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S2 Ep75: All Hallows' Eve
78 Plays6 years ago
Sometimes the thing that goes bump in the night is actually just us tapping the microphone. Hopefully we avoid that in this week's episode as we dive into the spookier monsters and themes from games that we've played!
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Thoughts? Comments? Requests for new episodes? Feel free to email them in!
SoapstonePodcast@gmail.com
Like our podcast? Like our podcast! We'll post when new episodes are uploaded!
https://www.facebook.com/SoapstonePodcast/
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Transcript
Introductions and Halloween Jokes
00:00:37
Speaker
How's it going, everyone? Welcome to another episode of Soapstone. My name is Jake, and I'm joined by my co-host, as always, Dave. How's it going tonight, Dave? Dreadful. Oh, yeah. That's thematic. That was my point. Life's actually okay-ish. Yeah. I mean, it's not ideal, but I mean, it's hollowing. Therapy is for another episode. That's true.
Personal Halloween Connections
00:00:59
Speaker
This is all about Spooptober. Spoop. Spoop. Super spoopy.
00:01:05
Speaker
I'm not even talking towards the microphone. I'm just making it as bad as possible. Yeah, this is a spooky time when people have pumpkins and costumes and interact with their friends. Other terrifying things like that.
00:01:19
Speaker
Yeah. Dressing like a slut, dressing my pumpkin like a slut, dressing my dog like a slut, sluttiness all around, and also pumpkin spice things. I was like, I don't know. I don't know where we're going with like the slutty dog thing. I think that's, we'll just move away from that joke. I'll link you later. Don't worry about it. Yeah. But you actually have more of an affinity, I think, to Halloween than many people do. Why is that?
Church Activities vs Traditional Halloween
00:01:47
Speaker
Because you were born on Halloween.
00:01:50
Speaker
Yeah, my parents were like trick-or-treat and they're like you're pregnant. It's like what? That was actually nine months ago because I was born on Halloween. So my parents just trick-or-treat are really odd times, right? I didn't think of my On the spot backstory so much. No, that's fine. I was just or maybe you were born again on Halloween That would be interesting too because you know church accepts Jesus into my heart
00:02:15
Speaker
I mean like I know art my church used to have this like they would always have an alternative Halloween party Just like I guess the equivalent of like keep kids off the streets But for like the completely mostly harmless Halloween. Yeah, it's like for every fucking holiday the church would have like Hey, do you guys want like play some games? We're gonna pray. We're gonna play some games. We might also provide like some mediocre food You're like
00:02:41
Speaker
I guess. Yeah. Parents won't let me do anything else. I guess so.
Hosting Halloween Parties and Social Dynamics
00:02:45
Speaker
We just the main game I liked from church youth group things were.
00:02:51
Speaker
It's called nubby ball here. Hear me out. I saw the recoil, but it was like a really shitty, uh, Wally ball or volleyball. Oh yeah. But it was like a small rubber ball with nubs and the physics on it were impossible to determine. So you just hit it and hope for the fucking best.
00:03:11
Speaker
This is like golf with friends with the egg basically. Yeah, it was pretty bad How about we like establish a good baseline concept for like a fun activity and then we just sabotage it Chop it off at the angles. Yeah
00:03:27
Speaker
I like how you didn't point out prayer as being like, this is kind of the downer. You're like, ball of nubs, not ruining my sports. Oh, man. Yeah. But you also have the Halloween party. Yeah. Other than being born and born again on Halloween.
00:03:44
Speaker
Yeah, it's just a lot of events life events happen for me on Halloween including Getting drunk and dressing like a slut. So that's every every year, right? So what do you know how many years you've been actually running the party?
00:03:59
Speaker
Um, it's been a while now I'm gonna say four question mark, but actually might be five. Yeah, basically other people had Holidays like so-and-so had like New Year's people had like 4th of July or Christmas Thanksgiving usually family holidays. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Those are reserved. So it's just kind of like
00:04:19
Speaker
Hey, fuck you guys. This is my holiday. So I took it and I made a Facebook event. I'm like, I am hosting this. Everyone comes to my apartment and we will drink and hang out. Right. And it has evolved since, I guess.
00:04:32
Speaker
I like that your expression of F you guys is inviting all of your friends together, providing food for them and entertainment, so they end up all these decorations. I'm like an angry grandmother. Fuck you. Come over here. I'm going to feed you. No, that's pretty great though. I think it's like the only main social event I go to in a year from our friend group.
00:04:53
Speaker
Like looks at you and says land party out loud. That's actually true. Yeah, there's a land party but other than that Those two yeah, those are the two
Halloween Candies and Traditions
00:05:04
Speaker
mandatory ones. Are you a big Halloween guy? I'm like trick-or-treating or spooky things are just the I think autumnal temperature and color change. Oh
00:05:14
Speaker
I've only, I fall, I love, but like Halloween itself, I've probably only ever gotten trick-or-treating like once in my life. Like again, religious upbringing and then like past the point, the existentialism kind of sets in and you're just like, oh, all right, I'm part of the generation that just, you know, is constantly questioning their reality and whether anything means anything. Maybe I won't go trick-or-treating this year. And then you just ride that wave.
00:05:43
Speaker
I just order candy on Amazon. It's much easier. No human interaction. I do that as well I get the vanilla tootsie rolls though for like Christmas. Nobody else likes them. So I'm literally the only person keeping this industry afloat, but Yeah, people call them midgies too, which I always find out. Yeah If you're gonna drink candy, you got to go like full orange slices. Give me a jelly that's covered in sugar and
00:06:09
Speaker
Interesting the orange slices are good. I can't I can't contest that orange chocolate is pretty freaking delicious That's probably the one thing I have against Halloween actually is like the candy. It's candy But for the most part, it's not like amazing candy. It's not like good holiday candy
00:06:26
Speaker
No, usually it's kind of like if you look at candy corn as the prime example It's kind of like some weird waxy shit. Yeah, um, I think i'll still eat it But I think it's the bulk nature of it people just buy a lot of candy for like halloween They're just like how do I get the most candy for the least amount of money? Because i'm gonna give it to these worthless kids, you know And then also other people's kids
00:06:51
Speaker
Yeah, it's just it's a lot. Yeah. I remember initially I was like, we're going to go trick or treating and later is like, oh, we're going to have trick or treaters. That's kind of cool. Then I'm like, turn the fucking lights off. Nobody will disrupt my living arrangements, please. Yeah. Yeah. I think the only the only time I've ever like been receptive to trick or treaters was like an event at the end laws with my wife. Like we had zombie makeup and stuff like that and handed out candy. Otherwise, like, you know, standard things stay as far away from kids as possible.
00:07:22
Speaker
Yeah, I'm like Life's changing for me. I also hate children.
Halloween Games and Themes
00:07:27
Speaker
So it works out. It was really funny because it happened really young and so he's just like The other kids like that they just won't understand they're gonna don't take this the wrong way I'm not affiliated with them a short adult keeps trying to play dodgeball So how about a spoopy games anything jump to mind for you just like
00:07:50
Speaker
Is there something you like to play on halloween to get into the season so to speak? I think like Normally, no because you know, we've talked about this before but I don't really like horror games for the most part So I would just normally play whatever I still want to play again, you know not huge on the observance outside of the one social event, but there've been like a couple games that probably really have that kind of
00:08:16
Speaker
Spooky vibe or like isolationist feel things like that. It's not even on literally the list we prepared but I got that with like Some older games where they just didn't populate the world's that much and these like creepy music or something. Perfect. Dark is perfect example You're just like what's going on? I know we already talked a little bit about it, right? But that for me, it's like oh you've got that sermon kind of playing in the background the alien music Very few. Yeah the instrument there
00:08:45
Speaker
No, no, mine's modified. Oh, a super there. Oh man. Yeah. No, it is there when you're right. Like from the doctor who. Yeah. They use it there. It's a, the traditional, I think Halloween instrument. Um, but I don't go out of my way to play spooky games on Halloween. That's already, it's already bad. The skeleton's out there. The skeleton in me.
00:09:10
Speaker
The ultimate face. What about, what about you? You ever like, man, I'm just appreciating life too much. I mean, I just spooked myself. Due to some medical conditions, that hits too close to home, but I usually will not play things for the sake of just seasonal.
00:09:32
Speaker
But I think around Halloween is when I initially got Costume Quest, which I super love, Tim Schafer game.
Introducing Games to Non-Gamers
00:09:38
Speaker
It's a very simple RPG as far as mechanics go, but it's just very cute and fun. And it has that Tim Schafer humor and aesthetic, but it's also based around Halloween because it's a brother and sister. You can play as one or the other.
00:09:54
Speaker
The one you don't play as gets kidnapped and you have to go and find them and save them from these Goblins who are trying to take all the humans candy Just like really
00:10:06
Speaker
Yes again, not a great understanding of following but Yeah, I haven't Haven't played that one though I remember you talked about it like a while back and you're like, hey I'm gonna get other people one other person I think to play it and you're like, I don't think I I think I've Like one or two people who I data be like hey try this game. Yeah, it's the test sadly a lot of people have eight or not Gamers as much. Mm-hmm
00:10:32
Speaker
So like they don't pick up on the what I consider to be like intuitive controls of things, but they do enjoy the aesthetic. Um, so overall, I still do recommend it as a game.
Vampire: The Masquerade Discussion
00:10:44
Speaker
Even if you're not, I'd say more so if you're more of a casual gamer, you're just like, this looks fun. I want to play this or experience it with somebody rather than like going to fucking 100% it's not one of those.
00:10:55
Speaker
I was going to say the, uh, I find that that's probably the reason that, uh, they're not into games as much as, cause they're not true gamers to do that. You have to date men, obviously, since you're a guy to be, to be a gamer, they have to be men. So that's the pun. I'm going to start searching. Uh, I think it's a subreddit too. Well, G A Y M E R definitely. Yeah, it is. Yeah.
00:11:21
Speaker
And that's if I liked guys, right? I'm not there yet. Maybe one day it's gonna be a Surrender of a kind you're like fine fine. Maybe I just need to wait for the right full moon Because cuz butts or it was because also werewolves Okay, yeah some of those lycanthropes if you will
00:11:43
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, you know what? I thought of a game you should have said. Didn't even think about it until you mentioned Lycanthropes. But Vampire the Masquerade. Yeah. That is Halloween themed because of vampires.
00:11:59
Speaker
Again, yeah, not even really something I was planning on talking about, but love that game. It's like hecka broken. The community had to fix it. I think Troika made it. If that doesn't ring any bells, it's because they don't exist anymore. So they made this game and then disbanded?
00:12:17
Speaker
more or less. I think they weren't, they weren't tremendously successful with it. There's supposed to be a new one kind of coming out pretty soon here because there was vampire masquerade and then vampire masquerade bloodlines or vampire masquerade two.
00:12:30
Speaker
Yeah, there's blood blood lines Uh, I think redemption is the other one and then vampire the masquerade two is coming up um in that order not exactly in that order but uh, yeah, you know, you got the traditional vampire attire, uh, you've got the Dependent like everything vampire tropes i'm not gonna go through literally all tropes can't be seen in sunlight but there was a section in that game where you had to avoid a giant werewolf because the werewolves are like
00:12:59
Speaker
There's gangro, which is one type of vampire that is more bestial Like they have their beast form power and they're kind of more like the gargly like gargoyly. Yes Actually, that's pretty accurate and werewolves which are usually not playable is my like understanding from the tabletop game and
00:13:19
Speaker
are like hardcore against vampires. This isn't like some twilight nonsense where you're like, oh, at the end of the day, we'll find a way to get along and there's a baby and they're gonna drown the baby. No, it's none of that. It's like you have to like run around an observatory at night while it's like chasing you, trying to kill
Krampus and Cultural Horror Lore
00:13:39
Speaker
you. And you can like escape it, I guess, or run around enough that it runs away.
00:13:44
Speaker
Or you can kill it by crushing it in the observatory doors, by luring it in as the doors are closing. It's like, it's crazy. It's like 15 feet tall, 20 feet tall. It's absolutely gigantic.
00:13:57
Speaker
I like the idea of holding the elevator for a werewolf until I'm like, just kidding. The last minute's like, nah. I think that you have those like spring elevator doors just slam closed. Hold the door please. No. I want my arm.
00:14:14
Speaker
Or it's one of those, uh, I guess more dumbwaiter styles where it kind of just has like that lattice that slides across and it's like, it's technically closed. Let's go up. It's not like a full door. You could like drop your keys or phone out or anything else, but also things can reach their fingers and you're like, Oh, shit. Yeah. No, those are inherently uncomfortable. I want no part of that.
00:14:36
Speaker
That's why I don't like lattice or fishnet stockings not playing those games. You'll lose your fingers That's exactly what happened One other quest and that will move past vampire the mass grade but was particularly spoopy was you found a
00:14:52
Speaker
I think it was a Middle Eastern vampire. There's like a different type basically. I know right well they so there are different like regional types. There's one for like Asia There's one for like kind of European US and then there's like Middle Eastern type then they have different attributes and things
00:15:10
Speaker
But you find her in like the bottom of an abandoned hospital. And there's people investigating the hospital was like paranormal team, like one of those shows. And they're all like, oh yeah, this is all 100% fake, whatever, you know, we'll like make some fake stuff up, kind of manufacture the experience.
00:15:29
Speaker
as I assume they do and You can find her down there and she's like hey You're I say like you're also kindred If you lure like the cameraman down here, I will reward you greatly you'd be like
00:15:46
Speaker
What are you gonna do with him though? You gonna eat him? She's like, yes. Like, oh, okay. And then you have all the information you need. So you lure the guy down there. She kills him, eats him, and you get your artifact, I think. Basically, Vampire Grubhub.
Cultural and Personal Halloween Reflections
00:16:04
Speaker
It was remarkably efficient for her And I think it was actually I don't know if he had to trick multiple people or not but I got like more difficult to like get more people to actually leave and Be devoured by her because she like straight up usually you drink blood as a vampire Usually yeah, her variant like actually has to feed on flesh Hmm. Yeah, so it's more Halloween II What is the definition of Halloween
00:16:34
Speaker
Eating flesh, obviously. Right. Um, but yeah, those are, those, those stand out as some, some pretty good Halloween moments from that series, I think. Yeah. I'm going to ask the question again, what is Halloween for you? Is this just like spoopness? Is it just, yeah, I guess, I guess like theming and kind of this.
00:17:00
Speaker
This is a big cultural question. What is Halloween for me? Well, I'd say it's probably October 31st. I don't know where the accent came from, but...
Halloween vs Christmas Mythos
00:17:13
Speaker
But yeah, I think it's, I think it's largely, largely that get together time. It's a very social thing for me, I guess, like in real life. But if you're talking games, then it's going to be something, something a little spooky, something a little jump scary.
00:17:32
Speaker
i just like the celebration of weird fucking horror mythical lore that people have made up yeah because like every fucking place in the world has like their own like uh hey kids uh be good or else uh this thing's gonna kill ya yeah
00:17:52
Speaker
It's just really cool how those things have like developed over time and how they're different like variations like oh I see how this vampire is kind of similar to Something else like Eastern European culture right or just where all that shit comes out Yeah, like one example I can think of for that because many people see Halloween is kind of the lead-up to Christmas or the anti-christmas in some ways You're just outside snow everything like that and then Halloween you're like no it's nighttime. It's dark. It's like lights and scares and all this and like
00:18:20
Speaker
So something we had here was Krampus which I'll be honest like the Wikipedia article is nowhere near as Intimidating as the trailer for the movie if you saw that yes There was a comedian. I liked in that movie when that trailer came out like For anytime I said like two years ago. It's probably actually like yeah, I know right when I was born I was born again on Halloween
00:18:49
Speaker
It might have been Paul Rudd, actually. But yeah, I did see the trailer and it's like, oh shit. Yeah. Like, I think it's like stealing kids and just murdering things. I'm like, I hate kids, but I don't hate kids that much.
00:19:02
Speaker
It's kind of funny, actually, because it's the anti Chris Kringle sort of figure. You're just like, we're not going to just reward kids, because in the US, it's more like, oh, Santa won't give you anything if you're bad, or you get a lump of coal, or something like that. You stay at zero, whereas these European kids are like,
00:19:22
Speaker
Oh, if you're a bad kid, they're gonna drag you away into the night. They're gonna pull you out of your bed and, like, through the window and you're gone. You're like, oh, I see. We're reducing way below zero in the reinforcement.
00:19:35
Speaker
It's all like different parenting right or how religion treats like you have your fire and brimstone It's like yeah, you're gonna go to hell and hell is really bad says the southern preacher. Yeah, or it's like hey God reward your good actions in
Game Mechanics and Cultural Lore
00:19:49
Speaker
heaven. Mmm You're like, but I thought rewards were material goods that we shouldn't focus on Don't pay attention that worship God get that paycheck get that bread be a good Christian get that bread. Oh
00:20:01
Speaker
give 10 that bread to ducks and the poor but mainly the ducks your pacing on that reminds me of uh oh crap we were talking about comedians i literally lost it i'm gonna abandon that threat entirely because i know i'm not gonna think of them but uh
00:20:18
Speaker
Yeah, Krampus. He's in games. So for this one, one of my examples was he's in Don't Starve, where he has a bag and he will attack and steal your stuff. Well, he doesn't really fight you as much, but he steals all your stuff, which in a game about accumulating stuff is bad, much like real life, really.
00:20:42
Speaker
Um, having all your stuff stolen sucks. Um, but he steals your stuff. If your karma is too low, like you've attacked innocence or like done other things that negatively impacts your karma, generally bad interactions with innocent people. Um, then he'll come over, steal your stuff, throw it, throw it all in a bag. But if you kill him, then there's a 1% chance he'll drop his bag and it's like an amazing backpack item. Hmm. Yeah.
00:21:13
Speaker
So being bad pays off, I guess, the lesson at the end of it. But if you kill Krampus at a cruise, more negative points and spawns and more Krampi. I think it's actually true. Um, I only know if Krampus from, I mean, obviously like the occasional Lord, but from game wise binding of Isaac, which is one of the devil room spawns. Hmm. I'm not actually familiar with this one.
00:21:36
Speaker
So basically if you go into a devil room, you can usually get a devil deal where you can sacrifice red hearts for usually stronger upgrades. Yeah. Uh, but sometimes you get fuck all or sometimes you just get red chests, which give you generically shit. Yeah. Or you might have the boss Krampus, which half the time seems to drop a Krampus's head and sends out like brimstone lasers. Oh, geez. I like four either.
00:22:04
Speaker
like a cross or diagonally, diagonal cross. Or, more commonly, before the one patch, would always drop a lump of coal. Which, the further your tiers went, the bigger they got and the more damage they dealt. Gotcha. So it's not actual garbage.
00:22:20
Speaker
No, it's actually good Huh I don't usually think of positive like positive effects to a lump of coal I assumed it was gonna be a garbage item like Camera brought it was like toenail or something like that. Well something doesn't do anything in the game It just takes your slot and you can't swap it out that's kind of what I would expect out of a lump of coal, but It's interesting they put a positive twist on it
00:22:45
Speaker
No, weirdly enough, all, all items in binding of Isaac have some utility. Yeah. Even the poop, which just allows you to spawn a poop once a room. Right. How can you be spooked if you can't even poop?
00:23:00
Speaker
Constipation gives me courage Pooping pooping fills me with determination and the determinations guys Weirdly
Horror Elements in Games
00:23:11
Speaker
enough. We are one a hundred percent on par with the notes. We've actually just been reading off this thing the whole fuck This is a plan to dialogue all the way down. Next up is leopard dead the witch is someone that toward the end of my leopard head career
00:23:27
Speaker
Was much less scary, but I would say early encounters with her More so just like prepubescent me I didn't like girls crying And that game really reinforced that now
00:23:42
Speaker
I'm a little more practiced. I still don't enjoy it overall. But worst case, you give him a nice crown. Hey, I'm celebrating you. Right. Bye bye. Princess. Usually you'd have one person who'd go crown. Everyone else would sit back with like the AK-47. It's like, all right, when they fuck up, we're going to shoot the witch and then pick them up. Always. Yeah. I think that's that's how that game worked, though, because you start out and you're like, oh, you know, investigate the crime, figure out what's going on. Oh, that's scary. She ran at me and killed me.
00:24:12
Speaker
You're like I'm not scared of her anymore, but I'm scared. I'm gonna screw up the crown like with the shotgun Yeah, cuz then she's like streams and it starts like Instantly downs you and then search just like mauling you for your down health. You're like Fuck how much you mates are confident? And they never were No, they threw boomer by laughing Maybe this will scare He's the decoy get out of here
00:24:39
Speaker
I don't even think that's the scariest thing from life or dead. Yeah. Well, what is what's scarier in life or dead? I would say
00:24:48
Speaker
Thematically the smoker because it has like a tentacle tongue right and then it you know once it's grabbed you and If you don't have like the reaction be like turn and shoot it or break it yourself Mm-hmm. Are you distracted because there's always shit going on in that game, right? You're kind of fucked. You just get like slowly dragged away from your team Yeah as zombies are like kicking the shins like fuck this guy
00:25:12
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know. The smoker was never like super scary for me. Very weird, obviously. Yeah, it's not normal to have a tongue that long. But what about the tank music that starts? Yeah. Oh, shit. Freaking no mercy finale up on the roof. That's scary. You're just I hope I don't get melee'd. Hope people are. I always have my back to a wall. I'm like, let's go physics this motherfucker.
00:25:35
Speaker
Yeah, like a coordinated team. Tank couldn't do much, but man, if you actually managed to break them up, you had some infected support. Start knocking people off of this freaking skyscraper. It's pretty good. It's fun times. Yeah. Uh, charges really good for that. Yeah. But they didn't have them in the first one. No, but thankfully they ported all of the maps. Uh, what else we got here? What's next? Thief. Okay.
00:26:05
Speaker
So around the three of the more important, probably more apt is a fee for the always have like, hey, here's like an insane asylum level. You're like, great. Yes, I love rickety beds with shitty mattresses with no, no sheets, no comforters. But everything's like rusted and decayed and kind of abandoned. But a lot of times they'll also have these mannequins there. Yeah. And a lot of time it's just for scenery.
00:26:31
Speaker
But occasionally it's not for scenery and it will move. And it's one of those uncanny valley things that will always. Unsettle me. Yeah. I think if I was at the department store and somebody moved to like two inches and when I looked away for two seconds, I'd be like,
00:26:47
Speaker
I think mannequins in general are actually pretty scary. It's just the almost parallel to acting human, but obviously not. You just need to throw mannequins in any game and it'll become scary. Take Hello Kitty's daytime adventure and put some mannequins in there. You're going to have a bad time.
00:27:09
Speaker
Yeah, it's just mannequins and lighting. Yeah. There's something about it. It unsettles me. Yeah. I think like, I don't remember. Did that, did Bioshock also have like a mannequin segment at some point? Well, they had some statues. Oh, that's what it was. That were statues until they weren't statues anywhere. They moved.
00:27:29
Speaker
Yeah, no, there's, there's a lot there that I'm not really comfortable with. I think it's actually, you talked about doctor who earlier. I think part of it is the, um, kind of like the, the weeping angel idea of like fundamentally things are changing when I'm not perceiving them. And that makes me very uncomfortable.
00:27:50
Speaker
It's like booze, but terrifying. Yeah. Like booze. Booze are really just shy. Weeping angels, the opposite. Oh, you were talking about booze from Mario. Yeah. I thought you were talking about alcohol. Booze are shy. That's OK, booze. Come here. I want to meet you. That was the point when I realized we weren't thinking of the same thing. We were like, booze are shy. And Dave was drunk already.
00:28:21
Speaker
No, I had a beer. It was a pumpkin beer, god damn it. You like pumpkin spice?
00:28:31
Speaker
I like pumpkin spice in pumpkin pie. I've had other like pumpkin spice things and it can be done well. Yeah. But it's not my go-to. Sometimes it's just like a spice tastes like overpowering spice. It's not pumpkin-y enough, I think. Just give me chai at that point, if you're going to spice the fuck out of it. Which I do drink. I do. I do like vanilla chai time to time, but I agree.
00:28:55
Speaker
similar thoughts on pumpkin spice. Um, the other one we have up here is amnesia, the monster, which is not really clear. Um, what we're talking about, if you're not super familiar with amnesia, cause there are monsters in amnesia, right? Like there's the, uh, the creatures that chase you. Right. But well, those are.
00:29:21
Speaker
So technically there's like three variations of the monster. But basically I think the monster in the early stage is just.
00:29:30
Speaker
This kind of Slightly decayed a little too fleshy is missing the bottom part of its jaw type of monster. Yeah, or it has like these Alien jowls that kind of go out. Yeah, kind of like a upside down What was the creature in the upside down stranger things the first one it was the Demi Gorgon Demi Gorgon mouth. Yeah
00:29:52
Speaker
Something like that flower petal mouth basically But when I wrote that the monster here as notes the one I was thinking of in particular was the The force the monster that chases you throughout the game like outside the castle. Yeah
00:30:10
Speaker
because like I mean go go to listen to our amnesia episode for a full explanation of our deep dive right but I think that having a force chasing you fundamentally changing the like architecture closing doors like oppressive and your inability to escape it uh is fundamentally scarier than
00:30:33
Speaker
You know, I kind of like relatively poorly rendered model with a creature whose AI you can exploit something like that. Give me something I can't confront. And that's more scary to me. Yeah. Put my emotions in the game. I fucking dare you. It's like your parents will never accept you.
00:30:53
Speaker
But yeah, I don't remember a lot of distinct moments in Amnesia, but there's one where you have to scale outside of the house, the structure castle, whatever it is, and trees just start falling in the distance as something out there is searching for you. And you're like, what, though?
00:31:17
Speaker
Yeah, like the whole plot is kind of like you took an artifact and it's like hunting you down to kill you Yeah, we don't know anything beyond that but it kind of like drives your actions throughout the game Well, I guess your actions before the events of the game take place. Yeah, which you then rediscover as your memory comes back through
00:31:37
Speaker
notes and reading. Yeah. Yeah. It's really a driving force for the game itself. And for more on that, go back and let's do our episode on amnesia. I like that. We referenced all our previous episodes. Yeah. That's the end of the year episode. That's what we're building towards. This is the culmination where we have a lot, we rest on our laurels as opposed to what we usually do, which is rest on our butts in chairs.
00:32:06
Speaker
So I know you have not played it and I have not beaten it but amnesia too This is the pigs machine for pigs. Yeah, it's all very pig men and slaughterhouse themed and very weird. Yeah, but it
00:32:23
Speaker
It unsettles me much more. There's something just very creepy about hearing like a pig squeal out of like terror or pain. Yeah. Where you're just like, I do not like this. Yeah. It kind of curdles a little bit.
00:32:39
Speaker
I think like it's also a little uncomfortable because like biologically there's parts of humans that aren't so different from like pig parts, parts, things like that. And you're just like, ah, something more biologically, like pigs traditionally, I think in a lot of experiments and things like that. And this mythos, this Halloween culture, you're just like, oh, what are they doing with the pig? Is this, is this real? You know, like what's going on?
00:33:06
Speaker
I think I don't I don't know a lot of machine for pigs, but I I believe that the machine is actually for humans I think that's I think that's the takeaway Yeah, and humans are the pigs It's just kind of like When that lying explorers like hey, um, you don't like standard society What if we turn that on his head and we were just like treating people like livestock gotcha. Mm-hmm
00:33:29
Speaker
That's not the point of the game. It's just like, that's one of those concepts that's innately kind of terrifying. Yeah. That's really building off the themes of the first two. Maybe I'll have to play that someday, but I probably won't. Instead, I might replay limbo. I'm going to buy you a segue for Christmas. Do you really need one? Yeah.
00:33:52
Speaker
But the reason I might replay limbo is because it sounds just like the back of a box or a box, like game box or something. But, um, in particular, and I think if, if people have played through limbo, they know what we're talking about, but the spider, uh, that haunts you for the beginning of the game and pushes you forward.
Limbo and Spider Phobia
00:34:12
Speaker
Yeah. It's, um, they do a really good job because it's fairly simple graphics is like pretty much black and white and just some, uh, gray gradients. Yeah. But they designed the world in a way where you're not sure if something is a physical object. That's a part of like something you can interact with or is it background scenery? Yeah. Um, so they play with that a lot and like having like the fake spider legs that show up later. You're like, is that, oh no, okay.
00:34:40
Speaker
Because it's it's huge and it'll just kill you and you don't have Like certain giant monsters in games if you look at like the Dark Souls series like it'll have a tell like hey Coming in for this thing. Oh, you nearly got you nearly missed. Yeah But it's just it's quick. Yeah, and that's what always makes it more terrifying is when you have something small that can kind of like skitter and you can't anticipate its movements and
00:35:08
Speaker
near the start of the game it's one of the first real segments where it's like hey this is this is timed like if you move too slow you're gonna it's gonna kill you you're gonna die in particular though the encounter with the spider that's scariest to me or the the mechanic is there's a point where you have to lure it into attacking you yep
00:35:27
Speaker
and it like it kills you by stabbing you with its legs like it stabs through you and it's a very uncomfortable thing to see and you have to lure into attacking you but actually get out of the way before it kills you and I don't like that I don't like confronting that no the timing of that is a little a little too close though is that it yeah it's like um
00:35:51
Speaker
I think like facing your fears is how you overcome them a lot of times in these games, not to like harp on amnesia, but when I like kind of just let myself sit down, tapped out, it'll be like, Hey, you know, I'm going to die here, but let's see what the monster looks like. That took away so much of my fear of the monster for like the rest of the rest of the game.
00:36:10
Speaker
The creatures that chase you um, whereas in this i'm like, oh no I I know what it's like to get like to see the kid get stabbed by this fighter. I want no part of that Facing my fear is not going to make this less scary. I just don't want it. Yeah, and that was much more impactful Yeah, they did a good job of that. I wouldn't say that inside was As scary it had its sections though. Yeah, where there was the selkie underwater. Is that the The thing tries to drown you
00:36:41
Speaker
Selkie might be like uh, I think historically hmm selkie irish or norse, but basically it's kind of like a Watery creature. I feel like it's more supposed to be more horse like Mm-hmm, but it's whole thing is just to try and drown you Mm-hmm wait for one person's like a sort of fucking self Yeah, someone someone but it's this girl who like chases you and you can you're in like a little bathysphere and you shine a light on her Yeah, when the lights on her she's like
00:37:09
Speaker
All right, I'll hang back. Yeah, but as soon as it's not She's like coming for that ass and she will like break into the bathysphere and pull you out and kill you. Yeah Yeah, so like timing those sections always really weird. Yeah, I'm not a fan of drowning like no I mean in real life too. I'm not a fan of drowning but in video games, I think The psychological aversion to it's still there probably developed from sonic the hedgehog. I'd say that's where it started and
00:37:35
Speaker
Sonic the Hedgehog and Tomb Raider. Yeah. Really put me off water entirely. I didn't really play Tomb Raider. Is she particularly susceptible? The Mrs. Lara Croft. Miss Lara Croft. So going back to like the OG days of, um, not Sierra. Holy shit. This would have been. Squaresoft. Okay. At the time.
00:37:57
Speaker
Maybe I'm going to do squinty eyes. Like I'm trying to remember, but I don't actually remember it. Uh, but basically when she's around, she had guns on land. As soon as she was in the water, she was slow as fuck and they'd put things in the water, like alligators, which you couldn't really deal with at that time. Yeah. Uh, so you're just going through a cave. Like I gotta do a swimming section and then you would die. Yeah. It's like real life. Yeah. That's why I don't swim or drink water. Yeah. Can't take chances.
00:38:27
Speaker
It's true. Also the fuck on the spiders in Skyrim. No. Yeah. Like I was replaying Skyrim the other weekend to just get back into. I like leveling up shit. I think that's really what it is. It's a generic RPG progression. Yeah. But those spiders are too big, too hairy and like too much detail in the face.
00:38:49
Speaker
There's a lot of face detail. They have mandibles. I don't use that term ever. Yeah. They definitely like heavy fight. Because not giant spider, because giant spiders are usually what you fight. Like those are your standard garden variety spiders as giant and scary. No, giant spiders. Then there's like giant, giant spider, gargantuan spider. And like it's really early in the story too that they actually have you fight. It's the start of the golden claw.
00:39:17
Speaker
Yeah, which like almost everybody does right out the gate. Um, just cause every part of the game still need to go there. Well, he's like, Hey, there's a dragon attack. Cool. Go to this place. I don't want to go here yet. Oh, okay. Golden claw quest. Give me a stone. If you talk to the, um, the trader in Riverwood, he's also like, Hey, give me back that cloud though. Thief got it. Went over here. There's a lot of ways you end up there, but.
00:39:45
Speaker
Get me this mammoth tusk, it's in this cave, next to the giant spider. Some people like, some people stop playing the game then, actually.
Bloodborne and Mythological Roots
00:39:52
Speaker
Cause there's like, as far as phobias that are, like you have a reaction to it that's too strong to overcome, like spiders up there.
00:40:02
Speaker
A lot of people just can't like have a phobia of spider that they can't deal with. Um, and so I remember reading like years ago that, you know, there was a fair number of people who just literally stopped playing Skyrim because they got to the spider park and they're like, nope. Yeah. And it's mandatory too. Like for main quest, you have to do it. Huh.
00:40:22
Speaker
so they kind of locked like an entire section of obvious behind that like at the beginning of the game unless you're on pc and you got the mod that turned the spiders into bears and then you could not progress because there was a k full of bears between you and the aggressive objective
00:40:41
Speaker
We're just imagining like a bear kind of like dropping down from the ceiling like Why do you have eight legs? Oh my gosh if they had taken the bears skin and put it on the spider So much worse This is the Halloween episode I Don't want that so anyways Not having that you put something on here for blood-borne Which I played like a little bit recently you seem to be into it
00:41:10
Speaker
I am super into it. I want to do an episode at a point. Right now I'm at a bullshit point in the game. Right. Which I won't spoil. But uh, what the fuck?
00:41:22
Speaker
But yeah, there's one thing in there that I appreciated from, again, horror mythos lore is the kinder catch. It's not actually called that in the game, but a kinder catch is part of like Germanic lore, where there's like this type of giant creature that would like have a bag and put kids in the bag. And then the kids would stay in the bag.
00:41:43
Speaker
Keep putting more kids in the bag. That was kind of its thing. Yeah, maybe it would take them off somewhere. Maybe eat them. I don't remember But in blood-borne like I found one I immediately knew what it was Mm-hmm, but it killed me because it does stupid amount of damage. Yeah stupid but then if you die to it the first time there's a cutscene where you like you just see like burlap and then like you wake up in like some other Place. Oh nice
00:42:13
Speaker
So it's kind of cool to like see that tie in. Yeah, it is cool. The other, uh, the other place I've seen this term now, I don't really play magic, but I know there's a card in magic that is, is it literally can kind of catch? Yes. Yeah. I might have it somewhere. Cause I appreciated the art. You showed me the art in particular. I remember this specifically. Yeah. There's like two, they're just kind of like in the woods, but like in the one you can clearly see like in the bag, there's like a, like a kid's arm poking out and like their face.
00:42:43
Speaker
Hey help. Yeah. No, it's it's really disturbing really actually. Yeah. I don't want to make it seem like I'm a sociopath. It's good art. I get that. I just appreciate them being consistent to that lore. Yeah. There's this actually comes up in like.
00:43:01
Speaker
Um, like a fair bit of mythos sort of like kids disobeying their parents and like falling a trail out into the woods, something like that. I think this also has like, what I think of is, is Witcher there's trail of treats, which parents would send their kids on if they like, couldn't support them or anything else. They just, instead of, you know.
00:43:19
Speaker
Continuing to get food and clothing for their kids, they'd get some candy, lead them out into the woods with this trail of treats.
Dead Space and Tentacle Terror
00:43:26
Speaker
And then I guess at some point they would join the natural trail of treats, which is placed here by witches and the kids would follow them through and be abducted by the witches. Similar deal. Basically we're here to scare the kids. That's what these stories are about.
00:43:44
Speaker
Yeah, uh german's really don't like kids exactly that much because a lot of those things from like uh Like grim's era of horror. Yeah all seems to be kind of germanic based the brothers Brothers groom. Yeah
00:44:03
Speaker
I had another one I added here, but more a specific encounter. Dead Space as a whole is not a terribly scary game, especially once they added co-op.
00:44:16
Speaker
Um, but the first one was definitely the most uh, atmospherically scary before they just like give them the entire military arsenal and make it overpowered and he's in like a functional mechanism at this point, you know, it's like uh, before you get there you start off as just like an engineer with a little plasma cutter and you're like The game makes you feel like an engineer not like you're the doom marine, right? Yes
00:44:41
Speaker
And I think that's that's one of the important things is just like you are not equipped to fight back the hordes of necromorphs You're just a guy with a plasma cutter. Like this is for engineering work Yeah, and it feels good to like overcome that when you are that kneecapped because also like you're slow as fuck. Yes, um, so you really have to plant things out and pace yourself
00:45:06
Speaker
But once you get an upgrade and you have a little bit less scoliosis, more and more scoliosis, as you upgrade your health and stuff. More pips on your scoliosis. That's what it is, yeah. You've got a lot of pips there, Dave.
00:45:21
Speaker
But no, it was really good because I feel like later on it got a little more jump scary. Yeah. Or just cinematic. Yeah. There was like the, the early parts of the game ammunition was like so scarce. You can like, you couldn't light up every corpse in the room before you entered it. And just to check.
00:45:37
Speaker
You know, like maybe they'll animate maybe they won't but the The moment in particular there's people play through the game will know these segments and i'm sure be reminded of them at least right now the uh, you'll be going down a hallway and A necromorph like tentacle will just like pop out of the side and like grab you And start dragging you down the hallway like in increments so it'll drag you a ways and you'll kind of stop and like stabilize a little bit
00:46:05
Speaker
It'll drag you further, stop and stabilize, and then continue that until you reach the opening where it's pulling you into the ship, basically. And if you have not injured the tentacle enough by this point to make it retreat, it'll rip you down into the ship. Oftentimes your limbs will come off at this point as you're pulled through the hole and just pull you into the ship and you're gone.
00:46:34
Speaker
And it's freaking scary because the game usually lets you manage things under your own control and pace. You mentioned Isaac's really slow. By design, you're usually methodically going through the game. And this is quickly pulling you to your imminent doom, which is really unexpected.
00:46:58
Speaker
But the developers actually spent a crazy amount of time like actually making that work Because they're like, how do we have Isaac on the ground because you're like laying down shooting with your free hand Kind of like wobbling left and right as you're being pulled down this hallway. I don't know It's it's something where it's like it didn't need to be in the game. But the fact that it was made everything way scarier and
00:47:23
Speaker
Yeah, because now you're like, Oh shit, are we doing that again? Yeah. Is that, is that a thing? Was that a one time thing? What's going on? And Nash. Oopsie.
00:47:31
Speaker
in the same way That game in particular and also looks from later Dark Souls. I don't trust dead bodies. Yeah, I would walk into like a a Mortuary a graveyard a morgue anywhere and I'm gonna fucking kick every dead body be like are you fucking dead? I'm double-checking because and the odds that you're not actually dead I don't want to find out when I'm cornered and this is inopportune for
Personal Fears and Phobias
00:47:58
Speaker
me and
00:47:58
Speaker
At least in Dead Space you had the best, probably the most powerful stomp in video games. It did like a bajillion damage. It was an instant kill to anything on the ground. And the screen literally shakes every time you stomp. Getting two people stomping in co-op is hilarious.
00:48:17
Speaker
I think the other thing that really made that moment particularly scary is it goes back to that fear of the unknown. Cause you're like, where, where is this tentacle in the ship coming from? Yeah. Like if it's there behind the wall, is it part of the ship? I don't know. What's the creature, right? Yeah. And that's intrinsically not knowing what to be scared of is intrinsically more scary than actually having the full picture. I think.
00:48:46
Speaker
Unless the full picture is yourself. That's the scariest thing. I can't deal with that. If there are two things I hate, it's being fresh out of college and seeing myself naked in a mirror. Oh God. What is this? Scroll up. Scroll up? Is that what it is? That's what my emotion was. Oh, okay. What am I scrolling up to?
00:49:07
Speaker
was just, um, I still wouldn't like talk about as we've touched on cause we don't ever have like a singular topic for an episode. We always branch. What is something that like scares the piss out of you consistently, even with your adult brain, what is something that you come across? You're like, no, not about it. We'll go out of my way to avoid that. Something I like, I can't play basically.
00:49:30
Speaker
Either can't play or so you don't want to deal with in real life. Oh, in real life. Like for me, not a big spider guy. No, I think like thematically, they can be like cool, but I don't ever want to be near one. Right. There are times like I've seen one in my shower and I've like the, like the karate chop of water from my shower out it to like try and get it down and then like kick it down the drain type thing.
00:49:57
Speaker
I'm less afraid of spiders, but I don't like them. I'm not like spider bro territory. I've had friends where they're like, oh yeah, I have a spider bro. I stand by the spider bro. You have one that lives by the window, kills all the dumb shit you hate. Yeah. As long as it's one, it's bro. It's not bro, not bro. It's spider bro. Yeah. And it has its own, it's a tenant in a very specific section of the house and that is it. It's spider bro. If it goes beyond its boundaries, it dies. Simple as that.
00:50:25
Speaker
The thing I'm scared of in the apartment sense is anything with too many legs eight legs I can deal with that makes me a little uncomfortable squeamish I understand they have the place if you have more than eight legs you're an abomination and you shouldn't exist That's my quick that's my my take basically on legs Jake do you have a story about? Killing someone with a lot of legs. I do it all the time anytime. There's things with too many legs This is why we have raid in the apartment
00:50:54
Speaker
Was there a specific story? I can't remember, but you probably, so you have the gleam in your eye that tells me that you do. So I remember a couple of years back, um, you guys must've been like a year or two at that apartment. This is earlier on.
00:51:12
Speaker
I think it was you. Probably. Not Shane, but like there was like a silverfish where like house centipede started dashing across and you like frantically tried to kill it, but you use like the physical can. Oh yeah. Versus the actual spray. Yeah. I mean, whatever's on hand, you know, natural reaction. Sometimes you gotta, you gotta get there, but no, they're not. They shouldn't. I don't want that.
00:51:43
Speaker
I can't. That's my, that's my fear. That's my fear. You found it, Dave. You successfully nailed it down. To unsettle you a little bit, I will share a story. Sure. Uh, growing up in my parents' basement, it was a finished basement, but in some of the closets, it was like a cement wall. But for insulation, there was like a, like a,
00:52:07
Speaker
painters plastic sheet To just kind of go from top to bottom just to help with insulation Yeah, but there was like tons of little silverfish or house centipedes. It would kind of like crawl behind it No, so what I would do cuz I didn't like them as nobody should right is if I found one and I was hiding the closet because I was really good hide-and-seek Yeah, anyway, yeah
00:52:29
Speaker
I would essentially like start to close the area of plastic and then like it's little bubble until it like had no space. And then we'd just go, I'd squish it. Cause I hated them. Yeah. They're not, they're not okay. I wonder if like the new tenants now that my parents have moved, just like found this wall of like dead plastic. Like, what is this? Uh, I thought of the other thing, uh, less personal, but also terrifying to me, uh, cave diving.
00:52:59
Speaker
Yeah, because I've never done that but the idea of other people doing it also induces anxiety in me Yeah, it's just going down. It's like a deep unexplored thing where you
00:53:10
Speaker
Life is not guaranteed. Yeah, you have the oxygen on your back, but I would hear stories of Like articles not like oh you hear about Jimmy. Yeah, Jimmy's doing cave diving Because at a point like if you don't have the oxygen you don't know your way back You think like oh, this is up towards air But it's actually like a false pocket of air. It just looks like the way to go and I don't know. I just I hate being trapped underwater. You've played subnautica
00:53:40
Speaker
I was literally thinking of some day. I was like, how is some Nautica now on this list? It's not a horror game, but it is. We're like parts of it. It definitely has. He uses fear though. Like a hundred percent fear is what keeps you contained in the safe shallows for 40 hours. There's usually build up mineral resources. Uh, no, that's definitely man. Subnautica is great. We'll have to have an episode on that someday, but.
00:54:09
Speaker
particularly the other part the other thing that sucks about cave diving is I'm afraid of loss of self-control or self like initiative or not being in control of my own actions and cave diving has this
00:54:25
Speaker
If you go deep enough, your blood basically becomes intoxicated just because of natural pressure. And past the point, you have to deal with it similar to being drunk, where you have to focus on one thing, or in particular, your brain starts focusing on one thing.
00:54:44
Speaker
I read this like really freaking long again article the same same maybe same one you did Or like a guy was cape that cave diving in Australia found a corpse of someone else That was diving before I was like, okay, we're gonna retrieve this
00:55:00
Speaker
organized this whole big thing like news was there covering it where he like got a friend to assist him and he went down the friend will only went like halfway whatever and literally died trying to retrieve the corpse of this other guy and then like his wife and daughter were up there and like they you know didn't get to see him and then his friend went down to try to
00:55:27
Speaker
Save him and he almost died and it's like maybe stop going in the cake It's like none of that none of that is good that's making serious because it's not a video game, but you know Maybe you don't yeah, man was only meant to do so much, right?
00:55:48
Speaker
Like, make video games. Please focus on that. And play video games. Those are the two things.
Jump Scares and Fear Mechanics
00:55:55
Speaker
Full circle. Yeah, nothing else here is as scary as Subnautica. Actually, that's a lie. That's a lie. Because there's a few things here. I never played Five Nights at Freddy's.
00:56:07
Speaker
I don't think that most of our audience probably has either given what I know about that. They're adults. Yeah Yeah, I played a little bit and by that I mean I watched somebody play it a little bit when it came out initially Yeah, and no, thank you. Mm-hmm. It just it hits that perfect bit of Uncomfortable reality. Yeah it's just like going through anywhere that's like normally populated with people and
00:56:33
Speaker
You're like, hey, it's not though. So what if this was a little bit off? Yeah. How would your mind perceive that in the dark? You're like, no, no. And the whole thing spirals down. Yeah. It's, it's like a, I'm not going to like circle jerk about five nights at Freddy's because, you know, the game's already super popular and I don't even own it. I'm not going to like play it because again, jump scares, but the, uh, it is tailored for fear.
00:56:58
Speaker
like limited resources and fuel so you can like or like energy so you can close the doors only so much like the fact that when you're looking through the cameras you can't see anything in front of your face like it's all sensory deprivation like limited resources and sensory deprivation and then animatronics freaking animatronics the worst the only way they could be worse is have more than eight lakes huh
00:57:28
Speaker
But I don't want to think of that, so I'm not going to. Yeah. Anything else? Anything else spring to mind compared to the atrocities we've already visited upon people's minds by thinking of cave diving and things with lakes. Clowns, I feel is probably worth a mention. That was interesting. There's never a thing where I'm like, Oh, cool. A clown. No.
00:57:55
Speaker
See, I don't have like, I don't have the phobia for clowns, but I am afraid of people who would want to be clowns. There's, there's some depth to it. It's just, it's one of those things where it seems so dated now, but again, there's like something in that uncanny valley range of. You're almost human.
00:58:24
Speaker
But it's like, it's meant to be like such like a cheerful, happy thing. Yeah. That as soon as like you, you dim the lights and like, put like a slightly, slightly different shade on it. You're like, this is twisted in, twist out of control in a bad way. Yeah. It's pretty scary.
00:58:41
Speaker
Like if I saw a puppy in the dark, I wouldn't be like, holy fuck, that puppy's terrifying. Clowns though? No. Yeah. Yeah. Never want that. Yeah. Honestly, just not at all. I wonder how much of that is the like subversion of clowns by making them serial killers. And then that's fed back into the fear of clowns and how much it actually is. The clowns have always been terrifying and we just never faced that fact.
Closing Thoughts on Halloween
00:59:07
Speaker
I feel like a lot of things just were not perceived as terrifying initially like i'm sure you saw like a lot of those like easter bunny costumes from like the 1930s and shit like that all of those things you're like what the actual fuck now they're animatronics so yeah don't want that want no part of that i want no part of this none of this none of the stuff on this list all right we don't have to talk about this we don't want to that's good i don't want to trigger you
00:59:36
Speaker
That's fair. It's a little bit late. We're an hour in at this point. Uh-oh. Yeah. Are we? Pretty close to it.
00:59:46
Speaker
All right, let's kick these kids out of here. Let's send them off to some candy and trick-or-treating and fun revelries. Some good drinking, dressing slutty. I really feel like I'm advocating that because I've said it like six times. Right. I don't know. Your costume is just not that slutty. It's OK, but eh. I wish I could post pictures, but it's not that type of podcast.
01:00:14
Speaker
I'm hoping it's not that kind of party. It's just going to be Dave. It's going to make you a little uncomfortable though, I promise you that. Yeah, almost guaranteed. That being said, with that mental image of Dave left in your mind. Thank you guys for listening to this episode. Not sure why I did for this one. This one will be the one you skip. I really think so.
01:00:43
Speaker
It's the one I'm gonna skip when I replay them. But thank you nonetheless, making it through the whole thing as we come up on another completion for a year of episodes, which we will probably visit more. Oh, when's the formal date for the two year anniversary? Two year, it'll be probably around March, between February and March. Oh. Yeah.
01:01:10
Speaker
We're coming to the conclusion of a year, not like a year of the podcast. A year of the solder calendar. But thank you guys for listening. And as always, we'll see you in the next one. And if you want to reach us in places, you can always email us at
01:02:45
Speaker
you