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A Not So Brief Guide To Kitbashing - with Kirioth
77 Plays4 months ago
Kirioth joins me to talk the philosophy, practicality and mentality behind kitbashing your monstrosities for 40k and Age of Sigmar. You can find Kirioth here: https://www.youtube.com/@Kirioth/videos #warhammer40k #warhammerpodcast #kitbash
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Transcript
Introduction and Welcome
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello and welcome back to another episode of PK's War Room, the badly named podcast that's kind of about Warhammer but isn't. Well it is, i say it isn't, that's not true. And today I'm joined by the Kitbash man himself, which is kind of our topic for today. Kitbash Kirion.
00:00:15
Speaker
Kirioth? Kirion? Your name's even Kirion. Kitbash Kirioth. Once I turned into a brain scramble I could not say. Hello Kirioth, how are you today? I'm good, thank you. I'm fine. We're all we're past the technical difficulty stage. So many of them.
00:00:32
Speaker
And there might be more for I know, because we're using different fucking systems and everything like that. To layer out what we're doing today, for people who don't know, this is a podcast.
The Creative and Therapeutic Side of Kitbashing
00:00:40
Speaker
So there are three episodes prior this. You can find on the podcast but playlist on my channel, and find them on Spotify, iTunes, and maybe some other places. I can't remember if I put them up other places.
00:00:48
Speaker
Today, going to talk generally about... Getting creative within the hobby, which is something you're kind of known for, right? Would you say that? I mean, that's mostly all that i all that I do. At this point, I think I kickbash more armies than I actually play the game.
00:01:05
Speaker
Well, it's... Yeah, I think that is fair to say, but that's also like its own part of the hobby, right?
00:01:12
Speaker
ah Yeah, definitely. And also, it it's... One of the whole things that makes playing the game fun for me is the fact that I get to take the silly things I've made and actually use them for something. So that's like... It's all sort of part of the same thing. like there's There's the end goal of, one day, this army will be usable. It's just going to take...
00:01:31
Speaker
so much more time to get it to that stage because i've opted to do something silly on every single model so but so it's like i'm starting a new project and in two years you might be able to play against it so is is is it important for you do you only get bash if you've got a use for it at the end of it
00:01:52
Speaker
that Actually, that used to be the case. Not so much anymore. I've started to just make stuff for the fun of it. There's there's a lot of like there's a lot of ah i guess like therapeutic um stuff going on with kitbashing.
00:02:04
Speaker
but just I mean, that's sort of hobby in general. like Building models and painting. is like It's the ultimate little
Building Larger Models and Kitbashing Origins
00:02:10
Speaker
zen space, isn't it? Where you can just go, here is my here is my tiny man. Then nothing exists outside of the tiny man Only the tiny man and the little tools I'm using on him That's it There is nothing beyond this that you know the say ti man what i'm painting this face You say But some of your men are quite big Some of them chattterably yeah dogggged my shoulder Yeah, I mean, bigger than MegaGargins.
00:02:38
Speaker
All my MegaGargins are bigger than the actual MegaGargins kit that came to Workshop cells, which wasn't intentional, but i'm not you know I'm not complaining. I mean, you're essentially modelling for disadvantage when it comes to Age of Sigmar with larger models, right?
00:02:52
Speaker
Oh, 100%. It's a good job line of sight isn't really a thing, because I'd be in real trouble. There's there's some stuff, like, there's a big angel thing over there. That is, it's, I think, about a third taller than the actual Mega Gargant model.
00:03:07
Speaker
So it's, like, comedically big. You put it down on the table next to an actual one, and it's like, why did you do this? Why is it why is it that big? Is it the correct base size?
00:03:18
Speaker
Well... Yeah, it's the correct base size. Okay, so that's the only bit that really matters for Age of Sigmar. So yeah so let's let's clarify some terms before we get too into the weeds of this. I've lot of questions about this sort of stuff, and I think it's an interesting topic. But for people who are listening at home, because this podcast is aimed at the widest possible net possible, because that's how I want to, yeah I guess, grow that this as a thing.
00:03:38
Speaker
So when we say kitbashes, do you want to explain what a kitbash is to people who are like, what the fuck is a kitbash? but Yeah, that's fair. I mean, it's actually think it's it's kind of both an intuitive term and not an intuitive term at the same time. If you if you are like if you're into the hobby, you know the the different boxes that are being sold as kits. So if you buy like if you buy like the yeah the Terminator Lord for the Chaos Space Marines, you know that that kit has got options for the so like Lightning Claws and Combibolt and all the different weapons, but you can also build it as a sorcerer as well.
00:04:14
Speaker
So you that's a kit with multiple options. Kit bashing is just taking two or more, usually more. I mean, in my case, it's... I don't want to think about it sometimes. Just any number of kits and mushing them together until you get something that you want out of it We're going to come to that bit later, by the way, is how...
00:04:31
Speaker
Because I also love a good kit patch and how it's wasteful, there's an argument that's quite exuberant in some ways. We'll come to that more a little bit later. But um for people who are wondering what the word kit, with this kit thing, we're going to proper origin here. Because like modeling back in the day would have been like just building a cottage out of like it suit what's called scratch building now.
00:04:49
Speaker
You'd build your thing out of just stuff. And then along came kit modeling, which is your air fix, it's your war hammer, it's your here's some injection molded plastic or white lead or...
00:04:59
Speaker
back in the day, or resin or whatever it is, and you cut it all up and then you put it together via the instructions usually, with a bit of modularity, a bit of change, but like you said, the Chaos Lord kit, being able to be a Chaos Sorcerer, is so unusual by today's GW standards, because most characters are like, you get a head swap on the sprue, and besides that, and maybe one weapon option.
00:05:18
Speaker
Most characters are hard locked. But that's what kits are.
Challenges in Warhammer Content Creation
00:05:22
Speaker
yeah so kit bashing like you said sticking them together so but but before so that's kit bashing before we get really into it so we're going to our stupid introductory segments that i always want to do because structure is important and familiarity is good children love that shit what have you been doing recently in terms of hobbying Mostly, I've mostly been preparing for two things. I'm going to be doing a a battle report soon with Liam Dempsey.
00:05:52
Speaker
Oh, sweet. so i I'm finally finishing painting my Armoured Company, which I tried to find the first post of when that project started and was really upset with myself to realise that the two-year figure I came up with moment ago, that's...
00:06:07
Speaker
that's I think you were doing those you were doing those tanks when first saw your stuff when I got into the hobby, which is at least three and a bit years ago, wasn't it? It might be longer than that. I mean, there was it kind of started out as one thing and turned into another thing, but like the Armoured Company is like an actual usable army, has only really been a thing for like two and a bit years, which is way too long. It shouldn't take that long. That's down to you know hobby butterfly issues of just going, ooh, a new shiny thing, which happens lot.
00:06:36
Speaker
um But... So when you say Armored Company, explain explain that for people who haven't seen this yet. andre where Where's best to see your Kitbash? You do some videos on it, but like is it on Instagram yet?
00:06:47
Speaker
i put I put stuff on Twitter. I put stuff on Instagram. There's like a whole other channel that I'm building up content for, um just like filming it and editing it so that there's a huge backlog before I actually set anything up for it. Oh, a second channel.
00:07:02
Speaker
it's ah It's just going to be a hobby channel. Hobbit show. Hobbit show. Horror Show Hobbies is what I've ended up naming it because every single thing is basically an experiment. And certainly kind I guess the conceit when I go into it, I don't know whether it's going to turn out really well, in which case it should be something that causes a little bit of discomfort because that's often what I aim for with kitbashes. I like monstrous things and, you know, unusual tanks and things with a kind of...
00:07:29
Speaker
like a much darker and... Like the the ah Armoured Company, for instance, it's but it's like a haunted tank regiment, effectively. So there's there's like weird stuff going on with it.
00:07:39
Speaker
um And if it doesn't go as I wanted, then it's the other type of horror show where it just goes absolutely wrong and nothing works as it should. So either way, it kind of... It's going to be bad, but it'll either be intentionally bad or it'll be an actual catastrophe and I've got to try and fix that somehow.
00:07:56
Speaker
um But... I'm kind of building up a bunch of stuff for that because I found that weirdly, despite the channel being about like primarily 40k and well, games workshop stuff as a whole, hobby videos don't actually do that well. Yeah. It's like a different audience, I guess, or only a portion of your audience necessarily interested.
00:08:17
Speaker
i think that's I think that's the thing. that's There's always people going, oh, you should put more of your hobby on the channel. And then I do, and I'm like, I've tried this, though, and you don't watch it. There's requests for it, but then the actual... The number of people who take you up on the thing they asked for is always way lower than the number of people who actually asked for it to begin with. Yeah, the demand can seem higher than it is, especially when you get...
00:08:45
Speaker
and you put it up even even if those 15 people watch those 15 people are only like a small portion of like the people actually watch the other videos so yeah comments can be an absolute um like a a red herring as such but they can be quite misleading in terms of like numbers and things like that but there's There's element of like, if you want to grow in a space, because it's relevant to this, this podcast is on the Warhammer channel, which my second channel, because originally i was doing Warhammer magic on the same channel, and I believe it still did my growth and discoverability because YouTube cares about who clicks on a video when you first put it up. So when I put Warhammer video and the magic players don't click, I put a magic video and the Warhammer players don't click, it just makes YouTube view the
3D Printing in the Hobby: Benefits and Concerns
00:09:21
Speaker
channel unfavorably. So that's why I split off to do this. And it's a smaller Pokemon channel for whenever whenever I feel like doing a Pokemon thing, which isn't actually that often.
00:09:28
Speaker
But um yeah, so splitting off makes sense. Even when you think that hobbying, kit bashing and converting should fit the general MO... Yeah, you'd think it would overlap nicely, but it's it's surprising how much it doesn't, except for some reason, and I don't know why this is.
00:09:45
Speaker
Videos that specifically focus on products that aren't Games Workshop stuff, so I've worked with Archon Studio few times, various 3D printing Kickstarters and stuff like that. this printing for Warhammer, though?
00:09:59
Speaker
Is this feeling pretty to make? No. That's the thing. like The Archon Studio stuff has pretty much always been D&D. And in fact, a lot of the other STL stuff that I've covered um that have been like... It just means there might be an untapped market or an untapped niche, shall we say. we We're talking very much from a content creator perspective here, kids home. I'm sorry about this.
00:10:18
Speaker
But hopefully it's at least mildly interesting. It's easy absolutely. And that's part of it as well. This podcast is meant to about chat, that stuff that I enjoy. And beyond Warhammer and card games, I'm also quite into making videos on the internet. I've been doing it while now. um But yeah, that's interesting. Because that means there must be there must be an untapped niche for like...
00:10:33
Speaker
three but Okay, let's talk about that for a second. Let's let's park that and talk about that. Because you 3D put a lot of shit for D&D, right? when you yeah When you post your... When you post... Again, check out Curious Instagram. There'll be links in the show notes and shit for that.
00:10:45
Speaker
Because that's where you post quite a few of these images. When you post the like the dungeon rooms and the inns and stuff where fights are about to break out in your in your games, ah the feeling I get, and this is the feeling that you probably want to capture with an audience, is I wish he was my DM. That's the feeling I get.
00:10:59
Speaker
but I mean, that's that's like one of the highest compliments, right? I mean, yeah to be fair, a lot of... half the stuff that I like put up isn't even for like my my session. So because because of working with Archon Studio so much, I've got loads of Dungeons and Lazers terrain.
00:11:15
Speaker
um Admittedly, it's not just a case of they gave all of it to me. I also like have taken sponsorships with them and then spent some of that money on the Kickstarter. Because their stuff's good.
00:11:26
Speaker
Yeah, it's so good and you can make anything out of it and it's become... Before we did printed battle maps, so you just print a map out on A4 paper and it would be fine. It would be 2D, but would be fine. And we used those for ages and we didn't have a problem with it. It worked well, we were happy.
00:11:44
Speaker
Then I did the first video with Archon and they sent me a big box of Dungeons & Laser stuff. I got it painted up and then the next fight we had was in and in.
00:11:55
Speaker
And it was a full, like, two-floor inn that had furniture in it. because You tried brush it all up as well, didn't you? it wasn't just 3D printed. That's the reason. Because you see a lot of 3D printed D&D stuff that's, like, you know, quickly done and it's one-and-done jobby. But, like, painting it up takes time and care and energy. Yeah, it does. To do the first mix of, like, 3D printed props and stuff and Dungeons & Lasers Plastic Terrain was, like, a solid three or four days of just sitting there and just...
00:12:26
Speaker
spraying and then spray paint it and then airbrushing and then dry brushing and then washing and then on to the next thing and the next thing. Is that accessible? Okay, is that accessible to the average gamer who isn't lucky like us who gets to spend part of their work life is sort our sponsorships, making models, playing the games that we love.
00:12:45
Speaker
Is that an accessible thing for a normal person who... They have to get home from work, deal with the kids, deal with the family, put the kids to bed, and then they've got, at best, an hour before they are crashing hard.
00:12:56
Speaker
Is it accessible in that regard? I feel like it can be. it It depends on like it depends like how granular you want to get with it. like all of my All of my plastic terrain and three d printed terrain that's that's painted, it's not painted down to the finest detail.
00:13:11
Speaker
I'm not saying that like going, oh I've got to make sure every like edge is perfect on this you know wooden floor tile. It is literally just the quickest possible method to get a ah a good result from a few feet away.
00:13:25
Speaker
yeah Because otherwise, you just it's just impossible. I mean, that's a that's a skill and a talent. I say talent. It's more of a skill because learn. It's a skill that new players and new gamers and and modelers have to learn.
00:13:35
Speaker
And there's good tutorials out there, too. People like, yeah I guess Midwinter Minis is a good example. I mentioned him. i think i mentioned him in this episode because he's on the last one. He does good tutorials that teach you to do basing and terrain very quickly. and Because if you if you get stuck in the weeds of trying to do it like you would do a character model, you're going to drive yourself insane.
00:13:51
Speaker
Well, that's one of the things where the last thing that Archon did um is pre-painted stuff, which it still looks kind of like magic to me, but it it works. So it's, you know, they have one person just paint the entire kit and then they replicate that exact paint job onto every but like onto the other Violet, machine? um Yeah. so it It does sound like magic.
00:14:15
Speaker
They've done a little video where it sort of explains it, but it's also like, okay, but I feel like there's there's steps here that either you didn't explain or I don't understand, because it goes from this this paint scheme that this person has painted on to then being pressed onto the kits afterwards. Like, almost like, um...
00:14:33
Speaker
What's the screen? No, it's not screen printing. What is it when you put an image into water or an oil or a solvent? Hydro dipping. Hydro dipping. Is it hydro dipped?
00:14:44
Speaker
It's on a sort of rolly sponge thing. Rolly sponge? i can't have good i call him That good. look good. Honestly, it looks it looks really good. Can you imagine trying to paint your model paint scheme onto a sponge and then applying the sponge to the model?
00:15:02
Speaker
I think probably what must happen is they scan the thing that's been painted and then it's like replicated somehow through... ah it Through arcane genetic resin alchemy.
00:15:13
Speaker
It really feels like something that shouldn't exist, but like I've got
Cost-Effectiveness and Safety in 3D Printing
00:15:17
Speaker
some preview kits up there that we used literally the other day for D&D, actually. And I was looking at them and like, this is better than I would do, because...
00:15:25
Speaker
when it comes to me painting this i've got like two sets of this to paint and then there's a bunch of other sets that also need painting and that takes time and the easiest way is to just go super quick dry brush it then you're done but if you've got one person who paints it once and then it can just be replicated infinitely with a machine you can have someone sit there and do a really fine job on the whole thing this so this is all stuff that's coming to you when you buy this stuff it comes to you you're not getting the stls then No, so that the Archon stuff is plastic kits. Didn't Archon used to do STLs? i feel like i I think I printed some STL stuff from them.
00:16:02
Speaker
Am getting the company to someone else? I don't You might be thinking there's another company called Broken Anvil that did STLs and then moved into doing plastic kits, but they they went in an interesting direction. No, maybe I'm thinking Archvillian or someone.
00:16:17
Speaker
I mean, there's a few companies now that are kind of shifting over to either plastic or doing like 3D printed. Yeah, I might be mixed Archvillain who was like on their Patreon for a while because printing loads of this stuff. So I guess... Yeah. Because going back to that point about, like, can the average consumer and or player and or enthusiast and or fan or whatever term you want to use for it, can they use this stuff?
00:16:36
Speaker
Because I'm quite a big fan of 3D printing because 3D printing is... it's like the It's like a hobby of a nation. Like I mentioned earlier, before kits existed, people would build cottages out of, like, clay and lollipop sticks, right? And then we got to, like, ejection moulding from companies. And now we're at a stage where we're moving on to... You can... you can sculpt it yourself or get someone online to sculpt it and then print that in your home.
00:16:57
Speaker
However, as someone who owns four 3D printers myself and they're all like out of commission need to be fixed because they're of the shed at the moment, like it is a hobby in itself. It's time consuming and it's fucking, it is annoying in some regards.
00:17:10
Speaker
100% it's like there's this kind of weird mix of like the allure of i can see a model I can download it and then in a few hours I can be I can be painting it and I don't have to go anywhere and it's also so much cheaper than if I yeah have to go out and buy a plastic kit from from anyone like it's not even a case of you know games workshop being expensive which they fucking are we're recording this like a day after the price increase stuff I'm like yeah and their example ah little tangent their example oh oh uh warriors will be going up by three or five percent an extra pound fifty or whatever I'm like yeah all right that's the warriors why you show us how much the knights are going up by you bastards Yep, it's always the lowest cost kit, isn't it?
00:17:50
Speaker
It's not, oh yeah, the Land Raider, which is like a two decade old kit now, is going to be another five pounds something. No, it's it's always the the cheapest of the cheap unit that they can get away with.
00:18:02
Speaker
It's like the the guy getting out the elevator with a llama and the milkshake. like And there's the a 160 pound night kit or whatever. like what have you got there? And like, £31 Nequans. And it's like, no, that's not what we're talking about, is it? Yeah. Anyway, anyway, so yeah, GW's expensive. So as an example of that, to tangent or segue and then come back to what we're talking about with 3D printing, we haven't got away from that yet.
00:18:21
Speaker
yeah My hobby thing at the moment is that I'm going all fucking mad. So I've got ive thought this thing, won't be able to see this if you listen on Spotify, but on YouTube, this thing's almost as big as my head. This is the arse of a stomper. So I'm building a stomper now. This isn't even going played at competitive level because it's just not very good.
00:18:35
Speaker
But really, really want to build and paint one as ah as a hobby. Orc fan. But more importantly, Orc Mega Knobs are really good right now and they're going to nerfed, but I'm going to build and pay 18 of them and play with 18 of them and smash them into people because they're too good. So, for people don't know, Orc Mega Knobs come in packs of three I think it's £35 is like the fucking retail value for three of these fucking things.
00:18:58
Speaker
So I bought 10 of them, Station Forge, shout out to Station Forge, again, I always mention them because their sculpt was pretty good. They could have been sized up a little bit because if you can see that on YouTube, they're not quite... dropped a mega knob. Don't do that.
00:19:11
Speaker
They're not quite thick enough. But the point I'm getting at is £25 for £10 versus £35 for £3. And if my 3D printers were set up and I bought the STLs direct from Station Forge, I could have printed them for less than £25. I could have printed them for like yeah a equivalent of £6 or £7.
00:19:25
Speaker
The problem is, I didn't want to clean my printers that i are currently minging outside of my shed. but But I also wanted these to arrive so I could build, paint and get them all ready for, I've got a two day event coming up in like a week or two.
00:19:36
Speaker
And I was really scared when ordering some of the station for stuff on Etsy, because some of them like, oh, we're printing this in like deepest, darkest Europe and you won't see it for like 16 weeks. But luckily I found one on eBay selling it. So there's a weird thing where, like like you said, I could have walked into my shed and just printed them and painted them that day.
00:19:52
Speaker
But and because I'm fucking lazy and all of the overheads of maintaining printers is a lot. Like printing is incredible and companies Eligu do great work with their tech. But my God, is the hobby still... That's not hobby. That part of the overall hobby still inaccessible them in a way.
00:20:07
Speaker
It does so much like that's that's the thing that I try and i try and point out when people are like, oh, should I start 3D printing? It's like, OK, hang on that. It's a good idea, but there's so many caveats to it. Firstly, you've seen a 3D printer and gone. I can make a bunch of miniatures at home. You can. You don't just need 3D printer. You need a wash station. You also need a cure station. So if you're thinking I'm going to pick up a Mars, like a Mars 4 for, I mean, what are they? Like 120 quid something? Yeah, i got I got my Mars 2 or 3 a couple of years ago on Amazon Prime Day. I know anti-Amazon too, but I also don't have infinite money. So when I saw it for cheaper, I was like, I'm i'm on it.
00:20:43
Speaker
um It was less than 160, I think, at the time. yeah They probably least the might even be cheaper now. but um But yeah, yeah. Yeah, like, yeah it's it's... The printers themselves are insanely cheap for what they are. Like, not even it's not even that long ago that the idea of being able to do this in your house, like, it just seems... It's science fiction. Like magic.
00:21:07
Speaker
yeah Yeah, Asimov would be like, anything too technology advanced looks like magic as I'm printing my resin knobs. He's like, look at those resin knobs you've produced, Vince. I'm like, are you proud of me, sci-fi dad?
00:21:19
Speaker
But um yeah, no, absolutely. But you mentioned wash stations. So when I first got printers, I did water v washable resin, um which I think I might move away from when I reset them up this summer because that's that's the long story of this is I'm going to reset my printers in summer and clean them, which is going fucking nightmare because resin is toxic. going be there with gloves up to my elbows, just scrubbing the fucking things.
00:21:39
Speaker
You've got to have you your thingy as well, your mask. Yeah, oh no, I do. So so i've going to come into that as well. So, wash station, because I had a fucking box of water and I was scrubbing the models and now I've got a box in my shed I've just like like cured resin floating in water that i Because the box is like...
00:21:55
Speaker
I didn't choose a very good box. put a fit for purpose box either, Kiriath. So I've got a box that I've got to somehow get to the dump without spilling resin water all over my car. I don't know i't know what I'm going to do with it. So I wish I'd bought a wash station just so I could like keep it contained, keep clean it in a Fuck. i wish it's like know it's £100 more whatever or £60 more for a wash station, but even the cheapest ones, but it would have been so much better than my box of toxic waste I've got in my cupboard now. oh The way to deal with that is when it gets hotter, leave that out in the sun. Yes. And yeah letting and cure and let the water evaporate.
00:22:28
Speaker
And then you'll end up with just a ton of like... Dead birds. A ton of dead birds in the garden. That's the thing as well. it's like, if there's no lid on it, then... But then also, if you put the lid on it, it makes it harder for the water to go anywhere. So it's like this weird mix of, that's the advice always say. It's just, I'll just leave it out in the sun for a few days. Like, put it on a windowsill.
00:22:46
Speaker
And I'm like, okay, well, I can't, I'm not leaving it out in the garden because there are cats in the garden. Yeah, I get frogs in my garden all the time. don't want dead frogs in my resin water. Yeah, that's terrible. Also, I can't just leave it in the most sunny windowsill in the house because I have two children.
00:23:02
Speaker
You'll have a dead family by the end of it. Yeah. I don't like i've brought them in here when I... Go on, sorry, go on. I was going to cut you but I shouldn't. i brought them in here when I was really producing loads of like resin prints. i was like, okay, girls, this is basically magic. It's not really magic, but it's basically magic.
00:23:20
Speaker
So I want that model. I send it to that. It does it. The only downside is... If this is on, you do not come into this room. You do not touch it. You barely even pretend it's not there even.
00:23:32
Speaker
You can't come in unless I'm in the room whilst this is on. Because the stuff it makes the models out of is toxic and harmful. At the very least, it can make you extremely itchy. At the very worst, you go to hospital and I have to explain why my six-year-old has been playing with... Inhaling resin. Yeah. yeah um Also, the bottles down there, you can't touch those because that's isopropyl alcohol.
00:23:56
Speaker
so don't mess with that like they've got tamper-proof caps and everything of course no yeah that's why mine's in the shed now dude like but because i've had a kid recently and the my wife's like they can't be in the house like agree yeah because they were an annex but no can't be i've moved all the stuff into the garage like i don't i don't trust it's not that i don't trust them to to not come in but they're kids mess with stuff because they they probably won't but they're also curious and you know all the warnings in the world ah only work so far when we start egging each other on. How many horror films have you seen where a kid drops their ball and it bounces down the steps into the basement where they're not meant to go because there's like a you know a deranged cousin that's chained up down there? you know yeah So that's right. that The 3D printers should be positioned to them like Bart's twin in the basket in the attic. Don't go near it.
00:24:40
Speaker
Yeah, it's got to be kept away. think the toxicity of resin has been understated. I genuinely believe this. So there's a really good YouTube video by a... got into ah i had a deep hole of watching a lot of 3D printing content for a while.
00:24:51
Speaker
And there's one YouTuber, he set up three printers. See, it's three mass market printers. It was like Elie Goo or something like that in his in his like workspace. And he measured it with like... um you seen this video? Yeah, he measured it with... i wish I could remember who was.
00:25:02
Speaker
An industrial air grade filter thing. And it was just outside of human living standards, like, the entire time they were on. And e and he was using, like, charcoal filters, open windows, ventilation pipes, and it still was bad.
00:25:15
Speaker
And I had mine running in this room when I first got them. I had i had one put over here. And I got, like, ah like an ulcer on the back of my throat. And I was like, that's weird. And I just moved it out straight away. yeah So I think, although it's not harmful if you filter the air, I don't think that's necessarily true.
00:25:30
Speaker
and there's probably a lot of stuff that's going to out years down the line for that. It's even stuff like the idea of the like the charcoal filters. Like, Elgu sends charcoal filters with most of their printers. They didn't send one with the Saturn IV Ultra, which is interesting. I think probably because there's got to be some tacit acknowledgement somewhere that they don't do anything.
00:25:46
Speaker
I mean, one of the big things is, oh, it it removes like the the harmful odours from the air. like You can't smell it. That's also a total lie. Because if the printer's running in the garage, like the print the garage door is sealed and everything.
00:25:57
Speaker
But if you open the door just for a moment to go and check on it, you can just smell it. You can smell it just permeating through into the kitchen and stuff. And it's like, yeah even with two filters running inside that unit and with an an air purifier next to it, I can still smell it.
00:26:14
Speaker
If I can smell it, that probably means that all the other stuff that's coming off it is also not going away. Yeah, be careful about by getting into your kitchen and stuff. I really would. like not I don't want to scare my gun. I think the equipment is fantastic. But there's no doubt in my mind that that this is like...
00:26:28
Speaker
like way more harmful than anyone is really actually admitting or yeah we we have stuff like um i've got stuff so it it gets sent to basically the outside of the garage so the garage isn't like sealed or insulated um which makes printing in winter interesting um but same with the shed i've got i'm just not printing it the weather's just got better so i guess i can start yeah i'd For the Saturn 4 Ultra, when I did that review, I did have it printing in here, but I had it printing in here whilst I was not in here.
00:26:54
Speaker
door was sealed, the window was open, there's a there's a fan setup that is just sending all of the stuff this way. like I had a pipe with a little fan plugged into the... like Not into the actual printer itself, mostly because I couldn't... couldn't get the little fan cover off the front towards that very open window.
00:27:12
Speaker
That door's going to stay shut. The other door connecting to the garage going to stay shut. I'm not um' not messing with it. Came in like once or twice each time was just very quickly kind of walking in going, yeah, it's still going, going back out again, and then just leaving it. And after that, I didn't come in for a while just to wait for everything to clear out and for it to air out properly. Do you know that that begs the question about, like, so we don't want to breathe it, we want to filter filter it and air it out and put it out, and but then those fields are going into the environment, and on a minor scale it's going to do nothing, right? Yeah.
00:27:41
Speaker
But as this gets more and more mainstream adopted, because I believe in, like, I believe in, like, 10, 15 years people will be 3D printing taps to replace the taps in their homes and the home stuff, right? That's but the direction I assume it will go.
00:27:52
Speaker
So there's got to be leaps and bounds made to make that stuff less toxic if you want people to print stuff in their home for daily use, you know? That's more filament than anything, but... Yeah, I mean, i I just feel like there hasn't been... It's like it hasn't been around long enough for there to be proper research into it. It feels like companies went... You can do this at home. I don't think this podcast is getting sponsored by 3D Prits anytime soon as I'm doom and glooming about resin damage, but it's true. it's you good I listen to like history podcasts and Behind the Bust and stuff of that, and there's often they talk about how people first responded to lead pipes or or um cigarettes or all these things that like later on online were like, oh, actually, this fucked us right up.
00:28:30
Speaker
I think like, yeah, yeah, but yeah, exactly. Women licking brushes that had radium paint on them to paint watch faces. Yeah. And then suddenly they all get awful illnesses and it's like, oh, what's this?
00:28:42
Speaker
Oh, oh, we're just licking. people People were irradiating their balls at one point to try and make their virility better. And then those people just got testicular cancer because no one knew what was going on. I'm not saying it's quite like that. I'm not saying Ellie Goo is giving anyone testicular cancer. That's not what I'm saying. Yeah.
Creative Freedom: Kitbashing vs. Conversion
00:28:59
Speaker
um Just to be very clear before I get sued. Anyway, so that's 3D printing and we live in a hobby renaissance. but Not only do we have kits that we can kit bash, we can 3D print stuff to stick on our things and make them new and fancy and special.
00:29:13
Speaker
That is the thing. it's it is ah It is genuinely incredible. like You can just go, i want this model and I now have this model. ah One of the creators I like the the most is Bestiarum Games.
00:29:26
Speaker
Yes, yeah, yeah, I was on on the Patreon for a while too. right he' there One of their horrific angel things, um which I printed on the Saturn 4 Ultra. And it's amazing that you can just go, I want this thing.
00:29:39
Speaker
It's super useful for kit bashing. It's super good for D&D because someone at some point will have made pretty much exactly the thing you're thinking of. So if if it's a case of... I need something with too many faces and not enough arms.
00:29:52
Speaker
And you just go for a little hunt through a few good creators and you will most likely find something along those lines. You also get parts too. I head swapped some marines with some 3D print stuff. I 3D printed 10 Orc jetpacks and just stuck them to normal boy models to create my Stormboys.
00:30:08
Speaker
Because again, I wasn't going to pay GW prices to try and build like 15 of those things because I like to put everything in their excess and min-max everything. Salad helms for Stormcast Eternals to make them look better. Oh yeah, because you're not a fan of the... I've never liked the face helmets, but I do love a good silent helm. And one of the... There's a creator who just did like ah like a big helmet pack. They've got like Bretonnian knight heads, also cat girl heads that are in there, but I don't tend to those. Of course, of course. Like silent helms and various other things.
00:30:35
Speaker
and that i've there's a drawer over there that i can't currently access because it's got a tank on it but it's just full of plates of salad helms that i just one day went i'm i need to just print a load of these for whenever i need them and there's like 120 or 130 in there that i just yeah mass produced that's that's my plan three is it is to print loads of stuff things for bases and stuff and things like that.
00:30:59
Speaker
So, because that, there's an argument that makes kit bashing less expensive. So let's go back to that bit I mentioned earlier about the exuberance of kit bashing. yeah Because buying one kit, so I, for example, here's an example, a very hard example for it.
00:31:12
Speaker
I recently kit bashed a kid's toy that I bought a car boot sale. So this is the opposite end of the scale. I'm going to show it on stream now. Is it accessible? Have have I put it, where the fuck is my ambulance? Let me grab the wah ambulance, one second.
00:31:27
Speaker
I mean, I already love the name.
00:31:31
Speaker
Now the paint job for this, people at home, is not finished. But this, and I'm sorry for listening on Spotify, this is why you should subscribe to me on YouTube. This is the Waambulance, right? This is an ambulance that I got off a car boot sale for 50p and my wife was like, why are you buying that? like, because it looks like it could carry some Ork boys. Yeah. And I've stuck shit all over it and the stuff's stuck to it. There's a bit of green stuff for some wires and there's some Plastikard and stuff. But mainly it's like guns from other kits and spikes from other kits. And this is all Plastikard.
00:31:59
Speaker
Love me some Plastikard.
00:32:02
Speaker
where was I going with this? oh the wheels. So, my three-pointed ones were set up. I needed some wheels. So, I went into my local... This is an absurd thing and I'm really embarrassed. I bought this for 2050p. Went to local store. Bought the um the the Gene Theodore Colt transport truck. What's it called? Rock grinder? the Goliath. Yeah, the Goliath.
00:32:21
Speaker
Took the wheels off that stuck them to this. Oh no, hang on, did the wheels for that go on something else these are the wheels for my truck? Either way, I bought another kit to get wheels for another kit and took the wheels for that kit to put on this kit. By kit I mean toy.
00:32:32
Speaker
So, 50p, cheapest chips, kit bash, ended up being quite expensive because bought £35 kit. Yeah, you bought a full. yeah um But oh in my defence, just my defence, the Goliath, not the Goliath, Goliath Rockwinder, whatever it's called, the front grille, that's going on another Orc vehicle. The body itself, I'll probably put on skis. going have to do all sorts of weird shit with it, so it's not completely wasted.
00:32:55
Speaker
It's going to be cannibalised for multiple projects. Yes, it does. This one looks a bit exuberant. That's the thing. It's like, it's it can be way more expensive.
00:33:06
Speaker
But on the other hand, you then have all the stuff that's left over to then build other things with. so You hope, because sometimes you put those other bits in a box. And then you're like, oh yeah, remember that time I bought a Void Dragon just to get his spirit? That's not an example I've done, I know people have done this.
00:33:22
Speaker
And then they've just got like half a Void Dragon, like a 60-pound, 70-pound kit. Yeah, i I tend to try and force myself into using stuff that i otherwise wouldn't have a use for. think you're better at this from the outside looking in because you do a lot of 3D printing for like the the all the arms you use for that big arm thing.
00:33:39
Speaker
Oh yeah, like sticking too many arms on things. I don't know why. um So that this is one of the like stupidest mechagargons I've done. Because this was me forcing myself to use part of a kit that I didn't think I would ever actually use. So those are the steps from the like the Sigma Palisade-y stepping thing?
00:34:01
Speaker
What's it called? The Bone Tithe Nexus. That's Oh, okay. So i i used I bought that box because I wanted the the big like column in the middle yeah so that I could stick it into into a Nurgle kit, which is like over there, like that tall guy there.
00:34:19
Speaker
Again, sorry Spotify users. Yeah. I suppose just take this podcast completely to a visual medium, but carry on, carry on. It's very visual heavy, isn't it, so far? So I used that for that model, then I used the swords that the statue is holding in that kit on um another model, gave it gave them sword, like knife legs, um and then I had the just the base of it left over.
00:34:42
Speaker
And it was just in the box, I was like, I don't know what i'm going to do with this, because I've used everything else. Like, this is it. There's just these steps, and what can you build out of that? And then I found a bit of graveyard I had left over from another kit, and a banshee from the Soul Black Gravelords, and decided to make a floating prison that's got a screaming woman trapped in the middle of it.
00:35:06
Speaker
That's pretty sick conceptually. i had it like I've managed to get it just... It mostly looks like it's hovering. It's not perfect. It's very hard to get something this tall to sit on a tiny contact point.
00:35:18
Speaker
But when it comes to like getting a kit for one idea, i don't... I'll do it, but then I force myself to use the other bits because it's like I've spent 45, 50 quid on this thing.
00:35:32
Speaker
I've used one part of it. That's not an acceptable ratio. Do you ever go... um What's the term? a Kit break diving. with The people on eBay who sell parts of stuff. Do ever go looking bits on there? Yeah, all the time.
00:35:44
Speaker
All the time. Because there's there is some stuff like... I find it easier to buy a bigger kit to to do kitbashes with because just the sheer size of it means like I don't and don't actually need eight Mega Gargons.
00:35:58
Speaker
I know I don't need that. I'm ending up with eight. I'll probably end up building more after that just because it's just a very fun thing do. How many fits into AOS points list the moment? Four. Four? four Yeah. um There's seven. I've got seven currently.
00:36:12
Speaker
I've got the parts to make an eighth. And I know I'm going to build more than that. I think I'm going to end up with this with Orc trucks, because this this is a really interesting point that we're coming to naturally, is like what you can play things as.
00:36:23
Speaker
So like the Warmbulance, for example, is that's going to be a truck, and I've got a truck, I've got a rhino, I've got an impulsor, and I'll probably end up trying to get like most transports in the game Orcified, just for the fun of it.
00:36:34
Speaker
Fuck knows where I'm going to put them all. But anyway, but like the Warmbulance, compared to... Oh, I didn't show you. The lights still work. Oh, it's still on the... So, again, sorry, listeners, but look.
00:36:47
Speaker
So when I call the wah, I purposely blue-tacked over them and didn't like airbrush those when I was putting yeah the base colour on. Anyway, so... The War Ambulance is too long.
00:36:59
Speaker
I was thinking, because I measured the length, I wanted to be playable, like I played tournaments too, I'd love a bit of Warhammer even if the game is horribly unbalanced. But, so I measured it, I was like, fuck, is too long. Do I just saw the back end of it off? And it can be really funny, that make it look like they just sawed the end of it off.
00:37:14
Speaker
But I liked the shape of it so much, i don't want to do that. So now, before every match, I say, this is a truck, this is a truck, this is a trucks truck, this truck. Please note the wire ambulance longer than the other trucks and that gives me inherent advantages of being able to get out further, see around corners, body block.
00:37:28
Speaker
So what I explained is from windscreen wipers down, if you're okay with this, we'll just play that though that part of the model does not exist for sight lines, for measuring, for body blocking or anything. yeah um And so far, out of two or three events that I've played that wire ambulance at, everyone has been pretty cool.
00:37:42
Speaker
Because tournament players are actually way more relaxed than casual players realise. The vast majority of them are like, sure, whatever, let's just play. It's only your slightly gamey pricks. And you you find one of them every ten ted matches where you're like, oh, you're a prick. Okay, well. But you find pricks everywhere. I meet pricks down to asko.
00:37:56
Speaker
So, Mega Gargans. You've played your Mega Gargans at an event, didn't you? Didn't you go up to Honest Wargaming? Yeah, i I went to Facehammer. Oh, Facehammer, that was it. I took my Mega Gargans with me. um The year before, I'd actually taken the Soulblight Gravelords that are up there.
00:38:11
Speaker
um which, again, that's an army that's got a ton of conversions in kit bashes and Explain to the audience at home, the layman, difference between a conversion and a kitbash, would you say?
00:38:23
Speaker
I mean, for generally, i think when it comes to conversions, it's taking one model and trying to change its function to something else, um whereas a kitbash is more just...
00:38:36
Speaker
I guess, like, personalising something. Would you say they're completely different, or are they on a scale? I think, honestly, it's become a bit nebulous at this but this stage. because Sure. I would i would class like my Mega Gargons as kitbashers, but they also... None of the kits are Mega Gargons. Like, you can buy a Mega Gargons kit from Games Workshop, and it's a big giant dude with, like, gut on him and a big weapon. He's got sack full of people.
00:39:04
Speaker
He's got a sack full of people. He'll have some sort of club. none of my None of that army, I didn't use a single one of those. They are all totally different models. so so So a conversion usually, I guess to try and put some definition on it, is normally taking one kit and literally converting it to do something else. So the very common thing is you take a major Sigma thing or 40k thing and you convert it to function in the other game. So for example... yeah I've got ah a score of knobs that are in a different room so i won't grab them that are blood bowl black orcs but they've got I've put a power claw on one hand I've put a pistol on their hip and I've changed their headdress so they are now knobs and the common one with mega gargans that you see is people saw their arms off stick guns on them and play them as chaos knights
00:39:45
Speaker
That's a way that people normally convert MadGarGens into the other game system. So a conversion is normally with the aim of changing them to be something else. A kitbash can create a conversion, I guess. You can kitbash two things together to convert it.
00:39:57
Speaker
But I guess a kitbash doesn't necessarily have to have that conversion focus or plan. Yeah. it it does It does kind of feel it just feel a bit like a bit nebulous in a way where it's kind of one can kind of be the other but also not necessarily be like maybe like all kitbashes are conversions but not all conversions are I don't know. don't think it's too important to have to define it hard but i thought it'd be good to at least because I find myself doing this a lot saying terms that then someone's watching like what the fuck does that
Hobby Terminologies and Accessibility
00:40:25
Speaker
mean?
00:40:25
Speaker
Yes, yeah. and I mean, there's a lot of, especially in that side of the... When it comes to like the the building and painting side of the hobby, I feel like there's not quite like just as much...
00:40:38
Speaker
kind of innate language that you pick up, but but there can be. Yeah, I think so. Things like, oh, well, do you use Zenith or Highlight? It's like, well, if to someone who's just starting out, what does that mean? yeah what does that actually What does that actually mean in ah in a functional way? You've got tones that don't work compared to... You've got basing, and you're about playing or modelling, because that can mean to do two different things in those contexts.
00:40:59
Speaker
Someone mentioned rimming, and you're like, ooh-woo. It's just... There's a lot of terms that need explaining. Xenophil highlighting, glazing, layering, edge highlighting, um all sorts of shit. So absolutely, I think i think there's a lot of that. It happens in gaming too.
00:41:15
Speaker
the The lexicon that we get of like a brick of this or a... or um ah Crumping and all these terms that you come into the lobby They saw card games and you're like what the fuck Is that guy talking about I'm trying to make this accessible So if if I did that at any point Let me know because it means I've actually achieved At least one minor goal and done something anyway i know I'm quite bad for just like Throwing a term out because it just it just Becomes second nature doesn't it You just get used to yeah to saying stuff I think I've got a better perspective of this in Warhammer because I'm kind of new. I'm like four years back in now from COVID and stuff. But with with Magic, I'm very bad at it because it i'm I'm an old man.
00:41:50
Speaker
I've been playing for so long and I'm so long in the tooth that I'm just saying like... um' i'm i'm but I'm self-referencing jokes from the channel from six years ago. People are like, what the fuck's a machine gun bastard? I'm like, you only know this if you've watched an old video of mine. That's pretty bad. I need to get better at that. You mentioned conversions in the Soulplate Gravelords then. So are they, do how did that work for taking them to an event and playing them?
00:42:13
Speaker
for For the Soul Blight, it wasn't too bad. it wasn't like The Mega Gargants were way worse because they just have no resemblance to the actual models that Games Workshop have made for that army. And to someone who's Age age of Sigmar fresh, because I've just started getting into it, how many different Gargant data sheets or War Scrolls are there? How confusing can that be? believe at this point there's four. No.
00:42:35
Speaker
six okay different Mega Gargant War Scrolls. So you just walk up the table with your like thousand handed one and women screaming in a cell and you're like this one is Gargant Destroyer this one is Gargant Reaper or whatever.
00:42:47
Speaker
Yes, so I actually have a picture that I made and like I have an army list that I printed off and took with me for taking the Mega Gargons, which in fact I'll throw you over Discord because that could like put that in the description as an example of what you... you don't I don't think you necessarily have to. Yeah, yeah. Because immediately you're saying that, i'm like, that sounds like more work than I'm willing to do because cause I'm a lazy man.
00:43:08
Speaker
Well, i I just like, but as I was putting it together, i was like, I can't take... Like, with the Soulblight Gravelords, with that army, it's a bunch of dy it's a bunch of wolves who look like wolves, but they've got mushrooms growing out of them.
00:43:20
Speaker
It's like Lalkovai, who... She still looks like her. Like, the the top half of her is what it should be. I just didn't put the monster body on, and moved the wings up, and... Oh, sure, yes. that The half-woman, half-monster. Yes. Looks like a centaur almost in the original. Yeah, I made her, like, fly around on a big vortex of gore instead of having the monster body, but you could still clearly see it was her. Sure, sure. um And there was no zero complaints from people?
00:43:46
Speaker
No, all on the all on the right basis. is the only thing that The only things that caused confusion were the dragons that I took. So, funnily enough, it was a very monster-heavy list. There's sort of a theme that goes on with my army. Isn't that also metagame very strong?
00:44:00
Speaker
Wasn't one of the best armies in Age Sigmatic for ages, the the zombie dragon list? The Soulblight Gravelords were. the the um The Vampire Lord on zombie dragon, is I think, still is really good. many did you take? but Two? um I took one Vampire Lord on zombie dragon.
00:44:15
Speaker
ah a normal zombie dragon and a terrorgeist um which actually when that book came out it had only been out for like a month when that when that um face hammer happened um and it was the weakest like that that sub-faction was the weakest one there were people showing up with like really good armies of just filled with cavalry that did horrendous damage on the charge and all sorts of like really really good builds, and then there was me with the absolute weakest build you get out didn't accidentally show up with the better game army? No, I showed up and they were like, this is a really cool army. I don't think you're going to win anything. I did win one, so I'll take that. And that was also that that was my first experience actually playing Age of Sigmar, so that was a
Base Sizes and 'Counts As' in Gameplay
00:45:01
Speaker
fun way to... yeah a fun way to go in um but like the the dragons were the things that caused the most confusion because the ptergeist had two heads instead of one which then meant that a few people thought oh is that like a vampire lord but yeah because because because that's the thing there's certain like iconno not iconography what the world i'm looking for like visual design cues that i are meant to tell you what a thing is like Kairos, Fate, Weaver, the big bird demon in Fort Kairos, two heads, but the other ones don't.
00:45:27
Speaker
so if yeah So some people do build a Lord of Change with two heads, and then that can cause some confusion and stuff. Yeah, there was there was a few a few a few issues like that. Like the actual Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon, I changed it because I wanted it to be a bit more...
00:45:42
Speaker
The whole idea behind the army was like horrific hallucinations. So like the Die Wolves have got things growing out of their eye sockets and their ribcages and stuff. The Terrorgeist has got two heads and there's a giant mushroom growing out of one of the sockets. Inspired by the thing, I assume?
00:45:57
Speaker
Yeah, there was a bit of that. A bit of annihilation as well. A lot of annihilation, actually. Oh, yeah, okay. That kind of like just everything mushing into strange sort of blooming visuals and things. um So the Vampire Lord I didn't put on the back of the dragon, like riding it.
00:46:12
Speaker
It's at the end of the neck, so the torso leads into the neck and there's a bunch of hands coming out of the midriff, like hands and arms reaching down. And because the Vampire Lord wasn't on the dragon...
00:46:26
Speaker
people just forgot that it was a vampire lord and zombie dragon. Because she was at the front, not in the middle. They just did not register. that That's probably a really interesting takeaway from all this. so So firstly, before we move too far on, I just want to highlight how cool of a name the unit vampire lord on zombie dragon is.
00:46:43
Speaker
yeah Because it's really on the nose and it feels very classic Warhammer. Yeah, there's no disputing what that model is, what that unit is. It's much better than like exterminatus, liberatus, up my arses or whatever some of the like...
00:46:55
Speaker
the current like cast ones everything ends in all or us and i just i i don't know what anything's called it's just low gothic high gothic gobbledygook right and it happens with all factions anyway especially in 40k anyway so zombie lord sorry vampire lord and zombie dragon and yeah So I guess two takeaways, and interesting points to talk about there are like when kitbashing something up that you plan to play either just casually with your friends, because it does apply here, but also at events where you're meeting people that haven't played with you before, who are coming into the you want to go into ah a match with someone who's a stranger in a way that makes everyone feel relaxed. It doesn't feel like that you're trying to game the people.
00:47:32
Speaker
So, a few things about kit bashing. So firstly, we've mentioned it two or three times now, we haven't really explained it. Base sizes. Now, the reason base sizes matter in Age of Sigmar, for example, it's how much of a space you can hold up, how much of the objective you can block off from someone being on it, how many models you can come into contact with in melee.
00:47:49
Speaker
So bigger and smaller bases can give you advantages. a Smaller base means less of orcs can surround you to fight you. Bigger bases means you can, with a zombie dragon, for example, it's very hard to kill, it can cover a huge amount of the of the objective and stop people getting on it.
00:48:01
Speaker
So there's an argument that in 40k and AOS and all tabletop games, the base size and your footprint is really important to how playable or what your rules are. So if you go and kitbash something and absolutely fuck it by giving it three times the base size, I've got an example. Check this bad boy out.
00:48:19
Speaker
so Did you do the thing of going, i have this base, this will work, and then look at the rules and go, oh, no. Kinda. So getting into the hobby, I was getting back into Blood Angels, which will be a question we're going to come to at the end of the episode as well.
00:48:31
Speaker
And I owned too many Blood Angels, and wanted everything Blood Angels, because as a kid I couldn't afford anything, and now got disposable income. I'm like, give it to me. Anyway, the Sanguidor model sucks. but There's just no two ways about it. old fine cast piece of shit. So I'm like, I want to do my first full kit bash, which involves no parts from the Sanguidor.
00:48:46
Speaker
So I built this thing. but It's not ideal, it's not fantastic, but it's okay, it's fine. It's my first ever kit bash, and it's basically parts of Sanguador Guard, parts of some AOS kits, and all sorts of stuff, right? But this base size is literally twice the circumference of a Sanguador, because he's on like an old fine cast base. yeah And that matters a lot for all sorts of things. It can be an upside and a downside, because the Sanguador in the current rules, he comes out a Deep Strike. He heroically intervenes out Deep Strike. If you charge the Blood Angels, he can appear out of nowhere and join the fight, which is such a fucking sick rule.
00:49:14
Speaker
yeah but that means that when he lands and got a base this big you can position him in ways that mean that he's closer to multiple models than he should be able to be and that can fuck up how people move during combat we're getting really into the weeds of how 40k combat works something that i love but i understand the audience might be like finch shut the fuck up But he shouldn't a base this big I fucked it. And this guy's never seen play at event because I can't even, can't even be like, oh, by the way, just pretend the base is smaller because it just makes things so difficult.
00:49:39
Speaker
So be careful about base sizes. It's quite important. That is the main thing. Like i' I've made a similar mistake where i I built a bunch of things that I thought were cool. I didn't know what they were going to be. I just had a fun idea to take the Ambot kit. Oh, I don'm grapp i'm fucking love that kit.
00:49:57
Speaker
I wanted to make Meganobs out of that kit, but I never got around to it, and now I've got all these Meganobs made. I've got to find something else to make them into you now. So, this guy. It's the Ambot kit with a bunch of extras, obviously, but I wanted to make them taller, so I decided to see what would happen if I stacked the legs.
00:50:15
Speaker
Hmm. so that you're using both sets of legs out of that kit, but one on top of the other. which really raises the height of it. And then I decided that it would be fun to try and make them sort of steam... Like, someone like steampunk, like, magitek knight sort of feel to them. So there's, like, grey knight helmets in there. There's weapons from... I mean, there's a there's, like, a Deathwing mace. There's a Stormcast hammer of some kind.
00:50:39
Speaker
There's a bunch of warpstone from various Skaven things on the back of it. I mean, there's even stuff from, like, the yeah the stupid Khorne... The Lord of Skulls. Like, that... smokesta Did you buy a Lord of Skulls just for that smokestack?
00:50:53
Speaker
No, no, I bought a Lord of Skulls for my Slanesh Knights Force, because, you know, why wouldn't you? um yeah And I built it, and I put it on that base.
00:51:04
Speaker
And then I said, what could this be? what could What can I use this as? Because I want to make more of them. I've got like eight of these now. and to the but That base size like a Contemptor. but They don't exist in 40k anymore.
00:51:17
Speaker
But Contemptor Dreadnought size, right? It's not Redemptor, is it? It's a bit smaller? I think it is the Contemptor. Redemptor quite a big base. um But I was like, what could this be? What can I use this as?
00:51:28
Speaker
And I just went to just went to social media and said, what is this? This is the height of it. So this is the term used in the 40k sphere and in gaming as Counts As. yeah So you rock and you're this counts as X. And that means you've got a model that might look nothing like the original, which brings us back to some of the gameplay elements, but it counts as X. So two of my war bosses, a third party, no, it's the goth rocker with his guitar, with the head swap. That's one of my war bosses.
00:51:53
Speaker
And the other war boss is a third party guy screaming into a microphone. And my war bosses are like war singers. And I explained at the very beginning, the two guys holding guitars and microphones, they're the war bosses. They're counts as war bosses. Yeah. Can't do that at GW event though. Can't do that at an actual Warhammer World. They'll get really funny about third party, not quite the right stuff. If it's entirely GW parts, they don't have a problem with it.
00:52:15
Speaker
but if Oh, so so technically one of my Warbosses is legal because their head is from the Warboss on bike that is now Legends or whatever. Yeah, I think that would still be fine. But like for these, i was just like, I built them.
00:52:26
Speaker
so So is that Warhammer World legal? Yeah, all of this double of this is GW parts. You GW whore, Kiriath. Yeah, can't help myself. I've just got so much of it now. There's no... but there's no um but You're stuck in the ecosystem.
00:52:40
Speaker
Gargons, just normal gargons for AOS. Oh, the smaller ones. that Yeah, they're the right size for that. And I was like, okay, cool. what base What base size do they use? Having already you know built a bunch of them, they are on ovals and they are not this size. Yeah.
00:52:54
Speaker
so Oh, so social media wasn't very helpful. I've got to basically rebase all of them if I want to use them. But then they won't be cohesive with the rest of your your Gargan Force, because your Gargan Force is very eldritch horror, very bloodborne boss. Well, that's the that's the thing. I technically have two Gargan Armies for AOS at this point, because I've got the sort of Steam Magitech, sort of Warpstone-powered...
00:53:17
Speaker
robot knights yeah and then i've got a bunch of lovecraftian nonsense as well so i've got the same army twice but also given that these are these are the smaller ones like the play style of having a bunch of small gargons compared to having four big ones is quite different so i could actually have quite ah a bit of a different experience yeah absolutely i do taking the bases off eight of these things and then replacing them with ovals that sounds like a fucking nightmare That's why I haven't done it. It's been years and I'm just like, i i can't think of anything more annoying. or like, kind of soul-destroying because these, I was really happy with the bases on them.
00:53:52
Speaker
And also was like, ah one day, I'll get around to it. play um the Talons of Slaanesh or whatever. He's one of the big fans of like, blue, oh mine's blue behind it.
00:54:03
Speaker
They never got 40k rules and i love those models so I bought one, built it, painted it up and then I play it as a Shalaxy. But the problem is it's on the wrong base. The the profiles, so I'm modelling for disadvantage because it's too big. It be seen around corners that Shalaxy couldn't because arse is so big.
00:54:17
Speaker
And then I just, for the event that I played it in, I blue tacked it. I completely understood that this wasn't I might not get best painted for this. I think someone could argue shouldn't get fully painted, but blew a tactic to a different base. The base blew a tactic to was fully painted.
00:54:29
Speaker
was like a temple base for one of dreadnoughts. I blew tactic to that so I had the correct circle underneath it and just put it like that because it's on an oval. So you can do stuff like that. The other thing about Council as, and your Mega Gargons are a good example of this, is walking up to an event, saying things as X, and then it's... But there is X, Y, and Z that are all similar looking, similarly named shit.
00:54:48
Speaker
And your opponent, who doesn't even know what Gargons do, is now like, i don't know what any of this does. Like, yeah there is an element of with kitbashes and counts as that you should try and make your models recognisable. Because there's a visual language in 40k, right?
00:55:00
Speaker
Like, you know the profile of a unit. You know what colours and helmets and guns mean some sometimes. A lot of alien factions, no one knows what any of the guns are, right? It's always like, your guns aren't correct on your orcs. I'm like like, fuck, you know what a mega blaster is compared to a mega zapper?
00:55:15
Speaker
Get the fuck out of here. yep Yeah, yeah. So there is an element of that, but I think if you just communicate with your opponent, if you just talk to them, like, I clearly explain things as we go quite regularly. If people have kitbashes in my army, I'm like, don't forget, this is X, and this can do y Like, yeah you can't be a gamey prick and stay quiet and then catch people out with stuff, because then you're really fucking them, because, like, the visual language is also leading them down a garden path, which isn't fair. Yeah, that's that's one of the reasons that I made that that kind of, that sheet saying what each...
00:55:45
Speaker
Megagarden was in the book. I also, whenever they whenever were like it came to deciding what they were going to charge at or shoot at or whatever... ah straight away i be like so remember this is this type this is this type this is this type and then if the if the response was can you remind me what that does again it's like yeah no that's fine that one has got a ranged attack that one doesn't so like trying to make sure you're on top of like because i can't like as i was making that army i was fully aware that it doesn't follow the visual language of the actual models it's being used for at all it just doesn't i mean two of the four models in there have wings and
00:56:23
Speaker
Megagogans don't fly. They have no fly speed. There's movement speed. Scarbrand has wings and he can't fly. Yeah, it's true. But it's like i can't i can't have this like, I can't have this big winged creature that looks like it should have a super high movement speed on like a big pile of rubble to get the right height and then not tell people this only has a movement speed of this. Because if you look at it and you're not like familiar with the army...
00:56:48
Speaker
And even being familiar with the army doesn't help when things are that far removed. like Yes. i you know i I played against someone who had a a Sons of Behrman army, and they just they were like, this is amazing. What are any of these? And I was like, that's why I have this. And just yeah I printed out enough for everyone to have. think you did good due diligence there by bringing that. That's like a ah good bit of sportsmanship, in a sense. I feel like you've... if you're going to go that far with it, because there's, there's, I think there is a difference between this was a, say this was a Stormcast Eternal and now he's a super fancy, I don't know, custodes leader of some kind.
00:57:25
Speaker
The visual language is similar. As long as you've got the right weapon on it, Most people will able to look at that and go, okay. mean, be fair, I'm pretty fucking WYSIWYG is bollocks too. Like, this is something that going to get, maybe you want to come on and debate. want to get Mikey on to do like a debate episode because he's so fucking anal about WYSIWYG. I've got an AT-ST, I won't grab it because it's up there.
00:57:45
Speaker
That's got like a claw on it and gun on it. It's painted, yeah, it's got orc shit slapped on it. He's like, it's not a Morkonaut because it's the claw's too small. like, shut the fuck up. It's obviously a Morkonaut. It's a big walking robot with claws and guns.
00:57:57
Speaker
I'm absolutely not that. I mean, I've got... There's a two of the tanks on my desk at the moment. There's this one. So that's a Lehman Russ. Yeah, which the double plasma exterminator cannon does not exist in 40k. Yeah, no, that that's not a thing. But you can have a sponson on either side with a plasma cannon on either side. Right.
00:58:14
Speaker
so that's oh your plan is to play that as double plasma cannon and plasma turret or whatever yeah because it's got it's got two lots of plasma yeah the one counts for the sponsons one is the main gun yeah that but there's no so you've actually done more WYSIWYG with that than you might first think because you've thought about what sponsons are I try and make sure that at least they're at least represented on the model. Like the Bane Blade that's up there, technically it has an extra heavy bolter because it looked cool to put the turret where I put it. So to explain people at home why this stuff matters, because like especially at tournament play, but even if you're just playing casually, like having people tell what your models have got is helpful for the game to flow because Wham is so needlessly complicated.
00:58:56
Speaker
It's so overtly, you know, explicitly complex that having something to simplify it down by looking at model or going, oh, that's got a flame or that's got a bulk on or whatever, does help. Absolutely do agree.
00:59:06
Speaker
I also think that the hobby is so fucking cumbersome and slow to get anything onto the tabletop. Hobby lag, ah money, cost, time, energy. was talking about earlier, the you know, the the hobbyist who gets home and...
00:59:20
Speaker
she, he, they, they they sit down and they're like, I've got an hour and I'm not gonna get these fucking models done to play an event. It's really sad to take those people and force them to have to WYSIWYG everything to the extent that it's almost like a barrier to entry that's, it's to an extent it's ableist, it's it's got a privilege element to it where then the people who are part of like competitive teams or content creators or whatever have so much more time, energy and resources to make their things WYSIWYG or to have these options.
00:59:48
Speaker
So like average Joe who works their nine to five and this is their hobby, they're like, oh, I i can't actually keep up with the metagame or I can't adjust. And I'm not just saying chasing the most powerful thing. I'm talking about like if there's loads of three wound models in 40k now, you might want plasma cannons that do three damage.
01:00:03
Speaker
And then they're like, none of Lehman Rush is a model like that and so on and so on. So there are elements like that. There are arguments for and that's why i'm going to do a whole episode on that. But I also think ultimately my goal is to let people play the fucking game in a way that's manageable.
01:00:15
Speaker
Yeah. And I think WYSIWYG is actually quite counterintuitive to that. But also when you slap on top the wild kitbashes that you're doing, and my kitbashes that are bit zany, like the AT-ST does look fucking derpy and weird.
Content Creation Pressure and Gameplay
01:00:28
Speaker
yeah But I also think you should reward that creativity in the hobby. Yeah, yeah, 100%. Like, it's it's kind of...
01:00:36
Speaker
It's trying to make it for me. It's always like, how can I make this clear as to what this is while still getting to do what I want? Like that, that's, that's kind of what it boils down to. It's like with a lot of the, the Lehman Rust tanks that I've got, um, they, they have mostly the correct loadout, but,
01:00:51
Speaker
but they'll be represented in different ways. Like, there's a Punisher version of that plasma tank that's got two Punisher cannons, because it's got a Punisher cannon on the turret, but it's got three heavy bolters as well. Now, technically, it hasn't got the sponsons, but to me, it's like, you see a tank with two Gatling cannons attached to it, your i would I would hope that your thought would be...
01:01:13
Speaker
Yeah, that probably pumps out a lot of shots, which is exactly what that profile does. That's very different from you saying, by the way, this has um three last cannons on it. You're like, sorry, what? That doesn't really make lot of sense. Yeah, that's true. but I'm saying you're doing the right thing because you're making it a visual language that fits or it'll tell something.
01:01:30
Speaker
Because there is none of that. I'm not saying that you should lock up to an event and expect people to be happy when you go, oh, my 10 Invernus Marines all have different weapons and it's actually a Sturnguard veteran squad. And you're like, scurvy, what?
01:01:41
Speaker
Firstly, the name's nonsense. And secondly, you wouldn't know what any of those fucking guns are. So I absolutely agree with that. But when you lock up, one thing's going to happen with me is that my orcs aren't quite all clawed up. Some them are weird power weapons. Some of them are power weapons from other armies.
01:01:53
Speaker
I'm like, army-wide, every knob has a claw. And if they're in mega armor, they might also have a saw. So they can yeah move it between the two profiles. That's so clear that I'm not... It's not to distract anyone. It's just to not punish me for having things from last edition or punish me for kitbashing something. Because so some of my kitbashes are...
01:02:11
Speaker
This guy's in... Sorry again to Spotify listeners. This is like a running... joe im I might have a t-shirt printed. Sorry to Spotify listeners. He's got a saw here. He's got a bolt gun attached to the saw. And his other arm is like a rocket slash claw thing. And his armour is like cataphracty armour from the Heresy.
01:02:27
Speaker
So he has like seven different parts of different kits. And I'm just going he's clawing saw. Like everyone is. like Yeah. Don't punish It's a lot easier to just go, this is they've got. And the thing is, yeah sometimes it can be a thing of like, i can't remember what that unit does.
01:02:42
Speaker
You can look at them and then you might know what they do immediately. But then you can also just go, can you remind me? yeah like i Yeah. I mean, to be honest, I'm prone to doing that anyway because I i i think I have a... like a ah I think I have like a limit on information I can take sure when playing games. Warhammer is so testing. Yeah, exactly. Warhammer is very testing on all that as well, right? It's also to go somewhere, communicate to someone you never met, and then remember and explain the rules. for like oh yeah Yeah. I mean, even with even with people that I like i know and you know I'm friends with, like there's ah there's a ah lost like a lost battle report that I did with Mikey.
01:03:20
Speaker
where, i for whatever reason, partway through, i just fully forgot like a core ah core rule for my Soul Black Gravelords. Just never used it. yeah It's like one of the foundations of the army. It's what makes it do what it does.
01:03:35
Speaker
And I just fully forgot, because to me, it had gone from... It's like I remembered that we were recording it. It was like, okay, I'm having a fun game with my friend. This is cool. But then at some point, the back of my head went, no, no, this is content.
01:03:48
Speaker
At which point, my brain just went, I i can't do that. I can't i can't do the on-camera thing and play at the same time. That's not possible. That's very fair.
01:04:01
Speaker
The thing is, I'd already done one with him. So it made no sense. like We'd already had battle report that we'd done together. I'd done one Winters like a few weeks before. So it was all like... I'm obviously capable of doing that because I'd already done it, but just on that day, some there's a little switch that just went, and you can't do that now. It's choking a lot of plates, right? We talked about this before we turned the cameras on today. like Content creating is often spinning plates. and then um So I've just already commented about how Warhammer is intense for what it asks of you to remember and do. And then on top of that, you content you're doing content as well.
01:04:30
Speaker
I don't think that's i think it's unreasonable. or The thing is, the audience don't always think that way. do they not not Some of them will understand it. Some of them will comment, but like I can't believe you forgot your core role or whatever. You're like, cut me some fucking slack here, dude. but um those sir I don't know.
01:04:45
Speaker
ah but When we did that God Tier tournament together, there was there was a moment that I think, I don't know whether it was fully captured on the on the stream or not, but... I was playing against ah Discourse Minis on the stream of the first game, and i was enjoying myself. It was all good, and there were some issues with the microphones, and Mikey came in to say something about it, and he made just the most like supportive offhand comment, because he knows that I struggle with anxiety and stuff.
01:05:11
Speaker
And it was like, this this this looks great. it looks like you're having a really good time. This is awesome. And as soon as he said it, the self-awareness just went haywire.
01:05:22
Speaker
it but It went from, it looks like I'm having a good time because I'm enjoying myself, to I need to make sure that I'm looking like I'm having a good time. And you like there was literally... Sometimes it's best forget, right? Sometimes it's best not to have it in the forefront of your mind.
01:05:36
Speaker
Felt my entire face go from smiling to just like deer in the headlights. This is now pressure. What do I do? And then I lost it for the rest of that but that game. I just didn't know what I was doing because I was like, I forgot why everything does.
01:05:51
Speaker
There's a camera. I know there's a camera there now. It was there the whole time. It was fine. I don't
Model Standards and Personal Style
01:05:55
Speaker
know what's happening. I get that playing 40k. In fact, any sort of like... tabletop game, I still get it sometimes.
01:06:01
Speaker
So when it comes to, like, with the thing of what see is what you get when it comes to extensive conversions or kitbashes, I always am just in the boat of, well, I need to be able to say, how does that work again?
01:06:14
Speaker
because there's a chance that even if you have exactly what you're supposed to have i might forget what that does and it's not a case of sitting there going i'm not going to learn anything ever it's just the information just drops that's a that's a good point about the whole like um making it clear to your opponent like like i said with all weaponry and elder weaponry people don't know what the fuck things are anyway so like how important is that but on the wizzy wig thing on on a point for helping with the wizzy wig you're talking about like ah the stresses, the social anxieties, they're trying to figure out and remember stuff.
01:06:42
Speaker
Having all your models just have on them what they're meant to have can be helpful for you too. So you can look at a unit and be like, without checking the app or your or your army roster or whatever, you can look at a squad like, oh that's the one with the power fist.
01:06:55
Speaker
Although yeah my ah advice for that would be to try and standardise all your squads to have all the similar similar stuff. So if you've got 10 squads of boys, they want to one rocket launcher, one claw, or whatever. And then the problem with that is that people don't have that stuff modelled. So then we're back to this point of...
01:07:07
Speaker
Being a bit more lazy, fair, and whizzy, allows you to have that sort of thing. um Especially if things represent stuff. So there's one orc in the squad with a big fucking thing, they're all rocket launchers. I'm not saying you should rock up with a guy with a sword and a pistol, and he's like, that guy's got a rocket launcher, because that's a little bit... Because that can be games too, because you're like, oh I didn't pick the rocket launcher guy out when things died and stuff.
01:07:28
Speaker
I get there's a lot to it, and I i the thing is i think a lot of comp players going to disagree with me on this, but I just really like the idea that anyone can rock up and play games. I think painting standards are bullshit. That's not what this episode's about, but I think forcing people to paint to a certain standard is just bollocks because some people don't like painting.
01:07:45
Speaker
ah Yeah, I think like having the the move they've made to it being like a Sorry, my light is absolutely it's collapsing and I don't know what it's doing um So yeah, I think for for some of the I'm not always split between it because for me a game doesn't look as good if things aren't painted Sure And i i like I like things to be painted for like the immersion factor of it too As much as you get that Don't get me wrong, i love that.
01:08:13
Speaker
Like, i love two-paid armies. I try to get all my stuff pated playing casual games if i can. But at the same time, i'm i'm like I think we're both like in quite a lucky position where we can we have the time to sit and do it, and it it can literally be classed as part of the job. Yes. And if someone like came to a game with me and they were like, look, this is a fairly new army.
01:08:36
Speaker
i know half of it is just prime black, but I just haven't had time. that's That's fine. yeah it's like it's it's a hot it's It's a hobby. there's If you can spare a bunch of time for your hobby, then that's brilliant. Not just for like the game we're about to have, but also for you personally.
01:08:53
Speaker
But if if you've been working like overtime for the last two weeks and you haven't got it finished, I don't think someone should sit there and go, well, you've not put enough effort in, so I'm afraid penalise you. It's like, no, that's not how life works. What are talking about, And also, like, in a tournament setting, especially, it's like, you're meant to be playing the game against other. It's not a golden demon.
01:09:13
Speaker
Like, ah gold this is the joke I always and I'm going to keep making it until people adopt it You don't ask golden demon players to play a round of Warhammer 40k before they submit their painting. So why the fuck do you ask Warhammer 40k players in a tournament to make sure that they base and paint at the minimum of... Because the minimum three-color thing doesn't even achieve what people say. Because I've played people who obviously do know don't like painting, and their armies look very bad because they have just...
01:09:35
Speaker
sprayed them a colour out of a can and dry brushed their heads and then put a bit of black on their gun. i've so Like, there are top-tier English players who do that because don't like painting. So, like, the three minimum standard stuff doesn't even get you there. Anyway, that's perhaps... There's schemes that don't even feel like they have, like... They do have, like, the three colour minimum standard, but, like, I mean, okay, this thing, this ridiculous Banesword, right? Mm-hmm.
01:10:02
Speaker
Again, heavily heavily altered. Trying to get that gun to stay in that hull when that is a square opening and the gun... Sorry, that's like a sort of a bleak angled opening and the gun is mostly round.
01:10:14
Speaker
Quite an experience trying to get that to fit and stay in there. um This is going to be nicely white. It looks dope though. I love the front bulldozer blade things. That was such a late addition, I'm really glad I did that. But this is going to be mostly white. So the colour scheme for the Armoured Company, which is literally just Imperial Guard tanks and nothing else, is a mix of this kind of cream white and blue. So you can see with that one, there's blue at the back, there's white at the front. With some of the others, it's more mottled, so it looks a bit more cloudy or a bit more sort of camo-y.
01:10:47
Speaker
um And it just depends on which way round I fancy doing it at the time. You've got to play with it now before they like remove the ability to play only armor. Because at the moment that's doable, but you can guarantee XI Federation they'll introduce troop taxes again because they always whack some weight on stuff.
01:11:02
Speaker
If they do that, I'm going to be so sad because my entire the entire army is just tanks. But like that that big Bane sword is going to be primarily white. I'm not going to do any blue on it because I've got other tanks that are mostly blue. I've got another like bain i've got a ban blade that is the mix of the two. i want there to be a contrast. The theme is haunting, right?
01:11:22
Speaker
The theme is haunting? Okay, hear me out. I know it's only tanks at the moment, and you don't even have to do this in necessarily until they ask you to. How about ghost infantry? And I'm talking the little ghosty people from um AOS. What the fuck are they called?
01:11:37
Speaker
Oh, the Nighthorns. Yeah, Nighthorn. But you put little like ah English World War II little hats on them, and they've got muskets, and that's that that could be your troops. really like that idea, actually. like Just ghost men.
01:11:51
Speaker
Yeah, that would be really fun. That would fit as well. There's an idea. There's an idea for you. It's not going to look like it's got the three colour minimum on it. It's going to be white with weathering, and there's going to be a bit of metal, and the candles are going to have to have some yellow and orange. My microstate the same. There's like a purple hair, and they're gold with like ah like a wash and a dry brush. There's like at least four colours on the minimum, and the blade's blue, but they don't they still look...
01:12:15
Speaker
because they've been spent I don't know there's just some colour schemes that don't look that like complex just fucking let people play play like if they want to play let them play if they want to play let them play and the two should not be mixed well they can be mixed I mix both but anyway okay so I think we've given people some good starts for kit bashing in terms of how to play with this stuff How did you start kit bashing? What was your first kit bash?
01:12:38
Speaker
Oh, the first one. Because one of my patrons asked, we have patron questions we're coming to now. and One of them asked, what was the first model you painted? That's from Tape Deckard. He's got another question, but come to the second. But I think it's more interestingly, what was the first thing you kit bashed?
01:12:51
Speaker
The first thing I kitbashed was an Iron Warrior a squad leader. So I had a squad of 10 Chaos Space Marines and the leader had a chainsword and bolt pistol and I wanted him to have a bigger chainsword and I had a spare bit of like a spare chainsword. You gave him an orc stomp a chainsword so it was like 15 times his size.
01:13:12
Speaker
Oh yeah, it was massive. And he was still only holding it in one hand, and because I didn't know what I was doing, and I was a lot younger, because this was in like third edition, um I think to be honest, I was probably still a little too old to be doing as bad a job as I did, but it was also like one of the first boxes I ever bought.
01:13:29
Speaker
um So I just took the the blade of one chainsaw, chopped the end off the other one, and stuck them together. So they were like, that? That? totally wonky I then tried to give it a cool flame paint job on the side but I didn't know how to paint so it was just like a layer of red then of orange then of yellow no blending looked absolutely terrible course I've still got it somewhere um and I was like like okay now this guy looks different to the other squad leader what can I do to make that guy look different to the other guy next to him though because they look really similar unlocks something primal in you
01:14:03
Speaker
Yeah, um from that point on it was just, okay, well I i could just leave this how it is, but i can I can do things to make it look more interesting, and if someone has this army, like, has a similar army to mine, then mine will also look a little bit different because it'll have different aspects to it that theirs won't have.
01:14:19
Speaker
think that's one of the driving forces, right, is to make your army unique compared to others. but Even you look up and see someone with the same... least it is for me, who has the same paint scheme as mine. I want them to have different helmets and heads and their weapons look slightly different and their backpacks look slightly different. theyre basically you like that that That's one of the driving forces behind playing with miniatures is to make them look like mine. Yeah, it's it's it's your it's your thing. It's like your interpretation. It's kind of... ah kind of i don't know whether it sounds like melodramatic or maybe even pretentious, but I feel like...
01:14:52
Speaker
The armies that you that you make, there's there's definitely something of like there's something of you that goes into it. <unk>re You're kind of displaying a bit of yourself, even if it's just like a bit of like the creative process that you use. There's a bit of you that goes into any given project.
01:15:07
Speaker
you know For people who... for people who just go super hardcore, competitive, you know, they're not fussed about painting or anything, or kitbashing, there's still a bit of them in the army that they've got, because their army is, like, the sleekest, most streamlined, you know, best version of what that army can be. And play stars, too. You might pick something that's very aggressive, because that's how you like to play.
01:15:31
Speaker
Yeah. yeah Yeah. I feel like there's there's a lot of, like... Your personal interests, how you how you like to build things, certain colour schemes, i mean I find that colour scheme-wise, I have to force myself out of comfort zones to to manage to paint things differently. like Part of the the army company was forcing myself to not fall back on just making metallic tanks with red accents everywhere, because I like that colour scheme.
01:15:57
Speaker
Or using like turquoise colours for things, because I like that combined with... like iron colours and stuff, I fall back on certain things over and over again because I just prefer that type of scheme.
01:16:10
Speaker
yeah So you kind of have to occasionally push yourself out to focus on something. still fucking do it now. I still default to doing red on... Because I've painted so many Blood Angels. i'm like, oh, I'll do this red accent colour. I'll do this red cape. I'll do this... i like Stop using red, Vince.
01:16:22
Speaker
Jesus Christ. want to get used to and then, like, you know that if you do that, it's going to look good. so Yeah, yeah. Because when you first paint a purple and you're like... Oh, how the, what, what is my mid-tone? Well, how do I, how do I highlight this? but I don't understand what I'm doing. Cause you've watched so many Darren Lantham and like tutorials of a, of a certain way, you know?
01:16:43
Speaker
Yeah, it's it's very much like any given army just kind of starts out with a what would be fun? Like, what would be fun to make? Not, like, necessarily what would be good on the tabletop. That never comes into it. Like, I i enter most games knowing full well I'm probably going to lose this just from the jump because there's no
Army Composition and Play Style
01:17:02
Speaker
synergy here. It's just...
01:17:04
Speaker
That's an interesting one because Tate Deckard asks, the other part of his question that asked, the it's like, what armies do you think are the best to paint and which ones you think are the best to learn or easiest to learn? But like, because you said about how like,
01:17:16
Speaker
but The armies you pick and the armies you build the armies you customize and the armies you paint, they're an extension of how you want to play a game. i find it really hard to be like, you should try X or Y because they're easiest or whatever.
01:17:27
Speaker
Because like yeah knights have less models to remember and custodians have less models to remember and marines are easy as a paint. But I don't necessarily think like directing people to those all the time is the best thing to do. Especially if you want to be creative like we're discussing.
01:17:41
Speaker
Yeah, you've also got to have things that like interest you. like If the idea of going for something simple works for you, one of the reasons I like the Soulblight army that I took to Facehammer the first time I went is that it was very simple.
01:17:54
Speaker
There's not much like going on. Vampire Lord and Zombie Dragon. It's your name. bunch of dragons that fly in and then there's a bunch of wolves that run in and a bunch of bats that fly in and they are all like pretty much exclusively melee there's just a few kind of was that your was that your notes was it so you can remember how to play fly one fly like i can do pretty much it was it was just keep the small things in front of the big things until you get to a point where the big things can really hurt people that was pretty much that sounds like you know a bit more about aos than you let on because that you're screening and noobies don't know what that is
01:18:28
Speaker
The thing is, i I was directed to screen. So when I was building the army, I was talking to ah to Russ and Byron from Facehammer. I did an episode of their podcast where we sort of built the list together.
01:18:40
Speaker
And initially, i was just going to go, all monsters, that was it. And they were like... maybe have a wall of meat monsters maybe do some just you know maybe do some screening you want to make sure that you don't lose your monsters instantly which you will do if you have four of those and nothing else that's why for your armored company you need little ghost men to stand in the lines the orcs can't get to the bane bites well that's the thing the bane blades stay at the back and the lehman russes act as the screen you don't need a wall of ghost meat
01:19:11
Speaker
I mean, to honest, I probably do.
Tank Models and Strategic Decisions
01:19:13
Speaker
And also, the Baneblades, from what I understand, um because I haven't played for a little bit, I've been very D&D heavy and a bit more yeah AOS heavy. I don't even know that the Baneblades can really move with the current... In current tournament terrain, no, not really. they don't know They also don't have the special rules to climb over four-inch buildings. on the stop Like Stompers and Morkonauts and Knights and similar can all climb over four-inch or lower buildings.
01:19:35
Speaker
The Baneblades don't get that privilege. And also in tournament... They drive through it. Yeah, maybe they should have some sort breaching mobility for smaller terrain pieces or something, but... There was a kid at a Baneblade at a local event that was playing, and it just sort of like, it drove up the side of the map because it couldn't fit in it couldn't turn. There wasn't enough space for it turn.
01:19:53
Speaker
And then, yeah, he did okay, I think. A Baneblade's still going to shoot stuff, you know, and it's got reasonable guns. That's... That's the thing, though. It's like, I know they're not good, and yet I have a Baneblade a Banesword in the current list. Have you not done a Roguel Dawn yet? Speaking of big tanks, if you not got Roguel Dawn for your own company? Well, I mean, I haven't built one yet.
01:20:12
Speaker
I would be lying if I said I didn't own two. Did you buy the Battleforce? I haven't built them. I got them from someone who broke down the Battleforce. They didn't want the tanks. They were like, do you want these? It's like...
01:20:23
Speaker
Yeah. they the cools why have mon out I haven't built my Regal Dawns yet. I built load of the troops. I'm going to build the Regal Dawns soon. I built some Demon Rustas for the first time last week. and They're not... But they date they're dated. but Yeah, so so definitely boy I had a really interesting experience. I'm going to wind the podcast down, but coming from another anecdote.
01:20:40
Speaker
I built the original Lehman Russ model, and then I built the new Heresy Solar Auxiliary Punisher model. And it's just interesting see the differences of, like, yeah, the age of the first one. But I think the Lehman Russ kit still stands up, but but that's because you can customise it quite a bit, and you can...
01:20:56
Speaker
build a little tank commander on top i can't complain about it because i've built 10 of them so yeah it's just like the thing is i don't know that if i ever got any more which ah to be honest i probably will most because i want the solar auxilia version because i it's pretty it's got all like not filigree but it's got like metal banding around it and stuff i i annoyingly think i prefer the sides of it you can see more of the suspension and the track but it comes with no fucking sponsons Yeah. But, but as you've got, if you built 10 Lehman Russes, you should have some spare sponsors somewhere because some of yours don't have them and they all come with two. Did people know this?
01:21:30
Speaker
The Lehman Russ tank comes with two sets of sponsors, like on the sprue. That's why when you go on eBay, you can buy so many spare sponsors. Yeah, it's super handy.
01:21:40
Speaker
How the fuck are there spares? Print them as well. Yeah, you can just print them as well. I like recessed ones now. there's there's I need to print some, but I found some STLs for the recessed sponsors instead, which I really like the look of those. So if I do end up going for... utter I mean, why do you need more than 10? mean, I only got 10 because that's how many you could fit into 2,000 points. there I think there are 160 points right now, so I think you can fit more than 10 into the current game.
01:22:06
Speaker
Hang on, I'm checking it live on the stream, ah on the on the podcast. I'm pretty sure they're 160 now. So you're actually a little bit short. You've got 400 points to play with. I mean, with the Bane Sword and the Bane Blade, that accounts for nearly 1,000. I've got... sorry. got points left.
01:22:25
Speaker
Yeah, that's not... That's a Rogal Dawn, I think. I think a Rogal Dawn's only like $2.80 or something. $2.60, Rogal Dawn, I think. They're cheap. I also... I kind of want to get the Makarius and use it as... The what, what?
01:22:37
Speaker
Oh, the Transport. The Solar Axelia Makarius. Yeah. the... It's the... It used to be a Forge World model, not the Dracosan Transport. it's like ah It's another tank. It's like a kind of medium... As in the Malkador chassis, is it?
01:22:51
Speaker
Or not? Is it the Malkador? It might be the Malkador I'm thinking of, not the Macarius. Yeah, because it's named after Malkador, man, it? Yeah, no, I'm thinking of a different Forge World tank. There's so many that I've just been coveting for so long. Well, joked earlier also about the stupid fucking names, so how how can you get these right? But um the Transport... Yeah, blokes whose names are also nonsense. They're all like superhero names in Logothic or whatever. um the The transport in that box that I really wanted to get to make into an Orc battle wagon, but I was like, I don't know if I ever need two Orc battle wagons.
01:23:20
Speaker
But stop making Orc transports. Stop it. See, I would just run two for the fun of running. so like that's well That's basically how every single army is. It's just like, if I could make two cool versions of this and I can run two, I will do that. They are pretty like fucking king good. So maybe i should make a second Batwagon. My first Batwagon, I should finish it. i Check this out.
01:23:42
Speaker
I started building it last week. It's a tricky bit. Yeah. That's it. It's quite funny that you can build, the for those of you can't see, on Spotify users, I'm sorry. It's a flat panel with wheels on it. And I didn't realise that's how you could stop at that point, which is really interesting. so always feel that they're bigger than that, and I don't know why. I think it's just the frame gives it more space. but What I'm thinking for the battle wagons now is might buy a second one, build this one normally, then for the second one, build this part, build this at the top part, put the top part on a rubber dinghy,
01:24:10
Speaker
that I got off my carboot sale, okay? yeah And then um I'll have one that looks like it's a boat, and then this bit, I can stick other things onto it and make this into like a... And then I've got like three battle wagons for the price of two, and dingy for my carboot sale.
01:24:24
Speaker
I mean, it kind of feels like you need three battle wagons. Well, they're really fucking good in the current rules too, so maybe I could find a list for it. At some point, I need to dig out or replace... I had a little... One of the one of my favourite features from that Baneblade up there, that one there, is that you can take the back off it. So i i based that vehicle off someone's artwork, an artist called Mike Franchino, who does Trench Crusade. Have you seen the artwork he's done for... So he he's kind of got this universe that he's setting up that I think is being developed into an actual...
01:24:59
Speaker
like tabletop game at this stage okay which is it's kind of it's called the trench crusades and there's like kind of heavy Christian iconography but fighting demons and you've got warriors with swords but you've also got guys in like gas masks and trench coats carrying flamethrowers with it sounds like you're describing without I'm looking at and my other monitor so i'm I'm with you but does sound like you're describing It does kind of sound very much like that.
01:25:24
Speaker
um But he did a he did a some art of a tank called the Hammer of Witches. And I really liked the look of this tank. And I had a Baneblade chassis that I'd started building for my... um For...
01:25:37
Speaker
the emperor's children that never really went anywhere um because i was going to make it into a big sound stage and have a bunch of you know noise marines rocking out on it sure and i got part way through and i just didn't like the way it was going and i kind of shelved it for a bit and i was like i'll i'll do something with that later but i'm just not feeling it's just not working out apparently this uh trench crusade from the designer of maudheim the creator of maudheim Oh, interesting. I didn't realise that he'd got that far.
01:26:02
Speaker
So it sounds like it's actually quite a big deal in a way. Yeah. That's made me more excited. I've got some miniatures for it on the way, hopefully, at some point. Are they doing miniatures for it? Is it miniature agnostic?
01:26:16
Speaker
They're doing miniatures for it. Okay, yeah, these measures are sick. The guy with the Christian tollpoint church helmet and shit. Yeah, it's it's really... i just really like... His style is really good and the kind of overall theme of it is really fun. But like that Baneblade was supposed to be a big soundstage, so I made space in it by cutting a little bit away on the inside to put a little Bluetooth
Unique Model Creations and Personal Storytelling
01:26:36
Speaker
speaker in.
01:26:36
Speaker
Sure. So that whilst it was on the table, you could you know it could rock out as it goes. But then, because I didn't do that in the end, because I just didn't like the way it was going, I saw this artwork for this this tank called the Hammer of Witches that he did, and I just had one those moments where i went, I want to make that.
01:26:54
Speaker
I want to make like a super heavy version of that. I wonder if I can take this... I've got like still got all the parts for the Baneblade. Can I make like a super heavy version of this? What, with a cathedral on it, back of it? Have you done this yet?
01:27:06
Speaker
So I've got it, just emphatic. Show me. And the YouTube viewers, but not the Spotify viewers. I'm whacking the vulture with it. So...
01:27:19
Speaker
that it's Technically, the layout is not Baneblade because in't got a turret, but it still counts as a Baneblade. um Counts out. It's got a bunch of braking wheels on the back, which I had to look up what they were because his artwork has got these sort of struts with wheels with people like crunched all over them. Yeah. So I basically took the artwork and made a Baneblade version of it.
01:27:44
Speaker
But it's still got the thing that it had from when it was supposed to be a soundstage. So you can take that off, and then inside, there's space for a little Bluetooth put a Bluetooth speaker in it and have it play people screaming.
01:27:57
Speaker
Pretty much. That or Powerwolf. I don't know which way to go with it. Because it's quite like... ah That's kind of the whole aesthetic is where this force came from, because I just saw that, wanted to do a version of it. Because I've wanted to do some form of church-like Baneblade or Knight to go with my sisters, because like the exorcist is cool and everything, and stained glass, but there' there isn't enough actual moving cathedrals outside of like the huge Knights and Titans and the Titans in 40k. So I always wanted to do one that... This is like a pipe dream that I've still not got around to. I bought the Knight and everything, which was...
01:28:31
Speaker
um build the knight, have it flat-topped somehow, maybe sand it down, put some plastic card on it, put some cork on it, put some mud texture on it, and then put the Sisters Battle Sanctum on top of the mud texture.
01:28:42
Speaker
So basically you got a knight that has a cathedral on top of it, complete with dirt and mud and graveyard, And then have it painted as if it's come out of the ground. So it was like the cathedral was built on top of the night.
01:28:53
Speaker
And then when the night is used, it lands. Again, pipe dream shit. But i just I just basically, I want a big fucking church on top of something. And then the other option is a Baneblade because then it'll be literally just a moving church. It'll look like a terrain piece, but it's got a cannon poking out of it.
01:29:07
Speaker
that's i there's i I haven't told my own ah my own views about this yet because I'll be told off but there's another Baneblade over there which I haven't put together but how many Baneblades are you up to now?
01:29:21
Speaker
Only three only three so it's not i mean you don't need three i say i think you need to I think you need enough that each Lehman can have a friend Well, I did think, like, once I've done... Because I had a similar idea of, like like, wanting to do a sort of much more cathedrally churchy one that is just, like, basically ah a moving building.
01:29:41
Speaker
um And then, as I was thinking about that, I did also think it would be kind of fun given that there's... The whole backstory for this force is ah kind of...
01:29:52
Speaker
not like copied but inspired by the the like original artwork that I saw and I kind of liked the idea of this being a distinctly like this tank company there is something clearly wrong with it but the Inquisition uses it anyway because it's extremely effective at hunting down psykers and witches so there's like a zealotry that goes into hunting down the like mortal followers of chaos not necessarily the chaos space marines but the traitor guard now we're getting into headcanon which we didn't even touch upon did we like uh so it's your headcanon that there are humans move like uh driving these tanks
01:30:30
Speaker
Yes, the tanks don't open, but you can they can communicate with the with the drivers and the crew, but they just get shipped from one planet to another where there's, you know, insurrections going on and they get deployed against Psyka-heavy enemy forces because for whatever reason there is an an extreme zealotry... It makes it even weirder that they're not like lost and damned. They don't just come out of the fog. Instead, it's like...
01:30:53
Speaker
the the battle is over, the the smoke is clearing, and everyone's like, right, ship them back in and you just hear muffled, like, see you next week, Trevor. Like, the guys inside, uh, Yeah, they they they don't ever see the crews. The crews don't leave when the battle is finished. Do they get fed? They sit and wait. Do they get fed?
01:31:12
Speaker
Do they open a little slot and slide in a bit slop? I think probably they don't get fed, and at this point they don't want question too much about how the people in there are still alive and responding to questions and orders. Tears and is the only food they need.
01:31:24
Speaker
but Yeah, that's all they that's all they need. um The sustenance of a dead psycho. i feel like I feel like having a good backstory is a good, like, it's like a core part of what makes a Force cohesive anyway. Yeah, don't even think that's Kit Bash unique thing. Like, when I was paying off my sisters, i was like, but they're in bone colours because they smear the ashes of their dead all over them. That's like, that's their thing.
01:31:43
Speaker
And some of that, I just think, I think headcanon's cool. It adds an extra element to the storytelling part of like playing the games. Yeah, it's it's part of part of it. right like It's funny because like i don't I feel like that's very absent from card games. No one makes up a little story about the decks and in card games because it's kind of more abstract when you come to play Magic. But when it comes to D&D and 40k and miniature tabletop and and bolt action, or any any any of this stuff. People like want the historical context, or they want the lore, the fluff, or the theme, or the flavour.
01:32:09
Speaker
And card games don't really get that. Once you get over the age of 14, you've got to pretend the cards are abstract notions, math representing damage, as opposed to being like you know fluff pieces. But this has gone on long enough.
01:32:21
Speaker
I don't want it too long because I don't want fuckers to... People have already turned off. They don't what the retention rate was. The Spotify viewers are like, that's it. You can only apologise so many times before I turn off. Kiyof, where can people find your madcap inventions and what you do on the internet?
Conclusion and Where to Find More Content
01:32:34
Speaker
Mostly either Twitter or Instagram. ah I think it's Kiriath for both of those. And then for YouTube, it's... Okay, this confuses me. this This could be like the last bit of Inside Baseball.
01:32:46
Speaker
If you go to Kiriath or Kiriath TV, both work. And I'm not sure why, because I feel like that shouldn't happen. But it does. I assume that's because one of them is your at name, and one of them is the overall channel name that you've got on there. Okay.
01:33:01
Speaker
i've never I've never tried to fix that or work out why. I've just left it in case I broke something. yeah's Yeah, I'm the same. I'm like, don't touch anything in the back end of YouTube. It's not worth the stress.
01:33:14
Speaker
It's too scary back there. It's worrying. Yeah. like you you don't question It's bit like the ah the ghost men in the tank. You don't question It just works. Yeah, no. It's just how it... I guess, actually, also technically Adept is ridiculous. but i was about to say, aren't you doing something with them now? I haven't listened to any of it.
01:33:29
Speaker
So, i'm like the last episode of the month, I host. So, Bricky basically gets... He does the other three, and then he gets a week off doing hosting duties.
01:33:40
Speaker
because I think he might be the busiest person on YouTube at this point. It's ridiculous. I have no idea how he has time to do literally anything. the Well, you've seen the video. He had a video go a bit viral, which is him talking about how he hides his candy apple obsession from his assistant.
01:33:57
Speaker
And I mean, look, I love Bricky and everything, but my God, does not that sound like a privileged position to be in? It it does. it was there was ah there was ah I think it was not the last episode we recorded, but one before. I woke up on the Monday morning, um because we record them on on Mondays, and I had a look at YouTube and Bricky had just finished streaming like as I woke up.
01:34:18
Speaker
And he streamed for 8 hours and 15 minutes. And I looked at the i looked at the at the clock and I was like, would you to record 7 hours? Like, what what is he going to do now? Is he going to just switch off? like what Go to bed for a bit? What does I just... was just like... He's one of the... i Don't tell he's one of the people like, you know, I get up at 3.30am and go for a run. Those, like, you know, the the the grind set hustle influencers. You're like...
01:34:44
Speaker
I'm just built different. Who knows? I'm like, I need to sleep more. I don't like sleeping. I like spending, but we're going to another thing now i probably shouldn't. I don't like sleeping. I like my time doing stuff, but I'm always fucking tired and I'm also trying to get in better shape and the way to get in better shape is also to sleep because your body needs time to repair and heal and stuff. But that's the topic for another podcast where we talk about fitness 40K. That will not be a video.
01:35:06
Speaker
I'm sorry. I find that stuff very... Because people like, I'm going to like train like a space marine. I'm like, fuck that. Train like an orc. Space marines are cringe. I'm going to be the biggest knob in the room. Anyway, on that note, thanks for coming on. It's been fun. i'm definitely I'll get you on for another one because i've I've very much tried to tailor focus towards this topic.
01:35:26
Speaker
But I'm sure we could talk for fucking hours about all sorts of shit. easily yeah that's ah that's the only problem with doing with doing podcasts with like where there's where you get on really well it's it can just be in infinite and topics like this there's just so much to talk about yeah we've hardly spoken about my knobs i've only mentioned my knobs twice this entire this entire podcast on that note thanks for watching everybody don't forget to like comment all that shit uh and if you did watch this on any of the itunes or spotify platforms let me know because it's interesting to see if people actually do see it over there i'll see you the next one it's a tough now