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Episode 7: Space Echoes and MIG 50s (Spicy Caps and Crappy Jacks)
82 Plays3 days ago
In this episode of Amplified Nonsense, hosts Bryan Sours of Soursound Audio Works, Charles Henry of Silktone Amplifiers, and producer Emily Harris of Get Offset talk about repairing their Space Echo Tape Delays, describe what changes they'd make to a MIG 50 amp, and discuss tremolos and Labubus.
If you'd like Bryan, Charles, and Chris to answer your question on an episode of Amplified Nonsense, call (513) 334-3803 and leave a voicemail.
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Transcript
Introduction to Hosts and Podcast Format
00:00:07
Speaker
Welcome to Amplified Nonsense, a podcast that is more and more about amplifiers, but is also an excuse for three amp experts to hang out and answer your random voicemail questions.
00:00:19
Speaker
Your hosts are Charles Henry of Silktone, Chris Benson of Benson Amps, and Brian Sowers of Soursound Audio Works.
Producer's Introduction and Voicemail Number
00:00:26
Speaker
My name is Emily. I'm the producer of this podcast and I am just here to facilitate this and try to keep these guys on track. And before I forget, please call 513-334-3803 leave a voicemail with your questions for these guys
00:00:45
Speaker
334-3803. That number is also in the show notes.
Safety Warning on Amplifier Modifications
00:00:49
Speaker
And one quick note, this episode discusses amplifier modifications. If you are not comfortable working with high voltage electronics, please do not work on amplifiers. You can leave that to the experts.
00:01:02
Speaker
So have fun and stay safe. It's time to turn it over to the fellas and
Cincinnati's Skyline Chili and Regional Foods
00:01:07
Speaker
get the show started. So how are you guys doing? I think the show is actually about Skyline Chili. It is today.
00:01:13
Speaker
Yeah. Skyline Chili and diarrhea. but Emily won't stop talking about Skyline Chili. Also, that was not a that's not ah that's not a poster I have, Brian. It is a canvas print, and I bought it at like a Bed Bath & Beyond or something.
00:01:29
Speaker
don't want to make a poster of what my concept of of Skyline Chili is. Oh my God, Chris, that microphone, that's some hot sauce. Hot chili sauce. Yeah, it's the only mic I have in the house and it's a Shure 545 SD. I don't know what SD means, but it has a switch on it. It probably means switch.
00:01:53
Speaker
Do you think that microphone would sound great if it was dipped into a bowl of Skyline chili? I don't know why. i just needed to say it. It just happened.
00:02:03
Speaker
Would it sound more like diarrhea after the chili? Can you sprinkle oyster crackers on that microphone? Do guys get that reference? Emily, I want to know why the obsession with styline, is it really good or what's the... I've never had it. How sober are you is the first part of the question.
00:02:21
Speaker
Ah, okay. I like skyline chili. Part of the reason I like it is because it's very regional to Cincinnati where I'm from. And I just have a very strong love and appreciation for regional foods because I think as the United States gets more homogenized, the regional classics are kind of less of a thing.
00:02:42
Speaker
like Cincinnati has skyline chili, which was invented by Greek em immigrants using sort of Greek flavors to create a regional chili. Yeah. Now, when we think about chili, we think largely about either hot dog chili or Texas style chili.
00:02:56
Speaker
But it used to be way more regional. And I just think that's fun. And I like it. I think it tastes good. It's a covered. You start with spaghetti. You put the chili on and then you top it with a ton of mild cheddar cheese that's shredded very thinly it's very fluffy.
00:03:15
Speaker
I like it. I actually kind of think you would like it. I mean, sounds great to me. I'm a fan of Wiener schnitzel chilies. I'll eat anything, man.
Availability of Regional Fast Food Items
00:03:23
Speaker
ah You didn't put the crackers on top? Sometimes. Today was the day that the chili cheese burrito came back Are you guys familiar with the chili cheese burrito at Taco Bell?
00:03:34
Speaker
It's like an elusive thing. They have a whole map where you can find them. Like they're only available in like select limited locations. They have them ah in Kansas city. So whenever I go there to visit the Sife dudes, they're always like, let's get chili cheese burritos or, or I am.
00:03:48
Speaker
And, um, today they came back as part of some limited thing where it's like chili cheese burritos everywhere this month. So I was like, Oh, I'm going to go get some. And it was super disappointing. It's kind of exactly how you think it would be.
00:04:03
Speaker
I just assume it's disgusting. It sounds gross. It was kind of gross. They were really good in Kansas City, but I was also pretty wasted. i can Can corporate fast food, that can't be considered regional, even though they do have regional items. like Idaho had those like potato things.
00:04:22
Speaker
Is the chili cheese thing a regional thing? why am I even asking? I'm never going to eat it. I don't even want to know. I'm disgusted by the thought of it. I just, I think I'm just a glutton for grossness or something. Like, I don't know. Yeah. This conversation's like bumming me out.
00:04:39
Speaker
Like sounds terrible. I think I'm just in podcast mode. I'm like, oh, well, let's discuss it. But I don't really want to talk about Let's talk about whatever is on the docket. We don't have to.
00:04:49
Speaker
Yeah, going to have to deal with it later, if you know what I mean. So I'm well i'm totally fine with not talking about it now. yeah Let's not do the yes and to to chili cheese.
00:05:02
Speaker
So what have you guys been up to other than messing with microphones and eating chili? I've been going through a bunch of projects that I owe people and have owed people for several years.
00:05:14
Speaker
Getting them down, clearing out the closet. Yeah, I am. Yeah, that's like on Sunday, I just set them all up and started knocking them down. So I fixed a ah fix someone's space echo. I finished a rotary cabinet that I owed someone.
00:05:29
Speaker
I finished an amp and case that I owed someone. and fixed a warlitzer too. Yeah. Just clearing, clearing out
Repairing Space Echo Devices
00:05:38
Speaker
the barn. Sweet busy weekend.
00:05:40
Speaker
I guess I had a similar experience with that considering I fixed your space echo. Well, yeah, I was thinking about how funny that was like fixing the space echo I was fixing.
00:05:52
Speaker
Yeah.
00:05:54
Speaker
Wait, wait a second. You were talking about that. And I'm like, is this some sort of dig? Is this like a behind the scenes dig? I'm not, I'm not vibing you at all. Yeah. You said years. And I think I only had that one for a year. So wait, Sowers had yours and you fixed another one?
00:06:12
Speaker
ah he freaks I think he fixed mine on Sunday too. No, it was Friday. It was Friday. he' like Yeah, because he texts me. He's like, dude, either either have to yeah after either i have to finish it or I have to get it back, but I need it back and I need it by the 10th. And I was like, oh, and just like did it that day.
00:06:30
Speaker
and I was like, should just come by. This thing sounds great. And that was Friday. So I'm like, I'm so confused by this. Did you use it as a template to fix another or not? te you know yeah No, I wasn't copying off your work. how one did This one didn't need a motor rebuild. I brought you mine because it needed a motor rebuild. I just, yeah you're better at it.
00:06:51
Speaker
Oh, I just, yeah, I went kind crazy on This one just needed did a bunch of cleaning. Obviously, there was like a tape snafu that like blew the motor fuse. So I had to replace the fuse and replace the tape loop with the one you gave me. Thank you very much. Oh, good. I have more if you if you just want another one. Cool.
00:07:07
Speaker
But yeah, they and they sound ah ah sand really good together. i ran both of them. Did you change the preamp fuses that go the rest of the circuit? No, I just fixed what was broken.
00:07:19
Speaker
Well, here's kind of a funny thing is that for some reason, those fuses are of such low quality, the original fuses, that you know when we did like the mail-in service, changing those fuses was always a part of that. It's just something we always did because every single space echo that came in, ah you would test the DCR on those fuses and it'd be like 10 ohms.
00:07:40
Speaker
They're like the worst fuses imaginable. Holy cow. That's crazy. So we ended up just every single space echo that came in. I'm specifically talking about the RE-201, not the motor fuse, but the other two fuse fuses. And um yeah, like I changed them in yours.
00:07:54
Speaker
I always change them because then the power supply just works better. It's just one of those things.
Partnership with Echo Fix and Business Model
00:08:01
Speaker
How many of those do you think you've worked on, Brian? Because you you if if nobody knows this, Brian, before diving into Transformers and all that, was like the authority on on Space Echoes in the United States, right?
00:08:14
Speaker
Well, duringing so during, during, basically. basicallyly Yeah. I mean, the the short of it, as fast as I can make it is, is that I started kind of like veering away from walk-in repair work back in, i don't know, like 2018 2019.
00:08:31
Speaker
And i was working with Shane over at Echo Fix in Australia and buying a lot of parts off of him for stuff. And you know we so we became good friends and colleagues. I knew a lot about Tape Echo stuff and he was used to dealing with people who didn't.
00:08:46
Speaker
And I think it was kind of refreshing for him. And eventually he proposed a kind of partnership where he would refer to me, his United States clients for ah Tape Echo. Oh, cool. Yeah.
00:08:58
Speaker
created this like business idea, if you will, that that was just, uh, what is it? Okay. Send it. It's flat rate. And basically we just, we tried to do just like we're doing everything.
00:09:09
Speaker
So we're going to fix what's wrong with it, but we're going to fix all the other crap that no one's ever dealt with all the, you know, ah grease that's dried up, you know, all this stuff. And then it also turned into what we just do everything as a, preventatively, you know, we, we rebuild every single space echo motor that came in, even if it spun up. Okay.
00:09:27
Speaker
We just did it. What was, what was everything you did? Like you did one of mine. It sounds amazing. Yeah. ah Trust me. We don't have time for it. Yeah, it was such a comprehensive list. I will say there's a couple of things I want to do on Chris's that I didn't get to do because I didn't have parts and it's just kind of some power supply caps and electrolytics and stuff.
00:09:47
Speaker
Can you put your own buffer in there? yeah I, that's the thing is I didn't have the parts for it. So I didn't put that in, but I showed him the difference. I used an old boost pedal and showed him like, listen to how bad this, and he's like, Oh, I know it's low input Z. And I was like, dude, this sounds, it's so murky, yeah which Chris, I dug out those boards and I will make you a space echo input buffer and you can install it. Oh dude.
00:10:10
Speaker
Oh, okay.
Chris and Brian's Meeting and Collaboration
00:10:11
Speaker
If it means something to you. Yeah. It it's sounds great, but yeah, I basically did kind of like the shorter version of what I did on yours, Charles. Oh, right. Um, It sounds so insanely good. That's one piece of gear that I will never let go of.
00:10:25
Speaker
Yeah, everyone always thinks they're kind of like, I don't know, everyone thinks tape echoes are lo-fi and it's like quite the opposite. I prefer them because of their fidelity over a bucket brigade delays, which I love, but I i love tape echoes for where it's at for me.
00:10:40
Speaker
I played a really cool Tape Echo in Japan by a different company called Voice. And it was ah ah the whole preamp section was tubed. It was like it had four different adjustable heads that were all switch. You could switch them all in and everything. it was very cool.
00:10:58
Speaker
I liked that it was all tube buffers and stuff and tube gain. lot of character, not nearly as much fidelity as the space echo that but you did for me. ah Speaking of Shane, we should get him on the show sometime. What if what a pop nice dude.
00:11:12
Speaker
Oh, yeah. That'd be cool. That's a great idea. Yeah, that would be... He he was so fun to hang with. Man, that would be a good time. Who's Shane? Shane runs Echo Fix in Australia. He does all the new, he has a bunch of cool pedals and a couple, how many Echo units does he have now? Two or three?
00:11:31
Speaker
Yeah, I'm not sure. I think he started with the one and spun it out. I there's like four variants maybe. oh wow. right wow yeah Also, you know I started working with him before that because quite honestly, he is he' basically spearheaded tape echo replacement parts, but specifically Echoplex and most definitely Roland Space Echo. I mean, the guy, there's so many parts, there's so many even concepts of parts replacements in those things that wouldn't exist without what he's done. I mean, he's literally oh yeah the Space Echo guy in the whole damn world. Yeah, that's so cool. I've been buying parts from him for so long.
00:12:10
Speaker
Yeah. Like years before even you and I met. Wow. That's right. I didn't know him until semi recently, but ah I'm not sure I've met a ah nicer human being. He's super, super kind.
00:12:23
Speaker
Yeah. Good dude. i I wanted to mention that we met and through tape echoes. That's actually a great story. Do you want to tell that one? Yeah, so tape echoes is what brought me and Souris together.
00:12:37
Speaker
So I was taking them in for repair as well. ah Mostly echo plexus. I didn't really like working on space echoes as much, or i just preferred echo plexus in every way just because they seem like they were built by farmers or something.
00:12:51
Speaker
Total weirdos we built those things for sure. They're so primitive. Yeah. But they work really well and I just prefer the sound. um So I went to, let's see, I went down to LA and bought a bunch of parts from Echoplex Pete, who I think is Echoplex Repair on Instagram.
00:13:10
Speaker
I don't think he's super active anymore, but he's, a yeah, he kind of hooked me up with a bunch of parts and kind of showed me what he does with those things and I brought everything back to Portland and I had fixed echo plexus before quite a bit, but never had like a big part stash like that.
00:13:27
Speaker
And I think I went for about a year and probably fixed maybe 30 echo plexus. Like we'd, people would just like email echo repair at Benson amps.com. And, uh, we would take their echo in and,
00:13:40
Speaker
kind of do everything to it, like what Brian was doing to Space Echoes. Everything got a new pinch roller and new tape and full cap job and full cleaning, et cetera, et cetera.
00:13:51
Speaker
And I really, really enjoyed it, but I just got too busy. And at a certain point, I think in like 2018 or 2019, think it was, we were thinking about moving shops. I was just trying to get rid of stuff. I was like, I don't have time for this.
00:14:03
Speaker
And knew Brian had been taking some Echoes in. So I just called the Soursound number, or maybe I got your number from like a Oh, no, you called the shop. It was zero cold call.
00:14:14
Speaker
Who is this? You called the shop.
00:14:19
Speaker
And ah Brian and I had never really talked before, which is kind of crazy. But he ended up coming over and checking out the stash and giving giving giving some of the parts is ah his review. Yeah.
00:14:33
Speaker
That's rad. That's cool way to me. And ended up walking away with ah um almost all of it. Hey, i I paid real money for that. Yeah, you did. I'll give you 10 cans of chili. Yeah.
00:14:45
Speaker
Yeah, that was cool. I remember specifically kind of this like talking about, you know, doing the transformers and I was I was doing, ah you know, layer winding and you had some you even gave me some transformer parts. I still have EI 100 square bobbins that you gave me.
00:15:00
Speaker
yeah because I was learning how to wind transformers. Yeah, you gave me a huge box of those. Like we're still going through those. No way, really? Yeah, I mean, we don't use them for a lot of stuff because, I mean, most, like 99% of what we do is layer wound. But, um you know, for a funny anecdote, I know I made chokes for like Caleb, Caleb Barton, Barton High Voltage that I know was wound on those things.
00:15:21
Speaker
Anything I've ever done on a 100 square bobbin, I've probably wound chokes for Charles on those bobbins and they they all came from you. Oh my gosh, that's so funny. i vo i like I vaguely remember... Yeah, you know, i was used to like doing quantity stuff, so I was buying a lot.
00:15:38
Speaker
I like totally forgot that I bought a giant box of bobbins until yeah you just... You gave me, I think there was like some air drive varnish, a couple spools of wire too. Yeah, you gave me bunch stuff. Is that where my winder went? No, I didn't. I had a winder. ah No, no equipment. I got no equipment from you.
00:15:57
Speaker
ah Did you ever use your stuff in an amp, Chris? The stuff that you want? No, I never ah got far enough. Like, I was reading a bunch and creating, like, a to... Ryan obviously knows this a lot better than me, but, like, you basically need, like, a whole mathematical schema to plan winding transformers. Like, it's it's you know, planning your winding window, like, your inductances, like...
00:16:20
Speaker
if your core can handle it. And you can basically, most Transformer people I know work backwards from essentially a spreadsheet that does a bunch of calculations to see if it's going to work. And I was kind of working with this guy, Bud Purvine, who i I had known in Seattle, and he was trying to get me to get this crazy old calculator. Oh, yeah. but The TI-92 or TI-98 window utilization program. I remember that. You tell me about that.
00:16:46
Speaker
ye And then, you know, like the Echoes, I just got way too busy with Benson to continue with it. And then, so when I met Brian, I had all these parts and I knew something about Transformers.
00:16:57
Speaker
So we managed to start talking about it. Oh, right. Yeah, that stuff. yeah It's insane what what goes into Transformers. I don't think people realize how much has to happen there. It's a lot. It keeps me awake at night.
Portland's Culture and Craftsmanship
00:17:10
Speaker
It's a lot.
00:17:11
Speaker
I was just tired of it being like a black box, like that I didn't understand that I just trusted. So I wanted to like essentially become like an expert at that as well. But you can't be an expert at everything.
00:17:22
Speaker
That's stupid. You can try, but then you you go insane. I'm glad I know Brian. Yeah. I mean, obviously that's where like me kind of talking about the layer winding stuff and then you kicking me that film, the sound transformer to rewind Oh, yeah. And then that spun off into the 15-watt, Benson 15-watt output.
00:17:44
Speaker
Not directly, obviously. It's a totally different thing. But ideologically, it started there with you giving me that. And, ah yeah, i mean, then COVID happened. And then I was like, well, I'll wind your transformers. I'll do this. And, yeah yeah, me and Jess putting all that stuff together and VPI-ing it in the the driveway. It was...
00:18:05
Speaker
It was a... That's amazing. You should have taken video. Yeah. It was ah a strange time, but, you know, we got it done. Do you have old photos or videos? No, I'm not super sentimental. I'm more kind of in the moment, get done. Yeah, that'd be cool to see. I wish. I wish. I just, I've never really been like that, so I don't...
00:18:24
Speaker
How long were you doing it before you got a shop to do it? Well, I've had a repair shop in Portland since, I don't know, 2000. mean, I started working in Portland doing repair work in my basement in like 2002, think.
00:18:39
Speaker
So, I mean, I've always like, we just transitioned, you know, it's like, well, I'm doing less amp work. I want to start making transformers. I mean, the whole reason for me to make transformers was to put them in the amps I was building. Yeah. That was the whole point, you know, and then I started making stuff and listening to it and changing it.
00:18:54
Speaker
I want more low end, I want less top end, you know, well, add more wire, get get the flux down, get more inductance, ah higher insertion loss, higher DCR, lower top end. Oh, that worked. And it sounds really cool. And, you know, it's that's really what it was like learning to voice transformers with my own amps. And I think once I started kind of figuring out like, oh, I can do a lot with this,
00:19:16
Speaker
I should do this for other people. And quite honestly, like Chris was in my mind because, you know, at that point in time, Benson Amps was getting bigger and Chris was obviously in town.
00:19:27
Speaker
That was kind of my like a big goal. Really? i don't know if I ever told you that, Chris. You never have. ah didn't know that. Yeah. Yeah, like but definitely like working, winding transformers for them was like, oh, they're they're up and coming. They're doing really well. They're here in town.
00:19:45
Speaker
i don't know how to ship a bunch of transformers, you know? That's cool. Yeah, back in the day, i just we'd box stuff up and I just put it in the pickup truck and Chris's old shop was near my house. So I just take the stuff home and then we'd VPI it at home and put it all together at home and then just drive it on the other side the highway, which is where he was. was Rad.
00:20:06
Speaker
That's super cool. Yep. It's crazy to me how many people build stuff in in Portland. There's a lot of builders out there that it seems like a super tight knit little community of builders.
00:20:17
Speaker
I like it every time I go there. It's weird how there's cities like that. Not necessarily tight knit. There's a lot of characters. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's just, you have a place where individualism is appreciated.
00:20:30
Speaker
You know, we don't have a lot of chain restaurants. There's, there you know, there's there's small independent restaurants all over the place. There's some local chains, obviously, but the point being, it's just uniqueness and individualism is celebrated here is the best way I could describe it.
00:20:45
Speaker
And so, you know, with music, I mean, everyone's playing music. There's tons of musicians, so they're all buying gear. Everyone's looking for like a different sound, a new thing. And i mean, that's really what like boutique builders do best is that they cater to, in my opinion, they cater to, uh,
00:21:01
Speaker
specific sounds and smaller groups of of niche right yeah it's interesting to see where those havens trying to land there's a lot going on in portland with builders there's a lot in like oklahoma city and kansas city and maybe because of the large companies that are in those areas and then there's some break off i guess but yeah that's always been interesting to me there ain't for builders out here there's no one in sacramento area Yeah, that's true.
00:21:27
Speaker
There's hardly anyone in l LA. Yeah, like California as a whole. Not a ton of people, I feel like. Yeah, it's weird. There's some larger companies. There's some big companies. Like, I mean, Universal Audio is here.
00:21:38
Speaker
Fender started here, and I think it's still headquartered here. bunch of... You mean California? California specifically, yeah. lot of acoustics. His LAN devices? Yeah, LAN is here. Sorry, cables. lot of... Ren and Cuff is down there. Ren and Cuff's in LA, yeah. I think Beatronics is in LA. 29 Petals is in There's a few in l LA, I guess. Yeah, now that I think about it.
00:22:02
Speaker
San Francisco. Milkman's in San Francisco. Spruce. Spruce, yeah. Spruce in Pacifica now. Yeah, East or Bay Area.
00:22:13
Speaker
I guess everything's so spread out because California is so big. It just doesn't seem like it's like a ah community of of builders. Yeah. it's so It's weird. where We proportionally have way more than we should. Yeah.
00:22:25
Speaker
Most definitely. It's in the water. Right. No fluoride, but we got that. Oklahoma City really has a lot. And I think our first question, our first call-in question something that we could tie back to someone in Oklahoma City who builds puddles.
00:22:46
Speaker
If we're ready for that. Let's do it.
Electro-Harmonix MiG-50 Modifications
00:22:48
Speaker
Oh, yeah. All right. Hi, this is Frank, a big fan of Get Offset. Any takes on the Electro Harmonics MiG-50? Thank you.
00:22:58
Speaker
So I picked this question partially because i know that Chris had a little discussion with Heather Brown of Heather Brown Electronicals, which is based out of Oklahoma City, about her personal MiG-50 amp.
00:23:10
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, she yeah, she, ah we just started talking about MiG-50s and she plays Rhodes, Fender Rhodes, and ah effects through Rhodes.
00:23:21
Speaker
And she was just asking, like, what she could do to it to, ah but what she could do to her MiG-50 to make it more appropriate for Fender Rhodes. So I sent her kind of like a little suite of mods that I thought would work well for it.
00:23:38
Speaker
And we had this in the chat earlier, actually. And let's see. It was like the exact opposite of what Brian would do, but he didn't realize it was for Rhodes.
00:23:52
Speaker
So what are your opinions on the Meg 50 what did you recommend, Chris? I recommended some tone stack mods that I would just do anyways. Like ah it's got a weird like treble cap value that I would make the Marshall value because I ah like that.
00:24:06
Speaker
And then ah think that it can be too bassy or not as much range on the bass control. So I was going to make the ah base potentiometer smaller in value.
00:24:17
Speaker
And I usually do 250KA, which is a from a 1MA. And then it also has kind of a ah pretty bright cathode bypass cap in the...
00:24:30
Speaker
in one of the channels that I would definitely make bigger. But it's got two channels, um or at least the schematic I'm looking at. And one of them is wide open frequency and the other is that bright. So maybe I i would leave that in case, you know, she wanted a bright channel.
00:24:48
Speaker
Oh yeah, and then like the the biggest one was like shrinking the size of the filter caps just because they used absolutely gigantic filter caps in that amp, probably just to come back home, I would imagine.
00:25:00
Speaker
What'd you change them to? I have a schematic in front of me now, so now I can judge all of your responses. So the stock circuit is 200 mics in a series, which comes out 200 mic.
00:25:13
Speaker
And I would put two 100 microfarad caps in that position to get it down to a 50 mic in the, uh, B plus reservoir area. Yeah.
00:25:24
Speaker
You know what i never realized on these things now that we're looking at this is that that voltage divider off the screen supply that goes to feed the heater center tap. That's smart. They really were trying to get low noise on this.
00:25:37
Speaker
I've never noticed that a make 50 did that and they have two heater windings. So it's only going to the preamp heaters. Oh, interesting. look Yeah. But if you look, so the three, four, and five. So output tubes, phase inverter, have no center tap on their heater winding, and one side is grounded.
00:25:56
Speaker
So I'm like, just do it on the whole damn winding. Just do one winding. but that's that's I never noticed that before. It's interesting. I mean, roads, I think, complicates it.
00:26:08
Speaker
I think you'd want more headroom for roads, but yeah. MiG-50 in Rhodes. I'm really curious how that sounds. I mean, I'm assuming that she's kind of clipping it in the preamp a little bit.
00:26:19
Speaker
It's going through an open back Benson cabinet now. That probably helps the low end. It's funny that the um for the stage one and two, the cathode bypass capacitors are like wildly... It's funny, the tiny little 0.68 on the bright channel to brighten it up and then just a massive 220 mic on on the yeah That's so much larger than than you need for for any of that. So funny.
00:26:45
Speaker
That's that old Marshall 4 input thing, like JTM 45. I mean, don't quote me on the values. I don't have those schematics memorized or anything, but you know, the like base channel, treble channel, and they expect people. Well, I don't know if they expected it at the time to jump or I'm obviously that's what people do. Yeah.
00:27:02
Speaker
I probably would have done a different approach personally, just you know thinking like the people that I know that have used the MIG amps are usually clipping the crap out of them and it's usually heavier music. I like totally do like your idea, Chris, with the bass pot.
00:27:15
Speaker
That does make a lot of sense. That's what I do on my tone stacks. I have a 250k bass pot and it seems to work so much better than those like traditional values in a TMB.
00:27:26
Speaker
But if you look in the tone stack, the slope resistor is 47K. That's pretty low. I mean, you know, lead Marshall was 56K with 2.02s, if I remember correctly. But there was another Marshall variant that I think was 33K. I'm hardly an expert on that.
00:27:43
Speaker
You're right. But I'm a big fan of increasing that slope resistor with the.02 twos. And I think, you know, even up to like eighty two k a hundred k Getting into Fender territory, just like hundred k No, I mean, it's definitely, yeah, size-wise and value-wise. Yeah, totally. But, you know, and if you look to the, um yeah, in that input section, personally, i like I kind of do this sort of thing with super leads where I kind of scrap the...
00:28:11
Speaker
the bass channel and just voice out the treble channel. And then I'll go when I'm all done, like basically turn into like a lead channel and then go back and voice the bass channel to just be like flatter and more clean. But yeah, I definitely would like...
00:28:27
Speaker
you know, shrink the, so if you see the cathode bypass cap on that bright channel is two, or sorry, the cathode resistor is 2K. So obviously at that high value, that 0.68 is really doing its job with that filter.
00:28:41
Speaker
So sure reduce that 1800 or 1500. So the 0.68 isn't as strong, but you know, also like, don't know, I'm going to clip, I'm going to clip the out of that side. So, you know, that hundred K plate resistor, bump that up to like 180 You know, maybe put a snubber cap across it. You know, I don't know. 8,200 pico farad. That might be a little high, but. Dang, dude, that's a crazy plate value. Yeah, like, I mean, the input headroom goes down. That 68K that's feeding that grid, that's too big. We need more signals.
00:29:14
Speaker
The gain goes way up, though, and gain for these is rad. So. That's, yeah, that's kind of what after. The more you pull out of it with a higher plate load would be, yeah. That would do it a lot of favors.
00:29:26
Speaker
Yeah, input resistor go down to 47K, if not 33K, get more signal hitting it. Up the plate resistor, you're going to get a boatload more out of it. But, you know, we want to shave off that top end if you're going to clip the crap out of it. That.022 cap is too big.
00:29:41
Speaker
That should go down to like... point .01 or.0068, which I have a stack of old mustard caps that are in 0068. o o six a Which trap are you talking about here? Looking at this trap. Oh, it's the first cap off the bright channel feeding the volume pot.
00:29:58
Speaker
Yeah. But... Yeah, why one k on that on the stage that that's the directly coupled Cathode follower? The feed's the directly coupled Cathode follower. That's an interesting... They're usually pretty low.
00:30:12
Speaker
I mean, sure, like 820 is like the normal value in a Marshall if that's what they were copying, but I was just like, why 1K and not 820? Oh, maybe they didn't have 820. Yeah, maybe that was... that's the's what the Russian military had or something.
00:30:27
Speaker
I don't think that's going to make much of a difference anyway in such a high... I'm just curious. it's just it's an interesting It's an interesting choice, but um yeah you know definitely like that negative feedback cap, the presence cap, I do this thing where I bump that up to 0.68 or even 1 microfarad, and it turns the presence control into like a gain knob.
00:30:49
Speaker
It's awesome. it's You're letting way more waymar low in Well, you're filtering more out of the feedback loop. So you have more upper, like mids, upper mid. Well, you're letting more into it. Yeah, yeah. But you're going to have more upper mid range and push in the output section. Yeah.
00:31:08
Speaker
You're a crazy person. I know, right? know. I'm like looking at this. That's crazy. I liked your response. Like, what'd you say? Spicy caps and jacks? Yeah, that's...
00:31:21
Speaker
I mean, that is a great description for the amp. Well, well one one thing about these amps is so most caps will drain current once you ah once you take power off of them.
00:31:34
Speaker
these never do. They never drain the caps. Maybe it's because, I mean, they should. because looks like Look at the bleeder resistors. Their bleeders are too 300K. In series, too. They still yeah sit around.
00:31:50
Speaker
And the outside of the capacitors are conductive on these. Yeah. If you look at the first can, it says can one. right and the negative is connected to the second cans positive obviously so that can right there is yeah is fully hot at half rail yeah and the damn rails 430 volts i have shocked myself so many times on these things yeah i've never had the pleasure of working on a mig 50 I'm pretty happy about it.
00:32:23
Speaker
They're cool. I've worked on a bunch of these. I mean, look at the plate resistors in the phase inverter, 220K. Like, they're trying to push the output tubes. That is that is what they're trying to do.
00:32:34
Speaker
You know, look, you got you got a flyback diodes. There they are. I saw that. There they are. In the factory schematic. But then also you've got three jacks for you know for different taps on the output transformer, and not one of them is a shorting jack. Yeah. You got to have those for how hard these things get pushed in the power section.
00:32:55
Speaker
the one I mean, without a shorting jack, someone's going to blow it up. They're going to do the like... you know plug in my guitar, turn the thing on and like play while the thing's warming up sort of thing. But like, whoops, I forgot to plug my cabinet in cabinet in. Well, it's like, okay, cool. yeah you know Hopefully those flybacks maybe help your output tubes, but no, that thing is a goner.
00:33:16
Speaker
I have a different take. Mine might be a little more boring, but um I like the MiG-50. I think they're fun as is. I'm not a big fan of modding stuff. I like playing with toys for kind of what they put them out to do.
00:33:28
Speaker
I think it's a pretty cool bang for buck amp. Again, driving the out of it. You get really cool distortion tones and stuff, but I don't like fixing other people's circuits. I don't like i don't like having to mod stuff.
00:33:39
Speaker
i If I get something and don't like it and want to change stuff, I just get something else instead or additionally and use that for what it is and use it for the tones that it that it can produce instead of trying to turn it into more of a Marshall.
00:33:53
Speaker
Yeah. I'm like that with some things, but these things are almost worthless.
00:34:01
Speaker
This is essentially a ah radioactive chassis, a handful of tubes, and an ugly box as far as I'm concerned.
Charles' Views on Amp Modding
00:34:08
Speaker
I can have fun all day with a rat into a MiG-50.
00:34:12
Speaker
You know what i else I just saw? I just realized on this too that I just didn't know. The screen grid dropping resistor in the power supply is 470 ohms. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's not that uncommon.
00:34:24
Speaker
A plus is 532. It's huge. That is ginormous. And the screen grid, the limiting resistors on the screen grids, the output tubes are only 470. What does that mean? It's super hot. That means that the screen grids on the output tubes are getting the living kicked out of them. So, okay, but here's the other thing that I didn't even think about either that I'm putting together.
00:34:48
Speaker
it says 5881. Yep. So, assume the russian this is a Russian schematic. Assume it it's for it's designated for the Russian 5881, which that tube supposedly is not really a 6L6 or a 5881. It's like some variant on a Russian missile tube.
00:35:06
Speaker
This is internet lore. Don't quote me on it. But I think they they knew that that tube could handle a lot more in the screen grids. Or they just didn't give and they wanted to sell tubes. So there's that too. Bingo. I mean, there you go. Yeah, that's...
00:35:22
Speaker
Either way, those poor 5881s, like the amount of screen grid current that they can draw is got to be just unbelievable. Are the new EHX models the same? They've changed a bunch, right? We're looking at a soft tech schematic here, but the EHX ones, are they pretty close to the soft tech ones?
00:35:42
Speaker
I have no idea, Chris. I have no idea. don't know. Yeah, don't know. We're not amp repair shops. Come on, man. Yeah, not anymore. Yeah. That was like three lifetimes ago. Well, Heather actually cloned that amp, that MiG-50 that she has, and made a pedal called the Volga. Have you played one, Chris, or any of you? i haven't played the Volga. i should, if I'm the one feeding her the schematics for the mods, but I should probably get one. I've never played any of her stuff. Yeah, I'd like to try out some of her pedals. I've never ah ever had one in front of me.
00:36:13
Speaker
I think they're great. I'm biased. I'm running two vulgas on my board right now. I absolutely love the fact that I can, I hear whenever Chris is about to talk because he switches Unidine on. No, I didn't know if you guys could hear that or not. Oh my God. It's so loud.
00:36:28
Speaker
No, just doing and do it, man. Just do it. Oh, fudge. I'm so sorry. I'll stop doing it. I'll remove it in post. Don't worry. I've clicked it like a thousand times. I'm so sorry.
00:36:39
Speaker
I started listening to the last episode earlier. I was like, I realize I haven't listened to this. And I only listened to a small amount of it, but this right away with the Benson samples and the hogs.
00:36:51
Speaker
I was like, what the fuck? It's just sound. What is this?
00:37:01
Speaker
ah That was a fun
Hypothetical Attire as LaBubus
00:37:03
Speaker
one. Well, ah do y'all want to do you want to do a a fun little short question to to end it? Because this has been a very tech heavy episode. Sure, sure. Yeah.
00:37:13
Speaker
Someone who picked up an amp from Benson today called this one in. Hey, what's up? My name is Alex. And I wanted to know if y'all were La Boo Boo's, what would your outfit be?
00:37:26
Speaker
And then also, what is your favorite tremolo pedal? OK, thank you. Goodbye.
00:37:34
Speaker
Oh my God. Okay. I know why they, know they asked this. And it's because my shop manager, Ryan, had a labubu on his keys.
00:37:46
Speaker
And that was the first time I've seen a labubu. And ah he's into labubus. I don't know anything about them. Yeah, I saw that South Park episode with him and that's that's where I got my news, like most of my news.
00:37:58
Speaker
But apparently they're a big thing now. I think I saw Ryan's LaBubu too in Chicago if he had it then. I'm pretty sure he he mentioned LaBubu's and that's the first time I heard the word.
00:38:10
Speaker
So the question is how how would they be dressed? Yes. If you were. how would we be dressed if we were LeBuboos? Oh. All black. Probably wearing black jeans and a band t-shirt.
00:38:24
Speaker
Why you copying me, man? Come on. yeah to To be clear, Chris is wearing a Chase Bliss shirt. They're kind of a band. Charles is wearing a... Sure, yeah. Charles is wearing a plain black shirt and I can't see Brian's. It's a band t-shirt. I only wear band t-shirts.
00:38:41
Speaker
What band? i was a I think they're defunct, but it was just a a heavy band I played with a bunch of times back in the day called Church. Yeah. Black jeans, black shirts, black hats.
00:38:53
Speaker
But why is the labubu... And listeners, that's what every single one of these men is wearing right now. Does the labubu have to look like you? i Personally, if I had to choose, if I was forced by gunpoint to choose what my labubu was going to look like, I think it would want to reflect more of my inner essence than my outer presentation.
00:39:14
Speaker
But I have no idea what that would be. I'm a soulless creature dead inside. I i don't know. That's a good call. Yeah. So like made of pumice? Yeah, I guess in that case, mine would just look like Robin Williams. Okay, so Robin Williams, LaBooBoo. Mork and Mindy Robin Williams?
00:39:35
Speaker
Sure, any of them. Just be an assortment of Robin Williams outfits. He's more of a Patch Adams, LaBooBoo. The second part of the question was, what's your favorite tremolo pedal?
Favorite Tremolo Pedals Discussion
00:39:49
Speaker
I've heard a lot of them, but... ah I don't have a favorite tremolo pedal. I don't use a ton of trem. I have a Maleco's version of the Goatkeeper. i got Actually, I got it from them at that amp gear show that me and Chris did where we destroyed our brains by having discordant guitars all day.
00:40:09
Speaker
um But the Goatkeeper, which I should dig that thing out. I haven't played it in a long time. It's a vibe count. It's not amplitude modulation. So no, I guess not.
00:40:20
Speaker
So no Silctone tremolo pedal coming anytime soon? Not anytime soon, no. Yeah. I like Tim Marcus's, you know, or I'm sorry, Milkman sounds like reverb tremolo all in one thing.
00:40:32
Speaker
That tremolo sounds really good. The F-stop. The F-stop. That's right. I like the tremolo in that quite a bit. Sounds like an app.
00:40:42
Speaker
Can I just pivot back here for a second? i just Googled La Boo Boo's because I don't think I've ever seen one. And... A lot of them are just straight, are these are they straight up naked?
00:40:52
Speaker
They're like woodland creatures that are naked with their fur. Okay, no, that one's wearing overalls. Okay, nevermind. ah No real point with that. I just, just labubu. I was just labubu. Go watch the new Tathbock. They're like Teletubby-esque.
00:41:07
Speaker
Yeah, it's like Teletubbies met, what are they called? The little little bears, the Thai bears. The Wikipedia calls them, what is zoomorphic elves.
00:41:19
Speaker
Zoomorphic elves with exaggerated facial expressions, of which the central figure is Labubu, a monster with sharp teeth, large ears, and a scruffy appearance.
00:41:31
Speaker
Yeah, ah looks like where the wild things are. Like to me, that's what I think of when I see this. So are they really used in like satanic rituals, like the South Park episode?
Conclusion and Voicemail Reminder
00:41:41
Speaker
No, no, that's like Pokemon cards.
00:41:45
Speaker
For all I know, they they are. so i I believe South Park, I guess. Thank you for listening to this episode of Amplified Nonsense. Our goal is to release a new episode every other week, so please subscribe wherever you listen.
00:42:00
Speaker
If you have a question for Brian, Charles, and Chris about amps, pop culture, or relationships, please call 513-334-3803 and leave a voicemail.
00:42:13
Speaker
If you enjoyed this episode of Amplified Nonsense, please leave a rating and review. Thanks again, and we'll see you soon.