00:29:56
Kristin Paulin
yes
00:30:03
Pablo Tomasi
And yeah, sort of the circular way, yeah, six g is going to be an evolution. As you said, I think, yeah, I pretty much see it the same way, but you will still have the possibility of kind of changing the, you know, the the order of success of the of different telcos, doesn't it?
00:30:22
Pablo Tomasi
Every time there is a new... you know, generation is like, okay, a new game that is starting. So someone else can win, someone else can lead and let's see what else. And everyone is going to try to kind of reset expectation and growth.
00:30:37
Kristin Paulin
Yeah, well said.
00:30:39
Pablo Tomasi
But I think that it was like everything I wanted to to touch on the sort of American market.
Fixed Wireless Access in Strategy Plans
00:30:46
Pablo Tomasi
Do you think that there is anything else that people that are listening should know about the the American market? Anything else that you think is interesting or that we should have discussed and that I forgot to ah to the agenda?
00:31:01
Kristin Paulin
Well, very early in our conversation, when they were talking about the different personas for each of the operators, we touched a little bit about what they were doing with FWA.
00:31:10
Pablo Tomasi
Yep.
00:31:14
Kristin Paulin
And you mentioned you mentioned specifically T-Mobile and Fiber. So if we if you want, I could circle back a little bit to that area.
00:31:26
Kristin Paulin
And just the way that I see the three operators and their strategy as far as, you know, we at how FWA sort of fits into that. So AT&T was like anti-FWA until much more recently.
00:31:43
Kristin Paulin
First, they were they were thinking, okay, as we can use it as what they call copper catch. For anyone that was you know and on DSL and they were and they were shutting down DSL, they could then keep them as customers by offering them FWA.
00:32:02
Pablo Tomasi
Mm-hmm.
00:32:04
Kristin Paulin
then all the while, they're watching T-Mobile and Verizon and their FWA subscriptions grow and grow and grow. And then AT&T did sort of expand their interest in FWA, but there's they're not putting it in the forefront in in any respect.
00:32:25
Kristin Paulin
But as far as like their fiber expansion, is a as they're planning to expand in fiber again? They might go in first, offer FWA to customers in that area who they then plan to switch over to Fiber once they deploy it.
00:32:39
Pablo Tomasi
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:32:41
Kristin Paulin
So they're kind of using it in this like, you know, picking and choosing strategy. Whereas Verizon had a much smaller Fiber footprint. So they were...
00:32:53
Kristin Paulin
gung-ho on FWA in the beginning. FWA gave them possibility of offering bundles in more areas of the country. Everything is about offering bundles of wireless and broadband these days.
00:33:07
Kristin Paulin
And um so they, I see them as like, they are they are interested in fiber, they are interested in FWA. And then T-Mobile, nearly complete opposite in a sense.
00:33:19
Kristin Paulin
They are getting into fiber, like you said, but it's not as their primary. They're like, yes, we acknowledge some people are going to prefer fiber for the qualities of that technology.
00:33:31
Kristin Paulin
So if any of our FWA customers want to become fiber customers, that just opens up a space in our network for a new FWA customer.
00:33:41
Pablo Tomasi
Mm-hmm.
00:33:41
Kristin Paulin
They apparently have a long waiting list.
00:33:43
Kristin Paulin
So for them, they are still more focused on FWA in a sense. But as you said, they've been acquiring fiber operators along the way too.
00:33:53
Kristin Paulin
And in some sense, that is probably a competitive as factor, you know, against their their main mobile rivals there. But so I did, I didn't interrupt at the time to add that point in, but I did just kind of think that was um sort of an interesting point to me.
00:34:13
Pablo Tomasi
So FWA is quite important then for the dynamics of the US market.
00:34:19
Kristin Paulin
Yeah, yeah. It it has shown staying power. When it first came, there was not a lot of expectations for experience and people would try it and they would they would ditch it But how many years later, it's still growing.
00:34:37
Pablo Tomasi
Nice. and And it's good. It's sort of a success story in the telco world, right? So if the technology is sort of working and delivering and not, it's not always the case, is it?
00:34:50
Kristin Paulin
Yeah. What do they what do they say? The first monetization of you know their 5G network, your first sort of additional service that that was offered. Yeah.
00:35:01
Pablo Tomasi
and And that's sort of what I like about FWA in a sense is that it has a pretty straightforward business case, right, compared to some of the things that are... So we we didn't touch a lot about the the slicing part, um but but slicing is quite difficult to monetize ah at the end of the day. is At least for me, it's never that clear.
00:35:22
Pablo Tomasi
the specific benefit you're getting team benefits you're getting. so and and And I still think slicing is for enterprise and not consumer, despite what some other guests have said on this podcast and in general.
00:35:30
Kristin Paulin
if
00:35:35
Pablo Tomasi
but But I'm biased, like everyone knows I'm biased when when I'm thinking things. But yeah, no, very, very good to see FWA.
00:35:42
Kristin Paulin
Right.
00:35:44
Pablo Tomasi
Now, I think that's that's it from a tech and market perspective.
Kristin's New Podcast
00:35:48
Pablo Tomasi
But I believe you recently launched a podcast and I'm quite interested to hear a little bit more about... ah Well, and I already know this so the theme of the podcast, but would be good for the audience to know a little bit more about ah was the podcast about what the podcast about and regard.
00:36:07
Pablo Tomasi
yeah anything relevant in in that regard
00:36:12
Kristin Paulin
Yes, thank you. And I have to say, it was watching you have this podcast and grow this podcast that gave me some sense of confidence to try it. Now, I am far behind where where you are at this stage, but but i yeah i honestly wouldn't have ever taken the plunge if if I you know hadn't had some of the insights from you.
00:36:36
Kristin Paulin
So thank you for that. And yes, my podcast, I call it
00:36:38
Pablo Tomasi
You're welcome.
00:36:42
Kristin Paulin
Kristen's Next Chapter. It's a part of my slightly larger book brand where I focus on supporting authors and engaging with other fellow book lovers. So we've been talking about tech this whole time. um and for me, in this digital era, with all this AI, it's really important to have what I call analog habits to keep us balanced, to make sure you're going for walks or cooking or doing puzzles or reading, whatever your your preference is to move away from the screens for a little bit and engage your mind in a different way. And so for me, i enjoy many of the things that I just mentioned, but reading is is really my passion. And that's what what I've been sort of deep diving in. And so my podcast is, it's a short format as a single host, it's me. I publish every other week right now. Each episode has a sort of different topic theme and plenty of book recommendations. So far, my topics have included 10 reads from 2025, setting book-related goals for 2026, everything that I think is so great about book clubs, why we need to support debut authors, and how to incorporate your love of books into your travel plans. And so as far as my episodes go, everything's been solo, but I would love to include conversations with other fellow book lovers or authors or anyone really in the book community.
00:38:23
Kristin Paulin
So if there is anyone in your audience who is interested, feel free to reach out. But I've personally been really enjoying this new medium and trying to to put my my thoughts out there and share what I think is so great about books today.
00:38:43
Pablo Tomasi
Fantastic. and and And definitely, I'm going to put your LinkedIn contact and podcast you know podcast link in the description.
00:38:50
Kristin Paulin
Oh, thank you.
00:38:51
Pablo Tomasi
So anyone that is interested in sort to hearing more about Kristin's chapter at can just reach out directly ah to you.
00:39:01
Kristin Paulin
I did bring some book recommendations, if we still have time.
00:39:05
Pablo Tomasi
Yeah, yeah, of course. Plenty of times.
00:39:06
Kristin Paulin
All right.
00:39:07
Pablo Tomasi
like One of the good things about running your own podcast is that you can just decide, you know, to talk a little bit longer, right?
00:39:11
Kristin Paulin
Yeah. Perfect. And everyone can stop. I chose books for maybe interest in your audience. My first book is culpability by Bruce Holsinger. So this book explores moral responsibility in the age of AI through a family drama that centered on a fatal car crash involving their self-driving minivan. The story follows the family as they confront the aftermath of the crash, questioning who's to blame, the teenage son who is driving, the AI itself, or the parents, one of which is a key AI researcher in the story.
00:39:52
Kristin Paulin
And the book delves into themes of family, AI, moral responsibility, corporate power, and the challenges of raising children. in a tech saturated world.
00:40:02
Kristin Paulin
And it was an Oprah book club pick last year. So that's culpability by Bruce Holfinger.
00:40:05
Pablo Tomasi
ah that's That's very on point.
00:40:12
Kristin Paulin
Yeah, and I did read it for a book club and it was a really it was a really interesting discussion and AI was that much newer last year. So it's really interesting.
00:40:25
Kristin Paulin
My second one is Project Hail Mary. So you may be seeing this as a movie right now. that A big movie just came out last week starring Ryan Gosling and an alien named Rocky. So it's a sci-fi novel about a lone astronaut, Rylan Grace. He wakes up with amnesia on his spaceship and he's tasked with saving the Earth. from a sun dimming algae called Astrophage. So the story follows his journey, rediscovering the mission on this spaceship and meeting an alien and working together.
00:41:08
Kristin Paulin
he has the same the same problem on his planet and they're trying to work together to find a solution. The book has themes of survival, discovery, friendship, sacrifice, and the meaning of being human.
00:41:21
Kristin Paulin
And it is a fantastic book and movie. So highly recommend this one.
00:41:29
Pablo Tomasi
is Has the movie gone out on the cinema or on some of the platforms?
00:41:34
Kristin Paulin
It went to the cinema, at least in the U.S., last week.
00:41:38
Pablo Tomasi
Okay.
00:41:38
Kristin Paulin
It's in Amazon um Studios. So I'm not sure how quickly they would end up on the on the streamers, but I would look for it on Amazon when it does.
00:41:42
Pablo Tomasi
Mm-hmm.
00:41:50
Kristin Paulin
And the last one it's called, it's not science fiction or about AI. it's It's called the correspondent by Virginia Evans. And in this one, the main character, Sybil Van Antwerp, has always expressed herself best through letters. Over her lifetime, she's written letters with friends, family, authors, customer service, sort of anyone.
00:42:15
Kristin Paulin
um And now she's in her 70s, and she's sort of facing some hard truths about her past and seeking forgiveness. And the book explores the human connection, seeking forgiveness, and building a full life at any point by opening yourself up to it. And the reason that I included this book is because it's an epistolary novel, which means it's told entirely through letters.
00:42:38
Kristin Paulin
And that's why I'm including it because I think it fits nicely with the analog habits theme. I gave this book and some stationery to my mom for Christmas, and we've been exchanging snail mail letters ever since.
00:42:51
Pablo Tomasi
Oh, that's very nice.
00:42:52
Kristin Paulin
So it's kind of a nice way to keep up some, and you know, little analog habits in
00:42:58
Pablo Tomasi
I do like some epistolary novels, more on the horror side of things though, you know, like ah Dracula sort of classic one and then Frankenstein as well.
00:43:03
Kristin Paulin
Oh.
00:43:08
Pablo Tomasi
I'm not sure it's the epistolary, but sort of the same style anyways.
00:43:14
Kristin Paulin
I didn't realize that.
00:43:14
Pablo Tomasi
But oh thank you very much, Kristin oh thank you very much, Christine.
00:43:15
Kristin Paulin
Interesting.
00:43:15
Pablo Tomasi
You know, really appreciate you sharing some of the of the books as well, definitely adding them to my reading list. And and i think that sort of, you know, brings everything to a closure. So thank you again, Kristin for joining me on The Drift.
00:43:27
Pablo Tomasi
And yeah to the audience, just reach out to Kristin and leave comments or get in touch with myself or with Kristin again for tech or books or anything. Have a great day.
00:43:38
Kristin Paulin
Thanks, Pablo.