Going Back to Work After Baby: Mom Guilt, Identity & How to Make It Work with Jessica Martin and Taara Sajnani Das

Transcript

Speaker: Hello and welcome back to Since I Became a Mother, the podcast about the things that motherhood changes, the things no one warns you about, and where we figure out who we are becoming together. I'm your host, Taylor Rae Roman.

Speaker: Hello and welcome back to Since I Became a Mother, the podcast about the things motherhood changes, the things no one warns you about, and where we figure out who we are becoming together. as always, I'm your host, Taylor Rae Roman. Now, before we get into today's episode, I just want to give a quick thank you to Healthy Baby for supporting Since I Became a Mother, One of the things motherhood has made me think about so differently is how much exposure to potential irritants our babies have in their everyday products that they use, especially something like diapers and wipes. So Healthy Baby is a brand that I really appreciate and love because they put thought into the safety, the ingredients, the materials, and the performance of their products. It's one of those small everyday choices that makes me feel a little more confident as a mom. And you can find everything about Healthy Baby in the show notes as you always can. Now for today's episode, I'm as always so excited. I say I'm excited every week because honestly, I am excited every week. This episode, we're talking a little bit about being a working mom, which is kind of an annoying title because are dads ever working dads? No, they're just dads. But for me, my story is when I was about a month and a half postpartum, I started a very high level job at startup. That was insane. I was working full time hours with my baby strapped to my chest, exclusively breastfeeding, experiencing postpartum depression, experiencing postpartum anxiety. My brain was melting. But for me, just like having something else I could be good at other than motherhood.

Speaker: felt amazing. i only lasted three months there, but honestly, i get, I totally, totally get the appeal, but also the hard parts of being a working mom. So that's why I'm so excited today to have Jessica Martin and Tara Sajnani on the podcast. Hello guys. Hi. Hi. Thanks for having us. Welcome. So before we dive into our questions, I'm going to give the people a little intro on you. Let's start with Jessica.

Speaker: Jessica is a New York City-based birth, postpartum, and return to work doula who supports mothers through the transition from pregnancy and early postpartum into working motherhood. She's a certified Body Ready Method Pro, birth and postpartum doula through Manhattan Birth, and she focuses on preparing mothers' bodies, minds, and relationships for birth and beyond, And before becoming a doula, Jessica worked in finance, international development development and health. So I cannot wait to hear from you. and then Tara is a New York City-based working mom. She's a content creator who shares openly about modern modern motherhood, career, style and the realities of balancing work and family. She's the founder of Sajnani Brand Management and also a director at Harvey AI, previously at Google, Snap and Goldman Sachs. So working queens on the podcast today.

Speaker: We love it. Okay, I'm just going to dive right in, guys, because I know the people want to know. And I just talked a lot. I just talked for like three minutes straight. So let's hear from you. So take me back to the period before you returned to work after having your baby. What were you most worried about? What ended up being harder or easier than you expected? so Jessica, let's start with you. And then Tara, i want to hear from you right after.

Speaker: Yeah, so it was um spring of 2017. So taking you back, I have a nine-year-old, almost 10-year-old. I had her in January. so i was going back in May. So it felt sort of like I was excited. i was excited to be kind of like coming out into the world springtime after winter hibernation. Yeah. um And yeah, so on the surface I was excited. My husband had three months paternity leave, so I took four and then we stacked his. So I wasn't really worried about kind of leaving her. That felt okay.

Speaker: um But underneath I was worried about everything else, like everything else. like how am I going to get dressed and look presentable five days a week? How am i going to breastfeed? How am i going to feed myself? Or how am I going to pump at work? um This was like in the office five days a week, um schlepping my pump back and forth on the subway. um So I think I was just really worried about like all those things. But I remember being very worried about my speaking abilities and my words because I felt like I had spent four months alone with this baby, mostly. yeah Not having many conversations other than what we're saying to our babies, like narrating what we're doing through the day. yeah And I found as I was starting to get out there, like words would just disappear from my head. And I was deathly afraid of that happening like during a meeting or at work because I had i went into motherhood with this notion that like it was a liability. And like that was like a very visible like sign that like I like motherhood was impacting my ability to deliver at work. Yeah. um so i was deathly afraid of that

Speaker: along with like all the other things um and so i think sort of the kind of just the framing that i came in i really wanted to be a mother and i knew i could be a great mother because my mom was wonderful a wonderful model But I thought motherhood was a liability to all the other aspects of my life, especially working. yeah And so i think there was ah just like the mental angst and like just lack of self-compassion for me whatsoever.

Speaker: that all was just so much harder for me to deal with. Yeah. Tara, how is it for you? Yeah. I mean, that is so relatable. um I think, you know, similarly, I was, of course, worried about Dua. Is she going to be OK without me? And how old is she right now? She's almost two and a half.

Speaker: Yeah. So it's still everything still feels very fresh. But I think the biggest thing was, you know, I am a New Yorker in New York. You define yourself by your career. And for the last 15 years, that's what I've been doing. You know, this is my career. This is who I am.

Speaker: And so this new definition of mom, i really wondered, you know, how are these two things going to coexist? How am I going to be good at both? I think the biggest thing that I was also afraid of is just kind of like that identity shift, right? Like, who are you bringing to, you know, when you're at home? Who is that person that's coming out? And who's the person that you're bringing to work? Similarly, you know,

Speaker: Being in front of your team and making sure you have the right words, making sure that they know that you're still there for them. Right. At the end of the day, like that team is also a family. Wherever you're working, you know, you want to make sure that you still have that empathy for the team, that they still can kind of lean on you. Right. And so I feel like being able to start figuring out, like, what are those pieces that I can meld together is what started to bring me more strength in the workspace and in the workday. And I felt like I was getting stronger at that over time. But it took time for sure.

Speaker: Yeah. i kind of following up on that, Tara, what did going to work feel like for you emotionally? Before we started recording, you were saying like you remember having like meltdowns and that completely makes sense to me especially knowing that this was something that you were going to have to be juggling. Like literally it feels like forever. Cause you feel like, I mean, my son's also still really young. You feel like they're going to be little forever. yeah And then it's just going to be like that hard forever. So how did that feel like just ah ah strictly emotionally? Like what were the vibes?

Speaker: Yeah, I mean, you saw it. I remember seeing you and just being like, how am I going to do all of this at the same time? And I think as a mother, as a woman, you take on so much responsibility, whether it's making sure that your family is taken care of, but also your, you know, your mom and dad, your in-laws, your you know, your extended family. My sister just moved to New York, right? Like, I just want to make sure she's doing well, too. Right. And so i feel like you take on so much more as a woman, even before you're mother, that I started to feel like some of those balls that were in the air were starting to fall. And I think emotionally going back to work, it was tough because I didn't want to let anybody down. I'm a Virgo. I'm a type a woman. i want to

Speaker: be as good as I can be in all those circumstances. And I think that is really tough when you feel like, am I failing someone? yeah Am I not doing enough? Right. And so I think that's when you saw me. Yeah. yeah And that's when I met you. And I was like, I was pregnant, but...

Speaker: Did I scare you? No, you didn't. Because also especially like I've had non kind of traditional work for like a really long time. Even when I was working full time in quotations, the the most full time job I had was when i was an instructor on a fitness mirror. It was technically full time, but I filmed twice a week. And then I went to I was in grad school. Like I was mostly vibes. Like I've not ever worked five days a week in an office. Even when I had that brain melt and was like, let me start a new job at the startup when my baby was teeny, it was 40 hours a week at home.

Speaker: And also, like I said, it did not last very long because my husband and my mom were like, are you OK, girl? Like, that's a crazy thing to do right now. And I was like, you're kind of right. Like, maybe I don't do this at the moment. um But yeah, I've never had that kind of experience. So I think this is so helpful, especially for like all the moms listening, because a lot of moms do. yeah My mom was a working mom, so absolutely. So for Jessica, when you work with a mom preparing to return to work, what are the biggest things you want her to think through before that first day back?

Speaker: Yeah. I hope she's starting to think about it while she's pregnant and having those kind and having starting conversations with the partner, if the partner's involved. um But I know she's thinking about child care. i know she's figuring out feeding, pumping bottles, whatever.

Speaker: But the things that I don't think she's thinking about um is getting clear on, like, why she works. So if you're pregnant, I'd love you to start thinking about this and get a pen and paper and write it down um and capture that. um If you're still on leave, you can do that, too. But why do you work?

Speaker: Like, what does money have to do with it? What does your impact in society or yourself have to do with it? um What does your family have to do with it? um And then...

Speaker: Capture some of your like career confidence and milestones. Like what are you proud of? Like in the past 12 months, what's some great like strengths based feedback like that you've gotten? Like, what do you do well? Yeah. um Why are you great to work with?

Speaker: um And just like, even if it's just like on a post-it, just like have that um before going on leave and kind of get grounded on like why you work and why it's important for you.

Speaker: Yeah, as something you can kind of come back to and like revisit to remind yourself. Yeah. And then when you're approaching and preparing for returning, I want you to revisit it um and see if things have changed. um Because I feel like someone who's confident and like grounded in like what they believe about themselves um helps them make more confident decisions.

Speaker: Yeah. um Because there's going to be storms coming at you and a lot of emotions are going to be coming with that. And I think if you can sort of put some stakes in the ground and also watch how reflect on how you're evolving and have a conversation with yourself, um that's a great foundation to start from.

Speaker: Yeah, I love that. I want to go back and do that right now. Yeah. I mean, i feel like I'm continually doing it, you know, as we're kind of figuring out the right mix of work and family and- it's such a great practice. Creative pursuits and friends and then having to go back to caregiving for parents maybe or things like that. Like it's ever evolving. So yeah, yeah start that conversation early. Yeah, I love that.

Speaker: I want to pose a question to both of you so you can respond in whichever order. But how did motherhood change your relationship with ambition? Because I know you were working in a completely different role. Like you weren't a doula at the time when you were returning to work with your from your daughter. um But how did motherhood change your relationship with ambition? and did you still want the same things professionally? Or did you define do your definition of success start to shift?

Speaker: I'll go. Yeah. um I think motherhood made my ambition more intentional. And similar to the exercise that you were kind of mentioning, it's, you know, what are those goals? And ultimately, what are you prioritizing, right? Ambition can look different in so many different ways. The career that you have had maybe for the last 10 years, the last 15 years doesn't have to look the same, right? There's no path that everybody needs to follow. And you can kind of create that path for yourself, right? And so seven years ago, I started my own company, where i basically said, I want to do something that I can also harness my creative outputs. And that path and that journey is completely different than, you know, my more traditional professional journey that I have. And both can be true, right? Both can be excelling in their own ways. But I think what I learned was that, like, I am allowed to be ambitious in any path that I choose. It doesn't need to be tied to what a typical society would say success looks like. And motherhood gave me that okay or gave me that permission to essentially say, like, you are allowed.

Speaker: Yeah. Before you tell me your response, Jessica, it's making me think I remember very early on I had in some ways, I don't know, like, I don't know if it's necessarily an opposite response, but I know i definitely had moments that I was like, I actually don't care about anything. i don't care about my career. i don't care about anything else except for this baby. And like, actually, I'm just never going to do anything again. I'm just going to be home with him forever and I will never make another dollar. And like, that's fine.

Speaker: And then that would completely flop. And I actually took a picture of myself and wrote a letter to myself. um Maybe I'll post it like in my stories when I share this episode, but it's very vulnerable. And it's literally me. What I felt like was actually my lowest moment of my life. And I was telling my husband like, wow, I'll never have a career again. And like, I will never do anything again except for like take care of this baby because this is 24 hours a day. And like, I'm never going to be a person again. So, yeah, I think it's like also for the moms listening that are maybe super early on in their postpartum experience, if you are like, oh, I will just never work again, i think that's a completely fine feeling too and maybe won't last forever. but Jessica, I saw you nodding, so I want to know your thoughts. No, I mean, there's seasons. yeah And i you talking about like, oh my gosh, is it going to be this relentless like forever?

Speaker: Thankfully not. Mom from the future. It's not going to I know having a nine year old, she's like a full person. Yeah. That's crazy. She is a full person. Yeah. And like stealing my makeup and things like that already. Yeah.

Speaker: um There are seasons and I think it's helpful to be like, this is a season where I am being ambitious in my motherhood. Like I love how you talked about I can be ambitious and in different lanes of my life. And I think for me, my um my ambition or relationship with ambition changed to be more expansive. Like I think it was very focused on my career um and work identity. And at the time I was working at a nonprofit supporting social enterprises and social entrepreneurs and nonprofit leaders.

Speaker: who were like up on Ted's stages talking about really world-changing things. And like, I was like, oh, like that's what success looks like. You have an idea big enough to like spread or whatever Ted's line is. um And now i feel so so honored to be a trusted person at the feet of women when they are birthing and in their most vulnerable states. I feel so, so honored um that small children are so excited to talk to me and like trust me with their most exciting discovery of the day that aren't my children. um

Speaker: i think, yeah, my idea of ambition and how I want to live, how I want to live my values, um and how that sort of like shows up in my life um has really expanded my view of how I want to be ambitious and what type of life I want to live, not just in work, but being able to contribute to our community, have a life full of friends, rich with friends.

Speaker: So it's really expanded. um But it was it's been a process. Yeah. Like sort of getting to that spot because we do pin a lot on our work identities. For sure.

Speaker: And I think especially in New York or in like a big city, a lot of times I remember Especially i think like in my 20s, I mean, it hasn't stopped, but especially in my 20s, you'd meet someone and they'd be like, oh, what do you do?

Speaker: Just always, hi, what do you do? And I'm like, oh, my gosh. Meanwhile, now it's so different because I'm meeting like other parents at the park. and I'm like, hi, how old's your baby? That's like yeah the go to question. Um, but what do you do That question can be so exciting when you feel like you're really killing it, but it could also be, like, so treacherous when you're like, I really don't want to talk about this. Can we talk about, like, something else? So it's a tough one.

Speaker: Another question for both of you guys. that I want to get into a little bit is mom guilt. So mom guilt shows up in so many ways. When you're guilty, you're working. When you're guilty, you're not working. When you're guilty, you're missing something. When you're wanting just me time. I want to know how mom guilt, how you've navigated that, how it might personally show up for you, how you've combated that. I mean, i I don't know that anyone has solved it. I think, unfortunately, it's something that so many parents and moms especially deal with. I do hate the name mom guilt because it's like not really guilt that you're feeling. It's just you're feeling at odds being pulled in two different directions. Like Shonda Rhimes gave an amazing so like speech and she was saying how people always ask her, how are you always killing it in like both parts of your life? And she's like, I'm not. I always drop the ball somewhere.

Speaker: Like you can never do both. You can never be a mother and run this entire company at the same time. It's not possible. So what are your thoughts mom guilt? What are the like, how do you navigate that?

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, mom from the future again, like, I have good and bad news. Bad news, it never goes away. Yeah, I figured. But, and also, like, dads have guilt, too. Like, when they're out working, too. So everyone feels guilt.

Speaker: But the good news is i feel like you build resilience around being able to navigate the strong emotions around it. um And I think that that comes with experience and having those opportunities to be able to kind of think about like what's important to you. Like what am i bringing into the home? I carry a lot of things into the home. What do i bring into the home?

Speaker: um I might have forgotten to order the dance leotard in time and she had to wear a different color. um But I am so joyful.

Speaker: i can make everyday adventures, like everyday mundane activities feel like an adventure. um I am a safe person that she will crawl up into at the end of the day and tell me if something's not going well at school.

Speaker: um i think you really need to ground yourself and sort of like, what do I do really well? Like, what am I bringing like into this house? And that sort of helps you. weather those like emotional storms when you're feeling pulled um and also have conversations when they get older and be like, you know, like mommy is really excited about creating content and storytelling um and helping to like make the experience of motherhood more transparent.

Speaker: um this is This is work that really lights me up. i need to I need time to go do that. yeah But I'll be back. yeah And we'll have our special time to like read or go out to eat or something like that.

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. I agree with that. I think I was at a book club with ah Janelle Teaves, who's the CCO of Bugaboo. And she said, you know, like, of course, she's being pulled in so many different directions. She's a multi-hyphenate and she's doing so many different things. But what is the special time for her is breakfast. Yeah.

Speaker: And that is what she values. That's what she cherishes. And our kids know she is going to be at breakfast. And I took that and i kind of said, like, what is my thing? What is that special time that we have? And for me, like, I love style. I love fashion. I'm really hoping that it's genetic and it passes down to her. But getting dressed for school every morning, she loves to match me. And so then she'll follow me into my room. And it's, can we wear brown? Can we wear pink together? And I think we've started to build a bond there where Even if I you know if i miss her later on in the day or if I'm not you know not at pickup most of the time, but you know if I do see her, she's like, you're still wearing brown. We're still wearing blue, right? And it's that connection that I'm trying to build with her about something that I love that I can share with her and just say, like this is something that is going to grow with us, right? I hope she's 16 and still wanting to match with me, but who knows if that's going to happen. And so building that special time together, building those moments together, turning your phone off, making sure that you're like really present,

Speaker: I think that's been working for me. I'm just starting out. I'm just trying it. So I'll keep you guys posted. But yeah, I think it's really like, how do you find those moments in the in your everyday life and make mundane special?

Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. You just gave a couple like really awesome actionable steps for moms that might be listening that are thinking, how do I navigate this? How do i figure out what works for my family? i love the matching. That's so cute. I'm obsessed with that. I make my son match me, but he's like tiny. Like he doesn't know we're matching, but I'm like, we're coordinated, and it always coordinated. um So I love that, you know, turning your phone off or choosing a designated time like breakfast that, you know, you can spend together. So what are some practical systems that make the biggest difference for you? But also, Jessica, as like someone that does this with other families and other moms, like what are some practical systems for when mom goes back to work? You mentioned things like child care and feeding.

Speaker: So if um if someone's listening and, you know, they're going to be returning to work sometime in the future, what are some like tangible takeaways and systems and like things that that they can be thinking about?

Speaker: I'm curious to hear what you've figured out oh my god so far in your two years. No, no, I'm still very much figuring it out. My husband would say that we are very much still figuring it out.

Speaker: um I think that one of the things, and this is probably a little bit different, it depends for everybody, like what their work situation is. But I think one of the things about communication is not just communication with your support system. Like if they're going to daycare, yes. If they have an if you have a nanny, yes. If it's grandparents, whatever it is, right? But also communicating with your manager at work, communicating with your team, right? Making sure that you're saying, taking stock of like, what do you need for me in the next 30 days? What's actually important for me to come back to And what are the things that you need me to plug holes into, make sure that I'm fixing? Or this is not something that that's as important for you to catch up on right now. right And I think something that happens is that you have this overwhelming feeling of, I need to know everything that happened in the four months I was gone, in the five months that I was gone. and that's quite impossible, right? Like, it's very difficult to do that. Maybe with AI now we could do that, but it's still incredibly tough. And so I think having that really open and honest communication, i am feeling behind. i don't know what to catch up on. Four months, five months is a long time to be gone. What are the things that I need to know? What do you need from me? And how do I get that done for you? Right. And I think those three questions, I am going to take that back with me. And I've started to share it with other people because even folks on my team, I want to make sure that they feel prepared and that I also feel prepared if somebody is going to be coming back. Right. Because i want to basically say to them, like, I have you. I got your back and I know exactly how you're going to be feeling. And I want to make sure you are supported. Right. So that's a little bit more tactical. And of course, it depends where you work. But I think that communication is like one of those key things that we think about in our family life, in our support system. But sometimes we forget that we should be communicating in the same way at work.

Speaker: Yeah, I love that. Yeah, that's very good. I like that so much. I'm going to take that. um In communicating back to your team, I think on sort of the home front, I would use postpartum as like an example, like how you started to prepare for postpartum. um How are you meeting the needs of your basic things? Like...

Speaker: rest who's wait who's doing wake-ups how are we sharing the night when we're both that maybe back at work um how are we getting food on the table like is it meat meal deliveries is it maybe are we getting another meal train from friends and family um are we doing batch cooking um i feel like think about like the first two weeks like the first two weeks of postpartum like how can we have that sort of figured out already Um, and then also kind of figuring out like who's doing drop off, who's doing pickup, or maybe you don't need that with the nanny.

Speaker: Um, getting those conversations kind of squared away and having all the basics. Um, I think having sort of a family North star of like, you know, during this time i want to,

Speaker: do X at work, keep my job, but also be as present as possible, um can give you sort of a guide guiding kind of star of like, what are we what am I doing and what am I not doing? Like, what are we choosing not to do this this six months, this year?

Speaker: um i like seven months back at work decided that I needed to like take my whole family and new baby to Turkey to meet the other side of her family.

Speaker: Looking back, like I didn't necessarily need to do that. So having sort of a sense of like a shared sort of sense of like, what is the focus of this season as we're returning? And like, let's take it a month or two or three at a time um and help and use that to help sort of understand what you're taking off your plates um and not doing. And then what sort of things that you need to do to resource yourselves to support you.

Speaker: Yeah. i love all those actionable tips because and especially what you were saying about communication not only being something that you're doing at home and with your family and with your caretakers, but also at work, because i would assume, again, as someone that doesn't have that kind of work environment, I would assume it feels really intimidating to transparently talk to your team about that because kind of going back to what you said, in some ways, a lot of moms are made to feel like but being a mom is now a liability. Like i need to... you know, work like I'm not a mom and then parent at home like I'm not working, right? That's something I hear moms say often. And trying to get rid of that mentality sounds like the direction we want to go in, you know, with that communication.

Speaker: Yeah, I would say there's a few things even during like maternity when you're on leave, you're like documenting your child's milestones to the T. I know you're doing that, but take some time to document like your growth and what you're learning about yourself. You do this so well. I mean, it's your Instagram and podcast, but. um Yeah. What are you learning about yourself? And what are some moments where you really displayed like leadership skills, crisis management? There's a coach in the UK who talks about how she locked her baby and her toddler in her car with the keys in it and they had to go catch a flight.

Speaker: She decided to break the window and like unlock the car. um But that was like some serious like executive decision making skills and crisis management. And I'm sure we all have different examples of that like across our mothering yeah lives. um And so, yeah, I think there's a lot of people out there that have been really helping to flip this narrative that like. The things that we're doing in the home and around raising the next generation um of people um is one of the biggest leadership incubators.

Speaker: Yeah, I think you could have. I think the other thing is you can't assume that someone else knows what you're going through. And then you can't assume that there is a plan for you in place just because you're coming back from leave doesn't mean anybody else is prepared for you to come back. And so there shouldn't be this kind of like, okay, I'm back. I'm going to go right back into my seat and I'm going to perform exactly how I did. Right. Because not only are you a new person now as this new, you know, not only this new real character of your child has come into play, but this new person that you are becoming through your new identity, you need to figure out, okay, what?

Speaker: Does everybody understand that I'm not the same person I was before this child and I'm not technically sitting in the same seat in the same way I was before? Right. And so kind of going back to your, you know, your your thought on just kind of like the decisions you're making, you're making billions of micro decisions as a mother every single day. You're making billions of micro decisions with the team every day at work. Right. And so I think those start to meld more and more and more.

Speaker: Yeah. okay. kind of want to switch it up a little bit and talk about how you stay connected with yourself outside of being a mom, being a professional, working, momming, all of those things.

Speaker: It is so hard, especially in the first. I have a friend that her baby is eight weeks and she's like, I'm so unwell. And I'm like, yeah, girl, I was super bad at that time. i was not doing good. Some people absolutely love the newborn bubble. And if you've listened to this podcast, you've already known I've said probably every episode. Not for me. Not for me. Didn't love it. Was...

Speaker: fighting for my life, honestly, throughout that newborn period. I was like, oh, I'm not good. I didn't actually know how bad I was until I was out of it. And then I was like, wow, I was bad. That being said, um if you're in those very early days, you can't even brush your teeth some days, never mind being like, what's my self-care going to be? But for the mom in the future, Jessica, you spoke to us from a mom in the future. So from a mom in the future,

Speaker: What are some ways that you are able to like make any time for yourself, do anything for yourself? What do you see some, you know, when you were working, I know you're still working as a doula, but like when you were working in an office or like other moms that you work with, like what are some things that you do? And also, how do you even find the time to do that?

Speaker: Truly. yeah You do need to prioritize um what feels the best for you in that moment. And so I forget where this exercise is from, but it's like writing down, what do i really want to do today? Like, I would love to just lay on the couch and read a book.

Speaker: and then like what's the like one thing that you could do that kind of brings in an element of that and that's like i'm gonna put my feet up for 10 minutes and i'm gonna read a poem or like a paragraph or like i love flipping through like really visual magazines um But yeah, finding the small things.

Speaker: And then as your kids get older, you do get more time to go out. And so I've had the same book club for 10 plus years in New York City. It's amazing. We've all seen each other go through different. That's so cute. Like boyfriends, girlfriends, partners, children.

Speaker: um So that's something I didn't stop doing um and really sort of takes me out of my mom identity. Yeah, I find that having something that's actually scheduled that isn't necessarily just like me on my own getting a pedicure, but it's like, oh, I have this thing. Like I have my mom run club. So it's like, OK, me and like we're running and like I'm in charge of it. So like I have to be there. Like it's literally mine. So I can't miss it. But having a thing that's like, OK, i have to go and like do this thing with other people has been really powerful and helpful for me. So I love, oh my gosh, i love that you've been in that book club 10 years. What a slay. That is so good.

Speaker: What about you? Yeah. um Similar, right? Like taking some of those small moments and seeing like, what can I fit in today? but I also think like when you do return back to work and you're like, okay, I still need to figure out how to make time for myself. Remember, like, you've been gone for a while. Catch up with people. Like, get multiple coffees on the calendar. Like, don't feel like you just have to go sit at your desk and work all day, right? Like, we are in a place where your network, your people, the connection is everything. And so if that is something that energizes you, that could be kind of like dual, right? You're getting that social aspect of it but you're also catching up on what you might have missed, right? So I think that was one of those things that not only like sped up the process of getting back to work for me, but it also really gave me this sense of like, oh, I can speak to people again. I can be social. Like, let me remember how to have a conversation. so am pretty extroverted. And so I think for me, that was really wonderful to be able to like, OK, I got this again. Like, I don't feel like, you know, a weirdo. it's Confidence building. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah.

Speaker: So if there's a mom listening right now that's going back to work in a few weeks and feels completely underprepared, unprepared, what are a few things that you would tell her to do or give herself permission not to do right now? So at least like one big thing, but even if there's like two things that this mom should definitely do or should definitely not worry about as she's going into this. And it could even be something you already said.

Speaker: It's not going to be perfect. honestly, it's not gonna be perfect for a while. And I think with the type of work and the future of work, you're almost working all the time, right? Like, slack never stops.

Speaker: And I think that permission to make sure that you're not feeling like, oh, okay, like, drop-off wasn't perfect today. Or, you know, I saw the nanit and it's been going off all day and, like, the nap time wasn't perfect. Like, it's not gonna be perfect for a long time. And it future mom, you correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't know that it'll ever really be perfect. And so, Give yourself permission to take little steps every day to feel like you have had some success in that day. Maybe the success was you just made your train. Maybe the success is that you had a great presentation. Maybe the success is that you were able to make pickup, right? Like whatever that success is, give yourself that permission. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. Permission, a lot of permission to not have it all figured out. um So if you're feeling totally overwhelmed, like I want you to stop and sit and do some four, seven, eight breathing. So in for four, hold for seven, out for eight, four times.

Speaker: Help sort of bring down your nervous system. um And then, yeah, write down whatever is worrying you. Pick the top things and take it one at a time.

Speaker: um And if you haven't been able to capture sort of the like, why do I work? Why do I like working? Why do I want to return to work? um Take 20 minutes to kind of put down your thoughts on that and see if that sort of helps calm you down a bit and ground you a bit.

Speaker: Yeah. I think that exercise is like one of the top takeaways from this because I think that's going to be so helpful um and just like grounding and a great reminder to come back to So I want to ask you guys some questions that I ask every guest that comes on the show.

Speaker: So since you became a mother, what do you understand about motherhood now that you didn't before?

Speaker: Can I say everything? I felt like I went in ah pretty unprepared, honestly. Like, I think pregnancy was okay. not going to say great, but I think I was kind of like, okay, I got this. I'm feeling like, all right, nine months later, i figured out pregnancy.

Speaker: But I didn't feel very prepared. And I don't think I realized that the constant demanding nature of motherhood. And I think that's been the biggest takeaway for me that there is no off switch, very similar to Slack.

Speaker: And you said relentless earlier. There is off switch for that. For Slack. Hopefully. But you said relentless earlier and relentless is the word of that i always come back to because motherhood really is relentless. It really is for forever to 24 seven. But it feels, especially when they're little, that it will always be that intense.

Speaker: Yeah. um So Jessica, since you became a mother, what do you understand about motherhood now that you didn't before? I feel like mothers and motherhood is such an undervalued asset in this world.

Speaker: It is such a powerful transformation. And it comes with so much power. We're creating little humans for the next generation. like...

Speaker: that like moms are amazing like even even mothers who are home with their children they're being they're ambitious they have skills they are helping each other build build worlds build businesses um and I think our cultural view of just sort of like framing motherhood as a liability or something that should be kept in a certain area, um, I think is so wrong. Um, so I think, yeah, I think I came in with that view and was just like, I can't become a soccer mom.

Speaker: Um, but I love being a dance mom. Yeah. Um, and I love being able to work and I love to be like, just showing the next generation of girls, like what they can do.

Speaker: Yeah. What is something mothers worry about that you wish they would give themselves permission to stop worrying about?

Speaker: Comparing themselves to any other mother. Comparison kills your joy. And if your kid is not meeting a milestone or something as fast as another kid...

Speaker: Don't worry about it. Who cares? The, the like, I don't know, the breadth or like spectrum of like milestone hitting, especially when they're young is so broad.

Speaker: um yeah. Don't worry about who looks like they're carrying motherhood better because you have no idea what's going on underneath. We're all so, so good at wearing masks.

Speaker: For sure. I mean, that's the best one. um I think one thing that is a larger conversation, of course, but like that is best in my opinion. And I think that's something that is really, really tough, especially going back to work and taking your ba breast bump on the train or trying to figure out if your office even has a room to do it. Right. And so be kind to yourself in that moment. And even when you start solids, right, still be kind to yourself. Most of it ends up on the floor. So, you know, it's a trying time and they will either kind of like, you know, love certain things, hate certain things, but they're just like us. Right. the They're many, many humans that have different tastes and we have to kind of like get on board with that. Yeah, I we do. i have an episode specifically on breastfeeding.

Speaker: um That's all about breastfeeding. And I'm an exclusively breastfeeding mom. But I do want to make it super clear that this is a fed is best community and support all the moms however they decide to feed their babies. So I'm so happy you brought that up because. I know there's especially when you're going back to work, my brain would explode like the thought of being on a pumping schedule, trying to maintain my supply, also in the office all day. Like that sounds so hard.

Speaker: It sounds so hard. And as someone that's never experienced it, but just is like empathizing, if that's happening for you, like sending you so much love and that is best. That is best.

Speaker: Last question is what would you say to the mother listening right now who feels like she's the only one struggling with today's topic?

Speaker: No, you're not alone. You are not alone. um yeah And I think if you're struggling and you're seeing other moms um like in your workplace or just on the playground or something after work, just be like, ah I'm really like having a day with this whole work mom life thing.

Speaker: And honestly, that's going to open a conversation and you're going to hear about how she is also having a day trying to manage the whole work life thing, too. Yeah. I've never met a mom that I was like, wow, this is so hard. And they were like, really? It's easy for me. Sucks for you. Bye. I've actually that's never happened to me, thankfully.

Speaker: Every time I'm like, wow, this is tough. And they're like, yeah, let me tell you about it. So I love that. Yeah, the other thing is like if there are other um folks in your workplace that took a leave, Pat leave, Matt leave, whatever it was, right? Have conversations with them. Like, how did you do it? how What are some tips or tricks you have for me? Like, what was the hardest thing? How did you have conversations with your manager? What was the communication process? Did you get any benefits that I don't know about? Right. Like, I think that's another thing.

Speaker: A lot of great companies have great benefits, including mine. And I think not everybody always explores all of them or even uses them. For example, my last company had an amazing therapy benefit that I loved and used this company as well. And so these are things that, you know, maybe you didn't know about until, you know, the other person that took leave told you. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. Having those conversations with other moms at the playground or other moms in your company, for sure, other parents. Thank you guys so much. Honestly, i really hope that this conversation helps another mom who is returning to work or working right now feel just a little bit more seen. I feel like every single episode, the takeaway from every single guest I have is you're not alone. yeah Like, every single topic, every single guest is like, you're not alone. You're not the only one struggling with this.

Speaker: and for me, especially when I was new to motherhood, I would think exactly, I'm not the only one struggling with this, so why is it so hard for me? Like, I would almost take it in a negative light. Like, ah so many other women are moms and like, they're not, deal they're not, it's not as hard for them, but it is, it's hard for everyone. You said it so well, you said people are so good at wearing masks. Like,

Speaker: Being a mom is so hard. Being a mom who works in any capacity. Exactly. You said stay at home moms are also doing so much hard work. Like it's all hard. It's all hard. So thanks so much for sharing how you guys make it just a little bit easier, a little bit more manageable um for your home, for your families, the families you work with. So I love that.

Speaker: Thank you guys so much for another episode of Since I Became a Mother. One thing that really helped me when I was juggling work and motherhood was finding ways to take recurring decisions off my plate. So having non-toxic EWG verified healthy baby essentials helped me a lot delivered from healthybaby.com. One less thing to worry about, and that will also be in the show notes.

Speaker: Thanks so much, guys. Thank you. See you on the next one. Thanks so much for listening. if you loved this episode, if something resonated with you, if you learned something that you think is interesting or amazing, make sure you share this with another mom that you know.

Speaker: All of the links for today's episode will be in the show notes, my social channels, any info about our guests, any links, products, or resources that we mentioned will all be there for you.

Speaker: I hope to see you in the next one released every Tuesday. Before I was a mother, barely noticed mothers and now they're all I see. I see you.