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The Final Step We Miss In Forgiveness #SermonSlice
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In this week's #SermonSlice, we unpack what Ridley preached about on Friday when he said "We can’t have forgiveness if the offending party does not confess and choose to receive forgiveness".
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Transcript
Introduction to Forgiveness with Pastor Ridley Barron
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome back to the Grove Hill Church podcast. I'm Dan Sanchez. I'm joined again by Pastor Ridley Barron for our sermon slice series. This past Sunday, Ridley covered finding faith to forgive in the story of Joseph. And I wanted to dive deeper with Ridley on this topic of forgiveness, because you said a few things that I'm like, whoo, that's new. That's a fresh
00:00:21
Speaker
take, and so I want to dive into it. The first one being, and we might even spend the whole, whole podcast on this one thing.
Does Forgiveness Require Confession?
00:00:28
Speaker
We'll see how far we get before diving into the second one. But this first one was the idea that we can't have forgiveness if the offending party does not confess or choose to receive the forgiveness.
00:00:40
Speaker
Which is interesting to me is I've always heard like, you know, forgiveness is like a prison that you put yourself in that doesn't affect the other party at all. So you might as well forgive them to get out of get out of jail, you know, because you're putting yourself in a mental jail. And I've certainly heard. I mean, if you're if you've been in the faith a while, you've probably heard some I've heard some sessions on forgiveness before. And this is
00:01:00
Speaker
This is a common thing and an important one because we often find ourselves there. Even if we know the topic, we can still find ourselves in unforgiveness because it's a common thing. We get offended and we get mad at someone and we forget to forgive them or have to re-forgive them. I've heard it, but it's the first time I've ever heard someone come at it from this
Attitude vs. Transaction in Forgiveness
00:01:19
Speaker
angle. Tell me about how did you arrive at this conclusion?
00:01:25
Speaker
being honest on the front end of this, this was a bumpy journey for me personally, because like you, I've heard the story of forgiveness is for us. Forgiveness releases our hearts from bitterness.
00:01:35
Speaker
So let me be clear to say that what I said doesn't diminish the importance of that. There is the personal aspect of having that attitude of forgiveness towards people who have offended us. And I think for me, when you filter all this out, that's where it settled was that there's a difference between having an attitude of forgiveness, which we all should have as followers of Christ Jesus versus the completed transaction of forgiveness.
00:02:01
Speaker
Um, so, um, began to dig in, began to read a lot of different opinions, uh, different scholars, different commentaries, uh, even a couple of just websites, you know, guys offering their thoughts on it. Uh, we even got into some pretty, I won't call them heated, but some pretty good, adamant conversations around the conference table at staff meeting. And I love that kind of stuff, you know, just bouncing ideas and thoughts off of each other. Uh, at the end of the day, I think even the ones who thought they disagreed with this opinion,
00:02:30
Speaker
Really did agree. They just didn't understand how this all fleshed out. It's all in the nuance, right? Yeah. Yeah, really. So in fact, yesterday at staff meeting, I asked one of them who said, I'm still a little fuzzy on this. I said, let me ask you this.
00:02:44
Speaker
When did you receive forgiveness from Jesus? And she said, when I asked him to be my savior and Lord, I said, and that started with the idea of confession and repentance, right? She said, yes. I said, so in other words, your forgiveness didn't start the day that Jesus died for you because you hadn't received it yet. It started on the date that you said to Jesus, I receive what you're giving to me. So that's when your forgiveness began. And that's really the, the,
00:03:11
Speaker
The gist of it, that's the reality behind the transaction of forgiveness. I can offer Dan Sanchez a gift all day long for a week, but until Dan takes it into his hands, he can't actually say that he has received this gift. And, you know, it's kind of painting with a fine brush, you know.
00:03:32
Speaker
But the attitude of forgiveness is what we're commanded in Scripture, where Jesus says to us that we should have, well actually it's Paul who says to us, you should have the same attitude of Christ Jesus to forgive those of their wrongs, just like you've been forgiven of your wrongs by Jesus Christ. So that's the attitude. We should always be willing to offer that. And again, that helps us with our condition of our heart.
00:03:56
Speaker
But the transaction of forgiveness is something that isn't really truly complete until somebody says, I received this because I confess and acknowledge that I need it.
Personal Stories of Forgiveness and Reconciliation
00:04:06
Speaker
So let's walk through an example of this of maybe you've had a business partner who cheated me out of a deal and I'm bitter towards them and they walked away with a lot of money. I, and of course I'm a Christian. I'm trying to like overcome the anger and the bitterness. Otherwise it's going to, I mean, it's going to affect me every time. And anything I see that reminds me of that person is going to bring it back and Ooh, I'm going to fill it again. It's going to be something that just eats away at my heart like acid, right? Yes.
00:04:34
Speaker
I can forgive them and I can work on forgiving them over and over again and actually come to a place of forgiveness. But you're saying that forgiveness hasn't actually happened until they confess about what they did. Right. I mean, think about your example. Let's say that your business partner is having lunch one day and you see him at a table and you walk over and you sit down and practicing Matthew 18, assuming he's another brother in Christ.
00:05:00
Speaker
But practicing Matthew 18, you sit down with him and say, Hey, I need to let you know that what you did offended me or hurt me. And I'd like to talk to you about it. The whole goal of forgiveness in every situation, the whole goal is reconciliation. Let's mend the relationship. So Dan says that to him and he looks at you and says, I don't have any idea what you're talking about. I don't think I did anything wrong. Well, you don't have, you don't have finality to that. There's no closure for you because
00:05:26
Speaker
He hasn't asked for forgiveness and you can't force it on him, right? You can't force his response. So the next day you see him at the same restaurant, you go sit down and say, Hey, just want to let you know, even what you did yesterday was offensive. And I think you need to reconsider. And he goes, you know what? Overnight I was thinking about it and you're exactly right. I had a little bit of pride yesterday. I want to tell you, I think I did you wrong and I would like to ask for your forgiveness. Well, at that moment it's an entirely different feeling because now the transaction has been completed.
00:05:56
Speaker
Yeah. So it's what you're saying is you could, you should still work towards those things, but you should still work towards reconciliation. Absolutely. If possible, there might never come a time when that person admits to what they did was wrong and actually asked for forgiveness, but you can still forgive them though the transaction isn't complete. Yes. Yes. And when I said that on Sunday, it may have been, you know, you appreciate three times in a row, it may not have been,
00:06:25
Speaker
communicated as clearly as that in one of those services. But, you know, we use the illustration in all three services. Sunday, if somebody came up and offered me a check for $1,000 and I said, you know, that's really kind, but I'm not going to take it, then he can't truly say I gave him $1,000 because I didn't receive it. I rejected that. However, he can say I offered him $1,000.
00:06:48
Speaker
So going back to your example, you could clearly say to my business, to your business partner, I've offered you forgiveness. I've had an attitude of forgiveness, just like Christ has compelled me to do. But until you receive it, it's not a complete transaction.
00:07:02
Speaker
Man, it reminds me, I remember the first major sermon I heard, not his sermon, it was a story I heard about forgiveness, was a friend of mine who was engaged to someone in college and then cheated on him with his best friend, engaged. And then he was his RA in his dorm room because it was a Christian college. He was the one responsible for making sure he was in his bed early because they had obviously committed adultery together. And he slammed the door in his face like, yeah, and she was great, bam.
00:07:30
Speaker
BAM every night he's like walking through forgiveness years later like my friend had to overcome forgiveness towards both of them his best friend and his his Fiance, obviously that was broken off years later. He Had someone kept trying to call him and then hanging up Found out it was the guy. Oh, well, you're talking decades later. I
00:07:53
Speaker
found his number and had been holding onto it for decades. My friend had forgiven him long ago, but he was still stuck in the prison of what he did. And eventually he finally, I think he knew who was calling for some reason and he's like, is that you? He's like, yeah.
00:08:10
Speaker
and they had reconciliation decades later, but because my friend had forgiven him, and believe me, he's like that seven times 77 thing, it's actually way more than that. You can imagine in a situation like that, forgiveness took a lot more than seven times 77. Absolutely. It took more than 400-ish forgivenesses. It took thousands of moments. So they had a reconciliation there, but with the woman,
00:08:35
Speaker
He actually saw her on the day his first child was born. She was a nurse in that hospital and he caught a sight of her. Yeah. And he's like, because I had forgiven her, I saw her and it didn't ruin that first day of that moment with my first child. It would have. But you know, she never I don't think she ever came around to getting reconciliation. And now, unfortunately, between the three of them, two of them had found found resolution, but she probably still holds on to that till this day.
00:09:05
Speaker
Well, first of all, thanks for sharing that story because I think it's a perfect example of what we're talking about here. Okay. Let's talk about your friend's feelings. Forgiveness for both of them. Okay. And again, forgiveness is not a feeling. It's a decision you make. So I guarantee you along this process, there were many days he didn't feel like forgiving them, but he knew it was the right thing to do.
00:09:24
Speaker
If you were to sit him down as part of this podcast today and go, how are your feelings on the day before the guy called you and finally got through versus the day after? And he would have told you there was something different because now the transaction has gone the full length. It's been completed.
00:09:41
Speaker
Um, in a small, I mean, like a very small way. Can you imagine, isn't that what Jesus feels when he says, I offer all of the world forgiveness, every single one of you without question, if you'll just receive it. And then the joy he gets when Ridley Barron goes, I'll take it. I need it. I acknowledge I need it. There's a little bit of that same feeling we feel when we do the right thing, we offer the forgiveness.
00:10:07
Speaker
And now a relationship is reconciled and restored. By the same token, you ask him the same feelings towards that girl, he would probably say, you know what, there's still something there that's not right because we know the relationship has still got some awkwardness and brokenness to it. And it won't ever be fixed until she chooses to acknowledge her wrongdoing.
00:10:27
Speaker
That's it.
Forgiveness, Salvation, and Biblical Texts
00:10:28
Speaker
It's funny. I was actually reading John three 16 today. And if you read the rest of that passage, it's like, yes, for God so loved the world that he gave his only son that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have eternal life. And some people would read that and be like, well, he gave his only son. Everybody has eternal life because he's forgiven the whole world. But then you read the rest of the chapter and it tells a little bit of a different, Oh, my page just closed. I'm like, where'd it go? It tells a little bit of a, I'm opening back up on,
00:10:56
Speaker
Bible gateway here yeah a little bit of a different story because then it goes into uh Let's see whoever believes in him who is is not condemned and then it says And this is the judgment that the light has come into the world and people love the darkness rather than the light because of their evil Because their works were evil for everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light lest his work should be exposed but whoever does
00:11:20
Speaker
What is true if what is true comes to the light? So that may be clearly seen that his works have been carried out by God essentially He's talking about those who stole linger and wickedness those who lean linger like it is something you have to accept you do have to repent and change otherwise You still love the darkness and you want to stay there and they'll be exposed and
00:11:44
Speaker
Well, that's why we went and Sunday during the sermon, we went to those if then passages that we showed one from Second Chronicles, the other being from first John one night, where in the Old Testament and in the New Testament, it clearly says that if we will do something, then God will gladly give us forgiveness. But until we do that, it's not that he can't. Well, actually, it is because he can't, because as we pointed out,
00:12:08
Speaker
If God just randomly forgives us without us confessing and acknowledging it, then what he's doing is excusing our sin, not forgiving it. He's excusing it. And once he does that, then he stops being a holy God. So because we come to him and say, my confession is, yes, I sinned. My repentance is I acknowledge that you're God and I have a need for you to turn my life around.
00:12:32
Speaker
Then in that moment, what happens is the blood of Christ now covers that cost. And man, that's the only way we get the real forgiveness that we're seeking.
00:12:44
Speaker
It ties in nice to the nice topic I wanted to talk about because you hit on it. Normally, when you talk about forgiveness, you talk about the transaction between people. There's also this thing between you and God. You mentioned it a couple of times in the sermon, which is, can we disqualify ourselves from God's forgiveness? Which is kind of a different topic more than forgiveness. It's like, how do I know if I'm saved? Kind of a conversation.
00:13:08
Speaker
It all falls under a very fancy word we use called soteriology, which is the study of salvation. A lot of questions that fall under the study of salvation, and one of them is this question, in a very primitive way, it's usually expressed to them, once saved, always saved. You know, can I ever outrun the grace of God? And for me, am I understanding or reading scripture? No. The Bible in the New Testament is very clear that salvation, when it's true, when you receive the forgiveness of God, is a
00:13:38
Speaker
for everything. It's not based on our performance at that point because if it were then we
00:13:46
Speaker
would have the ability to earn it and also therefore the ability to lose it because of our lack of performance. So it's always the fancy Latin phrase, solute de gloria and all those things, all the solos, by grace alone, through faith alone, for God alone, those kinds of things. Well, the phrase for by grace alone, through faith alone, lets us know that it's based on the completed work that Christ has done for us, not because of what our ability to do, anything.
00:14:13
Speaker
So if we live in unrepentant sin, we can't disqualify ourselves from salvation if our salvation was true. I do not think so. So here's where I have grown even myself in this understanding. Because growing up, you grow in your faith. You learn a lot of things. And early on, I would ask that question. Well, if I'm saved and there's nothing
00:14:35
Speaker
Well, what's, what keeps me from going out and just committing murder after murder? Cause I'm already saved. It's sealed. How do I, why is that an issue? Well, there's a lot of explanations. Uh, it could be that the, the original emotional thing was not an actual salvation experience. It was instead of an emotional experience. So there was no legitimacy to it. Uh, it could be that I indeed was saved in that moment. And like the story of the prodigal son, I have wandered away. Um, but.
00:15:03
Speaker
have yet to be recalled and come back to my senses. The beauty of that story is that all the way through the story, the son is always still referred to as a son. He never loses his position before the father, even when he's far away country spending all his money. The third thing here that I began to understand is, and this is something we don't talk a lot about, we like to talk about our rewards in heaven. We're gonna get rewarded for good things that we do. I do think there is a reward system in heaven, and I think there's also a lack of rewards for
00:15:33
Speaker
okay Ridley decided to live his whole life according to his plan after he got saved well then we're going to take a few jewels away from his crown or maybe we're going to put his mansion on the outskirts of Jerusalem or you know whatever uh i don't know what all that you know
00:15:47
Speaker
filters out to be, but I do believe that when you have a genuine awakening by the Holy Spirit to God and what he has done for you through Jesus Christ, that that is a sealed deal. It's sealed by the person of the Holy Spirit in your heart. And that even people who do go off and do sin, there's still something inside of them that
00:16:08
Speaker
nudges them as their conscience and says, you're missing the mark. You may ignore it, may choose never to come back to it, but yeah, it's there.
Judgment, Accountability, and Faith
00:16:19
Speaker
The two ways I've seen this conversation frame before, it's like you're either in two camps and there's like this messy middle camp that I get nervous about sometimes. One is either you can lose your salvation, you can walk away, you know, recant, or just start living in a way that's obviously like not in line with scripture for not just a little bit, but like for a long season of time maybe. Or like,
00:16:48
Speaker
It's kind of like once saved, always saved, and you can't lose your salvation. And if you do walk away, then you were never saved to begin with. It's kind of the argument that would be made. It's like, well, it seemed like they had a genuine salvation, and then they completely returned at some point. But I certainly see some people go,
00:17:10
Speaker
I don't know, like they feel like they're saved even though they living in unrepentance at some point. And that's the part where I'm like, you should be still concerned potentially. Absolutely. And this is where we get into one of those very misunderstood passages of scripture about judging one another. People love to throw that verse out there, judge not lest you be judged. And that's not what the Bible's talking about. The Bible's saying that you and I don't have the authority to judge someone's eternal experience, whether that's going to be heaven or hell.
00:17:39
Speaker
But we are absolutely commanded to judge one another's brothers and sisters in Christ so that you can look at me as your pastor or your friend and go, Ridley, what you're doing doesn't line up with God's will. You need to be held accountable in this situation. That requires judgment. I mean, how else do we know whether the fruit is good or bad unless we make a judgment? Right. So, yeah, we
00:18:00
Speaker
We can use that phrase, once saved, always saved, as a really big and a really bad crutch to go live with our boyfriend before we get married or to make an unethical business deal and go, you know, I don't have to worry about that because I'm saved. Well, I think that mentality is an indication that you never really were to begin with, that you can treat the blood of Jesus Christ that callously.
00:18:26
Speaker
So that's, and that's the thing that I think most people need to remember. You got to be careful. Uh, you don't want to live in a place of excused sin, right? Cause that God doesn't excuse you. He's forgiven you, but you got to accept the forgiveness by confessing, bringing the sin to light and actually repenting, or at least making repeated attempts. Right. Right. It's the secret sin that gets you in trouble or this, the sin that you, you given up on, you keep doing it, even though you're not.
00:18:54
Speaker
And let's make a- You're not even trying. I think it's important we make a separation between sin versus willful sin. I mean, all sin is willful. It's not like sin, we accidentally sin. But there's a difference between Ridley getting mad and saying a curse on somebody because of the way they've treated me and losing my temper versus Ridley sitting down and plotting how I'm going to take advantage of people on a regular basis as part of my business to steal money from them.
Accidental vs. Willful Sin, Repentance, and Grace
00:19:25
Speaker
One is I'm planning it out and I'm going to make sure I get my rights, my things that are coming to me. The other one is, oh, in that moment, my heart was not listening to God. I need to come back. I need to get this right.
00:19:39
Speaker
I think every believer has those moments where they slip, they stumble, they don't follow perfectly the will of Christ. And that's where the grace of God, man is endless. It's eternal. You keep coming back to it and you always find that the reservoir never runs dry. Um, but then the former situation, you know, where you're constantly choosing to willfully go after that. Now again, you got to go back and go, okay, do you really understand what was done for you and what sanctification really looks like? Yep.
00:20:08
Speaker
And I'd say if you're in that place, just get help, ask for help. There's grace and not just in community, but probably even grace. You didn't even know that you didn't know, you didn't know what was, what promises have been made in scripture that you could be leaning into. Let me throw this in there too, because it actually was another conversation we had in staff meeting yesterday about this very thing.
00:20:29
Speaker
We talked about the phrase once saved, always saved, how that becomes a very bad crutch for people who say they're following Christ Jesus. Another one that we like to throw out that I think also can be equally as damaging is Christians aren't perfect, they're just forgiven. That almost becomes an excuse for our sin, right?
00:20:47
Speaker
Yeah, I know I sinned, but we're not perfect. We're just forgiven. Well, the Bible says be holy as he is holy. The goal isn't just to try to get by. The goal is to move towards that perfection that Christ showed us and demonstrated for us. So I think to go back to what you just said,
00:21:04
Speaker
This is why being in fellowship with other believers, worshiping with other believers, being in the word of God, those things keep pushing us upward and higher and to the goal of sanctification so that we can get to that place where we are very much like Jesus. But when we start to use those excuses, lean on those crutches, remove ourself from fellowship with other believers, then it becomes very easy and very commonplace for us to find ourselves in a pattern of sin.
00:21:28
Speaker
I think the one thing that comforts me the most, even though I might stumble or try to do good and stop. And it's hard sometimes, you know, you're in seasons of difficulty. I've heard someone say this and I find it to be true. They could test me on it is that if you don't give up, you win. Like if you continue coming back to the altar, bringing yourself back. If you don't give up.
00:21:48
Speaker
You win and the enemy loses So we always got to keep trying you got to keep giving back up and you might say like oh But I've tried a hundred times to stop doing this thing like I don't know what to say if you don't give up you win So don't don't stop trying You know
00:22:06
Speaker
I've had many guys along the way, mentors, friends who have encouraged me into seasons where I felt like I was struggling to say something similar to that in the sense of, you know what? If you feel the guilt of your sin, that's a good sign. That means the Holy Spirit is still speaking to your heart. It's when you stop feeling the guilt that you need to start worrying.
00:22:27
Speaker
Man, this has been insightful conversation. I've, I don't know, extra thing about forgiveness. I, it was encouraging to me is I've never heard like, okay, yes, you do need to forgive them and let them let that go so that it doesn't continue to put that in the prison. But this is like, I don't even know. I don't even want to call it the extra mile, but it feels a little bit like that way. Like take it, take it all the way through to closure. If it's here, you can. Again, some people like, like they refuse to see or talk to you. And as soon as you talk to them, they're throwing hurtful things at you. Sure. Like,
00:22:57
Speaker
Always remain calm to them always go out of your way to bless them and be there for them So when if they ever do turn around and of course pray for them because maybe the Holy Spirit will turn their heart So that day maybe when they come calling decades later, you can complete the transaction you can complete the full you come full circle and getting the full full forgiveness and It's done because like you said there is something different when it's come when they've actually received the forgiveness so do
00:23:25
Speaker
Sunday after one of our services, a family that had been a part of our church from the very beginning, who chose to leave somewhere around year two, walked out. The guy, who is a friend of mine, came up to me at the end of the service. They have since returned to our church, become part of our church. He came up to me and he said, I owe you an apology. He said, when I left a few years ago, I said some things I shouldn't have, and it was wrong, and I need to ask for your forgiveness.
00:23:51
Speaker
And I said, well, first of all, I want to thank you for doing this. It means the world to me. I said, because I never stopped considering you a friend, despite the fact that you did, you said some things that hurt. I said, but I also want to take responsibility to say that as your pastor, I may have done some things that put you in a corner that made you feel like you had to say those things. So I want to tell you, I'm sorry. Okay. Well, really cool thing there. I had already forgiven him.
00:24:15
Speaker
back in year two when he left because I knew that was important for me. That's an lesson I've learned the hard way over the course of my life. But Sunday, it went that extra mile, like you talked about, because now there was a full completion of the forgiveness because he had received the gift that I had already offered him. And man, I walked away Sunday. I mean, to me, three services, all the preaching, all the noise, everything else was worth it because at least one relationship had the reconciliation it needed.
00:24:44
Speaker
It's powerful because I'm starting to see the light in it now. I'm like, Oh, this is so obviously the thing because God's in the business of restoration, right?
Restoration and Trust in Forgiveness
00:24:52
Speaker
Um, and it's harder. Honestly, it's easier just to forgive them and not let it hurt you anymore to go out of your way to try to do your best in order to reconcile the relationship, which is another level of forgiveness. If you think about it, like in order to try to bring the relationship back and right standing within your means is a hard thing to do.
00:25:09
Speaker
And if you don't want to do it, then maybe you probably still have some unforgiveness in your heart. So it's like the final test of forgiveness is being able to restore. Maybe not fully. Cause again, there's consequences for maybe of what have happened. It doesn't necessarily mean like you invite them fully back into your life the same way. It takes time to build trust and all that kind of stuff back, but it is the final step of forgiveness is a restoration. Yes. Great point, man, man. Good conversation today. You're doing it.
00:25:37
Speaker
Good. Can't wait for others to listen to it. If you're listening to this, thanks again for joining us today.
Conclusion and Call to Share
00:25:42
Speaker
Remember we want to do anything we can to impact the life of every person with the whole gospel by any means possible. And that includes this podcast. So thanks for listening to it. Uh, share it with some friends and family who, who need to hear a little bit more about forgiveness. Yeah, absolutely.