Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Episode 2: New ways of doing things
84 Plays9 days ago
Season 3 of Branching Out: The Forest Podcast, hosted by Gerda Wolfrum from IUFRO HQ, explores how IUFRO scientists work across disciplines to address emerging issues through Task Forces. In the second episode we discuss why innovation matters in the forest sector, the different forms it takes, and how science underpins scaling up of innovation. Hear from Task Force co-leads Lyndall Bull, an Australian forester specializing in innovation and the bioeconomy, and Rajat Panwar, a professor of responsible and sustainable business at Oregon State University, along with co-host Leila Rossa Mouawad from the American University of Beirut and Deputy Coordinator of IUFRO’s Communication Working Party.
Tune in to Branching Out: the forest podcast! Listen on Spotify and Apple Podcasts, and don't forget to follow us!
Podcast website: https://www.iufro.org/podcast
Recommended
Transcript
Innovations in Governance and Community Stewardship
00:00:05
Speaker
We also need to keep in mind that some of the most powerful innovations in governance, in community stewardship and livelihood integration, they are emerging from the global south.
Introduction to Hosts and Podcast Theme
00:00:25
Speaker
Hello everyone, i'm your host Gerda Wolfrum from the International Union of Forest Research Organizations, IUFRO, a global network for forest science collaboration.
00:00:38
Speaker
You're listening to the second episode of season three of Branching Out, the forest podcast. It's great to have you with us as we explore more forest science. In this season, we will find out how scientists in IUFRO work across disciplines to tackle emerging topics.
Meet the Co-host and Guests
00:00:57
Speaker
This work takes place in our 13 task forces. Last time, we talked about the forest-based bio-economy. And this time, we will look at forest sector innovation and how we can scale up science-based forest sector innovation.
00:01:15
Speaker
Let me welcome my co-host, Leila Rossa Mouawad. Leila is a deputy coordinator in our working party on communication and I'm very happy to have her with us.
00:01:26
Speaker
Leila, please introduce yourself. Hello, thank you for having me, Gerda. My name is Leila Rossa Mouawad. I'm joining you from Lebanon. I have a background in forestry and currently work at the Nature Conservation Center of the American University of Beirut.
00:01:42
Speaker
And as you mentioned, Gerda, I engage in science communication through IUFRO's Working Party. Welcome to Branching Out, Leila, and welcome to our guests, Lyndall Bull and Rajat Panwar from the IUFRO Task Force on Skaling Up Science-Based Forest Sector Innovation.
00:02:00
Speaker
They are joining us from really far away. And when I say far away, I mean far away from where I am based at IUFRO headquarters, which is in Vienna, Austria. Lyndall is based in Melbourne, Australia.
00:02:13
Speaker
And Rajat joins us from Corvallis, Oregon, in the west of the US.
IUFRO and FAO Collaboration
00:02:21
Speaker
So, Lyndall, could you say a few words about yourself, your academic and professional background, how you became a task force coordinator in IUFRO, and how this is linked to FAO, the Food and Agriculture Organization of the United Nations?
00:02:37
Speaker
Hi Gerda and hi Leila. It's a pleasure to be with you here today and thank you very much for inviting both myself and Rajat to participate in your branching out podcast. It's a real pleasure and honour to be here.
00:02:52
Speaker
As you mentioned Gerda, I am Australian, so I'm an Australian forester trained at the University of Melbourne and I have a PhD in the development and commercialisation of wood product innovations.
00:03:04
Speaker
The PhD was at the University of Melbourne, but during my time of of studying my PhD, I spent a considerable amount of time at Oregon State University, which is where I first had the great pleasure to meet my colleague and friend, Rajat.
00:03:18
Speaker
Over the course of my career, one of the great things about forestry is the diversity that it offers us and and I've been able to benefit from that and worked right along the forest sector value chain. I've done a diversity of things from managing research requirements of a plantation mistake to acting as a non-executive director of two of Australia's state-owned forestry companies.
00:03:41
Speaker
moved into sort of more academic role at Australian National University with Professor Peter Kanowksi, some of your listeners might know. and But most recently as a forestry officer with the Food and Agriculture Organization of the United Nations.
00:03:56
Speaker
Really impressively, FAO and IUFRO have had a formal collaboration which stretches back over 75 years, right back to almost the start of when FAO started.
00:04:08
Speaker
And in 2024, when I was still at FAO, the two organisations really recognised that their relationship and formal activities could be enhanced and the impact of their respective work further leveraged by scaling up their collaborative efforts.
00:04:24
Speaker
Our IUFRO, you've lightly touched on already, Gerda, of course, has this incredible network across the world's forest research community, while FAO has this global presence as the lead technical agency for forests within the UN system and has extremely strong links with governments around the world. So it's this wonderful complementarity.
00:04:43
Speaker
And so they initiated the process to develop a task force with IUFRO and we were successful in our application, so we were thrilled about that.
Challenges and Innovations in the Forest Sector
00:04:52
Speaker
In establishing that task force, know, the ambition was that it was truly global and that it brought together researchers from all the divisions within FAO, within IUFRO, sorry, And that we had a relatively even spread of researchers from both the Global North and Global South. And I think this is a really wonderful defining feature of this task force and is something that I'm really proud of.
00:05:14
Speaker
Thank you for the introduction and overview on how FAO and IUFRO are linked, Lyndall. Now we would like to hear more about our second guest, Rajat. So Rajat, you please share a few words about your academic and professional backgrounds, your research interests and your role at IUFRO?
00:05:32
Speaker
Thank you, Leila, for inviting me and Gerda for very kind invitation and to Lyndall for already alluding to our the origination of our connections. My name is Rajat Panwar and as Gerda said already, I am speaking today from Oregon State University located in Corvallis in the United States where I'm a professor of responsible and sustainable business.
00:05:59
Speaker
Currently, I'm also the interim director of of the Center for the Future of Forest and Society here at Oregon State University. I have two doctorate degrees, actually, and I know that Lyndall always makes fun of me for that.
00:06:14
Speaker
One in forestry from here, Oregon State University, and another one in the business administration from Grenoble, Management in France. My research focuses broadly on forest-based bio-economy, responsible and sustainable business, and quite a bit of my recent work has focused on the relationship between business and biodiversity.
00:06:37
Speaker
In terms of my association with IUFRO, I have long been associated with this organization. and addition to one of the deputy coordination boardroom, this top course, I'm also a deputy coordinator for Division 5.1.
00:06:54
Speaker
In addition to these two roles, I have also been associated with a recent policy brief chapter when I was a co-author. and also a lead author of an FAO, IUFRO project that analyzed the networks, opportunities, and challenges in the bioeconomic development in the Latin America and the Caribbean region last year.
00:07:18
Speaker
And if anyone could not tell yet by my accent, I'm originally from India, and then that is where I also did some forestry work, particularly in Nordwood forest product sector, before I moved to academia.
00:07:32
Speaker
So that's all about me and I'm very honoured and delighted to be part of this conversation today. Thank you so much Rajat, what an impressive journey. Let me start by asking Lyndall with the first question about this task force. Why you came up with this task force? Why does the forest sector need more innovation or more science-based innovation? Perhaps you can also give us one or two practical examples.
00:07:59
Speaker
Thanks, Gerda. I would expect that most of our listeners and most of the globe would understand and and recognise that, you know, the world's forests are under pressure and they cut they're under pressure from a wide range of things, but particularly climate-related stresses such as wildfire, pests and diseases. Deforestation, whilst decreasing in its race, still remains a great risk for our forests.
00:08:23
Speaker
And then this is taking place a low rising demand for wood and non-wood forest products. So we really have this sort of emerging complex scenario for the products and services that we we expect from our forests, as well as extremely important need to maintain their health and resilience.
00:08:44
Speaker
And so i guess it would seem somewhat obvious that under this really complex scenario, more innovation is needed in the forest sector with particular needs related to forest and land management approaches, the land the changes that will be required in transitioning to a bioeconomy that I noticed last week discussing in Austria at the summit, as well as the capacity to take advantage of the opportunities that non-wood forest products offer that Rajat briefly referred to.
00:09:13
Speaker
So whilst we know there's this great need for innovation, that's not to downplay that the forest sector to date has demonstrated a really great ability to innovate. Innovation has driven, for example, substantial gains in growing and processing efficiencies.
00:09:30
Speaker
It's led to this enormous array of wood and non-wood forest products that we all use in so many parts of you know our everyday life. It's catalyzed dramatic improvements in measurement, reporting and verification capacities of our forests.
00:09:46
Speaker
And then it's also enhanced local governance mechanisms and and boosted the deployment of new financial tools. But whilst this is extremely impressive, gaps remain. Those challenges for forests and the communities around them, that they do remain.
00:10:02
Speaker
So there is a demonstrative need to enhance the forest sector's capacity to innovate, particularly For example, in those places where processing efficiency might be low and there's a sort of recognised unmet potential for sharing transformative solutions across the globe that are needed if we're to meet the sustainable development goals. And I guess it's that point as to why I'm so glad that we have a task force that's so truly global in its nature.
00:10:33
Speaker
think it's really important that we recognise, and think Rajat will pick up on this a little bit, right, some of his answers as well, that innovation comes in a variety of forms. I think we're all largely familiar with the technological innovations, so product and process innovations.
00:10:51
Speaker
But it's really important to touch on the importance of other types of innovations, the social, policy, institutional and financial.
Understanding Innovation Globally
00:10:59
Speaker
And then with regards to practical examples, what is a product example that I think many listeners might be familiar with, but I think it's an important one just given its prominence.
00:11:09
Speaker
But that would be the mid and high rise buildings that are being built all around the world. And these have been enabled by wood products in ah wood product innovations such as cross laminated timber.
00:11:22
Speaker
And they're really working to reduce the carbon footprint of the built environment. I fully agree with you, Lyndall, that as our forests face more and more pressures, innovation becomes essential in the sector. And you also mentioned that innovation comes in many different forms. So i would like to take a step back. I'm here from Rajat.
00:11:44
Speaker
If there's any common understanding and awareness of what innovation truly means, and do you think this definition varies between regions? Thanks, Leila, for that wonderful question. The first one, is there a common understanding and awareness of what innovation means? Let me start out by a very blanket and broad statement that innovation is truly a loaded term and the answer may very well vary based on who you ask and where in the world they are located. So you can you can easily understand where or sense where I'm going with my answers already.
00:12:19
Speaker
But regardless of which type of innovation we are talking about in the forest sector, typically the end goal is to enhance the economic, environmental, and social performance of forest-based systems.
00:12:32
Speaker
Yeah, while there is a growing awareness of innovation across the sector and so much major rewarding, so many conversations, forums, including this task force and this podcast we have today, a lot of this is happening.
00:12:48
Speaker
There's not really already fully shared understanding of what it can be. So in some parts of the world, the innovation is really good technological advances, you know, new products, digital forestry tools, advanced processing technologies, all of those kinds of things. In other contexts, particularly where forests are closely tied to livelihoods and local governments, in those areas, those regions, innovation mills include institutional arrangements, community-based forest planning plans, or even new market mechanisms.
Community Forest Initiatives as Innovations
00:13:22
Speaker
So these differences are not trivial, but they are ah also fundamentally not aiming at very different outcomes. Ultimately, regardless of where they are, the economic, environmental and social performance and the integration of all three is what we are seeking to enhance through innovation. And as a follow up, Rajat, Lindel already mentioned a couple of examples of innovation models in her answers. But are there any additional ones at the top of your mind that you would like to share with the audiences?
00:13:54
Speaker
but Yeah, absolutely. So as I was mentioning that in the part of the world where I have done some research in, the social and institutional innovations are at the forefront of innovation conversations. And so, for example, community forest initiatives in Nepal and Mexico, they come to my mind often when I think of innovation in those regions.
00:14:17
Speaker
And there, are local forest user groups have developed innovative governance and management systems that combine, let's say, forest restoration or conservation with income generation through small-scale forest enterprises, also called community forest enterprises in some parts of the world. These innovations are not necessarily driven by advanced technology or technologies, but they represent important institutional and social new ways of doing things, new organizational models that have improved forest conditions and also supporting rural livelihoods. So I am very excited about those type of innovations that are in abundance in many parts of the world.
00:15:00
Speaker
Wonderful question. Thank you. Thank you so much. That was actually very enlightening. So you say, regardless of where we are, innovation is always about enhancing economic, environmental and social conditions. Now we've already heard about why we need innovation in the forest sector, or what it means and that we need to take both the global and the regional approach.
00:15:20
Speaker
But what is actually the role of science in scaling up innovation? Thanks, Gerda. There could hardly be a more important question, could there? And it's such a big question. So I'll i'll have a go at answering that sort of step by step. I guess in its most fundamental, science absolutely plays this critical role, underlying critical role, if we're going to develop and then scale up innovation in the forest sector.
00:15:48
Speaker
And that is because it provides for us the foundational knowledge that we need to understand all those different aspects of the forests and the forest sector that we've touched on. This evidence base is essential for ensuring that those innovations that we do develop, be they technological, be they forest management or governance, are both effective but also inclusive and that they're also sustainable. We can't do this without science. And it's through those sort of classic, I guess, science-based techniques of experimentation, pilot projects, monitoring approaches, testing innovations in different ecological or social conditions to understand what does work, what doesn't, before sort of looking to have them scale up and adopted.
00:16:35
Speaker
So science does reduce the uncertainty and risk, which is often obviously a key barrier to wider adoption in the forest sector. And I do want to just stop there for a moment though.
Role of Science in Scaling Innovations
00:16:45
Speaker
Everything I just said holds absolutely true, but it doesn't necessarily mean that every innovation should be scaled up for the globe. You know, some innovations are important and have a big impact at the local level, but then moving on. Third, science plays an important role in creating the right platforms for collaboration. the resulting innovation really works best when those different parts of the forest ecosystem work together. So we have industry, we have policy makers, we have the research community, we have local communities, etc.
00:17:18
Speaker
And it's these partnerships that are absolutely essential if we're going to take the the knowledge that's produced by science and then translate that into practical applications. I think there's another piece, and and I'm sure this is something that IUFRO gives a lot of thought to, Gerda.
00:17:36
Speaker
This is this piece around improving knowledge translation so that research findings are communicated and shared in ways that are accessible so they can be used by decision makers and practitioners and actually adopted and implemented.
00:17:53
Speaker
Then I guess the final piece and I touched on in my first answer about this very task force is this importance of interdisciplinary research, bringing together ecological science, engineers, economics, social sciences in order to help address those complex challenges that forest systems really face to ensure that ultimately yeah innovations are not just technologically feasible, but they're socially and economically viable.
00:18:21
Speaker
Thank you, Lyndall. So we heard from you the role of science in providing knowledge, ensuring sustainability and allowing the scale up of innovation and creating also room for collaboration. And you mentioned a bit some kind of transition from science to communication when you talked about facilitating knowledge sharing.
00:18:43
Speaker
So I'm going to move to Rajat and talk a bit about your task force objectives, one of which is to improve education and develop communication material.
Communication and Education in Innovation
00:18:53
Speaker
Can you please tell us why is this important and who is the specific audience that you target in such communications?
00:19:02
Speaker
Thank you, Leila. Lyndall already alluded to this, the importance of communication in translating scientific discovery into products or technologies that are widely adopted. So in that sense, improving education and communication is truly essential because in a sector like the forest sector where innovation has not been sort of germane to its its traditional ways of operating, it is not going to spread automatically.
00:19:31
Speaker
And even when strong scientific knowledge or promising technologies exist, we have seen it over and over again that they often remain confined to research institutions or sometimes pilot projects unless they are effectively communicated and translated into forms that various practitioners, policymakers, communities, investors, entrepreneurs, they can all understand, adopt, and use.
00:20:00
Speaker
So in that sense, I would argue that education and communication actually play a bridging role. They help translate complex scientific insights into, say, practical knowledge for forest managers, industry leaders, and stakeholders who ultimately would make the decisions about forest use and investments.
00:20:19
Speaker
They're also important for students and early career professionals. This is the most important aspect in in my understanding, and that is where the role of the task force is also crucially important, because these are the groups that will shape the next generation of the forest sector.
00:20:35
Speaker
And having said that, this is precisely where communication specialists can actually make an enormous contribution people such as yourself. Scientists are often trained to produce rigorous research, but not always to communicate it effectively beyond academic audiences. I will admit it it is one of the weaknesses of our institutions. Effective communication and understanding what effective communication is in today's society, it would help ensure that good science actually informs the practice rather than just sit in silos or ivory towers.
00:21:09
Speaker
So in a sector as globally important as forestry, I would say, Leila, that connection between knowledge and action is critical for scaling innovation, achieving sustainability outcomes, and therefore the role of communication and outreach cannot be overstated. It ultimately is a communication problem in many ways.
00:21:30
Speaker
Thank you so much, Rajat. I couldn't agree more. Communication and science communication are really essential. And I think this is something that is now more widely understood and also already built into many proposals and scientific
Bioproducts Business Journal Special Issue
00:21:46
Speaker
work. So thank you for emphasizing this important role.
00:21:50
Speaker
Talking about communication, publications are also a way of communicating. And I think your task force is currently pulling together a joint publication, Lyndall. Is that right? It is a special issue in the Bioproducts Business Journal titled Scaling Up Innovation for Sustainable Value Creation. Can you tell us a little bit about it, maybe just briefly?
00:22:12
Speaker
Sure. Thanks a lot, Gerda. Thank Yes, I mean, the special issue in bioproducts business, I think really speaks to a lot of the points that Raja has just raised about the important role that you play and the different perspectives that they have. And there is no greater champion of this point than my colleague, Assistant Professor of Sustainable Biomaterials Marketing, Pipiet Larasatie at Virginia Tech. And I really want to acknowledge her, who acknowledge Pipiet, who's championed the development of this issue.
00:22:42
Speaker
and really taken an innovative approach to the development of this special issue. Because whilst of course it's open to all researchers and very much open to a traditional papers, we're also trying to bring a really open mind to the sort of papers that we might include in the special issue and have made particular efforts to welcome early stage researchers where it can be sometimes sort of hard to to get ah a publication in a peer reviewed journal.
00:23:12
Speaker
Early on, we'd offer advice and mentoring to assist the researchers to write a successful journal submission.
Upcoming Activities and Webinar Series
00:23:18
Speaker
The special issue is also open to innovative topics, but also writing forms that, again, typically it could be challenging to get into a peer-reviewed journal. So if any listeners are interested, they're very welcome to get in touch with Kapit or myself.
00:23:34
Speaker
We all look forward to reading the special issue whenever it's out. Now, Rajat, are there any other current or upcoming task force activities that you would like to share with us?
00:23:44
Speaker
um Yes, Leila, absolutely. Actually, we have an exciting year of activities ahead. But I'll just, in the interest of time, just will pick out on a couple that I think might be of particular interest to our audience here. We are currently working with FAO to deliver a global survey on forest sector innovation.
00:24:03
Speaker
We are in the process of finalizing the instruments that the questions. And hopefully that will help us understand better the barriers and and opportunities globally that lie ahead of the forest sector stakeholders in terms of their ability to wait and also in terms of their abilities to harness the full potential of innovations in their respective jurisdictions. In addition to that, later in the year, in collaboration with the Yale School of Forestry and Environmental Studies, we'll lead the delivery of a webinar series on innovation in the forest sector. And I believe that would yet be yet another important mechanism. We were just talking about the importance of communication. That will also be a very important way of communicating the various aspects of innovation, various dimensions of innovation, and and the challenges that lie ahead of the sector. And I'm hoping and very much looking forward to those deliberations, particularly because some of the topics that will be addressed in those webinars are essentially about ameliorating and overcoming the barriers to innovation and and scaling up of science-based innovation in the forest sector globally. So very much aligned with the objectives of this task force.
00:25:21
Speaker
And I don't have any more details now to give the kind of pitch that Lyndall gave for this special issue. But in the due course, as the information become available, I think it would be wonderful if you could share with your audiences and of course with you for support.
00:25:35
Speaker
I think it would be wonderful to take those webinars to stakeholders
Summary and Key Messages on Innovation
00:25:39
Speaker
globally. Thank you for sharing these activities. And as you said, we will help promoting them. And this is an invitation to our listeners, those who are interested to also join these webinars and to join these activities and follow what's going on in your task force.
00:25:55
Speaker
But now, i think before we close this exciting conversation about forest sector innovation, can I ask all of you for a key takeaway message? And maybe, Lyndall, you start with a brief, in a nutshell, message? Sure, thanks Gerda. Not necessarily an easy question, there's lots of things I'd like to say, but look, we will recognise just how essential forests are for functioning societies, our economies and their healthy ecosystems. You know, really, there's hardly a more important topic. We know that forests are subject to a number of pressures and we certainly can't let up on our efforts around decreasing deforestation, increasing restoration and ensuring that forests can continue to supply our wood product needs.
00:26:47
Speaker
I think there's some great opportunities for hope or, you know, one for me would be the increasing recognition by the investment community of natural capital being a sort of a legitimate asset class. So I do think we're seeing change going in some places in the right direction.
00:27:06
Speaker
But we're really only going to continue to see out that sort of long-term capacity to steward forests so that they can continue to deliver all those wonderful products and values that we rely on them for if we continue to invest in science and
Global Innovation Flow
00:27:24
Speaker
innovation. It's been the point of this whole podcast, obviously, so it seems a rather obvious take-home message. But I guess extracting from that, I really want to just then touch on the importance of collaboration.
00:27:36
Speaker
We're not going to get there without effective collaboration. And I'm really proud of this task force and the collaboration between IUFRO and FAO, these two amazing global institutions to work on this big task. And then all the members of the task force who are putting in so much effort making a contribution to those aims, which ultimately is this point about the appropriate stewardship of the world's forests.
00:28:04
Speaker
And so I guess I'd like to just close off with thanking you for the opportunity to have this discussion. Thanks. Thank you, Linda, for the positive and forward-looking message, highlighting the importance of collaboration as well.
00:28:19
Speaker
Now I'll pass the mic to Rajat. What would be your key message our listeners? Leila, I knew that you were going to put me in this difficult situation. Honestly, one key takeaway message in such a broad topic is it's a very, very difficult thing to do, but I'll do my best nonetheless. To me, the most important message to extract from any conversation in the innovation field is that meaningful innovation in the forest sector must flow in both directions.
00:28:51
Speaker
That is not only from global north to global south, but between the global north and the global south. Yes, granted that advanced technologies are often developed in the north, no question about that.
00:29:03
Speaker
But we also need to keep in mind that some of the most powerful innovations in governance, in community stewardship and livelihood integration, they are emerging from the global south.
00:29:15
Speaker
And so recognizing and valuing and learning from these diverse sources of innovation, that I believe will be essential for building a truly global and resilient forest sector and to harness the forest's fuller potential in addressing you know multiple social and environmental problems. Not only will this be important to achieve these goals, it will also be more respectful and more inclusive.
Connecting Science with Policy and Practice
00:29:40
Speaker
That is my key takeaway message, Leela. but But may I invite you back, Leila, and ask what could be your main takeaway from this conversation, if you may allow me to?
00:29:52
Speaker
I see we're flipping roles now. So I think after what we heard on this episode, I can answer this question from a communications lens, given my involvement in the Working Party.
00:30:03
Speaker
And in simple words, I can say that innovation is only possible when communication connects science with policy, people and practice, which means that communication is truly a key enabler of innovation in the forestry sector.
00:30:20
Speaker
Thank you so much to all of you for your great inputs for for this great conversation. And we're coming to an end now.
Closing and Next Episode Preview
00:30:29
Speaker
And I would not only like to thank you, our guests and Leila, my co-host, but especially also our listeners for joining us.
00:30:39
Speaker
And I invite them to look out for the next Branching Out episode, where we will explore the connection between forests, water, livelihoods and governance, which is the topic of yet another IUFRO taskforce.
00:30:53
Speaker
And if you want to know more about IUFRO, follow us on social media or click on the show notes. And until next time, goodbye.