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Ep 107: Pulp Fiction with Butch Peel
100 Plays3 years ago
Butch Peel from CGC joins us to talk all things Pulp Fiction. Also he clears up so of the confusion surrounding the game.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Episode 107
00:00:01
Speaker
Thanks for tuning in to the loser kid pinball podcast.
00:00:04
Speaker
It is episode one Oh seven with me, my co pilot, as always Scott Larson and I am Josh Roop.
00:00:11
Speaker
And this week we have a very special guest on the Scott, before we get to that guest, we'll see.
00:00:16
Speaker
We
Flipping Out Pinball Offerings
00:00:17
Speaker
want to talk about, uh, flipping out pinball.
00:00:19
Speaker
If you have that itch and you want to scratch it, please call contact Zach and Nicole, many at flipping out pinball.
00:00:25
Speaker
They have all things pinball and even other stuff.
00:00:28
Speaker
If you, uh,
00:00:29
Speaker
want to put a golden tea in your room or a, Hey, if you want to do one of those raw thrills, Jurassic park games, and just drive that into your basement, they can hook you up.
00:00:40
Speaker
They've always been really good to work with.
00:00:42
Speaker
And so just reach out to them.
00:00:46
Speaker
go to flipping out pinball.
00:00:47
Speaker
Zach is very responsive through texting and, and Facebook, but there's also a contact number there for him.
00:00:54
Speaker
So just reach out.
00:00:55
Speaker
They've always been good friends of the show.
00:00:57
Speaker
And it sounds like they've got some pulp fiction still available, not the L E's.
00:01:00
Speaker
Those things want like hotcakes, but if you're looking for that classic edition,
00:01:05
Speaker
You can definitely get your hands on them.
00:01:07
Speaker
Definitely worth your money.
00:01:08
Speaker
I heard it was amazing at Texas Pinball Festival.
00:01:12
Speaker
We want to get someone on to talk a little bit more about it because there's been some information floating around and we want some solid answers, right?
Interview with Butch Pill on Pulp Fiction Pinball
00:01:19
Speaker
So we asked our good friend Butch Pill to come back on.
00:01:22
Speaker
It's been a couple of years, Butch.
00:01:23
Speaker
How you been doing?
00:01:24
Speaker
I've been doing great.
00:01:25
Speaker
It's nice to be able to talk about what I've been doing.
00:01:30
Speaker
What exactly have you been doing with CGC?
00:01:32
Speaker
It's been a couple of years since we last talked to you.
00:01:36
Speaker
Well, you know, you guys brought me on when I first joined up with CGC.
00:01:40
Speaker
And of course, all this stuff was super secret back then.
00:01:43
Speaker
But, you know, when I very first talked to them on the phone and I heard about the project that was undergoing with Mark and doing Pulp Fiction and being in a position to do the manual for Mark's comeback game, that was really exciting.
00:01:59
Speaker
prospect for me.
00:02:00
Speaker
So it's like, yeah, like, like when they asked Mark, if he wanted to do a pinball, I'm like, yeah, I'm on board.
00:02:06
Speaker
Heck yeah.
00:02:06
Speaker
Sure.
00:02:07
Speaker
Where let's go.
00:02:09
Speaker
So we've been, I've been working on the manual now, like, like we have been with the game, the Chicago gaming play mechanics going back and forth, you know, and, and trying to constantly trying to improve things.
00:02:22
Speaker
We've had a lot of people talk about bake time for this game, a lot of time for it to, to get, you know,
00:02:28
Speaker
the cream to rise up the things that we really liked in the games to, to make sure that we got them tweaked up and working as well as we possibly could.
00:02:36
Speaker
So there's a lot of changes and things.
00:02:38
Speaker
I document stuff and have to go back and change things because we updated and all that.
00:02:42
Speaker
So it's, it's been a, it's been a long process to get to where we're at, but it's so exciting to be able to see people over the Texas pinball festival weekends play and actually enjoy the
00:02:53
Speaker
what we've been working so hard on.
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Speaker
And Marcus and those guys that play mechanics and CGC, especially before I came on board many years, even before I even started.
00:03:01
Speaker
But man, it's been a great, fun, fun thing to work on.
00:03:05
Speaker
Now, when you guys go to, when you go to shows and you're, you're displaying the game, what are you guys looking to bring back from the experience of the show?
00:03:18
Speaker
Well, we get, for one thing, you've got a lot of audits on the game.
00:03:21
Speaker
So the game keeps track during all the play during the weekend, the heavy, continuous play.
00:03:28
Speaker
You get a lot of feedback on what kind of shots are being hit, how many modes are being started, how many people are finishing them, how many jackpots they collect, whether they are able to complete the modes.
00:03:38
Speaker
If anybody gets all the way through to some of these mini modes, wizard modes, and whether those are completed and how far they get and how many times that happens, how long the balls last,
00:03:48
Speaker
you know, how long play is, you know, you get a lot of, a lot of feedback for Josh, especially like on his rules and things to see how difficult things were.
00:03:56
Speaker
Did it seem like people were kind of progressing in the game a little bit?
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Speaker
Did it seem like everything was stonewalled or, you know, how approachable was the game?
00:04:05
Speaker
How many times can people get multi-ball?
00:04:07
Speaker
How many, how many games, you know, it took for, for certain features to be revealed and,
00:04:13
Speaker
A lot of good feedback there.
00:04:14
Speaker
And we're also standing there watching people play the games too.
00:04:17
Speaker
And you're just seeing people's reactions and the people that you had two or three people playing and you'd have two of them sitting up there with their ear next to the speaker listening to the call out so they could hear better.
00:04:28
Speaker
And, you know, just a smile and the...
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Speaker
The joy of people seeing this game.
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Speaker
I knew it when we had video out of the game and people saw that and they got really excited over that.
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Speaker
I told Mark, I said, when people are able to play and hear the game, it's going to be that much better.
00:04:47
Speaker
And it really was.
00:04:48
Speaker
So a lot of different angles you pick up.
00:04:50
Speaker
And of course, you see if things break, you see how things hold up.
00:04:54
Speaker
You get a lot of information when you play a game for three days straight like that.
00:04:59
Speaker
Four of them in this case.
00:05:02
Speaker
Well, and from all the feedback that I've got from Texas Pinball Festival, people are loving this game.
00:05:07
Speaker
It's easily in the top three of everyone's choices I've heard.
00:05:10
Speaker
And the theme integration that you guys went with has been astounding.
00:05:15
Speaker
Someone had mentioned the shot, which I guess is one of the final modes.
00:05:19
Speaker
And just the integration of the lights, you know, that scene in Pulp Fiction when they're trying to revive Uma Thurman's character is
00:05:28
Speaker
And you guys have integrated the lights, so it's like heartbeats
Collaborative Game Design Efforts
00:05:31
Speaker
and you're hearing our heartbeat.
00:05:33
Speaker
It's amazing.
00:05:36
Speaker
I actually was with David Thiel when he met the guys at Play Mechanics for the first time.
00:05:41
Speaker
And it was right around expo time last year.
00:05:43
Speaker
He came to the expo last year.
00:05:45
Speaker
We went over to Play Mechanics, he and I. And then we went to CGC together and I introduced him to Mark for the first time in person they met.
00:05:52
Speaker
It was kind of cool.
00:05:53
Speaker
But I saw George show David Thiel and got to listen and see.
00:05:59
Speaker
David had never seen a topper before.
00:06:01
Speaker
He was still working with a game without a topper, his development game.
00:06:06
Speaker
and to see him look at all of his, and he doesn't have RGB LEDs, all these kinds of things in his game that, that are just really cool in the final.
00:06:14
Speaker
And to see how George choreographed to his sound, how the lights and everything worked.
00:06:19
Speaker
And you're like, you say, that's a, that's one of the, that is the final role scene mode.
00:06:23
Speaker
That's the last one you have to complete all the others to get up to it.
00:06:27
Speaker
So, you know, it is really hard to get there, but man, it was so amazing watching the topper and the lights and everything changing and,
00:06:34
Speaker
heart beating and the lights going in and out and the colors changing and then how he choreographed that with the sounds and the coughing and things that she was doing.
00:06:43
Speaker
It was amazing.
00:06:44
Speaker
It was really amazing.
00:06:46
Speaker
And to see David's face, you know, he was just crazy excited about it.
00:06:51
Speaker
Well, I want to know, too, you know, there is a lot of emphasis.
00:06:54
Speaker
This is a Chicago gaming company game with play mechanics.
00:06:58
Speaker
What are we looking percentage wise?
00:06:59
Speaker
Is it just kind of Chicago gaming's producing the game or have you guys had a lot of input with how the game has been built?
00:07:07
Speaker
Well, that's something I've been working my way through the Pulp Fiction hype thread on Pinside.
00:07:14
Speaker
76 pages is a long ways to get through.
00:07:16
Speaker
That's a lot of posts and a lot of repetitive stuff and a lot of off topic and everything, but trying to...
00:07:25
Speaker
trying to go through some of that.
00:07:26
Speaker
And I've seen that people just seem to be really confused about how the breakdown came about, what exactly each company is doing.
00:07:34
Speaker
And the best way I can describe it, it started as a production and distribution and marketing
00:07:42
Speaker
you know, that the website and things like that would be on CGC's side of the fence.
00:07:49
Speaker
And then the design and development and all that would be on play mechanics.
00:07:53
Speaker
But they really got a lot more blurred than that during the production and development of the game.
00:07:58
Speaker
So, you know, it's really a collaborative partnership.
00:08:02
Speaker
I've had some input with Mark on, you know, some things on the game that we, Jim Thornton and I got together and
00:08:11
Speaker
and dress the game all up in that black anodized hardware.
00:08:16
Speaker
Just, you know, we had said, well, would Mark like this?
00:08:19
Speaker
And they were kind of at CGC.
00:08:21
Speaker
They were like, well, I think we were thinking of doing that at the one time and that we didn't really like it.
00:08:25
Speaker
But Jim and I fixed the game up like that.
00:08:27
Speaker
Mark was coming over that afternoon.
00:08:29
Speaker
We changed all the hardware out and he looked at it and he said, I love it.
00:08:31
Speaker
I love it.
00:08:32
Speaker
I love it.
00:08:32
Speaker
So we went with it.
00:08:33
Speaker
you know, so things like that just, just happened.
00:08:36
Speaker
I, I talked to him about rubber rings at the beginning and replacing some things.
00:08:40
Speaker
We, we decided to put the passive ball stop in the ball trough to protect all the, you know, blast the plastic back panel and all of the beautiful sculptures and things on the game.
00:08:51
Speaker
So, and yeah, Doug working with him hand in hand with George doing the programming of the, of the topper and the mechanics of the topper.
00:08:59
Speaker
It's really a,
00:09:01
Speaker
It's really blurred as to who does what.
00:09:04
Speaker
It's a team effort, and we really, all parts of it.
00:09:07
Speaker
Play Mechanics helped them with the marketing and things, the materials too, and helped outline what we wanted and wanted to put on the website to coincide with the teasers and everything.
00:09:19
Speaker
Everything just came together perfectly and fit.
00:09:22
Speaker
So it was really cool.
00:09:23
Speaker
And it's a team effort.
00:09:26
Speaker
There's no stovepipes there where you stay in your lane and no one was ever told to do any of that.
00:09:32
Speaker
So it's been really cool.
00:09:34
Speaker
If somebody had an idea, they floated it.
00:09:36
Speaker
If everybody liked it, we went with it.
00:09:38
Speaker
If people didn't like it, they weren't afraid to say, I really don't think that's a good idea.
00:09:44
Speaker
So it was a great team effort.
00:09:46
Speaker
And this has been an amazing team to work with too.
00:09:49
Speaker
It's just been very fun.
00:09:52
Speaker
This seems to be a game that everybody that was involved was really excited for this theme and really excited for the integration.
00:10:02
Speaker
You can tell when it seems like a team's like, yeah, I got this assignment and I put it together.
00:10:08
Speaker
This seemed like a passion project for everybody.
00:10:12
Speaker
Yeah, starting with Quentin Tarantino, I think.
00:10:15
Speaker
I mean, all the way down to the guys building him on the line.
00:10:19
Speaker
It's amazing, the passion flowing through this.
00:10:23
Speaker
I had said in my Texas presentation when me and Mark were up there that, you know, that the guy that started Atari had said when he started, he hired passion.
00:10:36
Speaker
And that's what made Atari explode so quickly, you know.
00:10:40
Speaker
And this is a guy that had, you know, Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak working for him in his garage, you know, when he started this thing.
00:10:49
Speaker
But it's like passion,
00:10:51
Speaker
breaks through barriers.
00:10:52
Speaker
Passion doesn't take no for an answer.
00:10:54
Speaker
Passion does whatever it takes to make it work.
00:10:56
Speaker
They work extra hours.
00:10:58
Speaker
They put extra effort into it.
00:11:00
Speaker
And everybody, as George put it to me one time, George Petro, everybody doing everything they can to make the game better.
00:11:08
Speaker
And it's really about the game.
00:11:10
Speaker
It's not about trying to self promote or anything like that.
00:11:12
Speaker
It was being proud to be part of something that as a whole, you could say I helped with that.
00:11:19
Speaker
It wasn't something I did by myself, but I was part of that.
00:11:22
Speaker
And it's really cool.
00:11:25
Speaker
So for the people who are involved in the process,
00:11:30
Speaker
to get a game on your own.
00:11:31
Speaker
So how does this work?
00:11:32
Speaker
Do you guys have to go into the same, the same network that everybody else has to go through?
00:11:39
Speaker
Do you get like a players, you know, I guess a collaborators edition, something that you guys can get.
00:11:46
Speaker
I'm just curious how this all works.
00:11:48
Speaker
You get a team T-shirt.
00:11:50
Speaker
That's a little T-shirt.
00:11:51
Speaker
Yeah.
00:11:51
Speaker
That's kind of cool.
00:11:52
Speaker
Everybody was asking about those at Texas.
00:11:54
Speaker
So they're pretty bad.
00:11:56
Speaker
You know, bad mother flipper on the back, I say.
00:11:58
Speaker
You know, so there's not a lot of people with those around.
00:12:00
Speaker
But, you know, I got my prototype Pulp Fiction a couple of weeks before Christmas.
00:12:06
Speaker
So I've had one for quite a while.
00:12:08
Speaker
And I was one of the
Owning and Manufacturing Pulp Fiction Pinball
00:12:09
Speaker
last guys to get it.
00:12:09
Speaker
Josh had one for quite a while.
00:12:11
Speaker
They've had them over at Mark and George's place at Play Mechanics for quite a while.
00:12:17
Speaker
Dave had a development game, but his was an older one.
00:12:20
Speaker
And I, to me, I'd rather have a prototype one than the production ones.
00:12:26
Speaker
But, you know, if Chance gets to get a production one too, that'll be cool too.
00:12:31
Speaker
But mine's an LE, so it will have a topper.
00:12:33
Speaker
It doesn't have one yet, but I will have the topper and everything.
00:12:37
Speaker
And it's just really cool to... That was part of the first thing.
00:12:41
Speaker
I talked to Doug when I was getting offered the job at CGC.
00:12:45
Speaker
I said...
00:12:46
Speaker
every new, new game.
00:12:47
Speaker
I get one that that's, that's take that as part of my, you know, the component of my pay.
00:12:52
Speaker
Cause I'm a fan boy and a pinball collector first and foremost.
00:12:56
Speaker
And I just love this stuff.
00:12:58
Speaker
So yeah, it is, it is cool.
00:13:01
Speaker
I mean, when the LEs come out, they'll officially have a group of them.
00:13:06
Speaker
I'm sure that are, that are set aside for the team.
00:13:08
Speaker
You know, the artists at play mechanics, Scott Pekulski and,
00:13:12
Speaker
and George and, and I'm sure everybody over there will get one that worked on the game.
00:13:16
Speaker
It's, it's just a cool thing.
00:13:18
Speaker
Something you were very proud of.
00:13:22
Speaker
Well, and what shocked me is like, you guys had talked about, uh, I think it was on the featurette, how Doug wanted to make the topper.
00:13:32
Speaker
I don't know many presidents of companies are like, you know what?
00:13:35
Speaker
I'll be back in like a week with the topper.
00:13:37
Speaker
And this thing is astounding too.
00:13:38
Speaker
Like I, I,
00:13:40
Speaker
I think that's why they sold out so quick is these toppers are like a big creator.
00:13:44
Speaker
Yeah.
00:13:45
Speaker
The topper is great.
00:13:46
Speaker
CGC does toppers the best.
00:13:49
Speaker
Yes.
00:13:50
Speaker
And where did that come from?
00:13:51
Speaker
I mean, you know, that stuff, that's been Doug's kind of niche.
00:13:55
Speaker
He's, he's really gotten involved with those toppers and, and he, he feels like he's got to outdo himself every time.
00:14:01
Speaker
It's like how we were talking about it during cactus Canyon, you know, topper days is how are we ever going to make something better than this?
00:14:08
Speaker
Or, you know, that measures up to this.
00:14:10
Speaker
I think you did.
00:14:12
Speaker
And I have a cactus Canyon.
00:14:14
Speaker
I think that this is more eye catching.
00:14:17
Speaker
And I guarantee you there's more aspects to Doug Duba than just, yeah, doing toppers and disappearing for a while.
00:14:22
Speaker
The guy immerses himself in all kinds of things.
00:14:25
Speaker
And you'll, you will never meet another guy that runs a company.
00:14:28
Speaker
That's, that's like Doug Duba just on a bunch of different fronts.
00:14:32
Speaker
He's, he's involved with everything and that's the way he loves it.
00:14:35
Speaker
It's why he does it.
00:14:36
Speaker
So.
00:14:37
Speaker
Yeah.
00:14:39
Speaker
No, he's doing a great job there and it's showing, right?
00:14:43
Speaker
And, you know, David Thiel coming in, we were talking about David Thiel earlier and hearing the music and all that.
00:14:50
Speaker
It's kind of an interesting story the way he came into play because when I started, as soon as I started in 2020, I went out to dinner with Doug the first week that I was up here in Chicago, up in Chicago.
00:15:01
Speaker
And he said, you know, anybody who does sound, we need a sound guy really bad.
00:15:06
Speaker
And I said, well, you know,
00:15:08
Speaker
One of my best friends, David Thiel, does sound and he says, well, can you talk to him and see if he's interested in doing it?
00:15:14
Speaker
And I had just talked to him like the week before and I knew where he was at with the deep root stuff.
00:15:18
Speaker
He was still involved with that.
00:15:21
Speaker
He was still under a quote unquote exclusive contract, but it was kind of ebbing and coming to an end.
00:15:26
Speaker
Things were not doing so well.
00:15:28
Speaker
Let's just say that over there.
00:15:30
Speaker
and i knew david's relationship with them was deteriorating so i mentioned to him you know about the pulp fiction thing i couldn't tell him what it was exactly you know the title but i told him you know that play mechanics and cgc needed a sound guy and he was very happy to to contact the guys that at deep root and see if they would take him out of his exclusive uh role there so that he could do some side work and they did and
00:15:58
Speaker
Mark was ready to pass on.
00:15:59
Speaker
He's like, I talked to Dave.
00:16:01
Speaker
He's still under contract with Deep Root.
00:16:02
Speaker
It's not going to work.
00:16:04
Speaker
Sorry, that didn't work out.
00:16:06
Speaker
I wasn't going to let that happen.
00:16:10
Speaker
I was like, wait a minute, wait a minute.
00:16:11
Speaker
We can work something out.
00:16:12
Speaker
I'm sure we can.
00:16:13
Speaker
We were able to.
00:16:14
Speaker
It's really cool.
00:16:16
Speaker
I'm really proud to have been able to help make that happen.
00:16:20
Speaker
Definitely.
00:16:23
Speaker
Go ahead, Josh.
00:16:24
Speaker
I was, well, actually, no, you go ahead, Scott, because I feel like my question.
00:16:28
Speaker
You go again.
00:16:29
Speaker
No, you go ahead.
00:16:30
Speaker
All right.
00:16:30
Speaker
You do it.
00:16:31
Speaker
You, you, you, you.
00:16:32
Speaker
Okay.
00:16:33
Speaker
Me.
00:16:34
Speaker
Okay.
00:16:34
Speaker
So let's talk about there.
00:16:36
Speaker
I guess there were some mixed messages and I know this is hard with manufacturing to, to nail down anything.
00:16:42
Speaker
So,
00:16:43
Speaker
We know that there is no official manufacturing guideline of we're going to put these out first and then these out.
00:16:51
Speaker
I would venture to say that this is more of a collaborative process.
00:16:57
Speaker
You're trying to get some out there so people can see them.
00:17:01
Speaker
And that's a very similar marketing that other manufacturers have been able to do.
00:17:08
Speaker
We know that Stern does that.
00:17:10
Speaker
What is your approach to these games?
00:17:13
Speaker
Because there's three models, correct?
00:17:15
Speaker
Right.
00:17:16
Speaker
There's a coin-op edition with a standard cabinet mount start button and a standard black powder-coated Suzo hat, dollar bill acceptor ready coin door.
00:17:31
Speaker
I've been on location.
00:17:32
Speaker
I keep track of a bunch of games for my buddy and down where I live on the weekends,
00:17:39
Speaker
taking care of games, cleaning and repairing a bunch of Stern and JJP and other brand games.
00:17:45
Speaker
And I see people struggling to figure out how to start a game.
00:17:49
Speaker
And our start button on that stainless steel door is very small.
00:17:53
Speaker
It's lit and everything.
00:17:55
Speaker
But I've seen bright flashing lights that these guys just can't see.
00:17:59
Speaker
So it's nice to have that coin-op edition there.
00:18:01
Speaker
I think that's a great idea.
00:18:03
Speaker
And we're going to need dollar bill acceptor.
00:18:06
Speaker
So that's going to be kind of your first priority, right?
00:18:10
Speaker
You want to get it out to the masses.
00:18:11
Speaker
So that's going to be the first thing you want to do.
00:18:14
Speaker
So we came up with that idea and made a special edition, coin-op edition around that.
00:18:19
Speaker
But, you know, the entire not having a date when you're going to ship this thing, it's kind of a natural flowing culmination of the process of designing and getting this game ready.
00:18:31
Speaker
The extra bake time that we had, we're only able to do that because nobody had a schedule and said, you got to do it by this day.
00:18:37
Speaker
It's got to be out.
00:18:38
Speaker
Everybody was doing their other things.
00:18:40
Speaker
And we're doing this, too, on the side.
00:18:42
Speaker
And then it became more and more, you know, getting closer and closer.
00:18:46
Speaker
And we're getting it more and more the way we want it.
00:18:49
Speaker
But there was really no pressure to have it out at this certain time, by this certain date.
00:18:53
Speaker
And so we're just when we're asked about when are they going to be shipping?
00:18:57
Speaker
It just kind of seems natural to say that, you know, we're going to do it as quickly as we can.
00:19:01
Speaker
Like we've done every other part of this process, but we're going to do it right.
00:19:04
Speaker
And we're going to do it.
00:19:06
Speaker
in a certain order.
00:19:07
Speaker
We do have a plan.
00:19:08
Speaker
And the plan is, of course, to get coin-op games out there first so we can get some of these coin-op additions out.
00:19:15
Speaker
We want to make some SEs to get the process down.
00:19:18
Speaker
We like to have everything flowing well and people know how to build things really well.
00:19:22
Speaker
We have no surprises by the time we are putting LEs out.
00:19:26
Speaker
So we'll do a run of SEs and then we'll do some of the LEs after that and run them through all the way and then do more SEs and coin-ops at the end.
00:19:35
Speaker
It's kind of what the plan will be.
00:19:38
Speaker
So when we talked to Mark and Josh, Mark had originally said that they come out with a very rough draft of what they want Pulp Fiction to be.
00:19:46
Speaker
And then Quentin kind of came in and said, I don't want it as modernized, right?
00:19:51
Speaker
Right.
00:19:53
Speaker
But we're also hearing some conflicting ideas of that as well.
00:19:56
Speaker
Can you set the record straight with that, Blitch?
Influence of Quentin Tarantino on Game Design
00:19:59
Speaker
Well, I put a rendition of the
00:20:03
Speaker
initial concept of the concept of the concept way back when this is like you're just your first ideas and i put a picture of that up at texas on one of our first slides and mark talked a little bit about his first wide body design it had a gun handle for the ball shooter he was going to put ramps and a bash toy in there he'd have a subway he was going to have all these ball locks and things he's going to have an lcd on it all these things but when you
00:20:28
Speaker
try and make a visual rendition of that you're just really getting a very very rough thing out there to do exactly what we did in this case find out if you're on the wrong path early on before you put a lot of effort into it so that you can get on the right path before you start really putting a lot of details in it so
00:20:46
Speaker
To see people talking about, well, you know, Quentin Tarantino needs to be credited as part of the designer of this game.
00:20:52
Speaker
That really isn't the way it should go.
00:20:55
Speaker
I mean, he said, you're on the wrong path, Mark.
00:20:59
Speaker
Start again.
00:20:59
Speaker
This is more what I had in mind.
00:21:01
Speaker
He sent some pictures of things like strikes and spares and, you know, some of these hand-drawn artwork and things and said, this is what I'm looking for.
00:21:09
Speaker
I want something that looks like it was from the 70s and 80s.
00:21:13
Speaker
That's a time period that Quentin loves.
00:21:16
Speaker
you know, that's what we were doing.
00:21:18
Speaker
And so back in those days, they really weren't showing every single thing.
00:21:24
Speaker
And he wasn't telling them, you know, move this target over there.
00:21:26
Speaker
You should have, you know, this shouldn't be a vertical up kicker.
00:21:29
Speaker
It should be some kind of ejector.
00:21:31
Speaker
He doesn't have that kind of input into the design.
00:21:34
Speaker
That just didn't happen.
00:21:36
Speaker
And for people to say now that, you know, thank God he got involved or it wouldn't have
00:21:41
Speaker
It would have been a horrible looking game like this.
00:21:44
Speaker
I mean, the concepts are always going to look a little offhanded when you look at the final project and the final product.
00:21:52
Speaker
Definitely.
00:21:53
Speaker
Well, people don't go with their first whitewood.
00:21:55
Speaker
I mean, that's the whole point of having a whitewood is to set it up and try it out and make changes as needed.
00:22:00
Speaker
This is way before a whitewood.
00:22:02
Speaker
This is this concept of what the artwork might look like.
00:22:05
Speaker
And they're just using cut and paste, you know, images from the film and things like that.
00:22:11
Speaker
There's nothing like the game was going to look.
00:22:13
Speaker
It was just a rough.
00:22:14
Speaker
This is kind of what we're thinking to begin with before we even start heading towards a whitewood.
00:22:19
Speaker
And if this isn't what you want, please let us know.
00:22:21
Speaker
And boy, did he let them know.
00:22:25
Speaker
He was not shy about it one bit, huh?
00:22:27
Speaker
Yeah.
00:22:27
Speaker
I mean, he had an idea what in his mind, what it was going to look like, but he couldn't have put it on paper any more than they could have on that concept.
00:22:35
Speaker
Right.
00:22:35
Speaker
You know, but when he saw it, he knew it, you know, and when they hit the mark, that was when it was like, okay, we have an approved artwork.
00:22:42
Speaker
We have an approved, you know, look to the play field.
00:22:45
Speaker
Everything looks okay to him.
00:22:47
Speaker
Characters are right the way he wants it because it's got to be him.
00:22:51
Speaker
Pulp Fiction is Quentin Tarantino's baby, period.
00:22:55
Speaker
Miramax is a rubber stamp kind of sign off on the thing, but he has veto rights on virtually everything.
00:23:00
Speaker
And every single thing in his...
00:23:03
Speaker
Pulp fiction comes right through his desk and he says yes or no to every single thing.
00:23:08
Speaker
That's how important it was to him.
00:23:10
Speaker
Wow.
00:23:10
Speaker
That's that's cool, actually.
00:23:12
Speaker
That license.
00:23:13
Speaker
Yeah.
00:23:13
Speaker
I mean, it just means that much to him.
00:23:15
Speaker
He's that proud of it and doesn't want anything to bend or twist or reshape that image that he's got in his head of what it should be.
00:23:23
Speaker
So
Managing Game Content for Audiences
00:23:24
Speaker
tell me about, this theme can be controversial.
00:23:31
Speaker
It's not gonna go into Chuck E. Cheese, I'll put it that way.
00:23:35
Speaker
This is an exclusive, we're gonna do flipping the script on autism again, and we're gonna be putting one of these in a children's hospital.
00:23:43
Speaker
Yes, yeah, that'd be interesting.
00:23:47
Speaker
Yeah.
00:23:47
Speaker
Adult version.
00:23:48
Speaker
Yes.
00:23:48
Speaker
Yeah, exactly.
00:23:50
Speaker
So if you believe all that, I've got a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.
00:23:54
Speaker
There are bridges in Brooklyn.
00:23:57
Speaker
Okay.
00:23:58
Speaker
So how do you walk that line of trying to figure out, oh, okay.
00:24:02
Speaker
So we're trying to maximize the audience while being true to Pulp Fiction because Pulp Fiction is a movie not for everybody.
00:24:11
Speaker
Pulp Fiction is a vulgar movie.
00:24:13
Speaker
I mean, that's all there is to it.
00:24:14
Speaker
There's a lot of vulgarity in it.
00:24:16
Speaker
And if you're going to do that theme, you've got to be able to add that.
00:24:20
Speaker
You don't want to abandon a lot of the things that made Pulp Fiction what it is.
00:24:24
Speaker
And you can kind of clean them up a little bit.
00:24:28
Speaker
You know right off the bat you've got to do something with the vulgarity.
00:24:31
Speaker
The profanity is just...
00:24:34
Speaker
It's there.
00:24:34
Speaker
It's everywhere.
00:24:35
Speaker
And you're going to do all the call outs.
00:24:37
Speaker
People that are wanting this theme, that love this theme, are in it to a good degree because of Samuel L. Jackson and those words that he uses all the time.
00:24:46
Speaker
And you're going to, you know, right off the bat, you got to make some way to turn that on and off in a game.
00:24:52
Speaker
so that you can kind of clean it up.
00:24:54
Speaker
I mean, but you know also that you're not going to be able to completely clean it up.
00:24:59
Speaker
And of course, the problems with Josh's kid, you know, when he's got a development game in his basement and sometimes the code comes through and it hasn't, David hasn't bleeped out things yet.
00:25:10
Speaker
He has to,
00:25:11
Speaker
Literally what goes on with the game, when you switch from profanity to non-profanity, it has to load an entire series of call-outs.
00:25:20
Speaker
It goes back into the game.
00:25:21
Speaker
It actually resets the game when you do that in settings.
00:25:24
Speaker
You go in and tell it profanity or clean, and it'll...
00:25:28
Speaker
reset the game.
00:25:29
Speaker
If you've been playing it one way and you want to switch it to the other, because it has to load all of those sayings up in there.
00:25:35
Speaker
And David has done every single one of those and cleaned them all up and set them all up and, and put them in there to call out.
00:25:41
Speaker
But he's, he's made a set of them with bleeps and he's made a set of them with the real words in there that they use.
00:25:46
Speaker
So,
00:25:48
Speaker
It was a lot of added complexity, but you just can't abandon the customers that love Pulp Fiction for what it is.
00:25:54
Speaker
And being profane is a huge part of what makes that film so popular.
00:25:59
Speaker
But we're always quoting each other.
00:26:01
Speaker
We're laughing about those lines all the time.
00:26:03
Speaker
And we need that anymore these days, people.
00:26:06
Speaker
We need people with a sense of humor again.
00:26:08
Speaker
Don't take everything so literally, you know, step back a little bit, smile, take it as it was intended.
00:26:14
Speaker
You know, it doesn't have to be so serious all the time.
00:26:18
Speaker
Well, in David's defense, I mean, Pulp Fiction has 265 F-words in it.
00:26:26
Speaker
With a grand total of 431.
00:26:29
Speaker
He just uses it 265 times, that's all.
00:26:32
Speaker
That's true.
00:26:33
Speaker
With a grand total of 431 curse words in the total of Pulp Fiction.
00:26:38
Speaker
So there's a couple that he had to use.
00:26:40
Speaker
That's pretty dense.
00:26:41
Speaker
How long is the movie?
00:26:43
Speaker
The movie's like what, an hour and 40 minutes?
00:26:46
Speaker
If so, then that's what?
00:26:48
Speaker
It's three swears per minute.
00:26:50
Speaker
Yeah.
00:26:51
Speaker
Yeah.
00:26:53
Speaker
And people will still watch it from beginning to end, you know, they don't turn the volume down and do subtitles and things like that.
00:26:59
Speaker
Fiction is two hours and 34 minutes.
00:27:01
Speaker
So still that's about two hours.
00:27:03
Speaker
Yeah, that's a lot.
00:27:04
Speaker
Two squares a minute.
00:27:05
Speaker
Okay.
00:27:06
Speaker
Here's an idea though, for family mode, what you need to do is hire Christopher Walken to read the lines and self edit those.
00:27:18
Speaker
So you can have Christopher Walken.
00:27:19
Speaker
Does he look like it?
00:27:25
Speaker
Yeah, exactly.
00:27:26
Speaker
I think that would work really well.
00:27:29
Speaker
oh yeah well you know having the the call outs themselves was a huge part of getting the license and yeah you get you got to use that material and you've got to you've got to also you have a you have to uh oblige to to make it where you can take some of that out also so
00:27:47
Speaker
Do you think you could have done this game without the call-outs?
00:27:50
Speaker
Because you don't have a display screen.
00:27:53
Speaker
I mean, they're almost crucial.
00:27:54
Speaker
I don't know if you could get away.
00:27:57
Speaker
And I've seen people say it a lot too.
00:27:59
Speaker
And it's absolutely true that even with the bleeps in there, your mind fills in the bleeps for you.
00:28:04
Speaker
If you're that big of a fan of that scene, you know what's said there.
00:28:08
Speaker
And you're almost saying it in your head.
00:28:10
Speaker
And it takes you to the scene itself.
00:28:12
Speaker
You see what happened in those scenes.
00:28:13
Speaker
You don't really need an LCD screen to have that back.
00:28:17
Speaker
So I think that's that's that's part of it, too, that, you know, people know what he said there is these classic lines that people know him.
00:28:26
Speaker
I mean, they recite them constantly.
00:28:29
Speaker
So, yeah.
00:28:30
Speaker
What mode is your favorite to play?
00:28:34
Speaker
I, you know, I really, I like to start the twist contest.
00:28:38
Speaker
I just think that that's really cool.
00:28:39
Speaker
I love the way that that music starts and, and trying to get the ball up the, into the pop bumpers.
00:28:44
Speaker
And there's a couple of sneaky ways to get them in on the side, but then trying to make the orbit shots, which are my personal green kryptonite.
00:28:51
Speaker
I can't, I'm not shoot orbit shots very well, but.
00:28:54
Speaker
I love that music and the way it all comes together.
00:28:59
Speaker
I just think it sounds really cool.
00:29:01
Speaker
And then you put the topper with it, and it's just like over the top, so to speak.
00:29:06
Speaker
I don't know if you can speak to this, Butch, but this is your guys' first venture outside of Vacation America or whatever.
00:29:13
Speaker
This is your first venture into pinball that isn't a remake.
00:29:16
Speaker
Are we going to be seeing more titles that are drifting away from remakes?
00:29:20
Speaker
Are you still going to be making remakes?
00:29:22
Speaker
Can you talk to any of that?
00:29:24
Speaker
We're still in the remake business.
00:29:28
Speaker
I believe we'll be able to remake some of the remakes again in the future, you know, run another Medieval Madness and
00:29:35
Speaker
Attack from Mars and Monster Bash.
00:29:37
Speaker
I think we're still able to do that contractually.
00:29:41
Speaker
It's a, you know, the, the contracts up for renewal.
00:29:45
Speaker
We can do some certain things.
00:29:47
Speaker
They're, they're, they're in negotiations with that.
00:29:49
Speaker
That's a Doug Duba, you know, question.
00:29:53
Speaker
And, and there, I know they're, they're involved.
00:29:55
Speaker
I know that there's remakes we want to do.
00:29:58
Speaker
I, I personally am trying to talk Doug into more.
00:30:01
Speaker
I think there's a lot of great games out there that,
00:30:03
Speaker
that people would love and that he he's, he's seen as not, as not that, uh, not that feasible or not that sellable.
00:30:11
Speaker
I think a lot of those games and those, those remakes era will work.
00:30:15
Speaker
And are we doing, going to do more of that?
00:30:18
Speaker
I mean, this, why, if you're playing mechanics and you say you want to go into this and do some,
00:30:24
Speaker
do a game of your own.
00:30:26
Speaker
And, you know, why would you stop if your first game was a huge success?
00:30:30
Speaker
I mean, this seems like a test case, a test case to see if, Hey, can we do this?
00:30:36
Speaker
And can we still make money at it?
00:30:37
Speaker
Cause the bottom line is, you know, pinball is they're selling pinball machines.
00:30:42
Speaker
It reminds me of the, the class, you know, Steve Ritchie in the seminars.
00:30:46
Speaker
The first thing he says is, hi, I'm Steve Ritchie and I sell pinball machines.
00:30:50
Speaker
And that's the whole point is that you have to make a profit and make something so they're not losing money on it at least.
00:30:58
Speaker
So I think this is an excellent test case that could maybe whet their appetite for the next potential future opportunity out there.
00:31:09
Speaker
Well, let me put it this way, that I know some of the numbers that were tossed around for what would be considered a success of a play mechanic design.
00:31:19
Speaker
And we surpassed those numbers on the first day.
00:31:23
Speaker
Probably by factors.
00:31:25
Speaker
Yeah, like by factors.
00:31:26
Speaker
Yeah.
00:31:27
Speaker
And that's the other thing about people like the run raw thrills that run play mechanics.
00:31:33
Speaker
Those guys love doing things that's cool.
00:31:35
Speaker
You know, these these this is a cool game.
00:31:38
Speaker
This is you.
00:31:39
Speaker
You've shown that out of nowhere, you can flash like a bolt of lightning here and and really take the market by surprise and by storm.
00:31:48
Speaker
They never even saw it coming.
00:31:50
Speaker
I mean, why would you not want to do another one?
00:31:53
Speaker
I mean, it seems to me like a good recipe for moving forward and doing more.
00:31:57
Speaker
But, you know, that's that's way above my pay grade.
00:32:00
Speaker
I just write manuals, you know.
00:32:03
Speaker
Well, you're doing really good at your job.
00:32:05
Speaker
I'll tell you tell you one thing about the cool thing is, you know, Quentin Tarantino thought having a Pulp Fiction pinball was going to be cool.
00:32:13
Speaker
And he didn't, I don't think he cared one bit about how many pinsiders thought that was just the baddest ass idea.
00:32:20
Speaker
I guarantee he has no idea what pinside is.
00:32:23
Speaker
He doesn't even care.
00:32:24
Speaker
Yeah.
00:32:24
Speaker
And so to see this kind of reaction to that from something that we did and all started because he said, no, that's not what I want.
00:32:34
Speaker
I want something retro and that will be cool.
00:32:38
Speaker
You guys, you'll see retro can be cool.
00:32:42
Speaker
And just the whole...
00:32:43
Speaker
The whole fact that the pinball is cool.
00:32:48
Speaker
Our livelihood now, our hobby, our collection, all that stuff, we are just so fortunate that other people think pinball is cool.
00:32:59
Speaker
People like Quentin Tarantino.
00:33:01
Speaker
People like some of these parts manufacturers, you know, COVID and things, the way that the struggles that some of these places have made, you know, we are very, people ought to understand that you're a very small business.
00:33:14
Speaker
user of these parts manufacturers and their facilities.
00:33:18
Speaker
Pinball numbers, you make a few thousand of these.
00:33:22
Speaker
These people are used to making metal parts in the hundreds of thousands, plastic in the tens and hundreds of thousands.
00:33:28
Speaker
And we're just a small piece of that.
00:33:31
Speaker
But a lot of those manufacturers of parts do what they do for us and help us get to prototypes and onesies and twosies of really expensive normally things is because pinball is cool.
00:33:44
Speaker
They're like, you guys are building a pinball machine?
00:33:46
Speaker
Oh, that's really cool.
00:33:47
Speaker
Yeah.
00:33:48
Speaker
Okay.
00:33:48
Speaker
Well, we'll make 50 of those and we'll make 500 of those.
00:33:51
Speaker
And we'll do that before we do this other order we have for a million parts, you know, but you can't demand that of them.
00:33:58
Speaker
Right.
00:33:58
Speaker
So it's really cool that they think it's cool.
00:34:01
Speaker
Yeah.
00:34:02
Speaker
I mean, be honest.
00:34:03
Speaker
I mean, you tell people that you've got a pinball collection.
00:34:06
Speaker
There's nobody that says, well, that's nice.
00:34:08
Speaker
You know, I'm sitting next to people on an airplane all the time.
00:34:11
Speaker
They're like, where are you going?
00:34:12
Speaker
And they're like, oh, I'm going to, you know, such and such, see my sister or something.
00:34:17
Speaker
They ask you, where are you doing?
00:34:18
Speaker
I'm going to, you know.
00:34:20
Speaker
Ohio for a pinball show and they'll just do like a double take like that is so cool and all of a sudden you know they just get this big smile on their face that is the neatest thing so you build pinball you get to work on pinball machines you're around pinball is your job that's just the coolest thing and
00:34:35
Speaker
I've had people stop me when I'm coming through the airport security.
00:34:39
Speaker
And the guy's like, the line's backing up behind me while he's asking me, they still make those?
00:34:43
Speaker
And
Perception and Enthusiasm for Pinball
00:34:44
Speaker
what do you do?
00:34:45
Speaker
You work for New Jersey or you live there?
00:34:47
Speaker
And I'm like, I got to get my bag and get on the plane.
00:34:51
Speaker
But it's just so cool to them.
00:34:52
Speaker
It's just something they don't hear often.
00:34:54
Speaker
And it's really neat.
00:34:56
Speaker
We're very fortunate that what we do and what we love is so cool to other people.
00:35:02
Speaker
Well, and I've got to toot your horn for a second, Butch, because one of the things that I don't think I've ever heard from any other pinball release is
00:35:11
Speaker
is everyone said how amazing the manual was and how the walkthrough was how to play this game.
00:35:17
Speaker
Like they were just blown away by looking at the PDF on your guys's website and how easy everything's laid out and how just straightforward it is for anyone to understand.
00:35:27
Speaker
And then you know how many people reached out and was like, this is what we need more in pinball.
00:35:31
Speaker
Like this is, this is perfect.
00:35:34
Speaker
So Mark comes to me.
00:35:36
Speaker
One of the first things Mark says is, can you help me with the rules?
00:35:40
Speaker
Can you help me illustrate the rules?
00:35:42
Speaker
And they used to do shot maps in the Williams days.
00:35:44
Speaker
Can you help me do shot maps and explain the rules?
00:35:47
Speaker
And I said, heck yeah, I've done that a lot already.
00:35:49
Speaker
And so he says, well, that'll be great.
00:35:51
Speaker
When I'm ready, I'll send you the rough rules and you can kind of draw them up and show me.
00:35:55
Speaker
So he sends me the rules and I start working on how I would illustrate that and put arrows on the play field.
00:36:01
Speaker
I've done
00:36:02
Speaker
I spend months and months making a drawing of the playfield, an illustration of the playfield.
00:36:08
Speaker
top and bottom, looking at it directly from above, looking at it directly from below.
00:36:11
Speaker
So I can use the one from above as shot maps because that looks, you know, it's got a lot more detail in it than any of the shot maps William's ever had in the front of their manuals.
00:36:20
Speaker
And so then I can just start adding graphics to the top of that and I can do something that looks pretty cool and it's all to scale and everything works.
00:36:27
Speaker
And so I did that and I was real proud of myself.
00:36:29
Speaker
It's kind of like what I'd done before, but like everything, what I'm doing with the Pulp Fiction manual, I'm trying to make the work that I did previously look
00:36:37
Speaker
You know, like like I was an amateur.
00:36:38
Speaker
So I really stepped everything up quite a bit.
00:36:42
Speaker
I think if people like the other manuals I've done, the Pulp Fiction manual still going to knock you out of your chair because I put that much more time and effort into it.
00:36:50
Speaker
But.
00:36:51
Speaker
Mark looks at these and he comes back and just completely deflates me by saying, well, I think I'm going to need to see artwork and the insert labels and things.
00:37:00
Speaker
I don't think this is going to work for me.
00:37:03
Speaker
I'll figure something else out.
00:37:04
Speaker
And I'm like, whoa, no, no, no.
00:37:05
Speaker
Wait a minute.
00:37:05
Speaker
Wait a minute.
00:37:06
Speaker
I can do better.
00:37:07
Speaker
I can do better.
00:37:07
Speaker
OK, so that wasn't good enough.
00:37:09
Speaker
OK, all right.
00:37:10
Speaker
Well, check this out.
00:37:11
Speaker
So I can take the artwork files and I can superimpose them right over the top of the play field drawing that I have.
00:37:17
Speaker
And you still have all the other parts.
00:37:18
Speaker
I can make the parts invisible that are
00:37:20
Speaker
you know, this or that.
00:37:21
Speaker
I can take things that are in three dimensions that are above the play field and I can make them translucent so you can see through them.
00:37:28
Speaker
And I can take the plastics artwork and I can put that in.
00:37:30
Speaker
I can put decals in.
00:37:31
Speaker
I can do all these things.
00:37:32
Speaker
I can make your signs and put them off the sign.
00:37:34
Speaker
And so I showed him.
00:37:36
Speaker
And then when I did all that, I'm like, holy cow, I can't see a red line on here showing me where to shoot anymore at all.
00:37:42
Speaker
It's way too busy.
00:37:44
Speaker
So I tried to think of some way that I could show that again and highlight what I'm trying to highlight.
00:37:49
Speaker
So I came up with this opaque, white, complete playfield mask that I put on.
00:37:55
Speaker
And then I cut holes in the mask to show little areas of the playfield I wanted to highlight with shots and arrows and
00:38:01
Speaker
and highlighting the inserts that we're going to light and things like that.
00:38:05
Speaker
And he just loved it when he saw it.
00:38:07
Speaker
And then Josh Sharp started going through it and helping me fix up the areas, you know, where I had things worded a little wrong or things like that.
00:38:14
Speaker
So we went through this iterative process back and forth.
00:38:17
Speaker
And then the play mechanics guys got the idea that they wanted to do a rules manual and put it out.
00:38:22
Speaker
And I thought that was a great idea.
00:38:24
Speaker
So it was the actual rules manual.
00:38:26
Speaker
It's just a small excerpt from the big manual that I've written for Pulp Fiction.
00:38:30
Speaker
It's showing the rules.
00:38:31
Speaker
So that worked out really well.
00:38:33
Speaker
People really appreciated that.
00:38:35
Speaker
And that's really cool, too, when you do things that haven't been done before.
00:38:39
Speaker
And it's like it seems like a simple kind of thing, you know, put out the rules to the game.
00:38:43
Speaker
Or the other companies I've worked for before, they wanted the rules kept top secret.
00:38:47
Speaker
You know, you couldn't show them that.
00:38:48
Speaker
We wanted to discover it themselves.
00:38:51
Speaker
So the next thing you know, somebody's playing it on a Twitch stream and showing everything to everybody.
00:38:56
Speaker
And I had more people come at me to shows and say, you know, where do I start?
00:39:00
Speaker
What do I do?
00:39:01
Speaker
What's my goal?
00:39:02
Speaker
What should I be trying for first?
00:39:03
Speaker
What am I looking at?
00:39:04
Speaker
Why is this all lit?
00:39:06
Speaker
Well, I could explain it to you, but the guys that made the game don't want me to.
00:39:10
Speaker
But now I'm able to.
00:39:11
Speaker
So it's kind of nice.
00:39:13
Speaker
It is nice.
00:39:15
Speaker
So tell me about the ball locks on the play field.
00:39:18
Speaker
You were talking about the mechanics being slightly different that you were working on.
00:39:23
Speaker
So this game, everybody likes to call it a street level or a single level game, but it really isn't.
00:39:29
Speaker
I mean, you consider the back panel a level of its own.
00:39:33
Speaker
It's up above the play field and things are elevated back there, but you just can't see it.
00:39:37
Speaker
You've got a subway underneath that's below the play field, again, that you can't see.
00:39:42
Speaker
And there's a four ball lock in each one.
00:39:43
Speaker
And there's four balls in the game.
00:39:45
Speaker
So that means either one of those locks is capable of holding all four balls in the game during any type of mode that you want to stop everything and do something special.
00:39:53
Speaker
That's really cool in and of itself.
00:39:55
Speaker
As a matter of fact, I brought up that this was a four ball game at Texas and then thought I had explained myself.
00:40:02
Speaker
And I go back and I see on Pinside people are saying, oh, well, that means that you don't play three balls.
00:40:06
Speaker
You play four balls during a game now.
00:40:07
Speaker
I'm like, no.
00:40:08
Speaker
I mean, you could set it that way.
00:40:09
Speaker
You can set it from three to five balls, right?
00:40:11
Speaker
It's an adjustment.
00:40:12
Speaker
But when I say a four ball game, I mean, that's the max you'll ever see on the play field at one time is four balls.
00:40:18
Speaker
Yeah.
00:40:19
Speaker
That's what you put in the trough to start it up.
00:40:21
Speaker
Because Williams used to put that, right?
00:40:23
Speaker
The beginning of their manual.
00:40:24
Speaker
This is Theater of Magic as a four-ball game or something like that.
00:40:28
Speaker
And they put that up in the top of one of the pages.
00:40:31
Speaker
So I thought it was kind of self-explanatory, but I needed a little more explaining, I guess.
00:40:35
Speaker
I knew what you mean.
00:40:37
Speaker
Like on the old stickers, too, you know?
00:40:38
Speaker
The old stickers say install however many balls.
00:40:41
Speaker
I think they still do on every new pinball machine, you know?
00:40:44
Speaker
Yeah.
00:40:45
Speaker
So you've got subways, you've got basically an inclined ramp across the back panel back behind there that can hold four balls in succession and keep track of them, how many are in each location.
00:40:58
Speaker
So that's really a cool thing.
00:41:00
Speaker
And it's a physical ball lock.
00:41:02
Speaker
Remember back in the days when we had physical ball locks, you didn't just shoot forever trying to get the ball in that hole and have it say, okay, ball one lock and spit it right back out at you again?
00:41:12
Speaker
I put that up.
00:41:12
Speaker
See how much work I put that in there?
00:41:15
Speaker
Now you're just kicking it back out.
00:41:16
Speaker
No, I'm going to hold it and I'm going to launch you another ball and you start all over again.
00:41:20
Speaker
And with the saucer and everything up there, that makes it great.
00:41:22
Speaker
So you get to try and get another character and collect and all that.
00:41:26
Speaker
It's fun.
00:41:27
Speaker
Can you switch it to virtual ball locks if you prefer that?
00:41:31
Speaker
I think you can probably shut those off, yeah.
00:41:35
Speaker
I know sometimes tournament players prefer the virtual option.
00:41:40
Speaker
Yeah, they can flip or something like that.
00:41:44
Speaker
I'm sure Josh Sharpe, understanding those rules will do it.
00:41:48
Speaker
Yeah.
00:41:49
Speaker
Yeah.
00:41:49
Speaker
Josh is probably thought of it.
00:41:50
Speaker
I think of it more from a maintenance standpoint.
00:41:53
Speaker
If something were to break back there, you could disable it.
00:41:56
Speaker
but still play.
00:41:58
Speaker
Yeah.
00:41:58
Speaker
Even then, I'm not sure with these, the way these work, that if you're in your optos didn't work or how you would disable it, if a ball got shot up in there, I guess you could kick the thing and let it just come back out.
00:42:10
Speaker
That's something we will look into.
00:42:11
Speaker
I'm sure.
00:42:12
Speaker
Yeah, definitely.
00:42:14
Speaker
So, but there's a lot of information floating around about Pulp Fiction.
00:42:18
Speaker
We've, we've covered a lot tonight.
00:42:20
Speaker
Is there
Clarifying Game Features
00:42:21
Speaker
anything that you just feel like we haven't touched on that you just
00:42:24
Speaker
A couple of things need to know.
00:42:26
Speaker
Yeah.
00:42:26
Speaker
A couple of things that I wanted to hit on that I've seen some confusion about the center post.
00:42:33
Speaker
People are saying, you know, oh, that's not going to come in the game.
00:42:35
Speaker
It's that's an optional.
00:42:37
Speaker
So they said it's it's optional.
00:42:38
Speaker
It won't be in the game.
00:42:40
Speaker
The center post will be in the game shipped from the factory.
00:42:43
Speaker
It will be manufactured with the center post in place.
00:42:46
Speaker
In the coin box, you will have a goodies bag, and part of that goodies bag will be a plastic plug if you want to take it out of there.
00:42:52
Speaker
And we've gone to great CGC with making play fields and all that.
00:42:58
Speaker
We know what can happen if you try and pound a post out of the play field and it's in too tight.
00:43:03
Speaker
It can take some of the clear.
00:43:04
Speaker
It can tear up the...
00:43:06
Speaker
cause the veneer to come loose.
00:43:08
Speaker
It can cause all kinds of problems.
00:43:09
Speaker
So it's been specially made, specially screened around there and routed out so that that post will come out fairly easily and be able to put back in.
00:43:19
Speaker
And then you could just take the plastic plug and put it in if you don't want anything.
00:43:22
Speaker
And the game will be brutal at that point.
00:43:25
Speaker
And we saw some people saying, well, why would you put a post in like that during the show when you want to shorten ball times?
00:43:32
Speaker
And I'm like, who said we wanted to shorten ball times?
00:43:34
Speaker
You know, we did.
00:43:36
Speaker
You're going to stand in line for 45 minutes.
00:43:38
Speaker
You want to play your ball, too.
00:43:39
Speaker
You don't want to get up there to find out a game.
00:43:42
Speaker
How can I show you what I've done in this game or what this team has put together with a two-ball game and, you know, with the outlanes completely open and all that?
00:43:51
Speaker
That's not the way it's going to play in your home.
00:43:52
Speaker
Why would I want to introduce you to you like that?
00:43:55
Speaker
Right.
00:43:57
Speaker
And we had people complaining about the ball times and the length of games and things like that.
00:44:02
Speaker
Somebody was telling me, you guys ought to outlaw four-player games.
00:44:06
Speaker
I'm like, so you'd rather stand there and watch four people play one at a time rather than a four?
00:44:11
Speaker
That will take a little bit longer, but, you know, pinball is a social game.
00:44:16
Speaker
I want to play with other players.
00:44:17
Speaker
I want to compete with someone, three other people.
00:44:20
Speaker
That's what's great about it.
00:44:22
Speaker
So, you know, people are standing in line.
00:44:23
Speaker
Sometimes you get some of those people that one person stands in line and then three guys come up and join them right when they get to the game.
00:44:29
Speaker
That's kind of a bummer that people do that.
00:44:31
Speaker
But welcome to society, I guess.
00:44:33
Speaker
Yeah, right.
00:44:35
Speaker
Then the other thing I wanted to talk about was the sound.
00:44:41
Speaker
The Texas Pinball Festival was like super, super loud.
00:44:47
Speaker
We had a pin sound booth next to us that had like eight games facing straight at us.
00:44:52
Speaker
I was telling people, you know, when we were raising our volume, their volume would go up.
00:44:55
Speaker
And in between our two booths, I was calling it the kill zone.
00:44:58
Speaker
I mean, you couldn't talk in there.
00:45:01
Speaker
It physically hurt my ears to stand in there.
00:45:03
Speaker
And I'm a social guy myself.
00:45:05
Speaker
And pinball is a social game.
00:45:06
Speaker
I like to stand there and talk to people while they're playing.
00:45:09
Speaker
And I just couldn't do it in Texas.
00:45:11
Speaker
It was too loud.
00:45:12
Speaker
In fact, the last day I went in with earplugs, I couldn't stand it anymore.
00:45:17
Speaker
It was hurting too bad.
00:45:18
Speaker
And, you know, damage to your ears is cumulative.
00:45:20
Speaker
That stuff...
00:45:22
Speaker
it doesn't get better.
00:45:23
Speaker
Your ears don't heal.
00:45:24
Speaker
They just get worse.
00:45:26
Speaker
So, yeah, it was unfortunate the way that the layout was there that we couldn't, they couldn't hear things a little bit better, but you know, it's a, it's a loud floor out there.
00:45:35
Speaker
Some of these smaller shows that we'll have the games at, you'll get a better, better feel for, for what it sounds like.
00:45:41
Speaker
And it was cool that we were able to put the profanity on for a while after hours and things like that.
00:45:46
Speaker
So that's a thing we'll try and do with the other shows too.
00:45:49
Speaker
So,
00:45:50
Speaker
so we can kind of please both sides of the fence there but it's tightrope well i know one question that we have not covered tonight that i think a lot of people are asking and i don't know if you can give us a straight answer butch but when are we going to start seeing these games when are when are they going to start shipping out and getting people's homes
00:46:09
Speaker
Yeah, that's a good question.
00:46:13
Speaker
Me working for CGC like I do, I don't like to talk about specific dates for sure, but we're doing things the right way.
00:46:23
Speaker
We're doing things in our own speed, and they're going to be done when they're done, and when they ship, they ship.
00:46:29
Speaker
And I know that's a horrible answer.
00:46:32
Speaker
If I order, I wouldn't want to hear that.
00:46:34
Speaker
Just know that I was going to get a prototype game a lot longer than
00:46:39
Speaker
previous to when I got my game than I did.
00:46:42
Speaker
But I waited for it, and it was worth the wait.
00:46:45
Speaker
And I hate telling people that, but there's no reason to believe that CGC is going to drag their feet, that Play Mechanics is going to just kick back now while we've got everybody beaten to a froth and just say, well, now let's see how long this lasts if we don't ship games.
00:47:02
Speaker
We're going to try and get them out just as quickly as we can.
00:47:05
Speaker
We're going to do everything we can to get them in people's hands, to get them on location where people can play them.
00:47:10
Speaker
And the games are going to be great.
00:47:12
Speaker
We had a lot of bake time on this.
00:47:14
Speaker
And as such, we're going to be careful in the final steps, which is production and actually getting them into your hands.
00:47:20
Speaker
We want to know how they're going to work and how well they're going to survive.
00:47:25
Speaker
For instance, the drop targets on this game.
00:47:29
Speaker
I said in Texas last year, the Cactus Canyon,
00:47:34
Speaker
finishing Cactus Canyon seminar that, you know, we've worked on all these drop targets for Cactus Canyon when in fact, we really kind of worked on them for Pulp Fiction.
00:47:43
Speaker
They were being fixed up and readied for Pulp Fiction.
00:47:47
Speaker
So we were doing work even during Cactus Canyon, um,
00:47:51
Speaker
development on the drop targets so that they wouldn't brick and they would stay up.
00:47:55
Speaker
And you can see in the Pulp Fiction application of those same targets that a lot of the things that we did are working very well.
00:48:03
Speaker
And it took a lot longer to get Pulp Fiction and Cactus Canyon out because of that, but both games are better for it.
00:48:12
Speaker
I'll say it again.
00:48:13
Speaker
There's like three things.
00:48:15
Speaker
You can have it fast.
00:48:15
Speaker
You can have it good quality.
00:48:17
Speaker
You can have it cheap.
00:48:19
Speaker
The fast one is just not going to be the choice.
00:48:21
Speaker
You can have two or three.
00:48:24
Speaker
We're going to put the third place, the time all the time.
00:48:28
Speaker
That's just the way it's going to work.
00:48:30
Speaker
We're going to give you a good quality product.
00:48:32
Speaker
And people have been raving about the price.
00:48:35
Speaker
We're trying to keep these games as cheap as we can.
00:48:38
Speaker
I think we're doing a really good job of it.
00:48:40
Speaker
And I think we're still building them really good too.
00:48:42
Speaker
It just takes a little longer to do.
00:48:46
Speaker
I've heard third quarter, you know, I'll put a number out there like everybody else is hoping for.
00:48:52
Speaker
I'm hoping as much as anybody.
00:48:53
Speaker
And I know the rest of the team is as well.
00:48:56
Speaker
Doing everything we can to get them as quick as we can.
00:48:59
Speaker
So I'm just going to give a quick shout out.
00:49:03
Speaker
Where are you?
00:49:04
Speaker
This week.
00:49:05
Speaker
And so we're recording April 11th, but where are you this week?
00:49:08
Speaker
And I want, and I, I want to make sure that people know like, Hey, this, these events are out there.
00:49:14
Speaker
So,
00:49:16
Speaker
What do you promote?
00:49:16
Speaker
I am at my good friend Keith Campanelli's house.
00:49:19
Speaker
This is his spare bedroom where he puts me up.
00:49:22
Speaker
And I am here for Pimbrew, which will be starting Pimbrew, Ohio, which will be starting up in Girard, Ohio on Thursday.
00:49:32
Speaker
That'd be Thursday, Friday and Saturday.
00:49:34
Speaker
And this is, you know, craft breweries.
00:49:37
Speaker
getting together.
00:49:37
Speaker
They're going to have eight different breweries coming, bringing their crafts in.
00:49:41
Speaker
And yeah, they'll be playing pinball and drinking beer all weekend.
00:49:47
Speaker
And I don't drink myself, but I'll be playing the pinball part and have a Diet Coke with me.
00:49:51
Speaker
So yeah.
00:49:53
Speaker
It's great.
00:49:53
Speaker
It's a great show.
00:49:54
Speaker
It's the second one I've been to.
00:49:56
Speaker
It's the third one overall.
00:49:57
Speaker
I think Keith was actually on you guys' show promoting COVID.
00:50:01
Speaker
Yeah, it was the first show after basically when people started opening up after the COVID lockdowns.
00:50:10
Speaker
So it was interesting to talk about him trying to, okay, we want to do a show, but how do we do it responsibly?
00:50:17
Speaker
But people still were itching for that social aspect, which is why the value of pinball machines skyrocketed because people wanted that experience.
00:50:27
Speaker
They craved that experience.
00:50:28
Speaker
And if they couldn't go to a bar or an arcade, then they wanted that in the home.
00:50:34
Speaker
Yeah, I see over Josh's shoulder, all these pinball machines back there.
00:50:37
Speaker
If you had four or five people there, they'd be playing, you know, and you'd be playing with them.
00:50:41
Speaker
You know, when you're all by yourself, your machines are just beautiful.
00:50:44
Speaker
You know, you don't seem to give them much time to play them.
00:50:47
Speaker
But it's a social thing, you know, get out there and come to these shows.
00:50:50
Speaker
They're great.
00:50:51
Speaker
These people are putting a lot of effort into making these places available to people.
00:50:56
Speaker
like-minded people to get there and enjoy each other's company and a passion, share the passion together and, you know, drink some beer, have some fun, make some new friends.
CGC's Commitment to Quality
00:51:07
Speaker
Drink a Diet Coke.
00:51:10
Speaker
I'll drink a Diet Mountain Dew.
00:51:12
Speaker
I'll drink my Fresca.
00:51:13
Speaker
I like my peach Fresca.
00:51:15
Speaker
That's good stuff.
00:51:17
Speaker
Whatever hits your horn right there.
00:51:19
Speaker
Yeah, drink it.
00:51:22
Speaker
Thank you so much, guys.
00:51:23
Speaker
I really think, honestly, CGC should make you the spokesperson because I just – you put our concerns to rest.
00:51:31
Speaker
Like you're always a great spokesman whenever I hear you at Texas, whenever I hear you at Expo.
00:51:37
Speaker
You just – you believe in this product and you're right.
00:51:41
Speaker
Like I can't remember – we sat down at breakfast at Texas last year and you said, you know –
00:51:47
Speaker
no one remembers how long it took the game to get out.
00:51:50
Speaker
They always remember the problems that they have with the game when they have it.
00:51:54
Speaker
Once they have the game, if it's quality and it's amazing, they're going to love the game for the rest of their life and not have an issue with it.
00:52:01
Speaker
And that's what they're going to remember is the love of the game, right?
00:52:03
Speaker
So if it takes a couple more months, then so be it because you don't want to put out a bad product and then leave a bad taste in everyone's mouth.
00:52:11
Speaker
Doug Duba says it best.
00:52:13
Speaker
They'll forgive late, but they won't forgive wrong.
00:52:16
Speaker
Yeah, it's very true.
00:52:17
Speaker
I will say from my perspective, the amount of the number of CGC games I have purchased is three.
00:52:25
Speaker
The amount that I have sold is zero.
00:52:29
Speaker
They're staying.
00:52:30
Speaker
They're not going anywhere.
00:52:32
Speaker
They're amazing games.
00:52:33
Speaker
And they've retained their value.
00:52:35
Speaker
I mean, no one really talks about that.
00:52:36
Speaker
And that's what shocks me.
00:52:37
Speaker
Like, outside any other company, outside maybe Stern, everyone else's product just deflates.
00:52:44
Speaker
But CGCs and Sterns,
00:52:48
Speaker
Yeah, they just, they're bulletproof.
00:52:49
Speaker
I've had people come up to me to show and tell me, you know, I go work on this guy's collection and he has all the CGC games at the beginning of one line.
00:52:58
Speaker
And he says, you don't need to mess with those there.
00:53:00
Speaker
All these other ones are broken, you know, but you don't need to mess with those CGC games.
00:53:04
Speaker
They're like tanks.
00:53:05
Speaker
And as far as- Hey, bookachips, you can get me a line on a monster bash with a topper, let me know.
00:53:16
Speaker
We'll see what we can do.
00:53:18
Speaker
Say all your prayers and eat your vegetables and be a good boy.
00:53:21
Speaker
Maybe it'll be one of your Christmas.
00:53:22
Speaker
Are you Santa Claus now?
00:53:24
Speaker
You're Santa Claus.
00:53:26
Speaker
That would be a great job too.
00:53:28
Speaker
I think I got the greatest job in the world.
00:53:29
Speaker
I tell people that all the time.
00:53:31
Speaker
My passion, I can't hide it.
00:53:33
Speaker
I'm sorry.
00:53:34
Speaker
I told...
00:53:36
Speaker
Jack Granari when he first started talking to me and I told him, I said, I put my passion for pinball up against anybody's anybody's.
00:53:43
Speaker
I said, I just love this stuff and I can't hide it.
00:53:46
Speaker
So thank you guys.
00:53:47
Speaker
Speaking of your company and working for you, if you're looking for a job, they are hiring right now for a pin tech.
00:53:55
Speaker
You do have to live in the Chicagoland area.
00:53:59
Speaker
But if you want to send your resume in, talk to Kathy there at CGC.
00:54:04
Speaker
You can find the phone number there on their website.
00:54:08
Speaker
It's a wonderful company to work for.
00:54:10
Speaker
If you want to work with Butch, you've heard him for almost an hour now.
00:54:13
Speaker
This man bleeds passion.
00:54:16
Speaker
You'd want to be around this every day.
00:54:17
Speaker
I mean, it's amazing.
00:54:19
Speaker
So great company.
00:54:20
Speaker
Like you said, Scott, they're just amazing.
00:54:23
Speaker
quality product i have no complaints because to the build quality and the the amazingness that is a cgc product yep completely looking forward to more of them so yep always you guys aren't going anywhere right not that i know of i don't plan on going anywhere i'm having a blast we're good
00:54:45
Speaker
great people enjoying our stuff and being able to play it and you know there's there's no no greater thank you that we could get from from the pinball community than the reception we've received with Pulp Fiction in Ohio this weekend go ahead and go to Pinbrew and hang out with Butch and play the game not not with Butch Mark Ritchie's gonna be here to come out with Mark we interviewed Mark last so yeah
00:55:13
Speaker
If you want a cheap date, apparently take Butch because all you got to do is buy him some Diet Coke.
00:55:17
Speaker
Diet Coke, yeah, you can buy those.
00:55:20
Speaker
Two Pulp Fictions to play here at Pembrys.
00:55:22
Speaker
Come play them.
00:55:24
Speaker
Nice.
00:55:24
Speaker
Scott, you got anything else for us that we can think of?
00:55:28
Speaker
You know, I'm just, man, this last month has been crazy for pinball.
00:55:33
Speaker
It's been so much fun to get the excitement because there was a lot of anticipation.
00:55:39
Speaker
And I would say this is one of the few times where the hype was justified.
00:55:45
Speaker
Yes.
00:55:46
Speaker
For all the games.
00:55:47
Speaker
I'm truly excited for all the games that are coming out.
00:55:52
Speaker
And it's a great time to be alive.
00:55:55
Speaker
Yep.
00:55:56
Speaker
And I'm going to plug our product right now.
00:55:58
Speaker
I am currently wearing the Keith Elwin shirt.
00:56:02
Speaker
I know you haven't been able to see it.
00:56:03
Speaker
Mike's kind of in the way.
00:56:06
Speaker
But if you want to get a hold of this or other sweet swag, we've had a lot of people get the shoes.
00:56:10
Speaker
A lot of people got the shoes.
00:56:12
Speaker
I actually still need to get my shoes.
00:56:13
Speaker
But you got the shoes.
00:56:15
Speaker
Did you like them?
00:56:16
Speaker
I got the shoes.
00:56:17
Speaker
My son has the shoes.
00:56:18
Speaker
I have not given them to him yet.
00:56:22
Speaker
But I did get my shoes.
00:56:23
Speaker
I love them.
00:56:24
Speaker
And they are true to fit size.
00:56:25
Speaker
So I wear a size 12.
00:56:27
Speaker
And 12 came in, and they were perfect.
00:56:30
Speaker
I mean, they feel comfortable.
00:56:32
Speaker
I'm the kind of guy that has, I'm a firm believer in orthotics.
00:56:37
Speaker
I'm only 35, but like I'm always on my feet all day.
00:56:40
Speaker
And so if you're worried about the comfortableness of the shoe, buy some orthotics.
00:56:45
Speaker
I do the FP insoles that I found.
00:56:48
Speaker
Those are amazing.
00:56:48
Speaker
Those are the best ones.
00:56:50
Speaker
But seriously, silver ballswag.com slash collections slash loser kid pinball.
00:56:57
Speaker
That's where you can get a kid pinball silver ball.
00:56:59
Speaker
You'll get it.
00:57:01
Speaker
And there's a ton of product there.
00:57:03
Speaker
Shoes, shirts, backpacks, tumblers.
00:57:06
Speaker
I mean, coffee mugs with the original logo.
00:57:08
Speaker
We've got plenty of original logo.
00:57:10
Speaker
We've got Keith Allen.
00:57:10
Speaker
We've got.
00:57:12
Speaker
the print.
00:57:14
Speaker
The Brad Albright.
00:57:15
Speaker
Yeah.
00:57:16
Speaker
Yeah, the Brad Albright print.
00:57:17
Speaker
And we went with this print because, you know, Brad actually had suggested that we do something that's more iconic imagery to pinball.
00:57:24
Speaker
So that way you want to wear it.
00:57:26
Speaker
It's not all inside joke stuff.
00:57:28
Speaker
And you know what?
00:57:29
Speaker
I think he was right.
00:57:31
Speaker
I appreciate all the input Brad gave us.
00:57:33
Speaker
And
00:57:33
Speaker
He was like a third team member on this.
00:57:36
Speaker
So we'll have to get Butch something.
00:57:37
Speaker
We'll have to make he wear some sweet shoes or something.
00:57:40
Speaker
Fruit-sized shoes, huh?
00:57:43
Speaker
They're awesome.
00:57:44
Speaker
I'm almost 60, and yeah, I believe in orthotics, too.
00:57:48
Speaker
I've come to believe them.
00:57:50
Speaker
I don't have to be on my feet all day for them to hurt.
00:57:53
Speaker
Exactly.
00:57:54
Speaker
Well, if you're in a pinball tournament, especially like the Sanctum or something like that, you're on your feet for 24 hours, you're definitely going to want them, right?
00:58:01
Speaker
Yeah.
00:58:01
Speaker
If, if they want to get ahold of you, butch, how do they get ahold of you?
00:58:04
Speaker
I am butch at Chicago dash gaming.com.
00:58:08
Speaker
So Chicago hyphen gaming.com.
00:58:11
Speaker
Butch at Chicago dash gaming.com.
00:58:14
Speaker
Awesome.
00:58:15
Speaker
And if they want to get ahold of you, Scott, how do they do that?
00:58:18
Speaker
Uh, you know, Facebook's the easiest way.
00:58:20
Speaker
Just get him some shoes.
00:58:22
Speaker
Yeah.
00:58:24
Speaker
You can always drop an email to us.
00:58:26
Speaker
That goes to Josh, but he lets us know if, uh, if there's something I need to see.
00:58:30
Speaker
So.
00:58:31
Speaker
Correct.
00:58:31
Speaker
And if you want to get hold of us, then hit us at LoserKidPinballPodcast at gmail.com.
Social Media and Contact Information
00:58:37
Speaker
All the socials.
00:58:37
Speaker
So Facebook, Twitter, Twitch, Instagram, YouTube, all at LoserKidPinball.
00:58:44
Speaker
I think we even have a TikTok now.
00:58:46
Speaker
And I don't know what we're going to do with it.
00:58:48
Speaker
I do want to give a shout out to Jen Rupert, though, with No Coin Drop Required.
00:58:52
Speaker
She's doing some amazing stuff.
00:58:54
Speaker
She has been, she got her shoes and she pulled out some sweet videos with her shoes.
00:58:59
Speaker
And thank you so much, Jen, for everything you do for us.
00:59:02
Speaker
And you guys get out from under those headphones and get out to a show every once in a while.
00:59:05
Speaker
We need to see more of you.
00:59:06
Speaker
Come on.
00:59:08
Speaker
I will definitely be at Chicago.
00:59:10
Speaker
I have a pretty busy schedule until then, but you know, definitely reserve me a breakfast there.
00:59:17
Speaker
Pinbrew next year.
00:59:18
Speaker
Okay.
00:59:19
Speaker
You still owe Keith one.
00:59:21
Speaker
Yeah, I do owe Keith.
00:59:24
Speaker
Okay.
00:59:24
Speaker
Thanks much.
00:59:24
Speaker
Thank you so much, guys.
00:59:25
Speaker
All right.
00:59:26
Speaker
See you in two weeks.
00:59:27
Speaker
You bet.