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Building a Consistent Company Culture: Key Insights and Strategies
73 Plays2 years ago
Welcome back to The Better Contractor Podcast. Join hosts Brent Oberlink and Travis May as they discuss the critical components of creating and maintaining a consistent company culture. From discussing the importance of core values beyond mere rhetoric to exploring strategies for attracting and retaining top talent, they provide invaluable insights backed by real-world examples.
Learn how to align your organization's actions with its stated values, navigate the dynamics of different generational attitudes toward work, and implement effective hiring, onboarding, and evaluation processes. Discover how fostering a culture of accountability and continuous feedback can drive long-term success and differentiation in your industry.
#CompanyCulture #CoreValues #TalentRetention #GenerationalAttitudes #HiringProcesses #FeedbackCulture #LeadershipDevelopment #BusinessEvolution #CompanyCulture #Efficiency #EntrepreneurshipPodcast #Entrepreneurship #TheBetterContractorPodcast #TheBetterContractor #Leadership #Business #BusinessOwner
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Transcript
Challenges in Post-COVID Labor Market
00:00:11
Speaker
Welcome back to another episode of The Better Contractor. Today we're going to talk a little bit about attracting and retaining employees. So if you guys are like us and pretty much every other contractor in the space,
00:00:24
Speaker
This is something everyone has been dealing with. Probably always been an issue, especially since COVID. It seems like it has been an issue during then, especially, and then after still an issue. So one of the top things I'm kind of seeing is that, hey, I'm having trouble finding good employees, but I'm also having trouble retaining because the market is so competitive.
00:00:47
Speaker
people are after each other's employees.
Employee Engagement and Advancement
00:00:50
Speaker
So I've got my trusted sidekick Travis. Hey Travis. Good to see you. So we're just going to talk a little bit about kind of what we think it takes to basically build or what it takes to retain and what it takes to attract those employees. And
00:01:08
Speaker
The labor market is a little different now, and I think you'll agree Travis, but the labor market is different now than it used to be. The newer generation, uh, and not generally just them, but they're, they're wanting a lot more of the culture. They're wanting more engagement. They don't just want or need a job because jobs are ample. They're everywhere. They're wanting to go somewhere where they feel like they're not just a number where they feel like, Hey, you know what? This is actually a place I enjoy coming to work. They have a culture here that makes me feel welcome. It makes me feel like I'm engaged.
00:01:36
Speaker
There has to be some sort of advancement structure of some kind. Um, there needs to be evaluations. There needs to be core values. Um, you know, I know like with lander Corp, one of the things we do, and we didn't do this well in the beginning, but now we do very consistent evaluations where before you pretty much had to come to us and say, Hey, I want to raise. And then we're like, okay, well, we didn't do an evaluation. That was a few
Evaluations and Core Values in Hiring
00:02:02
Speaker
years back. Now we have a system in place, uh, with bamboo HR.
00:02:06
Speaker
And that has allowed us to say, Hey, it is time for your three month about your six month about whatever evaluation period we have it set for. But what that does is allows us to go in with that employee and say, Hey, what are your goals? So we actually do a goal setting vision with them. And then we will go through and also say, Hey, here's some constructive feedback that we need to see worked on before your next advancement. But if you're wanting to get to this position,
00:02:33
Speaker
And the other nice thing there is we're actually able to say, Hey, in order to get to that position, these are the things that we need to see. So having that evaluation period, but then also we've really set up a set of core values to where we are trying our best to hire by those, to review by those and to fire by those. What that does though, is that's building culture. You know, it, it's not just setting the tone for, Hey, this is how we do business, which is that is what it's doing.
00:03:01
Speaker
but it's also saying, Hey, this is how you are going to advance or potentially seize employment here as a whole.
Marine Corps Culture Insights by Travis
00:03:08
Speaker
Um, I know Travis, you've got a military background and I, I think the military is one of those places and I've read some of like Jaco's books and stuff like that, where culture is obviously hugely important, but I was just kind of curious, kind of what your take is on culture and engagement. I was, I was a Marine and I'll be honest, the, I remember from being very young,
00:03:30
Speaker
that i wanted to join the military at some point and then what gravitated towards the marine corps was i really didn't know about special operations or like the green braz or navy seals so this was in the uh 90s so there wasn't a ton of books and literature and things out there smiley exposure was really to whatever the the marketing and the recruitment videos were and the marines had a pretty consistent one it was
00:04:01
Speaker
We're looking for a few, the few, the proud, the Marines. We're not looking for everybody. If you think you're tough enough, if you want to join the elite, give us a try and we might take you if you have what it takes. And so I remember that's the thing that attracted me to the Marine Corps is I wanted to be part of something bigger, special, more challenging, kind of test my mental toughness, my physical toughness,
00:04:31
Speaker
What did it say about me as far as test who I am as a person? And that was really the challenge. I didn't know much more beyond that. And I remember that was some of that influence my older brother joined the Marine Corps. So he graduated two years earlier than I did. That always irked me a little bit that he got the chance first, but that was ultimately what led us both to the Marine Corps. And if you look back,
00:04:56
Speaker
over the past couple decades, the Marine Corps has been one of those has consistently hit its recruiting goals and the target. And a lot and I'm sure there's somebody out there that can look at all the marketing or statistics or actually notice some of the more intricate details about why it's successful or not. But one of the big contrast is the way the other services market. And a lot of times you'll see the recruitment and how they present themselves is
00:05:24
Speaker
join for college money or go travel the world or do things other than make it kind of something other than maybe what the core components are. The other branches have always missed their recruiting, I say always, for a long time and more consistently missed their recruiting targets in Marine Corps. I believe up until today over the past several decades has never missed a recruiting target and I think what kind of that speaks to is
00:05:51
Speaker
It translates over into the civilian sector as well in that who you present yourself as a company is going to attract those types of people.
Aligning Actions with Core Values
00:06:02
Speaker
How you present is your core values, is your core values aligned. Everybody likes to be on a winning team. Everybody wants to be on the team that just won the Super Bowl or the Stanley Cup. And there's obviously things that drive them to that level of success.
00:06:20
Speaker
you're going to attract the type of people that you market and that's when it starts. So in a highly competitive marketplace where you're trying to get the right people in, you're trying to attract the right people, you're trying to hire them and then keep them, it really starts with that in that who are you presenting yourself as an organization will ultimately determine who applies to your organization. And then once you've attracted them, is that message consistent? So Brent, I know that you talk about the core values of like land record,
00:06:51
Speaker
that it's more than just something that's thrown up on the wall. And that we see other organizations where they'll spend a lot of time and crafting this beautifully written, very articulate core values. And then it's almost never visited outside of just marketing. And you look at their actions. There's a saying that I love is your actions speak so loud, I can't hear what you're saying. So it's incongruent that what they actually do
00:07:17
Speaker
versus the core values they have. And so once you have attracted the candidate that you most want and you get them in, everything else has to be consistent too. Do you have standards? Do you have processes that mirror who you presented yourself externally as that type of company? And setting high standards, again, it will attract those who want that structure, who want to win.
00:07:42
Speaker
who know it's not going to be easy, but they also need to know it's going to have a reward on the backside. You can find organizations now that have no problem recruiting younger generation in the younger staff and staffing their organizations. And a lot of those conversations, it's been about, one, we started with very specifically targeting, holding high standards, and then maintaining that part of what you were talking about, Brent, of show them there's a career path, show them clearly how to get to it.
00:08:11
Speaker
a lot of the younger generations and across the board, too, is there's going to be some people, and it's the dynamics versus the traditionalists, the traditionalists. And it's kind of the spectrum as far as those who adapt to change. The traditionalists never wants anything to change at all in that they want to come in, know exactly what they're doing. And if you introduce variability to it, it just wrecks their world versus the other end of the spectrum is the dynamics where they want change.
00:08:41
Speaker
excitement and something new and fresh all the time and if you try and give them repetitive work and they say they go crazy and then you got the pragmatics in between and they can they can modulate based on whatever's coming their way but there's still a consistent component in there and that one knowing your people and having those regular touch points and feedback sessions with the people
00:09:05
Speaker
It's two way, one, giving feedback to them and helping them understand where they're at, especially in aligned with personal goals, professional goals, and making it more of a family type environment and helping them in both regards because they will affect each
Culture of Growth and Accountability
00:09:21
Speaker
other. But then it's also for them to give you feedback as a leader or somebody who is running that organization to get feedback and take some direction and
00:09:33
Speaker
understand your leadership role and how are you affecting because it kind of goes both ways leading up and down the organization and that ultimately them knowing where they're at have a clear career path have a clear expectation of what are we trying to achieve we're working together it's not it doesn't always have to be negative and if things in the communication channels are open more often it's not going to be negative because you're going to be in sync but
00:10:01
Speaker
putting all of that together, it's being that consistent along with core values that are solid, that represent what you're wanting to create. And then you mirror that across all touch points of your organization. That creates that culture that you were just talking about, Brent, of people know what they're getting into. You're actually attracting the people that like that culture and want to be a part of that culture. And then you're consistently building that culture.
00:10:31
Speaker
And that's how you retain the top talent that you just retracted. And that's what we're seeing consistently with organizations that are winning in the talent game, employ various elements of that, but are highly engaging. Yeah, I think you're right.
Intentional Hiring and Onboarding
00:10:47
Speaker
And I think in this industry that we're, you know, the better contractors involved with, one of the issues I see a lot of contractors do is hiring out of being desperate. So I will say upfront, there's no way you're going to build culture.
00:11:01
Speaker
If that is what you're doing, you gotta be a lot more intentional about your hiring process. When Travis, when you were talking about like, you are going to build culture. You're just going to be able to be heard over. And I know there's going to be times when you first take this initiative to start doing this. If you had, if you didn't start with it, there's going to be some employees that you're probably going to terminate or that will leave because like you said, they don't like that change. They were comfortable with it before. It was easy.
00:11:30
Speaker
and that's actually what they wanted. So will there be some headaches maybe getting this started? Probably so. Will it be harder to hire? For a while, yes. But I think once you get known as the company that has a standard, where people that are in that industry know, hey, this company here, that is what they're known for. And that is where I want to be. Like when you said the Marines, you wanted to go there because you wanted to be a part of something bigger. And challenging and something that
00:11:57
Speaker
It was excellent. I wanted to be part of something tough and test who I was as a person. So where other people, so 100%, I've had conversations, I have lots of friends across all the branches. And that was not what they were looking for. Like I have no desire to go get beat up and have a miserable life. For me, that actually attracted me to it. And I know that's similar to the other special operations, whether it's seals or rangers.
00:12:27
Speaker
They want that and they attract those types of people. So it depends on the organization. So funny, this, this made me think about, we had a conversation, one of the other podcasts, we're talking about working out and staying healthy. I forget who said it. It might've been you or maybe it's Tucker that said, uh, it's going to be tough either way being fat. It's going to be tough and having health problems or discipline and working out is going to be tough, but which one would you rather have? So,
00:12:53
Speaker
implement the right procedures, processes, systems, training programs, safety programs, abiding by your, it's going to be tough, but the other path is tough, too high turnover, lawsuits. In some ways it's tougher. Yeah. Yeah. So I think building that culture, but then being aware you're going to have to hire that way and you may need to fire that way. But then going on into.
00:13:20
Speaker
Like onboarding, you know, so a lot of companies, okay, I think I've found this guy or gal that I like. Well, then all of a sudden they just throw them into the workforce. There's no real onboarding, no real training. Maybe they didn't even have a mentor assigned to them inside your corporation. That is a little bit of an issue too, where you're just tossing someone in, hoping they pick up on everything. So I think the onboarding process is important because you're, you're, you're basically setting that tone.
00:13:49
Speaker
You're basically saying, here's what's required to work here. These are our standards. This is what we expect. And some of the better contractor trainings, you know, deal with a little bit of that of, Hey, when you roll up to a job site, this is what is expected at the most basic level. Obviously you want to take and assign that new employee a mentor so that they can then go through and actually see this more in an advanced level and real life on a real project, not just in the training video or in training.
00:14:17
Speaker
but that's how you're going to build that culture from day one. So you don't have to correct it, the six month evaluation or one year or whatever. And I was curious, Travis, what, from the military standpoint, how is that onboarding process? Like how did that help set the tone for you guys?
Structured Onboarding for Consistency
00:14:35
Speaker
I know it needs to have a civilian translation or, and it's, it's obviously 100% extremely structured down to the minute, almost, even though,
00:14:45
Speaker
what might seem like chaos, it is structured completely to the point where now you board. So everybody west of the Mississippi goes to San Diego, recruit depot and training depot. Everybody to the east goes to Paris Island. So I was in Texas, went to San Diego. They keep you up all night that first one. So you don't even go to sleep.
00:15:15
Speaker
And it's not happenstance. So they just forgot to check on you, but they're testing you and they're, they're putting you in a mental state where it's just chaos and they're breaking you down. And the entire intent of especially the first few weeks is just to break you down so they can remote. And I mean, that's happening no matter where we're at for the civilian side. I know that I've seen a very, very structured and it always makes you feel better. One kind of.
00:15:44
Speaker
military fog of war is always confusing. Communication breakdown is confusing. It makes people uneasy. And so when you're getting onboarded to organization, and there's not a lot of structure, you don't know who you're supposed to talk to, there's not a lot of guidance, you've got questions, pay, or what are my responsibilities, who am I supposed to be working with, any of that stuff that's not clear, or they have to ask about obviously raises red flags. And it
00:16:13
Speaker
It creates confusion and confusion always leads to potentially horrible outcomes, especially in an organization. And so the onboarding process, organizations will set the tone for that new hire and the rest of the organization. They can give them a strong, stable foundation where it's clearly articulated who we are, what we are, what's expected, set the standards, and then you have to maintain that. It has to be consistent throughout.
00:16:40
Speaker
But if you got some training or you're safety conscious or you expect hard work, getting some sort of stable structure and you can leverage technology, you can leverage platforms and things to help do this. And a lot of organizations are, and there's a lot more out there, but it's so important to have that structure. Question back to you, Brett. I mean, have you seen an organization?
00:17:07
Speaker
that did really well and that was really strong, short and long-term that didn't have structure. No, especially nowadays. Whether they had it in the beginning or not, but they had to develop it at some point. Yeah. I would, I would, I think it's fair to say a lot of companies probably don't have enough of it in the beginning. They learn, this is something I need to do. And that's when they, you know, fully adopt
Competitive and Accountable Culture
00:17:29
Speaker
it. And, you know, I know internally with like Landercorp, you know, we're doing it now. We didn't start that way. There was a culture, don't get me wrong.
00:17:37
Speaker
Um, we weren't hiring and firing by it quick enough, you know, in the very beginning, um, and it showed a little, you know, now, I think now we've, we've got a lot better culture. We've got an excellent management team, but it took work and it wasn't overnight. You know what I mean? And there's still work to be done. Um, but it's a lot better than it was. And I think, you know, when you brought up like the onboarding, but then like setting the tone, you know, the reason we bring up the military is.
00:18:05
Speaker
They're one of the best at doing this. I mean, you're literally preparing people to go into war, potentially lose their life. They're at least at minimum away from family and friends for months on end sometimes. So, and as a family, so they're an awesome example of how to build a culture. There's a company locally that sells internationally that, um, the owner, you know, has been super.
00:18:29
Speaker
He's super well known for building culture and it's the same way. It's almost a competition when you get to work there, um, of trying to actually meet those core values better than others even do. You know, did that happen overnight? Most likely no. Um, but it's that competition even now, Hey, we are going to be that. And then what that does is people start to hold each other accountable, which I think that's amazing. If you can get your culture built to where let's say Travis, you and I are on a team together and our culture is so strong.
00:19:00
Speaker
and you see me not doing one of our core values and you're like, Hey Brent, dude, come on. You're letting me down. You're letting the canopy down. What can I do for you to help us improve? You know, that is powerful too. And I think we've called it brother's keeper, Atlanta Corp, you know, there's mentorship, whatever you wanted to call it, but having someone that you're basically saying on your crew or whatever saying, Hey, I want you to be my accountability partner. So if there's a crew of six of us Travis, and I pick you, I, Hey,
00:19:28
Speaker
I want you to hold me accountable and I'm giving you permission to also hold me accountable. You know, and then going back to those core values. The other thing on core values I wanted to share in, I've said this a lot where a lot of companies just have core values like on a break room wall or their conference room wall. When we talk about core values, that is not what I'm talking about. Those values can be listed there. They can be listed in your website, but they've got to be something that your team knows.
00:19:55
Speaker
And that you actually talk about daily because in the absence of not talking about those people will not remember them. They will not be something that comes first to mind. It has to be something that is done almost daily. It has to be how decisions are made. So if you roll up to a job site, uh, unless say one of your core values is always given the customer 110%, you get ready to leave that job site. You look around and it's 90%.
00:20:21
Speaker
you know, hold each other accountable and say, guys, we got to go clean that trash up. We got to go do this. We got to go do that. Then it's 110%. So it's that constant revisiting of the core value on real life examples and making it, making people, you know, hold to it. Um, it's kind of like, you know, the squeaky wheel gets degrees or the loudest person in the room. Core values are very much that way. If you're not talking about them as leadership,
00:20:46
Speaker
someone else is going to feel that quiet time with something else, whether that's complaining about the company, complaining about you as a leader, complaining about their coworkers, make the conversation positive and make the conversation about what actually matters, which is the core values. And I think that there's another parallel for the military organization. So the core values almost in some cases can serve as the overall objective in that
00:21:12
Speaker
in the absence of orders and we'll take it for the long care landscape, we're right of way clearer the trades, but it really across any organization, not all the time does the plan work out exactly the way you thought it would.
Empowering Employees with Core Values
00:21:26
Speaker
And there are variables that change once you actually get out into the field or you're on the battlefield. And if you have to wait for guidance and directive, and it's a micromanagement type environment where you've always got somebody dictating
00:21:40
Speaker
You're just going to be moving a lot slower and you're potentially not going to be able to move at the speed of change, which will actually be to the detriment long-term. You, you'll lead to more failures than successes. You don't have a dynamic work where as opposed to if everybody down to the lowest level understands what the overall objective is. This is what we're trying to achieve. This is what we're going after. So you take the customer gets a hundred, a hundred percent all the time.
00:22:12
Speaker
If somebody is the lowest level new hire was out on the job site and saw something as long as they have the, I know that what we're trying to achieve are our mission statement, our core values as an organization. I'm layering that and seeing this job site or what I'm working on through those core values and something doesn't look right. I think what we probably need to do is something here that's going to affect the customer in a negative way. They can always look at the objectives.
00:22:41
Speaker
or look at the actions, whatever they're doing through that lens. And even then, if they did something that was incorrect when it comes back and they're doing an after action debrief at the end of the day with the crew, and it turns out that what they did was incorrect. They can then come back and it's a lot more leaning to this. Here's why I did that. I was trying to apply the objective of doing what was right for the customer. They clearly articulate
00:23:10
Speaker
what they did or why they did what they did and then it opens that dialogue to help improve them as an individual but at least you knew where they were coming from and they could clearly articulate this is the objective I thought it was going to get as closer to it and they were acting in a manner that was consistent with the company and what they believed was right according to what your organization represented and so it really but that that comes down to
00:23:38
Speaker
So you're saying it can't be just something hanging on the wall. If you spent the time and that's really what you're representing, you've got to be communicating that down at all levels back and forth so that they can see through the lens, but it allows them to have decentralized command and leadership. They're leading themselves. They're leading their team. They're leading themselves away from the hierarchy, always waiting for guidance and they can go effect change much faster and
00:24:07
Speaker
They're going to know more out in the field with hands-on than what you could see if you were not co-located with them. So it empowers them to handle whatever's needed when they need to and take care of issues before it potentially spirals off into a bigger problem because they're waiting for guidance. Yeah, I like that. You know, because your core values should be, you don't want them to be so long that you've got to actually put a ton of thought into memorizing them.
00:24:36
Speaker
but they should be concise and to the point in that, that like you said, if, if something happens on a job that they don't need to call me or another leader at the company for every little answer, like they should be able to think through those core values and say, well, this is pretty obvious. This is what we need to do as a crew on this job site. Um, or maybe that's the wrong answer, but then I should be able to, as a leader, look back and like, Hey, you, you did the right thing. Maybe we lost a little bit of money.
00:25:05
Speaker
That's, you know, a different issue altogether. We'll work on that, but the core values, you met those, you know, so that the crew would still get a hat on the back for that. So I think that's key. Uh, just like the Jocko, uh, so Jocko, they, they wrote, uh, discipline equals freedom, which is the first one about taking leadership to the lowest level and at all levels and back and forth. But they quickly, after that book was released, had to release a second book, kind of a partner to it called the dichotomy of leadership. Cause it can be taken too far where you're so detached that
00:25:35
Speaker
you as a leader don't even know what's going on and taking too much ownership where maybe you're not addressing the problem. So there's a balance to that too. You definitely want to empower with the objectives of beliefs, the core beliefs and the core values down to the lowest level and they're taking ownership, but there's also a break point and a balance too that doesn't for the leader, if you're leading multiple crews,
00:25:59
Speaker
and you're not on site with all of them, you still need to be checking in and know what's going on. And they need to be comfortable with coming to you and your organization will understand based on your own individual culture and the way you run your operations, where those break points are, but there's a balance. But most people over index on one and don't push and empower to the lowest level enough. Yeah. Now I like that. And yeah, one thing that comes to mind a little bit too is
00:26:29
Speaker
As a leader, and it should be all of your management team for sure, but especially the main leader, whether that's CEO or president or whatever.
Leaders Embodying Core Values
00:26:35
Speaker
You have to absolutely live these core values out. Like you, you, you cannot be one who has these and force it, encourage it. But then when they watch you, they're like, man, you don't do one, three and five at all. So, you know, the only way you can build a work as a leadership and culture really is from the top. You know, you're setting the standard, you're setting the tone.
00:26:58
Speaker
And then you're encouraging that every single day. One thing we kind of kicked off the podcast with, which is another element of this is evaluations. Uh, I don't want to reiterate too much of that, but I just want to kind of keep things in a little bit of an order. So you've, you've built culture, you've implemented that. It took you a few years or whatever. You, you've, you've, you've established yourself in your industry as this is who land a quarter. This is whoever, whatever organization you are. This is who we are and what we stand for. And this is our standard. This is how we operate.
00:27:25
Speaker
then you're doing the onboarding, you're doing all that stuff to kind of really set those standards for the new hire. But evaluations is an important part of that too, because typically if you have those high core values and high standards, you're probably bringing forth a little bit more of a driven individual, which means that driven individual wants to probably know there's some advancement opportunities within your organization. Those evaluation periods are a good thing. I recommend every three months, six months max,
00:27:55
Speaker
That way there's a long enough period of time where you can say, Hey, you're killing it on these eight items, like nailing it core values. You exhibit those. There's these two areas where we could see a little bit of improvement. So you're giving that employee the positive feedback. You're reminding the core values matter. If there's one, they're not doing well enough and you give them constructive feedback on that one. Um, but then you're also doing a goal setting, you know, so where, where do you want to be? What does your life look like in one year, three years, 10 years?
00:28:25
Speaker
And then how does that fit within this organization? So your, your goal setting with them and then letting them know, Hey, to get there, this is what you'll need to do over the next one year, three years, five years. You'll need this training. You'll need to go to this kind of a job site and get some experience there. You know, if they want to do bidding and estimating, well, that's not something you just like to shove somebody into. So then you got to build in, Hey, these little small jobs, we'll have you do those. We'll see how you do. We'll get feedback in advance from there.
00:28:53
Speaker
But that's an important part of this as well, because those driven individuals have to know, hey, I have a future here, but then you as the leader, and you can't lie about this, but you have to have a vision that's big enough for your company that Travis's, Brent's, everyone else's visions can fit inside of that one vision.
Growth Opportunities for Driven Employees
00:29:12
Speaker
Because if I go out and I'm setting this tiny little vision, like, hey, we're gonna grow 2% per year, well, as a driven individual, I'm thinking, okay, well, it's time to go elsewhere.
00:29:22
Speaker
Because the top is pretty close to where I'm already at. So you've got to set a big enough vision to say, you like that position. We're going to grow fast enough. We're going to get more of those positions available. But again, you can't lie about that. You actually have to be able to deliver that and execute on it. But that evaluation period, I think way too many companies don't put quite enough effort because a lot of companies don't like to give raises. And that's what evaluations are typically viewed as, is the opportunity to get a raise.
00:29:52
Speaker
But once you've got that culture and you've got those employees, then you need to keep those employees. And that evaluation process is allowing that growth to happen from a pay perspective. But it's an awesome opportunity to say, hey, you are awesome at these things. I do need to see some feedback and some constructive criticism and then give them feedback on that later, like in a month, maybe afterward. Hey, I'm seeing you've made some improvements. That's awesome. So I think.
00:30:22
Speaker
taking your organization and thinking through those different steps, but then also knowing, guys, this is not going to be, I want to implement this tomorrow. And by three months from now, we're rocking and rolling. We're the, the most culture driven, high, high energy organization in the world. It will take time. Um, and it'll take you time to find those employees and probably remove some that don't meet that, which would be tough conversations and tough things for you to do as an owner or leader.
00:30:50
Speaker
but it will be required at some point. So you're going to have some previous employees. If you're implementing this after the fact, which a lot of people do, you're going to have some employees that don't meet it. You know, maybe they were great at whatever, but they do not meet this. And if you do not get rid of them or repair that, you will have a very, very hard time developing that culture because they will develop a counterculture to yours. So the feedback.
00:31:17
Speaker
Peace. I know this is, this is such a delicate balance because the, so even the three months, that's better than what a lot of people do. And, and there's, there's maybe different perspectives too, in that if you're doing, and some organizations do this, some, some don't, but if you're doing at the end of the day, after action type reports for the military or debriefs, if you will.
00:31:43
Speaker
but it's the getting the crew back together, recapping, hey, this is what went on for the day, this is what's coming up tomorrow, taking those opportunities. That's almost micro feedback sessions too, in that it, so I love the analogies of a ship or an aircraft. If it's off one degree off target, when it starts from its end point, by the time you get a few hours into its journey, you're off by a lot. And so,
00:32:11
Speaker
the longer you drag those feedback sessions out, they can be off course significantly if that's the only time is six months. And I even think three months is probably too long, but it depends on what other checks and balances you have in your organization. If your individual team leaders, crew leaders out there in the field are not just task focused on the job, that's obviously part of their job,
00:32:41
Speaker
But they're also wearing a leadership hat. And at the end of the day, they're having those conversations. They're plugged into their teams. They are working together. They'll have that ongoing day-to-day feedback and be able to give and receive feedback from those individual team members. They just have to be deliberately wearing that hat from the leadership standpoint of I'm building this relationship. I'm building them as a person. I'm building them as a part of their career and their objectives, which that also requires some foundational things that
00:33:09
Speaker
they have to have in place.
Feedback Loops and Trend Analysis
00:33:11
Speaker
I'm working towards this structured bonus plan or career progression plan with them. So now on the day to day basis, I'm kind of micro evaluating, giving feedback and doing micro adjustments. And then there's the documentation piece too. I know it's probably the least favorite of any organization to go document, but it's important to document that stuff. So I was a part of an organization where
00:33:36
Speaker
It was weekly. You did weekly one-on-ones with your team and the larger that team got, especially when they weren't co-located with you, it was really tough as a leader. And a lot of times those would get postponed or moved and you do what you have to. That's maybe too much just because what happens is you've put that expectation. It's almost a full-time job just, and if they've got dual responsibility, if they're supposed to be
00:34:01
Speaker
doing individual performance and tasks out on site and things. And then they've got the manager hat where they got all these managerial and documentation. There's probably a balance in there. Um, but having that constant feedback and be able to, because things get lost on a day to day basis. If you're not revisiting this for two weeks, there's little wins or things that that person or those people on your team did that like, that was amazing. I want to reinforce that behavior.
00:34:28
Speaker
that's definitely on track and I actually want to document that and replicate that thought process or whatever in the rest of the team that gets lost if you're not if you're just bam bam bam job job job focused and then when it comes down to two weeks or three months you've completely lost all of that or if there was something I notice they're off on this and maybe they're not doing something incorrectly maybe I addressed it on the spot but never revisit it didn't document it have no it
00:34:55
Speaker
There might be a trend that might be an indicator that, hey, maybe we're not talking about this at the beginning. Maybe there's a safety training thing or an equipment orientation thing that we're missing on this because it maybe popped up over here. And two, you can see trends and patterns across groups or teams. Maybe it's two crew leaders working in different parts of the country and they're having the same challenges, whether it's behavioral leadership or technical, where it's safety or equipment operation.
00:35:25
Speaker
And it was minor at the time, so it never really got addressed, but maybe there's a pattern there that's indicative of higher things that aren't happening or things that can be adjusted that you would never even know is happening unless you did document, unless you did have those structured things. When I think each individual project, if you can have KPIs, I love KPIs. So if you can have your individual projects where you're reviewing those KPIs,
00:35:54
Speaker
Maybe that's something you're doing on a little bit more frequent basis, you know. And AI is going to be able to help us with this stuff. If we can document it, there's programs that can go look for trends and patterns and pull some data and things. So there's tools out there too. You know, I couldn't inject technology or innovation. But no, I mean, like even Atlantic Warp, like, you know, I think we have a strong,
00:36:22
Speaker
core value and awesome culture. And I look at, for the most part, I'm dealing with our management team on a daily basis. So that's my interaction throughout the day. And like the one we have now, like I would put them up against any of our competition. I actually would take them over most of them. So we deal in oil and gas. I would take my management team over most of our customers management team, just because of how good they are, the follow through, the engagement, the passion,
00:36:52
Speaker
Um, how they meet those core values. Like they're actually people that they don't just fit a role need. Like I actually liked them as people. I would hang out with them outside of work happily. That matters so much. And I look at the group we have now versus several, several years ago, and this is not dissing those. It just didn't have that core value fit yet.
00:37:15
Speaker
Now that it does, job is so much nicer, so much better. I always enjoy going to work, but now I actually enjoy the people I work with, again, could hang out with them on a Saturday or Sunday after work. But that's that culture. You brought up like trends and stuff like that. So safety is one of our big things because we work on oil and gas and part of our culture, what we do is dangerous. So safety is a big deal to us. We want everybody to go home, same condition they came to work in.
00:37:43
Speaker
So in safety, you know, there's this thing called near misses. So meaning that something almost happened, but it didn't quite happen. And then there's BBS, behavior-based safety. There's all these different tools where we are trying to find a pattern before it actually becomes an incident.
00:38:00
Speaker
And the value of that data is like you just said, if we can identify that pattern, identify a trend before it becomes something major and then prevent it and put tools in place to prevent it.
Improving Safety through Data Analysis
00:38:10
Speaker
That's the goal of it. And I think, you know, to just to kind of give like a real world example to what you're talking about in this industry, that's one of the easy ones. Like there's so much data there, but you got to collect it. You know, it's not, it doesn't just come in for the most part.
00:38:24
Speaker
Most people, if they have a near miss and you don't want that information, request that information, or have some kind of reward system for turning it in, probably going to look the other way and be like, well, that was a close call, but I'm fine. One day that may not be a close call for you, or because you didn't submit something or turn something in, and that's where your brother's keeper. If you didn't turn something in, and now two years later, that wasn't ever repaired or fixed.
00:38:51
Speaker
Now, all of a sudden your, your coworker actually got hurt or died or whatever. Um, so it kind of brings that personal element to it, but, um, kind of start to wrap this up a little bit, Travis, are there any kind of closing thoughts, mental thoughts you have?
Structure and Culture for Talent Attraction
00:39:05
Speaker
No, I mean, it, the topic is super important, but the underlying component is structure, developing a deliberate and consistent structure.
00:39:18
Speaker
whatever that might be for you, but, and then layer this on top of it of, uh, I know we started out with talent acquisition retention, but it ties into culture, uh, specifically in that that drives all of it, but being very deliberate in structuring what you want to really on. And then you can build upon it and adjust it and tweak it. But the, the sooner you can get that structure in.
00:39:45
Speaker
the more stable the foundation and you're going to put it in. If you're going to survive as an organization, you're going to put it in at some point early and you can always tweak it as you grow because you probably are going to have to get as you grow. Yeah. No, I like that. And we spent most of our time kind of talking about retaining. I feel like in a nutshell though, attracting, once you have built this culture, this system and you have all this in place,
00:40:14
Speaker
One of the most powerful ways to attract is by word of mouth. Once you have that stuff in place, and hopefully you're also doing some kind of PR or marketing to get that out there, and then all of a sudden, worker A that's working for your competitor, this one over here, this other competitor, all of a sudden they realize, hey, this company here, there's something different, and I don't feel that where I work.
00:40:36
Speaker
That is the most powerful attraction, attracting method for a new employee out there is that where when they think, Hey, I'm frustrated with my current job, my current employer, whatever. And it feels like when I look at this company here, it's different. They don't have that issue. That's where I'm going to go. So that's what you want from the attraction standpoint.
00:41:00
Speaker
market a little bit, but don't over, don't lie market, you know, make sure everything's accurate, but highlight your wins and highlight that culture a little bit. And that's how your other employer, potential future employers are going to say, Hey, there's nothing here. Strong company culture, clear core values, articulate that at every point and make that consistent across every aspect of your company and join the Marines.
00:41:27
Speaker
There you go. That's the perfect wrap-up. That's the perfect wrap-up. That's the perfect wrap-up. Right there, we have to do it now. But in all seriousness, no guys, for you guys and gals listening, it's not easy, but it is going to be so worth it. If you're wanting to grow your company and have a strong company that can make it for a decade, two decades, three decades and on, you've got to do this. So put forth the effort. Like we've talked about earlier, there's always two ways to do something and it's going to be hard.
00:41:55
Speaker
This is hard. The alternative to me is actually harder. I would pick this hard over the other one. So guys, if you enjoyed this podcast, share it with others. If you didn't tune on out, we'll catch you guys next time. Thank you.