Transcript
Alexis: Hey peeps, how's your 2025 rocking?
Plant People: It's still January from the 30th week of January.
Jessica : would
Jessica : January, that will never end. It's been so cold.
Plant People: I'm tired of dirty snow. That's where I'm at right now.
Alexis: m
Jessica : Yeah.
Brett: dirty dirty dirty snow
Jessica : ah
Alexis: It's weird how like January takes forever, but then all of a sudden we'll be like, so it's September and ah like how
Plant People: Yes, yes.
Brett: Time to get those fall crops on the ground.
Alexis: yeah
Plant People: That's it. You know, I always say it's just January. I've got a little time to get my seating, you know, trays in for like, especially cool season crops. I always miss that window. I always miss if I'm going to grow a for few transplants.
Alexis: and
Alexis: February 1st is go time, baby. Let's go.
Plant People: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Brett: Yeah, I've got my I've got I've tried so I'm trying out a new thing this year.
Jessica : Yeah.
Alexis: um
Plant People: Yeah.
Brett: um I'm trying out a bonsai but this would work for gardens to a bonsai reminder set up in my phone like a pre pre scheduled reminders for the whole season that I'm having repeat every year, you know, first
Jessica : Oh.
Plant People: Oh, nice.
Plant People: Yeah.
Brett: first sunday in or yeah first Sunday in January every year or you know whatever. I'm going to see how it works. We don't know because there's there's different times of the year where you do different interventions as far as pruning or repotting or any of that kind of fun stuff.
Alexis: Mmhmm.
Plant People: Mm hmm.
Brett: So I have mine that most of them are are just around the bend as far as starting some new seeds and thinking about repotting. So that's an exciting time.
Plant People: Reminders are a good thing.
Brett: Yeah.
Jessica : It is.
Plant People: That's a very good thing.
Alexis: I just like reorganized the greenhouse bench for like things that really didn't need bottom heat, but they were already on the like heat mats or whatever, because seed starting for me starts next week, the first week of February.
Alexis: So um for those cool season things.
Jessica : Right.
Alexis: So I'm like, okay, I need to actually like, how many bales of soil do I have and start.
Jessica : We strategically placed our giant order of vegetable seeds, but had it placed early and it was like, please don't ship it until last yeah the last week of January.
Alexis: Mm -hmm.
Alexis: Please don't.
Jessica : So nobody like jumps the gun right to like want to start things early.
Alexis: Uh.
Jessica : But then at the same time, we were like, man, we really got to start those hot peppers earlier.
Alexis: Uh.
Jessica : Because those things, those scorpions, ghosts, all of those guys as Carolina Reapers take forever.
Plant People: Do they take a longer time to germinate?
Alexis: ah
Jessica : So they are the first thing that we will seed.
Plant People: Yeah.
Brett: I've always had had really long experiences of very long, not only germination, but then even growth.
Jessica : Yes.
Alexis: Mm -hmm.
Brett: It just takes for, you feel like they've been in the greenhouse for like a year by the time you, and you've put out, you're like putting everything else out and yeah.
Jessica : um
Alexis: Mm -hmm.
Alexis: Don't ever grow Lizzianthus then, both of you. It is, it will haunt your dreams.
Jessica : Oh.
Alexis: It takes so long. It's like, it's like six to eight weeks just to germinate, like just to germinate.
Jessica : What?
Brett: Oh gosh.
Alexis: And then.
Brett: That's so Ah, man.
Jessica : Oh, that would drive me crazy. Cause I don't want to keep coming and check in and checking and be like, we can do anything.
Alexis: Mm -hmm. Yep.
Plant People: Yeah.
Alexis: Yep. So like if I wanted to put them in and say like the first week of April, cause like I've, I've seated them before. And if I wanted to put them in, say the first week of April, I would have had to start them in December for them to be like barely big enough to go in the ground.
Alexis: Like, like not beautiful plants, like just big enough to go in the ground.
Jessica : Wow.
Brett: Yeah, we'll never do that.
Alexis: Uh -huh. It's so shoutout shout out, shout out to Lizzie growers.
Brett: Sorry.
Jessica : Yeah. The hot peppers are.
Jessica : I'll just take the hot peppers, at least they'll like germinate and pop up, but then they just take forever after that.
Alexis: yeah You know they're alive.
Jessica : You know, they're alive at least.
Alexis: Yeah, they're not just like a film of green ah growing on the soil surface.
Brett: My plants are little in their seeds.
Brett: It always freaks me out to like, like manage the water because I feel like I'm like, I want to water you but I don't want you to be too wet.
Jessica : What if I love you too much?
Alexis: and
Plant People: Mm.
Brett: But what if like that.
Alexis: Oh, you know what? My, you probably already do this, but, uh, vermiculite just sprinkled over the top is so great for really small seeds.
Plant People: Yeah. Mm.
Alexis: Cause it keeps that moisture like right there at the surface level and you don't overdo it. So that's my, that's been really helpful for me with like Snapdragon seeds that are just like dust.
Brett: Um, vermiculite great, great in South great and salads as well.
Jessica : Hmm.
Alexis: Um, vermiculite sprinkle, like a fine.
Plant People: And just don't get paralot confused with vermiculite. So yeah, don't get those two things confused or put in salad.
Alexis: Yeah, no.
Plant People: Yeah.
Brett: Okay. Yeah. Don't eat that.
Alexis: Don't eat it. No, it is a naturally a occurring substance. It is Omri approved.
Plant People: Paralot will not have the same effect if you do that over the top of your seeds.
Brett: Yeah.
Jessica : No.
Alexis: No.
Plant People: So the two are, you know, it's lighter in color, but do not get them confused.
Alexis: Are indeed different.
Plant People: They do different things.
Brett: How did you all make it through the cold? Any impact?
Plant People: Here in Kentucky, it has been we we had snow just for those of you that may not be here in Kentucky and central Kentucky.
Jessica : um
Plant People: I know ah most of Kentucky's had a lot of snow, but the snow has stuck around for weeks now. So.
Brett: More snow and more staying power than we're used to.
Plant People: And in in cold weather.
Jessica : We, down our way, ah speaking for Alexis and myself, we had a lot of ice. Like we had, we had a lot of snow.
Alexis: Yeah.
Jessica : Then we got a layer of ice and then we got more snow on top of that.
Plant People: Yeah.
Alexis: Mm -hmm.
Jessica : So that was not fun.
Alexis: The sandwich effect was weird. Yeah. Usually it's like ice is either all the way at the bottom or all the way on top.
Plant People: Yeah.
Alexis: The fact that we got so much snow on top of it was, was unusual.
Plant People: Then if you drove over top of that sandwich mix, it formed ah something, ah a plate of steel or rock that would not melt.
Alexis: Hard like rock.
Jessica : Yes.
Alexis: Yeah. Yeah.
Plant People: And I finally took it like a steel bar out and chipped it away in four inch sections off of our driveway. We have a small driveway and and it took forever and it's still laying in piles outside and it's very slow to melt.
Alexis: Mmhmm.
Jessica : Yeah.
Alexis: Yeah.
Plant People: Very slow.
Jessica : it i mean As of right now, plant -wise, I think everything is okay. I will say for any of you those who you know are plant lovers but also may have some livestock on the side as well, um chore time greatly increased by an extra at least two hours you know to feed everything during that weather.
Alexis: Oh yeah.
Plant People: um Yeah.
Jessica : so it was like better with, I guess, the snow, but now we're like in that lovely period and in right Ray knows what I'm talking about, mud season.
Alexis: Mud.
Jessica : um So.
Alexis: But.
Plant People: and And when it's been frozen for the longer it seems like it's been frozen, the more it's actually frozen to a depth, the worse it's going to be when it finally unthaws.
Jessica : Mm hmm.
Plant People: And that's at a point in time when four wheel drive vehicles, tractors, trucks, whatever, don't mean a whole lot because they will all sink to the axles and stop forward momentum.
Jessica : Right. Right.
Plant People: Yeah.
Alexis: m
Jessica : It was like, it was like, it was harder. Like once all the snow and everything stopped for like making the tractor around versus like when it was happening, like when you would think it would be like, Oh, it must be really difficult to get out there and feed hay at that time.
Jessica : But it was like the couple of days afterwards. That's when it was harder to get out and go down the driveway and you know, those things.
Plant People: yeah
Alexis: Yeah.
Jessica : But, but we made it through, right? Because the sun is shining and it's actually like going to be like 50. And we're all going to get excited and want to plant things.
Alexis: And then the rain's gonna come and more, it's gonna be even muddier than it was before.
Jessica : Right. I'm just trying to be like, it's filling the ponds up.
Plant People: The reserves.
Jessica : That's a good thing, right?
Alexis: Yes, totally.
Jessica : It's filling the ponds up.
Alexis: We're getting in some deep, you know, water penetration. The trees are going to be happy. Everybody's.
Jessica : That's right.
Alexis: Yeah, it has been a really, I feel like a really sunny winter so far, like even though we've had a lot of precipitation, which is not super usual.
Plant People: Mm -hmm. Yeah.
Alexis: And like the sun is what, I don't know, makes it better. Like I can work with the cold, but the gloom is can, you know, brings on the the seasonal depression.
Jessica : Yep.
Plant People: The days are short.
Alexis: So the sun has been nice.
Plant People: Yeah. And if they're gloomy and short, I feel like that, yeah, it's never ending, but the days are getting longer now about 20, 30 months a day.
Alexis: Yeah. Yeah.
Jessica : They are getting longer.
Alexis: It's good for starting plants when we have that much sun.
Plant People: Yeah. Oh, yeah.
Alexis: So.
Plant People: Oh, yeah.
Brett: Yeah, Alexis, and now we're talking about shoveling some snow into structures to just get a little bit of that moisture inside.
Alexis: Mm hmm.
Plant People: Mmhmm.
Brett: ah You know, I have the bonsai and other things in pots that they don't need a ton of water in the winter, but a little bit to kind of keep things moist and I have them under cover and protected.
Brett: And so as a result, ah and they you know i they don't get that snow layered for insulation or anything else.
Alexis: Mhm.
Brett: so i've and throwing stuff in, but it's it was weird because it was it got so cold for a little while, um like down into single digit zero, maybe even a little sub zero around here.
Alexis: Mhm.
Jessica : Mmhmm.
Alexis: Mhm.
Brett: I don't know. It's just just been a strange, i was I was really worried about, because with the ice about losing power, but around here, the a lot of trees the lot of the trees that are aging out and that are in trouble got knocked out by other aberrant weather events over the last three years.
Brett: and Knocked out power for four days when it was nice outside. So luckily when it was freezing cold, we didn't ever lose power, which was very lucky.
Alexis: Mm hmm.
Alexis: Yeah, we found out that negative five was the cut off for our pipes. So ah negative five, they freeze.
Brett: Okay.
Alexis: So now we know.
Jessica : yeah Now we know.
Alexis: Now we know.
Plant People: I don't want to ask, how do you know that?
Alexis: Well, the main line does. So yeah, the main line does.
Plant People: And it sounds like you know that the hard way.
Alexis: Yeah, yeah.
Jessica : Unfortunately, right?
Alexis: Right.
Plant People: Yeah.
Jessica : It's a little
Alexis: Yeah. Luckily. Yeah. We got it on in the same day, but, uh, it was, it was a little sketchy there for a while, but the, but it was fine because it was just the one to the house, the ones to the barn, um, and the tunnels and stuff still had water.
Alexis: So I just like lugged water into the house. It's usually the opposite. Uh, you're looking water to the barn, but yes, that was fortunate. But anyways, I think I've said, but 4 ,000 times and no longer has any meaning.
Brett: all all of this All of this winter activity and buildup and anticipation, it's headed somewhere, right?
Plant People: It's got to head somewhere.
Alexis: Plants.
Plant People: So it's got to play.
Jessica : Yeah, you know, yeah, it's kind of like um
Brett: play points yeah
Plant People: It always comes back to plants.
Alexis: since
Plant People: It always does. Yeah, eventually, eventually.
Jessica : winter chore time, planning, plants, all of that, getting ready for the farmer's markets. That's what I've, I've been doing in this cold winter weather because that's the time to do it.
Alexis: business
Jessica : And I also don't want to be outside.
Alexis: Applications are yeah yeah exactly making excuses to actually do desk work.
Jessica : So yeah. ah Yeah. Yeah. Filling out farmer's market applications and like gathering all the info that goes with them, right?
Jessica : You're like Kentucky proud stuff, maybe your micro processing license, all of those fun things.
Plant People: I always forget like ah how much stuff there is, and I know some of you guys are are you know growers personally, but ah we just had our annual meeting. um in the county that I'm in. And I forget that there's so much stuff. And I was like, well, where am I going to talk about this year? And I've got a little checklist. Jessica's helped me develop that over time. But I added to it, and I kept added to and and i kept adding to it. And I was like, I dominated the meeting with just basic updates for new diseases or regulatory things you have to do or microprocessor things or all the things. There's a lot to get ready for in farmers markets here in Kentucky. So this is a great time to kind of get that started if you've not already got started on that.
Plant People: Lots of things going on, but.
Alexis: Farmers market. So ah one thing that CCD does and works a lot with Center for Crop Firstification, which is where Brett and I work, ah is we do a lot with farmers market. And so if any of you are interested in farmers market as it of it becoming you know something you want to get into, whether or not it's the right market for you,
Alexis: Uh, just what are all the things that go along with it? We do have a lot of resources on our website. One of them we're going to talk about today that is, uh, can be particularly helpful when you're planning your summer and what cashflow could look like, might look like.
Alexis: And Brett has done, Brett, you've been doing this for like price, these price reports and, um, AOL over 80 years.
Brett: for well over 80 years.
Plant People: 80 years.
Brett: Or no, no, ah like 10 years. Yeah. So we've been, I've been doing it since 20, since 2015. But we, the CCD has been collecting price reports from farmers markets and from produce auctions dating back to like 2004.
Brett: In the, there if you aren't familiar, either, either you're from Kentucky or from somewhere else, maybe and you aren't familiar. there was this thing that happened called the tobacco master settlement agreement that essentially it was a legal action between a lot of parties and it, but the effect that it had on agriculture in large part was that it, it was going to mean that there was going to be less tobacco produced in the state of Kentucky. And that was a huge part of the profitability and the whole, the whole culture, everything of farms in Kentucky. And so as a result, um,
Brett: there was either going to have to be something to theoretically replace or offset tobacco. There's many people in agriculture who are going to try to figure out new alternatives. And so the organization that we work with, the Center for Crop Diversification, is actually celebrating its 25th anniversary, which the 25 years dates back to a couple of years after, ah our we got our start a couple of years after that that um the tobacco settlement.
Alexis: Settlement.
Brett: Yeah. And there's a lot of programs in Kentucky that, that's kind of start at that point. And so as we're looking back on these price reports, which were started in 2004, we're celebrating this 25th year.
Brett: Uh, we have ah generated over the last few years, these retrospective publications to kind of compare average prices, um, over three year periods. As you know, one year might be crazy.
Brett: There might be something about it, but there's a drought or there's a, hurricane that makes its way inland, hypothetically, or something else happens that affects things.
Jessica : Mm hmm.
Brett: So we try to use it a three -year average to um just buffer some of those differences to see see how things are changing across time. And so we have a new publication as of ah December, I guess, which is called the three -year average weekly prices at Kentucky's farmers markets, 2022 to 2024 version.
Brett: um not Taylor's version, but 2022 to 2024 version. And um yeah, so that we put these together because ah agents and producers as well as they're useful, it gives a sense of how things are changing and shifting and whether or not
Plant People: world here.
Brett: Stuff at my market's been really expensive or it feels like prices are coming down at my market.
Alexis: who
Brett: Is that true you know elsewhere? It gives a little bit of ah a sense of the the broader marketplace and some trends that are happening. and so we We released that back in December. We've got a couple of short articles to that orient you to um what how How you might use it what you might think about it but also and also i have some some data here so what do you all how do you all interact with farmers markets is this and and the pricing thing is this something new comes up in the offices.
Plant People: Well, we used this report ah actually just last night at our excuse me ah farmer's market meeting and went over some of the the basic trends and and got a lot of questions that I said, well, let me get back to you after we do this podcast episode and I get to talk to Brad a little bit more.
Plant People: But the the information in this report is very well laid out. And I know that that I saw market members pouring through the data. And that sparked a lot of conversation during our annual farmer's market meeting. And I guess what they were seeing on paper kind of jived with what they saw happening in the real world. you know Number one, they recognize that there has been ah you know big swings in prices over the last few years you know due to, I'm sure, a variety of factors. but They loved it. They found it very interesting and and I use a lot of Center for Crop Diversification publications with our farmers market. You guys have really great just ongoing through kind of seasonal price reports and then you have these historic price reports. But sparked a lot of great conversation at the market among growers um ah during that meeting.
Plant People: And I don't know, I guess we would be more of a rural market, you know, Bourbon County and where our markets located in Paris, Kentucky is a small. It's not really a population center, smaller population. But one of the interesting things that they were looking at our growers is they really noticed that you guys broke down.
Plant People: you know, and differentiated between urban and rural markets. And they just found that fascinating. They kind of always knew that sometimes you could fetch a higher price at the urban markets, but they loved seeing that data quantified it on paper.
Plant People: They loved it. They really liked it.
Brett: Yeah, that's the variability of of the rural spaces and and the prices there and in our urban markets. It factors into a lot of different conversations. I mean, there's conversations about cost of living and in rural and urban spaces and and wages in those places.
Brett: But there's also discussions of is it worth it for me to drive an hour and a half to get to an urban area?
Plant People: Yeah.
Alexis: isn't it
Jessica : Right?
Plant People: that That's the conversation.
Jessica : Yep.
Brett: Is it worth it?
Plant People: Yeah.
Brett: Yeah.
Plant People: We're about 20 minutes from a more urban market.
Jessica : Yep.
Plant People: So that's why they found it so interesting. Some of our market members were, you know, we're selling at our local rural market, but they also have access to fairly close by with, you know, within 20 minutes, ah urban market.
Plant People: So they found it really interesting, Brett.
Brett: Yeah, well, and the thing is too, once you show up to that urban market, you may be asked to pay a really high fee in order to set up there.
Plant People: Yeah.
Jessica : Yep.
Brett: And I mean, we're talking, there's there's urban markets that we have where the the whole fee for the whole year might be $0, it might be $25, it might be, you know, some of these rural markets, they're they're just trying to get vendors there, so they're not really in a position to charge.
Jessica : Yep.
Jessica : Right.
Brett: And then you have urban markets where it can be thousands of dollars to set up for the whole, you know,
Jessica : Waitlist.
Plant People: and waiting list, yeah, wait list.
Jessica : Waitlist. Yeah.
Brett: wait -listed politics, all the other fun things that are associated with.
Jessica : Waitlist to get in. Additional gate fees, percentages on what you make a month.
Brett: Yeah.
Brett: Yeah.
Jessica : Right.
Brett: What's your take? What's your take on that stuff, Jessica?
Jessica : ah Well on your on the information you just are kind of like what Ray said like for work -wise like that's a I provide this information is a good starting point for people who are new to markets because they never know what to actually charge and it's also good for those more experienced people as well um who are thinking about bumping up to maybe that urban market or It kind of can be used sometimes where people are like, oh, maybe I am charging a little too much for our area.
Jessica : And that's why I'm not moving products compared to you know some other vendors.
Alexis: Hmm hmm.
Jessica : Personally, I find this information really fascinating and interesting because I've been doing markets for about 14 years now. My husband and I have. So it's really neat to see the change over time with the market prices.
Jessica : um I've always, same thing as Ray mentioned, value that urban versus rural and um being able to you know provide that to growers to see how they should balance their prices. right and um Yeah, just with the markets, like you said, if you go into these urban markets, a lot of our smaller markets have like a one -time fee at the beginning of the year. And so not as much of an input cost to it. So if you're not bringing home a ton, that might be okay. But then ah these larger markets have a ah lot more inputs into them to be involved, but you're hoping for
Jessica : a more trafficked market, you know you're able to ask for those higher prices that kind of go along with it.
Alexis: Yeah. I could also see this being a useful tool for someone who maybe wants to expand what they grow. And so, you know, looking at, again, these are these are averages, you should always, in you know, in theory, we tell you that you should know your own numbers.
Alexis: But, you know, if you've never grown garlic before, um but you can kind of say, all right, it'll be about this much to get the bulbs in. And let's just say it'll take me an hour to plant.
Plant People: Yeah.
Alexis: You know, you're kind of going through these things. but you don't know how much you're going to get for it. It can be nice to have these averages just to give you a place to start and whether or not it's worth it to grow garlic or lettuce.
Jessica : Mmhmm.
Alexis: And you might say, I'm not going to get a high end enough price to warrant ah me purchasing this in my time to take to grow it. And I think that can be really, really helpful for people who are wanting to ah expand their production ah and what that might look like.
Brett: So I'm i'm wanting to to write a publication, maybe a couple out of some of the these data, because we now have we now have three year averages going all the way back to 2016. And so just to to put a little point on the the conversation about the urban rural and that decision making in this report, just taking a look at these averages in 2022,
Brett: On average, urban prices were 35 % higher than rural prices.
Alexis: crazy.
Brett: That number in 2023 jumped to 39 .6%, almost 40%. And then we saw in 2024, actually, the number came back came down a little bit back to 31%.
Brett: But in any case, you're talking about almost a third higher prices. And in some cases, for some commodities or for some product crops and products, that difference is greater and some that's lower, obviously.
Brett: Um, but it is kind of, uh, yeah, it's, it's expected, but when you see that type of number put on it, it's, it's pretty staggering, honestly.
Jessica : Mm hmm.
Plant People: Yeah.
Alexis: Game changing, yeah.
Jessica : Yep.
Brett: Yeah.
Plant People: There are some interesting sub trends there and it kind of maybe speaks maybe you could help me out Brett kind of speaks to that what you just you know some of the statistics you just threw out there is that I was looking at one thing that you had published and kind of pushed out to this and it was really interesting that on this latest price report the average price increased 3 .5 percent in urban markets, but the average price increased 5 .3 % in rural markets.
Plant People: So a larger increase in rural markets. What do you attribute that to? A price correction or what's going on there? Is there any inferences you can make from that? and Yeah.
Brett: Yeah, hard to say, but the the thing that you're pointing out there that I really like is that the the gap between urban and rural was closing more as a factor of rural prices increase or rural markets increasing their prices than it was about urban prices decreasing.
Plant People: Meeting a little bit. Yes.
Brett: So the city slickers didn't get their stuff any cheaper. The rural markets were starting to just charge a little bit more for their product. I think I would love to believe that some portion of that 5 .3 % is the result of people like us out there telling people to really think about how they're pricing their products.
Plant People: Input cost, yeah.
Jessica : Mm hmm.
Brett: Think about it. And yeah and and and sometimes maybe the the realities of the spikes in input costs in 2022 and 2023 didn't really come home to roost until you know this year.
Jessica : Right.
Brett: ah you know it's it's hard That one's hard to to know. I think it also could be that there's maybe some more savvy business people coming into some of our rural markets who are pushing that those prices up.
Brett: Um, but yeah, I think there's a number of different plausible Hypotheses, uh plausible guesses as to why that might be But it was good to see that it wasn't just that urban markets have crashed and that's why there's a smaller gap Right all of it's all of it's because of us
Plant People: Yeah.
Plant People: Yeah, no, it did it didn't seem to indicate that. Yeah, it was pretty interesting. Pretty interesting.
Jessica : I think people are utilizing your resources.
Plant People: Maybe.
Jessica : it's so it's like oh right But serious.
Plant People: and in
Alexis: You're welcome.
Jessica : In these smaller markets, it's like opening their eyes of what they could potentially ask you know for their product because they're growing a great product as well, just as they are you know the urban markets.
Jessica : so
Brett: Yeah, well, you bring up you bring up a good point um about the ability to have conversations and the role that data can that from a third party who really isn't involved can play in these groups.
Plant People: And I'll and
Jessica : Yes.
Brett: And it's something that I always encourage people. I've gotten a lot of mileage out of this one particular example that I'll share here. But um it It's an opportunity to to have a conversation that's informed. And I found at times there are some people in the group who are really resistant to changing prices. ah There's some that are really adamant that we should be. And um if you if you aren't familiar with farmer's market dynamics, there's a lot of them who collectively discuss their prices and they discuss
Jessica : Mm hmm.
Brett: you know let's Let's try to retain the maintain the value um of and the profitability of everyone by not selling stuff below cost or so cheap.
Jessica : Right.
Brett: and But there's a lot of anxiety too about raising prices too much. And I have this you know example from one of our reporters who um she was talking about green onions.
Brett: This is a number of years ago now, but she's talking about green onions. And she said that they had been selling green onions at their market for a dollar a bunch since, you know ah I don't know what, the beginning, or for for at least the several years, as long as she'd been around.
Alexis: the Donna time.
Brett: And they wanted to, think about raising their prices, but people were super you know nervous about it. and so She goes to the reports, she kind of points out, look, everywhere in the state, even these markets that are kind of comparable to us, these urban markets are sorry these rural markets, ah everywhere is selling them for at least $2 a bunch. We are giving this product away So having that data to point to instead of just vibes and just sort of arguing, you know, like, I just, I saw my cousin said, um, allowed for them.
Brett: And they all, they, what they did that next week was they charged $2 a bunch and everybody still sold out. And.
Jessica : Right.
Brett: They got this so they made twice as much money on that just that little change and they probably could charge more than that but.
Alexis: They doubled their money, yeah.
Jessica : Yeah.
Alexis: this
Brett: um and so that Those types of and and i've had similar conversations where you have either new people coming into the group or there's just an ongoing skism that has different opinions about profitability and different or is some people are.
Brett: If you have folks in the market who are more on the hobby side versus more on the professional side um whatever those distinctions mean.
Alexis: Yep.
Brett: it can be difficult to to have that conversation. And so, yeah, I'm i'm hopeful that this these data do inform ah some some good decision -making.
Plant People: Well, I really like the, and maybe we should just deliberately visit this, but at the beginning of this report, I like the way that you guys laid out, Brett, how to use this document.
Plant People: It's not a prescription, and you guys have sort of been talking about that this whole time on this episode, but it's really not a prescription of what you should charge.
Jessica : Thank you.
Plant People: It sort of lays out the do's and don'ts of how to use the document because what it boils down to is, you know, you have to make a lot of individual considerations based on your situations. But it's real explicit about that and the trends that are contained in there and, you know, that points to the fact that, yeah, you do have to.
Plant People: no matter what, know your own input cost and you know how far you are from markets or whatever, all the variables that you know your market has. And they picked up on that last night because they started making comments. I heard someone yell across the room. It says, hey, that says how not to use this report. And mom like they said, that's not a to -do list. And one person yelled across the room. At one point, there's a bulleted list.
Plant People: And they were like, no, no, you're using it wrong. And I was sort of cracking up. Yeah. And they were like, Oh, yeah, yeah.
Alexis: That's awesome
Plant People: We see how to use this report.
Brett: Oh, the how -to use.
Plant People: ah Yeah. The how to use, but I was ah kind of laughing, but they did pick up on that. And hopefully, you know, that, that does aid people when they use these documents, because I know that all this data that you guys put together and all the interpretations can be tricky, but ah very interesting.
Brett: Well, yeah, the ah the reality is that the the data, these data that come from farmers markets is tricky to collect. It's tricky to pull together. It's tricky to analyze. Everybody, you know we we preach um diversification. I'm sorry, and but we do preach diversification, but we also preach differentiation of your product. you know Tell me the story of why this bean is special.
Brett: And so at your farmer's market stand, you say, this is my grandma, Thelma's 12th generation heirloom bean that was brought here you know from Ireland and blah, blah, blah, all these things.
Alexis: Mm hmm.
Brett: And and that's why it's an extra 50 cents per pound. And i'm as ah on the marketing side, I'm like, yes, please do that. If your customer cares about that, amazing, amazing work.
Brett: But when it comes to a farmer's market price reporting, we have like, I don't know, 35 characters to describe what an item is, what size it is, et cetera.
Alexis: Mm hmm.
Plant People: Yeah.
Brett: And we're trying to compare to some extent like to like. So that's one thing that's kind of kind of wild is if you have something that's specialty or different or unique, that it's hard for us to really bring that in, especially if you're charging a premium because We really want to compare green beans to green beans to green beans, regardless of the the market.
Alexis: Mm -hm.
Brett: and um so And everybody's special and that's amazing, but that's one thing. And then the other is just units. Units is the ongoing.
Plant People: Hounds and bunches, yeah.
Jessica : Yeah.
Brett: Yeah.
Plant People: Yeah.
Brett: Handful. I'm like, who's handful? Is this like my handful?
Alexis: Mm
Jessica : Right.
Brett: Is this a small child's handful?
Alexis: -hm.
Brett: How you know how how ah how tight are you gripping the the
Plant People: I think quantify that, yeah.
Jessica : ah yeah Are they weighing them? Are they putting them in cork containers? Are they putting them in plastic bags already? Yeah, it's all over all over the place.
Brett: Yeah.
Alexis: That's one of the reasons cut flowers are not all on the list currently because they are the way.
Plant People: They're too special.
Alexis: Well, though like that's they're special for sure, like variety wise, but the ah just like, you know, a bouquet is not a bouquet is not a bouquet.
Plant People: Yeah. but Specialized maybe.
Alexis: So.
Brett: Yeah, that is an, I had just just having a conversation.
Alexis: ah
Brett: Alexis and I were out at the Organic Association of Kentucky conference. Shout out to the Oak team.
Alexis: What up?
Brett: Amazing, amazing event. um And the a person came up to me and was asking about, do does our reports include include flowers? And I was like, well,
Alexis: ah sure sure
Brett: Yes, but, uh, and like, so it's like, you know, a book, the idea of a bouquet that's, and that's how a lot of people are marking them.
Alexis: No.
Brett: That might be just sort of a, what do they call it? Alexis, when it's just like a random, you just, uh, what is it?
Alexis: A mixed bouquet? A mixed bouquet? Like just a market bouquet?
Brett: Yeah. Mixed. I feel like, uh, Sarah used some, Sarah Gerkink used some term that she had, that was like, it's, I don't know, I have to get back with her and follow up. But yeah, it's just like a, you got, you have like zinnias and some other, I don't know, other mixed kind of summer flowers, you're just, you just cut them, go, and it's a bouquet. It's very different from Specialty Lizzie Anderson specialty this and specialty that it that would be wouldn't be out of place at like a ah New York high concept event, you know, they're different things and so it's hard to compare those ah The idea of the you mentioned the unit pricing like the weight by weight so we what we end up doing is we end up making some assumptions and this is all included in there with links out to the publications we use for reference and
Alexis: Right.
Alexis: Mm -hmm.
Brett: that like a certain number a certain number of pounds of tomatoes is this many quarts and so vice or vice versa. as far as the and this This many bushels of beans of green beans has on average this many pounds in it or quarter bushels or whatever.
Brett: So we do have to do some conversion and some stuff. And so that's why but that that, in addition to just the basic marketing and business principles for why you wouldn't want to use this as a prescription is why we do that.
Brett: And so, um for example, or the way that I talk about it, I guess, is that this price or sorry, these reports can help you see what the going rate for a product is in some markets similar to yours.
Alexis: Mm
Plant People: Oh, God.
Brett: That's all it tells you.
Alexis: -hm.
Brett: that is not That does not mean that that that those products are being sold as at a profit. It doesn't mean that those people are growing in the same system as you, have the same costs as you, have the same quality as you.
Brett: There's no quality ah component here.
Alexis: or like organic versus not, you know?
Brett: Yep, correct. I mean, we we do sometimes report those if if available in our era weekly reports, but that's not factored in here in these these year end reports just because we don't have enough reporting organic markets to to factor that in.
Jessica : right.
Brett: But it's this is this is one part of it. How much is stuff going for? And then the other part is how much does it cost for me to sell it? And how much can i how much profit do I want to make?
Brett: And do those two things line up? And so if you do your math, and you see that you can't possibly sell tomatoes at a farmer's market for less than $5 a pound, then that means maybe you shouldn't be growing tomatoes to grow and sell at a market.
Jessica : Mm
Brett: And that's an okay decision to make because maybe you're really good at growing cucumbers or you're really good at ah doing value added stuff and you actually wanted to go that direction or cut flowers or whatever.
Jessica : hmm.
Brett: So um yeah, that's
Plant People: But that's that's a great number, though. I mean, not to discount the number. that's I love the numbers. it doesn't I mean, it is more of an indication to me of like the public's price sensitivity to things in a given market.
Alexis: and
Plant People: ah you know If you really look into it, you guys are very deliberate to say, hey, know your own situation, know your role, know your expenses. But I love the fact that, I mean, that's a great number still. ah And you guys have done a good job of leveling that as much as you can, because I i realize, and Jessica, you mentioned, is it a bunch?
Plant People: Is it a pound? Breh, you said, you know, how big is a handful? And I know that drives you guys that love spreadsheets crazy, because you're going to have to have a million columns, Brett.
Jessica : Yeah.
Alexis: Just like only a little.
Plant People: You just add more columns, man. Add more columns.
Brett: Yeah we are.
Plant People: ah But yeah, it's I know it's super tough, but it's still great. It's supremely useful information. Not only the the historic stuff that I mentioned earlier, like the the during the season numbers of about what's going on immediately and those are awesome too.
Alexis: Uh -huh.
Alexis: Yeah, that's really cool when you think about, um so like tomatoes are the most popular high tunnel crop in the state, right? So, but looking at that, like is it worth it to put your tomatoes in extra early and maybe rip out another crop because you're going to get a high enough price point versus the field tomatoes in, you know,
Plant People: Yeah.
Jessica : Right.
Alexis: And then you can look at, okay, well, it costs me a lot less to do field tomatoes. So really I make more per pound, even though I'm technically not you know charging less per pound. Being able to look at that and make this like production system ah decisions ah were or yeah having data to support those decisions is super, super helpful.
Plant People: Yeah, and watching the crash.
Alexis: and like the opportunity cost of going to a farmer's market, right? So if you just said, and we kind of said this, but I like to call it opportunity cost because I learned that term a long time ago and I've kept on it. But you know if you are deciding between a roadside stand and going to a farmer's market,
Alexis: ah You might make less at the roadside stand, but you're not putting in as much effort right that is going to the market. And so seeing those general numbers can be so so helpful. And I think sometimes we forget to use it in that way. And we're just looking at, am I charging enough for my tomato? Well, I don't know.
Plant People: And timing. you and It's so interesting watching a new producer interpret these for the first time or see it graphed out ah monthwise, you know, on one of the axes. And then they're like, well, why is there always such a big dip?
Plant People: And then, you you know, they start to think about it and they're like, oh, that's when everybody has tomatoes in the process.
Jessica : Mm hmm.
Plant People: Bottoms out and that leads to a whole other set of interesting, you know things and questions and conversations And it just goes to show that and especially this historical data, you know If you're looking at, you know monthly like what process things bring it's a really interesting and and I've even had a market person said Oh, you know, I guess we're losing money on that what we you know Um, we lose per unit.
Plant People: We'll make it foreign volume and just laughed because it was a numbers person. And that's the classic Joe guys cracking up because they saw that at a certain point, they were going to put, you know, grow field tomatoes, but it was, they were going to be coming off based on the days to maturity of that particular variety, um, that it was going to come off right at the bottom of the price curve.
Brett: i
Alexis: Mm.
Jessica : Mm.
Plant People: So yeah, I mean, ah there's lots of great, you know, little side conversations you can have from the data historical and current. It's like good stuff.
Brett: Yeah, you're really gassing us up here. I appreciate that. ah But and you know one thing too is that you in general, we sometimes approach, and this is because there's a lot of beginners involved, we sometimes approach direct marketers, farmers, marketers, et cetera, like at a very basic level as if like the content and the information should be very basic and very straightforward.
Plant People: love the numbers
Brett: And I i appreciate that. I appreciate good basic information regardless of the of the context, but the reality is, These direct direct marketing channels are pretty complex um and they're they're really complex in small spaces.
Plant People: I love the numbers.
Alexis: Yeah.
Brett: What I and i mean by that is there's some other you know agricultural markets and and other phenomena in general that are complex, mainly just because they're so big and there's so many actors involved. But there's a lot involved.
Brett: And so that all that heady talk for me to say, Alexis, when you're talking about looking at early tomatoes, There are some data to suggest that one of the more important things for farmers market vendors is to establish your customers early in the season because if someone comes to you, they know you, they know where your booth is, they feel comfortable with who you are, they're more likely to buy from you across the whole season.
Jessica : oh
Jessica : I would agree with that. I've seen that a lot.
Brett: Yeah, we're we're creatures of habit. And like, ah safety is important. And at a very like primal level, it may manifest as like, Oh, that nice person sold me that stuff.
Alexis: Mm
Brett: And so and I liked that. But on a primal level, it's almost more like, I got my food stuff from that person, it was safe, it was, you know, cool.
Alexis: hmm.
Jessica : It was good, yeah.
Brett: So I will keep going.
Plant People: the power of routines, yeah.
Alexis: Yeah.
Brett: And so You see these weird really weird dynamics in the prices and in the end if you go through if you go and find the report you can see the um individual crop. ah Price dynamics and they are throughout the course of the year so you know what was it in may versus june versus august for things that you know things are in season then.
Brett: And it's not at all what you would expect. And a lot of times it's like relatively flat or like, so the inference, meaning that most people are charging around the same price for the whole season.
Brett: In some cases, there will be a decline where, when, um, you know, stuff comes into season or, or, or, but other times it'll completely go against your expectations.
Plant People: Hmm.
Brett: This is kind of to what Ray was talking about. If you compare that to like our, our auction. reports in our auction analysis, it follows, we have we're and with auctions, we're able to better track volumes.
Alexis: Mmhmm. Mmhmm.
Brett: And it's literally as as volume, the amount of product that's available goes up, i .e. it comes more and more into season, the price goes down. And then as that goes but as the amount available goes down, the price goes right back up.
Brett: And and so it's this you know two upside down or two opposite types of curves that you can see. And we just don't see that in farmers markets because they're, again, but they're complicated in this weird way because they're relational.
Jessica : Mm hmm.
Plant People: Yeah.
Brett: It's a retail space, but it's also seasonal. And so the the amount of the volume that's available doesn't necessarily translate in a lot of consumers minds, the types of people who are who are messaging and in in April and saying, oh, you're going to have tomatoes at market this this weekend?
Brett: Well, no.
Plant People: Brett, do ah do you have, ah do you guys see any differences?
Brett: um
Plant People: I mean, maybe the information is not nuanced enough to speak to this, but ah you speaking of prosperity, you see much of ah any kinds of trends between urban and rural markets.
Plant People: I've always been really interested in that, where urban markets seem to have a ah you know little bit different kind of swagger about them, different population levels, so on and so forth. I mean, i just I've always wondered, are they more buffered against some of these swings?
Plant People: I don't know.
Brett: yeah Yes, I think so.
Plant People: Are they?
Brett: and i think I think another thing that we have seen across these reports has been that availability of product tends to be more continuous at urban markets compared to rural markets because there are some places where people only want to buy stuff until it comes in in their garden.
Jessica : Right.
Plant People: Oh, yeah, yeah.
Brett: and then
Jessica : Yeah, we see that a lot with Have a Day.
Plant People: Rural markets, yeah. I could see that very easily. um
Jessica : Because everybody has has a garden, right? And so like in our our county, we see a different definite change in that because you know then they're just kind of supplementing some of the stuff if they don't have enough.
Brett: Yep.
Plant People: Mm -hmm.
Jessica : Something on topic with this, but it would be interesting how you mentioned how with farmer's market, there's more of that relationship with vendors and about how you said, like Oh, I bought something from this person from the beginning.
Jessica : So now I'm always going to shop with that person. That would be very interesting to track that or to see why people go to certain vendors. And you do build relationships with people and some of them, you know, their names, some of them, I, I will own up to this.
Jessica : There's a man, an older gentleman. He has a Corgi. Um, the Corgi's name is Dougal. Dougal barks a lot at the market.
Alexis: Not mine.
Jessica : I know Dougal's name. I do not know the gentleman's name, but he is wonderful. And he always buys tomatoes from us. But we are his tomato place when there are five or six other vendors who also sell great tomatoes or who've had them way before we've had them. So that's kind of interesting that to think about those relationships and how they might impact your your trends as well for selling -wise.
Brett: Totally. Yeah. And it it emphasissize it brings an emphasis to to some of the other marketing education and support that we do to try to help with that. I mean, granted, theoretically, if everyone followed our advice, they would kind of create an equal playing field, but it doesn't really do that. people Some people listen, some people don't.
Brett: But things like having an attractive display that looks clean and is is you know just attractive and inviting, and you yourself being friendly enough to say hello, to have clear signage, to have all those little things, it actually has this effect. Yes, you're sort of converting that first sale, but converting that first sale in these relationship -based marketing contexts can have all of these domino effects throughout the course of the season, even one season to another.
Brett: And you've seen that with Dougal Senior and Dougal Junior.
Jessica : Mm hmm. I always look forward to seeing Dougal and owner.
Brett: buddy And in hearing, seeing and hearing it sounds like.
Jessica : Yes.
Alexis: in the...
Brett: Yeah, so I'm curious what like, um do you all have you all observed any, you know, this this covers 2022 to 2024.
Plant People: Look.
Brett: But maybe if we think a little bit longer back to COVID, the COVID times, um this last five year, four year, five year chunk of time.
Jessica : Uh huh.
Brett: Do you all have any kind of impressions or thoughts about farmers markets where they're headed? ah What what people are saying are you having more? You know new people get involved as vendors or what about customer basis any any kind of tales from the field would be really I'd be intrigued to hear
Jessica : I think during COVID you saw an increase on both ends, right?
Alexis: Mm
Jessica : You saw where people were like, I'm going to grow my own stuff, right? For my family.
Alexis: hmm.
Jessica : And then if I'm going to grow enough, I'm going to sell it. So I know I saw an increase of people wanting to join markets, but then also being a vendor ourselves, it was just, they were slammed, right?
Jessica : The markets were slammed with people coming in and buying because there was that worry about, I'm not going to find stuff in the actual grocery stores, right? And then, After COVID, that leveled off, but I don't think like it dropped.
Jessica : right like I think you the market's gained new customers.
Plant People: I think they established some habits, and I love it, some buying habits.
Jessica : Yeah. Now, as far as vendors, i I think a lot of people got really excited and wanting to do it, and then they realized, oh, this is
Alexis: Oh farming is hard.
Jessica : Yeah, farming's hard.
Plant People: Yeah.
Jessica : And so maybe they've tailored off a little, but I think they're like, it wasn't a significant drop, right? There's still always new people interested in joining markets and doing that.
Jessica : And I think it helps like if they've had a successful home garden or if they're like already a mid range grower like wanting to bump up. But definitely like during COVID, at least I saw an increase from both sides of it, like increased customer foot traffic and people wanting to be a part of a market and and start selling.
Brett: Yeah, i think so I think um people were expecting that there'd be this spike in demand and as soon as things went back to normal, the grocery stores shelves were restocked, it would just be an instant return to normalcy. and um or whatever that meant, or the absurd state we were in before.
Alexis: It's ridiculous.
Brett: I don't know. Maybe it's not normal. none of it There is no normal, um but that the the economists have a very evocative term for us to say that the demand for local products is was stickier than expected, that it it's more resistant to change.
Alexis: Oh yeah.
Jessica : Huh.
Brett: um and and sort of you know It's like a Klingon. It's clinging on.
Plant People: I think ah tasty, fresh fruits and vegetables are a habit for me. That's my philosophy. That's my theory. It's a habit for me.
Brett: Well, and in the in the midst of a crazy um isolating period of time where you have time, some some degree, what depends on who you are and what you were doing, but you at least had some time force time alone and probably time to reflect on relationships.
Brett: We know, and there's some really cool interesting data from ah Tim Woods that we work with about some of how important community is to people who shop at farmer's markets, which is no duh, but like to have data is,
Plant People: Hmm.
Jessica : Mm hmm.
Alexis: That's exactly what I was going to say.
Brett: oh sorry alexis
Alexis: No, no, i'm glad I'm glad I didn't know that Tim had some data.
Brett: we
Alexis: So that's that's good for me to know as a newbie to CCD, but you know being an agent you know for four during COVID and like four years after it, um we really saw, we would have a rural market and it grew a lot, but a lot of that had to do with the community of just having something to do on a Saturday.
Alexis: And so, you know, everyone would come, everyone would buy something, but they were there for the the chatter and the, you know, maybe the music playing the socialization of it.
Brett: Oh, sorry, Alexis.
Jessica : Socialization here.
Plant People: Yeah.
Alexis: So that socialization is what keeps them coming back. And they're like, well, while I'm here, I might as well get some stuff, you know, so it was sort of a, and that's what we've seen continue as those relationships made.
Jessica : ah
Alexis: during a time when you know people were maybe be feeling more lonely than usual, maintained. And so it was kind of like a standard, I see so and so on Saturday at the farmer's market. And we really saw that increase. And then I think also, going back to what Jessica was saying about a lot of people grew gardens, right? ah So maybe they were vendors or ah maybe they um aren't any And they aren't anymore, but I think the value of what farmers do, the perception of that for probably increase, I would assume, again, I'm not going off data here, but the people who tried to grow a garden and maybe they're not getting as many tomatoes as they thought they should, they see the value in paying maybe that $5 a pound for a tomato because they know how hard it is. ah So I think that there was ah some added value to the work done by farmers.
Alexis: ah
Plant People: It's another interesting thing I observed at our market that was already happening pre -COVID. I mean, there's pre -COVID and post -COVID as far as, you know, the scope of this discussion, but it was interesting. And and I wonder if it's not one of the things that helped people develop a habit in that friction was removed in purchasing at the farmer's market. And by that, I mean,
Plant People: I think that the evolution of a small and medium sized vendors sort of sped up. and And they did things like they accepted alternate form of payments or they accepted all the swap payments. And it's amazing how many people said that they are that's why they shop at the market because then they realize that people can swap. And I saw things like that accelerate through COVID and post COVID during COVID and then after COVID.
Plant People: ah is that the payment methods removed a lot of friction to purchase. Not only that, but our market greatly evolved in things like ah CSA baskets. Our market acts as an accumulation point where they're a purchasing point, the market itself, and then they assimilate you know baskets and then have different share levels. There's more microprocessors now. There's more home -based processors. All of that, I think, sped up in evolution, but the biggest factor there was just simply something small like a payment swap method that made it so much more easier.
Brett: Man, you all are so smart and you're so engaged and plugged in. It's so awesome. It's just like so awesome. to Because yeah, ah so back when you know we're coming up on the the time of of year where I'm reminded in 2020 when everything started to be like, oh no, things are going to be different for now.
Brett: Um, and, and that March, April, may period time period where. Luckily we had been preaching, take other forms of of payment because people are, i I refer to it as the, as the inverse Dave Ramsey that Dave Ramsey wants you to not use your card because you're going to spend too much money.
Jessica : Mm hmm.
Jessica : Right.
Plant People: Yeah.
Brett: Please use your card so that you can spend too much money. You can't say, I don't, I don't only have $40.
Jessica : Please.
Brett: So I can't, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. My friend swipe away.
Jessica : We take a card, yeah.
Brett: We take a card, come on.
Plant People: That's a big deal for ad markets. I mean, people constantly, and it's amazing how many people come currently and they hadn't been to a market in a long, long time.
Brett: Invest in your health.
Plant People: And they say, wow, we're really amazed that everybody can swap now. And and they're just, yeah.
Jessica : Mm hmm.
Alexis: Now, Venmo is like a big thing. People don't even bring a card anymore.
Plant People: yeah
Alexis: They just want to like pay you on Venmo or Cash App or something.
Plant People: Yeah. The systems have gotten better.
Alexis: Yeah, it's wild.
Plant People: Yes. Yeah.
Alexis: Yep.
Plant People: All the technology, the support technology that market vendors can then employ, you know, and use to get their products into people's hands more easily.
Jessica : That's not even thinking about like all the WIC and senior programs as well.
Plant People: It's all awesome. It's all awesome.
Plant People: Double dollars and all of those programs now.
Alexis: Yeah.
Jessica : And they've, those are all, um, swipeable now too.
Brett: Mm hmm.
Jessica : Like they have like cards for those and like you said, double dollars program and streamlining those things to make them easier or both market vendors and the clientele to use them.
Alexis: yeah
Plant People: Yes.
Plant People: Just making it so much more easy to come and purchase things and be convenient.
Jessica : Yep. To buy things.
Plant People: Yeah. Do you guys ah take ah like ah all the ah alternate methods or like Venmo or PayPal, Jessica, when you guys are selling Alexis?
Jessica : Definitely we do, um, we have like square credit card wise and then still, you would still be amazed how much, how many people they're just trained though, like to this who bring cash, like cat, you know, to, to markets still.
Plant People: Awesome. Awesome.
Alexis: Mm hmm.
Plant People: Oh, sure.
Alexis: Yeah.
Plant People: Sure.
Brett: Totally.
Jessica : But, um, definitely the credit card is game changing for, for a producer.
Plant People: Yeah.
Brett: yeah
Alexis: Yeah. We do ah Venmo, especially because we have a self -service stand, ah but also just, I think with flowers where they're, um you know, they're not a necessity item for most people.
Plant People: Oh, awesome.
Alexis: And so Venmo tends to kind of be more on like, like fun money, I guess is a good way. That's the way Tyler and I, as' my husband and I describe is like fun money tends to be in more Venmo accounts.
Plant People: Just dictionary spending.
Alexis: And so ah people are like, able to spend it easier, I guess, is a way to think about it ah from that perspective.
Plant People: We're just making your data more complicated, Brett.
Brett: Yeah.
Plant People: We're mentioning all these secondary factors or fringe factors.
Alexis: Yeah.
Brett: Well, and that and that you know if if there could be people who raised their raised their prices marginally in order to cover some of those credit card fees, people are so averse to the credit card fees.
Alexis: Yeah.
Plant People: Swap these, yeah.
Alexis: and yeah
Brett: And I get it.
Alexis: and
Brett: I do get it.
Alexis: Right.
Brett: But like i the whole simple math of if you sell 20 % more as a result of taking credit cards, factor that into the fee.
Alexis: right
Brett: like' It's just the cost of doing business in the same way that if you had to drive more you know or you have... but Anyway, that's a getting on me um me getting on my soapbox.
Jessica : it's
Brett: But i still there are still people who I so you know sat with on the phone in March and April in 2020 who set up pre -order systems
Jessica : yeah
Alexis: isn'
Brett: And they set up their ability to take cards. They set up their all, all of these things so that they could, they could use still function, you know, in a contact free world that still use those technologies because they saw like, Oh wow, this is way easier when I can like know how much I need to take.
Jessica : Yeah.
Brett: I can have this pre -packed and it's.
Alexis: And people got used to it, so they were like, you know, they want that now.
Jessica : Yep. And.
Brett: Amazing. and so And in the same way that it got a lot of people used to the this this digital ah meeting space and digital presentation space, for better or for worse, I don't know, a lot of webinars.
Brett: um But it it did hit fast forward on that technology adoption, right?
Jessica : ah
Jessica : Yeah, to brag on, to brag on Brett, I attended some of those like trainings for our market here in Mercer County of like doing these pre -order systems and using, you know, we we were using like Google forms and stuff before, but we weren't like really using them like we, you know, did once like COVID and stuff happened.
Brett: So I think that's right on.
Plant People: So.
Brett: Sure.
Alexis: but
Jessica : So like excellent training opportunities from Brett.
Brett: Aww. Well, thanks. Yeah, we're and we're we're hoping to...
Alexis: So, head of the curve.
Jessica : Yeah, he was.
Brett: well that we we we had been My colleague Christy at the time and I had been doing webinars for uh five years at that point and That was before zoom.
Brett: It was before it was he is adobe connect i'm sounding like the old, you know, whatever but um i've been i've been lucky to work with i've been lucky to work with people who uh, you know elective and including alexis including ray including jessica who like to think about things a little differently and prioritize what people really want and and deliver it in a way that's that's useful and
Jessica : Hehe.
Plant People: Still around, nobody's still around.
Brett: works for them. And that's that's the whole reason that I go through the very fun ordeal of creating these three three -year average price reports is because I do think that they're useful. I think it's a helpful conversation starter. and i'm I'm you know, in the same way that I think farmers market people are just excited to like have a document that is just all about their experience of thinking about prices. It's like a weird, you know, it's like going to the Comic Con or whatever for whatever whatever your interest is. and Everyone there is like, whoa, we're all into this. I think that they have that experience. And I'm I have that experience today of like, yeah, this is all stuff that we have talked about and thought about. And so it's ah it's nice to to share.
Alexis: Cool. So if you're interested in price reports, even if you don't live in the state of Kentucky, uh, you may be able to to check stuff out and see sort of how that, how that works, whether that's auction or farmer's market, we have.
Plant People: You should be.
Brett: Yeah, we have reports for Tennessee that ah our car our colleague mar Margarita Volandia down there collects that we post on the site as well.
Alexis: Absolutely. So there you go.
Jessica : Cool.
Alexis: You can get two states. And if you're in the Southeast, even you may be able to kind of use those. ah to check that out but you can find those on our CCD website which is just ccd .uky .edu and so we can throw that in the show notes if you're interested in checking out any of the resources that we have on there ah for direct markets or wholesale markets or We got a lot, so definitely check out the website. It's new, so we're pretty proud of it. ah and and Let us know if you've got any questions, if you want to deep dive more into wholesale marketing and the different avenues of wholesale for you know institutions and farm to school. We've not really done that, ah but that could be of interest to some of you out there. so
Alexis: Feel free to drop that ah down in the ah review section as you give us five stars say this was great would love to know about XYZ. You can also send us an email our emails in the show notes if you want and we all.
Alexis: get access to that email so we can all check that out. ah Also, you can find us on Instagram, ah at Hort Culture Podcast, and you can drop us a line in there if you have interest, and it'll just kind of keep you up to date that a new episode has has dropped or some cool stuff that we have found. We share a lot of stuff from our um other organizations, such as Oak, who we mentioned earlier, ah but things that are timely and might be useful you know in between your, of course, programmed weekly episodes. so If you've got anything for us, definitely let us know, but we appreciate you guys being here today with us and we hope that we will chat with you next time. Have a great one.
