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S2 Ep48: Kirby Super Star
78 Plays7 years ago
Join Dave and Jake as they keep the old times rolling in this week's episode!
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Transcript
Superman's Responsibilities with Humor
00:00:35
Speaker
Actually, it's Soapstown. How's it going tonight, everybody? I'm joined by my co-host, as always, Dave. How's it going, Dave?
00:00:44
Speaker
It's going good. How you doing? Doing pretty good. You know, that was a little bit of a weird start to things, but you're not doing good. Superman does good. You're doing well. I'm I'm doing good. Oh, out in the streets. Since killing off Superman, you know, it's just somebody's got a fill spot. You know, I feel like that happens. I haven't been keeping up with Superman versus Batman, but pretty sure he dies.
Superman Meets 'The Lottery' - A Mashup Discussion
00:01:11
Speaker
What if the whole short story of the lottery was actually about Superman and it was kryptonite instead of rocks.
00:01:23
Speaker
But they just kept it vague. You know, it's your own interpretation. It was actually canonically Superman. Are these are these the rocks that are thrown at the end of the lottery or is this? Yeah. Mm hmm. That would be interesting. He won the lottery with his superpowers, but his weakness being stones. Look, here's all this free crypto.
00:01:43
Speaker
We'll get this to you as soon as possible, throw it at his body. He's so recipient of the kryptonite. Not recipient, what would that be? Receptive. Yes, receptive. He'd be a recipient of the kryptonite. Right,
Nostalgic Dive into Kirby's Adventures
00:01:59
Speaker
he would be.
00:01:59
Speaker
What game are we talking about, by the way? Superman 64. Ooh. Okay. Well, one thing I really hate about the game is the whole game. That's fair. All right. It looks like we have a lot of time to fill. Let's talk about Kirby. Hey, Kirby. What Kirby game you want to talk about this time?
00:02:17
Speaker
Looks at prompter Kirby super stuff. It's not even up there. You got that from memory. Give yourself credit Yeah, Kirby superstar, which I had not played prior to preparation for this But I believe you had you talked about it a little bit
00:02:33
Speaker
Yeah, we've been double dipping on my Super Nintendo nostalgia days from Mega Man and now this. I'm like, hey, Jake, have you played Super Nintendo? And Jake's like, what's that? And I was like, I'll teach you. Whenever I heard SNES, I thought people were just kind of combining its NES really quickly. I'm like, SNES.
00:02:53
Speaker
I was like, yeah, but there's other characters. Snack, Snack's a quick one. Kirby for the Snacks, and you're like, that doesn't make any sense. You get to play one character in Smash at a time. Yeah, so speaking of Smash, obviously like you've known Kirby from Smash.
00:03:08
Speaker
How did you play any other Kirby titles? I had played an old Game Boy Kirby. Fat Game Boy or Game Boy Color? Fat Game Boy. Yeah, like OG found in the dirt somewhere 25 years later. Where it's like, if you have cargo pants, you're fine. Otherwise, you're not so fine. Yeah. It was a dual hand. I mean, like all of the Game Boys you're supposed to play with two hands. What the fuck is that? You're one handed.
00:03:37
Speaker
He's got his popsocket on his fucking
Exploring Kirby's Co-op Mechanics
00:03:39
Speaker
Gameboy. He's just like ABAB. Yeah, I mean modern phones You could maybe do that a little bit more with but yeah the OG Gameboy The the gray with I think it was purple buttons or something like that. That sounds right. Yeah As is, you know old Nintendo colors like the SNES. Yeah, exactly
00:03:56
Speaker
played that and crystal shards which for the n64 which we borrowed from Like a rental store. So that's a little you know, they don't notice how he didn't say like a blockbuster or game stop It's just a rental still it actually wasn't either. That's why I was trying to be more explicit It was just like a local local rental store that dates it even more. Yeah
00:04:21
Speaker
Someone's like, you know be a good business. What if I had these things but let people borrow them for money But I was like I only have this for like three days which is like a certainly short amount of time if you think about how long that game is and Like my parents were just like gone for the weekend. So I basically
00:04:40
Speaker
fast fasted essentially and just played this game at every waking moment for as long as possible So I liked it But not this one not the not the OG 19 year old Sakurai Kirby
00:04:56
Speaker
I want to start telling you're like but not this one I've actually not played any games prior to Discussion on the podcast. I was really excited when Dave suggested revenge Yeah, you're welcome for that So For me Kirby has always been nostalgic thing because I didn't really have as I've said Games as much growing up right until later point my parents were like fuck it do whatever right because for a while they're like
00:05:24
Speaker
No, go do other things or maybe you can have one system at a time. And my cousin was like the god tier. He just... I think he had to get his own things or maybe he didn't. I'm gonna make him sound spoiled. He had everything game-wise. Right, he was like smoking with the Sega Genesis. Yeah. He had those cool 80s shades and the neon windbreaker. And a girlfriend. No.
00:05:51
Speaker
But it was really cool to go over to his house for like a summer week or something. So we would just play games. I'm like a motherfucker. Like we would actually wake up early and play games. We had this rule of like first one up has to wake the other one up. So like alarm clocks, I mean they existed back then but we didn't know of them. Right, you didn't acknowledge they existed.
00:06:12
Speaker
We had our own rules. Make sure they're up and you just start playing games. And so a lot of that would be SNES titles like Mega Man, also Kirby Superstar, which a lot of the modes had, or if not all of them, have co-op.
00:06:29
Speaker
Yeah, I had very similar experiences growing up. Sega Genesis, my brother and I, Sunday mornings, before having to go to church, we'd play Sonic 2. It wasn't even our Sega Genesis, it was my sister's, but they didn't appreciate it. They didn't know Cyborg Justice or any of those other good games.
00:06:46
Speaker
Yeah. So I can appreciate that. And this game really harkens back to those, uh, kind of, I was going to say legacy. That's, that's weird, but nostalgic, uh, gaming moments where it's like, uh, if you can get somebody else in with a second controller and it's a co-op experience, that's pretty rare. And, um, I was surprised at some of the functionality of this game actually had, I was not expecting like a decent co-op experience from a SNES title.
00:07:15
Speaker
Yeah, it's surprisingly I shouldn't say it's too surprising But it is a really fun game and they put a lot of I guess smaller games into one game and then packaged it as
00:07:26
Speaker
Uh, yeah, here you go.
Design and Music in Kirby Games
00:07:28
Speaker
I mean, like a lot of games did that though, like, or there was a lot of bundled games that were absolute trash. But yeah, cause usually it's like, what can we get for free or like a license of like two cents or like, uh, thousand game emulator type thing, or just a bunch of shit. But this was at least all canonically within Kirby. They're all Kirby titles.
00:07:49
Speaker
Yeah, and even the ones that are like very basic the minigames that are very basic which we'll get to Like megaton punch, you know Not basic. Okay. It's not actually the most basic game here most basic one would be samurai Kirby
00:08:06
Speaker
Whoa It doesn't get more much more basic than see input hit button The thing is like I prided myself on that growing up right because it was probably one of my first Instances of like competition. Mm-hmm Because you just have like the wind blowing you have like samurai Kirby and then samurai to whoever else to fuck the second players like waddle D or waddle D is the first one hmm, and if you play up against the AI it's like waddle D chef and I think
00:08:36
Speaker
A tire. You definitely have a tire somewhere.
00:08:40
Speaker
But you just wait for the input to show up on the screen. But at the same time, I don't have a sound. That's why I always play with my eyes closed, because I was cool and edgy. And I thought that would help me focus. And then you just press the button at the right time, faster than the other person. And you win. And you murder them straight out. That's like a best of three. You can do three, five, seven. At a point, it seems grueling. But it's fun just to be like, hey, I beat you at this game. You're like, that doesn't matter.
00:09:10
Speaker
I actually wonder like whether people react more quickly to visual stimulus or auditory stimulus. I guess light travels faster than sound, but I don't know how that would interface with the human nervous system. I'm wondering if you're cheating basically by closing your eyes. This is essentially what I'm asking.
00:09:29
Speaker
I felt like I did better, but that was kind of just my own positive reinforcement to my own gameplay. Right, you had the strategy. You had the headband on and stuff, you know, like Karate Kid. And then I kicked my cousin in the shins. Makes it much easier to win the button press game when you've been capacitated the other opponent.
00:09:55
Speaker
So it's like, are we going again or what? Yeah. So that's, that's the most basic one. Yeah. We didn't play that that long, but I like the aesthetic. It's got, uh, it's got that art style. It's um, it's still got effort put into it, even though it's the most basic of the games.
00:10:16
Speaker
Yeah, like if it was a flash game like I took around this for 20 minutes. Yeah easily. Mm-hmm What did you think about megaton punch? Megaton punch was like I was so bad at this compared to you I had a chance with the basically just a reflex game because we're belt. We're both, you know old men at this point and Reflex games are for young kids first-person shooters. Yeah RTS strategy turn-based all of that's for young kids What
00:10:45
Speaker
Battle Royale, Dota. But Megaton Punch, I got my butt handed to me pretty consistently. It's another button press game, but it's one where you aren't pressing in reaction to something to beat the pacing of the other character. It's your own like a meter will fill and press the button when it's at the top.
00:11:11
Speaker
And you're such a waiting for like you eyes to match up in a certain way, you know, this is the time to press the button. Yep And then you complete that three times and your punch or go like karate chop Basically shatters the star that is the world everybody's on so first off you're on like these two giant stone slabs each character is and they have their each individual bars meters, whatever and
Kirby's Powers and Gameplay Impact
00:11:37
Speaker
But then when you've done the third one you go and like punch in and it breaks the slabs But then your punch continues through the fucking moon you're on and it shows how far down it goes It's like Dreamland or whatever it is. Yeah So I was like really cool. I was like damn because there have been a few times when I was a kid We're actually did punch through the moon. I'm like who's got a big dick It's really cool. It's Kirby Don't look
00:12:06
Speaker
But you can also, conversely, you can fuck up the input so bad where you go down a punch and you're just like, fuck my hand! Oh man, that's pretty great. Yeah, I like the absurdist beat to it as well. Kirby has never been a series that takes itself seriously in any capacity.
00:12:26
Speaker
fairly lighthearted but usually in like a martial arts competition you're not like fundamentally destroying the planet on which you're competing you know unless you're playing like dragon ball or something where you punch somebody they're like being thrown at light speed through a giant mountain that like none of these mountains exist anywhere
00:12:46
Speaker
I hate to be that one like lone earthbender that has to reconstruct all the mountains after Goku is done with his fight. Just like a hot cheese. Was this one here? I don't even remember. There's a mountain here now.
00:12:59
Speaker
Google Maps comes back there, you're like, hold on. Yeah. Well, that was a, that's a pretty good, uh, mini game. And, um, I also want to pepper in because I don't have any sense of planning. Um, as this is a SNES title, this is all Pixley 2d Kirby.
00:13:19
Speaker
Yeah. But I feel like this is the progenitor, not true progenitor, but around the time where like the music started being really, really good. Yeah. Because it was outside of just Game Boy or just basic Nintendo. Yeah. And they actually put a lot more effort into it.
00:13:38
Speaker
I could definitely tell that, like, I immediately was drawing Lietmotifs for, like, the later Kirby songs. Or maybe that's the wrong word, because they're the same songs. It is. It is. They're the same songs. They're covers of the song, and they do, like, orchestral versions for Smash. Yeah. So it's not Fonder Lietmotif.
00:13:56
Speaker
It's like, uh, there's some variations, but it's really just a revision of the song. It's not, it's not reusing the core themes. Um, but I was surprised how much of it was intact, like all the way since SNES. And SNES really was, I don't even, I didn't care about original Nintendo. Oh, no. Nobody cares about it. Yeah. Like no one's going to defend that.
00:14:19
Speaker
We've all blown the cartridge, but like, eh, it's not the best. It doesn't blow back, that's the problem. But yeah, SNES is where things really started to pick up. Get some cool stuff there.
00:14:34
Speaker
Yeah, this one was a solid launch. I was looking at some best of titles and I was like, oh, geez, like the game Dave has played or has picked, you know, or we talked about and decided to play for this is like on these lists. So is it the top top what list? Just top 10 or 20. I would say most sites had like top 20 SNES games. Okay. If you're playing like multiplayer games, it was like top five for all of them.
00:15:01
Speaker
That's really decent because there's actually a surprising number of Super Nintendo titles. Mm-hmm. Yeah We were playing on You're talking about like how even with like the pixelated graphics and we got to see every pixel because we were playing projector Blown up on the wall like full black bars on the sides because this is standard definition. This is where we're from and Now it was it's fun though So that's the game that's it this whole thing
00:15:30
Speaker
Alright, let's talk about one of the ones that's not as much of a minigame. Sure.
00:15:35
Speaker
Uh, spring breeze spring breeze. Yeah, that's fair. That's the first one and it's super basic. This is the, uh, the traditional Kirby start has the traditional Kirby music, first level music. And, uh, this is where like, if you started with this, you're like, I'm playing a Kirby game, right? Um, introduces you to the basic mechanics. Uh, you can suck guys.
00:16:00
Speaker
And that's it. Curvy's a very intriguing game. He's a lucrative entrepreneur. Suck guys up and then he kills them. Or you turn them into hats. It's basically what Curvy does. But the core feature here, and we've alluded to it some, is the co-op nature of
Co-op Mechanics and Storytelling in Kirby
00:16:26
Speaker
of this game. And so Dave was playing player one. So you're playing as Kirby. And I want to say I did give Jake the option, like, which way you want to do. I just handed you player one. I was just like, here you go. Because I figured in the case that I just completely screw something up, I would not be the mandatory death. I wanted to be the tales to your sonic. Yeah. So my fuck ups matter. And you're like, damn it, Dave, I fucking hate you so much.
00:16:52
Speaker
the only difference is like in this one in sonic and tails it doesn't matter what tails does at best he can be useful at worst he does nothing yeah like he can't screw you over actually you can if he picks you up
00:17:07
Speaker
If he flies like the right, I'm just like, I got you. You don't react in time. But in this one, like, um, so you get your hat, right? Uh, the Kirby hat, you copy a power and then you can kind of sacrifice that power to turn it into an ally. Um, which is a really freaking cool idea.
00:17:27
Speaker
Yeah, cause you're like, well, I just got sword. I don't want sword as much, but I would like somebody to help me. Cause you just summon essentially the same enemy, but now your player two can be them. Yeah. Which is really nice. And, uh, also if your player two ever gets a little bit uppity, a little too big for the bridges, you can press the same button to essentially D summon them and turn them back into the item. Yeah. Which then if you suck up, you get the power.
00:17:55
Speaker
Yep. So you can constantly like birth and destroy your own teammate. It's literally useful though. Cause if like as Pete player two, you might get into like a nasty scrape, have like no health and you start to like explode and die out of and phase out of existence. Yeah. But at that point I can D summon you suck you up or suck up the power and resummon you and then full health. Yeah. We use this in one of the boss fights actually.
00:18:22
Speaker
Yeah, I didn't have a power and the boss will always be like, if you don't have a power, like here's something you can suck up and then shoot back as a projectile. Yes. But that wasn't happening. And I had like no health. So I was like, I'm going to fly in the corner. Jake, go. We were basically playing Pokemon and I was the Pokemon. So I was like, fight it a bit. And he's like, Pikachu, come back. Rims over the power, shoots back out. I exist again.
00:18:47
Speaker
That's the weird part of Pokemon Satan. Pikachu come back. Go Pikachu! Ash just opens his coat and he's just got Pokeballs and they're all Pikachu. I thought I was getting benched.
00:19:01
Speaker
Yeah, but it's a really freaking cool mechanic. It's like, you don't, if you're playing single player, I believe the AI, the AI just controls the second for you. Yeah. And like jumps around, does some attacks and things. And that's fine. That's cool. Not everybody has a friend. I understand that. But in the actual co-op context, it's surprisingly fleshed out.
00:19:22
Speaker
And like these powers, I mean, Kirby obviously has a lot of the depth to the game or the other, like all the copy abilities he can get, but they like gave these copy abilities and unique sprites and things like that to the second character as well, which is like freaking awesome.
00:19:40
Speaker
So I really appreciated that. It was also nice not to be the one with whom victory hinged most of the time. I was just running around killing stuff. It was like doing objectives and things. I'm constantly like a screen behind holding the catch up button.
00:19:57
Speaker
To be fair though, like, I had played the game before and I knew where to go for the most part. So at least from like a efficiency perspective, we kind of ran it that way. Yeah. But it's kind of fun to just explore because they don't really have, it isn't like a side-scrolling game, so it is left to right. Right. But sometimes they'll have like more than one door. You're like, fuck, do I got it? Yeah.
00:20:20
Speaker
And they're usually like small side rooms with like an enemy, like a one up. It's very similar to like Mario in that sense. Yeah. You're going to have like a little adjacent room. Um, what is cool though, the other thing about a co-op is if your teammate jumps into you in the right way, you can get like a super jump. Not that you ever need it. Cause you can both fucking fly. Yeah. Kirby like sucks up and then flaps his little arms.
00:20:44
Speaker
And this isn't limited flight Kirby either. It's just you can fly. And then the P2, no matter which character they are, they can just like infinitely jump in the exact same way. You're like, cool. But you get the super jump. And then also as you get food, which is a healing item because it nurtures your soul.
00:21:05
Speaker
Right. Naturally. In real life and in the game. Exactly. It speaks to me. Gourmet raise. So like I'd eat like a small cake, candy, or sometimes fruit, if I was feeling healthy. I was going to say, if your food speaks to you, Gordon Ramsay has something to say about it. But like you eat these things and you get your health up and then you'd like bump into your P2 and you would
00:21:33
Speaker
Share that food. It's definitely a mother bird type thing. Yeah, it was a full-on like Snowball of food. Yeah It's it's always cute is like Kissing sound light. It's also it's not even like a sacrifice for stats. You both get full value Yeah, the food which is really like a maximum tomato. I'm like Jake come kiss me. Yeah
00:21:55
Speaker
I actually did like there's the one time not talking about the real life. Yes, I'm talking the game I like was running ahead just like
00:22:06
Speaker
Basically if you have like a friend who just goes spastic you put them on player two because it doesn't matter They'll kill some stuff But I like picked up one of the max max tomatoes and you were actually injured like yeah And you have like a brief period of time to actually share the food. I think it's like a couple seconds. Yeah, you're like, oh god I like it. It's a little nice co-op mechanic to throw in there
00:22:31
Speaker
I agree. Spring breeze though. Yeah. It's got like, uh, three brief levels. They're really fucking short. And then you have the classic. I forget the actual bosses name because I've never needed to know. Yeah. But the tree it's, it's a tree. Yeah. Um, and you just Elmer Fudd, I think.
00:22:52
Speaker
Elder Fudd? What was I thinking, Elm Fudd? There you go. That's the pun I was trying to go for. I just didn't reach the finish line of the Gourmet Race. What's the Dark Souls 3 boss?
00:23:06
Speaker
There's a lot of them rotted great wood. Yeah curse right a great one. Yeah, so you're fighting that You just beat the shit out of it and a lot of these bosses in the old these old games don't really have I Frames you just beat the shit up when you can and this guy is basically a test. So do you know where the attack button? Yeah at worst he will drop apples and
00:23:30
Speaker
Yup. Yeah, we were talking about this as a primary means of defense. It's kind of sad that Kirby's just wailing on this tree whose only defense is that he can attempt to provide food to placate Kirby. You want apple? Here's some apple. Shit didn't even work on Isaac Newton, dude. Isaac Newton chopped down that tree immediately. Even the giving tree, he got fucked up. Yeah. Traditionally, trees have been on the losing side of history.
00:24:00
Speaker
It's all I'm saying. I guess there was a... I mean, Lord of the Rings. That's why I was actually thinking of the trees. Obviously not historical. Yeah. But... For Middle Earth. Maybe trees have a chance. But in real life, we cut that stuff down.
00:24:17
Speaker
Why are we ranting about trees? Because this is R420. No, is it Rweed? It was marijuana enthusiasts. Okay. Yeah. That's the subreddit that's actually about trees. Correct, yeah. That's so good. But yeah, he's a really easy boss. He usually is. And he's like in every game.
00:24:40
Speaker
Yeah, it's not like just like uh, I know that guy makes me even more sad kind of because he's literally the whipping boy of every game before you go off to the last Joe of Super Punch-Out. Yeah There always has to be like a whipping boy. It was like they know what their job is. It's just The characters like this is how you do basic shit. It's just a story of lost pretty much Kirby doesn't even kill him He always just makes him cry. That's literally always the defeat state for the tree. I
00:25:09
Speaker
He never finishes it off. He's just like, I'm going to beat you up till you cry again. Then I'm going to go out there and I'm going to find the next guy. If you ever think you feel good, I'm going to come back here for some choice fucking words. And then like, he finally finds a friend. I'm just developing the lore of this character at this point. Later. There's another boss fight or there's the double trees. He finally finds a friend and Carpies just like, what have you done? Take your both out. Anyway, so that's cannon.
00:25:39
Speaker
But it actually does come back later. So one of the other small games in here is DynaBlade. I forget, it has like a full name. It's got a bird. But basically you're doing more small levels, but you kind of like move through a couple stages to get to DynaBlade. I was just thinking, what if they were all revenge? Revenge of DynaBlade. It's just like Meta Knight's Revenge. DynaBlade's Revenge. Spring Revenge.
00:26:09
Speaker
You still in that revenge? No man, I'm good, no. But yeah. But Dynablades, I think, I think is much more interesting because it technically has a story where like Dynablades being a dick because Dynablades protecting her little bird babies. But... Does that make her a jerk though? Well, I mean, she's being a protective.
00:26:32
Speaker
Mother but like she's attacking other things the curb goes up there to beat some sense into it I don't know if Kirby's the good guy too. We're not developing this narrative wait for the fun part on So dine blades cool cuz it's Layers of sprites and like her head will kind of move out to like pecking attack Oh, yeah, and then she'll like fly off-screen and then her model will kind of come at you Mm-hmm from like the background of the foreground
00:26:59
Speaker
Which they do that in another boss fight as well. I'm like, what the fuck? Yeah, the detachment effect is kind of like like vector man Yeah, it's a really similar effect to that. She's just like a big robot bird basically, right? She were just a normal bird doesn't know. Yeah, but yeah, I don't know why I thought she was a robot. I mean she's in a video games. That's fair.
Reflections on Kirby's Nostalgia and Fun
00:27:18
Speaker
Yeah
00:27:19
Speaker
electronic bird at the very least But after you beat Dynablade you go over to Her little nest. There's like three birds in there. You see Kirby like essentially roll up the sleeves and then they start like Pushing the thing the nest. Yeah, and from every single player who I've played with her talked to it I swear to God it looks like he's going to push it off of that giant mountain you're on. Yeah, like kill the mom kill the kid
00:27:49
Speaker
But he actually you see him push it over to the tree and then he punches the tree again very rudely But then the tree then drops apples for the baby birds to eat. Yeah It would have actually been funny if he subverted that whole thing where you're just like but in reality in this case It looks like her he's gonna kill the baby birds. He pushes them like over and then he he does kill them. Yeah I don't think a Mario 64 penguin situation, you know, yeah
00:28:17
Speaker
One more penguin that I made. Oh man. Yeah, it's actually really cute, cute scene though. I don't understand Kirby's like relationship with nature, but.
00:28:29
Speaker
I think he's... I shrugged. I guess you guys didn't see that. I swear he has to be like part guardian because he's always like chillin with like cute things that live in the forest for the most part. Yeah. He's kind of like a sprightly nature. He seems like he's a part of the wood. But then you just go murder things constantly. Right. Keep the wood on their toes.
00:28:51
Speaker
Like there is like little small chicken enemies, which only hurts you if you run into them. Right. But you suck them up and then like you be like, give me that power and it's nothing. No good. It's like a little, the party ball from Smash, what is that called? I'm not sure what the party ball is.
00:29:09
Speaker
I probably know what the power up is. I don't know what the well, it's just like a ball like goes up and it cracks open It's always like a little fortune cookie wrapper of like get fucked man. It doesn't give you a power, right? And he just kills those I mean, I guess I kill them constantly. Yeah, I don't know if Kirby's the monster if it's the players but Well, really making me
00:29:30
Speaker
Look hard on myself here. Yeah, that's it's it's solid in Dynablade establishes continuity for the rest of the story, which is something I wasn't necessarily expecting.
00:29:42
Speaker
Yeah, because they actually have certain games within the game locked. You have to do an order. So after you actually complete DynaBlade, it opens up one of the poorest box arts of Meta Knight's Revenge. It's so good. I feel like everything there is kind of drawn like.
00:30:04
Speaker
the original Mega Man box art. It was like, it was MS Paint and he tried, I guess. Yeah. It's really good though. I like like Meta Knight's Revenge. It kind of like is evocative of Star Fox to me in a certain extent. You've got all these characters talking in dialogue. I mean, it's also just an RPG, right? Yeah. But I think it's just the fact that they're on a ship makes me think of Star Fox. That's the only association. The great ship Halbrid.
00:30:33
Speaker
Yeah. Um, which, uh, is makes maybe a reference to the company made the game. She's like, how, how? Yeah. Um, it's just the, the characters are all like Meta Knight's minions and Meta Knight himself, or his lieutenants, I guess is probably a more congenial way to say it. Um, and they just have the greatest facial expressions.
00:30:59
Speaker
Yeah, it goes full anyway for a lot of things. As Kirby is slowly destroying the ship, you see them bursting into tears and stuff like, what? And everyone's afraid of Kirby. But at the same time, they don't respect him. Because they're like, we'll just shoot him with a giant gun. Oh, he's only under the ship. And then Kirby's like, and it turns fucking shit off. There we go.
00:31:23
Speaker
Well, that was bad. Kirby is like in entirely. And I just I love this representation of Kirby. He doesn't know what he's doing. He just goes left to right and kills things. But he's a force of nature. Yes. And they realize it. They're just like, all right, we think that he's reached this area and then like explosions start happening. It's kind of like
00:31:56
Speaker
You know in the Incredibles how Jack Jack has powers. Oh, yeah, you see Credibles too. I didn't I see I saw one But he does develop his powers at the end of one. Yeah So like into and again, this is a trope that's been done somewhere. Mm-hmm It's a lot of like Trying to be like control the disaster and like yeah, all right You stay here don't get into anything and then like it just explosions are going off I
00:32:13
Speaker
I'm trying to think what the actual trope would be.
00:32:23
Speaker
just trying to like navigate it in a way and like they don't know yeah and curvy is kind of like that yeah curvy is entirely like that um and eventually they do like knock you off of the ship i also like this from a storytelling standpoint um or like we're talking about trips a little bit this is one of those trips which is like
00:32:43
Speaker
start the protagonist or the main character relatively well progressed into their, their goal and then have them suffer a setback and their path becomes reattaining their goal, rereaching that mountain to finally like climate. Um, and so that's literally Kirby starting on that at night ship for the first level. And then you get blown off by like an air cannon or something. Well, I think, I think the ship actually just takes off. That's what it was. Yeah. And then.
00:33:14
Speaker
you get like a warp star to be like, I'm going back on that ship. And then they shoot you.
00:33:21
Speaker
And then your buddy DynaBlade gives you a ride back. And that time you're actually on. Yeah. If this was like, uh, one of the more punishing kind of Nintendo games or SNES games, there would have been like, they would have unlocked this level first. And then if you made it to the end, they'd be like, oh, if only you had a bird friend to like make it to the ship. That's like, you're like, okay, well, I guess we'll do other content and then come back and replay the level and get the bid. Um.
00:33:50
Speaker
But it's a it's a cool level. It's got a lot of personality. The characters are great. I think one of the one of the exchanges I really liked is I think it's the second or third time I guess you're on the ship and Kirby's just is like wrecking the wings. He's like, oh, no, they're like the left wing is taking so much damage. Like we're like, we've lost balance. And then Kirby destroys the other wings. Like the right wing is taking all this damage. We've regained balance.
00:34:20
Speaker
As you slowly plummet It's just the best it's just that childlike Entertainment value and humor that is just it's freaking good. It has that right amount of charm. I'd say mm-hmm. Yeah And I don't know it's not as He's not badass in this one as much. Yeah, cuz he's like has dialogue and he just seems like a nice boss if anything. Mm-hmm
00:34:49
Speaker
He's like, I'll go fight Kirby myself. They're like, you guys abandoned the ship. And they're like, no, we'll stay and fight. And he's like, you guys. And you kill all of them.
00:35:03
Speaker
Yeah, these are like relatively developed characters at this point. They're the only ones with Dialog. But then it's like some generic enemies, he just murdered them. Yeah, Kirby is the bad guy, I'm pretty sure. Yeah, he might be. But then you actually get to fight Meta Knight.
00:35:22
Speaker
He hits you with the side Bs. Spams that move out a bunch. I do like, though, when the fight starts, Meta Knight's kind of, like, up in the corner, like, being a badass. And then there's a sword in the middle, and the game's, like, literally blinking, saying, take this. So you pick up the sword, Meta Knight draws his cloak around himself and kind of, like, disappears, and then, like, fades down to, like, the combat area. And you guys have, like, a sword off.
00:35:53
Speaker
Meanwhile, Jake's like beating the shit up and I'm like, Jake, help me. Yeah. No, it's, it's really cool. I had a nice one of the cooler characters in the Kirby universe. Whoa. Cooler, not coolist. I'm just saying. They do have DDD and I think he was in an early like spring breeze or something. Yeah. He didn't, he wasn't, he wasn't a boss, was he? No, he was the last boss spring breeze. The tree was like the mid boss because you go up to DDD's castle.
00:36:22
Speaker
We must've aperized him. Oh yeah, I remember the hammer. Yeah. Yeah. We just knew, like, a lot of these bosses die really quickly if you have two people DPSing them. Cause no iframes, so just... yup.
00:36:36
Speaker
Real quick, I want to do a tangent to some of the powers. You can get his Kirby. Right. Because every time we talk about Meta Knight's Revenge, I always think of like two things. One, yo-yo. Yo-yo's fucking great. Okay. Great range on it. Yo-yo. Jay, what up?
00:36:57
Speaker
You can throw it out, you can throw it up. You can do like this. This might be how Kirby uses it. You can use like a really cool like spin vertically thing where like you push off the ground. It's like a running dash attack. It's solid.
00:37:16
Speaker
Yeah, so the other one I know you jotted down was the the tire wheelie. Yeah, I actually really like the concept of the tire Because like you you get introduced to it like relatively early Well before it the the final segment and the tires just like
00:37:34
Speaker
I don't think Kirby can turn into a tire if he has the power, can he? He can. He can? Okay. We just didn't use it. You always gave it to me, I guess. Well, for good reason. Yeah. So you can stand there on the ground and Kirby will jump up. You can jump up on the tire and player two can just like speed through the rest of the level, jumping over ledges and stuff. And it's, it's actually pretty freaking great. But also as Kirby, I can shoot out little projectiles too.
00:38:02
Speaker
Yeah it's basically the equivalent of like a spin dash or something like that in Sonic where it's like here's the section where you're supposed to actually go fast and you get to do that with the tire which is pretty legit and it's more responsibility than player two has literally anywhere else in the game. Yeah and I get to be chauffeured which I like too.
00:38:21
Speaker
Yeah. After you've defeated Meta Knight at the end, there's a final finale where you think you're forced into the tire for player two. You are. Like the ship's going down. It was kind of like a bit of a countdown and like any music from the game kind of stops. Yeah. You just shoot like the countdown.
00:38:43
Speaker
And then you go off and then like some eerie music starts and then like demon Meta Knight shows up and he's like flying around while you're like escaping the exploding ship. Yeah. You know, he's going super fast and it's kind of just an accelerated, um,
00:39:00
Speaker
No one's going to get this. It's like the race against Metal Sonic and Sonic CD. Yeah. I guess any race against Metal Sonic. As you didn't say Sonic R, I'm like, you lost me. But yeah, Sonic R also, I guess. Not as much, but it is like a speed-through. We should do Sonic R. We should do Sonic R after the next episode. Or for the next episode, we'll see.
00:39:29
Speaker
But it's cool. There's a lot of gaps you need to jump over and some enemies you can avoid. Meta Knight's being like a buzzy little bee and speed hacking his way up to you, which he is wont to do. Meta Knight's always kind of had like, what abilities do we need him to have right now? What kind of god ninja is he today? And then he just does that.
00:39:56
Speaker
What's that like anime thing where it's just like, this isn't even my final form. That's literally just Meta Knight. I mean, he literally is a defender of the Meta. It is, it is just Meta Knight. But yeah, you escape in the end and there's this dramatic, like his ship crashes into the sea and Kirby and is it just Kirby actually at the end?
00:40:20
Speaker
Or do you get your ally there as well? I mean, you're still on the tire. Yeah. Whether it's AI or player control. Cause you pull a turn on the one wheel. That's the thing. It's a one wheel. Like that cool, like, like the slide break, but you're on one fucking wheel. It's not like he really has like legs to put that. It's kind of like, oh, like a foot. I don't know what the fuck it is. It's just, it was very like, I see what you're going for, but what?
00:40:47
Speaker
It's really cool though. I think that's the coolest level that we played. I really like Meta Knight's Revenge. It's got narrative where the rest of the game didn't have it so much, or implied narrative in the case of Dino Blade.
Kirby's Powers and Strategies
00:41:00
Speaker
But Meta Knight's Revenge really had you playing as bad guy Kirby.
00:41:06
Speaker
Yeah. And I love the music for it too. I think Mennonite's theme, probably my favorite. Yeah. Back in the day, I used, I lived in my parents' space pretty much. Right. Because that's where the CRT was. I lived with my parents back when I was a kid. Oh, you too in high school? Wow.
00:41:27
Speaker
But the same CRT I have in my living room now is the one I grew up with. Right. And because of the CRT, they had like the individual video and then the two audio inputs. Right, the RCA cables.
00:41:39
Speaker
And when Kirby Air Ride came out for GameCube, there was an option where you could like play music from Kirby things. Right. Like a jukebox thing or something? Yeah. Kind of like, hey, you have the song now. I'm like, oh, nice. So I put on Meta Knight's Revenge, which is a pretty hype song. But for the video.
00:42:00
Speaker
I'd set up the VCR and put in like Tybo tapes with Billy Blanks. Yeah. So I'd be like doing like these triple punches and kicks as like a little kid. It won't like jam it out to like Meta Knight. You've literally got your like youngster training montage set up. That's freaking legit.
00:42:17
Speaker
I was so happy and like, what if I just removed this one and put this here? This is so much better. No, that's that is actually legit. That's just a precursor to modern exercising, where it's like you have a phone and like Bluetooth earbuds or something. I guess it doesn't even have to be precursor to modern. People have had cassette players and headphones for forever, but. Yeah, no, I get that. I completely get that.
00:42:48
Speaker
Thanks for understanding
00:43:06
Speaker
Great Cape Offensive, which my cousin and I would also play the shit out of because it's still Kirby, but it's a collect-a-thon at the same time because hidden throughout all these different areas.
00:43:21
Speaker
There's like 40 or something treasures you can get. Yeah. Yeah. If you miss one, like there's a spot in your pause menu. It's like, Hey, this is blank shit. Yeah. This is where you suck and you don't like the Kirby suck.
00:43:38
Speaker
In that you're playing the doll where you'd like to be so But yeah, you don't have to get them all yeah, but it's like a rite of passage mm-hmm and my cousin just knew where they all were and For a lot of the things it's you needed to have two players right and not just the AI Because you have to step on certain buttons open a door right and then you have to like have these little timing sequences and the AI is just like
00:44:24
Speaker
I'm a I'm a sness AI. I'm not I'm not gonna do that And my favorite treasure was always the zebra mask because I think it's supposed to be the same mask that Meta Knight has okay, but I guess the zebra mask is more split colors kind of like black and white But I like that style of mask where it's like split down the middle and then has like the the eye holes kind of like masquerade would also kind of like a
00:44:51
Speaker
Vega from Street Fighter. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And I thought that shit was like so badass Vegas basically like a budget Wolverine, right? Like that's kind of his thing Yeah, I mean like he's Spanish and like he has like these I'm gesturing with my hands. Yeah, I forgot they're not They are not katars. But yeah, no, that's a country. I Think it is a cut like a TAR. Yeah
00:45:21
Speaker
I think I could be right because like you slide your hands into it and then like off of your hands and wrists or like these blades Right kind of like what um, Waldo has their illegal biking gloves Yes Yeah I'll be honest. I'm not completely caught up on my is he Street Fighter, right? Where's the Mortal Kombat Vegas Street Fighter? Hmm
00:45:47
Speaker
Baraka has wrist blades. They're like bones. Yeah, that's that's a hundred percent budget over in them Yeah
00:46:01
Speaker
What was your favorite treasure in here? Favorite treasure? Great cave offensive. I don't know. I don't actually have a favorite treasure. They did have a lot of references to other games and things like that, both as treasures and, um, yeah, there's like a Triforce or something. Yeah. They've had like a bunch of interesting things.
00:46:20
Speaker
They had that you you told me about the the stone upgrade and the rare chance that you get some of the other characters when you're transforming Oh, yeah, so switch switch of context Jake's talking about the stone power up in Kirby. Mm-hmm
00:46:35
Speaker
Where if you use it you turn into a rock? Yeah, if you're above somebody you become invincible and just like drop down due to gravity Yeah, but you switch between like an eight ton weight A rock. Yeah, like two other things are pretty common
00:46:53
Speaker
Then he had a rare chance to get one of the rare, um, rarerities. Such as a bodybuilder was the one we got, which was like a tall guy, which is pretty cool. Apparently also Mario and, um, Samus exist. I've seen Mario. Yeah. That's a really rare one. I did not know that Samus was an option. Yeah. I read about that one after the fact.
00:47:17
Speaker
Not that patient I guess yeah, I never saw it as a kid it takes a while Just mashing that so then I would see it briefly and then I've already switched off some mashing the button Yeah, exactly. That's that's the issue But they should have like a chozo statue hmm Missed opportunity. Yeah, I cry get back on that and the they already remade this game once I think
00:47:43
Speaker
Yeah, there's like a superstar ultra. Yeah, plus plus. That should be the new one. Plus ultra. There you go. Oh, is that the kid being hit? So because that was very accurate to the kid beat it. No, that was just me being excited about the the music that we use for that other video. Yeah, we've used a lot of music for a lot of videos. The one we did on hot. We've had two videos, Jake. Yeah. Oh, you mean hot lava.
00:48:11
Speaker
So you said video, my brain literally interpreted it as like episodes or clips or something like that. You're correct. We've only had two videos. Jake, have you been, have you been filming? I just got a bunch of cassette tape or a video VHS tapes of a constant feed of your apartment. I'm sorry about those things that I do.
00:48:36
Speaker
Yeah, that's probably my favorite, favorite minigame, though. Second to that would be Milky Way Wishes, which is another kind of adventure. Well, like standard gameplay series of levels, but with the special caveat or caveat.
00:48:58
Speaker
which is the incorrect way to say it. That instead of just copying an ability from an enemy and then, you know, like losing it, if you get wasted or replacing it with a new ability, they'll have these pedestals that are kind of like special shiny glowy versions of the standard pedestals where you can get copy powers.
00:49:20
Speaker
And it basically gives you the ability to switch between powers at will, which is really cool. And it canonically makes no sense. Kirby can't do that, so. Yeah, game's busted. So what's your favorite power? Favorite power? Out of obviously Kirby superstar options. Yeah, I mean, I got a maybe like a couple options here. I like the bomb for consistency.
00:49:49
Speaker
Bombers just it's match the button super freakin basic, but it's a reliable projectile Has like a reasonable hitbox really easy to land Like multiple modes you can throw that from to like hit people in the air on the ground, whatever But I also really like the the pincer the insect one because you like judo Yeah, you suplex people which is freaking great But it's probably worthless versus bosses
00:50:19
Speaker
Yeah, cuz you can't grab and The last one that I really liked was um The sword was good, but I really like the the fire the fire Flame kind of wall you can put out the series of projectiles. What is that? It's from the I think it's from model D or something like that beam. It's called beam. Yes Like a little beam. Yeah, if you charge it you're like Yes
00:50:45
Speaker
You can be like a fireball for a bit run on the do a dash attack Well, um, am I confusing out with another power beams dash attack actually sends out like a little Like a little bubble thing. Hmm interesting Maybe I'm confusing that with another but those are probably my favorite powers that I like there There's a lot of like situational ones or ones that were like slightly less exciting. Um
00:51:12
Speaker
I wasn't as, I liked the look of, uh, Chile, Chile's power, um, and the frost, but it's like such short range. I feel like that limits it a lot. Um, what powers did you like?
00:51:28
Speaker
Brief interruption, one thing I love is that every single power seems to have a grab move, where if you do an attack close enough, like with yo-yo, which I said I already said I'd fucking love. Yeah. Okay. Like you kind of attach the yo-yo to them and like you throw them out and slam them into the ground. Hmm. Parasol, I think is probably my number one. Really? Interesting.
00:51:51
Speaker
If you jump up and you float down, it's the cutest thing because like the wind just takes you and you're on the little umbrella. If you attack with it, it technically hits twice because the umbrella goes out and then it shoots out some stars. I know how much you appreciate abilities that have like residual stars with hit boxes. Somebody solved it like playing Dedede in Smash.
00:52:18
Speaker
Yeah. Actually, a lot of his stuff too came from Kirby. Yeah. I mean, obviously. So not, not super, super smash bros originally from.
00:52:33
Speaker
but like the the down B hammer where he like charges it up yeah um if you actually have hammer i was watching somebody do a playthrough you can actually do like a down upswing that has like a flame on him like holy shit that's where that's from huh interesting
00:52:49
Speaker
So like certain things obviously went into Kirby, like Kirby's dash attack. He does like the running fireball. Yeah. And his side B is like, it's that hammer. And you're like, oh shit. Yeah. Kirby's got, maybe it is canon that Kirby can have multiple abilities at a time because he definitely doesn't smash. Well, he can switch between. He's got cutter on like a lot of his attacks. He's got stone all the time. I really like Knuckle Joe also. Knuckle Joe is pretty good.
00:53:18
Speaker
We were talking about how some of these characters have personality and like actual names and other ones are just not named. Sword. Well, sword is the power. The character's name is Sir Kibble. Sir Kibble is a pretty good name. Is it a dog? Because if it's not a dog, yeah, it's kind of a missed opportunity there. Huh.
00:53:45
Speaker
Yeah, you get like a kind of home run credit sequence, right? Where it's like, hey, here's all of the characters after Meta Knight's Revenge completion. It's like, these are all their names and things and their powers, which is pretty cool.
00:54:01
Speaker
Kirby's not like a complicated formula. What? For what it is, but it's just fun. I think a lot of it is the music. Oh yeah. The art design's cute, and then all the music is very upbeat, or it's very chill. Yeah. It's like, doo doo doo doo doo doo doo, and you're like, yeah, today's gonna be good. It's just, it's only slightly hampered by like how much absolute carnage Kirby is inflicting upon the world, but
00:54:30
Speaker
Yeah, you know. Yeah, sure. Can't win them all.
00:54:35
Speaker
I was thinking about this since Sakurai made Kirby originally when he was 19 and then went on to make Super Smash Bros. And then eventually Ultimate and in World of Light, Kirby is the only one that escapes Galim in the intro. Interesting. That's some pretty blatant favoritism there, Sakurai.
00:55:02
Speaker
as I know you listen to our podcast, which is primarily... Friend of the show! Friend of the show, Zachary. It's actually kind of funny. I was reading his Wikipedia article a while back because I was like, I should know more about this person. And he was actually, he expressed some thoughts of being burnt out, like exhausted or stressed out, like game development and stuff. He's like, I may quit.
00:55:30
Speaker
Like soon and then there's like no other content in his Wikipedia article until like and then smash ultimate was released It's freaking great. Oh, well, he's just staying in a job for a while. You know, it kind of burns him out. What's that like?
00:55:50
Speaker
I don't know. But, uh, yeah, Kirby's always a solid game. If, if crystal shards were shorter, I would love to cover crystal shards, but it is a pretty lengthy RPG like experience. Yeah. Not like Paper Mario, which is like even further impossible for us to talk about here, but.
00:56:09
Speaker
But the cool thing is that neither of us have a Super Nintendo, obviously. Yeah. Because those are limited and kind of janky at certain times. But we use the trusty old Z-SNES to emulate the game. I did use a different one this time, so we could use both controllers.
00:56:27
Speaker
A slightly different Z-SNES. But it was really cool because like, Jake had me, player one, I'm like, these controls suck. He's like, oh, just change your mappings. Yeah. Done. Done. So it was nice to get that old classing experience. But as it turns out, an Xbox controller does not map one to one with SNES. But you can make it work. Xbox controllers work with anything.
00:56:54
Speaker
How are you making me do that? Yeah. Well, anything else about Kirby that you wish to speak of? Do you like the character? You like how angry he is in America? Yeah. Yeah, me too. Japan makes him too soft. Yeah. It doesn't reflect his attitude in the games at all for his mindlessly slaughtering thousands of beings.
Kirby's Aggressive Nature - A Humorous Outro
00:57:22
Speaker
He's just a very violent character. He's just trying to eat. He's me. He doesn't even eat though. He's like, does it provide sustenance when Kirby eats people? Cause presumably he eats food too, right? Like it doesn't, he doesn't get a power from food. Well, I think he's eating people from a more primal need to absorb their essence.
00:57:45
Speaker
Side note, this kind of reminds me of like a certain plot line near Automata. But, huh. Yeah. So anyways, think about it. Stay woke. I'll get back to you. Back to you on that. Oh man. Well, as always, thank you for listening to us. And this episode of soapstone, as always,
00:58:12
Speaker
Thank you for listening to us on this episode of Soapstone. You can send your feedback to us at facebook.com slash Soapstone podcast or directly to us if you don't like talking to other people at Soapstone podcast at gmail.com. We also just recently have started setting up a thing. So if you are praying, we actually get those now. So if you pray to us at Soapstone podcast at gmail.com, we can pray back to you. That's convenient.
00:58:41
Speaker
Well, I mean it probably goes through God first. Okay, so he's got like this filter in place. Yeah, so don't Don't send us hate mail. He hates that God will see it kind of literally in this case Bye Boy sure is nice weather outside
00:59:11
Speaker
Oh, hey Dave, how's it going? Oh, hey Jake. Really nice day today. Yeah, it's a little bit windy though. Yeah, sure is. It's just wonderful. Dave, I think it's picking up. It is, I feel like I'm losing my footing, Jake. There's a giant pink figure behind you, it's eclipsing the sun. Oh my God, it's curving me. Oh God, oh God. He's eating him, he's eating him.
00:59:40
Speaker
Did he leave me? Oh my god!