Transcript
Speaker: Hello and welcome to the Crafty Pine podcast. I'm Will. I'm James and once again, Will, we've somehow failed to be in the same room together despite the fact we now supposedly inhabit this same building where our studio is. um And unfortunate reasons, well, last week it was me with a sick family, this week your illness has hit the Zeeble household.
Speaker: Yeah, i'm I'm quite well, but I'm surrounded by illness. so I thought out of an abundance of caution, I probably shouldn't come into the office and make everyone else unwell too, particularly because it's a momentous week for the Crafty Pint and we have some pretty big news, don't we, James?
Speaker: Yes, um that's right. and Talking of family, the Crafty Pint now has a sibling in the shape of the full measure. A new publication that went live this week, something that I guess we've been dropping hints about to varying degrees, certainly in recent weeks, I'd say greater than hints in recent weeks. But certainly for a while. So this is, I guess, a new website that's attempting to do um for the World of Australian Spirits. what We've been doing for the World of Australian Craft Beer for the last 16 years. um It's actually gone live 16 years, pretty much the day since the Crafty Pint ah went fully live. um And yeah, pretty exciting times. There's ah not just the the online publication, but also a podcast. And we've actually shared the introductory podcast episode across both um the Crafty Pint and the Full Measure platforms this week. But um yeah, it's been in some ways a long time coming um and we've got to great hopes for it as well.
Speaker: Yes, definitely. So hopefully by now you might've spotted the episode that went out on Tuesday this week. There's bit of an introduction episode with myself, James and Luke McCarthy. He'll be steering all things spirits. And from then on, on Tuesdays, we'll have a news wrap. And then on every second Friday, there'll be a longer form interview, I guess, more like the Thursday Crafty Pint interview with a guest. So that's a sort of coming schedule. That's right. You know, we didn't have enough things to juggle just with the Crafty Pint and the the Crafty Pint podcast. So we thought we'd best throw a second publication and ah twice, you know, and an even more frequent podcast into the mix as well. But yeah, jump online at thefullmeasure.com.au to have a look at that. um And you'll find the Full Measure podcast across all the usual platforms. including YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, et cetera, et cetera. Importantly, though, we're not slowing down with Crafty Pint coverage at all. We'll have the same news, the same interviews and all those things every single week as we always have. Although one bit... ah
Speaker: A bit of a change for the next the coming month is you're not going to hear my voice because I'm getting married this weekend and then we're heading straight on our honeymoon to Italy. so when um When you say we, you mean yourself and Courtney, not you and me, obviously. well we we We have a very close working relationship, but ah i'm I'm already taken, unfortunately.
Speaker: Yes, definitely me and my partner Courtney are getting married and then we're off on our honeymoon. And, um, so yeah, you're not going to hear me for a little while, but it's, it's not like there's been some kind of big takeover and I've been replaced by a spirit, uh, writing AI machine or anything like that. I'm just enjoying a very long holiday. Well, you say that now, there could well be an AI bot sat in your seat by the time you get back from Italy. But no, um yeah have a wonderful time, Will. i'm Looking forward to the the wedding at the weekend. I'm sure you will have an awesome time over in Italy. um but But before you head away, um you've been racking up a few more articles before you head off, including... One that we ran at the start of the week, which I guess is a pretty um crucial topic right now. like Things are still pretty challenging out there, especially in the wholesale space for for brewers and I guess all drinks producers. um And so you chatted to a couple of people who have got, I guess, a long history in sales who um have had some sort of fresh ideas about how to go about and potentially finding your market and and and increasing or at least maintaining your sales in the current climate.
Speaker: Yeah, definitely. So I chatted with Lockie Bada and Viren Goodry. Viren spent a long time at Stone and Wood. He ended up being national sales manager and left a few years after the sales line. He's recently launched Paradiso Supply Co with the different approach to sort of working and collaborating with a number of different independent drinks companies, breweries and distilleries to to get their sales ah to to sort of act as their sales um effectively. And Lockie started Lemonade, which is a app that sort of works to integrate a huge amount of sales function. Basically, the idea is to free up a lot of sales time. So you spend less time planning where you're going and more time actually selling. And I kind of felt like with these two people who've been in the industry for some time, both launching things in quick succession, I felt, oh, how do we cover it? And I just wanted to touch base on the two of them about both what they're seeing in the market at the moment,
Speaker: what they think are sort of longstanding problems people have, but also, yeah I asked for their, I, did we call them three keys to success or three golden rules or something like that? I never quite worked out exactly what they were, but you know, it's three key things they thought never actually do change in sales. And I thought it was really interesting that both of them said, listen, uh, it was important. Those were the, the, what the one point that crossed over. so both, I do think that's an important thing for sales, but it makes me think they've probably seen some pretty, um, shocking, maybe fresh faced reps on the road that sort of walk it into bottle shops or bars and just won't shut the hell up.
Speaker: No, it's great. It seems to have a good response online already as well, so jump online there. We'll include a link to that in the show notes. um Aside from that, we've got a couple of new listings going up on the site this week, pretty different operations. We've got Salt Line Brewing in WA. We did a piece on, I guess, the new owner's takeover what had been South Camp Brewery a few weeks ago. Jono's been back in, sampled all the beers. Now they've got a whole bunch of them on tap. So we'll include a link to that. That's down in in Dunsborough. And there seems to be a lot of excitement around what's happening there at Salt Line. And very different to that. Also, we should have a listing live this week for the Freehouse in Collingwood. Again, that was one that we sort of broke the story on back in January, I think it was, Will. This is Two Bays um venue in Collingwood. 100% gluten-free. heap of their beers on tap, plus some other drinks. Absolutely everything they're building is gluten free. um As someone with a celiac daughter, it's always really encouraging to see people going down this route. you know i think if you're planning to go out and every time you do so, you have to check ahead and you have to call and check on, you know do you have separate fries or this kind of thing? I think it becomes, know, you get used to it, but it it becomes quite frustrating with people that have to deal with that. So it's awesome to have a place that people can go to have a wide selection of award-winning beers, and cocktails, food, um everything. So very excited to see that when I head along for the media launch the night before this podcast goes live.
Speaker: And maybe you'll run into someone there, James, because this person does pop up at quite a few industry events. Lindsay Gregg, who we finally got to join us on the Crafty Pint podcast. That's right, yeah, Lindsay, well, she's been joined us in this very studio before and with her HPA hat on to talk about um pairing HPAs, sing some single hop beers um produced by Rocky Ridge when they were doing a bit of celebration of their their new hops a while ago. But yeah, Lindsay's had a whole number of roles in and around the beer industry for a number of years um and done a fair bit of beer travel as well, especially as she's now the New Zealand rep for Hop Products Australia, HPA. um So she joined us for a chat about all that stuff.
Speaker: Yeah, it was great to have her on. I've um known Lindsay for a long time. We're really great mates and I love the way she talks about beer, communicates beer. It's really interesting to get her insights on the New Zealand market as well. as Someone who used to brew be be there and now she's been brewing back in Australia. Now she's selling Australian hops to New Zealand. She's got a really fascinating role in the beer world, but also a fascinating way of thinking about the industry too.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, for sure. um So yeah, that's coming up after the break. um Before then, and I guess for the last time for a few weeks, Will, until we see you again at the end of September. Well, you know, maybe you want to wish me well on my honeymoon and at the wedding, you can do so by emailing podcast at craftypint.com. Our producer, Matt, will save those regards for me when I get back. You can also like, subscribe, comment on the Crafty Pint, however you get your podcasts. And James, if people want to engage with the full measure, how would they go about that?
Speaker: Yes, well, you can um you'll find that on all of the the main podcast platforms as well. and The handle we're using for there and for socials for the full measure is FullMeasureMag. So F-U-L-L-M-E-A-S-U-R-E-M-A-G. So you should be able to find that on all the key social platforms and podcast platforms. Again, if you like what we're doing, please like, subscribe, rate, review, tell your mates about it, send links to people who are into Aussie spirits. We want to get people excited about this this world as we have done with Australian craft beer over the years. um And yeah, you know we're we're excited about it. We've been putting a lot of time and effort into it. So now we need people to get behind it.
Speaker: Enjoy the chat. Cheers. Cheers.
Speaker: Returning this October, Grainstock is a truly unique conference created for the brewing, distilling and baking industries, and you're invited to be part of the experience. Held at the stunning Witten Malthouse in the Riverina, attendees will be able to take part in grain field tours, a technical symposium, trade show, live demonstrations and sensory tastings, networking with growers, maltsters, brewers, distillers, bakers and industry suppliers from across Australia and beyond.
Speaker: Even better, if you're a brewer or distiller and able to supply beer or spirits to be featured at the event, you'll be eligible for a complimentary all-access conference pass and return bus transport from selected capital cities. Check it all out at grainstock.com.au and hit the Fields and Ferment tab for details on the industry conference.
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Speaker: This year's theme is Brewing and Distilling, the Adaptive Future, Resilience, Relevance, Reinvention. Celebrating innovation and craftsmanship, the convention brings together professionals from across the Asia-Pacific region and beyond to share knowledge, explore new ideas and strengthen the connections that make our industry so collaborative and compelling.
Speaker: From match to mastery, the future of our industry will be defined not by volume alone, but by value, quality, adaptability and bold leadership. This convention is an opportunity for attendees to contribute to that future together.
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Speaker: Lindsay, welcome to the Crafty Pine podcast. Thank you. Thanks. It's so nice to be here, Will. To be back here again. Crafty and back here. here with you once before. Yeah. on On HPA Hoppy business at the time then as well. Yes. Bit of a different business time, yeah that one. um But I'm so glad you guys are having me on. thank you. And we may still have snacks. I'm so scared. Snacks. Yes. still have snacks as part of this discussion. yeah Spoiler, before we get into the snacks, do you want to tell us a little bit about what your role at HBA involves?
Speaker: Sure. um So my name's Lindsay Gregg, which you've already introduced me, probably. But it's still Lindsay Gregg. It's still Lindsay Gregg. Since the intro, which is good to know. Great. I'm still Lindsay Gregg, and um I am the New Zealand sales rep for Hop Products Australia. So I sell Aussie hops and the Barthas portfolio.
Speaker: um So US hops, German hops, and all of our advanced hop products um to New Zealand. New Zealand is my sales territory. Although I live here in Melbourne. So what's it like selling Australian hops? New Zealand, they have their own hops. How's it sort of feel being over there?
Speaker: Are you in enemy territory? um Well, it's interesting. It's... um Yeah, so New Zealand does have their own hops. There are a lot of hop growers in New Zealand and it's a very different kind of market over there. I think that's what I find really interesting um because of plant and food research and because of IPs coming up. All these different growers have started growing things like Nelson Savant, etc.
Speaker: Whereas with HPA, we have our own varietals. So nobody else can grow Galaxy. That's ours. Nobody else can grow Luna. Nobody else can grow Ella. um Those are our single varieties. So I guess the point of difference is you can only get Galaxy from me.
Speaker: I'm the Galaxy Gatekeeper um in New Zealand. ah But ah we have different Tawar as well. The hops are different fundamentally. So it's... It's been really interesting, I would say, to um to be over there and in such a crazy hop forward industry.
Speaker: um Yeah, it's a challenge, but it's fun. And I love the New Zealand industry. And I do think that Aussie hops have a place over there. um Especially if we're looking at, you know, replacing some American varietals. I think that Aussie hops can really step in as far as like big secret with a lot of pine and dank characters, high bitterness um and high high oils as well. So yeah, that's kind of where I'm going. I'm not trying to compete with NZ hops, um but trying to like offer a point of difference.
Speaker: And what what does it look like, not day to day, but week to week, month to month? Like, how often are you in New Zealand? Like, when you're over there, are you just, you do you pick a part of the country and visit a whole bunch of breweries in one go? Like, what's the...
Speaker: Yeah, well, it's, I've been in the role for 13 months now, 14 months. Um, my first year was hectic, so I kind of just hit the ground running. Um, I guess the benefit of me coming into this role is that I lived in New Zealand before I lived in Australia and I worked in beer in New Zealand before I came over here. So a lot of the people that I knew from then are still there. They have their own breweries still involved in the beer industry. ah but I do,
Speaker: I go, i try to center it around events where I can see a lot of people at one time, and then I hit up a lot of breweries. So in my first year, I visited like over 74 breweries in person in New Zealand, um and some of them really far away, like short jaw. Shout out short jaw.
Speaker: But it's, yeah, I think I spent roughly 100 days in NZ last year, um which is a lot. So, and I do, I tend to tack on weekends because I have so many friends over there. So every four weeks, four to six weeks is what my contract says, but I tack on weekends, use personal time and go see friends and family. um Yeah, so. How's how's it going with tapping up brewers at events? Do you have to get in before a certain time, you know, in the day to actually have meaningful conversations or can you actually seal more deals once they've had a couple more drinks? Oh shit. I'm supposed to be sealing deals.
Speaker: Oh my God. Uh, forgot about that part. No, I think the important thing is showing up and showing support. Um, and you know, This time last year, Birvana is coming up again. um It'll already happen by the time this comes out. But this time last year, going to Birvana, there were still a lot of breweries I didn't know. So I was just kind of going up to stands and being like, hi, I'm Lindsay. I don't know. Here's a hydrolite. I'm like running off because sales isn't my background. So I'm.
Speaker: Pretty awkward, probably, um doing that stuff. But yeah, I kind of like go up, introduce myself, and then I'm like, hey, can I come by Can I come see your kids? And ah they've been really receptive and been like, yeah, come by, i have a conversation. i don't think it's good to have really important technical conversations at events. Like maybe other people are better than I am, but I'm not going to remember Like, you know, I'm not going to remember the details. I don't think that's the time and place. And there's so many other things going on. But I do think it's important to show up, show support, try their beers, have a casual conversation, build the relationships, and then ah weasel my way in to see their kits and have a more serious chat. And what's, you know, you were in New Zealand working in beer, been in Australia brewing for a long time, and now you've gone back. What what sort of surprised you all about going back and realizations we probably often consider New Zealand might be basically the same industry as Australia, right? It's so different. No, i think I think that's a really common misconception um with Australians because i like a lot of Australians haven't spent a lot of time in New Zealand, which I think is really sad. um
Speaker: New Zealand's a completely different industry and it operates in different ways. I mean, just the way the breweries are set up, ah that ah so many of them just have two vessel systems. And I think kind of the standard we see here is like three. Even if it's a small kit, you have three vessels. But there it's like two vessels. They'll still be doing over a million liters a year on a two vessel system, which to me is just mind boggling. um And it's a lot more of...
Speaker: like kiwi ingenuity and their kits are very much like old dairy equipment that they're just making work. Um, and they're putting out amazing beers over there. So I think that's one of the biggest things is like, they're not a schmick and shiny. A lot of the breweries I've seen, but they, they're doing good, really good stuff. They also get their hands on. They're so used to having deep conversations with hop growers because they're that's where they're at. They're in New Zealand and hop harvest in March in that time of year is such a big part of it. So I think NZ breweries are really thoughtful when it comes to their hop selection. And they're also really proud of their local ingredients. um I think that's something that really, to me, differentiates them from Australia. um The very, very deep pride in, you know, using Gladfield malt and using NZ hop suppliers.
Speaker: Yeah. So how do you get them over the line to try some of your products? I'm like, can I see your case? I mean, it's a point of difference. and And like I said, it really is. Like, there's still a lot of US hops floating around in the market.
Speaker: Presumably there'd be a number of and breweries over there that would have been using Galaxy and some other hops for years as well. There'd be, you know... some core range beers out there or some, I guess, iconic beers out there that you can refer to and say, you know, these guys have been using Galaxy or Ella or Vic Secret for while. Yeah. Yeah. So up until a few years ago, ah we didn't have cold storage in New Zealand. So breweries were having to order direct from Australia. um Now we have cold storage in New Zealand. So it's made it a lot easier for breweries to get into Galaxy. um But I think one inch outside of Galaxy...
Speaker: people don't know the rest of our hops. They don't know Ella, they don't know Eclipse, they don't know Enigma and Vic's Secret, you know? So it is kind of being like, You have these U.S. hops, which I also sell U.S. hops. Citra, Mosaic, Simcoe, like everybody knows those. But then people are like, yeah, but what is Ella? Like, what does Ella do? What is what is Enigma? what what I know nothing about it. And it's like, man, that's one of our major hops over here. And there's a lot of Aussie brewers who can, you know, very familiar with Enigma.
Speaker: but they're not over there as familiar. So just trying to get it in the hands of the right people and, um, yeah, encourage them to adopt. Yeah. It's such a funny space. Cause I always think of Enigma as such a great, like a pilsner hop, like modern pilsner hop, but New Zealand's brewing industry is so built around modern hoppy pilsners that it works so well in that industry, but you've also got so many other hops to to play with too. Yeah. And, and, but with that as well, I mean, it does come to me and I guess my, how I'm looking at selling hops, I'm such a baby salesperson. Um, i I really think it's the high alphas and the really high oils. That's something Aussie hops do have. Um, so less is more kind of thing, you know, and in in this economic climate, uh, it's a good kind of thing to think about is like, What are you actually using? Are you being considerate about it? And are you making sure you're getting the most out of every product that you're using? And I don't think any industry, like there shouldn't be one hop grower, hop supplier for any industry that just makes boring beer.
Speaker: um You need to be able to layer and and contrast things. you know Enigma is such a great supporting hop. I wish more people would kind of just play around with adding just a little bit to their hot bill, you know, like 15% because it can really make a difference.
Speaker: And talking a bit you talking about this sort of the more sort of basic rustic setups or, you know, the two vessel setups there, any highlights? Remember when we, Will and I were over for the NZ Hop Harvest in March, I think the best sort of collection of beers I had in any one place was the tasting paddle at Renegade Brewing in Christchurch. Yeah, right. um And... That was a very old school brewery. It is. up as well, right? Kiwi continuity, man. Kiwi continuity. Yeah, well, it was like a real, you know, you're a classic brew pub in like the... the The two-story building with mezzanine was full of all sorts of reclaimed stuff, whatever. But his kit looked like it had been repurposed from a spaceship that Wallace and Bromit would have taken to the moon when they're going cheese hunting. And he was up there on top doing everything himself and then getting behind the bar. and it and like But the beers were fantastic. And it was so rudimentary looking. you know Yeah. And it does – his space especially, I think, really reminds me of –
Speaker: American brewing so um I came I started brewing in the States in like 2014 2015 in New Orleans and it was very that brew pub vibe where brewers were also bartenders so the first brewery I worked at and brewed at um you know, I would be back up doing a transfer in the back. We'd go ahead and open up the garage door and someone would come in and have to yell back and be like, hey, can I get a beer? I'd go serve them and go back to doing a transfer. Like that is to me what really built the craft brewing industry in the U.S. really brought beer to where it was, was that very like being able to
Speaker: see the person making the beer, but they're also serving you or they're setting at the bar. And it was like the accessibility to the, to the creators, to the makers, to the ones doing the work. Um, yeah, his space is really good. Other spaces. I mean,
Speaker: Other spaces that I love, i i i do have to shout out to Altitude. i just They have a really great spot on the water. um And Queenstown. And like Queenstown is humming right now. It's insane. Christchurch.
Speaker: I love Three Boys Brewery. I think every time you go in there, you can really see the regulars there. um A lot of the breweries just have such a good... more community feel, i think, probably in New Zealand, just across the board. Probably New Zealand in its entirety, you could say that, right? Yeah. a A bit more of a chilled out place and more relaxed and more of a community. Yeah. And people are still going to like support their local because they love their local. And I love going into any brewery where it's like, oh man, no, the people who are come here all the time, they feel like they are owners, you know, they might not have shares in it, but they're like,
Speaker: It is their brewery, you know, that kind of love, that kind of pride. Yeah. And you mentioned your days brewing in the States. So so going back to the early days of Lindsay. So yeah what was it first drew you into the world of beer and brewing?
Speaker: Yeah, so I studied theater in college, musical theater. I always worked a bar job as an actor. That's what you do. I started working in a, well, where do I go? Where do I go back? I was always supposed to be an actor. I wasn't supposed to be a brewer. um I've also always loved food and flavors, and I've always been interested in beer. I grew up on Boulevard Wheat. That was my holy grail beer that I grew up on in the States. So I'm from Southern Missouri originally. um
Speaker: I loved that beer so much. And then pretty much anything Boulevard would make, I would try. So I was 21, and I was drinking bourbon barrel-aged quads. And when they put out their Love Child Sour series, I was like, I don't care. I'll drink it because it's Boulevard, and I trust this brand, and I love this brand. um I ended up being in New Orleans. I moved there for the film industry. At the time, Louisiana had a big tax incentive. So it was easy to get on really big budget films in Louisiana as an actor. um My agent essentially fired me. I lived two blocks from, because I gained weight from living in New Orleans. um i lost to All those barrel aged quads. All those barrel aged quads.
Speaker: All of the all of the gumbo and jambalaya and fried food. um But I live two blocks from a craft brewery, a nano brewery called Courtyard Brewery. And at the same time my agent was firing me, I also managed a craft beer bar in the French Quarter with 40 Louisiana craft beers on tap. um So this was 2014. This was right when Parrish Brewing was getting up and going.
Speaker: The owner of the brewery that I live close to, he knew that I managed this craft beer bar and I would go in a lot and talk to him about beer. I was really interested in the flavors and I used to have people like blind pour me beers all the time just to see if I could figure out what they were. And his assistant brewer got injured.
Speaker: My agent fired me. was like, I don't know what to do if I'm not going to be an actor. He's like, well... my brewer's out for three months, um do you wanna brew? i was like, i don't i don't know anything about science man, like I'm an actor. He's like, yeah, well, do you wanna learn?
Speaker: I was like, okay. And so he kinda just took me on. Does it bring a whole new meaning to the phrase from acting, break a leg, but just break someone else's so you get a get yeah way into the new industry? Yeah. Oh, he actually, he had burns on the bottom of his feet.
Speaker: Oh, okay. Ooh. Ouch. yeah it wasn't good. And it was a very, like, you know, it a 350 liter kit. Like, it was essentially a giant homebrew thing. But at the time, in New Orleans and in Louisiana, it was such a good time to be coming into beer, And I just loved going to beer events because people wouldn't like I was coming from film and theater and going to those events were very different, I guess, when you're going to networking things. It's very like showmanship, whereas going to beer events, people just wanted to talk about what they were tasting.
Speaker: Like, and I was like, oh, wait, people just talk about like you guys just talk about like what you're tasting, like tasting food and eating food and drinking beer is like a good thing you can do.
Speaker: um And so I got really into it. And then through a friend of a friend, i was, it was Mardi Gras. I was at a 24-hour craft beer bar in New Orleans called Avenue Pub. um This was twenty early 2016. And the bartender there, i knew him quite well. It was like 3 o'clock in the morning. he was like, oh, after Mardi Gras, I'm moving.
Speaker: to New Zealand and I was like I don't even know what New Zealand is like what's that and he's like oh New Zealand you know I'm going I'm gonna manage a craft beer bar in a beach town I was like oh my god that sounds amazing that sounds so cool i want to do that and he's like well you probably could and I was like uh no you know I have a I have a dog. I have a cat. I have a car. I have a two bedroom apartment. Like, nah. um A few months went by.
Speaker: he messaged me and he's like, hey, if you're interested in moving to New Zealand, my boss, the guy who owns the company I work for, is in New Orleans right now. And I told him about you.
Speaker: And I was like, oh, okay. He's like, I'll have him come by the brewery. was working at Nola Brewery. I'd already moved to Nola Brewery at that time. He's like, I'll have him come by the brewery and say hi to you. And I was like, oh, okay, yeah, sure, whatever. Well, the day before was at Avenue Pub again, Parish Brewing Ghost the Machine had just been released. I had like six pints of that probably for happy hour. And then sure enough, somebody walks up to me is like, hey, the guy that owns...
Speaker: the beer bars in New Zealand he's actually here he was gonna come see you tomorrow right and I was like yeah yeah I'll see him at the brewery tomorrow though and they're like oh no I already told him I'd seen you so I went up and talked to his name's Evan um Evan King who has Lumsden Freehouse and a few other venues in New Zealand um I went over i went and talked to Evan and Evan was like yeah if you want to come over come on over, you know, you can get a working holiday visa. um I'll hire you, you live up in Mongafi, it's a beach bar, da da da da. Sounds like one of the lowest energy sort of job interviews and getting a job ever. It was. No effort on your part, it's just like, hey, come and work for us. Yeah, it was so bizarre. And like, I went home and I was not sober and I just booked a one-way flight to New Zealand. Oh, it happened that quick?
Speaker: Yeah, I was like, well, I guess I'm doing this. Like, just I and I maybe I'm a little bit of an impulsive person. um But it was just such a foreign concept to me. I also thought that New Zealand was north of Australia.
Speaker: um So I did think I was going someplace. You hadn't looked on a map by this stage. just like, no really still the stir the ring the stars are See, I didn't understand that until after I had already booked the flight. Somebody brought it up. And I was like, and I was talking to someone at the brewery. was like, yeah, I'm moving to New Zealand. I'm going to manage a k craft beer bar on the beach. And they're like, in New Zealand? Lindsay, that's so close to Antarctica. And I was like, what? What do you mean? they're like, Lord of the Rings. And I was like, what? All of Lord of the Rings? The cold parts? Yeah. Yeah. But I got there and i kind of fell in love with it.
Speaker: was supposed to stay for three months and then I was there for a year and a half, but I wanted to be brewing again. um and so I came to Australia to brew again.
Speaker: right Was that a visa ground visa thing or just more the job opportunities? So I was able to get, I would have been able to get sponsorship through Evan, um but it just would have been managing a beer bar.
Speaker: And I really, like, I really wanted to be brewing. I didn't want to be, like, it was great to get me over there. And initially I was like, yeah, three months, I can do this. um But I really, really wanted to be brewing again.
Speaker: And, yeah, Evan knew the folks. He knew Craig, um who at the time was Gabs, because Gabs always does their after party at ah Lumsden, or they did, sorry, back in the day at Lumsden Freehouse in Auckland, and that was Evan's bar. Evan became friends with Craig.
Speaker: Craig was like, hey, stomping ground, we'll hire you. and that'd been pretty very And relatively early days of stomping ground as well, I guess Yeah, so that was, I came over here in March 2018. So I started at the Tappy and then I had to go get my visa extension. I came back and I went to stomping ground. Well, if anyone wondering is wondering who Craig is, he's our partnerships and advertising manager. So if you'd like to take any advertising at Crafty Pint, you could do so during this break, which we'll now take. Cheers. That was smooth.
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Speaker: Welcome back. Hopefully you've all reached out to Craig and Lindsay. For you, moving from brewing into the supply side, what have been some of the biggest, i don't know, lessons, challenges, learnings, discoveries? Yeah. Well, after stomping ground, I actually worked for Beer 30 for two and a half years, a brewery management software company, which was wild. um Going from a very physical job with very real world consequences, if you fuck something up,
Speaker: you get us You get burnt feet. yeah Huh? You get burnt feet. Yeah. Or, you know, you could implode a tank. Like things have consequences and you see those, like if you forget to pull hops off of a beer at the right time, like you're going to get astringency and over extraction. And like going from that to working for an American software company where I was the only one on this side of the world in my own house alone. every day was why that was really hard. um Like you don't get the satisfaction of task completion, physical activity. Like i miss not having to think about going to the gym because I was brewing and brewing was my gym.
Speaker: um So doing that for two and a half years, but I kind of felt, I i ended up doing like digital experience and analytics on that. um And I really loved like user journey and stuff. I think that comes with my theater background. I love human psychology and um i love being in an app and seeing where people are going and what they're clicking on and then trying to figure out why they're not clicking on something. That's just fun for me. Um, and then, yeah, switching over to back in, I thought I was going to leave the beer industry, um, before this job with HPA came up, uh, HPA I've worked for loosely. I started doing snack pairings with them in 2021, but didn't come on full time until a year and a half ago coming into a sales role lessons, man, so many, um capacity I think is a major one. I really hit the ground running. And I, I, whenever I was in New Zealand, like I think there was one week where I did,
Speaker: just an obscene like 25 meetings or something and just trying to like really and these were all like first meetings so they're longer meetings and I just came home and was like catatonic for like two weeks afterwards so really learning and understanding what my capacity is um in a sales role uh another lesson is how to sell probably um It's an interesting one, isn't it? I'd always say, and Will's probably quite similar to me as people from sort of a journalistic background, that sales isn't something that comes naturally to you. But then I sort of sat in some sort of sales discussion meetings with where people who love it.
Speaker: And you're like, oh, it actually doesn't have to be a bad thing. Like you're actually trying to help somebody and understand what they want and then come up with a solution for them. We mentioned Craig. I've sat there a meeting with Craig and I'm like, this is really good. You're actually helping them. They might want to give us some money, but you're actually doing a good thing. And I just, as a journo, like you almost feel like you're anti-sales and you kind of have to just turn your thinking around and go, no, I'm actually not just, you know, there's there's ah there's a good thing happening here. Yeah, it's really, that's a really challenging part. um And I think I'm still learning it. And, um you know, HPA invests a lot in in their team. Like we're all, everyone on the sales team is brewing backgrounds.
Speaker: um you've got Yeah, you've got really quite the team there. Like you look at all the people in the the roles across the business. They've all, you know, done very substantial things in various roles. It's sad that none them are brewing, really. That's the travesty. but Maybe there's some fantastic home brews. Maybe you have the annual gathering that everyone brings house. The annual gathering. I can't homebrew. I was never a homebrewer before I was a professional brewer. 350 was your smallest brew. like Yeah. And like, i I couldn't do it. I can't do homebrew setup. that You know, I want the chemicals. I want, I want,
Speaker: I want the thermometers. I want, I want all of the kit caboodle. Where is my board to flick switches on? Yeah. I want a good heat exchanger. Like I want temperature control. There's the, I much respect for home brewers, but it is not, it is it her ah anxiety. um Yeah. So a lot of lessons, I think.
Speaker: just working. ah Yeah. Just brewing. like Anyone who goes from brewing to supply side, you know, we all kind of, um, even when I went into beer 30, we all have a, there's like a knowing kind of conversation. um Sam from Vintani, I think is one of them who like, ah you've done it and i've I've made the switch you've made the switch yeah yeah how are you going you know like we all there's a bunch of us who have been brewers who have now become supply side and it has been amazing the community there and being able to talk to people and just get a coffee and kind of talk things out how to adjust and how to like score ourselves I think is a
Speaker: thing as well, like knowing I'm, how do I know I'm doing a good job if I'm not physically making a product? Yeah, it's amazing because it is, you know, such a small group of you, really. It's great that the...
Speaker: collegiate nature that you often associate with breweries working together sort of carries through on that supply side because yeah the rest of the team don't necessarily in HQ understand what it's like or what what it's like being on the road and I'm sure you're running into each other all the time and that yeah too yeah and it's it's great like I actually love competitors I love people who have been brewers who are on the supply side and we're all friendly and we just have a camaraderie there Did you find it helps that you've been on the other side as well, that you've probably had people come to you trying to sell their products to you when you were a brewer, so you kind of understand what mindset you or your colleagues at Stomping Ground might have been in when you were being approached and you know what you may have liked or not liked?
Speaker: Um, so I would say it's stomping ground. The benefit there is Ash is the head brewer. So if we saw sales reps come in, we would just dodge them. I'll go get Asher. these tools I'll go get Asher. I'll go get Asher. Um, that being said, you know, uh, Frazier from convoy, he was the, well, and Phil HPA were like the two sales reps that they would come in. Um, I remember one time Frazier on like a really hot day just brought us some Gatorades. Um,
Speaker: And like just for all the brew team. And that was such a nice thing. And he just like brought them in and then left. I was like, that anything you can do sales like that? um So, yeah, I didn't really have to deal with it a lot at Stompo, which was another learning thing, learning contracts and how...
Speaker: hop contracts work, but also learning the agricultural side of the business, I think is probably the biggest, um, learning curve for me, really understanding the agricultural aspect of hops and how things work and why they work the way they work. Yeah.
Speaker: Nice. And as someone who's on the road a lot, you know, how are you finding managing that ever difficult work life balance between nonstop events on the road, working from home as well? It's it's pretty, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but imagine that's pretty diabolical. As someone who's just moved into an office, I'm finding it better already. Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, well, and you know, I was just saying earlier how hard it can be working from home because there's days where you don't talk to anybody except for your cats. I'm so lucky I have two amazing cats that support me, Laszlo and Lopi.
Speaker: um Lopi is a desk cat. She likes to be on a pillow on the desk. Being, think, being on the road in New Zealand, it is starting to feel like a parallel life a bit. Like, there's... you go through some sort of portal and now it's now I'm he really as a friends. and yeah Yeah. And it's a different industry, right? And like, I was so involved in the industry here um for such a long time and really like deep in it.
Speaker: And now I don't really see any of the people here over there. Or you see them in a different way that you would have seen, but you're still, oh, you're Lindsay, we know from the beer industry. Whereas over there, hey oh, you're Lindsay HPA Lindsay. Yeah, yeah. it's It's a strange, and then coming back to Australia, it's it's so weird. Like, NZIPA at Rocky Ridge, um three of my customers were over here. And the whole time I was just like, this is so weird. Like, you guys are here? Yeah. I'm here too. like it just as They've crossed over some sort of you know forbidden you know demarcation your existence. Yeah, yeah it's really was it's it's bizarre. I don't know if I'm managing it well. I don't think I am yet. I'm i'm working on it
Speaker: I'm aware of the things that, you know, I'm aware that when I get home after a trip and I have that like, wo i should probably stay at home for a little while and not overload my schedule.
Speaker: Because I do love, I love to overload my schedule. I just love it. Or maybe you need some sort of routine going to Australia. So midway through the flight, it's like, okay, I now need to go through some sort of process Like meditation, chanting, cleansing. Maybe not chanting, but who knows? There could be something. It's like, okay, now I'm through. I'm now into it. I'm now Kiwi Lindsay for the next 10 days and I shall return home. But I'm trying to figure out how I can integrate the two, I think. It's more of the... It's getting very metaphysical here. Yeah. How do I integrate? Yeah. It feels like a different life. Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah. And you you mentioned before, you know, that that that first trip over there, twenty you know, 25 first meetings, which I'd imagine you're probably like, who did I actually speak to? Oh, 100%. What conversation I have. So how have you, you know, sort of managed that as someone who's come into sales with the technical knowledge and and the experience that HP, I'm sure, wanted from you and the personality they want to get out there? but then not having that side of things. Like, have you managed? Is it from conversations with the likes of Sam and, and you know, Michael, other people on your team, or is it you just had to go, this is how it's going to work for me?
Speaker: A bit of both, right? Because we're all different people and we all manage things very different ways. um Being able to talk to, you know, Michael, but also our sales rep, Brad, who has to travel to KEDA, South Australia as well. So he kind of has that dichotomy um of the two. i mean, all the boys have been so helpful. I really do love team. um I love them so much. They've all been so helpful and so willing to chat about managing life on the road. um
Speaker: The biggest difference for me is just that I'm doing international trips all the time, which it's not a big trip, you know, it's a four hour flight, but it's still international security, coming back, going through customs, like all of these things that are very Disassociating a new a new car every time I go over Constant currency as well.
Speaker: Conversion in your head, I imagine. I don't even think that. I don't even. Have you learned, when we flew back from New Zealand, I thought we'll get the earliest flight back on the Monday because it was a couple hundred bucks. Oh, no, no, no. And we realized that we actually had to be at the airport for 1 a.m. to catch up. 1 a.m. Melbourne time, I guess. Yeah, 1 a.m. Melbourne time to get back. And we're like, we didn't think this through at all. Sorry. Yes, that is a lesson I've learned, which I was doing at the beginning. was like, well, I need to take the 6 a.m. flight out. I need to get out. actually don't. I'm also of my, I guess, one of my biggest flexes in this role is how casual I've become in airports. Like, I keep pushing it to see how far. Oh. I can go. I don't even like hearing about it. No, it's, it's gotten so good. it's like one of my favorite things, like how late can I leave my house? How late can I get to like, how close can I cut it? And I think, you know, because I travel a lot, being able to get things like status where you get easy check-in, like I can drop my, I get quick check-in, whatever, drop my bags. That is like such a blessing. yeah.
Speaker: But yeah, I do. Even in New Zealand, I'm like, I know all the airports now. And I'm like, oh, I'm in Christchurch like an hour max. I'm going to get there for an international flight for a domestic flight. 20 minutes, you know, like you just you push it. where we We saw this sort of slightly more laissez faire approach to. ah The lack of security. There's airports where you don't have to go through security. It blew my mind. I was like, where am going to get checked? This was just explained to me why. never understood why sometimes you do. So you only have to go through security if you're flying to another international airport within New Zealand. So if you're flying from...
Speaker: Wellington to Christchurch, you have to go through security for a domestic flight. But if you're flying from Wellington to Nelson, you don't have to go through security. That's what we found. We got on the flight from Auckland Nelson. And once we took off, Will just goes, did you know Senator's difference? I'm like, yeah. I've got all these dynamite straps in the body. I was like, well, it's just a small plane. There's only one person in the cabin crew. like, no. Did anyone check your bags before the flight? I'm like...
Speaker: No. That's the first time in like 15 years longer than someone's ever checked my between flights. As someone who never flew before 9-11, it's kind of like it just really blew my mind that you could go through an airport. I felt like starting to smoke, you know?
Speaker: I think it's great. It's so good. I love it. And I love like even p k my ah old boss from Beer30. The first time we went to New Zealand together, he he was freaking out about that as well. He was like texting me, you know, in America. He's like, I didn't have to go through security? What do you mean I don't have to go through security? What? Is this even safe? And it's like, yeah, man, you're fine. It's just New Zealand. it was just It's just New Zealand, man.
Speaker: As someone who's been involved in communicating beer for a long time, i feel like might've watched one of your TikToks before we even knew each other. No. No, surely. No, I didn't start TikToking until 2020. We met before. oh okay. Right.
Speaker: Maybe it was really, it really evolved real. Yeah, potentially. yeah doing Talking about beer styles and doing education things, obviously your relationship with HBA goes back a long way. um Talking about enjoying these things better. How do you look at the way we communicate craft beer at the moment as an industry?
Speaker: Broad question, I know, and a few landmines for you maybe. Yeah, it's such an interesting time. um in And not just, like, let's just not say craft beer, let's just say beer as a whole, right? Like, and drinking and all of this, and human psychology and how we interact with each other and how we interact online and the way we used to, like, I don't TikTok anymore. I stopped doing TikTok when they started flooding it with ads. And then the ads started being AI ads. And I was like, I don't wanna do this.
Speaker: um And then there's this thing in the industry where you're seeing a lot of people try to copy and try to imitate those who have been really, really successful with their socials. um Like Mountain Culture does an insanely good job with their socials, but that is like them. That's their brand. If you know them personally, you're like, yeah, that checks out.
Speaker: um I think there's people trying to copy what works, even though it doesn't work for them and their team and their personalities, um but trying to force something to communicate with an audience that doesn't read well, or maybe it just doesn't read well to me because I'm a brat and I have a theater background. don't know. Yeah. But you could probably copy that across even, especially during maybe sort of the late 2010s and the COVID era. People going, oh, those styles of beer are selling really well for those people. Let's do it.
Speaker: And it doesn't either fit for their brand or they just can't do it as well. You know what I mean? Yeah. Maybe it's not just me. Yeah. Like a hoppy, a super hoppy brewery suddenly being like, Let's just make super sour barrel aged things. And, you know, they don't have those barrels going anymore. Like every every brewery under the sun was like, oh, barrel aged beers are popular. We should get some barrels. And it's like, should you though?
Speaker: Like, do you need to or should you like stay to what's true to you? I think that's just across the board. We're not. Um, and there's so much information coming at us from everywhere and there's so much AI information.
Speaker: um I've had to call out someone recently because, and it was, um, it was like a hop farm in the U S that I reached out to. Cause I was like, Hey, this AI slide that you're using is not like, it doesn't really line up. They were like talking about use it. And these,
Speaker: Hoppy styles or use it in an IPA and a West Coast IPA and a hazy and a pale ale and Other hoppy IPA s and it's like that like ah some things just aren't being checked Um I it's so hard I don't know I think building a community we need to be communicating in person again we've lost so many events as you guys know like we've lost events and events with consumers and I think that's really unfortunate because I know in my beginning craft beer journey that's how I connected with that's how I kind of fell in love with it was like going to these events and talking to the brewers and Not just learning, but feeling their passion, I guess, as well. You know, yeah the emotion they put into something as well as the liquid. Yeah. And then them being like, just try this. This is what I get from it. And it's like, oh, thank you. I can't remember the last time somebody offered me something. i was like, I'm getting a bit of like this and this and this from it.
Speaker: Like, try it. And it's, you know, like being willing to. Yeah, we're we're missing events. We're missing connections with punters, with people, with the youths, with our own generation. um i i really would like to see small-scale events coming back that are really um focused on educating, but not in like a...
Speaker: panel or lecture way just in like a really just homegrown kind of setting down a sitting down at a dinner table you know having some We should get more of our ah blind tastings going but ah you know if if someone does want to get in touch with Craig again and help help us fund bringing back our blind because those we did that one for the NZ IPA. What a great turnout. yeah it was Sold out, bigger numbers and we probably normally do for one of those. Massive. But then, um you know, Chris from Smith's Craft Beer House, who started that in New Zealand, he's like, can you come and do this for us in New Zealand next year? goes, you know, we really think about looking after all the producers, all the brewers and their teams that come down and all the consumers have a great time because they come and drink all these amazing beers, but we don't actually do anything for the consumers. And I'm like, we love doing this. It's just it's so much effort and it's a tough time in the minute to have the resources do it. But those kind of things...
Speaker: whenever we've done them, you do see this amazing reaction because it's like learning, but fun and a bit of surprise element to it, you know? And I think, um yeah big yeah, there's a so many conversations with people who've been around the industry long enough going, oh, this should be more education. There should be more opportunities to do this. And I guess...
Speaker: Maybe it's for a lot of businesses, it like but they're also going, we've just got to make it through, you know? So yeah. And I get that too. I just, I do like, how can you make it through if you're not connecting with consumers and the people who are buying your beer, right? Like it's a circle, you know, like you so you have to, and I even think as a hop supplier, like there was a time where Citra was such a buzzword and consumers knew what Citra was and like, well, why? Like how, why, why like people wanted to buy the beers that had citra. If they're buying more beers that have citra, more brewers are using citra, more citrus sold. Citra becomes what it is today.
Speaker: ah Like how, how do we, how do we bring that back? Because I think that's something that's really been lost. yeah how How do we bring it back? Lindsay? Lindsay? Well, you've been on this mission, I think, to, um, you know, ah bring a lighthearted, fun approach to beer and food pairing and your passion for snacks. yeah that' That's exactly what the industry needs more of. How far back does it go for you though?
Speaker: What? Beer and snacks? Yeah. Like, so I've been eating snacks my whole life. Unbelievable. i am yeah. Yeah. I was, I came out of the womb just snacking away.
Speaker: um I grew up in Southern Missouri and i grew up with a bunch of brown food. And like just remembering the first time even having like Mexican food or the first time I had sushi, I was so like I was so curious.
Speaker: um I've always loved trying new food and new flavors. And I'm one of those people who goes when I travel, the first thing I do is go to a grocery store in a new country. And I just walk up and down the aisles and I look at things. What's this? What's this? What's this? I'm going to buy this. And then I buy it and I open it and I eat two bites and I'm like, that's awful. Or I'm like, yum. And if it's awful, I just don't eat anymore. But like, I i love trying things. I love trying snacks and beer has flavors. And I just think those two things together, like beer is meant to be.
Speaker: enjoyed in a social situation and with food, like what's better than having a good dinner or meal, or even just like a nice cheese board with a bunch of beers with your friends, like, or new people, it's such a way to bond. Um, we need more people having beers and snacks. intentionally as well. And it's a way to think and get into your, um, like flavor is so subjective, but for me, and flavor is tied to our emotional memories. Right. And I do feel privileged having a theater background because I have easy access to my emotional memories. So flavors really trigger like,
Speaker: intense responses for me and that's how I'm able to like remember things um and when I get a really good pairing like it's just so cool that you can be like I have this thing that tastes like this but when I put it with this it becomes a different thing like how crazy is that And I guess the great good thing about doing it with snacks as well is like you can get people to think about that and think about flavor and think about what their palate is telling their brain in a way that if you said, hey, you want to come for this beer and food pairing dinner? They might be like, that sounds way too wanky for me. yeah Whereas it's like, just try these. It's accessible. I've got three different bags of chips. Yeah. And I've got three different beers. Everyone likes chips. Everyone likes beer. Just give it a go. And you'd be like, oh, this is different. Or one beer, three different chips. yeah Because that's the best way to be like, okay, wait.
Speaker: That's when you start to pick up the fundamentals, right? So if you have one beer and you have something sour, something sweet, and something bitter or spicy, get those three elements together.
Speaker: different textures or the same texture and just vary the the flavor, um you'll start to be like, oh, wait, why does this not... Why isn't this as enjoyable as this other one is? like And you start to kind of figure these things out. um I think that's the best way to go about it. That's like how beer and snack pairing started as an actual concept and something that I would eventually get paid to do was... In 2019, after judging the Independent Beer Awards, we were at Carwin Cellars. There was a group of us. It's like Tiff Waldron. um But specifically, i know Cassie O'Neill and myself. um They had just gotten a bunch of hers, like American... um
Speaker: Cheetos kind of in like the jalapeno and different flavors and I think we were having like a barrel-aged imperial stout and we were like let's get a bunch of bags of the hers and see which one works best um and at the time I was working at Molly Rose and Nick Sandry wanted to start doing events and I was like can we do a crispin beer, like pantry pairings, crispin beers. And so for that one, we had five or six different breweries bring a beer and they got to pair it with a chip and it became a competition and it was such a good turnout. Like, I think we had like 50 or 60 people come to that one. Um, it was amazing. Like it's such an easy concept. It's so accessible. It doesn't require a lot of money. Um, everybody snacks. I hope everybody snacks. Um, I was so sad if you don't snack. If you don't snack, fix that. like and what is that What is the point? What's the point? And back to what you were saying there about, you know, if someone, let's say they did have a beer and tried three different types. Even if they don't get to the point of going, why does that not work? The fact that they realize that one works better than another, even that's enough, I think, to yeah surely spark some sort of curiosity to go, okay, maybe I should think about what I'm putting in my mouth, whether it is a drink or whether it is food. Like, because...
Speaker: something's different there I you know whether you'd want to go and explore it further it's just the fact that it is different you know yeah and it's mindful I mean mindful eating I'm a big fan of like mindful eating um because if you can't life is so hard right now like the world is so hard and scary and a dumpster fire in so many ways if you can't um take as much joy from little everyday things as possible.
Speaker: i just want to enable people to be like, oh, you know what? This is, this is actually really good, you know? And you can do like, you can easily do that at home on a low budget, low, no budget, um, with whatever you have in your cupboard.
Speaker: how How does the the snack scene in New Zealand compare to the snack scene in Australia? You've got, you know, your previous time there and you've been back more recently. Yeah. You know, have have you found any real killer kiwi snacks that, you know, out outperform anything here or from your childhood?
Speaker: Oh, I mean, for my child, it's so hard. American stuff is like, I've ah i've almost, um I'm almost, ah American snacks are almost too sweet for me now. I've i've acclimated to this side of the world where I go back and I'm like, corn syrup, oh my God, why is it in everything? um i do think America's great at doing really big, intense flavors.
Speaker: We're just a big, intense country. um I mean, Velveeta, but I won't talk too long on Velveeta here. Shelf-stable dairy product from the United States. It's amazing. Look it up. um That's a great snack. But in New Zealand, there's like certain things I always bring back. Ginger nuts is one of them. It's just like a ginger biscuit that's really, really yummy. um always different kinds of chocolates, whatever I can find. um For a while it was rations, you know, but you can get them here now. They're in Aldi recently. um
Speaker: Rations are good. They're like cheddar bacon. They're delicious. um I... New Zealand does really good potato chips. They do. they They're just cut thicker. like Heartland, all of them. They're so much more premium. Yeah. newsy and i And I do think, to an extent, food, a lot of food in NZ is still quite premium that's made in New Zealand. Like anything you buy in a grocery store, it's expensive.
Speaker: and of right now like they're really getting hit with inflation hard it's gnarly um but i do find like their grocery store food that's made in new zealand is like of higher quality than it generally is here and here is way higher quality than the u.s um but yeah nz does really good potato chips also kiwi onion dip duh um so good i should have brought you some oh damn it Oh my God, I could have made that at home. ah We'll have to get you back on for another session at some point. And what about favorite pairings then? do you have any specific like NZ snack, NZ beer pairings or Australian equivalents? that you know you're absolutely If someone's listening listening or watching and you want to give them the easiest insight into what you know gets you going is go and put these two things together and you will understand why I'm so passionate about this. because well okay well one thing if you can get your hands on about a belgian double um dubelle uh with compte like just some compte cheese you can even get grocery store compte you know i won't judge um but also plug for maker and monger excellent selected compte at maker and monger um that or hollerhocker which is another
Speaker: um another alpine cheese that is amazing it's like melted leeks and chicken but with with a belgian dubelle or a belgian quad you those that combination i think is always a game changer for people it's something i normally showcase at my cheesemass that i like to do every year um which is a big cheese spread with a lot of beer and friends come over and Yeah. um It's great. is it Is it close to Christmas or is it? It's on Christmas. It is on Christmas. yeah Yeah, it's on Christmas Day. So people who have their families here, they spend time with their families during the day and then come to my house for Cheesemass.
Speaker: And they have nightmares.
Speaker: Dreams. sweet, sweet, sweet dreams of delicious cheese and Belgian beers. And I put it out in rounds, you know. i really love that. um Yeah, Belgian. Yeah, that's so good.
Speaker: As far as NZ goes, I have not done New Zealand beers and snacks. Like, I haven't. I haven't had time when I'm over there. haven't had time to, like, sit down and be in the right space to, like, get snacks and pair them. And normally...
Speaker: um when i When I bring stuff here, I don't think about it. I should. How about bring some... Steak and cheese pie. Bring some NZ snacks home and then pair them with some HPA hopped beers. find the And that's your sales thing. You go into brewery and go, guys, girls, sit down. Have this amazing kiwi snack with this, you know, Enigma hopped beer and I'm going to blow your mind. So I do that for... Well, and I should do it with NZ snacks, but I do do snack pairings. I do do...
Speaker: I'm a i I do snack pairings for HPA. We have another round coming up. um Touching on that, which I think I did. I've done it before, but that's really fun for me because it's not just what snack goes best with the beer. It's what snack brings the hop character out the most. Um, so I'm working on another round of that this week. Um, they do those twice a year and I work really hard on it. So it'd be really great if people actually got the beers, uh, that feature the hops and then got the snack to go along with them because it is a, like,
Speaker: It's a real challenge. It's real fun for my brain. Oh, sour beers and goat's cheese. Like a kettle sour with goat's cheese. I'm like, what else can I think of right now as far as pairings go? Steak and cheese pies. If you're in New Zealand, steak and cheese pies. New Zealand just does a better job of pies. Better chips and better pies, hands down. I thought think you had a pie in pretty much every town we passed through, and That's actually pretty common for touring New Zealand if you're not a vegetarian. Did you have one? Aw.
Speaker: Well, yeah, you're not a vegetarian. Oh, you are. but I mean, you can, it's, yeah. the So I have a list of pies because it's something I've also taken on. Pies are great on the road salesperson food, you know, just like gremlin eating a pie in a car. um So I have a whole list of all the pies I've had in New Zealand.
Speaker: Butcher's Pie Shop in Christchurch, I think has the best steak and cheese pie, in my opinion. There's a tip for you. Lindsay, thank you so much for joining us. Oh, I'm done. Thank you so much for having me. Cheers.
Speaker: The Crafty Pint Podcast is produced and edited by me, Matt Hoffman. For all partnership inquiries, please reach out to Craig Williams at craig at craftypint.com. To keep up to date with everything in Australian craft beer, head to www.craftypint.com.
