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Trail to South Korea - Episode 2
311 Plays19 days ago
Welcome to episode 2 of the Trail to South Korea!
In this ep, hear a more in depth replay of what the training weeks of Sarah, Charlie and Mikey look like, before we do a deep dive into the courses for APTRC.
Plenty of insights in this one into the different approaches to the race and thoughts behind each of the key sections, which may help your own mental approach to your next trail event!
Thanks for listening!
Sarah: @sarahludo
Charlie: @cowboyhamilton
Mikey: @mikey_dimuantes
Music from #Uppbeat (free for Creators!): https://uppbeat.io/t/moire/new-life License code: VJ9EPZM2AQUSWRXL
Transcript
00:00:25
Speaker
Hello and welcome to episode two of the trail to South Korea. We are reneging on the names of last week and already just getting revamped. But my name is Simone Brick. I am one of the regular hosts of Peak Pursuits podcast and I am lucky enough to be joined by three absolute powerhouses and the Australian trail running scene in our lead up to the Asia Pacific Trail Running Championships in South Korea in October. Now,
00:00:56
Speaker
get host guest one that I have, Sarah Ludoichi, started running, I've just been told, because her siblings jumped on a treadmill one day, sprinted as fast as they could, and she tried to copy, only to fall, end up with burns all over the front of her body, and never wanted to feel that pain again. So Sarah, how's the ah avoidance of that pain going so far? I definitely still hate the treadmill, ah but I do what I have to do.
00:01:24
Speaker
I love that as an origin story. It's pretty insane. um I feel like most people would then just never run again. But ah no, you took it, you ran with it and became an ultra runner. Absolutely love it. And my other two guests are Mikey DeMoyantes, who I've just been told by Charlie to look up Mikey DeMoyantes' fast car on YouTube. Much to Mikey's chagrin. So ah welcome Mikey. What are people gonna find when they search that, by the way?
00:01:53
Speaker
you're gonna find a prepubescent 14 year old boy. good ricy chap really gonna find It's actually pretty good. I would genuinely don't look it up. It's actually pretty good. If you've got three minutes, then you know, treat yourself.
00:02:07
Speaker
Amazing. Amazing. That is going to be a great blast from the past. And that voice that we just heard is the one and only Charlie Hamilton, who had been told on his Spotify, at least 70% of his downloaded files are one woman's ASMR files, which I've just learned is essentially just someone talking to him. and but yeah Charlie, even what is that? Listen to ASMR again. Treat yourself. Go to YouTube. Search ASMR. It'll put you to sleep. It'll relax. It's it's beautiful.
00:02:36
Speaker
Okay. I like this. I like this. That's a different side of Charlie that we're getting perfect. Perfect. So for today, um, if you haven't listened to last week's episode, go back and listen to it with Brody. We got and a bigger intro to each of these three legends, but now we get to get started in the nitty gritty side of this thing, which is the training. We're going to also today go through a bit of a rundown of the course and what they have in store for them. Um, I've just done a deep dive and it's making part of me jealous and part of me very glad I'm not doing this one.
00:03:07
Speaker
So to get us started, I might throw to you first, Mikey, you're the one doing the long course. yeah is Based on the website, it's called the 80. It's actually 74 by their official. And then when I uploaded it to Strava, it's 72. So something in that range. um But take us through the last week of training from sat last Friday to today, I think is what we're going, or are we going Saturday to today if you've already trained today? Let's go let's go from from the moment we recorded last time to the moment we recorded. Okay, let's go, do that. um I mean, I had a pretty decent week last week, like got into it got back into it pretty quickly with a couple of lighter sessions and then
00:03:59
Speaker
Um, so that weekend was a long run in the mountains with a good crew. We had Jess and Charlie, um, and Gatton B and Driscoll, which was fun. And we did like, um, ginger genini, like 36 K 30, 34 K like 2000 meters ish.
00:04:18
Speaker
So a fairly decent first long run back. um And that took it out of me a little bit, I think, for the start of the week. And then I actually had a spill on Monday and like cracked my knee open, not badly, but like had a decent bruise. So the rest of the week has been a little bit shaky, but not too bad. So I'm kind of getting getting haven't missed that many sessions, but have just like been careful and have been um watching it. But yeah, just did a like a threshold hill session on Wednesday and then just normal jogging apart from that. Me and Charlie just did a gym session. Yeah. What's the mileage you've hit around about in the last sort of seven days? ah So last, I mean, last week was 130 with four and a half thousand meters. So in that range. Yeah. yeah And then with of like two hours on the bike.
00:05:08
Speaker
Yeah. And for someone training for a 80-ish K race, what did the Wednesday session look like threshold-wise and distance-wise? Uh, so that was, yeah, it was just four by six minute threshold climbs on like a fairly runnable climb and then ah like a full jog recovery down. I had planned to do like a threshold condition conditioning mix session where you threshold up and then kind of send the downhill, have a bracket, like standing rest at the bottom and then do the same again. Um, yeah but I was just being a bit.
00:05:42
Speaker
tentative with my knee somewhat. So just did a wall by six minute threshold on, on Hills. Just pretty standard. Very, very fair. And I feel like we maybe should have covered this last week, but do you have a coach and who is the coach? Yeah. Um, yeah. Me and Charlie have the same coach. It's Blake. Um, I'll find for APRC. I'll find performance run coaching who I now coach with. them alysa
00:06:11
Speaker
Perfect, perfect. And so in terms of, is that normal mileage for you, you still hit even with the knee or is this a little lower than what you would max out at for this? Yeah, I'd say so. I mean, before UTI, I max out at 130, 140, maybe 150 for one week, and then similar before hounds low, and I'll probably do similar, I'll probably keep it chill for the next few weeks, not reach for a pulse week, but probably, yeah, that 130, 140 is a good range for me, I think usually. yeah So it works out at like 13 hours of running, I think, with with the BERT in the sessions.
00:06:48
Speaker
yeah yeah Yeah, because that's still a good chunk of it, which Canberra I've been told is pretty good for. I've only run there a couple of times. um But I've loved it when I have, although I have painful memories from the Aussie champs that were there.
00:07:02
Speaker
um But awesome. So in terms of the longest run you'll do, you said that one was 32. Do you have a plan for the longest one? Uh, we'll do, I'll probably just max out at 36. I found that long, like very long, long runs don't work as well for me. I think we've kind of realized with Blake. So we've preferred to like, as you're getting closer to a specific, closer to a race, we'll get a little bit more specific, still only do a 36 K long run with some climbing, but maybe do a little bit of intensity, like throughout the run or towards the back end of the run.
00:07:38
Speaker
Um, yeah, I just think I recover better from that. i did Like initially I was doing, like when I was first starting doing options, I was doing like, you know, five hour long runs plus sometimes, yeah which you could do, but I just wasn't recovering as well from them. So I found I tend to and do better off the, off the shorter, more quality long ones, I think. Nice, nice. And, uh, one last question is the, what's an easy day look like for you? Is it a double run or are you putting everything in one run each day?
00:08:09
Speaker
Um, one run, usually, usually I will single run, but I have doubled this week because I doubled today, but I don't like, I usually don't like to double. I'm only double if I am too busy or something in the morning and then I'm like, or I want to get out. But yeah, okay. Cool. So like one 30 of singles is still a good chunk of running. Sorry. Say that again. Usually just like a 12, 14 K flat, easy run single day is a recovery day.
00:08:38
Speaker
Perfect. Easy done. Sounds like up and down, but overall still managing the week. And that was a ah good damn that that's a good group for a long run. um You're making me a bit jealous because everything's fricking solo at the moment for me. But Sarah, I'm going to take it to you now across in Broome. And I want to hear what these training weeks in Broome look like because I can't quite imagine it having never been there.
00:09:03
Speaker
Well, let me let me paint the picture for you. um It is like flat. It is very sandy or Pindan. So every run I usually finish with a jump in the ocean and then run home completely drenched with squelching shoes.
00:09:18
Speaker
And my theory behind that is at the end of the wet season, I'm that sweaty anyway. My shoes squelch and froth and everything. So I'm so used to running in wet shoes. I have this joke at the end of my runs in the wet season. I ask Bart and I'm like, sweat or swim. And I make him guess whether I've just been sweating or I've jumped in the ocean because like there isn't any difference between the two.
00:09:42
Speaker
um So, yeah, it's sometimes I've done jumps in the ocean in the middle of my runs, my long runs. And probably the most memorable of those experiences was there's this sort of sandy beach track that goes like north of the rocks where you can like drive on the beach and you're sort of behind the sand dunes and it's like a rolling sand dune track. And that's pretty much the only spot I can do a long run.
00:10:08
Speaker
and you pop out onto the beach for the like the last little bit home and I was pretty hot. So I decided to just jump in the water. And then um all of a sudden I see this man walking towards me completely naked. And it is, you are allowed to be like naked north of the rocks, but you know, imagine like a hat, sunnies, crocs, and like a beer belly. It's just like, I would straight out you. And um, you just.
00:10:36
Speaker
And he just, um he was being very nice. He wanted to come and tell me that there was a croc passing through and they've just seen a croc swim in this way. So just to warn me to stay out of the water. So anyway, I was like, where in the world would this happen other than here? Do you ever run into crocs in the water there?
00:10:56
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I haven't yet, but like people do see sightings, but it's usually like the crocs just pass through. They don't come to like attack you, they're just passing from one spot to the other. But it is always on the back of my mind and I have had very vivid dreams of being attacked by crocs. So it definitely is there in my subconscious.
00:11:21
Speaker
Oh, worst nightmare stuff. Worst nightmare stuff. So for the last sort of week, what was the long run with the sessions? How did that pan out? Yeah, so obviously we had Hounslow like two-ish weeks now, so sort of had a light week after that and then I guess just building back to a full week now. um So last weekend I would have had my long run on Sunday, which was 26K on, yes, sandy rolling sand dunes. And when we say rolling sand dunes, I'm still only getting, I think, like, less than 100 meters of elevation here. um Yeah, but is it soft sand? Because that's- It is soft sand, yeah. A lot of the run is pretty much soft sand, especially this time of year when there hasn't been any rain. So even the flat sand is soft and you trudge along. So yeah, it's good, I guess it's good, like, strength, endurance,
00:12:17
Speaker
Definitely I imagine people look at my strap and be like, man, she's so slow on this sandy, but I'm running on sand and it's really soft and there's no elevation. So it doesn't look, anyway, it doesn't matter. But, um, I don't even know how you go fast on sand. Like yeah and it doesn't happen. No, not really. No. Um, I don't even go on the sand. Like if I go to the beach, I won't go in the water cause I won't go on the sand. So you've got me beat there.
00:12:45
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. And the few races I've done by the coast where I am on sand, honestly, I spend the entire time hating it. So I have so much respect for you, woman. This is like, and that's where the strength comes from, I reckon. Like you get the hills you need from sand.
00:13:01
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. um And then I sort of had to mix my week around. We had a long, a long weekend here in WA. So I was away for the weekend, this beautiful curling black base, but I had to go do my run out there, which again was um very muddy, very muddy and very sandy.
00:13:24
Speaker
So it's like, you know, this sort of mud that sticks to your shoes and then you feel like you're running with three kilos on your feet. So that was meant to be a speed session, but it wasn't like a far leg session, but it wasn't very fast because I was, my my watch had also died. So I didn't have my watch to record it properly. So I was like on my Strava phone, like having no idea what paces I was doing, but I did the session. It was, it was a good weekend. Sometimes it's the best way to do a session having no idea what you're actually doing, but you know, you're working hard.
00:13:54
Speaker
Yes, yeah. um And I did see some donkeys out there. So no dingoes this time, just donkeys. So, and they weren't aggressive, which is great. It's like donkeys scare me more than a lot of animals. Yeah, it's sort of a weird, um I don't know what the word is. It's not a plague, but like, just what's, what's it when there's heaps of rabbits? Like, just like that, but donkeys up on the peninsula up here. Yeah.
00:14:23
Speaker
Yeah. Um, anyway, and so, yeah, that's a good one. He's not breed. They're in, no, they maybe, I'm not sure. All right. Let's not get into the, I don't know what I'm about. yo Um, cast is speculative you have pay company um And then the rest of the week has just been pretty cruisy. I will have a, I'm trying to think, yeah, 16Ks undulating on Wednesday. And again, my undulating here is like running up and down a hill or or um soft sands soft sand dunes, which just feels like it takes forever. It blows out a 16K run to like an hour 45 and you just feel like you're trudging. um But we did it. It was fun.
00:15:11
Speaker
Yeah, the boat ramp. I should have run those. Yeah, but the golf course. All of the ramps in Broome. And i I might get that.
00:15:22
Speaker
um i
00:15:27
Speaker
And yeah, so I've got a long run tomorrow and another workout on Sunday. So um I was meant to do a ride yesterday, but I was feeling rotten. So I didn't, I missed that session. Nice. Any, any gym in the week there or no gym?
00:15:40
Speaker
Oh yes, I did do, I took a Pilates class whilst we were away on the weekend so we all did that and I've done two and a bit, well one strength training and I'll do my second one, the salvo. Nice. And are there any stairs in Broome that you can do stair training on either? Yeah, there is actually. So by undulating I finished with a few reps of the stairs.
00:16:05
Speaker
um Yeah, nice. There's like, there's like maybe 30 stairs. It's better than zero stairs. It is better than zero. Cool. I reckon that takes the cake for the week with the most random animal sightings that I didn't expect.
00:16:23
Speaker
um between, ah actually, the croc was a different ah different one, but yeah, up there in Broome, you but and did not expect an infestation of donkeys. So, awesome. What was the mileage that you're hitting for these weeks? Oh, gosh, I have to pull out my Strava and hope that it's all up to date. Oh, my. um but kind of close and follows Yeah. mr yeah Yeah, come and follow me on Strava guys. I'm all about it. Um, so I think it was about 70, 70 ish K's last week or 80 K. Um, and yeah, it'll be a little bit longer this week. Um, but yeah, pretty, pretty low mileage. I think usually when I'm doing my biggest week, so I um probably only to get up to about a hundred or a little bit under a hundred K's anyway. So then that's two hundred a hundred K distances. Uh, no.
00:17:18
Speaker
No, i I've been doing more cycling um and usually have I guess a rest day most weeks, but sometimes not. Yeah. Yeah. How long do you cycle for when you cycle? Usually. Oh, an hour 15, an hour 20. Okay.
00:17:35
Speaker
Nice. Is the cycling in Britain good? I'm assuming it's just nice and flat. It is nice and flat. um There's really strong winds up here sometimes. So it really depends which way you're going. So, and same with your running, like sometimes it's just like you got a ah mad headwind and then other times, yeah, it's really lovely.
00:17:54
Speaker
um like Especially in the wet season, it's like one street you run down, you have a headwind, which is nice because it's cooling you down. When you have the tailwind, you actually get, you're overheat and then other, but you've got the push behind you and then some streets are just steel and it's the worst because it's just like hot and you're going nowhere.
00:18:14
Speaker
Lovely. Sounds amazing. Yeah. Come to Broom, everyone. I was going to say you're really selling it to me. But wait, are you moving to Canberra soon? Have I heard that? Yes, yes. So next Friday, we drive out of Broom and make our way to Canberra. So that week is going to be an interesting week of training because we'll be going through the and nullable, I mean, like,
00:18:39
Speaker
through the Pilbara and then the Nullarbor and training as I'll get Barton to drop me on the highway and I'll just run in. Something like that. Who knows? to we straight learn Will you just cross the Sterling Ranges, Ludo? I don't think so. Oh, damn it. Anyway, if you were to go running there, but you might not. It's in the end.
00:19:04
Speaker
on the drive. Yeah, it might not be a huge detour if it is. They're also it're driving from b Broome to Canberra. I don't think they really want to take a detour. Anyway, if it's because the running is awesome. Thanks for the tea. That's already a pretty big drive. Man, in Canberra, you guys are about to have the coolest squad going round. Two pristine additions with Jess and Sarah coming up there. Nice.
00:19:29
Speaker
Very nice. So awesome. That was cool to hear. Sarah, I'm like, I'm looking forward to hearing how this entire build goes from you, but chucking it back to Canberra, the Canberra Cowboys. Charlie, how's your week been? Break it down for us. Um, yeah, week's been pretty good. Um, I had, I had a little niggle about maybe three weeks ago. Um, I can't remember. I talked about it last week. Yeah, you did. Yeah, briefly.
00:19:58
Speaker
Yeah. it works Anyway, so, but I'm back. i'm I'm back moving properly, which is good. So the last, I think two or three weeks had been, you know, back to regularly scheduled programming. Everyone can start sleeping normally. Yeah. Because I wasn't. I mean, like all runners getting injured is just terrible. Um, but that's cool. And we so, where is it worse for Mikey when you get injured, Mikey?
00:20:23
Speaker
Mikey just ditches me. No, I give him space. yeah icole I call in tears and he just says, I don't want to hear from you unless you fit. Call me when you don't have a sore foot because it's having a sore foot is bad. He made fun of me for having a sore foot. Like I was injured and he's bullying me for having a lame injury. I think it's the least cool running injury. Shin's probably the least cool. Yeah, that's true. But anyway. What is the most cool running injury?
00:20:51
Speaker
Sacral Stressy. No, tendinopathy is always cool. Sacral stress or hyphemmeral i think um i think Stressy is my apparent injury of choice, so nice to know I'm cool. like Yeah, as cool as it can get. Tendinopathy is pretty cool.
00:21:07
Speaker
Um, sore back. Sore back is probably as low as I can go. I just saw tummy as well. So I saw tummy and a sore foot. I had a tummy ache and a sore foot. Okay. Okay. So we've, we've survived the tummy ache and the sore foot. And, uh, then what did the training look like? yeah I'm back training. So I guess, actually, last Friday is an interesting one. We do, it was just a black hose special, like four weeks out from a race. so yeah As you do a 40 minute tempo, like undulating, I did about, I think it was like 10K, 400 meters of climbing in 40 minutes. um And it's just, that's just classic black hose. Like he'll give that to you at the same point in the block. And it's, it's kind of one of my favorite sessions because it's almost that race pace, like,
00:21:52
Speaker
if you You find that ice in the first 10 minutes and then you just hold it. and but And you don't have to hold it for two hours, like you wouldn't erase. So it's really fun. um So that was good. And it's a good feel, good confidence building, feel-good session as well. Yeah. If you are feeling good, which you should be. For sure. Plus, yeah. Took one of Mikey's segments there. So that's kind of carried me through the weekend. Again, you mentioned that on the last podcast. You need to find some new material. I'll probably bring that up next week as well.
00:22:19
Speaker
Um, and then just easy jog Saturday, Sunday long run. Our long run was really good. Um, it was super specific. So basically we did like, you do a 30 K loop, come back to the car and then from the car, the first two and a bit K climbs.
00:22:37
Speaker
550 meters. So it's 2k percent basically. And we did the 30k with everyone else, which was really nice. And then Mikey and I just slowly jogged up um the climb again. And that's basically what our racing career is. It's like a bit of running, quite a bit of hills and then a super steep climb to finish. So that was about as specific as it gets, actually. um And felt felt pretty good after that.
00:23:05
Speaker
Monday would have been an easy jog. Tuesday this week I had two by 15 minutes. ah Like I did and I do that as about eight minutes on like a pretty steep climb. There's maybe like 20 odd percent.
00:23:20
Speaker
um And then a couple of minutes on like a little flat rolling section, then hard downhill. So use that as a bit of a downhill session as well. um And that was pretty good. Wednesday, I headed out to the mountains. I don't really have a job, so I can drive 45 to an hour on a Wednesday, you know, at eight in the morning to run up a hill.
00:23:41
Speaker
pro study i mean Yeah, so so that was 22k, like 1100. Mikey ditched me that day because he had had to do that solo, but that was beautiful. That's Mount Tennant. That's my, like, I loved it, but also that's the only place I've run in Canberra pretty much. change But you ran up the boring side. like there's a There's a fire road. The trail is a 7K beautiful trail. Stairs. I saw an echidna. I saw a live bird. um why yeah Why they didn't send us up that for Ozchamps, I don't know. like I get the up and down because you probably wouldn't want to be going down it while other people are still coming up. um But even if we went up that and down the other side, all I remember is hooking it down that fire road.
00:24:36
Speaker
Yeah, as fast as I could for six case was like so much fun, but also it was a long freaking road. down here So anyways, um, so that was sick and that's really good because I think it's quite specific to the race. Um, and we pretty much just head out there every Wednesday. Um, Marky also doesn't work on Wednesdays. So we usually just go out there and like.
00:25:01
Speaker
Classic Wednesday, you know, two hours, a thousand meters. And then yesterday, Thursday would have just been an easy run, probably a ride. And then today I had a session. I did just some steep hills. There's like a, I found a 28% climb and it was like five by four minutes.
00:25:24
Speaker
up this climb and then like solid back down, which was a pretty nice little workout. Um, so I guess the week was probably about 130 to 135 K probably 12 hours, maybe 12 hours of running, like nearly 5,000 meters, maybe just under. Um, and then I think I would have done about six hours of riding two hours of gym. So 18, 18, 19 hours. Um,
00:25:54
Speaker
Yeah, pretty pretty pretty pretty good week of running. Is that your norm? Yeah, pretty much. like I'd say I'd probably average between 17 and 19 hours. um I do a lot of riding. I love riding.
00:26:08
Speaker
um And so yeah, I ride basically like as much as I can, um as much as my legs will let me, um yeah which is really fun.
00:26:20
Speaker
So yeah, I'd say, and and that just helps boost the hours. Like, cause you can only run so much. Like I can only run between 10 and 12 hours a week, week in, week out, but you know, I can do a fair bit of riding and gym. So yeah, but probably 18 hours is pretty standard. Um, pretty good week of training. Yeah, that is very, very solid. but I wish I could ride that much. My hips don't let me anymore, but they do let me.
00:26:44
Speaker
do the 18 hours of running, so can't complain. um But solid weeks by all of you. I actually like, I find it super interesting that obviously you and Charlie and Mikey have very similar training, but very different racing. It's pretty cool. um And it shows how everyone's physiology kind of just is different a little bit maybe. Cause you guys would be the same longest run.
00:27:09
Speaker
Yeah, sometimes Mikey goes slightly further, but not much. We pretty much do the same thing. we don't We don't really do our workouts together. Yeah. um But we do most of our other running. And I think, yeah, I think that's it last week, but I think it's because I tend to do more short trail type workouts because I think that's what I need to work on compared to Charlie. Whereas I need to work on the longer stuff um that Mikey is good at, it actually. so Makes sense.
00:27:37
Speaker
um Yeah, plus <unk> it's pretty nice, like, because it can be grim if you do a long run with someone and you run for three and a half hours together and then they have to go do another half hour. Like, that solo half hour at the end by yourself is so grim. Yeah, I always try and do it before I'm with other people yeah rather than at the end. You want to get that shit done early for sure. You don't have to keep going.
00:28:01
Speaker
And then Mikey and I tomorrow are actually heading down to Bright for, I think, 10 or 10 or so days for a training camp. um Just a good week of running and riding and... Go and see the coach. Go and see the coach. Yeah, and you can get some of the good, longer, steep climbs in there, because I'm assuming that would have longer and steeper stuff than Canberra does.
00:28:23
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Although it's funny, like I don't think I want to go, I want to go say run up Bogong, which is an hour 20 climb, but I don't really think that's not that specific for the race. I think for me it will be. You reckon? Cause I think, I think I need to do, I need to essentially do a long run and then do an 800 meter climb. Yeah, for sure. And that's, that's at 30%. And I think the only place you can do that is someone like Bogong. Even, even bright.
00:28:50
Speaker
Like, even on the inner hills in Bright, you can still... Yeah, like from Bright, you can go any way and run up. You can get a 700-metre climb from town pretty much, which is probably more specific. Yeah, and it's just good to get away from a training camp. Like, Mikey especially loves it when he's got nothing else to do and can just run and then relax. ah sleep I I was always training camps. Really? Okay, so you're the sort that needs the other side of life to actually just balance out the running?
00:29:17
Speaker
Oh, God, yes. Yeah, yeah we'll we'll be on this. The podcast next week will be funny because Marky will probably be tearing his hair out because he's only ran and done nothing else for the week. And then we'll have to talk about running. And he's going to be in tears. He's going to be like having. Love it. Michael, you would hate my life over three months. It's like all I do all day is train and then think about training and racing. That's great. No, that's. um Love this. Okay. Well, I think after having heard all of your weeks, we're now going to relate that back to the courses that you are all about to tackle. And I had a lot of fun this morning doing a deep dive into these courses and trying to get the GPX off the website and everything. And in in typical form, actually the 40K is looking actually accurate to be 40K, which is going to be novel.
00:30:12
Speaker
on the website. So the actual rundown of the races is the fact that the for first 30k is exactly the same for both of you. Um, for all three of you, I should say up until I think it's the third aid station. Um, and then, then there's a split and the short trail goes up and over one extra climb, but the same final descent while the long trail does a fun looking brutal looking loop. um So ah having looked at it myself, um I've been the the up and down nature of this, I think is going to be the crux of it in the way that you've got such steep climbs and steep descents back to back to back. But I would love to hear, Sarah, I'm not sure how much you said last week you haven't. I think this is offline. Damn it. This is chaos. Ludo, what do you want to say? Want to talk some shit?
00:31:10
Speaker
We're back, we're back guys, we got this. enjoy went I have no idea what has happened, but it's still, what did you last hear from me? You're talking about the up and down nature of the course, the up and down nature, such as trail running. Yeah, such as trail running, but some that I think are one long up and one long down is kind of easier on the body than having to go back uphill again.
00:31:35
Speaker
um But yeah, I would first of all, Sarah, I'm not sure how much course you said last week you hadn't actually looked at it a huge amount. Have you still not looked at it a huge amount? Have you done your homework or what? yeah This is my first time looking at it. So I'm I'm happy to listen and absorb because I mean, to be honest, when when Charlie was like, oh, it's like 50 percent incline, I'm like, how the hell do you figure that shit out? But now I know Strava.
00:32:00
Speaker
ah Yeah, so that's been really helpful. Thanks guys. I usually usually just run a little a little blind. So yeah, this is I just look at the hills. Yep, that's up, that's down. Cool. Sort of. Like off we go.
00:32:15
Speaker
But no, I mean, I should work on the one percenters and these are the one percenters. So thank you for your guidance. I have individual style files of each of the climbs. So if you want to look at them in more depth, which I'm sure you'd love to do, I can send out that level. I love the symptoms of Charlie, like full on making each climb. yeah if that might you might struggle to just with the nature of having a job that's That's a kind of one.
00:32:42
Speaker
job that I've done one lecture and then, you know, I've got lots to do. Yeah, no, i so I've still got clinical notes to write from today. So yeah. ah
00:32:55
Speaker
ah ah I'm with you, Charlie, I do very similar things, but maybe not make us individual strap a file for each of them. But I think, so Charlie, you're going to maybe have the most information on this course, but I've got I've got a full like list here of each of the climbs and descents, even though I'm not even going to be doing this thing, but I figured it out a little bit at least. And it looks like the first 1.8K for all of you is downhill on road. Did you get that, Joel? Yeah, which I really like. Like it hopefully will separate a little bit.
00:33:31
Speaker
Hopefully, like, no. You don't reckon in 2K? No, I would say the opposite. It'll keep everyone together. Some assholes will go, sorry, will just go out. You can say what you like, it's all good. There'll be no differentiation in the pack early on because everyone will just go out hard. Because everyone can run downhill at the that race pace. Yeah. Yeah. That would be my thought, too, that like you're all then going to hit the first climb, which for all of you is about 2K and 300 meters up.
00:34:00
Speaker
together, which that might then be where the start of the separation. um yeah i guess we yeah Okay. So what would be the issue there is like, I don't know. Hopefully it's wide enough that you can pass people because if it's really skinny single track, that actually will probably be an issue. Yeah. And have you guys been in races before the championship style races where it does go from a road to single track? Have you done that?
00:34:26
Speaker
No, but I remember working world in Austria and noticing- Elbow's out. yeah Yeah, so the world's in Argentina, um the one before Thailand as well. We had 800 meters of wide double road into proper, proper just single track where there was trees either side of the single track and you just had to go in. I was standing still in a world champs. It was not fun. Did you say that as well?
00:34:56
Speaker
What was that? Did you raise an Austria? Yeah, you did. Did you have that in Austria? Yeah, yes, yeah. It wasn't too bad. Like I think there was a little bit of standing still, but like it was moving, but it was like, it's hard to overtake and yeah. Like there was poles, like people were taking their poles out and that makes it even harder because it's like, yeah.
00:35:18
Speaker
I think like in in those situations, I mean, it's pretty hard, but I think you actually have to work the first, you have to work that first section to make sure that you're not in terrible position. You don't have to be in the best position, but positioning is actually pretty important in that kind of thing. It'll be interesting what you say. I kind of disagree. There's two ways about it because I've done quite a few races that do this, like even the the first Golden Trail race I did this year was similar. And there's two ways I've seen people be really successful. And that's either you're in the front pack and you're following and you never have to stop and your flow is fine. But obviously you don't want to be overexerting yourself when you've got hours left of running in the first like five minutes just to make that happen. And I've seen people chill, um let the fact let themselves slow down and sort of have to stop or whatever and navigate the terrain. And then when it opens back up,
00:36:14
Speaker
they're able to just pass so many people. So for me, it always depends on when you check the course the first time. If you've got that 2k climb, but then say ah at some point early on or with within it, it opens back up again after a single track, then I think it's less important your positioning at the beginning. Cause if anything, you save a bit of bit of energy and you can just pass everyone after everyone else has gone lactic trying to get there. It's going to be twice as long as any of the golden trail races. Like this is 47, that's a four hour. Like it's going to be,
00:36:50
Speaker
long. For sure. My head would probably be more on the side of if you if i have if you have to be slower in the first little bit, you're just saving energy for the last bit when you can pass everyone. So it's nothing really lost. um But from what I can tell when I look at the course, so I say that there's 2K and a 300 metre climb, but then it's only a sort of 500 metre descent into another what, 3Ks of climbing at 520 meters up to actually get to the top. and So overall, that's more of a longer uphill. What's that? 820 meters of climbing in then in that first little bit. So I think that climb will go for so long that your position at the bottom won't actually matter a huge amount because you've got 5Ks of climbing to sort that out. Once it's spring out, it will pass people.
00:37:41
Speaker
yeah Yeah. I guess it would just be, I actually wonder if this might be a fire road in there. and It might be. The photos I can find of this course, nothing actually looks too enclosed overall or forested. It looks a lot of, there was a lot of stairs in the photos on Strava. I will say that as well. Um, or even those trails that have like, it's a trail, but it's got the wooden blocks along it that aren't quite stairs, but also isn't quite just a normal trail. um So if it's anything like that, I think you'll have no trouble passing. But what are all your thoughts on sort of how you'll tackle that first climb sort of that 820 to 850 meters up?
00:38:22
Speaker
ah I reckon I will wait until I'm there. Um, no, I, I usually just try to think, relax. Um, and yeah, I'm going to guess run strong, but then yeah, not overexert myself and then just be okay with where I'm at when whenever, wherever I'm at. And then I think if I can get a chance to go on the first part of the course, I'll check it out and and probably make a decision from there. But, um, yeah, that's really my strategy. Nice.
00:38:56
Speaker
Marky, what were you doing along? Were you just curious? I think, um, I think I'm kind of becoming more comfortable with letting myself push it to start in various parts of races now. So I think I'll kind of let it go. However it goes. I think it'll be important not to lose yourself on this climb because then you've got a really long runnable section approaching getting up to 50 or like 40 Ks. Yeah.
00:39:25
Speaker
Um, but I think I'll be pretty comfortable running it solid, but not stupidly, you know? yeah Like it's, it's a 70 to 75 K race. It's kind of on that border, I think between like a marathon distance where in my head it's push, push, push from the start. And then an ultra where it's like you have that relaxing period. Um,
00:39:47
Speaker
So I think, yeah, somewhere between somewhere in the middle, see how the race plans out, how I feel. And if I feel good pushing in the first half an hour, I'll kind of let myself do that, but not be stupid about it. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. What about you, Charlie? I think like Mikey said in ah the way that that I've raced this year or some of the races that I've been doing is the first half hour has been really, really hard. And then you just kind of have to consolidate from there. Like.
00:40:18
Speaker
I want, I find it very important personally for how I like to race is to be in position, to be able to be near the front, to then yeah work the race from there. So whilst, you know, the first, the first little probably 4K is different, but by the first aid station, which is at 8K before we start that second climb, I want to like, I will want to be at the front and I i want to be with the front because I think that big this big, runnable climb here after is is where things are going to break up. And I think if you miss a gap there, or if people are so a minute up the road, like it might almost not be too late to catch them, but that will that will be where the race will be. And I'd like to be in the race.
00:41:08
Speaker
Yeah, I think so. I think you want to be careful though using that strategy because it will be a vastly different kind of race yeah here than something in Australia where perhaps the field isn't as deep as a championship race. I think that's fair. Yeah. I think there'll be a greater number of people that will be able to go out hard and a greater number of people that will have that racing strategy of going out gangbusters and they'll be all hyped up on representing their country and whatnot. Yeah.
00:41:33
Speaker
But I agree with you. I think you need to be the in touch. But I think there'll be some people that will go out. Yeah, true. I just think this that second climb and and but second climb is a very runnable climb. And that's what I like. By the looks of it, it's like it'll be quite fast climbing. and And personally, I want to be able to be there moving really strongly. um Yeah, for sure. Getting getting what you've got to send. So that's would probably be my tactic.
00:42:01
Speaker
Yeah, nice. Cause yeah, so you climb that little bit, you've got a one and a half K minus 20% bomb into that first aid station, um, just to prime the legs for that runnable climb. And then it's like, what, almost eight K or seven and a half K of just 10% runnable, um, runnable climbing, which yeah, I agree with you. That's, that's the spot where if you're not in the race mentally, that can That affects me for sure. um I want to be up the phone. I want to be in touch to mentally have that momentum going into there. um Sarah, what about you for that runnable sort of 8K almost climb after the descent into the first aid station?
00:42:46
Speaker
The runnable part? um Look, ah yeah, I'm just looking at the things now. That probably will be my weak spot. um I think gentle, hilly stuff I'm not great at. I much prefer the steep. um But yeah, no, I think just gonna have to stay in it and make sure I have a good attitude.
00:43:09
Speaker
I also think Ludo, that section will probably be quite, has the potential to be quite technical. I think because it is one of these like ridgeline trails. So I think it might not be as fast as we're anticipating. and It might be really strengthy, potentially. I think we we don't know.
00:43:29
Speaker
Yeah, always the potential for that. And the top of that is then the top of the first big descent, which looks like it's about, what, 5K dropping 700 meters or so into the aid station. And so the aid station is kind of midway down the descent, and that's the first aid station where you're allowed crew, which is at about that 22K mark.
00:43:55
Speaker
So what are your thoughts? yeah but When I think of the positioning of that aid station, I'm like, damn, it's like part way down percent. where I would rather get to the bottom. um But for you, Mikey, being in the longer, would are you planning would you stop at the aid station and um get as much support as possible? Is it one the way you it's early enough, you're kind of still blasting through or thoughts there?
00:44:17
Speaker
No, I would definitely try and use aid as much as I can. I think just to try and run as light as possible throughout the race. so like Just try and have fuel such that I can use it and then be empty as I approach an aid session to then carry as little as possible to the next aid.
00:44:34
Speaker
It'll be two hours, over two hours, so it's probably two bottles. But I think there's and <unk> there's an aid here, just a water refill at that little dip at eight and a half K. So I'll probably just carry like powdered flasks to there and then use powdered flasks to that next aid station where we'll have crew and hopefully a quick changeover. Have you seen, and I'm not sure, like just the way the mandatory kit is worded,
00:45:01
Speaker
It doesn't say capacity, it says amount of fluid and that you have to be carrying that amount of fluid out of each aid station. It's only 500 mil though, isn't it? For you it's 500, for Mikey it's a liter to be carrying out of each aid station. Yeah, I mean, if if it's that, it'll be hot. And if I feel confident that I can get to the next aid, I'll just dump it. Yeah, okay. Very, very much. Sounds like like,
00:45:30
Speaker
you know, a mandatory requirement. And I think a lot of people were dumping water on themselves. I was. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It just becomes a cooling strategy then. Yeah. For sure. What about you, Charlie? and You're a part way down a descent with still more descending to go and hit the aid station. What are your thoughts for that one being about halfway? Well, I'll probably pick up. I will probably pick up two bottles. Like that's our only crude aid station. yeah So I'll pick up a bottle there. I might, I might even just pick up one bottle and an empty one to then get to the next to fill up. Um, full club definitely yeah, but it's like, you know, I mean, in a four hour race, I personally wouldn't stop anyway. So like, I would just be blasting through and having Markey throw a bottle at me probably. Yeah. Yeah. And Sarah, same for you. Yeah. Yep. Sort of just grab and go. Grab and go. Yeah. Cool. Cause the, yeah, the descent keeps going until what that 25 K mark.
00:46:30
Speaker
And then you've got you guys all have a fun little up and over. Essentially you climb 300 meters and drop 300 meters in what? 6K. Is that the same climb? Yeah, you've all got the same climb against there still too. um Yeah. Big up until... Doesn't look too steep. Like 15% gets a bit steeper towards the end, but that'd be a nice little... That'd be a nice one, I think. Just a little tester.
00:46:58
Speaker
Although, if like depending on how much you've bombed that previous descent, that 15% might feel more like 20, I sometimes find, at least at the beginning. But then, obviously, you've got the big climb to come. So at this point, are you thinking push to get in a position for the last climb, or are you thinking conserve energy for the last climb, for the short trail?
00:47:20
Speaker
Oh, it's wait for the last climb there. I doubt anyone would push that climb. Like always, so therefore it's a spot to expose a move. Yeah. I was going to say, someone might think that and therefore they try and get a break on that climb so that the next climb they're doing solo at the front. Yeah, I don't know. It'll be interesting. exactly but That would be interesting. enjoy Well, cool. Because that that little bit puts you at the last aid station for the short trail people. 30K mark for you, um Mikey. And this is where the courses really do divert. um Because for Mikey, you've now you've then got like 10Ks of rolling net downhill coming up into the next aid station. So would
00:48:05
Speaker
Yeah, it looks very fast for that next section um after you've got what, net downhill for 15k at that point. So what are your thoughts for that section where obviously you could maybe feel like you're pushing pretty hard or is it a conserve for the last brutal bit to come? Yeah, I always think in ultra is the spots that you are moving the fastest.
00:48:31
Speaker
are never the spots to push or try and expose and move because the percentage, like the relative gain you're getting is less. yeah yeah yeah but that on't you should yeah like Like as in a 10% perceived effort boost on a 20 minute climb, you get two minutes. But if you do that on a, you know, three fifties compared to three thirties, if you're on a net downhill part of a course where everyone's running fast, you're not getting that. Like it's diminishing returns.
00:49:00
Speaker
ye i Um, so I think that's a spot where people will try and run really fast and expose a move, but I think that would be stupid. Yeah. So when would you suggest?
00:49:13
Speaker
I think on the climbs and technical downhills when you actually try and best on this course and I think those flat bits look really enticing. It's like, I'm going to save myself on that climb and then I'm going to, you know, really roll that downhill. But if someone really rolls that downhill and runs, you know, let's, let's say three thirties as an example on that, down on that downhill stretch, and then I more comfortably run four minute case for that 10 kilometer section. That's only like five minutes, yeah five minutes which would in cattle, yeah, five minutes, which, which comes at the end of a race extremely easily. Whereas I think that person has reached very far to try and, to try and do that at that point in the race.
00:49:56
Speaker
Yeah, ye I'm a hundred percent with you there. I think that's very, very smart because yeah, you can be making up over a minute a K on climbs and descents when you're fresher than the person ahead of you for sure. So smart move. But coming into that aid station for Charlie and Sarah is very different because you guys are about to hit what, 4K with over 800 up. And I think, is that the worst climb of your run too?
00:50:20
Speaker
thirty Yeah, yeah. it's not scared important for It's just like, it's more, it's about a thousand meters for 4k. What do you mean? Oh, no, sorry. Sorry. 800. 800. Yeah, 800. Bob walks with it too. You come out of that aid station and then the first 300 meters are super steep. Like there's that, what's that? Like a 400 meter section where you climb like 150 meters.
00:50:54
Speaker
that doesn't been nice yeah it's like thirty five um So I think that'll be the really tough spot. And then it's kind of like, from there, it's still really steep, but it's not quite as steep. yeah in In my mind, that's like the crux of the race. I think if people are somewhat close at the bottom of that climb, the winner of the race will be the person who climbs that the best. um And I think that's,
00:51:24
Speaker
pretty, that's a non-controversial statement to make. I think whoever runs that the best or runs that is, will win the race. True. Very, very true. um Although there is what, a 6K 920 metre downhill off the top of that. So if the person that runs that the best has cooked their legs and the person behind them has a good downhill legs, there's still a chance to lose it in the last descent. That's an eat that.
00:51:49
Speaker
No, i I disagree. I'm sorry, Sim. I disagree. um Charlie fetishizes climbing ability a lot. Six Ks of a downhill with 920 drop is one for the downhill 50s. Run faster than someone up the climb. You probably have better legs than them. And unless, like, unless they're, you know, a freakish downhiller, they're not going to catch you. Um.
00:52:15
Speaker
Depends on the technicality of that last downhill. If it's super technical and you've got a technical technical downhiller. the right hall Okay. Yeah, that's different than if it's a road, then yeah, you're not making up much as much time on that downhill for sure. Yeah. So, so in in my mind, um, like all I'm really thinking about mostly in that race is, is getting to that last climb and getting out of it, you know, running that last climb and then that'll be the winner.
00:52:42
Speaker
Have you ever pushed so hard up a climb though that you then don't even have legs to run down? I've seen people do it. Yeah, I guess that's a possibility, but that's an issue I guess I'll face at the top of the climb. Cause yeah, I think, I think you're right that most nine times out of 10, the person running the best up that climb is probably just going to have the legs to continue on. Um, but if someone is treating it like the top of that climb is kind of the first one there is almost just going to win. Um, I've definitely seen people run the legs off themselves up a hill.
00:53:14
Speaker
and not even be able to make it down properly so they get caught. But for you, Sarah, what are your thoughts on the fact that obviously you've got, what, 10K with 820 up followed by 920 down? um And that's, as Charlie said, the crux of the race. What are your thoughts for that last bit there?
00:53:36
Speaker
know um our version I guess I was just trying to think of like, you know, even my last race hound zone is probably the most like similar in terms of distance and and that sort of thing. um Yeah, I mean, I guess it's just sort of stay, yeah, stay in it for that last climb. And yeah, I mean, interesting to hear everyone else's opinions around when to push.
00:53:59
Speaker
um
00:54:02
Speaker
Yeah, i'm I'm actually not too sure. I think I'll just give it a go. Yeah, I think that'll be where you come really strong, Luda, and where you'll be able to climb and like take some people, I think. Yeah, I mean, I i think I definitely prefer coming from behind and um yeah, moving my way through people. So I guess Yeah, I guess I'll just keep that as as a goal in mind, you know, trying to to win that climb, um irrespective of where I am. And um yeah, stay strong on the descents. I personally love descending, so it's nice to know that that's where the finish is. So yeah, we'll just enjoy the last descent and stay in it for the climb.
00:54:45
Speaker
um Definitely had few a few races where it's really the last climb slash descent that has you've got me the lead. So like Buffalo a few years back, I think it wasn't until that last big climb did I see, you know, first place and then I just got to the top and I was like, it's now or never and like legged it down. so Yeah, hopefully I will just have something like that. Yeah. And are you just sort of mentally, when you hit the top of that climb and you're into the descent, are you the sort of person thinking chase the people ahead or run scared from the people behind?
00:55:24
Speaker
Oh, I suppose that just depends, um, where I am positioning. If I have that information, if I do, I, I always like to think forwards. Yeah. I like to think, um, yeah, reeling people in. I think that motivates me more than running away, but yeah, running strong and and using the people around me, if if that is, um, going to help me push harder, but if it isn't, and it's going to make me more stressed, then I just let it go and run my own race.
00:55:54
Speaker
I think by now, everyone in Australian trail running knows how much of a dog you are in a race and how mean you can get, especially to your competitors. What do you think, do you know what you'll say to the people that you pass on that climb? Like, are you allowed, will you be able to say it on the podcast or should we leave that for a while?
00:56:16
Speaker
is it Was it the pole-stabbing thing that through threw me under the bus? um I mean, everyone talked about it quite often, actually. Yeah, I'm a dog. Oh, look, I usually just run past and say, like, keep it up. Like, you're doing great. If she can. That's what I've heard.
00:56:34
Speaker
Yeah, we'll keep it up works for me because it's like, you know, stay stay in it. But also just state your own pace and let me keep going through. So your pace, which is slower than mine. Yes, but positive. You can all learn some Korean cuss words.
00:56:51
Speaker
Yeah. Just as you run past, just give that every single person an eat my dust. like Yeah. i think I think you can give them a humps amnida, which I think is a thank you. So you can just give them a thank you on the other side. Love it. I'll just learn passing on the right in Korea. Or left. I don't know. Do you pass on the left there? Oh, good question. Wherever the trail makes it easier. ah
00:57:16
Speaker
Over them. The way Sarah passes over them. The only way pass is... I'll just say, Adam, out of my way. yeah Nice. Nice. Well, at this point, obviously, you got Charlie and Sarah. have We've reached their finish line with that 920 metre 6K descent, which is pretty frickin' epic.
00:57:36
Speaker
But Mikey, you'll still be, when you hit that 40K mark, obviously you've just hit had that rolling section. um You then have your ah next up and over, which is another what, 550 up, 550 down, from what I can tell. Yes, 200 to, yeah, 550 up, 550 down. Yep. yeah With them runnable up and a steeper down, I think.
00:58:01
Speaker
Yeah. So what are your thoughts for that one? Like, will you have poles at this point? Do you, do you use poles? I have, I don't think I'll use it for this race. Okay. Or if I do, I'll pick them up at the very last aid and just use it for the last climb. Yeah. So I think this is actually where people's legs will start to fall apart because I think people will try, will have run too hard from the top of that first climb. Yep. From the top of the first climb,
00:58:28
Speaker
which is from 10K for the next 30Ks, I reckon a lot of people will have run way too hard. yep And their legs will be blown up for this climb, which is actually a really solid climb. um it is and then next And then the next section after that climb is still really undulating. And I think at that point in ultra, if you're moving well, that's where you just take so much time and people, and if you're not, then you've got no chance.
00:58:54
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. Cause you've got another, what 10 K is kind of just undulating or even longer, um, after the climbs. From 47, from 47 to 60, just before the bottom of the climb is undulating. I mean, it's still a, it's is still a pretty solid climb. It's like from 200 to. Yeah, 500. So it's like a 300 meter climb and then a bit of undulating stuff and then a descent, but yeah, not, not a mountain section.
00:59:23
Speaker
Yeah. Yep. So yeah, ah that's definitely where I would think that it's either going to, that it's going to split people or come back to each other and all those sorts of things. But when you then hit that last crude aid station at what's about 60, 61 K I think, yeah and yeah you then have your sort of up and down. um I think yours looks brutal for the fact that you get to the top of your climb, you've climbed 750 meters in like the 2.4K or whatever it is, like it's a 30% climb and you then have like just rolling terrain off the top of it rather than going straight into the downhill. So what are your thoughts for that whole section there where you've got steep up and then really steep down, up, down, up kind of stuff and before you hit that last descent? I mean, I think i think at that point,
01:00:17
Speaker
The goal will just be to empty as many beans as you can in the last time. And then you just hang on. I think like you'd be controlled for as long as you can. But then at 60, after you've run 60, probably pretty hard Ks. And then you have a 800 meter climb over three Ks. I think that's emptying you anyway, and you may as well empty it. And then you just get through that undulating section and get through to the end. Like you always leave a little bit, but I think it'll just be.
01:00:47
Speaker
full gas on cheating the tank. I think for sure. So my one big question for all of you is that at what point in that your respective races, so Mikey, I'll start with you, which point is your, I don't want, I don't know what to call it switch on point or the point at which you're no longer conserving and you're really pushing for the line. Where does that start for you in this race?
01:01:15
Speaker
Uh, I'll, I'll go first just cause I'm thinking, um, probably the top of my penultimate climb. So 45 K 45 K. So it's like I've had that big, long, minimal section. And then I've just completed that climb. Um, seeing how my legs are feeling.
01:01:34
Speaker
and then I'm probably pushing from there. Cause then you kind of, you're emptying your mid race descent legs on that next descent. Runnable legs, runnable section. And then you're emptying your climbing legs on the climb and then you're just getting high. Love it. It's like having two stomachs for dinner and dessert. We've just got multiple different types of legs in a race. Perfect. What about you, Charlie? Um, I'm thinking a lot about that final climb. Um,
01:02:03
Speaker
If the race plays out how I think it'll play out, hopefully I'll be with a few other people at the bottom of that climb. yeah And then it's a drag race out. um And I like, I like that. So i'm I'm pretty excited by getting to that final climb and then like, it'll probably be by the looks of it, 20, I reckon a 27, 25 to 30 minute effort.
01:02:31
Speaker
Um, and it's just, yeah, it's a full gas up that climb. I think you can put three minutes into someone who is moving quite well, quite easily. Yeah. I think if you can, 25, that would be like, ah what? I suppose it's a like a 35 minute VK effort. That's a bloody strong effort. If you manage that in 25 minutes. more three How many meters? 900, 800. 800 in 4k.
01:03:01
Speaker
It's essentially VK effort for 4K. That's a half an hour plus effort. It's not 25 minutes. Yeah, I was going to say, if you're covering that in 25, I reckon you're winning, man, by a long way. If it's 4K.
01:03:14
Speaker
oh Yeah, it's three and a half K. Okay. It'll be 35 minutes. You're right. So yeah, it's that climb.
01:03:26
Speaker
Yep. Nice. And for you, Sarah, where's your, like, is it earlier in the race or is it that last descent where are you push in for the line? Usually my race strategy for a long race is.
01:03:39
Speaker
I want to feel fresh at 50 or fresh at 40, like just keeping it cruisey till halfway and then going for it. So I don't know how well that applies here being fresh at 20. But I reckon. Just going to fresh at 40 it is. Yeah, I mean, I think.
01:03:59
Speaker
Possibly for me, it might be on, I think similar to Charlie, that last big climb, but I still think I wanna be making sure that I'm like like, I don't know, lifting in a way at at the halfway point. So on that sort of um long descent. yeah I don't know, that's really just you kid my rock deal. You could almost be standing on the start line, pretending you're at 60K of 100K. Yeah. And just go push, off we go. Off we go.
01:04:29
Speaker
Yeah, no, I think, I think having, yeah, I think it is always, you sort of can um underestimate the, like, I even think of something like UT800 and that last climb, like you can lose so much time in the last 20k. So, and you can be having the best day at, but you can lose a lot of spots, um but you can also gain a lot of spots in that last part. So,
01:04:55
Speaker
um Yeah, maybe maybe thinking something along those lines, being ready to, um yeah, feeling fresh for the last 10Ks really. yeah So fresh at 30, we'll go with that. Nice. Fresh at 30 is good, good. You do have what? Yeah, 10Ks with long way up, long way down. Brutal.
01:05:15
Speaker
Very nice. So this will be interesting then in a few weeks time for us all to get the rundown of how you feel about the course, having seen parts of the course, or who is it that we're getting as a correspondent that's getting there early to give us some questions.
01:05:28
Speaker
should get billy i'm actually paying billy to to do some course records Nice. Billy, Billy can ah come in and give us an actual rundown of where's technical and where's fast terrain. Um, but yeah, it'll be cool to see how that pans out. And then obviously now that everyone's heard a bit about the course and what everyone's in for, um, that plays into the sort of training you guys are all doing. And as, ah as Charlie said, the specificity of your up and down Sarah, by the sounds of it, yours can get more specific once you're in Canberra. Um, so
01:06:00
Speaker
We'll see how the last few weeks of training goes as obviously everyone gets a bit more specific for the race. But yeah, any final thoughts from you guys on the course, what's coming up and yeah, thoughts on that?
01:06:15
Speaker
Um, I don't have too many thoughts. I think, I think specifically, generally yeah i I think the fact that we've just talked for an hour about the course.
01:06:27
Speaker
is yeah probably is is so as in-depth as anyone will talk about Asian-Pacific trial running championships. We've nailed it. Cool. No thoughts is good thoughts at this point. We've done all the course recon you need. I actually haven't done all the training before, just if Ludo, if you could just stick with me for another 30 minutes. That was probably the most course recon series I've ever done.
01:06:54
Speaker
Absolutely, I learn a lesson or two in what I should be looking for and I don't know just do all of this sort of computer shit and then you know it's not until you're there does you do you really know what it's actually like because it doesn't really tell you the technical stuff so you know I mean you guys seem to have done a good job of extrapolating as much as you can from the thing um but Yeah, it's it's been very insightful for me. Thanks. Nice. Nice. Well, we will leave it there for this week. Thanks everyone for joining us. um And next week we are going to be doing same thing but we're going to be talking through just so you guys can plan for this. We're doing
01:07:35
Speaker
going to talk through the nutrition and gear you guys are going to be using out on the course and how you guys are training that. So as you go through training this week, maybe ah take notes on the nutrition you're taking in and how that is relaying to what you're going to tackle on race day. um We'll talk a bit about the weather and all that sort of thing. So That's what everyone has to look forward to next week, but we hope this has been insightful for how these guys are approaching this championship race. And yeah, we'll leave it there. Thank you so much for joining me.