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Nobody Runs on an Atheist Platform | Mayor Mack Womack | The Upgrade w Joe Adevai #007
33 Plays1 month ago
Pastor Joe sits down with a very special guest, Mayor Mack Womack of North Brunswick, New Jersey. Mayor Womack has served the town for 21 consecutive years. Born in Travelers Rest, South Carolina (the same town as Jesse Jackson), Mack's journey took him through West Virginia, Orlando, Alabama, and a failed Jimmy Carter reelection campaign before law school and a girl from Bayonne brought him to New Jersey for good. Pastor Joe and the mayor go way back to when their kids were scratching out violin recitals at the same elementary school. This conversation covers everything from why New Jersey property taxes are so high to the future train station, how faith-based organizations fit into the fabric of a community, and what it was like when the mayor showed up at Grace Church's little storefront on 9/11. Funny, honest, and surprisingly deep, this one shows you the heart behind the office. Whether you live in North Brunswick or not, this is a conversation about what real public service looks like.
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Transcript
Introduction and Gratitude
00:00:00
Speaker
I just want to thank you for one thing. You've always been so nice and gracious to us as a church. I always talk about it. You know, i say that this town has been so great to us as a church. You guys really support faith-based organizations. Very kind. The police. Everybody.
00:00:15
Speaker
Everybody. And it stems from you because that's who you are. Well, I mean, nobody runs on an atheist platform. i we're back You brought it back to politics. I didn't know. That's funny.
00:00:31
Speaker
Hey everybody, welcome to The Upgrade. Joseph Atavai here, aka Pastor Joe. I got the production crew here, Joe, Steven, and we got an awesome guest here today.
00:00:43
Speaker
This is the mayor of North Brunswick, population over 44,000, a friend and an amazing mayor for 20 years, the last...
00:00:56
Speaker
21 years. That would be Mayor Mac Womack. Let's give it up. Let's give it up. It's good to be here, Pastor. Yes. I mean, as Grace Church, we have to be nice to you. because As the mayor, I have to be nice to you. We'll it. So you've been mayor for how long?
00:01:16
Speaker
ah Like 21 years, like you were saying. 21 straight. yeah It's been good. I mean, there's no plan to be there for 21 years. They just have rolled one into the other.
00:01:30
Speaker
I mean, when you were a kid growing up, did you ever say, like, I'm going to be the mayor of a
Mayor's Career and Personal History
00:01:34
Speaker
city? kid No kid says I'm going to be the mayor. Every kid's like, I'm going to be the president. Did you say that? No, I didn't say that either. What did, you know, and you're not just a mayor. Tell us a little bit what else you do. I'm a lawyer. I, North Brunswick's a part-time mayor.
00:01:51
Speaker
So I'm a lawyer. And I do the kind of law I'm i'm doing now. I work ah for a couple other towns as a municipal prosecutor.
00:02:02
Speaker
And it was sort of the traffic court kind of thing. Yeah, who let me yeah man. i i I don't have like a prosecutorial heart. I know. And I never thought I would enjoy doing that.
00:02:15
Speaker
But, you know, you find that in sometimes in life, a position lets you help people where you you think prosecutor, you're going to hurt people, lets you help people. And I've really enjoyed that.
00:02:28
Speaker
I can't even believe I didn't know that. And that is amazing. I'm shocked, actually. I work over in in Edison and Woodbridge and Carteret.
00:02:39
Speaker
Yeah, you're like the nicest guy in the world. I can't see you. I mean, you should be. Even at the county and federal, I mean, you should be a nice guy if you're the prosecutor.
00:02:51
Speaker
You got to do what you got to do, but you're there to help people as well as to see justice. Justice is good, but also rehabilitation is good. yeah So how long were you doing that before you decided to run for mayor? No, no. my Most of my career, I i worked i worked in ah a real arcane part of a law that dealt with longshoremen who get injured.
00:03:18
Speaker
Because a longshoreman who works on the piers, he didn't get the semen's remedies if he gets hurt and he doesn't get jersey workers comp because he's not in new jersey he's on the piers so there's special laws and i was doing that for years and years and years and thank goodness i finally got away from that wow yeah one of our pastors is actually the cfo of maersk uh the pier in new jersey so i meet a lot of the longshoremen don't don't don't bring my name
00:03:53
Speaker
where Where were you born? i was born in Travelers, who asked South Carolina, same town as Jesse Jackson. So you weren't born in New Jersey? No, was born in South Carolina. Are you allowed to be a mayor of new jersey of ah North Brunswick? I don't know. No one's ever asked me about this one. But i was born in South Carolina and lived in Wilmington, North Carolina for a few years in Charlotte, North Carolina.
00:04:18
Speaker
Then we moved to Hinton and Lewisburg, West Virginia. and then West Virginia? West Virginia. That was great. And then Orlando, Florida, where I graduated high school, college in Alabama,
00:04:31
Speaker
And then I met this girl from New Jersey and it was all over. So that's that's how you got here. ah she yeah Was she going to Alabama? It was a church thing. It was a church thing. I'm a Presbyterian.
00:04:42
Speaker
And back then they had a program called Volunteers in Mission. And i I had a couple of friends who had been Mormon missionaries. And I'm like, we probably ought to try to go to Africa or something like that.
00:04:57
Speaker
And so i I signed up with the volunteer admission program, made clear to them I was willing to go to Africa, China, wherever they wanted. They sent me to Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. Oh, my God. With her?
00:05:09
Speaker
she She went to Franklin and Marshall College. And we both wound up doing an internship at the same radio station. and in Well, she was doing her internship. I was doing my volunteer work at the radio station in Harrisburg.
00:05:23
Speaker
So that was how we met. Love at first sight? For me, not for her. It's like a little while ago. She was a Bayonne girl. Oh, my gosh. Quite a while. quiet so she She apologized.
00:05:36
Speaker
No, no, her her roommates, when she took me to meet her college, she apologized to him first that, you he's not really that good looking, but he's a nice guy. so Now you're the mayor. Now I am, yeah. Yeah. Take that. So wait, so she's living in Bayonne, and then you Moved up here.
00:05:57
Speaker
I stayed in Harrisburg a little bit. I went to work on the Jimmy Carter reelection campaign. Wow. Which is obviously ah you can't miss. I mean, he's definitely going to be reelected.
00:06:10
Speaker
And um so I figured out of that, I'd, I'd get some career. And you were thinking politics then. Not really politics, but I was thinking something government-related something. Were you just working on the campaign, like, whatever they wanted, or were doing something specific? No, working in the Pennsylvania primary and and working around ah doing that kind of stuff. But...
00:06:31
Speaker
um He lost. Yeah, he didn't win. He lost. So what am I going to do? And law schools were still taking applications. Wow.
00:06:41
Speaker
So I went to law school. Where where did you go? University of Baltimore. Okay. And so I went to UB law school. Now were you married? Got married my last year of law school. Okay.
00:06:53
Speaker
And then when that was over, we yeah I took the Jersey bar. And we moved to New Jersey and started working for a law firm at Hoboken. and So you moved up by Bowne? Yeah, we moved and we moved into my into the house with my in-laws. Your in-laws? Yeah.
00:07:10
Speaker
okay He owned a bus company, my father-in-law. And I loved driving his buses. And it was a good life for a while there. wow So how did the North Brunswick thing happen?
00:07:21
Speaker
We decided to move out of Bayonne, and a realtor brought us down to see this cute little place in Society Hill in North Brunswick, and we bought it. 1988, late 87, 88.
00:07:33
Speaker
late eighty seven eighty eight We have a few people that are from Society Hill. My family loved Society Hill. We only had a two-bedroom. We had three kids.
00:07:47
Speaker
And then because of some ah financial issues, some other family members came and moved in with us. wo So, yeah. And so we were tight there for a little while, but what a great place for kids to grow up. I mean, just like in the movies, you know, the block was full of kids out on the street enjoying.
00:08:09
Speaker
was a great place. I remember, so this must have been around that time, maybe just meeting you at our elementary school, and both of our kids were playing some kind of instrument that they couldn't play, kind of scratching. Maybe your kid was bad. My daughter was like had a violin, and she was just making a racket. But we were in like the lunchroom or something, just sitting down, talking. I remember that. And the next thing I know, you're the mayor. i was like, wow. That's the same way I feel. Yeah.
00:08:39
Speaker
So you you you became a councilman first, you said, and then and then you ran for mayor. Yeah. see this is funny. I was born in North Brunswick. I didn't know. I thought you were a New Yorker. No, that's that's where I was kidnapped to, but that's another podcast for another day because this is about you today. But yeah, I was born, i lived on a Oak Road. It was right behind Nino's.
00:09:03
Speaker
It was a little little house the size of a room. And yeah and my brother and sister went to Maple Mead. They went to Maple Mead to school.
00:09:17
Speaker
As a school, my father brought a picture of me. Now, you know, our church, Grace Church, across the street right now, if you don't know, there's a field there, which we're trying to get the mayor to get for us to help us with parking, but...
00:09:35
Speaker
But um he came back. There was a Middlesex County fair or something there. Like, I'm dating my, well, 50-something years ago. And he had a picture from the home news, and it's me with a little water gun or something at the fair shooting something right across the street from where we are right now. Wow. Wow.
00:09:56
Speaker
So I'm from North Brunswick. i So I returned in 1990. so But just by accident. My wife and I lived in Edison. and We drove down 130. We were just looking for houses. we didn't I didn't even know it was North Brunswick. We turned into that Hoover Drive area. And she was just like, this is beautiful.
00:10:16
Speaker
it is That's how we ended up here. And what year did you get here? 88. Right. right So that's about the same time. Yeah, I i remember i was um I worked for that law firm in Hoboken, and I remember telling one of the lawyers that we were looking at houses, and we looked at some place called North Brunswick.
00:10:34
Speaker
And he said, oh, you got you gotta to gotta go there. He said said, that's great. They got this Farrington Lake full of fish. They stock it good. You got to go there. It's a beautiful place. Have you ever fished there?
00:10:45
Speaker
No. i I'm not a fisherman. Yeah. It is beautiful. It is beautiful. I mean, people don't appreciate you go back there by the dam. That, that, the dam is gorgeous back there. it It really is. You have some plans for that, don't you?
00:11:00
Speaker
No. Well, the, the, the town, remember something about maybe a nice open area you can get out by the water. That's, that's a little further down, not by the dam. The dam. So, mean, I, I, are you talking about the right here?
00:11:12
Speaker
Yeah, would yeah ah right across in um in what we call the pull the farm. um That's right here. We're going to have boat access. I tell people from North Brunswick all the time, we don't there's not a big sign or anything, but at this pull the farm, which is right across from your church.
00:11:32
Speaker
you You can't see it. You you think you see the farm because you see only the front part of the hill, and you see that you see the house back there. But that's like one-fifth of the farm. You cross over that crest, and then this beautiful big field that at sundown and sunup is full of deer, fox.
00:11:52
Speaker
It's a gorgeous place. Is open access for the public? Anybody. it's It's open space. We're taking the Cybertruck back there. We're going to go. It's... Now they they fly those, uh, the helicopters. Yes. We have someone in our church that uses that field. He knows Ricky. Uh, yeah. Everybody knows know Ricky. Ricky flies his helicopters upside down there. Right. So, um, but yeah, so we were rented it out to these guys who, uh, who fly model planes back there, which that doesn't hurt the area or anything. And it doesn't in any way preclude people from, from just being able to go back there. I go, I go back there for sunsets or, uh,
00:12:29
Speaker
You know days when I just want to unwind a little bit I just go sit in car back there. the mayor you probably need to unwind once in a while right? Every once in a while. What are like some of the challenges of being the mayor of almost a 50,000
Challenges and Community Life in North Brunswick
00:12:42
Speaker
city? If a kid's thinking I'm not gonna be president I'll be the mayor. Exactly right. exactly What can they expect? Exactly. there What are some challenges there?
00:12:53
Speaker
The thing about ah being a a local elected official of any kind – is um Most people come to you with very reasonable requests.
00:13:09
Speaker
And sometimes you really have a hard time figuring out ever how to do it. and in And it's rare. It's not rare because every town's got a couple of, it you call them gadflies.
00:13:25
Speaker
You know where gadfly comes from, I think? I think it's Aristotle, I believe. it was It was a term that was used back in that he used, in and a gadfly was you know some kind of fly that that annoyed you. Gotcha. Yeah, that makes sense. So now we have gadflies in...
00:13:46
Speaker
and and And by that, I mean there are some people that are in town that are just not happy with anything and they they enjoy, they feel, i don't want to say they enjoy, they feel it is their civic duty to complain constantly. And they do this at town council meetings? or Sometimes. They call the mayor's office a lot.
00:14:07
Speaker
They call the mayor a lot and council members. um and and And, you know, but but it's perfectly fine. But most people, when they call, they really have an issue.
00:14:20
Speaker
They really haven't been able to get it resolved by the time they call the mayor. And between regulations, financial constrictions, just what other people might want or not want, you lot of times you're not able to do right what what people want. That's the hardest part of it is when you really can't figure a way to do the right thing. something that you want to do. Yeah, hey when when you can't get the good thing done, that's a bad part.
00:14:46
Speaker
So you're not a dictator. I mean, you can't just push a button. There are mayors who have a style of that when I say this, I want this done.
00:15:01
Speaker
And there's a lot to be said for that. They do get a lot done. Um, our town is a, ah form a form of government where we have a part-time mayor, part-time council members. You get paid something, don't you? 12, five. Yeah. And,
00:15:17
Speaker
and i yeah You're being serious right now Yeah, it's mayor gi I think think the council gets $12,500 and the mayor gets $13,500.
00:15:26
Speaker
um but i think But under our form of government, we have a full-time business administrator. we We have directors for each department that that we we try to pay well to make sure that they're...
00:15:37
Speaker
able to do the job properly. And so, and I try to let them run their department. And, and I'm, my philosophy is in the mayor points, sort of the direction of the ship, but as far as how you actually run the ship, you leave that to the ship professionals.
00:15:55
Speaker
And I've always tried to do that in town. And so far I've been real lucky with the people that I've had. o And our town is growing. I mean, business is coming in and my son asked you about the train station that we were supposed to have for a long time, but there's so much that goes into that. People understand. It's not like you're there and the mayor's always like, well, no, we're not going to finish the train yet. I mean, oh it worked but it's, it's, um, you're talking about gadflies. I mean, it is, it is our job, my job to stay in the ear of the state senators, the, the,
00:16:31
Speaker
Assemblyman of the governor of New Jersey Transit. so i need to I need to be the gadfly that is constantly telling them, don't forget, we have our funding.
00:16:44
Speaker
We've already got our engineering done, um substantially completed. we You need to finish up on the North Brunswick train station project. it It may not get done while I'm the mayor or while I'm alive, but it is on course.
00:17:02
Speaker
We have to keep it on course. It's a town. you know which's it's It's not a person. So you have to think in the longer term of generations and make sure that we stay on the steady course to get the train station, to get the kind of development we need for 20, 30 years ahead.
00:17:23
Speaker
Well, I just want to thank you for one thing. You've always been so nice and gracious to us as a church. I always talk about it. You know, i say that this town has been so great to us as a church. You guys really support faith-based organizations, very kind, the police, everybody, everybody. And it stems from you because that's who you are. Well, I mean, nobody runs on an atheist platform. LAUGHTER
00:17:48
Speaker
we're back You brought it back to politics. That's funny. We got a funny mayor, everybody. Let me tell you, he's been having us laughing all morning. All right, now here's the question. Everybody's going to say, well, why are our property taxes so high? but ah I want to preface that with the fact that A lot of people move to North Brunswick because the property taxes aren't as high as the surrounding. don't know if you young guys know that, but the property taxes are a little lower here. That's why a lot of people move here. That's why our population has gone up by what? Almost 70% since you've been married. No, no, no. But but it's gone up.
00:18:26
Speaker
From 30 to 45. That's 50%. Yes, it's gone On my numbers. um And I know that our taxes are a little lower when I talk to my friends about, you know,
00:18:36
Speaker
So what is it that goes into the fact that just New Jersey, the properties taxes are just so high. What is the, can you give it in a quick nutshell why so people understand?
00:18:48
Speaker
i have a couple of things that always come to my mind and, and people may not always agree with me, but you heard me say, you heard me say i went to, I lived in West Virginia, seventh, eighth, ninth grades. um I went to college in Alabama and I went to high school in Orlando or part of high school down in Orlando.
00:19:10
Speaker
Nothing wrong with, I love those places. I loved West Virginia. I enjoyed Alabama an awful lot. Florida was fine.
00:19:25
Speaker
The education there is not the education you get in this part of New Jersey. Okay. Now, I'm not saying North Brunswick's the best education within the state of New Jersey. You're allowed to.
00:19:38
Speaker
I think we there's a lot of reasons I'm really proud of our education system. Look at these two. Wait, no, you might have a point. but Not me, not me. yeah But i but i yeah I do think a lot, lot of what we pay in taxes are...
00:19:58
Speaker
education where you It's for education. Yeah. and and And I'm not trying to pass the buck when I say I'm just saying that you hear people say a lot, Hey, as soon as my kids are done, I'm out of here. I'm moving to South Carolina. I'm moving to Tennessee, wherever all nice places. Right.
00:20:15
Speaker
but still hear But you think about what they say and it really is meaningful. I'm leaving as soon as my kids are out of school, they're here paying for their kids to get about the best education in the United States.
00:20:28
Speaker
mean, between us and Massachusetts, which go back and forth, you're not going to get a better education. I can remember the first time I bumped into somebody who I knew went to an Ivy League school, and I was already out of high school by that point.
00:20:46
Speaker
You bump into them on the street here in North Brunswick all the time. i mean, we really, in other words. So education is a big chunk. i' I'm not saying taxes should be high. No, of course. I got But I am saying you get what you're paid for. Hey, reality is reality. I mean.
00:21:02
Speaker
And I'm not, I'm not here to, I'm not here to, I'm just curious. And who do you want to have paying your taxes? You want to have, you, you don't want to be paying them yourself. you You don't want to have everybody just to pay the value of their house is how much, you know, divided by everybody who lives in town.
00:21:21
Speaker
And that's how you pay your tax. You want to have businesses and industry to help split it up with you and to pay a big part of it. And that's why you're pushing for that, right? We don't have that right mix right now. We don't have the right industry, which in my opinion, my my favorite the term for industry is basically out of sight, out of mind.
00:21:44
Speaker
You know, if if you're in South Carolina, you got a lot of land. We're out on the edge of town. You can have a lot of industry. and people don't even know it's there. We don't have that luxury.
00:21:57
Speaker
But we do need to have a better mix yeah of industry. And it needs to be the smart, right kind of industry. We're right here by, I mean, I'm i'm starting to rant, but we're right i mean we're right here by by New Brunswick, which is truly developing into a major science medical center. Oh, yeah.
00:22:20
Speaker
for the entire region. And we should be a part of that. We should be feeding into that smartness with places for so nurses, resident doctors to be living while they're working at the the cancer Institute here and at Robert Wood at St. Peter's. You've been talking about that. And the scientists, we need to be developing that kind of housing stock system that really nice and for us to be a part of this entire growth of medical science in in this part of the state.
00:22:58
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, we do have great hospitals. and we have We're so lucky. It gets to a point where people are like, I don't know if I can afford it, but you can't buy a house in New Jersey, so people want to live here for some reason. That's a real question. i mean people people when there There are people who who just throw it out there who obviously can't afford it. I don't know if I can afford to pay my taxes.
00:23:20
Speaker
they you know They would rather pay a lesser share. And then there's people who really... can I pay my tax? They may not be able pay. And we really got to try to do something. If you weren't a lawyer, would that fee salary you get for the mayor, you wouldn't be... I was joking with you. I yeah i get paid January, February. I said to you, who's going to be the next mayor? And you laughed and you said, how about you? And now I'm like, no way.
00:23:47
Speaker
That's a lot. that's That's not a great trade. I don't know. i don't i don't what I don't feel like that's enough for someone to do as much as you do. my don't You don't see me yeah stepping up to do any preaching either.
00:24:00
Speaker
Even though you could. So are you when is your term right now? I got about two more years left. Is this it? I'm getting older. I'm getting older, so we'll see.
00:24:12
Speaker
ah It's not. It's not over. No, no, no. mean, I mean, the other way to ask that question is, are you a lame duck? And the answer to that is no.
00:24:24
Speaker
There you go. You can't. you i don't You're going to do it. Who knows what? We want you to stay. How long is the term? It's four years. Yeah. So we want you to stay. Yeah, don't Because, you know, now we know a guy.
00:24:35
Speaker
We got the mayor. He's our friend. We'll see. We'll see. My son in the Navy, hopefully, he he wants to stay in for several more years. And I think the next several years will be in Asia.
00:24:47
Speaker
So I just don't know. Our family plans, you know, who family plans. Who knows? him Do you have something? Like I say, my daughter lives in Las Vegas. and Wait, are you that person that, you know, once you're going to leave New Jersey and go to South Carolina?
00:25:03
Speaker
i'm I'm not leaving Jersey. I'm very proud to be from Jersey. Very proud. got a question for you. I love Jersey. If you wouldn't mind, got a question.
Role of Churches in Community Building
00:25:11
Speaker
We were talking about this little earlier, and I kind of wanted to circle back to something.
00:25:15
Speaker
Churches and faith-based organizations, by extension, we know function as huge community centers, just wherever you go, no matter what township you're in, no matter what state you're in. Churches across the U.S. s who might be watching right now, whether big or small, how does a faith-based organization fit into the ecosystem of a community?
00:25:33
Speaker
It's a big question because, as you know, not not talking about our little town right now, but study after study shows that ah people are are less connected to one another in our society and people are less satisfied with the quality of life that they're having because of those interactions within our society.
00:26:03
Speaker
And there's an awful lot of scholars and people with, I think, good sense who believe that we have to find ways to connect together other than text messaging and internet.
00:26:19
Speaker
And there are fewer and fewer societal opportunities for that. I mean, people you guys are people, your generation is the one who is, i don't want to say suffering it, but you're living it. You know, when Pastor and I, we, I don't know about him. We used to, We used to go to discos you i won on Friday nights. did. there was that That's not the kind of community interaction you're talking about. You went to discos?
00:26:51
Speaker
Did you to Studio 54? No, I'd never been to New York then, but they had good ones in Orlando back in the day. I didn't know you used to discos. You get what I'm saying.
00:27:04
Speaker
This loss of societal connection puts a burden on on faith-based organizations.
00:27:15
Speaker
People become more reliant on it. It puts a stronger, much stronger obligation, I think, on the townships to find ways for us to reach out, have community events, constantly have community events where people um can be out. you know Neighborhoods may not be quite what they were where everybody knows their neighbors and things, but we have to do everything we can to try to create that sort of environment.
00:27:46
Speaker
We can't do it in the same way with the same cohesion that a faith-based organization does it because you're coming from that common faith, from that common belief or or at least a common ah desire to to to have a um a religion together or a belief a belief together that that gives you a certain cohesion.
00:28:15
Speaker
And the township, of course, comes from um a a desire to bring together the full diversity of everybody into the into the community.
00:28:26
Speaker
um So we ought to be working together as closely as possible. We meaning the township in every community. reasonable faith-based organization that there is to try to help work together both in your events, in our events, in our combined events, and just through coordination to change.
00:28:52
Speaker
taught it Because it's a big societal issue. We've got to try to find ways for people to be able to connect again. Connect as Christians on the one hand.
00:29:03
Speaker
Connect as neighbors and members of a community from township perspective. I even remember we were talking earlier, like on and you came to visit our little church.
00:29:15
Speaker
and We were in a little storefront. You know, that place used to be a brothel that we were in. But I didn't just come visit your church. I came there because it was nine eleven your church came together as a church community to pray on 9-11 for the things that were happening.
00:29:36
Speaker
and And we tried to do the same thing as a town to come together as a community. But, that's so important. I mean, you were a place where people could come. I mean, I didn't know. Well, it's close to my heart, obviously, because I lost so many friends. If you ever need anybody to talk on the 9-11 memorial thing, you just call me because I could.
00:29:59
Speaker
I mean, that just was hard. That was hard. But anyway, you always been always been, you personally in the town has always been nice to us. I love, ah you know. You didn't ask, but I talk a lot about, uh,
00:30:13
Speaker
We used to have these things called Rolodexes, you know, but it's, you know, it's it's my contact. your phone. Yeah, on the iPhone. I don't know. But the most important list and group that I have, one of the most important is the list of local pastors and religious leaders, rabbi, when something happens.
00:30:34
Speaker
Really, when something happens, we have the Office of Emergency Management to make sure people have water, or make sure the highways are are taken care of and that things are organized in an emergency.
00:30:46
Speaker
And we have something, a CERT team, community emergency response team, volunteers to help the the police and the fire, whoever may need it.
00:30:59
Speaker
But when it really, really gets bad, You got to have the names of the pastors and the priests and the rabbis.
00:31:13
Speaker
That's who you got to call when people really need counseling. That's who's got to, we can meet anywhere. We can meet here, but that's who's all got to come together. And the people of the community need to know that we're out there as person.
00:31:27
Speaker
for them. And that's been a real blessing in in North Brunswick in my time with pastor Joe and others. And you probably remember there, uh, the George Floyd situation, the time when there were, um, numerous officers that, uh, were shot all at the same time.
00:31:47
Speaker
um times when, when we have, I, we, we didn't quite have everything together at it nine eleven but, um times when people need to know where to turn, we've got people in town and it largely comes from our faith-based organizations that are there for all of us And they're together. you i mean, you've been there. I mean, it's it's basically locking arms and saying and we're a community that's going to stand strong and we're going to stand strong because our faith will let us get through this crisis regardless of what our individual faith is.
00:32:31
Speaker
Anyway, I mean, or race or race, color, agree. Absolutely. Grace Church is the most diverse church that you will ever see. It's a, and it's a, it's a town of respect. You, you, you may have experienced it, uh, pointing to our producers here when you went away to school or when you went to Rutgers, my one daughter went to college in, um, in Virginia, a good college,
00:32:56
Speaker
Virginia's great, but it's not anywhere near as diverse as we are. right And she missed it. She missed it. i mean, everybody gets along. and you want You want to see mountains and live in the beautiful mountains, you go to Aspen.
00:33:12
Speaker
you know You want to be on the Jersey Shore, it's easy to move to the Jersey Shore. We've got Farrington Lake. And we've got, but we're, we're old
Diversity and Family Background in North Brunswick
00:33:23
Speaker
farms. Our houses are everywhere. Your church here, it's all built. It used to all just be farms, flat Jersey lands, beautiful, but you don't move here for the scenery. You move here for the people. You move here for the diversity. You can move here for the interaction.
00:33:39
Speaker
People move here, go to your church now, I bet. But it's a wonderful thing about your church. I mean, you, you're, you're, You are of the spirit, but you are in the community so much. We stayed.
00:33:52
Speaker
It means a lot. After COVID, we lost a lot of pastors. I mean, that that pastor meeting, the North Brunswick thing, was much more. The last time I went, there was like just a few of us. I'm like what happened to everybody? that COVID?
00:34:05
Speaker
Didn't kill the radio star, but it killed some churches. Yeah. And, yeah, it not just pastors, but, i mean, the churches are churches are either consolidated or gone. Yeah.
00:34:17
Speaker
It was tough. not quite what You know what was so funny? During COVID, actually, so we went right to, we were, my son had already gotten us with an online presence, you know, now we have a pretty big one, but.
00:34:28
Speaker
it was stronger and people were giving more. I mean, people felt it was kind of like 9-11. There was such a rush to church after that. And stuff like that happens, people run to God. you know so Your dad just died this last year. He was 95, 96.
00:34:46
Speaker
But he he was a Presbyterian minister. too That's why we move so much because he... he became like a he became a specialist in healing churches where he would go to places where churches had had had internal conflict and he would stay a few years to try to heal things with them and then and then we'd move on yeah so you're just gonna keep mayor and gonna keep mayor you got an appointment in like 10 minutes got the got the directors meeting in 10 minutes what's that real quick
00:35:22
Speaker
It's so like all the the head of the Department of Public Works, the head of ah the Parks and Recreation. Oh, you can mention the... No, I'm going to go in. I'm going walk you in. Yes. going there's one thing and one thing only I want accomplished. By the end of this year, i want that fence taken down across from Grace Church. Yes. So they can park there. Go, Mac. Before my term's over in two years. And then... You have all our votes now.
00:35:47
Speaker
And then once they stop laughing, I'm going to that again. Wait second. Hey, everybody. Mayor Mack, that's an upgrade for you.
00:36:00
Speaker
I don't know if you want to run for mayor, but this is an amazing man right here. Let's give it up. Thanks for coming.